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The bag carrier

Posted on July 14, 2018 by

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    1. 14 07 18 08:56

      The bag carrier | speymouth

    430 to “The bag carrier”

    1. Thepnr says:

      Great drawing, you captured Mundell’s glaikit face perfectly.

      What’s with the left handed driver?

    2. Malky says:

      For all Trump cares, Mundell might well be our FM. He has the awareness of a brick.

    3. Les Wilson says:

      Excellent Chris, covers it very well.

    4. Cactus says:

      Stayin’ alive Mundell eh…

      They’ve nae gbaws.


    5. Cactus says:

      Can you find Cairnstoon Hamish…?

      Click to enlarge.

    6. Ghillie says:

      C.C. 🙂

      I especially like ‘ Orange Jobby’ !!!

    7. Robert Louis says:

      For all his faults and their are many- Trump will recognise Mundell for the snivelling wee suck up toadie that he is, straight away. Seriously, why is he even meeting him? Supposedly representing the ‘uk’ Government in Scotland or some such rubbish. I do not doubt Mundell literally pleaded to be ‘allowed’ to take part in the Trump visit, and, rather than be allowed to participate down in London at the proper ceremonies, was told, he could get to meet trump, up in Scotland for a few minutes afterwards. F*****g pathetic.

      Honestly, in all history if you ever wanted to find a true weasel of a man, then many might think they have found him in Mundell. Zero personal integrity, zero self respect. A nothing man. A truly pathetic excuse for humanity. happy to sell out Scotland for his masters in England.

      With any luck fascist Trump will take him home with him to the USA as a pet lapdog or whipping boy.

    8. Ghillie says:

      Oh aye Cactus!

      There’s oor Hamish =)

    9. Marker Post says:

      I saw a placard in George Square yesterday, “Trump has shit hair”

    10. Brian McHugh says:

      Trump is too coward to meet Scotlands First Minister. He is an intellectual dwarf next to her.

    11. Ghillie says:

      Robert Louis, the picture you conjure for me is from ‘Aliens from Mars’ (very hi brow me) when the ‘lap dug’ ends up with his head on the body of a wee jappy dog 🙂

      (sorry folks this is a pretty old niche kids’ film ref but hey it fits!)

    12. Ghillie says:

      Mundell does not even earn the title ‘Toom Tabard’.

      Fails even faint praise.

      What a shame. Where did that poor wee ladie lose hisself?

    13. Street Andrew says:

      Beautiful, Chris.


    14. Capella says:

      I like Tangerine Tube. Quality title. Chris has been honing his skills. It’s almost photographic.

    15. Robert Peffers says:

      @Thepnr says: 14 July, 2018 at 7:15 am:

      ” … What’s with the left handed driver?”

      Aiblins yon Trump gadgie mun bi corrie jukkit, (Perhaps that Trump fellow may be left handed).

      BTW: the term Corrie derives from the large Borders Family Carr who were predominantly left handed.

      Spiral staircases in their Borders seat homes were built left handed. The reason being that if they had to defend the fortified dwellings the right handed spiral staircases would be a handicap to their use of swords in their left hands but being built left handed they were a handicap to the attackers.

    16. Muscleguy says:

      @Robert Louis
      It was more that nobody in ScotGov wanted to meet and greet and nobody they would trust from ScotGov not to bail him up either. So Fluffy the Toady got the gig instead. Protocol etc.

      Still, it seems the White House has assumed a Yes vote in IndyRef2 is a given.

      I registered for an Aquarium discussion group yesterday and they actually had Scotland as a country. I was most pleased.

    17. Ian McCubbin says:

      Robert Louis puts it beautifully. Fluffy is the epitome of the crawling weasel. All he will show Trump is the weakness in some Scots.
      He (Trump) will do well to not underestimate the resolve of the majority of us.
      Great cartoon such a laugh.

    18. Robert Peffers says:

      @Brian McHugh says: 14 July, 2018 at 7:45 am:

      ” … Trump is too coward to meet Scotlands First Minister.”

      Well, Brian, I would venture a guess that he didn’t get the chance of an invitation from the Scottish Government to meet with the First Minister.

      I’ll explain my reasoning – Trump’s visit is actually not an official state visit by the POTUS but a private business trip by Trump. As such there is no duty upon the SG or FM to officially formally greet a visiting head of state.

      The FM has been quite open about her feelings about Trump and has been quoted by the media as expressing her feelings that Trump is no friend of Scotland.

    19. galamcennalath says:

      Captured Trump’s ‘Mussolini expression’ perfectly!

      And there oor wee Hamish keekin owr the bankin’.

    20. Clootie says:

      It is a puzzle!

      How can such a genius, sex God, diplomat and modest man be so misunderstood by so many (…so many relates to this side of the pond of course)

      A self made millionaire who started in business with a meagre $20million gift from his father….how many of us could have achieved success from such a difficult foundation.

    21. Breeks says:

      Ian McCubbin says:
      14 July, 2018 at 8:34 am
      Robert Louis puts it beautifully. Fluffy is the epitome of the crawling weasel. All he will show Trump is the weakness in some Scots.
      He (Trump) will do well to not underestimate the resolve of the majority of us.
      Great cartoon such a laugh.

      Agreed. Remember when Spitting Image depicted David Steel as a sycophantic toady for Michael Owen? By some accounts the depiction destroyed his credibility and ended David Steel’s career, but you’d have to wonder how Spitting Image would depict the likes of Mundell.

    22. James Westland says:


      Good point re Spitting Image. It was great in the 80s with Thatchers cabinet. Theres a massively richer vein of material to mine now. Would love to see them do it again

    23. Abulhaq says:

      Lampooning Trump is fun. He sets himself up for it. However he holds the US presidency. Nicola Sturgeon rather than having a day out in Glasgow might have shown some diplomatic, statesmanlike nous by meeting the guy, explaining to him why his mother’s homeland would be a much better place as an independent state and teach him a bit of history on Scoto-english relations. Not too hard really. Could be ‘fun’ getting to know the guy.
      Better the devil you know than the one you disapprovingly turn your nose up at.
      Personally, I’d love to have a chat, put him ‘right’ about the MidEast and other things the US has got messed up and that a certain hawkish Hilary Clinton might have made even worse.

    24. Breeks, @ 8.54 am there are no levels of degradation to which our Brit Nat Uncle Tom politicians won’t stoop for money.
      Mundell’s latest public grovelling to the New World Order does inspire us to literary comparisons.

      Uriah Heep Dicken’s sycophantic arsehole, wringing his’wery ‘umble’ hands and bowing to his betters, for money and the promise of elevation to the Elite Club.

      Mundell is Lewis Carroll’s slythy tove in ‘Jabberwocky’.

      Like the modern day not very talented Dim But Nice Tory Boys,he will do anything for money no matter how humiliating, or insulting to our country in the eyes of his fellow Scots.

      Like Gorgeous George before him who crawled on hands and knees in a pink leotard lapping up milk from a saucer, or Kezia fucking off to the jungle to drink penis wine for dosh when she was supposed to be serving the citizens of Scotland, or Mum 2B Davidson whoring herself on TV shows, Mundell, with astonishingly little skills or basic human qualities is used by May and the London Elite to act as this megalomaniac’s batman and gopher.

      Tories will do anything for money except serve the people of Scotland.
      A Master Class in Arse licking and defeat.

    25. Clydebuilt says:

      The BBC snd CH4 are interviewing anti Trump protestors, BBC radio Scotland are advertising the time and place of the Demos.

      Normall treatment of anti war and independence demos is for the camera to focus on some eccentric, with camera angles that downplay the turnout.

      Why are anti Trump protestors being treated differently from any other protestors that I can remember.

    26. Ghillie says:

      ‘Mars Attacks!’

      That was the film where Fuffily Mundelly ended up with his head on a wee dug’s body.

      Abulsag, you are so wrong.

      Nicola Sturgeon is showing the world it IS possible to be true to your beliefs and to have integrity, even in the highest positions in politics.

    27. Calum McKay says:

      Top line in Mundell”s job description is:

      “must have the ability to suffer humiliation in silence, brown nose, ditch your principals, endure long periods of isolation and sell your country down the river whilst mumbling incoherently.”

      And doesn’t he do his job just brilliantly!

    28. schrodingers cat says:


      I had this concern after he was elected and thought nicola was unwise to have made the comments she did before he was elected.
      however, nicola spoke out very clearly saying that sometimes you need to stand up for what you believe in.

      with hindsight, i think she was and is right. principles matter.

      wrt trump, making an enemy of the most powerful person in the world is not something you do lightly, but i dont think trump coming out against indy scotland will lose us any votes. he has become a figure of fun, if anything, i’m betting the unionist hope he keeps schtum. he is now a liability and a vote loser

    29. Archbishop of Dork says:

      Being a caddy is temporary promotion for Fluffy. A change from the ignominious routine of being Theresa May’s tartan footstool.

    30. ahundredthidiot says:

      NS is damned if she dose and damned if she doesnt meet him.

      I am guessing damage limitation wins the day with a no meet, but it doesnt have to be done discourteously, i think she is on the money with this one – again.

    31. Famous15 says:

      Our principal has no principles. Our Governer General will know his place and will not share locker room talk with The Donald. Wait! No I will not stray or grope around territory that could be a minefield.

      I cannot escape the thought that the best way to upset an egotist is to ignore him.

    32. ahundredthidiot says:


      fat fingers, wee phone!

    33. Highland Wifie says:

      Re. anti Trump protestors Clydebuilt says ‘BBC radio Scotland are reporting the time and place of the demos.

      This in contrast to a complete blackout of any information about independence marches. On the day only mentioned on traffic news as a march that may cause delays. Question what turnout we might have if we got that kind of publicity.

      Brilliant cartoon again Chris. Got Mundell’s obsequious mug perfectly.

    34. Dr Jim says:

      You get to choose your politics in an Independent country:

      We don’t have different politics in Scotland we only have one, either you’re for Scotland or you’re for the UK and anything inbetween is a pretendy excuse for being a British Nationalist

      The folk who start discussions with *I would support Independence but* usually followed by references to Nicola Sturgeon or finance or *the future in doubt* are just making up excuses to buy themselves time to come up with their own reason to convince you to buy into the UK status quo because you either believe a country should be run by itself or you don’t, whoever is in charge of that country at any given time would be a matter for the people of that country to vote on when you’re a proper country like every other country

      The counter argument for the UK is simply you don’t want the people of your own country to have a meaningful vote thereby denying democracy, because to believe in the UK version is to believe that England by right should maintain a voting ratio of ten to one over Scotland in perpetuity thereby always, always denying Scotland a legitimate say on anything, and that’s dictatorship in anybodies language

      Big countries with military ambitions always want to be bigger and will happily absorb every other country they can if they think it’ll make them more powerful or even seem more powerful and those bigger countries will always tell the smaller countries they would be doomed to penury or violent destruction without their larger protectors being the benevolent dictators that they are, but when you take a look around the world you see that the only people doing the destroying are those bigger countries by gobbling up everything in sight and then sucking them dry to feed the original big country

      Where does it end? well it ends by telling the big country with it’s military showy offy ambitions NO I’ll join up with a whole load of other countries who don’t subscribe to that idea thanks and in the case of Scotland there’s 27 of them just across the water and a whole bunch of them to the north of us as well across another bit of water who don’t want to take us prisoner and threaten us with all that unpleasant stuff, and I know there are is the argument of defence that the British Nationalists always come back to but I have to counter that one by saying the future of defence isn’t a big bomb or a big gun anymore, get with the program, the future of defence is a bunch of laptops and a bunch of geeks

      I think the most inventive country in the world, Scotland, has both and I’m very confident in my children and grandchildren to continue to make that so, whereas left to much of my generations apathy we really would be doomed

      It’s not a risk it’s an adventure…….. Vote YES

    35. Ken500 says:

      Nicola will tread lightly and have Trump right under the thumb. Just like the rest. Support education and the NHS and the special relationship Scotland has with the world. Over 10% of US voters are of Scottish decent, Enough to swing an election. A powerful lobby in Washington. Friends world wide. In the EU etc. 40million diasporia. .

      Doubt Trump even noticed Mundell. The amount of people leaving the plane. Hunners. It was like a tardis. Spilling over. A right carry on with a buggy load behind. For a two night stop. Totally over the top. Trump has invested £Millions in Scotland. Puts it on the map. Brings a lot of tourists and cruise vessels. Lots of Americans visit Scotland. Looking for their ancestry. Many people from Scotland have US connections.

      Trade and give aid. Do not invade might be relevant, Stop and refuelling on the way to Russia and the Kremlin. Should be an Interesting outcome. Jaw jaw not War War. The warmongering unionists. Killing and maiming millions in the UK and abroad. Sanctioning and starving people, causing the worst migration crisis in the world since the 11WW. Now their Brexit mess. They are despicable. An International disgrace, The sooner they are gone the better. The Trump just another short term distraction.

    36. Footsoldier says:

      @Robert Peffers 08:26 “the term Corrie derives from the large Borders Family Carr who were predominantly left handed”.

      That’s interesting I hadn’t heard that one, I always thought it came from the much older Gaelic “cearr, left or wrong hand”.

    37. Alba Woman says:

      Drawing of their truly gorgeous faces magnificent.

    38. dakk says:

      Truly brilliant Chris 🙂

    39. Orri says:

      The left handed staircase is actually better for a right handed attacker. The reasons it’d be chosen would be to suit the defenders who retain the advantages of unfamiliarity if the attackers haven’t fought left handers or on that kind of stairs.

    40. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Marker Post at 7.45

      Saw this from Des Clarke this morning “Trump flies up to Scotland on Hair Farce One.”

    41. galamcennalath says:

      @Robert Peffers

      My father used to say corrie haunit in his Ayrshire accent because I have always used my left hand a lot, but not to write. I’m old enough to have had left handed writing discouraged at school. I tend to use tools left handed.

      I had heard the tale of the Border’s castle with left handed staircase. Since I realised it would advantage both left defender and right attacker I wondered if the design was more a statement of ‘celebration’ of the family’s left handedness in a world where it must have been considered negative/suspicious/bad.

    42. Socrates MacSporran says:

      Anent the Tangerine Tube’s visit to Scotland. In the lead-up BBC Shortbread showed clips from President Eisenhower’s weekend visit to his apartment in Culzean Castle.

      That apartment was given to Ike, for his use during his lifetime, in thanks for his work as Supreme Allied Cmmander in WWII. As such it was as much his property as Trump Turnberry is the current POTUS’s property.

      But, the then Secretary of State for Scotland was not ordered down there to greet Ike, and, of course, we didn’t have a First Minister then.

      He was left to get on with it and pretty-much left alone apart from the obligatory photo-ops for the press.

      That visit was before Dallas, after which security around POTUS was ratched-up several notches, but, at the end of the day, in both 1959 and 2018, the presidential visits to Ayrshire were private affairs, so why all the kerfuffle.

      A 30-vehicle motorcade FFS, he could have got off Air Force One waved to the crowd, got onto Marine One and been at Turnberry in less time and with a lot less fuss and bother.

      Of course, unlike Ike, who was a simple soldier, accepting the call to serve his nation, the Tangerine Tube has an ego the size of Alaska and wants the world to know He’s Da Man.

    43. Breeks says:

      History will judge whether Trump visiting Scotland but failing to meet with Scotland’s elected Government is a snub for Scotland as the BritNats will portray it, or yet another monumental diplomatic faux pas by the Americans. There’s probably more than a hint of both.

      It’s a bit like GERS figures. They can be twisted to say whatever you want to say, but it would appear safe to say that where South Britain stands with the Americans, whereas Scotland would rather stand with Europe. The BritNats would have us Scots feel threatened by that “bleak” possibility, but for my part, I’m completely relaxed and more than happy about it.

    44. ronnie anderson says:

      Had to drive to Monkton to pick up a pup for the Mrs, what a waste of money Traffic Cones every 10/15yds & Police on 12 hour shifts to protect his plane /helicopters ect.

      BTW Police Scotland your officers are exposed to the SUN no shelters , wee Gizbo’s would come in handy should that Muppet come back to Scotland .

    45. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      I actually now believe that time’s up on Mumbles and Preggers. They have tried and tried and tried and relentlessly promoted them but they are still only at the giddy heights of about 24% in the polls (and I hardly believe that).
      Carlaw and the Professor don’t fit and I can’t see anybody else.

      Saw a generous interview with Richard Who? on STV the other night. Are they going to run with him again for a bit?

      We surely go into the final contest as favourites.

    46. ahundredthidiot says:

      a carrier bag is more useful than this bag carrier

    47. Legerwood says:

      I am sure Mr Mundell in preparation for his meet and greet (both meanings) had a tasty morsel in his beard ready to pass round with the canapes

    48. Socrates MacSporran says:

      High Heid Yins such as the Tangerine Tube have to meet and greet so-many people in the course of a day, they cannot possibly know who is next up for the formal handshake and maybe, if they are lucky, the picture.

      So, they have jobsworths ready to whisper in their ear, something like: “The small lady in the big hat, carrying the hand bag, she’s the Queen of England, has been for 66-years; she’s met 11 previous Presidents, so be nice Mr President.”

      Wonder what was whispered in his ear when he looked out of the window of Air Force One and saw the Viceroy waiting for him.

    49. ronnie anderson says:

      ronnie anderson says:
      14 July, 2018 at 11:45 am
      Had to drive to Monkton to pick up a pup for the Mrs, what a waste of money Traffic Cones every 10/15yds & Police on 12 hour shifts to protect his plane /helicopters ect.

      BTW Police Scotland your officers are exposed to the SUN no shelters , wee Gizbo’s would come in handy should that Muppet come back to Scotland .

    50. katherine hamilton says:

      This cartoon is just amazing on so many levels. Do you do prints or something. I want a copy for the wall. How can I buy one?

    51. frogesque says:

      Folk are being too hard on Fluffy, it’s not every day you get promoted from teeaboy to bag lady.

    52. Archbishop of Dork says:

      The Devil has all the best dunes. Or Menie of them anyway.

    53. Macart says:

      Great toon Chris. 🙂

      On leaders?

      Personally? I’m good with the FM we’ve got. 🙂

    54. Greannach says:

      Said in a Janet from Dr Finlay voice:

      “Welcome to Northern Britain, you Magnificence. I’ve made you a lovely cup of tea and a wee scone. Carry you bags, sir?”

    55. Alba 46 says:

      O/T 51st Highland Division

      For those interested Sunday 8pm channel 4 tells the story of the capture of the 51st HD at St Valery during the Dunkirk retreat.

      More Scottish soldiers sacrificed for the greater westminster good, told by the soldiers that were their.

    56. Kangaroo says:

      Robert Peffers @8:26am

      The Corrie fisted Borders Clan is Kerr another branch being Ker, both had houses in the Borders Ferniehirst and Cessford (now a single wall ruin). The name is still pronounced “Carr” in the borders, hence Deborah Kerr the actress pronounced Carr. In the 1200’s some of the family moved South to Northampton and changed their name to Carr keeping the same pronunciation. WE were on the Government side at Culloden as you will see if you look up Wikipedia.
      I am of the same name but an ardent SNP supporter and one who was there when Winnie Ewing won Hamilton.

    57. Movy says:

      Terrific cartoon. Sums it up so well.

    58. call me dave says:

      Nicely drawn cartoon and wee Hamish there too. 🙂

      James has an updated article piece on the latest poll in The National.

    59. Jason Smoothpiece says:


      Marches in Catalonia today to demand freedom for politicians jailed by the Spanish Fascists.

      Despite all that is going on here we should spare thought for our friends in Catalonia.

      Disgraceful situation continues over there.

    60. Confused says:

      I think it would have been wiser for our glorious leader to try and exploit The CombOvers visit – to guarantee an even-hand at least from the US on the independence issue – but it seems she needs to virtue signal to the identity politics pseudo-left.

      Which makes me glad – I mean, when we “do a catalonia” and then the UK deep state “does a Spain” on us – she can simply pick up the phone and call on … 200 trannies to come and fight our corner. Which ain’t nuthin – they are certainly capable of crazy violence when roused.

      – And the Scottish legions cried out not for “FREEDOM ! ALBA ! ” – but “I am what I am” and “I feel love” … the UK army lay defeated on the plain of Salisbury, the paras, the gurkhas, the SAS, their battle honours stripped from them, bodies impaled on long spears … our schiltroms proud, the air faintly wafting poppers and the techno skirling among the smoke … some of the captured were taken off to a crystal meth party, never to be seen again …

      – maybe Nicola took a sensible middle ground, as she often does – she didn’t meet him but she kept mostly quiet on the issue. I trust our leader though – she is savvy and makes few mistakes (- how many opponents have she and Big Lexo before her seen off?)

      Petras is usually bang on the money – read the first section, at least (Background to empire building)

      This one is interesting in a disturbing way

      – the guy’s clearly a ret … “special” in the modern way – he looks like he would have trouble filling in a form – but he’s been done on TERRORISM – because he had a lot of “stuff” in his house which COULD have been used to MAKE A BOMB … uh huh … then there’s a bunch of stuff on his computer, including the obligatory NAZI (home-run!) stuff … so there you go – proof by association, the new legal high bar. Okay, its hard to feel sympathy for this guy, but read down and here’s the kicker –

      Jurors heard he was “quite proud” he was part of the Scottish Defence League and travelled with others from the far-right group to a white pride rally in Manchester in 2015.

      Our spooks are well-capable of fitting people up for psychological operations, or “winding up the nutter” and letting him actually do stuff, or swoop in to arrest him just before he does. The “guilt by association” trick always works well in the papers – no one reads carefully anymore – scottish nationalists, eh? – just a bunch of terrorists. We need to watch out for this kind of carry-on – there will be more of it as indyref2 approaches.

    61. ronnie anderson says:

      For anyone who may be asking
      About Attending a Service For
      Mitch,, There will be no service
      Just a Celebration of his Life
      Mitch Organized his Own End of Life
      Arrangements, He did not want any
      Fuss, No speeches No nothing
      Only For people to Have a Celebration
      of his Life, All he asked for Was
      Chris the Piper to Play
      Flowers of the Glen for him
      And Elaine Page’s Memories,
      So we would Appreciate that Everyone
      Honor his Wishes, And Please
      Come help Celebrate his Life
      And his Commitment To Indy

    62. thomas says:

      @ kangaroo

      Robert peffers earlier explanation regarding the “corrie fisted” saying which footsoldier up the page correctly picked him up on , is in error and the saying does come from the gaidhlig for left handed.

      I do enjoy much of roberts knowledge on scottish history and folk tales and explanations but it is very much narrowly “teutonic” based rather than inclusive of the older and greater “Celtic” and very much post 14 th century scotland rather than inclusive of pre.

    63. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      I was a wee kid in primary school when we were ushered down to the North Deeside Road to wave our wee Union Jacks to Ike and the Queen as they were driven past on their way to Balmoral.

      Changed days indeed, in so very many ways. Not least, though, in the character of presidents.

      I don’t know about protocol, but an intelligent and astute Pres would surely have jumped at the chance to meet that very interesting political character and pleasant person, our FM. How better to get a grasp of what’s going on here from someone at the very centre of things? “Meet-and-greet”, isn’t that what the visit is supposed =cough= to be all about?

      It’s a mark of the man that he would rather play golf with that useless nobody, Fluffy, and whatever other fawning acolytes he can muster.

      (Oh, and BTW, “Toom Tabard” was an outright insult, not a faint compliment.)

    64. ronnie anderson says:

      Alba 46 Land was made available for a War Memorial by the People & Mayor of St Valery to erect a the Memorial . The war graves commission didn’t want to know

    65. Ken500 says:

      People can come across the Royals accidently on Deeside. Just by coincidence passing by, frequently in the area. The protection squad hardly noticed. Recognised by the short haircuts and the shiny shoes. Barbours and pinstripe suits.

      The Police have gone totally over the top. Trump came in and out of Scotland with hardly any notice. He is just one person. Now with an entourage of hunners. What a carry on. The jet is at Aberdeen airport. (Sons) Two globemasters flew into Scotland. Full of navy seals. They might have a swim among the eyesore turbines. If yer dinae laugh yer would greet. Up pops the whales.

      Nicola’s off on the other March. Already on the Calendar schedule.

    66. Thepnr says:

      O/T Don’t forget to vote in Scotland’s first ever World Cup final, it’s iScot v Doctor Who get your vote in and give them a wee boost. Might earn them a wee write up in the National and garner some welcome publicity.

    67. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      ronnie anderson @ 14:22,

      There is a fine war memorial at St.Valery, Ronnie, War Graves Commission or no. It’s on the bluff to the NE overlooking the town.

      Also, a couple of years back when the Tour de France cycle race was passing through, on the coast nearby there was another monument (to a sunken French navy ship, I seem to recall) consisting of a ship’s gun and three flagpoles, one each flying the Tricolore, the Union Jack and the Saltire. The English commentators (or course) hadn’t an earthly as to why the third.

      But the French locals had clearly not forgotten.

    68. Dr Jim says:

      British Nationalists heads exploding today trying to invent reasons to hate the First Minister for saying *gonnae no hate folk*

    69. Kangaroo says:

      Thomas @1:59pm

      I think both are correct. You would have noticed the WE in my earlier post. I am a Kerr, and the stairs are left handed. I am left footed but right handed as is my daughter, but I have a left handed son. Probably just coincidence but I like to think otherwise.

      If you notice the reference above then it suggests that ker means left handed. I think this is probably a llalands spelling version of the Gaelic as at some point Gaelic was spoken in the borders and further south too. Gaelic was largely erased in the borders and the central belt probably as an aftermath of Culloden, don’t hold me to that though, Mr Peffers might have more info.

    70. Kangaroo says:

      Belgium 1 poms 0 5mins in. Good

    71. Tatu3 says:

      We met some Americans in Scotland on a long dreamed for holiday. Their surname was Kerr, whose ancestors had come from the borders. My mother said to Mr Kerr “you’ll be left handed then”.
      Turns out he was, and seemed to think my mother was some kind of seer!
      This was in the mid 90s and she then went on to tell us about how back in the day, the Kerr’s/Carr’s in the borders being left handed and their staircases going the wrong way and that this helped them in battles.
      Not sure how true, but a good story and impressed the Americans lol.

    72. Chris Cairns says:

      To Katherine Hamilton (and anybody else for that matter) prints (and originals) are available through my website ( It’s a very old collection on there at the moment because I’ve been too lazy and been on too many holidays to update it. But any print can be ordered on request using the email on the website.


    73. Chick McGregor says:

      Trump’s just annoyed that the plan for the UK to become the 51st state has been scuppered by Brexit real politik.

      Never mind, 19th hole is almost as good.

    74. Robert Peffers says:

      @Kangaroo says: 14 July, 2018 at 1:13 pm’:

      ” … The Corrie fisted Borders Clan is Kerr another branch being Ker, both had houses in the Borders Ferniehirst and Cessford (now a single wall ruin). The name is still pronounced “Carr” in the borders, hence Deborah Kerr the actress pronounced Carr.”

      First of all the clan system was the Highlands & Islands. The Borders extended family system was similar but known as Family, not clan and the Ker, Kerr, Carr were all various branches of the same extended families. I have cousins both Kerr & Carr and both trace their roots back to the Kerrs/kers.

      If you study lowland/borders Scots language you will find great variations in the spellings even of surnames. My own family, being farmers, have records going back to the 1600s due to land ownership and/or tenure.

      When tracing the family tree we found there was a gap in the information but after much digging around old parish records the link was found. The early links were from the Tay coast of Fife, at Balmerino, (seat of a now ruined 13 century Abbey). In the records was a birth date for a son with the surname Peffers. The link was the marriage records for a make with the surname spelled differently but with the exact date of birth from a farm in Fife, near Kincardine. Checking other old records there was an amazing number of different spellings. Peffers, Pefers, Pephers and even pfeiffer, (mibbies the German branch of the Family)


      Anyway a bit or research found that in the time when the people were mainly illiterate only the clerics could read & write but there was no standardised spelling. So the parish priest/minister wrote down the name the illiterate person told them verbally and, of course, the teller could not spell their own name. So all the variations of similar sounding names were probably all from the same original family.

    75. Alba 46 says:

      Ronnie Anderson at 2:22

      It doesn’t surprise me that the war graves commission didn’t want to know about any sort of official memorial cemetary at St Valery.
      The evacuation through Dunkirk was an unmitigated disaster for Britain
      although to get 300,000 men out out was a miracle.

      To get so many out has always been portrayed as a great victory but the overall picture the foray into Europe was an unmitigated military disaster.

      To have an official war grave at St Valery would have meant recognising failure and they couldn’t countenance that. After all it was only jocks who Wellington characterised as expendable.

    76. Orri says:

      Doubt the plan has ever been for the UK to become a 51st state as that’d give us input into the the decision making process. Being some kind of protectorate is more like it. A much better arrangement than the EU where we might actually have to negotiate or compromise rather than just leave it all to the big man. At least for some of us.

    77. Les Wilson says:

      Alba 46 says:

      About time the 51st Highland division story came out.

      They held the Germans just long enough for “The Dunkirk miracle” to happen,before running out of ammo, and being surrounded by 3 sides,sea on the other, by German troops and panzers they had no option but to surrender.

      My dad was only 16 years old, having lied about his age, he joined up at 15 years old. So I know very well what happened, they were sacrificed by Churchill to allow as many English troops to evacuate as possible.

      However,my dad escaped after capture, he was recaptured and escaped many times and had many adventures in France, Spain and North Africa. Most were unfortunately taken back to German work factories.

      He got the military medal, from the King at Buckingham palace.
      Was a PTI for a while after that, and when the war was in late stages he ended up being a translator in French
      for the American’s as he had self learned fluent French during his adventures.

      He always said Churchill had a lot to answer for. I look forward to the ch4 documentary to see if some truths are told.

    78. Lenny Hartley says:

      Re 51st Highland Division. May I recommend “Churchill’s sacrifice of the Highland Division” by Saul David for those who want to read an in depth view of the 51st in 1940.
      Looking forward to the Channel 4 program , will be interesting one way or the other!

    79. Petra says:

      Great toon as usual Chris. Spot on.

      Big fearty Trump skitters off surrounded by his many bodyguards, LOL.

      The man that had the cheek to say that John McCain wasn’t a war hero.

      Trump the cowardly draft dodger. Money talks right enough.

    80. frogesque says:


      May contain footie.

      England 0, nil, nowt, f-all gubbed by Belgium. 2

    81. thomas says:

      @ robert peffers

      Hi robert , but the clan system wasnt just the highlands and islands.

      At one point it was all over scotland before retreating to the highlands and islands so that by the mid 18 th century that was all that remained.

      For example the macdowalls are a well known clan from galloway.

      Again , i think your scottish historical perspective is based mainly on pro teutonic and post 14th century rather than the older and larger celtic systems which are the bedrock for much of scotland as we know it.

    82. schrodingers cat says:


      re robert peffers area of interest

      lowlands, lallands, constitutional politics, post 1500,

      there is nothing wrong with that, indeed it fairly normal for historians to prefer certain areas of history.

    83. thomas says:

      And also the link to one of paul kavanghs excellent articles about gaidhlig once being spoken in the borders.

      Where the language was once spoken , so did the culture including the clan system prevail and it wasnt till the introduction of the norman french feudal system that ended this in parts of scotland post 12th century

    84. Hamish100 says:

      Abulhaq says:
      14 July, 2018 at 9:13 am
      Lampooning Trump is fun. He sets himself up for it. However he holds the US presidency. Nicola Sturgeon rather than having a day out in Glasgow might have shown some diplomatic, statesmanlike nous by meeting the guy,

      Aye lets meet someone who detests you, who greets like a wee boy to Teresa May. Looks like Albuhack is not the only comedian around. Maybe he’s really Mundell?

    85. thomas says:

      Hi schrodingers cat.

      Sorry if you are mistaking me but im not saying there is.

      What im saying is robert largely ignores the older celtic traditions and re brands scottish history in a more teutonic fashion for example giving his version of where corrie fisted comes from which i dont agree with , and saying there was no clan system outside the western highlands which isnt true.

      His very own south east of scotland was conquered by gaelic clans which is why it became a part of scotland , and wouldnt be part of scotland today if the likes of kenneth macalpin hasnt invaded south east scotland 6 times and burned dunbar to the ground.

      The great battle at carham entrenched the south east borders as part of gaelic scotland , hence many of the gaelic place names survive today and symeon of durham recorded great gaelic lords ruling as far as the tyne in the late 11th century.

      No offence was certainly intended by saying robert is very pro teutonic in his historical opinion of scotland , im simply offering an alternative to what he is saying.

    86. Kennedy says:


      Hope you do another run on Hamish toys. Let us know. Disappointed I never bought one when they first came out.

    87. schrodingers cat says:


      our understanding of early history in these islands in currently undergoing a complete overhaul. mainly due to genetic testing.

      gaelic is now proposed to be the bronze age language of ireland, scotland, wales, england, france, portugal and galicia.

      the linga franca of the tin trade.

      with the advent of iron, influences from greece and turkey were responsable for the change from q celtic to p celtic in the area we call today france.

      from 500bc onwards, tribes of gauls and belgians invaded britain, bringing p celtic and early germanic belgian to these islands. This early germanic language was confined mainly in the southeast but also into the lowlands of scotland.

      see dunfries, river Aa, torwald etc. in irish and scots early manuscripts they are refered to as belg, (firbolg) and laterly as saxobrit
      cf, Selgovae with Belgovae

      this very early germanic introduction to lowland scotland is possibly an early precursor of what we now recognise as scots(lallans)

    88. Greannach says:

      Òran Bagraidh is a poem about some of the Gaelic clans in the southwest, but so many texts have been lost that we have little documentary evidence of the nature of society in the southeast of the country. Place-name evidence from the southeast shows the presence of Gaelic communities there too.

    89. ALANM says:

      The Scottish first minister led Scotland’s largest ever LGBT event in Glasgow this afternoon. Leaves me wondering where was oor Ruthie when all this was happening? Trump Turnberry perhaps?

    90. haudonthenoo says:

      BBC news going the extra 500 miles today to talk down Nicola and the Scottish Government (yes really). Spending more time on that than talking about the ginger baboon playing golf.

    91. thomas says:

      @ greannach

      Thanks for that pal.

      I think a lot of the problem was the norman french takeover in the lowlands circa 12th century during the davidian revolution , which resulted in kings like william the lion becoming more french than the french , then the subsequent language change to english 14th century onwards by the nobility and administration led to gaelic being marginalised.

      By the reformation a pro english group came to power in edinburgh intent on preparing scotland for union ,the persecution of the gaidhlig language and culture intensified and the destruction of much of scottish historical records by both the english and anglified scots left us with the confusion and ignorance we have today , and the two nation myth of scotland.

    92. Effijy says:

      Best Trump Protest Banner Proclaimed:

      “We have enough Orange Bigots of our Own”.

      Thank Scotland’s God that we only need to listen to English Football Commentators one more time now that they are OUT of the World Cup.

      We just need to hear how great they are before the France Vs Croatia Final, at Half Time, and of course after the match.

      They are the strangest nation on earth!
      After they had been well beaten by tiny Belgium, their commentator put forward that everyone in England would have settled for 4th Place at the beginning of the tournament??

      I though hearing “Its coming home every 2 minutes for weeks on end, and words like “We are going to win this, “This Cup is Ours”, etc seem to contradict that fallacy.

      The English don’t even know what they were saying, but not to worry, the are going to win the European Championships in 2 year time and the world cup in 4 years time??

      Are Belgium, France and Croatian not being allowed to enter?

    93. Maria F says:

      The arrogant expression of Trump in that cartoon is a masterpiece!

    94. Capella says:

      Kudos to Nicola Sturgeon for standing up for human rights and shunning the vulgar individual who occupies the White Hose currently.

      He would be better employed memorising the words of his own Statue of Liberty which welcomed countless immigrants to the US, including his own mother and grandfather:

      Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
      With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
      Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
      A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
      Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
      Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
      Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
      The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
      “Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
      With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
      Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
      The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
      Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
      I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

    95. Thepnr says:

      New poll tomorrow for the Observer has the Tories dropping 6% and UKIP rising 5%. Nobody could have seen that coming LOL.

      The latest Opinium poll for the Observer puts Labour on 40%, the same score as last month, but four points ahead of the Tories who have dropped by six points since early June to 36%. The fall in Tory support would appear to be the result of Conservative supporters who backed leaving the EU turning to Ukip, whose support has shot up by 5pts from 3% last month to 8%.

      May’s leadership ratings have also nosedived, while those of Jeremy Corbyn have remained stable. May’s net approval rating – when the number of people who disapprove of the way she is leading the country is subtracted from the number who approve – has tumbled from -8% in June to -24% over a turbulent political period of just five weeks.

      She is now well behind Corbyn who is on -12%, little changed from -13% last month.

    96. Phil says:

      And I was looking forward to Saturday and inevitable toon of The Great Bluster meeting our local District Commissioner. And thank you Chris there it is. Now – the feather be-decked pith helmet our DC rightfully deserves? Don’t try to tell me that colonialism has died out. We see it day-in, day-out emerging from the Westshambles Parliament.

    97. Maria F says:

      Abulhaq says:
      14 July, 2018 at 9:13 am
      “Nicola Sturgeon rather than having a day out in Glasgow might have shown some diplomatic, statesmanlike nous by meeting the guy”

      The “guy” did not come to Scotland in official business, but rather to enjoy himself. The guy came to play golf in his property, not to be bothered with more official visits. So let him play golf and amuse himself.

      Now, the question really for me is what on earth Mundell was doing tagging along. He is just an MP. He is not a member of the Government of Scotland. Was he invited to play golf and make a fool of himself? was he sent by her English masters to finish the “negotiation” that clearly May didn’t finish? or rather he invited himself to make trump feel “welcome” and give his own Britnat interpretation of current Scotland’s business?

      Isn’t fascinating that none of the English tory imperial masters felt in a position of strength to come up here, strut their stuff in our country and continue the back-licking of the POtUS?

    98. ronnie anderson says:

      There needs to be a public inquire into why the LGBT rally appointed Nicola Sturgeon as Honour’y Presidency when there’s Mundell / Ruthie / Dugdale to choose from within the LGBT community , might be because there’s nae expenses tae claim LoL .

      Ah widve included wee Wullie Rennie in the above but as wee aw know he’s ah fanny oanyhows .

    99. schrodingers cat says:

      long post for a warm lazy sat evening

      thomas says:

      What im saying is robert largely ignores the older celtic traditions and re brands scottish history in a more teutonic fashion
      no, he merely points to the time period in history which he is interested in, where such terms were in use. i find no fault in the points he made. Culturally and genetically, Robert is probably as “celtic” as any highlander. so are most englishmen btw

      for example giving his version of where corrie fisted comes from which i dont agree with ,
      i know this as corrieducht and the word ducht (sp) is the same word the americans use when they say, put your “dooks up”
      it is of germanic (anglo saxon/belg) origin

      and saying there was no clan system outside the western highlands which isnt true.

      I agree with this. the clan system (clann=children) is a tribal/familiar/pateral/matriarchal system. It was once the basis for society across the whole of europe. it isnt a highland invention, it was the result of social evolution across the world.

      as such, it was as much an anglosaxon lowlands cultural meme as it was a highland gaelic one. the difference being that due to scotlands isolation and remoteness, this type of society endured much longer here, and in some parts (macphees and other tinkers) still endures today.

      eg, anglosaxon (scots/lallans) communities in lowland scotland in the 5th,6th,7th,8th centuries were just as clannish as highlanders, feasting halls, champions portions etc, even their ornamentation is now termed celtic.

      when comparing these same groups of people in the 15th 16th and 17th century to those in the south of england, they may speak different dialects of the same germanic language, but socially and culturally they are much more like the highland clans than they are londoners.

      isolation, remoteness and living in close proximity to the gaelic highland clans meant they missed out on romanisation, normanisation etc, hence their continued attachment to a clan like society.
      btw, the border reivers were very successful clans

      as to gaelic in the lowlands, as i have pointed out, from 2500-500bc, gaelic was the language of all britain. after the ironage invasion in 500bc, p celtic (gaulish) and germanic (belg) were introduced.

      by 1st century AD when the romans arrived, the southwest of scotland spoke cumbric (belg areas probably spoke a hybrid germanogaulish) but brythonic and cumbric, while being P celtic languages) are far closer to irish and scots gaelic than they are to gaulish

      60% gaulish words are cognate with german
      40% cumbric/brithonic words are cognate with german
      30% of gaelic words are cognate with german

      thats how we know that gaelic split from a common language shared with german about 2000bc and gaulish about 1000 bc. and that P celtic influence in britain is a much later event.

      subsequently, gaelic influence in lowland scotland has ebbed and flowed throughout the centuries, ayrshire and galloway much influenced by irish settlement. kenneth macalpine’s endevours you mentioned also influenced the retention/reintroduction etc of gaelic.

      malcolm canmore’s marriage to queen margaret probably cemented these germanic (lallans/anglosaxon) speaking peoples into the scots identity.

      history isnt a contact sport, but politics is, gaelic and lallans are dying, even the saltire is removed as a brand and denigrated as a separatist symbol by scots unionists.

      People like Robert Peffers, and yourself Thomas,are fighting for the continuation of our varied culture, a deliberately neglected culture, scotland has and has always had a varied culture. all strands should be cherished.

      lallans and gaelic are not dying languages and cultures, they are exterminated languages and cultures.

      there is a difference

    100. ronnie anderson says:

      Capella 6.34 Purloined to share in Yes pages ,ah’ll put it back effter

    101. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Les Wilson @ 16:20:

      They held the Germans just long enough for “The Dunkirk miracle” to happen


      they were sacrificed by Churchill to allow as many English troops to evacuate as possible.

      Sorry Les, I don’t know what your dad told you, but you’re repeating a confusion that has appeared here before.

      There were two actions happening at the time of Dunkirk. The first was the perimeter defence of Dunkirk (and incidentally to that, another “last-ditch” defence, this time of Calais, which could not be withdrawn). These troops were necessarily sacrificed in order to make the withdrawal possible, and knew very well of what they were asked. An unpleasant but necessary military fact of life.

      These actions of the BEF did not involve the 51st (Highland) Division, as some unfortunately seem to persist in believing.

      The second action was that of the Highland Division, an entirely different situation. The Division was under the command of the French Army, and had originally been part of the infantry support of the Maginot Line around the Hackenberg Fortress. Once the panzers broke through to the west of the Maginot defences, the French Army pulled troops back to cover the breach, including the HD. They were in action in defending the Somme and were pushed back with the French.

      Lines-of-communication troops, which included parts of the newly-landed 52nd (Lowland) Division, were withdrawn back to ports such as Dieppe and Le Havre, due to the imminent danger of being cut off. The HD could have done the same, but Churchill ordered it to remain with the French, because he feared that a withdrawal would be further demoralising for the already-demoralised French and give them an excuse to capitulate. So the HD were eventually driven back, still under French command, to the coast much further south (and nowhere near) Dunkirk, where the shoreline is predominantly high cliffs rather than sandy beaches.

      With panzers and field artillery eventually dominating all the high ground, no ship could safely enter the harbour of St.Valery and the HD were trapped with nowhere to go and no relief possible.

      So can we please once-and-for-all bin this “brave defenders of Dunkirk” myth. There were brave defenders of Dunkirk, and thst mustn’t be forgotten either. But it most certainly wasn’t the HD.

      As for the upcoming TV programme, what that is actually about we’ll just have to wait and see. From past experience, the HD might not get even a mention, or only a passing one.

      Lenny Hartley‘s reference is a valuable summary of the entire HD experience in 1940, and well worth a read.

      Incidentally, if any of you care to visit the Hackenberg Fortress, which is near Thionville by the border with Luxembourg and eminently worth a visit, in the museum there, among all the other exhibits, is a mannequin dressed in an HD uniform. So the French there haven’t forgotten us either.

    102. Abulhaq says:

      A golden opportunity was missed with the Trump visit. Scots being so high and mighty, holier than all the rest, how residually Calvinist, in the face of an existential-political ‘challenge’. They are reputed, media stuff, fake news whatever, not to ‘like’ each other, all the more reason to beard the man on home territory, shmooze and enlighten him particularly regarding his ancestry. If world leaders are willing to engage with Trump, why not Sturgeon? She looks petty and conventional, signalling how ‘virtuous’ she/ we all are. Scotland the unbrave? Scotland the going nowhere?. Scotland the snowflake? Scotland the rather pathetic?
      Scotland and its nationalist leaders need to engage with the world as it is, not how they might wish it, in their pink and fluffy dreams, to be.

    103. Croompenstein says:

      Trump is a cunt

    104. thomas says:

      @ schrodingers cat.

      Quite a long post to reply to , especialy in the short format of wings but i will try and answer your main points one by one.

      1.”no, he merely points to the time period in history which he is interested in, where such terms were in use. i find no fault in the points he made.”

      Dont agree. He clearly implied the clann system was highlander only and i disagreed with him. Giving a false interpretation of history does no one any favours and this most certainly was a faulty point made.

      2.”Culturally and genetically, Robert is probably as “celtic” as any highlander. so are most englishmen btw”

      I havent argued any race theories. The celts werent a race as you know they were differing groups of people linked with language and culture.

      3.”i know this as corrieducht and the word ducht (sp) is the same word the americans use when they say, put your “dooks up”
      it is of germanic (anglo saxon/belg) origin”

      never heard the term corrieducht and im from scotlands largest population centre in the central belt.Further all languages borrow especially english so not sure your point . It still doesnt prove roberts theory nor negate mine on the origination of corrie fisted.

      4.”as such, it was as much an anglosaxon lowlands cultural meme as it was a highland gaelic one. the difference being that due to scotlands isolation and remoteness, this type of society endured much longer here, and in some parts (macphees and other tinkers) still endures today.

      eg, anglosaxon (scots/lallans) communities in lowland scotland in the 5th,6th,7th,8th centuries were just as clannish as highlanders, feasting halls, champions portions etc, even their ornamentation is now termed celtic.”

      There were no anglo saxon communites in lowland scotland as a generalisation . There were anglian communities in what is now the south east borders and the south coast of dumfrieshire which were taken by the scandinavians and gaelic scots post 9th century , no one knows what happened to these communities for certain but they most certainly didnt speak a language called scots.

      5.”btw, the border reivers were very successful clans”

      tell robert he says they didnt exist.

      6.”as to gaelic in the lowlands, as i have pointed out, from 2500-500bc, gaelic was the language of all britain. after the ironage invasion in 500bc, p celtic (gaulish) and germanic (belg) were introduced.”

      not sure about that.

      Celtic came to these islands with the urnfield culture sometime between 1200 to 700 bc , king eremon in 1015 bc was listed as the first milesian gaelic king of ireland so surely the original proto celtic never mind gaelic would have came here no earlier than 1200 bc?

      7.”60% gaulish words are cognate with german
      40% cumbric/brithonic words are cognate with german
      30% of gaelic words are cognate with german

      thats how we know that gaelic split from a common language shared with german about 2000bc and gaulish about 1000 bc. and that P celtic influence in britain is a much later event.”

      to be fair mate i think most people into history are familiar with the common origins of europes indo european languages.

      That gaidhlig and english are distantly related doesnt make them the same language so no sure of your point here.

      8.”malcolm canmore’s marriage to queen margaret probably cemented these germanic (lallans/anglosaxon) speaking peoples into the scots identity.”

      you said that to me on here before and i dont agree with that.

      margaret was half hungarian half saxon who spent her formative years growing up in europe and there isnt any evidence she spoke anglo saxon.

      Her brother was rejected by the anglo saxon witan as heir to the english throne because he couldnt speak saxon , and when they fled to scotland very few saxons came north with them.

      Rather than their saxon identity being cemented into scotland , its more likely they were absorbed into gaelic scotland and margaret is mostly famous for changing the traditions of scotlands gaelic church which wsas to flourish for centuries yet.

      King aldfrith of northumbria is a classic example of this , an anglo saxon king brought up at the scottish court. He didnt cement his saxon identity into scottish life , scotlands absorbed him into gaelic life where he became a fluent gaelic speaker and many of his poems are still recorded in gaelic today.

      9.”People like Robert Peffers, and yourself Thomas,are fighting for the continuation of our varied culture,”

      i agree.

      That doesnt mean we cant have a civilised discussion or disagreement over history or politics nor that i cant pick him up on his constant teutonic view of scotland and its history.

    105. ronnie anderson says:

      ABULHAQ Given your name why dont you apply for a visa here

      Mind come back & let us know how U got on lol.

    106. Rick H Johnston says:

      On the subject o the anti trump rally in Edinburgh today.
      Funny how the MSM were falling over themselves to tell us where and when to meet etc.
      Contrast with the Indy rallies where reporting was minimal and begrudged.
      No in street vox pops asking why folk wanted a free Scotland etc.
      Guid tae see pensioners for Indy in the meadows plus the Edinburgh YES hub plus English Scots for Yes etc.
      Guid turn oot but dwarfed by the sheer scale and passion o the YES AUOB rallies.

    107. HandandShrimp says:

      I see Nicola’s Twitter page is a cauldron of hate from our Unionist friends A gem from the Blue Sea of Ibrox…presumably pastor at his local church because no doubt that is exactly what Jesus would have typed.

      What I have noticed with sturgeon she happily goes to every other religion but the Protestant one and that don’t need to be the OO just Protestants in general and the daft cunt talked about equality for everyone in Scotland fucking muppet needs to look at her constituency

      That is relatively mild compared to some of the others. No doubt JK’s staff are working overtime filing this lot in their folder.

    108. Macart says:

      @Capella 6.34

      Post of the day. 🙂

    109. Hamish100 says:


      Is it Rock? Colin Alexander? Either way he is a wee yoony troll for all to see.

    110. Croompenstein says:

      @Macart @8:04

      Aw Sam I thought I’d clinched it @ 7:31… 🙂

    111. Capella says:

      @ ronnie anderson – welks! 🙂

    112. Kennedy says:

      The English fans at my work couldn’t even be bothered watching the game today. Total change from last week when football was coming home.

      If Scotland made it to forth in the world we would be celebrating for a week. With the Belgian fans.

    113. sandy says:

      Croopenstein 7.31

      Abulhaq appears to be the same.

    114. Macart says:


      It was a close run thing. 😀

    115. Iain_mhor says:

      Not sure why people are getting in a right fankle about who should meet Trump. He’s been here several times before, it’s not his first visit.
      He’s met The First Minister before, Alex before her and had plenty of discussions with MSP’s. Though oddly never needed a mad cavalcade before.

      That fucking arsehole Obama was here too if anyone remembers. A round of golf, a statement that Scotland should not seek independence (he was very much against it) and then a jaunt over to Estonia – There to make a proclamation praising a small nation’s independence on its anniversary and how successful small independent nations were and it’s such a great thing being independent, everyone should try it (he is all for it) Except Scotland though, Scotland can go fuck itself.

      Quite frankly, I have heehaw regard for any of the retarded fuckwit American Presidents who come here. They can holiday and golf all they want. But once you’ve met one and realised he’s a retarded fuckwit you’re not in a hurry to meet him again. No-one from Scotland’s Parliament who has met him previously was in a tearing rush to waste time on him.
      Why would they? Has anyone actually listened to his previous statements to Scotland’s elected politicians? Away and dig them out. Quite frankly The First Minister is acting in the height of diplomacy, for the simple fact there was no official statement telling him to get himself hunted.

    116. lumilumi says:

      Great cheers to the holiday boy, he’s once again produced a brilliant cartoon.

      Spare a thought to us Finns. After the tangerine tube leaves you, he’ll come to our smallish independent country to meet Putin.

      After Trump and Putin said they want to have a f2f meeting in Helsinki, Finland, most of ordinary Finns go ‘oh shit, we don’t want either of them here’. But you can’t really say no… So these two near dictators are going to mess all Helsinki traffic, and some supine journalist and YLE (our public broacaster) will be having a hard on about having these two near dictators in our city. Never a nary opposing view will be allowed to get out…

      Send the Trump baby balloon here, we need it. We also need a Putin balloon, but he’s no baby.

      Jaysis, the world is one scary place. I grew up during the Cold War, I was young when the Berlin Wall fell, when Gorbatchev ended the Cold war, hopeful, free, all was great in the 1990s. Now we’re back to the old bunker mentality.

      *bangs head on wall*

    117. Capella says:

      @ Macart – aw shucks 🙂

    118. Macart says:


      “Jaysis, the world is one scary place. I grew up during the Cold War, I was young when the Berlin Wall fell, when Gorbatchev ended the Cold war, hopeful, free, all was great in the 1990s. Now we’re back to the old bunker mentality.”

      I hear that lumi and ditto. Forehead near permanently bruised after the past few years tbh.

    119. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Did anyone else hear that wee slice of snideyness on Shereen’s show this morning?

      Twas Tom Harris along with the other guests and they were discussing Trump, the demos etc. Other male guest said something about how he’d probably be joining the demos if he was younger (no idea what age he is) and later, Harris said he’d also have participated ‘if younger’. Shereen stepped in, asking ‘what is this about age? what’s that got to do with it?’ whereupon the guest who wasn’t Harris referred to David Mamet and quoted him, saying ‘if you don’t protest before you’re 30 you don’t have a heart…if you protest after you’re 30 you don’t have a brain.’ Cue much laughter from all present…

      We’ve discussed this programme before right here and there have been suggestions that Shereen’s show is more-or-less ‘scripted’. I’m wondering if that wee exchange this morning is a reaction to the very obvious prevalence of older citizens on, e.g. the AUOB marches?

    120. Rock says:

      Ghillie says:
      14 July, 2018 at 9:47 am

      “Nicola Sturgeon is showing the world it IS possible to be true to your beliefs and to have integrity, even in the highest positions in politics.”

      “True to your beliefs” like standing “shoulder to shoulder” with Saint Theresa and the “ghastly” Boris Johnson as they declared war on Russia after a false flag operation?

    121. Rock says:

      ronnie anderson says:
      14 July, 2018 at 7:32 pm

      “ABULHAQ Given your name why dont you apply for a visa here”

      Hypocrites complaining about President Trump being racist, what do you have to say about ronnie anderson’s comment?

    122. Rock says:

      Clydebuilt says:
      14 July, 2018 at 9:45 am

      “The BBC snd CH4 are interviewing anti Trump protestors, BBC radio Scotland are advertising the time and place of the Demos.”

      The majority of posters here are on the same side as the BBC and CH4 regarding President Trump.

      The same anti-SNP, anti-Scotland, anti-independence BBC and CH4.

      Gullible idiots.

      No wonder Scotland is still a colony of England after 311 years when the poorest countries in Africa got rid of their English masters in less than a 100 years.

    123. Rock says:

      lumilumi says:
      14 July, 2018 at 8:41 pm

      “After Trump and Putin said they want to have a f2f meeting in Helsinki, Finland, most of ordinary Finns go ‘oh shit, we don’t want either of them here’”

      100% populist fake news.

      Have you got any opinion poll supporting this?

      What is wrong with Presidents Trump and Putin trying to achieve better relations between their countries and in the wider world?

      The neocons and Scotland’s English masters obviously don’t want that.

      Interesting to see so many Scottish independence supporters on the same side as Saint Theresa and the neocons.

    124. ronnie anderson says:

      9.47 U never know Abulhaq might want to visit Vegas but ah widnae put ah bet on him getting ah visa

    125. Bobp says:

      Ronnie anderson. No, he might get a cage.

    126. PacMan says:

      There have been far worse leaders who have visited the UK than Trump and have attracted similar, if not bigger protests.

      Strange how they don’t seem to attract as much media attention as Trump currently has over the past couple of days?

    127. Bobp says:

      Pacman.maybe its because they didnt want to privatise our NHS
      or sell us chlorinated chicken.

    128. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Okay…own up…

      Who gave Rock the blue Smarties?

    129. sassenach says:

      I wonder if we clubbed together and bought some ‘Immodium’, it might just help Rock (and Abulhaq)?

    130. Fred says:

      Calvin has been a fuckin irrelevance in Scotland for quite some time, ask 100 people on Buchanan Street about Calvin & they’d answer Klein.

      Alex Salmond did indeed engage with Trump & that of course ended badly. Humiliated Theresa May should have told the Potus to fuck-off & save what’s left of her reputation.

    131. ian says:

      A bit of topic but i had a rather disheartening exoerience
      today and then an hour later a more uplifting one and all to do with independence in a small town in the middle of the limousin france(eymoutier).I was working at a car boot/market and was speaking to two couples(scottish)who have holiday homes in the town and the subject got round to independence.The two woman were unbelievably hostile towards nicola sturgeon and therefore independence the two guys were very quiet.Although i live in France i am a memeber of the SNP and made it clear i would be backing her decisions.I also said if i had known then what a i know now i would have stayed in Scotland.I would also never move back to the UK as things one of the woman seemed to be anti eu also.There was a defenite cooling of the conversation after that and they moved on.
      It left me on a bit of a downer so my daughter and boyfriend turned up and i went for a walk.I then bumped into a couple a scottish guy and his wife who was northern Irish and they were all for independence.We had a good chat about various aspect of the independence movement,economy,history ect and it lifted the spirits no end.Its very clear we are fighting over 10-15% of the population as both sides are very deeply entrenched and are not for changing.
      It was a bit sqtrange as i have lived in France for nearly ten years and have only met Scottish people at this particular market and the majority of woman have been very hostile re independence and the guys very quiet.

    132. ronnie anderson says:

      Ian Brotherhood it wiznae me it must hiv been ah big boy an he’s run away

    133. Bobp says:

      Ian. Any scots indy supporter would be shouting it from the rooftops to a fellow nationalist. These ‘quiet’ guys are obviously castrated follow the unionist wife sorts.

    134. Capella says:

      @ Ian – I know people who have holiday homes in France similar to those you describe. They have done well out of the Thatcher reforms. They do not want to contemplate higher taxes, especially tax on investments or property.

      It used to be called an “I’m all right, Jack” attitude. That was when we used to think selfishness was a bad thing. Some of us still do value community cohesion above individual get-rich-quick greed.

    135. Bobp says:

      Ian. And it will be interesting to see after brexit if these union loving wives will find it so easy to go to french car boot sales after brexit.

    136. Bobp says:

      IN. Then again they will be like the sly sleekit minority of scots brexiteers who go abroad and tell everyone, we voted to remain”.cowardly lying sh””e. Who will tell us all after indy. Oh i voted yes.

    137. Bobp says:

      In..should be ian. Apologies.

    138. highseastim says:

      The cartoon says to me ” two cheeks of the same arse coming together with an incredible stench of bullshit”. I’m still amazed at where all the Tories have sprung from as two days in a row Radio Scotland could not get one Tory the length and breadth of the land to go on radio and discuss the “dirty money” scandal, then silence from the “hate” party when their core voters decided to confront and abuse worshippers during one of the hate marches.

    139. lumilumi says:

      @ Rock, 9.22pm 14.7.2018


      You know nothing about Finnish history or our present politics or mindset, so do not patronisingly tell us what’s what. Just pipe down, aye.

      “What is wrong with Presidents Trump and Putin trying to achieve better relations between their countries and in the wider world?”

      Let me tell you something. We have a fucking 1000 mile fucking land border with Russia. I find all the Brit scare stories about big bad Russia laughable. You have no idea. That’s why tablod press can whip up all kinds of frenzy, to hide domestic problems.

      Anyway, back in the late 1930s Hitler and Stalin divvied up the “buffer states”. My country was supposed to be for the Soviet Union (Russia), only, they couldn’t take it, thanks to those pesky Finns who defended their own independent country.

      Do you see why a Finn might still feel a bit wary when two fascist superpower leaders meet in my country. Not just any superpower leaders but these particular ones. One is wily, essentially a dictator, basing his power in nostalgia, popularism, nationalism, and pseudo-democracy; and the other one is the same, except stupid.

    140. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Ronnie Anderson –

      Or maybe we could lob them some Viagra, then they’ll not bother us, at least for a wee while…

    141. Thepnr says:


      Well said, you put him in his place, he’s clueless at the best of times, just ignore his ignorance.

    142. Bobp says:

      O/t I see tory business minister andrew griffiths has resigned after sending lewd texts to two female constituents.details to follow tomorrow on the ebc and the “scottish” meedja .lol. Thank f**k it was’nt an snp member.they’d be getting the rack ready.

    143. mr thms says:

      lumilumi @ 11:21 pm

      Funny and scary at the same time

    144. Ken500 says:


      26Million Russians died

      83,000 Finns

      Since 1980/90’s Glasnost/Perestroika. Gorbachev/Yeltsin/Putin the Russia (USSR) pop has halved, 150Million people have gone to self governance and self determination. Latvia, Poland, Lithuania, Romania, Ukraine, Bulgaria, other eastern bloc states. German unification. All helped by the EU. The Russian (USSR) pop has halved. It was 300Million (on par with US). Now the Russian pop is 150Million. Putin has increased prosperity and reduced poverty. He is extremely popular in Russia with rating of 80% because of it.

      Trump and Putin are meeting to try and stop and cut nuclear proliferation. Cut NATO weapons on the Russian borders. Threatening Russia. Trump wants to cut the US Defence spending. The highest in the world (pro rata) and unaffordable. The UK/US and France have been bombing the Middle East for years. Reneging on promises. Illegally killing and maiming millions of people. On Russian borders. Causing chaos. Causing the worse migration crisis and human misery since the 11WW. Destabilising the world and costing £Billions.

      Defence spending

      Saudi Arabia (33 million pop) $66Billion
      US (328 million pop) $611Billion

      China (1.3Billion pop) $228Billion
      Russia (150Million pop) $69Billion

      UK (66Million pop) $47Billion Shared Defence cuts with the EU saved £Billions,

    145. Hamish100 says:


      Your obvious love of Putin has clouded your judgement on most other things/. As for defence spending some will be based on perceived threat either internally or externally.

      Please stop telling us how many people were killed in WW2 in the Soviet Union . We know the human sacrifice of individuals and the extreme measures the soviets put in place to ensure victory. We know Stalin murdered millions of his own people and had a peace pact with the Nazis.
      Putin and Trump are dangerous but they fear China more.

    146. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      I think what Sturgeon chose to do with the pride rally was quite good. I mean, it’s just a game, but this way I get to infer that she thinks Trump’s beneath her, which he is. He’s beneath everyone, but that’s beside the point.

    147. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      It wouldn’t matter if Nicola had met with him, anyway. He’s only got eyes for one man.

    148. Croompenstein says:


    149. Petra says:

      Bottom line is that Trump, the most powerful person in the world, is a TOTAL IGNORAMUS. So how do we all get round this?

      TAKE NOTE FOLKS. He knows nought about history: And he knows nought about geography (hence not knowing where and whom he is bombing for whatever reason).

      He knows nought about ANYTHING at all. Seemingly he is incapable of reading in fact. Aspergers? Whatever the case God give me strength.

      His eyes are on making a financial deal and on rooting out beautiful women. Grab their you know whats. Twenty years of ruling the roost over the Miss Universe pageants. The pageants included Miss USA and Miss Teen USA. Say no more.

      Here we have it. An absolute MORON is now ruling the world.

      He has no compassion for the suffering or the dispossessed, even although his ancestry (four grandparents and his mother) and two of his three wives came from elsewhere. He’s a blinkered bl**dy moron.

      Mrs May leader at Westminster is now on her knees to him (and continues to hold his VERY WEE hand). The erseh*le. Begging him. Please Donald give us your chlorinated chicken, beef full of hormones and destroy our NHS. Please Donald. Do it. Tell us how to cage children too. Use aluminium foil? Cheap or what?

      So what do we do now folks?


      If you voted NO before do your homework and help us to get out of this.


    150. Cactus says:

      How is it that auld golfin’ saying goes again…

      You drive for show
      You putt for dough

      Notice there doesn’t appear to be a putter in DT’s collection.

      There’ll be an analogy in there somewhere…

      Mundell the Mulligan.

    151. Cactus says:

      Maybe the nasty man will putt by playing Mundell like SO:

      Just like the purple beastie.

      Golf, croquet?

    152. cearc says:


      I don’t think he would manage croquet, far too complicated a game.

    153. Tom says:

      Just to say, I went to the demo in Edinburgh. Thoroughly enjoyed it. The other thing I enjoyed was reading that whenever his Trumpness is on the phone to Theresa, they can’t discuss anything serious as he spends all his time moaning about Nicola Sturgeon.

    154. Fred says:

      Whit a Roaster, Liam Fox from E.K (to E.K’s embarrassment) castigates anti-Trump demonstrators. A crook & tosspot who should have been jailed. A man who tells lies about his age will lie about anything!

    155. Dorothy Devine says:

      Big coverage in the Guardian ‘ close to ten thousand people” marched agin’ Trump in Edinburgh – I’m sure there was another march on another day which had somewhat greater numbers which the Guardian didn’t bother covering.

      I wonder what Trump thought of the Sec. of State Against Scotland.

    156. ahundredthidiot says:

      Liam Fox saying the protesters were an embarrassment to themselves.

      Trump is a divisive figure, a strategy which is working for him so far and someone who is used to protests against him, so I don’t think the Don will be too bothered.

      Now, I hate to get personal, but I know some good EK people who are actually related to Liam Fox by blood, and believe me, they are embarrassed about that.

    157. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      It should be remembered that it was actually Jack McConnell that had a “cosy” relationship with Donald Trump which Alex Salmond inherited. That didn’t last long.

    158. galamcennalath says:

      Kenny MacAskill in the Herald …

      “… an early second referendum on independence is even less likely than one on Brexit. The Tories won’t allow it and after Catalonia any attempts to circumvent Westminster consent are doomed to fail.”

      That’s a rather depressing view of Scotland’s situation! Needless to say I disagree and hope Nicola does too.

    159. Breeks says:

      Keep saying it. Trump is a confidence trickster. He is a chameleon who can change his colour in a flash. He can be blunt and disorientating to suddenly become mellow, or disarming and affable then suddenly ruthless when it comes to the take down. He is the epitome of a wheeler dealer who belongs in a used car lot or an estate agents, but somehow he has scammed his way into the job of US President.

      I am absolutely no fan whatsoever of Hillary Clinton, but nobody has summed Trump up more succinctly than she did when she Tweeted that you shouldn’t give the Nuclear red button to somebody you can bait on Twitter.

      Trump is popular with the US rednecks who buy into his Farage style populism and appeal to the more bass human instincts of fear, hatred and mistrust. Trump needs an enemy or his modus operandi simply doesn’t work. Without creating a bad guy, he has no leverage. He is a living caricature of Orwell’s Big Brother Organisation in 1984, – there is always an enemy, but it doesn’t matter who the enemy is, or even if they are real. It is a necessary component for mass control of the people.

    160. Ken500 says:

      Some people have difficulty with facts. Would rather believe Murdoch and the right wing Press and start world War 111. Stalin 1930 to 1950. Try living in the present. Stop harping back to other times. Instead of living in the past. The UK has been killing and maiming millions and destabilising the world, More than Russia or China where they are trying to improve their economy. Take people out of poverty which they have done.

      Why would anyone fear China? They are not the warmongers. The US/UK and France have been for the last 100 years, they have cause the conflicts in the Middle East etc. It is just appalling what they have been doing and the effect There is no excuse. China has been invaded twice. By Britain and Japan.

      Trump wants better relations with Russia, China etc. If he can succeed or the regime M15 and CIA will not let it happen. CIA/FBI being called out in the US. For their criminal activities. The worst surveillance in the world. Clinton et al were acting as mercenaries in the Middle East for the Saudis for money. The most absolute despot monarchy in the world. Along with the apartheid State The Balfour Agreement. Trying to deflect from that. Churchill was stealing Iranian Oil in the 1950’s. Put the PM who wanted a share in jail and restored the Shah.

      All US Presidents have been crooks Hypocrites and niot what they seem. Same as in the UK. Westminster crooks. They are the worst. Killing and maiming millions. Right on Russian borders. If Clinton was President there would be more conflict on the Russian borders. Along with Johnston. That imbecile. That did not happen because Trump did not go along with it. Going for talks instead.

      Putin supported Scottish Indepenence. Having supported the Indepenence and self determination of millions of others. Did not go along with Cameron’s’ lies and deceit. Cameron and his cronies caused all the Brexit mess. They are sanctioning and starving people in the UK. People are being denied food and dying. The basic human rights. The should be marching about that. Westminster unionists caused the migration into Europe and the human misery. Then used it to cause Brexit. The enemy is within.

      Trump is a convenient distraction from it and could be gone within three years, The unionists could still be causing trouble for ever after. If they had more migrants coming to the UK. It is because the Westminster unionists caused it. They are responsible but deny people their basic human rights. They are despicable. Migrant and refugees are treated badly in the UK. Kept detained in cages for years. Citizens are being deported illegally. It is about time the Scottish courts started dealing and preventing it. They have recently. Trump’s ‘crimes’ are nothing compared to other US President’s who have been lauded. Complete lying hypocrites. Kennedy who illegally dumped nuclear on Scotland, Two Bush Reagan, Clinton, Obama et al. All of them just as bad but lauded.

    161. bjsalba says:


      I cannot find the actual wording as most reports of Liam Fox select bits.

      I heard a clip in which he described Trump as the “leader of the western world”.

      I snorted at that one. Leaders who harangue, berate and tell lies and then deny they said them do not lead for long.

    162. ronnie anderson says:

      Marr on Sunday with Tereza May .

      Much of the White paper/Common Rule book is from the Mansion House speech ( which was rejected by the EU) . Whats that you say, keep making the same mistakes hoping for a different outcome.

      Hurry up Nicola, the longer we stay in Bedlam the more likelihood we’ll end up mental ourselves .

    163. yesindyref2 says:

      I think those big inflatable Trump babies are ridiculous, so does my wife, and neither of us know what they’re supposed to mean. And if I was a protest attending type that would have put me off going. They’re just childish to anyone who doesn’t understand their significance, and that’s me and persumably a lot of other people since generally I’m politically aware.

      Whether I’m right or wrong, and Trump in himself is largely an irrelevance to getting a YES vote, it’s a message WE need to keep in mind – themes, tropes, memes whatever, are all very well to those in the know, the few thousands, but others take them at face value only. Hamish for instance is great, he’s staring at me as I’m typing this wondering what I’m on about noo, but nobody outside of Wings would understand why!

    164. galamcennalath says:

      Saw this tweet on WoS twitter. It sums up everything which is wrong with journalism right now, and how to get it right!

      Sally Claire
      My fave tutor at uni had a great journalism 101 lesson: “If someone says it’s raining & another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. Your job is to look out of the f**king window and find out which is true.”

    165. yesindyref2 says:

      Jings, see how easy it is to give the wrong idea. In the context of Chris Cairns’s cartoon, Hamish is perfect along with John Bull, I think everyone would get the significance easily, and a picture as they say tells a thousand words.

      But stuck on my desk?

      I need another cuppa tea.

    166. Robert Peffers says:

      @thomas says: 14 July, 2018 at 5:00 pm:

      ” … Hi robert , but the clan system wasnt just the highlands and islands.
      At one point it was all over scotland before retreating to the highlands and islands so that by the mid 18 th century that was all that remained.”

      Indeed so but the Celts were themselves immigrants – or were they?

      The aboriginal residents in what became Scotland were the Stone Age peoples who once lived where what is now the North Sea now is. We call it Doggerland. It was originally claimed they were only wandering Hunter Gatherers who wandered North in Summers and wandered back south in Winters but as the Ice Age retreated north they remained in the North.

      Problem with that theory is the discovery of large permanent settlements like those discovered at Howick in Northumberland. The Hunter Gatherers co-existed with the first farmers who settled down and farmed.

      The other problem with the older theories is that the Celts really didn’t eradicate those aboriginal Britons as our gene pool is mainly from the aboriginal Britons. The Celts didn’t invade but came as mainly teachers and religious preachers and we know them as the early saints. The native Britons adopted their language and their culture and the so called Celts are the actually the aboriginal Britons. Those early Celtic Saints were Holy men and many are known to be celibate and lived as hermits.

      An amazing discovery was made near the Howick archaeological dig. A local genetics test found a local woman who was directly descended from remains dug up at the Howick Stone Age settlement. Just think on that for a moment – her family had been living in the local area since the Stone age.

      Modern archaeology is finding evidence that proves beyond doubt that what has been taught as our history in the past is bunk and history teaching hasn’t quite caught up with the real facts as yet.

      Just yesterday I came across an item on the internet quoting from an English newspaper. It was claiming the, “Amazing”, findings that, in their local area there were two women who had paid for personal genetic tests in an effort to discover their family origins. They were, “Amazed”, to find they were not genetically “English”, but descended from Native North Americans yet as far as their family history went back they were English.

      There were no theories offered as to how that could be. Yet a survey carried out in the Scottish Northern Isles some time ago had found a fair percentage of Native North American genes in the gene pool. There, though, there was a ready and proven explanation. The Hudson Bay Company in Canada had recruited, “Bay Boys”, in the Scottish islands for a very long time.

      “The Governor and Company of Adventurers of England Trading into Hudson’s Bay was incorporated on 2 May 1670, with a royal charter from King Charles II.”

      Now “Bay Boys”, were not invaders of North America who attempted to kill off the native Americans. They converted the natives to Christianity, married native American wives and it is historic fact that when a Bay Boy died in North America the Hudson Bay Company sent their wives and Children, “Home”, to their families in Britain — to a land they knew nothing about and in the Scottish Northern Isles these family members history was recorded.

      That is just one likely explanation for the, “English”, women of North American descent. However, there were many other examples of native North American’s being brought to Britain since the Americas were colonised. Some old teachings have been proven to be claptrap but the old teachings are hard to eradicate even among academics.

    167. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      @ Breeks: “…somehow he has scammed his way into the job of US President.”

      I like to think it’s more of a booby prize, or even a non-refusable favour in lieu of paying what he owes after a life of monumentally expensive depravity.

      Naughty kids’ bedtime warnings will never be the same again.

      “If you don’t behave, one day you might be the POTUS.”

    168. Maria F says:

      Abulhaq says:
      “Scotland and its nationalist leaders need to engage with the world”

      What makes you think they are not?
      From where I am standing, there is much more to the world than Trump.

    169. PacMan says:

      Bobp says: 14 July, 2018 at 9:50 pm

      Pacman.maybe its because they didnt want to privatise our NHS or sell us chlorinated chicken.

      if so, given the level of coverage over all the political spectrum of the media, that is telling.

    170. jfngw says:

      Interesting how Labour and Tories are now so interested in devolving power down from Holyrood to more local power. Being cynical it crosses my mind is that they can’t get into power at Holyrood but can work together at local level to thwart the SNP, as is being proven across Scotland currently.

      Also it is not being more democratic as the turnout at local elections is woeful. This is how you have parties like UKIP gaining some power, lack of interest by majority, minority get votes out, you end up with an extremist MEP.

    171. galamcennalath says:

      Read the same story at several sources and still don’t understand what TMay is supposed to be saying!

      She has warned Tory rebels seeking to derail her latest cherry picking plan, that they could be left with “no Brexit at all”.

      To me that reads like she is threatening to simply cancel Brexit.

      But no, I suspect she means a no deal Brexit.

      FFS!! Does that mean she is actually threatening them with the very thing they want!?

      My own brain really hurts trying to understand the workings of Tory brains!

      This latest plan, does anyone think it can be anything more that a rough starting point as far as the EU is concerned. It certainly isn’t an acceptable nor workable plan. So why is TMay getting away with her stance? Marr should have torn her to shreads (to use the language of the Express) this morning. Yet he took her seriously.

    172. Brian Powell says:


      I’m trying to work out why Kenny MacAskill would say that, what purpose he has in saying it. He has turned into another Jim Sillar, there is no direction in his arguments.

    173. yesindyref2 says:

      Dodo: a large extinct flightless bird with a stout body, stumpy wings, a large head, and a heavy hooked bill. It was found on Mauritius until the end of the 17th century

      Tory brains: see Dodo

    174. Abulhaq says:

      What might have been had wisdom and Scottish practical common sense prevailed.

      Scotland’s First Minister Nicola Sturgeon received the President of the United States Donald Trump at Bute House, the First Minister’s official residence.
      The communiqué issued after the private meeting described the encounter as an animated exchange of views on matters such as world trade and immigration. The First Minister made a strong case for Scottish independence which the President listened to with interest particularly given his Mother’s Scottish heritage.
      The First Minister presented the President with gifts reflecting the Gaelic culture of Scotland which now enjoys support from the Scottish government after centuries of neglect.
      The US President’s next meeting is with the Russian President Vladimir Putin in Helsinki.

    175. Brian Powell says:


      If power was devolved from Holyrood to Councils, the Councils would be sitting ducks for control from Westminster.

      But of course as with all things Labour can’t see what’s coming.

    176. jfngw says:

      @Brian Powell

      I’m not convinced Labour would care, Holyrood was designed to be their fiefdom. It didn’t work out as planned, they’re looking for another plan.

    177. Capella says:

      @ Galamcennalath – is Kenny McKaskill one of the small select band of “former” SNP ministers (plus Jim Sillars) who are MSM favourites when an anti independence/SNP quote is needed? Which is an everyday occurrence.

      Or is he acting as a “lightning rod” as Alex Neil was doing during the last election campaign, i.e. expressing a contrary view?

      Don’t see why they can’t just ask the present incumbents for an opinion, or would that grant them the “oxygen of publicity” (Thatcher’s phrase).

      Radio Scotland is on full damage control today casting slurs on Nicola Sturgeon as Health Minister not implementing a Labour report on reforming the SNHS along the lines of the English reforms.
      Good luck with that one.

    178. ahundredthidiot says:


      Once Scotland is independent and we receive POtUS on an official state visit, that may well be the case.

      For now though NS position is on the money

    179. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      There is much that is puzzling about Kenny McAskill and it goes back a long way.

    180. Ken500 says:

      The unionists councils are part of the problem. They have their own agenda. To mispend public money like the is no tomorrow. Then blame others. Borrowing and spending and getting into debt. Mismanaged public money. Wasting it. Building offices and shops and underoccupied hotels. When there are shops and offices already sitting empty. Instead of building houses and schools. Cutting funds allocated to public services to waste on groteque monstrosities of no value. Totally against public wishes. They are a disgrace and part of the problem. They have created. They just want more public money to be wasted against the public wishes. Giving them even more control will be a disaster. Putting homeless in prison rather than building affordable house etc. Costs more.

      The Westminster unionists mismanaging Scottish funds, revenue and taxes. Ruining the Oil & Gas, fishing, farming and other sectors. Wasting Scottish revenues on illegal wars, nuclear and gross mismanagement. Costing Scotland £Billions and thousands of jobs. Sanctioning and starving people. Just appalling. Denying people the basic right to food and shelter.

      Trump was on a private visit. That is why Nicola did not need to meet him. Get over it.

    181. Capella says:

      From Stu’s twitter – comment on BBC Scotland dredging up an ancient health report to smear the FM:

    182. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      The MSM,the unionist establishment and their representatives like Rock and Abulhaq are losing this current debate big time.

    183. Robert Peffers says:

      @thomas says: 14 July, 2018 at 6:24 pm:

      ” … I think a lot of the problem was the norman french takeover in the lowlands circa 12th century during the davidian revolution … “

      Let’s just get this correct, Thomas. I’m not the one attempting to compartmentalise Scottish history to one particular time period to suit a particular theory.

      I’m the one looking at the whole and complete, (as far as can be currently proven), picture. There are several, already disproven older theories that just do not hold up under current evidence.

      I’ll briefly highlight some. “The Scots really are Irish”?

      Yet more recent archaeological digs on the more difficult to get to Sea Stacks and the harder to access Scottish Islands have found artefacts that pre-date those from Ireland that the, “Scots came from Ireland”, theory was based upon. Carbon dating does not lie.

      The more reasonable theory is the common sense one that, as the seas and rivers were the superhighways of the times, the Tribes known as the Scots lived all around the shores of what we now call the Irish Sea and they then penetrated inland through the dense, almost impenetrable, Great Caledonian Forest that was the natural environment that covered the whole of Scotland.

      The existence of the very large, “Middens”, composed of sea shells around Scotland’s coasts proves the point that the Scots were tribes that inhabited the shores around both what became Scotland & Ireland. After all there is only around 23 miles between Scotland and Ireland at the narrowest point.

      If the waterways were the easier to navigate areas than the forests then common sense says humans would use the seas and rivers rather than hack their way through forests full of dangerous wild animals and would live, as we know they did, on food from the seas and rivers.

      There isn’t a square foot of Scotland that was not artificially created by humans to make habitable and most of the barren wasteland that is now modern Scotland resulted from humans being driven out to make way for sheep. Our Highland glens and Southern Uplands once supported far larger populations than they do today and yet some would fight to keep those lands barren believing that was Scotland’s natural habitat – it isn’t. Fence off an area to keep out sheep and deer and the enclosure will soon revert to the forest it once was.

    184. yesindyref2 says:

      @Dave McEwan Hill
      I can’t make McAskill out. He does have a voice in the MSM, and perhaps that’s the point, he can get the odd quote in with the other critical stuff, and will still be there when it’s important, i.e. near the actual date of Indy Ref 2. Or he’s bitter because he was sacked by Sturgeon. He does go way back with Salmond though. Shrug.

    185. ronnie anderson says:

      Capella Nicola not implementing was mentioned in Holyrood debate i think the message to Labour was to get elected & form a Gov & implement their own report .

      It’ll be a long long wait .

    186. Dr Jim says:

      There’s no free ride in the SNP:If you’re good for the party you’re in, if you’re not you’re out

      Kenny MacAskill is from a different era in politics when times were a little easier and slacker and politicians could coast from time to time, like the Labour party do all the time so sometimes some ex politicians get grumpy when they’ve gone out of favour and have a moan in the newspapers about not being loved enough, but Nicola Sturgeon demands 100% all the time from everybody including herself
      The FM is driven 24 hours a day in everything she does all for her vision of Scotlands potential and if you work for the SNP under her leadership you have to graft or you’re gone, it’s that simple
      The media and the opposition try to portray her as some sort of tyrannical obsessive dictator, she’s not she’s just totally focussed 100% of the time on her work for Scotland and expects everybody else to do the same

      You never hear Michelle Thomson complain about her ex boss
      and likely you won’t hear Shona Robison complain either

      Not easy being an SNP anything when every single British entity is after your head, so you have to be pretty tough and that means casualties from time to time and sometimes the casualties don’t like it

    187. Fred says:

      Scotland’s FM is not responsible for reserved matters so no point in being civil to an arsehole like Trump, there is nothing to be gained from such a meeting.

      The inflated Trump balloons have upset Trump & will be shown all over the world, therefore superb.

    188. Rab MacLaren says:

      “After all there is only around 23 miles between Scotland and Ireland at the narrowest point.L

      12 miles actually!

    189. Ken500 says:

      There will be a GE. The Tories will lose to get them out of the mess. A complete shambles. The next lot will be as bad. People do not know whether to laugh or greet. Cameron caused it. Another Tory/unionist scandal. Lining their pockets and embezzling public money. £Trns in debt. Just a disgrace.

      Vote SNP/SNP. Vote for Independence.

    190. Smallaxe says:

      Don’t be deceived – Secret trade talks at the heart of Trump visit;

      In Trump’s U.K. Visit, Some See ‘Infomercial’ for Money-Losing Golf Resort;

    191. Flower of Scotland says:


      I used to leaflet for Kenny MacAskill decades ago in West Lothian. I always thought he was a good guy. He was one of the 79 group with Alex Salmond on the left.

      I don’t know what happened to him, but in my mind I’m very disappointed with him. He is like Sillars. Grumping all the time about SNP policies. He would be better shutting up!

    192. Robert Peffers says:

      @Abulhaq says: 14 July, 2018 at 7:23 pm:


      That is probably the most hilarious Unionist pish I’ve read in a very long time indeed, and, believe me, I’ve read a great many hilariously pretentious unionist comments of recent years.

    193. yesindyref2 says:

      @Dr Jim / @Flower of Scotland
      The SNP Conference NATO debate in 2012 was one of the most hotly debated issues ever for the SNP, as Robertson backed by Salmond and others moved for the SNP to change from its stance of backing “Partners for Peace” (PfP) in NATO, to full membership. Remember Finnie resigned from the SNP after.

      McAskill’s speech was one of the most passionate, and very strong too, he took no prisoners criticising the other side of the debate. In the event it was won by a very small majority which took a long time counting. And yet he was going against his own ideals for the sake of Independence, and even though membership of NATO would win few YES votes, the PfP stance would in my opinion have kept a lot of people on a NO. Defence is something we take for granted, and PfP would have given Better Together a massive axe to use against Indy Scotland.

      So for me there’s no doubting his YES credentials, he put himself very much second to the cause of YES, and went for it like a bull in a china shop. It’s why I’m prepared to defend him – if he needs any defence at all of course 🙂

    194. Robert Peffers says:

      @Ian Brotherhood says: 14 July, 2018 at 10:26 pm:

      ” … Who gave Rock the blue Smarties?”

      Who he?

    195. yesindyref2 says:

      Oh, forgot a URL for that:

      Perhaps the most influential speech came from Kenny MacAskill, the Justice Secretary. He opened with a wry reminder that he was scarcely in the pocket of the United States (as the man who released the Lockerbie bomber from prison.)

      But then it was passion, emotion. He had marched with CND, he said. He had lobbied and cajoled for nuclear disarmament. He was “tired of marching”. He wanted independent power in order to bring about change. The chat after the debate was that he may have won the day with his powerful pitch.

      I agree.

    196. yesindyref2 says:

      The irony of that, by the way, is it’s likely all Grun’s Sevvie’s fault the stance changed from PfP to full membership, and a factor in the rise of support for Indy rose from 25% to 45%, as he persecuted Robertson and the SNP about the NATO issue. Let’s hear it for our Sevvie 🙂

    197. PacMan says:

      A personal and quite possible cynical view of McAskill and co with their anti-SNP sniping.

      People who go into politics are like everyone else. Regardless of their motivations, they are compensated for their role with a salary. If they leave politics then they go to another profession that offers a similar level of salary.

      That’s all very well if you had a profession before you entered politics that offers a similar level of pay you can fall back into or are able to go into a new one due to your previous political experience. What happens if that doesn’t happen?

      I can’t help but feel that the House of Lords isn’t only a reward for politicians as a reward for towing the British establishment line but also to stop them from undermining it in the form of not stopping them from biting the (British establishment) hand that feeds them?

      If this assumption is correct it is a good form of control by the British establishment to stop ex British politicians from spilling the beans, so to speak. There is no way that the Scottish government could implement this because because they would be rightly criticised for trying to buy silence.

    198. Danny says:

      Brexit is the big picture.

    199. liz g says:

      Re Trump
      Here’s a thought….
      As POTUS or even ex POTUS,how can he ever visit his Golf courses again,in an Independent Scotland without the consent of the First Minister and or the Scottish government?
      So while that’s Nicola ….
      And even when it’s someone else, having brought our Government home and mair tae the point “within slapping distance” and given the strength of feeling about him coming to Scotland ,I don’t think Auld Trumpy boy will see his Golf Courses again!
      His best hope is to sell up before Holyrood get round to land reform and foreign ownership of Scotland!!!!
      As “they” say them that laugh last laugh the longest…

    200. Ken500 says:

      The MSM nonsense, They can’t even google a few facts. What a bunch of complete useless incompetents. Havering total nonsense.

    201. jfngw says:


      It’s just the normal BBC Scotland news output. Decide the story you want then go and look for anything that will confirm your story, it’s simple. They don’t even need to look outside to see if it’s raining, it is what they say it is as far as they are concerned (referencing someone else’s post regarding journalist training).

    202. auld highlander says:

      Smallaxe, re the wee queenie wifie, trumpy is just erse lickin.

    203. Smallaxe says:

      auld highlander,

      That’s wan well-licked erse, ma friend.

    204. yesindyref2 says:

      The Yanks do have a thing about the “Queen of England”, I daresay Trump is no different.

    205. Thepnr says:

      That opinion poll in todays Observer has a very surprising result (at least to me) to the question:

      Q:EUR9. Earlier this year the Prime Minister said, in relation to Brexit, that “no deal for Britain is better than a bad deal for Britain”. To what extent do you agree or disagree?

      Excluding don’t knows and neither agree or disagree, then across UK 72% Agree 28% Disagree. In Scotland only, 56% Agree 44% Disagree.

      I guess it shows that people can be brainwashed by a single slogan if it’s said often enough, pretty scary how easily the public can be manipulated.

    206. yesindyref2 says:

      I’d be tempted to agree though. I guess for people if the UK is going to pay, then it needs some benefits for that payment, so a bad deal is the worst outcome.

    207. auld highlander says:

      Aye indeed Smallaxe, the trumpies did not follow etiquette as he failed to give her a wee bow and she failed to curtsy. Oh the shame, smirk.

      Just as well he never gave her a wee pat on the behind.


    208. Thepnr says:


      You’ll not be surprised that I strongly disagree.

      No deal has to be the baddest of all bad deals.

      The people will pay all right if it’s a No Deal and it’ll cost them a hell of a lot more than any contribution that might have been paid to the EU from their taxes.

      Cost to business of customs transactions £20 billion, 800,000 job losses, 9% lower GDP ect ect. No deal will be very costly indeed.

    209. Smallaxe says:

      ICYMI: Brexit Balls Up! It’s fun to watch, but does anyone actually know what’s going on?;

    210. yesindyref2 says:

      Booger! I put in the new free SSLforfree cert a few days before expiry on a minor website but forgot to restart Apache. Slap slap. Oh well, only a few hours lost.

    211. wull2 says:

      Has another sleeper mole been activated.
      Is it getting near the end game.
      Tell everyone you know to vote YES this time.

    212. yesindyref2 says:

      Yes indeed, but that’s for not having SM / CU.

      I’d say if there was another question about Brexit about the type of Brexit, a majority would want a soft Brexit with a “good” deal – or staying in the EU completely.

      It’s as always the actual wording of the question.

    213. Thepnr says:

      Here’s news of part of Ireland’s preparations for a No Deal Brexit just released.

      Ireland to move oil reserves from UK over Brexit – Sunday Independent

      DUBLIN (Reuters) – The Irish government is planning to move 200,000 tonnes of its oil reserves from Britain as part of its Brexit preparations and will sign off on the move this week, Ireland’s Sunday Independent newspaper reported.

      The stories of the UK running out of food in the shops and petrol or medicines in the event of No Deal within a week or two might not be as exaggerated as some may think.

    214. Smallaxe says:

      Peter Mandelson joins Brexiters in attack on May’s EU ‘humiliation’;

    215. yesindyref2 says:

      200,000 tonnes is apparently 1.4 million barrels of petroleum, and that’s refined not crude oil. Ummm, quite a lot of money!

      Yeah, it’s a reminder that in the autumn I’ll have to look at getting stocks of some stuff for business to see me through the disruptions 🙁 🙁

      Cashflow will be a booger. Stupid effing Tories, who’d have ’em?

    216. jfngw says:


      It’s a loaded question, who would ever say they wanted a bad deal as opposed to a totally unspecified deal (in this case no deal is a bad deal, but it’s not how the question is phrased).

      Bit like asking do you want no independence rather than bad independence. pretty much guarantees the answer you want.

    217. HandandShrimp says:

      The No deal question is dumb. If the bad deal required us all to wear our underpants on our heads and stick pencils up our nose then you could argue that no deal would be better.

      In order to determine whether no deal is better than a bad deal you have first to define the bad deal. The bad deal could be worse or better than no deal. If you assume that the bad deal is very, very bad then of course no deal might be the better option.

      It is a foolish question.

    218. Smallaxe says:

      Pride comes before a fool as Nicola Sturgeon ignores Donald Trump’s visit to lead equality parade;

    219. Danny says:

      Piers Morgan and Nigel Farage are a couple of racist little Englanders.

      Morgan and Farage are Trumps first point of contact when in comes to anything regarding British Politics.

    220. jfngw says:

      Public enquiries are set up to delve into the areas of a scandal that the politicians want them to reveal, and avoid the areas that they want the public kept in the dark about. Hence there is rarely ever any prosecutions of those at the top of government/industry as a result. Want they will find is some middle ranker to pin the blame on if it is felt a head needs to role.

    221. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      “The stories of the UK running out of food in the shops and petrol or medicines in the event of No Deal within a week or two might not be as exaggerated as some may think.” @Thepnr says at 1:06 pm

      It is all part of the Tory plan I think unfortunately

      No Deal Brexit

      Impose state of emergency

      Close Holyrood

      Mundells beefed up Scotland Office now officially the “UK Government in Scotland” will become our defacto Government (think Vichy France).

      Then it’ll be “God save the Queen and her Neo-Fascist Regime”.

    222. Footsoldier says:

      Many Scots are ignorant of Scottish history, partly because it was not taught properly at many schools for decades. Nevertheless, there are loads of people with a very good knowledge and interest.

      Like any topic, there are different angles and there are many historians who disagree with each other. One has to read different historians to form your own view.

      Robert Peffers appears to have a good knowledge but his is but one view among many, although on Wings he does seem to be predominant and this is an observation, not a criticism.

    223. Luigi says:

      When the BREXIT vow comes out, that’s when you know the establishment panic level has finally gone critical. IMO there will be a signed promise to deliver SOFT BREXIT MAX.

      (with bells on). 🙂

      Whether BREXIT is good or bad, the UK (ahem) voted for it and that’s what many people want. The full Monty. What they will get will be a watered-down version: BREXIT in name only. When the people realise they have been duped, that the UK will transform from being a member of the EU to being a colony of the EU all hell will break loose.

      Heck, it may even persuade me of these disappointed Scottish LEAVE voters to support independence again. 🙂

    224. Petra says:

      @ Yesindyref2 @ 10:04am ….. “Trump in himself is largely an irrelevance to getting a YES vote.”

      I reckon Trump will be a main player as soon as Indyref2 is announced. He’ll be extremely vocal in his opposition and will no doubt make all kinds of cataclysmic threats towards Scotland. There’s no way that he’ll want to see us remain in the EU / out of the UK and with the ability to rid ourselves of Trident. On a positive note Trump’s “interventions”, when the time comes, could get right up Scottish noses. We’ll see.

      People like Abulhaq seem to think that Nicola was wrong in not seeing Trump. The fact is that Trump didn’t want to acknowledge her, no doubt at the behest of T May et al. And we all know what that’s about.

    225. Derek Henry says:

      This is excellent !

      Rev should post this on this site

      I’ve read over 300 economic papers and studied the accounting between treasuries, central banks and commercial banks.

      And nothing brings it together like this in layman terms for the last decade.

      I dream every day of having an economic summy like this in Scotland.

    226. jfngw says:

      Has there been a poll suggesting that SNP support is rising again? I must assume their is as the BBC has upped its attack mode to defcon 1 again.

      Get ready for SNHS, education and police FOI stories rearing their head imminently.

    227. Derek Henry says:

      Foreign direct investments in the US have fallen by a third since Trump took over.

      Why is it people concentrate on investments in the same way you look at debts ? You look at public debt instead of private debt the debt that matters ?

      Investors chase profits not ideological purity. A growing economy with innovative investment in public infrastructure is fertile for attracting FDI. Building sustainable growth through high employment with stable prices with good wages and appropriate productivity improvements and strong rule of law is fertile for attracting FDI. Investors don’t go on strike under these circumstances they are knocking down your door to invest to steal all of that aggregate demand.

      People choose to ignore Foreign Portfolio Investment, which represents foreign investments in a nation’s financial assets which bear no interest in an underlying productive activity in the real sector of the economy. Driven by unregulated financial markets and the four freedoms.

      It includes purchases of shares, corporate and government bonds, and other local currency-denominated assets which are typically easier to liquidate than assets created by FDI. Real estate is included in this category if held for speculative purposes, although it is less liquid than the array of financial assets that the ‘hot’ money is attracted to.

      Clearly, this capital can be withdrawn very quickly and can be the source of financial instability and we’ve seen first hand the problem it causes with house prices.

      If these type of investors don’t like say Corbyn’s tax policies they will start a run on the £ that is ideologicaly driven. They will try and destabilise a left wing government as much as possible.

      Capital controls function to limit the extent of the currency depreciation when a currency is under attack from ‘hot money’ speculators.

      If targeted to short-term capital transactions (‘hot money’) they counter the speculative flows that might destabilise an exchange rate and force a nation to run down its foreign exchange reserves.

      You don’t want those you love the four freedoms. You love stockholm syndrome that gives power away to some unelected entity that you can serve.

      For example, China prevents foreign funds from investing directly into its capital market. It also has quotas on the use of short-term foreign debt that its domestic banks can engage. They know the consequences if they don’t.

      Those that love the four freedoms and stockholm syndrome say that the financial markets will always subvert capital controls, but the reality is different. Speculators know full well that such controls stop their damaging behaviour.

      Otherwise, why would investors and speculators cry bloody murder whenever capital controls are mentioned as a possibility?

      While it is usually claimed that imposing such controls would automatically cut a country off from access to international capital markets, plunging the nation into autarchy, the experience of various countries that have imposed capital controls in recent years disproves this claim.

      Indeed, the evidence shows that countries that employed constraints on surging capital inflows fared better than countries with open capital accounts in the recent global financial crisis.

      In fact, it is often forgotten that the Bretton Woods system was ultimately derailed precisely by speculative capital flows that threatened the exhaustion of the foreign exchange and/or gold reserves of nations running external deficits.

      It is also the case, that it was only capital controls that gave any semblance of currency stability during the fixed exchange rate period, especially in the various European arrangements that followed the collapse of the Bretton Woods agreement in 1971.

      They also claim that a nation will run out of money if foreign investors lose confidence in the government, or, more to the point, dislike the policies it is pursuing.

      This is also false.

      No foreign investor funds a sovereign currency-issuing government. As long as that government does not borrow in a foreign currency it is financially sound.

      As long as they do not allow the neoliberals to cause a crises like they have just done in Argentina. The first 2 things the neoliberal government did in Argentina was stop capital controls and borrowed in US$.

    228. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      @ Footsoldier

      That’s the great thing about Peffers – his posts provide impetus to go off and learn more yourself.

    229. Derek Henry says:

      In February 2010, the IMF released a research paper – Capital Inflows: The Role of Controls – where they argued that under certain circumstances “capital controls … is justified as part of the policy toolkit to manage inflows”.

      The IMF concluded that short-term speculative surges can compromise sound macroeconomic management – by pushing the exchange rate up and undermining trade competitiveness.

      They also acknowledged that:

      … large capital inflows may lead to excessive foreign borrowing and foreign currency exposure, possibly fueling domestic credit booms (especially foreign-exchange denominated lending) and asset bubbles (with significant adverse effects in the case of a sudden reversal).

      FDI which “may include a transfer of technology or human capital” can “boost long-term growth”, but the flows associated with FPI – “such as portfolio investment and banking and especially hot, or speculative, debt inflows — seem neither to boost growth nor allow the country to better share risks with its trading partners”.

      Another IMF article (June 2016) – Neoliberalism: Oversold? – concluded that short-term capital flows have questionable legitimacy and that:

      Among policymakers today, there is increased acceptance of controls to limit short-term debt flows that are viewed as likely to lead to—or compound—a financial crisis. While not the only tool available—exchange rate and financial policies can also help—capital controls are a viable, and sometimes the only, option when the source of an unsustainable credit boom is direct borrowing from abroad.

      Which asks the question why a nation would ever allow unfettered FPI. Driven by unregulated financial markets. One of the four freedoms free movement of capital ?

      Why anybody would want to support a type of democracy that allows the neoliberal gloablists to depoliticise their decisions, thus reducing the political costs of unpopular policies, by ‘scapegoating’ international institutions (such as the European Commission) or simply by blaming ‘the markets’ is beyond me.

      In my own view it is insane and not democracy at all it is what George Monbiot has written about for decades and nothing more than state capture. When the poachers become gamekeepers.

      Yet, here we kicking and screaming wanting to protect the four freedoms and state capture either by unelected technocrats or hedge funds and investors.

      Of course the very same people will tell you that they can reform the EU within and Jeremy Corbyn will reform the EU. Which is nothing more than pure delusion free movement of capital is one of the four freedoms and we know what the EU thinks about those.

    230. Derek Henry says:

      You can’t just keep on ignoring what’s going on in the US and the UK

      You can’t ignore why it is happening and why populism is on the rise everywhere.

      Giving people labels just won’t cut it anymore. You have to recognise the reason for both is a failed economic system of supply side Jesus tosh.

      The lazy Greek, the dim witted Irish, the hot bloodied Italian, The sleepy Spanish, the commie french or the nationalistic scot just won’t cut it anymore.

    231. cearc says:

      Thepnr 12.35

      I agree. The phrase ‘leaving bill’ has been the most amazingly sucessful bit of propoganda.

      It is, of course, merely settling debts.

    232. Derek Henry says:

      Free trade only works if the playing field is level

      LOL !

      Which means it doesn’t exist. Free trade is invalid it is as useless and the four freedoms that support it. Which should be called the four prisons especially free movement of capital.

      To sum up, It is inapplicable, and irrelevant in the real world of trade imbalances; global movement of capital, technology, research, and management skills; worker specialisation; persistent large-scale unemployment; huge wage-level gaps between countries; “sticky” prices, wages, and currency rates; technological progress; “learning curves”; production overcapacity; geopolitical and economic instability; and unprecedented uncertainty.

      We haven’t even mentioned such things as predatory trading and currency manipulation.

      Among the best sayings of George Orwell, “There are some things only intellectuals are crazy enough to believe” takes a place of honor. Free trade is one of these things.

      Yet, here we are with both remainers and leavers arguing in a sack about figments of their own immagination.

      Free trade and the four freedoms means one Freedom and one freedom only and that is the Freedom to exploit.

      Why is the free movement of capital so key in the Brexit debate ?

      Why is the city of London fighting so hard to get services into the deal and keeping the UK in one of the four prisons ?

      I’ll let Jonathan Hill explain it to you UK’s former EU Commissioner.

      This is what he said in Febuary 2018

      A copy and paste job of….

      a) White paper

      b) Exactly what Hammond is saying to the city of London

      So what do you want to be a prisoner or free ?

    233. ahundredthidiot says:

      Elderly friend buys the Sunday Mail (muggins here has to go get it)

      The rag makes me boak, but the front page was a good one for us, without a doubt.

      NS smiling leading a parade in Glasgow

      POtUS making an arse of himself on the golf course

      Might even make a few soft No’s have a wee rethink.

      Canny lass that NS.

    234. cearc says:


      I think Trump interventions could easily swing it for Yes!

    235. Derek Henry says:

      Tax Avoidance and the Irish Balance of Payments

      Free movement of capital one of the four prisons.

      Apple’s Exports Aren’t Missing: They Are in Ireland

      Free movement of Capital one of the four prisons

      You still want Scotland to….

      a) Set its own laws

      b) Spend its own money

      c) Set its own monetary policy

      d) Set its own tax policy

      e) Control it’s own borders

      Etc, etc, etc….

      Such a crime you don’t want your friends in the EU that use the Euro to have the same. One day you’ll understand the four freedoms or should I say the four prisons especially the free movement of capital The six pack, the two pack and the stability and growth pact.

      I think the HUGE difference between you and me is I want the countries that use the Euro to be free because at the moment they are like Scotland but instead of being under the control of the BOE. They are under the control of the ECB.

      You just want Scotland to be free which in my view is selfish behaviour.

      One day you will understand the difference between a single currency and a sovereign currency and the difference between a fixed exchange rate and a floating one.

      Once you do you would never support the EU.

      I’ll never under stand why you want independence sho much for Scotland but not for Greece, Italy, Catalonia free from the Euro.

      You want them enslaved as a colony by free movement of capital and I’ll never understand that position.

    236. Derek Henry says:

      Is it possible to call the political regime of the euro democracy?

      Says it all really. How the EU and ECB try repeatedly to financially crush any EU governments that challenges neo-liberal policy.

      Free movement of capital one of the four freedoms. I mean four prisons.

    237. Derek Henry says:

      Trump, the first Keynesian GOP president in many, many years. Bigly.

      US gov’t spending now up $125 bln over last year. Growth rate 3.54% y-o-y. Spending really accelerating. It’s expected to reach $5 trillion a US record.

      Huge tax cuts which could have been targetted better.

      The complete opposite to austerity.

      Protection of domestic industries and stimulating/incentivising domestic production.

      Everything Keynes advocated after the war.

      The slow growth of the past 30 years has been exactly due to neoliberal policies, i.e. trade agreements, outsourcing, financialisation, etc.

      He’s doing what most of you have been screaming for, for nearly 4 decades now.

      Infact the only thing missing is a new deal aka a job guarentee and that would have been so much better to create jobs in the US. Rather than impose tariffs to bring jobs back to the US.

      I would call it military Keynesian.

      It’s not far off a left wing dream what he is doing with fiscal policy and monetary policy. He is
      definately Protecting domestic industries and stimulating/incentivising domestic production via import substitution.

      Supply side Jesus has gone missing in action. I’ll keep saying it, the right acting like the left in many ways and the left acting like liberals in many ways.

      What the Trump administration has also been doing is balance sheet reduction.

      Other countries haven’t even thought about all the QE they did and what they are going to do about it.

      The Fed’s balance sheet resumed its decline last week. Down $12.6 bln to $4.347T. That is the lowest level since May 2014 and down $166 bln y-o-y.

      Fed Treasury holdings down $7.6 bln to $2.37T. Down $94.5 bln y-o-y. They are now at the lowest level since May 2014.

      MBS down $5.9 bln to $1.72T. This is the lowest level since Nov 2014. MBS holdings are down $49 bln y-o-y.

      This is yet another huge Keynesian fiscal stimulas into the economy.

      QE sucked billions worth of interest income out of the US economy as it swapped interest bearing treasury securities for reserves.

      Balance sheet reduction is the opposite it swaps reserves for interest bearing treasury securites or lets the treasury securities mature putting interest income into the economy instead of stripping it out.

      They plan another $400 billion reduction next year and the year after that.

      Also, because their monetary policy is to hike interest rates that aslo increases the interest income flowing into the economy another Keynesian fiscal stimulas.

      As of the 5th July Interest on Treasury Securities, $197 bln, up $15.9 bln and growing at 8.8% y-o-y. This is the fastest growing major line item in the US at the moment. Going into the economy.

      Compare that with Medicaid, $289.4 bln, up $6.4 bln and growing at 2.3% y-o-y.

      The Federal deficit thru July 5, 2018 is $555 bln or 2.8% of GDP. It is $83.2 bln more than same time last year.

      = The household, business and foreign owners of $’s sector surplus is $555 bln and is $83.2 bln more than same time last year.

      The private sector has $83.2 bln more than same time last year. As the government budget deficit = private sector surplus.

      Total net spending for the fiscal year thus far, $3.68 Trillion.

      I love it that the dollar is rallying despite the fact that Trump’s policies including tariffs are, in essence, a general price hike on the entire population.

      I’ve been short the $ since the FED started hiking interest rates because they do the exact opposite of what they say they do.

      They cause inflation they don’t fight it

      Because when they raise interest rates the cost of borrowing increases but that cost gets passed onto the consumer as higher prices.

      So interest rate hikes are price hikes and then you have the interest income channels with 20 trillion worth of debt paying interest no wonder Interest on Treasury Securities, $197 bln, up $15.9 bln and growing at 8.8% y-o-y.

      Record government spending

      Record tax cuts

      Balance sheet reduction


      All inflationary which causes inflation pressures EVERYWHERE.

      Inflation Reducing purchasing power (which is what Trump’s policies are doing) DOES NOT RESULT IN A HIGHER EXCHANGE RATE.

      Commodity markets and gold continue to trade like a recession is coming.

      Only one problem…


      This is fear trade. We’ve seen it expressed in sentiment readings.

      That’s all this is.

      But, but, but, but I thought raising interest rates fights inflation and makes the currency stronger ?

      7 US rate hikes and inflation is at 6 year high

      It’s hialrious !

      You should be buying gold and selling the $ any chance you can get.

    238. ahundredthidiot says:

      Derek Henry

      Damn, I thought I was quick at typing, but you are lightning my friend.


    239. Derek Henry says:

      Ask Ireland what the Free movement of capital is doing to their books?

      House prices soar as Ireland’s economy booms

      Yeah sure, we all know why Ireland’s house prices are booming.

      The freemovement of capital one of the four freedoms. I mean prisons.

    240. Smallaxe says:

      Rigged: New Report Details How Combined $5.1 Trillion in Tax Cuts by Bush, Obama, and Trump Went Mostly to Nation’s Richest;

    241. Ghillie says:

      Derek Henry @ lots of times.

      So, to summarise… you are not keen on the EU?

    242. Derek Henry says:

      Can Spain’s PP turn eurosceptic over Catalonia?

      The Schleswig-Holstein question in the 19th century drove the few people that understood it to madness. The same is now happening with the decision by a Schleswig-Holstein court not to extradite Carles Puigdemont on charges of rebellion. It threatens to drive the PP and the Spanish judiciary to insanity. El Mundo reports that the Spanish supreme court is considering to reject the extradition on limited charges of misuse of public funds only, which would make Puigdemont a free man in Germany but keep the European arrest warrant dangling over his head if he moves to another country. And Esteban Pons, leader of the PP group in the European Parliament, reacted to the decision by declaring the European Arrest Warrant a failure, and demanding that the Spanish government suspend Schengen in protest.

      Is this a knee-jerk reaction or a sign of a PP policy shift? Pablo Casado, the younger candidate in the ongoing PP leadership contest and who is running a hard ideological campaign, also came out yesterday calling for the Schengen border-free area to be scrapped, given that there are no guarantees that Spain will be respected. Casado said that as PP president he would not tolerate Spain being humiliated in this manner by a German court. Soraya Sáenz de Santamaría, Mariano Rajoy’s deputy PM and the more technocratic candidate for the PP leadership, stressed respect for judicial independence instead. So the PP faces a party congress the following weekend, and will resolve its leadership contest, divided on its reaction to the German court ruling.

      And all indications are that Casado will beat Sáenz de Santamaría for the leadership. He came second in the vote of the party members, but the party congress will be decided by delegates, which have a different composition. PP secretary general Dolores de Cospedal, a known personal foe of Sáenz de Santamaría, has the most delegates and appears to have thrown her lot behind Casado who can probably count on about two thirds of the delegates.

      Free movement of people another of the four prisons.

    243. Hamish100 says:

      derek henry

      “..You just want Scotland to be free which in my view is selfish behaviour.”

      Your long financial neo con nonsense is only surpassed by your statement above.

      All the other nations in the world are of course not selfish as they are not Scots.

    244. galamcennalath says:

      Re Labour’s support for an England-led bid for the 2030 World Cup.

      Perhaps the Scottish Government should put forward a counter Celtic Nations bid for 2030!

      I most sincerely hope Scotland will NOT still be in an England-led UKnotsoUK long before then!

    245. Ghillie says:

      Derek Henry … again

      So, you are not too keen on the EU then?

      Chlorinated chicken anyone?

      A cup of methane Vicar?

    246. Thepnr says:

      The reports of running out of food as a result of a hard Brexit apparently was not the worst possible outcome. That one was known as “Armageddon” and as far as I know there were no scenarios published in the MSM.

      You can guess though that as well as the second worst case being bad enough “Armageddon” must include a rationing of electricity. There was what seems like a ridiculous story of barges loaded with generators being used to provide Northern Ireland with electricity if they couldn’t access what they need fom the Republic.

      So surely the UK would be affected in exactly the same way if England couldn’t access French electricity for example.

      Fancy a 3 day week anyone?

    247. Phil says:

      @Derek Henry, above various …

      Do I read correctly that you say Mr Trump has wrought such changes all since his late January 2017 inauguration? That is good going, or takes little account of previous incumbent’s fiscal / financial moves.

      Do I take it that you think Scots – or anyone who wishes their nation to be self governing – is being selfish toward Greece or Italy or whoever else you list? Surely that is for the Greeks or the Italians, etc to make up their minds upon and act upon. Just as it is not for Greeks to try to deliver independence to Scotland.

      I take it you understand the inappropriatness of neo-con philosophy and do not wish that upon Scotland or any economy. Good going. If only more average punters did.

    248. Smallaxe says:

      Presidential election confirmed as Sinn Fein decide to field candidate;

    249. HandandShrimp says:


      Well presumably we under Derek’s analysis we would tell Trump where to stuff his chickens and his free trade agreement as that would be swapping one prison for another.

      Free trade is does have swings and roundabouts and constraints but so does protectionism. If there were easy answers we would have exercised them a long time ago.

    250. HandandShrimp says:

      Apologies for the random “we” and “is” in my last

      We is multi tasking…badly

    251. Dr Jim says:

      Once we’ve convinced people they’re going to starve to death then tell them at the last minute they won’t then they’ll vote for you out of gratitude PM

      That seems to be the basis of the UK Governments advice and strategy from it’s own advisers, and Corbyn still can’t win over that so who’s advising Corbyn, Zoo animals?

      Scotlands British nationalists are down the well waiting because they know the UK will throw the rope down any minute to pull them up, they will, they know they will, won’t they?

      So these are the probabilities and yet the sectarianists in Scotland are still prepared to wait down the well, no matter how long it takes, or even if ever, but that doesn’t matter as long as you never surrender never give in to……what now?

    252. Thepnr says:

      @Dr Jim

      Of course Dr Jim, the Armageddon and other scenarios are all just part of the softening up process to get the Leave voters to accept that contrary to the mantra that “No deal is better than a bad deal” they wan’t a deal.

      Doesn’t mean they will get one though as they don’t get to decide what any deal will look like. No, that’s the EU’s job and the Tories and the UK public will like it or lump it.

      Does not apply in Scotland, we will make our own mind up as to whether any UK deal is acceptable or not. If it’s not then we will choose to leave and have our own deal with the EU.

      “Armageddon” applies only to rUK, we can choose to take back control with our Independence and leave rUK to deal with the problems they themselves have created.

    253. Macart says:


      Did a piece back in April. It laid out the post Brexit scenarios as available from both Scotgov and UK gov. The varying degrees/percentages of loss available through the links provided, that sort of thing.

      Near as I could see, there is no good Brexit for people. ALL of them without exception mean long term hardship of varying degrees. As an example of what to expect… From a 2% contraction in the 4th qtr of 2008 we’ve enjoyed austerity UK. Under current UKgov economic policy and management, ten years of austerity legislation. The effects on the poorest and least able in UK society have been appalling. The softest Brexit scenario was a 2% contraction and moved upwards from there. What people call a hard Brexit will be (by that measure) catastrophic in its fallout.

      All the hypothetical cunning plans, political strategies, new monetary/economic policies mean nothing, NOTHING, without the power to make decisions and take actions for ourselves. Without that, there is no avoiding anything. Third party legislation won’t cut it at this point I’d reckon.

      As for folk who hope that a devolved Scottish government will be able to mitigate or offset central government budgeting or legislation? They’d be in for a very rude shock.

    254. Thepnr says:


      I’d just add, a “very very rude shock”. Like voluntarily taking a seat in the Electric Chair and clamping the cuffs on yourself.

      Sparks will fly!

    255. Ken500 says:

      World Trade Organisation 164 member countries. 24 negotiating to join. EU States are members. Established to maintain rules of free, equal and fair trade. Tries to keep consumer prices down.Etc.

    256. Ken500 says:

      There are 195 countries in the world

    257. Legerwood says:

      Macart and Thepnr

      Couple of the most recent articles on Newsnet on the subject of food supply and Brexit

    258. Dr Jim says:

      English by proxy:

      Apparently if you play football in England even if you’re from another country you become English when you play in the world cup because the commentators keep talking about the clubs in England the players who are taking part are in so that’s obviously the answer to all Englands immigration complaints just give all foreigners footballer status… more nasty foreign immigrants anymore, just more English footballers

      I don’t know why nobody else thought of it

    259. gus1940 says:

      Is there not an electricity connector between Scotland and NI?

    260. HandandShrimp says:

      Tipped France to win this but Croatia really don’t deserve to be behind in this game. They have totally owned the first half.

    261. ronnie anderson says:

      Just caught the last 5mins of the Windsors ch5 . In a world of uncertainty the Windsors offer stability & continuity FFS . Better ending would have been & they will continue to rip off the public purse to furnish their lavish lifestyle .

      Eat yer Foodbank supplied cereal Plebs .

    262. Macart says:


      Plenty of possession by Croatia in the first half, but France have been lethal and clinical on the counter.

      France 4 Croatia 2 currently.

      Jings! 😮

    263. Thepnr says:


      Thanks for the links, very interesting view on things.

    264. Macart says:


      Cheers for the links. 🙂

    265. HandandShrimp says:

      Ce arrive maison…or something 🙂

      Well done France! Croatia ran out of steam but it was tighter than the score suggests.

    266. Thepnr says:


      Losing 4-2 was harsh for Croatia, they had 66% in the game.

    267. Macart says:

      Scoreline doesn’t tell the whole story tbf. Croatia were well worth their place in the final and but for a couple of poor decisions that could have been a whole different story.

      Well done France though. Their countering was quite clinically efficient and they got to that final by taking out big names.

    268. Thepnr says:

      Oops, 66% possession in the game.

    269. Hamish100 says:

      gus1940 says:
      15 July, 2018 at 4:55 pm
      Is there not an electricity connector between Scotland and NI

      Not sure, but the recent connector at Hunterston picking up turbine electricity heads to Lancaster, England. It means when we need energy England can helps us!! Aye right.
      Westminster acts like a controlling leach bleeding us dry.

    270. HandandShrimp says:


      Yes and 14 shots to 7. Croatia gave it their all, if their crosses had been a little more accurate and the very soft penalty hadn’t been given that could have gone to Croatia very easily but they were dead on their feet for the last 10 minutes.

    271. dakk says:

      Clever cheating by Griezmann and a terrible penalty award by the referee were the two main determinants of the outcome of this final.

      France and Brazil followed by Belgium may have been the tournament’s best teams imo.

      However,I feel heart sick for Croatia losing the final this way. They were easily the better team and will always be the winners of World Cup Russia 2018,even if in my head only.

    272. ScottieDog says:

      Many mmt proponents can’t get out the EU quick enough. It seems however that there’s a weird assumption that the tories will abandon neoliberal values over night.
      Yes the stability growth pact is shocking but I didn’t see anyone plaster that across a bus in 2016.

      Trade deals with trump will be disasterous

    273. Thepnr says:

      OK that’s the entertainment over for now so back to the day job.

      Immigration decline costing UK economy billions, says think tank

      Global Future, which promotes the benefits of openness, calculates that the loss to the public finances is the equivalent of more than 23,000 nurses or 18,000 doctors.

      It also claims that meeting the government’s immigration target of “tens of thousands” will also cost Britain £12bn a year by 2023 – which represents 60 per cent of the funds promised to the NHS by Theresa May as part of a so-called “Brexit dividend”.

    274. Greannach says:

      Maybe Croatia could sue France. Not sure where or why, but it could be beautiful.

    275. Andy-B says:

      Croatian female president, shrugging off the heavy rain, whilst all the others male leaders includin Macron and Putin, remaining under aides umbrellas.

      Kudos to the Croatian president.

    276. Petra says:

      @ Legerwood at 4:25pm …….. “Newsnet articles.”

      Thanks for posting them Legerwood. Excellent articles from Molly Pollock …. a reality check …. and very timely indeed, as two of my visitors voted no to Independence and remaining in the EU. By the look on their faces they’re now having second thoughts, lol. Lol, but not really funny if you know what I mean.

    277. frogesque says:

      @Dr Jim :4.45

      On that basis, England played England therefore England won the World Cup’.

      QED or some such mathematical nonsense.

    278. Abulhaq says:

      On the matter of anti-Catholic sectarianism in Scotland, it is raw, unsophisticated, ahistorical and quite ‘in yer face’.
      In England it’s more subtle more intellectual, eg atheist Prof Richard Dawkins ‘the pope is leader if the second most evil religion on the planet’ ; one assumes Islam is the first. Ring a bell?
      You take your choice but the Brit psyche is fundamentally anti-Catholic. Phobic in the true sense of the term, fearful.
      When Scotland ditches the Brit, may that go with it. It will take,however, a profound cultural change to do so. We will need a new style of leader and leadership to effect that change. A new Scotland, regenerated from the living roots, an area conventional party politics has generally little to contribute.

    279. Ken Clark says:


      I’d go with, “or…”. 😀

    280. yesindyref2 says:

      @Derek Henry
      Calm down, it can’t be done all at once. Much the same as Independence itself, it wasn’t mainstream in politics, it wasn’t mainstream in people’s minds, it took a Referendum campaign – and perhaps the “best” efforts of not only grassroot YESsers, but also Better Together who annoyed a lot of quite hard NO voters, before that became mainstream in Scotland.

      As for “selfish”, Scotland can’t bully the whole world or even the EU into mending its ways it can either get out (or stay out) of the EU, or work patiently within it.

      Your link in your first post I’ve bookmarked, no time at the moment to read it, but beginners guides are always good. MMT is not mainstream, as you know neolibcondaft is, it has to be enough to start with to get MMT more into the public consciousness, and you won’t do that if you insult potential interested people up to the eyeballs. Richard Murphy, quite new to the cause I think, is similar in his way of not accepting criticism or comments to what he sees as the “only way”.

      MMT needs friends, not pissed off enemies.

    281. Legerwood says:

      A rather chilling take on Trump, Iran and Putin.

      Might be a bit overly apocalyptic but given Trump’s comments in his CBS TV interview this weekend about the EU being a foe
      then maybe not. Call them a foe then maybe they will bend over backwards to give you what you want to prove their friendship.

      Article in Guardian

    282. Smallaxe says:

      gus1940 says:
      15 July 2018 at 4:55 pm
      “Is there not an electricity connector between Scotland and NI”

      A link Gus,
      The Moyle Interconnector links the electricity grids of Northern Ireland and Scotland;

    283. HandandShrimp says:


      Trump sees everyone who sells stuff as a trade foe. The worst kind of foe in his book. Putin is just a strategic foe which is why he said “Russia is a foe too in some respects” (or words to that effect).

      I do wonder what they will actually talk about. Putin looked in good form at the medal ceremony.

      Russia did put on a cracking WC. The winter one in Quatar will be a strange follow on. The heat and the dust will be a challenge. Bet Scotland qualify and our players melt in the sun.

    284. Effijy says:

      Haven’t seen this all over the TV and Newspapers?
      He could have got so much more detailed coverage over many more months if he has joined the Scottish Party.

      A Government minister has quit after reportedly sending “depraved” text messages to two female constituents.
      Andrew Griffiths resigned as minister for small business on Friday night for “personal reasons”, the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy said.
      In a statement to the Sunday Mirror, which said it would be publishing details of the texts, Mr Griffiths, a former chief of staff to Theresa May, apologised to his local Conservative Party and to his constituents in Burton.
      “I am deeply ashamed at my behaviour which has caused untold distress to my wife and family, to whom I owe everything, and deep embarrassment to the Prime Minister and the Government I am so proud to serve,” he said.
      “Following discussions today with the Chief Whip, I have referred myself to the Conservative Party’s code of conduct procedures. I entirely accept that pending this investigation it is right the whip is withdrawn.
      “I do not seek to excuse my behaviour and will be seeking professional help to ensure it never happens again. In time I hope to earn the forgiveness of all those who put their trust in me and that I have let down so terribly.

      “The Prime Minister and the Government she leads will continue to have my full support.”

    285. Robert Peffers says:

      There is nearly as much claptrap blethered about NATO and WMD as there is about Westminster being other than the Unionist Establishment. In both cases the bletherers draw wrong conclusions even as the truth stares them in the face.

      At Westminster there is no democracy and all unionist parties prime objective is to preserve the union at all and any cost. The Three party setup is a sham and it always has been and always will be. For Westminster the prime Raison d’être will always be the union and they have always stood shoulder to shoulder together to maintain the union – and they always will.

      As For NATO their Raison d’être is, and always has been, for all member states to stand together against any outsiders who threaten to attack or who attack any individual member state.

      The fact that there are three member states that have independent nuclear threat capabilities is not the Raison d’être of NATO – mutual protection is.

      NATO consists of 29 member states and Article Five of the treaty states – if an armed attack occurs against one of the member states, it should be considered an attack against all members and all other members shall assist the attacked member with armed forces if necessary.

      Of the member states 26 are NOT nuclear powers but the three that are were founder members and they the permeant members hold great extra powers within the organisation. In fact there are member states actively anti-nuclear states.

      In any cast no NATO actions have ever included nuclear strikes for, like the UK’s deterrent, their nuclear weapons have not prevented any of the three nuclear powers from being attacked. Their nuclear capabilities did not stop the attacks on the USA Twin Towers nor the Pentagon and both France and the UK have been subjected to terrorist attacks.

      Yet uniquely the SNP is attacked for having a policy to stay in NATO like the 26 other non-nuclear NATO Members. Why do genuine Scottish independence supporters get taken in and fall for Westminster Establishment propaganda?

    286. Smallaxe says:

      Effijy, Your link my friend.

      Married Tory minister Andrew Griffiths quits over perverted demands he made in 2,000 texts sent to two barmaids;

    287. Bobp says:

      O/t had a delivery last night from amazon around 8.30pm from an east european female delivery driver who had already done 238 drops. She looked absolutely frazzled. Wonder how many brexit voting ” they are stealing our jobs” would do her job?. Then again benefit sanctions will probably get their arses in gear.these brexiteers are in for a rude awakening.

    288. Iain mhor says:

      Ok I’ll call it, not that it needs calling.
      Albuhaq has never lived in Scotland.
      The whole Proddy-Catholic thing Albuhaq, is a cultural thing and has shifted back and forth and is predominantly, though not exclusively, a West/Central Scotland deeply, deeply, historical ‘thing’ with a myriad of complexities.
      There’s heehaw black n white about it.
      So, dig your face out of academia and take a telling.
      Away tae fuck explaining it to Scotsmen in that neck o’ the woods. Ye’d get yer c**t kicked by both sides and they’d team up tae dae it tae ye.

    289. Bobp says:

      Cheap slave labour returning to the uk after brexit. The turkeys really have voted for christmas.

    290. Robert Peffers says:

      @Footsoldier says: 15 July, 2018 at 1:33 pm:

      ” … Robert Peffers appears to have a good knowledge but his is but one view among many, although on Wings he does seem to be predominant and this is an observation, not a criticism.”

      Here’s the thing, Footsoldier, and it cannot be denied. The entire written history og Britain has been written by the many, many elite ruling classes and every bloody, (and I use that term advisedly), one of them have been immigrants to Britain.

      Now consider what modern genetic science tells us. The largest portion in the overwhelming majority of British people’s genes is from the aboriginal Stone Age Britons and now factor in that all these invaders, including the Romans, were elite rulers who did not generally mate with the native populations and they still don’t do so today.

      This has been so until fairly recently by the Royal Family itself to such an extent they were suffering genetically influenced health, and in particular mental health, problems.

      The Romans were so much an elite that there was little genetic traces remaining after they left. They were replaced bu a long succession of the first faction of the Germanic Tribes, (not Germany as we know it), The Anglo-Saxons who were invited into South Briton by the native South Britons who had been ruled for centuries by the elite Romans.

      These first Anglo-Saxons became the first of the several elite Germanic factions who have ruled Britain ever since and the Normans were NOT French as many Britons believe for Normand is a contraction of Norsemen who were Germanic Tribes.

      The Normans set up the feudal system that is the bases of British Rule today and sitting in the current House of Lords are still some Hereditary Peers the descendants of the elite Germanic rulers going back to the original Anglo-Saxons and the British Royal Family are descended, “The House of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha”, which is a German dynasty that ruled the duchy of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha, which was one of the Ernestine duchies.

      It is a cadet branch of the Saxon House of Wettin. In 1688 the Westminster parliament, composed of the elite rulers of the Kingdom of England threw out the monarch who wore both the crowns of Scotland & England and thus also wore the crowns of Wales & Ireland but as the Kingdom of Scotland was still an independent kingdom in 1688 their deposing of their monarch could not be legally applied to Scotland so they conned the Scottish parliamentarians into a fake Treaty of Union and they now claim total sovereignty over Scotland but under English law the legal sovereign is the Queen of England and Westminster is Her Majesty’s Government so you believe whatever particular fake British history you choose to believe but you will be unable to prove that since Roman times Britain has been ruled by the immigrant Germanic tribes.

    291. twathater says:

      JWT @ 1.32 pm I already linked to this assertion , IMO reality , put forward by indycar Gordon Ross a couple of days ago .

      I was very surprised that nobody wanted to discuss it .

      This to me is the reality of the situation as touted by Dominic Grieve , twice in the independent newspaper ( EMERGENCY LEGISLATION ,ALL DECISIONS MADE BY WASTEMONSTER , NO DISSENT ,HOLYROOD IN SPECIAL MEASURES ,SG SUSPENDED ) , and possibility of troops on the street to ensure stability and security .

      As I posted at the time I hope Nicola has plans of her own should this happen

    292. Rock says:

      lumilumi says:
      14 July, 2018 at 11:21 pm

      “You know nothing about Finnish history or our present polit”

      I see Russia hasn’t attacked and taken over Finland yet.

      lumilumi (11th November 2016 – “Spotting the differences”):

      “But I loath and deplore and hate the re-emerging Russian nationalism, embodied by Vladimir Putin and stoked by him. He’s got his eyes on the Baltic states, and after that, even Finland.”

      Rock (11th November 2016 – “Spotting the differences”):

      You seem to be have been completely taken in by Western propaganda.

      Who has got their eyes on all the countries surrounding Russia, especially the oil rich ones?

      Who has been sponsoring revolutions on Russia’ doorstep?

      Clinton is an anti Russian hawk and warmonger whereas Trump is much more likely to have a better relationship with Putin and Russia.

      I think that would be good for world peace.

      It was extremely foolish of European leaders, Nicola included, to have openly backed Clinton against Trump.

      If the hypocrites (Nicola excluded) really meant what they said, they should start distancing themselves away from US policies detrimental to world peace instead of blindly following them as has been the case till now.”

    293. Rock says:

      lumilumi says:
      14 July, 2018 at 11:21 pm

      “Do you see why a Finn might still feel a bit wary when two fascist superpower leaders meet in my country. Not just any superpower leaders but these particular ones. One is wily, essentially a dictator, basing his power in nostalgia, popularism, nationalism, and pseudo-democracy; and the other one is the same, except stupid.”

      You are displaying your own prejudice and populist fake news.

      The vast majority of Finns have absolutely no problem in this summit being hosted in Finland.

      Otherwise the Finnish government would not have hosted it.

      Or is the Finnish government and Prime Minister also fascists to welcome a couple of fascist leaders against the wishes of the Finnish population?

    294. Rock says:

      Dave McEwan Hill says:
      15 July, 2018 at 11:00 am

      “The MSM,the unionist establishment and their representatives like Rock and Abulhaq are losing this current debate big time.”

      Not too long before Nicola declares that there will not be a second independence referendum before Brexit has been completed.

      Or Saint Theresa holds a second “snap” election where the SNP loses lots of seats to Unionists United.

      Or there is a “snap” Brexit and the SNP is caught napping and unable to hold a second independence referendum.

      I wonder what the clueless pompous armchair pundits like yourself will have to say then.

    295. Thepnr says:


      Drip drip drip. Pretty pathetic trolling Rock, I’m taking it your on a zero hours contract? Personally I can’t see it being renewed.

      lumilumi (11th November 2016 – “Spotting the differences”):

      And @ Rock.
      How dare you pontificate on me about my opinions, call me “brainwashed” by “western propaganda”. You don’t live right next door to the old Russian empire/the USSR/modern Russia that wants to be an empire again (England and Russia ought to be friends about this).

      For nearly 100 years Finland has carefully negotiated every step to keep friendly relations (often contrary to US or UK wishes, and later sometimes even general EU view).

      OK, so Trump and Putin are supposed to get along fine. Is that supposed to make my country feel comfortable?

      No, they’d be talking above our heads, my country wouldn’t matter much, just another small oil-less piece of land – but with strategic access to the Baltic Sea for Russia. (Russia’s big problem is that they have scant and awkward access to European seas).

      Whoopi-doo! (It’s even worse for the Baltic countries, they were occupied during and after WW II, Finland at least repelled the Soviet Union and kept her independence.)

    296. Hamish100 says:

      definition of rock – troll & clueless

      definition of hard rock- clueless and troll

    297. Thepnr says:

      I apologise folks, I shouldn’t have posted that response to Rock as we should ignore the disrupters on Wings. It got my gander up as it was meant to and I foolishly fell for it.

      Things have been a lot more civilised and better debate has been had in recent weeks when we don’t engage with the disrupters. That’s the entire point of his posts, to push someone’s button and elicit an angry response.

      Don’t do as I did and fall for it.

    298. Hamish100 says:

      You take your choice but the Brit psyche is fundamentally anti-Catholic.

      prey tell what is a brit psyche ?
      Douglas Rees-Mogg type is catholic

      You don’t know yer psyche’s from yir psychotics

    299. Smallaxe says:


      You didn’t fall, my friend. You were pushed, passion is permitted against pish.

    300. HandandShrimp says:

      WTF! Blue smarties? More like crack cocaine.

    301. potter says:

      Rock slithers from under his …boring as .. minimum wage?

    302. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I Think regular readers of WOS have realised that Rock’s input can be skimmed past – repetive and crap.

    303. Iain mhor says:

      Ok I’ll call it, not that it needs calling.
      Albuhaq has never lived in Scotland.
      The whole Proddy-Catholic thing Albuhaq, is a cultural thing and has shifted back and forth and is predominantly, though not exclusively, a West/Central Scotland deeply, deeply, historical ‘thing’ with a myriad of complexities.
      There’s heehaw black n white about it.
      So, dig your face out of academia and take a telling.
      Away tae fuck explaining it to Scotsmen in that neck o’ the woods – Ye’d get yer c**t kicked by baith sides and they’d team up tae dae it tae ye happily – naw, seriously, that’s exactly whit ye’d get.

    304. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      repetive = repetetive.

      Apologies for the typo.

    305. highseastim says:

      On a funnier note, whilst driving out by Troves outside Elgin this afternoon, I noted someone has painted the Belgian flag onto a piece of wood and nailed it to a post, with another piece of wood above it saying “It’s coming home – ma erse!!LOL

    306. Thepnr says:

      @Iain mhor

      I nodded my head in agreement the first time you posted that and meant to reply. No harm in repeating the message though 🙂

      I asked him outright if he was a Scot, no answer of course Scots blood in his veins he told us which he believes entitles him to lecture the rest of us in where we are going wrong.

      All kinds of people want to jump on to the Independence bandwagon for their own purposes. Beware those telling us to RISE UP and end English rule. No thanks, we can do this our way as of of today still less than 50% want to end English rule.

      There will be no civil war in Scotland that I would take part in in. We need to win Scottish people over to our side and that can only be done by talking to and persuading your neighbour, your granny or the guy in the office that suffers from the cringe.

      The grassroots are the antidote to the cringe, get out there and get in there with the head down, we will fight for an Independent Scotland with the good Scottish tongues in our mouths.

      Never miss an opportunity to talk and keep visible, get they badges back on.

    307. Iain mhor says:

      As for the “Rock”
      Listen arsehole: Finland won the last world war.
      They held Russia to a 0-0 draw, Russia went back and said ‘Fuck me! We’re a bit shit, we’d better ‘git gud’ (in modern parlance)
      Germany took a look and thought ‘Fuck me, if Finland can hold Russia to a draw, we’ll pump them!
      Germany took their eye off the European ball and went on tour to hump ‘Mother Russia’- by that time though, Russia had ‘Got Gud’ – result of that is history.
      Don’t ever presume to tell me the Finns didn’t win WW2 ya fuckwit. Not withstanding native Finns telling you tae get it right roon ye!
      How many years will it be til something, something, something, chance of something? 600 and odd years blah de fukn blah.
      Away dig yer database and pull my posts up ya fuckwit.

      Apologies to Wingers, not my usual posts, but a bit of a shitey contract, so I’m a crabbit bast*** this weather

    308. Iain mhor says:

      Cheers, been a right shitey month and not my usual. Sometimes you just have to let it go.
      That old saw about “you have the technology to access the entire knowledge of the world at your fingertips and you use it to get into arguments with complete strangers” – rings true 🙂

    309. Liz g says:

      Thepnr @ 10.18
      Nae need tae apologise,but glad that ye did say how things are better when we don’t respond.
      I can understand why ye did though…. One of the most British ( the fake construct ) thing – ever – is the arrogance of telling other’s what they are like.. and how odd they are
      While we are stuck in this bloody union and under that damming Treaty,it’s so embarrassing,to have that worldview portrayed as ours.So the urge to correct it is perfectly natural… But to remember the bigger picture and to redress it within a couple of posts…… Actually…. Well done you!
      By the way..
      Did think the “Blue Smarties” comment said it all really.
      What say you Alex?

    310. Ken500 says:

      Finland was dependent on Nazi Germany for fuel and supplies, Allied with Germany to fight against Russia. Then with the Allies to fight against Germany. Neutral 1955. Along with Ireland, Austria, Sweden and Switzerland.

      The Russian pop has halved since 1980/90’s. Glasnost/Perestoicka. Gorbachev, Yeltsin and Putin.
      150Million people have gone to self determination, self governance. Russia (USSR) the population was 300Million (on par with the US). Now it is 150Million. Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania, Bulgaria, Poland, Ukraine etc are now self governing. German reunification. All Helped by the EU. Putin has a high rating in Russia 80% because he has increased prosperity and poverty has decreased. Putin is a reformer. Not out to occupy other territories on that record. Increased democracy and freedom. Russia still has a lot of bureaucracy. It is still changing.

      If Putin and Trump can bring some peace to the world, especially the Middle East. It is welcome, especially to stop the migration crisis, caused by the US/UK and France illegally bombing the Middle East to bits for years. Total ignorance. The Americans voted for change. They got it. The loser won.

    311. Robert Peffers says:

      @Thepnr says: 15 July, 2018 at 11:30 pm:

      ” … get they badges back on.”

      Whit! I bought a small gold SNP badge when I was a laddie and I never took if off again. It then got stolen but I replaced it with other SNP badges and added a large YES badge when the YES movement took off and that has never been off but has moved from the lapel to the woolly hat.

      I’ll probably get buried with it on if I don’t make it to Independence day.

    312. Thepnr says:

      @Liz g

      Blue smarties said it all for me. Ian Brotherhood knows the score.

    313. Thepnr says:

      @Robert Peffers

      Well done you though I would have expected nothing less. Your wooly hat must weigh a ton LOL

    314. Ken500 says:

      1975 Ford and Berzhnev met in Finland, Helsinki accord

      1990 Gorbachev and Bush met in Finland

      1997 Yeltsin and Clinton met in Finland

    315. Still Positive says:

      Happy to take down my anti-Trump poster in my front window once I knew he was out of Scottish airspace.

    316. Macart says:


      Apologies for the lack of archiving, but that particular site is pants to archive.

      Anyhoo. This is either idiocy, pure theatre, or both. Bear in mind that this ‘split’ is supposedly over a deal that the EU would logically reject out of hand anyway and would still result in a hard brexit.

      Also? The threat of Corbyn would likewise result in a hard brexit for the simple reason that you couldn’t put a fag paper between May’s unrealistic wish list and Corbyn’s art of being in without being in.

      So hard Brexiteers are throwing their dummies oot the pram why?

      Aaaaaand we’re back to idiocy (see under yet another leadership backstabbing exercise), theatre for the masses (see under don’t look over here and prepare to blame Johnny Furriner), or both.

      This is, near as damn, weirdly surreal at this point.

    317. Liz g says:

      Still Positive @ 12.32
      Aye…. This is when the Scottish song … Wull ye no come back again…. Takes oan the exact English translation!

    318. Thepnr says:


      I guess that’s the main reason that Nicola Sturgeon has stuck by her plan on waiting for clarity on Brexit. The Tories are imploding and Labour show no sign of taking back control lol.

      Bide our time, we can afford to for now because this will end in tears and that much is certain.

    319. Chick McGregor says:


      A genius utilising direct popular support to by-pass the controlled mainstream media of a decadent and corrupt Western establishment in order to bring about a paradigm shift for the better.


      A clueless, extreme right wing, numpty, narcissist whose buffoonery and blundering is putting the whole World at risk.

      The juries out.

      Oh wait! – they’re back.

      That was quick.

    320. Thepnr says:

      @Chick McGregor

      Wait a minute I know this, the answers B.

      I’m positive, I think, it’s B definitely B.

      What’s my prize?

    321. Chick McGregor says:

      Oops! Grammar alert. Can’t have two nouns, should be:

      A clueless, extreme right wing, narcissistic, numpty, whose buffoonery and blundering is putting the whole World at risk.

    322. Robert Peffers says:

      @Chick McGregor says: 16 July, 2018 at 12:59 am

      “The juries out.
      Oh wait! – they’re back.
      That was quick.”

      Aye! Chick, I’ve held the opinion for a while that, “The Donald”, and, “The Boris”, are both clowns and could do very well together as a double act – if they could ever agree which one played the straight man clown and which one the idiot clown.

    323. Thepnr says:


      For old times sake and taking a leaf from Rocks book.

      Thepnr (11th November 2016 – “Spotting the differences”):

      @Chic McGregor

      “We are on the verge of a political paradigm shift. The neoliberalism experiment is collapsing having demonstrably failed the vast majority of people.”

      I’d love to know if Torrance and Fraser believe in the so called “neo-liberalism experiment” Of course it has been a failure, you can’t export jobs and production without some kind of backlash.

      The so called invisible earnings were what spurred Thatcher to close down production in coal, shipbuilding and steel. The real things that did put the Great in Great Britain. Our Industrial might.

      We closed it all down, privatised everything in sight making the bankers rich in the process. Even when the banks fail, we will bail them out as we now know to OUR cost.

      Banker bailouts have resulted in a reduction in living standards of on average £2000/year for every worker in this country since 2008. That doesn’t matter when £2000/year is 0.1% of your wage but it certainly matters when it is 10% of your wage.

      the reason the voters in England can still vote for this shit is simply because of the newspaper barons and state propaganda via the BBC about immigrants or welfare claimants.

      I was accused yesterday on a thread here of being “brainwashed” LOL. Some people need to look in a mirror.

    324. Macart says:


      Pretty much. As I say though, surreal.

      I don’t mind that they’ve brought themselves low with their power struggles. They are what they are. That they put the populations of the UK in harms way throughout this idiocy?

      It was always a question of when, not if, tbh. They had a choice and it’s fair to say they chose poorly.

    325. Chick McGregor says:


      The one thing we can learn from Trump is that the MSM can be by by-passed by politicians by calling out their lies and distortions.

      The public already know from years of their own inner credibility alert ringing that the MSM is highly establishment agendised.

      If Trump can do it by shouting ‘fake news’ when half the time it is actually true in his case, how much more successful might it be if politicians on the side of truth, i.e. the SNP, were to do so?

    326. Robert Peffers says:

      @Chick McGregor says: 16 July, 2018 at 1:35 am:

      “If Trump can do it by shouting ‘fake news’ when half the time it is actually true in his case, how much more successful might it be if politicians on the side of truth, i.e. the SNP, were to do so?”

      But Chick, the SNP has been doing it for as long as I can remember – but as no one prints it, no one broadcasts it and no one puts it on the internet except the SNP and no one but SNP members reads it on the SNP websites then no one except SNP members know about it.

    327. schrodingers cat says:

      Now consider what modern genetic science tells us. The largest portion in the overwhelming majority of British people’s genes is from the aboriginal Stone Age Britons

      um, the stone age peoples of britain and ireland died out and were replaced by the indo european beaker copper age settlers about 2500 bce.

    328. Smallaxe says:

      Bannon calls for Brexit supporters to take up arms and fight to take back the UK;

      From last month…still relevant!
      Fintan O’Toole: Trial runs for fascism are in full flow
      Babies in cages were no ‘mistake’ by Trump but test-marketing for barbarism;

      America you are in serious trouble, being led by morons. Don’t know if I should laugh or cry!;

    329. Smallaxe says:

      Theresa May battles to hold party together as Brexit splits deepen;

      Trump has stockpiled cash for his reelection;

      Leak at Porton Down lab may be behind UK nerve-agent poisonings – Russian embassy;

    330. Smallaxe says:

      Theresa May’s Fascist Britain;

      Ridiculing Trump is easy but we ignore his threat at our peril;

      Just Sitting Down With Trump, Putin Comes Out Ahead;

    331. Jock McDonnell says:

      Thanks @Smallaxe
      If we read nothing else all day, we should at least read the Fintan O’Toole article, concise & to the point.

    332. Dorothy Devine says:

      Good morning Smallaxe and thanks for he links – you are the first person to link the alliterative phrase ‘passion and pish’ for me!

      Off to make the coffee and settle down to read.

    333. Smallaxe says:

      Jock McDonnell & Dorothy Devine,

      Good morning, my friends, thank you, for your replies.
      Have a great day.

    334. thomas says:

      @ schrodingers cat

      Alright pal , i dont know what robert is talking about.

      The much publicised cheddar man , who lived 10 thousand years ago in somerset , was found to relate to only 10 % of people living in these islands.

      So how that is the overwhelming majority of people is beyond me.

      Further , 64 % of male europeans ,including us in these islands are related to just three males something like 4000 years ago

      so calling them “the original stone age britons” is extremely misleading as the term britain didnt exist back then , and it gives the impression the people living in these islands were different from other europeans when the evidence shows we are all descended from the same people.

      Last thing i will say is genetic science , nationality and culture are differing things and should never be confused.

      We share as much in common with the english as we do most other north and western europeans making the term ancient britons extremely misleading and inappropriate and certainly not unique or different from everyone else.

    335. Smallaxe says:

      Scotland in Europe Update 13th July 2018;

      HMRC seeks new access to taxpayers’ bank accounts;

      My bet still is that Theresa May will face down her overexcited critics;

    336. Smallaxe says:


      Trump’s Visit: A Strain on the Special Relationship;

      Justine Greening endorses second Brexit referendum;

    337. Highland Wifie says:

      Good morning and thanks for links Smallaxe. You’re doing a grand job.
      After reading some of what’s going on though I’m seriously thinking of hiding back under the duvet.

    338. Smallaxe says:

      Blair dismisses May’s Brexit plan as ‘mush’;

      Scottish Government Support for EU Citizens Living in Scotland;

      Lesley Riddoch: Nicola Sturgeon the winner after Donald Trump’s tour;

    339. Macart says:


      Mornin’ Smallaxe. The Fintan O’ Toole article in the Irish Times hit the nail on the head. A powerful and insightful piece of writing.

      I’d strongly suggest everyone reads.

      Hoping Nana is keeping well?

    340. Smallaxe says:

      Good morning, Highland Wifie,

      Thank you, now get out from under the duvet and Stand Up for Your Rights!
      Have a great day.

    341. Breeks says:

      Theresa May warns EU exit may not happen ‘at all’ if rebel Tories don’t play ball.

      Yeah, and England might still win the World Cup.

    342. Smallaxe says:


      Nana is supposed to be resting but still doing far too much as usual.

      Here’s another one for you, my friend,
      Ireland set to remove oil reserves from Britain as Brexit deadline looms closer
      Have a great day!

    343. frogesque says:

      I’m knackered.

      Apparently I spent all night in the middle of a roundabout. Waving a giant YES2 flag. Dressed in a gorrilla suit.

      Beep beep!

    344. Macart says:


      Thanks Smallaxe. I’d heard this was a possibility and no shocks to find Ireland finally taking action.

      Also no shocks about Nana. 😀 Stubborn doesn’t begin to describe…

      You have a good too ma friend.

    345. Smallaxe says:


      Pacific trade bloc rules out early UK entry
      Callum Jones, Trade Correspondent
      July 16 2018, 12:01 am,
      The Times

      Donald Trump
      US politics
      United States

      Britain could wait years before it can join a trade bloc that Theresa May singled out as a major post-Brexit opportunity, senior officials have warned.

      Members of an 11-nation alliance that includes Canada, Mexico, Australia and Japan have welcomed UK interest in signing up but are currently focused on enforcing their deal and “securing the opportunities” it creates for its founders.

      The prime minister has dismissed Brexiteers’ claims that her strategy would prevent Britain from signing trade deals, saying that it would “enable us to accede” to the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership (CPTPP).

      Officials from countries within the bloc say the chances of a swift agreement with Britain are slim, however, as the UK is expected to strike individual deals with member states such as New Zealand and Australia first.

      “We do support Britain coming in but we’ve got to be realistic about the timetable that will take,” a source said.

      A trade spokesman for the Canadian government told The Times: “With respect to interest from others like the UK in joining the new deal, our focus right now is on ratification and securing the opportunities we achieved as one of the original signatories to the new CPTPP. The fact there have been expressions of interest from other jurisdictions illustrates just how many opportunities this deal represents.”

      A white paper published last week said Britain would “potentially” attempt to join to the bloc “on terms consistent with the future relationship with the EU, and domestic priorities”.

      It started life as a proposed agreement crafted by the US to counter the dominance of China. When President Trump abandoned the deal, the remaining members — which also include Brunei, Chile, Malaysia, Peru, Singapore and Vietnam — forged ahead and signed an agreement in March. Six nations must formally ratify the deal before it comes into force.

      When the trans-Pacific bloc finally crossed the line earlier this year, some expressed surprise. “It’s a bit like Australia entering the Eurovision song contest,” a former British minister said. “You can’t quite work out how it works.”

      In April, Mr Trump ordered officials to examine whether the US should, in fact, sign up.

      A spokesman for Britain’s Department for International Trade said: “We are exploring what opportunities this could present to the UK.” Canada has also expressed interest in striking a bilateral trade deal with Britain. Justin Trudeau, its prime minister, has said that Brexit could allow Canada to strike a “more impactful” agreement with the UK than its deal with Brussels.

    346. Macart says:

      Mmmmm. That should have read ‘ a good day too’. (sigh)

    347. Smallaxe says:

      To understand what is happening to the NHS, you must understand the relationship between private healthcare corporations and those who are running our NHS. This is part of a deliberate, long-term plan and it’s happening now.;

    348. galamcennalath says:

      Media full of rebellion against TMay and talk of EURef2. Exactly what is this second vote supposed to achieve and what’s could be on offer? There won’t be anything other than a Divorce Treaty known before Brexit.

      The English were presented with an option of Leave, which was in effect to give carte blanche to the Tories to decide how to leave. They chose this. They then had a general election to choose that Tory government. They have been asked TWICE and the outcome is Leave defined and delivered by Tories.

      The REAL ISSUE is what happens to Scotland and Northern Ireland who are being dragged out against our will. Any EURef2 should deal with THAT ISSUE as a priority. It won’t.

      EURef2 needs to have a clear, understood, and binding plan to allow NI and Scotland to remain in the EU (or at least the single market) if the outcome is England again voting to leave. It won’t.

      We need IndyRef2 to settle this. England voted to Leave, they need to be left to get on with this. We need to have the option of going our own way. The time of parting ways is upon us.

    349. Smallaxe says:

      Sutherland site is UK spaceport frontrunner;

      Sorry but I haven’t had time to listen to this, so please take it as you find it, thank you.

      Theresa May’s grand plan has left her stranded in no woman’s land;

    350. Ken500 says:

      1975 Brezhnev Ford met in Finland. Helsinki Accord

      1990 Gorbachev met Bush

      1997 Yeltsin met Clinton

      1986 Reagan and Gorbachev met in Reykjavik, Iceland. To try and limit nuclear prolification. Reagan did not agree.

      The US spends the most on Defence in the world. A third of all world Defence spending.

      $611Billion. They can’t afford it. Half of all Federal taxes.

      The Saudis (33Million pop) spend $66Billion (pro rata the highest)

      The Chinese (pop 1.3Billion) spend $228Billion
      Russia (150Million pop) spends $69Billion.

      The Chinese and Russians are not the warmongers.

      The US and the Saudis are the warmongers. Saudis the most absolute despot monarchy in the world breaking every international Law. Israel the apartheid State breaks all international Law. The US acts as a mercenary for them both. It can’t afford it.

      The first people in the world came from Africa. Everybody in the world carries the DNA strand. They are related. Great big melting pot. Hopefully will not go up in smoke.

    351. Ken500 says:

      There will be a GE. So the Tories can lose to get them out of the mess. Labour unionists and the rest are just as incompetent and useless. Who wants the poison chalice? What a Westminster shambles. Sanctioning and starving people. Causing the migration crisis in Europe. Havoc and misery. They are despicable.

      Vote SNP/SNP. Vote for Independence. For prosperity and better governance.

    352. Smallaxe says:

      Israel blew up a public park & children’s play area to kill, maim & spread terror: but now watch it cry, victim;

      Please stop arming Israel;

      Have a peaceful and productive day, Wingers.

    353. Macart says:

      Apparently Scotland is to be considered for a burgeoning UK spaceport programme. Hmmmm!

      I recall that some reasonably high profile British nationalists considered Scotland’s space industry potential laughable not so long ago.

      Their apologies on a postcard, care of Bute House, any day now I’m sure.

    354. Smallaxe says:

      A Finnish Paper Is Trolling Trump And Putin About Press Freedom Before Their Big Meeting;

    355. wull2 says:

      If there is a snap GE, can we have a independence vote on the same day to save costs.
      I hope the answer is YES, YES, YES

    356. Graeme says:

      Totally OT but watching the World Cup award ceremony yesterday I couldn’t help thinking what an amazing lady the Croatian President is, Even though her team lost you could see pride written all over her face for her small country,

      Apparently she traveled economy class with the fans with her own money, supported the team side by side with the fans,hugged each and every player (of both sides) after the final in the pouring rain.

      That’s what I call a president

    357. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Ken500 at 9.36

      I had a conversation with a bampot at my local investment office (aka Ladbrokes) who was rabitting on about Putin and AS being on Putin’s TV. I agreed. Lost faith with Putin when he invaded Iraq I said. Should have learned after he invaded Vietnam and invaded Afghanistan. Put the cap on it I said when he destroyed Libya.
      Open mouthed response.
      But he’s representative of the general view.

    358. Finland, so proud of you.

      I wish our press were more like yours.

    359. ronnie anderson says:

      Macart there’s ah big F in Bee Sting in there hopes & asperations & there boosting the UK economy & thats Scottish Independence lol.

    360. Smallaxe says:

      Are Scottish youth in favour of independence? Is Scottish independence inevitable?
      Peter A Bell
      Answered Jul 16, 2018;

      May hit by another PPS resignation as Tory MP says he won’t accept ‘watered down Brexit’ – Politics live;

    361. Macart says:

      @ronnie anderson

      ‘Course, all their own idea t’boot Ron. 🙄

      Simple choice though. A £3.5bn boost to the UK economy, or a £3.5 boost to Scotland’s economy?

    362. Smallaxe says:

      ronnie anderson,

      Ah couldnae resist it, Ronnie;

    363. Brian Powell says:

      On the Scottish Space Industry. Over the last 300 hers Scots have been handing over their achievements to Westminster and the Tories so there is no reason why the Tories shouldn’t claim this as their own.

      If you don’t protect it gets taken from you, and quite right too.

    364. Macart says:

      Should read ‘£3.5bn boost to Scotland’s economy’. (DUH!)

    365. Dr Jim says:

      Justine Greening and her plan:

      Multiple choice Brexit with 3 options

      Option 1 Leave
      Option 2 Leave some more
      Option 3 Remain a bit

      Scotlands involvement and options in this new plan are

      Option 1 Wait and see what England decides all over again
      Option 2 There is no option if we agree to option 1

      Scottish Solution: A decision from Scotland not to put up with any more of Englands batty twisted options where Scotlands vote doesn’t count anyway in order that England can pretend to justify a lunatic decision to itself on behalf of the lying Tory party who came up with this shit in the first place for their own ideological party political survival

      Remember folks, Prime Minister Cameron ran away after promising to see it all through win or lose, he lost and ran
      Theresa May wasn’t even first choice for PM it could’ve been Boris, he didn’t want it, Gove, he didn’t want it, Leadsom, she didn’t want it, so they had to find somebody who was a bit thick but with a giant ego and up popped Theresa May the most incompetent Home office minister of all time, 6 years at the Home office spent hiding on the stairs doing nothing saw an opportunity for glory and here she is, still doing nothing

      Even the British Nationalists are struggling to keep up the excuses for this pile of shit, oh they still want to leave alright they just don’t even know what they’re leaving

      I’m just away to get the top of this bottle of bleach and drink it, I don’t care how hard it is to get the top off and I don’t care what’s in the bottle, I’m drinking it anyway and nobody’s going to tell me not to

      Coz I’m not stupid!

    366. Ken500 says:

      MSM total misinformation. A propaganda coup. Non Dom tax evading owners. Just a disgrace. Controlled by Westminster hypocrites.

    367. Meg merrilees says:

      Anent the Scottish Spacelaunching site:

      So when are they going to attach nuclear warheads to the space ‘satellites’ that the UK gov wants to launch from Sutherland?? Gey handy for reaching Russia/China and N/Korea over the Arctic circle.

      Is Trident dead – didn’t T May actually just ask for the UK to be downgraded from a tier one nuclear state – phasing out obsolete trident because the USA isn’t prepared to support them after mid 2020’s?

      I wonder why they are putting this site that has controlled explosions in such a remote place? Isn’t that near the area where they wanted to carry out nuclear tests in the ’50’s?

      I smell a funny smell and it’s all part of the big bribe to stop people voting for INDY REF 2.

      Read the press release “.. the site in Scotland will be the first but there will be more”

      I guess there will be a two year planning hiatus which will conveniently straddle the next Indy ref2 and then surprise surprise, whether we vote YES or the other way, they’ll decide to put it in Cornwall or some other place as far away as possible from WM.

      Call me a luddite but I never trust a tory bringing gifts.

    368. ronnie anderson says:

      Smallaxe i was going to put it up myself lol cannae get to much of McGinn

    369. Smallaxe says:


      This wan’s mair appropriate;


    370. Ken500 says:

      The Space site subject to Scottish planning Laws. Scottish Law Courts.

      They are trying to develop space travel. So a craft get zoom into space to Australia in a hour. They are already being designed, They will be harvest minerals in short supply on earth, from space planets in a decade. From Mars etc. Already being developed.

    371. Luigi says:

      Dr Jim says:

      16 July, 2018 at 11:33 am

      Theresa May wasn’t even first choice for PM it could’ve been Boris, he didn’t want it, Gove, he didn’t want it, Leadsom, she didn’t want it, so they had to find somebody who was a bit thick but with a giant ego and up popped Theresa May…

      “I’m no Spartacus, He’s Spartacus!”

      “No, I’m not Spartacus, He’s Spartacus!”

      “I’m not – She is Spartacus!”

      TM: “Ok ya yelly bellies – I’m Spartacus!”

    372. auld highlander says:

      This proposed space location couldn’t get much further north, according to the bias broadcasting company it’s location is between Bettyhill and Durness,

      And the Electron rocket that they intend firing is a two stage expendable launch vehicle.

      If this so called space port was to benefit anybody it would be located down south but ask yourself this. Why locate it up here? There is no way they would have it down south if it was a danger of a device exploding and obliterating the good residents.

      Space port my erse, it’s looks more like a cheap way of launching nukes.

    373. Macart says:

      @Meg merrilees

      Oh, it’s a bribe. They have just one minor problem.

      It totally undermines a prior stance taken by Scottish conservatives.

      Article on the original Common Weal report here:

      This is completely achievable with or without UKgov. It’s a case of attempting to bribe you with something you can have if want it anyway.

    374. ronnie anderson says:

      Rev whits the verdict wie Dugdale , or ur you under ah gagging order

    375. Dr Jim says:

      How can you be a health minister if you smoke says John Beattie, I presume calling for phone ins from the great Scottish Yoon supporting public to have Jean Freeman sacked before she gets her feet under her desk

      Now here was me thinking Jean Freeman was getting the job of running a business on behalf of the government of Scotland, I never knew nor cared whether Jean Freeman smoked cigarettes cigars or a pipe but I suppose we have to expect this kind of infantile pettyness from Britnat world, a world in which they can lie to millions of people and get away with it but God help somebody in the SNP who dares to have a quick puff of a fag wae her tea because that is completely and totally unacceptable because eh, eh, oh role model or something

      What was I saying about that lying thing again?

    376. Ken500 says:

      She should stop smoking. Get some patches or chewing gum. Show how it can be done. Healthier.

    377. Ken500 says:

      The BBC puppet, muppets are a disgrace. The nonsense is astounding.

    378. Smallaxe says:

      Look out Govanhill!

      Hello, my darling.
      This Saturday we will be leafleting in Govanhill, which is part of Nicola Sturgeon’s constituency.
      If you want to help us leaflet door to door then please reply to this email for further information.

      Andrew Skinner
      Scotland in Union/Free firelighters.

    379. mike cassidy says:

      I liked this article on Brexit negotiations.

      Has anybody ever seen this film it mentions.

      An EU thriller based on a book by Boris’ dad!

    380. Thepnr says:

      @ronnie anderson

      The Sheriff has taken a time out to decide whether the case should go ahead or not. Kezia Dugdales QC has asked for it to be thrown out.

    381. Highland Wifie says:


      Yes sir! ?
      Bring it on. We can do this.

    382. Smallaxe says:

      Highland Wifie,

      We will do it!

    383. Ghillie says:

      Thepnr @ 10.07 pm

      Oor hard pal went just past his/her usual bedtime =) And then not up to reply. Hmmm.

      Legerwood @ 4.25 pm Thank you for the links to Newsnet (still have their decal in my car window from early 2014!)

      Chilling reading. Worth a look folks.

    384. Highland Wifie says:

      Does anyone know why my smiley faces always turn into question marks?

    385. Ghillie says:

      Dr Jim @ 12.41 pm

      As someone who thoroughly enjoyed working many years for ASH Scotland, having stopped smoking the day before the interview (! They never asked!) I can assert there are few folk more sympathetic to the plight of the smoker or their difficulties in quitting than someone who knows what it is all about!

      This is not a draw back for our Health Minister. She is real. She is human.

    386. galamcennalath says:

      Highland Wifie says:

      Does anyone know why my smiley faces always turn into question marks?

      You need to use the correct codes for WordPress 8)

    387. Ghillie says:

      Highland Wifie @ 1.15 pm

      A gremlin?

      A very unsure gremlin mibee?

      You are not alone. I’m sure I’ve heard this very question asked before.

      Someone knows the answer. Not me, sorry, just being supportive until its sorted =)

      Question marks instead of smilies sends a very different message. Hang on, someone WILL sort this for you!

      I press a : then ) close together. Hope that helps. 🙂

    388. frogesque says:

      Here’s a brilliant wheeze, see all that Scotch touristy stuff created by those pesky Gnats and their North Coast 500? Well, guessed what, we can bugger it up with a nuke, umm sorry Space Port exclusion zone!

      Oh! Spiffing idea chaps!

      Thought the original SNP proposal was something a bit more substantial at Prestwick ??

    389. Thepnr says:

      @Highland Wifie

      Ghillie has given the answer that works for me. A colon : followed by close brackets ) gives 🙂

    390. Highland Wifie says:

      Thank you.
      Testing 🙂

    391. Highland Wifie says:

      Sorry it was Ghillie who suggested. Thanks Ghillie.

    392. Highland Wifie says:

      Thanks for that link to WordPress. That is really useful info.
      I think emojis on iPad must be incompatible with whatever system is used for Wings comments but I’m happy for anyone to tell me otherwise.

    393. Shinty says:

      frogesque “Well, guessed what, we can bugger it up with a nuke, umm sorry Space Port exclusion zone!”

      Let’s not forget, long before the NC500 was famous. The
      barstewards at Aldermaston were going to nuke on the Stacks of Duncansby in the 1950’s.

      The test was cancelled only due to bad weather. Think they ended up testing in some poor corner of Australia.

    394. Ghillie says:

      Highland Wifie @ 2.34 pm

      You are very welcome, glad to be useful =)

      🙂 🙂 🙂

    395. Ghillie says:

      Shinty @ 3.15 pm

      VERY few folk know about that.

      Caithness came VERY near to being blown off the map if not at least to being utterly and for ever contaminated. Thank God for Highland weather!

      Not to mention the death of most Sinclairs, Gunns, Mackays and many many folk, ooh and the Castle of Mey being forevermore inaccessible (did the Quinne’s Maither know about that!)

      But hey, those broad shoulders and all that.

    396. Ghillie says:


      I feel a wee bit sick at the thought of the ‘space port’ in Sutherland.

      I know the location well.

      Many worries about it.

      Will withhold judgement until I know the whole story.

    397. yesindyref2 says:

      @Meg merrilees
      The UK doesn’t really have warheads for ICBMs any more, it got rid of the WE 177 which was a freefall bomb from the Vulcans back in the 90s, so all it has is the wearheads for the subs, the SSBNs – Trident. And I think Glen Douglas would be a better site, even if it is a huge munitions storage base. The new spaceport would be civilian, and the UK also still has ranges on/off North Uist, more suited to its needs.

      What that spaceport might be used for, however, is launching the UK equivalent of the US GPS as I think the UK is frozen out of the French-German version (I forget its name) because of Brexit.

    398. yesindyref2 says:

      I thinkn it will be good for Scotland, as we have one-fifth of the UK’s space program already. Very kind of UK Gov, ta muchly! But yes as someone said, timing is a bit critical. Its remoteness by the way is the reason for selection, as if the rocket blows up or is destroyed in flight, it’s a fair way away from population, and the launch would go out over sea. Presumably with a temporary fishing exclusion zone!

    399. Liz g says:

      Testing….. 🙂

    400. Meg merrilees says:

      Me too…:)

    401. Liz g says:

      Meg Merrilees 1.21
      Doesn’t work from my mobile phone.

    402. Fred says:

      @ Ghillie, great bothy on the Moine, worth the traipse! Happy Days!


    403. Fred says:

      Michael Fry calls Modric “small ugly & elfin!” fuckin pots & kettles!

    404. yesindyref2 says:

      @Liz g
      I managed to post for the first time on my mobile (iPhone 4s with Safari) last week at Tongue – slow wifi connection. It’s a bit of a pain with a small screen and small letters!

    405. Cactus says:

      Me three 🙂

      Imagine this Cairnstoon and put your own words in the place of Mundell.

      What would you say…?

      Ah’ll suggest; “Here Trump.. ye hit yer baw the other way laddie..”

    406. Cactus says:

      Instead of word bubble, howsabout he said this hehe: (alternate version)

      There are two key ingredients.

      Next up…

    407. Cactus says:

      It has been an eventful day, politics of the UK.

      17 July, 2018 at 11:51 pm

    408. Cactus says:

      The purple obelisk, mmmmh: (frae a different perspective)

      Aussi, see how the spokesperson of their Orange Order last week stated that it wiznae wan of their heidbangers that spat on the holy person…


      Same as Ally McCoist, upon their antics way back in ’14 in the Square.

      LBC is illuminating.

      Enjoy the movie.

      Cheers CC.

    409. Cactus says:

      Did ye enjoy the movie?

      Mundell says to Trump, “Go West!”

      Topically, this was Boris Jo in a previous life:

      And their shared surname is definitely the same.

      That’s how they rolled in Rockridge like.

      “I’m booked solid” 🙂

    410. Cactus says:

      Greetings frae oor Merchant City…

      Glasgow, the Caring City.

      Gaun Glasgowin’.



    411. Cactus says:

      Mundell says to Dirty Donald…

      “You’ve left your putter in No. 17’s bunker laddie.”

      Fuck YOU Donald!
      (your citizens and ‘neighbors’ are not an experiment).

      Love the US of America.

      Adore Scotland.

      D’amour GLA.

      Love it 🙂

    412. Cactus says:

      Pan, tilt, zoom in on oor Hamish.

      He not impressed.

      He angry like.

      CC kens.

      David Mundell is ‘The Bawbag Carrier’.

      Theresa ewe May not like.

      Ahhhhh ha ha ha ha ha.

    413. Cactus says:

      Pan, tilt, zoom in on oor Hamish.

      He not impressed.

      He angry like.

      CC kens.

      David Mundell is ‘The Bawbag Carrier’.

      Theresa ewe May not like.

      Ahhhhh ha ha ha ha ha.

      Did aye post this comment already like, let’s do it again, to be sure, to be sure, there IS always poetic delay…

      Did you know that like…?

      Aye did and do.

      D minor.

    414. Cactus says:

      Shit tables…

      Won twice outta 10.

      Back in Botega.

      Be a merchant.

      Be foreigner.

      Go Sco.

    415. Cactus says:

      Heading along Argyle St PP… Catty bound, prob too late, bus check…

      HOME soon.

      Love WOS.

      Ye ken.



    416. Cactus says:

      Ahm at Glasgow’s Grand Central Hotel…

      Got food.

      Somebuddy knows.

    417. Cactus says:

      Ra last time when ah wiz at ra doors wae Ian Brotherhood, wiz at this central hotel.


      Good morning LOVERS.

      We cool like…?

    418. Cactus says:

      Check dis out…

      Ah got knocked back frae Glasgow’s Delmonica’s for being too straight!

      Ahhhhy ha ha ha ha ha, tis good tae be me LIKE.

      Love Glasgow.


    419. Cactus says:

      Ahm back HOME Tjenny, love you xx.

      Here we GO…

      Be Extreme and dance:

      It is raining…

      Tick fucking tick fucking tick fucking tock fucking lovers of Scotland.

      Take it up… NOW!

      Be empowered!!!

    420. Cactus says:

      Me on The bag carrier again.

      Rattled it.. whose up?

      iSCO very soon.

    421. Cactus says:

      Anyways aye like, gettin’ back on topic Wingers.

      Have an excellent week.

      Golf’s up.

      T down.


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