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The greasy poll

Posted on March 15, 2018 by

A new Scottish Labour propaganda website called The Red Robin attracted some attention at the weekend by claiming that new polling had shown Labour closing the Westminster voting gap on the SNP to just 4 points.

To try to lend some credibility to this rather dubious assertion – the SNP’s average lead is currently around 15 points – it pointed out that the polling company’s owner was the Vice-Chair of the British Polling Council.

Readers would quite reasonably infer from that that Moonlight Research was a BPC member, and BPC rules state that if figures from a poll enter the public domain, the full data tables concerning those figures have to be released within 48 hours so that people can scrutinise them and ensure that the methodology (sample size, weighting, question wording etc) is fully up to scratch and above board.

So since the blog post is now five days old, we dropped Moonlight a line asking if we could see them, and quickly got an interesting reply.

We thought you’d like to know.

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357 to “The greasy poll”

  1. starlaw says:

    The Poll was taken in the Caird Hall last weekend

  2. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    I’m not sure Labour would have polled as high as 30% in those circumstances.

  3. heraldnomore says:

    Typical Labour, red and robbin’, baseless assertions.

  4. Bob Mack says:

    Moonlight,moonbeams and zoomers.

    I’m sure Cole Porter could have written a song about that.

  5. Black Joan says:

    Ha ha. So he’s literally moonlighting, i.e. operating outside hours and on his own terms at the behest of a particular interest-group.

  6. Muscleguy says:

    Propaganda plain and simple. Just like this ‘Russian’ chemical weapon scam.

  7. bobajock says:

    ROFL – bordering on some weird alternative universe for Labour in Scotland.

    Can I predict something? I polled 3 people in my office on how Brexit was going – they all said different things, but 100% polled said ‘jaw dropping stupidity’ in their responses.

    (never call them Scottish Labour, given there is no such entity).

  8. Andy Anderson says:

    Sounds like another Brit Nat lie to me.

  9. stonefree says:

    Given that not data is or will be released for scrutiny , and the Blog is more than likely read by the true Labour faithful I’d suggest that the published Blog is merely to keep them on board, nothing else.
    Who is going to be the first Labour chancer to rave on about these spurious figures?

  10. heedtracker says:

    A little confusing is nice. SLabour charlatans could also be described that way if you didn’t want to hurt feelings. Headline frontpage UK press in Scotland tomorrow though.

  11. Thepnr says:

    Sham political party “Scottish” Labour publish sham poll results, no real surprise there then.

    Deluding yourself like this is plain stupid, again no surprise there either, just look at who they have elected as leader.

  12. heedtracker says:

    “Good research isn’t easy
    But I can make your research or researchers better”

    Our prestigious client includes the Labour party and many many others, what we’ve made better.

    Call now and you’ll receive your personalised poll to make it look like your doing far better than you really are, and a free pen.

  13. inkypic says:

    Well Red Robin is also a fictional superhero so why not continue on with the same fictional theme!

  14. TheMadMurph says:

    OH! Headshot, as the saying goes!

    Great work Stu!

  15. Macart says:

    Bob, bob, bobbin’ along to the same tune as usual then.

  16. BrianW says:

    Little Robin Red Breast
    Sat upon their Laurels

    A little poll they did behest
    for Corbyn they did their best

    Jumped with glee
    claim gain on the SNP

    Little Robin Red Breast
    they’re not in the BPC

  17. donald anderson says:

    Ronin basturts.

  18. HandandShrimp says:

    I guess Labour felt that they needed a boost at their conference and this was all they had. The fact that the scheduled their main speeches for the Scotland game and the Old Firm game also shows that forward planning is not their strong suit either. Did anyone pay that event even a passing glance?

  19. A2 says:

    I take it you then asked if you could see the details anyway?

  20. Calum McKay says:

    The north british branch remains a joke!

    After listening to the laughter at Richard Leonard during FMQT today, I give him to the summer.

    He is like a record, asking the Scottish Government to intervene in reserved matters, reserved matters he will not support the responsibility being made a matter of the Scottish Parliament.

    I never thought I would say it, but Kezia is better than Richard!

  21. Abulhaq says:

    [Male robins are noted for their highly aggressive territorial behaviour. They will fiercely attack other males and competitors that stray into their territories and have been observed attacking other small birds without apparent provocation. Such attacks sometimes lead to fatalities, accounting for up to 10% of adult robin deaths in some areas.]
    That’s good to know.

  22. OT when was an accused person not allowed to see the evidence against them I’m talking about the nerve gas scandal against Russia so Britain is going to give samples of it to there friends who will of course find in their favour,but no sample,to the accused justice British style by the way I held a poll on Scottish independence and got a 100 per cent yes vote I won’t tell you how many I aske or where I asked but I expect you to believe it is the oppinion of the whole of Scotland well I mean all the rest of the pollsters do

  23. artyhetty says:

    Red robin, yes Robin’s apparently steal other birds’ nests and are quite aggressive.

    It looks like in this case the Robin is nestless however!

    Question is, should this guy have even stated his vice chair job at the BPC, because it is very misleading and somewhat unethical imo, and certainly opportunistic. Very dubious. But then, the Labour party are just that, opportunists, very much to the detriment of Scotland.

    It’s just another heads up that Scotland has been duped by Britnat Labour for a very long time. Keeping Scotland poor and begging, while enjoying a huge popularity and taking money from the people.

    Just sickening really.

  24. Dcanmore says:

    or as the title should read, ‘Labour’s polling shows it is doing really well.’

    Reminds me of Blair McDougall during the last GE campaign where he says that ‘polling’ has put him in the lead but just to be sure of a win please send more cash. He came a distant third.

  25. Effijy says:

    Thanks Labour for confirming that you are continuing to avoid the truth at all costs and present deluded unqualified garbage as fact.

  26. Macart says:

    Just been following the Rev’s twatter feed on FMQs and dear God! Both Conservative and Labour lead with questions on reserved matters.

    What is the point of these people? Seriously.

    Davidson banging on about Russia and RT which are defence and broadcasting related, then Leonard on employment law. Did we miss something throughout the Smith commission farce and subsequent Scotland Bill debates? Did we actually win the 2014 referendum and the past three years have been a Bobby Ewing moment?

    Or is it more likely that our parliament opposition benches are full of half wits and folk who are being somewhat less than honest?

    One of life’s mysteries.

  27. Proud Cybernat says:

    The moment you are found lying is the moment you lose all trust. SLabour have not learnt that lesson and, consequently, they will continue to wallow in the political doldrums. They seem to have no clue that THE INTERNET EXISTS and EXPOSES THEIR LYING to hundreds of thousands of people in seconds.

    And still they wonder why they languish in the polls. Because you’re a bunch of weapons-grade LYING COCKWOMBLES.

    Aye – the blue Tories do it too but we EXPECT them to do it.

  28. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    Moonlight = Yoon Shite

    Is Nick Moon, Moon the Yoon?

    Red Robin is BritNat Labour Propaganda championed by Common Space and other Old School SLaBbers.

    The BritNats last hope seems to rest on:

    1. Con Scots into thinking Labour care about Scotland and her people

    2. Say that there is “no appetite for a 2nd Indy Ref” and push a Federal UK solution to the Constitutional Crisis

    3. Publish “Now is not the time 10 Year Indy Plans” to try and push the Indy genie back into the bottle

    They still don’t get it.

    Labour had their chances and blew them when in Government at all levels in UK and Scotland.

    They sold us out via “The Vow” and Smith.

    There will be a Second Indy Ref, they know it and are frantically playing for time.

  29. GORDON FORREST says:

    Anyone want a bet that we are about to see a huge surge in this type of “poll” by many other “polling organisations”and that the media will quote them ?…. Rev how about a little black book with a list of all the tricks that these cretins get up to when trying to boost their credibility and put down theirs. This could be used as a guide for spotting “fake news” or as I call it another ******* blatant unionist lie.

  30. ClanDonald says:

    Haha, “the greasy poll,” so witty 😀

  31. HandandShrimp says:

    Weird that FMQs were not on the meeting over Brexit yesterday. That, one would think would be far more relevant to business in Holyrood this week. Leonard seems vague on what is and is not reserved and so far has failed to set the heather on fire. Davidson and the BBC seem to be focused on RT so I suppose it is no surprise that she used her question time to go into UK propaganda mode rather than deal with Scottish political matters.

  32. heedtracker says:

    PM Teresa and her BBC r4 news gimps are Russia bad funny tragic right now, as they run out of Russia bad superlatives, “its terrible that Russia should do this in such a remarkable city as this one,” announces Teresa.

    Now its Corbyn’s fault, beeb gimp wise, for not backing Teresa enough, like them.

    Near on two weeks now of Russia bad blanket BBC r4 vote tory gimp coverage, in every single BBC r4 Russia bad news show. How much longer, for ever probably.

    Without any self awareness, BJ describing a post imperial, belittled, once great country, diminished, trying to assert itself on the world stage, but dont worry its not nuclear holocaust stage, “thank heavens” explain the toryboys.

  33. Sharny Dubs says:

    OT (although its been mentioned already in this discussion) All this “outrage” at the supposed Russian involvement in a supposed attempted murder. Has it not be recently disclosed that British agents have been officially preforming illegal acts, the magnitude and severity of which will not be disclosed? Hypocrisy hardly covers it.
    Look a squirrel!!!

  34. Chick McGregor says:

    In the words of the old song:

    ‘When the red, red robin comes bob, bob, bobbin’ along, along
    There’ll be no more sobbin’ when he starts throbbin’ his old sweet song ‘

    And reading below the headline, as Stu has taught us, it is technically true.

    It is an old song and folk won’t be sobbing they’ll be screaming.

  35. Artyhetty says:


    It’s completely deliberate Macart. They are a) undermining the Scottish parliament, by attempting to fool the people, and b) deceiving those who have no idea about what is devolved to Scotland, and what is reserved to WMgov.

    Their weapon right now is relying on ignorance. I had friends up from NE Eng at the weekend, they have no idea about devolved or reserved matters. It doesn’t matter, but in a way it does, because they are fed so many lies about Scotland by the bbc and daily rags including the daily dose of the Graun.

    When I pointed out that immigration is not devolved they were quite shocked. ‘What Scotland has no say over that at all?’
    Also no idea about the continuity bill or potential power grab. Sadly this is also the case among many people in Scotland.

    The main and most important thing we need to get out to everyone in Scotland, is what devolution means, what is and is not devolved and of course what it will mean if the UKgov succeed at their power grab.

    Devolution light won’t keep Scotland afloat for much longer as it is, it’s not working with so many Scottish unionist, British nationalist MP,s and MSP’s working against their actual own country and even their own parliament. It’s just ridiculous and incredibly dysfunctional in fact.

    Independence, or years and years of this system that works against Scotland, that is the choice, and people need to get that reality into their heads.

    Labour/tory/libdem all rely on fairytale politics, detracting from anything that is real, with 100% of UK so called media creating more fairytales by the day. It’s just freaking bizarre!

  36. Welsh Sion says:

    “As it only has 1 polling client, Moonlight doesn’t meet the Membership requirements [of the BPC]”


    Someone should tell the BPC:

  37. GORDON FORREST says:

    OT Although mentioned a couple of times already Russia
    dominates the news defence secretary Gavin Williamson said: “Frankly Russia should go away – it should shut up.” Very grown up. Whats he going to say next “or we’ll get our big brother to sort you out and he is bigger than your big brother” these people really make me want to puke they are either imature, ignorant of diplomacy, gingoistic,or downright nasty or in some cases all of the above of course Brittish inteligence ( god I hate putting those two words together) dont do the sort of things that Russia has been accused of.

  38. Bob Mack says:

    @Welsh Sion,

    They do seminars but have only ever conducted one National poll in 2015. Think they miss the criteria. Seem like tree huggers.

  39. mogabee says:

    Oh the murky world of Scottish Labour…

    I wish all this was in the past. I’m itching to get started on a new indy campaign, and judging by social media, I’m not the only one.

  40. admiral says:

    HandandShrimp says:

    15 March, 2018 at 1:25 pm

    Weird that FMQs were not on the meeting over Brexit yesterday. That, one would think would be far more relevant to business in Holyrood this week. Leonard seems vague on what is and is not reserved and so far has failed to set the heather on fire. Davidson and the BBC seem to be focused on RT so I suppose it is no surprise that she used her question time to go into UK propaganda mode rather than deal with Scottish political matters.

    Scottish Tories? Members in the Westminster unable to ask questions about the competencies of that parliament, instead witter on about what happens in the Scottish Parliament.

    Members at Holyrood unable to ask questions about that parliament but witter on about Westminster responsibilities.

    Are they thick or what?

  41. Welsh Sion says:

    @ Bob Mack.1.55 pm

    Agreed – And if you follow my link you will see that they are listed as a Member of BPC.

    Shurely shome mishtake.

  42. Dan Huil says:

    Let British nationalists wallow in their Russian mess. They’re desperate to forget brexit and the constitutional issues that go with it. Britnats are also desperate to ignore all that Russian money they’ve pocketed. I’m sure more dodgy polls are on the way.

    Britnats can run but they can’t hide.

  43. Jack Murphy says:

    Ruth Davidson,Leader of the Tory Group in the Scottish Parliament during First Minister’s Questions.

    “…….We have a proud tradition in this country of a free press which acts without fear or favour, a media which seeks to meet the highest standards of objectivity, so that people get the truth……..”

  44. manandboy says:

    The bloke in the pub thinks that everyone and everything connected with the Salisbury nerve gas incident has been removed to Porton Down which is just over 7 miles from Salisbury. Where else would you go. No shortage of chemical weapons experts to gather evidence.

    A remarkable coincidence that the only place in the UK where samples of the nerve gas used in the incident are stored, is a mere 7 miles from the scene of the crime, except that Skripal lived on the outskirts of Salisbury. That’s the coincidence! A former double agent lives so close to the UK’s only chemical weapons base and there’s no connection ? Pull the other leg.

  45. North chiel says:

    “ Macart @0107 Ruth Davidson banging on about Russia and RT, reserved matters”. Yes it looks to me that the unionists are choosing their ground for Indyref2? They have lost the economic case and as usual when a Tory government is in severe trouble , they run with “ defence of the realm” as their “ get out”. How convenient also that TM can now emphasise the defence of “ Europe” in future Brexit talks. The state propagandist have now turned an attempted murder , into a Russian state chemical weapons attack on the “ U.K.”.

  46. Chick McGregor says:

    Welsh Sion

    Well spotted, another fib.

  47. Thomas says:

    That is why I absolutely love this site, you are worth every penny of that 100 grand every single penny. I love the way you show these lying bastards up for what they are LYING BASTARDS.

  48. Referendum1707 says:

    It’s beyond any doubt that as things hot up re Continuity bill, indyref2 etc etc there’s going to be some highly dubious polling going on.

    EU Ref 2015. A couple of days, maybe 3, after the result I was in the corner shop for something and caught out of the corner of my eye a big headline on one of the rags something like “59% now support indy” or it might have been “59% for 2nd indyref”. Needless to say I didn’t bother buying it or even looking more closely, such is my aversion to and disdain for these shitty little rags and so just ignored it.

    Sure enough a few days later “polls” were again putting indy support at the usual approx 47%.

    So you’re expected to believe that within the space of less than a week – during which time would they even have had the time to commission and carry out polls? – support for indy went from 47 to 59%, then back down again to the default figure.

    US Elex 2016. ALL the polls had Clinton winning outright by a large majority. Either they were flat out making them up or they deliberately focused only on areas/demographics where Clinton had strong support.

    Certain things make me think that broadly the polling re indy may be roughly accurate because neither side can, at the moment at least, be even confident of winning and that could only be because their private, extensive and unbiased polling is telling them that it actually is pretty evenly split. If there were clear indications to the contrary then one side or the other would be demanding a ref NOW.

    On the other hand who here honestly believes that any series of polls conducted by any of the established polling organisations which showed a clear and consistent uptick in support for indy would ever see the light of day?

  49. Robert Peffers says:

    @heedtracker says: 15 March, 2018 at 12:08 pm:

    “Call now and you’ll receive your personalised poll to make it look like your doing far better than you really are, and a free pen.”

    Yes, heedtracker, but that, “Free pen”, is well worth having. It is the one they keep all those SNP BAAAD! Sheeple in.

  50. Schrodingers cat says:

    It is this sort of poll and headline that people are refering to when they say that indyref1 started when support was only 28%
    It wasn’t , the SNP won in 2011 with 45%. Yes had 45% in 2014. We ate on 47% in the polls. These last few % will be hard won

  51. geeo says:

    None of the labour and tory politicians want to talk about stuff pertaining to their relevent parliaments for good reason.

    In Scotland, they would be destroyed by Nicola and co as the SNP have widespread backing across the political spectrum.

    By that i mean, people who are firmly AGAINST indy still vote SNP at holyrood because they actually LIKE the SNP policies.

    I know several of them, most of which are looking at voting YES this time as even they realise what brexit will mean to Holyrood.

    At WM, they have to be seen to trash Holyrood to curry favour with Treeza and the Whips office.

    “We love you Scotland”…like a wife beater loves his bruised and bloody spouse the next morning.

    Time to seek refuge and finally end this systematic abuse.

  52. Schrodingers cat says:

    You are correct it was 58%? The Rev tweeted It. But polls occasionally throw up rogue results. The last few have trendedicated. 46 49 46 48 47 etc. We are probably about 47 48 %

  53. Thepnr says:

    @Jack Murphy

    Yes it’s interesting that Ruth Davidson and the media themselves. in particular the BBC feel the need to state how trusted and honest they are in bringing the “truth” to the public.

    Sites such as Wings which debunk media lies on a daily basis have them worried. Very worried as the scales fall from the publics eyes.

    The louder they proclaim their honesty the more the public will look at them suspiciously. It’s all good in my opinion.

  54. Scott says:

    Tory colleagues, including the Chancellor, use the fact that the Russian donors to the party are now UK citizens, can we ask on what grounds they were granted citizenship when others are being refused and removed from our country?

    How do you go about getting a FOI regarding these donors and citizenship.
    Up here in the Highlands a few family’s have been deported and some still await their fate maybe they have not given enough money to the Tories.

  55. heedtracker says:

    Agent Alex Salmondski at least tries to counter the rolling beeb Scotland gimp fury at him, for daring to have a telly prog on Russia telly.

    He’s up against it right enough, our beeb Scotland gimp masters just will not tolerate anyone else but beeb gimps on the airwaves.

    Ah the joys of having one of the most corrupt public broadcasters in the west, desperately trying to bring down Scotland’s elected government, only £3.5bn a year.

  56. Dan Huil says:

    Don’t pay the bbc tax. Let British nationalists pay for British nationalist propaganda.

  57. HandandShrimp says:


    Not sure but for most of the campaign Yes was stuck around 37% although they did dip to 28% in Oct 12 and, oddly, in Oct 13. It was only in June 2014 that the polls tipped upwards into the 40s and they have stayed there ever since.

    A starting point of 48% would be a better place than we had in 2012 but I agree that it will be that last 5% that will require a huge amount of work.

  58. galamcennalath says:

    The Brit Nat side are resorting to some very dodgy tactics over the last 4-5 years …

    – dubious polling
    – fake grassroots
    – coordinated letter writing to newspapers
    – ‘experts’ passed off as neutral who don’t reveal affiliations
    – think tanks with a hidden agendas passed off as neutral
    – etc etc

    … what does that say about their belief in their own cause’s merits and prospects?

  59. Robert Peffers says:

    @mogabee says: 15 March, 2018 at 2:11 pm:

    “I’m itching to get started on a new indy campaign, and judging by social media, I’m not the only one.”

    And there are more battles lost through that kind of itch than were ever lost through military might. An untrained soldier will start firing their weapon before an enemy is within range.

    Hence the old saying, “Wait till you can see the whites of their eyes”. The troop that charges too soon often finds itself outflanked and totally wiped out.

  60. heedtracker says:

    … what does that say about their belief in their own cause’s merits and prospects?

    Is the RT Alex Salmond show the trigger for all this tory fury at Russia too?

    Probably not but its hard to not wonder, not out loud though:D

    Its easy to conjecture like a tory conspiracy theorist, that the snap GE that took out Salmond and Robertson was just that, coordinated surprise attack, across Scotland, with BBC Scotland gimps laying down their two years of “we said no, we meant NO,” scorched earth fury and SNP bad monstering ofcourse.

    Toryboys’s looking across the House at nearly all Scots MP’s vile seps, a wildy enraged beeb Scotland that had come very close to losing its hegemony over all UK state attack propaganda in its Scotland region, a dead in the water red tory comedy troupe and then up he pops again, on RT.

    Its extremely likely that RT will get closed down by planet toryboy and that will be that for Salmond, wont it!

  61. 10/30 says:

    Re the secretary of state’s stiff upper lip statement today which was followed by questions from the media, this from Louise Brown (daily mail)……could future package of measures to be unleashed in response (to Russia) include a military response….god knows what’s swirling around this woman’s head to arrive at a conclusion of ‘military response’

  62. starlaw says:

    This may indeed be about closing RT, too many people are now relying on RT for their news reports, weve had it with Brewer and Jackie Bird etc.
    But Moscow could shut down BBC in Russia.

  63. Ottomanboi says:

    UKGBNI needs a Ministry of Truth. Our dear Ruth might be put in charge. Can just see her on the big screen down the shopping mall. Haloo, I’m Ruthie Proudscott of Ministruth, just one wee squirt of Struthie Bang and those troublesome nats are gone!

  64. orri says:

    Perhaps a question might be whether any of those ex-Russians are potential targets and the UK is kicking up this shitstorm in an attempt to cover their asses.

    OTOH I wouldn’t be surprised if after the elections in both Russia and the UK evidence turns up to pin the blame on a 3rd party and embarrassed apologies made to Russia once the exercise has run it’s course.

    Good news that the UK is about to embark on chemical warfare research under the guise of “defence” though. Worked well for Japan when the most credible threat they face is Godzilla.

  65. Ottomanboi says:

    Terezilla v King Putong…in IMAX and 3D

  66. yesindyref2 says:

    OT – defence
    An article in UKDJ about numbers of hulls (ships) the RN has, had and will have, not the first. I guess I have a different perspective from many because of looking at the possible composition of a Scottish Navy.

    Clearly we won’t have a huge number of hulls, so the key thing will be to optimise the use and availability of them, particularlay the availability for service.

    The RN apaprently works on a rule of 3, so for 6 T45 only 2 would be worked up and on active duty. I think even the fairly compact RN needs to shake itself up and make this a rule of 2, and Scotland particularly will need to. If we have 4 frigates, 2 of them at least need to be available, and even 1 of the other 2 within hours or days at most of getting ready and worked up.

    For me this is planning and base spending, spares inventory, infrastructure, repair maintenance and even refit facilties. It’s not what we’ll have, it’s how we’ll maximise use of it.

  67. heedtracker says:

    But Moscow could shut down BBC in Russia.

    All this frenzy has got a lot of benefits for the tories, RT getting the chop, with Salmond, is just one of many great reasons for the whole toryboy/beeb gimp network to go apeshit right now.

    When this happened it was simply reported, by exact same beeb gimps, currently going medieval on Russia’s arse.

    You can do this all day, which is presumably what top beeb gimps and toryboys have been doing to, cost benefit analysis if you will.


    A lot of journalists have been murdered in Russia, investigating Putin in particular. From the same beeb gimps, hardly a mention.

    As Russia is turned in to the great enemy again, FBI Russian meddling in US politics gets closer and closer to planet toryboy’s greatest ally, Orange Hitler.

    Trump will be the BBC’s most powerful foreign vote NO or else weapon indyref2.

  68. Meg merrilees says:

    This whole anti-RUSSIAN guff is OTT.

    Though having said that Nicola has heard enough to convince her that ‘some’ action should be taken.

    I am in no doubt it is an attempt to close down access to RT;
    it may be an attempt to prevent Trump and Kim Jung Il meeting;
    it is no coincidence that the Defence minister has announced today £750 million ( ? or some other sum can’t remember) to research ‘Chemical Warfare’ at Porton Down. If they had announced that three weeks ago there would have been uproar. Why not put £750 million to the NHS?
    Never a time more like now to need Trident

    I’m more inclined to favour the report in the Irish Times – Skirpal was a spy, a double agent, how do we know that he wasn’t currently involved in some other assignment and was getting close e.g. about to find out exactly what is going on in Trump’s admin.

    And they certainly didn’t like Corbyn telling the Tories that they were being hypocrites and i notice Nicola inferred that when Davidson was hedging around RT discussion at FMQ’S today.

    Listening to Holyrood discussing OBFA just now and it seems to me that the hysteria virus has infected this place as well. Does nobody member what was going on at the weekend in Glasgow – ‘Goodnight Green and White”, balaclavas on the streets of Scotland in daylight …. where is this going and when is enough going to be enough!

  69. yesindyref2 says:

    OT – defence – Air Force
    For Indy Ref 1 back in 2012-14 the RAF had intended to retire all the 53 odd Tranche 1 aircraft, which had limited multi-role capability in terms of ground attack, suitable really for air defence. So quick as a flash I marked them up for the Scottish Air Force on the basis they’d be going for a song. Some for operational uses, some for spares.

    Problem is the RAF changed its mind, and there will now be two QRA air interception and superiority squadrons made up of the Tranche 1 Typhoons, some of which are in storage to preserve airframe flying hours (max 6,000, usable 3,000), probably one squadron at Lossie and one at Coningsby, with about 16 Typhoons each plus around 12-16 for spares (I spent last night loking through chassis numbers and info!).

    This means we won’t get the Typhoons, though as a transition I’d expect to see QRA remain as it is while Trident is still on the Clyde till its new base is ready, so it means it’s now open season on what type of fast jets Scotland would need and acquire over a period of years. It could well be the Gripen, Typhoon is at end of line for production, but I guess since the F35 is likely to be around $100 million each and a lot cheaper to run than the £80,000 per hour of Typhoon (compared to £30,000 of Tornado), that’s a possibility too.

    I’d go for the F35-B probably to go with my pet LDA project which could be able to carry 4 to 6 F35-B if big enough, though not able to take off fully fuelled and missiled up.

  70. Ottomanboi says:

    The Conservative and Unionist party has gratefully received much financial support from certain expat, ex-communist oligarchs with no love for Putin resident in England. Could it be, a set up?
    Gospodi pomilui!

  71. Meg merrilees says:


    MSP just arguing that the OBFA is unnecessary because bad behaviour doesn’t happen at Nairn football ground, and the behaviour we saw last weekend is going to happen anyway.

    So, I don’t steal cars and there is a law forbidding that, but I don’t ask for the law to be removed on the grounds that cars are safe where I live but in Glasgow it is going to happen anyway.

    What am I missing about this Act,- at the risk of opening the floodgates, why do people think it is a bad law?

  72. Meg merrilees says:


    MSP arguing that the Football Act is unnecessary because bad behaviour doesn’t happen at Nairn football ground, and the behaviour we saw last weekend is going to happen anyway.

    So, I don’t steal cars and there is a law forbidding that, but I don’t ask for the law to be removed on the grounds that cars are safe where I live but in Glasgow it is going to happen anyway.

    What am I missing about this Act,- at the risk of opening the floodgates, why do people think it is a bad law?

  73. Dr Jim says:

    If I did a poll in my street the Lib Dems would win the next election

    So what does that tell you about personalised polling!

    Nobdy who is actually affected by the consequences of not having OBFA wants this law repealed (NORMAL PEOPLE)
    It’s purely political opponents and legal pedants, neither of which groups live anywhere near the clubs these nutjobs purport to support

  74. Cactus says:

    Question time, dunno if mentioned already but ah was wonderin’…

    See how this alleged nerve agent (as we are advised) came in the form of a ‘GAS’ and NOT a liquid or a solid…

    And see how when you ‘fart’, this would normally come out in the form of a gas and eventually disperse into the air.

    How was a gas able to do harm to others, LATER, outside, does it linger?

    Aye also saw some footage of the crime scene on a guest tv and noticed there was a Greggs shop nearby… them greasy steak-bakes are lethal btw.

    Any thoughts RP.

  75. yesindyref2 says:

    My contribution is simple.

    Go for the bridies, they’re the best.

  76. Dr Jim says:

    I initially misjudged the FMs comments the other day but after FMQs today the FMs words were chosen very carefully when she pointed out that going by (*what she’d been told*) Russia was very bad, that’s a little different to Russia bad,
    because what the FM said without saying it was *If I get it wrong it was because the UK Guv told me that was true information so it’s not my fault if they’re found out to be telling big fat fibs*

  77. Scott says:

    Martin J Keatings on Twitter as I don’t do Twitter can I tell you I got the same reply regarding Smith.

    ?Many thanks for contacting us about BBC News at Six on 7 February.

    Firstly, we apologise for the delay in our reply. We know our correspondents appreciate a quick response, and it is a matter of regret to us that you have had to wait on this occasion.

    We understand you feel that a report on Police Scotland contained an inaccuracy.

    We have discussed your concerns with the relevant team in our newsroom, who accept we were inaccurate to say that the call to Police Scotland was to 999, as you are correct, it was to 101. This was an error, for which we apologise.

    We would like it noted, however, that this report was in the wider context that there have been other very serious incidents when Police Scotland have been criticised by the Police Investigations and Review Commissioner for poor handling of 999 calls, as well as PIRC criticism of the poor handling of 101 calls.

    We hope this explains our approach. We do appreciate the time you have taken to raise this with us.

  78. Dan Huil says:

    I believe the tories, since May became PM, have benefited to the hypocritical tune of over £800,000 from “friendly” Russians.

  79. Meg merrilees says:

    OBFA no longer exists ~: 62 to repeal against 60 to keep.

    A large group of muscular guys clapping energetically in the front rows of audience.

    OH DEAR!

  80. Craig P says:

    Moonlight Research, preferred polling company of lunatics.

  81. Stoker says:

    Rev, several days ago i put it to you, as a suggestion, that the next wee book is called (and coloured) The Wee Gold Book (Wee GB). And i stated it would also be quite apt as the next opportunity would truly be our golden moment to grasp indy. Just came across this in the archives and it reinforces my thinking.

  82. Tinto Chiel says:

    O/T but fingers colossal Tory hypocrisy on Russia:

    Oh, for a balanced media…

  83. ronnie anderson says:

    Come tae think of it ah hivnae seen ah Red Robin this year ur they oan the endangered list .

  84. Andy-B says:

    So one could safely say the poll is a load of bias bollocks….thought so.

  85. 10/30 says:

    10/30 @ 3.34, secretary of state should read defence secretary

  86. yesindyref2 says:

    OT- defence – again
    Mulling it over I’ve gone off the F35-B for iScotland, it’s expected there’ll be a maritime version of the new Gripen E/F which would take care of my LDA, so it makes sense to go for the pretty cheap C/D to start with likely second-hand off the peg and hence way cheaper than the new price of about $30 million each, but with long life, half the cost it seems of maintenance of other aircraft, quick turnaround time. Perfect for our needs. And we could go for 2 full squadrons for the same price or less as 1 bare one of Typhoons which was my previous preference. Plus SAAB do pilot training.


    Sweden is also a member of NORDEFCO along with Norway, Denmark, Finland and Iceland, something I’d want us to join.

    So that’s that sorted 🙂

  87. Clive Scott says:

    Anyone know how many turned up at the Caird Hall for the Red Tory Britnat SNPBaaad fest?

  88. yesindyref2 says:

    OT – defence for the last time while I’m hot
    Frigates. Probably looking at something like the T31e maybe a bit bigger in weight and length, but fully kitted so will be looking with interest at the accepted full spec. I’m kind of guessing to get the £250 million price tag they won’t reach their full potential without a lot more spending over time, so a cost of £500 million each for the 4 the Scottish Navy would want.

    Plus the cost of the likes of a hangared Merlin HM2 each (available) for anti-sub, but a hull sonar rather than a quiet hull with towed array as they’d need to be GP. Should be adequate for our ASW all the same, along with some MPAs perhaps the P-8A. Who’d build them? Babcock and Fergusons, with Thale. I suspect BaE is on its slow way out of Scotland in terms of naval shipbuilding once it’s done its few T26es.

    We’re going to need a high level of integration navy to air force, as within the 12 nm territorial waters and 200 nm of an EEZ, air defence from the Gripens would be primarily land-based from Lossie, with minimal actually on the frigates.

  89. galamcennalath says:

    yesindyref2 says:


    I remember being surprised at the F35 talk, in a Scottish context. The Gripen seemed more appropriate.

    Also, the idea of the Scottish Defence Force using ships designed of the present Royal Navy’s requirements. Building the type of ships, especially patrol boats, used by Norway under license in our yards also seems more sensible to me.

    I expect iScotland will have a clean slate. Given the way these Brexit talks go, I don’t think there is a hope in Hell that rUK could negotiate the breakup of the UK coherently. The outcome, IMO, will also be walk-out! They get to keep all assets, and all debt.

  90. yesindyref2 says:

    Sugar! I always forget something. The frigates would have to be “ice capable”, perhaps with an auxiliary ice-breaker, and perhaps with their own modular ice mission bay. It’s only now it seems the US and UK are awaking up to the Arctic threat increasing with global warming, with a joint sub support exercise (ICEX / SKATE) ongoing at the moment off a floating ice floe base.

  91. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Clive Scott at 5.41

    No claims about attendance numbers were made and TV coverage went to great lengths to avoid showing the attendance

  92. yesindyref2 says:

    Yes, I fixed on the idea of some F35-B some time ago for the LDA [1] and VSTOL, and since we wouldn’t be able to afford too many types of aircraft in terms of maintenance and spares, just went for that automatically for land-based air defence as well. But since the Gripen should be maritime capable, we could standardise on that instead, even if a slighty different version as is the F35-B from the A (and C) variants. Supposedly the Gripen can switch from air defence to ground attack mode quickly, at the flick of a switch for the pilot. The E variant has mach 2 super-speed, and 1.1 cruise without afterburners. Nice.

    [1] LDA – Large Deck Amphibious for a kind of definition. Possibly a converted merchant ship with a big deck like an ore carrier. It’s reckoned there’ll be 80 I think around the world within 10 years giving smaller nations the ability to have mobile air defence and ground attack. I want one! Cost – maybe £400 million, I’d err on the side of caution and say £500 million.

  93. Macart says:

    Well? Opposition benches got their dearest wish and defeated the government benches today over the OBFA.

    What’s the cost to society for their … victory? Do they even care? The win was all that mattered, right? Omelettes and eggs, right? Oh, and let’s not forget the votes.

    Just so the meeja types and policy wonks know? When this goes wrong in people’s communities, and it will go wrong. I don’t think many will be listening to any SNPBAAAAD bullshit. They’ll know exactly where the blame lies.

  94. North chiel says:

    The “ Real “ propaganda channels in full anti SNP swing this evening ,
    with STV opening up with a triple whammy of RT/Alex Salmond, SNP Dundee councillor story and of course Mark Macdonald. Pacific Quay go with RT/ Alex Salmond , Mark Macdonald and finally SNP bad delay on opening of Aberdeen Bypass.( never mentioned the 40 year delay when the unionists were in power).

  95. Gullane No4 says:

    Cheery wee spot by me today.

    Very polite and well spoken [assumed English] guy in Morrison’s picking up a National from the basement and placing it on top of the Record.

    Teaches one to not make assumptions.

  96. yesindyref2 says:

    The strapline on RT of the Salmond picture in the Herald in its Salmond Bad article is interesting, and true:

    “Alex Salmond: Scotland incredibly well-placed in world in terms of soft power”

    something many of us have said. Backed up with a compact proportionate but strong defence, what’s not to like? I can see a couple of the universities having a Diplomacy degree, an Institute of Diplomats, with of course some Trade Ambassadors to go along with them. That’s do for me.

  97. galamcennalath says:

    North chiel says:

    propaganda channels in full anti SNP swing this evening

    Most annoying. I’d be worried, though, if I thought they were winning. They clearly aren’t. Their onslaught is relentless and yet, if anything, Indy support is creeping up. And that’s with no equivalent widespread pro Indy campaign.

    At best they are slowing our advance with their rear guard action. ( I dislike military analogies, but sometimes they fit well. )

  98. Dan Huil says:

    Britnat media desperation is getting embarrassing. I believe more and more people in Scotland are seeing through all the anti-Russian, anti-Scottish crap.

    Westminster’s toothless moth-eaten lion isn’t roaring, it’s squeaking like a mouse.

  99. Proud Cybernat says:

    OBFA repealed by 62-60 votes. Now this sectarian cancer in our society is free to sicken all of us.

    I hope now we will all have learned what happens when we lend our second vote to the Greens.

    Never again.

  100. ScottieDog says:

    Initially I found myself disagreeing with the SNP over Russia gate. The more I have thought about it though, if I had been making the strategic decision on how to play this, I would have done the same (I would bet a good number of MPs are feeling torn over it though)

    I think it’s a case of choose your battles. Had they gone down the Corbyn route, the whole of the Scottish press corps would have rounded on them and made political capital for weeks, at a time when we need to focus people on brexit.
    The majority demographic watching MSM news have lived through some of the Cold War and are easy to Manipulate with regards to Russia.

    I also fear that calling the Russia chemical ‘attack’ into question would motivate those pushing all the buttons into something more ‘convincing’ and maybe closer to us.

  101. starlaw says:

    clive scott 5-41 re Caird Hall

    Only half the hall was in use, cut off by a black curtain. no Balconies were open. I guess those in attendance were Labour Councillors and their partners, probably on expenses.

  102. heedtracker says:

    Incredible vote tory teresa propaganda there from Channel 4 and Jon Snow. A half hour party political broadcast on behalf of planet toryboy.

    What on earth has spooked the whole of planet torboy like this? Teresa’s walkabout set ups in Salisbury pretty much like what Brenda and her fellow parasites take for granted.

    Something is up on planet toryboy.

  103. Tinto Chiel says:

    Macart:”What’s the cost to society for their … victory? Do they even care?”

    Indeed. I’m probably in a minority on here in that I attend all my diddy team’s home games and we are due to host the two big Glasgow teams over the next few weeks.

    Celtic are not immune from having some unpleasant types in their ranks, like some of the loopier of the Green Brigade (believe me) but now I am dreading more than ever our visit from the Sons of William/Queen’s XI now that the Muppets have defeated the OBFA.

    It’s the Butcher’s Aprons, the vile songs, the abusing of our black stewards, the general WATP arrogance, exceptionalism and sense of entitlement which makes me, a provincial fan since 1962, ask myself “Why do I put myself through this for just a fitba’ match?”

    Then my thrawn gene kicks in and I attend regardless through gritted teeth, but I do wonder the effect of all this, on both domestic and street violence.

    Debating club points about human rights and freedom of expression have never seemed so self-indulgent and smug.

    And for the decent Rangers fans, of whom I know a few, well, they really need to make their views heard in opposing sectarianism.

  104. TheBuchanLoony says:

    ScottieDog @ 7.22 I Agree. I believe the SNP’s support for the, no evidence, Novichock poisoning pantomime has actually outsmarted the Tory government. There is little doubt that Teresa May going large on this event has brought welcome squirrel deflection from the Brexit mess still going on in the background but I also think that they also thought they could include a conveniently timed trap to undermine the Scottish governments credibility in the ‘power grab’ negotiations. In 2003 the SNP MP’s were vilified for voting against the Iraq war. I believe the Tories also expected the SNP to have a similar stance to Jeremy Corbin and ask for evidence and independent proof of Russian involvement (especially as Ecky is ‘under the Kremlin’s control’ on RT). This would then allow a MSM and BBC onslaught of the SNP ‘not bringing the country together’ in times of attack by a very bad Mr Putin. (Britnat Patriotism rules ok, SNP are tractors etc). I think Nicola has brilliantly avoided this trap and outwitted Teresa May in saying that based on the briefing the SNP has received so far from the Tories they fully support her. When it all comes out that it was all lies and falsehoods then Nicola is squeaky clean and can still say that she acted on the information she was told by May’s government at the time.

  105. K1 says:

    In honour of the increasing hysteria involving the Rushins. I’m now changing my moniker, for the first time, to K1ski…see ye’s oan the ither side comradskis.

  106. K1ski says:

    Here we go, now posting under new moniker….could ye tell it wis me?

    (coat oan)

  107. heedtracker says:

    So all the UK cops and spooks out there couldn’t find any Westminster paedos, for decades and despite all kinds of evidence but, they’ve already found the Salisbury poisoners, Russia, expelled a couple of dozen Russians, with the whole UKOK tory media go berserk at us to vote strong and stable teresa tories.

    Its just that Ted Heath also owned a lovely mansion house in the cathedral square, one of several too.

    Any vote teresa polls out yet. Maybe get that choob up there to do it.

  108. yesindyref2 says:

    Yes, it was the right thing to do and the clever thing to do. It shows she can be a strong FM when neccessary, preseve the public order and security of Scotland. Something the unionists can’t criticise at all. The UK parliament by custom get behind the Government even if they don’t totally agree when it comes to national security, and as the 3rd biggest party the SNP have done just that, leaving Corbyn gasping like a fish out of water in his bewildering rambling point-scoring – something voters in Scotland won’t have missed.

    I suspect Sturgeon has built up a close circle of advisers over the last 3.5 years, ones she can listen to and ones who can speak their mind. She had a bit of a shaky start with the Trump / Clinton thing (even May did better), but I can’t think of any serious mistakes she’s made recently.

  109. yesindyref2 says:

    It is, by the way, quite possible the security services know exactly whodunit if it is the Russians after all. can’t prosecute, so they’re expelled in the batch of 23 to let the Russians sort out their own messki.

  110. Sinky says:

    At PMQs Nicola Sturgeon again exposed Ruth Davidson’s hypocrisy and totally demolished another hapless performance by Richard Leonard.

    If you missed George Monbiot online article in Guardian it’s well worth a read.

    Theresa May is dragging the UK under. This time Scotland must cut the rope

    After seven weeks still no SNP rep on EBC Question Time this evening. Howver Brian Cox is on and hope he has been well briefed.

  111. heedtracker says:

    yesindyref2 says:
    15 March, 2018 at 7:50 pm
    It is, by the way, quite possible the security services know exactly whodunit if it is the Russians after all. can’t prosecute, so they’re expelled in the batch of 23 to let the Russians sort out their own messki.

    Has anyone died yet?

    Be funny if they’d all had the iffy fish.

  112. Macart says:

    @Tinto Chiel

    You have my sympathies TC. You couldn’t pay me to go to a football match these days and in my younger days I was football daft. I just wouldn’t risk taking a family into that atmo now.

  113. ScottieDog says:

    Worth a listen.
    Over paid smug prick John humphries interviewing Afshin Rattansi (RT) on radio4..

  114. galamcennalath says:

    “Prime Minister Theresa May and British businesses are banking on European Union leaders granting a Brexit transition deal next week but diplomats said they could face disappointment unless a deadlock is broken over the Irish border.”

    Tick tock. Though to be honest, I don’t think that worries the Tories the way it worries everyone else!

  115. Tinto Chiel says:

    Sam @8.11: attending these games is just a bad habit for me now, really, I suppose, but I am glad that I decided not to expose my girls to all that stuff when they were wee and the “supporting” link is now broken.

    Sad all round.

    We need a New Scotland pronto.

  116. Rock says:

    Rock (26th January – By hook or by Cook):

    “The British Establishment makes sure that anyone who goes to Westminster gets corrupted.

    56 SNP MPs achieved as much for Scotland as 6 would have: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

    I would prefer that all of them are called back or lose their seats before they have been bought off.”

    The SNP supporting Westminster in its false accusations against Russia prove my point.

  117. Macart says:

    @Tinto Chiel

    Couldn’t agree more. I miss the stands and the banter and on a professional front, I even miss taking the pics for local sports pages. The cup games used to be awesome. (sigh)

    Maybe some day I’ll go back and have a look, but not anytime soon.

  118. Ken500 says:

    All the polls are suspect, The Polling so called ‘expert’ s gets it wrong has been censured and fined many times. BBC BT ‘expert is head of the Association. The whole industry breaks the guide lines, Poor methology, data collection and statistical analysis. They get censor and fined all the time but nothing is done, The should be banned. Gerrymandering is punishable by prison. They use the Polls to manipulate the result.

    Sir BT is biased and not impartial. For services to BT. It is not what is said but what is left out. They get £Millions of private and public money. The unionists illegally give it over to their mates. BT Danny Alexander illegally gave thousands of public money to his mates ‘polling company’. The Polls are just manipulated. They break the Purdah period. The Pollling industry gets it wrong. It would be just as balanced blindfolded putting a tail in a pretend donkey. Donkey’s game of chance. The Bookies get it right. Better analysed. They have monies to lose.

  119. crazycat says:

    @ Sinky

    Here’s your Guardian article archived:

    It’s maybe even more relevant now than when it was first published a year ago, since then he was only speculating about various things, some of which have now happened.

  120. Rock says:

    Proud Cybernat,

    “OBFA repealed by 62-60 votes. Now this sectarian cancer in our society is free to sicken all of us.

    I hope now we will all have learned what happens when we lend our second vote to the Greens.

    Never again.”

    geeo says:
    14 March, 2018 at 12:16 am (A historic breakthrough)

    “Poor rock…still desperate.

    As long as the Greens are supportive of independence, i have zero issue with them.


    Rock (25th June 2015 – “One question answered”):

    “I have made it very clear that my suggestion is to SNP supporters.

    I want zero risk to an SNP majority, therefore SNP supporters must give both their votes to the SNP to avoid any risk.

    The likes of Paula Rose are trying to dupe SNP supporters into giving their list vote to the Greens.

    The Greens leader Patrick Harvie is as much anti-SNP as the unionists, and independence is not his top priority.

    I don’t want a hung parliament where the SNP has to rely on Green or Socialist MSPs.”

  121. Ken500 says:

    Statisically the SNP rep should be on QT every ten weeks. (1/12 pop). Just don’t watch it. Unless an interesting person is on. Otherwise not good. Do not watch it. Put the rating down Viewing figures. Thst is the only way there will be change. Is if the rating go down It can be pathetic and depressing.

  122. heedtracker says:

    56 SNP MPs achieved as much for Scotland as 6 would have: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

    So why did the BBC for example put so much in to getting them out of Westminster then? Duh Rock.

    Can you not come up something a bit more original Rock, same thing every night, SNP out, Rab Peffers is horrid, youre all a bunch of stinkers etc.

    Do you want some new SNP out ideas Rock?

    I hear some of them even have sex lives Rock, unlike you no doubt:D

  123. Artyhetty says:

    Re Auld Highlander@8.25pm

    ‘Jobs North’ sounds like the ‘north’ not scotland, but ‘north britain’. A Tory called ‘Mountain, how apt. We have a massive fckg mountian to climb with Britnats wrecking Scotland, especially the ones ensconced in and taking the absolute rip out of Scotland and a massive wage to fck Scotland over all in one go.

    I am truly truly disgusted today at these Britnat gits at Holyrood and the Greens! Utterly disgusting. What is their dirty little agenda, we all know, but many do not know. Troughing, lying, scheming gits of the highest order, may they rot in hell.

  124. Artyhetty says:

    I think you may well be correct.

  125. Brian Cox on Question Time,

    don`t know his views on Vladimir Putin but Brian spent a bit of time acting in Russia and recently done/did a tv show in Russia about Scots who had contributed to the story of Russia,

    it was a Scottish/Russian who`s strategy halted Napoleon`s conquest of Europe by abandoning Moscow instead of fighting and then starving the Grande Armee (you know the rest).

  126. ScottieDog says:

    Jeez just looking at the Rev’s twitter feed.
    The MSM emperor Is starkers.

  127. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    This Brian Cox?

    Check his badges!

  128. jfngw says:

    I see the Herald journalists are circling on twitter to agree how bad this site is.

    Their rage is oozing out, why do we not recognise their journalistic quality. Possibly because it doesn’t exist I suppose.

    The bad news is I can read full herald articles whenever I want, no payment, it’s easy. Also block the adverts. The problem is the quality of the output is so poor it’s not worth the effort.

  129. Tam the Bam. says:

    yesindyref2 … 6-19pm

    How many JAS-39’s did you have in mind.Very capable aircraft and kinda expensive too.

    Bargain-basement F-16’s?

  130. Jock McDonnell says:

    Can’t fault the FM for her position on the nerve agent stuff. Her job is to look after Scotland’s interests. I have to bow to her judgement here.

    And today’s Salmond show – an absolute stormer – maybe the best yet.

  131. Rock says:


    “56 SNP MPs achieved as much for Scotland as 6 would have: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

    So why did the BBC for example put so much in to getting them out of Westminster then? Duh Rock.”

    Guardian reader with a Slovene (ex-)girlfriend, don’t you know that Pravda GB has always been anti-SNP and anti-Scotland? Is there any surprise in it putting in everything to get rid of the SNP? Whether there are 6 SNP MPs or 56.

    But tell me what the 56 SNP MPs achieved for Scotland.

    No Ken500 style fake news please.

  132. Rock says:

    Jock McDonnell,

    “Can’t fault the FM for her position on the nerve agent stuff. Her job is to look after Scotland’s interests. I have to bow to her judgement here.”

    Dr Jim says:
    12 March, 2018 at 8:56 pm (A historic breakthrough):

    “The First Minister should have kept her mouth firmly shut on Russia and I don’t usually disagree with her on much but I believe her to be way wrong on this one”

    Rock says:
    12 March, 2018 at 8:19 pm (A historic breakthrough):

    “Yet the clueless pompous armchair pundits posting here would be happy for Nicola to be declared First Minister for life, so blind is their faith.”

  133. Rock says:


    “I see the Herald journalists are circling on twitter to agree how bad this site is.”

    Buy the fake “independence supporting” The National to keep its elder sister The Herald alive.

  134. Tinto Chiel says:

    Macart @8.53: understand completely.

    On the plus side, the Pies Where I Am are ok.


  135. Glamaig says:

    ScottieDog says:
    15 March, 2018 at 7:22 pm

    ‘Initially I found myself disagreeing with the SNP over Russia gate’

    I agree with you, I think its a smart move politically. Its not as if we are supporting military action which would be a totally different kettle of fish.

    We get enough pelters for other stuff, we dont need the ‘stooges of the Kremlin’ thing, for no gain.

    Possibly Nicola being on the Privy Council has seen evidence that we will never see, and it would be unwise to refute it without solid counter-evidence.

  136. Thepnr says:

    @Brian Doonthetoon

    Wonder where Mr Cox got his Eh! badge though think I can guess 🙂

    On a totally different topic I wanted to say something about support for Independence among our older citizens. We all know that support among the under 55’s is above 50% but that over 55’s is support for No is over 60%.

    I wouldn’t give up on them, especially not if there is one such voter in your own family. Politicians aren’t going to change their opinion from No to Yes and neither are the MSM but YOU can.

    If you have a family member that voted No then that’s who you should concentrate your efforts on. Their opinions can be changed and those best placed to do so are YOU and their wider family. Keep talking to them, you can get through and it’s worth the effort.

    No kidding I believe the key to a Yes vote next time around is by taking our own older voters along with us. Plenty of whom already support Yes but we need more. Every No to Yes is worth two votes.

    Keep at them relentlessly, eventually they will listen, it’s worth trying and who better to try than a Yes supporting relative they love.

  137. Rock says:


    “Can you not come up something a bit more original Rock, same thing every night, SNP out, Rab Peffers is horrid, youre all a bunch of stinkers etc.”

    Like ranting about the Guardian and your Slovene (ex-)girlfriend?

    Let us make a deal.

    If you make a vow never again to mention The Guardian and your Slovene (ex-)girlfriend here, I will stop referring to you as the Guardian reader with a Slovene (ex-)girlfriend.

  138. Rock says:


    “Possibly Nicola being on the Privy Council has seen evidence that we will never see, and it would be unwise to refute it without solid counter-evidence.”

    Something like the “sexed up” dossier on Iraq’s non existent weapons of mass destruction?

    Blind faith is not a good thing in a democracy.

    Everyone and their dog knows that the Russian state had nothing to do with this.

  139. Rock says:

    Rev. Stuart Campbell (5th March – “Our problems and how to solve them”):

    God Save The Queeners

    “How do we win them round? We don’t. We walk away and use the time to do something productive instead.”


    “So there probably isn’t much hope of making a serious dent in the grey vote any time soon.”

    Thepnr says:
    15 March, 2018 at 9:51 pm

    “No kidding I believe the key to a Yes vote next time around is by taking our own older voters along with us. Plenty of whom already support Yes but we need more. Every No to Yes is worth two votes.

    Keep at them relentlessly, eventually they will listen, it’s worth trying and who better to try than a Yes supporting relative they love.”

    Rock (5th March – “Our problems and how to solve them”):

    “In my humble opinion, with limited resources, it is the ultimate in stupidity to waste them on those who are highly unlikely to be convinced and converted: the British Nationalist elderly, the selfish middle classes, English settlers and the thugs.”

  140. Clootie says:

    Will the person impersonating and posting as Rock please stop it. You are over doing it…even Rock isn’t as stupid as these posts try to make him out to be.

  141. heedtracker says:

    Let us make a deal.

    If you make a vow never again to mention The Guardian and your Slovene (ex-)girlfriend here, I will stop referring to you as the Guardian reader with a Slovene (ex-)girlfriend.

    I don’t care Rock.

    You can say anything you like on WoS. My love for Prof Smirky gets stronger and stronger by the UKOK BetterTogether Slovene day.

    You do have to hand it to this two pay cheques toryboy carpetbagger, he’s doing alright out of trying to destroy nascent Scottish democracy, and for this sort of carry on teamGB garbage too.

    You also have to wonder if he’d making as much mullah back in the day, when he was a republican trot, from England, trying to start a revolution, in our Scottish hearts.

    You yoons eh Rock. What a bunch. But as it says on the first page of the great UK Constitution, “who says life in teamGB is fair.”

    Adam Tomkins MSP Retweeted

    Murdo Fraser
    Verified account

    Mar 9
    More Murdo Fraser Retweeted Cabinet Office
    Let’s not forget that the SNP want every single one of these powers returned to Brussels.

  142. geeo says:

    Arshin Rattansi on QT tonight…this will be this guy.

  143. manandboy says:

    Were any other business in the UK to produce forecasts like this below, Theresa May would be shouting from the rooftops about it and doing so regularly. But instead, what do we get from Theresa and the State Media? NOTHING.

    From Rigzone: UK North Sea production will increase in 2018, according to WoodMac.

    The energy research and consultancy organization expects output in the region to hit 1.9 million barrels of oil equivalent per day this year, its highest level since 2010, as a raft of projects that started up in 2016 and 2017 ramp up to full production.

    “Two big fields, Mariner and Clair Ridge, are also due to start up during the year,” Swann said.

    BMI Research Oil and Gas Analyst Richard Taylor confirmed that the start-up of fields like Mariner and Clair Ridge were expected to drive an output improvement in the North Sea this year.

    In terms of UK North Sea exploration, WoodMac expects 2018 to be like last year but said all eyes will be on West of Shetland, where several “key” exploration and appraisal wells planned throughout 2018 could start “a new wave of UK projects.”

    “An exploration well at the giant Lyon prospect … and an appraisal well at the Cambo discovery are two good examples,” Swann said.

    Theresa May is following the example of her PM predecessors going back to Jim Callaghan in the 1970’s in NEVER speaking about Scotland’s oil reserves for fear of spreading the news that SCOTLAND IS WEALTHIER THAN NORWAY and thereby risking interest in Scotlands wealth developing into a demand for Independence .

  144. heedtracker says:

    That was quick. Will they build this actually inside No.10?

  145. Thepnr says:

    Support for Independence is rock solid at around 45 to 48% for the moment, so as an individual I will keep plugging away at persuading fellow Scots that originally voted No to come over to the side of the good guys.

    I certainly won’t give up because of something some journalist or British Nationalist politician has to say. Keep plugging away bit by bit we can change peoples minds.

    Especially a No voter that is part of your family, they can be won over. Don’t be shy about hassling them they will thank you in the long run. Never forget it’s in their best interests too.

  146. ScottieDog says:

    I love some of the economic shows on RT, like Boom Bust, renegade inc, and Keizer Report.
    The economists (non-neoliberal types), the likes of Steve keen, Michael Hudson, Richard Werner and campaign groups e.g Positive Money invited on are rarely given any airing on BBC.

    Keen wrote the book ‘Debunking Economics’ and predicted the financial crisis of 2007 some 3 years before it occurred. He is of course persona non grata as far as MSM are concerned.

    I made this point to David Leask and was labelled a Russian bot and subsequently blocked.

    The shows call into question the neoliberal economic ideas that thatcher Britain has been built on.
    They threaten the financial establishment of the U.K. – the oligarchy, the city of London and all those who are stealing everyone’s wealth. An end to this power and a return to a more equitable economy would if anything make the UK a more cohesive unit, and if anything a much tougher nut to crack for any opportunistic foreign power.

    Of course the idea is now that the very mention of RT shows will stir up a well of emotion in the naive, lazy British populace. Some are branding it Neo-McCarthyism.

    The U.K. is doing a wonderful demolition job all on its own. Why would Putin want to intervene?

  147. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi Thepnr. (Changed your monicker again 8=))

    in order to win indyref2, we have to convert 5% of former NO voters to YES.

    Some people commnenting on this web site just don’t understand that fact.

  148. heedtracker says:

    Some are branding it Neo-McCarthyism.

    If only it were that interesting. Brexit is a rolling catastrofuck of Gordon Brown and Tony Blair proportionality. There’s more than likely going to have to be an Ireland/UK border running down the middle of the North Sea, for example.

    All this Salisbury poisoning carry on does, is give the Teresa tory clown show and massed ranks of beeb gimps, a great chance to blot it all out and keep the UK populace frightened, anxious, and voting tory, just how both the red and blue tories like us all to be.

    Having said all that, if you live in the blast zone near Faslane, hope your practicing the teamGB atom bomb dropping in your neighbourhood drill.

    You put your head between your legs, your British legs and kiss your arse goodbye.

    Rule Britannia.

  149. Ottomanboi says:

    How can it be that there are Scots who think that their country is better served by playing second fiddle in a political arrangement that in real terms amounts to a form of colonialism, both physical and psychological. Such a rheumy-eyed ‘institutionalisation’ may need a sharp shock to the system. Delivering that shock goes beyond the domaine of conventional party politics and strays into the area of psychological warfare.
    The British state has employed and may well re-employ, ‘project fear’ in pursuit of its fundamentally anti-Scottish aims. We need a ‘device’ of our own, a constant reminder that we are here and our people and country will not be airbrushed from history by a bully with antique notions of grandeur.

  150. Capella says:

    The excellent Chris Hedges also has a show on RT. The MSM would not give him air time.

    The lunar modules in Westminster have spun out of orbit now. Once they calm down and present some evidence then we will know whether their accusations are credible.

    No doubt Russia’s oligarchs are just as venal and brutal as our own. But this episode has all the hallmarks of an orchestrated witch hunt.

  151. Jock McDonnell says:


    what is a ‘country city’ ?

  152. Hamish100 says:

    Another day not to discuss independence from brexit

    alex salmond
    James Kelly whose not for laws for dealing with bigots

    and for Davidson whose hired herself ouf for a meal with a Russian to say we follow the rules is just the lowest, Noticed she wasn’t smiling.

  153. Thepnr says:


    Ruth Davidson is the most dishonest politician in the UK and that’s saying something. A hypocrite that will take Russian money for the Tory party to have a dinner yet will attack Alex Salmond for doing a TV show.

    She is never of the telly and getting paid for it! Great British Bake Off, Have I Got News For You.

    On 13 October 2016 I appeared as a guest on the BBC’s “Have I Got News For You”. I received remuneration of £1,500 from Hattrick Productions (a television production company, of 10 Livonia Street, London, W1F 8AF), which produces the programme. They also paid for one night’s accommodation at Premier Inn London County Hall, Belvedere Road, London at a cost of £177. [Registered 01 November 2016]

    On 16 October 2016 I appeared as a guest on the BBC’s “Great British Bake Off – An Extra Slice”. I received remuneration of £2,065 from Love Productions (a television production company, of 43 Eagle Street, London, WC1R 4AT), which produces the programme. They also paid for one night’s accommodation at Hilton London Bankside, Great Suffolk Street, London at a cost of £178.34 and a flight from Edinburgh Airport to London City Airport at a cost of £66.49. [Registered 11 November 2016]

  154. jfngw says:

    Hey Ruth, ‘Show me the Rubles’

  155. yesindyref2 says:

    @Tam the Bam
    Apaprently the unit cost for a C variant is £22 to £44 million each, compared to £100 million for a Typhoon, and probably soon enough, a little less for a F35-B. But Sweden is taking delivery this year of the first of the new E variant, so may well have some second-hand ones for sale by the time we’re ready in early 2021. Going cheap 🙂

    Interestingly, the E variant has: “Perhaps the most important feature is the new British-built Selex Raven ES-05 active electronically scanned array radar”

    Rang a bell so I looked it up and it’s Leonardo Company who have a facility in Edinburgh producing that, with 1,800 jobs, so when time to move up to the E variant, would bring back money into our economy.

    How many? I’d like 2 squadrons of 12-16 each, with maybe an extra 4 for the usual testing purposes. Say 32-36 in total. Some would be used for training, but rather than a different training squadron as the RAF does, I’d have that within one or both squadrons.

  156. Chick McGregor says:

    IPSOS-Mori ll a couple of days ago had YES for indy at 48% and NO at 52% (neglecting a small amount of DKs).

    That poll had nearly half its respondents over the age of 55.

    It was a telephone Poll and a large percentage of younger voters no longer own a land line.

    Every age group below 55 years voted YES, those over 55 voted NO with 62% NO.

    Starting point for indyre2 is too close to call.

  157. Lenny Hartley says:

    Chick McGregor the poll results were weighted and they did also do a small number of mobile calls, but your wright about it being too close to call.

  158. heedtracker says:

    The English still keep on voting tory though. Maybe there’s a kind of mass masochism going on down there, “thank you Sir toryboy, can we have another,” style. If they piss off the Russians enough though, they’ll really have something to moan about.

  159. yesindyref2 says:

    OT – defence for the last time tonight
    Mmm, re Gripen just found this: “The Gripen production line is backed up to 2022, but Saab officials have suggested they could sell upgraded versions of the older airframes that are in storage. Saab told reporters at the Paris air show earlier in the year that it might be able to sell between 300 and 450 jets over the next two decades.

    One thing buying the older C is it does need the MBDA Meteor upgrade to have an up to date air to air capability, a sneeze at £2 million a shot for a 100km range at mach 4.

  160. Dr Jim says:

    The moment when Brian Cox loses his patience with the thick English audience on QT and tells them a really quick truth about Scotlands desire to leave England

    If you’ve got the tech know how don’t miss a magic few seconds

  161. Cubby says:

    Gavin Williamson = one seriously scary dude.

    Please do not let this guy anywhere near nuclear weapons or indeed any weapons.

  162. Cubby says:

    Most sensible comments on the ruskygate by the two women guests on the second half of the Alex Salmond show. They cut through all the hysteria.

    Has everyone forgotten Blairs dodgy intelligence dossier and all the lies that took us to war in Iraq.

  163. Ken500 says:

    It is ironic that Alex Salmond etc attempt to have a full, fair and inclusive IndyRef1. Including EU citizens resident in Scotland. getting to vote. Back fired. Many EU citizen residents voted NO because they were lied to about losing EU membership. There are reports it was 290,000. How they know? Goodness hows. It is a secret ballot. ‘Devolved’ decision. Eu citizens residents are not allowed to vote in GE. Only in local elections and EU elections. (Other EU countries do the same. EU rules/lLaw?)

    If they had no been included in the vote. Ie Same as GE + 16+ (really most 17/18 years depending on DOB)

    YES would have won in the IndyRef 1. If those figures are correct.

    They will vote YES in the next one.

  164. Dr Jim says:

    Thatcher had the Falklands to boost her profile
    Blair had Iraq to boost his profile
    Cameron tried to get Syria to boost his profile
    Now we’ve got Theresa May and she picks Russia (sharp)

    It’s all so familiar

    I used to be a Tartan Tory then I was a Nazi, then I was an Ultra extremist, this week I’m a Russian sympathiser

    At least I maintain my dignity of still being a Vile separatist through all the adversity

    Funny thing about England, they have unpleasant names for everybody, no one left out

  165. Golfnut says:

    @ yesindyref2
    The Grippen would be my choice, far cheaper in both maintenance and running costs. I read recently that they were looking at a carrier version.

  166. Ken500 says:

    Gavin Williamson (Russia should shut up) got £Thousands in donations from the wife of the ex Russian Defence Minister. (living in London) The boy from RT said, where do you think it comes from? – Russia’. The RT guy asks, ‘ Why are the Russians giving the Tories so much money.’ – ‘What are they getting back?’

    Grayling says, ‘All the donation to the Tory Party from Russian residents in London (£Billion?) are above board and accountable. They are British citizens.etc.

    The Tories are chucking good people out of Scotland who obeyed the emigration rules. The Felbers were looking for donations to fight their cause against the Home Office. The government department illegally chucking folk,out of their house is called the ‘Home’ Office.,Disgusting.

    The Tories have been taking secret donations from anywhere for years and getting caught out. Ashcroft? Rothermere might be giving them money. Offshore tax evaded? Murdoch? They gave Labour money. The fund raising Parties in London. for At Murdoch’s family house. Cash for honours.

    The secret Brexit money channelled through the DUP being kept hidden. £1/2Billion?

  167. Dr Jim says:

    Irish border new idea:

    The Tories have suggested people could pre register to do cross border trade or movement by frictionlessly filling in a form online to make everything as frictionless as is frictionlessly possible

    Thus moving the Irish border frictionlessly into your living room, I’m sure that’ll go down a treat with the folks over there

  168. yesindyref2 says:

    I was getting interested in the idea of the maritime version, but unfortunately having checked it out it’s not STOVL and requires Catobar or Stobar – and a full carrier by length.

    Yes, found a figure for C/D airframe lifetime and it seems like 8,000 combat hours. This compares to the Typhoon 6,000 but safe operational 3,000. So the add on lifetime cost is say half from the point of view of its figure in full cost per hour, on top of being cheaper to start with. And with being designed for quick and easy maintenance, less than half that of the Typhoon, probably nearer a quarter cost per flying hour. Overall maybe one-third the cost per hour at a guess.

    Like the Typhoon it’s probably a 4.5 Gen for what that’s worth, though I’d back the Typhoon against the Gripen C/D. The E is probably on par, would be around $80 million new price (£60 million). C is one-seater, D two-seater by the way.

  169. Still Positive says:

    Dr Jim @ 12.05

    I missed that as I went to RT to watch Alec Salmond. I hope someone else can put the clip up.

  170. yesindyref2 says:

    Apparently, and I’m just making this up, if anyone guesses today’s all in total to the nearest full pound for the fundraiser, Rev emails them the lot. So my guess is £100,573.

  171. Morgatron says:


  172. Arabs for Independence says:

    So the day AFTER the vote to repeal the OBFA, BBC Scotland run a story about SFA/Polis ignoring complaints by stewards and match officials about sectarian singing at football matches in Scotland.

  173. Dorothy Devine says:

    Dr Jim , you forgot Libya and the hideous mess we made there.

    Both Saddam and Muammar wanted oil paid for in gold dinars – none of your paper petro dollar rubbish.

    I look forward to our Minister of Defence leading the charge against the Russian army because their leaders gave a ‘smug’ reply – like , ‘Nothing to do with us you pillock’

    Favourite RT programmes apart from the news , are Watching the Hawks ( best advert ever) and Cross Talk .

  174. Robert Peffers says:

    @Brian Doonthetoon says: 15 March, 2018 at 10:40 pm:

    “Hi Thepnr. (Changed your monicker again 8=))
    in order to win indyref2, we have to convert 5% of former NO voters to YES.”

    Not true, Brian Doonthetoon, and far too oversimplified. There are far more factors to be considered. For example what about the, “not Voting group”? Get them out to vote YES and you get nearer the magic 50%. What of the NO supporters who didn’t vote the last time – get them out and you are further from independence?

    The overall problem is demonstrably far more complex than simply converting existing NO voters to vote YES or blaming the older generation as all being NO voters.

    For a starter I’ve often pointed out that one reason there are more elderly NO voters can be seen in video and still photos of Labour, LibDem and in particular Tory conferences.

    These party conference videos and photos are depicting the age demographic of the actual unionist political parties and the reason they are predominantly from an older generation is because they are all that now remains of the actual unionist parties now in decline.

    These at conference are not just No voters they are the actual political parties and the fact they are predominately older is proof the unionist parties, not their voters, are on their last legs.

    “Some people commnenting on this web site just don’t understand that fact.”

    Aye! and some see things in far too simple terms and thus they draw very wrong conclusions. To clarify that, as there are obviously many reasons for people to vote either YES or NO there are also many reasons for people to not vote at all and the YES movement will continue to fall short as long as the Grass Roots activists have these fixed and intractable views and thus miss the chance to gain a vote by assuming that particular groups are beyond being gained.

  175. ScottieDog says:

    “Rang a bell so I looked it up and it’s Leonardo Company who have a facility in Edinburgh producing that, with 1,800 jobs, so when time to move up to the E variant, would bring back money into our economy.”

    I used to work at that facility in a former life. It was previously celex and BAE systems before that but started life as ferranti. Ferranti was the biggest employer in Edinburgh when I left school. That has changed now to RBS. That is a great indicator of the way the U.K. economy went – export industry to banking and unearned income.

    Just to add , I’m not particularly proud to have worked in the U.K. defence industry. My eyes have been opened.

  176. Golfnut says:

    @ ScottieDog, yesindyref2

    Remember Ferranti well. Did the school careers trip there way back in 67, Ferranti made the gun sight for probably the best interceptor ever built, the English Electric lightning.

  177. Robert Peffers says:

    Had a good laugh at the BBC Text service this morning.
    They begin an item headed:-

    “Mini Beast”, brings new weather warnings

    It then begins the report with this:-

    “Yellow snow warnings have been issued as a, ‘Mini Beast from the East’, is expected to hit the UK.”

    I had to laugh as my old Grannie used to give her grandchildren, ‘Yellow Snow Warnings’, as far back as the late 1930s/early 1940s, “Noo mind ye an no eat the yellie snaw”, when we were about to go out to play in the Winter snows.

    I had a wee mental picture of an East Lothian wee dog cocking a leg on a snowy Winters day in Mid Lothian.

  178. Nana says:

    Brexit: Government ‘paranoia’ over secret business agreements

    EU publishes draft text of Brexit treaty, some key issues unresolved

    A ceremony to mark the destruction of Russia’s stock of chemical weapons may have been held too soon

    Government told to ‘urgently investigate 10,000 additional deaths’

  179. Robert Peffers says:

    @ScottieDog says: 16 March, 2018 at 8:23 am:

    “I used to work at that facility in a former life. It was previously celex and BAE systems before that but started life as ferranti. Ferranti was the biggest employer in Edinburgh when I left school.”

    Aye! It was just yards away from Bruce Peebles and close to the shared football ground of Edinburgh City and Leith Athletic that Morphed into, if memory serves, “Ferranti Thistle”, that Morphed into, “Livingston FC”.

  180. Nana says:

    Last links until Monday, have a good weekend.

    little thread why @Douglas4Moray @Kirstene4Angus and this @ScotTories thread have resulted in me finally returning my medals for my military service in the first gulf war

    Concern at rising infant mortality rate in England and Wales

  181. Macart says:

    Ta Nana

    You too. 🙂

  182. louis.b.argyll says:

    Donated! Feel better now.

    If you haven’t got round to it yet..

  183. Iain mhor says:

    @Ken500 12:15am
    Just reminded me about voting and the whole “Secret Ballot” thing everybody tells me.
    It’s a secret from your neighbour and anyone standing next to you at the polling booth. After that Votes are tied to your ID. If you ever look at the ID list, even at local elections, you’ll notice codes next to your name; these correspond to the code on the voting slip. It’s a glorified raffle book if you will.
    Which is probably why everyone with access to the register and the voting slips appears to know how I vote. Unless it’s changed since I last voted in 2017, it’s been like that since I clocked it decades a go as a plooky youth.

    “Secret Ballot” my sheuch!

  184. Davosa says:

    Red Robbin Lying Basterds

  185. John MacRae says:

    What’s all this about the Irish border in the North Sea??

    That would include all of us on the GB Mainland.

    Just asking.

  186. Phronesis says:

    Scotland’s government putting children at the centre of its policies,having a universal children’s rights based approach to supporting children an families – such are the choices that a government that believes in society can make

    Compare with WM , determined to undermine any state support,raiding budgets that make a difference to children an families – that alone defines an unworthy political system.

    And the numbers of poor children are set to increase, stressed lives stressed families:

    A dereliction of human rights – without rights there’s is no democracy, without social stability there is no economic growth and no future for the majority of citizens. Thankfully Scotland can choose to get out of this farcical arrangement with WM.

  187. Fred says:

    You can tell Ruth Davidson’s lying when her lips move.

  188. Ken500 says:

    Harvie and his mates using SNP second votes to vote against OBFA. The SNP support. They had been warned. The tail is waging the dog again .This happens all the time. You have been warned. Some people never learn. The greens could cost Scotland FFA/Independence support. Helping the opposition. Criticising the SNP all the time for no reason. They renege on their own policies. Cutting off their nose to spite their face and ruining economic growth. Reneging on their own policies. Wasting £Billions. That could be better spent. Like the unionists.

    Just look at the six white makes sitting in Holyrood voting again it whenthe majority support it. A bad Kaw but it worked, No equality, no diversity. No parity. Supporting thuggery, violence and inequality for people. Sectarism and the community bring blighted by racists, bigots misogynist Letting the society, the economy and the people down. More of them should be arrested, charged and get penalties for their crass behaviour not encouraged. The Greens as usual are totally out of line. Saying it is only a game Does not cover it.

    Playing games with the voters will bring penalties. Another own goal. They reduce their support. They are such an unpopular team with unpopular members, Let’s hope the Police, and authorities, now get on with the job of stopping the thuggery and criminality Along with the corrupt sporting clubs disobeying the Law all the time. The only Law that ever worked has gone without replacement. Now Police Scotland has been sanctioned cleared and clean out. Will they step up to the game and sort it out? The affront and blight on society.

    The corruot unionist controlled (Glasgow) Police were breaking the rule of Law with impunity. Putting too many people in cells overnight on ‘charges’ that could never come to court. Fo mild misdeanour or malicious complaint. Instead if needed just a warning. The Police wasting time and public money clogging up the courts . While letting the ones committing genuine crime get away with it. Acting like criminals and breaking the Law causing stress and disharmony. They should sort their priorities out. Football thuggery and bigotry should have been sorted out.

    The Clubs should be censored and fined. The Directors breaking Company Law should be investigated and given penalties. Banned from holding business Office or liability. Instead of supporting and letting malicious thugs and hooligans roam the streets. That is not sporting. Causing violence and threatening behaviour the unionist and the green (politicans) support. Just an affront to decent dignity. No wonder the terraces are empty and the game in disrepute. Ruining their own industry. Taking the punters for fools. Adding to their own demise. No one likes losers.

    People were warned. Some people never learn. Imagine helping the Tory – unionists to win. Claiming to detest them. Their vile policies and austerity are causing the problems. Harvie kicks the can down the park. Does not play a fair game and could do it again. Holding the electorate in comptempt. On a corrupted electoral system introduced to oppose fair play. Not an equal playing field. Letting the 3rd loser rejects in to corrupt and ruin. To spoil the match. They should get a red card. They are showing their true colours.

    The electorate have been warned when the rematch comes along. Not green but naive Let them out to graze on the green grass for victory and winning the main prize. Independence prosperity and equality. Fair shares for all. In the divi of the prizes and rewards. Bring it on for fairer play. Join the game.

    Andy Murray a true sporting hero gets major support, plays the game and excels. A true world champion to follow. Hope he is well and back to fitness soon. Have a much deserved spell. A wee break. Andy, Jamie and all the Murray doing so much for sport and Scotland. Entertaining and giving great example. The wonderful and excitement you and you compadres bring to world class sport. Legends one and all. Pursuing the Cup and entertaining, like gladiators in the ring but respecting each other Top class sportsmen. Gentle men one and all.

  189. galamcennalath says:

    John MacRae says:

    What’s all this about the Irish border in the North Sea??

    Brexit talks won’t proceed until TMay agrees to it.

    That is the reality of the situation, but the Tories are in denial.

    In detail, the agreement of December says the Irish border issue can be solved in three ways.

    1) the UK’s eventual deal would be soft enough to allow no border. TMay has rejected that with her red lines.

    2) a high tech solution. That still means monitoring and checking, even if passively or away from the border. So doesn’t comply with Good Friday Agreement

    3) the fallback has to be NI in customs union and regulatory alignment, which means border in the sea between Ireland and Britain.

    The only possible outcome is 3) if TMay sticks to her hard Brexit plans.

  190. schrodingers cat says:

    ‘Military grade nerve agent’. What other sorts of nerve agent are there??

    I hear that Tesco Value nerve agent is as effective as the big name brands, but at a fraction of the price.

  191. schrodingers cat says:

    I look forward to welcoming our new russian overlords

  192. galamcennalath says:

    A good article on Rules of Origin. If you don’t know about, or don’t understand RoO then you do need to read this.

    The article is correct in that we don’t hear enough about RoO. Without a customs union then there has to be a hard border, goods checking, and potentially tariffs to pay EVEN IF THERE IS A FREE TRADE AGREEMENT.

    The best TMay is hoping for would still require full RoO administration with associated costs and delays.

    A free trade agreement (like ‘Canada’) is closer to no deal/WTO than to single market membership!

  193. John MacRae says:

    When I was at school the North Sea was to the east of the mainland.

    Have the Tories moved it when my attention was elsewhere?

  194. hackalumpoff says:

    From Craig Murray

    Of A Type Developed By Liars

  195. manandboy says:

    According to Bloomberg, “European diplomats say that on Ireland, the two sides are still a long way from seeing eye to eye.”

    Do the DUP and the UDA see eye to eye with anyone?

    History shows there’s no room for diplomacy in ‘No Surrender’

  196. Glamaig says:

    I notice that the BBC headline is ‘MSPs vote to repeal football bigotry law’ and last night Radio Shortbread reported it was the ‘Scottish Parliament’ wot dunnit.

    No mention of the parties involved at all. They know the repeal is unpopular but dont want to say who was responsible.

  197. galamcennalath says:

    John MacRae says:

    When I was at school the North Sea was to the east of the mainland.

    Indeed. Apologies, I missed the North. In fact I missed the joke and the Tories’ mixup altogether!

    Too many serious things to take too seriously these days!

  198. jfngw says:

    Pretty much an all out attack on Corbyn on This Week for not falling dutifully into line with the government and condemning the Russians. Not much time for Corbyn but this was just pure character assassination.

    It would have also have been the Sturgeon treatment if she had not given her support, but remember hers was based on the information supplied by the government. If it turns out she was not given accurate info or lied to then expect the tables to turn.

    Caught the end of QT, after watch RT news at 23:00 (don’t normally but felt obliged to as it is claimed to be propaganda), caught Grayling claiming there would be no border at Dover. They are now apparently going to control the EU border rules after exit, deluded or what.

    As for RT, didn’t find it any worse than the BBC news, the unquestioning voice of the government position (not the Scottish government obviously).

  199. schrodingers cat says:


    my comment from a few days ago

    schrodingers cat says:
    15 March, 2018 at 8:44 am
    politics 101

    support that which costs nothing.

    treeza will expell russian diplomats, media will be indignant and bad mouth russian sympathisers, see corbyn, but in the end, proof or not, westminster has nothing else since gunboat diplomacy needs gunboats, westminster is now only a talking shop. even the threat of england boycotting the world cup has dissappeared.

    if russia is shown to be innocent (hint, we will never see any evidence to prove this one way or another) nicola just needs to say she based her decision on the evidence given to her by treeza.

    nicola’s comments will appeal to the 52% who still want to vote no, if she had come out in favour of the russians, the msm would today have been going full tonto on the snp

    this is a diplomatic spat which nicola has sidestepped, it will eventually be forgotton, (4 days i recon) or at latest when the world cup starts.”

    i would amend my comment only by saying “it (the anglo saxon sabre rattling exceptionalism) will eventually be forgotton, (4 days i recon) or until they are dumped out of the world cup on penalties by germany”

  200. Liam says:

    I’m confused. Is this Moon fellow the “Vice-Chair” as Red Robin says, or the “Secretary” as he says, of the British Polling Council?

  201. robertknight says:

    RT: Ruski Twaddle

    BBC: Brit-Nat Brainwashing Channel

    ‘Tweedledum meets Tweedledee’

  202. Dorothy Devine says:

    Schrodingers cat , you forgot wonderful wee Iceland – I hope they qualified for this round ballkicking fest , because I want to hear that chant again and again and again.

  203. Socrates MacSporran says:


    Just had a swatch at the Rev’s twitter feed. There are some diamonds amidst the dross in there this morning.

    I particularly liked the one which renamed Benedict Cumberbatch as Butternut Crinkle Fries. I shall perhaps never again be able to think of him by any other name.

  204. heedtracker says:

    In the year of our English Lord, 1918. Actually were they bigoted towards their fellow Brits a hundred teamGB years ago.

  205. Valerie says:

    From Twitter

    Putin is sending his top investigator, Yukanol Fukov.

  206. Breeks says:

    schrodingers cat says:
    16 March, 2018 at 9:58 am

    ‘Military grade nerve agent’. What other sorts of nerve agent are there?…

    Gruinard was poisoned for decades with weapons grade Anthrax bacteria, which made it much more potent, virulent and durable.

    The same non-weapons grade Anthrax bacteria occurs naturally, often on corpses or animal skins, and historically accounted for some deaths to people working in leather tanneries. If memory serves anthrax bacteria recently killed somebody in the Borders whom I believe was trying to make a drumskin from a badgers pelt he was attempting to cure himself. But relatively safe from casual exposure, without such close/intimate contact, natural Anthrax spores are thus potentially dangerous, but could not be considered weaponised.

    Botulism is similar, another bacterial related toxin which occurs naturally, but the weaponisation factor is the modification to make it more virulent, lingering, and contagious.

    There are also itching agents and blistering agents which occur naturally, like the dusts and sawdust components in itching powder in a joke shop, and the naturally occurring chemicals for example in Giant Hogweed that can make your skin blister, but its all a question of degree.

    Weaponisation is the science of making such affects much more concentrated and potent, longer lasting, (or sometimes shorter lasting), while manageable enough to store, handle, and deliver to the target with predictable effect.

    Weaponised nerve agents sounds high tech, but the term is equally applicable to South American Indians wiping the tips of their blowgun darts on the back of a toxic frog.

  207. Valerie says:

    @ Cat, 10.40

    Agree with that. I came round to thinking if this turns shit shaped, Nicola can say, I commented based on the info given.

    However, I do think that’s possibly a hostage in future,,because obviously Indy can’t happen now, because, as in 2014, the Russians will be straight in here, and we are so stupid not to see how we are a security risk to the UK.

    Twitter reporting Scotsman today saying SNP is Kremlin funded, presumably on back of Salmond’s show. So, siding with May buys you no slack.

    It was used last night to Brian Cox on QT. He said we should stick with EU, so immediately audience member said, “why do you want to leave UK”

    Cox was howled down as he started to say “that’s different…”

    Good latest piece from Craig Murray from hackalumpoff @ 10.08.

  208. Lenny Hartley says:

    Just to add to what Breeks said regarding Chemical and Biological agents, the aim in many cases is not to kill the opposition army but to make them incapable of carrying out their actions. So for example use of a gas which would make you stoned or refuse to obey orders so that the opposing army can take over your position without opposition and without the victors having to deal with thousands of rotting corpses and decontaminating the ground. Btw have you see the photo doing the rounds of several folk suited up biological warfare suits whilst beside them two fireman are standing with just their standard gear on!

  209. Ken500 says:

    The Irish border in the Irish Sea.? Would mean the whole iof Ireland would be in the EU common policy area. No need for an economic border in the middle of Ireland. Ireland as a whole would still be in the same EU common trading or policy areas. Subject to EU reguation and good policies areas.Application. No need for a border (checks/posts in the middle) The border would be a sea border with the British mainland, coast of England Wales and Scotland. The east coast of Britain. Basically all of Ireland would for economic reasons be united. That seems to be the position? Who knows.

    In the whole of Ireland through you can travel freely without borders. Six counties. There are different economical decision areas in both the North and the South. IR (Eire though some folk disagree with that name). In IR they use the Euro. The cost of living is cheaper in the South. (because of any fall in the £ against the Euro).

    In the south things are relatively cheaper than the UK the food, accommodation etc. Essential Something in (UK International) chain stores trading in Dublin/IR are slightly dearer. For the same goods clothes shoes etc in the UK. (taxes) This is offset by the lower cost of living on other essential goods. Food, accomodation etc. It is worth a shopping trip in the leisure sector. Dublin and the rest of Ireland is a really nice place. Brilliant scenery and historical interest. Most of the Irish people are nice as well except for the bigotry and division.

    The Republic boomed in the EU. (Tiger) Getting lots of EU grants for growthn, construction and improvement. Extremely successful economy. Some of it based upon lower taxes for foreign Corporations. (Allowing tax evasion elsewhere) but that has been tighten up the EU commission. On going.

    Many American tourists fly into Dublin as their base for Europe travel. It is cheaper. There are direct flights The flights and accomadation is cheaper by comparison. There are flights over Iceland to the Ststes shorter and therefore cheaper, Many Irish people have American relatives. The diaspora. The clearances, poverty and famine caused by Westminster rule. There is a special committee in the US Senate to encourage trade and co operation between them. Senators of Irish descent. An interest group. Same Scotland. People of Scottish descent a factor. New York Scottish week etc. Highland games,

    Billy Connery lives in the States /Australia.wuth his Australian born wife. They sold the Estate no use for it. The wife sold up some property to go in a sailing trip in a yacht around the world. Billy was not be pleased but he did not try to stop her. He comments on it in his stage act. Getting pretty frail now.

    NI voted to remain in the EU. The DUP want Westminster UK rule but do not follow UK EU/International Law. The DUP a minority in NI (AV or PR?) 40% support? The DUP want Westminster rule so they can disobey UK Law, So they can do want they like. Ie Break the Law. They are a Law unto themselves . Racist, misogynistic and bigots. Hardliners. They act illegally with impunity for unionist support at Westminster (votes in the HoC supporting the unionists). The Masonic dominated political Parties denied the Catholics the vote for years. In parts of Belfast they could not vote until the 1960’s. Bernadette Devlin Campaign.

    The NI administration Stormont are funded much higher than the rest of the UK to keep them sweet. £42Billion for 1.5 million population. That was on the UK Gov accounts website. Don’t know how that is worked out? They try and hide it? Tony Blair – Labour gave NI £12Billion extra years ago to keep them quiet. When Westminster Treasury were taking the equivalent of £Billions out of Scotland.

    Sin Fein/DUP get £Millions of UK funding of support but do not attend Westminster because of taking the Oath of allegiance to the Queen. Many people wish they would walk in and take May and the Tories down. Just this once over Brexit. (austerity etc). It would be amazing.

    The NI admin has broken down because of the DUP intransigence. The will not enforce UK/EU/Ihternnational Lsw on equal rights etc. They oppose gay marriage, freedom of language Gaelic, and right to abortion for any reason. (No Contraception?) Bigots and secrecy of the Masonics. The handshake etc. They are not fit to stand as candidates. Breaking the code of conduct of declaration. Criminals.

    If the DUP/unionists do get Westminster Rule. The equal rights etc they oppose should be brought into Law and practice. The equal rights they oppose for biased religious reason are not compatible with modern rule of society. Dinosaurs. The Catholic Church is even more enlightened on some subjects. Trying to get up to date. Or lose more members and expire. The majority of Church members are elderly women because they out live men. Baptism, marriage and death are all the Churches are of predominantly use. Organised religion is dying out. Just like the Tories. The average member is seventy. The Tory Party could die out.

  210. heedtracker says:

    Vlad Putin versus what ever the fcuk the demented tory creep show thinks this idiot is. Beeb gimps, are you watching?

  211. heedtracker says:

    It’s easy to see why Colonel Ruth thinks she can be UKOK Prime Minister right enough.

    “While he had given his speech, which he read from a piece of paper, taking lengthy pauses before most words of more than two syllables, the Russian government had indicated it would be expelling some British diplomats of its own, in response to Theresa May having done the same.

    Defence Secretary tells Putin to ‘go away and shut up’
    What was Private Williamson’s view? “Russia should shut up! Russia should go away!” he said, in his very loudest whimper.

    This intervention, from one the UK’s most senior politicians, and the head of its armed forces, came not 24 hours after Theresa May was quite right to have accused Russia of treating Britain with “sarcasm” and “complete disdain”.

  212. Ken500 says:

    Australia rugby coach who complained about racist, bigoted attack. Is a racist bigot. ”Bloody Migrant Bastards’ Ruining rugby. It’s only a game. ‘Tie me kangaroo down sport’.

  213. The Great Brutish Empire was a big fan of chemical and bacterial warfare,

    from deliberately spreading smallpox to the indigenous people of North America and Australasia to using chemical weapons in bombing the Kurds the Afghans and the Russian Bolsheviks,


    Churchill also wanted to use M Devices against the rebellious tribes of northern India. “I am strongly in favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes,” he declared in one secret memorandum.

  214. Ken500 says:

    May complained about Russia treating Britain with ‘sarcasm’ and complete disdain’ What?

    The way May treats Scotland and everywhere else. – with Sarcasm and complete disdain, Kettle black does not come into it. She is a complete hypocrite. Nasty lying, conceited, arrogant, racist bigot just like the rest of her party. Cheating, criminal liars.

  215. heedtracker says:

    Explains Green OBFA vote.

    That Green Union Bear vote, could well the breakthrough for Green environmentalists of Scotland, assuming Teresa’s not hit the big red button by Monday.

  216. Glamaig says:

    Maybe the anti-Russia hysteria and Labour-bashing as ("Tractor" - Ed)s is a prelude to a GE?

  217. heedtracker says:

    Stinky old The Graun’s Scotland section news headlines today,

    UK weather: snow warning extends to most of England as winter bites back
    Warning for Sunday now covers all of England except for Cornwall and parts of north-west

    London tourism flatlined in 2017 due to terror fears, rail issues and cost
    Northern Ireland and Scotland saw big increases, according to figures from Association of Leading Visitor Attractions

    It is odd watching a British broadsheet mock its Scotland reader.

    Severin Carrell is well.

  218. Ken500 says:

    The SNP is funded by it’s members. With full and properly declared books and accounts. Publicallyb displayed, It sticks to the rules. The electoral rules. The only one that does. Complies. . Thst is why it is so sussessful. It can carry out successful.policies free from influence of outside interests. Or donations.

    Alex Salmond although a SNP member is a private citizen. The stinking, sinking Scotsman can get stuffed before Alex Salmond associates takes it over. Lying bastards. Not fit to call it’s name. Or an editor fit to print. It is going bust with massive debts that need reconstructing by 2019 because of it’s lying editorial polices. Biased and non impartial. No one will buy it. Out of touch and out of time. JP based in north of England supports Labour/unionists Over £200Million debts. No one will buy the rubbish, regurgitated, recycle nonsense. They have to sell off their commercial estate and rent it back. A fire sale, shortly.

    RT is the only vehicle of more honest truth. Worldwide. That is why the Tories what to shut it down. No opposition or free speech. The Tories want to shut down the internet. Control freaks. Trolling the world.

  219. heedtracker says:

    Glamaig says:
    16 March, 2018 at 11:52 am
    Maybe the anti-Russia hysteria and Labour-bashing as (“Tractor” – Ed)s is a prelude to a GE?

    Its going to make all the Russia World Cup qualifiers demand that England should host the World Cup instead.

    Think that’s crazy?

    BJ says he’s not going. No wonder. Can’t see any of our tory imperial masters fancying their chances over there, with all this endless tory teamGB monstering of Russia.

  220. Dr Jim says:

    Word slowly leaking out from Porton Down is the Russian nerve agent analysis appears to show that the Russian nerve agent in fact isn’t a Russian nerve agent at all, but for the purposes of the UK Guv they’ll have to find a new classification to still make it a Russian nerve agent even if it turns out to be Tesco own brand oven cleaner which as we all know is probably a Russian brand of oven cleaner which contains Russian nerve agent because it says don’t breathe this in or you’ll die, on the side of the tin

    A full program I’m sure will be dedicated to the dangers of oven cleaner and the sooking in of this product with accompanying foty of Vladimir Putin for added menace and gravitas

  221. auld highlander says:

    They were drinking the value brand of oven cleaner which was administered by a non professional.

  222. galamcennalath says:

    Glamaig says:

    a prelude to a GE?

    Anything seems possible with this bunch of halfwits.

    IMO it come down to what is most important to the Tories right now.

    1) Power? To stay in power they need the DUP. NI is causing the Tories a lot of grief …
    … a majority would free them from the DUP. Winning more seats improves their mandate.

    2) Brexit? What type of Brexit do they really want? If it’s hard then only they will take that route. The DUP would back a ‘no deal’ crash out. So they won’t need a GE if a very hard Brexit is their objective. However, a simply way to achieve a soft(er) Brexit would be to lose a GE! One way out of the Brexit mess is to hand it to Labour!

    3) Their precious Union? I think this is very important to them. If they thought a GE could further damage the SNP, that would be motivation. Also, they would be happy if Labour took SNP seats. Worth considering that if Labour won, IndyRef2 probably wouldn’t happen.

    Conclusion …. I think they are aiming for a last minute ‘crash out’ so they don’t need a GE.

  223. schrodingers cat says:


    ah, i see, so badgers home brand is even cheaper and just as effective as tesco’s?

    not a lot of people know that

    after the gulf war, the section i was with, was tasked with clearing an iraqi munitions dump. (near As Salman, along with the usual uk made 155mm tank rounds and 80mm mortar rounds etc, were numerous anti personal mines of the “bounding betty” type. the inner envelopes of these mines had the ball bearings removed and had been filled with a variety of neurotoxic liquids, eg, soman, sarin etc. these cases of mines had been stacked high in wooden boxes in the iraqi desert for over a decade and these mine’s metal casings had corroded over time resulting in the liquid spilling out.
    destroying these mines, and their contents meant opening the boxes, laying out the mines in rows and overlaying them with high energy (old fashioned but effective) bangalore torpedo explosives.

    Doing this in summer, in the desert, wearing a gas mask(nb taking a drink of water using a gas mask with no water inlet point, is an adventure in itself !!!) and full a charcole NBC suit, has given me a good understanding of the nature and effects of neurotoxic chemicals.

    it also helped my sense of humour, dry and caustic

  224. Dr Jim says:

    The stupidity just keeps coming

    Anas Sarwar who’s awarded himself a big medal for championing the cause of anti racism says if anyone’s racist to him they must lose their job be fired resign or all of the above
    except if they’re racist towards Humza Yousaf then they must be given a chance to change and reform

    Helluva guy Anas eh

  225. schrodingers cat says:

    i think nicola should be calling for england to boycot the world cup. seems only fair


    oh, and if the ruskis leave london, who will bank roll chelsea and the rest of the english premier league?

    seems only fair

  226. wull2 says:

    What about the squirrel brand Breeks, its easily spread over a vast area, and costs nothing.

  227. heedtracker says:

    Front page The Graun.

    I don’t know, England and our imperial masters do seem to be determined to have another bloody good war with anyone at all these days, good for morale, rallies the plebs to the flag, keeps beeb gimp network news very exciting, focused away from all kinds of toryboy shite…once a decade say, the grand old UK marches off to war.

    The Salisbury attack was appalling. But we must avoid a drift to conflict
    Jeremy Corbyn

    Britain needs to hold the perpetrators to account. Yet this is not a time for hasty judgments that could lead to a new cold war

    • Jeremy Corbyn is leader of the Labour party

  228. Dr Jim says:

    The nerve agent may have been used after the best before date thus rendering it less nervy agenty

    I’m defo going on the oven cleaner, anybody that’s ever whiffed that stuff can testify, it’s deadly and gets everywhere in the hoose if you don’t shut doors

  229. schrodingers cat says:

    this is not a time for hasty judgments that could lead to a new cold war

    if the ruskis cut of englands gas supply it would be a freezing cold war

  230. Proud Cybernat says:

    Ms Sturgeon has vowed to begin her quest to break up the UK next week.

    She added she wants a fresh ballot to be held “when the terms of Brexit are clear”, previously citing Autumn 2018 as her opportune moment.

    “We have a duty to give people the choice before it’s too late, to ensure our relationship with Europe.
    “I think practically for the UK Government to be in a position where it can also puncture Scotland’s lifeboat as well would not be acceptable.” – From:

    Can’t wait until “next week”!!

  231. Socrates MacSporran says:

    schrodingers cat @ 12.51pm

    No, no and thrice NO! Scotland must insist, England goes to the World Cup.

    I mean, given the SFA has decided, we must not qualify, watching the English media hype themselves up to breaking point with their “England Expects” hyerbole, knowing they are heading for a huge fall somewhere aroun the last 16 or the quarter-finals, why, it’s the best summer fun the Tartan Army can think of. And, if the English hooligan fans get a serious kicking from the Russian Ultras, win, win.

  232. heedtracker says:

    BBC r4 vote tory lunchtime news, toryboy admiral explains its a Russian nerve agent attack on our country, not fully proven, yet, he explains and its Corbyn’s fault too, explains the beeb gimp, isn’t it? yes it is, says toryboy admiral.

    Stick it up your murderous kleptocratic regime Vlad! Anyone can be a Murdoch boot boy headline writer.

  233. Dan Huil says:

    It seems Doris Johnson is getting another leadership bid in with his latest deranged outburst against Russia. Britnats desperate for a war. Britnats desperate to ignore brexit ramifications.

  234. galamcennalath says:

    Proud Cybernat says:

    Can’t wait until “next week”!!

    Indeed. If only it turns out to be true.

    I think we should believe it when we hear it from a reputable source 😉

  235. jfngw says:


    It could be an election, that would explain the ramping up of the anti-Corbyn agenda at the BBC. The Tories need a majority that does not rely on the DUP, they can then have that border in the Irish sea and eliminate an intangible obstacle to Brexit.

    Also the MSM in Scotland have started with a SNP/Russia connection, not sure this one will have legs but who knows it depends on whether the BBC takes it up.

  236. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    “In the same week that the OBFA is repealed, BritNat Local Authority promotes incitement to religious hatred with controversial OO march on St Patrick’s Day”

    Only in BritNat Occupied Scotland.

    Divide and rule, the BritNat Empire tool.


  237. Meg merrilees says:

    just noticed the Rev’s twitter feed:

    North Lanarkshire council have approved Orange Order marches on St.Patrick’s Day!!!!
    and when you look at it more closely, they’ve also allowed them on Good Friday.

    I am speechless – it’s obvious now that they want open civil war in Scotland.

    The summer is going to be a hard slog what with two Royal weddings an a baby being born. Expect sales of the Butcher’s Apron to soar.

    Why does this make me feel really sad…

  238. Stoker says:

    heedtracker wrote on: 15 March, 2018 at 9:06 pm:
    “Can you not come up something a bit more original Rock,….”

    Try taking your own advice and GTF with the direct links to BUM rags. I’d rather have 1 “Rock” than 100 BritNat enablers like you.

    A lot of us put endless effort into promoting this site and its invaluable work. We don’t do it for utter clowns like you to sit on here 24/7 trapping people into helping BUM rags pull in advertising revenue.

    Revenue which is in turn used to help pay for more anti Scottish indy articles, to crap all over Scotland and the aspirations of her people.

    Get your own house in order before pulling up other people and despite being told multiple times by Rev to pack it in, you continue to niggle and attempt to stir the shite.

    I also note you started blasting the thread with direct links right after ‘crazycat’ archived ‘Sinkys’ direct link. Your motives are highly questionable.

  239. Meg merrilees says:


    depends on whether the BBC takes it up.

    what’s all this ‘if’?

    The BBC Scotland newspapers round up has highlighted this story as the mort important in Scotland today.

    Accusing Nicola of rank hypocrisy because there is’ a direct line of ( Russian) funding and influence at the heart of her NEC’ and how dare she accuse our dearest darling Ruth of having any flaws whatsoever.

    Choppy waters ahead…

    Daily Torygraph says that ‘they’ now think that the nerve agent was put in the daughter’s suitcase before she left Russia and that the Russian Agents weren’t on British soil.

  240. Breeks says:

    I see Gibraltar is “warning” Spain not to veto a Brexit deal on pain of restricted rights for Spanish citizens. That’s gonna end well… Great timing Gibraltar. (You’re just trolling Theresa May now aren’t you?…Ha! Ha! Ha! I like it).

    What else can we do next to foster a better understanding of what it means to be British in a modern and progressive global perspective? I know! Let’s send the giant Theresa May billboard from the Cliffs of Dover down to the Falkland Islands and point at Buenos Aires! What could possibly go wrong with that idea? We could get Rory the Tory to keep the peace and dump a tipper load of rocks at the bottom and pretend it means something deeply profound.

    Britain seems to be in the middle of a revolution but with no revolutionary ideas, just a Butlins Expo of knobbly knees, misguided nostalgia, and a procession of revolting people.

    Can we Scots please pull our constitutional ejector seat lever please? I feel the time is fast approaching when we need to retire to a safe distance….

  241. jfngw says:

    @meg merrilees

    I was really referring to Rep Scot, I hardly read the website except for a casual quick look. I don’t think the website has the same impact as on air stuff. A lot of their target audience probably only watch/listen.

  242. heedtracker says:

    Try taking your own advice and GTF with the direct links to BUM rags. I’d rather have 1 “Rock” than 100 BritNat enablers like you.

    OK! Just report me to the blog owner. Why that’s beyond you I do not know. Archive is gets blocked sometimes on my work network admin levels.

    So you know where to stick it Stoker. Or get your own blog and ban btl you don’t like.

  243. heedtracker says:

    Get your own house in order before pulling up other people and despite being told multiple times by Rev to pack it in, you continue to niggle and attempt to stir the shite

    Missed that Stoker. I don’t recall being told multiple times to pack it in at all.

    But I am always sensitive to criticism:D

    So I’ll revert back to lurker status.

  244. Valerie says:

    @ Meg 1.47

    oh well, that theory of it being packed in daughter’s case exonerates our security services. Although, she is a Russian citizen, daughter of a spy come visiting, was she not flagged?

    Guess not, as terrorists seem to trip in and out with no hindrance.

    So the daughter was unpacking her case in Zizzi? Cos they allegedly burnt that table.

    I think Dr Jim is right, this nerve agent was well past it’s sell by date.

    She decided to open her case in Zizzi, her and the father got contaminated, then staggered around for a few hours before collapsing on a bench.

    Anyone see the episode of Homeland where Quinn was undercover with terrorists? His cover was blown, and the terrorists decided his punishment would be death by the Sarin they were carrying.

    It was really horrendous to watch, and im not squeamish at all. He was in a glass box, gassed, and left for dead after about 3/4 mins.

    Weapons grade nerve agents aren’t being made to act over hours.

    I know we are all amateur tinfoil hat conspiricists, but we are used to asking questions.

  245. geeo says:

    Re Brian Cox.


    You might want to report what Mr Cox said next, for context .

    He said “thats different, we voted to REMAIN IN the EU” (*but are being taken out)(*paraphrasing)

  246. geeo says:

    ProudCybernat @1.10pm

    What an odd story..says its published on March 2018 but the text is from last year !!

    It is the Express mind you..!

  247. Dr Jim says:

    I have two very old and valuable Samurai swords made in the original way, if I go out and lop somebodies head off and they find trace elements of original Japanese steel in the wounds am I an assassin ordered by Japan to go out and politically murder somebody or am I a guy who just doesn’t like the bloke whose head I just lopped off, or could I even be a guy who stole such weapons from somebody else and being a nutter decided to try out these weapons just to see if they cut as good as in the movies, or could I be a paid assassin of the British government to make it appear the way my boss ordered me too

    Did somebody mention Brexit? Oh Aye? That! Now I remember

    Nicola Sturgeon said .. *I support the UK government on the information I’ve been told*

    Clever girl our FM!

  248. Dr Jim says:

    Let’s say that if the Daily Express is even half right (big pinch of salt there) that Scotlands much loved First Minister Nicola Sturgeon is to announce the launch of our next Independence campaign for saving the life of our country from the galloping hooves of Englands heavy horse approach to Brexit then I look forward with huge anticipation to the return of that side of our FMs nature (The Velociraptor) that we seldom see due to her monumental and enormously patient efforts to endure the gross negligence and Fuddheaded dumplings she has to put up with on and hourly basis and the first of those steps taken on that path will be the election of Keith Brown as deputy leader of the party to lead that campaign

    They won’t like it when she’s angry

  249. Ken500 says:

    Unless the Britsh/Russo spy was wandering the world with chemical. To sell to the highest. Responsible for millions of deaths ready and chaos in the world in the world already. Why the hullaboo about his safety he did not care about anyone else. Party to killing millions for money. Trying to stop him talking. To save his own skin.

    It is more likely the Boris Johnston, the Tories and M15 planted it in the house.To cover up for the ‘dodgy dossier and bugging Trump. Then trying to make some connect to the Russian supposed interference in the US elections to try and get rid of Trump who got rid of the Clinton/Obama corrupt administration.

    Johnston has been trying to make trouble with the Russian (and everyone else) for years. To divert away from Austerity and Brexit . Unless he gets throw out of public Office. In order To keep embezzling public money and tax evasion. Breaking every rule of government. The Tory chaos. The could not make a bigger mess.

    The carry on is just a cover up. To try divert attention. Trying to divide and rule. Johnston and the Tories have been trying to get the US to attack Russia’s borders for years. Mass provocation. Cause more war and economic strife. Just like Blair did in secret. With the Iraqi dirty dossier.

    If Clinton had been elected they would have done it already. She was being funded by the Saudis. May and the Hedge fund manager was selling £Bilions of weapons to the Saudis last week. To line their pockets. The Saudis are killing and starving millions. They are brutal mass murders. The lot of them. Saudi Arabia is the most despot, autocratic monarchy in the world. Going bust. That is why they have to try to modernise. Stood killing so many people and ruining the world economy.

  250. Proud Cybernat says:

    BREAKING from Pravda Quay
    with Union Jackie Kim Ono:

  251. starlaw says:

    I think we should do something to sort out these Awful Russkies
    I propose sending a task force to the Crimea lead by our new aircraftless carrier.
    It could be stuffed full of the foxhunting horsey brigade, lead by Boris the Bold…re-capture Sebastapol and hold it to ransom.
    This should sort the buggers out no end.

  252. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    “Velociraptor vs The Fuddheaded dumplings” love it Dr Jim says at 2:54 pm that made me smile.

    I’m more cerebrally lowbrow and would have gone “Good Guy vs The Wanks”

  253. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    “I think we should do something to sort out these Awful Russkies I propose sending a task force to the Crimea” you say @starlaw at 3:32 pm

    Nae aircraft fur the carrier, mair Navy Captains than hulls and the ‘Thin Red Line’ is bloody anorexic these days .

    Yet the BritNat lunatics currently running the asylum were told Bwitain is truly great and believe combat is akin to the argy bargy of Eton’s playing fields.

  254. yesindyref2 says:

    The National’s doing OK, but for anyone who wants to print off some pdfs promoting digital subscriptions and leave them lying around in YES shops, SNP / Green / SSP branch / Labour / LibDem / Tory party meetings, there’s some on this page:

    all the pro-Indy parties back The National as you can see from the congratulations from Sturgeon, Harvie, Elaine Smith and all. Yes I know some people have concerns it favours the Greens / Bella / common weal, well it doesn’t, it backs Independence and gives space to anyone or any party who does to write columns – and letters.

    It’s also in your face wherever it’s displayed in shops and not covered up with the Daily Wail.

  255. Dan Huil says:

    More views from Ireland [sort of]:

  256. Ken500 says:

    @ Headtracker.

    Your too good. They don’t like it up them.

    Yer nae going anyway. Stoker can get ta feck. Along with the rest of the mindless trolls who sneak in.

    They can clear off. Chancers.

  257. Ken500 says:

    @ Headtracker

    You’re too good.

    Fecking predick text

  258. geeo says:

    @Proud Cybernat.

    Wee shout out for your brilliant Union Jackie Kim ono series…superb !!

  259. yesindyref2 says:

    Is Heed being expelled? Is this the first retaliation for the expulsion of the treeza twenty-three? Are there any more expulsions to come? Will Ken500 be next? Will I be next? Will the Rev be next?

    For the next thrilling episode tune in to RT …

  260. galamcennalath says:

    Dr Jim

    Did somebody mention Brexit? Oh Aye? That! Now I remember

    It’s like Fawlty Towers … “don’t mention the war Brexit”

    My understanding is TMay is expected, very soon, to sign up to the legally binding version of the Dec agreement. There is an important EU meeting, very soon. If satisfied, they will agree to things moving on to transition discussions.

    If this slot is missed, then nothing happens until June.

    You would have thought all this might be perceived by the media as important and on the verge of a crisis.

    Nope. All eyes on unexplained events in Wiltshire.

  261. Foonurt says:

    Awfae folk, thae rid-tie tories.

    Richard Leonard – yurr huvin ah laugh.

  262. twathater says:

    Very Very Important

    Just watched in car Gordon Ross on youtube link above where he is giving info about the London electoral commission holding seminar in Edinburgh 26th March re rules relating to referenda criteria , eg what level is acceptable to carry consent eg 50% 70% 75% if this is implemented it could have GRAVE consequences for our indy ref . Is this another fudge coming up .Entry is free if you register can I ask Edinburghers to attend if possible it lasts 1 and a half hours

  263. AlbertaScot says:

    As much as I’m against violence it’s going to be interesting times this summer when the nobody-likes-us-and-we-don’t-care boys show up on Tverskaya street and sing “god bless our gracious team!”

    Yup, the World Cup is going to take on a whole new dynamic thanks to Theresa May booting out the Russian diplomats and pinning the donkey tail on Putin.

    My senses tell me that the Moscow Ultras (or any other Ultras where England plays) won’t take too kindly to this gong show and will make their feelings felt.

    Please sing Rule Britannia, just the once.

    Couldn’t happen to a nicer mob.

    Oh, and I’m sure the Russian cops will do their very best to assure that no violence breaks out.

    Ya, right.

  264. jfngw says:


    I don’t think the electoral commission make the rules, they are there to ensure the rules are adhered to. They can make a recommendation but it is up to the parliament to decide the criteria.

  265. Ken500 says:

    @ Heedtracker

    They tried it before. Until everyone protested and got him/her back. Stoker’s making it up. Verbal abuse. Agrees with a Rock. Once would have given him the benefit of the doubt. No more.

    Do not play into their crap. The unionists pest Trying to troll the site.

    It takes Rev Stu a while to get rid of them because of the traffic on the site. He’s always busy doing research and getting the articles together. Getting e-mails and information in. Plus having to deal with twitter. Keeping all the equipment up dated. and protected.

    Nae bother here.

  266. Breeks says:

    Jockanese Wind Talker says:
    16 March, 2018 at 4:17 pm

    “I think we should do something to sort out these Awful Russkies I propose sending a task force to the Crimea” you say @starlaw at 3:32 pm

    Nae aircraft fur the carrier, mair Navy Captains than hulls and the ‘Thin Red Line’ is bloody anorexic these days…”

    I don’t know the Russian word for popcorn, but in a short three months, there are going to be hordes of English, Russian, Polish, Croatian, Spanish, and other assorted football fans arriving in Russia, ostensibly for the World Cup.

    Might need a dose of the old Dunkirk Spirit, and a fleet of tiny low swinging chariots needed to carry what’s left of them back home.

    I could be wrong, but something tells me Theresa May’s Government still haven’t quite got their heads around the concept of impact assessments…

  267. Valerie says:

    @ geeo

    My comment stands. Brian Cox was drowned out by the Dover audience on utterance of those two words.

    He was actually shouting “I want to answer that” What followed next was of no interest to the Dover inhabitants. As we all know, QT isn’t even a civil affair, especially for Scots.

    Dumbledore made sure the audience knew Cox was a firm supporter of Scottish Independence in the intro, thereby giving the audience their motivation.

    Cox is an incredibly respected actor, but you would barely know it, from the intro.

  268. Liz Rannoch says:

    twathater @ 5.23

    Info for meeting re Changes to Referendums.
    Book here (free tickets)

    Sir Joe Pilling is the Chair. See this on IPSO & Leveson:

    “She said of Pilling’s appointment that the panel was seeking “someone of unimpeachable independence, with a track record of conducting high profile reviews.” So they were “very pleased”, she said, “that we were able to appoint someone as eminent and experienced as Sir Joseph.”

    Pilling had a distinguished civil service career, rising to become permanent secretary of the Northern Ireland Office in 1997 until his retirement in 2005.”

    Andrew Wilson is former SNP MSP.

    Alan Renwick see this:

  269. Ken500 says:

    May reneged on the December agreement. She agreed NI could be part of the single market (or customs union) regulation. To stop a border between IR and NI (Ulster). She rejected it not long ago. Went back on her word. That is when the EU said come up,with your solution. They got exasperated.

    If Ireland has to have a border between north and south.,It breaks the the terms of the Irish agreement. The Tories do not know what they want because they can’t come out of the EU with out causing havoc. They should have thought about that before they had an EU Ref to stop UKIP getting a couple of seats. It really is unbelievable.

    Boris Johnston has a personality defect. A personality disorder. Delusions of grandeur and paronia. He could he schizophrenic. A psychopath. Many of them show these traits. It has been proven before. Master criminals and high ranking businessmen have similar traits. No empathy. Risk takers. Psychology Dept make these analysis. Find these results.

  270. Shinty says:

    Heedtracker – just you keep on posting, love to read your comments.

    Rev Stu – sorry haven’t contributed yet but promise to do so soon.

    Meg merrilees @1.41pm – reckon sales of Saltires this year will also soar!

  271. starlaw says:

    Any English football fan planning on going to the world cup in Russia would be advised to check their Life Insurance policies …they could well be void.

  272. Ian Foulds says:

    twathater says:
    16 March, 2018 at 5:23 pm

    Thanks for the information via Gordon Ross.

    Unfortunately, I shall not be able to attend on Monday.

    If someone is attending, could they ask for clarification that these people giving the talk are considering any rules applicable to Scotland would presumably be under Scots’ Law and also that the Scottish PEOPLE are Sovereign?

    Thank you,


  273. Shinty says:

    Sorry meant to add AUOB (all under one banner) marches for indy.
    Glasgow 5th May (not so far away). Other marches for indy planned for other towns on different dates.
    Mark you diaries folks.

  274. Shinty says:

    Sorry, that would be ‘you’ with an ‘r’ on the end.

  275. jfngw says:

    Anyone who wondered how a populace could me whipped up into a state of jingoistic frenzy pre-WWI has now had an ample example this week of how easy it is. You just need a Nationalist government filled with ministers of dubious ability, a PM with no authority and a compliant press.

    Remember most journalists, especially those on TV, love wars. They get to become GI Joe, don their combat gear and use their experiences to coin it in for the rest of their lives.

  276. Glamaig says:

    o/t Faisal Islam is quite good on Brexit, I learn more from his twitter feed than I ever do from the BBC:

  277. heedtracker says:

    Ken500, Shinty, Thank you! Maybe if I tone it down a bit.

    But then we have to sit and listen to massed ranks of beeb gimps, neo fascist professional liars basically, all those tory bullshitters and deniers, royals arse lickers etc or just this red tory twat for example,

    Daniel Johnson
    3 hrs ·
    The Offensive Behaviour at Football Act has been repealed.

    I argued in my speech that the Act provided no additional power to police or prosecutors, had human consequences and has been profoundly illiberal in its effect. Congratulations to James Kelly MSP for securing this victory for football fans across Scotland.”

    Its quite hard to not hit the old WoS btl circuit:D

  278. John from Fife says:

    Just read the Misreporting website on which it says that the Scottish and Welsh Governments are willing to agree to the “temporary Lending” of the 24 EU powers to Westminster under a “Sunset Clause”. Surely some mistake!!

  279. Rock says:


    “Support for Independence is rock solid at around 45 to 48% for the moment, so as an individual I will keep plugging away at persuading fellow Scots that originally voted No to come over to the side of the good guys.”

    It would make sense to “keep plugging away” at those who are more likely to be persuaded instead of wasting limited time and resources on diehard unionists.

    Thepnr (10th May 2015 – “The power of the press”):

    “Embrace the NO voters, even the Tory ones if you hope to reach your ultimate goal.”

    Rock (10th May 2015 – “The power of the press”):

    “Target and embrace the ones who can be persuaded.

    That is why the Radical Independence Campaign was so successful and the Yes campaign in the SNP “heartlands” a disaster.

    Do you seriously believe that spending limited resources on persuading Tories in Scotland to vote for independence is a good idea?”

  280. ben madigan says:

    very off topic – but may be of interest as anecdotal evidence of what is going on all over the EU.
    A young EU undergrad in nursing asked me, as advisor of studies, where he should apply for a job when he graduates.
    He discounted canada, Australia, NZ as too far away.
    Wanted to stay in Europe.
    Had to tell him that with brexit coming up the only safe place for him was the ROI.Qualifications recognised, inside the EU, no immigration issues etc etc.
    He asked about Scotland.
    “would be perfect” i said “but we don’t know if there will be Indyref2 and if Scotland will vote for independence. And if it doesn’t your future qualification may not be worth anything in the EU”

    Had the same conversation with a post-grad in Politics before Xmas who was wondering about where to apply for his PhD.

    How many other young people are there like them in other disciplines who would apply to Scotland for jobs or post-grad studies – if only they knew what was going to happen here?

  281. Rock says:


    “Ruth Davidson is the most dishonest politician in the UK and that’s saying something.”

    Rock (13th May 2015 – “Moodievision: The Fall And Fall…”):

    “Ruth Davidson is the most disgusting and nastiest politician in Scotland in my view.”

    As I keep “plugging away”, the clueless pompous armchair pundits posting here, with hindsight, come to the same views as I express with foresight.

  282. heedtracker says:

    Do you seriously believe that spending limited resources on persuading Tories in Scotland to vote for independence is a good idea?”

    Yes. Because you don’t know who else is listening and learning Rock.

    Although your style of political educationarising, is endless repetitive nothing yawn bore.

  283. Glamaig says:

    John from Fife says:
    16 March, 2018 at 8:52 pm

    I would take it with a pinch of salt. The BBC always spin headlines to depress yessers, or to show Brexit as going well. The article also says this:

    They have called for further amendments to ensure that the temporary restriction on devolved powers would require the consent of the devolved administrations, and any primary legislation required to establish common frameworks must be agreed by them.

  284. Rock says:

    Guardian reader with a Slovene (ex-)girlfriend, I see you posted another rant but didn’t say what the 56 SNP MPs had achieved for Scotland.

    Outnumbered 10 to 1 at Westminster, Scottish MPs can never achieve anything for Scotland.

    Certainly not SNP ones although Blue and Red Tory ones get some bribes before elections.


    “But tell me what the 56 SNP MPs achieved for Scotland.

    No Ken500 style fake news please.”

    heedtracker says:
    15 March, 2018 at 10:27 pm

    “I don’t care Rock.

    You can say anything you like on WoS. My love for Prof Smirky gets stronger and stronger by the UKOK BetterTogether Slovene day.

    You do have to hand it to this two pay cheques toryboy carpetbagger, he’s doing alright out of trying to destroy nascent Scottish democracy, and for this sort of carry on teamGB garbage too.

    You also have to wonder if he’d making as much mullah back in the day, when he was a republican trot, from England, trying to start a revolution, in our Scottish hearts.

    You yoons eh Rock. What a bunch. But as it says on the first page of the great UK Constitution, “who says life in teamGB is fair.”

    Adam Tomkins MSP Retweeted

    Murdo Fraser
    Verified account

    Mar 9
    More Murdo Fraser Retweeted Cabinet Office
    Let’s not forget that the SNP want every single one of these powers returned to Brussels.”

  285. yesindyref2 says:

    Stoker doesn’t own this website, nor is stoker appointed as the boss, moderator, controller, prime minister, gauleiter or scout troop leader.

    I like your postings, they make me laugh, and if you want to play with your favourite toy, rock, then carry on regardless, saves the rest of us from the job.

  286. Rock says:


    “Harvie and his mates using SNP second votes to vote against OBFA. The SNP support. They had been warned.”

    The likes of you had also been warned about Green seducer Paula Rose, but you patronised her:

    Rock (25th June 2015 – “One question answered”):

    “I have made it very clear that my suggestion is to SNP supporters.

    I want zero risk to an SNP majority, therefore SNP supporters must give both their votes to the SNP to avoid any risk.

    The likes of Paula Rose are trying to dupe SNP supporters into giving their list vote to the Greens.

    The Greens leader Patrick Harvie is as much anti-SNP as the unionists, and independence is not his top priority.

    I don’t want a hung parliament where the SNP has to rely on Green or Socialist MSPs.”

  287. Rock says:

    schrodingers cat,

    “‘Military grade nerve agent’. What other sorts of nerve agent are there??

    I hear that Tesco Value nerve agent is as effective as the big name brands, but at a fraction of the price.”

    Nicola and the SNP made utter fools of themselves by supporting Saint Theresa, in my humble opinion.

  288. Rock says:

    Now that the United Kingdom is at war with Russia and Nicola totally agrees with Saint Theresa, there is a ZERO chance of an independence referendum before Brexit has been completed.

    I am revising my previous prediction of 1% chance downwards to 0% chance. I will be happy to be proven wrong.

    Rock (9th September 2017 – “Mascot Of The Universe”):

    “– I can say with 99% confidence that Nicola will not dare defy Saint Theresa.

    By squandering a once in a 1000 years golden opportunity by wasting more than a year flogging a dead horse – a separate deal for Scotland which was never going to happen – Nicola has set back the independence movement by at least 620 years.

    So she is now flogging another dead horse:

    “Scotland is the best place in the world to grow up in and be educated”

    Why do we need “independence” in that case?”

  289. Iain says:

    Rock and labour,a bunch of fannys.
    Who would have a problem with that.
    Yoons that would sell out their country.
    Who would have a problem with that.
    Maybe the whole population of free Scotland.
    Freedom is in your hands.
    Roll the indy referendum.
    Nicola we await your call.

  290. Rock says:


    “A lot of us put endless effort into promoting this site and its invaluable work. We don’t do it for utter clowns like you to sit on here 24/7 trapping people into helping BUM rags pull in advertising revenue.”

    heedtracker (9th February 2017 – “A division of principles”):

    “Rock, whatever you’re up to on WoS, listen up, the author of Wings over Scotland is not the messiah and he’s not going to win ref 2.”

    Rock (9th February 2017 – “A division of principles”):

    “If anyone can tip the balance in favour of winning, it is this site and its author.”

  291. Iain says:

    Stu,what about banning the paid for trolls!
    You know who they are.
    We are sick of them.
    They are destroying your web site.
    Democracy is great, but surely a line must be drawn.

  292. galamcennalath says:

    John from Fife says:

    Scottish and Welsh Governments are willing to agree to the “temporary Lending” of the 24 EU powers to Westminster under a “Sunset Clause”.

    I may be wrong but I reckon Nicola regularly offers reasonable compromises knowing they will be rejected by TMay. It’s intentional. Part of a plan to say everything possible has been done to offer middle ground and everything gets thrown back in our faces. So now we have no choice but to …..

  293. heedtracker says:

    Nicola and the SNP made utter fools of themselves by supporting Saint Theresa, in my humble opinion.

    If the Russian’s didn’t do it, who else would Rock.

    Beeb gimp SNP out attack propaganda wise, look at what the shills at BBC2 Newsnight did to Comrade Jeremy this week.

    15 mins in ish Rock, a giant comrade Jezza, Kremlin backdrop, fills the studio.

    Wonder what the ministry of beeb gimp truth, would have done to FM Sturgeon.

    Beeb Scotland gimps repeatedly smeared Alex Salmond this week with the Salisbury poisoning and he’s no longer a politician, beeb gimps are getting that desperate.

    Popor old Jezza, he’s got no chance, he’ll never beat the BBC and he does look like Lenin too.

  294. Iain says:

    My case is proven.
    I rest my case.

  295. Valerie says:

    @ starlaw 7.17

    That’s a good point. UK govt are warning Arsenal fans to be aware of anti British feeling if they travel.

    In HoC this week, after statement, safety of football fans in World Cup was raised. If this is raised at govt level, I’m pretty sure travel insurance cover is being reassessed as we speak.

    Travel at your own risk.

    On a related note. The travel industry say Thomsons (who own many airlines) are now to insert a Brexit clause for travel aftet Mar.2019. This is to anticipate any disruption following Brexit.

    I wouldn’t worry, no one will have any money, and Europe will ban Brits from entry in response to the threat we won’t be checking anything at Borders.

  296. heedtracker says:


    Cheers bud! I’m not that much of a flamer.

    If a shill with a silly hairdo like Gordon Brewer, can sit in a £30+million studio in Glasgow and say that nation state Scotland is parochial or insular or anti English bigoted, its kind of hard to beat that level of yoon state gimpery, anywhere, let alone btl WoS.

  297. Indy2 says:

    Heedy v Stoker

    I see Mr Stoker has also caught on to you being a BritNat troll and well and truly skelped your arse for you Heedy.

    Heedy,,I have always said your links lead to Unionist websites.

    Heedy was quickly supported by the usual suspects (Probably Heedy himself)


    and about a dozen other trolls have well and truly fucked up a decent forum.

    They have to be on the books of somebody, they must be getting paid to post on here.

    No one could spend the amount of time they are on here and not be getting paid for it.

    I suspect the paymaster is a lot closer to home than we think.

    I suspect Rev Stu pays these clowns to be on here 24/7 to make the forum look busy.

    But in truth they put punters off from joining in the debate.

    It is our loss I’m afraid.

    Keep up the good work Mr Stoker.

  298. heedtracker says:

    I suspect Rev Stu pays these clowns to be on here 24/7 to make the forum look busy.

    He does. I make so much money from btl WoS, I drive a Bentley.

  299. yesindyref2 says:

    Yes, Sturgeon and Black played it the only way they could do, cleverly, Sturgeon making it plain that on the basis of information from May she supported the action. Traditionally the UK parliament as a whole supports wartime – and security – action taken by the UK Government, even when they have reservations, as the 3rd largest party the SNP did the right thing. Corbyn actually did do the right thing by asking the questions but was of course quoted well out of context by the media that seems intent on destroying him.

    That’s the lack of a negative side of what she did, the positive side is she got a lot of praise from “unionists” who may just possibly feel a little closer to Independence now …

    It’s all about hearts and minds, herats and minds.

  300. Dr Jim says:

    My Bentley’s two years old now AND it’s got a scratch, time for an upgrade Rev

  301. Sinky says:

    Let’s be clear I have no time for Putin and the way he is running Russia but BBC is now on full Falklands / Iraq type war footing. Why else would they have a Henry Jackson spokesperson commenting on the situation without a contrary view?

    And to think the same people want to ban Russia To-day as a propaganda outlet for the Kremlin. Have they never seriously considered the BBC’s unsubtle Great British propaganda output to the other nations in these islands?

  302. Indy2 says:

    Dr Jim

    just another Troll I’m afraid

    As I have said, dicks like you have ruined this forum.

  303. galamcennalath says:

    heedtracker says:

    a Bentley

    Way too Brit Establisment for me 😉

    If anyone out there is hiring …. make mine something fast and Italian.

  304. galamcennalath says:

    “The UK cannot get a legally watertight transition deal until it resolves the status of the Irish border as part of a wider divorce settlement with the EU, sources have said “

    …not exactly news. Well, it shouldn’t be news because that’s been the EU line. But it’s good to see the media engaging with reality again.

  305. heedtracker says:

    As I have said, dicks like you have ruined this forum.

    ooooh! up pops another fan.

    Indy2 what would do you and your angry chums here, btl a blog about Scottish politics and the relentlessly creepy UKOK msm?

    Did you hear “Wings over Scotland” and think its about bird watching, perhaps.

    Its really not indy2.

    Try this indy2,

    Tweet tweet:D

  306. Rock says:


    “If the Russian’s didn’t do it, who else would Rock.”

    Guardian reader with a Slovene (ex-)girlfriend, you are living proof that not all people in Scotland are stupid.

  307. heedtracker says:

    Indy2 what would do you and your angry EXPECT chums here, btl a blog about Scottish politics and the relentlessly creepy UKOK msm?

    Sorry indy2. You’re getting me all excited. Must go for a calming drive in Wings Over Scotland Bentley.

    You should get one indy2. Always soothes the troubled soul.

  308. Indy2 says:


    Trying to divert attention away from you being a Troll.

    You and your wee gang of Trolls have the Revs ear.

    That is why you will probably have me banned from the site.

  309. heedtracker says:

    galamcennalath says:
    16 March, 2018 at 10:20 pm
    heedtracker says:

    a Bentley

    No no no! It has to be a WoS Bentley.

    Bentley pinched the Wings over Scotland logo. But no doubt the owner of this blog can be persuaded for Italian muscle cars too.

  310. heedtracker says:

    That is why you will probably have me banned from the site.

    I wouldn’t even think of doing that indy2. Free speech is all. Anyway, one day you might get the opportunity to knock my head off. Don’t forget indy2. I wont.

  311. yesindyref2 says:

    All right for you lot with your Bentleys, I don’t get paid unless the fundraiser goes over 250% of target. But I do get 10% of that, I think that’s a good deal? Rev said it was.

  312. schrodingers cat says:

    Rock says:
    in my humble opinion.

    not interested

    ben madigan says: if only they knew what was going to happen here?

    so do I ben, i suspect that treeza will storm out very soon, but in truth, i dont know and until we do, we are left watching this fiasco unfold.

  313. Ian Brotherhood says:


    Whatever happened to TartanTory?


  314. Indy2 says:


    Otherwise known as The invisible Man.

    Your last post sounded very threatening Heedy.

    I am a regular at Indy Rallies,,Unlike yourself.

    If you ever come out of the shadows I will gladly “knock your block off” if you really insist on it.

    Ya Unionist Troll

  315. louis.b.argyll says:


  316. Thepnr says:

    @Ian Brotherhood

    He’s probably still hanging around, this business of supporting Independence is a long game and that’s why the toerags keep trying to wear people down.

    They’re a joke though, not that funny a joke but laughable all the same. When the starting gun is fired for the next referendum we can welcome old friends and new.

    There are too many now for them to defeat in this the “interm” period, stick with it and Independence will come. It’s a necessity if Scotland is to prosper and it will.

  317. louis.b.argyll says:

    Indy2, I know neither you nor Heedy..Oh I can’t be bothered…

    Anyway, just in.
    What I was gonna add, to comments from various engaged folks, was..


    But now I can also add..


  318. heedtracker says:

    If you ever come out of the shadows I will gladly “knock your block off” if you really insist on it.

    Ok indy2. You’re a credit to democracy and free speech. If I stop WoS btl comment, will you not knock my head off indy2? I mean who wants to get their head knocked off. Or is too late for little me now, in your tough guy book?

  319. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Thepnr –


    Aye, it’s a serr fecht man.

    But it’s quite comical when ye’ve got yon belters tae help punctuate the boredom of waitin for the inevitable.

    They don’t like that – the fact that they actually keep us goin!

    They don’t like it one wee toty bit!

  320. Dr Jim says:

    These wee Trolly boys don’t know me at all do they, which kinda proves what they are
    I suppose it must be once again when Independence becomes high on the agenda they dive right in with their garbage in the hope of putting off those genuine readers who actually do want Independence as opposed to these creeps whose allegiance is to nothing

    Pouring foul garbage out of their mouths isn’t even a good hobby

  321. Lenny Hartley says:

    yesindy2ref, IB Just love it when Trolls call other folk Trolls 🙂

  322. Robert Peffers says:

    @heedtracker says: 16 March, 2018 at 10:03 pm:

    “He does. I make so much money from btl WoS, I drive a Bentley.”

    Nah! What you drive is the false flag Britnats on Wings to desperate measures.

    Anyway they are all the same idiot. Had you not noticed, “they”, all come on-line around the same time and all clock off around the same time too.

    No genuine Indy supporter would want a cosy wee site with everyone holding the same views as everyone else but that’s what Rock wants. The rest of the sock puppets are all the same style with transparent, contrived and obvious unimportant differences.

    Each and every one of them comments under a nom de guerre instead of their real names. What are they frightened of?

  323. yesindyref2 says:

    @Lenny and others
    There’s been a big increase of trolls this week and they’re getting more desperate by the post, I wonder what set them off?

    Could it be the Continuity Bill passed its 2nd stage?

    Or Sturgeon and the SNP steering clear of a trap over Salisbury and incidentally setting another one of their own?

    Maybe the Rev’s crowdfunder going over target and more than twice already?

    Scotland in Union seemingly desperate for funds and spamming forums with please for a few hundred thousand to keep them going?

    Or only 20% of Scotland now not wanting an Indy Ref at some time?

    Or support for Indy at 48% – and rising?

    Choices choices.

    The more activity from them the more happy I am to see them squirm.

  324. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    I find it “interesting” that long-time WOS commenters (like Stoker) are called out as trolls by relative newbies.

    Get a grip! We’re under attack here. United we stand…

  325. Robert Peffers says:

    @heedtracker says: 16 March, 2018 at 10:45 pm:

    “I wouldn’t even think of doing that indy2. Free speech is all.

    Neither would anyone else on Wings, that is except for that same guy with all the different names who actually is trying to stop Indy supporters from posting and causing trouble all the time.

    Notice they are not posting information or arguing political points. They are the Trolls intent upon diverting all topics by calling everyone else Trolls.

    I’ve been ignoring Rock for a considerable time and do not often reply to his sock puppets. So is it a surprise he changes his nick name and posts as someone else?

    If we ignore this present batch I’d bet it would be just like London busses – There’ll be another lot along in a minute.

  326. Dr Jim says:

    Have you noticed the Tories are starting yet another petition to put a stop to Scotlands democracy
    Ten years the SNP are voted the favoured party by Scotland but the losers keep telling us NO because they say somehow whatever we vote for it shouldn’t be respected but whatever they say should be imposed

    Now that the Britnats have refused to show the analysis of the NOT nerve agent because it might be oven cleaner or Draino for all anybody knows, Tory credibility which was rock bottom anyway coupled with their noisy war drums has pitched Scotland to the point of screaming for Independence and in case any doubters are reading, remember their Nuclear shit is in our back garden not theirs and in some of our more northerly pubs when time’s called there are some very nice Russian lads finishing off their pints along with some of our own folk and they’ve never bombed our pubs once, even if they get beaten at darts

  327. louis.b.argyll says:

    Peffers says 12.46
    ..’No genuine Indy supporter would want a cosy wee site with everyone holding the same views as everyone else..’

    Yep, spot on Robert.

    It’s the gift o’ the gab that creates a nation’s linguistic prowess. When matched by speed of thought, colour is created where before only shades of grey.

    Arguments are where we challenge our language to progress a previously insurmountable challenge.

    Nationhood can widen AND polarise debate, it’s great.

    It is for us, alone, to decide how we live with each other.

  328. Ken500 says:

    Warned folk endless not to give their vote away but to vote SNP/SNP to ensure a majority. In fact never to vote for another. Party. Did not see the point of it at all. Just diluting/cancelling their vote. Others stated that was stupid. It was necessary to vote for others in some way to rank the opposition. When the most obvious thing was to get an SNP majority.

    Apart from the fact it could mean voting for a Tory, Labour LibDem or a green. All of whom many detest with a passion for various reasons. Local

    So stop lying you wee toad. Seeing you follow folk on here with surveillance like a stalker. Bit weird but some folk like attention but do not make points. Any Green can vote how they like. That is their right. There is not enough of them to make much difference. If they support Independence and want to vote for it. It is a bit weird a troll who claims to support Independence. Constantly make negative, lying comments about the SNP. It gives the impression that they are not being truthful.

    The wee bully boys have been having a go at Heedtracker. Complaining about folk posting They would rather there was less posts. Why? Why would they want to stop
    Comments. If they don’t want to read them. Don’t. What is the problem? Instead of turning the site into a bum fight.

    There are three folk wanting to stop folk posting comments. It isn’t even their website and they have nothing to say about Independence but to criticise the SNP for things they have not done without qualification.

    Thanks fot the mention. Would feel left out without it. Any publicity is better than no publicity. Fine.

  329. louis.b.argyll says:

    Love yer style, Ken500.
    Especially when your punctuation adds unwritten frustration and cause.

    One of the many, who are obliged to speak out.

  330. Robert Peffers says:

    @Dr Jim says: 17 March, 2018 at 1:09 am:

    “Now that the Britnats have refused to show the analysis of the NOT nerve agent because it might be oven cleaner or Draino for all anybody knows”

    It is a matter of fact, Dr Jim, that this particular type of Nerve Agent, “Novichok”, is the name of a type of nerve agent and not a specific nerve agent.

    Most Nerve agents are organophosphates and the particular thing about,”Novichok”, type Nerve agents is they are indeed made from fairly cheap chemicals commonly used to manufacture Weed Killers and Drain Cleaners.

    Furthermore, they are not too dangerous to handle as they are a binary, (two part), combination and quite safe until the two parts are brought together.

    So they are safe to produce the individual parts and safe to transport – as long as you keep the two parts separate.

    It is total nonsense to claim the Russians are involved on no other evidence than Russia developed the type several decades ago. The component parts are not even restricted by law and can be bought by almost anyone.

    Going by the vast quantity of synthetic recreational drugs in circulation that require far more complex production techniques there must be lots of people with the skills to produce organophosphate nerve agents and they do not require complex industrial equipment to make them from common non-restricted raw products.

    So that remark about weed killer and drain cleaner is not too far fetched at all..

  331. ben madigan says:

    what a shock to see all this quarrelling!
    let me attempt to pour oil on troubled waters and invite you all to unite in celebrating St Patrick’s Day!
    nice concert here for you all to enjoy!

  332. Dr Jim says:

    @Robert Peffers

    I know!

  333. Ghillie says:

    Yes! Happy Happy St Patrick’s Day =)

    And well done Ireland on winnning the 6 Nations Championship!

  334. Cactus says:

    Have yerself a grand day Ireland, oor international neighbour.

    Toon soon.


  335. yesindyref2 says:

    @BDTT: “I find it “interesting” that long-time WOS commenters (like Stoker) are called out as trolls by relative newbies.

    Who are you actually referring to? AFAICS the only one who did that is Ken500, who isn’t a newbie here – and isn’t a newbie all over the interweb during Indy Ref 1 being pro-indy including on CiF. OTOH from out of nowhere Stoker attacked Heed who also isn’t a newbie, who I also knew from CiF back in 2012 being pro-indy. Or is it me? Who?

    Attacks need to be specific or it can leave loads of us sensitive but incredibly, massively, hugely, enormously robust souls when it comes to the usual nasty personal unionist attacks wondering “is it me?”. And wondering “Can I be arsed with all this?”. Which of course is exactly what the real trolls want.

  336. Fred says:

    This is a £100,000 site yet clowns are permitted to pish all over it. Petra was a regular contributor but has stopped posting as she’s sick to the back teeth of it. They’d be dumped on Stu’s Twitter, what’s the difference?

  337. Ken500 says:

    @ Reader beware. If you do not like this comment do not read it. Not for the faint hearted. You have been warned.

    @ Stoker does not make any points. Stoker just appears occasionally. Not to made any points or information. Just to attack other posters. Or support a poster who attack others. Gives misinformation or disrupted the thread. When people are attacked they have a right of reply. Most people just ignore the trolls. Unless they go over the score. Persistent. When they make concerted attacks on others. Rev Stu obviously wants them away because the persistent ones disappear eventually. Rev Stu is very busy collaborating all the articles. Gathering information. They have to be legal. Keeping twitter going. Monitoring the equipnpment. A collosal task. You just can’t get the staff (a joke!)

    Why would any one what to prevent comments? Either read them or don’t. It is not compulsory to read the comments. Many people don’t. The fact the website goes from strength to strength. With unionist/ non believers banned shows the commentators are a force for good not evil.

    Other wise the site would not go from strength to strength and be so successful. Amazingly successful in the circumstances. Being supported from all over the world. To infinity and beyond. The fact tgat one talented guy and his helpers can actually through the Internet challenge the MSM. Getting higher viewers or listeners. Higher figures. Challenge political decision. Give excellent analysis. Links. Challenge the establishment and call them out. Is nothing short of spectacular.

    Most people are just grateful that he does it. If Wings was not here it would have to be invented. Once again Rev and Nana everyone else who contributes with relevant information. Thanks a Billion for the change in Scotland. Most of all thanks to the SNP Gov. Standing up for Scotland.

    Many do not want to join a political Party for obvious reasons. They just want to stay out of mainstream and vote any way they like. Like the majorty of people. They only join when they have to for obvious reasons. Often in desperation. When their society or communities are under sustained attack from all quarters for years. They just have to stand up and be counted.

    If members are not happy about any issues. They can just let their membership lapse. That is easy. Hopefully not in the present situation. Or it can be seen as some kind of defeat. It is more committed to stick it out. Or hope more people will join. A 2 hour+ meeting every three months to keep going is not a lot to ask to stand up for your place of residence. If it is possible to get there. Or just being a sleeping partner helps for many busy people.

    Once they do, even reluctantly, join they find like minded people. They can donate and campaign in an organised way. No matter how much or how little they can do. It is actually a relief that they are standing up being counted and doing something. It can actually throw off the depression of bejng defenceless. Feeling useless. While the world and it’s dog is going to the dogs. People comment because they are so desperate. In desperate times. The idea that a Gov could be sanctioning and starving it’s own citizens for no reason for ideology is too much to bear. Makes people sick. To the majority it is abhorrent and a step totally too far.

    The grammar, punctuation, language etc is to try and precise (not always successful) as can be seen. Ie to throw a few ideas in. Try and simplified. Keep it short? I know, l know. So people can go and check. Just look up the internet. For further information. It is all there. It has been looked up for qualification. The spelling mistakes are predick text. Or that’s what’s getting blamed. Schmidt or whoever.

    Anyone who doesn’t like the comments. Just do not read them. Simple really, I have been banned and deleted from many sites. Consistently. The Scotsman, the Guardian, the Herald. Years ago when they were good fun and banter. Before the trolls destroyed the sites. Cutting off their nose to spite their face. All going to the dogs. Advert revenues and sales going down.

    (Except the deceitful Guardian) It might take longer. It has £Billion in reserve and is pleading poverty. Wanting poor people to sent a £. Not blooming likely. Hardly anyone reads it, especially in Scotland. Making it irrelevant. You can just change your e-mail address and go back. Many do not want to do so. They give up. If MSM do not want people’s comment. So be it. They are just taking the mickey any way. Trying to put up their advertising revenues. With constant pop up annoying commercial adverts. Putting people off there site. They use the click bait to try and get revenues in. Boring. Wings goes by donation. A more consistent way. More and more. Remuneration by results. Sorry for another rant! but no one has to read it. Warned right at the start.

    Imagine if Rev had adverts the revenue stream. Perish the thought. Just does consistently good articles and calls the unionist out.

    Even deleted and banned @ Craig Murray. So much for freedom of speech and openness. He does not take kindly to criticism for criticising the SNP. I still donated to his Defence though. He gets some good information,. So do his posters. He is a good oratator. Just would not stand in line to wait his turn. Or chance, Everyone wants it now in this modern busy world. No patience. Or there might be something the opposition can use against him. The spy from the Daily Mail is still stalking him it seems. Mavericks can still do great things even out of a regular Party. They can do more good and make better points. Get better remuneration.

  338. Auld Bob says:

    @Indy2 says: 16 March, 2018 at 11:46 pm

    “I am a regular at Indy Rallies,,Unlike yourself.”

    Aye! So are Polis Scotland, The BBC and lots of anti-indy SMSM Gimps.

  339. Rock says:

    Robert Peffers,

    “No genuine Indy supporter would want a cosy wee site with everyone holding the same views as everyone else but that’s what Rock wants.”

    Let us see who wants everyone to hold the same views as him:

    Robert Peffers says:
    12 March, 2018 at 2:10 pm (A historic breakthrough):

    “Absolute and utter pish! Squirrel.”

    Robert Peffers says:
    12 March, 2018 at 11:44 pm (A historic breakthrough):

    “Oh! Go and do some research before mouthing off, Valerie.”

    Robert Peffers says:
    13 March, 2018 at 3:05 pm (A historic breakthrough):

    “Sheesh! Where do these uninformed numpties come from?”

  340. Rock says:

    Robert Peffers,

    “No genuine Indy supporter would want a cosy wee site with everyone holding the same views as everyone else but that’s what Rock wants.”

    How do you know what I want if you don’t read my posts you liar?

    Robert Peffers, (15th March – 2018-03-15 Spinning down):

    “I wouldn’t know. I never read what he posts except someone else is quoting him or, like tonight,(oop! last night), when I read the last line in one of his posts and nearly choked laughing but I’ve no idea what he posted except for that last line.”

  341. Ghillie says:

    What an amazing day for Ireland! Well deserved. Hope you all had a fabulous time celebrating St Patrick’s Day too =)

    Hey Scotland! Well done our boys in Italy =)

  342. Gary says:

    So, he doesn’t HAVE to release the data. But, wanting to retain integrity he will ensure that the data IS released so that no one can unfairly criticise him, his poll or the company itself.

    No? Quelle Surprise!!

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