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Wings Over Scotland

The Absolute State

Posted on March 30, 2024 by

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0 to “The Absolute State”

  1. Kenny

    Painfully accurate. I could cry.

    I think we’re a pilot for where the entire developed world is headed.

  2. Mark Beggan


  3. Mark Beggan

    The big Coo is the best.
    So good.

  4. BettyBoop

    Brilliantly captured…

  5. Georges

    A picture is worth a thousand words.
    Hopefully Wings, like women, won’t wheesht.

  6. Alastair Campbell

    Haste ye back

  7. Alison

    Oh, Humza.

  8. Mac

    How long before we have an actual case of some indoctrinated child reporting his parents for saying some wrongthink at home.

    Police Scotland building secret files on people for things which are not crimes but which they will ‘share’ with future potential employers…

    This is full on Stasi territory.

    It is hard to believe what is going on right now.

  9. Linda McFarlane

    Perfectly described Chris.

  10. Old John

    So good, but so sad at the same time. How on earth have we allowed ourselves to get to where we seem to be now?
    Anyway, good to see that you’re doing your bit for diversity, and that the cow at least is brown, and not “white white white”

  11. duncanio

    SNP’s Scotland:

    Police State, not Free State.

  12. Jeremy Wickins

    That coo is scary! Great cartoon, Chris – hope we’ll see many more soon.

  13. The Isolator

    Stick a fork in Scotland as a nation. We’re done. Until…

  14. Morgatron

    Chris, I’m worried I will get into trouble for liking your marvellous, cartoon by Stasi Scotland.

    I just can’t believe what’s happening here any longer since Sturgeon and her stooge took over. Democracy, free speech, my arse.

  15. Dan

    Nae sign of Hamish in that pic! Though guessing he may have already left Scotland for warmer climes and be found dozing in a sun lounger whilst Chris whacks WHITE! golf balls about a meadow.

    Ach, all this crap we’re enduring reminds me of this previous cartoon. 🙁

  16. Frank Gillougley

    That’s a crystal clear perspective, Chris. The power of a cartoon to depict a whole political actuality at a human level, way better than words, though i do love the title of the piece, The Absolute State. And a state that has failed, can only turn in on itself.

    Words can’t describe what I think about all these politicians and Holyrood – My disgust at these miserable wretches. Stop voting, to change the system.

  17. Scaredy Cat

    This really is unbelievable, but the worst thing we can do is fail to take it seriously. Wings will be missed but you are doing the right thing for now.
    I really hope this legislation is quickly repealed, but I fear it will leave a lot of misery in its wake.
    Who would have predicted that in 2024 in Scotland, of all places, we would have come to this. It is so very sad and frightening.
    Anyone who hasn’t seen the movie “the lives of others” should watch it. It is a very accurate portrayal of how bad things can get when the government intrudes and the private lives and thoughts of its citizens.
    Stay safe everyone!

  18. Chas

    How long will it be before a machine gun nest is visible in the tower, along with a couple of snipers?
    What a sad, sorry place Scotland is. I only voted SNP once and that was 40 years ago-don’t blame me.

  19. Breeks

    Uncannily prophetic. Who’d have thunk it… ever.

  20. Giesabrek

    When this madness starts turn it against the SNP and Greens – listen to every word they utter or print, looking for something that could offend you, then report it to Police anonymously. Not only overwhelm the cops enforcing this draconian law but at least some of the complaints against the SNP and Greens will have to be investigated.

  21. Carol Neill

    Sad and scary , hopefully not your last

  22. Rab Clark

    A wee WOS-related poll included here…

  23. Andy Ellis

    Another belter Chris: we’ll all miss these during Wings’ (hopefully temporary?) lock down.

    In the meantime, perhaps folk should take a look at supporting organisations resisting “this king of thing”?


    If it is not forbidden do not presume to think it will remain so.
    Remember «l’État c’est nous».
    «But the State has no nous», said the small boy.
    «Such precocity», screamed the Citizens Commissar.
    «In the name of State, Out with his brain!»
    Amen! mumbled the Masses.

  25. fran

    Come Monday, it will probably be a crime to like this. Sums up how we all feel Chris.

  26. Den

    Belter… isn’t it sad that Scotland has been brought to such a point by the SNP\Greens, ably assisted by Labour and Lib Dem’s. How on gods earth did it ever come to this ? how can an administration possibly be so polarised on every level from the Scottish people ? There needs to be a root and branch clear out of Holyrood it has been contaminated to such a point were getting rid of a few weeds will no longer save us.

  27. Bob J

    What a sad day for Scotland and all lovers of liberty and freedom. Makes me weep. However, .if we keep our heads down and we have already lost. It’s time to get of our knees to stand up and be counted. Not you Stuart. You have done your share and more. Take a richly deserved break, and one day come back in hope of this:

    Posterity did ne’er survey a nobler sight than this
    Here lie the bones of Sturgeon
    Stop traveller and piss

    Apologies to Lord Bryson

  28. Alf Baird

    duncanio @ 8:03 am

    “Police State, not Free State.”

    And meanwhile, alongside the intensified oppression we see ‘whenever colonialism is imperiled’, the economic plunder continues: i.e. a Colonial State.

  29. Oneliner

    What a fitting swansong from Chris. And nil desperandum Rev Stu – I’m sure that there are other things you can put ‘Over Scotland’ if you so desire.

    Remember the clocks go forward tomorrow in the UK – the acronym being:


  30. Grouser

    One of the best cartoons; sadly, it says it all.
    I am busy making little green and purple bows (not nooses) which I will attach to my YES badges on all my coats in honour of the Suffragettes who suffered for women’s rights and all those who came after who suffered discrimination because of their sex (XX) – myself included.
    Will anyone take umbrage at a 76 year old woman over this?

  31. JockMcT

    Did anyone vote for this? Thought not. We have to fight this, all the way. It needs co-ordination, but without Wings, how do we do that? SNP have to pay a heavy price. Oh, and the sign needs the hate monster at the bottom of it, doesn’t it. Good luck to us all.

  32. willie

    Have the freeports now extended down to Gretna perchance?

    Britain’s very own Guantanamo Bay replete with all the security apparatus!

  33. JockMcT

    In the Telegraph. Scotland’s Hate Crime Act will make opinions dangerous – and play into the trans lobby’s hands

    Good article, and they don’t seem worried they will be reported or put anyone’s nose out of joint. Big thing that strikes me is how totally into this the SNP Wokerati under Yuseless are.

    Independence? Who would want it under this lot, and they just don’t care. Wee dark devolved Scotland, and before our very eyes!

    So begins the curtain twitching and score settling. The police are crapping it before the deluge, so maybe we all need to make sure it is a Tsunami that sweeps the place clean of this nonsense.

  34. Mia

    Welcome to 2024 Scotland, the nation where even cows have been repurposed to spy on people.

    The nation where political parasites working for any entity under the sun other than Scotland herself, have secured state-sponsored abuse of parliamentary seats; state-sponsored deconstruction of democracy; and state-sponsored misuse of taxpayers’ funds to fund toxic quangos and create an illusion of diversity of opinion; launch fabricated accusations and then proceed to hide the real criminals so, rather than being prosecuted, they can be parachuted to some plum job from where they can continue patronising us with their lessons on faux morality, faux ethics and self-righteousness.

    This is the nation where the political parasites who call themselves our “representatives” have made a complete mockery of our parliament, have unlawfully handed over Scotland’s legislative and executive control to external entities so they can deny us our right to create our own laws and force on us instead toxic ones like this one, which are now proceeding, like the good useful idiots they are, to force on us, on behalf of their handlers.

    These wannabe dictators do not belong in a parliament. They belong in jail. Every single one of them.

    Meanwhile, criminals like the thief/thieves of the 600,000 pounds in donations for the referendum continue to roam free in front of our noses, as do the “leaker”, the “perjurers” who participated in the fabricated case against Mr Salmond or the “legal” minds who launched malicious prosecutions.

    Because, of course, in Yousaf and Sturgeon’s Scotland as the colony of the north, prosecuting real crime is of no advantage for the imperial power compared with forcefully gagging yes people who has the audacity to use their brain to think logically, to acknowledge biological science, and, heaven forbid, to demand enforcement of popular sovereignty and see the politicians for the useless empty vessels and treacherous puppets they are.

    Political parasites, their external handlers and their “advisers” and support in high places may be saying “yes” to Scotland becoming a police state. But if the people of Scotland stands up to these self-serving creeps and says “no” and “stick your fascist legislation up yer arse”, it will be a no.

    I refuse to accept these mediocre wastes of space and the even more waste of space that are those directing them to assault and insult their country like this, can silence an entire nation, so they can fullfil their toxic and self-serving interests. We should resist this with ever fiber of our being.

    The first step is to find out who are those handlers, where are they based and what are the interests they are really pursuing.

    The next is to use every opportunity to report to the police whenever one of these biology deniers insult a woman by calling them “terfs” or “cis”; or ageists insult middle-aged or older people by calling them “boomers” or by discriminating them by claiming “politics belongs to the young”; or any politician dares to insult Scotland’s intelligence by claiming “hate” is rampant in Scotland; or any politician dares to attempt to distort the representation of the population of Scotland by claiming there are far “too many white people” in positions of power.

    The next is to bypass this failed political system. This toxic legislation has demonstrated how this system has failed us and it is no longer designed to represent the people of Scotland, but rather to control them and to silence them.

    We need independent candidates who will not respond to the triple whip coming from some self-entitled arsehole acting as the useful idiot for some external power who takes delight in pissing on us from high.

    Stu and Chris: thank you for your outstanding work. It has been eye-opening, informative, entertaining and a delight to read and to watch. It has been a pleasure to watch the parasites squirm whenever you published one of your articles.

    Thank you for your efforts and for successfully revealing just how useless, vindictive, untrustworthy and betraying those parasites sitting in Holyrood and Westminster, allegedly representing Scotland, really are.

    There is no way back. The concept of party politics in Scotland, and I dare say the UK, has been killed by these parasites and their greedy handlers. Party politics is no longer, if it ever was, a way to exercise popular sovereignty. It is a tool to deny popular sovereignty. It is deliberately vague legislation like this what reveals the true colours and purpose of the political parties bringing this forward, those voting for it, those advising on it and those implementing it.

    They used to say “religion is the opium of the masses”. Well, right now, in 2024 Scotland, party politics has become the propofol of critical thinking, democracy and the fundamental right of freedom of expression.

    An excess of propofol is lethal. Right now, this toxic legislation represents an overdose of state-sponsored and forced thought and expression repression.

    If we do not want to be put to sleep, it is time to bypass party politics and all the abuse that has come through it.

    See you all at the other side.

  35. Stoker

    LMAO! What a work of art. Outstanding! Top class Mr Cairns, you never cease to amaze. The big Highland Coo… Watery eyes with laughter.

  36. John Main

    Fa’s the streams o cars heading sooth?

    That’s gonna be a thing BTW. If the additional Tartan Tax doesn’t drive Scots and jobs across the border, the ludicrous price differentials associated with booze and foodstuffs will.

    If the cross-border price differential on petrol and diesel gets high enough once Grangemouth closes, shopping trips to England may become self financing. And maybes English leccy for recharging will be cheaper too.

    So we’ll need border inspections, paperwork, ID, and limits on the importation of alcohol for personal use.

    Oh well, the SNP long fantasised about a hard border between England and Scotland. The faithful always thought it would be to keep the English out. How long until it’s also keeping us in?

    Ah ken, I’ve taken that too far. But who back in 2014 predicted what’s happening from Monday?

    Still 2+ more years of pretendy FM HY calling the shots too. We’re gonna all be living in innarestin times.

  37. Stuart MacKay

    If you have nothing to say, then you having nothing to fear.

  38. Johnlm

    In truth the cops have been running wild since Covid and in every western country.
    Which the western BTL fanboys seem unaware of.

    Australia has rushed through a Digital ID Bill, with minimal debate, 2 days ago.

    There seems to be a crisis point approaching and they don’t want debate on it.

    The WHO is trying to get World sovereign powers over health issues, due to be voted on in May.
    Is that the crisis?
    With everything being now conflated into the One Health initiative humans, animals and climate are now being packaged as health issues and immense power shifts to the UN/WHO.

  39. Republicofscotland

    Come April 1st, Scots, most Scots, will be to afraid to discuss any topic incase they feel they are breaking the evil hate crime laws, conversations will be tainted with a lack of free speech, Christ even the (US) Great Satan’s First Amendment protects Free Speech, what does that say about those vile bastards at Holyrood, the idea is to shut us up or bang us up under the guise of preventing hate speech.

    In Scotland in 48 hours free speech will be over, finished done with, they’ll be an aura of fear and loathing combined with anger and frustration that those treacherous bastards in government in Scotland along with many other unionist branch office MSPs have created vile laws to shut Scots up.

    Anyone can make a complaint even anonymously there are several designated points that a complainer can make a complaint, one being a sex shop in Glasgow how fuckin ludicrous is that, the SNP government are really taking the piss here.

    The Scottish Stasi (Police Scotland) will carry out the hate crime laws enforcement with gusto, some have had training other Stasi officers have an affiliation to certain groups than in their eyes matter more than others.

    Another thing that will happen for sure is that those MSPs that voted for the evil Hate Crime Laws have unwittingly demonised Police Scotland, people will look at those police officers in a suspicious manner now, they’ll find them untrustworthy and see them in a different light as they arrest folk for making conversation that has been twisted or massaged to look like some sort of hate crime.

    How much more are Scots going to take from this government before they say enough is enough, the next couple of months will surely answer that question.

    Lets at least get every SNP MP out at the next GE send those bastards at Holyrood a clear message, we want you out.

    The Sword of Damocles, will come April 1st be hanging over all our heads in Scotland remember who put it there.

  40. Molesworth

    Goodbye Stu and Chris. Haste ye back.

  41. Xaracen

    Absolutely superb, Chris! Arguably one of your best ever.

  42. Stoker

    Well, folks, given the last 2 – 3 articles on WOS i have decided to call it a day until further notice, ie: there is a great deal of legal clarity on this situation. And by that i mean in Scotland.

    I will, from time to time, check in and see if there is any change to Stuart’s position. But other than that? I’m out!

    NOTE to Sturgeon’s Nasty Party, Yous will *NEVER* get another vote from me, at any level. Yous have Sturgeon & Murrell to thank for that. The SNP are no longer a party for indy but rather a party of self-serving Wokesters hell-bent on destroying Scotland and the idea of self-determination.

    NOTE to real trans folk. This is a serious point. Before all this nonsense created by Sturgeon i was very firmly on the side of supporting and protecting any trans person being abused or attacked in the street. I was a firm believer in live and let live, apart from paedophiles & rapists.

    I am now very much on the side of not giving a toss about Yous. This is one very strong ally that Yous have lost. Please also note, thanks to the amateur and kackhanded way all this has been handled and portrayed by Sturgeon’s SNP, Yous have been lumped in beside paedophiles & rapists etc among the wider public.

    I feel genuinely sorry for real Trans folk. But anyone destroying my dream of self-determination to achieve their own agendas, and destroying Womens’ rights in the process, cannot rely on my support. EVER!

    Another thank you to Chris Cairns, one of the best political cartoonists Scotland has ever produced. And what an absolute cracker produced for today. What a toon to bow out on. Major LOLs!

    Take care, Troops!

  43. Republicofscotland

    “Welcome to 2024 Scotland, the nation where even cows have been repurposed to spy on people.”


    In my opinion Scots are the most propagandised people in the world, Scots are also the most surveilled people in the UK.

    This report is two-years old, my home town probably has even more CCTV installed since then. The colonised are always heavily monitored incase they decide to break free.

    “New research has revealed that Glasgow has the highest number of CCTV cameras in total in the UK.

    A whopping 5,352 cameras are in operation in Scotland’s biggest city, which works out as roughly 874 cameras for every 10,000 people in the city.

    It means Glasgow is by far the local authority area with the highest number of CCTV cameras.”

  44. Andy Ellis

    There is no way back. The concept of party politics in Scotland, and I dare say the UK, has been killed by these parasites and their greedy handlers. Party politics is no longer, if it ever was, a way to exercise popular sovereignty. It is a tool to deny popular sovereignty. It is deliberately vague legislation like this what reveals the true colours and purpose of the political parties bringing this forward, those voting for it, those advising on it and those implementing it.

    Perhaps the truly worrying thing is that anyone with two brain cells to rub together actually believes this kind of intellectual effluent. What’s the plausible alternative to political parties and representative democracies then? Show us where and when it has been tried and with what results.

    Are we to have a modern day Athenian Pnyx, with direct democracy and a new magistracy chosen by lot from amongst the pure of blood and heart? Stuff and nonsense the lot of it. Citizens referendums and direct democracy “à la Suisse” may have their place to decide certain local issues.

    You might even want direct democracy to decide particularly contentious national issues (though brexit is hardly a glowing example is it?), but in the end the answer to our current crap political representation and execrable parties isn’t to throw the representative democracy baby out with the bathwater polluted with the ordure of the current crop of charlatans, it’s for all of us to do better.

    We need to elect better people, ensure our systems are not so easily hi-jacked by those promoting wedge issues with negligible popular support, make sure our elected representatives are held accountable, subject to recall and unable to become over-mighty by having undue influence on the media, judiciary and police.

    The fantasists proposing novel and half baked government via popular sovereignty, direct democracy and permanent citizens assemblies are a clear and present danger to democracy, because they have no coherent plans and no way of guaranteeing that their silver bullets won’t be used to blow the brains of our democracy out.

    It’s necessary to guard against Ceasarism just as much as against fascism and communism.

  45. robertkknight

    Not much you can add to that Mr Cairns…

    Indy for Scotland!
    SNP Tyrants Out!

  46. John Main


    You have 2days to come up with a suitably OTT and biblical term for Scotland.

    How’s about Tartan Satan (Scotland)?

    Obvs you’ve had a hell of a lot more practice than me, so I expect your term will be a belter.

  47. Stoker

    BTW, a final wee word regarding Stuarts previous article on here. There’s a few comments included in his article that seem downright threatening. If that’s worried you, Stuart, don’t suffer in silence, report them. And others, like Leasks’, are blatantly hate-filled.

    NOBODY should ever be allowed to create laws designed to get revenge because as far as i’m concerned that is exactly what’s going on here. And a massive sledgehammer attack on free speech and thoughts.

    NOBODY should ever be hunted down for any past verbal or written deeds (unless it’s an outright threat) other than paedophiles, rapists and any other violent crime. Possibly fraudsters too. But never for expressing an opinion/belief regardless of how strong that opinion/belief is.

    What the SNP have achieved by doing what they have done is demonstrated that any one wanting to exact revenge on someone can just get into politics, get your colleagues support, invent a wide-ranging law then put it into practice. That is exactly what the Malitia(ous) Wokerati have done here. They’ve created an act of revenge and got everyone playing along. This will not bode well for politicians, councillers and the police.

    Have a great weekend, Troops, and stay safe. 😉


    ¡Viva la muerte!
    What next?
    A very slimy slope however sanitized by «careing» politicians social rhetoric.
    Hitler’s brave new order was rather popular too.
    To Life!

  49. Andy Ellis

    @John Main 11.27am

    Tartanistan surely? 🙂

  50. Antoine Roquentin

    Any government attempting to police its unrequired legislation by means of an already overstretched police-force will only squander that forces limited time and meager resources.

    The production of faddish legislation to secure hip brownie-points for our “progressive” legislators amongst their Left-fascist fellow travelers throughout the Western world must be seen for what it is.

    Colonial legislators without real powers, can do little else other than produce ever more policies-of-fascination, and damn the expense! How else are they to keep themselves in the media spotlight and maintain a seeming degree of public relevance? This is a phenomenon that won’t be resolved by marking ‘choices’ on any ballot paper, I fear.

    Vote: #END the UNION

  51. Campbell Clansman

    isn’t it sad that Scotland has been brought to such a point by the SNP\Greens, ably assisted by Labour and Lib Dem’s. How on gods earth did it ever come to this ?

    How did it come to this? Simple.
    Scots voted for it.
    75% of Scots voted for the parties that enacted this.
    Most of the people commenting here voted for these parties, and will continue to vote for these parties (I include Alba on this, as Alba’s MSP Ash Regan voted for it to).

    It’s understandable that you’re embarrassed about your progeny. And that you’re in the denial stage of grief.
    But YOU did it. Be honest about it.

  52. robertkknight

    Andy Ellis…

    I was going to suggest “Transinistra” but the bloody Moldovans beat me to it.

  53. David Holden

    Cracker of a toon Chris and I will never look at one of my cows the same way after that. Thanks to our host for all his efforts over the last few years and the WBB has already gone down in history as one of the best campaigning tools of all time. I hope to see you back soon but if not all the best. I wonder where the sneering snarling oafs in here will find now to share their charm with the interweb when this place shuts down.

  54. Brian Doonthetoon

    Maybe there’s just time for a final push of this WOS crowdfunder?

    And the reasoning behind it…

  55. Mark Beggan

    Sturgeon has a wet dream…..
    When it awoke he found that she had made a mess of the sheets again. Just as well they had put his cream on her second penis.
    Murrell the cat would lick them clean.
    But it was all useless. The imigrant girl wanted his own party and the pigeon boy had lost his right tit. In state of fear she awoke….

  56. Johnlm

    John main has two days to say something witty.

  57. Johnlm


    Where everything is in lockdown and censored based on untutored opinion.

    Punishment by name calling.

  58. Anton Decadent

    Excellent cartoon.

    With regard to anonymous accusations a few years back Anas Sarwar made an accusation of historical racism against one of his colleagues in Scottish Labour. The accusation was from before this person had became a councillor and when asked to name the accusers Sarwar refused to do so. At the time this accusation was made Sarwar was a member of a cross party group supposedly to fight racism and the three main members of it appeared to be Sarwar, Humza Yousaf and Ross Greer. On searching to provide a link to not only this incident but the group itself it all appears to have been memory holed which is odd as I read about it in the Herald and will hopefully have it bookmarked it an old inactive computer. On going to the Scottish Parliament website neither Greer nor Yousaf are listed as being a member of this Cross Party Group whilst Sarwar is a member of a “Cross-Party Group in the Scottish Parliament on Challenging Racial and Religious Prejudice.” On looking into this I found that the group I mentioned, it was tackling Islamophobia in Scotland, but could not find had been binned and replaced with this group which Greer and Yousaf are not a part of, anyone have any ideas why? On looking into these two groups they all appear to be headed not by people of colour but this guy whose biography shows a joint project with a group I have previously mentioned, Tell MAMA, and a serious amount of cash being granted to his projects. His students have been inspired to go on to write thesis on important themes such as, and I quote, “research about transgender experiences of public bathrooms.” Not that I am suggesting that there is any connection between the race and trans lobbies or that intersectionality is an umbrella used to link these.

  59. Andy Ellis

    @Johnlm 12.53 pm

    Johnlm – the living embodiment of Abe Lincoln’s aphorism:

    “Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.”

  60. Graf Midgehunter

    robertkknight at 12:31 pm

    “Andy Ellis…

    I was going to suggest “Transinistra” but the bloody Moldovans beat me to it.”
    How about Trans Sinatra and do it your own way…

  61. Andy Ellis

    @Campbell Clansman

    That’s deeply disingenuous take. As Rev Stu’s own polling has conclusively shown, these wedge issues and the regressive, misogynistic ideology underlying them, are massively unpopular amongst super majorities of Scottish voters.

    The problem voters have is they tend to chose parties (whether to join or just to vote for) for a range of different reasons.

    Some vote for a party because it’s what their parents did &/or what they’ve always done, some because they’ve been converted by what they see as superior arguments by one side or another, some do it the basis of an overall platform, some will do it on the basis of only one issue which is central to them.

    Most of those of us who came to vote for and even join the SNP were converts from unionist parties, particularly “Scottish” Labour, but that doesn’t mean they were on board with the policies we see being enacted now. Naively perhaps we believed in the narrative that the nationalist Scottish government was more competent than a unionist led Scottish government.

    Lots of anti-independence voters were happy to support an SNP administration, even if they had to hold their noses to do so, because they could see what every dog in the street could see: at that time, British nationalist parties were immeasurably worse by any objective analysis.

    The fact that the SNP (and their Green parasites) have been intellectually and politically hollowed out by TRA entryists and advocates of regressive wedge issue politics, wasn’t something most of us could have foreseen. The SNP was supposed to be different from New Labour: perhaps the issue was (even if only partly) that it was the New Labour rats who left their sinking ship who infected the SNP.

    That can only explain or excuse some of them however: many of the candy floss haired Twitler Youth don’t have that excuse. They are a product of the times, and were obviously emboldened and enabled by people within the party who lacked the moral courage to put them firmly in their box. A fixation with sophomoric politics rarely ends well.

  62. Andy Ellis

    @Graf Midgehunter 1.03 pm

    How about Trans Sinatra and do it your own way…

    Don’t give the troons ideas…they’ll be appropriating Francis Albert as one of their own now….!

  63. John Main

    @Andy Ellis says: 30 March, 2024 at 11:22 am

    We need to elect better people, ensure our systems are not so easily hi-jacked by those promoting wedge issues with negligible popular support, make sure our elected representatives are held accountable, subject to recall and unable to become over-mighty by having undue influence on the media, judiciary and police

    Amen, brother.

    Liking Tartanistan too.

    It has great ambiguity over which (if any) syllable should be stressed, so would permit endless abusive, bile-spewing posts on here, should Rev Stu ever return from exile!

  64. Mia

    “Perhaps the truly worrying thing is that anyone with two brain cells to rub together actually believes this kind of intellectual effluent”

    Actually no. What is truly worrying is that somebody who claims to hold a PhD demonstrates to be completely devoid of disposition towards critical thinking, and embarrassingly rejoices in obstinate refusal of any acknowledgement of the rapid changes happening in the environment surrounding them. In layman terms, that is called burying your head in the sand.

    What is laughable, is that somebody with the head firmly buried in the sand, self-appoints themselves to an imaginary position of self-assumed knowledge, righteousness and experience from where they consider they can pontificate over others who, after engaging in critical thinking following experiences of their own and careful observation of the changes happening to their environment, have reached conclusions that diametrically oppose this person’s fantasy utopia.

    I would have thought that somebody who boasts of holding a PhD would have at the very least the curiosity of mind to find what things actually mean before putting themselves in the rather vulnerable position of making a complete fool of themselves when the person they are targeting with their pompous charade actually never saw them as a reliable, never mind credible, source of information, facts or experiences.

    Let’s take it to the basics, shall we?

    Democracy. What does that mean?

    If you do a simple google search, you come across something like this:

    “The word democracy comes from the Greek words “demos”, meaning people, and “kratos” meaning power; so democracy can be thought of as “power of the people”: a way of governing which depends on the will of the people”

    Right then, so “democracy” is the government by the people.
    It stands to the obvious that if you are forcing on the people something the majority does not want, these people are not enjoying democracy. They are subjected to a form of absolute rule. I am sure somebody with a PhD can understand that.

    Now, let’s go to the next step. If those who we elected to represent us UNDER A PARTICULAR MANIFESTO, deliberately go out of that manifesto and start to abuse our parliament so they can pass laws NOT INCLUDED IN THE MANIFESTO and therefore to which those who voted for them never consented and which they know they are opposed by the majority of the people of Scotland, then it stands to the obvious that whatever form of government Scotland is subjected to, it is not a democracy. It is a form of absolute rule. Again, you do not need neither a PhD nor above average IQ to understand that.

    Let’s move it up a notch. This takes us now to the concept of “parliamentary democracy”. The word “parliamentary” is used in that expression for both, to restrict “democracy” and actually to maintain the illusion that the denial of democracy to the people of Scotland is still “a democracy”.

    Well, it is not. Why? Because if the legitimacy for the laws forced on the people simply sits on what those in a parliament vote after being heavily lobbied by external powers or the powers that be themselves, independently, as it is the case with this hate bill or was with the GRR, if it is what the majority of the people elected those representatives for, or actually want, the system is not a democracy. That parliament is in fact a tool to suppress democracy and those sitting in that parliament are not representing those who voted them in. They represent the lobbyists, whoever those may be.

    The procedure may be democratic FOR THOSE SITTING IN PARLIAMENT, but it is not democratic for the people those individuals are meant to represent and therefore it is not a democracy. Again, I would think somebody who boasts of holding a PhD would at least have the ability to reach such an obvious and simple conclusion.

    And now let’s take it to the final notch: the control of parliamentary democracy. Take a look at Scotland. You have an unelected representative of the crown sitting in what should have been a democratically elected cabinet. What is that figure doing there? It is handing control over the executive, and via a self-awarded veto, as we have seen with the lord advocate when it came to the Keatings case and the referendum bill, it is also restricting the legislative power of the chamber.

    Again, you do not need a PhD to reach the evident conclusion that when the crown keeps control of the judicial, executive and legislative power of Scotland through an unelected representative, Scotland is not a democracy, not even a parliamentary democracy at that. Why? because that crown representative is vetoing what can enter parliament to be debated and voted in. Scotland is subjected to absolute rule.

    I am not sure what your objective was behind your comment. I am sorry to say that if what you intended to do was to ridiculise my conclusions, you failed at the first round. Why? Firstly, because you seem to think you are here in a position of more credibility and knowledge than anybody else. Well, let me disabuse you of such a ridiculous thought. A. you are simply a person commenting here and therefore whose “verbal effluents” are as much an opinion as everybody else’s. As a matter of fact, you rarely, if ever, provide real facts or evidence to back up your assertions. B. You appear to display an alarming lack of what I would consider fundamental knowledge in what a democracy constitutes, how Scotland is being “governed” by external structures through systematic suppression of Scotland’s executive and legislative powers. C. You still seem to think, or expect the rest of us to believe you think, that the UK, never mind Scotland, is a functional democracy.

    You really have to live in a parallel universe if, despite what we have seen since 2016, you still believe the political parties are in any way or form representing what the people in Scotland want and are not instead a vehicle systematically used by external powers to suppress democracy in Scotland, to forcefully repress popular sovereignty and now, to forcefully suppress freedom of expression.

    They say there is no somebody so blind as those who, despite having a 20/20 vision, refuse to open their eyes. I consider even even blinder those who, refusing to open their own eyes to the dystopian reality around them, self-appoint themselves to an imaginary position of power and imagined knowledge from where they feel they can pontificate over others, who keep their eyes open, to demand they close their eyes too.

    I am sorry. My eyes are wide open and they will remain wide open no matter how laughable or ridiculous your “verbal effluents” become.

    I am sure I do not need to tell you that your opinion is neither gospel nor necessarily a reflection of the truth. And as such, it is only as valuable as everybody else’s.

  65. And spouse

    Surely items not published in Scotland can’t be raised. What if we watch Ricky Gervais on Armageddon on You Tube. Can someone then “hate crime “ him? It has to be a nonsense.
    If Gary lineker says something on match of the day about Scottish Football and we get hurty feelz, is that a hate crime. Punishable in Scotland.
    This all makes no sense, what a mockery. I’m ashamed. “It’s s**** being Scottish”

  66. McDuff

    Absolutely brilliant. Absolutely true.

  67. Young Lochinvar

    The binoculars in the watchtower and cameras are mostly looking the wrong way.

  68. John Main

    @Mia Ignored says: 30 March, 2024 at 1:45 pm

    Did you even read Andy’s post?

    Why not answer his question then?

    What’s the plausible alternative to political parties and representative democracies?

    Please try to keep your answer succinct. We only have 1.5 days left to read it.

  69. PhilM

    Our last two great leaders talked of renaming the SNP…in light of the party’s political drift since he who must never be named resigned, something like the Free Scottish Democratic Party of Truth should do it (better check the Electoral Commission in case it’s already taken…)

  70. Hatuey

    It’s always interesting to see (and note) who is happy and chatty at times like this…

    The most powerful voice for Scottish independence is being forced to close down by the so-called party of independence.

    Getting rid of Sturgeon was like destroying the Death Star, the universe rejoiced, but the empire is striking back, and now Stu must flee to Dagobah to become a Jedi.

    I remain optimistic, despite everything.

    I understand the strategy now. Striking Wings down will make Wings more powerful than they can possibly imagine. It’s straight from the Obi Wan Kenobi playbook.

    We are all to sit tight for a while and wait for the return of the Jedi. The independence movement will be freed from its carbonite confines and it won’t be long before we are comfortably back on the millennium falcon blasting Tie Fighters for fun.

    Something like that.

  71. Robert Hughes

    @ Mia

    Superb post and response to His Clownship Ellis , who , even on what could be the penultimate WOS post ( excellent ‘toon , as per , Chris ) can’t let others post their thoughts without dribbling his usual laughable ( imagined ) * superior * commentary all over them .

    Of course he’ll defend the Political Party system despite what anyone with a scintilla of intelligence can see is the total failure of that system , which has brought – in particular – Scotland , but pretty much the entire * West * to it’s worst condition ever , at least in modern times , and made a total mockery of what vestigial – actual – Democracy ever existed ; as you brilliantly elucidate .

    The reason he defends the decrepit,dysfunctional Political Party system – apart from him having the imagination & capacity for original thought of a dead bat – is because he fancies himself as a candidate for ALBA in a future G.E/H.E .

    The way that Party is going , he’ll fill that role to a ” t ” .

    Mr Andrew Dull standing for the Dull Party in the constituency of Dullsville . Lost deposit time .

  72. Auld Nickum

    No more Wings? it’s happened before but this hiccup seems more assured given the long lived animosity between the Rev. and our corrupted representatives. For the average person this legislative dogs’ dinner means very little, surely common sense will prevail over the petty bickerings of the gender woo woo obsessed? It’s the bigger picture that is troublesome, woe betide anyone with influence who dares to reveal the inner workings of the political sharn pit. This ‘Hate’ bill, coupled to the sinister MSM Cancelling phenomena, is a fascistic blunt weapon of retribution for silencing criticism.
    It became evident after the great Salmond stich up just how completely infiltrated and perverted the SNP had become with the cult of Nicola and the alphabetty co-conspirators who should have served time for perjury. Instead, it was the very brave Craig Murray who got banged up in Saughton jail courtesy of a Scottish legal system hopelessly perverted by the infamous Scotland Act which politicized our judiciary and created the conditions for our knobbled, subservient regional assembly, a hollow talking shop for shite, a diversion for our aspirations, a byword for incompetence. If this is the calibre of Scotland’s democracy, then I’m ashamed, it needs to be torn down and replaced for any hope of independence to succeed.
    So thanks a million Stu for being a cat amongst the pidgeons and putting sleepy Bath (Hippie’s graveyard of ambition etc…) on the map of dissent. The hysteria will die down and given time an invigorated and radical indy movement will re emerge.
    I’m sure you’ll be back.

  73. Robert Hughes

    Oh , I see faithful Ellis retainer and dogsbody – wee Johnny Wean , has butted-in to defend his Lord . No Sooty without Sweep , eh ?

    @ Hatuey : aye , noticeable that the risible twosome seem pretty cheerful at the prospect of the – possible – demise of WOS . Wonder why that is ? Maybe Evadne Ellis in his delusion thinks it will result in more traffic on his own site – what’s it called again …” THE OMNISCIENT OLYMPIAN ” ? or some such . More in my Highland village between the hours of 3 to 5 am on a wet Wednesday

    Hilda Main is probably happy because his pathetic flag-waving endorsement of every insane action by his heroes will no longer be subject to the ridicule they deserve . Back to the Daily Mail comments section for you wee Johnny .

  74. Alf Baird

    John Main @ 2:03 pm

    “What’s the plausible alternative to political parties”


  75. Jacqueline

    Thanks Stuart for what you have do and have done. And more specifically what you will do. Support

  76. Hatuey

    “Maybe Evadne Ellis in his delusion thinks it will result in more traffic on his own site…”

    Ha. I have never seen Ellis’s website mentioned in the blog charts which by Ellis’s own often-repeated standard means nobody is interested in the crap he is selling.

    The truth is the SNP has been hijacked by people like Ellis, and it’s for that reason above all others that the SNP is finished.

    I’ve always said Ellis would be more at home in the SNP than Alba, and that’s especially true now that the SNP is on a ventilator with a DNR notice stapled to its forehead.

  77. Republicofscotland

    I think its safe to say now that the SNP is an enemy of Scottish independence, and an oppressor of those who speak up for it.

    We MUST vote out the SNP wherever we find them, at the GE, at Holyrood and council elections get them out at every turn.

    The SNP has betrayed Scotland big time, and they want to now shut you up by shutting down free speech, a vote for the SNP is a vote to keep Scots oppressed so no more votes for them.

  78. Jennifer Livingston

    I am generation “Just say no!” Promoted by Nancy Reagan.
    Doesn’t lawful gender changing drugs cause affects for the rest of us too now? Robust side affects need reporting.

  79. Andy Ellis

    @John Main 2.03pm


    Mia seems to operate only on transmit, not receive. Another living embodiment, but this time of “TL/DR” and “why use one word when many hundreds will do”. Her prose – if that’s not too kind a term – always had a whiff of the Effie Deans about it: constipated and about as welcome.

    Here eyes are wide shut, like too many of the moonhowlers in here. Same old, same old.

  80. Mia

    “What’s the plausible alternative to political parties and representative democracies?”

    A. Plausible alternative to political parties:

    1. In a functioning democracy, an obvious alternative to political parties are independent candidates without affiliation to any political party and standing on their own manifesto.

    2. In a situation like Scotland is living right now, where democracy is a mere illusion and political parties are being used as tools to suppress democracy, to disenfranchise, to repress popular sovereignty and to suppress dissent and to deny the fundamental right of freedom of expression, your alternative is anything that opposes the status quo.

    I can think in two options:
    a. voting for an independent who stands against the status quo and for the principles, type of governance and outcomes you seek, or

    b. you create your own option by repurposing your ballot so it can become the vehicle to make your voice heard.

    Advantages of independent candidates:
    1. they are not subjected to “Triple whips” from any other than themselves
    2. they are more difficult to control and bribe by external powers – External powers would need to control many of them individually for it to have a meaningful impact, rather than simply inflitrate a political party, change the rules of the party from within, and install some puppet either within the leadership or as a “special advisor”.
    3. People knows who they are voting for.

    Advantages of repurposing your ballot:
    1. You ensure you are voting exactly for what you want to vote, without having to compromise.
    2. it cannot be bribed or abused by lobbyists
    3. it is the ultimate middle finger to the status quo

    B. “plausible alternative to representative democracies”

    In the context of Scotland and I dare say the UK, the above expression is a double fallacy and you know it. It is based on two false assumptions:

    1. it assumes that what we have in Scotland is in any way or form a democracy. This is a falsehood. For as long as we have an unelected representative of the crown hijacking the executive and legislative power for the crown and removing it from the people of Scotland’s control, Scotland does not have a democracy. For as long as democratic mandates keep being ignored and discarded, Scotland is not a democracy.

    2. It assumes that the individuals sitting in Holyrood and Westminster “represent” Scotland. This is another falsehood. For as long as MSPs and MPs continue to abuse parliament seats to force through laws and policies to satisfy lobbyists, the crown, our foreign “allies” or simply forcing wills against the will and deliberately against the interests of the majority of the people of Scotland, what we have is not representative and never will be. For as long as the anti-union MPs voted in to end the union continue to abuse our anti-union votes to preserve the union, these individuals are not representing Scotland.

    I am very surprised that you, who so many times whined and whined in here about how undemocratic and rigged the process to select Yousaf as leader of the SNP was, comes up now with this double fallacy of “representative democracy” in the context of Scotland. You really must think that, either the readers of this blog are zipped at the back or would bow without hesitation to the self-righteousness of somebody who explicitly refuses to apply the concepts of critical thinking, continuous evaluation, reassessment and adaptation to evidently changing circumstances.

    They say that the attention span of a goldfish is 10 seconds. I would have thought that somebody like you would have a longer attention span than that and, after participating in so many threads of Wings, managed to built, at least, enough skim-reading skills by now to cope with my comments.

  81. John Main

    @Alf Baird 2:58


    But still functioning within a system employing democratic mechanisms to determine which of the independents is most aligned with the voters.

    It’s been found to be a widely acceptable system because it’s possible for reasonable people, just, to accept a majority decision, even when it is not what they would have wanted.

    And, with time limited terms in office, reasonable people finding themselves to be in a minority can hope that next time around, they may have persuaded enough people to make a majority.

    Mia spent her enormous post criticising this idea, but failed to propose any working alternative. I’m thinking no working alternative exists.

    Anyhoo, Alf, I look forwards to an independent or two standing in my constituency. My low opinion of the ignorant, tribal nature of Scottish politics suggests they won’t get far.

  82. George Ferguson

    A dystopian image but spot on Chris. I will miss your Saturday morning cartoon if it transpires WoS is unable to return. Either the HCA will be withdrawn within a couple of weeks or a very long campaign of resistance will begin. And that resistance will be directed at the Scottish Parliament as a whole. They voted for it including the incoming Scottish Labour Government in 2026. As a population we allowed them unrestrained power during a pandemic of their making. Closing Christian Churches (Illegally according to our so called Courts). And what has replaced that, the Islamic call from Bute House. A temporary residence now occupied permanently like a Presidential Palace. It won’t get any better under Anas Sarwar. I have enjoyed the banter about what to call Scotland now. My effort ‘New Gaza”.

  83. Andy Ellis

    @Alf Baird 2.58pm

    So alone of all the democracies in the world, Scotland will be governed by non-party independents?

    Well, it’s a position I guess, just not one that most reasonable folk would give a moments credence too, any more than they would the concept that a man in a dress is a woman.

    Tell us Alf, what percentage of the parliaments or assmeblies in other countries comprise independent, non-party representatives? We’ll wait for the answer, shall we?

    I’m actually all for a good number of free thinkers like Margo MacDonald, Jim Sillars, Jim Reid or their ilk, but the idea that some amorphous association of freebooters can govern a modern democracy is facile: it’d be like herding cats.

  84. Johnlm

    Nimwits Ellis and Main. “ …..just raise £500 and stand for election, blah blah”

    They have no clue that the elites see representational government as a nuisance and that their Nufudalism will have no use for it.

    We are obviously being steered into a new system where decision making is to be taken from the people; if we comply.

  85. John Main

    Talking of the ignorant, tribal nature of Scottish politics, we have Bob at 2:56, cheered on by Hats at 3:15.

    Bob found name calling to be a useful tool in his Primary Three year. Now he’s all “grown up”, it’s still his go-to means of debate, although even he has twigged its complete uselessness in any adult context, leaving him angry, frustrated and baffled.

    Ten years and ever more hysterical name calling has failed to even produce an Indy Ref 2, let alone Indy itself.

    Can you name call to Indy in just 1.5 days? You go, Bob, gie it laldy!

  86. John Main

    @George Ferguson 3:30

    I believe some of the “emergency” Covid legislation was retained on the statute books, both at WM and HR, so that it could be immediately re-used in the future.

    If you Google “MSPs back making emergency Covid powers permanent” you should be able to find some background info.

    Like so much that happens these days, there was a great stushie at the time, all forgotten about two weeks later.

  87. moixx

    Email from For Women Scotland:

    Respond to the Consultation on Ending Conversion Practices:

    We were hoping the final Cass Report would be published in time for this consultation but, unfortunately, it has been delayed until April. Now that the deadline for submitting a response is fast approaching we have put together a quick and easy guide to help. The deadline is 11:59pm on Tuesday 2nd April so please take just a few minutes to respond over the next couple of days – it’s important and really won’t take long. It’s fine just to tick the appropriate boxes without adding any text if you wish.

    You don’t have to be in Scotland to respond and you can choose that your name is not published.

    Find out if the police have a record of you committing a ‘non-crime’:

    Following the recent news story about Murdo Fraser MSP discovering Police Scotland had recorded his entirely non-criminal tweet, as shown above, as a ‘hate incident’ we think it is wise for everyone to submit a Subject Access Request to find out what information the police hold about them. Nearly 6,000 such hate incidents were recorded by the police in an 8 month period last year and we very much doubt many of the people involved are even aware they are named in these records, or that it could show up on disclosure requirements for jobs working with children or vulnerable people.

    Murdo intends to take legal action to ensure Police Scotland reviews its systems to bring them into line with the recent changes in England and will mean such trivial complaints are no longer recorded.

    In the meantime, click below to fill out the form and find out if there are any ‘non-crime hate incidents’ recorded against you. Police Scotland have 20 working days to respond and, given the anticipated increase in vexatious complaints under the new Hate Crime and Public Order (Scotland) Act, it may be useful to submit a SAR at least every three months.

  88. Mia

    “Tell us Alf, what percentage of the parliaments or assmeblies in other countries comprise independent, non-party representatives? We’ll wait for the answer, shall we?”

    And here we go, another fallacy disguised as arrogant righteousness. You are seeking to force Alf to a position where he is having to assume that what we have in Scotland is in any way or form comparable to what independent countries have. It is not and you know it. That assumption is therefore a falsehood and your premise built over it a fallacy.

    None of those independent countries are controlled by the crown of their neighbour. None of those countries have an unelected representative of their neighbour’s crown sitting in the middle of their government cabinet and actively usurping control over the executive and legislative powers from the people of that country.

    The parliaments of Catalonia, Galicia, Andalucia, Valencia, Madrid, Extremadura, etc, etc, enjoy far more powers as regions of a unitary country than Scotland’s parliament enjoys as a country within a voluntary political union. This is absurd.

    Scotland is treated at all practical effects as a colony. Your attempt at comparison between Scotland’s parliament and the parliament of independent countries is therefore ridiculous.

    The first step for Scotland must be to release itself from the suffocating and crippling colonialism it has been subjected to for the last 3 centuries. When democracy is systematically being denied to the people of Scotland, to talk about “pursuing independence through democratic means” is another fallacy.

    Scotland must release itself from colonialism with whichever means it has to its disposal. For as long as the crown of our neighbor country continues to control our executive, legislative and judicial powers, the democratic route is not an option for Scotland.

    Once Scotland has restored its statehood, then we can start talking about similarities and differences between Scotland’s parliament and those of other independent countries. Before then, however, Scotland has a much bigger fish to fry, which is to restore its own independence.

  89. George Ferguson

    @John Main 3:55pm
    You are correct I remember the debate on the retention of the pseudo martial powers. Ready to be enabled whenever the gravy train stutters. Contempt for human rights and the priorities of the electorate, the Scottish Parliament are oblivious to recent history on these Islands. Hiding behind 650 armed Police is not a good strategy. When millions including Independence and Unionists supporters are disenfranchised and not part of their game.

  90. Mia

    “but the idea that some amorphous association of freebooters can govern a modern democracy is facile”

    And another fallacy from Mr Ellis. This time he seek to build in our minds the falsehood that Scotland is somewhat “a modern democracy”. The form of government Scotland is subjected to is colonialism. There is nothing democratic or modern about colonialism.

    The “amorphous association of freebooters” are not seeking to “continue” a modern democracy that, at present, does not exist in Scotland. They are seeking to end colonialism so Scotland stands a chance of enjoying a modern democracy.

  91. Republicofscotland

    Today is Land Day, spare a thought for our Palestinian brothers and sisters under the evil Zionists cosh.

    “Every year since 1976, Palestinians around the world have commemorated Land Day on March 30, marking the killing of six Palestinians during a mass action to fight an attempt by the Israeli state to eliminate Palestinians from the Galilee region and carry out Yihud Ha-Galil (the Judaisation of the Galilee).”

  92. Sven

    Further to moixx @ 16.14

    It’s interesting to note that the Police Scotland SAR enquiry form lists only two gender options; Male or Female.
    If an enquirer identifies as, say, non binary, or a cat or dog, one wonders if they may find this apparent denial of them to be anything except male or female rather hateful and an attack on their gender status.
    Be ironic if one of the first (of many I’m sure) complaints against Police Scotland in terms of the new Act was made because of their very own Form.

  93. sarah

    Rev, can some Wings funds be put to keeping Chris producing cartoons?

    I don’t think cartoons are likely to be complained about, or would be prosecuted if there were complaints. Even our police and COPFS or judiciary could be quite so daft, could they?

  94. Anton Decadent

    I predict that we shall see the full extent of this when the internet is restricted, curfew imposed and shops closed down. Anyone who engaged in wrongthink here will have the bicycle delivery of their daily McDonalds state sanctioned midge burger limited to four days a week to set an example.

  95. ABruce

    Are books going to be pulled out of the local library because someone has been offended, for eg Irvine Welsh’s book “The Long Knives” where Gillman says to Lennox ” If you’re a gadge who feels trapped in a bird’s body, have the fucking baws tae get rid ae yer fucking baws. Get them whipped off and have a fanny built. Dinnae prance aboot lassie’s lavies and lassie’s nicks wi your cock hinging out, telling every cunt you’re a fucking bird”


    Add the German länder and the federal system in Belgium and Scotland’s «parliament» looks like the county council it was designed to be.
    The AngloBrits are such a conceited and smug lot. Rule of law, mother of parliaments, fair play…..sans blague?

  97. Alf Baird

    Andy Ellis @ 3:34 pm

    “So alone of all the democracies in the world, Scotland will be governed by non-party independents?”

    Naw, ‘Independents’ seem to be the norm also for parliaments in Isle of Man, and Channel Island ‘states’, as well as various councils here in Scotland. And both CI and IoM have a lot more powers than Holyrood, including ‘Population Management and Immigration’:

    “Generally everyone working and/or living in the island of Guernsey requires a Permit or Certificate issued by the Population Management Office under the Population Management Law. These ‘paperless’ Permits and Certificates give people the right to live and work in Guernsey, alongside Immigration Clearance from the Guernsey Border Agency.”

    “It also determines who can live in certain accommodation. Guernsey’s properties are primarily split into two ‘Housing Markets’ the Local Market and the Open Market”.

  98. Lenny Hartley

    JockMcT, remember there is one law for the Mainstream Media and another law for social media as laid out by Lady Dorian in sentencing Murray to 8 months in Jail .

  99. Lenny Hartley

    And spouse @1.53 anything read in Scotland after April 1st is deemed to be published in Scotland on the day its read, even if it was originally published in say 1745 and published on Mars. Please note for anybody thinking of reporting Anti Scottish Hate crime say for example feeling the hate from somebody in England, forget it, under the law we are all British Citizens (well u are, I’m now Irish) however I see any Paddy jokes etc, a wee 999 call may be forthcoming!

  100. John Main

    @RoS 4:39

    Maybes next year. Depends if the hostages Hamas seized in October have been released, dead or alive.

    When’s the 404 Land Day? I’ll defo be wanting to mark that one.

  101. James Che

    There a queer policy attached to this public order Hate Crime bill that is illegal,

    If a Case is not proven either way by law after the 1st April 2024,
    the person whom was been accused still has a record held against them, it is not automatically removed.
    Given people a criminal record.

    I suggest Barristers, lawyers and Solicitors in Scotland better find ways around this pretty quickly because they to can be accused of gender politics and so can their families,
    All it takes is someone whom does not like Solicitors or the legal system to point and accuse them of the Hate Crime Bill.

    Suppose your dealing with one of that catagory for selling or buying property and they think they were hard done by in your service provided bill……
    Or perhaps they considered you did not fully represent in Court, no matter wether you win or not,
    You now have a record against you for keeps of being accused.
    Retaliation may grow wings,
    As will judges, become targets,
    The police Are not infallible against being accused.
    As will politicians.
    As there is only one protected group mentioned.
    The legal profession individually will be accused too without doubt.

    However we can all state that at home we wear dresses or we are in one of those protected groups in the hate Crime bill,
    Here in Scotland it may be difficult for someone or a court to say you are not one of the protected Charecteristics being as you do not need to under goes any Physical or medical change, nor do you to be registered at birth, it is inter-changable and fluid.
    You only need to self ID,

    Do certain ones of these protected charecters get a lower womens pension if born before 2010?
    Just curious.

  102. Lenny Hartley

    Mia @1035, woman are exempt for the Hate Crime Bill so you can’t report any hate towards woman as a crime.

  103. Jack McArthur

    I will never forget the kindness of the police more than 50 years ago to a young boy in Easterhouse who gave him a second chance and whenever I could I helped them (a DI wanted to put me forward for an award a few years later re an armed robbery) and disliked anyone who would bad mouth them. Later a head of the Met would be a director of one the companies I worked for.

    Nothing is perfect in this world but what is happening now is off the scales. What is a crime in the eyes of this manic world is nothing to the Creator. What is good to this world is evil to the Creator. In the name of the Most High what spirit could ever say that dismembering a little one in its mothers womb was a good and a human right.?

    I am not a sectarian and believe the good, no matter what sectarian indoctrination, will have its rewards but if it is has not already been censored there is a post of mine on Craig Murray site, in which I tell a very true story of what happened, in recent years (which the Crown Office can verify), and the inauspicious fate for those who now run Scotland.

    If I was offered the entire world there is no way I would exchange my place for them no matter if that spirit tells them they are a true Christian or Muslim.

    John McArthur
    94 Dalziel Tower
    ML1 2HF

  104. Cee Bee Beaumont

    Nicola “Travelling Squad Of Scottish Lesbians” Sturgeon was the sexual minority phase of the Scotland-landscape-changing operation, and Yousaf is the racial minority phase. Both haters of Scotland past, for their own angry, vengeful reasons. Both sent to impose destruction on the SNP and Scotland by crowbarring racially and sexually divisive policies and laws onto the hapless, ever-more-angry populace. Criticise Sturgeon, and you’re a (sigh) ‘misogynist,’ and never mind her misandry. Criticise Yousaf, and you’re a (sigh) ‘racist.’ It’s all very clear. Two of the most hateful and horrible people in this confused country.

  105. George Ferguson

    @RepublicofScotland 4:39pm
    I am glad you mentioned 1976 which was the creation of the Palestinian State courtesy of Arafat. And 2000 years of made up Palestinian history followed. In biblical terms Palestine is not mentioned once. Academics think the people of Palestine descent were the Canaanites. Land Day goodness me my wife’s family thrown off the land during the Clearances. Real Scottish History unapproved by Bute House Presidential Palace. Decide what side you are on.

  106. Frank Gillougley

    ABruce @ 4.48pm

    Good point caller.

    Of course, censorship is thee trademark of a truly progressive society, just ask Kim Jong Un.

  107. twathater

    Chris another brilliant work of art, but are ye no confused , that sign says Scoatland should it no read welcome tae East Germany

  108. sarah

    A list of groups with new initiatives fighting to get independence:

    Independence Forum Scotland []: aim to unite non-political independence groups and create a National Convention to campaign for independence.

    Indy1st: AyeApp to assist voter registration.

    Schemes for Independence: working to register voters. spreading the truth about Scotland’s Constitutional rights; challenging Scottish government’s actions that contravene People’s Sovereignty e.g. Freeports; building the Liberation Movement [] to qualify for an approach to the UN.

    Electoral candidates: Independents for Independence; Independence for Scotland Party; Alba; SSP.

    All the above would welcome help so anyone with time on their hands due to blog and comment closure, please lend a hand [and a few quid].

  109. moixx

    Lenny Hartley @ 5.15pm

    “Mia @1035, woman are exempt for the Hate Crime Bill so you can’t report any hate towards woman as a crime.”


    Nothing to stop you making a report though. There’s been a few interviews recently where supporters of the HCA have made it clear that it’s always been the case that such reports can be made to the police.

    And I’m pretty sure we’ve been assured that ‘sex’, or at least ‘misogyny’, is under consideration for inclusion in the HCA, or in a new law in its own right.

    So I imagine the police would welcome such reports, even if they don’t come under the HCA as it currently stands.

  110. moixx

    Sven @ 4.41pm

    “It’s interesting to note that the Police Scotland SAR enquiry form lists only two gender options; Male or Female…

    Be ironic if one of the first (of many I’m sure) complaints against Police Scotland in terms of the new Act was made because of their very own Form.”


    Well spotted! Wonder how big this form might have to get to make sure all options are covered?

  111. twathater

    Well done Mia you have destroyed franchise fanny ellis’s diatribe comprehensively, then genocide John moan rushed tae crawl up his arse but Alf cut his legs aff wi his response

    Robert Hughes I would definitely say that franchise fanny Ellis and his wee sook genecide John moan appear to be excited at the possible closure of WOS, but they should be careful what they DREAM of it will mean that they will be going back to sitting in some wee dreary dingy pub ignored by everyone for the boring self aggrandising twats that they are

    Nae mair dinner parties for andy to wax lyrical to his unionist pals about him being the fountain of knowledge on WINGS

  112. Johnlm

    “ I am a Palestinian, from 1921 to 1948, I carried a Palestinian passport.“

    Golda Meir

  113. Republicofscotland


    Nice one.

    Here’s a wee expansion on that.

    “Before 1948, Palestinians had passports that told everyone they were from Palestine. It would have been impossible for them not to think of themselves as Palestinians. After Golda Meyerson left the United States and changed her last name to Meir, she admitted, “I am a Palestinian, from 1921 to 1948, I carried a Palestinian passport.” — Golda Meir”

  114. Campbell Clansman

    Russian voter, 1924: “When I voted Communist in 1918, I never dreamed that I voted for that!”
    German voter, 1935: “When I voted Nat Socialist in 1933, I never dreamed I voted for that!”
    Venezuelan voter, 2020: “When I voted for Chavez’s Socialists in 2005, I never dreamed I voted for that!”
    Scots voter, 2024: “When I voted SNP/ Labour/ Green/ LibDem, I never dreamed I voted for that!”

    History repeats itself….
    BTW, for those reading this comment after April 1st, I love the HCA! And Humza is the greatest!

  115. Republicofscotland

    “Decide what side you are on.”

    George Ferguson.

    Oh I know what side I’m on do you?

    Maybe we Scots should just hand over everything to the Italians (Romans) because they once occupied some of Scotland along time ago.

    Calgacus, historically or literally depending on your point of view (me I prefer historically) sought to defeat or at the very least chase off the invaders.

    ‘ubi solitudinem faciunt pacem appellant’, ‘they create a desert and call it peace’.

    The English and their House Jocks did in the Highlands, and now the Zionist murderers are doing in Gaza.

    My side/s should be crystal clear to you.

  116. Ian Brotherhood

    Someone who used to attend WOS Friends gatherings has DMed me asking about Ronnie Anderson.

    If you see this Ronnie, can you let us know you’re still around? Just in case this place goes down. (Your phone has been acting up again, apparently.)


  117. George Ferguson

    @RepublicofScotland 6:37pm
    Not a nice one when you consider Meir’s background. Born in Kiev and often said she was forced to take the construct of a British Passport. One reference to the biblical claim of a Palestine State would suffice.

  118. George Ferguson

    @RepublicofScotland 6:46pm
    I am on the the side of Scotland you are on the side of everybody else. Fighting everybody else’s corner but your own.

  119. Republicofscotland

    John Main @5.13pm.

    Things are so bad for the Kneo-Natzi junta in YouCraine that this has happened.

    “This suggests that over 1,000,000 men in YouCraine are on wanted lists of police for draft dodging even before new drastic mobilization law comes into force: “In the Poltava region, about 30,000 people did not show up at the TCC and SP departments. The TCC appealed to the police with an appeal to deliver these people to the military commissariat.” And about 40,000 men are on wanted list for the same in Ivano-Frankivsk Region.”

    I know that men in YouCraine can’t get medical treatment without first proving that they are in the military, the above suggests that for quite a few YouCrainians the penny has finally dropped.

    As for Land Day in YouCraine Zel and his Kneo-Natzi junta are selling it off at such a pace to big business, that they’ll be none left shortly.

  120. Alf Baird

    TURABDIN @ 4:56 pm

    “Add the German länder and the federal system in Belgium”

    Yes, the German federal system (and Belgian too, probably) also allows individual states to regulate their own media communications, and gives them power to enter into international treaties on certain matters.

    Which suggests Broon’s dodgy claim that Scotland has the maist powerful wee devolved (i.e. colonial) assembly in the world should be taken with the usual pinch of salt.

  121. George Ferguson

    @RepublicofScotland 6:46pm
    3 of my posts have gone into moderation in response to yours. The effects of the HCA come early. At least I use my real name.

  122. John Main

    RoS says

    “over 1,000,000 men”

    Gonna need a link RoS. The internet’s telling me 979,429 men.

    And remember, the internet knows all.

    And then we’re faced with the knotty problem, What Is A Man?

    Gonna need a link for that one too, RoS.

    BTW, fits a “kneo”? Is that some kind of Orc speak?

  123. Republicofscotland

    “I am on the the side of Scotland you are on the side of everybody else. Fighting everybody else’s corner but your own.”

    George Ferguson.

    You might be cold enough to sit down with your mouth shut when a genocide of civilians in Palestine is going on as Europe/Nato aids and abets it (Including the UK which we are unfortunately part of for now) but I’m not.

    I’ve posted countless comments on Scottish independence and why we need it, don’t believe me? go check the archives before it shuts down.

  124. John Main

    @twathater 6:08

    That’s my allegory about the boring dipso, maundering and greetin into his dram, shunned by the other pub goers.

    I only posted it yesterday.

    Hands aff, ye thievin cant.

    Exert yer limited faculties and come up wi yer ain original shite.

  125. Johnlm

    Only 26 hrs left for Main to ‘up his game’.

    It doesn’t look likely.

  126. George Ferguson

    @Republicofscotland 7:27pm
    If ever we needed Scotsmen to stand up it is now. You hide behind a non de plume and expect me to respect your comments about situations from far a afield. You would do well in a Humza Cabinet.

  127. John Main

    RoS 7:27

    The “genocide” as you insist on calling it, could be over by Monday if the Hamas terrorists were to come out of their tunnels with their hands up, bringing the remaining hostages with them.

    And that’s been the situation since November. The relief of the innocent Palestinians has never been more than 48 hours away.

    You make common cause with Hamas. No pile of Palestinian corpses can ever be high enough for you. To you the ends will always justify the means.

    At least Hamas have the excuse they need the hostages as bargaining chips to save their miserable skins.

    As to what your excuse is, God only knows.

    But the lesson is clear for us rational, decent Scots. Those who think like you can never be allowed anywhere near power.

    Or one day, those who think like you will be looking on unmoved as our corpses pile up in the tens of thousands.

  128. Hatuey

    George Ferguson: “In biblical terms Palestine is not mentioned once.”

    In “biblical terms”? What does that mean? Isn’t Philistine mentioned in the bible and doesn’t it correlate to the same place? I know the Romans called it ‘Syria Palestine’.

    The good news is that we don’t need to go back that far to establish that Palestine was recognised as a state — the British mandate granted by the League of Nations confirmed recognition just 100 years ago (article 22).

  129. George Ferguson

    @Republicofscotland 7;27pm

    Until you use your real name I can’t take you seriously. Big stakes at play. You are fighting for the Canaanites. I am fighting for the Scottish people. Before Monday state your name. Otherwise I am entitled to think you are 12 and your Mum doesn’t know your on the Internet.

  130. Republicofscotland

    “If ever we needed Scotsmen to stand up it is now. You hide behind a non de plume and expect me to respect your comments about situations from far a afield”

    George Ferguson.

    I don’t give a monkeys whether you respect my comments or not, like I said in a previous comment I know what side/s I’m on.

    I noticed you didn’t condemn the genocide that speaks volumes to me, let me guess your condemnation is stuck in moderation.

  131. George Ferguson

    @Hatuey 8:02pm
    I expected better from you Hats that you conflated Philistine with Palestine. Poor interpretation. Palestinian roots are in the Canaanites. I am still waiting on one single verse of the bible that states Palestine is a state. And if you think that’s unimportant It is the root of the current war. Personally I am concerned with the forthcoming civil war here in Scotland.

  132. Johnlm

    Zionists ad homing like mad.
    They can’t justify their genocidal beliefs. can only attack the messenger.

  133. Republicofscotland

    Georgie Boy @ 8.04pm.

    Wow! George you really do have the hots to find out my name before the blog kind of goes into stasis.

    I’ll e-mail it to Keast-Butler maybe she’ll pass it on to you.

  134. Republicofscotland

    “The “genocide” as you insist on calling it, could be over by Monday if the Hamas terrorists were to come out of their tunnels with their hands up, bringing the remaining hostages with them.”

    Utter bollocks Main.

    Trump who is now a nail on as the next POTUS, his son-in-law Jared Kushner is already eyeing water front locations in the Gaza strip.

    “Jared Kushner’s statements are easy to dismiss as a fantasy since they contain a measure of ridiculousness. However, to do so would be misguided: Kushner was the architect of Trump’s Abraham Accords, which led to the normalisation of Israeli relations with Bahrain, Morocco and the United Arab Emirates.

    He also has a close relationship with Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu (who used to stay in Kushner’s childhood bedroom in Livingston, New Jersey).”

  135. George Ferguson

    @Republicofscotland 8:24pm
    70 million people died in WII the genocide to end all genocides. The real definition of genocide. I wanted Scotland to take an even hand in this war. Humanitarian aid to Gaza notwithstanding. Unfortunately unnamed persons such as yourself have tried to railroad the narrative. Unhelpful and extremely naive. And now I don’t want you standing next to me with our forthcoming strife in Scotland.

  136. Republicofscotland

    “One reference to the biblical claim of a Palestine State would suffice.”

    There are plenty of nations that don’t have biblical claims but are recognised as nations nonetheless.

    Ask yourself why did Catalonia fail where Slovenia, Kosovo and the Baltic states succeeded?

    Because realpolitik rules in practice, and the Slovenians, Balts and Kosovans had obtained actual control on the ground of the land they claimed. The Catalans had not.

    There are several UN resolutions that explicitly state that the oppressed Palestinians CAN take up arms to evict the occupiers from their lands and they will need to do so to be rid of the Zionists for good.

  137. George Ferguson

    @Republicofscotland 8:32pm
    Ach your alright mate. I don’t need to your know your name but I can’t stand beside you or be worried about your welfare.

  138. Republicofscotland

    ” I wanted Scotland to take an even hand in this war”

    There ya go Georgie Boy calling it a war, Main will be so proud of you, for everyone else its the systematic extermination by all means possible of the civilians of Gaza.

    Get back to me Georgie when you’ve worked out the difference, though I doubt I’ll be standing next to you period.

  139. Lenny Hartley

    George Ferguson, can you tell me if Scotland or let’s say the United States of America is mentioned in the fantasy Iron Age goat herders New Testament superstitions book ?

  140. Hatuey

    Is there a reference to Scotland on the bible? I didn’t know a reference in the bible was required for statehood.

    Anyway, according to a real expert, Palestine derives from the Greek rendering of Philistia, thus;

    “The Philistines were an aggressive, warmongering people who occupied territory southwest of Israel between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River. The name “Philistine” comes from the Hebrew word Philistia, and the Greek rendering of the name, palaistinei, gives us the modern name “Palestine.”

    That means I was right, George. And you in a sense you were also right to expect more from me, but wrong in terms of the substance.

  141. George Ferguson

    @Lenny Hartley 9:07pm
    Can you tell me if Palestine gets a mention ? By the way it’s the Old Testament and is the source of the current war. So when you chant the Palestine dogma remember what it means. Yes Scotland is mentioned in Roman times. They built Hadrians Wall and the Antonines Wall. You can see remnants of Antonines Wall in Falkirk. Back in the day when Scottish people defended their lands.

  142. Geri


    “am still waiting on one single verse of the bible that states Palestine is a state. And if you think that’s unimportant It is the root of the current war.”

    You’ll wait a long time. The old testament & the new were written from a Jewish perspective & their own history. They didn’t record all their neighbours or provide Google Earth print outs.

    But even so – it’s 2024 & the UN has already voted & passed that Palestine IS a state. It’s already under the rules of international law. It already has a seat.

    There are only four countries blocking it’s full implementation. Is*eal, USA & two USA dependents shit scared their funding is cut.

    The USA keeps delaying & tries every tactic in the book to keep this pot constantly simmering since the 1960s with each president promising the two state..until they’re elected & then they start the delay again.

    Francesca Albanese, the UN rapporteur, is taking no shit from anyone now & did a Q&A the other day (Independent news channel broadcasted it). The International court has already given clear instruction to halt the conflict but the USA & UK (& others), are all under investigation now for what she made clear were clear breaches of those guidelines by continuing to supply weapons & continuing to up the language used across the media.

    There were some roasters from the media trying to annoy her over her use of “genocide” she gave them short shift & said she was pissed off with all these excuses while the whole world can see it televised. People dying of starvation or mercilessly executed because they are Palestinians.

    The eejits trying to fudge what a genocide is & who had a bigger one needs to get a life & also need to jog on to the UN website & see what their definition actually says..

    “In 1948, the United Nations Genocide Convention defined genocide as any of five:
    “acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group”.

    *killing members of the group
    * causing them serious bodily or mental harm,
    *imposing living conditions intended to destroy the group,
    *preventing births, and forcibly transferring children out of the group.
    *Victims are targeted because of their real or perceived membership of a group, not randomly.”

    “March 28 (Reuters) – At least 32,552 Palestinians have been killed and 74,980 injured in Israel’s military offensive in the Gaza Strip since Oct. 7, th”

    Can we all agree that IS GENOCIDE & stop with the pretendy made up definitions cause it hasn’t reached x amount just yet…zzz

  143. George Ferguson

    @Hatuey 9:19pm
    Very poor analysis Hats. One wishful source from the Internet doesn’t get you off. Academic sources say there has never been a Palestine state. Old Testament. New Testament in fact from any realistic source. Canaanites etc. I favoured a two state solution. But when Scottish Independence supporters fly the Palestine Flag they understand nothing about the source of the conflict. From the river to the sea. They promote genocide on one side. Left right Independence Unionist nothing to do with foreign fields.

  144. George Ferguson

    @Geri 9:36pm
    So you promote Genocide. Anybody that waves a Palestine Flag and chants the river to the sea is promoting the genocide of a people. I want nothing to do with that as a Scottish Independence Supporter.

  145. Geri


    Why are you fixated on whether Palestine existed?

    Lands have changed hands a thousand times due to wars.

    All we need to know is the here & now. In 2024.

    Jews were gifted a piece of land in 1948. Yes, gifted. It wasn’t theirs. The UK & USA displaced the people living there with absolutely no regard for them.

    The Jews were happy. But not for long. They decided they wanted more land..& then some more..& then some more & continued to herd a population further out of their own lands with the USA providing the muscle. That is against international law.

    Why do you think that’s acceptable? Would you like England to start expanding North & just take land as they see fit cause they’re running out of room next door & we’ve all to budge up or else we’ll be shot?

    Also, it’s disingenuous going on about the bible. It doesn’t mention European, American, Australian or Canadian Jews who’ve flocked there to live either or the Christian fundamentalists. They’re not entitled to live there.

    If they believed their bible their prophets warned they’d be cast out & their land would fall. It did. They were promised a saviour – they didn’t believe him.


  146. Hatuey

    George seems to be arguing that there was no Palestinian state in the bible.

    Should I tell him it doesn’t mention dinosaurs, or that things far away look smaller?

  147. Johnlm

    Stop digging George. The Israelis use ‘from the river to the sea’ slogan too.
    Stick to subjects you understand.

    Never go full zionist

    Btw Kfir Bibas who you appeared so concerned about was killed by the IDF months ago yet Israel still pretends that he is still alive.
    Hamas determination to send back the remains collapsed the first ceasefire because the Israelis didn’t want them returned.

  148. George Ferguson

    @Johnim 10:12,pm
    I forgotten more than you understand already. An unknown source relayed by an unknown name. A one liner commenter on WoS. Reads past posts as some psychological tool against the weak of mind. Kfir was an opportunity for the First Minister but he failed. And in everything he does he fails. Never mind I am will celebrate Easter Sunday tomorrow. At the moment I can do that.

  149. George Ferguson

    @Hatuey 10:10 pm
    I arguing that the Scottish Independence Movement should not side with Genocide on one side or the other. Either Palestinian or Jewish. You said to me recently you were a visionary. And yet you can’t see what’s in front of you.

  150. Geri


    “Anybody that waves a Palestine Flag and chants the river to the sea is promoting the genocide of a people.”

    What on earth are you on about?

    I quote the UN definition of what a Genocide is under international law & you reply with that bullshit?

    No one is advocating a genocide to anyone. I*rael needs to stick to the land they were given. They have absolutely no rights to expand. What is so hard to understand?

    This is exactly what the UN rapporteur was complaining about the other day in her press conference – this bullshit language that’s used to shut down dialogue instantly with claims every fcking thing is either anti Semitic (Their usual go to) or that anyone who speaks out against this is wishing bad things on I*rael.

    Naw! Stick to international law. It’s really that simple! Just because they’ve a history in that region doesn’t mean they get to exterminate everyone else & expand to their hearts content. Where do you suggest they stop?

    The same shit tactic used by TRAs. Woe is me attitude that’s prevalent these days. It doesn’t work.

    Have you ever seen live footage, for example,of I*raeli defence take chain saws to centuries old olive groves while the Palestinian farmer weeps & wails while being held at gunpoint while they all laugh? Or the snipers shooting kids playing in the street?

    Frankly I don’t care if you don’t wish to stand with me for indy or not. I don’t particularly want to stand with Genocide apologists either.

    Stick to international law.
    Stick to their own boundaries.

    Only you know why yer defending the indefensible.
    Their government are proud to announce they’re fascist. Ultra right wing nutters & make no bones about their intent to eradicate every single Palestinian. The whole world is watching in disbelief that the UK & USA is being complicit in this because they are donors to their political parties. They’re even making a mockery of the UN security council rulings claiming it’s not legally binding. It is. They’re in so much shit right now & they keep digging…I see you are too.

  151. Lenny Hartley

    George Ferguson, wow Scotland existed before Kenneth McAlpine , every day is a skool day!
    So The Jewish sect in their book called the land Israel however the contemporary Greeks and others including the Jews in earlier versions of the Old Testament did not give it that name . See link below
    The Israelis changed the Arabic place names to Hebrew starting from 1949 , so for example the port of Umm al-Rashr?sh Is now Eliat.,%2C%20in%20Joel%20only%2C%20Palestine.

  152. Hatuey

    Jesus, I thought string theory was tough…

    Forget it, George. You win.

  153. willie

    Ah well you do marvel at some of the BTL comments.

    There was never a Palestinian land says one erudite blogger. Consequently there were never any Palestinians, ergo there is no issue today.

    Jog on folks, nothing to see!

  154. Alf Baird

    Lenny Hartley @ 11:14 pm

    “Scotland existed before Kenneth McAlpine , every day is a skool day!”

    Yes indeed, albeit this land was known as Pictavia, according to the Romans around 200AD. Pictish tribes being descendants of the Neolithic peoples from abt 3000BC. Gaels arrived via Ireland rather later – from 500AD, followed by the Vikings – AD850….then the English thereafter, and still today. All invaders wanted a piece of Pictavia/Pictland and left their mark. Tho maist Scots are aye arguably juist modren Picts wi oor ain langage an cultur. ‘Pictland’ micht hiv been oor richt name.

  155. Lenny Hartley

    Alf Baird, I have a great deal of respect in your knowledge however ancient dna analysis has proved beyond doubt that the Picts were not descended from the Neolithic Farmers
    I thought the same as you for a long time.
    Basically pre Roman/Viking/Anglo Saxon three migrations into what is now UK/Ireland
    1st post ice age Western a Hunter Gatherers, dark skinned, blue eyed small in stature.
    2nd Neolithic farmers dark skins, small in stature , 5’ 3” average Lactose intolerant into
    adulthood. From around 4500 bce, y dna Haplogroup various but mainly g2a (check out a photo of a Sardinian and you will see what they looked like)
    3rd Bell Beaker People from Western Steppes , (sythia as per the Declaration of Arbroath)
    Taller ave height 5’ 7” Lactose Tolerant into adulthood , also heavier bones, perhaps drinking Milk may have made the difference , red hair, Y DNA Haplogroup R1b, Male population displacement of 90% in what is now UK and Ireland (Not Orkney) there is a hypothesis by eminent archaeologist Barry Cunliffe that the Celtic Culture and Language came from the Bell Beaker folk and originated on the Atlantic Seaboard between Iberia and now Uk/Ireland and spread eastwards , which differs from older hypothesis of Celts originating in Central Europe circa 500bc and moving west and further East, incidentally recently on X I asked the well known archeologist Prof Alice Robert’s what she thought about Barry Cunliffe’s Celts from the West Hypothesis as she in last five years or so wrote and appeared on The BBC stating the La Tenne/Halstatt theory , she responded that given the dna evidence of no meaningful migration after the Beaker People it makes a good case. Anyways 90% of modern Scots and Irish/Welsh have males have Y Haplogroup R1b and a surprisingly high proportion of English have it as well, the Germanic tribes like the English have the same Y dna Haplogroup as the East Scythian’s which is R1b , it is interesting to note that a east Scythian warrior group which had graves in permafrost , which meant the bodies still had skin were found to be heavily tattooed, were west sythians tattooed as well and was it all the Scythian’s who were tattooed or just the Warriors? If so were the Picts a Warrior Band? The Irish legends say the Picts came from Sythia with no woman and the Irish gave them women and told them of what is now Scotland and as part of the deal was that the Picts had to pick their Kings from the Maternal line. Recent ecavations at Lundun Links in Fife of a Pictish Graveyard disprove that story but it’s only a small sample and Pictish remains are few due to the acidic soil in Scotland.
    Another think to note, regarding the Scotti being from a Pharoahs daughter, although the ancient Egyptians were not Y dna Haplogroup , King Tut was R1b according to one article I read! king Tuts father and Mother were Brother and sister according to DNA tests, in the Neolithic Tomb of Newgrange in Ireland (later used by Beaker People ) dna analysis of bones found that somebody of high office (otherwise would not have been buried at Newgrange) was offspring of a brother and sister. Seems like same belief system that Pharoahs/kings were descended from the Gods therefore you did not want to dilute the bloodline.
    I have not done much research into the mtdna of the matrilineal side, but one thing that I noticed several weeks ago was that the rev stated in an article that the average height of a female in the UK was5’ 3” well that’s the average height of the Neolithic Farmers and in the UK/Ireland I don’t think the Beaker People brought many females with them!
    More research required.

  156. Andy Ellis

    Just been perusing the….”output” of one Johnny McNeill, aka @GasGilligan after it was highlighted on @WingsScotland. It’s comedy gold!

    The guy’s a proper mentalist, but it reads like a manifesto for some of the worst types soiling BTL comments here in recent months. 🙂

  157. Alf Baird

    Lenny Hartley @ 2:17 am

    “dna analysis”

    Thanks, but I think I’ll stick with the archaeological and historical record, much of which I can still see, rather than current voodoo science.

  158. John Main


    The people greetin and living in Scotland today are descended from those who exterminated the people who used to live in Scotland.

    Says so in the Declaration Of Arbroath so believe it and move on.

    What’s happening in Gaza isn’t genocide by any stretch. Hamas can stop the war and the killing at any time. But right now, it suits Hamas to let the bodies pile up higher than the rubble. They’re safe in their tunnels behind their human shields of Palestinian kids and Israeli hostages.

    The Jews know that you can’t stop a real genocide that easily. Plenty of national groups know that too, including the people of 404 who still have searing memories of their treatment at the hands of the Orcs in the 1930’s.

    The usual suspects could twig to all of this soon enough if they were in any way innarested in ever learning anything that would challenge their prejudices and their carefully crafted fantasy world views.

    But they’re not. And when you read their pretzel-twisted posts, on a forum supposedly dedicated to Scottish Indy, and with a blogger who is single-mindedly dedicated to the truth, you start to see just how it was that Indy crashed and burned.

    Next time around, those pursuing Indy really are gonna have to exclude the carpet biters, cos no cause can flourish with them poisoning the well.

  159. Lenny Hartley

    Alf Baird noticed a typo in my post above, east sythians and Germanic y dna Haplogroup r1a not R1b

  160. Johnlm

    Genocide John pontificating on every country in the world.
    But seldom, if ever, mentions England or WM.

    Only 16 hours to up his game.
    I hae ma doots !

  161. Andy Ellis

    @John Main 10.19am

    As the usual suspects in this place amply demonstrate, there will always be a leavening of cranks in any mass movement. It is to say the least unfortunate that a hard core coterie of yon types have taken up residence in this place, and have done so much to soil it’s reputation and render what used to be a valuable resource for the movement less effective by spouting their unreason, bigotry and deflecting from more important work.

    There was never a truer aphorism than “those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.” It doesn’t matter whether we’re talking about TRA zealots, the vatniks, Orc friends and Hamas apologists in here, or sundry other sub-MAGA tin foil hat wearing zoomers like @GasGilligan referred to above. All of them are politically toxic and corrosive of our democracy and liberties.

    On the eve of the introduction of deeply regressive the Hate Crime Act, it turns my stomach as a supporter of independence that the last best hope for many of us is that the UK government and/or Supreme Court will finally wake up to the implications of folk in England being arrested at the request of Police Scotland based on anonymous allegations of Wrong Think.

    Nothing can demonstrate more clearly the failure of the devolutionary system, the need for reform, and the dangers of parties being in thrall to coteries of wedge-issue punting ideological zealots, than the current bùrach.

    It’s beyond belief that this totally unnecessary “made in Holyrood” omnishambles is distracting from the real task at hand. Enough and more than enough of this kind of thing. It isn’t enough for the SNP just to be defeated and humiliated at the next Westminster General election: it must be destroyed as a political force. Nothing less will do.

    Hopefully the Scottish voters will recognise they have been had in time to effect change at the Holyrood 2026 elections. If not, we may be waiting longer than most of us would like to for a better opportunity.

  162. Lenny Hartley

    John Main, like everything else you post the one @ 1019 is pish, scientific evidence tells us by their DNA that the Picts are still here in Scotland, there is a specific DNA marker which the People descended from the Picts have whilst other Scots have a different marker.

    But the facts never mattered to you as can be seen by the rest of your post and the other tripe you have been posting since you first arrived to disrupt this forum.

    Regarding , the Declaration of Arbroath which was a Political Document to the head of a Church which in the not too distant past had conducted the Albigensian Crusade against the Heretic Cathars, The Pictish Areas still contained monasteries associated with the traditions of the old Celtic Church which was merged with the Catholic Church several hundred years before and therefore was no longer a separate entity, its possible that the bit about the Picts was just put in to suggest that any Heresy had nothing to do with the Scots and they (the Picts) had been wiped out.

  163. Johnlm

    Zionism is an English exceptionalism creation which morphed into a political tool to control the Middle East soon after the invention of Oil drilling in Baku in the mid 1800s.

    When viewed this way the Bolsheviks, 404s, Arabs, Israelis all have their parts to play.

    It’s about political influence through oil, but Genocide John, who thinks facts older than 60 years are ‘ancient guff’ and so, can form no coherent analysis, leaving him only sarcasm and ignorant opinions.

    Btw a picture of human shields

  164. Johnlm

    The Andy Ellis word of the day today seems to be ‘soil’

    Ironic, as he’s obviously a bit of a potty dodger.

  165. Lenny Hartley

    Alf Baird, ah well, each to their own , however you will find that all the professionals in their field aka the Archaeologists believe in what you call Voodoo Science.
    Btw what you say may be true of the Picts in Orkney, the Dna evidence show that the Picts in Orkney were of Neolithic stock meaning the Pictish Culture there was spread there .
    From university of Aberdeen paper

    The Iron Age and unadmixed Viking Age Orcadians also show the highest degree of a red ancestry component (Figs 2B and S7), which is inconsistent with having originated from direct gene flow from any population included in this study and instead likely reflects retention of a less diverse pre-Iron Age ancestry in Orkney and/or strong genetic drift (such as a bottleneck or founder effect) (see [45] for insight on how a bottleneck or admixture can result in a similar ADMIXTURE profile). In fact, recent research show that Bronze Age populations in Orkney were differentiated from their counterparts on mainland Britain because of strong genetic drift as a result of a small ancestral population size, which was deduced from the observation of a relatively high number of short runs of homozygosity [13]. The Bronze Age Orkney population also retained the Y-chromosomal haplogroup I2, which is associated with Neolithic ancestry, while the R1b haplogroup associated with Bell Beaker expansion largely replaced the I2 haplogroups in the rest of Britain [13]. Moreover, although modern Orcadians are differentiated from the rest of the British Isles due to extensive admixture with Scandinavians, recent genomic research shows that genetic drift also played an important role [11,46]. This is consistent with our results that show a high proportion of shared IBD segments among modern Orcadians (>1 to >6 cM, S19 Fig), meaning they share a high proportion of recent common genetic ancestors relative to most modern European populations, typical of small or genetically isolated populations. Three Orcadians dated from the Late Iron Age and Viking Age also displayed the highest number of small HBD 9.5 cM), the longest observed amongst all ancient individuals and indicative of small population size or consanguinity (S26 Fig). Overall, these data indicate a long-term small population size, which likely contributed to the extensive genetic drift observed in modern Orcadians. The genetic differentiation between populations living in Orkney and Scotland during the Late Iron Age and early medieval period could thus be partially explained by different degrees of genetic drift.

  166. Stoker

    John Main says:

    “And when you read their pretzel-twisted posts, on a forum supposedly dedicated to Scottish Indy, and with a blogger who is single-mindedly dedicated to the truth, you start to see just how it was that Indy crashed and burned. Next time around, those pursuing Indy really are gonna have to exclude the carpet biters, cos no cause can flourish with them poisoning the well.”

    Utter f@ckin’ bullshit. And if you don’t like it then GTF. You contribute nothing to this forum other than a shitload of posts constantly attacking others.

    This “supposed” indy site survived and thrived to the success it was with those same folk on board. They helped in that achievement, like so many others, and all long before you arrived here. So where does that fit in with your utter crap noted above?

    Just about everyone, then & now, tolerate others on here having different views. Just as they would in an indy Scotland. Even if those views are alien to them. Those same folk you constantly attack held those views way back when they were promoting Wings etc. Indy “crashed and burned” for a number of reasons but absolutely nowhere is there evidence that a few different opinions on here was one of them.

    ANYONE who spends most of their time on here disrupting and attacking indy supporters, when they should be taking on Unionists etc, are not truly pro-indy in my book. For someone who comes across as quite intelligent and occasionally witty, yet you apparently don’t understand the concept not everyone thinks like you.

    Folk are entitled to their own beliefs and you are entitled to scroll on by them. I don’t for a second think you lack the intelligence to perform such a simple manoeuvre. No! It’s just that you are more about grandstanding, attention-seeking and demonstrating your deeply held belief of how great you see yourself. At school you were probably a showoff, or the reclusive shy type who is now making up for lost time.

    I see you also arrogantly tell folk to accept something and “move on”? Wings survived and thrived due to folk like them spreading the word. And whether you like it or not, those folk are needed to convince other like-minded individuals over to supporting indy. Time you took your own advice, accept the fact folk have different views to you and “Move on”. Nobody is keeping you here. Away and watch daytime BBC.

    Right, back to my self-imposed exile.

  167. Alf Baird

    Lenny Hartley @ 11:04 am

    “you will find that all the professionals in their field aka the Archaeologists believe in what you call Voodoo Science.”

    No they don’t, thankfully. We will find different professional perspectives and theories in all disciplines, all subject to bias to some extent.

    Some academics believe Scotland is in a voluntary union, even though the evidence for this is thin and getting thinner by the day! Others like me who have studied the literature and reality in rather more detail and helped to develop theory even further, in the process demonstrating that Scotland remains subject to ‘colonial procedures’, much like most other former British/English colonies:

  168. Ali Clark

    Just testing my disbelief… ousted from commenting! I thought that was the thing WE are all against! Apparently not, it’s alive here too.

  169. Ali Clark

    Well, well, well… too little too late! Any chance of letting me know what the beef was or is? In fact can it… we need as many as we can to be on the winning side. When people get sidelined for no reason they leave the fight… best of luck to you all!

  170. Lenny hartley

    Alf Baird. I will continue todisagree with what you say on ancient dna ,however as this is
    Possibly the last time I will be commenting on WOS, can I say how much I appreciate your input in the what really matters today, Scotland having full political and economical control over its own affairs.
    Keep up the good fight.

  171. John Main

    Lenny Hartley

    So bits of the Declaration of Arbroath were just put in as propaganda?

    You do realise that’s religious gospel to some of the regulars on here.

    And now you’re dissing it!


    The “Indy Supporters” I attack on here are nutters.

    You’re better off without them, but I’m guessing you’re wedded to the belief that the ends justifies the means.

    That’s never gonna change the reality that nutters don’t persuade rational people to adopt their POV.

    Quite the opposite.

  172. Craig Murray


    Be cautious. The cases quoted in this Opinion all confirm both the extra territorial reach and the continuing publication. The Opinion quotes no cases the other way.

    It depends on saying “Naw, we don’t think they are that stupid”. It assumes the good faith of the system and ignores the fact that, while it would indeed be impossible to police the world, the Crown Office may just go after political enemies ie you.

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