Wings Over Scotland

@Charles Hodgson 1.45 am

“Leaving independence for Scotland aside for a moment(!), I would literally GO TO WAR with people like FPJ, Andy Ellis, Hatstand et al, on here. This is civilisational stuff. What is left when we lose our basic freedoms with the consent and encouragement of idiots such as these?”

Never a good sign you following the ususal flat earther’s MO of posting in the wee small hours, doubtless in your cups or frantically bashing the keyboard sitting in your kecks in yer mammy’s spare room while eating Crunchy Nut corn flakes from the box Charles.

The fact you would LITERALLY go to war with people who disagree with you woo-woo is worrying enough in itself of course. Rational people don’t talk that way and those who think that way are more to be pitied than laughed at. You’re not losing basic freedoms, you’re just being asked to take reasonable precautions. Hopefully Darwin’s Law will do for at least a proportion of the moon howlers who refuse the vaccine because they think it makes them infertile, or has a chip in it, or is a plot by shape shifting lizards in cahoots with big pharma.

We’re not laughing with you mate, we’re laughing at you. The vast majority of the population accepts scientific reality and rejects woo-woo conspiracy theorising for what it is. There are certainly plenty of idiots in this debate, but they are on the side of the anti-vaxxers and those calling in to question the underlying scientific realities.

Sadly this place seems infested with nutters these days. The problem for all of you “going off on one” about your hobby horse issue is that you represent a small minority of fringe nutters, emboldened by the fact you can come in here and circle jerk with other like minded (usually barely verbal) trolls. You’ve somehow managed to convince yourselves that you represent the “quiet majority” in the movement and amongst Scots more generally. Of course in reality most of us actually think you’re deranged: you have about as much traction as flat earthers, folk who think the moon landings were faked or that David Icke is a serious politician.

So the rancid piece of dogshit known as Neil Oliver who called Scottish independence a cancer, said recently that he’d gladly catch Covid for the sake of freedom, yet this lump of unionist shit would never vote yes to Scottish independence, for the sake of freedom.

Meanwhile Sturgeon the Betrayer of Scots says she concerned over the rise in fuel costs, really? when asked whether she regretted that she hadn’t set up a state owned energy company, she waffled that issues surrounding that were complicated, how twisted can she get.

Vile Tory Adam Tomkins, thankfully gone from Holyrood though bedded in at some die-hard unionist uni, has come out and said that Sturgeon isn’t serious about Scottish independence, how true, you now your cover story on indy is blown, when Tory ratbags like him can see through it.

Should read Anti-independence news rag apologies.

In some ways, Nicola Sturgeon reminds me of my grandmother. Keeping up public appearance was of primary overriding importance to my grandmother and her peers.

A very old-fashioned ‘whatever will the neighbours think’ other-directedness.

The kind of amoral overriding other-directedness that would tolerate unmarried mothers being condemned to live in lunatic asylums and their babies forcibly removed and put up for adoption.

People are being sickened and killed by the gene therapy experiment. 25,000 deaths in Europe with over two million adverse reactions. Go look for the stats yourselves you lazy complacent fools

“Sensible Dave”:

You, sir, are an idiot.

millions of people die in europe every day, and covid is well down the list of reasons for snuffing it
I new a man that went into a public toilet years ago
He sat down and died in the cubicle, the strain was to much for his heart, and this happens a lot more than we think
It will go down on the death certificate as a heart attack ofc
You never see the cause as, Died having a s–t

“Establishment figures who support Stonewall’s edicts, and social media sites too, can shut you down for expressing a view contrary to the received wisdom. The press avoid the subject, bar a few courageous columnists. This is a nightmare.”

“Define ‘Woman'” link to wp.me

Andy Ellis says: at 9:32 am

“…in yer mammy’s spare room while eating Crunchy Nut corn flakes from the box…”

That’s outrageous bigoted smearing of the lactose intolerant that can’t get close to getting on the housing ladder!

Hatuey.

It is my sister in law, that is ill, not my sister. After the vaccine,
She is not exactly a raver at her age, and is a bit more inclined to be reclusive in her quite nature.
Widowed and not one for joining groups.
Her hobbies are her home, garden and dog.
She also lives in the countryside away from large gatherings and faithfully follows the hand wash, mask wearing belief when she enters the small town,

My point is that locking people up as a medical practice,

1) does not work, and has not worked around the world in stopping Covid since the beginning of 2020.

2) those whom have been vaccinated are still able to catch the virus,

3). Those vaccinated are still carriers and transmitters of the virus.

4) most of the population that cannot take the vaccine for other medical reasons should not be incarcerated.

5) most of those that have had the vaccine if it is a good vaccine, should not be, but are scaremongering by peer pressure of being locked up those who cannot….

6) vaccinated or not, the politicians and world leaders are not following the mask wearing and distancing laws they are issuing when they think no one is around, many many have been caught and filmed and photographed around the world. This is peculiar as they are first to receive medical information from the health organisations.

7) there are mass demonstrations around the globe going on against imposing vaccines and mandatory lockdowns, and the mainstream media are not covering this news,
Governments will have to impose a ban on use of mobile phones at these demonstrations, social media, etc if they wish us to believe there are no mass demonstrations taking place,

8) doctors are being paid per vaccine per person, this coercion on doctors to follow a set pattern of behaviour is bribery.

9) vaccinated people that become ill afterwards are not being medically recorded,
My sister in law is one of them,
Her [ sudden ] illness has been suggested that it is the cold, then the flu, then a lung infection, she has been given anti- biotics that did not work, now they are suggesting cancer, everything under the sun, except any relation to her vaccine. She started feeling unwell three days after the vaccine,
And this will be so for many people, it will go unrecorded,

10). The two to ten year vaccine side effects within the bodies of adults, children, women, pregnancies and fertility rates cannot as yet be monitored as the vaccine is still in its infancy.

11) if the vaccines are safe, LIFT THE BAN on the VACCINE COMPANIES being exempt from future court cases, or being sued by the public.
As the British government does not seem to have much faith in the companies vaccines being safe long term. And must envisage many such future cases before that exemption was passed in Westminster.

12) a realistic study must be carried out, and published within six months of the deaths by other means in 2020,
This must have a list of statistic deaths from.
FLU.
Suicide.
Cancer.
Heart attacks.

And the statistics for deaths in care homes must come under a more severe scrutiny and serious investigation, for 2020 and 2021.
Abuse could have taken place of the elderly, during this time period, and families would not know as they were not allowed to see them, or visit,
everyone was in lockdown.
It is all to easy to say they all died of covid,

And other major illnesses that were already diagnosed, that seemed to have disappeared during everyone’s death is due to covid mantra.

For all people to have a believe that these vaccines are safe enough to vaccinate all the public.
The doctors need to return any finances received for vaccinations of the public,
and the exemption lifted by the British government from the vaccine companies of being sued in the future through the courts lifted immediately.

Perhaps then you will be able to convince people to get vaccinated.

Meanwhile without the above being taken into account.
Meanwhile THE LOCK PEOPLE UP mantra that you and others spout here without questions is to put it politely, only the political control of people used by NS, BJ and politicians.
As a way To control public behaviour.

It has selective exemptions and stops protests and marches.

How the hell is the Lord Advocates not prosecuting folk caught with Class A drugs in Scotland going to help reduce drug deaths.

Dorothy Bain the new LA, said she’s “confident” the measure would help tackle drug deaths.

Picture the scenario.

Person caught with Crack Cocaine or Crystal Meth, police officer, right we’re no arresting you the noo, person that’s good.

A wee while later that person dies after taking the drugs.
Aye that’s really helped the drug related death rates.

No the reason that the COPFS and the LA have come up with this ludicrous idea, is not to save lives from drug deaths, but to take pressure off the courts and Police Scotland, the PF’s office on Glasgow’s South Side must be bursting at the seams with cases piling up, hell PF’s office had around 5,000 cases files waiting to go to court before the pandemic struck.

This inept idea by the LA, basically says to drug users carry on, and that will inevitably lead to more not less drug related deaths.

A lawyer speaks out on Crag Murray’s unjust conviction.

link to yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com

Republic of Scotland @ 12.50

The police will confiscate the drugs.
Drug use is not of itself criminal, stupid certainly but stupidity is not a crime.
Prosecuting the possession for personal use costs the system a lot of time and money, whereas confiscation and a ticking-off will ruin the user’s day but not his life while saving millions.

As regards to vaccines and immunity, some stop you catching diseases completely (and we call that “sterilising immunity”) and some mitigate against disease severity (disease immunity).

The covid vaccines do a bit of both and when they were first developed we saw quite strong sterilising immunity in tests. The variants have weakened them in that regard but they still reduce the chances of you catching it, from memory by about 30 to 45% depending on the vaccine.

I have explained all this before.

@me

Correction: 111 deaths with covid of people over 65 from 1020 total deaths in that age group.

Andy Ellis,
I understand that this is quite confusing for you but let me walk you through some what you have said.
You agree that the vaccine won’t stop you contracting the virus, well done!
You agree that the vaccine will not stop you spreading the virus, again, well done!

Unfortunately you state categorically that the vaccine will mitigate the severity of Covid, this is quite evidently untrue.
The most severe symptom is death, vaccinated people are still dying with Covid.

I on the other hand said that it is claimed that the vaccine may mitigate the severity of Covid, an important difference that makes my statement true and yours untrue.

Now Andy, what if you’re part of the 80% that they have concluded will suffer mild or no symptoms from contracting the virus, should these people be vaccinated?
What benefit would you receive from being vaccinated if you are an 8 year old versus an 80 year old?

So again, some of the people you call flat-earthers and anti-vaxxers think that perhaps it’s a good idea for an 80 year old to get the vaccination but not so much with the 8 year old.

As your friend Hatuey points out there is a risk to benefit ratio that needs to be weighed up, he like me believes the older generation may benefit from the vaccine whereas the younger generation will not.

So I will ask you again, should everyone be vaccinated?
If so, why?
If not, why not?

If it is beyond you to answer the question and explain why, simply admit that you’re not sure what you’re talking about and we can all move on.

@Hatuey 1.59 pm

There you go, applying logic to the situation again: it’ll never catch on BTL here these days you know! ;-P

Andy Ellis says:
23 September, 2021 at 2:42 pm

@Hatuey 1.59 pm

There you go, applying logic to the situation again: it’ll never catch on BTL here these days you know! ;-P

—

What you mean is that people don’t agree with you on very much, causing your inner voices to shriek louder and louder with every post that calls you out.

I’m guessing that if there was an emergency-use vaccine for narcissism, you’d be at the front of the queue, every hour of every day.

@Scott 2.59 pm

No matter how often and how loudly the moon howlers in here howl, it doesn’t make them and closer to being right, or to making their a-scientific world view more convincing Scott. The fact that they don’t agree with me has to be a plus given their views.

The real narcissism here resides with those determinedly punting their conspiracy theorising as *FACT* and the even more ridiculous assertion that it enjoys support outside a statistically trivial basket of deplorables who make most Trump supporters look balanced.

Andy Ellis,
There you go again. It seems to be beyond you to understand that the people who are vulnerable (remember them) are the people who may benefit from the vaccine.
The vulnerable used to be considered to be people with compromised immune systems like the elderly and people with underlying health problems.

Now you’re counting people who were not endangered by the virus as successful vaccinations because they have not been hospitalised.

You seem to be a bit unsure why more of the older demographic ends up in hospital even though they’ve been vaccinated.
The reason there is a drop off in performance as you say, is because the younger generation are the least likely to have adverse reactions to the virus whether they are vaccinated or not.

Why on earth do you believe that people who don’t need to be vaccinated need to be vaccinated?

Sturgeon the Betrayer of Scots is pushing ahead with her woke agenda, do you know what your kids or grandkids or even great grandkids are being taught in Scottish schools? No me neither.

“SCOTLAND is “leading the way” as the first country in the world to embed LGBT inclusive education across the curriculum, the children’s minister has said.”

link to archive.is

Eh, any takers?

link to twitter.com

Andy Ellis says:
23 September, 2021 at 4:29 pm

You appear unable to accept the fact that vaccinated people can still catch the infection and end up in hospital, even though they’ve been vaccinated. No matter how often this is pointed out to you, you return to it like a dog returning to its vomit.

You said: “Why on earth do you believe that people who don’t need to be vaccinated need to be vaccinated?”

Because those people can still pass it on to others, many of whom will be much less able to fight the infection off, and because even though *most* of the younger age groups may not gain much benefit from vaccination, enough of them will avoid serious illness (and passing on the infection to those more at risk in vulnerable groups) to make the cost benefit analysis clear that maximising the number vaccinated is a good thing.

—

Andy thinks that vaccinated people who are infected don’t have the ability to pass on the infection…??

What a fucking arse he is.

‘Separate probes by the Scottish Government and information commissioner were unable to confirm how journalists obtained the information.’

Did they ask the journalists?

@Scott 4.37 pm

Andy knows vaccinated people DO have the ability to pass on the infection, because unlike Scott, Andy’s lips don’t move when he reads. Your level of reading comprehension seems about on par with James Che’s level of composition, and from memory he’s dyslexic.

Andy, who like most non experts is capable of researching such issues from generally available reputable sources, is capable of of discerning truth from lies.

Scott seems like the kind of person who would be confused if you poured water in his wellies.

How many deaths have been attributed to folk simply saying “fuck it” and losing the will to live after being exposed to a seemingly endless viral load of soul crushing covid discussions…

“The boss of coronavirus vaccine manufacturer Moderna has said the pandemic could be over in a year.”

Dan says:
23 September, 2021 at 4:49 pm
How many deaths have been attributed to folk simply saying “fuck it” and losing the will to live after being exposed to a seemingly endless viral load of soul crushing covid discussions…

Reply

Cause of death: Pixywine Overdose

Where’s J.O.E?

@Grouse Beater,

SNP need Patrick Harvie`s Scottish Green Party to form a Government,

Patrick Harvie is using this lever to force through this misogyny and eliminate all protected and safe places for woman and girls,

Patrick Harvie is a transcult zealot.

On covid and vaccines…

Some people die from covid, and some people die from the covid vaccine. Either is a risk. You have to try and figure out which is worst for you: covid or vaccine. Figuring that out can be hard, hence the debate.

Generally, the older you are, the less able your body is at producing the various molecules that fight invading pathogens. Thus, age has been used as a rough indicator of risk of death from covid – over a certain age, it’s almost 100% certain the disease will kill you. Under a certain age, it’s almost 100% certain the disease will be a short-lived, mild annoyance. This means you can’t simply ask everyone to be vaccinated – you have to decide separately for each age group.

Then in comes the public health v. private health debate. For an individual 16 year old, it’s probably better not to be vaccinated on purely private health reasons. On public health reasons, ie considering the effect of the infected 16 year old potentially spreading it around the community, then it’s better to get the 16 year old vaccinated.

Sadly, some 16 year olds will die from the vaccine. Plus some in the other age groups too. The governments have made the calculation that it’s better for around a thousand to die from the vaccine than a few hundred thousand (or possibly much more) to die from the disease.

Like in a war, you commit soldiers to a battle knowing that you’ll lose a percentage of them even if you win. Health officials are doing the same thing.

Is there a definitive, clear answer to all of this? No. We’re lucky the vaccines haven’t caused more side-effects and more deaths. It’s a shame that variants have rendered the vaccines much less effective than they were against the original virus. We need new vaccines against new variants and then maybe all these competing risk factors will be easier to assess. Imagine a new vaccine made it almost 100% impossible to catch the virus? Sadly, we’re stuck with a vaccine that doesn’t stop you catching the disease but seems to make it less severe in the non-pensioner age groups.

Sadly, not sure vaccine has much impact on over-80s (because of their weakened ability to create the immune molecules needed). Lockdowns are still required to protect us until either the virus evolves into a cold or we create better vaccines.

Anyway, that’s how I see things.

AUOB have had their route for Edinburgh march refused – their twitter says they will announce tomorrow mid-day their decision on what to do.

What on earth is going on? We had two vast marches along the Royal Mile in 2018 and 2019 with no trouble at all. Why have council decided we can’t march this time?

Gregory. Covid was on its way out last April when the Government, under orders, made everything worse by instituting lockdowns. The vaccine passports are the aim of this bogus pandemic. Lockdowns will be used as policy from now on.

Are there fewer transmen than transwomen?

Very little discussion about transmen.

I haven’t heard anyone from SNP say ‘transmen are men’.

Any stories of prisoners in women’s prisons iding as male to be sent to male prison?

Any complaints from male athletes because a transman was competing in their sport?

Any accusations of transphobia against a transman?

Pixywine @ 5.46pm
hey you do realise that drug etc abuse started llloooong before the evil carnate? ST St Sturgeon came on the scene dont’cha?. Sad as is it’s mostly 40 plus that’s dying and they probably started in their teens?. It’s tragic i know but it’s not just a simple as blaming one party.

sarah says:
23 September, 2021 at 6:00 pm
re above – “can’t march down the Mile..”

Reply
link to archive.is

Edinburgh’s High Street and Canongate set to close due to major roadworks disruption.

Now Now Andy…….As if? LoL

@Scott 5.06 pm

“All you ever do is try to denigrate others, to compensate for the lack of affirmation given to you. Your attack on James Che for being dyslexic is proof enough of that.

It would help if you actually just accepted that people have valid reasons for both taking and refusing the vaccines.”

Ach, dry yer eyes. I’ve no need of affirmation from anyone, least of all from some of the roasters in here: what possible value would affirmation from people so divorced from reality have? As for my comment WRT James Che’s contribution, it wasn’t an attack, simply a statement. Unlike his attack on me for being an infiltrator in Alba apparently on the grounds that I disagree with him it also has some basis in fact. Lord save us from prospective Councillors of that calibre.

I’ve stated before that some people may have valid health reasons for not being vaccinated. Many more however have invalid, a-scientific, conspiracy theory based reasons for not being vaccinated, as we see daily BTL here and elsewhere.

Andy Ellis says:
23 September, 2021 at 6:42pm
’ve stated before that some people may have valid health reasons for not being vaccinated. Many more however have invalid, a-scientific, conspiracy theory based reasons for not being vaccinated, as we see daily BTL here and elsewhere.

I Agree.

Andy Ellis says:
23 September, 2021 at 6:42 pm

Ach, dry yer eyes. I’ve no need of affirmation from anyone, least of all from some of the roasters in here.

—

Q: If you don’t have any need for affirmation, why categorise?

The answer being that you seek affirmation from others constantly.

eg ‘I think this, and so do many others in the mainstream‘ is another recurring pattern within your posts.

Your narcissism is toxic, but you appear to lack insight.

(If your written offerings were any good, your own blogs would have more readers and comments. But here you are, latching onto the coat-tail of Stuart Campbell, hoping for some of the respect and love you’re so evidently missing out on.)

If you ever need some tin-foil, I’m sure that someone will trade you some for the bubble-wrap enveloping your ever-so-fragile ego.

Scott says

Andy Ellis says:
23 September, 2021 at 6:42 pm
Whit? really? FFS

@smithie – 6:53 pm

“Many people may have valid health reasons for not being vaccinated. Many more have invalid, a-scientific, conspiracy theory based reasons for not being vaccinated”.

And some have the perfectly good reason that they don’t want to be vaccinated, it’s their health, their body, their future and their responsibility.

And by God I support their absolute right to tell officialdom where they can stick their inadequately tested and warranty-free needles.

Even although I have been vaccinated by my free choice.

If there is one site that should be populated by people who understand the meaning of freedom, it should be this one.

But no, small-minded, followers of conventional wisdom, mustn’t make a fuss, don’t want to stick my head above the parapet, follow the herd attitudes prevail everywhere.

And yet the very same people wonder why the Scots have yet to grasp independence. Maybe we’re just following the science.

There are roadworks all over Edinburgh.

High Street closed, Cowgate one way only, half of North Bridge closed, roadworks on Regent Road, tramworks on Leith Walk, Holyrood Park closed on Saturdays & Sundays from Dynamic Earth to Commi Pool, etc etc etc.

I don’t think the AUOB march is going to be very welcome in Edinburgh if more roads have to be closed.

James Che , I am sorry to hear about your sisters illness, I hope she gets well soon.

Have you reported these side effects using the yellow card system? If you Google yellow card UK you can report this. I know, probably last thing on your mind right now.

Where’s the justice when a country throws @CraigMurrayOrg
in jail for contempt but protects David Clegg who claims a right to protect a source who has broken the law by revealing accusations against Mr Salmond; surely this makes Clegg accessory to a crime?

Would Andy Ellis come over so smug and smarmy with a mouth full of teeth?
Just look for the dick checking everyone’s vaccine papers in any public establishment, and give it a try.

@Scott 7.41 pm

Q: If you don’t have any need for affirmation, why categorise?
A: Because categorisation is useful. Separating those promoting common sense from those touting a-scientific woo woo for instance.

You said: “The answer being that you seek affirmation from others constantly.”
Nope: It’s a BTL comments section. Folk come to comment. I don’t need or want the affirmation of anyone, least of all someone like you Scott.

You said:”eg ‘I think this, and so do many others in the mainstream‘ is another recurring pattern within your posts.”
Pointing out the fact – because that is what it is – that the moon howlers a minority needs to be don because (as Stuart MacKay rightly observes) we just can’t get the roasters to STFU. It is true you can’t educate pork.

You said: “Your narcissism is toxic, but you appear to lack insight.”
Uh huh. Says one of the moon howlers who have helped drive folk away in droves.

You said: “(If your written offerings were any good, your own blogs would have more readers and comments. But here you are, latching onto the coat-tail of Stuart Campbell, hoping for some of the respect and love you’re so evidently missing out on.)”
Feel free to regale us with your quality output then Scott. What’s that…? There isn’t any? Ah…right. Your output seems to consist almost entirely of coming on here shilling for or being a moon howler and abusing those of us pointing out their arrant nonsense. Some of us have a bit more than your two dimensional approach.

I’ve no need or desire to latch on to anyone’s coat tails. It’s always the snivelling anonymous online cowards that bloviate most of course, isn’t it “Scott”. Stun us with another.

Yay! I see we’re at the BP running out of unleaded and diesel supplies stage…

Ach, at least I won’t have fuel to be able to get to the shops to endure the disappointment of witnessing empty shelves of imperially weighted invisible stuff I can’t buy. So that’s a positive.

Dan says:
23 September, 2021 at 9:39 pm
Yay! I see we’re at the BP running out of unleaded and diesel supplies stage…

Reply

Every cloud……..
That’ll put an end to my frustrations re road closure.

La Lloyd is the weakest link.

It’s past time our law officers started on the long road back to credibility and respectable behaviour.

I’d jail Clegg on the Vow alone.
🙂

Andy Ellis says:
23 September, 2021 at 9:57 pm

@Scott 9.50 pm

You seem a bit obsessed “Scott”. And a bit sweary.

Always the tell tale sign of a no mark.

—

If you aim a comment at me, I’ll nearly always respond to it. I wouldn’t call that obsessed.

So what if I am “a bit sweary”…they’re only fucking words.

A pearl-clutching, sanctimonious narcissist. That’s you that is.

While I’m addressing you, was your Da the ref in ‘It’s A Knockout’, or was that some other Ellis with a dipstick?