Let’s fill the Hill
Posted on
September 03, 2013 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
Calton Hill is probably our favourite place in all of Edinburgh. You can see everything from its slopes – Princes Street, Arthur’s Seat, the Forth Bridges, Leith, the Castle, the whole city. It’s also, now we come to look at it, just about the worst conceivable place in the entire capital to hold a rally, but it’s too late to worry about that now.
Wings Over Scotland will be there. Come and join us. We’ve a flag and everything.
Hurrah! I’ll be coming through from Dunfermline with my partner.
I will be there for definate, wouldn’t miss it for anything. I want to be able to tell the grandweans in the future. Aye ah was at the three of they marches. Will be good to see you all there.
I don’t see “Wings Over Scotland” in the list of groups attending.
I just noticed that the march starts from the top of High Street. Where are they going to fit everyone in? Last year the group looked a bit small at the start, in the corner of the Meadows, against that huge open space, but at least there was plenty room. I’m not convinced about the High Street.
The march route itself seems very short compared to last year. I enjoyed “coming down the road” from the Meadows to Princes Street.
I’ll be there. The (short) march starts on the Royal Mile between George IV Bridge and North Bridge – not sure if there’ll be enough room for all the people that will likely turn up… a crammed High Street would be an impressive thing though.
I’ll there with my whole extended family! Kirkwoods for Independence!
I’ll be there along with several others. I too have concerns about the tightness of the route accommodating the expected numbers.
Fortunately the MSM have told me that no one will be at the rally so I’ll have plenty of room.
Hi Rev and all fellow marchers. See you on the day and I’ll try and introduce myself to as many as I can (not that you’ll gain much by it, but you wont loose)!
PS Morag – re the March last year – it was good and I did enjoy the stroll down the mound.
Really looking forward to being there this year, as last year was brilliant.
Off topic, but interesting article about record levels of investment in oil (30 year high) and likely to last decades. Slightly different perspective from those who try to play it down.
http://www.commodities-now.com/news/power-and-energy/15212-bright-future-for-uk-oil-and-gas-industry.html#
“not sure if there’ll be enough room for all the people that will likely turn up”
Just wait till soon after we win our independence back & the Queen rides up the Royal Mile to the castle!!!!! 🙂
I was kind of hoping that we would go down the mound again (as it felt and looked quite magical last year) then along Princes Street to Calton hill but a sea of Saltires on the High Street with tourists and locals viewing the spectacle could be quite something and bringing the traffic to a stop on the bridges. Lets go!
I’m conflicted at the moment. Pride won’t allow me to take advantage of the shuttle bus – yet – it is such a steep hill.
I’ll hang around the end of the march, if there’s enough folk, we just won’t all fit and I’ll (sadly) have to hold my own small rally at the bottom.
😉
I’ll be there. Alas, no way of identifying most other cybernats active in fora like WOS and on twitter.
is there a secret handshake?
@Christian Wright
“is there a secret handshake?”
In honour of your avatar we’ll give the code message – ‘Be seeing you’ 😉
I would guess that the buses / coaches will park on Johnston terrace
(http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/55.94877/-3.19601)
and people will make there way to the High street from there
and the overspill will have plenty of space to fill Johnston terrace
should be good
I’ll be there with two friends. Went last year on my own! x
Easy to spot them Mr. Wright; they will be grinning broad smiles of hope while the die hard unionists look on from the pavement with faces like a wet weekend.
I will be there. I think the route is short, and Carlton Hill is not the best for hearing speeches. Hopefully, next year it will start at Carlton Hill, and end with the speeches on the Meadows. It would be good if the route was different each year. Looking at the photo at the top it does not look like there is that much room, given there is also a building and grounds at the top.
Training Day says:
3 September, 2013 at 1:32 pm
In honour of your avatar we’ll give the code message – ‘Be seeing you’
ah, of course!
Bus ticket is booked and I’ll look out for the flag. This will be my first EVER political march!!
And G.H Graham, don’t be saying things like “wet weekend”…… :-))
I’ll be there. Can’t wait. Will be with a group but will look out for Wings flag and say hello. It was such a great day out last year – hope we get some good weather again. There was a real magical feel about it last time. Many of us were looking around at the crowd and just couldn’t believe the turnout. I was on my own to start with but I never felt alone at any point – didn’t take long to start up a conversation and found myself part of somebody else’s group. So, if there are any readers who would like to come, but are worried about being on their own, don’t be. You’ll find you’re just part of a massive family and you’ll get a peece at any door. Just come!
I’ll be there. In fact the whole familiy will be there this year!
Get yourself there, by plane, train, boat, bus, car or foot. Just get yourself there.
That’s the area where I work, if it can hold the Festival Fringe…
I’ll be there with my Euan McColm effigy to burn on a pyre at the end of the rally.
I’m coming with my wee boy (He’s even got his own yes t shirt). Hoping the massive crowds (fingers crossed) are managed well enough so that wee ones are safe enough.
I understand topics to be addressed on the day are BT vision for Scotland
According to Willie Rennie at the BT launch there are 3 good reasons for remaining in the UK .
1. Global clout = He means mindlessly enact American Foreign Policy & being first to Crusade/first to WAR
2. Social equity = He means food banks & bedroom tax for the poor (not jobs!) & sustaining Westminster’s status as most democratically unequal country in the developed world
3. Economic strength = He means Micro manage UK to create tyrannical personal & family Indebtedness & Macro manage UK to construct astronomical and repressive levels of national indebtedness
(debt owed to the US – see 1)
So “Best of Both” must mean
Global clout – Crusade & War
Social equity – Food Banks & Bedroom Tax
Economic strength – Indebtedness & Indebtedness
Or am I missing something??
@scaredycat
No need for concern, it will be well marshalled, they can’t go ahead if not.
Just had a look at the March website I hadn’t realised there was a ‘Lib dem voters for Independence’, good on them.
@dougdaniel
I hear he spends a lot of time in the shed at the bottom of his garden.
My flagpole has arrived – already got a Saltire bought back in the Scotland United days.
And of course I already have the blue body paint for the arse-cheeks.
Let’s hope for nice weather!
I will be there, but I’ll feel a bit daunted as I will be on my own. The last turnout looked great and it has inspired me to go.
As for the venue’s suitability – it’s photogenic and, if we can see Edinburgh from there, Edinburgh can see us. Also, good wind levels for flag wavage.
I’ll be there with friends, hope there’s some bathroom provision for the oldies or I’ll be away to the pub early.
I echo Gillie’s sentiments: it is vital that each and every one of us who is in a position to attend gets there.
The MSM may try and downplay/ignore the rally, but the folk on the streets of Edinburgh witnessing a huge turnout will spread the word..independence is coming.
Me, the wife and weans will be there.
I was there with family and friends last year and will be there again this year, with more family and friends, wouldn’t miss it for the world. Once we are independent though, how many others will wish they had gone, or claim they did, but didn’t? Poor souls. 🙂
@eva
There’s even a few of us would love to go, but can’t. I’ll be cheering you all on though, chocolate raisins in one hand, dram in the other.
Believe it.
My partner and I are looking at making our way to Edinburgh on 21st September. Aparently there is a wee march and rally or something going on we might take a wee gander at. 😆
We have checked out the rally site and are currently trying to figure out where to park as I’m disabled. I was a wee bit surprised to read on march’s site that Edinburgh council charge for disabled parking!
We haven’t yet decided whether we’ll go on the march or just attend the rally yet. I would love to go on the march but not sure my partner is up for all that pushing. :(:
Switched on TV to watch Scottish government’s legislative programmes for this historic year but all that was on was a repeat of Great British Menu entitled North East Fish featuring chefs from the North East none of whom resided north of Berwick.
BBC’s in depth coverage of Scottish politics continues apace
Alas and alack I have a family wedding and it breaks my heart to miss what will be a remarkable day I am sure.
You will all recognise me. I’ll be the one waving the Saltire. J
In the words of the great matt Munro song;
So, come with us, run with us,
We’re gonna change your world,
You’ll be amazed, so full of praise,
When we’ve rearranged your world,
We’re gonna change your world.
Two more will be there!
Count me in. In past days when Hogmanay was still celebrated on the High Street it easily accommodated 15,000. Carlton Hill for the Beltane around 12,000. If there are huge no’s, and I hope there are, we will just have to occupy Waterloo place down to junction with Princes Street and North Bridge. Will remind me of student Demo’s against Thatcher which blocked the entire junction for hours during the early eighties.
Could be a lovely walk down memory lane!
if everyone could invite a few friends it makes for a lovely day out.
Lanarkist.
@ Arbroath,
Contact the organisers. Parking in Edinburgh isn’t fun at the best of times. I am sure they made special arrangements last year for disabled parking.
I am going too, with partner and excited daughter!
Where is the best place to park that’s not too far away?
O/T Poor Old Cochers is on BBC 2 now.
Hopefully bring a full coach (49) from Moray. someone will be holding up a Yes Board with Moray on the back.
I can see it, we wont be listening to the speeches we’ll be to busy introducing ourselves 🙂
@mogabee
Which direction are you coming from?
Training Day says: “It is vital that each and every one of us who is in a position to attend gets there . . folk on the streets of Edinburgh witnessing a huge turnout will spread the word..independence is coming.”
Speculatively, shock and awe. Were there to be an authentic MASS rally far in excess of expectations, it might serve to loosen the bowels of the Unionist establishment, shift momentum, and change the tenor of the entire debate.
Andy Nicholl saying that Scotland can’t have a oil fund. He is effectively defending Osbourne now! SNP are making up figures etc.
10+ of us going from Glasgow, cannae wait.
@Arbroath1320
I’m sure you’ve already read this but if not ….isn’t it possible to get on one of the buses?
http://independencerally.com/main/?page_id=66
Albalha
M8 from Glasgow. We are leaving from Campbeltown.
Thanks Adrian we will.
Balefire I think there is just one itsy bitsy wee problem with your recognition technique I have a funny feeling there may just be one or two others waving a saltire as well. 😆
Provided we can get things organised for the day I suggested to my partner we have a banner clipped to my wheel chair, ‘ Arbroath 1320 says AYE.’ 😆
I’ll update everyone if we can get banner made.
Eh Rev
Go and stick the date of the march on the article somewhere please! Just for the folks that dip in and out of the articles.
Ta
Steve
Last year I hopped on the bus from Dumfries, because I had correctly figured it would more or less be going past my door. However, the wee snag was that I had to leave and come back with them, rather than do my own thing afterwards. This time, thinking I might meet some Wings cronies, I thought I’d leave myself free.
Our local buses go down Lothian Road into St. Andrew’s Square, but they’re pretty infrequent in the grand scale of things. I think I’ll drive somewhere and then get a bus that actually goes down North Bridge. I can get one at Penicuik, or the Straiton park-and-ride, or even Cameron Toll. These run more frequently and probably later too, so Auld Reekie will be my oyster.
I was going, with my son, my daughter and her not-quite-made-my-mind-up boyfriend (wait till he sees the turnout) and my old nationalist father in law, but now I find that I can’t go myself 🙁
Ochone, ochone, ochone 🙁
Aye I have Albalha, it was this bit at the bottom of the page that got me a wee bit concerned.
‘Please note: there is a charge for disabled parking.’
I assumed that this comment referred to Edinburgh council, no worries when we contact the organisers we’ll mention it tyo them and get the whole disabled parking thing cleared up.
Arbroath 1320 says:
3 September, 2013 at 2:45 pm
Balefire I think there is just one itsy bitsy wee problem with your recognition technique I have a funny feeling there may just be one or two others waving a saltire as well.
Bugger! Another damn fine plan ruined.
@Mogabee
My suggestion would be the east end of Holyrood Park in the Meadowbank/AbbeyHill area, that way you avoid too much of Edinburgh and can swing in from the by pass.
Then just walk past the swan filled ponds, Arthur Seat and Holyrood, up the High Street and you’re there.
That’s some drive by the way, real commitment!
Or come in on Dalkeith Road and park there, then walk round through the park.
That’s why I’d do but others may have better suggestions.
@Morag
I’m coming through on a bus, but if there’s something going on with Wings after the rally, I’ll forego the bus on the return journey and just take the train back to Glasgow later on.
I’m acoming too, bringing a lot of my Pictish friends, you will recognise us by the full body
painting, ( we don’t need flags!!).
I’m abroad until the 24th, I wished so much to be there, will someone film it, I will try to follow the progress on the internet. I can’t imagine the MSM reporting the event in any great detail.
I wouldn’t worry too much about it Balefire, it just proves that great minds think alike! 😆
Albalha
Many thanks for info. My daughter would probably enjoy the history of Arthur Seat and Holyrood (me too). Been waiting for this day for a whole year ‘coz we missed last one.
Woohoo, we’ll be there! Looking forward to it 😀
Don’t tell anyone I said this but the Edinburgh residential parking permit zones clustered around the town centre don’t generally apply at the weekends (best to check though, just in case).
Guys : Look foward to seeing all WoS troops their
As Margo MacDonlad said last year if we can convince one other to attend this rally / support /switch sides then we will win and win well.
If you take this subject seriously you must go. Im sure Westminster will be watching ; (Quite literally)
‘Lets Fill the Hill’
(Had some great banter with Celtic fans for Independence who are going / some great stuff all over the internet / facebook on this)
Nice one Stu, glad your going, looking forwad to meeting you, at least 6 of my family will be coming through from Glasgow, should be a great day. 🙂
For anyone coming into town I think if you stay off the main roads then parking on the central periphery should be free. So on the south side that’s Bruntsfield, Marchmont, Newington, the Pleasance and Tollcross.
Also, every main artery into town has a park and ride (I think) so that might be a good idea too.
@Alabaman
Are you serious, hope so!
Albalha
As for commitment..if the Proclaimers can do it!!
Mr and Mrs C will be there along with at least one young Mr C and his girlfriend and the brother and sister in law. Looking forward to a great day and meeting some fellow ‘Wingers’!
Balefire says:
“I will be there, but I’ll feel a bit daunted as I will be on my own. The last turnout looked great and it has inspired me to go.”
You most certainly won’t be on your own 🙂
As a wee reminder, this was last year:
http://wingsoverscotland.com/coming-down-the-road/#more-22705
http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-numbers-game/#more-22746
This year will be bigger.
If we want to be recognised we could all carry “wings” mugs Or buy and wear a wings t-shirt? 😀
Rev, do you mean you PERSONALLY will be there…?
@mogabee
Fair point! @Frances also mentioned the Park n Rides here they are, of course if you come in from the East you could park near Newcraighall and get the train.
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/48/park_and_ride_schemes/1170/park_and_ride
I’ll be there. With a stunning beauty on each arm.
Okay, okay, I’ll be getting helped up the hill by my two Daughters.
I am gutted – travelling back from abroad on 21st. Ah well, I promised my dear wife a nice holiday (she needs a break), and I did drag her to the rally last year. Pity the dates we booked clashed though. Ah well, see you all next year hopefully – I’ll bring some family and friends. Have a great time. Looking forward to seeing the rally on Youtube!
I am hoping to make the jaunt too. I suspect if it is a good turn out those at the sides and bottom of the hill will struggle to hear the star turns.
Entertaining having a Beeb page open isn’t it. I see the Bitter types have still not got the “be positive” memo.
You might recognise me because I’ll be wearing a Scotland rugby shirt which has the saltire right across it front and back. The paler blue – I’ve seen some so dark they’re almost black and that’s not on. But having said that, there may be several of these too.
If it’s really nice, I’ll strip down to the yellow WoS “A Hundred Of Us Remain Alive” t-shirt. I’ll be carrying my worldly goods in a WoS canvas shoulder bag.
“You can see everything from its slopes – Princes Street, Arthur’s Seat, the Forth, Leith, the Castle, the whole city.”
Don’t forget the Kingdom of Fife! 😀
I’ll be there too. 😉
HandandShrimp says:
Entertaining having a Beeb page open isn’t it. I see the Bitter types have still not got the “be positive” memo.
If I didn’t know better HaS I’d say you were shocked by their bitterness. 😆
@Christian Wright;
“is there a secret handshake?”
Just say the secret password ‘I’m with Stu’
Work permitting, we’ll be there.
I’ll keep a look out for the WOS flag.
Me and my wee lassie made it into the Daily Express amongst other papers last year, her sitting on top of my shoulders with her wee tartan tammy waving her saltire… was a great day out….
We met Alex Salmond and Dougie Maclean and both happily posed for photos too
I’m hoping one day when I’m long gone she can show the pictures to her weans and grandweans and say she was there and helped to make it happen
It was just the two of us with some friends last year… this year it’s the full bhuna of family (and friends) and all of them bringing extras
See you all there
O/T sorry.
Ministers at Westminster have thrown almost £2 Billion quid of public money, down the drain, in a BOTCHED aircraft carrier programme, according to the DR.
Westminster has done a double U Turn, on the types of aircraft for their future aircraft carriers, and the National Audit Office, has said this is the latest of several ongoing sagas that has cost the taxpayer over £2 Billion quid.
Could Holyrood really do a worse job than this lot at Westminster, I think not.
Lamont on BBC now. As bitter as ever.
Just for those worried about accessibility, there’s a bit of an alternative route. It’ll take a wee while longer to get up due to it being further, but what you do is instead of going up the stairs on Waterloo Place to Calton Hill you keep going away from Princes Street past St Andrews House, and then go up the road behind the Old Royal High School you should be fine. Much gentler incline and if memory serves no stairs at all that way. That’s the access road for the ice cream vans etc that end up at the top of the hill during the summer for anyone who’s ever wondered how they get there!
Also, the area at the top of the hill is absolutely massive. Been at the Beltane with about 10,000 others and the folk I was with had enough room for a full carry out to be spread about us as did everyone else!
For getting away afterwards, there’s about 5 different ways out. Suspect it’ll be well sign posted, but if not then heading towards the Leith side of the hill will bring you out at Royal Terrace which leads onto London Road.
Anyone needing to get a flyer for the train afterwards if they head out to Regent Terrace (just past St Andrews House) then the devils staircase gets you down to the back of the station.
Mogabeed,
Aye, and wait until you see the lassies!.
I see Dart Energy (Australian) want to dril in excess of 22 bore holes in Airth, in the intention of FRACKING for gas.
A public inquiry is to be held by the Scottish Government to determine the outcome, of wether Dart will be allowed to bore the holes and extract the gas, by pumping nasty fluids into the earth, and possibly the water table.
in my opinion if the Scottish Government give Dart the go ahead, it could damage the SNP’s and the YES camps chances of winning the independence debate.
she is such a horrible human being
This is awful, even by Lamont’s usual standards. She has not said anything remotely positive, her hatred of the SG is all too evident.
Since I booked mah bus ticket last month I have looked at 5ft x 3ft saltires, lion rampants and assorted Scottish clothing. Today its been Viking Helmets with Wings instead of horns. About as rare as hens teeth. Asterix style would be great. Love to meet you all.
OT
Watching Johann live on BBC now, all she needs to complete the Rab C Nesbitt outfit is the scabby bandage on her napper and a rolled up Daily Record.
can u imagine her as a next door neighbour ? frightenin
Make that another twa joining you all on the 21st, really looking forward to it as I missed last years march and rally due to work commitments. Tickets pre-paid travelling up on the Dumfries coach.
For those watching, has anyone asked Lamont where she’s been these past few months?
Don’t answer that question, it’s the BBC..
@archie(not erchie)
Here’s your site …..
http://www.partysuperstores.co.uk/section.php?n=14005000&p=3
Just bought a WoS ‘We’ll take it from here’ T-shirt to wear to rally. Was there last year on my own and this year will be going with another 5 who couldn’t make it last year – hope the hill’s big enough;-)
Nice to see that her LONG break of silence during the summer has helped her understand why no one has the slightest idea why she is allegedly the leader of Labour in Scotland. Oops sorry she still doesn’t understand why she is still the laughing stock of Scottish politics!
Lamont on BBC now. As bitter as ever.
I hope the intereviewer asked her where the hell she has been during the past three months.
@Training Day
Lamont is a fraud. She has been in hiding over Falkirk. She cannot get any more bitter. Lamont’s hatred of the SNP is so overpowering, she has lost the ability to be rational. Apparently the SNP is against devolution…Why did they campaign for it you liar? The negativity is incredible.
Aberdeen Holiday that weekend so I wont be attending as the Missus is taking me away somewhere exotic for the weekend but I will be there in mind and soul….enjoy yourselves guys, I’m jealous
Any chance of holding something up here in Aberdeen, we always seem to miss out up here 🙁
Look forward to seeing you all there.
Easy to recognize me with grey beard, MacGregor kilt and Clyde FC top 🙂
i think miss davidson is not one to be defied
Hi Gaavster, my husband and I marched alongside you and your lovely wee daughter last year. One of the proudest days of my life. Still remember the amazing feeling as we reached the Mound and became fully aware of the sea of people we were part of. Hope to see you again this year!!
This is also my first post on WoS, I love this site so much. It’s like home.
Aye, Muttley, she’s been in hiding over Falkirk, Trident, the bedroom tax..
But let her crack on. Her splenetic ignorance is turning people away from Labour in droves..
I would absolutely love to go, but I suffer severe anxiety issues in large crowds, in addition to several other things, so it’ll be extremely hardgoing for me. Nevertheless, me and my mother (indy supporter since she was a wee hing) do want to be there.
Luigi says:
“I hope the intereviewer asked her where the hell she has been during the past three months.”
Don’t hold you’re breath on that one Luigi.
“Rev, do you mean you PERSONALLY will be there…?”
Yes, me personally. With my Wings flag.
@Taranaich
You could see how it goes …..at least in Edinburgh there are a fair few wide green open spaces.
Welcome Emma, good to have you on board the good trawler WoS! Post and give us your opinions, the more the merrier. I was a lurker myself once (sounds dodgy). The next year could well be trying, given the antics of the Unionists and their MSM buddies.
@Training Day
Lamont is almost the most appalling SLAB leader imaginable. She is certainly up there with Curran, Bailie, Murphy et al. I have honestly never seen a more embittered politician.
Me and mine will be there too! Last year was brilliant. When we rounded the corner at Forest Road at the Greyfriars Bobby monument and saw the thousands of folk ahead of us, saltires aloft, going towards the mound – ahhh! such a memorable sight!
Sitting here at my PC in Houston, Texas….. reading the comments.
The hairs are standing up on the back of my neck
All the very best to everyone attending. I will be there in spirit
Christian Wright says:
3 September, 2013 at 1:30 pm
I’ll be there. Alas, no way of identifying most other cybernats active in fora like WOS and on twitter.
is there a secret handshake?
Pssst CW, I’ll have a yellow wings T shirt on and bring my Number 6 tea mug.
@ Albalha – Thanks for that link. The bronzy helmet with Wings looks great. Now that combined with a WOS T-Shirt should be just dandy.
Does anyone remember where the cartoon of the Rev Stu in the bath was? Was it Scotlandshire? Don’t tell him ok?
Going
Spoutlets too
Perambulating Consciousness Raising..
Balefire – I went on my own last year (never having been to any such event of any kind before) and spoke with so many friendly people I quickly felt encompassed by all that good will and friendship. I was on a high for days afterwards which renewed my vigour for Indy. Truly uplifting. So you wont feel alone.
Amongst others, I also spoke briefly with various SNP Ministers in the crowds as well as the Penguin! Wonder how the Westminster Ministers would fare out and about in such a Public arena – not very well I fear especially without their bodyguards.
@Muttley79
As you’ll know (I’ve said it often enough) I was at their BT Glasgow do, it truly is visceral from JL and the self satisfaction when she referred to AS as having a ‘tartan messiah complex’, surely, in the name of the wee man, people living and working in Scotland want to rise above this Labour pettiness and their politics of hate.
And I’m not an SNP person, I have some issues with them, however the way the Labour Party in Scotland conducts itself is foul.
Went to last years rally, we were seated near the stage (my hubby and me both have mobility issues). We got there ahead of the marchers, and it was amazing watching the space fill up. Such a positive vibe from everybody we spoke to. The group carrying the flag of Flanders was standing close to us, having a great time. Won’t be able to make it this year as hubs had a heart attack a couple of weeks back and is still recovering. Gutted that we can’t be there, would love to meet you all! Have a great day and please video the proceedings for those of us missing in action 🙂
I was there last year on my own. This year I’ll have a couple of friends with me. I’ve been looking forward to it for a year!
Speaking as a long time lurker….. I really really wanted to be there…. However life has intervened and I won’t make it. I will be with you all in spirit..can’t wait to hear all about it.
Morag, we were on the Dumfries coach too. Funny thing is we’ve probably met before and didn’t realise it. I know for sure I’ve met Arbroath 1320 😉
Was going to attend alone last year but decided to drag my middle son with me. He was born on the 1st July 1999 (which I always saw as a sign of something special coming) thinking it’s potentially going to be a huge part of his family history.
Thought he would do the march but get bored with the speeches, not a bit of it he was hooked and now devastated he will only be 15 and a bit come voting time.
Whole family going this year, can’t wait.
Last word…thanks to you all, you’re my daily sanity fix.
@Albalha
Yes, it is actually a visceral hatred of Salmond and the SNP that Lamont has. I do not know fully why this is the case? Obviously there is jealously, a fear of losing their privileges, and a belief that SLAB are destined to rule Scotland. However, there is something else there has well. I can only think that they genuinely believe that the SNP (and possibly indy supporters as well) are fascists. It is laughable of course, but it does seem as if they genuinely feel that SNP and independence are beyond the pale. You can see the hatred even when she attacks Nicola Sturgeon, Mike Russell, she was even having a go at Michael Mathieson! Ever time she is speaking about, or to the SNP, her expression becomes fierce and she looks like she is about to burst a blood vessel, Lamont’s blood pressure looks like it would soar even when she is only looking at them!..
I’ll be making the 870 mile round trip with the kids to show my support, even though I don’t have a vote.
I’ll be the one with the Saltire!
@Muttley79
Loss of power could of course be the main reason. You know the other thing about them, SLAB and BT as a whole is there are no laughs, no fun. Look at the optimism that will be on display at the march.
During the BT thing someone from, East Renfrewshire, I think asked that if and when they had a BT launch could there perhaps be a social event as well ……JL replied, something along the lines of …..’well not sure there can be much fun’.
@ Emma – I agree with Mutley79 and welcome to the good ship WOS.
Word of warning, its addictive ! You could end up like Macart [2:27pm] surviving purely on ‘chocolate raisins’ and ’12year old malts’. 🙂
Poor Johann, I have no interest in listening to her interview because I wince with embarrassment at the shallowness of her vision and the pettiness of her bitter, bitter hatred every time I hear her.
There have been so many Labour politicians I could have listened to (and voted for) down through the years. It is distressing really.
Considered bringing a bike… but it could get in the way.
Probably get the train from Airdrie.
I’ll be wearing a Saltire Buff and some other stuff.
@weefldingbike
What’s a saltire buff?
A Buff is a brand of tube scarf. They’re handy for out door activities and roll up in your pocket. You can wear them as a scarf, hat, bandanna, balaclava etc.
This one has Saltires all over it:
http://www.buffwear.co.uk/flag-saltire-buff?filter_name=saltire
Tiso stock them, Go Outdoors don’t have the Saltire one.
@Alabalha
Aye, I think loss of power is probably the main reason, although I think they may have convinced themselves that the SNP are beyond the pale. These things could be easily connected.
Lamont seems to think that Salmond is universally hated in Scotland. While this is the case among a section of the population, I do not think it is a good thing to base your entire strategy around. That they are doing this now is probably a good thing for Yes, given that there is obviously no positive case for the union, as we would have heard all about it from the MSM, and the Unionists. Talking of MSM I see Tom Gordon thought it appropriate to tweet WoS, just after the parliamentary session had ended, to have a potshot at Rev Stu. Why would he be so concerned to do that? These folk are so transparent…
I’ll take my Wings “hundred of us remain alive” bag for identification. I might try to make a Young Stu hairdo our of a hairband with a bit of jaggy black cardboard attached (a bit like Bart Simpson) to the front. You’d know me then….unless Stu shows up with his old hairdo and you can’t tell us apart 🙂
@ Albalha – Saltire Buff is body art that is so good you would never realise the person is totally naked. I think….:-)
Look for a middle aged skinhead with a limp. 🙂
I’ve recently had a leg op, so hopefully the route isn’t too steep.
Thank you for the kind ‘welcomes’. Already an addicted reader… have been lurking for nearly a year now. So yes, I may start posting a bit too. Will try not to rant too much though! I’ll need to stay away from watching/reading the BBC before I visit here…
Andy B at 3:37
Dart is bust, in Australia
Juteman
The short route has a lot of steps and a fairly steep incline. You might be better taking the longer route around the back of the hill.
Mutley79, Albalha, david
Re Lamont, i really cant even stomach to see or hear her vile outpourings, think ive heard all i ever wanted to hear from her. She truly is a stuck record and its become really boring. Maybe she expects to be on the scrapheap in an independent Scotland and her frustration boils over as she realises she and her party really have nothing to offer the people and she wonders who the heck are we to spoil her chance of getting to the trough like wee jokey lord McConnell with this blasted referendum on the way. Who knows.
Tarranaich – so sorry to hear that but you really would be amongst one big family there as i can testify from last years rally, the friendlieness and sheer occasion was something that had me buzzing for at least a week afterwards. Whatever you decide to do, you are still a part of it all right here. Listening to you all here fair makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up.
I think we’re going to need a bigger hill 🙂
I didn’t hear Johann Lamont. There was a time I would have tuned in to see what was being said, especially if I’d read something about it here, but honestly, it just leaves me cold now. I wouldn’t give Johann, Ruth or Willie the time of day. Their constant negativity and hectoring is just such a turn-off. And it’s all so predictable, you could write their scripts yourself.
“unless Stu shows up with his old hairdo”
Would that that were even possible now…
I’ll travel from Aberdeen on Friday to my daughters in Glasgow then we’ll head over to Edinburgh by train Saturday.
Sounds like the train could be busy.
If anyone fancies having a beer in the Horseshoe on Friday I’d be up for that.
Travel anywhere in Scotland for £19 return.
http://www.scotrail.co.uk/roll-with-us/club-55
I got 1st class to Glasgow (return) for £35.
PS I’ll be the one with glasses. 🙂
Thanks Cameron. I’ll maybe need my son to carry me, as i don’t want to misd the ‘buzz’ of the crowd by taking a lonely route. 🙂
Your hairdoo wasn’t that bad, Stu.
I had neon green and red stripes through mine many moons ago!
I understand there will be a mobility bus for those of us who may find the ascent a bit challenging;-)
@Rev Stu
Would that that were even possible now…
LOL…Never mind, Stu, I’ll lend you my hairband.
A Parking Tip
Leave Holyrood Park drive past the parliament (Horse Wynd)
Go straight ahead at roundabout up Abbey Mount
Take first right (under bridge) into Abbeyhill. (Opening on the right before this is entrance to Holyrood)
There are usually free parking spaces there in front of car showroom. See Google maps
Leave Abbeyhill turn left and go back down Abbey Mount to bus stop (100yards approx)
Take 35 bus which goes up Royal Mile to North Bridge (buses approx every 20mins). Either get off at last stop on High Street or wait until bus turns corner into North Bridge.
The 35 bus comes up Easter Road. Parking on one of the side streets off Easter Road would also be an option.
I’m relying on someone checking the above and verifying I’ve got it right.
The rally sounds exciting I wish I could be there with my camera unfortunately I’m have to work.
Muttley, re Tom Gordon et al.
The Rev’s output is showing them up for the charlatans and sock puppets that they truly are. They really, really don’t like that.
I’m a long time lurker and thank all the gods that I found this website about a year and a half ago. Sanity saver. Two of us were there last year and what a day, came home as high as a 2nd year student. 5 of us this year and hopefully counting.
Morag, we were on the Dumfries coach too. Funny thing is we’ve probably met before and didn’t realise it.
If you remember the bus stopping outside the Gordon Arms in West Linton to let someone on, that was me. I thought about asking if they had a spare space again this year but decided I’d rather go independently this time. I might see you anyway!
I’ll be there again this year 🙂 Can’t wait, the experience last year was incredible!!
To anyone worrying about going on their own, don’t! I travelled alone last year and met a great bunch of people who I only knew from Twitter and spent the day with them. You will not be alone for long.
As for Johann, so she’s finally left the bunker? Can’t bring myself to watch it though. She was dire as a teacher (I speak from personal experience) and she is even worse as a political leader (arf!), How she was chosen for that position is beyond me!
Anyhoo, looking forward to meeting as many of you guys as I can on the March and Rally 🙂
I’ll take my Wings “hundred of us remain alive” bag for identification.
That’s going to be my identification too, Jeannie. We must meet!
@archie (not erchie)
Re Saltire Buff, very good, you’re quite the wit, get my vote for funny man/woman of WoS. Laugh out loud moments indeed.
Just had to make a post, if nothing else but to be part of another great wings page.
Totally life affirming stuff; fair brings a tear to a glass eye.
I hope they have plenty pipers.
I’ll maybe wear my Bruce helmet – if it is allowed.
By the sounds of it from the posts here most people who attended yast year are at least going again this time around, and with a massive percentage taking even greaters numbers this time.
If that trend is replicated throughout, you get the impression this year is going to be crazy!! It seemed to me that last year people were perhaps holding back a little, not committing themselves to attending.
You definitely don’t pick up that vibe this time around!! By gum, my spine has been tingling all day reading the posts.
Would love to be there but first grandchild due on day of the rally maybe the wee one will come early.
@jond
Indeed. I’ve always known we’re quite a disparate bunch on here, but this thread emphasises it even more.
Come independence we could start the WoS Party, it really would be a diverse range of views and may well have a chance of sorting things out for the better.
I’d even knock on doors for that!
Arbroath 1320 says:
3 September, 2013 at 2:28 pm
My partner and I are looking at making our way to Edinburgh on 21st September.
We haven’t yet decided whether we’ll go on the march or just attend the rally yet. I would love to go on the march but not sure my partner is up for all that pushing. :
From recall (and it may be faulty) I’m sure you indicated in some exchanges on another site that you were from the “Queen of the South” area. If so, and you are travelling by car and come in via the A 702 you could:
A) Pull into the Midlothian Ski Centre at Hillend (entrance adjacent to the Steading pub and restaurant) and just beyond the gates is a car park (free). Then you could get on the number 4 bus at the terminus which is also at the entrance to the ski centre. The number 4 takes you to Princes Street Via Haymarket and you could join the march (and see it coming from Waterloo place – but it’s uphill from there on as you know.
B) you could take the car in as far as the Frogston lights, turn left and head for Hunters Tryst (Swanson area)and in 3/4 mile look for the signs for Morrisons (behind the Hunter’s Tryst pub) and head in that direction at the mini roundabout – at the end of this (short) road there is the number 27 bus terminus. There’s parking in the main and side streets around (or you could leave it in Morrisons I suppose). The 27 will take you right into the Royal Mile and you get off at the stop at the National Library – then it’s all down hill to Waterloo place with the march and with gravity assisted pushing.
The reason I suggested these two stops to you are that you’ll be able to get on them first and get the allocated space before the young mums with prams get on further along the route. Both buses can be caught back to the car from level ground (The 4 in Princes Street and the 27 at the foot of the mound (next to the National Gallery). The buses have auto ramps to assist access. Finally both the pubs have decent disabled access and toilets. The food at the Steading is good, The Hunter’s Tryst is cheaper.
Kind regards
Dram
PS if you are coming up the A703/ A701 then Straiton Park and ride would probably be best – free parking with disabled places . 47 and 67 service this route
http://lothianbuses.com/plan-a-journey/journey-planner
Re Parking Tip post. I should perhaps have said back entrance to Holyroodhouse. It’s where all the tour buses park. Confused?
There is no parking in residents parking bays on Saturdays in areas 1-4.
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/1278/parking-zones_and_permits/48/parking_permit_zones/2
@Juteman et al.
There are to be shuttle buses up the hill (11am-12.30) and back at the end for those who might find it hard going. Phone for details if you need them.
http://independencerally.com/main/?page_id=66
See you all there. Hope the Rev’s banner is big enough – sounds as though it might get lost among the saltires (buff and otherwise).
@Ruby Tuesday
Parking between Leith Walk & Easter Road is always a bit of a challenge, and particularly so when Hibs are at Easter Road which they are that day. You might well get a space, but you could be a good half an hour finding one. Anyone who finds themself in the vicinity of Leith Walk can get any bus that’s on the 7 times table and those will take you up the Bridges to the High Street. The number 7 and 14 are about every 10-15 minutes with a 49 a bit less regular than that. Anything else will take to the East End of Princes Street and you’re about a 10 minute walk up the road past Waverley and up Cockburn Street (take one of the vennels to stop you having to do the circuitous route).
If you’re willing to do buses you’ve got loads of options. You could basically find a space anywhere in Edinburgh short of the Gyle and be in the vicinity of the High Street within half an hour of taking a bus.
Would also say that Lothian Road is one of the main bus arteries. You can get off there and walk round the back of the castle via Castle Terrace to get to the top of the Royal Mile where the march will be starting.
Will be with you all in spirit, can’t make it. Will watch the video reports when they go on YouTube, Have a memorable time.
@Albalha 5.40pm
I agree. With Independence, endless possibilities develop. We will have that ability to effect change and shape our own futures. How far we take it and what opportunities and choices arise will be up to us. I suppose that is the essence of the Common Weal, as I understand it anyway. And with Scottish spirit and psyche given free reign anything is achievable. How exciting is that. For me it cant happen quickly enough.
Was trying to think of the best way to get recognised – will wear a BT t-shirt and be the one crying – simples
my family will be there, and I will look forward to meeting you and all the rest that share a vision…cannae wait
@jond
They’ve got a fundraiser going on just now, and it is exciting, we can do this.
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/the-common-weal-we-need-you-to-build-a-better-scotland
I will be there on the 18th along with my independence supporting son Stuart – if I see the Wings banner we will say hello and well done – you are an essential part of the effort.
Do not let your spirits flag under the wild and irrational interventions of MSM journalists on your twitter feed and that clumsy, amateurish piece of Unionist hate propaganda directed at you on Sunday. Take comfort from the fact that you are under their skin if not they would ignore you.
Hoping to make it – loved it last year ,the weather was brilliant , the atmosphere was calm and confident and the flags ours , Catalonian , Florentine and Belgium made a fantastic display . Ooops!I nearly forgot , there was one lone union flag but it was rolled up and put away fairly quickly!
To anyone thinking they are going on their own ,it just isn’t a lonely place to be!
@Albalha
Thanks for the link – wasn’t aware of this. I’m surprised it hasn’t been given higher profile,but still plenty time. Yes, I think this is what we should be aspiring towards – the absolute antithesis of what we tolerate today. Must contribute and enquire further re involvement. Thanks again.
Train booked a couple of months ago; diary cleared a year back.
Who said alone? 100,000 friends dancing up the hill. Can’t wait.
I noticed from last years WOS post that RT.com covered the march. Do you think that Sophie from RT might be there? OMG! Definitely getting the bronze helmet with silver wings! Now I am excited!
@ Albalha – Aye its good fun and thanks.
@ Arbroath1320 – There will be many strong arms quite willing to push yourself and others, you will not be left behind.
We’ll be coming from Dunoon cross country on a double decker bus and happy to pick up any groups on the way.
Our route is through Strachur along Loch Fyne, over the Rest and Be Thankful, through Arrochar, Tarbet, Luss (fag and P stop), back of Dumbarton into Glasgow west end and onto the M8 at Ibrox (fag and P stop Harthill).
Looking forward to revealing our An Loch Seunta banner.
@Ron Burgundy says:
3 September, 2013 at 6:11 pm
I will be there on the 18th
Are you camping out?
http://independencerally.com/main/?page_id=229
Got to have my pennies worth, I think Carlton hill is a mistake purely as it will not be able to accommodate us all! Other than that, it’s gonna be fab and fun, can I persuade my son’s drama group to forego their class that day? Bloody hope so! Looking forward to the event of the year, to surpass any bt approved and enforced patriotic celebration. YES to Independence!
Ron Burgundy says:
3 September, 2013 at 6:11 pm
I will be there on the 18th along with my independence supporting son Stuart.
I assume it’s just a typo, but you know it’s on 21st right?
Cynical Highlander
Ho Ho Ho just a typo
I’m concerned that none of my Edinburgh based, Yes voting family know about this march. Well they do now obvs 🙂
I’ve not seen any posters or any publicity that would reach non net users.
Last year was great. It was all downhill. This year I’m even more decrepit but if I don’t die of a heart attack getting up Fleshmarket Close I’ll be there. The only trouble, who with? I’m already signed up with two of the groups but I’ve a fancy to look for a Wings flag held by a bald man with a dog collar ( and spikes? ).
@ Dave McEwan Hill – A doubledecker bus cross country from Dunoon. Now thats the bus I want to be on. Oh please take photos just to give us all a legal high.
Should have given a contact no if anybody wants a lift – 01369 700132 or markewan2001@yahoo.co.uk
Great to see all your comments and excitement building for the march and rally. I am one of the organisers so will try and answer some of the points you raised.
Calton Hill was chosen as an iconic site and is very safe for the rally. As someone mentioned stringent checks are put in place before permission is granted so everyone will be fine. For overspill at Calton Hill should this happen we will have large screens at the foot of the hill so that no one will miss out on the day. Someone mentioned hearing the speeches – no worries there we have a very good stage management company who will ensure that sound is projected well for everyone.
For large crowds at the start again we have contingencies in place to deal with this so everyone will be safe. We have a large amount of stewards who will ensure everyone is safe and not overcrowded.
It is to be a family fun day with an important message so everyone will be very safe. A fund day out with an important message.
Re coaches instructions for parking and drop off please visit the website link and full details are given there.http://independencerally.com/main/?page_id=2024
For any other questions please visit our website where it answers most queries – http://www.independencerally.com. If you cant find your answer just email me anne@independencerally.com.
Looking forward to meeting lots of you on the day – please all come along and say hello – I am the only female organiser so should not be hard to find in my organiser hi viz 😉
Fire any more questions my way you need answered.
Lets hope for another great day with similar weather 🙂
Anne (McMillan)
scardey cat
I saw you were reassured earlier that the march will be well stewarded. Adding to that, last year’s was a very civilised and family friendly event.
P.S. Remember to cut eye-holes in your paper bag. 🙂
I was going to go last year, but I got my first job in years and guess what my start date was? I was so disappointed.
This year I’m hoping we can nip through on the train from Bathgate. There should be at least 7/8 of us including kids. I’ll be bringing a wee foldy seat and a picnic.
There’s no charge for parking with a blue badge in Edinburgh there be a time limit depending on where you park.
I have just returned from foreign parts and am looking forward to being there, hopefully with Mrs and Junior Seasick.
@DaveMcEwanHill
I admit to not knowing what your banner was saying, but duh, Holy Loch, should have worked that out, sadly needed to do a search.
You learn all the time on this site.
Blue badges Edinburgh
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/1271/parking-disabled_people/488/blue_badge
Thanks for that, Anne. Last year was fabulous, and I hope we’ll outstrip it by miles.
I note that Calton Hill is a LOT bigger than the Ross Bandstand, unless there’s an enclosed area in the former I’m unaware of. I would doubt we could “fill that hill” literally, but you never know. I’m certainly going to be there.
What about next year? Fill the Meadows? (Do you have a revised date for 2014 yet, since I assume the original date of 20th September has had to be re-thought a bit?)
There should be more people this time. 2 buses from Dundee this time compared to combined bus from Aberdeen last year.
Have carefully timed holiday (speaking to youse from Italy) to make sure I and mine will be there too. Be interesting to see if the Rev wears a dog collar …
Next years to be announced very soon but yes it will be earlier in the year given that people will be out canvassing prior to the big day as well. We will be announcing the date and the venue very soon.
On amount of people we never ever speculate on that but I definitely notice a lot more talk about it compared to last year and more coaches from areas as Marcia rightly says.
Its going to be pretty amazing.
We just need to pray for good weather again 😉
Anne.
@ Anne McMillan – Way to go lass! Thats just what we needed, this disparate bunch of hairband swappers, Saltire Buffers, and incidentally I will be wearing the hi-viz bronze pelmet with silver wings. Oooops I meant helmet. 🙂
@Cameron B
Well having seen the Saltire buff, I’m thinking of ditching the paper bag and going for one of those with a pair of dark glasses. A sort of cross between a biker and Jackie Onassis.
😎
Does anyone know where I can get ‘my message’ printed on a long sleeve, navy blue T-shirt?
Hi All, went with my youngest last year and had a ball, will be going with a bus load this year, am now starting to get butterflies with excitment. The Wings Flag is going to be a beacon on the hill, i cant wait to mingle instead of lurking with you all. Nae Limits.
We now need to make sure that all of Scotland is watching – and waiting for full coverage on BBC, STV and their newspapers.
I wonder if the Sunday Herald could be persuaded to do a memorial issue.
Thanks Anne for your comments and hard work (as well as others of course). Changing the route every year (next years’ is hopefully going to be the last one ever) is good, means that folk can more easily remember each years’ event. A march ending in the Meadows would be good as well!
@Marcia.
Are the details for the Eh bus fae Dundee on the Eh website?
I want to have a night ‘out’ in Edinburgh, so don’t want to travel back home too early.
Help me out here.
I want to wear a ‘Dundee’ Yes top.
How about this?
M
Voat’n
Eh.
or
Eh’m
voat’n
eh.
?
I’d love to be there, but can’t.
Hopefully if things go well next year it will really be an INDEPENDENCE Rally and I wouldn’t miss that for the world.
Just a suggestion.
There are many pubs in the vicinity; why not pick one for all WOS people to hing aboot?
Maybe I should get one of these
Its fantastic to read all the positive comments. I have seen similar enthusiasm on a number of sites…
I have a strange feeling that it is going to be much bigger than the organisers expected. There may even be Catalonians coming. Incredible.
What a signal to send to Westminster.
Is there anyway to get an idea of definite numbers under WOS Banner? What would be a good number?
Anyone going to the party the evening before? Or the pubs afterwards?
What does everyone think about the line-up of speakers?
To be honest I’m very disappointed that Salmond couldn’t put his ego and desire for publicity to one side for once and take a back seat this time.
If we’re going to have any chance of winning the referendum its absolutely crucial that we attract non-SNP voters to the cause, mainly by making clear that independence is for everyone across the spectrum, not just SNP voters.
In order to do that it is important to promote as much as possible alternative versions of independence to that of the SNP, and to make clear that it is possible to support independence regardless of whether you’re a Green, Labour, SSP etc and even if you dislike the SNP and Salmond.
Sadly Salmond’s attendance at the rally means that he will, again, grab all the attention and publicity and that the views and ideas of others like Harvie, MacDonald and Colin Fox will again be obscured.
We did to make clear to the Scottish people that independence is NOT just about the SNP, not further re-enforce that view by allowing Salmond yet more publicity and making it look like he alone is the dominant figure behind the independence movement.
I won’t be back in time for the rally (bugger!) but I am really enjoying the excitement of the build up on this thread. I am kidding on I am still involved, but come the day there will be some frustrated drink taken, I can assure yous.
Hoping for the perfect day, although the sight of a 100,000 drenched Indy Scots on top of a cold, dreich, windswept hill having a giant party (god forbid) would really give the betterNO establishment the fear.
Would be an interesting Caledonian counter image to the warm glamour of our Catalan flashmob Iberian cousins LOL. (What am I saying!) It’s been so hot over here now for so long that I am dileriously fantasising about sleet. WTF!
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Scottish-Flag-Scotland-Face-Mask/dp/B008GTFFWA/ref=sr_1_146?ie=UTF8&qid=1378232418&sr=8-146&keywords=scottish+flag
@ Archie [not Erchie]
If you do wear the hi-viz bronze pelmet, it could be ‘curtains’ for you.
Sorry, someone had to…
Conan
I’ll drink to that!
Anne, are there plans (resources) to advertise the rally beyond the net?
“although the sight of a 100,000 drenched Indy Scots on top of a cold, dreich, windswept hill having a giant party (god forbid) would really give the betterNO establishment the fear”
With respect I think you’re being a wee bit optimistic about the numbers.
There were 5,000-10,000 last time, I think we should hope for perhaps double that this time.
“Sadly Salmond’s attendance at the rally means that he will, again, grab all the attention and publicity and that the views and ideas of others like Harvie, MacDonald and Colin Fox will again be obscured. “
On the other hand, there’ll be more than seven people there.
Those you name are all good folk, but they’re not box-office.
“We now need to make sure that all of Scotland is watching – and waiting for full coverage on BBC, STV and their newspapers.”
But that’s the problem, Salmond’s attendance doing yet another grandstanding speech will again dominate all the media and publicity and again obscure the views and ideas of the other speakers.
It really is a shame that Yes Scotland can’t tell him to take a back seat this time and allow other speakers more prominence and publicity – its vital that the people of Scotland, through the media coverage on events such as this, are made aware that independence is for everyone, not just SNP supporters.
Salmond’s dominance of all the publicity and attention again will probably have the opposite effect, unfortunately.
Good shout Conan.
“On the other hand, there’ll be more than seven people there. Those you name are all good folk, but they’re not box-office.”
Yes but to be fair, Salmond’s attendance last time hardly resulted in a massive turnout did it?
Surely SNP supporters wouldn’t boycott the event just because Salmond wasn’t attending would they?! Presumably they still support independence and would therefore want to attend the march even if they wouldn’t get to see their leader making another grandstanding speech?
I think the importance of ensuring the message gets across that independence is more than just the SNP outweighs the necessity to get a few more people attending the march.
@ Eric,
We’ll have the Venetians too (and the Sardinians, if I understand the Italian correctly) Have a look here:
https://www.facebook.com/avantisanmarco
@Anne
Can you get us onto the list of groups attending on your site please? I gather the Rev’s signed us up….
We try to have a balanced list of speakers from all parties and I think that is reflected on the line up for the day.
On numbers someone click counted around 9.500 last time not the 5000 reported by the press for sure.
Advertising is mainly web based/social media. We would love full page adverts but it all costs money 🙁 This week we have the poster van advertising it touring around and lots of people out leafleting all over Scotland. YES have it on the front page of their website and are sending it out via email. Word of mouth is also so important and it would appear that is taking off too. Lets all just plan to tell another person before the rally and double the figures 😉
For anyone looking for a social event we have a pre event night karaoke in the Calton Hotel hosted by hardeep singh koli and I know there are a lot of post events taking place too. We will announce post events from the stage on the day so everyone knows where they can go.
Oh and bring your dancing feet – we have some fabulous new up and coming singers and bands 😉
Anne.
@ That Roman guy.
I hope Salmond plays a major part. He is an excellent speaker, and knows how to rouse a crowd.
Of course, any Britnat might want to suggest that AS should stay in the background.
Salmond was there last year. He spoke for about three minutes. None of these three minutes was “grandstanding”.
Stu, why do we have to put up with this again?
Norse – If Salmond wasn’t there, how do you think that would be presented in the MSM?
He couldnae be bothered to turn up…
Slamond is on a lose-lose situation with the press no matter what he does.
Will you be there, by the by?
Damn! I responded!
Juteman,
The buses are leaving the Science Centre at Greenmarket about 9 a.m.
http://www.independencerally.com/coach/
A lot are going by car and train also.
Not confirmed but I have heard 30th August 2014 banded about as being the date for the 3rd and final March for Independence Rally. We shall hae tae wait and see.
It was so obvious. A happy, enthusiastic thread,
“We try to have a balanced list of speakers from all parties and I think that is reflected on the line up for the day.”
Yes the list of speakers is balanced, but the problem is that one particular speaker will inevitably dominate all the media coverage and publicity, getting more coverage than all the other speakers put together.
That’s why, for this rally at least, he should have been encouraged to take a back seat and allow other speakers to get some coverage and publicity in order to put across the message that independence isn’t just about the SNP.
Someone from the SNP could still have given a speech, just not the man who will suck up all the coverage and publicity from everyone else.
PCSA
Why do I always feel you are here as a spoiler?
This has been great thread full of hope and excitement…and then you turn up …
@muttley79
next years’ is hopefully going to be the last one ever
I know what you mean but I hope not. March and Rally in 2015 should be the celebratory one (i.e. we did it) and the one in 2016 will be to mark our independence. Last year was great and I am expecting this one to be even better. Many thanks to Anne and all the organisers.
We have just finished delivering 9,000 March & Rally leaflets in our area so hopefully that will help swell the numbers attending.
Cheers Marcia, but that doesn’t say when the bus leaves Edinburgh for the return.
I would like to have time for a few drinks and a meal.
I’ll probably get the train.
Thanks anyway, comrade! -)
Elizabeth,
I had the same thought – he/she/ has an unhealthy fixation on the FM. I wouldn’t be surprised that he/she/ gets aroused when he/she sees him. 🙂
“I hope Salmond plays a major part. He is an excellent speaker, and knows how to rouse a crowd.”
Yes, I’m not claiming otherwise, I’m sure he will give a very rousing speech that will fire up all those who already support independence, particularly those who support his party.
But, we need to persuade people who aren’t SNP supporters to vote yes, and a rousing speech from Salmond, that claims all the media coverage and publicity and obscures the views of every other speaker simply is not going to do that.
While Salmond is still very popular among his followers, polls suggest that he is growing increasingly unpopular with the rest of Scotland, and therefore it is crucial that independence is separated from him and his party and presented as something that is attractive to anyone across the spectrum, even those who dislike Salmond/the SNP.
As our First Minister I think its only right that he is there and speaking. We are not affiliated to any particular political party but as Conan rightly says if he wasn’t there the press would have a field day. I don’t for a minute think he overshadowed anyone. Indeed Margo Macdonald got a rapturous welcome and applause just after him as did many of the others.
Lets all just get back onto the enjoyable part of the thread and look forward to the big day folks 😉 I know I am. Loads of work but the feeling of seeing the crowds arriving on the day makes it so worth it. I know last year I had a big lump in my throat watching everyone from the stage – it was a magical moment. The press could never have conveyed that electric atmosphere. People need to attend and actually feel it for themselves.
RE the final rally date no date is in stone yet but we will announce it very soon. Lets just get nearer to this one first 😉
Anne
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus
I appreciate that not all Yes supporters are SNP supporters, myself included. Can I ask you in all honesty though, what is your particular problem with AS?
“If Salmond wasn’t there, how do you think that would be presented in the MSM? He couldnae be bothered to turn up”
In order to counter that all Salmond would need to do would be to give an interview in which he says that he’s not attending in order to give others some of the limelight and to make clear that independence is attractive to everyone across Scotland, regardless of whether they like him/the SNP or not.
In fact he could still attend the march, just not give the headline speech.
Anne, please PLEASE stay off 16th August!
http://www.loncon3.org/
Marcia,
he/she sounds like Johann Lamont! Simply inspirational. (snigger)
“I don’t for a minute think he overshadowed anyone. Indeed Margo Macdonald got a rapturous welcome and applause just after him as did many of the others”
Yes but I’m not talking about those who attend, I’m talking about the media coverage and consequently the people of Scotland in general.
At the last rally Salmond completely dominated all the coverage and publicity – with all the attention focused on what he said in his speech, and the other speakers getting about a line’s worth of coverage between them.
“Lets all just get back onto the enjoyable part of the thread and look forward to the big day folks”
That’s all very well and good but enjoying a wee day out and the ‘magical atmosphere’ simply isn’t going to help us win the referendum is it? That’s the important thing.
Understood Morag 🙂
“Can I ask you in all honesty though, what is your particular problem with AS?”
In terms of independence my problem is that I think he is damaging our chances of winning the referendum.
PSCA
I have seen a fair bit of criticism of Salmond for having so little to do with the campaign so far. Yes, he will attract the media both domestic and foreign and this is good. It will get airplay and the MSM will not ignore the event. However, the other speakers will be there and they will be heard, filmed put on youtube etc., This is also good. There is a good mix of humour, politicians, independents and celebrities. On balance, it should be a cracking day.
Should also have said for anyone who needs it we have a shuttle bus running up and down the hill from 11 till 4.30. If you want to book seats on it please email me and I can do that. Also for anyone less able there is seating but it needs to be booked as seating is limited. Anyone who wishes this please email me anne@independencerally.com
I also noticed someone asked about toilet facilities. We have toilets/disabled toilet being arranged for the day too.
There will also be catering outlets and lots of info stalls, also some stalls selling goods on the day too. We also have a kids zone for any little ones with face painters, crafts, Mickey, Minnie with a Scottish twist etc.
Trying to make it a family fun day with a hugely important message.
Anne.
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus
At the last rally Salmond completely dominated all the coverage and publicity
So does AS control the MSM? I think not.
@Anne McMillan
Is there anywhere I can get a pdf for printing on my A3 colour printer? I want to put posters up in all my local shops. They will put them up if I can get them.
@ Juteman – I have the timetable for the bus heading North on my PC as I will be on one of them post rally to Aberdeen. Can email it to you if you want. Just give me the details. My alternative email ‘archiemelrose@yahoo.com’ or see me on FaceBook
Etrigan
Posters can be downloaded at the following
linkhttp://www.independencerally.com/download/posters/
PSCA, if it wasn’t for AS and all the other members of the Scottish National Party who have campaigned over the decades, many no longer with us, you would not be having a referendum. I look forward to having a good day out on the 21st.
No doubt about it Alex Salmond is a great public speaker and is a huge asset to the Yes campaign. Hence all the personal attacks against him.
“However, the other speakers will be there and they will be heard, filmed put on youtube etc”
Yes but will they be heard by the undecided voters we need to attract, that’s what I’m concerned about.
The average undecided Scot isn’t going to search Youtube for a speech by Margo Macdonald, they’re going to watch the news and read the papers – and see nothing but coverage of Salmond’s speech and his promotion of the SNP’s version of independence, with very little on the independence views and plans of any of the other speakers.
I understand the point that Salmond’s attendance will boost the coverage and possibly attendance, but if we got even say 20,000 there it would get extensive coverage anyway, regardless of whether Salmond gave a speech or not.
Morag – Penicuick and Bonnyrigg and Dalkeith have buses running all night if you plan to be late.
Cameron Toll shopping centre has private parking fines for people parking more than 4 hours but the surrounding streets are toll free at the weekend.
Ruby Tuesday – the road under the rail bridge at Abbeyhill has recently been closed to eastbound traffic so I would not recommend that route, you can no longer approach Milton St for example from the west. It is the weekend though, so only the Meadows-Holyrood-Queen St-Lothian Road are affected by parking restrictions.
I will probably look out for Arbroath 1320 as the most distinctive regular poster going by his description 🙂
PS ‘tartan messiah complex’ – said Fuschia Jacket, interchangeable superhero of the status quo.
PPS If time is tight, is it better to make the march, or the rally?
@Anne McMillan.
Thank you for playing a big part in the struggle for independence.
It’s appreciated, and folk in the future will remember.
“So does AS control the MSM? I think not.”
No but he’s Scotland’s First Minister and the dominant figurehead of the independence movement, so obviously if he gives a speech at the rally it will get far more coverage and attention from the MSM than any of the other speeches won’t it.
If it means that I can see our children grow up in an Independent Scotland and have a better life that is all the reward I will ever need but thank you for all your kind words 🙂
“Yes but to be fair, Salmond’s attendance last time hardly resulted in a massive turnout did it?”
It attracted as many people as the venue could accommodate.
Look, what’s your goal here? You moaning about it isn’t going to make Salmond not be there. So all you’re achieving is turning what was a happy positive thread into a load of bitching and arguing about him. How do you imagine that helps anything except the No campaign?
Any political party or cause in Scotland or the UK would kill for an asset like Alex Salmond. He isn’t for everyone. Nobody is. You don’t like him. We get that from the way you’ve said “grandstanding” about 20 times already. Point made. Now gonnae give it a rest?
Cheers Archie.
I think i’ll just book the train. Who knows, I might ‘get lucky’ on the day! 🙂
PS.
I would remove your email mate.
“No doubt about it Alex Salmond is a great public speaker and is a huge asset to the Yes campaign”
I’m not denying that he’s a good public speaker, but his status as an asset to the cause is disputable.
I’d suggest he has reached saturation point as far as his ability to attract anyone else to vote yes – he’s been in power for 6 years and given numerous speeches and had reams of publicity, surely no one else is going to be suddenly convinced to vote yes by another of his grandstanding speeches?
As I said earlier, the only way we will win the referendum is by attracting non-SNP voters to the cause, and the simple fact is that many of them do not like Salmond, regardless of the adulation he gets from SNP supporters.
Recent polls suggest 45% of Scots are dissatisfied with Salmond – those figures hardly suggest he is an ‘asset’ do they?
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus
I have to disagree with you about Alex Salmond. Out of the 14 speakers listed, only 3 are members of the SNP. How do you think the media would react if he had not been invited to speak? The leader of the party who started it all excluded!! Yes campaign split!
And BTW. Whilst we dont expect 100,000 (I suspect thatwas a typo) there were easily 10,000 there last year, and I expect there will be in excess of 20,000 this year.
“Stu, why do we have to put up with this again?”
We’re running out of patience with it pretty fast.
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus
Thanks for replying and each to their own. However, as you say, AS is “Scotland’s First Minister and the dominant figurehead of the independence movement”. As such, it would be rather odd for him not to take a prominent role would it not?
Thanks for that – this thread is a really positive exciting thread and we need to keep it like that. I am tweeting and Fb’ing it to people who might be undecided about coming along as its just the type of conversation they need to join to persuade them to come along .Its really important they come as its cross party cover for speeches and to listen to that in a relaxed family feel good atmosphere is just what people need. Plus we have lots of info stalls from all of the parties and different groups who will be on hand to answer peoples questions on the day.
We will be announcing the info stalls shortly but we have Labour for Independence, Greens, YES, SNP, Business for Scotland, CND, Radical Independence, to name a few who are attending on the day to answers peoples questions.
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus
You in some kind of challenge to say the same thing 100 different ways? Or maybe you believe if you say the same thing over, and over, and over, and over again someone other than you might believe it?
You wearing your toga to the march?
“if it wasn’t for AS and all the other members of the Scottish National Party who have campaigned over the decades, many no longer with us, you would not be having a referendum”
I don’t deny it. But that doesn’t preclude me from criticising him and his party if I think they’re doing something damaging to our chances of winning the referendum does it?
If you support a football club and your manager has got you to the cup final, but then starts messing up and using the wrong tactics, should you offer him constructive criticism and advice in the hope that he’ll lead you to victory, or continue to offer him unquestioning support because he got you there in the first place, regardless of whether that may result in you losing the final?
I had been looking forward to the rally all year; now I’ll be in the middle of the North Sea instead. I will however, be there in spirit.
enjoy!
“Out of the 14 speakers listed, only 3 are members of the SNP”
See my post at 7.38 pm
“How do you think the media would react if he had not been invited to speak?”
See my post at 7.45 pm
Anyway, I’ve made my point, there’s no need to go on about it. Let’s get back to the positive vibes and excitement, regardless of what I said I really hope the march is a success.
This is a desperate attempt by PCSA to reverse the fact that Alex Salmond has weathered the ” I don’t like Alex Salmond, but I don’t know why” storm which has been worked at by all the media for the last eighteen months.
Ignore the pratt.
All sensible people recognise the huge abilities of “political genius” (Copyright Andrew Marr) Alex Salmond and the half wits who don’t won’t win the referendum
Will this be like one of those Better Together public marches by invitation only?
Back to the point – why not a rally point up the High St, especially for people who are going by themselves?
It doesn’t have to be a pub.
But it would help.
@Murray McCallum
You wearing your toga to the march?
LOL
@PCSA
What does everyone think about the line-up of speakers?
Good, reflects the broad nature of the independence movement.
To be honest I’m very disappointed that Salmond couldn’t put his ego and desire for publicity to one side for once and take a back seat this time.
If Salmond’s ego was as big as you allege then he would not have given Nicola Sturgeon such a large role in the campaign. Sturgeon has taken part in nearly all the debates on TV so far.
If we’re going to have any chance of winning the referendum its absolutely crucial that we attract non-SNP voters to the cause, mainly by making clear that independence is for everyone across the spectrum, not just SNP voters.
Correct, that is why Blair Jenkins is CE of Yes Scotland, and Dennis Canavan, a widely respected figure in Scottish politics, is Chairman of Yes Scotland.
In order to do that it is important to promote as much as possible alternative versions of independence to that of the SNP, and to make clear that it is possible to support independence regardless of whether you’re a Green, Labour, SSP etc and even if you dislike the SNP and Salmond.
Yes, the Greens and the SSP have already said they have different opinions to the SNP over issues, such as the retention of the royal family etc. Dennis Canavan has said the same as well.
Sadly Salmond’s attendance at the rally means that he will, again, grab all the attention and publicity and that the views and ideas of others like Harvie, MacDonald and Colin Fox will again be obscured.
The likes of Dennis Canavan, Margo MacDonald, Ruth Wishart all gave good speeches as well.
We did to make clear to the Scottish people that independence is NOT just about the SNP, not further re-enforce that view by allowing Salmond yet more publicity and making it look like he alone is the dominant figure behind the independence movement.
Again, you keep bringing this up. Why do you think Labour for Indy were smeared by the MSM? Polls have consistently shown that around 20 per cent of Labour voters/supporters were vote for independence. Out of interest will you be putting an appearance in at the march?
“You wearing your toga to the march?”
I’ll probably wear the armour I wore when I defeated Carthage, I think that would be appropriate.
Jeez, that wet blanket needs a fairly good wringing.
Fantastic stuff Anne, well done to you and everybody involved.
re PCSA
We have a well poisoner.
Someone get the dettol!
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus says:
I’ll probably wear the armour I wore when I defeated Carthage, I think that would be appropriate.
Do you like dressing up in Roman armour?
@Murray McCallum says: You wearing your toga to the march?
That’s a keeper.
By the way Roman dude, stop grandstanding on this thread – you’ve already spent more time on here than Alex Salmond will take to make his speech on the 21st. Also, I smell shite.
The Rev has a superb moderation policy.
He believes in free speech, and doesn’t like banning folk.
Let’s help him out here.
IF WE THINK SOMEONE IS A TROLL, STOP FEEDING THE BEAST!
@PCSA
By any chance do you think Alex Salmond was standing behind the picket fence in Dallas in November 1963?
PCSA were you even at the rally last year? Your ‘ concern’ sticks in ma throat. Never a positive thing to say eh? Are you sure you are not a snout?
It’s all down to roman plumbing you see. They didn’t like copper pipes as they made the water taste funny so they used lead pipes instead, which just gave them lead poisoning which made them agressive and stupid. Quod erat demonstrandum.
@ Juteman – Nae problem, hope to meet up with you. Regarding email address its ok, a wee fish in a big sea. Many years ago I worked in a place on the outskirts of Berlin so all the hype about GCHQ is totally true. Personally I couldnt care less because I know I have nothing to hide and I want the best for my daughters and grandaughter to come, predicted on Christmas Day.
@ Marcia – A while back I did some research on trolls and flamers etc and you are quite right, They do get aroused and not only that they keep a tally list on the number of responses they get. It doesnt matter what the response is, its just a tick on the tally sheet.
“By the way Roman dude, stop grandstanding on this thread”
I already said that I’ve made my point and to get back to the positive vibes and excitement.
“Also, I smell shite.”
Get your nappy changed then.
Ker-ching!
FFS Publius, give us a break. This was a happy place till you turned up.
Why don’t you write to a personal letter to Salmond, explaining your point of view and ask him to stand down?
Whining at us going to make one iota of difference – unless, of course, it’s your intention is to kill the thread?
One pops away for a while and then …..anyway I enjoyed the truly communitarian spirit earlier, that’s why we will do this, despite all the negativity, attempts at divide and rule, it’s about a better future Scotland.
“Never a positive thing to say eh?”
Isn’t “I really hope the march is a success” positive?
Anyway I’d argue that trying to make the march more of a success in terms of convincing non-SNP supporters to vote yes is far more of a positive contribution to the independence cause than offering it nothing but unquestioning praise.
But, as I said, I’ve made my point, and as the ‘rev’ said, there’s no need to go on about it – Salmond isn’t going to pull out now so I might as well get behind the march and his domination of it as much as I can.
I don’t understand how this public march works. They seem to have announced the date, the venue and you don’t need to apply to be invited there?
@Archie.
It’s not GCHG I was meaning, that’s a given.
I would be more worried about spam, posting an email address. It happened to me on another forum years ago. I got trashed with shite.
Hopefully we’ll share a pint on the day.
@PCSA
supprime tuum stultiloquium!
Anne McMillan,
Thanks for all your hard work in organising this thing, it’s fabulous!
However now that you are mentioning all these YES stalls etc. that are so obviously and deviously being slipped into the festivities, have you ensured that BetterNO have confirmed that they will be fielding an equal number on the day? Edinburgh Cooncil’s ‘political parity’ Standing Committee do have the power to close the day down if you don’t you know! (weesmiley)
Re-juteman and others concerned at the climb.
Wife and I did a ‘dry run’ the other weekend. Me and my NHS Scotland knees (which replaced the 1941 versions) managed fine.
As lang as it’s nae a race tae the top, I’ll be there.
So if you see an aul’ mannie pechin’ ‘n’ plottin’ – (and possibly cursin’ ‘n’ sweerin’) – that’ll be me!
See ye there!
I think WOS has the same virus that hit The Scotsman and caused their readership to be reduced to 10 trolls with 50 monikers each.
Bagsy I get to man the NO stall 🙂
Morag – Penicuick and Bonnyrigg and Dalkeith have buses running all night if you plan to be late.
Cameron Toll shopping centre has private parking fines for people parking more than 4 hours but the surrounding streets are toll free at the weekend.
I’m thinking Cameron Toll, but in a side street not the shopping centre. Gordon Terrace is usually a good bet on a Saturday. And if the evening does get a bit extended and buses are scarce, it’s not too far for a taxi.
Having listened today to the First Minister I can only suggest it is only die hard Unionists that could possibly not want him to be the main speaker at the rally.
He was statesmanlike ,eloquent ,sincere and delivered a speech of vision hope and brilliance today.
I wonder if any clown suggested 50 years ago that Dr King should not have spoken.
when the ANC were looking for the final end of apartheid would anyone but an Afrikanner have suggested Mandela not speak and allow others to lead the movement.
would Ghandi have been sidelined in the Indian struggle.
Alex Salmond is the only true statesman and giant of politicians in the entire British Islands.
The rest are pygmies ,and spiteful nae users.
Those suggesting he is anything other than genius are Unionists ,no other explanation or excuse.
Hail Alba gu snooker loopy!
Looking forward to this, hoping for better weather than we had for the Mela on Sunday. Wonder if the Orb might play a set for the demo instead?
Still, even if it rains: as a famous Norwegian put it, there’s no such thing as bad weather, only inadequate clothing. Can we have a WoS cagoule?
How about the WOS crew meet/congregate on the steps of the Tron Church at the junction of High Street and North Bridge between 11.00 am & noon?
@Anne McMillan: Many thanks for the hard work that you – and others – have put into organising this event, and I am sure that it will be a stunning success, very much appreciated by (almost ;)) everyone posting here.
Thank you.
Thank you all. TO let you know all stalls are sanctioned at meetings that we have nothing slipped in 😉
Its going to be a great day. Off to do some more work on it so popping away from here but will be back tomorrow to answer any questions you might have.
Thanks to all of you for the support – without people attending it wouldn’t be anything. Its the peoples march and rally so the big thanks goes to you all – not us 😉
Anne.
Oh, Jezerna has a brother. Lovely. Don’t ban, just don’t respond. I could see ‘Jezerna’ becoming a Proper Noun for a certain type of operator. You read it here first.
btw I had blackening russulas, brown birch boletes and a homegrown free range egg for tea. This relates to the March and Rally in the following way: Totally Fantastic!
My oldest Son and I will be meeting up to go on our first independence march .
As my Son stays in Danderhall , I am hoping I can stay with him either the Friday night or the Saturday night so that I can enjoy some of the parties .
All this talk of togas and Roman stuff made me think of Frankie Howerd in “Up Pompeii”. PCSA as Lurkio in the house of Ludicrous Sextus… Titter ye not….
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus says:
3 September, 2013 at 7:22 pm
What does everyone think about the line-up of speakers?
To be honest I’m very disappointed that Salmond couldn’t put his ego and desire for publicity to one side for once and take a back seat this time.
OH FFS!!! Of COURSE Alex Salmond will be there .. he IS the FIRST MINISTER after all!! If it wasn’t for the likes of Alex Salmond and the SNP then there wouldn’t even BE a referendum taking place next year!
So what if some people don’t like him or the SNP, it’s not him or the SNP that they will be voting for… it’s for the emancipation of Scotland from Westminster rule. The time for whether people to vote Alex Salmond and the continuation of an SNP government will be AFTER the Referendum.
I was in two minds whether to respond to this, because “Publius Long Pretentious Latin Named Person” is intent on throwing a damp squib into the euphoria and positive feel good optimistic feeling generated by this thread! Just wish he’d keep his negativity towards the SNP to himself! Probably better that he is ignored.
@PCSA
Anyway, I’ve made my point, there’s no need to go on about it
Best laugh of the night. Are you at the wind-up?
“I was in two minds whether to respond to this”
It’s dead now. Or it was until you brought it back to life 😀
Morag says:
3 September, 2013 at 7:34 pm
Salmond was there last year. He spoke for about three minutes. None of these three minutes was “grandstanding”.
Stu, why do we have to put up with this again?
Agreed!! I’m with you on this Morag! This was a positive enthusiastic thread until the Roman invaded it!
Morag
Just wanted to add my appreciation to Anne. Wish I could be there,but am working, alas.
P.S. Alex Salmond is legend and we are lucky to have him here and now. Ultimately, we live in a democracy and if the people will it, they can vote him out. He nay, of course, elect to retire at some point!
It’s still a positive enthusiastic thread. Plus we get the added benefit of getting better and better at spotting it’s next incarnation, and the sarky put downs are very amusing!
Family SS hoping to attend. If you want to avoid me (e.g. have no interest in polling data or dislike foreigners as per A. Darling)…
Look out for a 6’3″, follicly challenged (No 1) bloke with a saltire, accompanied by a wee 5′ gorgeous lady with a French Tricolour and a mini 6-yr old lass in tricolour/saltire/rampant decor of yet to be finally decided form.
Hi Scottish Skier,
Glad to heabrother rest of the Anderson clan plan to be there.
“Anyway, I’ve made my point, there’s no need to go on about it”
___________
Thank you, there is a god. Now away and slay those undecided voters, we’re right behind you. Just, leave your sword at home, there’s a good chap.
Are Scotrail putting on any extra trains from Queen St as going by the feelings on here they may need to
“Yes, I’m not claiming otherwise, I’m sure he will give a very rousing speech that will fire up all those who already support independence, particularly those who support his party.”
DUH!!! I kinda think the people on this march WILL ALREADY SUPPORT INDEPENDENCE don’t you think??????
Rev Stu, I am a very patient reasonable person, and generally try to give people the benefit of the doubt but I am beginning to get seriously fed up of this Roman invader constantly derailing what are positive enthusiastic threads on here, I’m sure I’m not alone in thinking this!
O/T First Minister unveils new legislative plans as part of Programme for Government.
The 13 planned new government Bills are:
RCAHMS and Historic Scotland Merger Bill
Courts Reform Bill
Damages Bill
Licensing Bill
Food Standards Scotland Bill
Mental Health and Adults with Incapacity Amendment Bill
Budget Bill
Revenue Scotland and Tax Powers Bill
Bankruptcy Consolidation Bill
Conclusion of Contracts Bill
Community Empowerment and Renewal Bill.
Scottish Welfare Fund Bill
Housing Bill
There is a very sickly smell of Hogs, Ermine, Glenfiddich, Green leather, Carribean Rum and utter pish wafting through this forum now.
Will Hamish be there?
Hen
For Foulkes sake!
‘I am beginning to get seriously fed up of this Roman invader constantly derailing what are positive enthusiastic threads on here, I’m sure I’m not alone in thinking this!”
To be fair, I’m not that huge a fan of people dragging out “troll” arguments long after the actual alleged troll has stopped and everyone else is trying to get back to the original topic. Let it go now, please.
@Rev Stu
I presume you have seen the fake Twitter account of eh yourself? Do you know who is behind it?
Last year, Margo said take 10 more,i cant manage that but 2 more friends are coming as a result of the photographs of last year,i know of many others that will be there that couldn’t make it.
We are going to be pleasantly surprised.
Get an overspill area for the overspill area.
😉
I’ll be there. 800 mile round trip…should be quite an adventure. For me it doesn’t matter who speaks, its just important that we all gather just to say hello and show that we are not alone. Its going to be great!
Sorry not to be going again this year – being self employed I have to ‘make hay when the sun shines’. Just make sure you have lot’s of videos up on youtube etc for those of us that can’t make it.
The highlights for me would be meeting you lot, an inspiring speech from the FM and of course a wee song from Jai McDowall.
May the sun shine on you all on the 21st.
Of course I’ll be there. Thanks for asking.
Hamish (alter ego)
me and my pal who thinks he looks like elvis booked coach from stirling tnite. he is looking out his saltire speedos
“I presume you have seen the fake Twitter account of eh yourself? Do you know who is behind it? “
Yes and yes.
On behalf of my friend on Craggy Island who supports our campaign for independence and donated to the Wings fundraising, but is devastated she can’t come to the rally, I’ve agreed to wear her very own words of encouragement on my t-shirt (if I can get somebody to print it). It’ll just say…..”Ah G’wan” 🙂
HighlandMartin says:
“Will this be like one of those Better Together public marches”
Nope. Firstly it’s not July and secondly there won’t be any flute bands 🙂
Are we congregating at a particular point and time prior to the march?
I won’t be able to make it this year but have a look at photographs from last year, you may just see yourself in them…
We will be there, en famille. Missed it last year and can’t wait to bring both kids this year – we have just booked our train tickets from Glasgow 😀
We will have no ‘see you Jimmy’ hats or giant saltires unfortunately. The two weans will want a whistle and lanyard each and my husband will grumble a bit about potential hearing loss. It would be a blast if we met some fellow WoS folk.
@Rev Stu
Is it who I think it is (former poster?)
Back on topic, does anyone know where the politicians are going to deliver their speeches from? I think maybe near the big pillars towards the middle.
Nope that didn’t work – sorry don’t know how to link file 🙁 back to the drawing board.
Handandshrimp.
I’ve been suggesting this for a wee while on here now, for all of a couple of hours.
Being me, I favour a pub.
Conan
We will need to agree on somewhere as there will be no chance when thousands are cramming onto the Royal Mile.
Re meeting place what about World’s End, pub?
Jeeps, if all of the 300’s odd commentators bring one or two family members/pals, it will be a big crowd! Great.
I’m surprised the police are OK with this on a Saturday. It’s going to disrupt both shopping and traffic, I’d have thought.
Glad to heabrother rest of the Anderson clan plan to be there.
Damn, I’ll have to behave myself.
🙂
I’ll be wearing my ‘Leith Says Aye’ t-shirt and this time I won’t be standing on my own!
@Stewart Bremner
Sent you a note via your site t’other day, if you got it, a yes/no reply fine, if you didn’t let me know.
A Balharry
I like the idea of meeting in a certain area. Are we going to try to do that?
Albalha says:
3 September, 2013 at 10:27 pm
Re meeting place what about World’s End, pub?
That’s in the Canongate, the other side of the North Bridge.
The Albanach is right on the edge of the High St and Cockburn St.
@Conan
You have the right idea the Albanach it is. Are we all agreed?
The Albanach is easy to get to from Waverley Station. It is certainly a cunning plan…how many of us are there?
Joybell says: I like the idea of meeting in a certain area. Are we going to try to do that?
Meeting beneath the WoS banner suits me (though pub later suits me too).
@Albalha, I think it will have to be chewed on for a wee bit longer.
@HandS
Well as many of us that want to be, so far I’ll say YES, you and @Conan, sure there are others too?
The problem is the beer’s not so good in most of these places – also trying to get in somewhere on the Royal Mile might be tricky. The Bow Bar on Victoria Street (just off George IV Bridge) is renown for its beers though and is only one street away. Spoilt for choice.
@Conan
What not just make a decision? We could be here until the 21st at thus rate!
MajorBloodnok, I intend to start off as I go on. Pub first.
I’m up for meeting at the worlds end
@Conan – I admire your determination and fortitude. Have we met?
@ MajorBloodnok,
The Bow Bar has some great beer, perhaps not the quietest place. It isn’t very big and lacks seating.
Re pub herding cats comes to mind.
Don’t mind me. The most room though would be at the Three Sisters in the Cowgate (there’s a courtyard) – maybe we should just do a tour…!
@Albalha, three or four people a march don’t make.
It’ll keep the round down though.
Sorry can’t be with you all, up in Scotland for wedding week before and business in London the following weekend. Will be with you all in spirit.
great news! my wee ma 85 and voting yes from strong labour background.
Interesting conversation with Glasgow based sister moves in many circles, doesn’t frequent the indy blogs or websites talking about the huge amount of quiet “yes” voters in Glasgow.
Wasn’t sure if I was going to come down but getting quite excited about it after reading through all the posts! I’ll be coming down on the bus from Inverness. Hope to see you all there.
Last year there was two of us who went through, now there are five of us. That number is also reflected in the number of buses that are coming from the Paisley area, last year one bus was enough for the lot of us, this year there are many buses booked to bring through a huge number of excited and enthusiastic Nationalists.
@MajorBloodnok
Edinburgh?
I’m good with Edinburgh
Can we have a poll 🙂
OT. I just heard wee Ruthie accuse AS of presenting ” a deliberately uninspiring picture of Scotland” or something like that. Projection, much?
Good Lord, can I have a copy of his diet sheet? He looks five years younger.
Don’t know if Mr Cameron has ever read history, or if anyone has noticed, but
You could always ask Blair!
https://twitter.com/blairmcdougall/status/375009093435801600
Marchmont
Why is cameron not having a commemeration?
Pub sounds good (pub always sounds good). Somewhere with easy access to high st, but tucked out the way of much traffic, and small so that it increases the chance of seeing a WoSer, would be good.
Just ordered myself a 5′ x 3′ lion rampant and 4m flag pole for the march. As of tonight I now have 3 colleagues from work committed to attending with me 🙂
Working on the rest!
@southernscot
That’s why we can do this, my mum also been convinced, they are the secret weapon, can be convinced and will turn out on the day.
MajorBloodnok
We could meet at the Brewdog in the Cowgate.
Then we could walk up Niddry St and pass the Salvation Army hostel there.
And see the people outside it.
And vote for Independence with vehemence.
@Morag
Are you talking about A Salmond, if so he’s on the 5:2 diet, 2 days of circa 600 calories the others recommended intake.
@rabb
Are you going on the Kirky bus with that?
Well, whatever he’s doing, it’s working.
Oh yeah. Expect a run on Wings T-shirts.
Apologies for the ‘teddies’. Fill the hill.
O/T. Watching Newsnicht – believe me that’s rare. ‘It’s too much, it’s too large’ says Osbourne re. oil. It really goes from the sublime to the utterly ridiculous. Am I actually living in a parallel universe. And why do they keep talking about ‘keeping the Queen’? She’s not just the Queen of England? (and yes, I’m a republican).
From Parliament. Jono says same old stuff, supported by Tory ‘Leader’ and LibDem ‘Leader’ parroting the same. Dear Lord. Another session of this. The Unionists continuing to interminably demean the Scots Parliament – no Opposition, no Democracy, no Vision.
@Morag
@Albalha
Yes, I thought he was looking a lot better, too. On the other hand, there was a clip of Johann Lamont speaking and I thought she had lost weight as well, but I thought she looked a bit ill.
Comical edition of Newsnight there. Input from the Daily Record political editor who disclosed that Labour are planning an attack on SG on bedroom tax, that same editor omitting to mention that his own newspaper are attacking Labour councils for forced evictions. Then an anti SNP headline from the Daily Mail.
Our BBC opponents do indeed lack the self awareness to understand how farcically Pravda-esque they appear. All good for us.
Handandshrimp/Conan.
I suggested earlier meeting on the steps of the Tron Church at the junction of High Street and North Bridge between 11.00 am & noon?
That would put the WOS contingent + Wings flag at the head of the column – Those of you with time to spare could still get to a pub beforehand.
Just watched the First Minister being interviewed on Scotland Tonight and Newsnight Scotland. Alex was absolutely first class, without a doubt, one of the most able politicians on the planet.
Put. Up. A. Post. With. The. Pub 0oooh a poll!
@fordie
Jono – I like that. JoNo sounds about right. Oh no, no JoNo!
I am dropping my dog off at her “Auntie’s” in Fife, parking at Aberdour and getting the train to Waverly. I don’t do pubs but I am sure that I will meet up with some fellow Wingers along the way.
Fingers crossed for some good weather and lets show the naysayers what they are up against.
Saw Lamont on Newsnight Scotland.
That haircut she’s sporting made her look a dead ringer for Wee Burnie from Rab C Nesbitt.
@Training Day – You are right comedy gold. The guy from the Daily Rag was even good enough to tell us it would be a “three pronged attack” on the Bedroom Tax. He must be an SNP mole. You just couldn’t make it up.
Will be there with a few folk, including my grandkids. BTW suggest to anyone with kids to get into the body of the crowd since last year some U-thugs caused an incident at the back of the rally. Assuming, if there is any repeat, that they will again not want to imbed themselves within the crowd – hence the advice.
Will probably have the Lion Mouse banner there again.
@jimbo
I think there’s a fair amount of nonsense being talked about the pub, your idea sounds fine imo.
Anyway as @man in the jar says people will no doubt meet up one way or another.
“Rev, do you mean you PERSONALLY will be there…?”
Yes, me personally. With my Wings flag.
How about a visual aid – like a spoof movie poster someone might have done? 😉
@Albalha
I reckoned it would be a good spot as it’s easy to find, there’s room on the steps away from the pavement for people with kids, and it is very near to the point the march will start from.
@Jeannie +
“Yes, I thought he was looking a lot better, too. On the other hand, there was a clip of Johann Lamont speaking and I thought she had lost weight as well, but I thought she looked a bit ill.”
I don’t think that Lamont will make it to the referendum. I reckon that she will “take a back seat due to ill health” or the old favourite “To spend more time with her family” don’t envy them! Shame because I think that she is one of the Yes campaigns better assets. It just isn’t possible to carry all that hatred and bile around 24 / 7 without it having an impact on your wellbeing. The pressure will get to her in the end.
The simple answer to where to meet is to ask Stu where he intends to spread out the banner… Where the banner is, the rest shall gather.
Tron steps sounds good to me. Stu?
Re a pub for apre march. the Voodoo Rooms is a big comfortable pub off the main drags but close to Calton Hill. The proprietor is a sympathiser.
I hope that Stu is going to stand at the exit and shake everyone’s hand on the way out! 😉
@Juteman – Spot on. Beware of Romans bearing gifts, they are worse than the Greeks!
Speaking of diets, I have lost half a stone by delivering flyers for the march. Re getting there ,park outside the controlled centre and bus in if travelling by car . Park and ride is a good option.
Oh, and on Newsnight, a word to David Clegg of the Daily Record. Davy boy, you need to understand that the BBC are going to call on you big time to punt the Project Fear line in the next few months. Now, when you can do that unopposed, as you did tonight, there’s no reason to be so abjectly nervous and inept as you were. The BBC is your pal, Davy..
I do think it’s a good idea to register WoS as a Group. Decision up to Rev, of course. Thoughts?
And a meeting point for WoSers please. Some WoSers might be affiliated with other groups and/or not and/or wish to walk under WoS flag/banner and/or other. Which is OK.
@Albaha You could see how it goes …..at least in Edinburgh there are a fair few wide green open spaces.
It’s more an issue of having a “safe place” to go than claustrophobia for me (though that’s also an issue), but I’m going to see how it goes. My brother-in-law’s mam has a flat in Edinburgh, so I’m going to see if we can get the key as a base camp. My mam also has her health issues (going deaf, peripheral vision loss etc), so I may end up going with the other disabled folk. Functional mobility isn’t much use when your nerves freeze up.
@Edinscot: Tarranaich – so sorry to hear that but you really would be amongst one big family there as i can testify from last years rally, the friendlieness and sheer occasion was something that had me buzzing for at least a week afterwards. Whatever you decide to do, you are still a part of it all right here. Listening to you all here fair makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up.
I have no doubt whatsoever! Unfortunately anxiety disnae listen to common sense, but I do know that if things are difficult, I have nothing to fear from the folk there. We’re all there for the same reason, after all, and all my dealings with Yes-people have been happy and optimistic. I was briefly in Edinburgh seeing friends from Switzerland, and they were fair taken with the place.
BetterTogether have just announced a few results from a poll they’ve had conducted by TNS (who else?).
“Record low” support for independence at 25%. Downhearted? Don’t be – they’re also claiming only 55% of SNP voters would vote for independence.
*suffocates with laughter*
https://twitter.com/UK_Together/status/375031087044780033/photo/1
“Can I ask you in all honesty though, what is your particular problem with AS?”
Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus:
“In terms of independence my problem is that I think he is damaging our chances of winning the referendum.”
Without Alex Salmond, there would not have been a referendum in the first place.
How come the SNP, headed by Alex Salmond, got 47% of the vote and an unprecedented majority under proportional representation?
Alex Salmond is hated by the Unionist media and Unionist politicians, not by the people of Scotland.
*suffocates with laughter*
The battle of the polls has begun. We’ve hit the year mark just about, so off we go.
So our Wings poll will come out in the middle of the battle of the polls. Be interesting to see the MSM ignore it this time.
Two edged sword for BT. All their follower will get complacent as the battle is won surely. What was all the noise about, the UK is OK. Back to shooting the grice and any bloody nats who get in the way.
Handclapping – well, they’ve done a pretty good job of giving yesterday’s Panelbase one the cold shoulder. Clearly they were waiting for this one to come out to carry on Sunday’s narrative…
If I was an editor who had pinned his colours to the mast I’d be bricking it. With the whole MSM against Yes and they are not being rolled over the backlash will be terrible. They may prevent their readers from knowing but they do and they also know their readers have other sources for info now.
I’ll probably be marching with Yes East Renfrewshire (wearing my Arc of Prosperity T-shirt, if VistaPrint will deliver it in time), but I’ll pop over to the WoS flag when I see it. Looking forward to meeting many of you there!
“I do think it’s a good idea to register WoS as a Group. Decision up to Rev, of course. Thoughts?”
I emailed the organisers on Sunday doing just that. They’ve said they’ll add us to the list ‘as soon as possible’.
I’ll be coming along as a first-timer, on my own, and would love to meet up with the rest of the WoS gang. Not fussed if it’s the Tron, the World’s End or the Albanach, so long as I know where to go!
Can’t wait!
I’m going to have to wear my highest heels in order to spot you all, but that will make walking over the setts a tad tricky.
Can’t wait for this years rally, last years was absolutely brilliant, niece is flying up night before from Southampton, just to be there, now that is what I call dedication to the cause. Really hope to meet up with some wingers.
Oh no, another poll…….lol
suggest those coming in from M8 corridor use the park and Ride at Ingliston at the airport.
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/48/park_and_ride_schemes/1170/park_and_ride/4]
I have been reading these mille et un comments from people going to the Hill and, bearing in mind I missed last year, I have been biting my nails thinking about flying up for this one.
It is no cheap deal for me as I live two airline flights away from Edinburgh and would need to get an hotel.
I have decided, feck it and am trying to find the cheapest option for flights, even if it is via Uzbekistan and the hotel even it is a Sally Army penny hingy.
Will let WoS readers know if it it on.
Ok. Here we go again.
TNS-BMRB
Alternative Headlines:
Yes steady within variance
Possible drop in No but possibly unchanged too
Voters shy about support for independence when polled face to face or on the telephone
Only 32% definitely planning to Vote No in reasonable agreement with IPSOS MORI and Panelbase
Latest poll: 30% Yes, 51% No, 19% DK (amongst certain to vote)
Only 32% of total electorate certain to vote No
Ok, before dealing with each, TNS methodology:
I trust they are still doing face to face organised, as understand, by landline. This makes their method the most outdated of all; nobody does this anymore as it is very difficult to get a representative demographic (over 20% of homes have no landline and many use it for broadband only) and shy factors.
Sampling variance means the numbers, if unchanged, should be within +/-3% of each other 19 times out of 20. This actually means values could be 6% different yet no shift had actually occurred.
In October 2012 and January 2013, TNS got 28% Yes twice. They then got 33%. Then 30%, now 25%. All these values are within variance. Interestingly, TNS and MORI show the greatest variance; a problem with telephone/face to face polls due to sampling methods; obtaining an identical, good demographic each time is very difficult; hence pollsters moving to online.
The same could be said for No. It may have dropped, it may have not. Again, within variance. If it has dropped, it would be in line with all the others / the general trend.
Ok, now shy factor. I know some people find it odd, but the Tory shy factor was a big issue in 1992. And people lie all the time to pollsters. Here’s a classic:
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/images/2001graph.jpg
Up to 60% Labour just after they got 43% in the 1997 landslide… I voted/support Labour. Honestly; I didn’t vote Tory!
You can never prove a shy factor, but consider this:
When, sitting alone at home with their laptop or smartphone, and an online survey pops the indy question, ~80% of SNP voter say Yes.
When a nice lady from MORI London phones them up, ~60% of SNP voters answer Yes
When someone from TNS phones them up, comes around to their home and asks them while starting them in the face, only ~50% of SNP voters say Yes.
Independence has been demonised / ridiculed by the MSM. Is the above really a surprise?
If someone has an alternative explanation as to how the above arises, I’d be keen to know.
Now I don’t have the tables yet, but TNS says it’s wide open. Funny that, as MORI have been reporting great polls for No yet recently came out and said it was still wide open too. How come?
Well, MORI concluded only 56% were totally decided and planning to vote. Only 36% were saying they were definite No’s.
Seems TNS have found the same for a similar demographic.
They say only 62% are certain to vote and half of this are No. This means only 32% are saying they’re certain to vote and planning to vote No.
So, here we are again with only ~1/3 certain to vote No.
I’ve been saying this is probably the best No can achieve for some time now. The challenge for Yes is to match this – which would bring total turnout to similar to UK GE’s and then get some disillusioned who haven’t been voting out too. The first part shouldn’t be hard, the second is what they should focus on.
@BTP
There’s going to be two very nervous residents of a popular Edinburgh tourist attraction 😉
Good luck in your travels.
Looking forward to the 21st. Me and my partner will be attending. It sounds like there will be a huge turn out. Can’t wait.
Thanks to Albalha who posted the link to party superstore. I’ve gone from looking at the usual flags, to looking at blue wigs and all manner of fantastic items. Can’t decide if I should get the saltire contact lenses for the occasion or not?
On a slightly different note, sorry Rev, GMB have cut funding to Labour from £1.2million to just £150,000. That’s gotta hurt.
Ordered the T-shirt.
“Eh’m voatin’ eh!”
@scottish_skier says:
Magnus Gardham in Herald at pains to point out that Panebase poll commissioned by SNP but no mention of who commissioned the Mori poll.
Just to simplify things a little.
In Scotland, ~64% has been the turnout post 1997 (New Labour killed democracy, it was 76% before and can be again!).
About half of those who regularly vote are planning to vote and vote No. That, as noted, equates to at best 1/3 of the electorate.
This is why you find on the doorsteps 1/3 No, 1/3 likely/possible Yes and 1/3 ‘Dunno’.
If we get a standard GE turnout, it will likely be a very close race. If we get Higher, then Yes will benefit and likely win.
Yes should target 45% yes vs 30% No taking turnout to what it used to be before New Labour. That would give you a 60% majority.
Southernscot
Scotland with 4 Pandas?
Hello there, long time reader, first time poster and looking forward to seeing everyone (if I can get time off work that weekend).
Alas, I shall be unable to attend this year as I am getting married the night before and will be away off on honeymoon.
I was proud to attend last year and the atmosphere was electric, with the sheer size of the march lifting the spirits of all those who attended!
I hope it all goes well for you all!
P.S. You can add 1 for the 2014 March as I will be there definitely!
Magnus Gardham
Is a complete irrelevance. If Mr Gardham and co have achieved anything, it’s to create a situation where No are complacent as they can’t help but feel polls are showing they’ll win. Ergo, we can expect no change in tactics and that’s exactly what we want at this stage.
The polls are actually all very consistent when you ignore headline figures and dig into them. It’s just methodology and interpretation that’s yielding different answers. That’s why both TNS and MORI, having apparently both been showing great figures for No, following a big of deeper digging, conclude it’s actually wide open with a year to go.
If I was No, I’d be worried and thinking why can’t we get our solid base above 1/3 (status quo). Yes should be thinking ‘We can do this’.
@BTP
Are you hearing from your panda network there’s been a birth in Edinburgh?
Re accommodation Joppa, just beside Portobello has decent B and B’s, just a thought.
Alas, I shall be unable to attend this year as I am getting married the night before and will be away off on honeymoon.
Sod the marriage man. This is far more important.
😉
Congrats.
Hi All,
Am enjoying this thread, even with the silliness from the Punic Wars,
Yes I shall go. Shall be back from Islay Jazz Festival before then and “control” shall still be in E Africa so shall be alone. Albanach is appropriate, even in name only but there you go. Hope to meet many people.
Hail Alba
@Robyn
The eye wear sounds a bit spooky to me
and @sneekyboy
Congratulations etc
Scotland’s one and only psephologist (seemingly) has highlighted a major flaw in the poll – namely that less people said they voted SNP in 2011 than said they voted Labour. Of course, that’s what weighting is for… but they didn’t weight the results according to the 2011 OR 2010 vote.
Pretty major flaw, I would think.
http://blog.whatscotlandthinks.org/2013/09/now-the-dont-knows-have-it-new-tns-bmrb-poll/
Taranaich – Not to worry we know you’ll you marching with us in spirit and good will. I’m sure the Rev will do a great report on the march and youtube will be full of the folk’s recordings.
Eyes on the prize 🙂
@ Robyn Torry Quine – Saltire Contact Lenses? I never saw them. Incidentally the flags at Scotlands Bothy on George Street are 2pounds dearer than online. Looked at them earlier this week.
@Scott Minto
Alas, I shall be unable to attend this year as I am getting married the night before and will be away off on honeymoon.
Whit? What sort of an excuse is that?
Congratulations, Scott. All the best to you on the big day!
booked it €81 and a LOT of Airmiles.
I think the flight goes back via Cardiff!!!
@ SS – Wasnt there a movie called ‘Wedding Crashers’? I think Scott should be very very scared 🙂
@albalha
Sorry to be a pest, but I now can’t find that website you referred me to for the nice stuff. Could you post it again, please? Ta
Unfortunately the flight is already booked too and from Glasgow, see above.
Thanks for the suggestion.
need to find a daft relative who let me sleep on the couch. I have a few daft relatives.
More people who voted Labour than SNP?
Only 55% of people who voted SNP support independence?
Hard to get too worked up by this poll if these are the numbers coming out. Scottish Skier is bang on imo- lots of folk reluctant to admit to supporting independence when asked face-to-face.
Jeannie says:
@rabb
Are you going on the Kirky bus with that?
Jeannie, I managed to persuade a few work colleagues to go too. We’re meeting up at Croy by the looks of things and getting the train over.
If anyone in that area is travelling alone then your welcome to join our group 🙂
Albalha
re the new Panda
I am the donor.
@jeannie
Here you go http://www.partysuperstores.co.uk/
Discovered it when I googled helmets with wings for @archie (not erchie), I just can’t resist a search!
highlighted a major flaw in the poll
I haven’t seen the tables yet. If that’s true, then very interesting. Would suggest No is dropping and Yes not as headline suggests.
@albalha
Thanks for that.
Hi Archie, you have to use the search facility to find them, but they are there. It’s a wee treasure trove of a site. In 2 minds about the lenses though.
Where on George Street is Scotland’s Bothy? Is it new? Have to say I don’t shop outwith the main centres much these days (and I hardly shop at all as it is.) It was news to me about Bitter Thegither having a shop on Union Street!
DonDeeLugs Welcome to the wings family and congratulation to Scott on his upcoming marriage .
I cant believe just how much this site has grown in the last year , it will be sites like wings and all the hard work by the foot soldiers that will ensure a YES victory in 2014 .
As others have said we need to keep our eyes on the prize and keep fighting for every vote right up until 10pm on the 18/09/14 .
@Robyn
Could this be you?
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Scotland-Saltire-fashion-contact-lenses-FREE/dp/B0043NO3XU
I was on holiday last the time of last years march and so my dad was in a party of one. This time, including myself, we have 10 humans and 2 dugs!
I have a couple of questions though and would be grateful if anyone could answer them? We’re all travelling from Dundee and I’ll be picking up my dad and his wife from Grangemouth en route. Where’s the best place to park? My dad doesn’t walk too well these days (he’s 78) so it would be good if there was a sensible place to drop him off perhaps a bit closer to the hill? Also, flags and poles – where to buy and what to buy? Is there a Wings flag we can buy?
I believe this march and rally will be a genuinely life-changing event for us and future generations.
and another thing – all Intersport shops in the Angus area are having closing down sales. They’re selling a rather fetching rain jacket by Regatta in a blue which is as close to the ‘real’ blue I’ve seen. Price reduced to £30. I know of course the weather is going to be glorious but this is Scotland. Best to be prepared. And no, I don’t work for Intersport, lol.
@albalha
Discovered it when I googled helmets with wings for @archie (not erchie), I just can’t resist a search!
Looks like archie (not erchie) is in for a big surprise on the 21st. Albalha – you are naughty, but I like you 🙂
Sneekyboy,
and I thought my excuse was weak!
Congratulations, hope yous have a brilliant time!
Scott – surely this is the IDEAL Honeymoon?
@Bubbles
You’ll coming in Glasgow Road, Corstorphine way
What about the Ingliston park and ride, don’t know if that suits
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/48/park_and_ride_schemes/1170/park_and_ride/4
See Herald Headline this morning …. What agenda are they on ????
Jeeezzzuusss
@jeannie
I, honestly, am not sure I get that, slow on the double entendre up take, I’m afraid!
Just on the pub suggestions, somewhere relatively quiet (and relatively cheap for that bit of town!) would be the Jinglin Geordie on Fleshmarket Close. It’s not massive, but it’s completely tucked out the way of most footfall. Fleshmarket Close runs between Market Street and Cockburn Street and is at the side of the Scotsman hotel. You’d be a 5-10 minute walk away from the start point.
@wee162
On the pubs I think the list of possibles is now around 30!
@ Albalha
That’s worth considering but I’d really prefer together the car a bit closer as it can work as a rest station.
@ Jeannie – Behave ladies 😉
@ Robyn – The Bothy shop is at the far end of George St. same side as PartyMania. As for BT place on Union St, I believe its up at the Holburn junction area but apparently its just an office or orifice.
scottish_skier says:
4 September, 2013 at 8:36 am
Ok. Here we go again.
Sorry just found this cheers, still not buying Herald !!
@Bubbles
Not going to be easy to get that close I wouldn’t have thought, depends how close you mean, of course.
@Bubbles
This is from the main rally website, also one of the organisers, Anne McMillan, I think, was on the thread yesterday at some point, you could ask her, pretty sure she left her contact details
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/48/park_and_ride_schemes/1170/park_and_ride/4
Me and ma wee lassie were there last year, this year ma wife and son are coming anaw, plus 3 friends, this is gonny be so big it will be impossible for us to be ignored. Great how our struggle is attracting attention from around the world,hope to see the Waloons, Venetians, and Catalans out in force again,these people have more respect for Scotland than many of our fellow scots, especially those in the bitter together camp. Canny wait to see how the biased t.v and news media try and get away with putting any negative spin oan this wan, we are like a tidal wave ,and they are about to be drowned !!
Sorry wrong link, here it is
http://independencerally.com/main/?page_id=79
Can’t wait! Travelling to Edinburgh on the North Ayrshire SNP bus with Mrs Fairliered.
Hope to meet some of you – and especially Rev Stu!
Remember – forget Red Bull – only Rev Stu gives you wings!
If the list of pubs to visit keeps on growing, i’ll probably book the last train back to Dundee! 🙂
I am surprised TNS ran with their results if their sample was so out of kilter with the 2011 election result. Where did they conduct their face to face polling a Better Together meeting?
Might explain the large number of don’t knows 😉
translating the latest TNS poll results based on what percentage each party got in the 2011 elections, the yes is on a steady as she goes 31% (working shown below)
poll SNP, yes – 55%
2011 election SNP, 45%
translates to 24.75% for Yes in 2014
poll Labour yes – 14%
2011 election Labour, 32%
translates to 4.48% for Yes in 2014
poll Lib-Dem, yes – 11%
2011 election Lib-Dem, 8%
translates to 0.88% for Yes in 2014
poll Tory, yes – 5%
2011 election Tory, 14%
translates to 0.7% for Yes in 2014
Total Yes – 30.81
@Bubbles
St James’ Car park is not to far off the route.
@ Conan
That’s the one I was considering. I’m giving a lot of thought to hiring a mini-bus for it too.
Conan
e-mail sent
For Scottish Skier.
So is it the case that with a roughly weighted TNS poll that both the Yes and No vote are similar at the moment?
@Bubbles
Also Greenside Place is a possibility (although it can fill up with Saturday shoppers)
http://en.parkopedia.co.uk/parking/carpark/greenside_place/eh1/edinburgh/
Gillie
I haven’t crunched the numbers but I would guess if you weight the results it will show Yes rising slightly and No falling a fair bit but with a rather large pot of don’t knows. Not as encouraging for us as the Panelbase poll but more worrying for No as their vote is peeling off to don’t knows in hefty numbers. I’m sure SS is thumping away on his abacus as we talk.
Drive carefully.
http://www.carnewschina.com/2011/07/20/100-km-traffic-jam-in-northern-china/
Scott Minto (Aka Sneekyboy) says:
“Alas, I shall be unable to attend this year as I am getting married the night before and will be away off on honeymoon.”
Some excuse!
Seriously, though, congratulations and wishing you all the best.
Having been married for 37 years I can tell you I’m never doing it again!
For Scottish Skier.So is it the case that with a roughly weighted TNS poll that both the Yes and No vote are similar at the moment?
Tables are out. Will look at these later.
But yes the 2011 vote is way out meaning the demographic is not representative. Labour are over represented by +7% of the electorate with SNP voters down 8% of the electorate. That’s very big and explains why it’s on the lower side for Yes.
What’s very encouraging is that this means the No is highly likely to have fallen from their last poll quite a bit with the Yes actually up.
As the SNP polled over 900,000 votes to Labour’s 630,000 at the 2011 election a poll which is drawn from a majority of people who voted Labour is completely valueless.
In fact I believe phone polling is now valueless as a very unrespresentative subset – lower middle class/middle aged and older are the vast bulk of those accessible.
Most of my politically active friends are not in the phone book and many of them no longer have landlines.
It is worth remembering also that the polls still show SNP at least 15% clear of Labour at the moment so this poll is seriously wrong
Aye, quick table check, adjustment and that’s a likely small rise for Yes with No falling.
Solid No at best 30%.
Fits nicely with the general trend once corrected for 2011 vote.
I spent last night in Glasgow and asked a woman in Sainsburys Central what was the best paper to buy for what was on that night in Glasgow.
“Sorry, son, ah cannae read so I don’t know”.
We have to remember that people who are illiterate have to be reached out to as well as they are beyond the reach of both the Internet and printed press,
O/T completely
Talking of double entendres, Albalha
A young lady walks up to a bar and the barman asks her what she wants. She asks for a double entendre, so he gave her one.
Sorry
Back to the rally
@seasickdave
Yes, I agree, that’s why I have been going on about, billboards, visual posters, leaflets etc. Maybe encourage literacy classes to use the forms as part of teaching.
@juteman pointed out, at the time, folks who’re not registered to vote need to be reached as well. So community centres. Adult Education units etc etc.
@DaveMcEwanHill
Aye back to the rally!
Regarding the recent polls – you’d think the NO campaign would want accurate information; or maybe they do understand what is going on but for them it is more important to project to the public (or at least to their core supporters) that they are appearing to win, even if their not.
In fact a lot of what the NO campaign and particularly Labour is doing seems to be aimed more at stopping their own support melting away rather than trying to actually win hearts and minds in the referendum debate.
The problem for them is that the notion of independence is becoming normalised (which they have spend decades trying to prevent) and as soon as a majority of Scots realise that then they are dead in the water. And the long referendum campaign is the perfect way for people to find out the truth. Genius.
And I didn’t know TNS just randomly chapped doors and then asked what many people consider very private and are often reticent about admitting in public, particularly if they don’t know what the view of the person asking is. I figured they at least phoned up random numbers and arranged an interview.
No wonder they have one of the lowest Yes score and abnormally low levels of Yes in e.g. SNP voters (only 5 in 10 admitting they support indy compared to 8 in 10 for anonymous online polls).
If they randomly knocked doors it is very easy to randomly knock the doors in the areas you know will give you the result you want.
I thought polling companies had stopped this sort of nonsense. I worked for a polling company a good number of years ago for a few days when this sort of nonsense went on
scottish_skier
You’ve put your finger on something very significant. This is why YES car stickers and YES window stickers are very important. Identification helps the unsure.
@sneekyboy
Congratulations. All the best.
It is a curious aspect of the No campaign that they spend so much time attacking the SNP, and at the same time go on about SNP voters not supporting independence. How can they possible say that they are trying to attract SNP voters to their cause, when they spend so much time denigrating the party they vote for?
I wear my Yes badge most of the time, coupled with my strong London accent I find that many people admit to being tempted to vote Yes, the No voters certainly find some of their assumptions to be inaccurate!
I think Conan the Librarian and I will be meeting in the Albanach on Saturday before the march. If nobody else turns up we may have to form a splinter group.
The Popular Peoples’ Font for Wings over Scotland unless some other dastardly splinter group in another howf has bagged that.
If anyone is interested on the day I will be wearing a white T or sweatshirt (weather determinate) carrying a Bugger (the Panda) logo and an orange shirt over. Even the colour blind and illiterate could make out that out.
@BTP
What is a BTP logo? A panda size cardboard cut out?
Albalha
Look at my Gravatar.
That is really me, honestly. No blue suede shoes with orange soles this time as, last time in the Merchant City, someone thought I was a cocaine dealer.
@Bugger
For God’s sake don’t go accosting Alan Cochrane thinking it’s me!
Well how do you think I got my name?
Ok I believe you. I’ll maybe make it to the Albanach before the march, though I’m at the Scottish Trade Fair, the Sunday/Monday, so will see how quickly I can get set up on the Saturday morning.
@Major Bloodnok
Yes, the long campaign is definitely normalising the idea of independence – I was in the States earlier this year and met up with someone I knew from Edinburgh who’d been living there since 2006; she asked about the referendum and I gave her a brief summary of what was going on, mentioning how the MSM were all absolutely dead set against it. To which she said ‘Of course! Nobody in their right mind…’ then tailed off when I must have looked, to her surprise, like I wasn’t going to agree with her. So it might still go with people who are out of the loop; but people here as we all know are getting used to the idea, even if they don’t (yet) support it, and this is what we rightly call a culture shift. Whatever happens next year, attitudes are not going back the way they used to be. That bird has flown.
Ok – I’ve made a note of the Albanach then. Anywhere else I’ve to go?
The Panda enclosure?
Back in 2011, when I realised how long the campaign was inevitably going to be, I trembled in my shoes a bit. I knew it was going to be a very rocky ride indeed. But there’s no other way to do it. It’s not going any differently from what I expected, and I expect a decent majority for yes next year.
Re the normalising of things, somebody asked, at some point, (I spend too much time on here!), what kind of revolution this was.
It’s simply, imo, a grassroots revolution, I don’t mean by that only one group but those of us from all backgrounds that don’t buy the BS that the various Scottish cliques, on all sides, have us believe about Scotland.
Those who want to dictate the rules of the game. More and more people are realising there’s a paucity of talent in our media, politics, society and that we’re fed up. We know we can do better, that we owe it to ourselves and everyone in Scotland to make it better.
@Bugger the Panda
The Panda enclosure?
After what happened to the last panda?
I was the donor, the surrogate.
Hi Albalha, those are the lenses I was on about. Could be me on the 21st, minus the quality eye makeup though. If I even attempted doing my eyes up like that, I’d end up looking like I’d gone ten rounds with Mike Tyson.
@Robyn
Bit like @BTP?
500!!!