The pertinent questions
We’re not going to join in the attacks on a nurse who criticised Nicola Sturgeon during last night’s BBC election debate. While her lifestyle seems at a glance to be wildly at odds with her claim that she relied on foodbanks to survive, there are – genuinely – possible explanations for at least most of it.
Her daughter could have won a free scholarship to the £11,000-a-year George Heriot’s school. Family and friends could have paid for her five-star holidays to New York and frequent dinners in expensive restaurants. She lives in Stockbridge, which is a quite expensive area of Edinburgh – in itself the most expensive city in Scotland – where wages might not stretch as far as elsewhere.
Owning a convertible car isn’t proof that someone’s wealthy – I have one myself that’s worth less than £1000, and I also have a relative who has very little money but who nevertheless owns a horse just like Claire Austin’s daughter seemingly does. (It’s also possible to be quite poor but still own things you bought when you were less poor.)
It ill befits Yes supporters – who are happy to deploy the existence and growing use of foodbanks to justifiably attack the UK government – to complain if someone who calls the First Minister “wee Jimmy Krankie” adopts the same tactic. More to the point, we entirely agree with Ms Austin’s core view that nurses should be paid more in general, as we suspect most people do.
(And in Scotland, of course, they ARE paid more than in the rest of the UK, and under the SNP have always been given the full pay rises recommended by the independent pay board, which hasn’t been the case in England.)
But that still leaves some things hanging disquietingly in the air.
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1. Why was Ms Austin specifically invited by the BBC to ask a question about a devolved issue in a Westminster election debate?
The large bulk of last night’s programme was rather bizarrely taken up with discussion of issues on which the election can have no impact because they’re devolved to the Scottish Parliament, such as education and health.
What that did was ensure the debate was weighted significantly in favour of one of the two parties who are the main combatants – the Tories. When the discussion focuses on devolved issues the SNP are put under scrutiny and pressure for their record but the Conservatives get to escape scot-free.
If an audience member happens to bring a devolved issue up spontaneously during an unscripted part of the debate, it should still strictly be dismissed as irrelevant – just like if Theresa May was doing a radio phone-in (LOL, we know) and someone rang up to complain about the penalty Celtic were awarded last Saturday – but in live TV these things happen and sometimes you just have to roll with it.
But specifically inviting someone in the full advance knowledge you planned for them to ambush one particular panellist with an off-topic question is a lot dodgier.
2. Who does Ms Austin want to solve this problem, and how?
We can safely assume that anyone who calls the FM an insulting name popular with Unionist trolls isn’t going to be a big SNP fan. But who in this election is proposing a big pay rise for nurses?
Certainly not the Tories, and Labour are simply making their usual vague, meaningless noises about “the pay increase they deserve” without putting any sort of figure on it or explaining how they’d pay for it. Kezia Dugdale was allowed to get away without any questioning when she opportunistically joined in with the attack.
3. How is Ms Austin actually getting food from foodbanks?
You can’t just rock up at a foodbank and ask for some free grub if you feel like it. You generally have to be referred in writing by the DWP or some similar organisation, and if you – by your own admission – have a full-time job paying almost £8000 above the “National Living Wage” (which is currently £14,625pa for a 37.5-hour week) you might have a tough time getting that letter.
“My daughter’s horse is short of oats and I can only afford a relatively cheap brand of champagne for my parties” probably won’t cut it with the Trussell Trust.
4. When is a living wage not a living wage?
Of course, that raises another issue. If a nurse really can’t manage on £22,345 a year, how can you possibly call a figure that’s £8,000 shy of that a “National Living Wage”? But that’s a question that only the UK government can address – the minimum wage is reserved – so why was it only put to Nicola Sturgeon and not Ruth Davidson, who was after all the UK governing party’s representative in a UK election debate?
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It’s possible that Ms Austin’s account of her circumstances was somewhat less than entirely frank. We don’t know, and either way we certainly don’t blame her for trying to get a better deal for nurses even if she’s largely blaming the wrong people.
But both her claims and the “vile cybernat witch-hunt!” smokescreen that’s been blown up around them by Unionists (thanks to a handful of stupid and counter-productive Yes supporters going off half-cocked about unconfirmed and false rumours) mask the real mysteries that the debate and her appearance on it threw up.
It’ll be interesting to see if any of them are resolved in the coming hours and days.
Nice one yet again BBC.
A few minutes ago just as she was about to give an answer (some hope) about the hasty panicked cap being applied on the Dementia Tax somebody threw the switch and we got a plug for the FA Cup Final.
We were then switched to a News(sorry Opinions) bulletin and Nicola was being attacked in last night’s alleged GE Debate complete with yet another appearance from The BBC’s favourite ant-SNP nurse.
It really saddens me that, again, a band of people who forget the internet interacts with the real world have allowed the pertinent issues (NHS pay, living wage, rising foodbank use) to be completely ignored because of stupd rumour mongering and decisions to attack people who disagree with them.
It plays neatly into the narrative unionists want and it really damages the image of yes supporters.
This woman may be nasty to the SNP on the internet, but she’s also an actual person doing an actual job who had a fair point about her own field. We need to stop seeing people who don’t like the SNP as heretics that must be hounded out of the debate. This is why I’m not on that twitter or facebook or any of that shite. People who would otherwise be perfectly happy to talk to each other (see heineken advert where they build a bar) turn into real dicks. It’s stupid when the yoons do it, it’s stupid when we do it.
Hold politicians to account, aye, but ffs some woman off the street who happens to be in an audience? Leave her be.
What the so called debate proved beyond all doubt is that the BBC are willingly campaigning for the Tory party in their election bid.
The BBC deliberately avoided most of the pertinent issues and questions the Tory party and Labour to a lesser extent have to answer with regards to their manifestos.
By concentrating on questions not relevant to the GE which allows attacks to be conducted on the Scottish Government specifically they turned what should have been a GE debate into a Scottish Government witch hunt.
I don’t know why Teresa May is so afraid to put herself forward for a BBC debate she will obviously be well protected and never pushed to explain herself in any degree.
Sarah Smith has a lot to answer for.
Is she confused or unaware what particular areas are devolved or what Westminster have responsibility for?
Full marks Stu, for focusing on the facts rather than the hype.
I’d like to see Nursie give an honest account of herself instead of hiding behind vague suggestions.
Given that the BBC are not in full-on pursuit of the SNP over this I can only assume that it is choosing to (to quote Spinal Tap’s Nigel Tufnel), “Best leave it … unsolved.”
Ms Austin also explained that nurses were going on strike last night. But over all, a well thought out, mature nae perfect destruction of this 2017 General Election debate, by beeb gimps.
At the very least BBC Scotland is raising its get Sturgeon game now. Their Eardley ligger is all over Facebook for example, hard at it blaming SNP for “briefing” him.
I am sure neither Sarah Smith nor Jackie Bird would possibly have got involved in such a set up. Way beneath them.
AYE RIGHT!!!
It’s hard enough to get through the BBC filter once, to get in an audience.
To be invited back to ask ‘your’ (irrelevant) question seems unprecedented, and one can only conclude it was a stitch up.
Waiting for the dirt to seep out is the best bit anyways, no need to jump the gun. Anticipating yoon incompetence should be considered entertainment.
As for sympathy, if you participate in Aunties shenanigans & get caught out being economical with the actuality… Meh!
I am a real political geek but I don’t watch these types of programmes anymore. I had my fill of the red, blue and yellow tories & the ultra UKIP tories all ganging up against the SNP with the full support of rabid BBC foaming at the mouth Labourites like Smith, Brewster et al, all in full tribal warcry against the ‘nats’. Throw in an 80% Yoon audience and it’s simply a modern form of the Roman Gladitorial Games or the HUnger Games, with the hapless victim/sacrifice/fear figure – the SNP.
Meanwhile Sarah Smith’s mother is still claiming her £300 per day plus very high expenses flying up and down to London from Edinburgh to attend the House of Lords. And yet Sarah’s wee ‘socialist’ Maw has never, in over 20 years, EVER spoken in the House of Lords. She has still to give her maiden speech. She’s too busy most of the time attending the Scottish Opera. Aye, the Smiths are really in touch with the working class! It’s only because her father was the late John Smith, that Sarah got a shoe-in to the BBC media circus. Why he was buried on Iona, the burial site of ancient Scottish Kings is beyond me. I somehow don’t think Dugdale will be given the same misplaced reverence for someone who was never even prime minister! Socialist?! The whole Smith clan are an utter joke but the Union keeps them all in their cushy ‘jobs’.
Para 1 – I was referring to May.
Thanks Rev to put things in perspective. However I don’t expect to get any proper scrutiny of the legitimate questions you raise any time soon.
There’s three weeks, or so, to go. Let’s be smarter next time – and there WILL be a next time.
When is enough not enough?
There is not a snowballs chance of this person ever having or having to, visit a foodbank!
Some people can get by on what this person is earning but some never have enough to live the life they were or wish to become accustomed to.
They are living in cloud cuckoo land in that they feel that they are somehow wronged and they are entitled to eat in the finest restaurants, quaffing the finest champagnes, have exotic holidays and send their children to the finest schools all paid for by on a nurse’s wage.
In an ideal world we would all be better off in that respect but sometimes enough is never enough!
“Their Eardley ligger is all over Facebook for example, hard at it blaming SNP for “briefing” him.”
Well, he’s got a point. Joanna Cherry is a QC, for Christ’s sake, she should know better than to go parroting rumours.
Good piece.
I’m loathe to judge anyone’s lifestyle, but her own question to FM is about her lifestyle. Of course we would like to pay nurses more, no question.
My focus is her explanation that because she didn’t get asking her question on QT, she was invited 2 weeks later to this event, as recompense for not getting a shot on QT. Surely, that can’t be right, as there must be loads of folk don’t get their shot?
Are you guaranteed your airtime no matter what? She got an extraordinary amount of airtime too.
Record and Scottish Sun now running the story, which is going to result in some readers thinking food banks are abused, because of course, that’s how it’s slanted.
Just a comment about horse owning. They are hideously expensive to own, it’s like another mortgage, insurance, livery, shoeing, feed, vets etc. There are some ways to defray costs, but they are money pits, and I love them. I had a sharing arrangement.
I did not watch the debate but what you say is truth.
This is the BBC doing the Tories business for them. As for this nurse, I accept your explanation for the circumstances that may be involved in her choices. Nicola should be able tobat this over the net to Ruth, her boss has been running Britain one way or another.
I listened this morning to the Shadow Minister for Education being harangued unmercifully by John Humphreys and I was wishing she hasd simp!y said to him that he apparently knew the cost better than she did and then shut up. The BBC are well worth the watching. I would rather that people would not fall into the trap they set up say nothing that willsnnoy them more.
That Nurse has a very familiar face I am sure if people look through the Referendum stuff they will find her.
I should addn
@Cuilean
Don’t disagree, but Opera where I am working is an everybody event and not seen as just for the rich (working in former Soviet block country). But in the UK, I do take your point 😉
I have nothing but distain for so-called socialists taking the ermine and basically prostituting whatever principles they used to have to soak off the taxes of the very people they were supposed to represent.
Sorry, RANT over!
Martin says
“Hold politicians to account, aye, but ffs some woman off the street who happens to be in an audience? Leave her be.”
She hardly looks like that Martin, didn’t you read the post ?
She didn’t just “happen to be in an audience” mate.
Her question was deemed so important that she was invited last night, because they didn’t manage to get that juicy piece of SNP Bad squeezed into last weeks propaganda fest.
If it smells like a plant…
I should add not all nurses are angels, some I have known were short of a halo,one or two would definitely be members of the Scottish Tories.
The bottom line in this story is that it just solidifies the fact that the BBC is enemy number one in this battle for independence and is the thorn in our side that is going to make our task extremely difficult as long as the older people who are guaranteed to come out to vote are hard wired to the propaganda. It’s the real life matrix.
It really doesn’t matter which way you come down on this the fact is it went out on the air and probably reached the audience it was targeted at who knowing no better or caring less will have gotten the message that the BBC intended them to get and diverted the attention from where it should have been focussed the actual General Election for which Ruth Davidsons party is responsible
They called it after all, so defend it, but the BBC made sure they didn’t have to
So job done BBC
at Gus1940
Off-topic, but I couldn’t believe it when they quickly cut with the questions about to start. Did switch straight over to the BBC News channel where I have to say the journalists actually did their jobs and really put her on the spot. I haven’t seen her look this uncomfortable since Angus Robertson nailed her in PMQs
She ain’t so strong and stable now
Long may this rumble on
On-topic, spot on Rev on the above article
What a public service you provide!
Yes a fine and noble assessment and a warning to all who use social media , Now here’s the BUT , if this had been a one off occurrence ok fine everyone makes mistakes .
But as we all know its planned its contrived and has been for months , well probable years , people are sick to the back teeth of this shit storm without access to any kind of reply ,so the ones who lose the place a bit, cut them a bit of slack .
Daily Politics set to run this nonsense just now. Loathed to watch, but will see what their agenda is.
The “nurse” episode was so clearly a set-up. Does the BBC regularly invite audience members back to QT if they don’t manage to “ask their question”?
If so, why was Nurse not invited back to QT. Why invite her onto the Leader’s Debate. As Stu points out, it is a GE debate.
Their website posted the “nurse” statement followed by anti-SNP comments from the right wing invitees in the “spin room”. It was obviously set up so that the papers could run with it next day. Website live page now removed.
The State Broadcaster colludes with the yellow press to denigrate the First Minister. What’s new? The “nurse” was simply a useful tool.
So no apology from the BBC for obvious campaigning on behalf of the Tory party. They do, however, post an apology from Joanna Cherry in which they repeat the nurse complaints once more:
link to bbc.co.uk
@Martin
Hold politicians to account, aye, but ffs some woman off the street who happens to be in an audience? Leave her be.
_____
Why should her claims not be held up to scrutiny.
The FM is rightly held accountable for any failings in her Governance but this was not a genuine case and should be called out as such.
She was there to act as a symbol of the down-trodden trying to garner sympathy from the audience in the studio and those at home and hoping for backlash side-effect against Nicola Sturgeon.
Thanks to social media this person has rightly been called out for her lies with the Daily Rancid also thinking it of merit to expose her as well.
Tony Little, opera in Scotland is for everyone too. I was at La Boheme on Saturday wearing sneakers, shorts and a Madness t-shirt. It was only a bit more spendy than the cinema and the very back row is even cheaper, only sold on the day of the performance. I actually prefer the cheap seats because the supertitles are easier to see.
Two points;
Her pay scale indicates she is not a nurse. She is on the salary of a Health Care Assistant which is not a nurse.
Secondly she does not work in the NHS. She is employed by BUPA.
Who organised this set up in the first place?
No question about it -it is the bbc who is culpable in this instance – they INVITED her to ask about a devolved issue and quite deliberately used her to attack the snp and indy – just another day at blatantly biased and corrupt media. Sarah Smith will never be neutral in these debated nor Jackie Bird – their whole body language etc was in high spirit with the ‘star’ of the show – the nurse.
As ever the real issue is the BBC. They won’t change and will continue to pump out unionist propaganda and lies until we gain our independence.
I hope the SNP have plans to stop this when we gain our independence. They must not be allowed to continue to undermine our country when we finally break free.
Bob Mack says:
22 May, 2017 at 12:41 pm
Two points;
Her pay scale indicates she is not a nurse. She is on the salary of a Health Care Assistant which is not a nurse.
Secondly she does not work in the NHS. She is employed by BUPA.
Who organised this set up in the first place?
_____
According to her she is a charge nurse so more like £32k rather than £22k.
Quite clearly a set-up. SNP politician currently being harangued on the Daily Politics by BBC stooge about the clip, which was shown again preceding the item. The BBC will put this on a loop over the coming days.
What put the tin lid on it was the exchange at the end of the programme in which Smith said the issue was valid for discussion (it wasn’t) and it would influence the way people vote. Then, Bird delivered, grinning, what was clearly a pre-scripted line to conclude the broadcast – ‘hearing from the public can be a blessing – or a curse’.
A complete contrivance by a corrupt propagandist organisation.
Even more telling is her reaction to comments during her time on Questiontime 11th May (BBC iPlayer). seemed to be very much in tune with right wing comments. Obviously the BBC saw the merit in giving her the opportunity to give her question last night that they didn’t have time for back on the 11th May.
She also made mention of nurses going on strike, I am not aware of Scottish nurses threatening this but I have of the English, a downright dishonest person.
As an experienced Charge Nurse she would be earning in excess of £30,000 per annum.
The SNP being totally smeared by Coburn on daily politics about this and Drew Hebert sat and took. For God sake grow a pair and stop being so bloody nice. Enough is enough, time to go on the attack during so called interviews
Bloody predictive – Drew Hendry
The real story in this is that it was not a leaders debate about the G.E rather it was a platformed Unionist attack on Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP.
To my real surprise, Coburn was the only one that, rather than constantly attack Nicola Sturgeon, he actually tried to debate the real G.E issues although he was drawn into devolved issues through the drive towards those subjects.
The only one on that stage that should have been grilled was Ruth Harrison who should have been asked to try and defend her own party’s policies which affect the UK as a whole!
Absolute disgrace however that the publicly paid for BBC, made sure that this ‘debate’ was a full scale attack on Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP, the ONLY party in the UK even trying to help those on low wages and no wages.
It’s not far from Stockbridge to Lidl, or Leith walk cheap veg shops, or a bit further to a huge Aldi, if you have the luxury of having a car. Where you live, if in central Edinburgh, is not really a bother in terms of shopping, even Farmfoods is within walking distance. Buses are good and cheap to use as well, due to not being privatised.
It does appear that this nurse was slagging the SNP, and not the actual Tory, UKGov, even though it is the SNP who are the only real opposition to tory cuts and tory/red tory austerity. All a bit suspect, and orchestrated to ensure a programme which was designed to confuse people about the GE, and devolution.
Can understand why people were angry about it all. Has anyone really serioulsy threatened this woman like they have Nicola Sturgeon? Or is it a case of exposing something or at least something which might be worth examining abit closer, because we all know how dirty the BBC and the UKGov can play. They don’t like being called out.
If any witch hunt goes on anywhere, we can be sure it won’t be a tory of any kind, on the receiving end. They take no prisoners when it comes to independence supporters, or the SNP, for that matter. They show no mercy in fact, but are a dab hand at hiding dodgy Tory expenses, and such things.
All’s fair in love and war? :-/
Jim says:
22 May, 2017 at 12:37 pm
@Martin
Hold politicians to account, aye, but ffs some woman off the street who happens to be in an audience? Leave her be.
_____
Why should her claims not be held up to scrutiny.
The FM is rightly held accountable for any failings in her Governance but this was not a genuine case and should be called out as such.
She was there to act as a symbol of the down-trodden trying to garner sympathy from the audience in the studio and those at home and hoping for backlash side-effect against Nicola Sturgeon.
She was there to deflect attention from the ruinous policies of the Tory Party and, to a lesser extent, other Yoon parties. The inference was that the SNP is responsible for the whole austerity agenda and is deliberately targeting the NHS and education for cuts, when the opposite is actually true. The SNP is the only party committed to protecting vital public services, even within the constraints of the Tory austerity budgets imposed on us for the last 7 years.
[…] Wings Over Scotland The pertinent questions We’re not going to join in the attacks on a nurse who criticised Nicola Sturgeon […]
Training Day says:
Quite clearly a set-up. SNP politician currently being harangued on the Daily Politics by BBC stooge about the clip, which was shown again preceding the item. The BBC will put this on a loop over the coming days.
Totally agree Coburn AN sub a disgrace the way she dismissed the MP.Its a pity I can’t email her about this nurse and her very good life style she seems to lead and as I said before is she using food banks under false rules and if so she should be charged as she is taking food from some deserving person.
link to archive.is
I am livid about this distraction from the real issues.
link to moflomojo.blogspot.com
“totally smeared by Coburn” Yeugh
Come on the Wasp, it’s lunchtime. 🙂
Regarding the “wee jimmy crankie” quote. I would say to this nurse.
“You don’t have the looks to be so pass remarkable yourself”.
” You’ve just embarrassed yourself and your family with possibly some porkie pies! Get over yirsel,you’ve had your 2 mins of fame”.
Stu, these are the bald facts about nurses pay in Scotland, an abstract from my post on WGD. You are much more patient and reasoned than I. This was a deliberate attempt by Sarah Smith to full the TV audience.
“Ms Austin,the flame haired harridan who was a ‘re-invited’ member of the ‘balanced’ BBC audience who, and these are facts from her own tweets, is single, is photographed sitting in a very comfortable gaff, who earns according to her own tweet, £22,345 per annum, the nearest equivalent of which on the Royal College of Nursing’s official Scottish pay scales is £22,313, which is the fifth increment of the Band 4 scale , which is £404 MORE than her equivalent in England and Wales, where Ruth’s Government is demanding £20 BILLION in ‘efficiencies and savings’ from the English HS, which means sacking thousands of nurses doctors and vital health staff by 2021, while Clare is guaranteed no redundancies, by that BAD SNP mob whom Clare is accusing of bringing you to the brink of resigning.
In Northern Ireland the equivalent rate is £621 LESS that Clare’s take home.
They must be queueing ‘round the block at the Falls Road Food Bank across from the Victoria.
We have yet to discover the location of the Food Bank which gave ‘free food’ to a single woman, in full time employment, pocketing £437 a week. Did she mislead them? Or can anybody pop into their nearest Free Food Store these days? Somebody’s lying somewhere, and it ain’t the Royal College of Nursing.
I’m sure David Clegg will be investigating this juicy EsEnnPee Bad yarn today.)
There are two issues if we can call them that here.
Firstly according to the lady herself having been in QT she was invited by the BBC to this debate to ask her question. You have to submit questions up front in writing so the BBC moderator clearly understood it was being framed in Devolved manner pertinent to Holyrood not Westminster.
Secondly any daily mail types who have seen her photos in the Sun or indeed on line have their prejudices about the complex reasons for going to food banks reinforced and probably believe she does go to a food bank in between the foreign holidays etc. She has to an extent undermined what is a disgraceful situation in this country.
I would say the Sarah Smith handled it appallingly, the FM rightly stated that the public sector pay squeeze is unsustainable when inflation is going through the roof. Now that was the GE issue and all of the leaders should have been asked to respond to that. Instead we got an incoherent attack on a Holyrood government that may have caused initial misinformation on social media but has been exposed by tabloids who are not favourable to the SNP as being of questionable provenance.
I feel sorry for the nurse involved, I feel the BBC set her up for a fall and the BBCs involvement is disgraceful.
It was a shambles of a debate, an angry Ruth, Kez and Willie might as well have not been there, FM constantly under attack on devolved matters and Patrick Harvie and funnily enough Mr UKIP trying to get the debate to actually be about the GE.
Hate to say it but it has all the hallmarks of a former Labour leaders daughter & political editor for BBC Scotland’s influence, in making sure this nursing question got put to the FM as part of the show.
Whatever Ms Austin’s motives, hounding someone like that is sickening. I think your question no 1 is the important issue here – why did she get invited back to attack Nicola Sturgeon on a devolved issue (the actual pay) when the pay freeze comes from Ruth Davidson’s party?
But the debate had another questionable contribution. The maths teacher claimed the only reason good Highers are up is because the standard of exams has been dumbed down.
My son sat Higher Maths in 2015 and Advanced Higher Maths in 2016. In 2015 they ran the new and the old Higher Maths exams alongside each other as some schools hadn’t changed over. There was a media outcry about the new exam as it was much harder than the old one – so much so that they had to change the bands to compensate.
For Adv Highers most of my son’s class failed their prelims as the exam was so hard. He brought his questions home telling us that even the maths teachers were struggling to solve them (and that’s if they can even find teachers to teach maths at that level as the subject matter is so specialised).
So my husband who used to teach engineering at university sat down with him trying to solve the questions at home, for both exams in far more time than the exam and struggled with this, too. It’s true that in the late 90s/early 00s my husband and his university colleagues used to complain that the standards had fallen and that they had to start teaching first years at a far lower Maths level than they expected, but this has now changed. I can’t tell myself if they’re at the right level or not, because my own Higher Maths doesn’t even compare to what the kids do here, but the standard has demonstrably not been dumbed down.
And the older gent in his “5th decade of teaching” who claimed that the extra money for headteachers from the Attainment Fund couldn’t be used to hire extra staff? That must have been his headteacher’s decision. The school my niece works at near Perth just got a huge award of that money and that’s exactly what her headteacher is doing – hiring someone. And here’s what the Scottish government guidance says on this:
“Where schools identify the need to recruit additional staff for an appropriate intervention or activity, they should work closely with the Local Authority (as the employer) to ensure that the job remits and specifications are clearly tied to the aims of the intervention.” (link to gov.scot)
Hiring additional staff is clearly an option in deciding how to use this extra money.
The next time a debate of this nature is in the offing the FM should tell them to go fuck themselves!
So its another BBC “ringer”, just like during the last indyref.
Colour me surprised – the BBC cheat & lie? Who would ever have imagined such a thing was possible.
To paraphrase the late-great Michael Flanders (and out of context): The BBC hierarchy is NOT political – they are ALL Conservatives.
@Jim,
No Jim, charge nurses are generally band 7 which start at £40,000. This lady has this morning tweeted her status to others. She states she gets £23,000 per annum which is the equivalent of a band 4 Health Care Assistant under agenda for change pay scales. She is not a nurse.
Every health care assistant in the NHS on the same grade 4 is paid more than her because she is employed by BUPA who pay the national Agenda for Change rate which we know is lower in England.
This was an attempted stitch up.
Ward nurses are generally band 5 or 6.
Neatly done Rev.
I’m trying to picture a Conference Room at PQ with Donalda Wotsername and her henchpersons planning how to turn a scheduled GE Scottish Leaders Debate into nothing of the sort and make it a full on attack on Nicola and The SNP plus making sure that not a word is spoken about The Labour and Tory Manifestos.
1pm National BBC Opinions Bulletin has just started – any odds against Nursegate being featured?
Its got massive mileage for BBC, BBC2 lunchtime politics show, nothing much about huge May U-turn today, but full on monstering of, JC loves the IRA, SNP smear nurses, rounded off BNP leader interview.
Job done, tory BBC.
Martin
This woman was not just someone“ off the street“ she was invited by the BBC having apparently already been on QT, so it would seem she was a plant.
Her salary of £22000 should rule out her claim that she has to rely on food banks. If she is not lying about this then she can surely reveal the location of this food bank and vindicate herself but as yet she has not. Why.
Ms Austin by her own admission says she has received abuse from other nurses. Why.
I would suggest Martin that you reserve your sympathy for Nicola Sturgeon who was ambushed in an appalling manner by the BBC with the help of this planted anti- SNP audience member.
And perhaps a thought for those people earning less than £22000.
Her linkedin profile, link to linkedin.com paints a picture of her big-ing herself up.
She’s a Staff nurse and possibly not full time.
I then spent 2 years working for the NHS Lothian Staff Bank gaining experience in all areas; Medical & Surgical Admission Units, Medical & Surgical Wards, Gynae, DCN, Ortho, , MOE, Rehab and A&E.
I now work predominantly in A&E although as I work for three employers I can be sent to any area that needs speciality staff urgently.
Not sure how the overlap in her actually qualifying as a nurse and when she claims to have been employed as one works. She’s only been qualified for 5 years.
If you read between the lines of the tweet it’s obvious she asked for questions to ask.
@admiral
She was there to deflect attention from the ruinous policies of the Tory Party and, to a lesser extent, other Yoon parties. The inference was that the SNP is responsible for the whole austerity agenda and is deliberately targeting the NHS and education for cuts, when the opposite is actually true.
_____
Exactly right and Dugdale had the audacity to blame Nicola Sturgeon for Tory austerity policies when the fact is, the S.F spends a considerable amount of a limited budget mitigating tory austerity with no acknowledgement from the Red Tories!
Someone explain to Dugdale that all nations run a deficit through borrowing and the figure of 15Bn is highly dubious and debatable.
‘I, Daniel Blake’.
The reality of having to rely on state handouts, not this ‘nurse’s’ version of poverty under this disgusting, tory and red tory condoned attack on our most vulnerable, our poorest, our sick, disabled, and most disadvantaged members of the population.
Just absolutely raging now at the attacks on the SNP and Nicola Sturgeon when it’s the TORY/RED TORIES that people should be calling out, and raging about.
The BBC is a state run, state sanctioned Tory mouthpiece. Sickening indeed.
Control the media and you control the people could hardly be more true.
Only positive, noticed piles and piles of Sunday rags left on shelves and floor of local coop last night, what a waste of trees though.
There are two “Claire Austin”s on the NHS mail system that work in Scotland, both in NHS Lothian.
One is ST1 Obstetrics and the other is a Staff Nurse.
Staff Nurse is Band 5, which is £22,440 – £29,033. (info here: link to rcn.org.uk )
interestingly, that page gives you historical data for payscales (make sure you select Scotland), and none of the scales have the value £22,345. So either she doesn’t know how much she earns, or she’s plucked a value out the air to suit her agenda.
@Chas says: 22 May, 2017 at 12:11 pm:
“I’d like to see Nursie give an honest account of herself instead of hiding behind vague suggestions.”
She has given enough of an account of herself, Chas. She has said that she was invited by the BBC to ask a specific question that she and the BBC both knew was totally irrelevant to the debate the BBC had set up under the pretext it was to be a Scottish Party leadership debate about the General Election.
There is no doubt that both the BBC and the woman in question colluded in an elaborate ploy to turn a debate on the General Election into an attack upon the First Minister, The SNP, The SG and the Independence Movement.
If not for the alert independence movement supporters who recognised the woman, The BBC’s, “Cunning Plan”, may have worked.
By now attempting to divert attention away from the BBC’s, “Cunning Plan”, they are now attempting to justify the unjustifiable.
It was pretty clear who was in charge in a broadcasting sense for last night’s show. It is a side issue of whether the nurse was genuine or not imo. To be honest the SNP have used plants in the audience as well in the past, this is a standard political trick used I would imagine pretty much everywhere to varying degrees.
For me that is not really an issue. If anyone thinks independence is inevitable then they just need to have viewed last night’s offering to be dissuaded of that notion. Make no mistake, we are up against powerful people and forces, and they are and will be ruthless, and they have no intention of seeing Scotland become independent. There is a lot of both personal and vested interests in preventing independence. I just don’t believe for one second that BBC Scotland got confused over devolved and reserved powers. Holyrood has been there for nearly twenty years after all, and education has never been to my knowledge controlled from Westminster. This was deliberate imo, and we need to be able to deal with it effectively, and the media strategy from now on in has to be much better than what it was for the first independence referendum, and it is a wake up call for the likes of Nicola Sturgeon, Joanna Cherry (who made a mistake last night), and company (although privately they must surely be able to see what is happening).
defo says:
22 May, 2017 at 12:17 pm
It’s hard enough to get through the BBC filter once, to get in an audience.
To be invited back to ask ‘your’ (irrelevant) question seems unprecedented, and one can only conclude it was a stitch up.
And so it does, I was picked to ask a question during the Indyref debates, from a show in Portree, was relevent for both sides of the matter, but the way I worded it when we the audience were asked to right out two questions each was slightly against the Yes campaign, this was done on purpose to ambush the No side, anyway after an hour of filming having been waiting in the Portree community centre, five questions were asked, BUT after having to apply to appear on the show about two months before, three totally anti yes questions were allowed, two from doctors who were supposedly holidaying in the area, and just appeared that day and got in , even after we were all vetted that day, and the other wasfrom another holiday maker, again just appeared that day, we the locals were livid that for a debate on local issues that these three people hijacked it, think it was the folloqwing week that nut job in Inverness got clear airtime, did I get asked onto Inverness show to ask my question there, I dont bloody well think so, the BBC had plants in 2014, and they had them again now
My main concern in all of this, isn’t the nurse herself (though her claim was so outlandish to begin with, that it was no surprise that everyone started to question her background. Going on the attack and blaming the FM when really, the blame lies with Westminster and it’s control of the economy and inflation didn’t help her case either). The real blame here lies with Sarah Smith (primarily), Jackie Bird (backup presenter) and the BBC overall.
If Sarah Smith can’t tell when a question is asked and the issue is one that is devolved to Holyrood and not Westminster, then she is in the wrong job. Christ! Even an audience member along with Patrick Harvie highlighted the point that the questions being asked had no relevance to the General Election. Sarah Smith must have known what was going on and therefore not only allowed it to continue, but joined in the questioning. If it flew over her head, then she is utterly incompetent …even after being told by both panellist and audience member that the questions were irrelevant!!
My main concern is how do the SNP handle this? You can defend in a battle and win. You cannot defend in a war and win. Sooner or later, you need to go on the offensive if you hope to win. The SNP need to bring the BBC to task over this misguided and unbalanced TV debate. What was shown around Scotland had half the electorate howling at the TV over open biasm and opportunism.
As Stuart says, many questions remain unanswered; not just around the nurse …but also the BBC and its presenters too.
Who gave her the authority to speak for “all NHS staff” (which numbers over a million)? She then contradicts herself by stating the nurses who disagree with her.
Her agenda is blatantly transparent, and anyone unable to see that isn’t impartial.
A number of newspapers covering this story in a similar way to WoS.
Let folk listen to what she claims and compare with the lifestyle she appears to enjoy from her social media postings.
People will draw their own conclusions as to whether she was telling the truth or using foodbanks to play politcs.
Rev. Stuart Campbell says:
22 May, 2017 at 12:21 pm
“Their Eardley ligger is all over Facebook for example, hard at it blaming SNP for “briefing” him.”
Well, he’s got a point. Joanna Cherry is a QC, for Christ’s sake, she should know better than to go parroting rumours.
im certain the first tweet i saw was from nick saying that the bbc have confirmed she is married to councillor, then she wasnt, then she was, etc but cant find it on his timeline anymore???
mmmmm
@Bob Mack
No Jim, charge nurses are generally band 7 which start at £40,000. This lady has this morning tweeted her status to others. She states she gets £23,000 per annum which is the equivalent of a band 4 Health Care Assistant under agenda for change pay scales. She is not a nurse.
Every health care assistant in the NHS on the same grade 4 is paid more than her because she is employed by BUPA who pay the national Agenda for Change rate which we know is lower in England.
This was an attempted stitch up.
Ward nurses are generally band 5 or 6.
______
She apparently claimed on her FB page that she was a charge nurse;
From this website:
link to payscale.com
!A Charge Nurse (RN) earns an average salary of £32,762 per year.”
Even at the lower rate of £32K there is still no reason or need to use a foodbank and there is no way she would get referred to one.
I do realise it was a setup and the problem for the Unionists is that now, the whole country knows it to!
Not sure at how a 50yo nurse claims to be on less money than a newly qualified band 5 nurse? Starting wages are about £22,440 up to £29,034 at the top band 5 level.and from what her LinkedIn profile says, she is an A&E speciality Staff nurse 5 years qualified.
Really not sure how she could be qualified to be refereed to a food bank?
Staff nurse at band 5 in Wales gets £22,129 to £28,747 and they are voting to strike.
If anyone else graduated from university and then did the work they do and didn’t see an increase in pay above inflation or at the least to match inflation they wouldn’t accept it.
my partner works in the NHS in Wales so I have an idea of what they go through on a daily basis.
Not badly paid compared to many other jobs however underpaid for what they do and in England they have scrapped the nurses bursary.
Ms Austin says that her fancy dinners and trip to New York were paid for by friends and family, and we have no reason to disbelieve her on this point. However, were I in her claimed position of having to rely on foodbanks to survive, I think I’d be asking said friends and family to buy me a week’s shopping rather than taking me out for an expensive meal or on an expensive trip. Might just be me though 😉
Anyone who describes themselves on their published Twitter profile as “moderately rich” and whose published Facebook account is chockablock with trips to the theatre, posh restaurants and champagne-swilling international trips, who then (the second time she appears in a live prime-time TV election-special audience), claims to have been so unable to manage on her salary that she’s had to use the food bank… is the legitimate subject of public scrutiny and questions.
John Beatties show leading with the state of nursing. Two guests one experienced nurse in mental health lamenting the state of nursing within NHS and a spokesperson from Royal College of Nursing. What’s the guessing neither of these two guests were phoned up late last night or that the shows lead topic was dreamed up after last nights debate. The word orchestrated springs to mind.
The BBC colluded in this – I’ve been on one of their panel debates before – they phone you up beforehand to ask your availability and what your questions are! They then select the audience based on your responses – on the day they have 3 or 4 people selected and singled out to ask the pre arranged questions – it’s then pot luck if anyone else in the audience gets a chance to participate! Given that by her own admission they asked her because she didn’t get to ask her question the previous week, the BBC KNEW what she was going to ask and therefore KNEW that health was a devolved matter and F*** All to do with a Westminster debate!
Again, Sarah Smith could have intervened and cut the questioner off pointing this out, but allowed her to continue!
They deliberately orchestrated the whole thing to show Nicola Sturgeon in a bad light!
I hope the woman enjoyed her 5 minutes of fame because she exposed herself as a liar and a fraud – very naive to imagine that in this day and age she wouldn’t be discovered as such from her Facebook/ Twitter/ Instagram/ LinkedIn trail which are all readily available to the outraged public!
All she has done is gain notoriety as a liar and fraud and in the process of her actions has demeaned genuine food bank users and people in the nursing profession who actually work for the NHS unlike her who earns a lot of money as an agency nurse!
She has proven herself to be untrustworthy and the BBC again proves itself to be the manipulative, dangerous, propaganda arm of the British state!
The questions that need to be asked are – WHY was she specifically asked to go on a GE leaders debate to ask about a specifically devolved area? Especially when the Scottish govt have NO control over pay ( which is negotiated across the whole of the U.K. under agenda for change scales). Yearly pay awards are set by a uk wide independent review body, which the Scottish govt also cannot change. Every year the SNP have given their recommended award. Every year the Tories have not. link to rcn.org.uk Compare the pay scales across the uk. Why are the media not asking the BBC why they invited her on specifically?. Why does the FM not shut this line of hectoring down by saying pay and uplifts are decided uk wide so unions will not allow an increased pay award in Scotland! The truth is always the best way to remove a direct attack. This nurse appears to work in an agency ( not directly in the NHS). Even part time she wouldn’t be making the wages she claims as a ‘charge nurse’ ( band 6 at least, experienced as she claims she would be an SCN ( senior charge nurse) on band 7. She claims to have helped run benbecula hospital. ( a tiny wee place) so a foi request on if she had ever been employed in that capacity would easily answer questions about her honesty – as would a fitness to practice report to the nursing and midwifery council. If we cannot expect basic honesty from our nursing staff then that’s a worry. Nurses are not paid as they should be for the levels of skill, knowledge and responsibility they have and some ARE having to use food banks and charity to survive ( disgraceful in a first world country), but that shouldn’t be allowed to be used by the agenda’d bbc to try to have a go at the FM ( who is not responsible for it) while letting the Tory govt off scot free.
I am not going to makes any comment on that nurse in leaders debate.
However I for one have no problem with not just those working in the NHS, but workers in other sectors of our economy being paid a decent living wage to help keep
them out of poverty.
But as Stuart has already pointed out the setting of
the minimum/living wage reserved to Westminster and the Scottish Government’s fixed budget being reduced by Westminster austerity there’s only so much it can do.
And Sarah Smith and others should have been made clear in the leaders debate to the viewing public.
In case people didn’t catch the foodbank nurse/devolved issue/ SNP-accused squirrel, the lunchtime Daily Politics show just aired that entire section again and grilled an SNP person on it all over again.
Elephant in room — today’s newspaper stories blowing the woman’s claims out of the water so the clear evidence that BBC’s entire “question” is a total set-up — not even mentioned,
The SNP are obsessed with Independence so says the BBC Reporting Scotland
Indeed so much so they said it 9 times in 3 minutes
No SNP person was interviewed
I can assure everybody that most of this is utter nonsense. I am in a difficult position of knowing the full facts but being unable to break confidences. Staff morale in the NHS in Scotland is among the highest in any organisation on these islands. Take my word for it. It is being measured as we write.
One day I will tell all but for now, my word is my bond.
The work currently being undertaken by the Scottish government has attracted the interest from IHI in America.
This is the world’s most prestigious health care organisation, headed up by a Scot who used to control the NHS here in Scotland. They are very impressed indeed.
BBC Scotland wrecked a UK GE debate and the only real news is that it was a very skillful display by Pacific Quay, keeping everything focused on SNP bad and not on Teresa May or massive issues like,
link to uk.reuters.com
TOP NEWS | Mon May 22, 2017 | 1:30pm BST
No trade talks before Brexit bill settled, EU tells London
Was Brexit mentioned last night, was there angry passionate Remain Scots voters like Ms Austen given loads of debate air time and beeb close ups to grill Ruth D?
Whatever we say about Pacific Quay liggers, with every election, they are getting better and better at what they do, damaging Scottish democracy.
Could it be that her obvious lie and subsequently getting caught was just a way to cast doubt on the fact that ‘real’ nurses are ‘actually’ having to use food banks. That she was a plant with the intention of getting caught out so it would cast doubt on the recent reports of nurses having to use food banks to get by and that would vindicate the Tories by allowing them to then say ‘look! The stories of nurses using food banks were all false!’ or even just to bury the nurses using food banks stories in your google search under all the headlines of “Nicola Sturgeon criticized from nurse on using food bank” (just a thought) but very fitting of an underhand Tory tactic.
Haven’t read the earlier comments, so apologies I’d this point has already been made.
It is quite possible that there was a double objective here. Firstly to deflect the debate away from WM and the Tories, but also secondly to provoke a reaction from those pesky cyber-bullies-nats we hear so much about. Have tempted a few foolish folks to go too far online, Yoon loyal media will then have the opportunity to make mischief.
Everyone on the YES side needs to be ever vigilant for traps.
The Rev’s tone is spot on, highlighting the pro Unionist BBC bias and real underlying issues. WoS has wisely not gone down the witch hunt route.
The BBC clearly conspired to keep the debate away from Westminster and general election issues. A day of reckoning will come!
Post Indy I would suggest the Scottish government takes over all the BBC assets in Scotland, but NONE of the staff. The staff would be free to apply for posts in the new SBC. Anyone who have has undermined Scottish democracy need not apply.
The Sun editor said in the press room that it would be his front page story. It wasn’t and tucked inside was a picture of her guzzling champagne in posh NT restaurant.
I was attacked on the Hootsmon’s Loyalist comment page for mentioning this.
“I was attacked on the Hootsmon’s Loyalist comment page for mentioning this.”
Did you remember to go through the decontamination process afterwards though Donald ?
It takes more than just a quick shower to get the bile stink right away.
My issue with this is that the BBC website are carrying the apology, not from themselves for their duplicity in this matter but that somehow the SNP tried to “smear” somebody.
Of course it was a person who asked a question which was a deliberate BBC attempt to embarrass the Scottish government and got caught by all their fellow media doing it, however that seems to have eluded their necks which seem entirely made of brass.
It has damaged the BBC I think.
There was a point when they would do their own reputation damage in the eyes of the public, not by us who know what they have been doing but by the obvious over egging of some of their schemes one day caught out by the public at large. Once you lose belief that you are a truthful speaker you are then seen for what you are.
I would dearly love to know why the Scottish branches of the Conservative Labour and Lib Dem parties are getting away with putting forward their own election manifestos in Scotland separate from the election manifestos of their parties down South.
I thought this was against the rules?
If we all fraudulently went to foodbanks week in week out, Free food, Power cards, Gas cards etc etc, maybe just maybe we could all afford a to holiday to the US, Bollinger, fancy food in fancy hotels and restaurants.
If this is the case and she did fraulently take food and power cards etc, then she should be hauled over the coals for her actions.
The “nurse” moment in the debate is generating far more debate than it deserves. I think this primarily because
1) The debate was a poorly managed heap of crap
2) The opposition to the SNP including the Eardlies and that ilk were desperate for an ambush and will take whatever opposrtunity comes their way no matter threadbare.
It should be noted that anyone who points out that it is threadbare is an evil Nat for looking to see how threadbare it is.
However, it is a sideshow. The real news is that “weird” and “wobbly” May has wobbled (again) and is desperately backing off on a manifesto that is less than a week old. We are going to trust this person to negotiate? Are we really that crazy?
Anyone hear how the poll in Wales went?
Agree with some comments that this is also likely a tactic to attempt to divide people. Again.
A huge and very convenient distraction from the real issues that will impact very heavily and very negatively on the people here in Scotland and the rUK. Who’s that guy employed by the Tories to advise (propagandise) on their ‘campaign’.
Expect more of this kind of thing happening and being ratcheted up big style in the run up to June 8th. It is more an indication surely then, of what this Tory,( unnessary)General election is all about.
KEEPING SCOTLAND, shackled. Brexit, England= Bankrupt. Simple.
Mike says:
They can ans should produce documents covering devolved issues, but even at that, why bother for a GE?
If the produce documents which contradict HQ on reserved issues, then that would be something for the Electoral Commission to take up.
I can’t be bothered doing a comparison but I do reckon they will be careful and it will be a mix of devolved stuff and other parts towing the main party line.
The objective, of course , is to pretend to have some Scottishness about themselves.
As ever the real villain in all of this is the britnat bbc.
A few months ago i was watching a programme about foodbanks, there was a young couple complaining that they had two kids, both had a job and they had to use foodbanks, what they did not say was, they had a big house with a mortgage, they did admit both of them had a car, needed to get to work ofc, i managed to get to work quite well on public transport when i was their age with kids to support, and a wife that did not work, ofc, i lived within my means, no mortgage, could not afford one, no car, could not afford one, and no holidays, could not afford them, that’s what’s wrong with some of todays generation, they want it all now, and its all on credit they cannot afford, i would have loved a big house with an extra room for my 3 kids, but alas i come from a generation with the attitude , if you cannot afford it, wait until you can afford it and don’t take risks with your hard earned money, think of your kids, if things go wrong they will suffer for your buy now pay later attitude to life and finance…. Rant over, Peace to all
@Mike says: 22 May, 2017 at 2:19 pm:
“I would dearly love to know why the Scottish branches of the Conservative Labour and Lib Dem parties are getting away with putting forward their own election manifestos in Scotland.
I may be wrong and I have not checked but are not the Scottish Tories actually a separate set-up from their English counterparts?
I know the Greens are separate from the English Greens and Labour are described as an integral part of the London Labour Party as, “An Accountancy Unit”.
In the same way Labour in Scotland stupidly sacrificed itself doing the tories’ dirty work during the first independence referendum, so now the bbc in Scotland is sacrificing itself doing the tories’ dity work in promoting britnat propaganda. Fewer and fewer people in Scotland will now give the bbc in Scotland, or elsewhere, the benefit of the doubt.
The bbc is finished in Scotland.
Don’t pay the britnat tax; let britnats pay for britnat propaganda.
“Hold politicians to account, aye, but ffs some woman off the street who happens to be in an audience? Leave her be.”
But, she is not “some woman off the street”.
She is a paid up member who is being used to troll.
Get real. We know the script by now.
OH for the SNP to have someone with the gallusness to go on one of the BBC’s Tory party political broadcasts (aka known as any BBC political programme and, when asked about a devolved issue replied:
“Sorry, Andrew/Gordon/Sarah/Whoever, that is a devolved issue – I am on here to discuss matters pertinent to the General Election, such as the total mess this Tory Government is making of Brexit/its insidious death tax/its plans to claw back powers from Holyrood, Belfast and Cardiff. Ask me about relevant Genera Election matters, I will answer, otherwise, get stuffed”.
It is way past time the SNP got nasty with the BBC – don’t be so bloody nice and co-operative.
Some consolation: there was a few moments of booing directed at shouty pointy Ruth. Little mention of that in the media reviews.
Just watched that awful woman, Jackie Bird, sum up the Scots Leaders’ Debate. She’s been beaming lies and propaganda into our living rooms for 29 years and seems to be staying there forevermore.
It’s a BBC rumour that she poisons all younger rivals by inviting them to dinner, then sedating them while she eats their brains like Hannibal Lecter and buries them in the BBC basement.
I digress. She immediately sums up by talking up the nurse putting NS and that it is often these ‘unexpected and personal’ audience moments which can turn a debate!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not so ‘unexpected’ you poisonous excuse of a journo, when you invited the nurse on in the first place with the sole intent to attack NS. Clegg swallowed the BBC farce which might explain his anger at being conned that he ran the story in the Record that she was not what she seemed at all.
Stu’s right. THis story is not about nursey. It’s about the BBC’s shadowy role inviting a plant to embarrass our FM. Out and out propaganda machine.
We are up against a sophisticated adversary. The BBC in general is an establishment tool, and in Scotland specifically is a propaganda 5th column for the yoons.
Encourage the boycott whenever you can. Decline to pay the tax. At events sponsored by them wear your badges and T-shirts. Don’t buy any product made by their organisation.
I heard a snippet on R4 today ( I know ) from a chap who has written a new book about India prior to 1947. He managed to inform the audience about the British being instrumental in setting up the Muslim Brotherhood there, and in ensuring that county’s partition. Hundreds of thousands of people died as a result of British duplicity. They had a long long history of running an empire. They cannot ever be underestimated.
In Ireland last century it is arguably the clout of the US and Mr Devalera being a US citizen which made Britain see “sense” there. Weakened by the second war and undermined by the US the Empire was broken up to suit their aganda. But We have only ourselves.
This fight might go on a hell of a lot longer than we anticipate. And it is by no means certain that the yoon side will let us go gently.
For now, don’t pay the TV tax. Vote only pro Indy parties. Ignore aunty. She is a serial abuser, and yer mum should have telt ye to keep away frae her.
Wasn’t there a similar incident with a nurse on a Better Together leaflet during the 2014 Referendum? Wasn’t there a similar ‘row’ afterwards about how she was just a poor nurse and the Vile Cybernats were picking on her? Is this another weak attempt at a straw man by the same people?? And, aren’t the press/BBC treating us like we’re extremely stupid – again?
Not impressed by Sturgeon on this one.
She handled the recent Dugdale implosion really well but she’s off the mark on this.
I suppose that’s why they are politicians.
The BBC are helping us here. Ordinary folk are starting to question their impartiality.
This all out attack by the British Establishment will work in our favour.
Slowly slowly catchee monkey.
Don’t pay the tory state propaganda machine’s tax.
I am off the impression that people have to be referred to food banks by Social Services.
was unaware anyone could just walk in of the street and help themselves.
If I am right, then who referred Claire Austin and which food bank did she attend.
Some woman off the street?? Oh she knew what she was there for right enough, saboteur,troll,Jeremy hunt is the man she needs to talk to about a pay rise,his party control the purse strings. Are you listening Scotland?
Whilst not defending the social media frenzy regarding this nurse, i feel that a lot of it was fuelled by the knowledge that if this was an indy supporting person, we know there would be a five page spread on every paper bar The National and repeated ad neauseum on Reporting Scotland
Pay Scales for a nurse in Scotland.
Band 1 through to
£16,293 £16,293 £17,534 £20,101 £22,440 £26,831 £32,013.
Band 9
£40,832 £47,563 £57,232 £68,599 £81,011
This is just some of them so what pay scale is Claire Austin,on its a pity Jo Coburn did not invite this nurse to and ask her what her pay is and what food bank she used but then again that is not the BBC way I don’t think this story is finished yet.
I didn’t watch it. It’s the same old shite with the BBC so rubbered it, but for the ones who are angry.
Get even, and get out the SNP vote in 2 and half weeks.
Jc after all this blatant anti snp propaganda,what more does it take for those ‘proudscotbuts ‘,to see the light? I’ll not hold my breath.
This nurse is apparently a member of the campaign group “Nurses fighting for decent pay”, which as Stu says is actually a laudable aim, not least in England where their latest pay recommendation was not implemented by the Tory Government. (Something which Sarah Smith somehow couldn’t bother to direct at Ruthless.)
However, this nurse started her question in the debate yesterday quite differently:
This was directed principally – and in the event exclusively – at the First Minister and followed directly on the heels of another chosen audience member who also falsely claimed, against all the evidence, that the obsession is the FM’s.
This anti-SNP prologue of the nurse had in fact nothing whatever to do with nurses’ pay. So why did she include it?
What then seems to have been missed from this whole sorry episode is that by linking nurses’ pay with a partisan Unionist attack on the FM, this questioner has actually besmirched and damaged the case for nurses’ pay, which objectively is entirely unrelated to the issue of Scottish independence. There are no doubt many nurses who would like to see both their pay improved and an independent Scotland.
Ms Austin has left a distinct sour aftertaste that she is merely using the issue of nurses’ pay for rather different – and less laudable – purposes.
“starlaw says:
22 May, 2017 at 3:04 pm
I am off the impression that people have to be referred to food banks by Social Services.
was unaware anyone could just walk in of the street and help themselves.
If I am right, then who referred Claire Austin and which food bank did she attend.”
Thanks for that I was about to ask if anyone has established if she lied on TV or if in fact she did obtain food from a foodbank. Seems highly unlikely given her salary. If she lied then everything else she said,supposedly in defense of nurses, is null and void in my opinion.
@Juteman says: 22 May, 2017 at 2:59 pm:
“The BBC are helping us here. Ordinary folk are starting to question their impartiality.”
Indeed so, Juteman. I’ve been pointing this sort of thing out on Wings for ages but it won’t stop the usual suspects from posting comments to Wings with the constant Drip! Drip! Drip! “SNP should be doing this that and the other”. “Nicola needs to up her game”. “The SNP should be more aggressive”. “Blah”! “Blah”! “Blah”! “Blah”!
Sometimes I wonder whose side some of them are on. My impression is that whatever the SNP/SG are doing it is working and working well. It may be a slow process but it works and it has got us this far from when I first began to support Scottish independence all those years ago. Then almost everyone treated us as dangerous and violent terrorists.
Mind you there’s still some Yoon, Britnat, Misogynistic, numpties who still make such claims but it isn’t too hard for an open minded and thinking person to see who the real dangerous, violent and stupid terrorists really are. The smell of abject hate and fear can be detected for 100 yds around any news outlet.
As we speak the gap between the two factions is plain to see in the comments sections of such as the Scotsman, Daily Mail and other on-line broadcaster’s websites.
So once again we have dirty underhanded tactics by the BBC and a certain Andrew Learmonth writing in todays National fell right into the BBC Yoon trap and stitch up when reporting on the so called Debate.
I never watch those debates now because they are Brit Nat stitch ups. Mister Learmonth needs a face palm with a deid fish. It wasn’t the first stitch up and it wont be the last.
The whole thing stinks of the usual collusion between BLiS and BBC as well.
Thank god for WoS!!!!!
As I said earlier, and as is her excuse, she asked around for questions. She obviously didn’t understand them or forgot the version she’d meant to ask and defaulted to the originals.
O/t davidbsb,re Ireland and de valera,If jack lynch (irish taoiseach,)back in 1969 had the balls to threaten Westminster with a Russian naval Base in (lough Foyle)Derry. The yanks would have stepped in,and all those years of brit bloodshed averted.
When something seems a bit fishy, it’s to be expected that’s there is a bit of flurry of activity as people try and work out what’s going on. Well done Stu for trying to get to the bottom of it.
@HandandShrimp
O/T The Wales poll result will be released at 16:00. Try Roger Scully on twitter.
WTF was Sarah Smith involved anyway? Apart from being a rather crap journalist she is so anti SNP like the rest of her ilk that she could not possibly be fair and balanced. Strange, odd audience too apart from the above, ahem ‘nurse’. Hope the STV debate will be more balanced – would not be difficult after watching that tbh .
Well all I can say is thank goodness for the internet, because without it, we’d all have gone to bed last night worrying about the poor nurse who goes to foodbanks.
Seriously, it is now becoming an utter joke the nonsense that the liars at the BBC are indulging in. I now question ANYTHING on ANY subject by the BBC. Their news is pure anti SNP propaganda, their history programmes are pure britnat nonsense, with history from a very, very ENGLISH point of view.
The BBC is now just one big expensive joke. They are peddling bare faced lies to Scots, day in, day out.
I know they have always been against the idea, but I do genuinely believe that the SNP gains nothing from appearing on any BBC programmes or interviews. They should just boycott them altogether. Of course intially they will take a bit of flak, but longer term, more and more Scots will start to realise why the democratically elected Scottish Government refuses to have anything to do with the liars and propagandists at the BBC.
When it’s got to the point where even pro-Unionist papers like The Sun and The Daily Record admit BBC Scotland are at it, it really has to stop. Why does Nicola Sturgeon insist on offering up her teeth for the inevitable BBC booting, over and over again? If May can get away with not turning up at debates then why not Sturgeon? Turning up is like saying to the BBC: “Please boot me in the teeth!”. Surely there’s a limit to how many times she needs to be taught that lesson?
I was on question time with my wife a while ago, we didn’t get invited back to any other program to voice our questions.perhaps they weren’t the correct ones!
Tried a few times since,no luck so far,could be wrong type of supporters.
Nicola Sturgeon was first class, how she handles this shit is a marvel. Where would Scotland be without her?
@starlaw says:22 May, 2017 at 3:04 pm:
” … If I am right, then who referred Claire Austin and which food bank did she attend.”
Haud oan the noo. Starlaw. Are you not jumping the gun a wee bit there?
Before getting into those questions the first question has to be is the woman telling the truth that she has had to use food banks and if she was could it be as a result of her low pay or perhaps an error of a bank account or her employer being late in paying her wages or some such cause.
Her claim also inferred that it was due to her low earnings as a nurse in the SNHS – but was it?
Let us not jump to conclusions and start at the beginning.
Bob Park. 1.40pm
Very intriguing post Bob. Sound like NHS here is on the right track.
I’m looking forward to the dismantling of the BBC after independence and its replacement with a Scottish service.
Jesus wept, this little gem in the “scottish” Labour Manifesto,
link to scottishlabour.org.uk
The Curriculum for Excellence
was a bold policy conceived
by Scottish Labour, but it has
been undermined by poor
implementation by the SNP.
Teachers have not received the
support and resources they
need to successfully introduce
and deliver the new curriculum.
Instead, like so many public sector
workers in Scotland, they are being
asked to do more for less.
So basically the CfE was a gift to the SNP from the outgoing Labour administration which we’re now seeing the results of but it’s all the fault of the SNP for not throwing money at it rather than it being a stupid fucking idea in the first place regardless of how well intentioned it was.
Remember, you can still register to vote.
link to gov.uk
You have until late tonight. Do it, and make sure you vote, so we can ensure the red and blue tories have no success in Scotland.
How many people have used foodbanks across the UK in the past year? Over a million, isn’t it? How many of them do you suppose drink Champagne, fly off to New York on holiday and send their kids to exclusive, fee-paying schools. Not bloody many, I’ll bet.
Sure, nobody knows about anyone else’s financial situation, and no-one should be reaching for their torches and pitchforks, but come on! It’s not much of a stretch to suspect there’s something fishier going on here than the contents of Baldrick’s apple crumble.
IndyRef2 might be a while off yet, but the propaganda war has already begun in earnest. And it’s only going to get dirtier.
I repeat my previous post.
Play the ball, not the nurse!
Whether she is a nurse or not, or whether she is NHS or BUPA employed is not that important in the great scheme of things.
If she is a liar, then more fool her. It hasn’t seemed to have harmed Alasdair Carmichael much. I think it may be enough that her own colleagues don’t seem too happy with her.
The REAL issue is the the National Broadcasting company CHOSE to include a question about Scottish nurses in a GE WM debate. i.e knowingly included a devolved matter in a TV debate on WM policies.
That is wrong!
The question should have been ‘outed’ as a devolved matter and then batted to the leader of the Conservative and Unionist party, Ms. Davidson who is the representative of the WM government in Scotland and whose party is responsible for all decisions on Nurses’ pay in Britain.
All participants should have been invited to comment after the Conservatives and then Nicola could have pointed out the steps that the Scottish government has taken to mitigate those policies in Scotland.
Sarah Smith was woefully inadequate in stewarding this debate and admitted that they had deliberately allowed discussions on devolved matters because they know that will influence the vote. She admitted that the impartial BBC knowingly tried to influence the outcome of the election.
That remark should be reported to the Broadcasting Standards committee and the Electoral Commission.
That a gullible nurse has been made the scapegoat for all the ‘sins’ of the BBC is par for the course. People should not play with fire.
We can understand why our frustration at the BBC bias has caused people to investigate the nurse’s background, but sadly nothing is below them tactics wise now and a lot of the general public still believe the BBC.
It is the BBC who should be slated for this debacle.
@Robert J. Sutherland
Well spotted, she did indeed ask the FM if it would cost her her seat which in fact it couldn’t because the FM has no seat in the HOC
So a completely and totally irrelevant question designed to illicit an audience response
Which makes you kinda wonder how does someone with even a modicum of education not know that Nicola Sturgeon isn’t a MP given that the questioner even lives in Edinburgh
Are the powers that be who would defend this woman saying she’s educated enough to be a Nurse but doesn’t know what the First Minister of Scotlands job is
because if they are defending her on that basis then the nursing profession is in trouble because we would have morons working in it
But we really know no matter how you slice it or analyse it
this is definitely not the case
The only conclusion left therefore is collusion by other actors, and that the burden of suspicion because of past record of the BBC in this area, circumstantial though it may be, falls on them, unless they can prove otherwise
The prosecution rests m’lud
This was a concerted black ops by the BBC. From the line-up of Holyrood mps (why was NS on this?) to the plants in the audience, through to the ‘commentariat’ of the usual suspects of bitter SNPBad ‘journalists’. Jackie Bird could hardly control her pleasure at the outcome of the preordained stichup of NS.
Sarah Smith’s performance was a disgrace and in any normal world would merit sacking. But we live in a colony and these paid liars have been colluding for years to undermine the elected representatives of our country at all costs.
Personally, I am fed up of the SNP’s naivety in the face of brute force by the Brits. Hoping that the uncommitted will see through the artifice of this conspiracy is..to my mind..a vain hope. Try speaking to some of them on the doorstep!
I suggested a long time ago that the SNP needed to start educating the general populace about how Scotland funds itself and how our powers are so meagre. Yet there are those on here who think people aren’t interested in explanation as why the ‘£15 billion deficit’ lie does not need destroyed explicitly.
If enough folk buy the sort of shite being flung about last night then we aint gonna win anytime soon believe me.
One question : if nursery is lying about her status in the NHS and to actually using foodbanks…does this not merit disciplinary action against her by her employers?
David McDowell says:
Its all about proportionality. BBC is worth £billions, with unlimited cash, resources, liggers.
SO its clearly a tactical choice being made, probably made a long time ago. 4th estate, UK 4th estate BBC, must always be not exactly bowed down to, not exactly knuckling under the BBC but certainly not challenged, more of SNP acquiescing, far less battle it out with them, they are the boss BBC.
Everyone knows BBC Scotland is 100% pro tory, anti SNP and certainly anti Holyrood.
4th estate UK status is what gives all newsrooms and certainly all producers and editors, the confidence and the power to really get stuck in, shape and frame UK democracy and its haha democracy, wipe out threats, SNP, Greens, use and exploit useful idiots like UKIPers, protect and boost royals and the Lords. Look at how happy and confident Jacky Bird, Sarah Smith, all kinds of laughing hacks and liggers were in the BBC press spin room, MSP’s included.
Its what the UK is, or certainly what England is. And they all seem to like it too. Even if by some miracle Jezza does win, he’s hardly a radical threat to any of the UK estates at all. But their biggest threat today is ofcourse Scottish democracy and the SNP.
Scotland is ruled by the BBC, its their region, we just live in it. And lets face it, for at least a third of Scotland, BBC world is pretty fantastic.
Wales: Poll
link to blogs.cardiff.ac.uk
@David McDowell says: 22 May, 2017 at 3:47 pm:
Yes David, Great idea – let’s all blame the Nicola as you have just done. It’s all Nicola Sturgeon’s fault for meekly turning up to get kicked in the teeth yet again.
Has it never entered your head that it takes a lot of guts to turn up knowing you are probably going to get kicked in the teeth again?
Nicola does it and when it happens there are some previous unionist voters suddenly see the truth that the Union and its propaganda wing a rotten through the core. We have a great bunch of hard working and long suffering MPs who are regularly abused by unionists while doing their jobs at Westminster.
Tune in to Parliament TV when the next session begins and see it for yourself.
When it’s got to the point where even pro-Unionist papers like The Sun and The Daily Record admit BBC Scotland are at it, it really has to stop. Why does Nicola Sturgeon insist on offering up her teeth for the inevitable BBC booting, over and over again? If May can get away with not turning up at debates then why not Sturgeon? Turning up is like saying to the BBC: “Please boot me in the teeth!”. Surely there’s a limit to how many times she needs to be taught that lesson?
Lochside
Sarah Smith is just a BBC sock puppet. If it wasnt her, they’d get some other sock puppet to present their frauds.
Behind Sarah are dozens of very high paid grizzled old BBC tories sitting round Pacific Quay conference tables, day in day out, working out the best ways to take down the SNP. God knows they have a lot of experience.
Even all new and exciting Donalda Mac, will have almost no say in how the BBC in London want Scotland to vote.
“The bbc is finished in Scotland.”
I would love to believe that, but it can only happen after independence, and that will not be allowed to happen while the BBC has a breath left in it’s body!
People may be ‘slowly’ coming to realise what we on here have known for years (that the BBC is simply a corrupt, establishment organisation), but will it be soon enough, before Holyrood is dismantled by Maggie May?
We must get out of this lunatic Union.
heedtracker@4:07pm
“David McDowell says:
Its all about proportionality. BBC is worth £billions, with unlimited cash, resources, liggers.”
I didn’t say that.
In the nursery…
link to imgur.com
Our nurse was a willing stooge of the unionist BBC.
The debate was in regard to the General Election. She went in to cause damage by embellishment of the situation. Do not plead a case as yours when it is not. Many of us can tell a story of ATOS or Foodbanks. However we would never claim it as OUR story (I accept that a few on here could tell that story from direct experience).
She was shouting about the austerity pay rise limit imposed by the Tories to the UK and via consequential so to Scotland. Her spin was to put the blame on the Scottish Government.
She was fully aware of what she was doing as were the BBC.
She lied and therefore deserves no sympathy.
Meg merrilees @ 15:56:
Several good points there, Meg, and not least that one.
We’ve been rather distracted by the all-too-obvious dodgy nurse, but that wasn’t the only such infringement. The second segment of the programme began with a teacher going off on another devolved issue – teaching. Now we know nothing about her – maybe she was also a plant or maybe she wasn’t – but the BBC knew fine well what her question was beforehand, since (as we know) they always vet these things in advance, and they deliberately selected her to ask that question. So this devo-tilt wasn’t just some wee accident of an audience member going “off piste” somehow.
No, this was a deliberate setup, and the BBC has been caught red-handed at it. Even though they are now trying to rewrite history on their website by pretending that it was really all Joanna Cherry’s fault or somesuch.
Biased Craven Contemptible
Robert Peffers@ 4:09 says:
“Has it never entered your head that it takes a lot of guts to turn up knowing you are probably going to get kicked in the teeth again?”
No Robert, here’s exactly what enters my head:
If Nicola is turning up knowing she is “probably going to get kicked in the teeth again” then it’s a matter of debate whether that shows her “guts” or her stupidity. I’m entitled to my opinion and won’t be bullied into not giving it by anyone. I take heart that several other people in this forum clearly agree with me.
The poll from Wales is a Blimey! indeed.
Mayhem must be trying to throw this election Shirley? However, now is the time to redouble our efforts. The Tories appear to be crumbling in their own chaos (no coalition required).
Don’t know if it has been mentioned but the punch line in Greg Moodie’s cartoon in today’s National is, guess what! ” Wings Over Scotland”!!
How his Fame spreads!!
orri @3.55 – ha ha excellent digging ,the deeper you get the worse it becomes , a close inspection works wonders .
I believe if the BBC told the truth for one week, we’d be independent in one week.
Nursey has attracted most of the comment, meaning the performance of Ruth ‘raging bull(shit)’ Harrison has avoided its deserved scrutiny. She seems to have two settings. That manic grin thing, or a face of pure twisted hatred. A weird and angry woman.
Poor Dugdale seemed to be just plain angry as well. Her infantile reactions to Sturgeon were embarassing, certainly nowhere near the standard required for a (ahem) national party leader.
Rennie occasionally erred into sense when he rounded on the real and obvious enemy (blue tories). I was able to take him a bit more seriously when theres no animals humping in the background.
Harvie I thought behaved like a sensible grown-up politician, commenting on issues (as opposed to barking BS at NS then shouting over her attempts to answer stuff like ‘she wont say’).
And as for the Kipper, I thought he was OK for what he is, he got his (wrong) views over quite succinctly & didnt just attack Sturgeon, even having a pop at the tories. Kippers in Scotland, got to at least give them a modicum of credit for attending with a straight face.
The wheels have come off the Tory bus in Wales. Let’s hope engine blows up in Scotland.
The thing I don’t understand is how people on benefits who use food banks and live on less than £4,000 a year are demonised yet workers who use food banks and live on £20,000 a year are pitied. All the while we are told that working is the best way out of poverty.
I find her bad mouthing of other nurses rather bizarre (calling them a ‘disgrace to their profession’). It all lends credence to the idea that she’s just using the issue of nurses’ pay to further her own agenda. Whether she was lying or not about using food banks, the whole impression she gave was a negative one.
Holy shit. Has there ever been such a weak tory leader than Mayhem. I’d love to see the look on likes of Bird and Ligger Neil’s puss right now, under layers of slap, varnish, botox and hair dye.
link to independent.co.uk
For non Scots WoS readers, puss is colloquial round here for face, not actual pussy cats.
The next time an snp member stands up in front of a live debate.first words to address an answer/audience should be. For the benefit of ebc plants ,i shall answer a question only once.
I’ll leave this here.
link to twitter.com
defo says:
22 May, 2017 at 12:25 pm
Martin says
“Hold politicians to account, aye, but ffs some woman off the street who happens to be in an audience? Leave her be.”
She hardly looks like that Martin, didn’t you read the post ?
She didn’t just “happen to be in an audience” mate.
Her question was deemed so important that she was invited last night, because they didn’t manage to get that juicy piece of SNP Bad squeezed into last weeks propaganda fest.
If it smells like a plant…
INdeed, but go after the BBC,not her. People are just giving fuel to the unionists fire. I honestly thought we’d gone beyond being that stupid.
@Thepnr Here’s Two wee videos showing a bit of a meltdown in the Tory campaign
Weak and wobbly
link to youtube.com
Boris chased
link to twitter.com
Exactly Richardinho,why on earth would other nurse’s be a ‘disgrace to their profession?. She was definitely “no woman off the street “.
I am really disappointed in Joanna Cherry she should know a lot better especially as a QC.
It has completely taken the gloss off a story that was going badly wrong for the Unionists and the BBC who have now been able to turn the story back.
Will we never learn.
I can say factually that the lady concerned was not speaking on behalf of all nurses. Incidentally is she a member of a trade union who may dubiously make such a tall claim?
Do I think nurses should be paid more? Yes. – and nursing assistants, physiotherapists, occupational therapists, radiologists, microbiologists, porters, audiologists, maintenance staff. No redundancy packages should be extended and not just for nurses.
BBC set up and do I feel sorry for the person concerned? No .They chose their 5 mins in the limelight . Hell mend her. I’m such a caring person too.
Well I was talking to a Daily Mail Tory woman 83 yrs old again this morning in the cafe.
The one I mentioned last week who didn’t know her pension was safe in WM hands and they would pay it to her even if Scotland was independent.
She watched the debate and never mentioned Nurse but said she “noticed that the debate was a bit confrontational and didn’t like how Sturgeon was bullied”.
Switched off after the first 20 mins.
Meanwhile the latest UK polls are putting the wind up the Tories and ‘hey presto’ we have a reaction today.
link to archive.is
How will the sub-samples up here go …. don’t know, but the SNP will still be in charge after the stour settles.
I call out shortbread almost on a daily basis. I have learned to not watch these ambushes and excuses for our kilted auntie to piss on Scotland.
But don’t worry too much folks there is a long way to go and a Brexit winter is coming to Darn Sarf! Lots of leavers wish they had not been so rash.
Thepnr 4.36. Wales have an advantage,no sectarian orange bigots.
If the SNP continues to play this game using the BBC’s rules we will LOSE any second referendum. The SNP were told this before the first referendum and they are being told it again now. The SNP need to play a much shrewder media game. This latest blatant stitch up proves the BBC is still the real political opposition, not the Tory corpse they are trying to animate like a puppet. The SNP cannot lead us to independence by co-operating with these BBC weasels. When will they face up to that reality?
link to en.m.wikipedia.org
to found a “hospital” (then the name for this kind of charitable school) to care for the “puir, faitherless bairns” (Scots: poor, fatherless children) of Edinburgh.
scholarship could be an option if it’s charitable status relied on it.
OT, Welsh Westminster voting intention:
LAB: 44% (+9)
CON: 34% (-7)
… oh please, please let there be a swing against the Tories in Scotland’s like that!
Even if it was simply away from the Tories and spread amongst other parties (i.e. Not just all to SNP) it would be good IMO. The threat in this GE to SNP and Indy is mainly from the Tories.
OK.
Somebody has to do the dirty work.
And it shouldn’t all be left to the Rev.
So hold your nose and realise that the BBC has previous when it comes to planting nurses.
link to archive.is
I am always amazed when people commentators etc say that the S.N.P. Are obsessed with independence I mean do they not realise that was what the party was founded for and why it exists ?
Email from Kezia.. (Labour champion.. LOL)
Dear Croomp,
Today we launched our Scottish Labour manifesto.
You can watch my speech here and read the manifesto here.
Our opposition to a divisive second independence referendum is at the heart of our manifesto.
Voters across Scotland can use their vote on June 8 to send Nicola Sturgeon a message that she needs to get on with the day job.
But they can also use their vote to elect a Labour champion for their constituency and deliver a government that works for the many, not the few. In seats across Scotland, only Labour can defeat the SNP – the Tories aren’t at the races.
A Labour government would introduce a £10 Living Wage, grow our economy and invest in our valued public services.
Over the next two weeks, we will take our message across every constituency and every home in the country.
But we need your help. We need volunteers to help our teams across the country – and we need every penny we can to make sure we can deliver a Labour government on June 8.
Unlike the Tories and the SNP we are not bankrolled by millionaires and tycoons. Can you afford to chip in to elect a Labour government?
Together we’re Stronger.
Thank you,
Kez
Kezia Dugdale
Scottish Labour Leader
I observed Austen in QT on 11 May on Utube. Who was the man sitting on her right side? Was he the Tory Cooncillor?
@Me at 5:04pm
“The threat in this GE to SNP and Indy is mainly from the Tories”
Should perhaps simply be
“The threat in this GE to the SNP, Indy, and Scotland is mainly from the Tories.”
I am not prepared to belabour our own leadership with the type of criticism I am reading here – they have more than enough to contend with.
Keep it to yourself and be wary of splits and divisions.
Your own impatience is likely to be an embarrassment.
It is the integrity of the SNP’s positions and policy-making which will eventually win out, I am absolutely sure of it.
Here is a suggestion for our MSP’s etcetera
Check you facts then respond. Far more effective.
Have you never heard of a trap? I hope mr Mundell has sent the appropriate email/ tweet.
Having said that the BBC and patsy overstepped themselves.
I’ve been thinking of the Struggling and Foodbanks.
Here’s a wee bit of information from The Herald in November 2009 about the salaries at the BBC in Scotland.
“Ken MacQuarrie, the director of BBC Scotland, earns between £190,000 and £220,000, leading the list of 10 executives at BBC Scotland whose salaries are published today by The Herald, after a request under the Freedom of Information Act……”
“The second-highest earner in Scotland is Donalda MacKinnon, the head of BBC Scotland’s programmes and services, whose salary is between £130,000 and £160,000.
Six senior managers – Bruce Malcolm, Atholl Duncan, Ewan Angus, Anne Mensah, Andrea Miller and Alan Tyler – earn between £100,000 and £130,000, while Donald-Iain Brown and John Maxwell Hobbs earn between £70,000 and £100,000……”
2017—-Donalda MacKinnon is now the Director of BBC Scotland. 🙂
Bless.
I didn’t watch the debate last night, but I did catch the earlier BBC evening news broadcast. It attempted to frame the Westminster election in Scotland as being about “Scottish independence” (directly referencing the Tory election campaign slogan), and included an interview with Alex Massie (an independently minded journalist with no known political preferences apparently) and a vox pop with some people attending a race meeting at Kelso.
If the “public service” broadcaster had attempted to characterise the election in England as being about “strong and stable government”, then included an interview with Charles Moore as a supposedly neutral observer, and concluded with a vox pop of Ascot race goers, I think the roars of outrage would have been heard across all of England’s green and pleasant land.
Once again, it all comes down to the BBC’s practices. Devolved questions by people invited back onto BBCQT.
Either of those two issues blocked and it would never have happened.
Is the BBC corrupt or negligent? Either way, they are not fit for purpose.
I haven’t seen mentioned that Mrs May had a nurse and foodbank interview, where she said that there are many reasons why people visit food banks!
Camz 5.35
See my 5.06
Not fit for purpose.
And Joanna Cherry’s stupidity is enabling the BBC to focus the story on her apology.
Like other Wingers, I have been saying for ages that those representing the SNP have to be more aggressive with the BBC.
If they keep bending over…..
I didn’t watch last nights bun fight, I just couldn’t bring myself to do it.
Why are we all so surprised when the establishment owned propaganda machine gets to show the people who’s in charge?
Inform Scotland banners can be bought at yeshighland.net
Take a banner to marches or do what YesAirdrie is doing and set up a yes stall with our Inform Scotland BBC misreporting Scotland banner…stick it in their faces at every turn. Let others see that they should maybe take a closer look at what the BBC is doing. This is the only way to bring them down, get the message out. You can also get our car stickers from Lindsay Bruce at ayemail. We are a not for profit group.
Mark Fletcher – well said.
If the BBC and its Scottish Colony at PQ are innocent of political bias surely they would not object to a program along the following lines as they obviously feel that they have nothing to fear from a public interrogation.
A 2 hour program in QT format where a panel of BBC Scotland superstars face questioning by an audience consisting of members of the public but including politicians.
Suggested panel members – Donalda Wotsername, Glen Campbell, Jackie Bird, Toodloo Taylor, KayE, Sarah Smith and Gordon Brewer.
I can’t think of a suitable chairman but perhaps other wingers might have suggestions.
Trailer for tonight’s Misreporting Scotland has just had Bird announcing that it will be highlighting Nursegate.
Now Reporting Scotland is repeating what that nurse said as read. Jackie Bird asks, “Nurses and Foodbanks, how widespread are they? “Cheeky cow.
Apparently at 6.30 pm, Reporting Scotland is going to cover the NurseGate story, stating ‘a nurse has to use foodbanks, how widespread is this?’
I wonder if they will give the details of her lavish life style, that many of us could only dream of.
BBC reduce Scotland’s politics to sewer level just to prove that Scotland is uniquely incapable of mature governance. That’s what these ‘shows’ are really about. Don’t buy their narrative. Tipping point is nearing…fast.
Is it not the case that all Joanna Cherry is guilty of, if guilty at all, is re-tweeting what on the face of it was a perfectly plausible tweet from somebody else which proved to be inaccurate.
However, her alleged despicable act of doing so is being built up into some sort of cause celebre in an attempt to blow a smoke screen over last night’s disgracefully rigged BBC alleged GE Debate which wasn’t.
Gus 1940 @ 6.01
Robert Peffers
Oh no! Scotland’s about to get poorer! Nurse! Nurse!
link to thenational.scot
I’m going to have to call BS on all of this. If she has friend and family who can buy her trips to New York why won’t they help with the odd tin of beans. Sorry, just don’t believe it.
I usually just lurk. But I will share the content of my complaint to the BBC, not that I expect a meaningful reply.
In ‘The Leaders’ Debate, on 21st. May,the topic was supposed to be ‘The General Election’. Towards the end of the programme, a red headed nurse (Claire Austin?) was allowed to ask questions which were related to a devolved issue, the NHS, and therefore should have had no part in this debate. It was later revealed by her that she had been on Question Time on 11th May, but had not been able to ask her question then, and was therefore invited onto The Leaders’ Debate. Is this true? If so, it means that the BBC staff connived in arranging unfair questions in the programme,which placed members of the Scottish Government at a disadvantage, since they had to defend their record in Government, whereas the members of UK parties, who were in fact responsible for these issues had no need to explain their policies. It is difficult to understand how BBC staff on the programme were not aware of the unsuitability of these questions. Was this person specifically invited onto the programme?
Was the content of her question known by the BBC staff before she asked it?
Did Sarah Smith and Jackie Bird consider asking such a question in this context acceptable?
Does the BBC , as an institution, consider this acceptable?
What action does the BBC intend to take Now?
What will the BBC do now to ensure this does not happen again?
Will the BBC take action in the future to prevent a recurrence?
Oh it’s smearing time again
We’re gonnae leave them
Ye can see that rabid yoon look in their eyes
They will plot and scheme tae keep us in the union
Oh it’s time for aw that smearing shite again…
🙂
Just another point occurred to me-
Surely ALL nurses in England, N.Ireland, Wales and Scotland know that the NHS is devolved and who is in charge in their area of employment.
They must have heard about the Junior Doctor’s strike over pay and the role Jermey Hunt plated in that.
The woman in the spotlight suggested that ‘they’ are on the point of striking and if she is in a trades’ Union then she definitely knows who is to blame and where to take her argument.
Sorry Ms. Austen I’m trying to be fair BUT Nursegate not looking very good for you.
Beginning to look like there was indeed an unholy alliance or in plain English – a stitch up.
I think Nicola handed it brilliantly by saying that her own sister works in the NHS and tells her what it is really like.
What was tRuthless doing throughout all this?
I didn’t get to see it.
Heh, heh, great article from someone who takes no prisoners.
gus1940
I agree.
However, this is called ‘clutching at straws’. They are so desperate that they think they can bring down a scalp like Joanna’s – that would be a massive coup.
However, I think her instant apology will defuse lot of that.
Some of this afternoon’s headlines ….
“SNP minister accused of backing ‘smear’ against nurse who attacked Nicola Sturgeon during TV debate” – Telegraph
“Dugdale attacks SNP “dirty tricks” over controversial nurse” – Herald
“Kezia Dugdale blasts SNP over ‘smear campaign’ as ‘foodbank’ nurse is hounded with abuse” – Record
“Nicola Sturgeon backs SNP candidate accused of nurse “smear”” – Scotsman
… the opportunity to attack the SNP fully exploited.
No mention of the BBC wilfully orchestrating deflection from actual general election issues.
No investigative journalism to explore the validity of the claims not their authenticity.
Im with a lot of folk on here… the SNP need to grow a pair. All this apologising crap is weak. Salmond would never have been so tame.
What was tRuthless doing throughout all this?
I didn’t get to see it.
She looked like a scary ventriloquist doll, with only two looks, wide eyed mental and very wide eyed mental. She’ll have to work on that, if she’s going to tv debate again. BBC camera’s protected the worst of Ruth’s gurning, which they do always with tory oddballs, like May and her mouth drop thing, when she tries to be funny. Scary, beeb gimp cut away, fast as light.
It is worth a look by the way.
BBC website in full SNP attack mode, highlighting the SNP MP apology, way down the page the lifestyle anomalies. Strangely no mention of why someone was specifically invited to ask devolved question at debate. In this context the ITV debate puts the BBC to shame.
Who initially put out the misinformation, looks like a beautifully set up attack on the SNP. After all, as already, mentioned why was she invited back to ask a specifically non GE question.
The BBC now feels it has the SNP on the back foot, I feel a HoL place being prepared for some BBC Scotland staff. But it really needs to be the BBC that is under scrutiny by the people of Scotland.
Re the SNP media handling strategy.
No one knows for sure whether a more robust confrontational approach against the media/bbc would help or hinder our cause of Independence.
One thing I do know.
Donald Trump defied the Establishment and won US Presidency at least in part by calling out the media head on for what they are.
He is a winner,we are losers.
That is not to say it would definitely work in our case,but no one can know for sure it wouldn’t make a difference.
It’ a delicate matter and could backfire as not everyone has the mad Donald’s panache.
The BBC still running with the poor little rich nurse being the star of the debate.
How utterly corrupt can a State broadcaster be?
I would trust North Korean news before I put any faith in anything the BBC tells me.
“Poor nursey was in tears when i met her…”
Aye, big crocodile tears.
If you support independence, or even if you just like your country, BIN THE BEEB.
Give yourself a pay rise, STOP PAYING the tory propaganda tax.
It’ a delicate matter and could backfire as not everyone has the mad Donald’s panache.”
You are a trolling again Dak. Fair enough. Trump’s a neo fascist who lost. He lost the vote and won the electoral college. He’s essentially a US game show host and we’ll be lucky to get through his reign without massive wars and bloodshed.
So no, don’t copy Trump.
BBC just did a piece, not too bad. It flagged the higher rates in Scotland, and Brian T made it clear the pay rate, as recommended by the UK pay body has been implemented here.
That’s the bit Nicola could have put more emphasis into, but she was on the back foot.
They reported that said nurse was referred twice in 5 years to a food bank, in very specific circs.
So, there we have it, finally, the truth.
I find it somewhat bizarre on a day when the PM does U turn on a 5 day old manifesto that the only interesting thing the BBC can find to say about an election is whether the SNP were too critical of a particularly weird setup the BBC themselves had contrived.
The BBC are a joke and they are fake news personified.
However, we have wasted enough time on this dross. There is an election to win
Mis-reporting Scotland seizing the chance to repeat the attack on the Scottish government.
…the poor nurse was in tears and had been referred TWICE to Foodbanks…a little bit of journalism would have been useful here.
She is not a new start, nor is she an aux. so please BBC tell me how she fell below the net but can still have her public Facebook lifestyle?
She has now been used twice in 24hrs by the BBC. If she was so crushed by the response of the first outing why give the BBC an exclusive?
Bit of a spanner in the bbc lies..sorry, works..
“As far as we know a nurse has never used a foodbank” – Trussell Trust spokesperson.
BBC defence is that these devolved questions are legitimate. The query is was the majority of questions on devolved matters, if it was then is smells of a set up by the BBC to attack the FM. The BBC really needs to justify its stance on this debate.
We really need to have other broadcasters and the licence fee separated, subscribing to the BBC should now be optional without blocking out other broadcasters. I know some will tell me just to not pay it but I don’t want to get involved in a continuous threat of legal action.
As said before: the real culprit in all of this is the bbc.
Don’t pay the bbc tax: let britnats pay for britnat propaganda.
Steven Jardine will be discussing the ‘storm’ around Nursie at 10.30.
Getting their money’s worth out of this bullshit.
I noticed a link from “Poverty Alliance”. It states “.It is not up to us to make a moral judgement about how people spend their money.”
What a load of Shit. It makes comments all the time about the “rich” the “middle classes” and others. How WE spend our money is a moral judgement.
If we spend money on nuclear weapons as opposed to overseas aid, whether we enjoy a trip to New York have a slap up meal is a moral judgement.
If the wealthy RCN, UNITE, UNISON, BMA leaders all wish to give up 1/2 of their salaries then I would be happy to hear of it and will give them praise.
Now in the real world. I have worked all my life, good jobs bad jobs including cleaning folks backsides. Some paid less than nurses. What does this prove? It is an unfair world. What is my moral judgement to try and deal with this? Vote for Scottish Independence.
What were the circumstances Valerie?
“They reported that said nurse was referred twice in 5 years to a food bank, in very specific circs.”
On the idea that the nurses appearance is questioned, did anyone else notice with about 22/23 minutes left on the program last night, Ruth davidson subtly nudged the host and pointed in a direction for the next question from the audience. Tory trying to guide the debate?
The Reporting Scotland item just ended was breathtaking in its selectivity but at least one nugget of fact escaped the general obfuscation, that the Trussell Trust are unaware of any nurses using their food banks. Much emphasis was laid on the point that Ms Austin has been in tears over social media abuse but none on the questions raised in the Unionist press.
I suppose I should recognise the acknowledgment that Scottish nurses do earn a little more than their counterparts in rUK. And the reminder that I haven’t been to the Nurses’ Food Bank aka Malmaison for some time.
The thing at the moment is just how gullible are those in the rUK and indirectly Scotland.
Didn’t we have a consultation on extra powers for Holyrood that, despite propaganda to the contrary, was largely ignored?
So elect May with a mandate including a hastily tacked on grave robbing permission and don’t delude yourself that after consultation any cap will be introduced.
We, in Scotland, are already wise to this con.
On a lighter note, did anyone just witness Coburn’s Party pitiful broadcast ?
Twice nearly called the uk the EU, and almost a “oh aye..and this…” moment !!
Filmed on an old nokia with only 45 seconds of video…oh deary me, ma sides are hurtin’.!!
Did the Bird just say on Reporting Scotland that the FM has had to apologize to the nurse? Has anyone seen this apology?
Rock says:
21 May, 2017 at 9:49 pm
“I have no doubt that we will learn all about the “ordinary” nurse in a W O S article very soon.
The “independence supporting” The National should be on standby to offer the Rev. Stuart Campbell a reasonable fee to reproduce it as front page headline news the next day.”
Over to you, The National’s lobbyists here.
“Well, he’s got a point. Joanna Cherry is a QC, for Christ’s sake, she should know better than to go parroting rumours.”
This is what had me holding my head in my hands. We know the media will get huge mileage out of this when actually they should be on the back foot.
Just couldn’t believe JC could be so bloody stupid.
I have a cousin who volunteers for a foodbank. Some of her tales of customers are quite horrendous – this is a true blight on our society – but not one, if indeed in work, has anything like the apparent resources of this person. Referrals come via the DWP, the doctor and, I believe, the local churches. And you MUST (certainly for her foodbank) be referred to benefit. So who referred this individual?
@Brian McHugh
Didn’t say what the special circs were. It might be between jobs?? Not sure why they didn’t say.
Brian T said there was an apology from SNP about alleging she was married to a Tory councillor. He said, as these things go back and forth on social media.
I’m more angry that two visits in 5 years to a food bank was clearly played out as – can’t survive, not sustainable, have to go to food banks.
Nursie sure as hell didn’t say twice in 5 years!
“They reported that said nurse was referred twice in 5 years to a food bank, in very specific circs.”
That seems a bit too vague for me. She was ‘referred’, by whom, her Da, and did she actually go to a Foodbank.
All sounds a bit conveniently BBC dodgy/made up to me I’m afraid.
One_Scot says:
22 May, 2017 at 6:07 pm
“”Apparently at 6.30 pm, Reporting Scotland is going to cover the NurseGate story, stating ‘a nurse has to use foodbanks, how widespread is this?’””
?
……………..
Well according to the BBC report it is not very widespread despite framing a question that seemed to suggest it was. The Royal College of Nursing said about 40 nurses or so had applied for help via their hardship fund. So not so widespread.
When giving his spiel at the end I thought I heard Brian Taylor say responsibility for setting pay for nurses was devolved but then later he said pay is decided for whole UK.
Anyone else hear that? Which is correct? I thought pay was set for whole UK by the Pay Review board for nurses. And the 1% cap for public service employees was a UK Government policy.
TheStrach,
“As ever the real issue is the BBC. They won’t change and will continue to pump out unionist propaganda and lies until we gain our independence.”
It would need a massive revolution to gain independence as long as the BBC exists in Scotland.
And it is not going to happen any time soon.
Because it takes at least 620 years to grow a spine.
Why are we complaining about the BBC from our armchairs?
As if they are going to pay any attention.
Destroy the BBC, enemy number one of the Scottish people.
Valerie. I’m a complete film buff. I judge bad acting when I see it. She certainly had a lot less makeup than all other photos of her, no earrings, frumpyish clothes. I call her out as a extremely unconvincing bad act.
Jeezo, Saint Theresa flopping around like a knocked over goldfish, with just the most gentle of questioning from her chum brillo.
As always the Rev calls it correctly with his pertinent questions. If the disgraced bbc continues to milk this as an anti-Scottish government story it will only convince more and more people that the bbc in Scotland is fundamentally untrustworthy and a danger to democracy.
@Lochside says: 22 May, 2017 at 4:05 pm:
” … Personally, I am fed up of the SNP’s naivety in the face of brute force by the Brits. Hoping that the uncommitted will see through the artifice of this conspiracy is..to my mind..a vain hope.”
Well you could always vote for some other party that are closer to your own personal views. Let’s see now, there’s The Scottish Conservative & Unionist Party – Nope! They don’t do Independence for Scotland but they’d accept your vote anytime. There’s the Scottish Accountancy Office of the United Kingdom Labour Party. They want your vote but they’re for a form of Scotland being separate from Westminster – as a region of England.
UKIP are crying out for voters too as are the LibDems and that’s yer lot really.
“Try speaking to some of them on the doorstep!”
Do you really imagine that those elected as SNP Councillors, MSPs, MPs and MEPs have not done their share of talking to people on the doorsteps?
If you bothered to watch Parliament TV from Westminster :-
link to parliamentlive.tv
You would see & hear the SNP MPs talking to Unionist MPs every session in that House and they are the hardest working members of the hardest working party in that place.
If you view Holyrood TV :-
link to scottishparliament.tv
You would see the MSP there working very hard too and that cite will let you view all sitting committees too.
The SNP MSPs work their socks off both in the chamber and in committee.
“I suggested a long time ago that the SNP needed to start educating the general populace about how Scotland funds itself and how our powers are so meagre.”
And just how do you suggest they go about doing that, Lochside?
Perhaps if they ask the BBC, ITV, STV and BSkyB they would fall over themselves to tell the Scottish voters all about it instead of spreading Westminster propaganda. Maybe the newspaper owners might be happy to take on the task of educating those Scottish voters, who don’t want to know, on the error of their ways?
“Yet there are those on here who think people aren’t interested in explanation as why the ‘£15 billion deficit’ lie does not need destroyed explicitly.”
Are there, Lochside? I didn’t know that. I do know there are people in Scotland who don’t want to hear that particular bit of information but strangely I also know many of them actually do know the truth but they still tell us there is a 16 billion deficit anyway and, what’s more, they will tell anyone who will listen that it is all the fault of Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP SG.
“One question : if nursery is lying about her status in the NHS and to actually using foodbanks…does this not merit disciplinary action against her by her employers?”
Now there’s a thing, Lochside. Just who are her employers?
Some claim she works for BUPA yet if so then the SG are not her employer and the SG do not pay her wages. Some say she works for the SNHS in Edinburgh and if so then the local Hospital Board are her employers and they, not the SG pay her wages but the SG do regulate the SNHS wages and have stipulated that all nurses employed by Scottish SNHS Hospital Boards are better paid than their equivalent grades in the other UK countries NHS services.
So which employer is it you think is going to take action against this nurse?
@GEEO… 7-116PM
To quote Geoffrey Howe when ‘putting the dagger’ into Thatcher….’like being savaged by a dead sheep.’
SNP policy seems to be take BBC punches on the chin and apologise. That’s one SNP policy that needs to change.
BBC in meltdown over the need to boost the Tories after Corbyn’s leap in the polls. Their Election live website has 20 consecutive posts exclusively about May in the past hour. Clips from interviews etc.
Panic stations.
Does include the clip of Boris Johnston being heckled in Cornwall though.
link to bbc.co.uk
Labour in Scotland launched their manifesto today. BBC reporting Scotland seemed to concentrate on its declared opposition to independence.
Did anyone ask her how she felt now that she is campaigning on Labour’s manifesto promise to abolish tuition fees in England given that she has been a critic of the SNP’s policy on this?
The BBC are using this nurse farce like a sledgehammer against Nicola Sturgeon.
Its as clear as day this nurse was a plant. Its as clear as day she has never used a foodbank in her life. Its as clear as day she lied her arse off and all the BBC does is continue with the State propaganda circus by continuing to give this so called nurse credibility.
That’s what happens when you have a State propaganda service accountable to nobody.
@ Legerwood at 7.14
My understanding is that the Pay Review body is UK-wide, with their recommendations constrained by the 1% cap from Westminster.
It is then up to the separate health services to decide how much of the recommended increase to implement. Staff in the Scottish NHS have always received the full amount, which is not the case elsewhere. This leads to different payscales in the 4 services.
So we’re back to the shite of stacking the audience, with tomb tabards.
Just watched Nick Eardley on RS in Argyll & Bute. It was mince. He said Helensburgh was booming.Helensburgh’s population has dropped by8% in the last ten years.
He then interviewed a guy from the South who has just opened a new bistro. He seems to think the 6500 folk at the Base will help his business flourish. He’s in for a shock.
According to Babcock who run it 85% of the service folk live inside the Base during the week and go home to England every week. They spend nothing in Helensburgh. The lost salaries is equivalent to £64m per annum from the local economy.
As for the guy who has opened the cinema, he’s done it with grants from various sources but the service folk don’t use it because they have their own cinema in the Base and have subsidised booze.
@jfngw
I know some will tell me just to not pay it but I don’t want to get involved in a continuous threat of legal action.
Hi jfngw, I hope I can assure you that there will be no threat of legal action if you do things properly when cancelling your TV license.
Not having a TV license but owning a TV is NOT illegal, only watching the BBC or BBC iPlayer or any other LIVE broadcast including SKY without one is illegal.
You are though perfectly entitled to watch any other stations catchup TV, Netflix or other subscription channel without a license.
I cancelled mine the “official” way after the 2014 referendum, received a rebate and have not heard from them since. After you cancel they say that the may contact you after 2 years to ask if you still don’t need a license. That’s because they are not allowed to hassle you.
See how I did it here just following the instructions on this webpage:
link to tvlicensing.co.uk
The very fact that this woman asked Nicola Sturgeon if she was afraid she would lose her seat at Westminster, actually proves how little knowledge she has of politics itself.
In order to be able to use a food bank, one must be referred to by the DWP or by a healthcare professional i.e. G.P. The healthcare professional has to be concerned enough for your lack of nutrition first.
I’m sorry, but the complaints Miss Austin had about her daughter’s horse and having to use cheap champagne at parties etc is just sickening.
There are genuinely people out there who actually struggle day to day, wondering how they are going to feed their children.
I can’t remember if it was on here that I heard about this or another website, but there was a man who was a small business owner, his wife also worked.
One afternoon he received a phone call from his child’s school, informing him that the child had fainted. He was forced to admit that he and his family had not eaten for three days because they simply couldn’t afford to.
Now THAT is someone who is struggling. I will say no more on the matter.
To bring the nursegate thingy to a close, well a close to me it’s obviously a stitch up by the BBC was witnessed last night.
I made a complaint as I usually do to the BBC when they are up to mischief ( usual mode ) anyway it was posted on this site last night the account of this person being in some kind of relationship with a Tory councillor, exactly the same as the widespread Rumour Joanna Cherry happened to re-tweet. Ok I see the point of her apologising , but she should have qualified it with the relevant points discussed here at length , after the performance of this normal person it would have stuck in my gullet. As ruthless has had the brass neck to jump all over it and deflect attention from her party.
So please if your posting stuff try and make it kinda near what actually happened thanks .
@crazycat
That’s my understanding. As I said above, Toodleloo did say it was UK pay body on the 6.30 edition.
I agree with those who are critical of the SNP`s handling of the media. So many times when being questioned they dither searching for answers and seem not to have a coordinated strategy to deal with aggressive interviewers. The Unionist gloves are well and truly off and its time the SNP took there`s off.
Nicola looked very tired last night and must be under unimaginable pressure but the SNP must start and be more assertive because its going to get worse.
Wings unfortunate “David Mundell hompobia” comments unfortunately undermined an otherwise great website and resource
@Ashers,
No homophobic comments on this site. None you could point out at all.
@David McDowell says: 22 May, 2017 at 4:27 pm
“No Robert, here’s exactly what enters my head:
If Nicola is turning up knowing she is “probably going to get kicked in the teeth again” then it’s a matter of debate whether that shows her “guts” or her stupidity. I’m entitled to my opinion and won’t be bullied into not giving it by anyone.”
Bloody typical, David, So now I’m a bully for stating my opinion but your being bullied for stating yours?
Well get this, David. Since the BBC set-up so called debate the internet, TV, Radio and newspapers have been full of that very obvious BBC biased propaganda.
Yet in your book Nicola is the stupid one.
Aye!
Richt!
I’ll show you a parallel situation I watched unfold.
When I was a young person there was a big country where they had busses on which the coloured people were segregated. Their public toilets also segregated the coloured people and they were not permitted as pupils in whites only schools and universities. Trains were also segregated and even cinemas, theatres, pubs, clubs and even shops.
Nothing was ever done to end that disgraceful state of affairs until one very brave lady decided she had taken enough racial abuse and sat in a whites only section of a bus.
There was big trouble and many people died. That country was the United States of America:-
link to en.wikipedia.org
Yet if no coloured person had the courage to defy the segregation laws the United States would still be segregated today. If you doubt me remember this :-
link to nytimes.com
Just watched the livestream interview with Andrew Neil and Mayhem, he gave her a reasonable going over as far as I could see, what caught my eye was the BBC allowed a chat box at the side of the screen but it was going so fast it was difficult to follow, anyway the bits I managed to read were mostly gibberish and talk between a few contributors, then I got it ,this was to disrupt any points made, this BBC are at it 24/7 they never close , A well they have been at it a while , and a lot longer than anyone here , so that really cheered me up .
@Ashers 8:05pm
Interesting spelling of “homphobia”. Rather gives your game away doesn’t it. I was going to say, “nice try”, but, to be candid, your effort was pathetic. Nice bread though.
I have a customer from Lithuania who has 3 kids who’s dad unfortunately died ,she came to scotland with her sister they both work all the hours God gives them,got her fist car,an old vw which is polished to within a inch of its life
Gave her some parts on credit (yes we still do that in the countryside)returned today to pay and asked if we new somwhere to rent, we told her that the dhss would give her a house.
She flatly refused and wanted to pay her way, then we have this woman who lives it up ,party’s eats out ,jets of ti NY and says she can’t make ends meet on 23k a year and has to visit food banks.
I know which one I would give credit and which one I would throw out of scotland
Robert Peffers
What an idiotic response to Lochside`s very reasonable comment.
Did anyone else hear Jacky Bird on 6 oclock news say it was the FM who had to apologise. I noticed that Brian Taylor studiously ignored her and corrected the statement.
crazycat @ 7.41
That was my understanding as well. Pay Review Board for National award UK wide and Westminster put on the cap.
Of course, it is perfectly possible in these parlous times that someone who had trained as a nurse of some kind could find themselves between jobs for many reasons (eg. illness), and thus get into a situation where they had to make recourse to a foodbank.
The important thing being that at the time the person was jobless, not one of the “working poor” who can’t make ends meet even when in employment (and who also happens to be a nurse). In the debate programme, Ms Austin was definitely presenting herself as belonging to the latter group, which is =ahem= an overstatement. It also happens to be an insult to those who genuinely find themselves in that category. What she still may not comprehend is that these matters have the potential to harm the cause she is supposedly trying to promote.
As for the BBC, the website article on the subject is evidently written by someone who believes that attack is the best form of defence. It is an outright travesty to inflate a minor and fleeting misattribution of marital status as the major feature of the story, an aspect that is utterly insignificant compared to the whole contrived setup that the BBC obviously orchestrated.
But once again, the people’s news service outperforms the compromised professionals in Partisan Quay. People can’t be fooled like this any longer.
As an economic expatriate from the 80s whose grandchildren may one day be eligible to represent the country, my opinion is not necessarily welcome in modern Scotland. Nonetheless I agree with David McDowell when he questions at what point do the canines get kicked loose?
Could perhaps the SNP not promise that a vote for them would be a mandate to eject from the UK the country formerly known as England (now known colloquially as incompetent, racist, corrupted little england) and qualify that intent with a further promise to hold a referendum to determine who, and under what conditions, could be let back in again?
PS If you all distrust the BBC so much, why u let them count your votes at elections?
PPS Ashers at 8,05 pm fuck u and the stinking hairy ass you rode in on
I have just finished watching Brillo’s little chat with May.
Maybe I missed it but I was unaware of her having given a single straight answer to any of his questions.
All we got was a succession of bland cliched woffling generalisations and evasion.
One thing stood out – it looks as if ‘Strong and Stable’ has had its day and has been replaced by ‘Strong Economy’.
Poor creature – a perfect illustration of The Peter Principle.
I couldn’t keep my eyes off Brillo’s syrup as it had me puzzled as to what it consisted of – it certainly doesn’t look anything like human hair.
@Bob p says: 22 May, 2017 at 4:57 pm:
“Wales have an advantage,no sectarian orange bigots.”
No but they have had loads of English settlers since before 1284 and the Statute of Rhuddlan.
@Nana
Thanks for the video links, the Theresa May one on Sky was a cracker. That women is falling apart in front of our eyes, no wonder they have tried to keep her away from the general public.
Tories now in trouble I hope. The mask is slipping and Frankenstein’s monster is the one behind the mask.
@David McDowell says: 22 May, 2017 at 4:58 pm:
“If the SNP continues to play this game using the BBC’s rules we will LOSE any second referendum.?”
That’ll be why the on-line media is full of it today and it’s all over the papers, TV and radio.
Bob Mack says “Bob Mack says:
22 May, 2017 at 8:12 pm
@Ashers,
No homophobic comments on this site. None you could point out at all.”
Dan Huil says:
22 May, 2017 at 8:14 pm
@Ashers 8:05pm
Interesting spelling of “homphobia”. Rather gives your game away doesn’t it. I was going to say, “nice try”, but, to be candid, your effort was pathetic. Nice bread though.
I don’t see how my misspelling of homophobia gives any “game ” away? The Rev Stu quote about Mundell’s father was homophobic. Distasteful. Can gay people not father children after they come out. Respected out gay pro-indy bloggers like Jeremy Blackwell have blocked “Wings” for his homophobic tweets
May appears to have disappointed her supporters on Neil’s show. It is incredible to think that she was looking at a 20 point lead two weeks ago.
Is Brexit going to be such a disaster that she actually wants Corbyn to do it? It is what it is beginning to seem like.
The BBC in Scotland are so busy doing the Unionist bidding that they don’t seem to have noticed the implosion that is the Tory campaign. When will they wake up?
Bob says”
No homophobic comments on this site. None you could point out at all.”
Dan Huil says:
22 May, 2017 at 8:14 pm
@Ashers 8:05pm
Interesting spelling of “homphobia”. Rather gives your game away doesn’t it. I was going to say, “nice try”, but, to be candid, your effort was pathetic. Nice bread though.
I don’t see how my misspelling of homophobia gives any “game ” away? The Rev Stu quote about Mundell’s father was homophobic. Distasteful. Can gay people not father children after they come out. Respected out gay pro-indy bloggers like Jeremy Blackwell have blocked “Wings” for his homophobic tweets
Sadly Wings is now blcoked by respected gay pro independence bloggers. Why is that
McDuff,
“Robert Peffers
What an idiotic response to Lochside`s very reasonable comment.”
Robert Peffers is an aggressive verbal bully.
When his shite is challenged and he is left speechless, he pretends he hasn’t noticed (“The unholy union”).
His sycophants go after you like blood hounds if you dare challenge him, but I am one of the few posters who can take all of them on.
Don’t be afraid of them. Post your opinions. This site doesn’t belong to them.
@ Valerie and Legerwod
Glad we’re agreed!
@Davosa says:
22 May, 2017 at 3:43 pm
WTF was Sarah Smith involved anyway? Apart from being a rather crap journalist she is so anti SNP like the rest of her ilk that she could not possibly be fair and balanced.
============================
You just answered your own question.
Robert Peffers @ 8:14pm
“So now I’m a bully for stating my opinion”
No, you’re a bully for trying to deny me the right to state mine.
“Yet in your book Nicola is the stupid one.”
No, in my book it’s open to debate whether Nicola turning up again and again for a BBC kicking is “having guts” or just plain stupidity.
One kicking at these debates could be seen as regrettable, two might well be “having guts” but I’m afraid three is carelessness, if not rank stupidity.
So enough with the putting words in my mouth I haven’t said. Engage your brain first and try reading what I’ve actually written.
This “Saint Nicola must not be criticised” stuff is looking dangerously like the “cult-like obedience to the Leader” the Unionists always accuse us of.
Had a strange and unexpected thought. Perhaps there is no substance to this idea, but there a lot of evidence to support it!
Are the Tories trying to lose this election purposely?
Ponsonby interviewing Coburn on STV…now.
Ponsonby reminded me of the Monty Python sketch..:ELECTION NIGHT SPECIAL…..”and representing the Extremely Silly Party…Norman Ftang Ftang biscuit-barrel….0….Zero…..not a sausage”……LOL
@ Legerwood
Apologies for getting your name wrong – I tried to correct it in mid-submit but that didn’t work! (I’ll try harder.)
Craig Murray’s latest article is about the hopeless prospect of Theresa May trying to negotiate anything. She is temperamentally incapable.
However, his earlier article on the appalling bias of the BBC is also worth a read:
link to craigmurray.org.uk
Robert Peffers,
“No but they have had loads of English settlers since before 1284 and the Statute of Rhuddlan.”
Why are you so anti-English?
Robert Peffers (18th February “Here comes a surprise”)
“The fact is that a little common sense will show that the immigrants mainly come to find work. Elderly English cadgers excepted, these who sell up expensive city homes for cheaper, or better, Scottish accommodation, free bus passes and the benefits of such as free prescriptions, care at home and cheaper Council Tax. These are often the ones most prone to call scots subsidy junkies.”
Robert Peffers (20th May “The unholy union”)
“They discriminate against no one – not even the, sometimes ungrateful, English retirees who sell up expensive southern homes and buy into Scotland to benefit from the universal benefits the SNP SG have instigated here in Scotland.”
Dan Huil says:
22 May, 2017 at 8:14 pm
@Ashers 8:05pm
Interesting spelling of “homphobia”. Rather gives your game away doesn’t it. I was going to say, “nice try”, but, to be candid, your effort was pathetic. Nice bread though.
Dan Huil – what are you on about?
Neil on May I wonder if he will be like that with our Nicola I’ll lay money he will interrupt heckle her most of the time,I am still waiting for a straight answer from May it’s all about a green paper now but as a pensioner I Would like to know if I will still get my heating allowance a friend of mine over 80 will lose hers but still thinks the sun shines out of Mays A***
@galamcennalath..8-50pm
Are the tories DELIBERATELY trying to lose this election?
James O’Brien on LBC discussed that very idea this morning.
@Graeme McCormick
The base has concessions for shops, restaurant and bar(s), as well as quarters for the service staff (including married I think). Benefit to the local economy is low. If they need messages they drive to the supermarket, same as many folk! There are base employees who live locally though, so it’s an employer in the area, but same staff as would be needed for the HQ of the SDF. Meanwhile miles of barbed wire inhibits tourism, walkers and cyclists, so on.
Test
@Ashers
The comment wasn’t homophobic, and while I’ve been reading the articles here – including tweets I look at sometimes – the Rev’s shown no homophobia at all. Read this article:
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Bob Mack @ 1.01 pm
My wife is a ward sister, band 7 and I can assure you she is NOT on £40k per annum. But she is really angry at that nurse last night saying that she was speaking for everyone else in the NHS.
Ma hearts pumping pish for Britain on ITV and now Prince Phillp on STV he went to Gordonstone dont you know, oh how ah yern for the nostalgia of the yesterdays years in English Britain ,aff tae the toilet tae offload some vomit .
@Meg merrilees says: 22 May, 2017 at 6:22 pm:
” … However, I think her instant apology will defuse lot of that.”
Ah! Meg, have a closer wee think about that wee can of worms.
Think what the lady is apologising for and what the BBC are attempting to make out her apology is about but isn’t.
What Joanna Cherry apologised for was for claiming she, (Joanna), was led to believe that nurse was married to the Tory Councillor but now realised that the nurse was unmarried.
There was no apology for anything about the food bank claims or the level of the nurse’s income. Nor even that there were doubts cast about someone, on even the bottom estimate of the nurse’s income, had need of food-bank help.
That’s not to say there are other things that can cause a temporary shortage of cash.
That wee BBC story is just even more BBC spin, propaganda and lies. Just what is supposed to be shameful in Joanna saying she had been misled by someone else about the nurse’s marriage? status?
Context:
The First Minister is now under police close personal armed protection because of direct death threats against her and probably all stirred up by we know which Unionists
And there’s folk on this site arguing with each other about strategy
Well I’m old enough to be that lassies Dad and if she were my daughter I’d tell her to get the hell out of it coz if anything happened to her I’d be dealing with it a whole other way
Just saying spare a thought for the stress folks, it’s not supposed to be like this and it’s serious
galamcennalath says:
22 May, 2017 at 8:50 pm
‘Are the Tories trying to lose this election purposely?’
It would certainly set Labour up to either pay £60bn to the EU then exit with no trade deal, with all that entails, and be unpopular, or stay in the single market with freedom of movement and be unpopular…
The flaw in that argument is that the Tories dont seem to have told the BBC to stop helping them…
Another pertinent point to remember about nurses and pay in Scotland is that student nurses and midwives still get a bursary, and free tuition. Not so now in England. Also Scottish Government has improved the grants given to student nurses with Dependants etc. Details here
link to news.gov.scot
So as well as slightly higher salaries nurses leave uni in Scotland are very likely to have a much, much lower level of debt
O/T
I am currently watching a program about the £15Billion London Crossrail project – I wonder who is paying for that?
Just one of the many multi Billion infrastructure projects under way in London and The SE with proposed North to South to come which will probably cost another £15Billion or more.
How do we allow them to get away with it?
In Edinburgh we had to wait over 100 years to get a bleeding escalator at Waverley.
Theresa May crashed and burns on Sky News under questioning from journalists as their questions were not submitted beforehand. One guy said she didn’t look “strong and stable” but more like “weak and wobbly” 🙂
She then has a terrific car crash of an interview with Andrew Neil failing to answer a single question and coming across as a total buffoon just like Boris.
Tory support going into meltdown and their lead over Labour falling rapidly, now just single figures from in excess of 20%.
In Wales at the last full scale poll Tories led Labour by 41% to 35% now today’s latest poll has Labour leading the Tories in Wales by 44% to 34% within weeks.
Anyone reading Wings still like to insist that Theresa May is NOT an idiot? Hahahahaha.
@ashers
“Can gay people not father children after they come out. ”
You clearly don’t have much reading ability. The tweet was very clearly aimed at the son Oliver rather than the father David – i.e. to spell it out for you Oliver Mundell’s debating ability was so poor it would have been better if he hadn’t been born. Personally I don’t like that sort of comment, but the homophobic content of it was 0.00000000000000000%.
As for the rest of it, you’ve been rumbled.
@
gus1940 says:
22 May, 2017 at 8:34 pm
Poor creature – a perfect illustration of The Peter Principle.
==============================================
I think the perfect illustration was when she was in her last job. She’s now gone far beyond that to a kind of satire on the Peter Principle.
galamcennalath says:
22 May, 2017 at 8:50 pm
Had a strange and unexpected thought. Perhaps there is no substance to this idea, but there a lot of evidence to support it!
Are the Tories trying to lose this election purposely?
Nah, they’re just super confident and shite. Add some hubris and and its a lethal combo. Look at the Gulf wars.
If they lose, PM JC will probably be a far better Brexit negotiator, than all the tory roasters May’s got prepped put together.
He’s also making a total arse of red tory SLab right now. That crew have raged at the SNP to start Scots uni fees since ever. Not a peep out of them today though, thanks that daft nurse and cunning creeps at the beeb.
@gus1940 … 9-30pm
That…Gus…is a classic example of how Scottish income revenue is spent outwith the nation and is a prime example WHY G.E.R.S. misrepresents Scottish Revenue/Expenditure i.e.its a UK model.
@Dr Jim
A good point well made.
It’s getting serious now. They’re feart to lose us. 🙁
@Dr Jim
You are right. It’s shocking, and we know who to thank for the way language has been used in the media.
The election of openly sectarian councillors now gives violence a legitimacy, encourages knuckle drafters to come out of hiding, now emboldened.
I have said repeatedly, that what we see south of the Border, will slowly creep north, and its started.
I seriously don’t want to live here, if there is another No vote.
@galamcennalath says: 22 May, 2017 at 6:24 pm:
“No investigative journalism to explore the validity of the claims not their authenticity.”
I don’t think that Wingers are the only people in Scotland who now always question anything the BBC, or indeed the wider MSM, care to spin. As proof of that I offer the election results.
It has got to the point where there is indeed divisions across Scotland but they are not the divisions that Kez, Willie and tRuthless are daft enough to make great play with.
They fail to convince any sane person for the obvious reason that if there were indeed divisions all across Scotland then there would have to be more than one side to the divisions or there would be no divisions.
It takes at lease two to have divided opinions so the problem is not the division of opinion, per se, but which side is in the wrong. The ballot returns for Scotland prove that the majority of Scots think the wrong side are the Yoons.
I’m sure that it is not only Wingers who can see right through the BBC/MSM spin and propaganda. In fact I know that it isn’t as I know quite a few non-Wingers who know the BBC/MSM are liars.
Amber Rudd apparentlly claimed the average wage of a polisman was £40k a year, she was then told be Sussex polis that their federation gives polismen/women vouchers for local food banks as oftent they dont have much spare cash after rent in places like Brighton, the average wage a newish polis down there is £20k, damn I must be too proud, went without food last winter so kids would eat and bills got paid, being a seasonal worker in the islands I could sign onto dole, but I get a war disability pension that cancels that, must remember to go to a food bank next winter NOT!!! there are worse off than me
The tools need to take the BBC out, are already well developed.
As a lot of links are not clicked.
link to semioticon.com
@ Capella 8.52 My sentiments exactly & there long held, there can be no continuation of a Bbc Broadcaster from Pacific Quay in a Independent Scotland P45s all round , we’ll need to import ah lot of shit for these X Journalist to shovel, i wouldn’t want them to sit on there arses claiming benefits.
@Valerie, 9:38
“I seriously don’t want to live here, if there is another No vote.”
Likewise. I have kids at school, and I dread to think of their life chances in the UK as it is. Should a second indyref result in a No vote, I’ll be taking them to a country where they will stand a better chance of realising their potential (which would be pretty much anywhere in the developed world except the USA, so at least I’d be spoilt for choice!)
Lighten the mood a little, Yew Choob presents Fascist Queen in the style of ABBA 🙂
link to youtube.com
@dakk says: 22 May, 2017 at 6:35 pm:
“Donald Trump defied the Establishment and won US Presidency at least in part by calling out the media head on for what they are.
He is a winner,we are losers.”
Nah! You are comparing oranges with apples, dakk.
In the USA they do not have a either state or federal funded broadcasters and everyone knows which broadcaster favours which party.
Also they only have two parties. Not like in the UK where there are three main parties all in the one Westminster Establishment.
So when The Donald called out the fake news spinners all USAsians just naturally assumed Trump was referring to the Broadcaster they already knew to be liars.
Where is Eleanor Bradford when you need her?
Theresa Fyffe of the RCN kicked off this discussion about nurses using foodbanks and nurses applying to the RCN hardship fund on GMS ( 13/4/2017)funny enough.
Now while it is utterly wrong wrong wrong that anyone should have to rely on foodbanks regardless of where you come from, she was also talking UK wide.
If you are a nurse in London it is possible you will struggle on a nurses wage.
The RCN are as political as any other organisation and just as capable of spinning but no one asked Theresa Fyffe ( surprising given the BBCs fondness for highlighting the SNHS) for a breakdown of the areas where nurses are most being effected by wages and more importantly what is the RCN going to do about it?
Just as they ballot members about striking -UK wide
Someone said recently here or on Twitter- The BBC, where the truth goes to die, hits the nail on the head for me
ALANM at 7.46
Ni. It is not. It is exactly the right thing to do. Kills the issue stone dead and doesn’t allow an argument to ping back and forth over it.
Would be a different policy if we had equal access to the media.
Stephen Jardine has just announced social media has ‘apologised’ to nursey.
BBC Scot….10-30pm
Sorry it’s a bit OT, but how’s that strong-and-stable thing going?
link to archive.is
Whoops ! bloody banana skins .
link to independent.co.uk
link to caltonjock.com
Just catching up but @gordoz says at 12:59 pm
“…but it has all the hallmarks of a former Labour leaders daughter & political editor for BBC Scotland’s influence”
and Iain More says at 3:30 pm
“The whole thing stinks of the usual collusion between BLiS and BBC as well”
Claire Austin will no doubt now go for the greasy pole of BLiS NHS Union Rep (unless she already is one).
@Valerie says: 22 May, 2017 at 6:45 pm:
“… That’s the bit Nicola could have put more emphasis into, but she was on the back foot.”
I think if you go watch the clip again, Valerie, you will see that Nicola was not actually on the back foot.
She began to talk, then her microphone was turned down, so you could make out she was still attempting to talk but the sound engineer had reduced the volume.
The BBC do this all the time and sadly I have detected the same sort of thing happening at Holyrood since Ken became PO.
Only at Holyrood their trick seems to be to NOT fade down the background desk thumpers and shouters, (or in some cases the reactions from the visitors gallery), but only when it drowns out the SNP MSP who is speaking or the FM at FMQs.
Technology can be a power for good or evil depending upon who operates the switches and slider controls.
I commented last week :- Do the Conservatives really want to WIN the General Election.
My comment this week is What happens to Scottish Independence if Labour win ???
@gus1940
£15 billion for crossrail,
Would Scotland not get its population share from Barnett consequentials,
8.3% of £15,000,000,000 is £1,245,000,000.
@John from Fyfe who asked ” What happens to Scottish Independence if Labour win ???”
A few thoughts in here – not looking great for Indyref2 whoever wins
link to eurofree3.wordpress.com
@ Scot Finlayson
Not if it’s declared a UK project, you only get Barnett for spending allocated to England. It the magic of the UK project, a small percent will be allocated as Scotland spend but the money used will still be from all the UK taxpayers.
Crossrail is a designated “national” project so there are no Barnett consequentials. Isn’t pooling and sharing wonderful!
@John from Fife
Even with the current collapse of Tory support I think it still very unlikely that Labour could win a clear majority on their own even if Tory support was to fall further.
So ask yourself where they could get the support needed to govern if that’s what they wished to do and what that would mean for a second Independence referendum?
link to facebook.com
Remember people June 3rd !0.30am at Kelvingrove Park for 11.am kick of, if you have a highvis vest wear it .
Valerie at 6.54
Our enemy in the media sometimes isn’t very clever. Trying to deflect the stooshie about Nursie by attacking Joanna Cherry is really stupid. It just draws attention to the QT Nursie plant again and again.They should just have shut up.
Meanwhile is anybody identifying the food banks and how she was referred to them. And who her friends are. And importantly why she got “invited”. Folk are digging away with great gusto.
The BBC is being hugely damaged by this.
Meanwhile YES Cowal,the Forward Shop in Dunoon (186 Argyll Street PA23 7HA phone 01369 707844) have well produced DVDs of “London Calling – How the BBC Stole the Referendum” available post free at £2 or 8 for a tenner.
@Ashers says: 22 May, 2017 at 8:05 pm:
“Wings unfortunate “David Mundell hompobia” comments unfortunately undermined an otherwise great website and resource.”
Want to explain to me what these, “David Mundell momophobic comments”, actually were, Ashers.
I saw some remarks about David Mundell but nothing homophobic in the remarks.
Perhaps you could enlighten me, and the rest of the Wings readership?
Teresa May in her speech today acknowledged there were 4 Countries in this Union Why is the national GE debate only her & Corbyn .
John from Fife at 10.14
Not a lot. Labour in Scotland is still dancing with the Tories and the scenario in Scotland is entirely different from the scenario in England.
H
E
L
P
..BBC is so one-sided, I’ve fallen over.
Since the nurse is from Edinburgh, can we assume she will have used the foodbank nearest to where she lives?
If anyone has used a foodbank: does it instruct you on what foodbank you should go to?
Do you need to sign a form stating that all the information you have given is true?
because if you do, you may very well be guilty of fraud if you falsely claim to need a referral, when you clearly don’t (as is clearly the case with this person)
@McDuff says: 22 May, 2017 at 8:15 pm:
“What an idiotic response to Lochside`s very reasonable comment.”
But then you would say that – wouldn’t you?
Have you read my reply to your own comment yet?
Here’s the thing, McDuff – when I comment on something I give a reasoned reply. Your effort above is utter mince as it claims I made an idiotic response but gives no reason why you personally found it idiotic.
As I said, but then you would say that – wouldn’t you.
Do I need to explain THAT for you?
@ Robert Peffers
Please leave me out of that enlightenment , i read the Rev’s piece hot of the keyboard and understood every word and got the satirical joke. Ashers ramblings wont change the wording nor my understanding of the wording .
I’m satisfied either way.
If there is a possibility of beating the Tories at this election most Scots will recognise voting SNP is the best way to beat them in Scotland.
Picked up a steady stream of new members for our SNP branch in the last couple of weeks.
ben madigan says:
22 May, 2017 at 10:24 pm
@John from Fyfe who asked ” What happens to Scottish Independence if Labour win ???”
A few thoughts in here – not looking great for Indyref2 whoever wins”
Scotland is out of Europe.
This is what indy ref2 is all about, stay a region of the UK or nation state EU member?
Jezza or Mayhem won’t make any difference to the next big choice for people of Scotland.
If you want to lose your EU citizenship vote YES, slimed Bliar MacTenbellies MP, 2014.
Lies, Lies, Lies.
Staff Nurse with a Nursing Degree and 5 years experience
just doesn’t earn £23K per annum for full time work!
You can’t feed yourself so family and friends offer you a champagne fuelled trip to New York, so you take that as a priority over eating? Nobody would do that!
Sarah Smith Liar, suggested that the public demanded the inclusion of devolved services such as the NHS?
Why then did they have to track down a nurse who wanted to ask about NHS Salaries on Question Time?
Couldn’t they use one of the many demanding people?
The most talked about item this week was the Tory Manifesto and their Dementia Tax.
Was there anything about that Sarah, was the wee tank commander pressed on that?
What about the horrific Tory Ra*e laws? Nope!
92,780 people have had enough of Blatant Biased Corruption from the BBC.
They are holding Scotland down while Westminster continues to Rap* our Nation.
link to you.38degrees.org.uk
Trump presented a facade of change and sticking it to the American Establishment but in reality offers no change from full-fat neoconservative casino banking and social/environmental exploitation.
I wouldn’t worry too much about him though as he is on a very tight leash. It’s the ones holding the leash and funneling “black money” into British politics that we need to keep an eye on. The network of anti-democratic forces now combining in Washington and London is both extensive and expansive. Submitting to the demands of English nationalism would appear to be a rather risky past-time for Scotland, given the current political direction of travel.
tamson says:
22 May, 2017 at 9:50 pm
@Valerie, 9:38
“I seriously don’t want to live here, if there is another No vote.”
Likewise. I have kids at school, and I dread to think of their life chances in the UK as it is. Should a second indyref result in a No vote, I’ll be taking them to a country where they will stand a better chance of realising their potential (which would be pretty much anywhere in the developed world except the USA, so at least I’d be spoilt for choice!)
I feel the same way, but I am not ruling out going stateside, in fact it is my preferred destination, Trump can only be in power 8 years, I think the opportunities over there would be better than here, and states like Tennessee, it is possible to buuy an acre of land for $2000, that is cleared workable land, none of the planning laws we have here, but I have a mate who is willing to sell me ten acres so that I can move over in the next few years, a good ground water source for a well, two ponds that do have fish in them and a river and all I want is a log ccabin, internet and electricity, so I can write my post appoalyptic/dysotopian books set in Scotland, if Scotland votes no again the nation as we know it now will die, it will be back to pre holyrood days and us doing as we are told, no thanks, not for me
O/T but topical, re BBC bias.
I’ve just watched the BBC Wales version of 22.30 ‘Reporting Scotland’, via the http://www.tvcatchup.com app on my leedle iPhone. I wanted to see how today’s poll results were treated in Wales.
For those who aren’t aware,
“The regular Welsh poll was jointly commissioned by ITV Cymru Wales and Cardiff University’s Wales Governance Centre.
The poll would see Labour hold all its seats in Wales and take one off the Conservatives, Gower, the most marginal seat in the country.
It has top-line voting intention figures of
LAB: 44% (+9)
CON: 34% (-7)
PC: 9% (-2)
LDEM: 6% (-1)
UKIP: 5% (+1).”
Onnyhoo, there was actually NO mention at all of this poll. It looks like the BBC has a principle that if they don’t report something (e.g. bias protests), then it hasn’t actually happened.
The figures above are from the story at:-
link to independent.co.uk
@Stuart McTavish says: 22 May, 2017 at 8:25 pm:
” … my opinion is not necessarily welcome in modern Scotland.”
Nah! Stuart, you’ve got the wrong blog there – While it isn’t up to me, (or anyone else but The Rev Stu), all comments are welcomed on WoS. That’s not to say they won’t be torn to shreds if someone disagrees with them but that is what an open form is for. Debate is the thing and you do not get debate if everyone holds the same views.
” … Could perhaps the SNP not promise that a vote for them would be a mandate to eject from the UK the country formerly known as England”
Whoops! Sorry but no the SNP could not technically eject any other kingdom from the United Kingdom because the United Kingdom Treaty of Union has only two signatory Kingdoms and if one is ejected the Status Quo Ante, (a legal term for the Status as before the Treaty), is that when the only two kingdoms in the United Kingdom part company the United Kingdom has just returned to two independent kingdoms and both Wales and Ireland were English Kingdom dominions in 1707, so they remain as parts of the Kingdom of England.
” … qualify that intent with a further promise to hold a referendum to determine who, and under what conditions, could be let back in again?”
No way, Stuart! We get rid of that lot and we are never going to get shafted again. We Scots have very long memories.
” … PS If you all distrust the BBC so much, why u let them count your votes at elections? “
We don’t let then do the counting but they get to report, (and tell lies), about the results.
“PPS Ashers at 8,05 pm fuck u and the stinking hairy ass you rode in on.
I’ll let Ashers answer that one, Stuart, it is NOMBB, (nane o ma bliddy business).
;-))
Busy building an out-door oven today – hoping to show folk that larger versions can be used for community feasts. Community feasting is the way to go – make sharing food a positive way to strengthen our lives together.
@ Patrick Roden 10.45. Im not aware of any Independent operated FoodBanks in Edinburgh , most are Trussell Trust but irrespective of who operates the foodbank they will have associated partnerships ie Social Work depts/Churches/ Schools/Job centres.
Trussell Trust operate a 3 strikes policy whereas Independent foodbanks dont .
Let’s hope that this latest attempt by BBC Scotland to hold a fair and balanced political debate has shown them up for what they really are, A shower of London Establishment Patsies.
Hope to see many new faces at the next BBC Scotland Protest Rally outside their HQ at pacific Quay in Glasgow in the not too distant future.
BBC Scotland is the enemy of Scottish Independence.
Stu, I’m 99.9% sure we’ve seen this nurse before either in bitter the gither flyer or on TV but I’m sure we’ve seen her.
My first thought when I saw her was I know her, but I don’t. Maybe Wings have covered something with her?
Got to laugh at the Tories thinking the nurse story is good for them. Of course with nurses under Tory administration earning less maybe their agenda is that more nurses should be visiting foodbanks.
The message to any NHS worker should be, vote Tory for lower increments, vote Labour for a possibly a higher increment (but it will be taken back by increasing income tax) but definitely no independence referendum, not sure what the LibDems policy on increases are but definitely more tax and no independence referendum. And all this is irrelevant as health is devolved and decided at Holyrood, there is not a vote there until 2021.
How often have you seen anyone working in the SNHS openly posting as such on this site or any other?
I remember people calling out on here for NHS information during the run up to IndyRef1. I was working in the SNHS at the time – but now I am retired.
Specific instructions, reminders and warnings of the consequences of breaking professional obligations went out to all staff regarding openly taking part in political debate as NHS staff. No posters or badges were allowed on NHS property. How would your blood pressure have done if you were taken into hospital and subjected to BetterTogether posters?
NHS staff are held by various clauses including confidentiality and conduct bringing the various professions into disrepute. Breaking these terms can lead not only to loss of job but also loss of State Registration which the various professions require to practice the job at all. All that training gone for nothing as without State Registration nobody can employ you. I heard of nobody that risked losing that.
That is why I am so surprised at this nurse being front and centre in a televised political debate in this way.
As far as tories winning a large majority – they can do what they like – if labour wins -great for tories they can blame all they have done on Labour – win win for tories.
BBC last nights debate -everything snp fault no culpability on their part – aye right.
Wullie B says:
22 May, 2017 at 10:55 pm
tamson says:
22 May, 2017 at 9:50 pm
@Valerie, 9:38
Me anaw.
Wullie look for a few acres fur me anaw will yi lol
Internet now saying that Mr Teresa Mayhem is senior exec of Capital Group hedge fund, who own “major share2 of Legal and General, who own %29 of all UK equity release market.
Equity release at the core of Mrs Mayhem’s “dementia tax” scheme. Its probably not something these two were going to bring up on their BBC One show love in lately.
We’re such suckas.
@Ashers says:
“I don’t see how my misspelling of homophobia gives any “game ” away? The Rev Stu quote about Mundell’s father was homophobic. Distasteful. Can gay people not father children after they come out. Respected out gay pro-indy bloggers like Jeremy Blackwell have blocked “Wings” for his homophobic tweets.
Of course you don’t see it, Ashers. Of course you could not.
For the rest I can leave that to others as others have it well covered.
Except for, “Respected out gay pro-indy bloggers like Jeremy Blackwell have blocked “Wings” for his homophobic tweets.”
Respect, like beauty, is in the
eyemind of the respecter. There is absolutely nothing homophobic in the Rev Stu’s comment. However, it no longer is up to either you or I to make that decision as it is apparently now the preserve of the judiciary.caz m
Next outing for Wings stall 3rd June at Glasgow Green I must thank our Friend Andy in the Clutha Bar for his generous offer to supply us with Pizza’s on the day’s & I hope the Wingers will give him some custom afterward’s .
O/T but a fine observation from the UK Polling Report site
“As a Canadian who follows UK politics closely, I have no vote nor preference in this UK election. However, I would like to offer a view not often heard from partisans of all stripes.
It is hard to deny that the Conservative Manifesto, especially the policy on care costs has holed the ship of state below the waterline. The polls which were kind to the Conservatives are now not so kind and May’s comments on “undertaking a study to put a cap on how much the government will take” seems to recognize the hemorrhage of support.
It is my view that both the original inclusion of the policy in the manifesto and May’ s gambit to limit the damage are both mistakes that will be hard to overcome. The policy scares both core Conservative voting seniors and those who had traversed to the Conservatives since 2010. Whomever decided that putting this policy in the manifesto needs to be sacked as he/she has handed Corbyn a lifeline and maybe worse.
Setting that aside, May’s gambit to limit the damage is potentially an even more egregious error. In one move, she shows that:” the Lady is definitely for turning” and thus destroys the strong and stable image so carefully crafted. Secondly, May is trying to plug a two foot hole with a one foot plug. Rather than stand firm and back the manifesto or do a full U-turn and show that she can listen by admitting that it was a mistake and scrapping it , she did neither.
In Scotland, the SNP has already changed the emphasis of their yet unreleased manifesto to key on the challenges facing pensioners ad those in care to take advantage. Now the question in England is whether Corbyn and Labour can take advantage of these gaffes to frame the last three weeks of the campaign around this issue. If he can, the Conservative tsunami will look more like a dripping tap.”
The Tories!
Cameron puts forward that Brexit would be disastrous for the UK and so resigns when the English public vote for it.
May fights for Remain as Brexit would be a disaster.
So May wants to lead the Brexit that she doesn’t believe in?
Boris writes an extended report as to why Brexit would be a disaster, but bins it when offered a more high profile role leading Brexit.
Wee Ruthless says Brexit would be a disaster and calls Boris a disaster by heading up Brexit.
Boris wins Brexit, but realises that it would be a disaster and steps back down from leading the Tories into the valley of death, and so a patsy is sought.
Enter Dis-May.
When asked for details on Brexit, we are told that Brexit means Brexit??
When pressed for something beyond this mindless statement, May gives us that it’s a red white and blue Brexit???
People demand another election as May was never voted in as PM. She refused this categorically.
She now calls for that election she has refused to have.
May states that their will be No Indy Ref 2 as there is no appetite for it? Scotland democratically votes for it!
May justifies the need to increase Taxes of the self employed. It is only just and fair?
Due to public opinion, she now says it isn’t just or fair?
May Launches new Tory manifesto with new Dementia Tax, something that Must be done, as it is fair and just.
Due to public opinion, Dementia Tax is being watered down to “going to review” as it might not be fair or just?
Our own wee tank commander is against Brexit, against leaving the single market, is against blocking free movement of EU migrants that Scotland needs, against Boris.
Yes you guessed it, she now says she is for all of the above???
So the Tory Update is you are getting a Hard Brexit, that will be the best Brexit available, if a there is a Brexit deal available????
Then they threaten you that you would be in trouble, if Scotland’s political leaders were to sit at the Brexit table, because they are the strong and stable ones???
They in fact are the Wrong and Unable!
Incapable, feeble and delusional! Yes!
O/T
There was a call on this website the other day to get your SNP posters and flags up – ‘decorate the hoose’.
Can I just say, having spent the weekend leafletting, it really lifts my heart to see an SNP sticker on car or house window when out trekking and gives me energy to continue.
Can’t help but worry sometimes when I see doors surrounded by Rangers stickers that somebody will jump out and shout abuse and I’ve had a few troublesome letterboxes with what sounds like the beast from hell behind them.
But tonight I’ve specifically met three dogs (and some people) who like the SNP.
Only had two leaflets refused so far.. including one chap who’s entire (council) house is being insulated, free. Even then, he couldn’t bring himself to vote for the Scottish Government which is paying for it. Oh well – probably a NO voter too.
I don’t buy this at all. She says that she earns ‘only’ £22,345, when the lowest point within grade 5 in the NHS Scotland for 2017-2018 is 22,440. She does not come across as a newly graduated nurse, so I suspect that she has been working as a nurse for quite a while now and therefore doubt that she is at the lowest point in the scale. That must surely mean that this lady is working part time and not full time. If she was working full time and shifts (nights/weekends) as many nurses in hospitals have to do she would be earning more than that. If what she earns as part time is not enough, surely she can consider working more hours.
She does not speak for all the personnel in the NHS actually. She is a grade 5 ‘having to survive’ in over £22,000 and working part time. What about the rest of the people in the NHS that work full time and actually manage to survive on far less without having to go to food banks and that are grades 1 to 4 earning significantly less than the 22,000 she claims she ‘only’ gets?
I honestly think this woman is a tory plant.
I really don’t care what this nurse had to say at the leaders debate. I’m not in the least surprised that the BBC invited her onto the studio audience either, it’s par for the course as far as I’m concerned.
The Rev has asked the right questions in this article but I do not expect them ever to be answered. In fact how the BBC have continued to plug this story is exactly what we should have expected.
This was a well thought out strategy IMO by the BBC and those who direct them and that’s why they have continued with it despite the negative stories in the Sun and the Record. All of this was of course planned, the BBC present and big up the narrative, the newspapers give the headlines next day. Then the BBC go on repeating those same headlines.
It’s so blatant and obvious that surely more must be noticing, they just can’t stop themselves though from following the plan that had been laid out. This one has backfired to an extent because not all your average voters are as ignorant as the government and the BBC seem to think they are.
The nurse didn’t need to be a “plant” either and I doubt that she was in the true meaning of the word, she was used as the BBC knew what her question would be and wanted it asked.
The fact that she asked the FM if she thought she might lose her seat at this GE says a lot really, maybe not the brightest when it comes to politics. Her naivety has got her into a place I doubt she wanted to be, I hope others won’t be so foolish.
Remember the guy on QT from Inverness “We will keep our Union together in the name of Jesus”?
Well that poor guy did not seem 100% sound to me yet he was used, used and then discarded by those that brought him there specifically to make that rant. Here’s a 36 second clip.
link to youtube.com
Just keep in mind the establishment will stoop much lower than this when the going gets tougher. So we need to be wiser, don’t fall into any traps and don’t provide them with any ammunition.
Stay an Alert Reader!
Ronnie Anderson
Don’t you worry Ronnie, I will be at Kelvingrove Park on 3rd June heading for Glasgow green.
Political opportunism and a lack of ethical principle are key characteristic of a fascist politics.
Ronnie Anderson @ 10.30
Hi Vis vest????
Is that just wingers or is it everyone?
@Bill Dale
do you have a link that tells what projects are UK wide or England only,
according to UK parliament web site Crossrail is `England only` and should trigger a ‘consequential’ payment,
`the Treasury eventually agreed to the classification of spending on Crossrail (which will overwhelmingly benefit London and the South East) as an “England” expenditure therefore triggering ‘consequential’ payments for the devolved administrations`.
link to tinyurl.com
The bad news for those in working poverty is of course it will take some time to reverse the effect of disastrous policies of almost 40 years of WM Tory & Labour rule. I vote for independence in the belief that this direction of travel can be changed.
Independence is not going to result in an instant cure, a full recovery may take some time and some may be disheartened at the speed of progress. There are many dangers ahead, including a sizeable number of diehard unionists and a neighbour that may feel spurned.
I am almost certainly too old now to make any real difference but if we do achieve independence I hope the younger generation grab the opportunity with both hands.
Just listening to the leader’s debate on You tube.
You’ll know that the nurse ask her question quite early on (34minutes in) but Sarah Smith deftly defers it till later in the programme when we will come to discuss the NHS.
Here’s a curious thing…
Kezia is the one who brings the issue back to the nurse @ 1hour 6 minutes.
Kez accuses Nicola of voting against a pay rise for nurses.
NS: not true, Kezia.
Kez: you are not listening to the nurse here in the front row. “SHE CAN’T FEED HER FAMILY”
but our nurse friend didn’t say, earlier in the programme that she couldn’t feed her family, she said :
I am a nurse. I can’t manage on the salary I have. I have to go to food banks. I am struggling to pay bills. .. no mention of any family.
Did Kezia know about her and her circumstances in advance?
Just wondering, is this a S Labour stitch up?
Have to say despite the BBC style of reporting
I thought Stephen Jardine comes across as their best reporter
by a country mile ( for at least 3 yrs say )
Watch the part with the 4 candidates good fair grilling.
Old school ?
This nursegate business seems to have brought out the worst in a few Wingers today,Myself included I may say.
And to think I used to quite like nurses back in Benny Hill’s day.
No noo.
Heavy.
O/T Breaking news
Explosion in Manchester Arena – people dead.
Heedtracker
I remember when the labour manifesto came out last week that they repeatedly talked about looking after all ‘regions’ of the UK. So I reckoned that included us…
Looks like we have now have a horrific terrorist incident to throw into what is already one of the most unpleasant elections I can recall.
Here’s Fake News Nurse Claire’s Linkedin profile:
link to uk.linkedin.com
If she’s not lying about this stuff too, clearly not the poverty-stricken wee nursey she’s pretending to be.
[…] and the BBC a favour. While they’re acting like a pack of dogs chasing a car, no one, except Wings, is asking the fundamentally more important question of why the debate focused almost exclusively […]
Thoughts to Manchester xxx tonight,and espically to the people still waiting for word.
@David McDowell says: 22 May, 2017 at 8:48 pm:
“No, you’re a bully for trying to deny me the right to state mine.”
Rubbish! I disagreed with your comment. That’s what debate is all about.
“No, in my book it’s open to debate whether Nicola turning up again and again for a BBC kicking is “having guts” or just plain stupidity.”
So there you are, (above), stating your opinion that I disagreed with but I’m not the one accusing you of being a bully – you are the one accusing me of being a bully for simply disagreeing with your opinion.
“One kicking at these debates could be seen as regrettable, two might well be “having guts” but I’m afraid three is carelessness, if not rank stupidity.”
That’ll be in your own, not so humble, opinion of course. That and the opinion that no one should bully you by disagreeing with you about your opinions?
“So enough with the putting words in my mouth I haven’t said. Engage your brain first and try reading what I’ve actually written.”
I put nothing in your mouth, David, seems there isn’t too much room in there for anything other than your opinions that no one must disagree with. Not only that but I always read and comprehend what I have read before I comment.
“This “Saint Nicola must not be criticised” stuff is looking dangerously like the “cult-like obedience to the Leader” the Unionists always accuse us of.
Ah! Now there’s a thing. It is YOU who is claiming that Nicola is a saint – not me. Matter of fact I am under no illusions about such things as saints. As there are no Gods, there cannot be such people as Saints. Simples.
The truth is that I base my opinions on the overwhelming evidence, at least until the present, under the leadership of Nicola Sturgeon the SNP are not only the biggest party in Scotland but remarkably, for a party that only stands candidates in Scotland, the SNP are the third biggest party at Westminster and also have the greatest support of any party in the Scottish Council setup.
Now just what is the evidence that you base your opinion that Nicola is doing something wrong in a continual betterment of the SNP’s share of the voters of Scotland?
Correct me if I’m wrong, (I suppose I must be ready to be called wrong even when I’m right), but is it not a basic strategy that you do not change a winning tactic nor do you correct your enemy when that enemy is making mistakes.
So here’s a wee bit of whitabootery for you. What if Nicola were to start being as nasty towards tRuthles and The Dug as they are towards Nicola and the SNP. What if the public were to see her as so many have said to me when I was able to knock doors, “They politeesians ir aa the same”? I aye vote Labour like Ma Faither an his Faither afore him. An yon Nicola’s a richt nasty piece o wirk.”
What if by joining them in a strategy that is losing them votes Nicola reverses the present trend towards the SNP? The time to change tack is when the craft fails to make headway.
Far as I can see the fact that the BBC gives Nicola, (or any other SNP person), a very hard time while going easy with others is winning support for independence and Nicola is bright enough to see that is the case.
Now, I’ll put that another way for you – could you guarantee that by the SNP getting more aggressive the electorate, (not yet supportive of independence), would be more inclined to turning towards independence?
You propose an untried theory to replace a strategy known to be working, and you call anyone who gives good reasons for NOT changing tack a bully for disagreeing with your untried theory.
Furthermore you are not alone and the present batch of topics are full of critics of the SNP who mostly all claim to be independence supporters.
Re. Crossrail. Both the London Docklands Light Rail and the Jubilee Line extension have produced significant increases in property prices along their routes. This is what investment in public infrastructure does and along with other resulting development impacts, has implications for the local demographics, social needs and political affiliations.
Crossrail is exactly the same, however I don’t think the method used to calculate Barnett ‘consequential’ payments is sufficiently sophisticated or responsive enough to measure the cost that this London benefit will have to the Scottish economy. I might be wrong but I doubt it. HS2 the same.
As well as specialising at uni in “sustainable self-build development strategies in the developing world”, I also specialised in “Transportation Studies”. 🙂
Slightly off topic but about the BBC.
I did a doorstep survey the other day. It was supposedly about ‘Leisure’. However, there was an rather large section on the BBC. It was news to me (maybe not you) but apparently they are going to start pulling in funds from private donors and companies. How do you feel about that? Will it make you less likely to pay you licence fee? Etc..
You can be sure I ticked all the right boxes.
Well if it’s not biased now it sure will be when private donors want some payback.
Terrible news from Manchester. Probably many children injured. Why would anyone do that?
Thepnr @ 11.44
I think you have not the nail on the head there Thepnr.
The woman seems to be doing ok from the way things are ..aka the status quo…. So therefore believed in the Union.
Has been willing to put herself in to the debate to maintain the Union,and has been used and used badly.
She’s no the first and probably no the last.
Disgraceful tactics from the BBC…..She is a human being and they KNEW what they were going to bring down on her.
Liz g.
Absolutely – thoughts with Manchester and all with family and friends involved and emergency personnel.
(If it’s not too selfish to state-SNP manifesto launch tomorrow – think it might be overshadowed)
…or responsive enough to measure the likely cost that this London benefit will have to the Scottish economy.
Much of the development in the London Docklands was not a result of new investment and economic activity. A lot of development and economic activity that would have occurred elsewhere was attracted to the London Docklands as a result of loosened development and taxation regulations, among other stuff.
This is known as competitive destruction, Sarah Boyack c/o BLiS____d.
meg merrilees @ 23:57,
That’s my belief. Far too many coincidences. And well spotted there about Kez. That’s a loose end I had missed.
@ heedtracker says:
22 May, 2017 at 10:52 pm
“Jezza or Mayhem won’t make any difference to the next big choice for people of Scotland”.
I agree. Whoever wins the Westminster GE will make no difference to Scotland. Neither Corbyn nor May wants or will allow IndyRef2 to be held – certainly not within the late 2018-early 2019 timeframe FM Sturgeon is planning for and preferably not for a long, long time or even never.
How the SNP will then cope with Westminster’s refusal remains to be seen.
Here’s to SNP sweeping the boards in June.That’s a must for the next step forward in Scottish Independence
Very sorry for the people of Manchester.
May the dead RIP.
@ben madigan
Do you believe that Labour can win enough seats for an overall majority by themselves?
If it’s a hung parliament and Corbyn needs the support of the SNP to form a government will he ignore that opportunity and let the Tories form a government?
Will the SNP demand a Section 30 order for a referendum be granted in order that Labour can be in power with their support?
Anyway, what does any of that matter, Scotland will have it’s referendum at the time of our Scottish Governments choosing.
AI don’t make me laugh.
Paper cups are disposable,use them once,then throw them away and nobody blames the paper cup if the beverage tastes like shit,do they ?.
No,we should blame the pox ridden, bastard* son of a bitch,who’s responsible for the contents,if that is not overstating it.
*The term bastard as an insult,I don’t mean born,without the ‘correct’ paperwork,that’s just admin stuff or the people of Bastard in Norway (the stress is on the second syllable,nice place by all accounts) I mean the motherfucking assholes in the BBC who choose to be untidy bastards and leave their paper cups,lying around where the impartial/balanced audiences should be.
And is there any point in insulting a robot,calling it a bastard ? are we making a mistake in humanising it,they are after all just running on a programme,yes I know,there is a feel good factor in doing it,right,that robot made me a shit cup of coffee,useless bastard of a machine.
Or is there any point in insulting humans,calling them robots and heartless bastards,well yes there is,if they chose to be bastards,then that’s there look out,so fuckem the lying,hypocritical,greedy,self serving,stupid….bastards.
On a brighter note,there has been some right clever bastards,Leonardo da Vinci was born without the correct paperwork,likewise Confucius and he used to always say,never let the bastards get you down…..or make you a coffee in a papercup or something like that….kinbastard memory
#ToryRobotBastards
@Scot Finlayson says: 22 May, 2017 at 10:16 pm:
“£15 billion for crossrail,
Would Scotland not get its population share from Barnett consequentials,
8.3% of £15,000,000,000 is £1,245,000,000.”
The answer, as it so often is in such matters, is NO.
The funding only has Barnett Consequentials if it comes from a matter classed by Westminster as being English Only. Thus if Westminster claims something is a National Asset, (like the National Ballet, National Opera. et al.). then they claim that the whole nation of the UK benefits so no Barnett Consequentials.
Another ploy is to fund a London or English infrastructure from a fund that carries no Barnett Consequentials. The New London Sewerage System was funded from Government Reserves. The refurbishment of all London Bus and rail terminals is claimed to benefit the entire UK.
So is the Cross-Rail and HS rail links. Then there was a one off grant to set-up Transport for London. Another scam is that London is set up as a devolved government just like Scotland, Wales & N.I. Basically London is a Metropolitan City State with a block Grant like Scotland.
Note the recent announcement of a London sewerage tunnel as, (and I kid you not), the old system could not cope with London’s shit and even a fairly mild bout of rain saw the existing tunnel unable to cope with the untreated shit and it overflowed into the Thames.
Under normal conditions the sewerage containing shit was tunnelled upstream and put through water treatment plants before discharging the cleaned water into the Thames well upstream of London. A new tunnel is to be dug under the Thames to bypass the old tunnel and stop London actually flooding with shit.
Guess who will be paying for the new London tunnel?
Just picked up on the news of the Manchester Arena explosion. My heartfelt condolences to those involved.
CREATIVE destruction, doh.
Meg Merrilees @ 12.35
Having one of my lot and best friends in the recent past attend that arena,and all of mine and their partners working concert security and stewarding during their uni years in this country.
I am very much putting myself in the shoes of the “wating” parents tonight.
So I am speaking from a tiny and very humble wee bit of authority….you are not being selfish….. it’s our Independance that will take us OFF the terrorists radar…but more than that….if this turns out to be a health and safety issue…..then hopefully we can be world leaders in venue regulation.
I have read…but could not confirm that the Ibrox disaster resulted in that ground becoming the Gold standard for Stadium safety.
Not forgetting that in an an Independent Scotland naebody will be reapealing health and safety regulations.
Soooo….no meg it is,IMHO not selfish,to wonder about the Election, we need to address the modern threat so our kids are safe from terrorists/health and safety….. Westminster are shit at this…..we need to take it over.
Reports so far suggest a second device found at the stadium, controlled explosion underway. So not looking like health and safety issue Liz, though ah was rather hoping something as mundane though tragic was the cause, 19 dead, 50 injured so far, awful, just awful and as such yes tomorrow will be back to back news on this, rightly so, but it will mean snp manifesto will be drowned out, though again ah rather suspect Nicola will be kept fully informed of what’s taking place and security measures tightened round the whole of the UK in light of this,
Just so horrible. Those poor people out for a night out at a concert, lot of young people at that arena…tragic.
More Breaking new:
Lancashire County Council chief and leader of the Conservatives in Lancs is among four held by police in a fraud probe.
Liverpool City Council’s chief executive and Ged Fitzgerald Geoff Driver leader of the Tories at LCC are among those arrested.
The probe is into council contracts.
The explosion took place outside the arena, at 10.30pm just as people were leaving. They are reporting that there is always a bit of confusion surrounding events when they first happened. So it’s clear this is a terrorist attack.
@ K1
The thing they blew up in the controlled explosion seems to not have been a threat (abandoned clothing), so still perhaps some hope not terrorism? Probably pointless to speculate at this stage.
Terrible news from Manchester. This old World is never short of unnecessary death and wanton destruction.
Hate and violent revenge are terrible things.
Aye crazycat, just read that, was just reporting as it unfolded from main news sites. Yes, there is the possibility that it’s not the case…sigh
Oh K1 and every one.
The news is getting worse and worse….
I have to keep hoping that it’s not deliberate…up and to untill….. I can’t.,.
Anyhoo we must still keep on campaigning for our country.
I don’t think we should probably be worrying to much about the SNP manifesto launch. First world problems and all that..
Not that it isn’t important, and life has to go on, but it seems a minor thing right now.
Links
SNP says
Our thoughts are with Manchester. We will be postponing today’s planned manifesto launch.
link to scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk
link to indyref2.scot
link to noisesfaetheheid.wordpress.com
link to weegingerdug.wordpress.com
link to newsnet.scot
link to theferret.scot
SNP to insist on Scotland’s right to choose Brexit or independence
link to archive.is
This is a nurses response about pay structure. link to anyvoice.co.uk
link to independent.co.uk
European Commission receives mandate to begin negotiations with the UK
Video here
link to twitter.com
link to irishnews.com
link to skwawkbox.org
link to bloomberg.com
link to evolvepolitics.com
link to uk.businessinsider.com
link to tompride.wordpress.com
Just got up to the news of the awful tragedy in Manchester.
Thoughts and condolences go out to the families.
What a terrible, terrible day. 🙁
Condolences to everyone.
Can’t believe the news from Manchester,just waking up to it,horrendous.
Jeez oh. What a sick world we are living in, targeting children coming out from a pop concert.
One of my son’s mates lives in Manchester and he’s had a text from him this morning, saying that two of his boys and their mates were there last night. They still have not heard from them this morning. I just pray that the are all right. What an absolute nightmare for any parent.
Sick to my heart.
Condolences to all who are affected by this atrocity.
My thoughts go out to those Innocents & there Families who were killed or injured . I readily condemn the person who planted the bomb , but at the same time condemn BUSH & BLAIR & they’re BILLIONAIRE BACKERS for they’re illegal wars, not forgetting the NON DOM newspaper owners who whip up racial tensions to sell they’re bile .
Once again INNOCENTS suffer for the acts of POLITICIANS .
Shocking news from Manchester and SNP right to cancel Manifesto launch.
Meanwhile, Jill Stephenson since banned from Scotsman has taken to Edinburgh Evening News letters page and this morning attacks Wings Over Scotland.
May I echo the messages of condolence to those caught up by the evil in Manchester.
On a day like today, Rupert Murdoch never rests.
link to archive.is
THE SUN SAYS Innocent people were murdered specifically because Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell sucked up to the IRA
Labour pair were snivelling IRA fanboys as it unleashed slaughter on Britain
COMMENT
By The Sun
23rd May 2017, 2:35 am Updated: 23rd May 2017, 5:01 am
Deadly disgrace
FOR Labour it does not get more damning. Innocent people were murdered specifically because Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell sucked up to the IRA.”
All violence is obscene. The events in Manchester even more so considering that children are involved, and that some parents still don’t know where their children are. The perpetrator obviously has a warped mind, but if challenged, would no doubt point to the hundreds of thousands of children bombed into oblivion across the middle east by us and the Americans.
No point in telling him that two wrongs don’t make a right. People like that aren’t interested in hearing that. They’re too far gone.
However, the worst, most obscene violence is state sponsored violence. Politicians taking the “hard” decisions because they don’t have the ability to find a peaceful solution to problems. All violence at some point has to stop. It solves nothing, though humankind is taking an awful long time to realise this.
This terrible event will be used by these same politicians to further suppress our population. IDS has just been interviewed on tv, and already the internet is being mentioned, though not by him I have to say, but I’m sure that he and his leader will have it in mind.
Nothing good can or will come from this…for any of us.
Ronnie at 8.46am.
That.
Spot on Ronnie – as was the journalist interviewed on RT this morning.
@Nana
Thanks again for the links, the Bloomberg one was particularly interesting for this:
“The British currency also declined after Brexit Secretary David Davis said the U.K. will quit talks with the European Union if the bill for exiting the bloc exceeds 100 billion euros”
Didn’t Theresa May say at the dinner for EU negotiators that the UK owed them nothing? This is another mega U-Turn, their bottle has gone. The Tories are between a rock and a hard place and don’t they know it.
Looks like they will pay the EU 100 billion Euro and immigration will barely be curbed due to the effect on business. The Brexiteers and Leave voters are really going to love this.
Halfwits.
Nana says
I am genuinely beginning to wonder! To quote …
” Conservatives could well now be realising the enormity, and simply impossible mandate of what they’re supposed to deliver Brits with Brexit. The whole ‘Leave’ campaign was based on fairytales, and soon the chickens are gonna come home to roost. They know full well leaving the EU and single market under current circumstances is economic suicide, that the EU won’t play ball, and it’s not beyond the realms of possibility it could collapse the whole sodding country. “
… perhaps the critical phrase is “impossible mandate”. It can’t be done.
Don’t really know if I believe it likely, however these are very very strange times.
When and why was History Woman Jill Stephenson banned from the Scotsman? Do tell.
My heartfelt condolences to everybody affected by the the horror of Manchester. It is more than likely that the perpetrator was a member or inspired by Isis/Daesh/Islamic State or whatever handle its known by. This organisations biggest backers are Saudia Arabia, you know the place that Trump was grovelling too the other day. The UK’s biggest and besttest friend in the Middle East.
If anybody says it’s not the Saudi government that is directly backing the terrorists , that is bullshit, it’s a draconian state, they even have special religious police that ensure that woman don’t drive. If they wanted they could stop the money leaving the Mosques for Daesh.
We can only thank Mr Putin for destroying Daesh’s second most lucrative income stream, the stolen oil from Syria and Iraq which was transported unhindered by the USA/UK in truck convoy from the Oil fields to Turkey. Where was the much lauded UK intelligence services last night?
Sad,sad news still coming from Manchester. My sincere condolences to everyone who may have lost family or friends or loved ones at this venue.
In all my time helping people through various problems the one constant I found was that violence on other human beings never solved any problem. It did not satisfy the need for revenge nor the belief you were doing something you justified to yourself for whatever reason. You only created the same feelings in somebody else that caused them to ultimately act the way you did. We create a cycle of hate that destroys us all eventually.
I will pray for all those involved and though probably futile. hope that their tragedy contributes to a realisation that talking is better than killing.
I think today I will take the day off the Internet and reflect on my own beloved family. It seems the right thing to do somehow.
@Lenny Hartley says: 23 May, 2017 at 9:41 am:
” … Where was the much lauded UK intelligence services last night?”
Very likely they were to busy and had their hands full and their priorities correct, (by their standards), checking out the much more dangerous, (to the establishment), vile separatist on Wings, Wee Ginger Dug and other democratic and non-violent Web sites.
It’s dirty work – but someone has to do it.
Robert Peffers…why don’t you take your own advice and scroll past any comments you don’t like or more possibly don’t fully understand? I’m ignoring yours from now on and by the way, I don’t need lectures from a pompous know all pedant like you, yet again.
Should we just shut up for the rest of the day? It’s too much to have petty bickering on a day like this!
@Bill McLean,
No. Terrorism is all about disturbing our everyday lives. Don’t let them. I’m picking a mate up from Schiphol on Saturday. I’ll probably just take the train in. If some terrorist arsehole bombs Schiphol in the intervening time between now and Saturday, I’m still meeting my pal there on Saturday. Because otherwise, they win.
Bill McLean says:
23 May, 2017 at 10:06 am
Should we just shut up for the rest of the day? It’s too much to have petty bickering on a day like this!
No. The warmongering Westminster and UK media war machine that caused this wont shut up today.
This is all on every last MP that voted with Blair and Brown, for the invasion of Iraq, all of it.
Graun
Robert Booth
Wednesday 6 July 2016 15.39 BST
In a six-page memo marked secret and personal, the then British prime minister told Bush, US president at the time, in July 2002 that the removal of Saddam Hussein would “free up the region” even if Iraqis may “feel ambivalent about being invaded” and could well fight back.
Tony Blair wrote to George W Bush eight months before the Iraq invasion to offer his unqualified backing for war well before UN weapons inspectors had completed their work, saying: “I will be with you, whatever.”
Last night was more of Blair’s whatever.
OK let the petty bickerers get on with it! I recognize the war-mongering nature of the UK and the US and others. It’s the bickering that pisses me off – especially today. I am allowed to feel that way and express my opinion. This site which has been mostly wonderful, apart from the odd bit of foul language, over the years suddenly has a lot of presciptors and moderators around.
Bob Mack @ 9.56 am
Well said.
My condolences to all those who have lost family and friends.
@ ronnie anderson 8:46
Once again INNOCENTS suffer for the acts of POLITICIANS
Totally agree Ronnie. Today The Sun has a truly disgraceful front page piece accusing Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell of causing the deaths of thousands. It’s beyond belief that a Murdoch rag should be pointing the finger at others when the gutter press has stirred up more vile hatred than almost anyone else. They should be ashamed of themselves.
I don’t believe we should keep quiet today – or any other day. Scrolling through Nana’s links and reading the comments is keeping me (relatively) sane ATM.
Robert Peffers @ 11,09
Thank you for your kind reply & sorry for any confusion, I am a great admirer of this blog -and your contributions in particular. I am also envious of folks with the right/ ability to live, work and vote in Scotland/Uk as I miss the life, the good humour and my old friends terribly and I always have.
You are probably correct regarding what might (and perhaps is being) tried with status quo ante but I would argue uk membership of european union pre-empts a return to the way things were before whereas allowing England and its colonies to leave the UK would be subject to simple agreement under contract with the other 27 member states.
Before dismissing such an ass backward approach I would urge you to re read the act of union with particular focus on the articles relating to private property and taxation. In my opinion they only make sense if Scotland – rather than England – is the dominant partner (the real power behind the throne as it were) and would appreciate your thoughts; even if ultimately they serve only to slap me out of my delusions ..
All that said I remain unconvinced that England still wants its Brexit – the UKip performance in the English local elections was reminiscent of the punishment given to labour in post truth Scotland and indicates, to my mind, buyer’s remorse. How that manifests itself in the behaviour of a conservative or even labour government the devil may never know but a certain consequence of UK not leaving europe in the next 5 years would logically imply cancellation of the eagerly awaited second chance for Scots to (re)Unite.
Finally, as my heart goes out to the poor souls and their extended families and friends shattered in Manchester by what appears to be a hateful crime of the criminally insane, I sincerely hope that there remains sufficient strength of character in media circles to ensure that, after today, robust debate is neither silenced not rendered superfluous in the days and weeks to come and the purveyors of lies, smears and fears are neutered at source.
I think there is some confusion regarding my post at 1006. You will note that my post was immediately after a bit of a bicker. That is what I am asking for today – no petty bickering, not radio silence! Tolerance – after all, lack of it is what has led us to the horror of Manchester.
galamcennalath says:
23 May, 2017 at 9:28 am
Nana says
“http://evolvepolitics.com/theresa-may-trying-lose-election-something-weird/
I am genuinely beginning to wonder! ”
I have been wondering myself Fox hunting??? Trade in Ivory??? Sell you home for healthcare??? Big question mark over the timing of such an “unforced” General Election???
I don’t think Theresa May has the brains to be that manipulative on such a grand scale, but a powerful lobby group of Peers, British industrialists and power brokers who are alert to the cataclysmic dangers of Brexit might very well consider throwing a Conservative government to the wolves is a small price to pay if it coincidentally threw a lifeline to Britain somehow staying in the UK.
I think it was Michael Heseltine said that the Tories should have taken the Brexit Referendum as advisory, used its mandate to leave the EU as leverage to negotiate a deal which might be sold to the UK public as a brilliant compromise which took all the heat out immigration, and critically left the UK inside Europe, or at the very least in a credible position to hold a second referendum.
I know, I know, tin foil hat time, but what I’m enjoying is the delicious irony that IF there is such a strategic conspiracy, the BBC doesn’t seem to be in the loop. There might even be a suggestion of comeuppance for the BBC’s part in fostering Brexit stupidity, Euroscepticism, and Far Right rhetoric.
The reality is I fear much more prosaic. Theresa May drew the short straw and leads the unhappy band of clueless Brexiteers who are all out of their depth and hopelessly perplexed about what to do. They are actually so very bad that Theresa May trying to win a General Election closely resembles Theresa May deliberately trying to lose it.
Funnily enough I think Panzer Mooth Davidson suffers the same affliction. Here Ruth! Bite this snake. It’s a terrific photo opportunity….
Britain staying in the EU… sorry. Error.
Both Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell voted against the Iraq war in 2003. Far from causing the deaths of thousands, they advised against joining in that illegal war in defiance of the UN. They believed it would would provoke terrorism in the UK. How right they were. How wrong the Murdoch Press is.
John McDonnell’s speech against the war in 2003:
link to youtube.com
Capella – and still our rulers, the masters of the known universe, have not learned. I totally despair at their stupidity!
Is it too much to hope that Holyrood may take action to put BBC Scotland on the spot over Sunday’s disgraceful alleged GE Leaders Debate either by a member’s motion demanding that Donalda and her henchmen appear at Holyrood ito explain their actions or by means of a suitably framed question to Nicola at this week’s FMQs.
Capella says:
23 May, 2017 at 11:06 am
Both Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell voted against the Iraq war in 2003. Far from causing the deaths of thousands, they advised against joining in that illegal war in defiance of the UN. They believed it would would provoke terrorism in the UK. How right they were. How wrong the Murdoch Press is.”
You probably don’t have to be much of a psychologist to understand how provocative the UK must be to people whose countries have been destroyed by the Iraq invasion alone. Its not only that the US/UK Iraq war cost millions of lives, created ISIS and caused the mass refugee crisis, nor that tory UK wants nothing to do with any of it, look at how Blair alone has profited and is still treated like some kind of senior UK statesman.
Every MP that voted for the Iraq should have been “impeached” and at least barred from holding any public office. Ofcourse this can never be allowed to happen in a UK like this one, with endless war at its core. Chilcott was one of the greatest sham’s in UK history.
@ Bill McLean – I think it is not stupidity but liquidity that motivates them. Vast profits in war. Rich spoils in the Middle East and, one day, Russia.
Rupert Murdoch has investments in the oil fields of the Golan Heights, Syria, currently occupied illegally by Israel. So he will want to discredit anyone who opposes ME conflict. His paid hacks are only too happy to oblige.
Some people are starting to suggest that the Tories are moving towards wanting to lose the GE.
I first laughed at the suggestion but their actions over the last week make it look as if there may be some truth in the theory.
In spite of the rosy post Brexit picture of a prosperous land of milk and honey for all post Brexit painted by their pals in the media they realise that it will sooner or later become obvious that Brexit will be a total disaster and that there is nothing they can do to stop that happening – so why not hand the smoking bomb of disaster to Labour or a loose coalition of Labour, LibDems and SNP.
As for May herself her total incompetence becomes more apparent by the day and one gets the impression that she is not exactly enjoying herself in the job of PM. Given that the guy who puts out her bins is not exactly a pauper is not possible that she may jump ship and enjoy a life of luxury instead of having to avoid answering questions every day and hiding from the public.
@ heedtracker – Chilcot was a whitewash. I read the Telegraph account of the SNP motion to have Tony Blair called to account. This was supported by Jeremy Corbyn but vehemently opposed by the Tories and Blairites.
Not archive because there are some interesting video embeds:
link to telegraph.co.uk
Neither rain hail nor catastrophe can keep the Liberal Democrats from their appointed task
This morning I received the latest offering from the Lib Dems (hand delivered by activist) a newspaper style edition of Stop the SNP,and they are earnest about it by mentioning it 13 times but curiously they claim to be able to STOP the SNP but the only way they can is by overturning the Scottish Parliament, and if this in their minds is the case how are they able to achieve this great feat, plus if the Lib Dems claim to be that powerful why then do they only oppose the Tory Brexit but can’t stop it, I mean that’s just complaining then isn’t it?
Are the Liberal Democrats more powerful than the will of the people as expressed by a democratic vote in our Scottish parliament or are they just a bunch of big mouthed opportunist chancers who shouldn’t be out leafletting on this particular day when everybody else has called off political hostilities for the moment
You decide
Very interesting links posted by Nana. Particularly liked the one about the daily mail having to close comments.
Re this fake furore about Joanna Cherry’s tweet – I wonder whether she was set up. It would be ever so simple. Just nudge a bit of fake information in her direction, and hope to catch her off her guard.
Nana’s link to the Irish News at 7.16 contains this paragraph and a half, which might be of interest to those who periodically suggest the SNP MPs should not attend Westminster:
@heedtracker
Always wondered why UK/US did not covertly plant some WMD and Chemical bombs in Iraq to legitimise the illegal invasion and plunder of Iraq in 2003,
anyhoo,
Tony knew that removing the Saddam regime was not going to lead to a free democratic peaceful Iraq,
he wrote this to Bush before the invasion,
“The biggest risk we face is internecine fighting between all the rival
groups, religions, tribes, etc. in Iraq when the military strike destabilises
the regime. They are perfectly capable, on previous form, of killing each
other in large numbers.”
this was not about helping the people of Iraq this was all about destabilising the middle east and plundering/controlling oil production.
The way I see it, it will be impossible to take the BBC out of Scottish politics. It is a fundamental instrument of cultural and political control. The state isn’t going to voluntarily relinquish such power over Scotland?
No, we need to convince our friends and neighbours ourselves.
link to sustainabledevelopment.un.org
link to un.org
@crazycat
Point well made. Nana’s links are good eh 🙂
Gonna have to break ranks with you on this, Rev 🙂
– To my mind, we cant really complain about Holyrood competencies being raised when 4/5 parties fielded leaders that sit in Scottish Parliament. The only solution could be to have each party field a nominated leader from the Westminster parliament…or independence
– Are we really saying nurses can’t go on holiday or have a personalised numberplate? The fact is – food banks or not – this woman does a heroic job (way more than most of us on this site) and gets paid too little for it. Let’s put our hands up and say their salaries need raising and end the matter
– Further to the above, worried we’re looking like we’re trolling the woman. Fine, maybe she exaggerated her story but let’s leave it there. We’re looking nasty to a lot of people
We’re all gonna have to develop a thicker skin around criticisms of the SNP record. 10 years in office does that. Better to embrace it and refute the facts as they pertain to the whether Scotland can / should be independent
“Gonna have to break ranks with you on this, Rev”
You appear to be disagreeing with a completely different article to the one I actually wrote, which repeatedly pointed out that nurses should be paid more and at no point suggested they shouldn’t have holidays.
Re. the BBC. Don’t fall into the bad practice of Yoon accounting, there are two sides to every balance sheet. The BBC in Scotland promotes the continuation of the status quo but it also shines a very bright light on the nepotism and corruption that is at the heart of British nationalism. They are painted into a corner and can only get more ridiculous.
Just point and laugh.
@Lochside says: 23 May, 2017 at 10:00 am:
“Robert Peffers…why don’t you take your own advice and scroll past any comments you don’t like or more possibly don’t fully understand?”
That’ll likely be because I have never advised others to do so, Lochside.
“I’m ignoring yours from now on and by the way, I don’t need lectures from a pompous know all pedant like you, yet again.”
You do that, Lochside, but by doing so you confirm that the actual, “pompous know all pedant,” in this instant is none other than yourself.
As ever I do not make claims without reasoned explanation.
This blog is an open forum. Commenters are thus either imparting information, stating an opinion or are debating something or other that is usually the topic set by the Rev Stu Campbell.
You stated an opinion and that is your right. I considered your opinion was wrong and I stated my reasons for considering it wrong. I further explained it could be counter productive for the cause of Scottish independence. That is debate which is my right and everyone else’s and is the main reason for the existence of Wings over Scotland.
I always believe that open debate is both healthy and welcome. Why then would I advised people to scroll past things they did not agree with?
Obviously you are the one who is misunderstanding something as that has never been advice from me.
I advise scrolling past things that anyone finds unacceptable or upsetting. So there you go, if you cannot accept honest criticism then by all means scroll on by. If my honest opinion upsets you than again, Lochside, scroll on by.
However, neither of these is your stated reason for scrolling by my comments. Your stated reasons confirms that you are wrong in claiming I should follow my own advice and it confirms you are the. “pompous know all pedant”, who advises others to, “scroll past any comments you don’t like or more possibly don’t fully understand”?
I understood your obnoxious attitude all too well but you did not understand mine.
@misteralz says: 23 May, 2017 at 10:26 am:
“No. Terrorism is all about disturbing our everyday lives. Don’t let them.”
Well said, misteralz, and all very true.
@Bill McLean says: 23 May, 2017 at 10:40 am:
“OK let the petty bickerers get on with it!”
Do not, Bill, confuse petty bickering with numpties who just cannot bear being contradicted. One main benefit of Wings is it is an open forum for debate.
Unfortunately some here seem to think they should not be contradicted. I am not one of them. I welcome criticism and debate. Unlike Lochside I will not be scrolling past his comments in future. I will, though, scroll past certain others where all attempts at debate have ended in stalemate with no further debate possible.
“It’s the bickering that pisses me off – especially today. I am allowed to feel that way and express my opinion.”
No one has said you should not express your opinion.
“This site which has been mostly wonderful, apart from the odd bit of foul language, over the years suddenly has a lot of presciptors and moderators around”.
Again, Bill, disagreement is neither prescription nor moderation.
It only becomes a problem when someone cannot accept another’s views without throwing the proverbial dummy out of the pram. That’s the point where debate ends in a strop.
CameronB Brodie says:
23 May, 2017 at 12:21 pm
The way I see it, it will be impossible to take the BBC out of Scottish politics….
I completely agree, but that isn’t my beef with the BBC.
It is the absence of competition and access to any alternative perspective which gets me hot under the collar. It isn’t what the BBC broadcasts which disappoints me, it’s the arguments, perspectives and general narrative which arent currently being broadcast by anyone which leaves me frustrated.
The ScotRef referendum needs to be an informed choice, but I have no confidence whatsoever that the BBC is fit to be presenting the arguments which are meant to inform our electorate. I find the present near monopoly of news and political debate wholly unacceptable, whether it was biased or not, and of course it very much is biased.
Even say, for example, the BBC was magically excluded from commenting on Scotland’s polical landscape from now until the the ScotRef, then ask yourself whether social media and hosted video clips which we would have at our disposal is in any way equal to the task of adequately presenting the pro Independence narrative to the whole population?
I don’t want the BBC’s Pax Romana, I want to see the live and let live philosophy in practice, and an indigenous Scottish Broadcasting Service permitted to co-exist.
(Not being a Latin snob, Pax Romana is the Roman Peace which reigned after everybody who opposed them had been crushed).
I seem to repeat myself a lot these days, but if you compare a referendum to a contract, the actual vote on referendum day itself is just the signature at the bottom of the page. It is important, it’s the mark which makes the decision binding, but the meat and drink substance of the contract however is not contained in the signature but the body of the text which precedes it.
In an ideal situation, all of Scotland’s Independence arguments must be aired thoroughly and dispassionately, considered objectively in the round, rigorously debated with the hope of reaching a consensus, and ultimately exhausted before asking the population to give its signature technically ratifying the decision. That simply is never going to happen with the BBC in control.
All that looms ahead is another shotgun wedding type referendum with the vows rushed through and finished before the congregation has even had time to sit down. “I pronounce you still in the Union. You may now kiss my arse”.
Robert Peffers…you are an crabbit individual who does not brook criticism . You have called me a troll in the past… an unforgiveable insult… and coming from someone who insistes he’e ‘British’ because he lives in some kailyard in Fife.no doubt you will deny this as well…and now you have encouraged me to join other parties for having the temerity to criticise the SNP of whom I am a paid up member.
Why don’t YOU join another party or better still start up your own one: The Robert Peffer’s Dictatorship Party for Pompous Pedantic Prats. I’m sure you would enjoy declaiming to yourself all about the United Kingdom of blah blah blah…ad finitum
@Lochside says: 23 May, 2017 at 2:02 pm:
“Robert Peffers…you are an crabbit individual who does not brook criticism.”
Bloody hilarious, coming from a person who is throwing their toys out of the pram with both hands because I did not agree with something they claimed and is now trying to tell me to leave Wings, the SNP and even my own county.
As to your idiocy in objecting to my perfectly true claim that we are ALL actually British because we all live in Britain this indicates you have completely lost the place.
Laughably your strop is for nothing more than your own anger that someone will not agree with your own personal and obviously wrong views.
Yet in your view I’m the one who is in the wrong. You couldn’t make it up?
Oops! My mistake – you just did make it up..
coming from someone who insistes he’e ‘British’ because he lives in some kailyard in Fife
lol
“happy is the man who belongs to no party
who sits in his ane chair and stares at Benarty
Robert Peffers,
“As ever I do not make claims without reasoned explanation.”
What is your “reasoned explanation” for the following comments?
Robert Peffers (18th February “Here comes a surprise”)
“The fact is that a little common sense will show that the immigrants mainly come to find work. Elderly English cadgers excepted, these who sell up expensive city homes for cheaper, or better, Scottish accommodation, free bus passes and the benefits of such as free prescriptions, care at home and cheaper Council Tax. These are often the ones most prone to call scots subsidy junkies.”
Robert Peffers (20th May “The unholy union”)
“They discriminate against no one – not even the, sometimes ungrateful, English retirees who sell up expensive southern homes and buy into Scotland to benefit from the universal benefits the SNP SG have instigated here in Scotland.”
What was wrong with Gordon Brown calling Scotland “North Britain” while it is part of the UK when a certain pro independence poster insists on our right to be “North British” AFTER independence?
Robert Peffers,
“The Irish, whether they like it or not, live in the British Isles and are thus British. If they choose to claim not to be British then, like you, they have conceded their right to be British to the United Kingdom.”
Rock,
“”Conceded”?
They escaped from being “British” after a long and bloody struggle.
Who in their right mind in an independent Scotland would want to be called “British”?”
Only “pompous know all pedants” perhaps?
Fucks sake, he’s talking about the name of the archipelago…beggars belief what your problem is wi him Crock, 18th February…Jesus fucking wept, stalking is the creepiest and most vile of human predatory conduct and yet you indulge it to the hilt on here…what a weird little creeper you are. And what a sad fucking life you must lead if this is how you spend your time, keeping files of copy and paste on people ‘you’ have judged from your fantasy position of some twisted ‘moral compass’ on Wings.
Hi K1.
There are peeploids among us, who have a lack of imagination and/or original thought. They cannot put together a coherent argument about any topic at all, so revert to a position where they regurgitate the utterings of others to make their point.
The problem is that they have not formulated a coherent point of view (other than “National BAD”), so the point that is in their head is lost to other readers by the pasting of other contributors’ comments, rather than contributing any input to the debate taking place.
See you on 3rd June – no doubt a certain contributor will be conspicuous by his/her absence at the event.
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