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Wings Over Scotland


Taking back control

Posted on January 04, 2019 by

We’ve got no words for this, so we’ll let it stand by itself.

Because 55% voted No. Welcome to Brexit.

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    155 to “Taking back control”

    1. One_Scot says:

      Not sure Theresa May can really say, ‘Now is not the time’ anymore with any real conviction. 🙁

    2. Den Cairns says:

      A bitter pill to swallow indeed and bet some of those bitter and twisted nawbags will still embrace this medicine.

    3. manandboy says:

      No Deal will truly be a nightmare.

    4. Bill says:

      This could literally kill me

    5. K1 says:

      The scale of the harm this Tory gov is intent on inflicting upon UK citizens just to ‘take back control’ is a defcon level 10 warning about what is coming down the line post Brexit.

      Prepare the lifeboats Scotland…fuck it…get in the lifeboats…now!

    6. defo says:

      Nothing to add.

    7. Tam fae somewhere says:

      This will affect my wife. One day without her medicines and she cannot get about under her own steam.

      Speechless at this. Just speechless.

    8. manandboy says:

      Who is producing this leaflet?

    9. Bobp says:

      Den cairns.Oh they’ll get their medicines alright, but they’ll have to pay for them. Only losers will be the poor and less well off. But as you say those twisted nawbags will sleep easy at night as long as they can stay in their septic union.

    10. handclapping says:

      All those old folk who voted No to keep their pensions aren’t going to be happy that the Tories Brexit is going to kill them off instead.

      Who would have thought that the have it all generation of the baby boomers would be wiped out by their own selfishness?

    11. Dan Huil says:

      British nationalist incompetence is truly life-threatening.

    12. John Lockhart says:

      This has started already quinine bisulphate nearly impossible to get

    13. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Yes, a no-deal Brexit will be about survival of the fittest. Pure Darwinism in action.

      Though I still suspect this is a “head banging against wall” ploy, intended to make May’s deal palatable by comparison. Preparations for an actual precipice plummet are inadequate.

      But seeing that there are BritNat exceptionalists like David Davis who still seem to think that if they only take this thing to the wire, the EU27 will finally cave in to their demands, maybe no-deal will happen “by accident”, as it were.

      We need to take our own control over circumstances before that point, though. After the distractions of the festive season, minds will be concentrating. Not least among the elderly who depend on meds more than most. I can’t imagine that many of them thought it would end up like this.

    14. Douglas says:

      Hi Stuart,
      Is this real? I’ve tried to find an NHS source but only found anti leave sites.
      Can you give us the link?
      I’m sure that it will be a disaster but I’m not sure that these leaflets are launched, has someone found a leaked source?

    15. Ms Meg McLean says:

      Can I ask where this was displayed, when and who by?

    16. Bobp says:

      There will be a black market britain after a hard brexit, where only the well off will be able to buy anything. Scotland you need to get away from this madness ASAP.

    17. Happy New Year! Scotland voted for none of this, let’s shoot the craw.

    18. Dorothy Devine says:

      Good grief!

      I didn’t vote for this ! .Scotland didn’t vote for this

      It will have major implications for many folk I know and very directly for my husband.

      Destruction is the only area in which the Westminster Government appears to excel.

      Lifeboats out and ready please.

    19. Rob Outram says:

      Robert Peston
      Robert Peston
      @Peston
      I put to senior government source whether attached is official NHS advice. This was the reply: “No. This is not an official NHS publication. People should trust advice from official NHS sources. We are confident that if everyone does what they need to do, medicine…

    20. Gary45% says:

      Surprised the “Caring!?” Tories didn’t have,
      “Chin up, Remember ENGLAND won the war,(with the help of some lackies) England is theee only Empire.
      Take one for Brenda suckers.”
      A wee O/T
      Anyone hear the guy on LBC this afternoon, 4 kids and skint.
      I hope every TORY voter in this sorry arsed Island struggles till the day they die.(You, YES YOU, put them in power to KILL people).
      Hang your heads in shame.

    21. Ross says:

      Is this real or not?? There is no NHS logo or any logo of a professional body or even who printed it, this needs investigated more to find out if this is real I think

    22. robertknight says:

      Better stockpile my Salbutamol Inhalers in that case. If I don’t need so many I can possibly make a few quid on the thriving post-Brexit black market in medicines.

      I could afford to buy that new covert coat I’ve been hankering after – like the one worn by that git on the telly; Nigel Farage.

      After all, if I’m going to act like a Spiv in post-Bwexit Bwittan I might as well look like one, eh Nige?

    23. manandboy says:

      At this rate, we’re not going to get to March 29th, are we?

    24. CmonIndy says:

      I have to take a cocktail of drugs 12 hours apart every day for multiple conditions including a kidney transplant. In the last three months I have sought guidance from two pharmacies, my GP, two renal consultants and my Tory cunt of an MP. All advice was along the lines of ‘there shouln’t be a problem’, ‘NHS will have a plan’, they wont let it happen’, ‘there will be replacement drugs’. The Tory didnt reply. Now we see this scary shit, hear of gagging orders on pharmaceuticals and buying up fucking fridges. Well if I lose my transplant and have to revert to dialysis, or worse, then I will be holding my Brexit-voting MP personally responsible.

    25. Richard Smith says:

      Pretty sure that’s a fake.

    26. shiregirl says:

      I haven’t seen this in our local hospital – is it an NHS source?
      As a health professional and prescriber, this concerns me.

      Where are the medicines going to come from??

    27. Weechid says:

      Discussed with my GP on behalf of the person I care for and was more or less told f**k off “no patiient is more important than another”. When I said that those with money will be able to access medication I got the shoulder shrug.

    28. Stravaiger says:

      I notice some people still talking about a no deal Brexit happening ‘by accident’.

      There’ll be a no deal Brexit alright, but an accident it ain’t.

    29. galamcennalath says:

      I take three tablets daily. If I stopped would it be life threatening? Possibly not immediately, but my doctor assures me I ‘need’ them.

      Since I too will be one of those potentially suffering medicine shortages I feel able to say this …. the demographic most like to require medication statistically aligns with those most likely to have voted NO and LEAVE. Well, karma’s a bitch, ain’t it just!

      Bitter and angry, again.

    30. K1 says:

      Even if it is not genuine uk gov leaflet, it is in fact reality if no deal succeeds. Lampooning used to be a legitimate form of subversive activism, people need to shocked into realising what these bastards will allow to happen for their idealogicall driven agenda.

    31. Bill Hume says:

      Wings over Scotland. It must be the only political site on the internet where something which promotes the aims of the site, is subject to people asking whether it is real.

      A very healthy indicator I would say.

      You taught us well Stu, to question everything.

    32. Bill McDermott says:

      And all to deal with a stupid argument in the Tory Party. What a complete disaster!

      I see that Ross Thompson is being called to heal by the North-East Tories. Westminster has gone to his head and he has been frequenting with the wrong types such as Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg who still think that England can go global in its trade deals, given 50 years or so.

      Pull the trigger Nicola!

    33. Gary45% says:

      Stravaiger@5.31
      No deal Brexit by accident.
      Tory plan all along, hence the large contract handed to some Tory donors for shipping who don’t own boats, expect private medical service suppliers to “come to the rescue of the minions”, through the “back door” at the glee of the murdering Tories.
      Surreal doesn’t even come into it.

    34. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Stravaiger @ 17:31,

      Some in the Tory Party want no-deal – and we know who they are – and some do not, believing that the EU can be cowed into compliance, and some even realise it’s a complete bust. But that’s the whole point that you seem to miss. The Tories are highly fissile on the subject, and have been for years, it’s just coming to a head now.

      And as long as we remain in this damned UK Union, we will continue to pay the price for their divisive little civil war.

    35. Robert Kerr says:

      I take two tablets for hypertension and one anticoagulant.

      My GP tells me that the current policy is Preventive Medicine.

      That surely will end if there are serious shortages.

      galamcennalath is correct. Karma is a bitch!

    36. msean says:

      FFS.

    37. Fairliered says:

      I have just been told about a petition to keep EU citizenship after brexit. I have already signed it. The link is: https://eci.ec.europa.eu/002/public/#/initiative
      The link provides more details, but the summary is:

      Main objectives

      EU citizens elect the European Parliament and participate in its work, thus exercising treaty rights, enhancing Union democracy, and reinforcing its citizenship. Noting the ECJ’s view of Union citizenship as a ‘fundamental status’ of nationals of Member States, and that Brexit will strip millions of EU citizens of this status and their vote in European elections, requests the Commission propose means to avoid risk of collective loss of EU citizenship and rights, and assure all EU citizens that, once attained, such status is permanent and their rights acquired.

    38. Colin Alexander says:

      There is no proof this poster is genuine.

      However, the issues it raises could be real.

      Fostair inhaler is made by a company with a UK office in Manchester but, it’s parent company is based in Italy.

      Easyhale inhaler says Finland on it.

    39. Clootie says:

      …just like the Blitz. This will bring the nation together!

    40. Macart says:

      Also this…

      https://twitter.com/WingsScotland/status/1081240056113827841

      Are we CRYSTAL clear yet on what voting NO and Brexit means?

    41. Liz g says:

      I’m reading (sorry cant do links) that the problem seems to be that the Westminster Government asked the Pharma companies to stockpile 6 weeks worth of supplies,to give them time to iron out any difficulties… and considered the job done??

      These companies did… They’ve stockpiled their own stuff,as they were asked to do, but naturally enough not their competitors stuff.
      Therefore any medication supplied by a company without a major presence in the UK has not been stockpiled!

      Yeah.. Leave it to the market right enough!!!

    42. Essexexile says:

      In the lingo of YouTube, ‘Fake!’. Although it’s quite possible it will become reality.

    43. Breeks says:


      galamcennalath says:
      4 January, 2019 at 5:36 pm
      I take three tablets daily. If I stopped would it be life threatening? Possibly not immediately, but my doctor assures me I ‘need’ them.

      I have a rare degenerative eye condition kept at bay by eyedrops. Without the eyedrops, the condition comes back and attacks the optic nerve, and the nerve damage doesn’t regenerate.

      It was caught in time after I went for a routine eye test because I couldn’t read the subtitles on tv, and the Optician sent me directly to hospital for emergency medication. There was a very real risk of me going blind in both eyes.

      I was lucky. Specs are able to keep me fit enough to drive, but without them, I can see birds visiting the bird table, but I often can’t quite make out what kind of birds they are. One less spiritual lift to your day, but I should think of people worse off than me.

      I’ve asked Boots and the doc whether I need to worry about my eye drops after Brexit, but they don’t know. The best advice I’ve been given is to stockpile what I can depending on the sell by date. It’s good for 4 weeks after opening, but doesn’t say what the shelf life is unopened.

      My condition isn’t life threatening, but to be honest, going blind probably would be – indirectly. But I don’t know whether the supply of my drugs would take priority over someone’s life or death medication. Nobody really knows.

      I do wish however they would take these dreadful ads for guide dogs off the TV. I don’t want fking pupdates, I just want the fking eyedrops that will stop me going blind in the first place.

      I really do wish somebody would get off their fecking arse and revoke Scotland’s Article 50 unilaterally. Brexit is a leap into the darkness, and sometimes I get upset and I cry because it might just actually be a slide into total permanent darkness. Please don’t patronise me and tell me I can’t make my mind up because we need to know the details. Please listen to me. I really, really, really fucking don’t. Revoke Scotland’s Article 50, or at least make the fucking effort.

    44. Liz g says:

      Colin Alexander @ 6.01
      The Rev never claimed this was an “official” government/company leaflet ,and as he has taught us the words matter..

      There’s a world of difference between Genuine and Official..
      This is a Genuine leaflet not an official government or company one.
      And in this instance I’ll wager… The gap between them will be a Non Disclosure Agreement!

    45. Legerwood says:

      From the Single Market to the Black Market. Nice

    46. Robert Peffers says:

      @Bill says: 4 January, 2019 at 4:56 pm:

      ” … This could literally kill me.”

      You are not alone, Bill. I have more than 10 different medications in the morning and some of them are three times per day. Not to mention the, “just in case”, nitro heart spray.

    47. Kevin Brown says:

      If this is remotely true, you can see where this will lead with the current UK Government. People will fall ill or become iller; those requiring benefits will be declared fit for work and those already on benefits will be unable to attend assessments and sanctioned for not turning up. The spiral will get worse than it is now.

      It was bad enough 6 years ago when just after being made redundant I fell ill with double pneumonia. Was in a coma and on life support for 4 weeks and at one point on 3% chance of recovery. My partner tried to sort out benefits for me and was told that “I” would have to attend an interview before the process could be started. FFS! I know its worse now.

      Makes me think the government are trying to cleanse the streets of those in any need whatsoever. Brexit is doing their job for them!

    48. Ken500 says:

      Vote NO you get nothing.

      They are already illegally deporting and killing off citizens and everyone else, This will make it even worse. This behaviour is just sick.

      Going on about the miners, when they are murdering millions. The hypocrites are unbelievable.

      Ken McIntosh. ‘There are too many Scottish voice on BBC Scotland. People do not want that’. The total check of it. Leading the 20 years celebrations of Holyrood. Most of them would shut it down. Fleecing Scotland of £Billions. Habitual liars. Every word they utter is a lie. Despicable people.

    49. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      When trawling the Twitter pages that I keep an eye on earlier, “somebody” said that they had got that leaflet on a visit to their local hospital.

      No word on the name or location of the hospital though.

    50. Bob Mack says:

      Clearly anyone who thinks this is fake, has not read the official no deal Brexit guidelines from Gov UK sites.
      The leaflet may seem dramatic, but in fact shows the real possibilities which undoubtedly will arise.

      They are not hiring ferries for fun, and the great weather in the channel will also play it’s part in delays to medicine imports.
      Already drugs like Naproxen among others are vanishing from prescriptions. It is happening right now.

    51. galamcennalath says:

      Breeks says:

      I really do wish somebody would get off their fecking arse and revoke Scotland’s Article 50 unilaterally.

      If a ‘no deal’ looks to be the outcome, Nicola/SG/Scottish Parliament MUST do something dramatic before the big bad day.

      TBH I don’t know if your tactic of revoking Article 50 on behalf of the sovereign people of Scotland is the right one, or valid one, or whatever …. but in principle I agree something ground shifting has to be done.

      Does the world and the EU really expect us to follow England meekly over the cliff edge? Personally, I think we might be pleasantly surprised at the international reaction to Scotland saying … “No, we’re going over”.

      Everyone has the measure of WM and this totally inept, destructive, confused, and fragmented Tory government. A mix of balls, sanity, and real democracy from Scotland cannot be ignored IMO.

    52. Doug says:

      Thoughts as a semi-rural GP:

      Interesting that this is making the rounds on Twitter. I wonder how many more like it will be on social media.

      My suspicion is that is is a mischief-making creation by a remainer (or May-supporter trying to frighten away no-deal). When seen by some medical peers, there was a general feeling it wasn’t right (language used, that it contradicted existing advice).

      Having said that, the underlying message is grim, believable and feasible. The official Department of Health advice is also worryingly complacent/vague:

      “Clinicians should advise patients that the Government has plans in place to ensure a continued supply of medicines to patients from the moment we leave the EU. Patients will not need to and should not seek to store additional medicines at home.”

      (Roughly, pat them on the head and tell them not to worry)

      It is symptomatic of how bad things are in the UK/under May that this message is so easily believable. We do need to escape as soon as possible!

      (As a P.S., as a local GP we have NO control of medicine supplies. We would try to help but have no power really)

    53. Dr Jim says:

      Oh it’s probably official alright but not officially released at the right time so not officially official but will be official if and when they say it’s official but was a mistaken early release date which was unofficial

      Isn’t that how they officially deny the undeniable when they unofficially comment on an official document

    54. Barbara Nairn says:

      Can’t see who produced this leaflet. Not NHS or Government.
      Not proof read. Is it legit?

    55. CameronB Brodie says:

      I honestly don’t know how Brexit has managed to get this far. However, this definitely doesn’t look like an official document, we had a printing contract with the SNHS. The vocabulary used is doggy, as well. Perhaps it points to truth but it unreliable evidence. Why add to the fake news environment?

      ‘IMPLEMENTING EFFECTIVE ETHICS STANDARDS IN GOVERNMENT AND THE CIVIL SERVICE’

      1. Introduction
      This paper sets out a number of practical mechanisms for setting and institutionalising high standards of ethical conduct integrity and good Governance for elected officials and civil servants, based on the experience of Australia, New Zealand, Canada, the UK, Korea, Morocco and Ethiopia. In summary, the introduction of relevant Codes of Ethics and Conduct, to be effective, needs to be supported by a range of other mechanisms, training, and leadership by managers and political leaders alike. Examples of such mechanisms are given.

      https://www.oecd.org/mena/governance/35521740.pdf

      The Ethical Framework for the government sector

      Core values

      The core values for the government sector and the principles that guide their implementation are:

      Integrity

      Consider people equally without prejudice or favour
      Act professionally with honesty, consistency and impartiality
      Take responsibility for situations, showing leadership and courage
      Place the public interest over personal interest.

      Trust

      Appreciate difference and welcome learning from others
      Build relationships based on mutual respect
      Uphold the law, institutions of government and democratic principles
      Communicate intentions clearly and invite teamwork and collaboration
      Provide apolitical and non-partisan advice.

      Service

      Provide services fairly with a focus on customer needs
      Be flexible, innovative and reliable in service delivery
      Engage with the not-for-profit and business sectors to develop and implement service solutions
      Focus on quality while maximising service delivery.

      Accountability

      Recruit and promote employees on merit
      Take responsibility for decisions and actions
      Provide transparency to enable public scrutiny
      Observe standards for safety
      Be fiscally responsible and focus on efficient, effective and prudent use of resources.

      https://www.psc.nsw.gov.au/employmentportal/ethics-conduct/behaving-ethically/behaving-ethically-guide/section-2/the-ethical-framework-for-the-government-sector

      An Ethics Framework for Public Health

      Abstract

      More than 100 years ago, public health began as an organized discipline, its purpose being to improve the health of populations rather than of individuals. Given its population-based focus, however, public health perennially faces dilemmas concerning the appropriate extent of its reach and whether its activities infringe on individual liberties in ethically troublesome ways. In this article a framework for ethics analysis of public health programs is proposed.

      To advance traditional public health goals while maximizing individual liberties and furthering social justice, public health interventions should reduce morbidity or mortality; data must substantiate that a program (or the series of programs of which a program is a part) will reduce morbidity or mortality; burdens of the program must be identified and minimized; the program must be implemented fairly and must, at times, minimize preexisting social injustices; and fair procedures must be used to determine which burdens are acceptable to a community.

      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1446875/

    56. orri says:

      No Deal by “accident”. Punctuation is important.

      This isn’t really national self-harm for those in charge though, is it?

      Wasn’t there someone who mentioned “surplus population”?

      No doubt when the mass extinction of those classed as a drain on the NHS is over they’ll expect praise for balancing its budget

    57. galamcennalath says:

      Does it matter if this leaflet is official?

      Personally I doubt it is because the WM strategy will be to cover up the scale of the problem. That has always been the ‘British way’ … just hide the truth from the masses. That has been the WM Brexit bad news handling approach all along.

      However the leaflet, whatever its source, is probably a fair representation of what might well happen. It’s not scaremongering because the threat is very real. People need to be aware and need to think about it all because WM has the power to stop all this nonsense. Voters can make their views known and politician who want a future need to take note of the outrage.

    58. yesindyref2 says:

      It’s clearly a fake, and the twitter feed says it came off facebook somewhere.

      Anyone on such as thyroxin might be advised to submit their 2 month prescription every month of course.

    59. Proud Cybernat says:

      O/T

      The National
      ?
      Verified account

      We’re delighted to announce that @AngusRobertson has joined The National as a new regular columnist. You’ll be able to read him in the paper every Saturday, starting tomorrow!

      https://twitter.com/ScotNational/status/1081256538315153408

    60. Republicofscotland says:

      According to the Pharmaceutical Journal, 90% of UK medicines are imported, 45% directly from the EU.

      https://www.pharmaceutical-journal.com/news-and-analysis/news/brexit-could-hinder-medicines-supply-to-uk-mps-told/20204082.article

    61. Ken500 says:

      Some people who give a donation to training dogs for the blind. After the NHS saved their sight. Miraculously. Thanks Ninewells Hospital and all the wonderful staff. Absolutely amazing skill. They could not have been kinder and caring. Thanks forever. In an emergency. Thanks SNHS.

      They are almost put off donating by the terrible training guide dogs ad. From a different charity base?

    62. Stravaiger says:

      @ Robert J. Sutherland 17:45

      Oh, I’m not missing the point.

      Yes, there’s a difference of opinions within the Tory party, and yes, nothing can be ruled out with regards to the outcome, but I firmly believe that the outcome will be no deal and it has been planned all along. It will not happen by accident.

    63. Thepnr says:

      Who really cares who the source is for this leaflet. The simple fact is that the UK government are taking the possibility of severe disruption to medicine availability in the event of a No deal Brexit very seriously indeed.

      In fact just a few weeks ago they were writing to all the pharmaceutical companies with updated information on the issues.

      This means that whilst the six-week stockpiling activities remain a critical part of our contingency plans, this now needs to be supplemented with additional actions.

      The Government recognises the vital importance of medicines and medical products and is working to ensure that there is sufficient roll-on, roll-off freight capacity to enable
      these vital products to continue to move freely in to the UK.

      The Government has also agreed that medicines and medical products will be prioritised on these alternative routes to ensure that the flow of all these products will continue unimpeded after 29 March 2019.

      https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/medicines-supply-no-deal-brexit-preparation-plans-update

      We can only remain thankful that Britannia still rules the waves and great British ferry companies like Seabourne Freight have been drafted in to ensure these vital supplies will reach dear old blighty no matter what the evil EU have in store for us.

      You really really couldn’t make this up could you?

    64. Auld Rock says:

      Every year at this time Northlink Ferries seeks to charter a suitable ferry to stand-in while our two Northboats (Shetland & Orkney service) and the one on the Pentland service and every year there is not a ferry to be found. Now in fairness there are limitations on size of vessel that can enter and turn in the outer Harbour. Putting this aside it will be interesting to see what sort of filthy wreck this ‘Paper’ company finds. I just hope that May is not fermenting ideas to steal ferries off our life-line services to the Northern and Western Isles to try and save her scrawny neck.

      As for medicines my Consultant wants me to move over to ‘insulin’ and I’ve been resisting as I’m scared that I’d just get started and then there would be none available, scary stuff.

    65. Petra says:

      Genuine leaflet or not we all know via other sources that this will be the reality of a No Deal Brexit … maybe even a reality of Big T’s botchup Brexit deal too.

      As to shipping medicines from Europe to the UK, well you can bet your bottom dollar that the Scots will be left with the dregs following stocking up the shelves south of the border.

      And if this isn’t supposed to be a problem, as per Westminster, why are the pharmaceutical companies being gagged? Delays for six months? I wonder how many people they’ll manage to get off of benefits during that time period? No need for euthanasia to be legalised in the UK. Just vote for the Tories instead.

      ”The government’s “update on potential border delays for six months in a no deal scenario is stark,” the Association of the British Pharmaceutical Industry, the largest body representing the sector in the UK, said in a statement at the time.”..

      http://www.euronews.com/2018/12/24/drugs-companies-sign-gagging-orders-over-no-deal-brexit-preparations

      ………………….

      And gagging of ‘other services impacted’. Normal practice for sleakit Westminster right enough.

      ”Previous parliamentary questions from November had revealed that NDAs have been used by several other governmental departments, bringing the amount of so-called gagging orders currently in force to at least 60.

      The Department for Transport has 28 NDAs in force preventing companies from discussing plans about borders and customs while the the Department for Exiting the EU has six.

      The latter defended itself at the time arguing they are an “entirely normal practice.”

      …………………………..

      Reposting:

      @ Fairliered says at 5:59 pm …. ”I have just been told about a petition to keep EU citizenship after brexit. I have already signed it. The link is:

      https://eci.ec.europa.eu/002/public/#/initiative

    66. Ahundredthidiot says:

      I would fear not. Suppliers, against their own policy and SLA with NHS, are stockpiling. EU would not allow people in the UK to be put at risk in any case, they are above the policies of the UK simply as human beings.

      Everything else though, will feel the pinch.

    67. Ken500 says:

      ‘Jocks expect higher standards’ @ Wings over Scotland twitter. Anyone can google it. – 28th March 2018?

      Hopefully the author will have changed their mind.

      Jason R. Wyndham?

    68. Proud Cybernat says:

      “According to the Pharmaceutical Journal, 90% of UK medicines are imported, 45% directly from the EU.”

      Or put another way – hey 2014 No voter, if you want access to (at least) 90% of medicines that are prescribed in the UK to help ease your family member’s chronic pain, you know what to do when the First Minister of Scotland fires the IndyRef2 starting gun.

      Or would you rather your family member continued to suffer because of your blind loyalty to a flag?

    69. Robert Peffers says:

      @galamcennalath says: 4 January, 2019 at 7:26 pm:

      ” … Voters can make their views known and politician who want a future need to take note of the outrage.”

      Ain’t that the truth, galamcennalath?

      Thing is, considering this from a simply Kingdom of England perspective, just who or what can Her Majesty of England’s subjects aspire to do about it?

      The point I’m attempting to highlight is that this whole sorry mess is a product not of the Westminster Tory party alone but of the entire Westminster Establishment and that is far wider than the Westminster Unionist political parties. but the entire Unionist, English/British nationalist which includes a majority of Her Majesty, Queen of England’s voting subjects.

      Just who are they going to turn their fury against?

      It won’t be their unionist political parties for the English Nationalists voted them in after all. It won’t be the mainly English Civil Service for they are mainly comprised of Her Majesty Queen of England’s subjects as are Her Majesty’s Police Force and Her Majesty’s Security Services, Her Majesty, Queer of England is also the head of The Church of England too.

      I expect that Her Majesty, Queen of England’s subjects in the three country Kingdom of England will turn their fury against Johnny Foreigner and that will include those foreign sweaties just over the border in Scotland.

      All orchestrated and driven by the Westminster financed and controlled media that is already ramping up their SNP/SG/FM BAAAAAD! rage to ever higher volume. Can we hope for an Independence for England surge in the Kingdom of England?

      Now I might be wrong but hasn’t that been happening for some time already?

    70. Dr Jim says:

      The good auld days:

      Ach wur far too reliant on medicines anyway, in ma day ye rubbed a dock leaf on yersel and jist got oan wae it, ahv’e died mony a time an it didnae bother me an ahm nane the worse fur it

      Said the average 57 year old thirty years ago when that was the average life expectancy

      These days we’ve got our hopes up far too high expecting to live longer and be happy I mean for goodness sake who do we think we are, we’re Scottish, it’s our lot in life to accept what’s doled out to us by our superiors and overlords in England because they’re the ones with the brains to run everything so we must leave it in their hands and just stop all this grievance moaning about wanting what other countries have, it’s just not possible so just stop it and die with a bit of Scottish dignity like we used to

    71. yesindyref2 says:

      The thing is I guess, that while the NHSes will still be able to buy the drugs, it’s the price they pay that could be radically different. On that note, pages 36 to 39 of this are quite alarming, considering the Tories basic desire to privatise the whole shooting match:

      https://ec.europa.eu/growth/sectors/healthcare/…/products-pricing-reimbursement_en

      e.g. this:

      Two issues related to competition arise from the discussion; the first relates to whether health insurance companies or sickness funds violate competition rules, e.g. by abusing their dominant position.

      The no-deal Brexit does seem to be the greedy best preference for those in the Tories with “private interests”.

    72. Petra says:

      You could’nae make it up! Have I missed something? Is France an island? More to the point has France left the EU?

      https://twitter.com/dr_philippaw/status/1070667857032286209?lang=en

      ………………………

      C’mon folks support the ONLY newspaper in the UK that’s telling the Scots the truth. If you don’t use it we’ll lose it, much to the delight of the BritNats.

      If you can afford to …. buy it daily (85p), online monthly (£6.99) or yearly (£79.99). And that includes anyone beyond our shores who cares about the future of the Scots and our beloved Scotland.

      http://www.thenational.scot/subscribe/

      …………………………

      Think of joining the SNP and / or donating. Show Westminster that support for the SNP and Independence is rising.

      http://www.snp.org/join/

      Or donate:

      http://www.snp.org/donate/

    73. Lenny Hartley says:

      Auld Rock re availability of ferries, same for Cal-mac when the MV Isle of Arran suffered severe mechanical issues in the summer, Cal mac said they had tried to lease a replacement but no suitable replacements anywhere, the Isle of Man Steam Packet have said the same when the Ben Has had issues.
      However freight only vessels maybe more easily sourced.
      Time will tell.

    74. yesindyref2 says:

      Or this which I forgot to include – note the 90% discount:

      Two questions still remain , however: first, what proportion of the global number of generic manufacturers are not able to continue with discounts/rebates close to +90% – in other words, what is the likely impact on the market structure of generic manufacturers – and, second, how is the overall pattern of generic production, including logistics and stock management going to be affecte d, especially if more countries introduce similar systems.

      The prices for our SNHS could potentially be prohibtive in the face of inadequate commercial availability of supply in the first place.

    75. yesindyref2 says:

      Sorry, that link got fucjed up, it’s first link if you google:

      Tender systems for outpatient pharmaceuticals in the European Union: Evidence from the Netherlands, Germany and Belgium

    76. yesindyref2 says:

      Damn, put this on the wrong thread.

      The EU isn’t perfect, and back a few years was particularly corrupt in terms of chemicals and natural remedies, with restrictive directives to push out smaller competition that didn’t have directors in prominent position in the EU legislative procdure “advisory councils”. I guess pharma is the same. Ironically the previous UK government – Labour – were good at trying unsuccessully to fight that. I think with the EU Parliament becoming more active and antsy, and taking more control over the Commission, that might be becoming less and less. Hope so anyway, though the “harmonisation” directives member state enacted as legislation still remain.

    77. twathater says:

      Sorry OT @ SUPERNANA

      Thank you nana for ALL your links especially this one on the previous topic page https://guyfawkesrevolt.news/according-to-one-of-the-worlds-most-respected-economists-scotland-could-become-the-richest-country-on-earth/

      This is a bumper link for your armory and should be bookmarked for all wingers hoping to educate the undecideds

    78. ronnie anderson says:

      Dr Jim U dey whit U want but am no poppin ma clogs tae suit some fekin Tories / Rid Or Blue am chist gonnae keep oan keeping oan putting ma feet oan the flair every day oh and breath in oot in oot lol.

    79. Legerwood says:

      Auld Rock @ 7.45pm
      Channel 4 news tonight did a link piece on ferries etc. With regard to Ramsgate it was stated that even with dredging there would be a limit on the size of ferries that could use the port.

      This adds a further level of complication to the availability of ferries Seaborne can lease. Apparently DFDS has ferries of appropriate size.

      This is the link to the piece – 21 mins long but covers a lot of ground.

      https://www.channel4.com/news/ramsgate-port-dredged-as-no-deal-brexit-preparations-gather-steam

      ……

      Yesindyref2 @ 8.23pm

      The cost of medicines have already been impacted because of Brexit – falling value of the pound. It will only get worse unfortunately.

    80. Sarah says:

      Breeks at 6.31: very sorry to hear about your health problem.

      I am sure that there are plans ready in SNP HQ to get us out of this mess. Meanwhile we can keep sending them messages about what we want and why.

      And keep trying to get the word out to our friends and neighbours etc so everyone knows the truth about Westminster, MSM, Brexit etc etc.

    81. Dr Jim says:

      @ronnie anderson

      Hiv ye nae charity in yer soul mon, thur only askin us tae cut aff oor feet tae save their legs, it’s no like yer hivvin tae gae them a kidney, whit are peasants fur if it’s no tae supply wur maisters wae body pairts n a’thing thae need doon there in the big Lundin

    82. ben madigan says:

      With regards to medicine worries – these are obviously big, big for people with chronic conditions – asthma, thyroid problems, blood pressure,diabetes etc, etc. including Breeks above with his/her eye condition. Sorry to hear about that breeks.

      In any case, remember the European Medicines Agency has already moved from London to Amsterdam, so all research into new drugs cuts the UK out. ”

      On 20 November 2017, European Union (EU) Member States decided to relocate the European Medicines Agency (EMA) to Amsterdam, the Netherlands, as a result of the United Kingdom’s (UK) withdrawal from the EU. The Agency immediately began working with the Dutch authorities to prepare for the move and take up its operations in Amsterdam on 30 March 2019 at the latest”.

      https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/about-us/uks-withdrawal-eu/relocation-amsterdam

      Furthermore, whatever happens with the Withdrawal Agreement in Westminster the UK is already out of Euratom. This means that certain isotopes that are used for bone, cardiac, lung and kidney scans and in radiotherapy to treat cancer patients will no longer be available. They cannot in any case be stockpiled as they have a very short half-life

      https://www.bnms.org.uk/news/press-release-british-nuclear-medicine-society-statement-on-leaving-euratom.html

    83. Rock says:

      This leaflet has all the signs of typical fearmongering by a party which opposes a certain outcome.

      Like the fearmongering by the likes of Asda before the first and only Scottish independence referendum.

      There is no shortage of pharmaceutical companies in the world more than happy to flog stuff to the NHS, almost certainly at much lower prices.

      The only problem is those currently making a killing out of the NHS will lose out.

    84. Myles O'Butter says:

      I shared this post and received comment that this is just negative propaganda as there is no indication of where this flyer/poster comes from… Help please: who produced it ?

    85. Hamish100 says:

      rock
      Petra kindly posted this link earlier. I assume you buy and read the National now?

      C’mon folks support the ONLY newspaper in the UK that’s telling the Scots the truth. If you don’t use it we’ll lose it, much to the delight of the BritNats.
      If you can afford to …. buy it daily (85p), online monthly (£6.99) or yearly (£79.99). And that includes anyone beyond our shores who cares about the future of the Scots and our beloved Scotland.
      http://www.thenational.scot/subscribe/

    86. CameronB Brodie says:

      Policy development and implementation requires evidence based impact assessments, and plans approved by the Treasury. Where are they?

      Brexit is likely to be one of the worst cases ever of governmental failure and is clear grounds to dissolve the Union, IMHO.

      Guidance
      UK government’s preparations for a ‘no deal’ scenario

      Updated 21 December 2018

      What we mean by a ‘no deal’ scenario

      The UK triggered Article 50 of the Treaty of the European Union on 29 March 2017. As set out under that treaty, the UK has two years to negotiate a Withdrawal Agreement and framework for a future relationship with the EU before the point of the UK’s exit from the EU at 11pm GMT on 29 March 2019.

      A no deal scenario is one where the UK leaves the EU and becomes a third country at 11pm GMT on 29 March 2019 without a Withdrawal Agreement and framework for a future relationship in place between the UK and the EU.

      In a no deal scenario there would therefore be no agreement to apply any of the elements of the Withdrawal Agreement described above.

      The UK is therefore preparing for a scenario where there is no UK-EU agreement in place on exit day.

      Plans already in place

      For two years government has been implementing a significant programme of work to prepare for all scenarios, including a potential no deal scenario in March 2019.

      The government has taken its responsibilities to prepare the UK for all scenarios very seriously. The Budget 2018 confirmed an additional £500 million of funding for 2019/20, meaning the Government will have invested over £4 billion in preparing for EU exit since 2016.

      Technical Notices

      Over the course of August, September and October 2018, the Government published 106 technical notices to ensure that citizens and businesses have the information to prepare for EU Exit. Since the publication of technical notices, we have taken further steps to ensure people and firms are ready, including:

      Publishing more than 100 pages of guidance for businesses on processes and procedures at the border in a no deal scenario.

      Contacting 145,000 businesses who trade with the EU, telling them to start getting ready for no deal customs procedures.

      Advising hundreds of ports, traders, pharmaceutical firms and other organisations that use the border about potential disruption so they can get their supply chains ready.

      Publishing a paper on citizens’ rights, giving people clarity on their future.

      https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/uk-governments-preparations-for-a-no-deal-scenario/uk-governments-preparations-for-a-no-deal-scenario

    87. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Stravaiger @ 19:43,

      You can’t simultaneously believe that there is confusion in the leadership of the Tory Party and also that no-deal “has been planned all along”. The two are mutually incompatible, for obvious reasons.

      Planned by whom, FGS? This idiotic UKGov couldn’t organise a drink of water by the shore of Loch Lomond, so who is doing this supposed “planning”? They haven’t even got everything ready for this “planned” no-deal exit. Not even close! Contractors with virtual ships. Duh.

      This airy-fairy cloud-cuckooland denial of reality is what is particularly scary and damning about the whole farrago. In trying – and objectively failing – to even reach any kind of consensus within its own party, the Tory UKGov is staggering from one abject failure of management to another. Aided and abetted by an official opposition that has no more clue or answer, trapped in its very own “better” fantasyland.

      Organised? Planned? Directed? =laugh= This utterly incompetent shamblethon isn’t government as we know it, it’s farce.

      With very serious and unfarcical consequences for many real people. alas. Almost of all of us, in fact.

    88. Legerwood says:

      Rock @ 9.28pm

      There may be lots of pharmaceutical companies in the world but how many are producing dodgy drugs?

      At the moment around 1% of drugs in developed countries such as the UK are fake.

      If our current supply sources become interrupted as a result of Brexit then that percentage could rise.

      The need to maintain supplies puts the UK at a disadvantage not just an increasing danger of fake drugs but also on price when it comes to negotiating supplies.

      https://www.boehringer-ingelheim.com/sustainability/anti-counterfeiting/dangers-counterfeit-medicines

      https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-seizes-more-than-2-million-of-fake-medicines-as-part-of-international-crackdown

    89. crazycat says:

      @ Robert J Sutherland

      As has regularly been pointed out on here, the Westminster government, whatever its colour, is a front for the Establishment.

      It is very much in the interests of the Establishment to have a No Deal Brexit, and also to have a hapless government to take the blame.

      What remains debatable, in my opinion, though probably not actually worth debating, is whether they:

      a) only recently contrived to manoeuver such a useless bunch into the cabinet

      or b) have been running down the competence of both main UK parties for decades, in readiness for the opportunity they have now.

      So it is certainly possible to have both a deliberate No Deal and a load of eejits in the parliamentary LabCon Party – they are not the ones in charge.

    90. Ben madigan

      I am not even thinking of the implications of being unable to get my medication.
      I had a liver transplant 7 years ago and must take daily drugs to prevent my immune system rejecting and attacking the organ. Have spoken to doctors recently and they all say I don’t need to stockpile but I’m not so sure.

      How can T MAY do this to anyone when she herself needs insulin.

      I shall have to write my will if this goes through.

    91. Ken500 says:

      The pharmacy business is really important in Britain. Medical research etc. An international exchange. Especially in Scotland. Worldwide medical research cooperation with Europe and the rest of the world.

      Scotland’s achievements in medical research are recognised by Europe and worldwide. Too many achievements to list. Drugs being produced in Scotland. Dundee etc. The majority research and industrial activity will all be totally negatively affected by Brexit. Once again major decision being made elsewhere will damage the Scottish economy.Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen, Dundee etc medical schools recognised worldwide for research and development. Major breakthroughs

      Trident, 30 mins from Glasgow all the damaging industry based in Scotland by Westminster unionists against the people’s wishes. Dumping all the rubbish in Scotland against people’s wishes and destroying all the positive industry against the people’s wishes. A double whammy from crumbling Westminster. Totally ignoring the people’s wishes.

    92. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @crazycat (11.16) –

      When you speak of ‘The Establishment’ favouring a ‘No Deal’ Brexit, is that for simple tax-evasion reasons, or something else?

    93. Luigi says:

      If WM has been preparing seriously for a no-deal BREXIT for two years, it’s a great pity they did not take actually make even half that effort trying to negotiate a proper deal. Did they ever really want a deal?

      One thing’s for sure, folks. You can bet the house that WM has also fully developed contingency plans” for Scotland in the event of a no-deal.

      Holyrood neutered,Shiny new, all-powerful Scottish Office, headed by Governor Mundale?

      You have been warned.

    94. To anyone out there who wonders why Nicola doesn’t call for Indy ref 2 now – you must realise that she cannot call it while there is still a chance that T May could cancel Brexit.

      If Nicola called it next week, or even next month, T May could send a letter revoking Article 50 or extending Art 50 ( more likely as it kicks the can down the road a bit more) and pull the carpet from under the Indy ref

      What an omnishambles.

      Having said that I trust Nicola to get it right and at least we have that option.

      Maybe a few more leaflets like this will begin to turn peoples’ minds to the reality we’re facing.

    95. Ian McCubbin says:

      the young say no independence for 15 years as it is inevitable Brexit will happen . They may be right and what will follow is dissolution of Holyrood.
      These are real threats.
      So the SNP government in the form of Nicola Sturgeon needs to deliver a letter of dissolution of the union to Theresa May by end of March this year.
      That means brexit and break up of uk goes ahead for all.

      Then when we are free rejoin EU or single market and customs union.

    96. geeo says:

      Meg merrilees

      “How can T MAY do this to anyone when she herself needs insulin”.
      …….

      As if treeza and co will have any problem getting meds….such problems are for us suckers.

      I am on lifetime meds myself, including very high doses of pain meds, and even these only dull the pain i have suffered for the last 8 years since my injuries, ever so slightly.

      I can hardly function as it is, due to the permanent physical disabilities caused by my accident.

      Indy is critical to many thousands of people, for many multi layered reasons, we simply cannot let them down.

    97. ben madigan says:

      Meg – was glad to hear your liver transplant was successful and I sincerely hope you will always be able to access the immunosuppressive drugs you need to ensure it continues to be a success.

      Just skim reading through the posts shows how many of us need so many different high quality daily medications that we and our doctors are confident provide us with the exact dosage we require.

      The EU regulations ensure our pharmaceuticals constantly reach that optimal standard, that their safety profiles are monitored and new drugs are developed – often in collaboration with Scottish scientists as Ken 500 pointed out. That may all be lost to Scotland.

      I trust Scotland finds a way to remain in the EU and gain its independence from the UK so that the health of the Scots and the pioneering work of Scottish scientists and doctors is never again put at such risk

    98. AndyMcKangry says:

      I said immediately after Indyref 2014, “ plague and pestilence on all NO voters” half in jest and half for real.
      But you know what? As the years went by since that day and the gross ignorance and stupidity of NO voters continued, no matter the hardship I and my fellow YES voters will endure, I have become more entrenched in that hope, that all NO VOTERS suffer that plague and pestilence, for they brought us here and it was not necessary!!
      AND before the “lets all forgive and forget” brigade get started, I am not and never have been in the “we must engage rather than mock” faction when it comes to NO voters.
      They sold their country down the river and they know it and most of them are ashamed but will never admit it and I for one will never forgive them and the ones that know me know that.
      They are responsible for what is now happening and they should be reminded of that every day so that they know that their only atonement is to vote yes next time!!
      Is that bitter and twisted enough???

    99. Thepnr says:

      Independence absolutely is becoming critical in more ways than one. It’s not all about wealth as some seem to think but about health as well.

      Brexit has unleashed demons even the most rapid right wing UKIP Farage type could have foreseen. I think it is going to get very very interesting indeed in the next few weeks.

      I’ll be perfectly honest I’ll be totally delighted if it does bring chaos to the smug bastards that want a No deal Brexit at any cost as apparently 57% of Conservative party members do. These people really do believe that it will all be alright for them, only the foreigners and the spongers on the dole will be affected.

      LOL I really do hope that they learn a valuable lesson and that’s to be careful what you wish for.

    100. Dr Jim says:

      It’ll all be alright once Brexit no deal is done and blamed on Nicola Sturgeon and the Lib Dems and anybody else who didn’t want this because the Americans will ride to lil old plucky Englands rescue and SELL us all the drugs we need at the prices we can afford with our new shiny American healthcare insurance policies covering everything wrong with us except for what kills us (it’ll say in the small print)and our charity hospitals will *take care* of those who can’t afford insurance

      It’s a brave new world

    101. Josef Ó Luain says:

      There is already, and has been for some time, a black-market in medicines. Some people can’t afford to take the time off work to visit their GP, so are forced to source the prescription drugs they need, illegally, out of surgery hours. The current “back-street” suppliers will be falling-over one-and-other to meet the coming demand.

    102. Effijy says:

      That leaflet has a much truer ring to it than
      A fleet of buses promising £350 Million per
      Week to the NHS with Brexit.

      The deed is done.
      There is so called deal, shambles that it is, but still
      Qualifying as the best they could get, a red white and
      Blue Brexit.

      It is going to be accepted by Westminster, it is going cost a million jobs,
      It is going to take Westminster debt up to £2 Trilion and it is going to deliver
      Another 10 years resession and cut backs, take away human rights cost lives .

      Any Scot that accepts this or votes for it deserves to driven into the ground by
      Their London based Tory Masters.

      Wake up, stand up and fight for your rights Scotland!

    103. Elmac says:

      Re Breeks @ 6.31pm

      Have been catching up on this thread and saw your comment. My wife has an eye condition which requires regular treatment with Carbomer eye drops and I wondered if by chance the drops you use are the same. If so Amazon UK are selling a 20 x 10g pack of 0.2% w/w eye gel drops for £21.95 with free delivery. I think the shelf life is 2-3 years unless the tubes are opened but you would need to check. I know it is galling to pay in the land of free prescriptions but for my wife this represents a 5 month safety buffer. Please forgive the intrusion if your drops are different but I thought it was worth a mention.

      This sorry mess does make you think. I need a daily pill, not life threatening, but unpleasant to be without. Unfortunately it is prescription only so will have to beg extra from the doc to try to accumulate a buffer stock. When you read the potential predicament of some of of the people posting on here it makes you hopping mad at the callous evil attitude of these incompetent corrupt tories.

    104. crazycat says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood at 11.38

      Sorry for the delayed reply – was diverted.

      I don’t know the answer; the tax issue is obviously pressing, but if they have been manipulating for decades (perhaps since they saw “unreliable outsiders”, such as – shock horror – state educated plebs, becoming government ministers [Cameron’s government was the most Eton-heavy for a while, and there are now no Etonians in cabinet, I believe], thereby diluting their own influence), it would be broader than that.

      The Remembrancer only covers the City of London/Square Mile, but a virtual remembrancer for everywhere else is surely there too. They’re not lizards, and I suspect the Bilderberg conspiracy theories are a bit overdone, even if not totally without foundation. But these people know how to look after themselves – that’s how they got where they are, and how they stay there.

    105. yesindyref2 says:

      @Dr Jim
      Many a true word spoken in half-jest.

    106. yesindyref2 says:

      As a totally random thing, I hope the likes of Alyn Smith stays in the EU boat, even if as an observer with Scotland having observer status at the EP and in the Councils, while the formal application is going through. Plus the other MEPs, David Martin and even the Conservatives if they want to.

    107. Liz g says:

      Well….. Trying not to be adding more Heat than Light
      ( while still considering whither or not to share my own experience)
      Do we have any information about Veternary medicine?
      There has to be many of our pets depending on regular medications too ?

    108. Tackety Beets says:

      Not looking for an argument merely posing another thought.

      I agree NS is waiting confirmation of Brexit prior to calling Indy Ref2.
      The absolute disrespect shown to Scotland etc in these last 2 years, should be enough evidence that many people should be turning No to Yes.

      If NS called IndyRef2 in the morning & Brexit is cancelled in a few days or even after the vote in WM, I would suggest that MANY Brexiteers in south would be so mad at NS forcing the cancellation of Brexit it would change the dynamics of the constitution ……… for a generation.

      Maybe its just as well its not my call.

    109. Hamish100 says:

      Brexit is coming. Just not surecehat version. Labour is neutered.
      Once we know which brexit looms an independence vote is inevitable.

    110. Ben madigan

      Yes, my transplant has been the most amazing thing – I am so lucky to live in a time when things like this can happen and when someone ( and their family) was prepared to let their organ be used for transplant.

      Please everyone consider carrying a donor card and discuss this with your families.

      It was harrowing on the ward waiting for my transplant and knowing that two other women had no liver available. One woman was from the Caribbean and another was Asian and had a 5 year old daughter who visited her very weekend. I don’t know if either of them survived.

      Being a transplant survivor it makes me see red when the MSM attack our Health Service.
      We have wonderful medical provision and it is shocking that the PM of the UK is knowingly putting all of this at risk.

      There are certain things that should be ring-fenced and protected at all costs and a National Health Service free at the point of need is absolutely precious.

      I take my hat off to each and every person working in the Health Service. You deserve our respect and gratitude.

    111. Liz g says:

      Tackety Breeks @ 1.45
      Nae argument here,I think thats what Nicola has been holding off for all along.

      Joanna Cherry has put it beyond doubt that Westminster can cancel Brexit any time it wants to.
      A position that Westminster and the Media have tried to hide?

      Absent the overwhelming demand ( which is being suppressed ) for Scottish Politicians to “Strike Down the Treaty of the Union “, Nicola has to demonstrate that Scotland will be Brexited against it’s will… And to it’s detriment!

      To use the Mandate… WEll… The relevant part of it…
      She ( Nicola ) has to take it to the limit !!!
      She has to make sure as best she can that Westminster have run out of road!I

      We have always been told Autumn of 2018 or Spring of 2019..

      SOooo we cannot yet say that Nicola has been too cautious!
      We must at least acknowledge that Our First Minister has kept her word….
      We have not run out of road yet…
      We must stay the course and hang together…
      Which tells me, I must share too,for Breeks and the other’s!!
      I do hope it helps…

    112. yesindyref2 says:

      I think Grayling has taken Christmas songs as fact.

      I saw three ships come sailing in
      On Christmas Day, on Christmas Day
      I saw three ships come sailing in
      On Christmas Day in the morning

      Keep taking the tablets Chris.

      Oh.

    113. mac says:

      What have you done with Cactus ???

      Don’t tell me you got him banned from Wings???

      Where for art thou Cactus???

    114. Liz g says:

      Breeks…
      I feel the same way when I see the Stroke adverts!!
      When I had my Stroke there were no “clot bursters” ye had yer Stroke and delt with the aftermath!I

      When there was the CPR adverts ( the Vinnie guy quite RIGHTLY trying to make it cool) it broke my heart.. Because I failed in front of my children to get it right,and their daddy died!
      So I hope that you can find a .. crumb.. of comfort in that someone has a wee bit of understanding of how you feel!

      Yet … that was my past and I have survived it… And it does not compare to your fear for your future..
      But know this Breeks…

      I will be doing my very best,as best,as I know how to get where we need to be,and I am not unaware of you and people like you… Who depend on a decent health service..

      While I don’t personally need medication half my loved ones do….. Rest assured…as best you can…I won’t stop my friend… It’s all I can offer ye now,I know it’s not enough!
      But it’s what I have…. And I have to believe it’s very strong…XXX

    115. Liz g says:

      Max @ 2.22
      Cactus is not a fool,nor the entertainment.. He shakes things up when he sees it appropriate.
      He will show up and make a judgement..
      A wedgie should know this!

    116. Liz g says:

      Mac …
      Oops sorry…
      Mac not Max

    117. Dr Jim says:

      Mrs May doesn’t like bad language on the internet and wants it banned, affecting our yoof and such

      Immigrants drowning’s fine though

      Strange people Tories eh?

    118. Liz g says:

      Meg Merrilees @ 2.04
      Oh Meg all the best with yer transplant..
      My elder brother has my “late” father’s kidney.
      It ( the Kidney )has survived my father for over 25 + year’s… Which is obviously thanks to the (excuse the spelling … I hope I never have to learn it) siclo sporen… as I was sayin to Breeks my actual family and people I consider family need to be able to depend on the human endeavour that is medicine…. As did the fine mind of Steven Hawking…. We ( Humanity ) ignore this at our peril!

    119. Breeks says:


      Elmac says:
      5 January, 2019 at 1:08 am
      Re Breeks @ 6.31pm

      Have been catching up on this thread and saw your comment. My wife has an eye condition which requires regular treatment with Carbomer eye drops and I wondered if by chance the drops you use are the same…

      No, it’s DuoTrav I need.

      I did a bit research, and maybe I’ll be ok. Its made by a Swiss company Novartis Pharmaceuticals but they have a UK plant. Hopefully Brexit doesn’t close it down or cut off the chemicals used to make it.

      Thanks for all the kind words everybody.

      I find myself thinking of those Catalonian politicians who really don’t deserve to be thrown in jail, and the reckless Tory and UKIP imbeciles who so thoroughly do.

      Special thoughts and hugs too to those with dogs and pets in need of medication. I lost my best friend in the world last February. At least I can relax that he is safe now.

    120. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      crazycat @ 23:16,

      Well, it seems to me that the entire English Establishment is thoroughly discombobulated by Brexit, since it represents an unsettling (for them) loss of control.

      In fact, if anything, the Leaver disaster capitalist vultures and the 1970’s throwback neo-statists are the rebels, and the Establishment is for Remain since it means stability, which is why they have been trying to drum up this “People’s Vote” thing in an attempt to re-establish their lost control of events. (If you doubt this, just look at who has been funding and promoting it.)

      We are at a crucial time. The Establishment in its various facets is currently weakened by its own confusions and uncertainties. We are rather like the intrepid visitors to Oz who have just drawn back the curtain and seen that the whole edifice is a sham, run by a doddery old geezer trying to operate controls that don’t function properly.

      If we have the self-confidence to act effectively on an understanding of that weakness, and grab the initiative before Brexit, before the Establishment has a chance to rally and restore control, before it can turn its undivided attention back to us again, we have a never-to-be-repeated opportunity to win through.

    121. Shug says:

      It looks to me like Westminster is making a hard brexit look really bad in order to justify cancelling brexit at the last moment
      In that scenario will labour then support them. I think they would
      Leaves i indyrwf 2 in an awkard place

    122. Ken500 says:

      The appalling Brexit nonsense is not really about migration, the population nos or taking back control and all the other nonsense. The Tories, the usual suspects have been at it for over forty years trying to get Britain out of the EU. Since Britain applied to join (Veto all the way by De Gaulle. The French)

      The same suspects as today but over thirty years later. Redwood (knighted for his appalling behaviour and lies. Davis the incompetent. Duncan Smith (there are no words for these abusers) Hague. Lords. The suspected child abuse cover up. Destroyed the files or concealed them. The Tory abusers. Now joined by other self harmers and abusers. Corbyn (the total loser) No policies. No future. Along with sychophants in league with the Tories.

      It finally brought Thatcher down, along with their appalling policies creating civil unrest and hardship. Thatcher wanted to stay in a relationship with Europe. The other Tory renegades did not. The fight then as now was about embezzling and abusing taxes. Tax evasion and who wants to be PM.

      John Major won the battle to say in a closer relationship with the evolving EU. Called the Tories opposition to these agreements the ‘bastards’ in his own Party. Bastards then and ‘bastards’ now. The same suspects. Farague and Johnstone the biggest destructive liars now. Arguments about who would be PM brought the Tories down then and will bring them down again. Deja Vu approaching.

      These Tories have been at it for over forty years trying to destroy the UK economy and EU membership. They believe they have finally succeeded. They will find out differently soon. It will bring the Tories down again. Forty years+ in the wilderness once again. Their corruption and sychophance there for all to see on display. complete and utter corruption.

      Corbyn is just another deluded unionist, as deluded as the Tories. Reneging on all ‘principles’. Were they ever there at all. Depending on how the wind blew. Cavorting with the DUP will hardly win sympathy. All principles out. What they will finally succeed is to break up is their precious malicious Union. The appalling illegal lies and secrecy finally displayed for all to comprehend. The idiocy of their manipulation and lies. They learn nothing from experience just repeat the same old mistakes again. The same old behaviours. Some people never learn. The destructive conclusion.

      It is nothing about taking back control, migration or population size. They were at it forty years ago when the population and migration were lower. It is about these lying individuals having control to tax evade, embezzle public money and lie to try and cover their tracks, Thatcher established tax havens in the 1980’s to ruin the world economy. The banking crisis, sold off utilities etc.

      Thatcher had unemployment at 18%+ on average. The only place it was less than 10% was London S/E. Scottish revenues were been illegally and secretly taken to fund London S/E and ‘loads of money’ bankers. Thatcher’s mates funding the Tory Party. Inflation was up to 25% and interest rates 15%+ (the thieving Tory bankers). Lining their own pockets with other people’s money. The start of the banking crash being sown. Well documented.

      Poverty and deprivation all around, the 1980’s. The and civil unrest. People took to the streets to protest. There was no other redress through the Ballot Box. The bastards would not listen. Even worse in Scotland with no proper representation of reason and security. No democracy within the UK. The illegal wars, financial fraud and tax evasion destroying the world economy.

      They willl cause another world recession, as the pond ripples out bringing even more recession and depression. The biggest debt and wealth gap in the world. Murdoch, 81, away with £30Billion will not have a chance to spend it. You can’t take it with you. £Billions tax evaded, through law breaking, lies and manipulation. Thatcher installation. A decade of degradation

      These vandals finally think they have succeeded when they have not. The unexpected consequences will bring them down. The complete and utter badness. Many will be out on their ears. Years in the wilderness for many. A lifetime of oblivion.

      Roll on Independence,. To be out of this corrupt, unsightly embarrassing Union. Holding the balance of power should do it. The Tories (Corbyn) have blown it. All credibility destroyed. The emperor’s new clothes do not exist at all. Just wolves in sheeps clothing disappearing over the cliff. Trying to maintain non disclosure and secrecy. To keep their crimes and manipulation hidden. May can’t bribe Nicola. A major problem for her. Thank goodness for the SNP standing up for Scotland. Where would Scotland be without them. Throw aside again and disrespected.

      The Tories (Corbyn) are being exposed for the charlatans they conform to be. 30/40+ years of misinformation and duplicity. The creation of doubt. D Day is fast approaching. The exposure of !D’ notices. No taking back control but oblivion for the malicious Tories. Consigned to purgatory. Consigned to self harming, To try and recover some dignity. Not likely in the present circumstances. Destruction and disillusion all around. The only squeal, ‘where did it all go so wrong’ for the nasty Party being found out once again. Wicked and stupid beyond belief. Conned once again.

      Bring it on.

    123. James Barr Gardner says:

      Ken500 says:
      4 January, 2019 at 11:29 pm

      Trident, 30 mins from Glasgow all the damaging industry based in Scotland by Westminster unionists against the people’s wishes.

      Nuclear blast speed 300 metres per second puts Glasgow from Faslane in under 3 Minutes !

    124. Helena Brown says:

      Had a discussion a few months ago with a neighbour who I know suffers with glaucoma. We were discussing my dog at the time who was using eye drops to hopefully stop a common Pug problem. I mentioned that as it was also human medicine I was concerned that it would not be available after Brexit, that I had difficulty last year getting it as it is made by a company in Belgium. He said the Belgians would want to still trade and poo pooed the problem. I wonder how he is doing as they spend half their time down south.

    125. Ghillie says:

      Very OT/ and feeling more than a tad outraged.

      Apparently,

      The tories in Scotland are calling for shops to have special ‘local produce’ aisles so folk can easily see what is produced locally and support local small producers…

      AND for stuff to be clearly labeled as to origin.

      Would that be the same tories that advocate the slapping of the butcher’s apron on all things Scottish in order to make Scotland forget how brilliant are our many and diverse producers?!!

      Brian Whittle Scottish conservative spokesman for Wellbeing (there’s an oxymoron!) and Sport argues ‘that it would be a straight forward change for supermarkets to make, expanding options for customers and encouraging healthier consumption’.

      Mr Whittle! Do you not think, mibee, in terms of origin, returning to the correct labeling of SCOTTISH produce with the SCOTTISH flag would be the first and most obvious step!!!?

      The toerags just do not do irony!

    126. Hamish100 says:

      I don’t want cactus banned. I do wish he stops commenting about his attempts at getting coitus and his constant effin and blinding.Who is he to decide when to ” shake things up” . About what? Mostly its about him and independence is secondary. I wish some would stop encouraging him. Last thing we need is wings banned because youngsters are exposed to his comments.

    127. Martin says:

      Hello all, GP here. I’ve got the answers to the 3 questions but you won’t like them…

      1. No, there’s little to no information being shared with us.
      2. Nit sure, most medicines have alternatives but few if any made in UK these days.
      3. Really not sure, maybe pray?

      Sorry…

    128. McBoxheid says:

      Chronic illness does not come with a certain age. It affects all age groups. Chronically ill people with a long history of illness or condition tend not to be well off because their illness/disability is looked down on by those looking for workers.
      Not all, but many chronically ill or disabled are on minimum wage or universal credit (UC). UC has been rolled out just in time for brexit. They don’t want foreigners, disabled, chronically ill, other such “scroungers” and have found a way to reduce their number. I wonder if this a cynical way to reduce government expenditure?

      Faschism and racism go hand in hand and the tories love to “other” people. I am fortunate to live in Germany, but my future here is not guaranteed. I’m on 7 different meds a day and am in chronic, delibitating pain.

      Those wishing to escape the worst of brexit may not be able to move to a country outside the UK.

      Independence and membership of the EU is the only way to avoid this mess caused by spoilt tory millionaires throwing their toys out of the pram because of self aggrandisement, greed and reasons that the majority of people in Scotland cannot begin to fathom, at least I hope it will be a majority this time around.

    129. Anne Marie mcnulty says:

      Pretty sure this is take to scare people into voting for real on table. Bad deal is better than no real under this strong and stable government.

    130. Q says:

      This looks more like an unofficial political leaflet to malign the government. (Forgivable.) Bad grammar in patches too. (Unforgivable…)

    131. Hamish 100

      Please read my post on the previous thread – 4th January @ 1.27 Gloom-Tinted Glasses

      Jack KELMAN, a Glaswegian author who won the Booker prize in 1994 for writing the book, “…How Late it Was, How Late” was praised for its ‘ mesmerising, stream-of-consciousness depiction of a Glaswegian blind man

      Julia Neuberger , one of the judges, volubly expressed her disgust that a book she couldn’t understand had taken the prize. It was considered literary vandalism.

      In his defence Kalman said,
      “My culture and my language have the right to exist and no one has the authority to dismiss that” .
      He received the accolade of “genius” from the chairman of the judges, John Bayley, formerly Warton Professor of English Literature at Oxford.

      I have quoted an example of the book which you can read on the previous post – don’t be put off by the frequent use of the ‘f’ word because as a description of the thoughts of a blind person it is brilliant and an accurate use of vernacular.

      The controversy stems from the language used – but , in truth, if that is how people speak then “no-one has the authority to dismiss that”.

      Cactus is a ‘colourful character’ and if that upsets you then try to scroll by.

      We’re all trying to get Independence on this website – that’s the important thing.

    132. Liz g.

      Thank you for your kind thoughts. I’m still here, thanks to the NHS and will fight for Scotland’s Independence till my last breath.

      We only have a short while to wait now, I’m certain.

      However, increasingly hearing that T.May and MP’s will probably vote on amendments next week ( or whenever) but not on the deal itself.
      Then she plans to make a day trip to Brussels to ‘negotiate’ – trying to restrict the Backstop to a year- then she’ll come back and try and discuss further before finally, possibly putting the actual deal to the vote – at which point she expects to get it through.

      Seems to me that the longer she puts off the vote, she stops labour from a VONC and also prevents Nicola from calling for Indy.
      Someone called Nicky Da Costa, (T May’s Secretary? ) was being interviewed by John Humphreys on the Today programme – wondered if she is the wife of the obnoxious Da Costa MP.

    133. Cod says:

      Thepnr says:
      4 January, 2019 at 7:44 pm

      “Who really cares who the source is for this leaflet.”

      I care. For the simple reason that, regardless of whether the information contained within is true or not, if you use fake leaflets as a source it makes it easy for those who stand against your viewpoint or argument to point to the fact it is fake, and then to argue that “this person does not do their research, and what else are they telling you that is fake?”. It allows them to then throw doubt on all of your arguments by association.

      Now, as to the points within the item in question: I have no doubt that most of them are true or potentially true. After all, Westminster has been busy gagging pharma companies, pharma trade organisations, and transport companies with NDAs [1] in order to prevent the public from finding out what they think will happen, and Ministers, such as Sir Chris Wormald, Permanent Secretary at the Department of Health, have, as recently as October, stating that they cannot guarantee supplies of medicines [2].

      Even Government Cabinet members are now admitting the possibilities of a no deal Brexit (with the obvious caveat that the one in the link backs May’s deal, and so would likely claim all sorts of terrifying outcomes in any event, in order to put pressure on to vote yes to her deal) [3]

      It should be remembered that although the UK imports a lot of drugs, it also exports a lot – and 48% of those go to the EU, worth £11.9 billion. Further, the pharma sector largest companies have stated, unequivocally, that a no deal Brexit would impact the JIT (Just In Time) supply lines for many medicines, and the prices, as many of the finished products and ingredients are not covered by the Pharmaceutical Tariff Elimination Agreement, which would be extended to the UK, as a member of the WTO, even in the event of a no-deal Brexit [4].

      [1] https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/dec/23/pharmaceutical-firms-preparing-no-deal-brexit-ordered-to-sign-ndas

      [2] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-no-deal-crash-out-eu-medicine-supplies-a8588531.html

      [3] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-news-live-latest-theresa-may-deal-vote-parliament-commons-dup-nhs-matt-hancock-a8672091.html

      [4] https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmbeis/382/38205.htm

    134. Maria F says:

      This is appalling and totally surreal. Some patients rely on their medicines to live. How on earth can you tell a type I and some type II diabetics that “they may have a gap in their prescriptions” of insulin? That is pretty much telling them to brace for very possible early death.

      What about those in medication to reduce blood pressure? Also telling them to brace for the exponentially increased possibility of a stroke.

      And those medication for the heart? To brace themselves for a heart attack.

      And those that survive day to day thanks to strong pain killers or medication for rheumathoid arthritis? to brace themselves for “a gap” of undefined length of unbearable pain.

      And those that only have a chance to survive cancer or to at least slow its progression with chemotherapy? To say their good-byes.

      All in the name of the stupidity brexit that Scotland did not vote for but that we are forced to endure due to the most incompetent and undemocratic duet in UK politics in modern history: tories and labour. One useless to govern, the other useless to act as an opposition. So much so that the line between what is government and what is opposition has been erased from UK politics with these two. We don’t longer have a democracy in the UK, we just have two mediocre amateurs playing at pretend politics.

      So obsessed labour and tories are for their stupid brexit that they are willing to put the population of the entire UK onto totally unnecessary and completely unjustifiable danger. The negligence of this is raw to everybody to see, but furthermore,this is a total dereliction of duty.

      And this is what the England MPs steal our EU citizenship rights, steal our powers and drag Scotland out of the EU against our expressed democratic will for?

      Well, thanks a lot for nothing, you self-serving and useless wnkrs.

    135. Hamish100 says:

      Any “official” leaflet will have the NHS logo on it eg NHSScotland.

      Looks like something mad up on the hoos with a slight political angle. Probably accurate though.

    136. Hamish100 says:

      made up on the hoof

      Sorry

    137. Sarah says:

      Several commenters are saying that if Brexit is cancelled that will make it difficult for the Scottish referendum to be held.

      I don’t agree for the following reasons:
      1. the last referendum was held when UK safely in EU – yet YES came very close to a majority. Many of the top people in SNP [John Swinney, Alex Salmond] thought we had got it won.
      2. Since then Westminster has grown in vileness, lack of principle and lack of intelligence. This is visible to many people who hadn’t seen it before.
      3. Brexit is not the only ground on which Scotland can base its desire to withdraw from the Treaty of Union.

      In my view a referendum should be called now at the same time as pursuing all the other angles such as going to the International Court of Justice/UN/ European Court of Justice to argue for our rights to have our membership of EU maintained/ our own broadcasting/adherence to terms of Treaty of Union/ any other matter where we are currently being abused.

    138. Lochside says:

      Sarah @ 12.12…totally agree…whatever the real game is: No Deal or Shite deal…the poor and sick of our country must be protected at all cost. And if it means alienating England and its zenophobes so be it.

      Many have noted already that the retired population voted ‘NO’ overwhelmingly in the REF. But through age and infirmity they will now be most at risk and that will change minds radically.
      Whatever happens Scotland must remain in the EU by whatever means it takes.

    139. Hamish100 says:

      meg merilees

      fair doo’s you defending cactus. It is your right of course just as its mine to disagree.

      Back to fighting for independence. No effin in sight.

    140. Harry mcaye says:

      Many on Twitter saying this is a fake. Entirely believable though.

    141. crazycat says:

      @ Robert J Sutherland in the wee sma’ hours

      You may well be right about competence, discombobulation, etc. We’ll find out, fairly soon.

      If they are really this useless, though, how long has that been the case? Perhaps they got away with it because nothing too difficult came along to expose it; or perhaps it is genuinely new. That we won’t find out, because we can’t go back and see how previous cohorts would have coped with the current conditions.

    142. Rock says:

      Legerwood says:
      4 January, 2019 at 10:40 pm

      “Rock @ 9.28pm

      There may be lots of pharmaceutical companies in the world but how many are producing dodgy drugs?

      At the moment around 1% of drugs in developed countries such as the UK are fake.

      If our current supply sources become interrupted as a result of Brexit then that percentage could rise.”

      There are obviously fake drugs around but countries like South Africa, Brazil, India are producing generic drugs much much cheaper.

      There are people making a killing out of selling grossly overpriced drugs to the NHS and those are the ones who are scaremongering.

    143. Hamish100 says:

      rock – the standards for pharmaceutical products are different. Brazil v Holland, South Africa v France. I’ll stick with EU standards thanks. Cheap is not better just sometimes adulterated. Did you buy The National today or are you still an avid Mail reader? lol

    144. Rock says:

      Hamish100 says:
      5 January, 2019 at 8:46 pm

      “rock – the standards for pharmaceutical products are different. Brazil v Holland, South Africa v France. I’ll stick with EU standards thanks. Cheap is not better just sometimes adulterated. Did you buy The National today or are you still an avid Mail reader? lol”

      Hi Nick Robinson, are you happy with the prices paid to the pharmaceutical companies by the NHS?

    145. Muscleguy says:

      I’m not on anything so not worried personally but my wife is and even though we’re separated I don’t want any harm to come to her. She is unlikely to be harmed quickly but will likely be extremely uncomfortable.

      Fortunately the youngest is in NZ so will okay for her meds.

      I am however incandescent with rage over the risk to others and can understand the anxiety and apprehension those who rely on lifesaving drugs and their loved ones must be feeling.

      I signed this earlier: https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/228631/signatures/new

      Though I doubt it will do much good, May is not for listening and I expect a military helicopter would be dispatched to Downing St for the PM’s insulin while others slide into diabetic comas. The woman is a sociopath, she must be.

    146. Hamish100 says:

      rock — you are reading the Mail and Express too much. Your posts are getting more desperate.

    147. Terence callachan says:

      I made a comment here over a year ago saying that I think the whole Brexit drama is a smokescreen to hide the real intention of Englands Westminster government
      Which is to further deflate ideas of Scottish independence
      I still think Brexit will be cancelled
      Once it is cancelled they will say that the SNP were untrustworthy they will call for unity and say that the great Westminster coupled with the great House of Lords always saves the day and always reaches the right conclusion
      Labour voters in Scotland will fall for it
      England will suck the last thirty years of oil from the North Sea and Atlantic see off the EU threat to jersey and Caribbean tax havens with reconciliation at the last minute and proceed to dissolve the tried and tested holyrood citing it as a weak and divisive failure
      Scotland has been colonised there are so many English people living in Scotland that combined with the Tories they make up over half the NO vote
      BUSTED

    148. Cubby says:

      Terence Callachan@12.49am

      1. There is a lot more than 30 years of oil left.

      2. Your forecasts make as much sense as that other British Nationalist Rock.

      3. You said I threatened you and swore at you. I challenged you to say where and when. STILL WAITING.

      4.BUSTED The only thing that is busted is your phoney Independence supporter claim. Just another lying Britnat Terry old boy.

    149. Aldo says:

      No matter what, it is now time to rise now and be a nation again. Time is running out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    150. Betty Boop says:

      Whether or not that leaflet is a fake, it seems medicines are already being held back (personal experience).

      I wouldn’t believe any assurances from Westminster about anything at all and the shambles of the past couple of years should be enough to make any sane person swim for the nearest life raft. It is time to jump the sinking ship. No more excuses.

    151. Gfaetheblock says:

      Is this site now pushing fake Facebook stories as fact?

      Depressing

    152. Gary says:

      As someone who takes ‘Naproxen’ for pain, I know there have ALREADY been supply problems. I was told this was a manufacturer problem. A limited amount were released later, but only after ALL my local pharmacies had run dry for over a week!

      I never found out WHY this happened, the pharmacies simply didn’t know why, or for how long the problem will last.

      My own guess is that it is one of the drugs being stockpiled by the government…



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