Temporary service interruption
Posted on
March 26, 2015 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
See you Monday, readers.
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@ Joemcg
Don’t really understand why you and others on here think that morally it was acceptable that my Russian work friend denied my lifetime ambition of seeing my country independent.
Mainly because he didn’t
Russia is not in the EU. The only way a “Russian” could have voted last year (apart from lying about nationality on the registration form) was if he or she was a citizen of some other country, such as one of the Baltic states, but self-identifying as an ethnic Russian.
Sincere apologies for double post. Cat sat on my hand while I was submitting.
BTW I asked him if the roles were reversed if I was living in Moscow (his city) and did the same he would be miffed too!
‘I am an expat who lives near Frankfurt and I am an SNP member. If I had had the chance to vote in the Ref. I would have voted YES. So now you know at least one.’
Good to know. Smiley thing.
That is not quite correct as I understand it, crazycat
Foreign nationals resident in this country were entitled to vote. Foreign students do not count in the normal way, to answer someone else’s question, for they cannot establish residence as others can.
However this alleged russian could only vote if he was resident, and if he was in Scotland for such a short time he must previously have been resident in rUK to establish his right to vote.
Natasha
Whether Jim was right or wrong you can’t tell him what he meant by a post.
For the record I left Scotland 21 years ago to work as the place was a shithole. Given the chance I’d have voted for indy. If England had a ref I wouldn’t vote in it even if it was to my advantage.
Some folks need to grow up.
Btw I’m fairly sure Stu isn’t an expat unionist and I don’t think that an real Scot in England is feeling the msm love
@
M says:
My cousin Canada left at 3 and still has a UK Passport as well as a Canadian.
Give us all a break.
Crazycat-the guy in question is a bit dodgy right enough!
Ian Brotherhood: Wish I could locate the interview where AS gave a big sigh when asked how it was decided who would get a referendum vote (this was well after Sept 18th), and he said it was the single biggest headache they had.
As ever, Ian, a good even headed post. Many thanks.
Salmond knew there was going to be headaches.
Joemcg says:
28 March, 2015 at 7:41 pm
BTW I asked him if the roles were reversed if I was living in Moscow (his city) and did the same he would be miffed too!
And what did he answer? What reasons did he give for voting?
Just for some light relief,
A comment in Spectator re Gordon Brown
There’s a Greek Tragedy waiting to be written –
about a king with no kingdom, an emperor with no clothes, a politician
with no fingernails, a bully who demanded respect and gave none, a mirthless
killjoy convinced of his humanity and humour, a bigot who railed against
bigotry, a perfectionist who could get nothing right, an arch-plotter conspired
against by all, a Messiah with grievances that only He could bear, a listener
who could never bear to be interrupted, a misjudged sage devoid of judgement,
a belligerent poltroon, a self-taught economist, a historian with no sense of
history, a sociopath who longed to be appreciated, a latter-day Nero who set
his palace alight and then shouted for petrol, a Born Leader who wouldn’t leave
the stage even if bagpipes played him out – the archetypal Scotsman with a
Grudge.
Hey you guys don’t wanna fall out with any of you! Love this site too much. My final word on this topic. Apologies if I upset any one of you. Not my intention.
I am trying to donate to the SNP election fund but the Paypal / once off donation does not seem to work – can someone else try it? http://www.snp.org/donate
If there was something wrong I would like to alert them . .
It might be my Council-issued laptop – I will try the Ipad and see if that works
Sadly, divide and rule seems to work, even here. Please think carefully about what you’re saying before you press the submit button. Lollysmum and Natasha for example, obviously care very much about Scotland and her people. They want the best for us and ALL of our people.
It upsets me to see how hurt they are by some of the things that have been said here today. We need people of their calibre if Scotland is going to succeed in having the future I’m sure we all want.
I am still upset by the no vote too, and, like everyone else, having been searching for an explanation for it. It doesn’t matter though how many “New Scots” voted no. The truth is that if enough people, whatever their origins, had been convinced by our case we would be negotiating independence right now. If you want to blame someone for what happened, maybe the BBC would be a good place to start.
Fiona- he said he “hated Salmond and Sturgeon!” Great reason eh?
Some one(s) is stirring the brown stuff up, and for one it is not me.
Calm down and more calm down.
Pretend you are at a Wings pub night and there is a Daily Mail reporter haunting the venue, as there was, last time I was there.
It ain’t public and maybe we need to have a bare knuckle cage for those who like that sort of thing, off piste?
will i vote
should i vote
can i vote please i will vote what you tell me
you’s can get that to fuck i dont care how anybody votes
scotland has woken up and nothing is going to hold us back
i remember asking my mum years and years ago what would happen if scotland was ever in trouble all she said was if
scotland needs help she will turn to her sons and daughters for they will protect her and she will be proud of them
now some arseholes are telling each other who should and who shouldnt vote great guys show the world we are just a bunch of racists like ukip now tell me
would scotland be proud of you
how many people from around the world sent us best wishes the video sent from wales had me in tears and now we tell them we are racists fucking great people made their homes here but they can only stay if they are racists you can chase that to fuck
no not me im taking no part in this crap i sit on the side reading the comments all the time and must say this is turning mt stomach i was talking my partner into attending the next wings night no thanks giving it a miss shes not from scotland so how do you’s think that makes her feel looking about for racists
dont anybody come back and say nobody on this site is racist all it took was one person to start trouble and a few names jumped in and show their trueself well thats not me so wont be at any wings nights ever
for anybody offended by these morons please dont think i have any of these thoughts i dont and never will im sorry if you’r feelings have been hurt in anyway by these morons scotland is you’r home and from me you are very very welcome
for anybody that wants to know i stay in the heart of glasgow one of the poorest citys that voted yes if anybody asked how i was voting i told them yes i didnt ask them as it would have hurt very baddly if they said no
everybody was gutted by the outcome some people on this site where leaving scotland and they are still here what happened to they cowards didnt get you’r own way so take it out on the incomers fuck off morons you’s are not needed on this site
feel proud off you’rselfs
again for anybody that feels hurt by these comments im sorry but i dont feel that way and dont think the people of glasgow feels that way we dont
sorry for the long rant i felt as if i was getting dragged into this even if i dont post much on here no doubt when stu gets back he will tell us the number of visitors is dropping pat you’rselfs on the backs loud mouths
On Radio BBC 6 Craig Charles Show, now dancing around to Motown and missing Paula.
Bugger!
People should realise :-
It doesn’t matter the colour of your skin,
whether you’re black or white.
It doesn’t matter what nationality you are,
what religion you are,
what your political beliefs are,
because in the dead of the night when its pitch black,
we are all just the same.
I for one welcome anyone with open arms.
We are all Jock Tamson’s bairns.
Gary
@Dr Jim says: 28 March, 2015 at 7:01 pm:
“Can i just say, whoa whoa whoa, a few folk today have missed my point i’ts not UKIPy or racist stuff”
Tell you what, Dr Jim. I’ve chapped doors and shoved leaflets through letterboxes since around 1946 and I would assume that gives me the experience to make observations about political matters regarding public attitudes to politics and to independence in particular. However, feel free to correct me if you think me wrong, (I learned that a long time ago too).
It has long been my experience that, generally speaking, people from furth of Scotland who come here to work but DO NOT regard Scotland as their permanent home will not bother to register to vote in Scottish elections. In fact I’ve been questioned on that matter by such people many. many times as I was also a Union Steward for around 15 years. My advice was to explain how they could obtain a postal vote.
These people went, “Home”, every chance they got and preferred to vote for the candidate they wanted for their home constituency and had little interest in who was elected at their temporary place of work and that applies to those who were on 2 year MOD transfers from southern Dockyards to Rosyth. These last got a Dockyard rented house and brought their family with them.
@ Glamaig 2.21 p.m.
The best post on this topic: simple and eloquent. Any other course than giving everyone in Scotland a vote would have been a disaster because it would have been so divisive, and a delight to our enemies.
It seems this very questionable report is having the divide-and-rule effect it intended. Have we forgotten all the English Yessers we worked with or the English SNP members we know?
The reason we didn’t win was the high number of Proud-Scot-Buts who could not be shifted from their position. Every day, in every way, the reaction of English MSM and BBC is whittling away their numbers.
Let’s let them get on with it.
@ Fiona
Thanks for the clarification – I had thought that the same register was used as for Holyrood elections, hence Germans could vote but Americans not. The Americans I am thinking of are students, which is why they were excluded (didn’t stop them campaigning for Yes, though!).
The inclusion of 16- and 17-year olds obviously shows that it was not exactly the Holyrood register, but I’d assumed that was the only difference.
Gerry Packer: We just need to keep it up for another wee while and we’ll get a record number of SNP MPs in May.
I’m wondering what last minute smear or bribe the opposition will conjure close to election day.
There can’t fall back be another ‘vow,’ surely?
Currently, they’re dragging up the same hackneyed arguments thrown at Scotland during the referendum, plus research showing we are all related to Northern English in genes, Irish too, the majority of Scots feel British, and anyhow, in time it will all be a one-world society fed and clothed and sheltered by benign corporations.
It seems our culture, mores, traditions, and language are destined to die out. (No need for BBC Scotland .) Maybe we will all have to wear the same garb, like millions of Chinese did under Mao Tse-Tung.
We have arrived at this point because the YES campaign was so inclusive ,holistic – think of all the groups who were part of it – quite astonishing and inspiring. Not only was it inspirational for Scotland looking forward to a truly democratic nation it was also backed up by very robust socioeconomic arguments for YES.
WM now increasingly looks like a hollowed out institution ,acting like a private members club forgetting whose interests that they are there to represent . Independence is going to happen ,it is inevitable and should continue along the same lines as the YES movement – progressive ,enlightening,uplifting.
joemcg 6.40pm
I have a Russian work colleague and he has moved from country to country in Europe for the last seven years working. He voted in September and has no intention of staying here.
How could a Russian citizen vote in a Scottish referendum/election? Russia is not an EU country.
As I understood it, British and EU citizens (plus (some) Commonwealth citizens?) resident in Scotland had the vote.
Maybe it all boils down to the joke of an electoral roll the UK (including Scotland) has.
I lived and worked in Scotland for years and had made Scotland my home. As an EU citizen I had the vote in Scottish GE (Holyrood) but not in UK GE (Westminster).
I think I would’ve been well justified in voting in the referendum because I’d planned to live in Scotland for the rest of my life. Then life and family circumstances intervened (not in a good way) and I had to move back to Finland (for the time being) so, of course, no vote.
The funny thing is that as an ex-pat Finnish citizen, I would’ve been entitled to vote in the Finnish GE even when I lived in Scotland (quirk of Finnish law). I didn’t, because I felt that as I didn’t live in Finland, I shouldn’t interfere.
Well, now I’m back in Finland and we have our GE coming up on 19.4. The only party that has even raised the issue of TTIP is the Greens. They’ll get my vote.
Foreigners could not vote in the referendum unless they were resident and from an EU country OR a member of the commonwealth.
I’m struggling to understand how a Russian could vote in the referendum legally.
@Alex Waugh says:
Sincere apologies for double post. Cat sat on my hand while I was submitting.
Try using a mouse instead as they don’t purr.
My double posts are sometimes blocked with ‘you’ve already said that’ message, sometimes the operative word.
Midgehunter 28 March, 2015 at 7:34 pm
How’s life living in Germany at the minute?
I’m an engineer, with the situation in the oil industry at the minute looking at my options.
I worked in the heavy automotive sector before going back to oil. Got an e mail not long ago about working in diesel engine design for a German manufacturer, got me thinking.
vielen Dank
Dug
Thanks to all those who have made kind supportive comments. I have one last comment to make, which is in response to Grousebeater. Even though you are a prick, Grousebeater, I would still defend your right to vote. Unlike you, I am a civic, not an ethnic, nationalist.
I won’t be commenting further on this. I’m glad I stood up for what I believe in, but to continue this argument does play into the hands of the unionists.
By the way, Onwards, thanks for your clarifying post in response to my comment. Sorry I jumped down your throat.
LibDems worse than Labour and that is difficult.
They have delivered Home Rule remember!
This analysis of the who what and where of the Ref is legitimate. It’s timing is not. It was designed to divide and conquer….witness Radio Scotland using it to broadcast more aural shite.
Natasha and the English born voters on here need not take offence or regret their allegiance to Independence. The critics of ‘settlers’ have been clumsy and wrong.
Scotland is vulnerable as a small colony of the UK to population movement from RUK. The majority of these people have an automatic vote and appear from the stats to view Scotland as part of that UK. Therefore, this is a long term threat to Scotland’s aspirations as an Independent State.
This is not ethnicity, it is imperialism. We have native born ‘Brits’ usually old, rural and or bigoted. Together with the ‘fearties’ they currently make up 55% of our voting population. The increase in ‘British’ internal immigration to Scotland poses a tremendous threat to sustaining a built in majority against Independence.
The only way to change this is for people in Scotland to have a recognised legal identity, that of ‘Scottish’ and have it open to all who reside here, with the usual qualifications as elsewhere in the liberal world. Those home grown ‘No’s will remain as before, but have no vote. They would be resident ‘aliens’. The new ‘Scots’ would be welcomed with open arms e.g. Natasha etc.
The problem is that as long as we are not a nation state, we cannot prevent long term RUK movement into Scotland being a political threat to our aspirations.
This is not racism, it is pragmatic recognition that ‘British’ immigration brings larger numbers of prospective ‘NO’ voters. We can only prevent this legally by establishing Scottish citizenship for all those irrespective of race, colour or religion who want to be thus.
Hi Kenny.
You typed,
“There really needs to be an “SNP for England”, it is not fair that they have no party to vote for that promises the same policies as the SNP (barring, perhaps, the Greens).
You may not recall that, back in November, Rev Stu hinted that he could stand at a by-election, or the general election, and was looking for names for his campaign.
http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-time-is-right/#more-63490
So, we came up with this badge design, in time for the 22nd November Wings get-together at the Counting House in Glasgow.
https://sites.google.com/site/webgaffer/home/badge-designs/WOSomerset-46mm-crop.jpg
.
Hi bald eagle.
Good post! Keep on posting – the more the merrier!
.
Re: ex-pats.
I moderate ONE web site that is specifically for Dundonian ex-pats.
http://dundee3js.freeforums.org/
I started a thread last year, on the subject of “Scottish Independence”. I also ran a poll, “Should Scotland Be An Independent Country?”.
OK, there were only 24 votes but it came up with 63% YES and 38% NO.
Now, I should point out that the majority of site members are in Canada but the USA, Australia and New Zealand are also represented.
You CANNOT presume that ex-pats would have voted (if they had had the vote) in a particular way. Maybe it was that Dundonian ex-pats understood WHY they had been forced to emigrate and that’s why they came out for YES?
As someone else typed above, wirra Jock Tamson’s bairns.
We live and work here. We have a right to vote. We cannot start to disect how we can remove NO voters from the mix.
That’s not the sort of country I want to live in.
That’s called North Korea…
Robert Kerr: A comment in Spectator re Gordon Brown
Almost missed your post, Robert. Intriguing doggerel.
I got the impression Brown assumed his destiny was UK PM only to discover he did not have the ability or personality to sustain it.
Having lost Rome he then set about gaining a place in history by saving Scotland from itself … only to mess up that too. Anyhow, thanks for the quotation.
I’ve just looked at this:
http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/160697/Scottish-Independence-referendum-franchise-guidance.pdf
and it seems that I was right the first time (sorry, Fiona):
“The Franchise Act sets out who will be entitled to vote in the referendum.
A person must, on the date of the referendum,
be:
? 16 years of age or over
? Registered in either a register of local government electors in Scotland
or a register of young voters
? Not subject to any legal incapacity to vote, and
? A Commonwealth citizen, a citizen of the Republic of Ireland or a citizen
of a member state of the European Union”
So, no Russians.
The question marks were bullets in the original and looked like empty squares when I copied and pasted.
I thought I’d also checked the preview box, but clearly not.
Apologies, though it is intelligible enough, I hope.
A man I know,Scots born and bred,campaigned actively for a No vote in the full knowledge he’d be moving abroad to retire a few months after the referendum and leaving us with the consequences.That irritated me a bit at the time but what are you going to do?Make everyone sign a contract saying they’ll live in Scotland forever if they get to vote? Of course not.My point is,there are always going to be anomalies whatever criteria is chosen.The Scottish government chose criteria of a very inclusive nature for the people living here.I think that was the right thing for our circumstances.Other countries have different criteria for their circumstances.
Natasha: I would still defend your right to vote.
I am relieved. And no one, no one I know, has ever called me ‘mate’ who didn’t get a piece of my mind.
I am not sure if Nicola Sturgeons speech was shown south of the border, but if it was I would think there may be one or two people out with Scotland thinking, if only I could vote for a party like that.
@truth.
Not wanting to get into the rights and wrongs of who can vote and who cannot, but I had a young Russian family staying next door to me during the referendum.
They had previously stayed in Ireland and in England then settled here. They love it here and, I think, intend staying here.
They receive no benefits from the UK and have had 2 children born here.
The father is doing a degree at Stirling university paying his and his family way. He has job placements around the EU, the sort of couple you want to keep in Scotland.
I’m drifting away from the main point and that point is that they didn’t have a vote, but they told me that they would have voted YES for Independence if they did. They even drove around town with a YES sticker on their car window.
Hopefully next time they’ll have a vote 😉
Methinks there are a lot of Wingers on here, who should make every attempt to be at the get-together in the Counting House in Glasgow, on 1st May, so they can sort out their differences, face to face.
Read like a plan?
@Papadox says: 28 March, 2015 at 6:35 pm:
“However we need rid of the English Bullshit Corporation and their Home Counties propaganda bias. They are the mouthpiece of WESTMINSTER and the establishment transmitting their propaganda to support the rancid WESTMINSTER system.”
Can I now highlight the tiresome things I have so often bleated on about? For now is a great example of why, and how, the , “Establishment’s”, brainwashing has been so effective for so long.
The above bit from Papadox is a typical example of how it works.
We must not do their propaganda for them, but lazy and unaware use of their brainwashing is so easy to fall into.
As I keep harping on about the terms, Britain, United Kingdom, Great Britain, England and British are all distinct and very precise terms. When any of us slips up and misuses these terms we are playing the Establishment’s game for them.
Now look at Papadox’s claims above again : –
“However we need rid of the ENGLISH Bullshit Corporation and their Home Counties propaganda bias. They are the mouthpiece of WESTMINSTER and the establishment transmitting their propaganda to support the rancid WESTMINSTER system.”
I’m sure Papadox did not intend to slight the English in the above rant as it is obvious his rant is against the “Establishment of Westminster”, and not the good people of England but Papadox fell into the Establishment of Westminster propaganda trap and used the term English when he meant Establishment and/or Westminster.
I’ve pointed out before how the very worst offender of this propaganda is none other than David Cameron and I’m certain, in Cameron’s case he does so deliberately.
Please do not fall for their propaganda. I know we have all been subjected to it from birth – but we can – and should – make the effort to avoid doing so. The Enemy are not our counterparts in the other UK countries for they are as much subject to the Westminster Establishment’s abuse as we are.
When all else is said and done the United Kingdom is still a very rich place and the poverty and austerity are artificially engineered. The truth that stares us all in the face is that under the Establishment’s rule the poor have continued to become ever more poor on direct relation to the growth of the richness of the rich. It ain’t rocket Science – its, deliberate Neoliberal Economic Policy”,
Come back Stu . . . .
Can’t imagine where this might end up by Monday.
Natasha, thanks for saying a lot of what I felt.
Let’s not give the opposition any more ammo, eh?
There are millions of Russians in the EU. They got unintentionally cut off when the USSR was suddenly collapsed by the idiot Yeltsin.
I have several in my constituency who regularly vote for me. The third most common language on my page is Russian.
? ?????? ?????? ? ???????????? ??? ??? ???????? .
When someone can show me an example of where political correctness expanded a debate, rather than restricted it, i’ll go along with all this righteous indignation pish.
Dr Jim had a point, you don’t need to agree.
Only a pc fascist would deny him a voice.
I would feel it wrong for me to vote, if I were in the scenario he paints. On the other hand, having the ref open to those who actually lived here on the day, was both morally and pragmatically the right thing to do.
BTW Is that a new flavour of troll I can smell
An outrage troll. Smells a bit like chicken..
I never realized how hard the rev worked until he left the site unattended. No wonder he needed some time off. This site wouldn’t last a week without him. It’s like the invasion of the body thnatchers. Only another 24hrs though and sanity will return.
We seem to suffer from a lack of focus when Stu is away. Even poor Chris with his burgled house hasn’t been able to publish a cartoon. I know how invasive that feels. Sorry to hear that it happened.
Oh well. I really thought the SNP conference was great – what I could see of it given the lack of media coverage. If anyone finds videos posted do provide the links.
@ nana thanks for the link to the PPB. Thought is was very good and encouraging.
Well I’m off to watch Breaking Bad. Completes my education on how badly behaved crack heads are (as if I didn’t already know). It’s in a different league to Trainspotting though I suspect the Mexican cousins are about to fill the gap.
Scot Goes Pop has an analysis of the recent by-election results. Keeps his eye on the ball does James Kelly:
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk/2015/03/snp-vote-skyrockets-in-all-four-of.html
Anyone notice , on the national news the attendance at the conference was 2000, then a reporter on the Scottish news said it was over 3000, running true to form!!!!!!
My comment a bit earlier seems to be caught up in the 20 min delay… No doubt it’ll appear soon enough. 🙂
On that MSM report on indyref voting. Stop and think!
The report was released six months after the indyref but six weeks before the GE, with the SNP coasting high in the polls. Isn’t it pretty obvious why it was released now? To sow seeds of discord – as it has done even here on Wings – and to provoke a reaction that allows the MSM to portray all YES voters as “blood and soil nationalists”. Some people here have fallen right into their trap.
I’ve skimmed most of the comments but not all so apologies if I state something someone else has pointed out before.
But, considering that Scotland was a part of the UK at the time of the Edinburgh Agreement, isn’t it only natural that the franchise was something already existing in the UK/Scotland at the time? A case of KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid)?
The two choices were Westminster GE franchise or Holyrood GE franchise. As the referendum concerned people actually living in Scotland, the Holyrood franchise seemed the natural choice.
As I understand it, the indyref franchise was the same as the Holyrood franchise, with the addition of 16 and 17 year olds. It was a franchise already defined and enshrined in law. No need to define a whole new one with the quagmire of expats or people with a Scottish granny all over the world or whatnot.
Instead of people moaning about “carpetbaggers” or whatnot, the important thing is for all indy-minded people to think how they can reach out to as many NO voters as possible. Antagonising them with the type of comments I’ve been sad to see here on Wings today won’t win them over.
Hell, going by some of the comments from regular Wings commenters, who I’ve always thought welcoming, inclusive and friendly, I now think that maybe I shouldn’t meddle.
Rev Stu! Come back!!!
I’ll watch Nicola’s speech again to lift my spirits. So should you all!
Dr. Jim’s point seemed to be that he didn’t agree with you about the franchise for the referendum. He is of course entitled to that view, but some of us did not like the way he expressed himself and others didn’t think it was helpful. No-one said he wasn’t entitled to express those views.
If that makes us ‘outrage trolls’ then perhaps I could throw in a quick ‘pot/kettle’ comment Defo. Why not direct your ire where it will do more good? It is difficult to see how insulting other posters on here is helpful.
http://caltonjock.com/2014/08/28/down-for-a-wee-bit-but-not-defeated-were-back-the-2015-general-election-will-decide-if-scotland-has-a-future-vote-snp-to-ensure-scots-voices-influence-change-in-westminster/
The report was released six months after the indyref but six weeks before the GE, with the SNP coasting high in the polls. Isn’t it pretty obvious why it was released now? To sow seeds of discord – as it has done even here on Wings – and to provoke a reaction that allows the MSM to portray all YES voters as “blood and soil nationalists”. Some people here have fallen right into their trap.
Exactly.
Look out though, you will be called an ‘outrage troll’
@Tinto Chiel,
My family has many friends in Scotland from around Europe, English, Irish, Basque, Catalan, and German and also from further afield who have married Scots from the US, Canada, Peru, Malaysia and Japan.
They have lots of things in common – a belief in social justice, in democracy, a belief that we could build a better country together and therefore they, like my family – all voted Yes.
We lost the referendum due to the True Scots, many who I also know, who did not have the courage and imagination to free their own country.
The question marks in my last post were put in by WINGS – not me.
I presume the Rev or his staff do not speak Russian and took it out in case I said something offensive.
what I Typed in Cyrillic text was ‘I speak Russian and often use it when I go canvassing’
That is because the are a lot of Russian speaking voters in my area.
Ooops – How could I forget our Aussie friends who where diehard Yessers!
One is even an SNP MP Candidate for GE15!
🙂
Took two days for us to start eating ourselves I see.
People seem to be be getting anal on hypothetical technical matters of eligibility,but it sounds more like superficial musings rather than entrenched dogma.
I am more vexed at born and bred Scots voting No than immigrants to Scotland who don’t get the’Scottish’ thing.
All countries have their tribal elements. A friend of mine from Bury says he can’t stand Scousers,and obviously doesn’t like Yorkshiremen.He is a retired Classics teacher and impossible not to like,says he doesn’t like Scots either,and voted No.It takes all sorts.I doubt he harbours these feelings deep down.
Lolliesmum and Natasha.You are welcome here and nothing anyone has said should make you feel otherwise.We have our own issues like any other people,but no more so.
My wife was not born in Scotland, her first language is Russian, but speaks very good English.
She’s a fully paid up member of the SNP, voted YES and cried her eyes out on the morning of the 19th of September.
There’s no one on here not going to tell me she’s not Scottish.
@ Cadogan
I doubt if it was the content of what you posted as much as the script, which may not be supported. That is the same reason why I got question marks instead of bullet points.
Also, on my canvassing team in Forres during the referendum – Scots were in a clear minority.
English for Independence were the biggest – mostly ex military – then the local Green Convenor was Italian, the canvass organiser was a Swede, there were 2 Germans, 2 Irish (plus me), a Norwegian, Dutch, at least 2 French and several other Nationalities. Probably on account of nearness to Findhorn.
Have you gays and gals not been paying attention again?
Christian Allard is a Frenchman, born in France and has entered the Scottish Parliament as an SNP MSP.
http://news.stv.tv/north/225536-what-convinced-french-born-msp-christian-allard-to-join-the-snp/
He replaces Mark McDonald who resigned his seat to stand as candidate in the Aberdeen Donside by-election. Furthermore there are at least 6 English Born already elected to office members of the SNP and many hundreds of English born party members and not a few others born in other countries, many with no Scottish family history.
Scots Renewables: To sow seeds of discord as it has done even here on Wings
There is only ‘discord’ in insulting fellow posters for reasons personal to the writer.
I saw a decent discussion with some divergent thinking on the impossible goal given to the Yes side to pass the 50% barrier, and why the same impossible target might exist second time around.
My other reservation is the futility of taking the naïve, weak, negative, far too passive political line of waiting for Westminster to crash and burn sufficiently to induce even the most ardent diehard ‘British’ Scot to vote Yes next time.
Get a grip! How will we guarantee self-governance that way?
So far England has given us on a plate Iraq, Afghanistan, politicians and civil servants made rich aiding dictators and companies avoid tax, food banks multiplying, a huge expenses scandal, a paedophilia scandal involving murder, newspapers hacking telephones as a matter of daily chore, mass unauthorised surveillance by security forces, corrupt police forces, BNP, EDL, and Orange Lodge proponents, the rise of Ukip, the extensive belittling of Scotland and all its achievements, and STILL Scots and non-Scots won the majority vote.
lumilumi says:
28 March, 2015 at 8:51 pm
…. six weeks before the GE, with the SNP coasting high in the polls. Isn’t it pretty obvious why it was released now?
Indeed, and by amzing coincidence, C4 are showing “Coalition” tonight, no doubt to reinforce the idea that the largest party forms the government.
This is a well coordinated attempt to manipulate the electorate.
Hoss Mackintosh: We lost the referendum due to the True Scots, many who I also know, who did not have the courage and imagination to free their own country.
I owe you a pint. See my last post above! 🙂
The conference
https://weegingerdug.wordpress.com/
Scots Renewables
I wasn’t in the conversation with Dr Jim, and therefore there was no disagreement.
My point is that when anyone goes outside the touchy feely yesness of Yes parameters, as on many subjects, they are howled down by the pc’s. As a racist, usually.
I’ve insulted no-one personally, and merely made an observation about an un-named poster (who wasn’t you)
@Capella
You can catch up on livestream as all videos are archived.
http://www.independencelive.net
@Robert Peffers
As a long term fan of your posts and the wisdom that only comes from many years experience, I thought you should be just the man to answer this question…
In the early 50’s the Scottish Covenant got over 2 million signatories for Scottish Home Rule.
If you believe current British history this was just after Britain’s finest hour when we all stood against The Axis powers and won the War.
So why was there such a large demand for home rule at this time?
Why did the Labour Party not support it as it was their original policy ?
(cactus did ask for topics yesterday but nobody took me up and we have ended up with a daft argument over who should have voted in the referendum – what a waste of time).
From some peoples posts on here they should be voting for this lot who will solve their personal issues.
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/03/labours-anti-immigrant-mug-worst-part-it-isnt-gaffe
From some peoples posts on here they should be voting for this lot who will solve their personal issues.
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/03/labours-anti-immigrant-mug-worst-part-it-isnt-gaffe
@Cadogan Enright
Forres still has the Yes signs on the high street above the computer shop, I think.
Robert Peffers you are correct i dont listen read or watch anything the establishment put out it is all propaganda and yes people are jumping in with both feet
i knew somthing like this was going to happen they are taking some of their tactics from ukip it was my partner that said to me weeks ago they would do this stir up trouble and cause infighting
well now its began do not let them into your heads dont read watch or listen to anything they offer its coated with poisen do what i do visit all the enemys sites and wait they always slip up dont do anything just sit and they will tell you everything you need to know
i have only one problem anytime i try to screen grab the bloody thing wont archive do i worry no i dont i just come back here and somebody is talking about what i was trying to grab let them tell us what they are doing i fucking love site sitting jimmy bond would be bloody proud
if you get bored write down all the sites and go site sitting my partner wont take me anywhere with her as ive always got my tablet with me try it just sit like a sub dont do or say anything play the game whats good for the goose and all that crap
pay attention to what robert peffers puts up for gods sake he has been telling us for ages what they are doing and nobody is listening to him thanks robert you taught me a new trick
in the next few weeks they are going to throw everything at us so get ready and dont take it out on anybody here as they will also be falling for the same dirty tricks by responding everybody should know by now if you are not sure always ask dont jump in and start screeming somebody will know and have an answer
sorry for the long rant again
@ Wuffing Dug
“How’s life living in Germany at the minute?
I’m an engineer, with the situation in the oil industry at the minute looking at my options.
I worked in the heavy automotive sector before going back to oil. Got an e mail not long ago about working in diesel engine design for a German manufacturer, got me thinking.
vielen Dank
Dug”
—————-
Hi Dug!
Germany is awash in money, the last few years have been good.
It also has to do with the fact that Germany is an engineers paradise, designing and manufacturing products of high quality which are exported worldwide.
Germany is the no.1 exporter in the world before China and the USA. and that in spite of the higher standard of salaries.
The universities/technical colleges are trying to cope with the demand for engineers but the country needs more so they tend to look abroad for them.
Maybe this is why you’ve been approached.
Anything to do with cars, lorrys, engines, suppliers to the industry in general belong to the backbone of the German economy.
The pay is good, engineers are respected people compared to the UK where it seems the spivs in the banks dominate.
Remember it’s always good for your CV. if you can say you worked for a top German company. 😉
I’d do it.
@Hoss Mackintosh
So why was there such a large demand for home rule at this time?
Why did the Labour Party not support it as it was their original policy ?
Personal power and wealth with elevation to the Lords which would be denied them via home rule.
@ Hoss Mackintosh, alexicon , dakk and Cadogan Enright:
That’s what I call Wingers.
We go forward together or not at all.
Let’s go forward.
Good night, all.
Problem with going forward with your eyes on the past is that you don’t see what’s in front of you. We need to stop all this argy bargy and build a case for scotland so that the next time there a referendum its a no-brainer Whether you were born here or timbucktoo. Labour and Tories are playing right into our hands with their insistence on austerity measures which make no economic sense.
I had a friend who came all the way over from her sick bed in Eastern europe to vote NO. I just have to suck that up. She delivered verbatim the “best of both worlds” crap from better together to me afterwords. Do I have an opinion over whether she should have had a vote? Not really. It just makes me more determined to expose the UK press for what it is.
muttley79 says:
28 March, 2015 at 7:16 pm
“@Lollysmum
I would not pay attention to what a few individuals think. They damage their own cause, but they will refuse to see that unfortunately. I do not believe the vast majority of independence supporters would have any truck with their views on who should get the vote or not. I believe everyone who lives in Scotland should have the right to vote, regardless of nationality, or any other category like that.”
———————–
I think the VAST majority of SNP members agree with that.
The simplest and fairest vote was for people on the electoral roll in Scotland.
People are hurt at the result, and will occasionally lash out at various targets, without considering the consequences.
At the end of the day, not enough people were convinced of the economic case. Project Fear did its job, with the help of the BBC and the media.
Only around 30% of No voters said their number one reason was a UK loyalty and identity.
That leaves around 70% of No voters that could have been convinced if we had won the economic argument.
And we only need a 6% swing to win the next time.
That’s why Devo-Max is an essential next step.
To DEMONSTRATE that Scotland can collect taxes and pay its way, not just spend a block grant.
Personally, I would even vote for Devo-Max if we were worse off for a few years, under the current set-up.
Running your own affairs is an investment in the future.
It’s like starting your own business – the first few years might be tough, but it pays off down the line.
@Robert Peffers 8.36pm
Robert, while I whole heartedly agree with the thrust of your main comments, I have a question as to the last statement…
ie “deliberate Neoliberal Economic Policy”
I am specifically interested in gaining an understanding of the term neoliberal. I feel it may be misused. Not especially by you, but more generally.
Reading the text of the following reference…
http://mrzine.monthlyreview.org/2007/wolff041207.html
…makes me think that I dont really understand it fully.
‘Recently’ I would regard neoliberism as being short hand for a number of Westminster policies, in particular, continuing deregulation of the banking system (breakdown of building societies and banks as separate entities). Combined with the idea that directors bonuses were directly related to their companies profitability, rather than their own wage, and so encouraged greater riskier attitudes towards ‘investment’.
This, in my opinion, has lead to the recent economic crisis, which we all now are enduring.
I would like to finish by saying, I don’t condemn you for using that phrase, but ask for pointers to greater enlightenment.
@ Grouse Beater 9.19pm
Scots Renewables: To sow seeds of discord as it has done even here on Wings
To set the record straight, Scots Renewables was quoting me.
I agree that it is unproductive to insult fellow commenters.
I don’t agree with you on impossible targets. Hard, yes, but not impossible. Don’t give up and lash out, or look for scapegoats.
lumilumi
Scottie Dog:
I had a friend who came all the way over from her sick bed in Eastern europe to vote NO. I just have to suck that up. She delivered verbatim the “best of both worlds” crap from better together
Pitiful. 🙁
Good example, though SD.
Please folks stop fighting 🙁 – go and read Wee Ginger Dug and re-focus on the prize which is in danger of being lost if we don’t. Thank you xxx
alexicon says:
28 March, 2015 at 9:06 pm
My wife was not born in Scotland, her first language is Russian, but speaks very good English.
She’s a fully paid up member of the SNP, voted YES and cried her eyes out on the morning of the 19th of September.
There’s no one on here not going to tell me she’s not Scottish.
Of course your wife is Scottish, Ignore the holier than thou posters on this site and there are quite a few. Just saying.
I don’t think Scotland’s ever going to get independence, the powers that be are too powerful. Devo max is the only way forward. No voters I know were all voting no because they thought they would be worse off. It didn’t matter how much they had, how rich or poor they were, it could have been a possible mortgage cost rise that newly weds couldn’t cope with, it could be a stinking rich Aberdeen oil lawyer who wasn’t paying Salmond a penny fcuking more in tax. Such is the power of BBC style Project Fear terrorising the populace. It works perfectly.
These are the proud Scot buts that will only ever vote YES if they are safe in the knowledge that they will do even better in a Scotland that runs its own economy and its why devo max is scaring the shit out of all our chums in the south.
Also all most no’s I know are not so nice anyway, where ever they come from.
Lumilumi: Don’t give up and lash out, or look for scapegoats.
Others did. I point out nothing has changed to ensure a vote passes 50%. In fact, The British Establishment is moving fast to undermine any more unified resolve. English only votes for English laws, Scots MPs second-class, one example.
Flipper taught him well….
“Jim Murphy, the Labour party leader in Scotland, owns a property bought with help from the taxpayer just two miles from the Palace of Westminster, which he let out. Over two years from 2012/13 he claimed £39,372 to rent another London flat for himself.”
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-46-claim-in-london-despite-owning-a-property
#explainthatyabass
And so it comes to pass, I have to take time out from attending to the Rev’s needs,to point out –
IF I HADN’T SPENT TIME TALKING TO FELLOW SCOTS WITH MY ENGLISH ACCENT THEY WOULD HAVE VOTED NO AS THEY BELIEVED THE ‘NATIONALIST’ LIE.
I am very,very angry.
Hey guys
Not invalid to offer suggestions as to who should vote in an election.
Is it worthwhile discussing it now. Nothing can change for the general election and all our efforts should be concentrating on that event.
I did throw my tuppence worth in earlier about voting rights and regret that now as it is neither the time nor the place.
Let’s work today for the big immediate prize which is surely within our grasp.
@ Rachael,
Try here.
http://anotherangryvoice.blogspot.co.uk/p/the-what-is-series.html
Of course your wife is Scottish, Ignore the holier than thou posters on this site and there are quite a few. Just saying.
I’m not angry or having a go at anyone here, just stating a fact. 😉
People are, after all, entitled to their opinion even if I feel it is wrong sometimes.
someone up the thread (cant find it now) asked about the petition for Home Rule in the 50s that got 2 million signatures.
Id like to know more about that too from anyone who was around at the time.
I had never even heard of it until a short while ago.
Why is it so little known? And why was Home Rule on the agenda then? And how was it completely ignored?
Fantastic speech by Nicola this afternoon, laying out the priorities of the SNP very clearly. Now we need to make sure the opinion polls become reality.
Many, many people who fought long and hard to help secure Scottish independence in the past, are no longer with us, to enjoy where we are now.
So to those greetin about things in this thread earlier, they need to wise up. So far as the long struggle for Scottish independence goes, WE are the lucky ones, now in 2015. We have a class A team working on our behalf in the SNP and Scottish Government, and record level support from the Scottish electorate.
It is a privilege that those who came before us NEVER had.
The chance in May is ours for taking. Stop falling for agents provocateurs (they are here) and those who clearly wish to divide us, whilst Rev Stu is away. Think before posting.
Oh, and if you haven’t seen the speech by Nicola, then check it out. In addition, Stewart Hosie and Angus Robertson were both on top, top form when interviewed today. Seriously impressive.
probably everyone has noticed that true to form the London based broadcasters have invariably ignored the SNP Spring conference on their news bulletins .
All be it a short 30 second mention which ironically was juxtapositioned after a longer package on the Tory party spring conference in Manchester.
I say ironic as the broadcasters would show audience , not that large at the Tory conference (was it filmed inside a studio?) much much smaller than what the SNP had, but didn’t show anything of the SNP audience of 3000!.
Broadcasters are determined to play down what’s happening in Scotland, that’s IS clear
@Grouse Beater says: 28 March, 2015 at 8:00 pm
” … plus research showing we are all related to Northern English in genes, Irish too
…”.
For crying out loud I’ve told you all the truth about the British gene pool several times on this site. We, that is most of the white British Born people are directly descended from the aboriginal Britons who mostly came from what we now call, “Doggerland”, which was flooded when the North Sea formed. That was after the rocky ridge that held back the cold Polar waters fractured and formed the North Sea.
Then came the Romans who must not have interbred or we would all be Latinos now. However the Romans never ruled the North, the West or Ireland so that began a cultural difference with the South Britons becoming culturally Romanised.
The Romans left and the South Britons invited the Germanic Anglo Saxon Tribes to come and defend them. The Anglo Saxons promptly replaced the Romans as the ruling Elite. Anglo Saxons came from the same area as the later Vikings/Norsemen who began to take over the South and Normans is a short term for Norsemen.
In all cases they remained ruling elites in the south there was no great interbreeding and thus little addition to the gene pool.
As for the claims the Scots, West Country, Welsh and Irish being Celtic, that too is myth. These all adopted Celtic Culture but as the incoming Celts were by the large Holy Men, teaching Christianity, they too did not interbreed so it was also cultural adoption, not genetic interbreeding.
The Establishment claims of new studies are. if you’ll pardon the expression, Pure Pish. This information has been in the public domain for years. It’s Establishment propaganda and brain washing designed to cause trouble among the easily led or simple minded.
“It seems our culture, mores, traditions, and language are destined to die out. (No need for BBC Scotland .
Sheeeeesh! Are you really that dim? Don’t you know your own country’s history? The Highlanders have already, (twice), changed/adopted a different mode of dress. First for practical reasons, (and wrongly claimed to be an English invention).
The, “Breacan an Fhéilidh” or belted plaid, and the , “Feileadh Mòr”, or (great plaid), evolved over the whole 16th century. It came from the earlier ‘brat’ , (a woollen cloak), also known as a plaid, was worn over a tunic. It probably was plain in colour or of check or tartan pattern depending on the wealth of the wearer. This fashion hadn’t much changed from that worn by Celtic warriors back in Roman times.
During the 16th century, as wool became more available, the cloak grew in size and began to be gathered up and belted round the waste.. This belted plaid first began as a length of thick woollen cloth formed by stitching two loom widths together. This gave a width of 54 – 60 inches and was up to 7 yards long.
This garment, was also known as, “The Great Kilt”, which was gathered into pleats by hand and held by a wide belt. The upper half could be thrown over the shoulder as a cloak over the left shoulder where it hung down over the belt and was gathered up at the front. It could also be brought up over the shoulders or head for protection against bad weather.
It was worn over a, “léine”, (a full-sleeved garment that stopping just below the waist). This, “Great Kilt”, could also serve as a camping blanket.
When the Highlanders were suppressed and when many came to the central belt for work they often worked in the hot and dangerous iron works. The Great Kilt first got separated from the cloak, (or plaid), part of the Great Kilt for safety and coolness and this led to the short kilt belted at the waste.
You did know that the Establishment banned the wearing of Highland Dress, the playing of the pipes and the speaking of both Gaelic and Lallans Scots – didn’t you?
Yer jist a wee puckle late wi yer thochts aboot whit wi maun hae tae dae if we dinna free oorsels frae the Establishment.
BTW: Don’t you know about how the Establishment attempted to dictate what we could wear in the 60’s and 70’s? The demonising of the Teddy Boys and then the wars between the Mods & Rockers?
Front page for Sunday Herald;
https://twitter.com/newsundayherald/status/581947212361531392
cynicalHighlander 9:38pm
yes its still there I pass it occasionally and it gives me a wee lift every time!
Another favourite is the saltire tied to a tree next to the M80 near Cumbernauld.
In fact theyre all over the place 🙂 fair gladdens ma heart to see them
Anybody else got their favourite saltires and Yes’s that brighten their day?
@Hoss 9.29
Very much for the same reasons that we got 1.6 million votes for full independence in 2014, viz.
Westminster was bogged down with bitching between the main parties
Change was not happening
Austerity was in full blast and I mean cold blast. We lit the fire at 4 and damped it down at 8.
The social security promises were already being clawed back. Charges for specs and dentures on our brand spanking new NHS then. Atos for DLA and sanctions for JSA now
@ Grouse Beater at 8pm.
What they’re trying here is
” he’s a good local man, lived here and worked here all his life, it’s not really the party, it’s the man.”
I’m countering with:
Let him resign from the Labour party and stand as an independent then. Distance himself from the policies of the party and let him stand on his own merit.
They go awful quiet at that.
Glamaig
Scottish National Covenant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Covenant
You need to use the appropriate key words in search engines.
New poll shows SNP on 32 seats – sounds more realistic to me than clearing the decks of Labour.
Another teamGB media WTF day closes and its rancid Graun at again with their very individual creepy brand of progressive liberal/actually neo fascist creepiness-
“With polls consistently predicting an SNP landslide in May at the expense of Scottish Labour, Westminster parties and some parts of the media have ramped up the “sinister” nationalist threat.
Over the past week, Sturgeon’s predecessor Alex Salmond has threatened both to lock the Tories out of power and to exploit Labour weakness in a minority government.”
Guardian’s branded all SNP voting Scots as incestuous, sadomasochist thugs, dancing the heeland fling, in kilts. So “some parts of the media” must mean something else in teamGB land.
Just had a quick Speed Read thro the thread .
This must be the first night in 18 months I can’t be ar@@d reading it properly .
Please remember these posts are more or less here for ever .
I want to say hello to Paul………. , somehow your post with my Gravitar / Avatar landed on my FB page .Paul , remind me what the punishment is for stealing my property ?
Paul I am honoured that you wish to borrow it . I was pleased to to read the complimentary comments your friends left. Thank you.
Truth is I did not make it either , I too borrowed it , I would very much like to thank the person who did design it.
I think it encapsulates a lot about Scotland .
I found it on line a few years back by accident .
@Grouse Beater
New poll shows SNP on 32 seats
Do you have a link for that?
Joemcg says:
28 March, 2015 at 7:47 pm
Fiona- he said he “hated Salmond and Sturgeon!” Great reason eh?
Same reason I got from no voting friends from this country, though. Even from folk I otherwise really respect. And it is certainly not indifference or carelessness:it is quite heartfelt
Night folks, take a chill, watch Nicola’s speech or Outlander, or, stride up and down the street swinging a claymore if it floats your boat (but keep an eye out for the pollice). Whatever you do be kind to kittens and fluffy puppies and remember to reset your clocks. Tick tock, tick tock.
Tomorrow come back with fresh eyes and a focus on 59 SNP bums on the green leather at Westminster. Forget the IRef – it’s done and dusted. GE2015 looms and now is not the time for regrets or recriminations over something that can’t be changed. (Yet!)
It’s a time to look forward and convince everyone that this wonderful Country that adopted me 50years ago is a force for good not only for Scotland but our near neighbours and the wider world beyond. The key to the shackles is in our hands, all we need is the courage to use it
@cynicalhylandery 9.38
We must post a diagram of how to hang the wee YES saltires out people’s windows like that so others don’t have to go through the learning process – is that Brian?
Bookies poll
https://twitter.com/LordAshcroft/status/581516319255896064
Wow, a lot of English wingers taking offence at what some Scottish wingers have said. Name calling and grumpy exchanges and a lot of frustration. I find I seriously cannot take offence at the ‘incomer’ stuff or the ‘get off of moi land’ vibes…it is borne out of understandable frustration. The Scots get such a bashing in the media here and further South it must be wearing.
Everyone on here wants Independence or Devo or at least something better than what we have got. Let’s direct the passion outwards at the bastards who are determined to neuter this fine country. Let’s temper our emotions and focus on the bigger picture. And let’s show the Rev that we have learned summat since September.
I’ve learned Scotland is bigger than all of us.
And made of us…
for us.
Amen.
From an atheist that last bit is a bit rich, I guess.
StevieMcB
There is no new Scotland only poll as far as I can see after checking all the usual sources – it us a bookies guess as they have the SNP at 42.5 – how you can half of a seat.
Bookies constituency seats favourites forecast at GE15 CON 276 LAB 274.5 SNP 42.5 LDEM 30 UKIP 3
Gerry Parker: They go awful quiet at that.
I enjoyed that reposte.
Scots Renewables: No. It was announced minutes ago on SKY’s look at the Sundays, the programme on behind me.
Incidentally – this is aimed primarily at the shrieking harpy – I’m half-Sicilian. Abuse and pretendy PC orthodoxy of ‘shut up, ethnic nationalist’ emotionalising a Saturday debate, can be stuck right back up the poster’s snotty nose where it belongs.
🙂
@crazycat says:28 March, 2015 at 8:29 pm:
“I’ve just looked at this:”.
It doesn’t matter a rats rectum what you looked at. The explanation is rather simple. Anyone from anywhere who has become a British or EU Citizen is eligible to register to vote in Scottish elections.
Good grief I made friends with an elderly White Russian Princess and her Scots Husband way back in the early/mid 1950’s. She married her husband in Edinburgh. (Remember the Russian Revolution,(s). built up over decades and had incidents in 1905 but are generally said to have been in 1917).
A very nice lady and, believe it or not, actually a supporter of Scottish independence. The horrors she had seen and suffered during the revolution were such she would hardly speak of them but I gathered she was the only survivor of her own immediate family. Her great love of Scotland stemmed from the fact that Scotland took her in and treated her as one of their own.
. It was announced minutes ago on SKY’s look at the Sundays
Which paper? Was it a Scotland-only poll or a subsample of a UK-wide poll?
Just curious, not hassling you (much) 🙂
@Crazycat
It seems you are correct, and I apologise for misleading you.
https://www.scotreferendum.com/questions/who-can-vote-in-the-referendum/
My error arose from misremembering some information I got when I was looking into students conditions for paying tuition fees. I should have checked more carefully before responding, and I am quite embarrassed by this. Good for you for checking 🙂
Scots Renewables
I suspect a sub-sample of a UK Yougov poll in the Sunday Times. Their sub-samples have been all over the place this week. See Scots Goes Pop for more details.
I guarantee you that this video will make the hairs on your palms stand up 🙂
Andre Rieu – Amazing Grace
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GD-5mRyaJw
@JET JOCKEY says: 28 March, 2015 at 8:51 pm:
“Anyone notice , on the national news the attendance at the conference was 2000, then a reporter on the Scottish news said it was over 3000, running true to form!!!!!!”
Yes, Jet Jockey, and I saw the BBC’s Gary Robinson getting all shouty, indignant and arrogantly overbearing with Nicola. He seemed quite upset claiming Alex Salmond was winding up the Establishment wallahs for fun. Wee Nicola put his gas at a peep in an instant. It made me smile broadly.
@ Fiona
Please don’t be embarrassed; I think you are someone whose posts on the Guardian (about non-independence topics) I used to like and agree with, so I have been very glad to see you contributing here at such length and so informatively.
You are allowed to mis-remember the odd thing now and then.
🙂
Brian Doonthetoon says:
“there are a lot of Wingers on here, who should make every attempt to be at the get-together in the Counting House in Glasgow, on 1st May.”
Shhh, Brian, if yer no careful thon Ronnie Anderson’ll turn up an’ he’ll likely be on th Bru. Ah’m no sure aboot his geneology, ye ken 😉
Get your Saltires flying and your SNP posters up. Let’s see if we can get these polls hitting over 50%.
We are getting good feed back from potential SNP voters in Dougie Alexander’s constituency.
Scots Renewables: Which paper?
I think the pundits were discussing the Sunday Times. Mind you, Nicola sturgeon is getting lots of media chatter.
In between discussing new tactics for the next Referendum, I completed in the last two hours a 1,500 plus word essay on ‘Top Gear’ for my next blog to be posted at midnight, completed the days accounts, written five letters to friends and colleagues, read and answered by e-mail an art catalogue sent to me in courtesy that makes scant mention, stingy praise of the best artist in it by miles – a world famous Scot, of course – but praises English domiciled second-rate, and tentatively picked up and binned broken glass from a tumbler that fell of the kitchen worktop. I wouldn’t want folk to think I post on Wings for a living.
🙂
Indeed when it comes to yougov sub samples we have seen lib dems at 20% and UKIP at 18% for Scotland, not going to happen. They are not to be seriously considered on their own.
As far as Sky News goes, their own polling has been roughly 42 SNP seats for the last 4 weeks.
I work offshore,on the rigs,perhaps you might find this of interest,when you arrive on a rig for the first time (typically 150 people onboard)’as part of the safety induction you have to a desk top pc and carry out a psychometric analysis.
This typically involves answering the same questions,as everyone else has answered,there are no wrong answers,the questions never change.
depending on your answers,your are put into a category and a coloured sticker is displayed on
your hard hat (very american).
Green/Blue – Thinks about it then acts
Yellow/Green- Acts then thinks about it
The point is there are people with a different view point on how to problem solve albeit, with one objective,offshore it is safety/production.
When you write/read a post please bear this in mind,we all have the objectives (trolls aside),we should cut each other some slack.
Rev. Hurry back
@ Marcia
At last! The Sunday Herald front page. Looking good. A message from the immaculate Nicola to Labour:
“We can reform Westminster and end austerity…. stand with us or Scotland will never forgive you.”
Thanks Marcia.
@Robert Peffers 10:32 says “… Then came the Romans who must not have interbred or we would all be Latinos now. …”
I sometimes wonder about that. Although as far as I (vaguely) recall the legions stationed in Britain did not come from Italy at all, more like from the EU. So it seems to me it’s anybody’s guess, this thing about interbreeding.
@ RachalRascal
I hesitate to answer a query addressed to Robert Peffer, who knows so much. But I thought you might be interested in the link in this post, which is co-authored by Yanis Varoufakis and seeks to define the neoclassical economic model. To me a neoliberal is a politician who adopts that model and puts it into practice in the policy arena.
http://thosebigwords.forumcommunity.net/?t=50525659
@Scots Renewables says:28 March, 2015 at 8:52 pm:
” … If that makes us ‘outrage trolls’ then perhaps I could throw in a quick ‘pot/kettle’ comment Defo. Why not direct your ire where it will do more good? It is difficult to see how insulting other posters on here is helpful.”
You have the right of it, Scots Renewables, for the definition of a troll is – “One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument.”
Thus, if persons in the newsgroup or message board are getting outraged it is due to the trolls, “deliberately provocative message”.
However I already posted that I suspect the real trolls are the Establishment who published the rather suspect survey. Those now showing anti-non-Scots abuse are just, (not very), innocent victims who really should know better.
X_Sticks
Is the Counting House night out on livestream?
Being a non-drinker, I like to watch from a safe distance.
LOL smiley thing, wink.
Until you learn to swim
you’ve no idea what it’s like.
But once you’ve learned and overcome your fear
it’s great- and so easy, so natural.
Every other country has learned how to be independent
except Scotland. Help ma boab!
@Glamaig 10.36pm
Brian! no but that name always conjures up this to me.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIy76M-4txo
X_Sticks – I will be there, whip in hand.
Guys
Can I ask that you try to secure your April issue of iScot Magazine from your local independent newspaper or order online from http://www.iscot.scot
Iscot is a grass roots Pro Scottish publication born out of the indy ref. Your help is appreciated
@kendomacaroonbar
I take you meant newsagent ken 🙂 Does that mean you have gone nationwide now?
Supporters of Independence there is not a better way to spend £3.99 in a newsagents. Please support if you can.
@alexicon
I’m not judging who should or shouldn’t have had a vote, merely pointing out that Russian nationals did not have the vote. Even EEA citizens did not have the vote. I’m sure there were plenty yes inclined Norwegians who didn’t get to vote.
I myself was born in England and my wife overseas (non commonwealth). Lived in Scotland all my life except for the first three years, and the three years before the referendum. I moved 300 miles back to Scotland so I could vote. I got my wife British citizenship only a few months before September, and got her registered to vote. We proudly voted yes.
I was registered to vote in England but never did. It didn’t feel right, knowing I had no intention of living there long term.
Let’s just all get along. There are better targets for our disappointment. The media being the most obvious.
@Hoss Mackintosh says: 28 March, 2015 at 8:57 pm:
” … We lost the referendum due to the True Scots, many who I also know, who did not have the courage and imagination to free their own country.”
It can hardly be a secret that the opposition to, “The YES”, campaign were officially none other than the Establishment Unionist, “Better Together”, Group.
Now can anyone honestly imagine, in their wildest dreams, that they were really other than the London Labour Branch Office, who are almost to the last man/woman native born Patriotic, (To London), Proud Scots Butts, (did I spell that correctly)?
These were, of course, financially backed by the Tory and LibDems who were also mainly patriotic, (to London), proud Scots Butts, (anyone got a dictionary). Their combined supporters were also mainly Patriotic, (to London), Proud Scots Butts. (Ah! Just found my urban Dictionary and I did spell Butts correctly as it means arses.
@Thepnr
Amazing. ta
@Fiona 11.42pm
All information gratefully received. Will check it out.
Thanx
At our best, we are among the very best.
So then, let us strive to be at our best.
Then we shall surely be independent.
Foor those weary of clipped Wings:
‘Clarkson, and the Death of Laddism’: http://wp.me/p4fd9j-186
On the subject of who should be allowed a vote, I believe people are missing the point.
Should Scotland be an independent country?
It’s a simple question with a simple answer and I would be happy for anyone, no matter what country they come from to answer that.
The problem was most people were answering another question that they had made up in their own heads. Qualifiers were attached to the referendum question by people.
Should Scotland be an independent country if I was going to be better/worse off financially?
Should Scotland be an independent country if Alex Salmond was going to eat my firstborn?
They put their own personal qualifiers and so contort the question and therefore answer a question that wasn’t put to them.
Most people in this country wouldn’t have a problem answering these questions:
Should Poland be an independent country?
Should France be an independent country?
Should Norway be an independent country?
I understand that they are independent but that wasn’t the question.
Should Scotland be an independent country? is a philosophical question the same as the other 3 above and they all have the same answer.
It matters NOT where you come from but that you answer the question asked.
@ cynicalHighlander
Thanks for the link to Independence Live but I don’t see any conference footage there. Maybe it will appear in time – I will check back!
I find it absolutely unacceptable that, 40 days out from an election, the most important party conference in Scotland is not covered by the BBC (ie state broadcaster). It’s tantamount to a news blackout.
However, it was good that Nicola started her speech (not captured on the Livestream video) with the announcement of over 102,000 members. That means that around 2,000 have joined in the past week or so! So much for the Westminster propaganda machine! They must be wondering what on earth is going on?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pis3veqKl8k
When the teacher leaves the classroom
a dynamic takes over whereby an element misbehaves.
I believe such a dynamic occurred today.
A lesson to be learned perhaps.
@Thepnr
I did…my brain hurts….:-(
@Cadogan Enright says: 28 March, 2015 at 8:58 pm:
“The question marks in my last post were put in by WINGS – not me.
I presume the Rev or his staff do not speak Russian and took it out in case I said something offensive.
No, Cadogan, the reason is that unless the receiving computer(s) have installed and selected, a Cyrillic font on their computer their machine cannot reproduce Cyrillic text characters. Just a couple of days ago I attempted to cut & paste a special character from Character Map into a post for WoS and found it wouldn’t show as the character I had copied.
manand boy – lesson learnt
Been reading your posts about the ref and who should have or shouldnt have voted in it and i,d just like to say that while i,m not happy with the result i have accepted it and moved on and the sooner some of you peeps do the same the better,
Capella: the announcement of over 102,000 members.
Remarkable.
My wife is SNP and was her provost father, but neither thought they’d see the day.
Nicolas incredible speech will have picked a up few more members and voters do doubt.
Don’t forget what Nana Smitn told us the other night – 300 new members following the Question Time Anti-Scots hatefest with Janet Street Porter and co. Bet the BBC would be sick to learn that lol.
@Breastplate says:
29 March, 2015 at 12:07 am
“I believe people are missing the point.
Should Scotland be an independent country? The problem was most people were answering another question that they had made up in their own heads.”
Exactly this! Most no voters would be hard pressed to answer “what was the actual question on the ballot paper.” Try it, you will be amazed at the answers you might get. The establishment did a very good propaganda job.
@ manandboy
An old lesson. First explained by Kurt Lewin after WW2. He studied authoritarian, democratic and laissez faire group leadership styles. He set up an experiment with 3 groups of students each led by either an authoritarian, democratic or laissez faire leader. They were given a task to complete e.g. build a tower with bricks, or some similar constructive task.
The authoritarian leader told the group what had to be done but would not tolerate question or discussion. The laisse faire leader explained the task but then left the group to get on with it – or not. The democratic leader engaged the group in discussion about all aspects of the task.
Then the leader left the room. The laissez faire group don’t bother finishing the task. The authoritarian led group finished it on time but then destroyed it. The democrataic led group continued working on the task and completed it because they had taken ownership of it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Lewin#Leadership_climates
Nicola’s speech, in full…just superb!
For the insomniacs 🙂
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd_RwlWp2Ew
Correction on last post: No doubt ( not Do Doubt)
@ Almannysbunnet, nice of you to agree as it means I’m not mad or if I am, I’m not alone 🙂
Past my bedtime so goodnight to all.
@ K1
Fantastic! Good find. I’m bookmarking it and off for a sleep now so something to look forward to tomorrow. (you’re chief insomniac !)
some of you should be ashamed of yourselves.
not for your opinions, which you’re free to express.
you know why.
Remember and move your clocks forward LOL.
Crap, forgot the clocks go forward so it’s what, 2am now? Well better go get sleep. Thanks for that link K1, will be watching it again.
@Hoss Mackintosh says: 28 March, 2015 at 9:29 pm:
“In the early 50’s the Scottish Covenant got over 2 million signatories for Scottish Home Rule.”
I was, of course hardly more than an Edinburgh schoolboy, (in those days you could be a working man at age 15). One of the Sunday pastimes was to go to Speakers Corner at the Foot of the Mound. We used to listen to the greats like John McCormack, Wendy Wood, Cannon Kenyon Wright and many other exceptionally inspiring patriotic speakers.
Strangely enough I have never given that question a deal of thought. Perhaps just accepting the rights of the matter. However, there is a history to the Scottish Covenant in the 16th and 17th century, “Solemn League and Covenant”.
Anyway, the more modern covenant was a petition to the UK government to create a home rule Scottish parliament. First proposed in the 1930’s. It was promoted by, “The Scottish Independent”, in 1939, and the movement reached a peak during the late 1940s and the early 1950s.
John McCormick started it and, “The Covenant”, was written in October 1949 in the Church of Scotland Assembly Halls in Edinburgh and during the Third National Assembly of the Scottish Convention, the pressure group evolved into, “The Scottish Covenant Association”.
Around two million people signed it and at that time the 1951 census returned the population of Scotland as 5.1 million. Incidentally they got the name from , “The Solemn League and Covenant”, that established the rights of the Church of Scotland in the 17th century. There was also an Ulster Covenant in 1912, that opposed the motion of home rule in Ireland.
I think the whole late 40’s early 50’s movement had more to do with a feeling of Scottishness fostered by the pride of those Scots all comrades together in the many Scottish regiments, together with the pride in their kin by their families. Remember that certain Regiments traditionally drew recruits from their home areas and thus engendered pride and Loyalty in them in those areas.
So I really cannot throw much light on the matter and only know my own motives were probably driven by the many inspiring speakers and leading people of the movement.
Fiona says:
28 March, 2015 at 10:49 pm
Same reason I got from no voting friends from this country, though. Even from folk I otherwise really respect. And it is certainly not indifference or carelessness:it is quite heartfelt
The constant media demonisation of Alex Salmond was always going to have an effect on some people.
He is STILL getting treated like the leader, because they have built up so much mileage in that tactic.
Right now he is getting a lot of flak about his book tour, and ordering champagne to celebrate. You have to hype a book and do publicity tours, but it is starting to get used against us.
It would be asking a lot, but I really hope he donates a portion of the book advance to charity, or to a food-bank or something.
I understand he has already pledged his first ministers pension to charity, and his MSP salary if he is elected as an MP. Not many people seem to know that though.
SNP politicians are generally held to higher standards – whether that is fair or not – they represent change.
Robert Peffers @ 11.28 pm
It’s nae like ye , the BBC NS interview was by James Cooke , nae ma Aul mucker Gary Robertson .
Nae biggie , the flavour is the same .
James Cooke is the guy who said , unprompted , he got the Treasury leaky email too without asking for it .
His tone recently , especially today is quite unpleasant ….. Somebody squeezing his wedding tackle me finks ?
Same Mis-reporting Scotland with A Fraser Quote “NS is going to use whatever influence she may have to stop Conservatives returning to power “. What absolute codswallop That’s not what I heard her say !
As for Glen Campbell , oh Labour have now ruled out a coalition with SNP , keep up Glen that’s so last week ! Aye an he gets the SNP 1979 crap out again .
So there we have it folks , if we are not careful the Beeb will slap us down like they did in Sept ’14
Miss-information is their expertise !
@ Onwards
I have a vague memory he did say he was going to do that, at a meeting I attended a few weeks ago, but I might be muddling it up with the other donations you mentioned.
Labour winning UK is fine
I have plan B worked out
@Robert Peffers
at 2:09
Sorry robert but i have to disagree about the following.
“When the Highlanders were suppressed and when many came to the central belt for work they often worked in the hot and dangerous iron works. The Great Kilt first got separated from the cloak, (or plaid), part of the Great Kilt for safety and coolness and this led to the short kilt belted at the waste.”
One assumes that if they were working in iron foundries then it would be post industrial revolution. So how come “the Small Kilt” is proscribed in the dress act of 1746 which was pre industrial revolution?
There is also a similar myth perpetrated that it was highlanders working for builders in the highlands that were building the “castles” like Balmoral for example that took to the small kilt. once again all well after 1746.
It was as much about status and fashion as anything else. As the highlands became more “civilised” with the coming of Wades roads etc the need to sleep out in the heather became less important (if you were wealthy) and the great kilt has its drawbacks. For example you could arrive at your destination soaking wet with the rain and your only option would be to hang around in your shirt tails while your seven yards of double width woolen kilt dried out. (Granted shirt tails were much longer than the modern equivalent)
I say this as a occasional wearer of the great kilt. the next occasion will hopefully be at the annual commemoration of the battle of Culloden in a couple of weeks time.
Heavens! Woke up this morning to find you’d been talking about me and my friends while we were asleep and not able to defend ourselves. A bit like the QT audience getting stuck in to the SNP without anyone from the SNP being there.
I rarely comment on anything on the site but this really wasn’t pleasant reading – and you can be sure the media will have read every word and will use the worst bits in sue course.
I actually came to the site a few hours ago looking for reports on Nicola’s speech and found just total mince. After a couple of cups of coffee and letting a few hours pass,I had another wee look and can see that we’re now getting back on track thanks to a couple of late night stalwarts.
K1 – many thanks for the link to Nicola’s speech.
Brian Doonthetoon – a site for Dundee expats? I’ll check it out. Thanks for the link.
I see there have been death threats made to the Director General of the BBC over the sacking of Jeremy Clarkson.
Over half a nation suffered through biased, scaremongering and ultimately goal achieving BBC Scottish referendum coverage but maintained it’s dignity. Indeed, nothing has changed today in the BBC’s reporting.
One racist, bigoted, adulterous, violent, misogynistic English TV presenter gets sacked for verbal and physical assault, after years of getting away with it and being protected from the inside.
Is it just me, or is there a sense of irony in there somewhere?
Carjamtic @ 11.39pm
How are Transocean doing these days anyway? 🙂
The worst wings weekend ever!
When the enemy’s at the gate you dont sit in your tent
tickling your own fancy.
Beware of greetin faces flogging dead horses,the referendum
is over…just to get it was a massive step forward for this
country.
People are the same all over the world,all over the world
people are manipulated by those in power..if someone needs
help to see through the bullshit…help them.
That’s what this site is for,……..IS’NT IT?
This whole Scots voted Yes thingy.
1. If you live here you deserve to get a say on how your society is run, doesn’t matter where you were born.
2. Pretty much every time I canvassed, was in the Yes shop or was on a stall there were English colleagues with me, wanting independence every bit as much as me.
3. What would the cross tab of ‘born in rest of UK’ versus age and / or wealth be? My feeling is a lot people retired up here and irrespective of place of birth they’re simply falling into general line with their age group by voting No. Same for those high earners – they’re doing (statistically) what Scots in the same income brascket did.
Our job is to convince everyone independence makes sense.
Rigmac7: I see there have been death threats made to the Director General of the BBC over the sacking of Jeremy Clarkson.
The peoples’ hero. Unsafe to say a bad word about him.
@Donald.
Could not agree more
Donald: Our job is to convince everyone independence makes sense.
We need fresh thinking. All the road blocks to autonomy remain in place. We won’t win over ‘I’m British’ hearts if we talk of taking over Westminster.
All the main opponents admitted Scotland could sustain a prosperous nation if independent. That didn’t stop 55% voting to be ruled by another country.
We want to administrate our own country without interference from a neighbour state. We don’t plan to run our neighbour state We have to convince the convinced we are not a threat to their well-being. The place you were born does have a bearing on how you will vote if you think it holds better values and prosperity than the place you live.
Well, I’m mighty glad I didn’t wade through lots of tripe to get this far, just joining again after closing at 8.00 pm last night, but I do get the drift.
The referendum voting conditions were perfectly clear, no ifs or buts, the real damage was done to the YES campaign by the UK Establishment machine and guess what? It’ll happen again. So get used to it and overcome it.
@bald eagle says:28 March, 2015 at 9:43 pm:
“Robert Peffers you are correct i dont listen read or watch anything the establishment put out it is all propaganda and yes people are jumping in with both feet.”
Aye! Bald Eagle, not only have I been an independence seeker for a very long time but spent a 50 year stint as an industrial Civil Servant in the MOD. 15 years of which I was Shop Stewarding.
It certainly is a hard school that teaches just how the Establishment works. You develop a sense of self preservation and a defence against the sly stab in the back. Most of all a life-long study of the real history of Britain that, once realised, makes it all to clear the Establishment has always been in operation and the class system changes its disguise when it is forced to do so but it never goes away nor ever gives up.
I’ve pointed it out often that we still have the ancient families of Royals and Aristocracy – the elite ruling classes – holding the controls of political power. As far as they are concerned we are there as the means of their continued wealth and power.
Barontorc: The real damage was done to the YES campaign by the UK Establishment machine and guess what? It’ll happen again. So get used to it and overcome it.
Just noticed something interesting: the Wings fundraiser’s up to £105,774 now, with 23 hours to go. If I remember correctly, the most Stuart’s ever asked for in a fundraiser was £53,000. A little further and we’ll have doubled that, too 🙂
@Robert Peffers
I very much appreciate your insights into the history that shaped our culture. If we lived in a genuine democracy we would all be aware of the levers of power. It’s why we need to keep on using alternative media. I’ll check out getting a copy of iScot magazine as I thought I had subscribed but haven’t seen a copy for a long time now.
Now to track down the conference videos.
Loving the phrase that is being used to help people decide how to vote in the General election on May 7th.
“Who’s going to stand up for Scotland”
@caz-m
Hi caz, I think Thistle (Kevin) is going to be at the Counting House, but I don’t know if he intends to broadcast it on Livestream.
Over to you Kev…
On the subject of who voted what in the referendum, I think we’re wasting time looking backwards when we should be looking forwards. The report is very divisive, and I think it is intended to be so. The timing of the release of the ‘research’ is highly suspect and is calculated to cause division.
Don’t fall for this bait.
The referendum is passed. History. Whatever people voted in it is irrelevant to where we are now. We had support for Yes from all corners and some of the most dedicated Yes campaigners were not ‘born’ Scottish but worked harder than many native Scots to earn us our independence. We should not forget this.
A retrospective blame game does nothing to help. Put it behind you and move on.
The game is still afoot and there’s work to be done. As other have said, it is the british establishment we are up against and it will do pretty well anything to stop us achieving our goal. Getting us fighting amongst ourselves is part of their strategy. Posting comments that upset or rile fellow posters is doing the establishment’s work for them. Think before you post.
It’s the SNP Spring Conference and Andrew Marr of the BBC could have invited any number of SNP Ministers on to his show. And who does he decide to bring in? Douglas Alexander of Scottish Labour.
This was the BBC giving Scottish Labour more free publicity. Alexander talked of who he would deal with after the election, he is very sure that he is going to be re-elected.
Alexander is also getting another shot at kicking the shit out of the SNP, when he is a guest on the Sunday Politics show with Andrew Neil.
Add this to the BBC giving Murphy airtime the other night on Question Time, from BOLTON.
The BBC/BBC Scotland and Scottish Labour, really do have it in for the SNP.
@ScottieDog says: 28 March, 2015 at 9:52 pm:
“Problem with going forward with your eyes on the past is that you don’t see what’s in front of you.
Total nonsense, Scottiedog. Anyone unable to look back at the mistakes of the past is destined to repeat the mistakes of the past. For example, you will not see any outrage and criticism from me over the SNP MP accused of fiddling expenses by a Channel 4 documentary about MPs who rented out their owned properties in London and then were claiming hotel expenses.
I already knew the real score as, armed with the happenings in the past, I had already taken care to look for the truth of the situation and knew the real story. The SNP MP in question is actually the Scottish MP with the smallest expenses claim. He had no choice but to claim a minimum after the Establishment changed the rules.
Not so certain factions here who were, “Shooting from the lip”, and expressing great outrage and condemnation and who were quite obviously sucked in by Channel 4 deliberate attempts to get from Scots that very outrage and condemnation that the particular WoS faction had swallowed whole. You will find them doing so up there /|\.
If they don’t know yet that the Establishment includes in their numbers the Fourth Estate, (newspapers, magazines, television, and radio stations and the people who work for them who all wield great political influence, (i.e. brainwashing)). Then it is long past time they did know.
It seems to be, largely, the same faction now jumping upon the brainwashing of the referendum being won by only non-Scots nationals. For heaven’s sake it was without doubt that the main official opposition to the Y ES Campaign were, “Better Together”.
An organization of mainly native Scots headed by a London born, (Patriotic, (to London), proud Scots butt and financed by the London Unionist Establishment and mainly voted for by native born Scottish branch office Labour, Tory and LibDem, Patriotic, (to London), Proud Scots butts.
History shows it was just such London based Scots, or those Scots, landowners & parliamentarians, who aspired to join them in London, who first sold Scotland’s birth rights to The London Establishment for English gold.
Another 642 people joined SNP yesterday-total membership now 102,785
Does anyone know if today’s conference is being broadcast?
http://www.strathclydetelegraph.com/2015/02/contemplating-future-labour-party/
X_Sticks 10.02am
Agree with you on the moving on point. We have to deal with the GE first. As I said yesterday, the YES flag came down and the Saltire and the SNP posters went up.
We want to aim for OVER 50% of the electorate. It is very do-able. We are trying to gain the confidence of people who would never have thought of voting SNP in the past.
Vote SNP May 7th, the Party for all normal thinking people!
Well said Mr. Peffers and I hope all those who go running around screaming and yelling doomed, doomed, pay attention to your words.
Why this rush to condemnation without the facts, why this strange urge to believe the worst of our own on the sayings of those who would destroy us?
The fifth column would appear to be alive, fomenting trouble and spreading despair. Ignore the siren voices, we are strong and further on than we have ever been. Hold the ground!
Okay, today’s big juicy Sunday lunch with all the wings trimmings is off the menu, but there is a tasty dish or two on offer over at Twitter. The Extremely Very Reverend Stu is putting up occasional tweets on a range of issues, tweeting like a happy/grumpy birdy.
OT, I like the pro Indyness of the Sunday Herald but its journalists do need to browse Wings more and memorise the correct facts. In it I read,
“Today marks the anniversary of the motion of no confidence in 1979 – initially tabled by the SNP – which brought down the Labour government of James Callaghan.
The vote has dogged the SNP for years and strategists are determined the party is not held responsible a second time for ushering in a Conservative government if an alternative is possible after May 7.”
Only dogged the SNP because papers don’t go on to say what actually happened. Callaghan broke Devo promises and got hammered rightly for it. Liberals did much of the backstabbing.
@ Lollysmum
Conference? What conference?
Here’s a link to the BBC’s coverage of Scottish politics today. It does mention the SNP in the passing, mainly because the Tories have parked a big poster outside the SECC. The BBC helpfully reads out the text of the poster in case your eyesight isn’t up to it!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-32099260
No timetable as far as I can tell. But check out livestream in case they are there.
Hello folks,
Here are a couple of new images that might amuse you.
http://mistygee4.wix.com/-page-altered-images
@X_Sticks
Great post. Repeat as necessary until message gets through.
We won’t get anywhere looking back.
BBC coverage has started online. The star of the Conference has to be the very energetic sign language woman who puts all emotion to what she does when I was watching via Independence Live yesterday.
@ Lollysmum
Oh I tell a lie! BBC 2 are showing highlights of the conference at 11.30 tonight for half an hour. Scotland only. So sorry, you won’t be able to see the highlights even if you do stay up late!Tough.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b05pvzlw
But from the link I posted earlier, the BBC obviously think the conference ended yesterday:
“At the SNP conference, which the party said 3000 people attended, leader Nicola Sturgeon promised to reform Westminster for ordinary people, wherever they lived in the UK.”
@Lollysmum
Another 642 people joined SNP yesterday-total membership now 102,785.
Obviously there are 642 people out there who are a great deal brighter than Brian Taylor and his two journalist friends who had a nice little chat at the end of the BBC’s so-called coverage of conference.
What was really telling was their total inability to comprehend the real reason for the things Nicola said – ie that she actually believes in them. They simply accused her of cynical ploys to try and call the shots at Westminster.
Well, yes, we do want to call the shots at Westminster, but not for the same reasons as the Unionist parties. Firstly, we care about social justice, and secondly, our eyes are set on a far higher prize. They can’t understand that.
The other thing that really annoyed me was Brian Taylor’s constant attempts to accuse the SNP of being presumptuous. I realise that it’s part of his job to be a devil’s advocate, but he only does that part of his job when he’s talking to the SNP.
Plus, he’s unable to talk for more than a few minutes without betraying his true allegiances. He needs to take a long hard look at himself in the mirror.
The Referendum was lost because of Westminster Unionist lies and the colluding MSM. They are not getting away with it.
The Sheridan political show trial cost the taxpayers £5Million because of Labour/Unionists. The trial was a farce. The main witness committed perjury. Tommy Sheridan’s ‘conviction’ will be quoshed and family compensated.
The Press are a disgrace. The tax evading, official bribing, lying ‘Press’. Scotland should implement the Leveson verdict. At least the public would have some redress.
The Ashcroft exit Poll showed people voted NO because they believed Scotland would get fiscal autonomy. Now typically reneged upon.
Marcia
I agree with you about the sign language woman. She must be exhausted already and it’s only halfway through!
Caz-m: the BBC giving Murphy airtime the other night on Question Time, from BOLTON.
Exactly. Justified on the basis he is an MP not an MSP. So, what was he expected to talk about, real ale good or SNP bad?
Author Al: The Extremely Very Reverend Stu is putting up occasional tweets on a range of issues, tweeting like a happy/grumpy birdy.
He’s not at all happy with the vote on female quotas.
Murnaghan asking puerile questions of Nicola on Sky right now, he is such a prat
I was to knakered to post up last night, but I did read comments quiete a lot of them GRRRRRRR
I read from 6th post 10.03am Robert Peffers reply to ScottieDug.
As I recall the person who started this Angus Brendan MacNeil expences claim IS A BLOODY TROLL.
Now why would you,s think they would share that pearl of information with US.
C mon Wingers back on Track we have a to Country LIBERATE.
JTP/Kininvie & friends sorry I didnt get to sit down with you,s,I was hi jacked by some lovely ladies from Maryhill foodbank.
@RachaelRascal
Sorry, I can’t find the time of your original post, but if you are looking for a good explanation of neo-liberal economics, you could do worse than Richard Murphy’s book, “The Courageous State”. He helped to set up the Tax Justice Network and has a very good blog, Tax Research UK.
@Robert Peffers,
Thanks for your thoughts on the Scottish Covenant.
I have wondered about it for a while – I supposed the Scots servicemen came across lots of folk from the colonies during the war years who had home rule and independence and thought we can do that as well.
They were let down by the Unionist Party and the Labour Party – no surprises there then.
Meanwhile back at the Ranch…
Watched Nicola on iPlayer and what a truly inspiring speaker – head and shoulders above the Westminster politicians.
That speech should be compulsory across the UK.
Then I think the SNP should go into a formal coalition with Labour after May but only on the condition that Nicola becomes Prime Minister. 🙂
Capella says:
29 March, 2015 at 10:24 am
@ Lollysmum
Conference? What conference?
Indeedeedoodee. Rancid Graun creepy coverage, Lab’s up margin of error wise but look at them.
https://archive.today/BVYEl
Bless.
Or not. They wrought havoc last time so maybe less bless and oh christ please not again.
Hoss Mackintosh
Then I think the SNP should go into a formal coalition with Labour after May but only on the condition that Nicola becomes Prime Minister.
Your comment made me smile, because I was talking to my uncle who lives in deepest Essex, and who made a similar comment on the grounds that Nicola Sturgeon was the only politician in the UK who was talking sense at the moment. My immediate response was, “Well, you’re not having her, she’s OURS!”
If, however unlikely, we go into a coalition with labour, I think I would insist on Alex Salmond taking over as chancellor of the exchequer. LOL! that would have them crapping themselves.
The line I loved from Alex about Osborne was ” I do not know what subjects he took at University, but economics was not one of them” Brilliant!
Nicola,was outstanding, we can feel proud.
@Hoss Mackintosh 10.59 am
Unfortunately, as she’s not an MP, Nicola coouldn’t be Prime Minster! :o(
Listened the to the 30 minute conference report on Radio Scotland this morning with Severin from the Guardian and Bruce from the P&J. I did expect there to be a fair degree of antipathy from those quarters but was actually pleasantly surprised. I have to be fair and say I have found Severin a lot more neutral when talking on radio than in his written pieces.
The host (possibly Glen Campbell) asked Severin if he thought the polls right and the SNP are winning. Severin gave a one word answer, Yes. No qualification or “but” just a straight Yes.
HandandShrimp. I have to be fair and say I have found Severin a lot more neutral when talking on radio than in his written piece
You dont have to be fair at all. Carrell’s fellow vote SLab or else shill did a so so SNP thing in their Friday edition online but its merely because this dynamic duo then had to go to Glasgow and bother SNP people in packed conference halls. They’re only human these shills.
Next week, Libby Carrell will put the boot in harder than ever.
@ themaninthejar, Scotland’s pre-industrial revolution iron-works were in the West Highlands, these used charcoal made by wholesale destruction of the native woodland and often ore imported from Cumbria. This industry flourished due to woodland loss in England and laws preventing this destruction. This short kilt was, I believe, worn in the Highland ironworks, not those in the Lowlands which used coke made from coal & local ironstone. This new industry had the un-intended side-effect of saving what was left of the Highland forests.
@ Marcia
I checked the BBC schedules and can’t see where they are streaming the conference (not that I would watch BBC). Do you live in Pacific Quay?!
I’m going to stop posting as it sometimes can’t reload after a post, probably because of all the comments. I do wish Stu would take a break from tweeting about all women shortlists and start a new thread here – even if he doesn’t actually SAY anything.
Anyone else find the site struggling with the comments? Will check back later and see if things improve.
SNP conf
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-31999263
Thanks Nana!
Didn’t plough through the News sections!
Site reloading quicker already – MI5 must have switched off some devices! (that IS a joke).
Capella
The clue to the BBC coverage is in the first sentence;
Marcia says:
29 March, 2015 at 10:42 am
BBC coverage has started online.
People saying ‘what happened is past, move on’. True, to the extent we need to focus on the future. But also, we need to analyse how we got to where we are so we can avoid repeating mistakes and know what/who to target.
An example (from the vast amount out there) …..
http://lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Lord-Ashcroft-Polls-Referendum-day-poll-summary-1409191.pdf
Most important to No voters were the pound and pensions. This definitely needs sorted for next time!
And, despite all the recent suggestions to the contrary, a quarter of No voters believed a No vote would still mean extra powers. These folks will need special attention if/when no more powers are devolved!
I reckon the plan for how to move forward, and win, is in the detail of what happened.
Angus Robertson (SNP MP) , Gordon Brewer (onionist)Hahahaha
Angus well done & I wish more SNP interviewee,s would pull them up.
new balls please
http://caltonjock.com/2014/08/28/bought-and-sold-for-english-gold-how-the-greed-of-a-few-condemned-a-nation-to-300-years-of-servitude/
Free speech suspended on WOS.
Now had two posts censored by WOS. One on economy and the other scrutinising the SNP.
Looks like SNP clones have won the day and Free Speech will have to move on to other sites.
David Clegg, the record political editor, just admitted the he/we put the offer of printing ‘the Vow’ to the Westminster leaders. The Ulster Unionists were behind the vow.
@Fred
at 11:41
Hi Fred
I am not disputing that you are correct regarding the Highland iron works. However these would not have been on an industrial scale possibly more like a large blacksmiths. I could be wrong however thats not quite the point. If the heat of the foundry was the problem then all someone wearing the great kilt would only have to let the top half drape down behind as was frequently done in warm weather. The problem when wearing the great kilt while carrying out many tasks is that it requires constant adjustment. Have you even watched an Indian woman wearing a sari? I can sympathise with them.
Although I have looked I have never been able to find hard evidence either way for the origins of the small kilt I have come to my conclusions by talking to historians and what I can gather from reading. That and personal experience while taking part in “living history” events. I put it in the category of history that was considered so mundane at the time no one bothered to write it down.
Anyhoo in the great scheme of things its not worth getting uptight about. It is just a wee bee that I have in my reproduction 18th century bunnet. 🙂
@Nana
Enjoyed the conference stream on the BBC between 10:30hrs and 11:30hrs on my tablet in the cafe this morning. Couldn’t put the link up because difficult to save and paste (don’t know how) but I am glad you have stuck it up for today.
The BBC are experts at hiding links in difficult to find places.
In this case down the bottom of the ‘Laurel & hardy’ Tory advert on the politics page but hey! that’s what Auntie does best.
Many good issues raised and motions passed and great to see Swinney having his bit on the SNP record since first elected as the SG.
Looking forward to the afternoon session. 🙂
What do you mean by “censored”, yabadabadoo?
@Capella
I thought someone had already posted the link for the conference, really sorry I did’nt realise no one had.
J Swinney’s speech was fantastic. I hope the snp are recording these speeches.
Brewer’s been on the juice.
Clegg, Curtice, Carell. The three ‘C’s’ The Unionist BBC
Just watched Morning SNP conference on BBC online. Starts again 2.30 till 3.30.
I heard on the radio that Labour are saying the SNP are trying to take Labour votes.
Jings, Mealer. They are trying to take Labour’s very own votes, that they have been keeping in an envelope for a rainy day? That is just rotten!
Good afternoon Sunday readers, how ewes all doing with the temporary service interruption.. some accompanying background music would be good.
Here’s a funny.. if the predicted comes to pass and our present Scottish Government team are proven successful within Westminster (to the benefit of ALL those residing in these islands of ours), maybe in another five years time, who’s to say the good people of Britain would vote to relocate the nameplate from London to Edinburgh for efficiency he he? (unless our eventual independence comes sooner of course!!).
So, any other new topics for today anybuddy? Cheers back to ye Hoss.
39 steps to go.
I wish people would stop going on about Jim Murphy being on Question Time from Bolton.
They seem to have forgotten that Ms Sturgeon was on Question Time recently and it was taking place in England.
@call me dave
I was sure someone had already posted the link. As you say the beeb are determined to hide any coverage.
Did you notice how the commentator starting speaking over the announcement of Alex taking a Q&A session later. I did not catch the time and place.
The beeb won’t be covering that anyway, no chance.
Test
(comment in moderation?)
Fiona,
blocked from appearing.
funny that WOS would allow moronic squabbles to be posted and not political debate.
I will slip this one in to see if it gets past:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11501280/Eurozone-cant-survive-in-current-form-says-PIMCO.html
SNP’s drive to join the United States of Europe with it’s own army (not independence) now being uncovered MSM.
@ Nana No problem. I was looking for it for Lollysmum but as I don’t have a TV, don’t watch BBC except iPlayer and don’t use their website anymore I’m all at sea finding things. They don’t make it easy when the SNP conference isn’t referenced on the home page.
And it would be good if the SNP would upload all their conference speeches to their youtube channel.
For anoraks out there there’s a paper on “Arrogant Posh Boys” which looks at efforts to make the Tories look more normal, unsuccessfully, with their A lists. Does provide some facts for the short list debate. Soon all this will be consigned to the dustbin of history ( I hope).
http://tinyurl.com/q3gdl8v
Snode 1965 says:
“@manandboy, don’t agree on expats getting a vote. Every expat I know would have voted No, couldnt understand why so many of us could back a Yes vote. They no longer contribute to our social or financial fabric, therefore can butt out.”
Well thanks for that. That really made me feel a useful part of the yes movement.
I am an expat, a member of the SNP and have been a nationalist all my life but I should now butt out because I had to leave Scotland. That attitude really pisses me off. What am I? A second class yesser? I suppose that rev Stu should also butt out by your criteria?
Absolutely raging now.
@yabadabadoo
Have you got any evidence that your posts have been “blocked”?
Several posters have been reporting problems with the site: perhaps you are experiencing the same thing?
Well done Angus Robertson, you let Brewer make a complete fool of himself, running off at the mouth. Brewer is as much use as a chocolate teapot, a complete anti Scottish bigot. Only the EBC Scottish propaganda unit would employ such a moron, then again Boothman & MacQuarrie have a complete set of anti Scottish mercenaries, including Mr Curtis.
Severin Carrel gave a well balanced and honest put down to Brewer & Curtis’s diatribe.
We need shot of this EBC lot, permanently!
O/T yabadabadoo – I doubt it is censorship, more likely just the usual glitches in the site itself, where posts disappear or take a long time to show up, which even the best of us have problems with now and then.
Katy Clark has invited Gordon Brown for tea and buns in the St. Peter in Chains church in Ardrossan, 4 o’clock this afternoon.
SSP will be there to welcome him, and a’body’s invited to, hopefully, catch a glimpse of the Great Gordo as he’s whisked in!
Whoooooosh! There he goes…
@yabadabadoo
Read the article you linked. Did you?
Well done Angus Robertson, putting Brewer back in his Britnat box.
Tip for long meandering threads
Use your browser’s “Find” function for your name / subject so you don’t miss any replies that have been delayed or obscured in the witterings on other topics
yabadabadoo says:
29 March, 2015 at 12:39 pm
How did you get the statement in your post from that article?
I think you need to take off your UKIP glasses when reading.
O/T (but isn’t everything on this thread!),
Here’s the after speech media frenzy and the applause after Nicola finishes speaking yesterday. Coupled with comments on the live feed from independencelive.net
https://youtu.be/nwacqb7_XB8
yabadaba….Please archive pish from the rags
https://archive.today/dDlek
Patrician at conference session – Alex Salmond’s Q and A session. Loadsa camera’s there, BBC not broadcasting any coverage????
He will try to get photo posted.
Gordon Brewer’s dyspeptic encounter with Angus Robertson is obviously the result of his Slab buddies faltering at the polls. His carefully sprung trap which he doubtless was up all night constructing, came to nothing, at which point, like Kaye Adams whose face is also tripping her, he confessed to becoming confused.
Why do I keep seeing Stanley Baxter in this con artist?
@ yabadabado, don’t let the door hit you on the arse on the wey oot!
Wow! Compare that to the lib dems wake the other week yet that was broadcast live. Funny that.
Apologies if this link has already been shown but i’m not trawling through all this thread to check.
SNP hat trick of by-election wins.
http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2015/mar/hat-trick-snp-three-election-wins
And i’ve only one reply to that:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEzLTSF6XaU
🙂
Deja vu on the MSM threads. “Brewer tore Robertson a new one” according to them! Eejits.
http://centreonconstitutionalchange.ac.uk/sites/default/files/Scottish%20Referendum%20Study%2027%20March%202015.pdf
Interesting. But and I apologise for it being the Daily Record,
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/independence-referendum-figures-revealed-majority-5408163
the claim given is that if every rUK citizen eligible to vote had done so then 300,000 would have voted No. Allowing for a low turn out and subtracing those who actually voted Yes then that means that less than 200,000 margin was made up by them. At the same time I seem to remember only 5% of those eligible were non-UK citizens. There’s simply no way they could have made up more than 200,000 votes.
So, hard as it might be to accept, the result is flawed and the majority of Scots did NOT vote YES.
Also not the timing of the last part of the survey. It’s 6 months later when those replying might be more likely to report what they would like to have voted rather than they did.
Also note the lack of raw data to back the findings. We don’t have a clue how they’ve been processed.
We’ve been trolled by a set of slides with nothing to actually back them up.
yabadabadoo
The site has a SPAM filter. You may have triggered it if you used one of the key words or letter chains. One of these chains was N-F-L, which made things a bit weird, for a while. Try re-wording your post.
The mob that hassled Ed Milliband the other day, in Alex Salmond masks, have been revealed to be paid by the Tories.
I believe the story is in the mirror newspaper
Joemcg,
There’d be more chance of getting upto the bar at the LIbdem conference.Craic would be pish,though.
Trying to keep this uppermost – Gordon Brown to appear, as guest of Katy Clark, in Ardrossan at 4 pm today – St. Peter in Chains church, on the seafront.
A rare chance to witness the man who saved the Union as well as the world. Please tweet a’body ye ken who may yearn to catch a glimpse of this living leg-end.
Extra-special shout-out to anyone who may have banners, placards etc with appropriate messages of welcome.
Get the word out!
Yabadabadoo, you remind of a wee song.
*Stretches fingers and tinkles ivories……
Yabadabadoo, oh your patter it’s like poo
It makes me queasy, queeeeasssy.
Yabadabadoo, are you red or are you blue
You’re too easy, eeeeeasssy.
Yabadabaday, all your seats are going away
That’s what the polls say, pollllllls say
*leaves tammy on ground and looks about hopefully
To all who tried to find conference footage for me, many thanks for your efforts. I’d been on that BBC page earlier this morning & there was nothing there about today & text gave the impression it was a one day conference only. I tweeted Pete Wishart in the end & got the link back 5 mins later. Now that’s what I call responsive 🙂
BBC didn’t start their coverage till well after the beginning of today’s business but I got to see most of it.
@yabadabadoo
I very much doubt that your posts were blocked. I gave up trying to post last week when 3 posts in an hour failed to appear. I came to the conclusion that I’d inadvertently fallen foul of some of Akismet’s (anti spam/abuse programme) trigger words or that the site was struggling to cope during busy periods. I think even Stu is baffled by delays to posts appearing. It started off with just 1 or 2 posters but lately it’s been more than that affected.
Mac users don’t seem to have any problem though!Perhaps I need to invest in one. Nah, no laptop is worth that sort of cost unless you live on it or use it for business 🙂 so I’ll just carry on with my Win Vista laptop & put up with the problems till they become unbearable.
Alex Salmond this morning reading extracts of his book with a Q&A session.
Good job Newsnet filmed it as the beeb are worthless ____.
http://newsnet.scot/2015/03/salmond-pt-2-the-dream-shall-never-die/
For the love of God can we stop posting direct links to the Daily Record, surely everyone knows that by now.
For those new(ish) to the site, here’s what was happening here this time last year. If you think that’s good, compare it to the lead article on the landing page.
http://wingsoverscotland.com/a-rush-and-a-push/
X
Deja vu on the MSM threads. “Brewer tore Robertson a new one” according to them! Eejits.
Time is running out for Labour and Coalition in Scotland so expect a lot more “alternative reality” comments in the MSM and bizarre claims from politicians like “the SNP are taking Labour votes” as if this is some sort of underhand and unfair tactic.
I think Nicola and her team have played this election really well so far. They have given their opponents, both political and in the media, so little to get a purchase on that they are desperately scrabbling for any and every handhold…no matter how loose, dangerous and ridiculous.
We are entering the final straight now and the field is wide open for us to run to the finishing line. Everything I have heard so far from the conference suggests that Nicola intends to run strong and true in these last 39 days.
“but what if the tories offer you FFA” quips a smug wee idiot on the BBC
Who is this guy is he stupid or something lol way to hit the bottom of your bag Brewster ,nope checked out the window no flying pigs.
Well done tae Angus for pitting his gas at a peep.
Angus Robertson and Stewart Hosie, giving concise and cogent answers to the Leader of the opposition of the SNP in Scotland. Yes, you guessed it…The BBC.
Chief political branch officer Brian Taylor trying his very best to maintain the illusion that he is somehow ‘unbiased’ in his questioning. When it’s plain to ‘hear’ the exact opposite is the reality.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eMrOxDZEsg
New Gender balance rules passes.
Can’t say I’m particularly convinced with the need for potentially all-female shortlists, but looking at the figures, it is true that women are under-represented at the moment.
And if higher SNP female representation helps to increase the apparent polling deficit in women for independence, then it could end being a good thing tactically speaking.
@ orri (1.10pm).
Yet, given at least 3 alternatives, you opted to post a direct link to a rag which exists to crap all over our cause.
As you know, direct links help these rags to pull in advertising revenue and therefore helps them to survive.
Is it any wonder they print constant crap when there are people out there who help them to promote their drivel?
@ Noel Chidwick
Thanks for that-brilliant. ‘The press are going crazy’ was my comment. BBC footage cut off as soon as Nicola stopped speaking to make sure no-one saw the audience response but for me it was the press response that struck me as being so different to past events. They were fighting to get close for decent shots but there was just too many of them. They left BBC cameras stranded outside the scrum 🙂
Livestream was being watched by Scots all over the world including South Africa, USA, Canada, Spain, Philippines etc & it was the first time I saw the number of online viewers shoot up to over 500. Far better than BBC coverage. Well done indylive-you did us proud.
@ lollysmum
Pete Wishart isn’t “Parliamentary Tweeter of the Year” for nothing!
I don’t think I’ve enjoyed wading through so much political stuff on a lazy Sunday in quite some time. First I watched Nicolas speech again, I got the sames chills all over again – as good as I know Salmond is I don’t think I’ve ever been as electrified from a politicians words before as I have been by Sturgeons yesterday. Even her choice of outfit, that striking red colour, her posture, her ability to sound humble yet powerful all at once – she radiates leadership in sound and appearance. She is a true leader. And I confess, when she took over from Salmond I didn’t think she would have the same impact. I was sooooooooo wrong.
And the energy from that crowd – its what winners sound like. Umm, did we lose last year? :p
Then I was off to BBC tv / radio / Sky News. Is anyone else noticing how easily Sturgeon, Hosie et al are running rings around all these biased interviews with the likes of Taylor and Murnaghan? They are not letting themselves be phased, they have no delays in their responses just instant answers, and usually the answers are very hard to counter. It’s almost as if they have anticipated every bit of Unionist propaganda and argument that will be thrown at them.
Surely the establishment hasn’t become that predictable? It really feels like it. I can see why the BBC likes to avoid having SNP guests – the only way to peddle tired old lies without challenge.
Now we learn hundreds more new SNP members in 24hours. Hope This momentum continues.
Aye Nan, There was a piece by Ruth Davidson in the London Standard on the 25th March and the picture they use is of these ‘activists’. It actually states it below the photo:
Tory mischief: Conservative party activists wearing Alex Salmond masks protest outside The ICC in Birmingham where Labour are holding a one day conference (Picture: Peter Macdiarmid/Getty)
https://archive.today/mJZbs#selection-655.0-655.188
Caledonius,
Aye.Theyre a top notch team.Theyve worked really hard to get to this level of performance.They put that work in not for money,but to take our country forward.
People have been asking about the Scottish Covenant movement and the petition started by John MacCormack (father of Ian MacCormack, SNP MP for Argyll and Bute in 1974, and Professor of Law Neil MacCormack of EU, long time SNP member) in the 1950s, which attracted 2 million signatures.
Less well known is the Scottish Home Rule Association formed in 1888.
Scots have been asking for a meaningful parliament with full domestic powers (but not necessarily outside the UK) for 127 years!
At anytime since 1888 a majority of Scots would probably have backed this proposition.
But it might not have been No.1 on their political wish list.
What has changed is that many today (45%) see the constitution as No.1.
This is because of the growing centralisation and power of Westminster, also the loss of our overseas empire.
Westmister has sought to turn Scotland from an imperial partner to an imperial colony.
There was far more local power in Scotland between 1888 and the 1950s, more local authorities, more Scottish owned utilities and businesses, but Labour nationslisation and Tory privatisation and local government reorganisation have removed the local power that used to reside in Scotland. This has left many of us feeling like a colony and Tory imposed austerity threatens to rob us of even more of what is rightfully our own.
@Rigmac7. 05:31
LOL…I was listening to Billy Kay on Bateman,cracking interview,Back in the day’s of the auld alliance with France the drink of choice was Claret,later Claret fell out of favour due to influences from South of the border.
Never having tried Claret I decided to give it a go,for patriotic reasons you understand,hmmmm :-).
Transoceanic are still keek,the colours of course should have been yellow/red as am sure you know,I typed the post after the 4 th glass of said refreshment 🙂
Claret is gooood thanks Billy,(may make you colour blind) £4.99 from local shop,another positive thing is Smurph will never know the joys,slange 🙂
Lollysmum at 1:51pm:”Livestream was being watched by Scots all over the world including South Africa, USA, Canada, Spain, Philippines etc & it was the first time I saw the number of online viewers shoot up to over 500.”
At 12MD yesterday the figure was above 1,100 !
Livestream doing a great job—-bypassing the TV/Radio/Papers we are all supposed to trust and respect.
K1-OMG! Where to start with that wee ruthie link! Distortion of the truth or what?! What a feckin liar she is. How’s the police investigation going lying toad?
@vlad (not that one) says:28 March, 2015 at 11:42 pm:
“I sometimes wonder about that. Although as far as I (vaguely) recall the legions stationed in Britain did not come from Italy at all, more like from the EU. So it seems to me it’s anybody’s guess, this thing about interbreeding.
Wonder no more then, Vlad, for I spoke only of the actual Roman born ruling elite. The Roman Empire was run a bit like the United Kingdom or even the British Empire. They Romanised members of the native populations to do the running of whatever country it was they occupied.
The Romanized lifestyle saw no shortage of people willing to do their dirty work for them. A bit like the Scottish Branch Office of The London Establishment right here in modern Scotland.
Another wee reminder for anyone who’s just in – Gordon Brown will be in Ardrossan to meet Katy Clark at 4 p.m.
If you want to help welcome him, we’ll be getting together outside the venue – ‘St. Peter in Chains’ church – about 3.30. It’s at the seafront, not far from the town centre. Canny miss it.
You might want to bring a brolly – it’s been persisting down all day here.
Some news from labour sources.
https://archive.today/gIRHB and this
https://archive.today/JVn01
Later for footie fans Scotland.
http://www.crichd.tv/index.php
or
http://myp2p.ec/
@natasha – spot on!
Brian Taylor’s performance yesterday, where his “hallowe’en cake” face went progessively from pink to almost purple in the space of 2 hours, exhibited wall-to-wall bias.
Then of course we had Brewer today doing his mock-incredulity act whilst talking over almost every answer Angus Robertson tried to give.
The very real prospect of their Party of choice losing their hold over the Scottish people, is clearly exasperating them to the point where they are no longer even pretending to be neutral.
I did apologise. Do you have anything to say about the fact that either the report saying the majority of Scots voted Yes is wrong or that if it’s correct then there’s no way that the result of the referendum is valid? Given this site has had a wee bit of a stramash caused by it don’t you think questioning the information we’re been fed is more important than some principled stance.
To repeat, if you don’t want to look, the article in the Record says that
While 52.7 per cent of native-born Scots voted Yes, a massive 72.1 per cent of voters from England, Wales or Northern Ireland backed the Union.
There were more than 420,000 Britons from elsewhere in the UK living in Scotland when the last census was taken.
And if they cast their ballots in line with the findings of the Edinburgh University study,
more than 300,000 of them will have voted No.
That’s a significant number in a contest that ended with 2,001,926 votes for No and 1,617,989 for Yes.
Voters born outside the UK also rejected independence, with 57.1 per cent voting No.
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/9/9/scotland-independenceukbritishscotland.html
GLASGOW, Scotland — With polls suggesting a neck-and-neck race as Scotland heads toward a Sept. 18 referendum on independence from Britain, the ballot slips of people of non-Scottish origin could prove decisive. And opinion seems divided among those roughly 880,000 who on census forms identify themselves as other than white Scottish.
More than 160,000 EU citizens might see their work permits hampered.
Elsewhere you get …
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/home-news/ex-spin-doctor-i-knew-of-postal-votes-for-no-im-good-at-my-job.25537308
n the interview four days before the polls closed, Mr McTernan, a political columnist and former communications director for ex-Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard, said: “It’s important to remember that probably about a fifth of the electorate, and that will be about a quarter of the total turnout, voted already. They have voted by postal vote. Those postal votes are running very strongly towards No. So there’s a whole bank of votes in.”
Which kind of answers the question about why there was no exit poll. Haven’t found a reference to just how skewed those votes were. Nor how many were by people no longer resident in Scotland.
Perhaps that might explain how a survey one assumes was held solely in Scotland could still be at odds with the actual result.
For those that follow the fracking debate.
SG announce public consultation to be delayed until autumn, which means moratorium will continue past the elections next May. Canny.
@Ian Brotherhood
I’m hoping someone will be filming this for those of us too far away to attend.
I’m sure the great gord will have a force field surrounding his personage in case the natives get too close.
I do wonder what it is gord is so fearful off should Snp get too close to power. Skeletons rattling in his cupboards perhaps?
Agree with everything said about Angus Robertson’s performance. Brewer ended up making a fool of himself and being extremely bad mannered in the process. As each question was batted off with consummate ease, Brewer’s attempt’s to trip Angus up became more ridiculous.
The only good thing I could say about Curtice was that he very clearly explained that it was not the party with the most number of seats who would necessarily form the government.
Watching Outlander via Amazon 🙂
How sad the English lady has to marry the gorgeous, red mopped Jamie, to make her Scottish, and keep her out of English prison.
That just sucks, being wed to a lovely hunk.
On a serious note, up to Episode 7, and there are a few bloody scenes, but in context, just a bit graphic if children were viewing.
@ Brian Doonthetoon
Not all Dundee ex-pats are Yes on Indy.
http://rbs.postach.io/post/ex-pats-be-informed
@Jack Murphy
Thanks for that it’s even better than I saw then. I was sitting in a garage waiting for my car to be MOT’d at that point & cursing the poor reception on my phone. I could hear conference but not see it or the comments coming in on indylive.Hopefully, it won’t be the last time they broadcast to such big audiences.
People power worked during that broadcast as well. BBC demanded exclusive rights to film Nicola’s speech & all hell let loose when indylive aka Kev told us.We were all tweeting SNP to get the decision changed & it was-very quickly!Kev had the best position to film from so we got much better views than the BBC audience & you could feel the electricity being generated by the speakers & audience to the extent that some commenters were in tears whilst watching.
Kevin Gibney you are a star even if you did join Labour 🙂
Valerie says
“Watching Outlander via Amazon”
… and do you believe the conspiracy theory that it was kept off our screens last September while the rest of the world watched it?
We’re up to Episode 6 and I would yes, it was kept off intentionally.
However, if so, it does show how incredibly insecure the Unionists felt!
@nana
Popped along to St Peter’s in chains, Ardrossan to offer support to the hardy souls and we got lashed by the rain. A few English Yes voters present too and a couple of police vans.
Atmosphere peaceful as you would expect cos we are nice people. I feel a bit miffed that the police force I help pay for is looking on at us as if we are potential criminals, rather than citizens with a democratic right of expression.
Gordon is nowhere in sight so probably in the church. It should be called Scotland In Chains!
Would love to ask him if Home Rule has been delivered, what he thinks of the treasury and IDS watering down the Smith Commission, whether he is comfortable with the fact he failed to set up an oil fund and 300 billion has been wasted by Westminster…
This event/charade is to boost Katy Clark in May. The grey faced sourpusses hurrying inside are welcome to stop and hear the truth from us, but I guess they prefer Gordon’s grand lies.
No TV outside but photos have been taken…by whom and for what end I don’t know…
Sun now shining…on the righteous!
@ Lollysmum
Kevin Gibney you are a star even if you did join Labour 🙂
Correction L/M Delboy joined for ah £1,NoT Kevin,there sorted that for you.xx
@author_al
Thanks for your coverage of the great gordy broons appearance. Just the usual under cover rot from slab.
I’m sure if you had managed to ask a question the gord would have shaken his fist and shouted “of course I have delivered home rule with the finest icing on top ”
After all delusional Gord ‘saved the world’
Wish we could be saved from Gord
@ galamcennalath Re: Outlander
Meh, it’s the same unionists that refused to have the red arrows fly saltire colours over the commonwealth games. In addition the same unionist forces who via BBC turned our Scottish Commonwealth Games into the ‘Home Nation Games’. Opened by John Barrowman that union loving superstar who spends 99% of his time sounding North American. There was 500 miles, least we had that… except it wasn’t sang by the Proclaimers but by some American fellow. Slowly.
Then you have several occassions of our gold medalists having their cermony cut short back to the studio when Flower of Scotland was being sung too passionately. But at least those studios were filled to the brim with Scottish presenters… oh wait nevermind. I could go on but will leave it there.
No, it dosen’t surprise me they stopped Outlander being shown back then. They did everything they could to stop us the People of Scotland remembering we lived in Scotland as opposed to North Britain in 2014.
Oh and don’t forget T in the Park and the ban on Scottish flags by the BBC, YES and normal ones. Couldn’t have such a vile nationalist symbol on Proud Scots Butts televisions. Respect to those who defied the ban. Including Calvin Harris lol.
From the Herald as the archives which I posted earlier still had the pay wall block. New one here.
—————————————————
Mr Salmond told the SNP’s spring conference in Glasgow that neither Labour nor the SNP were being harmed by Conservative attacks on the possibility of a post-election deal between the two parties.
He told around 3,000 delegates during a question and answer session at the conference that the party’s MPs were already experienced in Westminster “skulduggery”.
Mr Salmond said: “I think you should never, ever put your political opponents on your posters … not because it’s dreadful but because it’s stupid.
“I think the Tory campaign is fundamentally stupid.
“I don’t think it’s doing Labour any harm and I don’t think it’s doing us any harm whatsoever because the most important thing for the SNP in every Westminster election is to achieve the thing we failed to achieve since 1974 and that’s to achieve relevance in a Westminster election.
“And listen folks, nobody can say we are anything other than relevant to this election campaign.”
Mr Salmond said current SNP MPs such as the party’s Westminster leader Angus Robertson already have experience of “upsetting the apple cart”.
He told the conference that he expected the number of SNP MPs elected on May 7 to be substantial, but that it was up to the Scottish people.
Mr Salmond said: “In terms of skulduggery and upsetting the apple cart and various parliamentary techniques, I think there’s a wee bit of experience might be there in the group we have.
“I think there’s a bit of background which will stand us in good stead, but make no mistake, if the SNP, as we did a generation ago, caused a fair amount of parliamentary interest when we were a group of four and five in a parliament of 650, then the very substantial group that we hope goes to Westminster from Scotland I think has an unprecedented opportunity to move politics in a direction of Scotland certainly but also, as Nicola (Sturgeon) has rightly pointed out, in the direction of progressive politics across these islands.”
The former first minister admitted he had some regrets about how the Yes campaign played certain issues during the referendum campaign but insisted he took the “glass half full” approach to the outcome.
“We may have lost the referendum but we are substantially on our way to winning Scotland,” he said.
Socialism the Gordy Broon way
https://twitter.com/ComediansForYes/status/581425540931936257
@ ewen says:29 March, 2015 at 12:40 pm
Snode 1965 says:
“@manandboy don’t agree on expats getting a vote. Every expat I know would have voted No, couldnt understand why so many of us could back a Yes vote. They no longer contribute to our social or financial fabric, therefore can butt out.”
Well thanks for that. That really made me feel a useful part of the yes movement.
I am an expat, a member of the SNP and have been a nationalist all my life but I should now butt out because I had to leave Scotland. That attitude really pisses me off. What am I? A second class yesser? I suppose that rev Stu should also butt out by your criteria?
Absolutely raging now.”
Ewen, may I make it clear that the statement above
which begins with my username (@manandboy)
does not come from me.
(I can only assume that it is Snode 1965 speaking.)
I have complete sympathy with your point of view.
@ Nana
His grasp of geography/the HoC is a bit dodgy too, it seems:
https://twitter.com/ardrossanherald/status/582199049429880832
OOPS
Thanks Ronnie for correcting me.
Kevin you are still a star-best livestream yet 🙂
A few days ago one of the articles on Wings contained in a comment a clickable link to the Dunoon Report on possible rigging of the Referendum.
For anybody who missed it or didn’t click on the link the report is well worth reading (all 8 pages of it) and if what it says is true it certainly raises serious questions regarding possible rigging.
It can be found by Googling ‘referendum dunoon report’ and looking through the various entries that are displayed.
Unsurprisingly no mention of it has appeared anywhere else in our wonderful unbiased broadcast and print media.
Broty Boy at 3.32
This Dundee expat is defo a YES. I left Dundee because it was not a place in which I could gain employment in the early 90’s.
If I could have stayed at home I would have done. My reasons for wishing independence are many.
When I first moved to England(joined the Army), I was of course ripped for being A Jock, sweaty, porridge wog, ginger cunt(I have dark hair).
Needless to say, initially many unfortunate folks received a little part of east Dundee flying towards them. (no not that part, that part’s big, honest!).
When folks told me that Scotland was subsidised and took the piss out of it in general it dawned on me that I knew fuck all about my own country. This was of course because I had never been taught Scottish history, along with the rest of Scotland. In addition Scotland had no media.
Don’t judge, but I did used to read the Record and the Sunday post to find out what was happening pre internet. I immersed myself in Scottish history in order to have a reply to the detractors and was surprised at just how much the establishment has been lying about or more to the point, hiding.
I stopped reading all newspapers in 2007.
Of course I am not anti English, having been here for 20+years now. I want to see Scots run their own country. I would like to return one day.
I would like to have equal status with normal folks in England. You can’t walk up to an Asian and rip his accent or ask him if he eats curried mars bars. You can’t rip the piss out of an Africans hair style.
These folk are protected. Scots are expected to take second class citizenship and suck it up.
Well fuck that. I will happily treat any NO voter I meet with the contempt that they feel they deserve the horrible cunts.
The information that proves Scotland can do it is out there and obvious. To ignore it is pathetic and a sin.
Good blog by the way.
“Trust Scotland to be on the receiving end”
Lots of expletives, English expletive explitive commentator expletive
Gordon Federal Brown will never ever be able to appear in a genuine public situation, in Scotland. To at least half of Scots he is an absolute pariah. Mind you, he gets gets good money for becoming a recluse. What’s the betting odds he goes off to live in London or the US after May?
Drove past the church just now and its half full carpark. Gordon has now been left to his own devices. No doubt he is twitching the curtain, looking out to see if the nasty Nats have gone away. I waved Hi to a wet bored police officer. The sun is still out. We must be very righteous. Perhaps Gordy is inside asking forgiveness for his sins? Hope he keeps his hands out of the collection box on the way out. If he climbs the spire and spins on the weathervane he can see Bute…
@ gus1940
http://wingsoverscotland.com/more-free-help-for-the-uk-press/#comments
This is the link to the wings discussion on that Report. For those interested. Some very good replys from wingers there on the night of the referendum.
@Gus
Here it is for those who missed it
https://m.facebook.com/notes/10152740278692513/
Should also add a bit of info about that link I gave, you need to scroll down to Lesley Anne @ 9.35pm when she takes the thread off topic with the Dunoon Report. How typical lol.
Manandboy your name is just part of the quote. I know it wasn’t you. Sorry if the formatting looks like it was your quote. Thanks for the heads up and apolvies for the confusion
It was from a post by snode 1965 and it is his post that irks. Still very pissed off at the anti expat attitude of some on here. They should just count themselves lucky they didn’t have to leave Scotland and maybe they should realise a lot of us expats were Scottish Nationalists back when such a thing was a rare breed. A lot of us have put a lot into Scottish independence and denigrating us seems like a stab in the back.
@tartanarse
I think the problem with my ex-pat mates is that they are all very successful, middle-class guys who left Scotland in the seventies and, coming from the Ferry they didn’t have much contact with normal folk before then.
The guy who now lives in Switzerland, for example, was born in Calcutta, like my mum a product of one of the ‘ye gang oot there just ordinary mill laddies and ye come back bluddy snobs’. The difference is that my mum utterly rejected everything to do with that.
I had the advantage of living in a Council House in Douglas until I was seven and being brought up in a socialist household.
@ ewen
I have compete sympathy for expats forced from Scotland due to economics. Almost happened to my familiy, looked like we where heading from Dundee to Kent in England, at the last moment my Dad got employment in Glasgow instead. Even if It had occurred I would always view myself Scottish, so don’t let anyones opinions here ever make you feel this isn’t still your land, or you shouldn’t still care about it. Been a lot of upset on this thread, just hope we can get back to focusing on unionists and slaborites instead of each other.
Also, I was still upset I had to leave Dundee lol. Ah well, I’ll always have Dundee United! 🙂
@Author_Al
“No TV outside but photos have been taken…by whom and for what end I don’t know…”
That might have been me actually 🙂
Bit tricky taking pictures while also making sure the rain didn’t short out my camera.
Only brought the cheap compact one with the cracked screen, since it’s the most expendable one I have!
Sorry this is O/T
Mark MacNicol has started a petition on 38Degrees for an inquiry into the strange death of Willie MacRae.
(I know, I know, but if you don’t like 38D you don’t have to sign)
What did Willie know and who didn’t want him talking? The questions surrounding his death need answers, and I hope Mark is successful in getting an inquiry.
If you don’t know the story have a look at Mark’s website:
http://www.markmacnicol.com/
If you want to sign the petition it’s here:
https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/fatal-accident-inquiry-for-willie-mcrae
Ok I did visit the BBC site, go to 2:14 I am sure I heard smurf saying very similar lines http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-32107876
W McRay article on p28 of today’s online Sunday Herald.
and for the first time I had problems with downloading. Conspiracy?
Oops spelling!
A wee story..
I’ve known my lawyer friend for 28yrs and she has always been TORY and voted NO in the Referendum.
Last night she told me that after watching Nicola on TV at the SNP Conference, she is going to vote SNP! Wow! I certainly didn’t see that coming. I was so taken aback, all I could say was that I agreed she was very good and we were blessed to have her as our First Minister.
She agreed!
@X_Sticks
I signed the petition earlier today. Circumstances surrounding Mr McRae’s death are suspicious to say the least.
@Robert Kerr
There is a lot of info on the Willie McCrae case on Google. Much more than in the Herald.
It is VERY suspicious. The gun was found yards from the car.
Yes lots, especially nuclear stuff up North.
I know first hand that there was a project for approximately a hundred remote monitoring stations to be sited around Dounreay for plutonium dust in the air. That project was cancelled.
Plenty of plutonium on the foreshore as well!
@Oneironaut
Phew – one of the good guys…
It was really wet at times this afternoon. I guess the guy with the long lens camera was from the local paper. Or – maybe one of Gordon’s mates who’s going to enter us into Britain & Ireland’s Next Top Model?
Midgehunter28 March, 2015 at 9:46 pm
Nice one, thanks.
Didn’t realise things were so bouyant.
Was in Berlin last year, loved it – you could kind of tell things were good by the amount of construction / restoration going on. Cranes everywhere.
Ich spreche ein bisschen Deutsch, so have a start. Have been on a German course recently am seeking continuation study.
Nothing like being imerssed in it though….
Ewen: It was from a post by Snode 1965 and it is his post that irks. Still very pissed off at the anti expat attitude of some on here. They should just count themselves lucky they didn’t have to leave Scotland and maybe they should realise a lot of us expats were Scottish Nationalists back when such a thing was a rare breed.
Good point well made.
My attitude to expats is uncomplicated; by definition those keen to vote generally support independence; those against won’t be bothered to make the effort. The fire is not there in their belly anymore. Who can justify the blanket opinion expats will always vote No? If they have turned their back on Scotland non-participation is as good as negative vote. An expat’s vote is far more valuable than effort expended on hoping to ‘turn’ British placemen running Scotland’s institutions. Salmond follows this line of calculation but knew he had to convince the electorate Westminster agreed to – and that’s why he decided on two years to do it. He knew it would be an uphill struggle, a real challenge. He almost pulled it off.
@Author_Al
Well if it was a really scruffy looking guy in a black raincoat with an SSP badge on it with a really cheap compact camera who looked in danger of getting run over by passing cars while taking said pictures, then that was definitely me! 🙂
Not sure who the other photographer there was.
I assumed he was from the Herald. He didn’t stick around long anyway, rain and expensive DSLR cameras do not mix well!
As far as I know, the whole event was only advertised on Katy’s website. So they were pretty much preaching to the deluded, sorry, converted there!
Probably hoping to avoid losing any more voters than they already have…
@ Gus.
I should have asked Dave Mc Ewan hill about that when I spoke to him yesterday but I forgot.
Does anyone know anything about the report Authors?
When does the official election campaign actualy start?
thx
Caledonius @4.45pm.
Laudo !
Yes indeed , as you recall . You remind me as to why I have been Pro Indy all my life .
We have previously discussed these situations as they are regular occurrences for as long as I remember.
I tend to put them at the back of my mind for my own sanity .
I’m a YESSER who will vote Yes even if I would be much worse off .
Re fear factor pre Sept .
I walked into the Polling Station calm , yet having voted YES , I left with a strange apprehensive feeling . Kinda ” OMG ! I so hope we are doing the right thing ”
I can add at the same time I was elated and excited .
So maybe that’s why I have some sympathy for some who voted Naw , me being a Gemini !
Fantastic SNP Conference , shocking MSM Reporting !
Watched Nicola’s speech again just to make sure it was as good as I thought. It was.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Awm_TU9i8U
@Oneironaut
Ah, that was you. I was the other side, by the bloke with the Red Tories Out sign. Where were my manners? I should have crossed over to say hello. Gave you a wee toot as I went belatedly to get the shopping – not from ASDA, mind. Thought the two police cars driving about – and the van parked opposite – were a bit overkill. Everyone going in and out looked really miserable. Fancy having to spend an hour listening to ‘GB is great’ from not great GB
Shocking hateful comments against the Catalan people. Sometimes I despair at what some humans do and say.
I know we were & still are subjected to terrible abuse but good grief this after many have died including children.
http://www.newsweek.com/spain-investigating-tremendously-cruel-germanwings-crash-tweets-316904
@RascalRachael says:28 March, 2015 at 9:59 pm:
” … I am specifically interested in gaining an understanding of the term neoliberal. I feel it may be misused. Not especially by you, but more generally.”
Sorry to be so tardy in reply, RascalRachael, but I was called away on family business.
I’ll do my best to explain –
USA dictionary definition : –
“an outgrowth of the U.S. liberal movement, beginning in the late 1960s, that modified somewhat its traditional endorsement of all trade unions and opposition to big business and military build-up.
British English Dictionary Definition : –
“The modern politico-economic theory favouring free trade, privatization, minimal government intervention in business, reduced public expenditure on social services, etc “
By definition any term beginning with, “neo”, is the new meaning and the old, “neo”, thus becomes the old version. I meant the British version. This is another case of two civilizations separated by a common language.
;-))
O/T
Beware of tricks. How does anybody know with any certainty what the English in Scotland voted at the referendum?
Most of the English I know voted YES – settlers as opposed to colonists – so I doubt that the English vote was determining one.
But what better way to create division in Scotland and what better way to provide a spurious explanation of a result that doesn’t stack up.
@ Wuffing Dug
Probably the centre of innovation and buzzing with technology in Germany is Baden-Württemberg, in particular round (100km)the Stuttgart area.
Here’s a couple of sites in English to give you an idea of what’s going on, companies etc.
However, learnig German is in some ways important but a lot of top companies have English as their working language because they operate/export in the whole world.
Stuttgart means Schwäbisch is spoken which has about as much in common to German as Glaswegian to Cockney..! 😉
https://www.baden-wuerttemberg.de/en/shaping-bw/baden-wuerttemberg-is-successful/
http://www.bw-i.de/en/start-page.html
6 bloody 1 🙂
Sorry
bookie from hell wrote:
“When does the official election campaign actualy start?”
Tomorrow, Monday 30th March 2015.
Gerry Parker at 7.17 and Gus.
The report is put together by George Anderson, a veteran of the Skye Bride campaign and who was jailed on it, who has a background at a high level in the trade union movement with the help of several others in the collation and illustration (graphs etc).
He is an economic expert with an Oxford University background and has published books on the Skye Bridge campaign and the economy of an independent Scotland
A printed version will be publicly launched soon and will be widely available at £2 to cover costs of production and wide distribution. I will post details as I get them
O/T
This Engish-Scot rose voted YES and convinced many many Scots to do likewise.
I agree with Dave Hill. The Oban Yes hub had good support from people from many countries who had chosen to live in Scotland and the predominant numbers of those were from south of Tweed; people who wanted to live in a fairer society.
@ Wuffing Dug
Sorry, forgot this. Important when looking for jobs.
http://www.bw-jobs.de/en/home.html
Need more help?
I just signed the Willie McRae petition. I hope as many people are possible sign it. It is an absolute disgrace that there has been no fatal accident inquiry into his death, particularly given the circumstances.
OK folks get a grip.Project Fear II is up and running with the help of the platoon 77 in the hope that we fight amongst ourselves. lets just agree to disagree and get on with getting our voice heard in Westminster!
Ach well, we didn’t get to see Sleepy Gordo after all. They whisked him past us in a black-windowed 4×4-type vehicle, and must’ve offloaded him at the back of the church, at the tradesman’s entrance.
The weather was suitably biblical though – the wind did howl and verily the clouds did roll and yea, the hail did lash our legs. It was good to catch-up with some familiar faces from the SNP, and we swapped friendly banter with the police officers, who declined to take down our particulars.
I had made up a banner saying ‘RED TORIES OUT’ on a roll of Christmas wrapping paper, with purple spray paint. We managed to get a snap of us holding it before the wind and rain reduced it to a pile of papier mache, which I took home and am now using to cover a balloon – when dried, it will be painted to look like GB himself. If Oneironaut manages to get it out of his camera I’m sure he’ll share the image with us all.
Still hacked-off I didn’t get to see the legend, and I’m sure he’s sorry he missed us too. Thus endeth the report.
@Dave McEwan Hill 7.59.
My Dad work in “Y Stations” during WW2.
At one point Brit Intel was so pleased with itself about how easily they could decode German messages that the powers decided to send some decoders & listeners off for a month to see how much they could learn about British operations. No access to Brit codes, ideas, movements etc!
At the end of the month British Gov. got a shock just how much accurate info these decoders and listeners had gleaned.
Brit Gov. experts in intel. gathering and spreading false info be very careful, my friends!!!!
@Defo says: 28 March, 2015 at 10:21 pm:
“Jim Murphy, the Labour party leader in Scotland, owns a property bought with help from the taxpayer just two miles from the Palace of Westminster, which he let out. Over two years from 2012/13 he claimed £39,372 to rent another London flat for himself.”
Aye! Defo, but that was not the point being made. On this forum there was great outrage expressed by a certain factions – not at Murphy who, due to the large profit made, obviously was indeed on the make, but at Scottish National Party MP Angus MacNeil.
However the real facts show Mr McNeil is well known to be the MP from Scotland who consistently puts in the smallest expenses demands of all Scottish Westminster members. He was thus obviously NOT on the make. In fact Mr McNeil was forced by the change in the system to request many times more than the original modest cost of mortgage interest he had first asked for.
Yet the outraged faction on WoS wanted him hung, drawn and quartered and then, before he actually lost consiousness, flogged as well. Turns out these were almost exactly the same faction that wished to exclude many of, “The People of Scotland”, from voting in the referendum for their chosen country’s independence.
If I could find the truth with a couple of mouse clicks why were these others so ready to condemn Mr McNeal as a bad-un? There is no excuse for such intemperate condemnation nor of active racist invective.
As I pointed out already, as Wingers we should long ago have learned the lesson that we should never, under any circumstance, take, anything promulgated by the Establishment’s Fourth Estate as the truth unless we double check the article or statement for truthfulness first.
A couple of articles from caltonjock.
http://caltonjock.com/2014/08/28/bought-and-sold-for-english-gold-how-the-greed-of-a-few-condemned-a-nation-to-300-years-of-servitude/
http://caltonjock.com/2015/01/18/sir-menzies-campbell-and-gordon-browns-secret-talks-on-pact-to-deny-snp-the-right-to-govern-scotland/
Christ, it’s like some kind of online Lord of the Flies experiment on here, the weans get left alone without any grown ups looking after them and all hell breaks loose.
Stop avoiding your parental responsibilities rev and put a new post up, pleeeeese I’m begging you!
@bookie from hell, Stoker
Monday is the day the Queen gives all MPs their jotters.
Officially the campaign begins on Tuesday when the local Returning Officer receives his/her writ to hold an election for a representative to a new Parliament
“Now, it would appear my vote was unwanted, at least by some people posting on the site in the last couple of days. Why ? Because, due to circumstances completely outwith my control, I was born in England.”
I haven’t been watching this thread as I’ve been TRYING to have a holiday (but actually getting ensnared in stupid gender debates on Twitter). What’s all this about? Can someone point me at offending posts, because if anyone here’s got a problem with people being born in England, I’ve got a problem with them.
Much as I would like to see a full enquiry into the killing of Willie MacRae, signing a petition on the discredited ’38degrees’ site will not get you one. They are as interested in Scotland or Willie MacRae, as Boris Johnson is.
An SNP android app has just been released in the play store. Looks nae bad
@ Ewen,and all other expats
I can only apologise for my intemperate language last night. I am glad to hear that some expats support our cause, unlike my own kin including my brother ????. Though I stand by my point, I do not believe expats should have voting rights here and non-Scot residents lose out. Is there a democracy anywhere in the world that would allow this to happen….think not!
Bookie from hell,
Technically (and people can feel free to correct me if I am wrong) the election campaign starts in reality tomorrow. Of course as we all know, it is already running.
Hurrah!!! He lives!!! The boss is back!!! Mwah 🙂 mumsyhugs x 1,000
Hi Rev! Good to have you back.Theres been a lot of comment and debate on here in your absence.Some quite heated at times,but mostly legitimate,genuine,civil and interesting.A lot of it centred around eligibility to vote in the referendum.What did you think of Nicolas speech?
Not guilty Rev 🙂
R-type Grunt – hope your situation is becoming clearer. Love to you and your family.
Chris – hope you and your family are also coping.
@ Marydoll It 77th Brigade Internet (Chindits) no platoon,but Wingers should be very aware as this weekend has show,how easy it is to disrupt this site when the Rev’s not here.
TROLLS started the disruptive posts & wingers carried it on.
FUCKING READ ALL THE POSTS & most of Wingers are familiar with other posters names.
NO opoligies for swearing.
@Stoker
thx
@Rev Stu
A few posters were arguing that in their words ‘foreigners’ should not have had the right to vote in the referendum on indy last year. Naturally quite a lot of people were angry at this because it is basically ethnic nationalism of the sickening UKIP sort. Someone even defined foreigners as anyone who was not born in Scotland!
@Robert Louis
You do know that the person who started the Willie McRae petition also staged a play at the Fringe in Edinburgh last year? Sometimes the cause is much more important that a personal dislike of a website. If you want a full inquiry into Willie McRae’s death then maybe swallowing some pride would be worthwhile on this occasion. Nearly 1000 people have already signed it, and only started today.
@ REV Thank FK your back we might get some sanity back.
Robert Louis: the killing of Willie MacRae,
It is one of those mysteries that keeps popping up, but I don’t know how it can be solved once and for all unless all the evidence is stored somewhere and a forensic expert can piece things together to reach some sort of high degree of probability, or Special Branch offer up a file!
Friends of MacRae maintained he had no debts or depressive illness that might lead to the suicide claimed by police. However, like others it was before my time. Every few years it’s dusted down for another magazine column but it remains a curious incident.
Brotyboy
Your mum seems a good sort and it appears to have rubbed off. I’m from Linlathen myself.
I can understand your friends knowing no different but they must have experienced or at least witnessed abuse of Scots in their lives.
It matters not your social standing, we are all tarred with the same pathetic subsidy junkie brush. Folks such as these who will laugh this off in order to fit into social circles I cannot abide. I feel you are on the cusp of telling these pals where to go.
When Scotland is independent and doing well you will always be the better man.
I expect you won’t rub it in.
I feel it is pointless and wrong to blame the referendum result on English residents in Scotland. Many voted yes, many voted no. Same applies to all people of various Nationalities who live here.
There is anti Scottish sentiment in England, but those who espouse it are generally anti everyone ( Max Hastings, Simon Heffer, David Starkey etc).
The real opponents, or enemies if you prefer, to independence are and always will be Scottish born and bred, (ProudScotButs as we call them). Brown, Darling, Murphy,
Cochrane, Massie (both). I don’t believe England produces such people who hate their own country and people.
Hopefully come ref2, English Scots for Yes will have many, many more members.
Good to see you back Rev Stu!
@ bookie from hell
The correct answer is
Officially the campaign begins on Tuesday when the local Returning Officer receives his/her writ to hold an election for a representative to a new Parliament
Do not listen to the siren voices of Stoker and Robert Louis. There is only one answer; accept no substitutes
node1965 says:
29 March, 2015 at 9:10 pm
@ Ewen,and all other expats
I can only apologise for my intemperate language last night. I am glad to hear that some expats support our cause, unlike my own kin including my brother ????. Though I stand by my point, I do not believe expats should have voting rights here and non-Scot residents lose out. Is there a democracy anywhere in the world that would allow this to happen….think not!@
Apology accepted and I also agree that expats should not have a vote in Scottish elections. I did have a postal vote for the Holyrood referendum but am now not eligible and am fine with that. That won’t stop me supporting those who can vote though 🙂
Just remember that there are a lot of us furth of Scotland who want to see Scotland independent again.
‘Scot goes pop’ predicts a possible future…interesting.
PS
Ireland equalise in extra time… interesting.
Midge hunter29 March, 2015 at 8:15 pm
Thank you for all the info will follow up.
Am learning about dialects, you start to pick up on it. We are like ‘your not saying vier right’ to our tutor already.
English is so widely spoken it’s a gift to us.
The only thing is, I would be daft to leave the job I’ve got but things are so uncertain action must be taken. I was going to learn Norwegian but that would mean staying in the oil and gas industry.
Fancied renewables but they seem to be a ‘tight crew’ And tough to get into.
Cheers
Sprechen bald
Mutley 79,
I did not in any way question the integrity of the person who started the petition – indeed I admire anybody who campaigns on behalf of Willie MacRae, I merely pointed out that signing a petition on 38 degrees will NOT result in an enquiry.
I do not have a personal dislike of 38 degrees, I have a rational understanding based upon experience, which I and others had many, many years ago, before wings, whereby they made it clear they had no interest in Scotland only matters.
No pride involved at any stage, so none needing swallowed.
Kindly wind your neck in.
Willie McRae petition .Im like a lot of people who withdrew from signing 38s petitions after the brown hi-jacking, but I will sign this one Special Branch had officers in every Police force in Britain then, & since.
Hello Rev. Most of the crap stats page 2.
@ Robert Peffers at 10.21pm,
I agree 100% Robert. The mask slips every so often…
@deValera
I don’t think the proud-Scot-buts hate their own country so much as they wish they were English.
Education, Accents, and political outlook are all in that direction.
@ Ronnie Anderson,
What are the odds that the two main contributors to this site, the Rev and Chris Cairns, have their homes broken into within months of each other…enemies of the State?
@ tartanarse dey you like the present Dundee yes gave me last Sunday,
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153188471422152&set=gm.1610598825822878&type=1
isent it nice n shiny, BTW the dingaling was optional.lol
Mark Simon Frankland, as usual, hitting the nail on the head.
marksimonfrankland.blogspot.co.uk/2015/03/my-immigrant-journey-to-becoming.html
Hope the link works. If not, you can hop across to Munguin’s Republic and there’s a direct link there.
Welcome back, Rev.
Bugger. Not sure what I did wrong there.
I wonder how many have been added to the SNP 700 new members list since this afternoon?
New thread tomorrow, plenty of scope, we will no longer have any MP’s. Many already planning their CV’s in anticipation of their impending and thoroughly deserved P45. 🙂
@Natasha
You’ll not get an answer; at this time of night Bugger is in the arms of Red Biddy 😉
Robert Louis @ 9.03 pm
Much as we have little or limited respect for 38Deg , I would suggest on this occasion it’s a few mins well spent .
Encouraging people to sign , it’s still their call .
Like Grouse Beater , I too feel that this incident has reared its self every decade to no avail .
Any incriminating evidence is probably well hidden , inc MacRaes little nugget what ever it was.
We need our old muckars ” New Tricks” to step in and solve it .
Any way Tackety Beets and our household all signed , only took a few mins .
Ps The Domini is on the prowl , he’ll be gie n sumbdy e strap shortly !
Looking forward to a fresh start in the morning .
De Valera at 9.28 and orri earlier today
The suggestion that English vote swung it is a red herring. Just like the continuous reference to “silent majority” and Ruth Davidson and John McTernan’s remarks about the postal vote and lots of other remarks which were designed to prepare us for a vote that is hard to explain.
Notice on dear anti (Scotland) Beeb, Scotland, on the same points as Germany, comes after them in third place despite having a superior goal difference.
Or have the rules on GD been changed?
@ Fireproofjim
Yes, you have put it better than me. A good example would be Andrew Marr and his disappearing accent.
Hey Ronnie I can hear Chuck Berry singing.
@Ronnie Anderson –
The wee golden Yes pin badge you gave me at the Ferry last year attracted much comment and envious looks today. Seems they’re not often seen. I’m paranoid that I might lose it and am considering having it superglued to one of my ear lobes.
Both tories and labour are not divulging their ‘pie in the sky’plans for the £10Bn to £14Bn cuts to welfare until after the vote. Blank cheque, or trust me I’m a politician.
@ronnie anderson
Like the new car.
Q: Why have the elephants got big ears
A: Because Noddy won’t pay the ransom..
@ bookie from hell.
https://archive.today/E9ljb
😉
Nana Smith: Shocking hateful comments against the Catalan people. Sometimes I despair at what some humans do and say.
Had a quick look – left shaking my head.
It reminds me of a conversation I had with the manager of a small Spanish bank I use. A kindly man in the manner of old school bank managers he was keen and courteous to know about Scotland’s ambitions for autonomy. But as soon as I turned the conversation to the Catalan question his expression darkened, and with a dismissive sweep of his hand said “Not the same! They are not Scotland, not a country!”
And that was the end of our conversation.
Pots and kettles.
Natasha honey – we can get back to knitting patterns on O/T.
@Natasha
You should leave the http://www on links to articles you want to post, only remove them for youtube videos. I think that’s what you done.
Worth learning to archive also, it’s very simple. Simply drag and drop to your favorites bar. Check here for instructions:
http://archive.today/
@Hoss Mackintosh says: 29 March, 2015 at 10:59 am
Further to my previous – here’s a bit more detailed stuff now that I’ve had some time to think about it. It is, by it’s very nature long. Just skip it if it is too much bother.
The original, “Covenanters”, were people in Scotland who signed the National Covenant in 1638. This Covenant was to confirm opposition to The Stuart kings in the affairs of the Presbyterian Church of Scotland. At that time the European laws were still based upon the belief of, “Divine Right of Kings”. The Stuarts believed that God wished them to be the infallible rulers of their kingdom and they also believed they were Divine spiritual heads of the Church of Scotland. So that was the original, “Scottish Covenant”.
That of 1945/6 was a bit different in that it was a petition to the United Kingdom government to create a home rule Scottish parliament. It was first proposed in 1930, by, “The Scots Independent”. This National Covenant reached a peak in the late 1940s and early 1950s and was bregun by John MacCormick. It was written in October 1949 at the Church of Scotland Assembly Halls in Edinburgh and , “The Third National Assembly of the Scottish Convention”, was a pressure group that evolved into, “The Scottish Covenant Association”. The petition was signed by two million people and, remember that the 1951 census gave the population of Scotland as 5.1 million. It was ignored by the Establishment until, in 1979, when the proposals became a serious political matter and the present Holyrood Scottish Parliament was reconvened in 1999.
Now consider also, “The Scottish Claim Of Right”, (a.k.a. “The Scottish Bill of Rights”, 1689), and the Tercentenary of this in 1989. The Claim of Right is an Act passed by the Parliament of Scotland in April 1689. It is one of the key documents of Scottish constitutional law.
In the Glorious Revolution, William of Orange landed with his army in England on 5 November 1688. King James VII of Scotland, who was also King of England and Ireland as James II, attempted to resist the invasion. He then sent representatives to negotiate, and he finally fled England on 23 December 1688.
Whilst the Convention Parliament in England declared that James, as King of England, had abdicated the Government, and issued an English Bill of Rights on 13 February 1689 offering the Crown of England to William and Mary, the Scots found themselves facing a more difficult constitutional problem. As James had not been present in Scotland during the crisis and had not fled from Scottish territory in December, it would be highly dubious to claim that he had ‘abdicated’ the Scottish throne.
Here is an article on The Scottish Claim of Right By andrew_constantine_free_england_party.
The readers can jalouse , (deduce), from that article that it’s author is totally unaware how much of an idiot he shows himself to be by his total failure to understand what the Barnett Formula actually is designed to do.
Namely that extra he is so upset about is simply the calculated value he, and the rest of the Englanders, obtain directly from Westminster Ministries as services funded by those ministries that are devolved functions in Scotland.
The phantom, “Extra”, is the properly calculated funds devolved from Westminster as funding for the devolved Scottish equivalent services every Englander enjoys but would deny to we Scots. Do these idiots not understand that Westminster must not only devolve the functions but also the funding to pay for them. A.T.M. Scotland has no tax raising powers. There simply is no actual extra – but there is a muckle steaming pile of bovine, rectally sphinctered , waste matter.
Paula Rose
A fellow tricoteuse? Whose head are you hoping will fall into the basket?
Chic McG – Scotland are behind Germany on the basis of the results so far between the two teams. This is now a well established rule for this and many other fooball competitions to differentiate between teams with the same points. Nothing sinister.
Natasha honey – so looking forward to getting back to one of our cuddly chats on O/T about all sorts of stuff instead of keeping an eye on the skirted boys.
Robert Peffers 29 March, 2015 at 8:33 pm
Fair enough, well put, I was a detractor. I stand corrected.
I just hate the thought of somebody from our side being seduced by the lure of the ambiguous rules and subsequent financial rewards seemingly offered by the Westminster system.
Sadly, I think some will be tempted. Sometimes the weak shelter amongst the strong until emboldened. This is what they rely on.
I guess nobody is incorruptable. Depends on the circumstances.
OT, Rev’s fundraiser now at £107,300 – fantastic effort!
Chic @ 10.17
It might be on head to head results.
I am not sure how it is decided as it changes all the time.
But the result in Germany, 1-2 loss would put Germany ahead.
in her shaky grip (anagram)
Chic McGregor says:
29 March, 2015 at 10:17 pm
Notice on dear anti (Scotland) Beeb, Scotland, on the same points as Germany, comes after them in third place despite having a superior goal difference.
—————-
Actually I think the rules on teams level on points has been changed. Head to head record is now more important than goal difference.
Still I think you have a point about the anti scotland BBC. I noticed that the main sports headline on the ten o’clock news was Gibraltars (admittedly well taken) goal against Scotland. Furthermore the sports presenter made a slip of the tongue when she reported a 6 – 1 win OVER Scotland and then corrected herself.
Maybe I’m just getting paranoid but the last couple of years has made me question everything I hear on the BBC and the MSM. I know I’m not the only one who feels this way.
I’d better go and put my tinfoil hat back on !!!
Ooh just hours now till it all kicks off – propaganda everywhere, tv debates, unwanted labour literature through your letterbox, awkward photographs with the constituents on the campaign trail, perhaps getting egged on the campaign trail. Lies, lies, and more lies, with an extra helping of spin.
May the WINGS colossus rise up and sweep all this nonsense before it, may it fix it’s gaze on labour and Westminster’s corrupt politics and cry out in intimidating shout:
WINGS SMASH!
The end.
Also: Go SNP woooooo!
And that was the end of our conversation.
A post script to that anecdote was, fifteen minutes into the convivial chat and a second espresso, the bank manager relaxed and, without solicitation, got stuck into our English friends holding onto Gibraltar. He was not pleased with the situation, not one bit, giving rational reasons why “imperialist England” should “hand it back to Spain.” It was not a tirade, more a firmly expressed political belief. I maintained diplomatic silence throughout, with only the occasional nod to show I was listening.
Thanks, Thepnr. I’ll try again.
http://marksimonfrankland.blogspot.co.uk/2015/03/my-immigrant-journey-to-becoming.html
As one conference speaker noted, the SNP aim at this election is to replace Labour in Scotland – and then be prepared to work with Labour in England.
Brian Taylor: BBC
https://archive.today/zZdD3
Rev’s fundraiser now at £107,300 – fantastic effort!
A bit more than there are members of the SNP! 🙂
Ronnie at 9.58
I like the car but I’m not a fan of Noddy the arrogant wee prick.
Make way for Noddy? He’s a wee cartoon boy and shouldn’t be driving. He disregards the law and is a selfish little shit.
Other than that, I think you’ll find Dundonians quite generous.
Sincerely hope you saw he 10:30 edition of the Press Review on Sky News
On a response to a DM article on Alex Salmond, the female reviewer stated that she would not like to meet Alex Salmond in a dark alley for fear on hearing her (English) accent would beat her up!
Certainly not one for those of high blood pressure – not healthy!
Got bored during the interlude and ended up watching this…
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01d26xm/alba-alba-1980s-10-1989
realising not much had changed in a quarter of a century(except for the hairstyles).
Let’s stick together now and get out there and work to ensure 2015 is THE year of change.
Lady on the Sky paper review reckons that Alex Salmond might thump her and is sinister. These polls have rattled a few cages.
@Grouse Beater says: 28 March, 2015 at 10:41 pm:
“New poll shows SNP on 32 seats – sounds more realistic to me than clearing the decks of Labour.”
If you want to know the real reason for the difference it is because of the Unionist Party Leaders interview on TV that saw the opinion polls sharply swing to 4 clear points in favour of the Red Tories over the Blue Tories, (first time in months). However it only reflects the trend in England.
Thing is, as usual, the Propaganda wing is telling porkies as the English opinion polls have not had the same effect in Scotland which still shows a quite different trend and the wipe out is still on.
@ Ian brotherhood I need to get a back button for my Yes badge I,m using it for my Gold Wings Badge
@ Nana had a chat with Jock today (sheeshed) but Chuck berry ( my dingaling) was Noddy,s favourite song.lol
Just watched ‘v for vendetta’ from Now TV, on one way to end of project fear from Westminster.
OK guys if they’ve changed the rules to head to head instead of GD, fair enough.
I just hope we do not fail to qualify on that basis.
I have been living in France for six years not thinking there was any chance of indepenence i thought we had missed the boat.I was also of an age to vote the first time round and we all know how that ended.I left for the adventure of it and although i thought i had a reasonable grasp of the economics of our situation it was my English born wife who rekindled my intrest in independence.
I am know as fervent as any on here and angry that my countrys future was stolen from it as far back as 1973.We would have been a leading economy in europe like Norway had we been informed as we should have been.There is not a single PM since that date that should’nt hold their heads in shame for the absolute betrayal of Scotland.
I like many other expats deeply resent that we care any less for the country of our birth and maybe our perspective from the outside looking in can be of assistance.
One da i may return but as i am far from rich its very difficult to come back because of the cost of living.
To do to Labour what we did to the Tories MP count in Scotland – that is the dream. And as Alex Salmond says… 😉
@Grouse Beater
In that situation least said soonest mended would be the best course of action. I would likely be making a fist under the table.
@call me dave
Big Brian’s interview with Angus & Stewart caught on video.
@Stoker
The Electoral Commission knows bugger all. An election to select a Member to represent a constituency in Parliament cannot take place until the Returning Officer for that constituency has received his/her writ to hold an election to fill a vacancy.
All MPs are discharged at 5pm on Monday’s dissolution. There are no vacancies until then so the elections cannot start until the Returning Officers get their writs on Tuesday. There are even special provisions for shortening the timescale of the election in the case a writ is not received on Tuesday.
The document you refer to is concerned with the returns of expenses incurred and used Monday as a date that did not depend on the vagiaries of our newly privatised Royal Mail which using the date of the start of the elction would have.
oops forgot the link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eMrOxDZEsg
Robert Peffers the wipe out is still on.
Thanks, RP.
@ Tartanarse PMSL at that responce,am well aquainted wie Dundonians, sure ah hud twa bairns wie wan wance,still goat the twa big bairns an ah lot of wee bairns in the Gowrie& Linlathan LoL.
@Rev Stu
Definitely not me. I actually quite like the English.
I reserve all my hate for Westminster.
@Ian Brotherhood
I got the pics out of the camera ok. (It actually survived the storm quite well, though that dodgy memory card is definitely on the way out!)
I don’t have anywhere to post them up, but I can send them to you if you like.
Got a couple of your banner, but one went a bit out of focus.
Nevertheless, through them your banner shall be remembered for the day it nobly sacrificed itself to the fury of the storm to symbolise Scotland’s wrath at the Red Tories! 😀
@ Tartanarse PMSL at that responce,am well aquainted wie Dundonians, sure ah hud twa bairns wie wan wance,still goat the twa big bairns an ah lot of wee bairns & they bairns had mair bairns, an before you say it, ma bairns wurrna conseived in the back seat of ma moter & their in the Gowrie& Linlathan LoL.
Earlier today I posted that Nicola should be the next PM in a coalition as she is the most popular politician in the UK let alone Scotland. It was a bit tongue in cheek but I suppose she could always do a MP/MSP swap with Jim Murphy.:-)
But in a more serious note something quite radical is going to happen in British Politics. If there is, as expected, a hung parliament and the SNP pick up the seats the polls are predicting then something extraordinary will happen.
Despite all the vilification in the press, it will not be Alex Salmond MP who will be leading the coalition/vote of confidence negotiations.
It will not be Angus Robertson MP, nor Stewart Hosie MP.
It will be Nicola Sturgeon, First Minister of the Scottish Parilament who will hold the balance of power in Westminster.
Someone that is not an MP or a Lord in Westminster – a historic opportunity.
This will be the most clear indication yet of the power of the Scottish Parliament and the power and sovereignty of the Scottish people.
I am surprised that the MSM and TV or the Red/Yellow and Blue Tories have not realised the significance of this but maybe they soon will when they get over their fixation with Alex.
The UK Parliament dependant on the Scottish Parliament – Ironic how things turn out.
May 2015 – Bring it on.
It will actually be quite interesting to see if Lord Vowdermort can scrape another false promise from the bottom of the barrel.
Even more interesting to see how many gullibles there still are in Scotland. Less than last time I suspect.
Ian: I am as fervent as any on here and angry that my country’s future was stolen from it as far back as 1973.
We would have been a leading economy in Europe like Norway had we been informed as we should have been. There is not a single PM since that date that shouldn’t hold their heads in shame for the absolute betrayal of Scotland.
I like many other expats deeply resent that we care any less for the country of our birth … one day I may return but as I am far from rich its very difficult to come back because of the cost of living.
Amen to that, Ian. Hands over the sea and all that…
I’m getting awaiting moderation on a post. I’ve tried several variants, don’t know why.
Just heading off to my kennel .
Checked in on Willie MacRae 38deg petition , it’s gone up by 700 signatures since 9pm tonight .
Only a few 100 to reach 2k target .
Well done .
Edward @ 10.56 pm
Never met AS but those who do meet him say he is a gentleman and impressive .
It only shows them who say say otherwise that they do not know or understand what they are now dealing with !
YES !
OT – On the subject of Salmond’s book you can see the trolls taking to Amazon to write reviews – quite amusing, especially for those of us who have read it. They are making themselves look stupid with their vitriole but heh – it means we are winning!
But for the most fun review of all check out the Daisley Mail’s review of the book. This journo is seriously funny http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/analysis/315095-daisley-mail-stephen-daisley-on-alex-salmond-referendum-book/
Great satirical writing from this guy – and he likes Wings!
Here is the great writer, former political prisoner, and Nobel Laureate, Wole Soyinka, talking about the current Nigerian elections. It could be Scotland’s Referendum he is referring to.
“We’re talking about a very positive response by the public in terms of determination to register and vote but, you know, this has been one of the most vicious, unprincipled, vulgar and violent election exercises I have ever witnessed,” Soyinka reflected sadly.
“It is the most expensive, most prodigal, wasteful, senseless, I mean really insensitive in terms of what people live on in this country. This was the real naira-dollar extravaganza, spent on just subverting, shall we say, the natural choices of people. Just money instead of argument, instead of position statements.
“Obviously this money didn’t come from personal pockets only, there’s no question. It’s been bankrolled by lots of businesspeople – many of them I’m sure have been taxed indirectly – and they’ll be expecting some returns for this outlay, and so how are we actually going to get rid of this thing called corruption, if the electoral process itself has been so corrupted? It’s a money election. How on earth is that bugbear going to be lifted from the neck of society? I just don’t know.”
[Para 2 emphasis is mine]
Awe Rev The punch line of ma post at 11.23 disappeared, whits happening.
@ Snode 1965
Apology accepted mate. 🙂
Expats may not be able to chap on doors very often be we try to help financially etc. and act as Scottish ambassadors in our guest countries.
Great song and the wee girl is magic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxByUb05M-c&feature=youtu.be
@Fireproofjim says: 29 March, 2015 at 6:56 pm:
“There is a lot of info on the Willie McCrae case on Google. Much more than in the Herald.
It is VERY suspicious. The gun was found yards from the car.”
That is not by far the most suspicious fact. A nurse present in the theatre when Willie was brought in testified there were two bullets in Willie’s skull. Now a man could perhaps shoot himself once in the brain – but twice?
A shopkeeper swore Willie’s car was followed away from the shop by two men in a car. Why would someone intent on killing themselves do so while still driving the car? Not an easy job even in a fully automatic vehicle?
First of all the driver would need to get the gun from either their person or from somewhere in the car while driving with one hand. The car was found well off the road so why did Willie not just pull over, put on the handbrake, and then shoot himself?
Can someone please re-post link to the MacRae petition?
Cheers.
@Grouse Beater
Deary deary me, comparing the Scottish referendum with a statement like:
“this has been one of the most vicious, unprincipled, vulgar and violent election exercises I have ever witnessed,” Soyinka reflected sadly.
Hasn’t taken long to provide readers of Wings with your real views since the last we disagreed.
Give a rest and stop talking shite, few are listening.
An interesting book, out of print now but I got a copy 2nd hand, is “Britain’s Secret War: Tartan Terrorism and the Anglo-American State” by Andrew Murray Scott and Iain Macleay.
“Scotland’s crucial role as an aircraft carrier for NATO and the USA ensures intensive scrutiny of her internal political situation by the CIA and Britain’s secret police….thorough investigation into the mysterious death of nationalist Willie McRae..”
Seems that agents provocatuers are the main culprits in stirring up discord and diverting people from the political path.
There’s an excellent film of Joseph Conrad’s “The Secret Agent” starring David Suchet, Cheryl Campbell and Peter Capaldi. A flavour of the power games and sacrifice of innocents involved.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6P7mzWQszlk
@John Young
Enjoyed that. Simple melody but direct and clear message.
@ Ian Brotherhood ther eyou go Ian
you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/fatal-accident-inquiry-for-willie-mcrae
I’m getting a bit pissed off now with the way that comments are going on this thread.
First up we have the bullshit report from which no one has seen any figures but widely reported in the media as “It was the furriners that done it” which caused mayhem.
Recently we had the “paper” that the referendum was rigged using the postal ballot.
Finally we have a fucking petition for a fucking inquiry into the death of Willie McCrae. Why are we raking over the coals now?
Have you any idea why all this crap has turned up in the last couple of weeks? Well do you?
I thought that the posters on here were above bullshit like this but it seems that some of us do zip up the back of the head.
There are less than 40 days until the Scots vote in probably the most important General Election ever in the UK. I wish some at least would try getting their heads round that and forgetting completely any unproven crap that is shoved in our face by the MSM.
Desist from arguing over the controversial issues we have between us at least for now and unite behind the goal of sending as strong a representation as we can to Westminster to fight on our behalf.
You know it makes sense.
OT – Nana and Grousebeater – re. the cruel racist and hate comments about Catalans in the social media over the GermanWings crash.
Unfortunately these are only what the Catalans are used to. Latent hate and envy is stirred up deliberately esp. by the governing PP party, which uses the Catalans as a whipping boy to firm up support for their authoritarian mindset (especially now ETA has fortunately stopped operating) and which a surprisingly large number of Spanish endorse.
And yet people outside Spain – even, I was shocked to see Alec Salmond – say Catalonia must seek central government permission for a referendum. They just do not understand.
Just signed. Now at 1847.
https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/fatal-accident-inquiry-for-willie-mcrae
There is a lot of talk of deals and coalitions with Labour in WM. But the first “deal” must be with our Welsh friends in Plaid Cymru and also possibly with Irish friends. Then the Greens. That might provide a block of up to fifty MPs.
Only then talk about negotiating with the Red Tories. And for that to happen, we need the likes of Spud Eggman and the rest of Nu Labour to do an 180-degrees turn and suddenly develop an aversion to austerity, privatisation and crony capitalism. Personally, I think hell will freeze over before that happens (gotta think of those SE England voters!).
What Thepnr said, in ferckin spades.
Been away from the site for a day or so and reeally can’t believe that, in the Rev’s absence, not only have we turned on ourselves…but we seem to be about to eat our young.
For (enter deity of choice)’s sake, I really thought we were much more savvy than to leap to gobble the unionist’s bait and start turning on ourselves based on some spurious dissection of the Ref.
For (enter deity of choice)’s sake – Gie it a rest with the who can/can’t/should/shouldn’t get to vote. 🙁
Rev, baby…pleeese come back, sooon.
Rev,it was awful.
First time I have ever seen an entire flock of cyber nasties in full flight. This weekend should have been a Wings highlight in the run up to the election. Instead way too much of it was spent rolling around in the gutter.
It started just round about the time we should have been analysing and rejoicing in Nicola’s speech. Funny that, eh?
Just watched the bbc’s broadcast on i player of the snp conference. I mean seriously that was a woeful attemp by the BBC to cover a conference. I am completely disgusted at what the bbc spat out. The majority of what I seen was of that stooge Curtis answering leading questions of to why the idea of Scottish people voting for what best represents them as a negative thing. The interviewer setting him up with questions that fits the BBC opinion. Luckily I can see through this nonsense but I still fear a lot of peeps fall for this sort of walk along follow our message broadcasting. It totally sickens me this is allowed, unchallenged and broadcast.
This is no way to live
Good grief!
If you want more background and info on Willie Macrae see my long and continuing series here,
http://calumcarr.blogspot.co.uk/
Been following this thread over the weekend, and without the Rev’s guidance it’s gone off at a few tangents and has sometimes been quite vitriolic. The weekend is over and it’s time to get back in focus.
I think the best thing is for the Rev to delete the whole thread.
I’m glad he’s back today because where there is discord, may he bring harmony. Where there is error, may he bring truth. Where there is doubt, may he bring faith. And where there is despair, may he bring hope.
Chuckles in best Dick Dastardly fashion.
Marga B: Nana and Grousebeater – regarding the cruel racist and hate comments about Catalans in the social media over the GermanWings crash. Unfortunately these are only what the Catalans are used to.
I’ve talked to a few Catalan friends but they have always been optimistic and positive. Only my Spanish bank manager gave me a moment’s insight into the hatred. Very sad. Then again, some of my English friends have expressed similar animus to Scotland’s aspirations. They repeat the garbage right-wing politicians feed them. Passions run high and Spain’s right-wing administration doesn’t help spread tolerance and understanding.
Best one can do in such situations is to try and discuss ideas (over coffee or a meal!) to show self-governance is not a threat to their well-being, or income. But you have to draw a line when you perceive it is impossible to convince them when their minds are blindly made up.
Interesting article by the respected Neal Ascherson on the pitfalls and perils of getting swallowed up by Westminster priorities. Worth a read: “A Bumpy Ride Awaits the SNP on Westminster’s See-Saw.”
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/29/irish-home-rule-scotland-snp-westminster-nicola-sturgeon
Re: Nicola’s speech.
As soon as she had finished, the BBC cut back to the studio/Brian Taylor.
However, Kevin and Delboy, due to punter pressure, had been given permission to livestream it as well.
(Originally, the BBC had “exclusive rights.)
Indy Live kept livestreaming to get the audience reaction. They’ve put a video together, which also includes the comments they were getting.
You can see it here:-
http://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1609305419307128&set=vb.1402639979973674&type=2&theater
@Brian.
They did the same at the end of the conference Brian. And they totally ignored Alex’s q and A session too. I wasn’t there on the second day but watched it on the BBC site. Within 2 mins of the broadcast ending the caption on the video read
“this content is no longer available”
I heard that Brian(toodle o the noo) was bealin’ at the comments made about the Beeb.
🙂
test
Thepnr says:
“Finally we have a fucking petition for a fucking inquiry into the death of Willie McCrae. Why are we raking over the coals now?”
I’m guilty of promoting that one Alex. Mark MacNicol and Andy Paterson have been campaigning this cause for a long time. There has never been a satisfactory investigation into the death of MacRae. The whole thing is vvery suspicious and may well involve the british intelligence services. That’s why I think it is still relevant today and worthy of support.
If you don’t know the story check my original post up the thread for links.
Sorry if you feel that this is “raking up old stuff” but I think that the need for a just investigation is important.
Thepnr wrote:
30 March, 2015 at 12:41 am
“Why are we raking over the coals now?”
“Have you any idea why all this crap has turned up in the last couple of weeks?”
Well said Alex, not only is it raking over old coals it is doing so against the express wishes of McCraes family.
It is also doing so at a time when our focus should be 100% on current events and issues.
Then, as Robert Louis has already pointed out, no petition from that site is going to achieve anything beneficial to ANYONE on this matter.
To me it’s a distraction from current events and an intrusion against the private wishes of the mans family.
A distraction we can well do without, imo.
I just ignore Thepnr’s posts now.
I would agree that 30 years on does seem a bit like shutting the door after the horse has bolted but. However one of the key players in saying there is nothing to see here was Nicky Fairbairn. The accusations in relation to Fairbairn in recent years does make one pause and wonder as to what actually went on 30 years ago.
@ XSticks, well said indeed, some of us are capable of thinking about the election, watching the mince, playing the banjo & airing the Willie MacRae controversy all the the one time.
Fuckin beat that!
Not sure if deleting this thread is a good idea. Simply put I doubt the study reflects the reality.
I’ve just run a quick sanity check on it. Taking the extreme ends and leaving out the non-UK votes in order to get the 45% No result you’d need one in three voters to be from the rUK. Taking non-UK voters into consideration it get’s even more absurd.
The only way that study can gel with reality is if there was a significant number of votes from those who don’t actually live in Scotland or were not actually cast by those living in Scotland. Given there was discussion prior to the referendum in some quarters about applying for postal votes even if you didn’t live in Scotland it’s possible that might have happened spontaneously. The unfortunate conclusion is that ex-pats can’t get a vote without allowing postal voting and postal voting is where that referendum may have been lost. Not claiming that there was mass fraud involved.
On the other hand, the data isn’t available yet but the results being put forward seem almost hand picked to generate discord. They’re simply propaganda.
Hand and Shrimp: one of the key players in saying ‘there is nothing to see here’ was Nicky Fairbairn. Accusations in relation to Fairbairn in recent years do make one pause and wonder as to what actually went on 30 years ago.
That certainly raises lots of questions!
If police are given endorsement to sift back three and four decades to check on sex crimes they sure as hell are free to look again at a mystery some call murder.
Fred says:
“..some of us are capable of thinking about the election, watching the mince, playing the banjo & airing the Willie MacRae controversy all the the one time. Fuckin beat that!”
Oh my, Fred appears to be looking for a Barney.
🙂
Anyway, that’s multitasking and according to some women folk men can’t multitask.
🙂
Stoker: that’s multitasking and according to some women folk men can’t multitask.
You should see me at work, Stoker!
Only thing missing is a child hanging from a nipple ! 🙂
Sorry aboot that Stoker, it is Monday & what with all this multi-tasking I’d forgot to move the clock yet. I’m a bit fazed with all these resignations, even the Panda was resigning at one point over the weekend? bamboo-zled no doubt. 🙂
Stoker says:
“Anyway, that’s multitasking and according to some women folk men can’t multitask.”
Funny how few of them can do a syncopated rhythm on a drum kit though 😉 (Although the few that can seem to do it VERY well 😀 )
My wife was Junior European Fencing Champion.
I never question if she can multitask.
🙁
What the hell. You guys had a civil war over the weekend? Glad I missed that. Some nasty views there. 🙁
“Incomers, colonists, and carpetbaggers” — yeah, no chance of that being seized upon by the opposition and spread about. 🙁
Epiphyta: No chance of that being seized upon by the opposition and spread about.
None whatsoever. Its days of controversy are long over – a quotation from Alasdair Gray’s seminal essay.
If you don’t even know your contemporary Scottish history how will anybody believe your view of Scotland’s ancient history? The referendum is over. Those who voted for the SNP last time were not all members of the SNP. The same will hold true this General Election.
And ‘carpetbaggers’ include Jim Murphy.
How long did it take you to read all the posts, GM_Dundonian?
8=)
Still reading! Been about 2 hours… I feel exhausted! I told you lot to behave! Lol. Ah well seems the Rev is back to keep order. I’ll just make sure to avoid this place when he’s not around. Keep my sanity and all that 😉
Eh, Wings can be addictive an’ thah’, iye?
8=)
GrouseBeater:If you don’t even know your contemporary Scottish history how will anybody believe your view of Scotland’s ancient history?
Where the hell have I said anything about history at all? I’m one of those who wasn’t born in Scotland and was not familiar with the quote’s origin; I saw people saying it, saw more agreeing with it, and felt unwelcome. Your comment isn’t doing a thing to ameliorate that.
Saw more agreeing with…
Agreeing with what?
A few jumped to their prejudices and muddied discussion. They may have had their own agenda for doing that.
The recipe for clarity in communication is simple, ask questions. Tarring and feathering gets the wrong reaction.