Lying right to your face
Dismayingly often, the thing that irritates us the most about the Unionist press lying to its readers isn’t the fact that they’re doing it, but the fact that they do it so insultingly badly. As an illustrative case in point, here’s the Sunday Times’ reliably dull-witted Scottish columnist Gillian Bowditch today:
Now, let’s be generous and ignore the honkingly stupid first paragraph, which paints a couple of exceptional bad years as a permanent status, and focus on the second one.
Because the truth of the matter is firstly that the financial position hasn’t significantly worsened at all – Scotland’s notional deficit for 2015-16 is almost exactly the same as the one in the previous year.
(The 2014-15 figures, published in March, were headlined at £14.9bn – though this was subsequently adjusted slightly downwards – compared to this year’s £14.8bn, which could obviously also be revised in turn.)
Bowditch then tells us that this is proof that oil is the “key plank” of the economy, when even a small child or Kezia Dugdale would notice that if an almost £2bn drop in oil revenue in fact hasn’t impacted on the deficit AT ALL, then logic suggests that the exact opposite is true.
The fact that Scotland has been able to absorb a multi-billion-pound drop in oil income with no damage to its bottom line whatsoever disproves Bowditch’s conclusion utterly, yet in the very same paragraph she blithely insists that black is white.
It’s exactly as if she’s just handed the readers two apples, then two more apples, and triumphantly proclaimed “Look! Now you’ve got three apples, which proves you can’t be trusted with apples!”, even as you and she are both staring straight at the four apples that are still in your hands.
We don’t like lying of any sort. But this type of spectacularly moronic, self-evidently obvious brand of lying, based on the assumption that the reader is a drooling cretin without the remotest shred of comprehension, is a lot more common in the Scottish media than any rational human would be comfortable with.
Or maybe she’s the drooling cretin.
They’re afraid, very afraid, their world view is crumbling and they don’t like it; they’re walking off a short, but key, plank.
I can’t think why anybody would rush to read an article on Scotland’s health by someone named ‘Gillian Bowditch’.
The first thing I look for is proven expertise, therefore, I’d expect to see “By Gillian Bowditch, economist, Nobel Prize winner, Specialist in Celtic economies. See below for prolific publications on Scotland’s economic health.”
The reason for the worsening financial position is that unionists are running scared of indyref2. Their scare stories from indyref1 have all come to fruition but they run against their scare narrative. They really don’t have anything else in their political toolkit so are thus prepared to continue to lie and obfuscate matters to the point of idiocy.
Thus it always was and thus it will continue to get worse…
Yet again, Bowditch gives planks a bad name.
Questions for yoons:
link to moflomojo.blogspot.com
Drinking with yoons:
link to moflomojo.blogspot.com
The UK’s economic plan for the past thirty odd years has largely been to sell public assets to bolster it’s financial position. Not much of a plan and one that is reaching the end of the line. Which is why the Westminster lot like to try to divert attention onto a bogus Scottish problem. It really is tedious that they never have anything positive or constructive or truthful to say. Good luck with their three dysfunctional parties in sorting out their mess. Fortunately Scotland has a couple of real parties where ‘spin’ isn’t in their Vision & Values Statement.
They carefully omit the comparison with last year in expectation folk won’t remember: they are probably right for a lot of readers will not.
But to me, it raises another question. If there is a loss of £2bn in revenue; and that makes no difference; how can we begin to entertain these figures.
It may be that in the same period on shore business has been doing well enough to make up the difference. But that seems a little unlikely to me. It is as least a hell of a coincidence. I am more inclined to think theses figures are fantasy from beginning to end
Many are calling for more transparency and more robust rebuttal of GERS from SG. But to be honest that strategy gives them more credence than they are worth.
It would be better to concentrate on two things:
First: to educate the population about the reality of economics comparing real outcomes under the keynesian model and the neoliberal one, for a start. This will be slightly easier than in the past because even MSM is starting to report dissent within the economics profession. Also people’s own experience of the disconnect between how they are told the “economy” is doing and how they are living is a powerful resource.
Second: having done that explain the fact that an independent Scotland would not be following the neoliberal line on economics at all because it is a complete failure in every respect that counts. To do that they must commit to an independent currency at the outset. Then lay out just what changes to the current policies would be made over the course of a first term govt, in that independent currency context
The “like a household budget” must be exploded. But meantime, in absence of independence, the reality that it is actually true for Scotland, and the implications of that, must be elaborated.
GERS is dangerous propaganda in the absence of the alternative positive analysis which is available to us. We engage on their chosen turf at our peril
I don’t subscribe to the Sunday Times –
there’s a surprise, I hear you cry –
which means that I can provide you with a Gillian Bowditch article headline which tells you all you need to know about Gillan Bowditch.
link to archive.is
I was making my way through the Sunday Herald (which is, politics to one side from time to time, by far the best Sunday newspaper in Scotland) marvelling at how Tom Gordon had announced Nicola’s independence initiative without completely underwhwelming it when up popped ASSS – again!
“A Senior SNP Source” waltzes into the Sunday Herald every week, courtesy Tom Gordon and this week it’s comment on a SNP Lanarkshire councillor. He apparently is protestant. He has been to Orange dos in his area. He is in fact an Orange Nat. I would have thought this was awfully good news for the independence movement. Laying that aside the fact however that he had also been to kafflic dos among his electorate pops up at the end of the piece and kinda sinks the intended purpose of it.
The simple fact is, however, that if this cursed, undemocratic and unwanted union of Scotland with England were any good, there would be no need for unionists to lie. Ever.
The fact unionists lie with every single argument they make, should tell us everything we need to know.
Scotland’s economy is NOT dependent upon oil (since the revenue currently goes to London instead of Scotland), indeed, it is, as the figures now show, remarkably flexible and resilient. Meanwhile, as the good ship Britannia racks up debts of 1.5 trillion, whilst singing ‘rule Britannia’ for the umpteenth time, the unionists look the other way, and gleefully tel us it is Scotland which is sh*te.
Great Gillian and her boss Rupert!
You just lost a whole raft of additional readers by trying to endorse the most idiotic conclusions as unequivocal fact.
Your sinking ship doesn’t have to many people left on it, mainly just rats. Perhaps Davy Jones has a calculator you can borrow when you hit the bottom.
Not to worry old Rupert still have Sky TV to indoctrinate the masses. He just has to fit in a few dodgy SNP Bad figures at the half time adverts to keep his rich tax avoiding non-doms in their ever increasing filthy lucre.
Thanks to all for signing this petition against Biased Reporting at the BBC. Now heading toward 91,000 signatures.
link to you.38degrees.org.uk
There’s no North Sea oil left now either, only £1.5 trillion to zero, pending the mood swings of tory BBC led UKOK propaganda in Scotland.
SNP bad, Black hole of NO, Sturgeon accused, England saves you, vote tory, red and blue. In a toryboy Scotland universe there’s 56 Scottish tory MP’s, tory Scots.gov Holyrood, FM Ruthie Babes Davidson, BBC in Scotland is actually watchable, everyone’s running around with a newspaper in their shopping and everything is groovy.
How we win Indyref 2:
link to moflomojo.blogspot.com
In other words, our oil wealth really IS just the cherry on Scotland’s basket of cakes.
@ Effijy
I’ll say this for you you don’t give up easily.
I would have thought that you had milked this particular site dry.
Why don’t you try Bella or somewhere like that.
This woman joins the long list of mercenary Dead Tree Scrolls hacks who appear to take malicious pleasure out of lying to the world about their native country and calling me a subsidy junkie who would starve to death if it weren’t for the patronage of England.
You are a liar and a coward, Ms Bowditch. (I know that you Dead Sea Scrollers read WoS avidly. Sue me; I wish you luck with that. I’m a UK pensioner.)
It is cowardly to hide behind the might of the Brit Establishment and churn out malicious propaganda like this, with impunity.
Of course you all write guff like this to engender cybernat outrage.
We’re not enraged, Ms Bowditch. We are laughing at you.
You are a laughing stock; you aren’t even part of the problem any more. I’m sure the Mums of Morningside believe this dog whistle mince.
I don’t suppose that you sell many copies where it matters, where real Scots citizens live, work, and make their way in the world.
GERS is a fiction concocted from flawed and incomplete data, ergo the Free Press lied through its collective teeth this week, to a man and woman slagging off this rich proud nation of ours. Doubtless it will put tourists off visiting this Third World backwater of ours. Good job. Keep it up. Scotland is shite, so says our crack reporter, Gillian Bowditch.
Scotland does not have a Black Hole, unless we include the News Rooms of the Unionist titles. The English Parliament ran up a UK debt, and having maxed out the Scottish credit card, has the temerity, courtesy of paid up floosies like this woman, to try to blame it all on us?
It is incredible that we are powerless to prevent evil people like this bad mouthing our country.
If they don’t like it, they can always feck off to Merrie England, and give us all peace. Their Black Hole is ten times as big as ours.
What subservient little toadies they are.
She’s as thick as two short planks.
Dear Gillian,
It isn’t about the money, it’s never been about the money, it’ll never be about the money.
It’s about self determination, it’s always been about self determination, it’ll always be about self determination.
Why bother reading this crap or responding to it. The majority of people realise the media are talking through there arse.
You would be better comparing them to cartoon characters and try to ridicule them. Analysing and dissecting the articles is what they want.
You would better just sayin they have printed pish as we know that statements true. They are so desperate for some sort of negative comment I feel its best to ignore. I think we have to put more emphasis on the SG to be more streetwise when dealing with the media as that is the main problem as they dont fight fire with fire and let the media away with journalistic murder.
No mention of the illegal wars, banking fraud, tax evasion or UK debt. Or Non Dom tax evading Media crooks who bribe public officials and phone hack illegally. Or illegal Brexit. The Tories want to tax evade.
Scotland having Westminster policies imposed on it. Trident costing nearly £1Billion.Tax evading £3Billion? A tax on ‘loss leading drink would save nearly £1Billion. The Oil sector taxed at 60/80% when the price had fallen 75% by Osbourne, losing thousands of jobs. £4Billion. Scotland paying nearly £4Billion in debt repayments on money not borrowed or spent in Scotland. Total £13Billion. The ‘Deficit’. Not allowing Scotland the powers to sort it.
Tommy Sheridan won his case against Murdoch.
“She’s as thick as two short planks.”
An insult to planks, surely.
The truth about the UK-Govt produced GERS:
link to imgur.com
The UK Govt being open and honest? Really? Remember The Vow?
Here’s a challenge to you, Ms Bowditch. Get the UK Treasury to release every single Pink Paper in order that they can back up this UK Govt proaganda that is GERS. Let’s see the UK Treasury papers, Ms Bowditch – ALL of them. Open the books for EVERYONE to see and not just the bits the UK Treasury allows us to see.
Good luck. You’ll need it. The UK Treasury are not known for their transparency and that alone should tell you everything you need to know about these so-called GERS. They are utter bunk.
Daft question . I have an S before my tax code so the figures can be collated.
If the Scottish Office are holding the people of Scotland accountable for spending this money , I’d like a reciprocal arrangement.
Can I ask for a rebate on my contribution to the say , the defence budget because it certainly looks like there’s too much money going on that and I’ll allocate my ( very) small tax contribution to renewables or the welfare system .
Can I and if not why not?
Not a very fair arrangement is it? Get the blame for the numbers but not let me address it
Ps. Can we also see ( in this transparent arrangement of yours) what ‘ Mr Angry from Manchester’ contributes to the defence budget , you know in this pooling and sharing way?
If not, why not? Maybe be a journalist could ask ?
” based on the assumption that the reader is a drooling cretin without the remotest shred of comprehension”
She knows her audience. And it’s depressingly large.
‘The Times’ seems to be becoming a major player in Scotland. according to a column in its Saturday edition, sales in Scotland have increased on 19 consecutive months, are up 27.4% and at 24094 they say they are 3790 copies ahead of the Scotsman. Know your enemy.
It would be nice if for once these journalists would actually do a bit of critical research rather than believing these HM Government figures. Would be nice if they would query the expenditure figures given and how they were arrived at. I suspect it is like being given a figure at the till but nothing to back it up, then later finding you have paid for your neighbours shopping as well.
Lets us see the actual figures and not estimates.
Neil Cook says:
28 August, 2016 at 12:28 pm
Why bother reading this crap or responding to it.
Philosophically there’s loads of reasons. But Bowditch and her merry band of UK hackdom in Scotland have a tory market to sell to, that 23% tory vote that gives the world clowns like Fluffie Mudell and Ruth Davidson. So what if toryboy economics run up giant public debt, they are loaded, they own the BBC and STV and they are not going to have their wealth and privilege put at risk, by likes of you or me.
She’s working class don’t you know, Ruthie Babes, a working class conservative. I say:D
philip maughan
If you travel on Virgin East Coast trains you can get a get a copy of the Times free. I was travelling down to London when offered a copy and said No I didn’t like their politics, the young man said it could have been worse and be offered a Scotsman.
O/T sorry
Watch @NicolaSturgeon with UN special envoy Staffan de Mistura live at #BBIF at http://broadcastingscotland.net . 12.50 pm
link to broadcastingscotland.net
Same old same old from the yoons only this time the screaching has not gone as they had hoped and instead they have no answer to the fact if gers is true then this is the UK that has done this.
Trying to say this is how an indy Scotland will look like is a smoke screen to the reality this is how Scotland looks inside the UK union.
So keep screaching about gers yoons when indyref2 comes we will use it to bash the crap out you.
[…] Wings Over Scotland Lying right to your face Dismayingly often, the thing that irritates us the most about the Unionist press lying […]
This constant appeal to Unionists to get behind the idea that in some way they should base their entire argument on sets of numbers (which change by the minute) cooked up by people of mostly no importance whatsoever is more pertinant than any Nation choosing to adopt a different way of running their own country than another country running it very badly is a moronic notion anyway
The next Referendum shouldn’t be fought on the UKs sets of failed numbers which have never in the history of my long life ever been right, and it probably wont
I suspect it’s more likely that the Ruth Davidson Unionist and Bigot party in Scotland will fight this one on good old fashioned Sectarianism (but with pretendy references to numbers) as heavily hinted at the last Holyrood elections and will be joined at the hip by Kezia Dugdale (who hasn’t won anything in a while) while a goodly part of her own Scottish Labour party will desert the cause and abstain or come out for Independence (If Kezia’s still the branch manager that is, big “IF” and big ? on that
My hope is that this time all of our (nasty new Scot furriners) wont be intimidated into voting no or abstaining by the threat of being thrown out of the country like they were last time with the Bitter Together leafleting campaign threatening them with all sorts of deportations
That one’s kinda shot it’s bolt with Brexit and the exposing of the dislike of all things “Not English” down south
I fear our next Referendum is to be fought in the gutter at the lowest level by the Unionists because it’s all they have left, every one of their arguments have been shown up as nonsense AND derogatory to Scotland as a country as good as any other but certainly a country that should be better than it is and that’s not now or ever going to be achieved under the rule of that other country who patently obviously don’t have the competence or the interests of fairness of Scotland on their list of to do’s
They’ve taken from us, used it up and now want to keep taking till there’s nothing left and for those of us old enough to remember
They’ve done it all before and without a doubt it’s coming again
In an Independent Scotland I’ll happily pay more tax so’s my children can get a bus pass if they need it when they’re my age
Or help with heating when they’re my age
So’s they don’t need private insurance for the doctor when they’re my age
So’s they can get help if they’re dying when they’re my age
It should never be allowed to be presumed by Unionists that all of their children will be successful geniouses and never need help in their lives
Old people can get a bit selfish and dolly dimple at times but sometimes need reminding that their own parents didn’t have these advantages that we have now but the Tories will and are removing these advantages little by little until we’re back to the days of means tested welfare which will come if we stay in this wretched Union
Time to revisit “What makes Mainstream Media Mainstream” by Noam Chomsky?
“They say, quite correctly, “nobody ever tells me what to write. I write anything I like. All this business about pressures and constraints is nonsense because I’m never under any pressure.”
Which is completely true, but the point is that they wouldn’t be there unless they had already demonstrated that nobody has to tell them what to write because they are going say the right thing. If they had started off at the Metro desk, or something, and had pursued the wrong kind of stories, they never would have made it to the positions where they can now say anything they like.”
link to archive.is
Awful example of how the BBC Scotland crew do it, from 2014.
link to bbc.co.uk
Oil worthless and gone, SNP bad, independence badder. BBC leaves little facts like almost all nation states, other than oil poor Norway, run budget deficits, even teamGB. But tory BBC says Scotland simply cannot have a deficit you see, you need England’s broad shouldered generosity because they love you and
“Even with oil, they claim, Scotland ran a budget deficit in 20 of the past 21 years and therefore could not afford to set up its own Norwegian-style oil fund, without raising taxes or cutting public spending.
Pro-union politicians allege that leaked briefing papers reveal that the SNP know this to be the case.”
That’s the way to do it, UKOK style.
jimnarlene says:
28 August, 2016 at 11:36 am
‘They’re afraid, very afraid, their world view is crumbling and they don’t like it; they’re walking off a short, but key, plank.’
They might be afraid but never forget many, if not most, of the readers of the red top press are unable to critically analyse headlines, never mind the full content of articles. They will be swallowing the Unionist lies hook, line and sinker.
I must admit I don’t know of any universal means of countering the holding of such false beliefs and can only fall back on accepting that constant public pressure might possibly encourage a more balanced view on the BBC if regular and peaceful monthly demonstrations were initiated. These might initially be reported as ‘terrorising’ BBC staff but over time with failure to find police prosecutions some members of the public might begin to accept arguments of bias in the BBC and the press whose reporting the BBC uncritically parrots.
As much as the media continually lie to us on a daily basis (and on a fairly grand scale at that), there is one thing that we should take heart from.
This relentless shouting down of Scotland and it’s nationalists on a daily basis tells us one thing; we are terrifying the s*** out of them!
If we were some band of demented loony-tunes proclaiming that Elvis, Shergar and Lord Lucan were all living in a wee bothie somewhere up in the back of beyond in Glencoe, then the media would have chuckled over it for a couple of days, and then got back to wondering who to place a bet on when it comes to the BBC’s ‘Sports Personality of the Year’.
But they don’t!
Instead, on a daily basis, we get screaming, wailing, shouting, demented shouting, fury, angst, bitterness, name-calling, howling, threats …you name it, we not only get called it, but also the way it is delivered at us! It’s relentless!!
Simply …they are in perpetual fear of us. We scare the bejesus out of them knowing that just one day …one day …we might bring an end to the British State and the last remnants of what was the glorious British Empire.
So don’t lose faith. Patience is the key here. Right now, we just watch and wait and see what Theresa May does when it comes to her vow of ‘Brexit means Brexit’.
But apart from that, we must be doing something right. So …kudos Rev …another great article!
Neil Cook at 12:28 p.m.
I couldn’t disagree with you more. Why do you think that people are starting to realise that the mainstream media tell lies? It is because people like the Rev are constantly debunking their lies. If we resort to your tactics of just saying its “pish” then we will be no better than them. Why should people believe us just because we say it’s “pish”?
No, the way to deal with their lies is to keep bringing them down using forensic analytical skills and to keep exposing them for the shallow, content free morons that they are. That is what is winning the argument for us. That is why the SNP are dominant in Scottish politics. That is what will eventually take us to the ultimate victory of independence. It may be a bit tedious responding to their nonsense, but Stuart Campbell is the best there is at this vital work – long may he continue.
@ Born Optimist,
Agreed.
Propaganda:
“there is this new art in the method of democracy, “manufacture of consent.” By manufacturing consent, you can overcome the fact that formally a lot of people have the right to vote.
We can make it irrelevant because we can manufacture consent and make sure that their choices and attitudes will be structured in such a way that they will always do what we tell them, even if they have a formal way to participate.”
link to archive.is
Several variables involved that have contributed to Scotland’s 3.7% increase in onshore revenue. Interestingly our population has never been greater (just short of 5.5 million). Coincidence?
Perhaps having control of our immigration policies would help grow our economy further.
The problem is the daily doom and gloom message thrown at the soft NO vote public does have an impact and until sites like WOS can be published in paper form and distributed like confetti we are really up against it.
I loathe the MSM especially in Scotland.
It is difficult. Talk back and dudes like BBC champ Andrew Neil call you the “scum of Scotland.” The Ligger is Bowditch with hair dye, this week autumn mist with auburn highlights, but here he is boosterising the all new F35 fighter jet, for the two UKOK aircraft carriers Crash Gordon decided to spend $10 bn+ on, in his constituency, which he then bottled out of standing in, as you do.
Andrew Neil Retweeted
UK Defence Journal ?@UKDefJournal Aug 27
HMS Queen Elizabeth to get F-35 jets in 2018 –
What this one BBC Ligger’s leaving out is that the F35 is costing at least $1.5 trillion. Why are the toryboy’s pumping so much money into war and running up so much debt, dudes like the Ligger wont say, especially to the scum of Scotland.
O/T glad you’re back Nana with the links. Here’s another video with Yanis Varoufakis and Noam Chomsky discussing BREXIT and other things.
It would scare you off Europe if Varoufakis wasn’t committed to staying in the EU but making it more democratic. 1hr 43 mins:
link to youtube.com
The arrogance of the mainstream media is beyond words…
That lie is so transparently a blatant lie of humongous proportions that I am surprised it was ever printed – oh so easily shot full of holes and sunk. Is that journo really so thick to believe we would fall for it? Or is it desperation?
It can only be desperation…
Just when you thought the britnat media couldn’t come up with more blatant lies…
This disgusting union with England is built on bullshit.
Germans, Swedes, French observers look on, aghast at:
(1) the notion that Scotland should be anything BUT independent
(2) the idea that, outside the seventeenth century, there is still a place in Europe where hacks accept money from other countries to run down their own nation.
If required, this presstitute would even say:
“Yes! We are too wee, too poor, too stupid! And I am proud to be an example! For I am one of you and I am proud to be parochial, self-hating and stupid!”
@Jack Collatin says: 28 August, 2016 at 12:20 pm:
” … You are a laughing stock; you aren’t even part of the problem any more. I’m sure the Mums of Morningside believe this dog whistle mince.”
Och! Jack, Ms Bedwetter, or whatever her name is, is probably is already a resident of one of the, “Little England”, constituencies like, “Moarningsaid”, or, “Kailvainsaid”.
Futhermore, Jack, it isn’t nice to disparage those who suffer “Learning difficulties”, (more correctly described as Mentally Handicapped when you are not trying to avoid using politically incorrect words), but let’s face it todays, “Politically Incorrect”, terms were yesterdays, “Politically Correct”, terms until they too become politically incorrect, (and they will).
As yon gyte English Bard gadgie aince said, (and we are never allowed to ever forget it), “a rose by any other name would smells so sweet.”
@Capella
Thanks for that link, lots more on off topic including some gers stuff and from my last comment on previous thread
Apologies if this has already been linked to but if you type Niall Aslen Gers into google there are a number of pdf documents
Not sure what has already been posted re gers while I’ve been away.
I’m sure I saw something the other day that broke down what the GERS equivalent was for Scotland, N.I., Wales and England. Funnily enough England was shown to have a deficit of around £65 BILLION.
Call me cynical if you like (you’re cynical 🙂 ) but I do not recall hearing anyone shouting England is broke or can’t go it alone because they have a £65 BILLION Black Hole! 🙂
Of course the other major problem “they” have is that GERS includes, I believe, all the *ahem* donations Scotland makes to to Porky’s wee vanity projects like Crossrail, London’s super sewr, HS2 and of course everyone’s favourite White elephant!
As WE all know by now our *cough* donations to these vanity projects would cease upon becoming independent. This would lead to, I believe, an immediate saving of around £11 BILLION.
My response therefore to brain deid earseholes like Bowditch is … FECK OFF ya dunderheid. WHEN we become independent WE will have a £4 BILLION Black Hole, in YOUR speak, whilst YOU will have in excess of £70 BILLION. Read the figures and weep ya Muppet! 🙂
Why are they pumping so much into war? It’s the perfect product. Costs trillions, constantly needs upgrades, routinely destroyed in endless wars.
To soften us up for an attack on Russia, see The Daily Telegraph front page:
link to archive.is
“RAF man guarding Europe’s skies from Putin. Wing Commander Gordon Melville is the commanding officer of 140 Expeditionary Air Wing, stationed at Amari Air Base, Estonia, as part of a strengthened NATO presence intended to deter any aggression form neighbouring Russia.”
Weel done Capella for mentioning and linking to Chomsky’s fine essay. I linked to it a few weeks ago in a previous thread.
It ought to be compulsory reading. And it’s an easy read.
I watch a lot of Chomsky videos these days. They give me hope. He said something in one i watched the other day “The people with the power, know the truth.”
Worth remembering that as we sift through the lies. They don’t come about by accident.
Whenever I read these economic discussions which discredit Scotland’s economic ability to be Independent I ask..”How, after 300 years of union with England, is Scotland unable to run its own affairs?” I have never had a positive answer.
@Neil Cook says: 28 August, 2016 at 12:28 pm:
” … I think we have to put more emphasis on the SG to be more streetwise when dealing with the media as that is the main problem as they don’t fight fire with fire and let the media away with journalistic murder”.
I have to disagree with you on that point, Neil.
In the first place the SNP strategy of simply ignoring the worst excesses of, “The Dead Tree Scrolls”, reportage seems to be working quite well. Are not the newpaper circulation figures plummeting like a North Korean ballistic missile uselessly dropping into the China Seas?
Secondly to lower yourself to their low, low, standards of dreadfully obvious vindictiveness would probably harden, rather than soften, marginal Unionist supporters resolve.
You do not gain anything by lowering your own standards. For then the marginal support will see you as equally unsupportable.
I long ago lost count of the number of the Scottish electorate who, upon being confronted on their doorstep by an ardent independence campaigner, said something along the lines of, “Ach! aa yon politicians are the same. Thir aa liars, cheats an oot fir whit thae kin mak oot o it”.
Best to show them, we are NOT all the same and NOT falling down to their low, low level. The tactic is best described as, “If it’s not broken then don’t try to fix it”. Those plummeting circulation figures show that it is not yet broken so why attempt to fix it and risk doing the opposite?
Capella –
Excellent quote of Chomsky’s.
I remember telling Herald’s Leask that he was fast and loose with truth. He answered, “I don’t feel any constraints on my freedom. I can write anything I want”.
I answered, “That’s because to employ you your boss first made sure you’d say what they like said.”
Here’s a man that only says what the British state wants said: link to wp.me
Re;DrJim@12.51
Some really great comments on here today btw, hard to drag myself away!
Great post DrJim. By ‘means’ tested social security, (once was called), that would be in both senses of the word, and back to the days where people had their furniture either removed, or had any of that lovely generous state support reduced according to what they had, which was nigh on nothing.
When we live in times where people are reduced to hardly even having the basics to sustain life, to just exist, in a rich country such as UKOK, in 2016, people really need to be asking some serious questions about their masters.
Any so called government working for themselves, ie the unionists in WM, and not looking after all of the people they are paid so handsomely to represent but instead attack those people, particularly economically, are criminals in my book and should be locked up.
@Molly says: 28 August, 2016 at 12:38 pm:
” … Maybe be a journalist could ask?”
Don’t be silly, Molly, just where do you anticipate being able to find an already unbiased journalist anywhere in Scotland? – (or indeed in the United Kingdom – or even in Britain?)
If Scotland does not suffer from the catastrophic drop in oil revenues, as expected; it begs the question why not? Seems to me that, at present, Scotland receives absolutely no benefit from “British” oil revenues at all. Now I wonder why that is?
This could be worth a comparison:
The effect of the oil price drop on Norwegian economy.
The effect of the oil price drop on Scottish economy.
Removing the effects of the former’s decades’ worth of huge oil funds, of course.
They’re laying it on with a trowel recently right enough. No craft or subtlety, just churn it out and plenty of it.
You’d think they’d run out of places to hide on their complete and utter failure to deliver over the past two years or something. HMG on pledges and assurances made and the media on holding HMG to account for those pledges and assurances. Mind you it can’t be easy for the poor dears seein’ as how they helped sell the bill of goods quite willingly.
Tick tock.
Robert Louis said at 12:02 pm:-
“……………Scotland’s economy is NOT dependent upon oil (since the revenue currently goes to London instead of Scotland),
indeed, it is, as the figures now show, remarkably flexible and resilient. Meanwhile, as the good ship Britannia racks up debts of 1.5 trillion…………”
Worth remembering when we get doom thrown at Scotland by Dugdale’s ‘Scottish Labour’ and their pals the Blue Tories up here and doon there.
That was a mercifully quick evisceration of a very silly and dishonest hack, Rev. Someone had to do it, and who if not you?
There can’t be many sales of the Sunday Times in Scotland anyway, once you disregard the swollen numbers of give-aways/special offers and the like.
And once you exclude the dim-witted Scotch Bourgeoisie who only get the ST to lend a certain je ne sais quoi to their coffee tables, it must be in pretty low numbers.
Offset a bit by owners of incontinent cats, obviously.
These oil revenues that have gone from £1.8 billion to £60 million in a year, I take it that is the Unionists idea of what Scotland’s notional share of the oil revenues would be as a member of the UK?
The Unionists always assume that Scotland’s spending would mirror Westminster’s – And always conveniently ignore what Westminster’s dreamed-up Scottish deficit would be if an independent Scotland was collecting 100% of the oil revenues in Scottish waters.
Can someone much better than I am with sums. Work out how much the wm exchequer lost to the drop in oil price.
It kinda goes something like this:
link to imgur.com
‘Oust her as leader of Scottish Labour’ … Dugdale at war with Corbynistas
See these senior sources, what are they like? 🙂
link to archive.is
Yoon pimps of British nationalist ideology do what they do, pimp British nationalism. Their ‘journalism’ is aimed solely at reproducing and shoring up the cultural artifacts and alibis contained within British nationalist ideology. This is necessary so as to maintain the prevailing social structure and to preserve the habitus of which they are a product.
Yoon pimps of British nationalist ideology are thick as pig shit but they have a formula and the social privilege of perceived authority. Well they used to anyway. 🙂
Quite vile frankly.
link to scielo.cl
@Gerry Hassan
Have you seen the light?
Gillian is touting the Times Unionist line and no doubt believes it herself. However, the elephant in the woodpack is that if Scotland is such an unbelievably shit economy that it requires absolutely massive subsidies to survive then why should voters in England continue with this unfair and uneven distribution? If they choose, as many frequently rant on English newspaper comments sections, to cut this alleged subsidy then why not independence? There would be nothing to lose.
The Unionist argument seems to be entirely that the benefit of the Union is a one way street with Scotland as useless and crippled beggar living off state handouts. We have seen the Tory position on the disabled, dispossessed and welfare payments. The moment they thought it safe to do so I amm quite convinced that they would refer Scotland to Atos and have us consigned to sleeping on a street corner.
In short Gillian, if your only argument is that we are subsidy junkies and must get our fix then you need to think again. That is no long term solution.
By their own argument the Unionists must cede that the best long term strategy for Scotland is independence because any subsidy they claim exists now is very unlikely to exist post Brexit.
Rancid the Graun takes another luny tunes UKOK route today, not worth archive.is time though. Lovely scenery, SNP bad, UKOK, couple of essays a week, a miserable old fart banks his Graun cheque.
“To civic Scotland and Holyrood, football supporters are regarded as occupying a position somewhere just above drug-pushers and just below crime lords:
you can do business with organised crime but you can’t do business with football supporters. They are unpredictable and are driven by strange currents and deep emotions that a politician will never understand. Even after decades of being overcharged and made to watch the game in gulags these football fans remain true to their club.
That’s why small armies of policemen are deployed to kettle them and frogmarch them to and from matches. ”
Be True to your club, its the UKOK way:D
@ MJT – thanks – I knew someone had linked to the Chomsky essay but couldn’t remember who. I watch a lot of Chomsky videos too – and Yanis Varoufakis. Nana has linked to Varoufakis on Off Topic. Who needs BBC!
@ GB – there’s an excellent video of Chomsky being interviewed by a young Andrew Marr who is utterly convinced that he is free to say anything he likes and still be broadcast. Bless.
Worth reposting for those who haven’t seen it.
link to youtube.com
Yoon pimps of British nationalist ideology do what they do, pimp British nationalism.
Decades of wealth transferring UKOK style, to the middle and upper classes of teamGB doesn’t come without a cost, in Mackenna, Carrell, Bowditch style tory tub thumper hacks, pounding out anti Scottish democracy propaganda but there’s always the toxic leaks of actual info.
SO stuff like, why did New Labour, Bomber Blair, Crash Gordo never build any social housing for the UK?
link to uk.businessinsider.com
“According to the National Housing Federation, private landlords are now taking in £9.3 billion ($12.1 billion) a year from people using specific welfare to pay for a place to live — housing benefit.”
These landlords banking this level of state benefits are more than likely to be your GP, your dentist, your councillor, take a bow SLab’s Wullie Young frae Aberdeen and so on.
Perfect transfer of massive amounts of money from one UKOK class to another. What is done with so much money? Pension boosts usually. My boss is loaded and spent £7800 on a bicycle on Saturday. We’re a state sector quango.
Whenever the Unionists lament our dependence on oil, I immediately load the McCrone Report in one barrel and John Jappy in the other…
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Times Journo under pressure to resign over racist rant.
Ditch Bowditch Murdoch urged.
The Scottish Press accused of being Unionist Lackeys an insider reveals.
HM Treasury slammed over GERS Fiction
Thousands call for biased hacks to be prosecuted.
Press barons underwrite losses of Anti Scottish titles to save the Union, a source leaks
BBC TV reject says Scotland will have to raise taxes and cut public services.
Sturgeon blasted for allowing George Osborne to run up Scotland’s debt.
Former News Editor Reveals: Scottish Hacks are paid to lie to Joe Public.
See, I can write shite too.
Doubtless WoS will come under pressure to block my posts now.
A ‘key plank’ of the hegemony we daily battle, is to educate then promote liars to positions of influence.
@McDuff says: 28 August, 2016 at 1:23 pm:
“The problem is the daily doom and gloom message thrown at the soft NO vote public does have an impact and until sites like WOS can be published in paper form and distributed like confetti we are really up against it.”
We were always, “Up against it”, in more ways than one. The point, of course, is that in spite of being, “up against it”, we have always been making gains in support in the longer term. Yes we have suffered setbacks but the overall trend has always been gaining support.
Here are a few thoughts on the matter of, “The Dead Tree”, news media and the on-air media outlets.
The newspapers are steeply losing in circulation and must soon become too expensive for even the Unionists to keep going.
Much of their readership buy their rags for specific items. Mainly the Football, horses and dog racing odds, results and other sports or betting articles.
Some of their customers buy for such things as the crossword, the often brain numbing competitions and the horoscope.
Then there are those who buy for the, “Celeb”, scandal news and their scantily dressed photos. Others buy for the kiddies in their wee panties photos and others because they cannot afford TVs or computers. In any case there are those who seem able to only read headlines.
Much of the press output is now either free give way copies or free local advertising rags that depend on advertisers for their existence.
As for the TV output – they have always been in a war with each other for top ratings. This to attract advertisers – not actually viewers. Viewers, except for the BBC, do not pay for programmes. To which end they each dumb down their output and really good output is getting to be as rare as hens teeth. What news there is biased to the extent that no intelligent person now believes a word any TV pundit expounds on air but the dumber ones would watch it by choice anyway.
Even programmes output by the likes of Radio Scotland are slowly moving to a 24/7/365 pop-music output and are, except for the adverts, identical. This is because a constant pop-music output id ultra-cheap to produce.
It is getting that a listener cannot tell what station they are listening to until the disk jockey opens her/his mouth. Mind you they do declare themselves as POP, Rock, Country, et al. Though even those billing themselves as, “talk”, “sport”, or “news”, stations churn out un-musical pop rubbish most of the time.
And don’t tell me the BBC don’t advertise – they never cease advertising both themselves directly and their political masters at Westminster indirectly. However, in spite of all that the independence for Scotland is gaining upon them all the time and the increase in sheer hysteria in their output indicates they, and their masters, are terrified to insanity of Scotland’s independence.
BTW: Publishing WOS and such websites on paper is a useless exercise – there are only two basic reasons for people coming to such websites. The first reason is because the reader already wants to support independence and have their own say on the subject. The second is because they want to disrupt the independence movement and thus to niggle independence supporters. These last are perhaps one of the best things as it always has the opposite effect than these people intend it to have and it usually results in very intelligent retorts from the faithful supporters of independence.
“you can do business with organised crime but you can’t do business with football supporters. They are unpredictable and are driven by strange currents and deep emotions that a politician will never understand. Even after decades of being overcharged and made to watch the game in gulags these football fans remain true to their club.
That’s why small armies of policemen are deployed to kettle them and frogmarch them to and from matches. ”
My, The Grauniad is even further behind the times and further out of touch than I thought, heedtracker. That was Scottish football in the 80s, before decades of SFA incompetence and Sky reduced it to the level of about the third tier of English football.
At least SG politicians seem to understand what supporters want. Despite ritual opposition from BLiS______d, The Offensive Behaviour Act seems pretty popular with Scottish fans.
Serious question to Wingers living abroad: does the UK have the most spineless, corrupt, venal and unprincipled journalists in Europe?
Or are there any other serious contenders on the continent?
Bias and agenda aside, the quality of journalism on the ‘mainstream side’ is utterly abysmal. Regurgitation with no checking facts at source. No analysis or added value.
Turning to that bias and agenda. Using such poor quality propaganda is astonishing. Is this the best they can come up with?
Who is it targeting? You would have to be very dense not to see through it all.
So, net effect? It can’t be doing the Unionist cause much good!
Tinto Chiel
Usual The Graun Scotland’s a terrible place, that doesnt exist but it is terribly terrible.
What’s likely is that Kevin McSpanner there’s seen the SLabour guys outside Scottish stadiums handing out their Scrap the Act, Vote SLab Again stuff, and then he’s fired it all down to Graun towers, who love this kind of smear, especially on their “civic” Scots. Note they never say “civic” Scots, its always “civic” Scotland. Another day’s out put of Britnat stuff farts along.
Must be a bit draining having to actual look at UKOK propagandists in the flesh, for our elected reps but that’s what they get the mega bucks for. Whatever happened about that Daisley twit anyway, heard that no one had actually said anything at all to any STV exec, shock. Christ, imagine being door stopped by vote NO or else Glen Campbell:D
@ heedtracker – re Prisoner of Conscience, Stephen Daisley – see Craig Murray’s 2015 article “The Disgraceful Far Right ‘Journalist’ Stephen Daisley” since CM hasn’t published anything new for weeks. Perhaps he really has gone doune the rabbit hole.
link to craigmurray.org.uk
Marie Rimmer MP had her case sent to retrial because the incident happened in Shettleston but the Court would only recognize Shettleston Glasgow.
At her next appearance the case was adjourned to August 29th 2016.
She is now appearing tomorrow in Glasgow Sherriff Court wo191 under the name Mairi ELIZABETH RIMMER – SCS/2015-111901-GE14018101-Court 16.
As there are no mentions of Mairi in regards to MP Rimmer CBE ypu would assume her name was Marie.
Is this yet another dodge to screw up this case if so the word blatant disnae quite cover it.
Unionists taking care of their own? Beggars belief!
‘The people of England deceive themselves when they fancy they are free;they are so,in fact,only during the election of Members of Parliament ;for, as soon as a new one is elected, they are again in chains , and are nothing. ‘ (Rousseau, The Social Contract, 1762)
WM it seems doesn’t really have a good track record in participative democracy- if it’s not battling its electorate along class lines, it’s battling them along geographic boundaries to continue to serve an elite minority.
Distortion of truths within the print media keeps us all in chains particularly when it’s re- inforcing the damaging elements of inadequate government and causing Democratic Fatigue Syndrome. By ignoring organised civil society WM has effectively ended traditional party loyalty and predictable voting behaviour.
Scotland has not stopped thinking or talking about its independence, it will thrive as an autonomous country .Indy ref2 will alter the script and reframe the debate -it is the remedy for such malaise.
Capella says:
28 August, 2016 at 4:49 pm
@ heedtracker – re Prisoner of Conscience, Stephen Daisley – see Craig Murray’s 2015 article “The Disgraceful Far Right ‘Journalist’
Thank you Capella I will read it tonight. But and I am going out on a limb here, but was the whole thing, hours and hours of BBC Scotland SNP bad rage, page after page of Britnat newspaper SNP bad commentary, a hundred million SNP bad attack free press tweets, just from these twa twerps alone, all not actually true?
Andrew NeilVerified account ?@afneil Aug 21
Euan McColm: Failing to back journalists puts free speech in danger
or even this Bowditch grade buffoon’s maybe been fibbing, for teamGB ofcourse. You can say anything yoon you like, if it’s for teamGB.
Iain Martin Retweeted
Iain Martin ?@iainmartin1 Aug 26
Bankrupt fantasists of SNP should no longer be indulged. (Gerald Warner – who must get off fence – for Reaction)
The purpose of GERs
That we are a financial basket case on a par with 3rd world countries – we are too poor
The media have to constantly explain our dire financial state over and over and yet we fail to grasp the situation – we are therefore too stupid
We are ungrateful that Big Brother England has to step in to bail out his little brother – we are too wee.
In summary Scotland is too wee, too poor and too stupid and GERS proves it.
Why can’t you just accept it?
@Jimbo says: 28 August, 2016 at 2:50 pm:
“These oil revenues that have gone from £1.8 billion to £60 million in a year, I take it that is the Unionists idea of what Scotland’s notional share of the oil revenues would be as a member of the UK?”
The trouble with their postulation of that as a theory, Jimbo, is that it is utter pish.
The entire truth being that nothing whatsoever regarding Scotland’s funding is based upon anything other than the Barnett Formula. Not revenues, not expenditure not earnings and not even needs. It is only based upon what level of funding The Westminster Establishment decide to be the level of funding to the three devolved countries.
Furthermore, Scotland is not the country that has the highest level of funding – that honour is reserved for the English Province of Northern Ireland. It is supposedly in proportion of the devolved functions that the Westminster Establishment has decided to grant to its three underling, “regions”, and it grants Northern Ireland the most devolved functions and when they devolve a function they must also devolve, from the relevant Westminster Ministry, the funding to implement the particular devolved function.
In order of per-capita funding Northern Ireland has most devolved functions and Wales the least but the calculations of the per capita funding does not stop there. First of all there is that little matter of, “Barnett Consequentials”, which can, (Supposedly), be either positive or negative. This again depends upon whether the funding for any particular devolved function in England, (and England is funded directly as the United Kingdom), is cut or increased. Who, though, decides whether England’s funding is increased or cut? Oh! That’s the Westminster Establishment again. Which knocks on the head the idea of there being anything whatsoever that is, “EVEL”, There is no such thing as an England Only function while Only England is financed directly as the United Kingdom.
But hang on a further minute – there are certain mainly English, or even mainly specifically London, functions that are directly funded, (rather like England is), by The Westminster Establishment. These are classed, again by the Westminster Establishment, to be of, “National”, importance, and supposedly of benefit to the entire United Kingdom. Like, for example, the Greenwich Observatory, The National Museums, National Ballet, National Orchestras, Opera and Theatres. Not to mention National Monuments and Grace & Favour residences. The Chunnel and its infrastructure, The London Dome, The Olympic Stadium, The London airports, bus and rail terminals and even the new London Sewerage System & the London Cross-Rail system. Plus a lot more too numerous to list here.
All these things are deemed, by the Westminster Establishment, to be of equal, “National”, benefit and thus we all pay for them and they carry no Barnett Consequentials whatsoever.
It is thus total pish that Oil, Gas or any other Scottish based commodity that raises revenue for the Treasury has anything whatsoever to do with how much funding any devolved country gets from the treasury.
Another article torn apart by Stuart.
Unfortunately, there doesn’t appear to be a national platform whete such articles can be dissected in front of the whole country and especially the unionist press.
These people, who write with such blind stupidity and blatantly ignore the facts soldier on again and again without ever having to justify the rubbish and moronic junk they produce. Because that happens they undoubtedly think they’re doing a great service to the people of Scotland – never mind that less and less people even bother to buy the newspapers any more – and they wonder why!
Nice one Stuart. Keep doing the same as it all helps the arguments to be refuted by those who want to take our country back and make our own decisions.
robert peffers
Newspapers and the BBC will still be here in twenty years and during that time they will continue to spew out their Unionist acid and there is no credible media to oppose them apart from the superb WOS.
You are talking as if we have a ten point lead, we don`t. This idea of just slowly jogging along in the hope we will gradually pick up enough support to give a 60 or 70% vote for independence is not going to happen the way things are going.
Since the vote on Sept`14 we have another Tory government, a host of broken promises, the renewal of Trident and Brexit. Given all that, it does not appear to suggest a significant rise in the independence vote, so what will it actually take for the Scottish people to see the light.
My point is that the MSM is a very powerful tool and if independence is to be achieved a way must be found to effectively counter it.
Complacency is our great enemy.
“What’s likely is that Kevin McSpanner there’s seen the SLabour guys outside Scottish stadiums handing out their Scrap the Act, Vote SLab Again stuff, and then he’s fired it all down to Graun towers, who love this kind of smear, especially on their “civic” Scots.”
Don’t worry, heedtracker, when they tried this wheeze a fortnight ago before my SPL match, they got the bum’s rush. They don’t quite understand that most real fans support the legislation.
But then thankfully, BLiS______d don’t understand anything anymore. Did they ever?
Mind you, the wee sowills seemed to be having such a great time dishing out the steaming Carmichael from their wee Union Jack bags and having multiplied organisms all over the place.
Sad but so funny at the same time.
“just a drooling cretin without the remotest shred of comprehension.” That is being polite about it as I just think of her as another anti Scottish bigot!
Bankrupt fantasists of SNP should no longer be indulged.
Who the hell does Iain Martin think he is? Who made him Grand Imperial Poobah? Since when did some journalist decide who does and does not have a voice in a democracy?
What a pompous prick!
It is all just so much hot air anyway as the press is the tail on the internet dog. They control very little these days. All they cam do is flounce like big girl’s blouses.
I don’t disagree with the fact that circulation figures for media are down but peoples interests hasn’t grown. The people who are aware that Westminster are ruining the Country can see the lies.
The problem I that the uneducated wont change, they have been uneducated by consistent shit in the Tv, Strictly, X- Factor, bake off and the rest of the dross.
We have had 2 weeks of butchers flag waving in Rio as though its the most important thing to happen in the last 20 years.
We have a nation who are titalkt brainwashed to a level that they follow political parties because my Da voted that way.
We have the SaG doing their best to try and debunk the nefua but fall into the trap every time. I have said before, chief political officer to answer all questions, Central Scottish bank, currency issue dead and buried, pension questions answered and a big fat No to Westminster to tell them Westminster
The easiest way to estimate how Scotland would do after independence is to look at other similar sized European countries.
They generally do far better than us, and often top the standard of living tables.
And that is despite many of the advantages Scotland has in comparison. There was a great article by Gordon Macintyre-Kemp in the National this week highlighting a few of them.
link to thenational.scot
I wasn’t trying to show off with my previous link and I wasn’t spanking the intellectual monkey.
@Gerry Hassan
Have you seen the light?
British nationalist ideology is unconscious of itself, as it has been internalised as the natural order of thing. This masks the meaning of social structure and camouflages the self-reproducing nature of British ‘middle-class’ habitus and British nationalist ideology.
The book ‘Hidden History’ (Gerry Docherty & Jim Macgregor) details how WW1 was orchestrated by British Politicians who were afraid of the economic rise of Germany and wished to clip its wings. Part of the strategy was to promote anti-German feelings among the British public and to paint Germany as the aggressor when apparently the reality was very different. A key player in all this was The Times, so they have had a lot of practice at the misinformation game.
What a pompous prick!
On balance though, there’s clearly quite a lot of money sloshing around for toryboy’s like him, to present the right’s agendas. Clearly all tory BBC led media still hasnt got enough bullshit artists and chancers. Despite being one of the Ligger’s ex Hootsman bootboys, Martin’s still a fringe tory lunatic, banging on the door to get back in. He’s even hawking his peculiar brand of toryboyness in the States. If Trump loses, a lot of tory commentator/gimps like Martin are going to either make money or go bust, and who cares
Tory money is still money. Look at a toryboy like Kevrage giving that dude Loki money and a lovely UKOK boost too. Far left meets far right in almighty cluster fcuk of yoons, shock.
Macbeda says:
Thanks Macbeda!
There are new visitor to Wings every day.
The UK Media, headed up by Westminster’s BBC
hack off Scots with an I.Q. on a daily basis,
and these newly recruited souls seek sanctuary from
the Rev’s church of truth.
Sovereignty, Freedom, and Justice!
Where is everyone?!
Robert Peffers @ 5.24 pm.
Thanks for that response, Robert.
@ Effijy
You are like Robert The Bruce and his bloody spiders man.
Try,try,try again.
?
“(The 2014-15 figures, published in March, were headlined at £14.9bn – though this was subsequently adjusted slightly downwards – compared to this year’s £14.8bn, which could obviously also be revised in turn.)”
Yes, I made the same point in the Herald. Like should be compared to like, and the published GERS figures should be compared with – published GERS figures for the previous year, which still shows the £14.9 billion deficit at that time.
Unionists are getting worse, even previously reasonable ones seem to feel the need to distort, quote out of context, smear, and outright lie. I intend pulling them up on it every single time they do it
She needs to use the middlename Lying and drop the owd from her surname for greater accuracy
Do you think there might be a point here about the comparison of the performance of the Scottish economy compared the the wider UK trend?
Aye, as the Sun says, “We’d be skint if we had voted Yes…”, but they forgot to add in….”…and went ahead with Trident renewal.” Funny how they conveniently forget how the priorities of an independent Scotland would differ greatly from a right wing, Brexit Tory one.
Having had discussions with people who believe the newspapers for news, her assumption is correct, though. Many readers also will not detect that conclusions made have no relation to the argument offerred, nor the argument to facts.
This is the hard part of crossing the line – a majority of people are either incapable of proper assessment or the conclusion is in line with their desires so they don’t care. You never persuade anybody by proving them wrong.
A rebuttal, on the off chance those aren’t being censored today.
Stuart doesn’t particularly dwell on para 1. The facts stated there are indisputable. You can find theses facts here link to gov.scot In the Scottish Governments executive summary of the latest GERS figures. You may disagree with how these are calculated, you may even think they don’t paint a representative picture of the Scottish economy. They are not, however, lies. They are national statistics published by the Scottish Government. The Sunday Times article then goes on to say that this has “major implications for the new tax raising powers the Scottish Government gets its mitts on next year…”. This is highly debatable, contentious even, but it’s an opinion. You can disagree with it, but It’s not a lie.
Para 2 says that Scotland’s financial position has worsened. In terms on the country’s net fiscal balance that is evidenced here link to gov.scot in table S6. You can argue about the post publication revision of figures but again, these are national statistics published by the Scottish Government, not lies, and the difference from 14/15 to 15/16 is clearly set out.
Examining the comparative positions of Scotland versus the rest of the UK it is clear that the on-shore growth in the Scottish economy has been offset by the fall in oil revenue. This is not the case in the rest of the UK where the deficit has reduced. Since it is self evident that the failure to keep pace with the rest of the UK is solely down to oil revenue, It does seem fair (or at least arguable) to describe the oil revenue as a “key plank” of the Scottish economy. Again, you might not agree with this, but that doesn’t make it a lie. To argue, as Stuart does that “…an almost £2bn drop in oil revenue in fact hasn’t impacted on the deficit AT ALL…” seems deliberately disingenuous when its clear that the drop has prevented the fiscal balance from improving by up to, well £2bn.
So tell me… where’s the lie?
Firstly, Martin, whining about being moderated for acting like a prick will get you flat-out banned. As also applies to everyone else, if you can’t abide by the rules you’re not welcome here.
Secondly, whether you agree with it or not the article makes it crystal-clear where the lie is:
“Bowditch then tells us that this is proof that oil is the “key plank” of the economy, when even a small child or Kezia Dugdale would notice that if an almost £2bn drop in oil revenue in fact hasn’t impacted on the deficit AT ALL, then logic suggests that the exact opposite is true.
The fact that Scotland has been able to absorb a multi-billion-pound drop in oil income with no damage to its bottom line whatsoever disproves Bowditch’s conclusion utterly.”
Even if you insist on comparing apples with oranges (by comparing revised figures to unrevised ones), the “worsening” was only a quarter of the size of the oil-revenue drop.
Bowditch’s conclusion is a load of shite and she knows it is. Saying things you know aren’t true is the definition of lying. If you’re too stupid to understand simple sentences, maybe it’s best you don’t comment until you grasp how language works.
Consider this a formal warning, in any event: you’re operating at the very outer limit of my patience. Any more whining or passive-aggressive abuse and you’ll exceed it.
After the scond world war the UK stared giving independance to umber of countries why becsuethey had just about stripped tehm of all assest and were no longer of use to the UK. So if Scotland is so bad why then is the rest of the UK so desperate to hold on to scotland. Answer it still must have a lot of assest that have not been assest stripped.