It’s the wrong colour, too
Posted on
August 09, 2014 by
Chris Cairns
The world's most-read Scottish politics website
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A tall tale
Wee Books
Video
Probably a robbery
Transphobia
Sink or swim?
Now that’s what I call an ultimatum.
🙂
So, Westminter isn’t really so stupid as comit suicide, is it?
The body which composes Westminster, probably not but the erse who used to fold towels probably is. At least he is arrogant enoghth to think that bullying us will work, and it will raise his esteem in the Empire Loyalist T Party in The Tory Pary and their right wing voters.
Whitehall is not and they know their onions. Remember the Head of the Civil Services has said that Osbourne’s de laration of no CU was based on an unresearched 3 page note written to order.
Sir Humphry, Bernard and those with half a brain more than Osbourne will control him.
The real problem is Boris Johnson who is clearly uncontrollable, although more intellligent. He might think it is a great way of enriching his mates.
Either way I hope Eck and John Swinney have a game plan with a variable built in called “barking mad manouvres” counterpoints. That and a unimpeded Fire Exit for Scotland.
Britnat strategy at its finest aka crash economics for the hard of thinking.
Big question is will Humphrey overcome the stupidity barrier of the Giddy-BoJo-Nige love triangle?
Labour No currency Union manifesto
Labour loses even more votes.
The gift that keeps on giving
Red Squirrel
For the good people of England, i hope so.
When will they ever learn?
Ken500
They will be told by their big backers to do so, or else
I see the parties are going to include no monetory union in their manefestos. Some friend! Anyway as the past repeats itself, another manefesto to be broken by the unionist parties
enshrined in manifestos – that’s it I’ve had enough, Vote No.
Aye right
Great work Chris. You capture the moment perfectly.
For generations to come it will remain an infamous stain on the history of the United Kingdom’s leading political parties that they blocked genuine democratic powers for Scotland and hobbled its elected administration.
[…] « It’s the wrong colour, too […]
Labour, Tory, LibDem unelectable in Scotland. What’s the alternative.?
Few people in Scotland will vote for Tory, LibDem or Labour policies. What’ s the alternative?
The Polls are skewed by not including in the weighing, the declining Tory, LibDem, Labour voters who will vote YES, and the voters who never vote in General Election but will vote YES. The PR pollsters are doing it deliberately (illegally), to make £Millions of non mandated public money. The piper is calling the tune. The Polls are rigged, by gerrymandering, trying to affect the Referendum outcome. It will not succeed. The support for YES is 10%+ higher. It is going to be a landslide YES depending on the turn out.
OT
George Galloway, on his own Sputnik prog this AM agreed with the proposition :-
“there are many roads to Self-Determination”
That would be everywhere EXCEPT Scotland.?
Well, one thing’s certain: anemic unionists won’t be able to sign their worthless manifestos in blood. Bile, maybe. Or pus.
OT
Galloway is back on RT`s “Breaking the Set” presented by Abby Martin where he supplies a very long list of reasons for Self-Determination that would equally apply to his native Scotland.
Imposition of a dominant culture, rigging elections etc on and on and on.
Suggest you hit this website to confirm that this is a nasty little man who refuses to relinquish his Bradford West seat in the Commons – a seat that makes him more ridiculous at every turn.
When we get a YES vote the negotiating comittee should really get tough with these clowns. They will 100% undoubtedly want currency union. Well, i think we can name our price.
Personally i’d go with nukes out immediately & immediate disbandment of the House of Lords.
That’s beautiful Chris, great work.
If the polls show even a hint of a win for Yes in the run up to the referendum, the markets will demand a statement from the Treasury on a commitment to a currency union with Scotland, lest international investors short the pound make a killing in the process, and destroy the rUK and Scottish economies.
I can’t see this playing out any other way. This is a high stakes bluff for the UK government where they may be forced to show their hand very very soon.
Excellent cartoon as usual Chris.
So the British party of international socialism is going to hurt the working class of Scotland not matter which way they vote in the referendum.
If they vote no, Miliband will carry on with the tory programme of unnecessary austerity and he will be even tougher than the tories.
If they vote yes, he will deliberately hurt them by blocking a currency union which is in everyone’s interests.
Fabulous!!! After the “Vision for Scotland” conference on Wednesday, watching the Livestream today and getting up to this … I am so confident we have what it takes to make a brilliant country going forwards.
We always hear about the role the financial sector plays in driving the economy. We all know how the banks have been treated after the biggest crash ever – bonuses back on etc. So who holds the power? Of course the financial sector will demand currency union when we vote for independence.
A question for Mr Darling and his friends in the conservative party: “What would you prefer our plan B to be?”
Make the point extremely well!
It is such an odd situation that England will need Scotland’s ‘power’ to keep their pound floating, but won’t admit it. And they are taking that risk as a dangerous gamble.
It probably isn’t a very good tactic … but wouldn’t be funny if Alec called their bluff and said “OK, Scotland will have our own currency”. They are worried now, they would be terrified at that prospect!
Brilliant Chris.At the moment they are saying they prefer the lead weight. How ridiculous they are.
OT. Pat Kane on R4 half an hour ago speaking on social justice in an independent Scotland. Absolutely destroyed the interviewer and the protagonist. Great man to have on our side.
These opinion polls. I have no doubt that the people who do them will be expert at it. They will know every nuance of statistical analysis and how to tweak results. But they are mostly private companies who thrive by credibility. If they show – even spun – wildly out-there results they will struggle to be trusted for years.
My eyes and ears show me most people are hiding their true voting intention. Few people I speak to casually declare for either side. But the window stickers favour Yes overwhelmingly on the handfull of windows declared at all.
Once again, genuinely, in hope I ask. Is it true that random unselective canvassing is showing Yes well in the lead? Are you only telling us what we want to hear on this Nationalist dominated site?
My resolve is as strong as it ever was, but I could do without the stress.
You just know Mr Bull is pissing in the water as well as the wind.
Sharp, well argued essay by Ian bell in the Herald warning of the impending privatisation of Scotland’s NHS – a damn certainty following from a No vote.
@ davidb. I understand what you’re saying davidb. In my part of Moray there are Yes signs in windows and some Yes flags but not that many [yet]. No ukok signs in windows that I’ve seen. People are still playing it close to their chests. I believe even my wee Yes poster might give some folk the confidence that they are not alone in wanting independence, even if, at the moment, they are tentative to say so publicly.
David: Are you only telling us what we want to hear on this Nationalist dominated site?
Strange comment.
Would you prefer to be told all was lost years ago, so we may as well go home and await the deluge and the drowning?
It’s a cracker, Chris, perhaps an alternative caption of, “Not on your Lifebuoy”.
John Bull pretending the tide of Scottish history’s ebbing not flowing in iultimate UKOK float test for their Project Fearing, shock.
I wonder what Labour voters in Scotland think of Ed Milliband’s pledge to block a currency union in his manifesto? A prime example of solidarity there, eh?
davidb
Volunteer to go canvassing and find out for yourself.
What worries me about the cu thing is they genuinely believe that treating us like that is a vote winner for them. Let me put it in simpler terms if an employer was to do the same thing to it’s employees the unions would be down on em like a ton of bricks.Effectively that’s what’s happening just now
@davidb
There is a combination of optimism and associated denial in any campaign. We will have our downs and our ups. What can we do about opinion polls when canvass returns of random streets the length and breadth of Scotland give us encouragement by the responses we get in the door step.
From my point of view, I’m not voting for Yes because everyone else is. I’m voting for Yes because I believe that would be best for Scotland. I am out there as much as I can be trying to encourage others to share my view and I will continue to do that until the polls close on 18 September.
The thought of a No vote is genuinely depressing but I’ll take to selling lion rampant flags where the lion is replaced by a mouse and ‘scotlandshire’ car stickers and make the best of a bad job
The answer is blindingly simple as Chris illustrates.
I’m also of a mind to tell Westminster that we’ll use our own currency and watch the panic!
BetterNothanks think the currency issue is a showstopper, but the markets will not let this run too far. Besides, I trust our government to make the best deal for Scotland.
If you can see how breathtakingly big North Sea oil and gas industry really is, ihuge highly skilled work force, world class engineering technicality, potential, capacity to grow, you’d understand their desperation to keep control of all of it.
Scots oil is practically the last and only teamGB heavy industry England has left now and it is big.
The fact that the BT no-hopers are getting so steamed up about Scotland’s future currency, even going so far as to enshrine a pledge against currency union in their manifestos for the UK general election in 2015, suggests that they are already conceding that Scotland will choose independence.
Wonder if LA knows?
link to thejournal.co.uk
Mexican standoff!
Who’s gonnna blink first?
link to youtube.com
Bob Sinclair sauys
“Personally i’d go with nukes out immediately & immediate disbandment of the House of Lords.”
I get the nukes out immediately but what would be in it for an independent Scotland to insist (as if we could) on the removal of the HOL?
@ davidb
I am certain that most people are keeping their views to themselves. This is a life changing event for us all and either of the two paths ahead lead to big changes. I think people are afraid to fall out with others over it. Perhaps I’m extreme but personally anyone admitting to being a NO goes down in my estimation. And, at the moment, I feel my view of them will be lasting. Which ever way it goes on the 18th , a lot of people will be left bitter with those who voted differently from them. So I understand many people not talking out. However, YES folks talking is what will win this!
Are we winning? I genuinely think so. It’s not just wishful thinking.
Firstly there are a lot of Don’t Knows (who may just be evasive)and to date they have converted 70:30 to Yes:No. That’s enough to swing it.
Secondly, as we discuss endlessly, the polls can be twisted by choice of interviewees, way questions are presented and by the weightings applied. Polling companies, I’m sure, will create a poll to give their clients the results they want. So I don’t completely trust them. Intentional bias aside, I think the polls underestimate the Yes following among those whi will vote, but proviously haven’t. These people’s views are down-weighted, yet they tend to be Yes. I believe there is a hidden Yes trend.
Thirdly, the more people hear about the wealth Scotland has and opportunities before us, they more Yes voters are generated.
Add these together and I believe Yes is leading. By the 18th, there could be a comfortable majority.
Davidb, Stress you will have in plenty if it is up to the newspapers and the television. People in Scotland are going to keep it to themselves on the whole, but funnily enough I get more, I am all for Independence when wearing my wee pink badge than the other sort. I am not canvassing, not got the temperament but if you have go and volunteer as others have said. I have to agree with G.A.Ponsonby on Newsnet this morning, we should all stop buying or reading the newspapers from today, it is the only thing they understand about bias, lack of money.
Cameron must be tearing his hair out at not being able to send the troops back into Iraq [Britain’s army proving it’s better to be together in killing other people] and missing out on the gung-ho British nationalist media binge.
O/T is anyone else having difficulty connecting to the Wee Ginger Dug this morning? Do you think this is an attack on him, considering his out spoken words yesterday?
I just caught the end of a BBC Radio Scotland item. Sarah Boyack, was dribbling on about Scottish renewables needing English subsidy to survive. Does this ignorant woman not know WM, as usual, claws back any extra the public in the south pay by use of such schemes as the unequal Electricity Grid connection charges that cost Scotland in excess of £100 million per year? Someone offer her a lifebuoy, or … Naw jist let her sink.
FFS
Glen Campbell troughing it in the US, trying to link Boring to Dull in Scotland
The CBBC is a disgrace.
Helena: I have to agree with G.A.Ponsonby on Newsnet this morning, we should all stop buying or reading the newspapers from today
I followed that advice many months ago.
They’re all determined to undermine Scotland’s progress.
I inadvertantly opened a Sun yesterday left by one of the construction crew. The pages of propaganda concocted to belittle Salmond, and by implication Scotland’s legitimate aspirations, were so startling crude that, had I been a dictator, I’d have jailed the editor and closed the paper.
I used to listen to Radio 3 in the morning, but now it is all about Great English music Elgar and unknown composers on Imperial ditties until yer ears bleed. Oh they let on the sometimes furriner like Mozart or Beethoven, but it is just an extension of the Imperial BC
A picture can paint a thousand words ( as our old friend Tele Savales ) once sung.
Chris – fantastic work and spot on . Would make an excellent ad and t- shirt too.
Rober Peffers,
How do you fancy a run up to Arbroath?
meet the gang (well some of them)
I could come and get you, take you up and bring you back?
Some of more deluded and deranged No supporters simply don’t understand that rUK doesn’t hold all the cards and is in no position to pretend it does during a negotiation.
Unless they really are mad enough to believe all the absurd nonsense about border guards and a barbed-wire fence to curtail exports. That would really help their own businesses at a time when one small shock to the system would plunge the economy straight back into the post 2008 recession since it’s floating on a fragile and an unsustainable bubble of London and SE house prices right now.
All those scottish pensions that were paid up as part of UK? rUK would have to take full responsibilty for them just as it does for every pensioner who then moves to another country.
Last and by no means least.
Oil.
Or are No supporters still pretending all that oil is a terrible burden? A terrible burden rUK certainly won’t have to worry about again after a Yes vote, that’s for sure.
Helena Brown says:
“is anyone else having difficulty connecting to the Wee Ginger Dug this morning?”
Worked for me. But have to say, yesterday’s piece is an excellent read.
THROW THE ANVIL!
“is anyone else having difficulty connecting to the Wee Ginger Dug this morning?”
Nope, I cant get on it either.
@goldenayr
I don’t have free time to canvass, but I do try to subtly convert when I am speaking to people. And I have donated 4 figures so far.
@ grouse beater
I am not defeatest but we spend a lot of time anylising polls here. I am minded to dismiss them all, and I long since gave up on TV/ Radio and newspaper mince reporting. We are pinning a lot on the unreported mass of Patriots.
I saw a fellow on a train this week going to Murrayfield. On his arm he had a tatoo of a baby with a Saltire. That did inspire me.
WGD loading fine for me!
@Robert Pfeffers
how about some carbolic?
The Survation swing the No camp are screaming about is heavily concentrated among the small subsample of 16-24 year olds who have been upweighted by more than two-fold.
Looks like No aren’t paying attention to the detail again.
Ha. Ace cartoon Chris. Some folk could write an essay on the currency issue to get others to try and understand it. This is perfect.
Result of a mass canvas of 249 doors in Alloa on Wednesday.
61% Yes. 18% No. 21% undecided.
Keep the faith.
We ARE winning
OT but brought on by Unionist gloating over the latest Survation poll . . .
The polls are depressing even hardened YES supporters with the constant drip-drip-drip of doom. We know they are unrepresentative, we remember how wrong they were in May 2011 – but it is still discouraging.
YES signs are the answer – the poll people can see. We are already winning the battle of the windows, but we need more, many more.
Seeing YES signs everywhere with very few NO signs will give people hope and make them question the polls more than anything else.
Bateman has been difficult to access, since the formatt was changed,
I’m honestly getting tired of it all.
My FB feed seems full of ‘No’ sentiment. Yes, I’ve tried, but have found it impossible to debate them against the full force of what they are reading in papers, seeing on the news every day. It comes across that I am some lone nutcase with paranoia when the BBC, STV, Daily Record etc etc are all telling them the same thing – which obviously then, must be true.
I’ve banged my head on walls and have to say in my circle of family and friends, there is quite a large majority for ‘No’.
With not long to go, I hardly post on my twitter feed anymore, and can’t remember the last time I put up a FB post in support of indy.
Tired, despondent and sad that *so* many people in this country are still so zipped up the back that they have swallowed the fear, hook, line and sinker…
Winning now will be a miracle. The polls aren’t always right, but when you have around 60 or 70 of them varying, but *all* pointing to a ‘no’ majority, then a miracle is exactly what is needed.
Sorry to be so negative. I just hope that after the dust settles and the Tory government in 2015 gets in, the ‘no’ voters express no regrets to me. A punch in the mouth is all they will receive…
Great Cartoon Chris.
Salmond – “All this, just because we will not give THEM a currency union.”
Youandmycomb, if someone is clever enough to print the Lion Rampant with a mouse instead of a lion, it would sum up the no campaign. Just to show the world what Scotland really is if its (God forbid) a no vote.
The message is getting out that we don’t need a currency union but the SG is taking a moral responsibility to service a share of the debt. Personally I wouldn’t throw John Bull the life ring.
PS Eck will love you Chris you’ve taken a few stone off him there 🙂
BBC’s mocking the Yes vote of Scotland, classic pre game psych out. “Hope you washed your arse this morning Baron MacQuarrie (200 grand a year), you’re about to have it kissed” “ofcourse Glen, keep the garbage coming” sort of thing.
Bit O/T here but have. been thinking about poor Gordon Brown and the role of fate…….or balls, if you like!
Remember in 2007 after waiting patiently for his turn as PM and he finally got it, there was much speculation in the summer of 2007 about a general election to give him a full democratic mandate but that opportunity was never taken.
18 months later the global financial crisis was in full swing and there was next to no chance Labour would now be re-elected in 2010.
As we all know the 2010 outcome and the Lib Dem abandonment of any vestige of principle led them into a coalition with Tories which paved the way for the SNP majority in 2011 and the unique chance to choose our own destiny.
if Brown had had the balls in 2007 the next GE would have been in 2012 and the SNP may not have secured the majority in 2011 and not have had the chance to give us the referendum.
should we thank Gordon Brown or take pity………….
Worcester MP tells Scotland to vote No.
Thats me telt then!
link to worcesternews.co.uk
McHaggis says:
Give your self a shake, why give up now, to lay and curl up does no good.
Me, you, all of us still have the power to get this. We need to work hard and be committed, friend, do not be weak at this stage. Pull yourself up and get on with it.
@ Machaggis Sorry to be so negative. I just hope that after the dust settles and the Tory government in 2015 gets in, the ‘no’ voters express no regrets to me
You need to get out more and leave Facebook to the Britnats.
Robert,
dont know if you saw my comment to you @ 09.16, the offer stands. 🙂
David: I am not defeatest but we spend a lot of time anylising polls here.
Which is exactly what they are contrived to do when promoted by the press and media.
In order to prove to myself I do not associate exclusively with Yes supporters, that I am not as biased as I must surely be, that I am not deluding myself, I continually broach the subject as diplomatically and with some humour, when meeting new acquaintances and friends.
(A good technique: I hold tight to their hand as I ask!)
I am rarely startled by a belligerent No voter. That’s happened only twice in six months.
I believe the reserve we meet lies in those who want greater political democracy for Scotland but not full independence. However, they are fast realising they cannot get the one without the other.
Remember what UK politicians are keen to ignore, over 75% of people – not all Scots – want genuine rights, fed up with ‘pretendy’ democracy. Don’t constrain the movement to diehard independent supporters. We do not constitute an exclusive opinion.
That is why I point out to the hestitant how much we wish to keep our links with England, socially, culturally, and economically.
‘It’s not real independence’ they say, and I answer, that’s right. What country does not rely on another for its good progress?
@McHaggis
The media were no less hostile in 2011 and trust in the media and papers has been plummeting ever since then. David Cameron’s spin doctor and the former editor of the NOTW is in prison as testament to that. The BBC also have a wee bit of explaining to do after the grotesque child abuse scandals of Saville and other in their employ.
Not to mention most folk don’t even bother with them now as smartphones are ubiquitous which has saw the papers circulations plunging still further year on year.
I have no idea where you are choosing your social media but it bears no resemblence to the ones I am seeing. The reason the unionist media and and No campaign hate and fear us ‘cybernats’ so much is preicely because we run rings round their feeble efforts.
Winning now will be no more a miracle than it was in 2007 or 2011. With more debates to come and the actual ground campaign and GOTV (which not even the unionists can pretend they will do well in) there is absolutely no reason to be despondent. Particularly after only one poll which is so heavily reliant on an upweighted subsample of 16-24 year olds. A group that are also notoriously reluctant to ever vote anyway.
It has nothing do with Gordon Brown. It has to do with the SNP policies supported by the electorate. The is funded by it’s members. ie crowd funded, that gives th opportunity to carry andensure policies which are supported by the majority of public. No corporate, no interest groups but the best for the people. The member crowding give the SNP admin freedom for better, open government. The people are sovereign. The people own the SNP.
Supporting the NHS/Education, help for the elderly and the vulnerable is essential for a successful economy. Unnourished/cold people get sick. Etc. Poverty and despair will not ensure a prosperous country. No taxation without representation. Independence will give Scotland the power and rights to make Scotland a fairer, more equal country and make the lives of people in Scotland better.
We know the Scottish government have a range of viable options – they are in the White Paper / Fiscal commission report for anyone that can read.
The UK government and anti Scotland independence parties have painted themselves into a corner and have only two options:
1. No currency union (the public will understand the risks but will wonder about the rewards if it involves printing more money).
2. Total loss of face and accept a currency union.
For a bunch of people who are supposedly doing *no* pre-negotiations they really are not doing a convincing job.
@Bob Sinclair says: 9 August, 2014 at 8:10 am:
“When we get a YES vote the negotiating comittee should really get tough with these clowns.”
A little reverse psychology might be in order now. A YES campaign declaration that Scotland will use the pound but under no circumstances do so in a Currency Union. The Scottish pound will be backed by the massive Scottish oil, gas, and other net Scottish exports.
A Scottish Pound Sterling, not tied to the Pound English will harden rapidly against the English pound. The deposits of English pounds held in the BofE vault will be withdrawn and converted into, perhaps, Norwegian “kroner”, as a temporary measure until the Scottish Government set up a new Central Bank.
Now remember that the present deposits against Scottish printed banknotes in the BofE earn interest so a transfer to the Kroner should actually yield a higher profit. While the BofE will lose the use of that Scottish deposit and also a negotiated share of the company that legally belongs to Scotland. The English treasury will lose the value of Scottish exports, including oil & gas revenues and may well suffer a run on the pound English because the Scottish pound can now be allowed to float against the English pound. It is then likely that the Scottish pound will then continue to harden against the Pound English to the pound English’s detriment.
Game on.
It’s not all doom and gloom. Obviously, I believe the Yes side will win, but here’s a ray of sunshine for anybody with slight concerns about the way things are heading.
Most people I know are voting yes, and these people have been involved in voting/politics for years.
However, there are at least another dozen people I know of, who are also voting yes. What’s the big deal?
Well, these people have never voted for anything before in their lives – they have expressed zero interest in politics as long as I’ve known them. Westminster elections, Scottish Parliament, nothing.
But know, with every vote counting, and the chance to make a difference, it’s all yes votes.
Admittedly, this is anecdotal evidence and a very, very small percentage of voters. But it’s not hard to assume this could be happening all over Scotland.
@ machaggis
Remember this is what we expected, we WILL win this if we stand strong. Get our friends to meetings, at least point them to videos and only convince just one person. This is for you:
link to youtube.com
Ooh look not future PM Milliband does the Labour hard man thingee front page.
As usual, the clown that is Libby Carrell, scourge of the Scots, excludes no CU for you sweaties devastating economic impact on England for his phoney progressive liberal editors.
It’s scary to think that rUK zealots like Milliband could be back in charge of a bankrupt economy based on City Banksters and English midle class house prices.
link to theguardian.com
Heard Pat Kane talk to Graham Nonentity this morning. Pat was excellent and Graham Non was shouty. Why are the NO mob so shouty?
This is not the mark of a winning arguement but rather a frenetic last stand.
The “no currency union” is a perfectly viable option for rUK. They can talk and sing about sovereignty and all that (while ignoring all aspects of the interconnected global environment).
However, can anyone point out a single political party that currently wishes to talk up business costs, more debt, higher interest rates, and the increased possibility of higher taxes?
I look forward to hearing Osborne and Balls talking about the implications of all this.
Keep the faith the polls are being manipulated and not to be believed. It’s the feet on the ground out there knocking doors who are getting the true feedback and its mostly Yes’s. In fact I would more Yes’s are on their way. Don’t lose heart and stay positive as that’s part of their plan…
Ken500 says:
9 August, 2014 at 9:46 am
I agree, just musing about the way things pan out, a different decision in 2007 and a potentially much different future than at present.
Point is we need to take this chance as I certainly did not expect it in my lifetime and convincing people is critical…..
If the St Claire oil field is as big as is being not suggested and the Clyde fields yield too, Scotland could end up by being rUK’s lender of last resort?
No voters described in a letter to the Courier as ‘canny Scots’.
Is that canny as in, ‘canny afford food’, canny afford a house’, canny think for ourselves’, ‘canny find our spines’?
Dear Businessmen of England
Our detestation, our fierce hatred of Salmond and his democractically elected nationalists, and our intense dislike of a self-determing Scotland, is so virulent and deep seated that we prefer you pay excessively for many years to come for our political folly.
However, take solace in knowing we are happy to remain loyal to real dictators and and authoritarian regimes worldwide in your economic interest.
Yours George Osborne
The “No currency union” boat is beginning to leak already.
Some journalists no doubt have noted that over the longer tern it is a crock of shite and basically the Better Together case on it is bollocks.
Despite the demented headlines of the last couple of days there is quite lot of sense appearing in some of the papers and Alex Salmond get most of a page in the Sun getting generous coverage on his currency union position.
Even Gardham in the Herald is backing off. There is a magnificent letter in the Herald from the Adam Smith institute pouring scorn on the Better Together currency nonsense (and the lead letter isn’t bad either). According to the Adam Smith Institute “the currency problem is no problem”
Let them tie themselves up on this issue. I see Milliband is at it today. They will appear wrong and progressively more malicious and anti Scottish. It is now becoming common knowledge that Scotland can use the pound no matter what rUK wants. This alone renders their argument a lie.
So, everybody, back to substantive issues like the NHS, Trident, oil revenues, better pensions, national self respect etc etc
link to worcesternews.co.uk
Talk about brinkmanship from “Your Worcester News can reveal how Robin Walker has played a central role in a key commons investigation around the issue.”
The first thing England will experience is their mortgages costing a lot more.
No CU, rUK borrowing costs jump, Osborne has to pay somehow, no sudden UKOK oil tax raides for Gideon, BoE hikes interest rates as sterling drop in value down its real value.
No CU, no Scottish UKOK debt share, debt mountain suddenly gets even bigger, Moodies and co shit themselves. If I was English with a huge mortgage I might ask why Robin there just doesn’t let evil and cruel Yes Scotland continue the CU as it is, with no problems and maybe even economic growth, shock.
Germany, France, Netherlands, Belgium etc all seem to be happily sharing a currency union, it’s just the great British nationalists that say it’s our pound so vote NO
Awayanbileyerheed at 9.50
Well said. McHaggis must be reading all the wrong stuff. We’re on the main street in Dunoon. I’ve never known such a surge in support and particularly such a surge in women coming in to express support.
I would say we are massively ahead in the under 45 population and doing less well with older people who still absorb their opinions from the MSM.
Most people under the age of 30 don’t read a daily newspapers anymore
Better Together is now campaigning on a big lie which has malicious anti Scottish undertones. The press is giving them an intial benefit but this will destroy them
Folks we are like two horses in a big race, we are approaching the last fence and closing the distance, we are speeding up, we are ready to take the lead.
A big push will put us over the line and to be declared the winner.!!!
The no2 was hot favorite yet in the last few yards he ran out of stamina, the winner was that bit more nimble and brought in a handsome profit for it’s backers.The punters were smiling ear to ear as they got their winnings.
We are that outsider, lets put on that big last sprint to win.
Outstanding cartoon – what a skill to capture an issue and sum up in one picture!
Bob Sinclair says:
9 August, 2014 at 8:10 am
Bob
Why would we even discuss the House of Lords? We will not be paying towards it and it will have no power over us post independence.If they want to keep it that is their choice.
O/T – Shameless self-publicity time (don’t tell the Rev) – I’ll be avoiding questions and making up stuff at the Auld Alliance cartoon exhibition in Glasgow next month. All Wingers welcome ..link to goo.gl
One of your best Chris.
O/T
I was at the opening concert for the Edinburgh festival in the Usher Hall. Just about as Edinburgh Establishment as you can get…
Even so, several Yes badges on display in the bar and I eavesdropped on several convertsations going on…
The fundamental point to remember about the polls is that the companies have no precedent for this. All their weightings are essentially a guess, and comparisons with previous elections are simply irrelevant. Add to this the thought that people’s opinion is firming up day by day one way or the other, and they are always going to be presenting a snapshot of the past.
That is a belter, if you Eck-scuse the pun.
The remaining labour supporters will be dumb struck by Milliband saying this, it so smacks of Westminster’s utter desperation. Yet by him doing the bidding of the Tories and indeed their dirty work, he has just destroyed the labour support in Scotland. He has shown what we actually mean to London Labour Party.
We see it, we hear it and we condemn it. Slab will rue the day as another hoard of disenfranchised Slab supports ditch their cards and move over.
This is still there for the winning folks, big time.
So, if we vote Yes, the Labour Party will have it in their election manifest that they will block a currency union – so there will be no point, I take it, in having anyone from the Labour Pafty in Scotland on Scotland’s negotiating team as they would have to argue against their own party (until March 2016). Has Ed just put the kybosh on Labour taking part in negotiating Scotland’s future? Who would trust them?
@ Machaggis Sorry to be so negative. I just hope that after the dust settles and the Tory government in 2015 gets in………
Woa Woa Woa there cowboy. We will win this 18th September. Not, Maybe the next time or the next time after that. But this time.
I speak to people everyday on my window cleaning round. Some are alright and listen and take on board what I’ve said. Where as others think that if they pull the covers over their eyes, the bogey man will go away.
Now I’m a slightly small man (5ft 6, 10 stone) and the other day two two very large men (6ft3, 18 stone + 6ft, 20 stone) saw my Yes t.shirt and started giving me crap about “Your Alecsammin” being an ar@ehole and a host of other names. I went face to face with them and asked if they preferred the majestic Ali D and the fantastic Westminster to a Scottish Goverment. Anyhoo a conversation built with one of them who calmed a fair bit and started to listen, the other was full of dung. 20 minutes I must’ve spoken to them, answering their questions and abuse with humour and the truth. One I changed but the other…….. well he’ll never change, but he’ll probably not even vote so. The point of this is to never put your head down and never give up. With thanks to Stu & Wings and all the posters on here I go out everyday with my head full of knowledge and pride in what oor wee country is about to do on September 18th 2014.
link to bellacaledonia.org.uk
Wow!
Bugger (the Panda) says
Who in Scotland would want to risk being their lender of last resort, have you seen their debt levels, they are a huge risk.
( I know you were really only kidding !) But I am not !
That image of the lion rampart next to the mouse rampart would make a good campaign poster.
With the slogan ‘What’s it to be?”
If the people of Scotland let the NO campaign scare them into voting against self-government, then I fear its going to be a pretty depressing place to live for the next few years.
Hopefully enough voters won’t let themselves be tricked.
@john king says: 9 August, 2014 at 9:16 am:
“How do you fancy a run up to Arbroath? meet the gang (well some of them) I could come and get you, take you up and bring you back?
Oh! John, how I wish I could. I’m now pretty much stuck due to my disability. I can walk but fall down, (rather a lot). This is due to Meniere’s Disease, (actually not a disease but injury to the inner ear). I have to stay within the distance I can get to either my home or my wee camper van when a meniere’s turn is coming on. I’m lucky, (probably the wrong choice of word), in that I get around 30 minutes warning an attack is coming on and must get where I can lie down until the attack passes. It can be many hours.
I would have brought the motor home up to Arbroath but it broke down a couple of days ago and I’m still waiting for it to be repaired. Anyway, thanks for the invite.
I was about to offer the use of the motorhome to the local YES group when it broke down. It would make an ideal mobile stall/office. I also have a petrol generator that can be coupled to the van to provide mains power and three back-up 12 volt batteries that can be charged from the generator.
Just rotten luck it broke down, (power steering fault), but I might get it going again later today as my step-son is coming to help. If not today it’s going into the dealers.
I still wouldn’t put it past those gits to torpedo the post yes negotiations in a final despicable attempt to overrule the democratic will of the Scottish people
Don’t know if anyone else has noticed but is that the Debt Sea?
Cracking cartoon by the way
If a NO vote
I can see Douglas Alexander coming out with
what was said was in the past is over
I’m taking notes
Scotland will not forget
Les Wilson
You have not seen the conditions?
Wonga levels.
Best cartoon yet.
England NEEDS the currency union because it is broke. That’s why they are covering their own hand by screaming at Alec Salmond to come up with a commitment to plan B. They think that would be his downfall & if so will simply resume to type on Sept 19th.
But Britain is in a very precarious financial position. It has run an average negative trade balance since the 1950’s. It has been positive once in the last 16 years & currently runs about -£2 billion per month.
At the end of each year, the UK spends about £24 billion more on imports than exports. This is an effective loss of hard currency which can really only be replaced by printing more.
In the long run, this weakens the currency as indeed it has devalued against all the major competitive currencies like the Dollar, Euro & YEN over the last 15 years by 10% to 20%.
Furthermore, despite all the austerity, Osborne will likely have borrowed another £100 billion by the time the books have been closed on 2013/2014. And another £75 billion is expected to be borrowed going into 2015.
Britain is still spending vastly more money than it receives & the debt mountain will likely exceed £1.4 trillion by the next general election.
But there’s more. British productivity is a shocking 30% lower than that of France, Germany & the USA which means it takes the average British worker 4 days to produce something instead of the 3 days that it takes for our neighbours. That makes exports more expensive.
Poor productivity is also often a response to lousy wages. It’s no surprise then that average wages are worth 7% less today than they were just 6 years ago. People are not motivated by work which makes one poorer.
Yes, the economy is back to the size it was before the recession but there are 5% more people living in the UK than 7 years ago so the GDP per person is actually 5% worse, not better.
Meanwhile a local housing bubble in London is making millionaires of millionaires to which the BoE response may well be to raise interest rates.
If it quickly rises to the average over the last 50 years, which is around 8%, it will cause an economic catastrophe caused by a virus of mortgage defaults, credit card defaults & trillions in written off loans.
Watching the media fool itself into believing that Britain is on the road to recovery is like watching a science fiction series; none of it is believable.
It is in therefore in England’s interests to include all the foreign currency that Scotland provides through its healthy export surplus.
Anyway, who else is going to help fund the cost of feeding the 807 peers & 21 English Bishops who now make up the politburo retirement home at the House of Lords?
@Bugger (the Panda) says: 9 August, 2014 at 9:25 am:
“how about some carbolic?”
I’d wondered if anyone else on here would be old enough to pick up on that very old advert or remember the very old joke about, “Put that on yer Pamolive”, with the retort, “Not on your Lifebuoy”.
Sometimes I feel very old.
;-))
I’m relieved Ed almighty never came up to Scotland on one of those Friday Fliers to preach to us. That would definitely be a vote loser. Oh wait…
“I won’t let an independent Scotland keep the pound”, says Ed Miliband
OT – Speaking to a neighbour earlier and he is voting no. A really nice guy and a good family man he is also in the Masons don’t know if that is his reason but I told him I am voting yes to preserve the NHS, free education for our kids and a WMD free country. I hope I’ve given him something to think about.
O/T but cheering.
I spent the week on holiday just over the border.
Looked into a craft exhibition at Lanercost Priory.
link to english-heritage.org.uk
Got asked by a Tory squire type if I could vote in the referendum. He was annoyed he cannot do so since it “is his Union too”. He then said that he had an hundred pound bet on with “Rory the Tory” his MP that there would be a YES!
Also said that if English were allowed to vote it would be a resounding YES and that’s why Cameron limited the franchise as per the Edinburgh Agreement!
Enjoy!
People join Unionist parties for what they can get. People join the SNP for what they can give (to help others)
“IT’S OUR POUND AND WE’RE KEEPING IT”
Will this become an official YES campaign poster?
caz-m – what about…
“IT’S OUR COUNTRY AND WE WANT IT BACK!”
If interest rates went up to 8%, I could retire tomorrow. Pity it seems everyone else would be ruined.
As it is, I’m considering an offer from my employer to move to part time working and go on for another five or six years. It’s probably a good deal actually.
But how the hell did we get to the point where people who have saved are seeing no benefit to having done that, and everything is being run to protect people who have got themselves up to their eyeballs in debt?
@Martin – second attempt at a reply -not sure what’s not working.
If we vote Yes in September but don’t become independent until March 2016, then Labour will still have Scottish MPs standing for election next year and as they are British MPs they will have to stand on a national platform of opposing a currency union – even if that is in Scotland’s best interests. So who is going to vote for them and how could they possibly be allowed to negotiate on a cross-party negotiating team on our behalf – especially if Labour wins the 2015 General Election as they will be the party in government at UK level. Any Labour MPs on the negotiating team would be negotiating against their own boss and on the opposite platform they were elected on. And now that Milliband has announced it to the Press, they can’t now get out of it. Own goal or what?
And as there’s no such thing as the Scottish Labour Party, only the British one, I don’t see how Labour MSPs could be part of it either – after all, Johann Lamont is leader of the MPs – you can see the implications.
Certainly your best cartoon yet as it hits the anvil on the head.
OT: Worth sharing.
link to youtube.com
I know I keep on about these polls that come out always in favour of no they are only comfort polls for them to keep telling their lies they are up to every dirty trick in the book so do not believe their polls if they are so sure why are they not reporting the results of the poll Cameron held ?because it would not fit in with their lies I predict there will be a 70 odd percent yes vote so vote yes
This would make an excellant billboard in a high traffic no-leaning area. Perhaps crowd funded via sales of t-shirts, posters etc
@Robert Peffers
We don’t actually want a currency that is that strong. It will make our exports, to the UK as well as everywhere else, more expensive. One of the reasons manufacturing in the UK as a whole is in the doldrums is because Sterling is overvalued because of our overmighty finance ‘industry’.
I wouldn’t want to be or be dependant on an export business in competition with others in rUK in your scenario.
Also with a strong currency the population tend to binge on imported consumer durables which is also not good for the domestic economy.
It might be fun in a schadenfreude kind of way but we will be laughing through our tears.
I’m with Muscleguy on the currency issue. I don’t believe a strong Scottish currency is desireable because it would stifle any attempts to develop industries in iscotland. (I don’t believe we will see Tories disappear either).
It is clear that UKOK believe they have traction on the currency issue and I expect this weekend might be our worst with more polls to come apparently. I say this for 2 main reasons. Firstly, someone reported an extensive poll run by Ipsos Mori last week with loaded questions. The next step in the campaign is to build on the ‘worry’ theme and we can expect poll reporting to play that up followed by the bitters advertising on the back of it.
My second reason has come from the recent pre poll boost in betting odds for the No side. I suspect that some, if not all, of the polling companies are pre-briefing the market before issuing poll results. I noticed one particular tweep has been graphing the Yes/no probability from a Betting exchange for some time now and trumpeting the shift. Last night he linked the survation poll to the betting market giving rise to my suspicions/paranoia. Unethical as this insider trading might be, the uk government and it’s allies are not immune to interfering with the process of this. On the back of the most recent rise we should expect further unpleasant surprises.
Important at this time to keep a sense of balance and proportion. Still time to address the issues in canvassing. Come on peeps get out there!
Actually, was just thinking that Milliband, in making it more difficult for Labour MPs to get re-elected to Westminster next year following a Yes vote, has just demonstrated that Scottish MPs are expendable as far as he’s concerned.
If I were a current Labour MP seeking re-election next year, I’d be absolutely raging about being put in this position.
I think it should be the new thrust of the argument on any debates in the future to any prospective Scottish Labour MPs (I have on in mind) – in the event of a Yes vote in September, do you agree that a currency union is in Scotland’s best interests and, if so, why are you standing on a platform of opposing it? On the other hand, if you think a currency union is not in Scotland’s best interests, why are you making such a song and dance about it and implying it will be a disaster if Scotland doesn’t get one?
Thanks to everyone, I am still unable to access WGD or Derek Bateman. John King I know you are in Fife also so it may be just us Fifers?
Ken500, Have been saying for years that joining the SNP could never be considered a good career move whereas joining Labour in Scotland was something a lad oh pairts did. I think I have said this about Alex Salmond until I am blue in the face that he could have been Prime Minister had he not been one who saw what being in this Union was doing to his country.
@Iain Gray’s Subway Lament says:9 August, 2014 at 9:26 am:
“Looks like No aren’t paying attention to the detail again.”
Do they ever?
Had one the other day say to me, “Ir ye ane o thae Cybernats”? I replied, “Aye! bit yon Alex Salmond seems tae hae loast ma e-mail address ‘cos he nivver sends me ony orders”.
It did, of course, fly right over his head. These numpties really do think we all are under direct orders from, “The Great Dictator”. So I asked him, “Are ye still a member o yer trade Union”? He said, “Aye”. I said, “Has yer union taken sides on the Referendum issue”? He says, “Aye”.
That too went right over his head.
I think Ed has shot himself in the foot with a howitzer and hung his Scottish MPs and voters out to dry.
I wonder how many more Labour voters will move to Yes today?
as it is so important for BT/WM to reject all of the currency options laid out by the scottish govt et al, including, the commonsense CU. imv it is now time to ask BT/WM what their preferred currency option is. link to snp.org
Bugger (the Panda) says:
Aye, your right, nice one!
Throw him the rock coz he looks like Carmichaelmoore and doesnt deserve a B or a C
Another great cairnstoon!
Helena Brown says:
Helena, having watched Alex Salmond from his early days, he has never changed his mind not even wavered an inch.
He believes in democracy for his own people.
Despite how the Unionists portray him he is a Patriot!
Grouse Beater, gave up buying papers a long time ago but have had the odd click on them when someone has put them up. This stops now. I bought the first two copies of the Sunday Herald but something stopped me continuing. Perhaps it was that they were still not being even handed. I want fairness with the MSM and even the Sunday Herald is not fair. What ever happened to investigative journalism, two things Tony Blair, David Kelly, The BBC and now Murdoch. All dance to the Establishment tune in fear.
Great Cartoon Grieg also, meant to say that way back.
Oops, sorry Chris, I really meant you.
les/helena
yes he is a patriot. i have no affiliation with any political party, i’m a socialist. salmond has soul. he is showing we the people what confidence and self esteem is. that we all matter and can all make a difference. we are indeed sovereign. he is saying see for yourself.
Brilliant cartoon, Chris !
A few thoughts:-
After Independence, rUK will struggle to stand on it’s own two feet !
I love the irony in that after a lifetime of being indoctrinated with the idea that Scotland is dependent on English support.
Further, after the Referendum on Sept.18th,
and given a Yes result,
about which I have no doubt whatsoever,
the City of London and the financial markets world wide will not wait for Independence proper
but will react immediately to rUK’s change of circumstance.
From Sept 18th, England will find itself in very choppy financial waters.
But David, George, Alistair and all those who are such experts on how England subsidises Scotland,
will come to the rescue.
Raising the Titanic will be easier.
But.. but.. but…
Let’s get across the line first.
Vote YES.
Helena
I too cannot get tho WGD site. looks but can’t find anything.
Hope Paul is ok and if he reads this maybe get a wee word from him
@Helena Brown
No problem loading WGD in Glenrothes.
Salmond does change his mind about policy details. For example he was in favour of joining the Euro, but changed his mind when circumstances changed. That’s pragmatic and sensible.
You’re right though, he has never wavered from his commitment to the good of Scotland, and his knowledge that that lies in independence.
I can’t wait for it to be a no. There will be no currency union, it has no benefit for the rUK. Big eck doesn’t even want a yes, he’s already pretty much got devo-max by default – his original plan.
And there will be so much egg dealt over the faces of these pseudo-intellectuals talking about ‘politics’. I hope you have good spatuli.
I’m really worried after that Darling-Salmond debate.
All i have heard is form people going on about Alex Salmond refusing to talk about plan B.
We all know that salmoind should absolutely destroy darling. The Yes arguments are so much stronger. With almost 2 million people tuned in this was the chance. It was blown big time and may have cost the referendum if something is not done soon.
a lot of anger on facebook my son tells me, over this –
“PIERS Morgan has dipped his toe into the debate on Scottish independence by tweeting his support for the No campaign.
The former Daily Mirror editor tweeted to his 4.2m followers: “OK, Scotland, you’ve had your fun. Now just quietly vote ‘NO’ and we’ll say no more about it.”
AAAGH!
macdoc
plan B has by default been rejected by WM/BT. plan B is in this doc;
link to scotland.gov.uk
plan B has always been sterlingisation. but @ least wm/bt are now discussing currency options. a lot can happen over the next few weeks.
O/T I believe it is worth emphasising that Darling (like Carmichael) conceded that iscotland would be in the EU and he was unable to refute Salmond’s statements about Scotland paying in more than it gets back. In all the angst about currency these are major shifts in the BT argument that don’t seem to be being highlighted. I’m sure if we go back to the first Darling Statement the day if the WP launch, you might be able to tick off his ‘assertions’ that he is now conceding.
Bob W I have tried everything from clearing my cache to using google still cannot get in, not can my Husband, I am reassured if others can, was worried that he might be under attack. His blog was excellent yesterday but it just might have attracted the creeps for you know who.
Nice cartoon.
I was just trying A4 size printed letters for the window and found AYE YES EASY
@john king says: 9 August, 2014 at 9:39 am:
“dont know if you saw my comment to you @ 09.16, the offer stands.”
I did reply, John. Briefly I’m pretty much home-bound with, (among other things), Meniere’s Disease. I can only stray as far as I can return, either home or to my adapted Camper van, when a bad turn comes on.
I get a warning of the attacks. However, the campervan’s power steering broke down two days ago so I’m stuck to within a 20 minute, (very slow), walk from home. Just waiting for the garage to come for the van just now and hope it’s not a long job.
You and My Comb says:
I agree with what you say, the Unionists are fighting for everything THEY hold dear. They WILL lie, cheat, manipulate, threaten, and anything more they can do. MI5 will be heavily involved, as will GCHQ. Every angle they can think of and yes, even bookies odds, to make it look like we are losing.
Yet, Scots are contrary people, you say no, we say YES.
I have faith despite all think anti democracy stuff, we will, on the day, vote YES. I cannot imagine we will forget all this.
MacDoc, I reassured a friend yesterday regarding the debate. From what I am reading and seeing Alex won without raising a tone. I think it hurt him to do so but he let Darling rant and rave and show himself up for what he is. Seems women are starting to see the way now. Alex was not the smug git they thought he was.
Stewart Hosie answers questions
link to bbc.co.uk
# fred blogger
I am wondering that Plan A was always going to be Sterlingisation, and that the Currency Union was actually Plan B..
So Milliband is going to have a threat of no currency union enshrined in Labour’s manifesto. That says much about his regard for Scotland and Labour’s faithful Scottish voters, and their support for a party that supposedly represents their interests.
The message this sends loud and clear is Labour’s disrespect of Scotland and its voters, an acknowledgement that our collective contribution to the UK over three hundred odd years counts for absolutely nothing, that Scottish people count for nothing in the UK Labour Party. Hopefully the message might make a few Labour voters think more seriously about their vote.
Vote No or we will destroy ourselves to get back at you, says Milliband, insisting destruction of businesses in rUK and its teetering economy will be a price worth paying to get one over on Salmond and the Nats. Doesn’t sound like a stance that guarantees sound economic management of rUK, does it.
Genius Chris. Just genius. Essential viewing for every pro-dependency politician.
Helena
I am in Dalkeith a wee bit more south than fife and can’t get the WGD. Had this problem with Derek Batemen a couple of weeks back. Might be the unsettled weather.
@Grouse Beater says: 9 August, 2014 at 9:41 am:
“‘It’s not real independence’ they say, and I answer, that’s right. What country does not rely on another for its good progress?”
The answer to that one I found most effective was, “That’ll be why the USA and UK have a, “Special relationship? These two states cannot be real independent states by your logic – or can they”?
They usually have no answer. You cannot beat a bit of real logical thinking to overcome confused thinking.
I’ve had WGD up all day with no problems. I’m not sure but McHaggis I’ve really not found many supporters of no in the real world. The only ones I know actually featured in a Vote Nob Orders advert which should ensure their long term ridicule. All seem to have longstanding connections to the men of Jaffa so perhaps you just need to keep away from them as they can just about operate facebook but are unlikely to have the ability to find a polling station as it might involve a school or a church hall, neither of which they have inhabited for a long time.
mr thms
I am wondering if Plan A was always you can keep the debt, a pegged currency with no debt will do just nicely. 🙂
mr thms
the offer of CU has to be made as plan A, and meant. even though looking @ the other currency options, CU does seem very generous in favour of r.uk. CU is imo in the best interests of all citizens of our island.
BT
cybernats/currency union
this will be it till sept 18th
@Bugger (the Panda) says: 9 August, 2014 at 10:10 am: I
“Scotland could end up by being rUK’s lender of last resort?”
Err! BtP, Scotland has been the UK’s lender of last resort since 1 May 1707. Didn’t you know that?
Looks like it’s time to put no bailouts for failing foreign currencies in the new Scottish constitution that would sit nicely alongside a strong Scottish Pound. 🙂
Just got a letter from Ruth Davidson with No Thanks stuff: A3 poster, window sticker and badge. Hope I don’t see many of them around!
What’s fascinating is the diversity of views for everyone interested. So from rather wonderful Brian Cox from bonny Dundee
link to bellacaledonia.org.uk
all the way across to link to adamtomkins.net
and my Slovene girlfriend, who is definitely not a rather batty law Prof at Glesga!
link to id.theguardian.com
My girl’s CiF for the union today “Thank you for providing yet more evidence showing that Scotland’s independence case is based on arrogant, bigoted, blind, greedy selfishness.”
I could stand in line for this, bet Jason Bourne’s a YES vote.
Blair Patterson, could listen to you all day, good stuff.
Indubitably.. ‘A’ Currency Union is what is being offered on Scotland’s lifebelt. Take it Westminster, before the currency under-currents drag y’all down, do it for your country! As a famous Scot once said, “these are Scotland’s terms”.
Also, nice looking cloud of wing 🙂
SuperCaliFragilisticExpialiDocious
link to youtube.com
headland shrimp
now we begin to understand why wm/bt condemn salmond for being so generous and insisting on CU. iscot can do plan B independently. it is not really anyone else’s business, but the people of iscotland’s.
The Pound Sterling is not a strong currency; it is weak. Any review of its trading performance against the Euro, Yen & US Dollar over the last 15 years or so, proves it.
Despite the weak currency, the UK has a £2 billion trade deficit EVERY month. And it is 30% less productive than France, Germany & the USA.
Scotland has a hugely positive trade surplus every month. That’s one major reason that there will be a currency union. It’s really more to England’s benefit than Scotland’s.
If you haven’t already seen the blog post that follows you might find it useful.
Ihttp://subrosa-blonde.blogspot.co.uk/
@Helena Brown
I can get Wee Ginger Dug no problem. Up in rural Aberdeenshire
Better to be a free poor man, than a rich slave.
P.R.D. says Aye Scotland.
Nothing wrong with the Wee Ginger Dug (or Bateman) for me. Either on computer or phone.
HandandShrimp, did you get my message about JREF forum possibly disappearing? Just in case you have any PMs you need to save.
We should be using Millibands own words against him, he would rather cost the rUK billions of pounds in transaction charges, lose hundreds of rUK jobs than be in a CU with Scotland.
Not to mention doing Scotland and the Scottish Labour voters down.
Just a wee OT thought. The Salmond versus Darling debate. I was wondering Salmond should have held out for a Cameron debate. Darling’s opposite number is really Dennis Canavan. Both being the chairs of the respective organisations.
I’m suggesting this because Salmond versus Darling might have been seen as SNP versus Labour. Since this referendum will be won by seducing Labour voters, that might have been a strategic mistake.
A Labour-Labour debate and a Scotland-Britain debate would have been more appropriate. Too late now. Anyway, BT would never agree to those formats.
Fantastic cartoon Chris. 😛
Thanks for the link goldenayr, I didn’t know but hey ho the Better Thanks/NO Together/ Project Feart/ Whatever never were ones to give advance warning of visits by any of their masters of the Doom world. We did have wee Anas Sawar thingy and his wee red bus, with NO windows 😀 , in Tesco’s car park in Annan a few months back. Never mind WE have Business for Scotland with their BIG bus in Tesco’s car park in Annan this afternoon, and it does have windows! We’ll be going along with our battle truck just to say hello like. 😉
Anyone worried about all the discussions about polls on here should realise that the vast majority of us do not believe a word of them. We all know that the pollsters are fixing the results to suit their paymasters, normally BTHQ. Do not be put off by the poll results, only one poll actually counts the one on 18th September and WE will win that one be in no doubt about it!
For anyone getting tired and fed up with all the so called unionists on their Facebook/Twitter accounts just do what I do ignore them. Well I say ignore them but I do have a wee *ahem* play with them now and again. 😛 I have one such individual on my Twitter account, I call him my pet DM reader, the trash he comes out with MUST be coming from the DM. Any way he regularly comes out with the old favourite what’s your currency going to be? *YAWN* It is always amazing that these incompetent baffoons are incapable of figuring out that it makes absolutely no difference what currency we use cause the in/out of a currency union is a totally different and independent issue. DOH!
Apologies for the long post folks. 😉
I think that this move by Milliband proves the rumours that the Labour hierarchy have conceded the referendum will be Yes. They know how this will go down in Scotland, that SLAB voters will be further alienated by it, but they don’t care. The announcement was aimed squarely at rUK voters. Scotland can go hang, they have a GE to win. Though how they do so without all those SLAB MPs will be interesting.
It further indicates that either they do not think a CU can be agreed before next May, or that the media will not report or give credence to statements by the Scottish negotiators. Judging by the media now I suspect they may be right.
I will even further posit that the rUK negotiators will be under instructions not to agree a CU before May. IOW the negotiations will not be in good faith.
We may have to call their bluff and announce intentions to go for another option and get the markets to kick them up the bum.
Lesley-Anne says:
” We all know that the pollsters are fixing the results to suit their paymasters, normally BTHQ. ”
Agree completely. Looking at the latest Survation poll’s breakdown by region and comparing that with another recent set of regional data, also from Survation, the two sets of data are sooo different it is literally unbelievable.
We are somewhere around neck & neck which explains BT’s hysterical behaviour.
The worry was that a Plan B that involved refusing UK debt would leave Scotland looking reckless.
Well, what can be more reckless than risking the UK economy by refusing to continue a currency union with Scotland?
If it ever came down to refusing debt, I believe the financial markets would completely understand the difference.
We are WILLING to pay, but not if we don’t get a fair share of the assets – including the pound that we have helped to build up.
In that case, any extra costs arising to Scotland could REASONABLY be subtracted from the debt.
Robert Peffers
This time Robert we charge interest and at Wonga rates.
If you listen to our FM’s answer to Willie Rennie from Thursdays FMQT, you will hear him say that it would be in Scotlands best interest to start off debt free, but that he didn’t think it was a reasonable position for the Scots Gov to adopt.
So the Scots Gov is being responsible and offering to repay our fair share of the debt…
But this is of course tied to our also sharing in the benefits (if any) of being in a CU.
No CU is a huge benefit to Scotland!
Well I can only think it is something like the weather, cause I cannot get onto the WGD at all. did a bit more housekeeping computer wise, still nothing. Haven’t tried Derek again, no idea what is doing it. I can even get onto my Social site and it is in the US.
@Colin says: 2:01 pm
Has Ed’s threat on cu and cost’s and jobs in rUK been been transmitted in LONDON. Doubt it, they are playing both ends against the middle, divide and rule.
A LABOUR potential PM threatens rUK workers jobs and company profits to try and frighten old insecure Scots into voting to remain in an abusive relationship that will steal their own money to feather the nests of the elite establishment in SE England as have the Tory and lib parties.
They have also signed up to all the austerity program’s and more, planned by the libdems and the Tory’s. This is the party of the people. It’s a con like everything else that UK politics is about.
The end for this lot is on the horizon and it can’t come soon enough to save these poor old brainwashed natives in Scotland from the plundering of their counties wealth and the embezzlement from their pensions and taxes.
Aye divide and rule and plunder at will.
A bunch of insincere conn artists and robbers, with menace and forethought.
Vote yes for endless hope. Vote no for hopeless end.
This is the time to stand up ask straight forward questions of Westminster and Brusssels. Not just about Scots oil, the future of the Scottish renewable energy or EU membership.
Westminster kept an EU farming rebate last year for Scottish farmers, only paying Scots farming an amount they decided was appropriate. So how much money does fishing in Scottish seas make and who gets it? Iceland have huge fishing stocks now but no one else gets near them except Icelandic fishing boats. Mind the Iceland UKOK cod war late 70’s. Scotland has a huge area of ocean.
link to en.m.wikipedia.org
It will be extremely interesting if there is a YES vote to see how the rUK could back track to agree to a currency union. I think the BT strategy of saying there will not be a C.U has dug them in way deeper than they wanted and I don’t see any escape for them unless Cameron, Clegg, Osbourne, Alexander, Milliband, et al, resign, step down, whatever.
@heedtracker
We have 1% of the population of the EU and 25% of it’s fishing grounds.
I take my hat off to the ScotGoesPop and skiers of this world who read the full tables of polls for “fun”. The old girl on What Scotland Thinks who is on about the polls being up the creek pursuaded me to look at this Survation one for the Mail. About as interesting as watching paint dry and hard on the old brain cell doing mental maths with all those figures.
BUT
but she may be right; this poll had like 70% voted in 2011 when only 50% actually did and again 70% watched the debate when only 40% actually did. How can you say that such a bunch can predict what Scots really feel when they are self-evidently not representative of the whole of the people in Scotland?
This is all about getting a Yes vote. They’ll say and do anything to prevent that. They’ll tell us they’ll carpet-bomb Aberdeen if we vote Yes, if they think that’ll achieve a No vote.
They don’t care what they have to do if there really is a Yes. They’ll back-track or u-turn or bluff it out or whatever seems like a good idea at the time. It doesn’t matter. The only thing they care about is scaring people into No.
The only thing we need to care about is countering this. Negotiations will happen after a Yes, we know that. But we have to get there first.
I’m going out leafletting, talk to you later.
The money allocated to Scottish farming amounted to almost a quarter of a billion euros over a seven year period.
Scottish farmers are losing about 60million euros a year until 2020.
Good wee, pic and how ironic.
The ant-independence minded, and London owned Daily Record gives Ed Miliband a two page spread today to scaremonger on everything from a currency union to the EU not admitting Scotland due to it not taking a share of UK debt
The Canary Wharf owned Record (must after all the facts of independence have been studied),be seen as an anti-Scottish newspaper.
The hypocrisy of the Daily Record knows no bounds either today they give almost a half page story about a Better Together sign, that was damaged, and they claim it was yes supporters who damaged the sign. No mention of the threat to Jim Sillars nor the disgusting slur made to his late wife Margo.
I’m fed up listening to the currency crap and I’ll bet a lot of voters are.
All people are hearing now is “We will not let you use the pound”
The first principle of achievement is mental attitude. People begin to achieve when they begin to believe.
@Les Wilson
“Folks we are like two horses in a big race, we are approaching the last fence and closing the distance, we are speeding up, we are ready to take the lead.
A big push will put us over the line and to be declared the winner.!!!
The no2 was hot favorite yet in the last few yards he ran out of stamina, the winner was that bit more nimble and brought in a handsome profit for it’s backers.The punters were smiling ear to ear as they got their winnings.
We are that outsider, lets put on that big last sprint to win.”
——————————————–
This would make a great Chris Cairns cartoon….
@ Jim, but how much money is made from fishing Scottish seas and ocean and by whom?
t’s probably not even recorded and it’s murder trying to find out. More importantly Scottish fishing stocks are all close to extinction , or actually extinct. The point is, why don’t we know these things, let alone allow ourselves to be projectfeared day in day out, by another country that thinks it has a god given right to run ours.
Norway is not in the EU and it’s not by chance.
@heedtracker
I don’t honestly know how much is made but I can tell you there are few deep sea boats that are family owned. The Wood group would be a good place to start looking for information.
All that seems to be left in my area anyway are creel boats, clam boats and shrimpers.
“The total value of sea fish and shellfish landed by Scottish vessels in 2013(p) was £429 million, a decrease of eight per cent in nominal terms compared with 2012. The quantity of sea fish and shellfish landed was 366,400 tonnes, under half a per cent more than in 2012.”
Source:
link to scotland.gov.uk
I don’t really think there is the time left to properly present a definite Plan B anyway. It is only just over a month to go. The MSM/No campaign only want a Plan B because then they will trash it (just as they have trashed the currency union option), and demand yet another currency plan from the Yes campaign. I say they can go whistle for it.
Where I think Salmond has made a mistake is in not being clearer on the other options, other than currency union. He should have listed them in the TV debate, instead of giving a page number to a fiscal commission that very few voters will have heard about. The other main problem is restoring momentum. The Yes campaign has been on the defensive this week. They need to find a way of regaining impetus and energy.
@ Jim, thanks, £429 million but what does say Spain take and earn from our waters? It’s one more EU/UKOK con that makes GERS look like what it is, half the accounts.
@ muttley79
Of course they will trash it because they know plan B is not what is best for Scotland nor the rUK which kind of negates there argument does it not.
More Libby Carrell of the Graun front page thundering, so scary
link to theguardian.com
@Jim
Not sure what you are talking about? They trash the currency union option because they are fanatically opposed to Scottish self government. This is not about wanting a Plan B, they could not give a flying one for whatever that would entail either. It is a tactic on their part, and as such should be resolutely opposed.
“Scottish boats accounted for 87% of total UK catch and 37% of total allowable catch in the EU. There was more fish landed in Shetland than in the whole of England and Wales combined. Despite the volume of fish landed by Scottish boats, Scotland receives only 41% of the UK’s European Fisheries Fund and between 1.1% and 1.4% of total EU fisheries funding.”
The FM has made too much play of trying to look reasonable & fair to the English electorate.
He knows that the rUK will suffer economically by achieving Scottish independence but he just really just come out & explain why it is in their interest to agree a currency union rather than just refer folks to a stuffy academic examination, sourced from the White Paper.
It really is quite simple; the rUK needs our currency to prop up a hugely negative balance of trade. Scotland enjoys a healthy positive trade balance while England’s is hugely negative.
And without Scotland’s wealth, the amount of sovereign debt as a proportion of the rUK’s GDP will jump significantly, further undermining their credit rating.
Whitehall & Westminster knows this but daren’t admit it in public because it shows a weak hand. The FM has been reluctant to highlight it for fear of appearing to be deliberately damaging the rUK’s economy.
But since London has been so belligerent over the currency union, it’s time to come clean & explain the even more precarious position the rUK will find itself in, without the financial contribution from Scotland.
@muttley79
I thought I made it clear enough but hey, ho.
I was agreeing with what you said, i.e, they are asking for a plan B so they can trash it because it is not in Scotland’s best interests, I never said they wanted one so where you got that from I do not know. Salmond knows a C.U is in the best interests of Scotland and the rUK which is why he is sticking to his guns on this.
I am well aware they don’t want us to have our independence.
Hope this clears things up.
With reference to the Wee ginger dug blog being offline.
I cannot access wgd here in Devon through my isp which is sky it just returns a constantly loading blank page.
However if I use a proxy called hotspot shield which shows me as having a US ip address WGD loads instantly.
This is the same crap which caused me to miss half of the salmond/darling debate.
those who cannot access wgd try hotspot shield proxy from anchorfree and you will see what I mean.
if we go to plan B,they will say whats wrong with plan A
canae win
Not only but also, why do hard core UKOK propaganda machines like the Guardian need two journalists by-lining exact same vote NO or else reportage, over and over?
Job sharing’s fun. “No no Severin say everyone hates AlicSamin again, 10 times isn’t nearly enough”
Want to look bettertogther fluffy and nice, use a girl Graun hack, want to be all dead serious? use boys.
Use two Graun lying hacks, v scary, three con artists v v scary…
Its not scary, it looks desperate.
Yeah that’s the thing, this Sea of the UK BALANCE OF PAYMENTS is not tidal, it doesn’t come and go, it WILL continue to rise at an alarming rate with DRACONIAN repercussions for all to bear (as previously promised by the Chancer of the Exchequer).
Pretty soon this sea level will be rising up to Mr Salmond’s shoe-line.
Vote oui-oui!
‘X’
Yes should be more belligerent about this anti Scottish crusade, led by Cameron’s pet poodle Darling. Scotland was effectively threatened with financial and trade sanctions by Westminster and the London cabal. Cheer leader Darling proudly leading from the front.
link to whitefeatherclub.wordpress.com
@ G H Graham, I think Salmond tried to bring some humour into the debate by mocking ProjectFear and Flipper Darling. But its pretty hard to do, especially if its something as ghastly as ProjectFear.
The soul of wit is brevity, apparently. Good clean gags are hard to find in UKOK world and so on.
lol guys they are shouting about the CU loudly because it is their Achilles heel and dont want to show how weak they are on this and are praying by demanding we give them a plan B that they can then enter into negotiations for a CU without losing face,but wee eck is to smart for that and is not going to move from his position on CU ,there is more to this than just Scotland my friends what are the people of England going to think about their politicians when after we vote yes they suddenly realize that all they have been told is one big lie.
Great cartoon Chris it about sums up westminster`s position either listen to what we have to say for once in your arrogant history or else!!!!
Alex Salmond on currency union and options. An informative 6 minute watch that explains background to adherence to currency union.
link to youtube.com
Sorry I’m O/T here, oh gawd she’s off on one again I hear everyone groan. 😛
Just seen this on ‘Scottish and Proud’ Facebook page. I really just do not know what to say. 😉
A Welshman, Irishman, Scotsman and an Englishman are standing on top of a mountain.
The Irishman throws his hands in the air and shouts “THIS IS FOR MY COUNTRY!” and jumps off the cliff.
The Welshman throws his hands in the air and shouts “THIS IS FOR MY COUNTRY!” and follows the Irishman
The Scotsman shouts “THIS IS FOR SCOTLAND!” picks up the Englishman and throws him off the cliff.
-Maggie
If I was advising Salmond, I’d be watching someone like Bill Clinton’s old speeches and debates. Like Salmond, Clinton was utterly depised by America’s conservatives and their media, although Americans have the rather special NPR, while we endure the BetterTogether BBC daily monstering of Salmond and Scotland.
Even So, watch Clinton bypass the US equivalent of our horrifying UKOK media freak show and talk to Scotland First Minister, the way Billy Bob talked to America.
Sorry if this has been posted already
link to snp.org
link to facebook.com
In an outside the box thinking moment I think that Alex Salmond may have been very clever on Tuesday night. If you look at the debate overall, not necessarily listening to what was actually being said (bear with me here 😉 ), then what do you see?
Well one the one hand you see a very shouty, finger pointing, line fluffing, extremely flustered, SCARED politician standing BEHIND his lectern as if he thinks it will protect him. All the time he is shouting he is looking and shouting at his opponent.
Now consider the other politician on the debate. Here we had someone who was calm, relaxed, laid back in his approach, did NOT get excited or frustrated, was NEVER flustered, NEVER fluffed his lines, and was definitely NOT scared. Not only that but this politician did NOT hide behind his lectern, he stood out in front of quite a lot of the time and spoke directly to the audience.
Now I don’t know about anyone else but there is quite a stark difference here. Now I wonder, thinking about this which man I would rather have in my corner fighting my battles for me?
Murray McCallum
Thanks for that BFS clip of FM Murray. Very clear.
Dont htink the debates are the right way to deliver that message – too many petty interuptions.
Still think FM should offer to explain position to public via Face to Face STV dicsussion with Mackay /Ponsonby and then give Darling chance to put the UK case response.
@bookie from hell says:9 August, 2014 at 10:54 am:
“If a NO vote I can see Douglas Alexander coming out with
what was said was in the past is over”
Well I see something a wee bit different. A variation of the series of WWII cartoon with ever more dire situations and a UK soldier always saying the same caption line. Think for example a Tommy with his leg blown off and the Medic saying the epic line, “If you can’t take a joke you shouldn’t have joined”
I see the cartoon as a billboard announcing a YES victory and Eck saynig to Comical Ali, “Well if ye can’t take a joke ye shouldn’t have Joined BT”.
I think your dead right Lesley-Anne. Plus, who were the press going after, who has the press being going after for nearly a decade now? Salmond’s taken everything who know how many teamGB, BBC newsroom wet farts have thrown at him and yet there he is, standing tall, explaining Scotland’s future and front of a rather thuggish bussed in from England, audience.
Why Yes voters are grinching, I do not know. Maybe it’s oor Scottish ways:D
Heedtracker
Initially written by severin and rewritten by the second?
Why, i have no idea.
Maybe the original did not full fit the narrative that the Editor want?
I agree heedtracker. Alex Salmond has for decades almost taken EVERYTHING the MSM/BBC etc have to throw at him and guess what HE is still here whilst a lot of the BBC/MSM joke journalists have disappeared!
With regards to the gringing thingy of the YES supporters I think it may be because we are all YES and are anxious to see him do so well against what is so obviously inferior opposition. The problem is we are looking at all these debates etc through the eyes of someone who wants to see the opposition, in this case Darling, knocked out flat on the floor. However, A.S. sees this whole debate thingy in a different hue. He is not in the debate for the absolute knock out. He knows, as I think we all do deep deep down inside ourselves, that his job is not to do stuff to please the convinced YESSER but to do and say stuff that will make the Don’t Know voter sit up and take notice and even begin to think a wee bit more seriously about what HE is saying and a little bit LESS about what Darling is mumbling/shouting.
I think we all have to accept that we will not see the knock out we all want. What we will see instead is a reasoned approach from A.S. along the lines he has done from day 1 of ‘slowly slowly catchee monkey.’ It is not the style that WE want to see, most probably because we are all sick to the back teeth of all the lies from BTHQ. However A.S. whilst knowing they spout nothing but lies also knows that the vast majority of D/K’s will still be getting their info from BBC/MSM. THAT is a very big mountain to climb.
A.S. know he will never convince hoardes ov voters to turn to YES during a debate. He knows that it is the likes of US, the people out on the street stalls, in the YES shops, canvassing, delivering the YES newspapers. It is US who will win the D/K voter over, and we ARE winning them over. FORGET all these rigged polls that always appear in the D.R., D.M. etc (spit) They ARE rigged, we know they are rigged. So while we will pull them apart they are NOT that important. It is what happens out in the streets, at the front doors, THAT is where the battle IS being won!
Slightly O/T
Thought I would share this picture of a nice looking Boeing 757. The sharp eyed will be wondering which country its registered, as you will see its registration is M-RISE
Well its little old Isle of Man, who not only has the Isel of Man have its own Civil Aircraft registry but also is in a currency union with the Bank of England
link to planepictures.net
@ Bugger (the Panda), its just all part of the act, the Times used to thunder, The Independent thinks differently, the Gran poops its pants. BBC/UKOK media’s a mafia and we have to very wary of what they’re capable of doing to Scotland and the Scottish people.
Well it made me laugh Lesley-Anne.
This made me chuckle too
link to north-star-news.co.uk
What a cracking paint job there Edward.
I have to admit I have often been seen late at night in bed dreaming of what our aircraft could be registered under other than the old G-ABCD type of registration. 😛
One idea that keeps coming back to me is, if ICAO would allow it, A-ABCD. 😉
i know we all wanted Eck to destroy flipper and i kind of think Eck wanted to do that as well, but flipper is doing such a grand job of destroying BT on his own why force them to replace him,as for the TV debate i have said it before Eck was going into the lions den and knew full well what they were going to attempt the fact that he walked out unscathed is testament to his debating skills a lesser man would have got caught up in the BS and looked foolish,ask that big idiot Crash about that 😉
@Muscleguy says:9 August, 2014 at 11:33 am:
“We don’t actually want a currency that is that strong.”
Indeed, and that’s why The SNP say a currency union is their first choice and would be good for both Kingdoms. The point is the Bitter Together campaign are attempting a gigantic bluff by ruling out a currency union.
That’s where the the reverse psychology comes in. We reverse our choice and dare them then to accept it. Except we DO NOT rely upon the BofE nor the Pound English and that takes the wind right out of their sails. The consequence of what would result, as you point out, are not good for Scotland either but it is a damned site easier to deal with a hardening currency than it is one that is going right down the stank.
@Lesley-Anne, 4.04pm
That anti-English joke on a BTUKOKNT site reminded me of the following post by Peter Arnott
link to peterarnott.blogspot.co.uk
A LEADING member of the referendum No camp has accused Yes supporters in Nairn of being so “vitriolic” and intimidatory they prevented reasoned debate.
He must be having a larf with this one AyeAlba. ‘Preventing reasoned debate’ is he being SERIOUS? 😉 I mean any time he turns up the most vitriolic anyone gets is when they actually ask him a question! 😛
I watched a video of said *ahem* leading member of NO camp recently and he was asked a question by a wee older lady who just so happened to have a YES badge on. She was SO vitriolic that he totally ignored her polite question and went into one of his by now well recognised shouting frenzies into the mic. Why he needed the mike is beyond my understanding, being this site’s village idiot always helps here :D, but there couldn’t have been more than a dozen folks standing around, most them with looks of “who the hell is that and why is he shouting?”
@ AyeAlba, That Bettertogether man quoted, is Donald MacKenzie, a rather well known dude around Nairn objecting to any and everything, including their bypass. Its not the Question Time man who said he die for the UK, more like the guy that crowd sourced nearly 700 grand in legal objections holding up the Aberdeen by-pass for years, lost and moved back to England. Its quite weird really, every Scottish town and city has people like Donald.
“One onlooker, Better Together supporter Donald MacKenzie from Crown, said: “The separatists wanted to shout him down. They behaved in a very unpleasant manner and were a very poor advertisement for their cause.
link to inverness-courier.co.uk
Lesley-Anne
No reason why not, A1 looks as if its available 😉
link to airlinecodes.co.uk
I love this, ” The separatists wanted to shout him down….
They only ” wanted to” but didn’t – is that what the fella is saying ?
Gee whizz! C’mon the Yessers!
Aye it does Edward. A1 would be nice but I actually thought just the A on it’s own you know like B-, C-, D-, G- etc. To be fair if ICAO said no to us being able to just use A- then I’d accept A1-. 😉
OT – Some people have been reporting problems accessing the Wee Ginger Dug blog. WordPress, who host the blog, have been doing some work on their servers and the problems ought to resolve themselves shortly. As far as I can tell there is no evidence of any nefarious activities, so nae need for any tinfoil hats.
if anything darling should have answered the plan B question, and not asked the plan B question, as he already knew the answer.
if not, why did he not know the answer?
take away the commonsense CU option, what’s left.
who on earth asks questions that they already know the answers to.
so there was no need to even ask the question, unless it was done to cause trouble.
people can easily find out the plan B answer. he tried to make it look like salmond was withholding.
salmond did not go to have a catfight, but to get the pos case for indy out there, he did.
O.K. folks here we are five lovely wee photos from Tesco’s car park in Annan today.
I’m the nutter in the cowboy hat and stick and yes folks that IS our battle truck with the YES Saltire. 😛
link to tinyurl.com
You have to give it to Alex Salmond as others have said.
If you think about it; In the ‘NO More Scotland’ opinion.
Scotlands future in this referendum ammounts to
Alex Salmond (Bad yin) v The good guys of UK such as
The entire UK State gov system (inc BBC) – Westminster / Civil Service, Whitehall + All British political parties = Tories, Labour, LibDems & UKIP (in coalition).
The OBR, IFS, Various select committes, CBI, Better together/No Fanx, No Borders, ‘Lets stay together’.
The Herald & The Scotsman, Daily Record, Daily Express, Sunday Post, & all regional Scottish Newspapers + all notional Scottish Broadcasters of TV & Radio.
Team GB, The mighty ‘Professor John Curtice’ (at every turn), Inept state polling companies Ipsos Mori, ICM, YouGov.
Scottish Journalism in general, The Church of Scotland, The Boards of Glasgow Rangers and Glasgow Celtic.
Has beens like Gordon Brown, Lords Reid, Robertson, Foulkes, Baroness Liddel, Kennedy, useless M.P’s such as Davidson, Sarwar, Curran et al.
Hacks like Chrichton, Maclead, McColm & Cochrane, Archie MacPherson, John Barrowman and the Krankies it goes on and on …
You have to say, for the polls to be at 45% YES / 55% NO its really quite ‘astonishing’ as someone in charge of SLAB would say.
He’s doin’ no bad, lets help the guy out and get into this fight, sleeves up everybody.
Link not working Leslie Anne 🙁
Lesley-Anne says:
Looks like your pics have been removed
Hmm, I don’t understand that Edward. I tried it after I posted it and works for me. My partner is going to e-mail me the photos, they are on her Facebook page, and I’ll put them up again later. Sorry about that. 🙁
@lesley anne
Well if ye think thats funny , i`ve jist saw six men kicking and punchin the muther in law at the bus stope.
The neighbour shouted ,”are you no gonnae help?”
A said “naw , six should be enough!”
ha ha ha
Aye I think you beat me with that one thomas. good one! 😛
@muttley79
The other main problem is restoring momentum. The Yes campaign has been on the defensive this week. They need to find a way of regaining impetus and energy.
Agree entirely.
This currency issue should have been turned into an attack.
The NO campaign are deliberately lying to the people of Scotland.
We already partly own the sterling system, and the Bank of England – which should really be called the Bank of Britain.
Refusing a formal currency union will need billions in compensation and greatly weaken the pound.
Every London owned supermarket and shop in Scotland will be hit with millions in annual trading costs, while Scotland will reasonably be able to disown a big share of UK debt.
They are taking people for fools.
It’s like one partner threatening to saw off their own leg out of spite.
Just not going to happen unless they are completely deranged.
Apologies about the previous problems folks. I really, really, REALLY hope this link works otherwise I’m gonna go for a long walk off a short pier. 😛
link to tinyurl.com
Good to meet Gerry, Ron, Tartan Tory and others at the Wings stall at Arbroath Sea Fest today.
I don’t know if anybody happenened to listen in on ‘Any Questions’ this week and the subsequent ‘Any Answers’. There was a question about the effect of a ‘Yes’ vote on the rUK and the panel of London types proceeded to say that Scotland going independent would relieve England(sic) of a burden. McDonald Hastings (former broadsheet editor)said he had no doubt on that score. The panel were unanimous that Scotland was a net financial benificiary.
With that falsehood, I thought there might be a chance of a contrary view coming from Scotland or Scotophiles in rUK when it came to ‘Any Answers’, but there was a complete blank on the subject as callers preferred to talk about Iraq, British values and Prince William.
What can I say? Another case of being ill-served by the MSM/Establishment. Chris’s cartoon is so apt but nobody on the ‘No’ side will admit it this side of Sepember 18. The schadenfraude will be lovely.
In 1997 Bliar,Brown, Darling and all their SLAB scab MP`s awarded 6,250 square miles of Scotland`s Ancient Inshore Fishery in the North Sea to England.
Those searching for Fisheries Revenues need to search under the English Count and deduct those 37,000 miles of Scotland`s Coastline extended out to Twelve Nautical Miles.
Those vast square miles all the way around Scotland from the high-tide mark that is OWNED solely by the CROWN ESTATE.
Do you realise that the Forth Estuary AND the Tay Estuary are owned by England – thanx to Bliar, Brown,Darling and their Scab SLAB MP`s in 1997.
Academic explaining media bias in the Independence debate.
link to tinyurl.com
Not sure the policy on youtube videos. My comment wont post without using tinyurl.
@Lesley-Anne –
The battle bus is MAGNIFICENT go you 🙂
@WantonWampum.
link to en.ria.ru
a nice wee Google doc picked up from FB
link to docs.google.com
Further, on SEA fisheries of Scotland.
Every lobster pot and crab pot and nets that are anchored to the Seabed requires a Licence bought from the Crown Estate.
Every MOORING buoy, mooring place etc in every bay also requires payment to the Crown Estate whose Published Profits will never be revealed,but they are always pleading poverty despite the fact CE Holds this Monopoly that must be greater than the land mass of Scotland.
Every MOORING buoy, mooring place etc in every bay also requires payment to the Crown Estate whose Published Profits will never be revealed,
And are they in GERS? Doubt it.
It wasn’t just the Labour M.P.’s Wanton, don’t forget Labour were running the Holyrood administration with, oh look, the LibDems. Donald Dewar was the man in charge, I think, when Blair did his thieving of OUR waters.
Thanks for that Croomps. Every little bit helps as they say. 😛
Apparently it’s going to be a supermoon tomorrow night, I would love to have a big Yes light something like the batman light to shine on it. 🙂
link to en.wikipedia.org
Jim Murphy stopped off in Tain on Monday evening and received the same kind of welcome he was given in Elgin and Inverness..
His reception line can be seen awaiting his arrival at link to facebook.com 3 pics down.
Even using his loudhailer I doubt if his message was heard by either of the naysayes who turned up.
Now LA the car in the 2nd pic with Connie Ramsay is one of our understated Highland Yes cars… best be about decorating I think!! 🙂
Did Jim Murphy just say on STV (news) that an independent Scotland will not be using the pound?
Farrochie says
“Good to meet Gerry, Ron, Tartan Tory and others at the Wings stall at Arbroath Sea Fest today.”
Sorry I didnt get the chance to meet you Farrochie, but the stall was a rip roaring sucess with a lot of positive feedback and several people shaking my hand and congratulating Wings for is debunking of msms scare stories,
People really do appreciate all your hard work Stu, Im just sorry it wasnt you who took the thanks of those people personally,
We had a wee visit from your old freind Alex Johnstone
I think he was hoping to see you there,
but for every person who said they were no voters when I offered them Yes campaign material ten said thanks we’re yes already and the undecideds took the offered material gratefully.
I had one guy who said he was a no, and when I asked him why, he said all the banks would move to London (because they said so),
Out comes the argument Stu made,
so I asked him why would they move several thousand jobs to a city with much higher wages and more expensive buildings to fight other banks for the available workforce when they have just that right where they are in Scotland at a much cheaper price, he had to acknowledge that argument made absolute sense and so began to question what else he has been told was a lie,
My no friend is now my yes friend. having walked off with campaign stuff a car yes sticker and proud cybernat badges for his kids 🙂
Understated is good Boorach, not everyone has to push the *ahem* boat out as far as we do with our wee battle truck. That said your wee *cough* decoration on your battle car would certainly look good on our battle truck. 😉 😛
In his Budget Report earlier this year Osborne informed the House of Commons that the unelected ConDem Govt would Borrow £198 Billion in 2014-2015.
Via Barnett Consequentials Scotland`s Share of the Debt is approx £19.8 Billion.
2014-2015 Scottish Parliament Budget from Westminster was set at only £28.6 Billion.
HOW MANY REASONS DO YOU NEED TO VOTE “YES”.?
Edulis – I heard any questions and the pomposity and arrogance of the panellists was sickening. Most sickening of all was MAX Hastings who clearly has no idea what he pomps about – a pompous, arrogant, windbag!
mr thms says:
Yes he did say that, without challenge ie HOW CAN YOU STOP THEM?
o/t It wouldn’t surprise me if Cameron manages to drag us into another war in Iraq in the next few weeks.
I wonder what effect that would have on the referendum ?
To Nana Smith
Thanks for the Link.
STV and IPsos/Mori set up a TV debate with a fixed audience so they can claim the FM did not do so well. This of course is followed by poor polling and hey presto they can point to the debate for the reason for the polling. Do not trust any part of the British establishment – they have lied for hundreds of years to get their own way!
“WantonWampum. says:
Every lobster pot and crab pot and nets that are anchored to the Seabed requires a Licence bought from the Crown Estate.”
Sorry but that is not really true. All commercial fishing vessels require a license but this is not purchased from the crown estates.
The licenses are owned by the skippers/owners and can be bought and sold, originally they were free to registered fishing boats when the need for them came into force, think it was an EU thing.
Shellfish do not have quotas but you must have shelfish entitlement on your licence to catch them.
White fish do have quotas and they are traded, lots of skippers/owners decommissioned their boats years ago and were given money from the EU to do so. It was meant to reduce the fleet but weirdly they were allowed to keep their licence and quota.
There is a healthy market for both licenses and quotas and it has ended up just being another means for the money men to make money, I heard Manchester United own the majority of the Monkfish quotas and they lease them out to Fishermen. Just another way for the money men to make money at others expense.
How the hell can a Scottish Labour candidate in the next General Election face potential voters telling them he is happy his party blocks Scotland’s prosperity in their manifesto because it’s ‘in England’s best interest?’
It defies belief Miliband will place them in that suicidal position.
To heedtracker –
I seem to recall a figure (this year?) for PART of the Crown Estate Revenue was £34 million.
UNfortunately, there were ZERO “GERS” (Govt Expenditure and Revenue Scotland) included in their “Guesstimate”.
Grouse Beater
I’m reminded by the last days of the Third Reich, when a desperate Hitler ordered his Generals to take suicidal actions in order to save wheat was left.
Miliband is doing exactly the same, stating that the 2015 manifesto will include a bit about the pound not being shared, creates two situations, first , the obvious, trying to scare voters, especially the ‘don’t knows’. Secondly to sharpen the resolve of the Scottish MP’s to start being more active in Scotland in the campaign for a No vote.
If their is a Yes vote, then you will see a bit of a reduction in Scottish MP activities, as you say, Miliband has effectively signed their collective suicide notes as not one would have the brass neck to contest a seat on Miliband’s Manifesto
Safe to go O/T? – Drool, dribble, pant and dream. I want, want want one of these. Thinking glass of Jura malt, sunshine through mah windae and explaining to weans why someone had sewn YES into the fabric.
link to twitter.com
It is great to read that new records are constantly being broken for visitors and page views to this site. Every time a new record is broken, I know that more and more people are looking elsewhere for the facts rather than from the conventional media.
Our time has come.
@yeAlba
This made me chuckle too
link to north-star-news.co.uk
_______________________
He wouldn’t answer a little old lady’s question about Crash Gordon’s lies about organ transplants therefore to use his own phrase, “prevented reasoned debate”.
“Yes campaigners tried to intimidate him and drown out his hour-long speech.”
I thought it was a debate, not a sermon and how do 15 people drown out a man with a microphone and amplifier?
“He also faced vocal opposition in Inverness.”
Anyone see a pattern here, i.e, people are not allowed to voice their opposition of better together to a member of the No campaign, whatever happened to freedom of speech?
“The Yes supporters kind of circled me,” he said. “I don’t know if they were trying to treat me like General Custer at the battle of Little Bighorn but I just stood my ground.”
Oh my God this is getting incredulous, General Custer, oh my God!
“I grew up in a housing scheme in Glasgow.”
And?….Who exactly cares, I doubt you were in any danger of having to use those fighting skills honed on the mean streets of Glasgow!
“It made me even more determined to stand up and speak for the quiet majority.”
Why would the alleged no majority be so quiet, ever think the majority may be the Yes side which is why you always have a poor turnout of people supporting your cause? I find it a bit strange that if the so called majority cared about staying in the UK then they would be out in force supporting you.
“It looked like an argument rather than a debate.”
What, like the argument you had, loudhailer in hand whilst totally blanking an old woman’s question about the lies of your former leader!
To HOOD
Thanx for the correction – duly noted.
Nae wonder Sir Alex Ferguson is a SLAB SCAB supporter when ManYEW owns the Monkfish quota or part thereof.
@Edward
In the event, nay certainty, of a Yes vote, the Westminster GE will be a damp squib. In fact I am not sure if the elected will have anything great to do, except ensure that skullduggery at Westminster is monitored and reported back to Holyrood.
If it is in 2016 at the new Holyrood GE, there will be no Labour, Conservative and Liberal parties as we know them now. How could Lamont, Baillie et al, as well wee Willie stand bearing in mind their perfidy would dare. That lot need consigned to the political wheelie bin of history and a new untainted generation advanced.
I also see the emergence of a small group on new political parties and thereafter groupings of them acting in consort on a case by case situation.
Funnily enough I could see Action Krankie trying and possibly succeeding at jumping to a Holyrood loyalty.
LA, afraid I can’t take credit for that car. Mine’s a 3.5 ton LWB LT35 similarly decorated.
There’s a half dozen of us who take pleasure in wee cavalcades around the area and certainly cause heads to turn!
Talking of cavalcades I’m desperate to acquire a 12v PA system if anyone can suggest a supplier. Remember I’m a pensioner so funds are limited! 🙂
Derek Bateman letter to the editor of the Scotsman
link to derekbateman.co.uk
Well said!
A great showing today at the Wings stall in Arbroath. By FAR the best display out of the three ‘political stalls’ present. Good to meet everybody and I’ll apologise for not remembering all the names (just blame the wine).
I went to the BT stall in the morning and stated my case as an undecided local businessman looking for answers. I put a simple question question to them as follows, Can you tell me how we are better together without using the words ‘Alex’, ‘Salmond’ or ‘SNP’. Not one of them could even begin to utter a sentance. After a while, an older woman told me “because we just are, now go away please”!
Not much to worry aboout there folks.
Well done to Alex (Thepnr) for pulling it all together. 🙂
Found this link from Munguin’s Republic:
link to anotherangryvoice.blogspot.co.uk
Seems this Yorkshire man is not too happy with Westminster either!
Some interesting comments from YESSERS and a link to Wings for our sincere friends to find our more. I like that.
With regards to the pound v the euro.
Here’s a post I did when Gareth Bale was sold to Real Madrid. I will paraphrase it for those who don’t want to click through. Unless you want pretty pictures of course.
link to welshnotbritish.blogspot.co.uk
When looking at the most expensive footballers I noticed that if you used pounds then Andy Carroll was England’s most expensive footballer. But if you used Euros then it was Rio Ferdinand.
In 2002 when Rio was sold from Leeds to Manchester Utd £1 was worth €1.49 but by 2013 when Carroll went from Newcastle to Liverpool it would only get you €1.17
If Bale had gone to Madrid at 2002 exchange rates it would ‘only’ have been £67M instead of the £85M due to the tanking of the pound.
As mentioned above a currency union is what is best for the people of this island. I don’t neccesarily believe it is what is best for the people of Scotland in the medium to long term though.
Oomph! I’ve just had a wee thought whizz through my solitary brain cell Boorach. 😉
Your wee collection of Tes, sorry AYE, cars and the battle truck in amongst them. Can you imagine the heads THAT sight would turn! 😛
Alas like you I’m on limited funds and live in the South of Scotland for my sins to boot. still it is a nice dream to have don’t you think? 😉
@Boorach
I was just saying whatever happened to the loud hailer electioneering cars and vans which used to go round the towns. Maybe I’m of a certain age to recall these so young folks on here may not.
I think your local hall may have a PA system which you might borrow. My friend regularly borrows one charity fundraising.
Many thanks to everyone I talked to at Arbroath Seafest today- was very pleased to be able to put faces to names for a few folk at least!
GEEZ T.T.!
That really is a cracker.
We are Better Together “because we just are now go away please!” :P:P:P
Aye that will certainly convince the 10,000 undecided voters to vote NO then! 😀
WantonWampum
It is actually quite a sad state of affairs, lots of skippers/owners have to purchase quota while at sea just to be able to land what they have caught.
There is a huge market in quotas and although the Fishermen make a decent living they are risking there lives daily for it. All the while someone else is making just as much sitting in a plush leather chair and selling that quota, it really annoys me.
Hope you don’t mind T.T. but I just had to relay your wee encounter with the very informative Better Together bunch over on Twitter. 😛 😛
@TT – because we just are, now go away please
Come on TT don’t you know that it’s better to be part of something bigger, to pool and share resources, to share risk and reward FFS it’s the best of both worlds! 🙂
@Wanton Wampum and Hood – this is a great piece written by a fisherman on yes Orkney’s facebook….
link to facebook.com
@ BtP – A New Untainted Generation. What an interesting post and something that has crossed my mind when I confront and in a kind way point out to Labour supporters their party’s future in an Independent Scotland. I oft point out that new vibrant politicians are needed to balance a good Scottish Parliament. However I am wary of youthful exuberance and just wonder which politicians with gravitas and knowledge would or could revitalise an effective Opposition or Coalition at Holyrood. Any comments?
Croompenstein
Aye, read it a few days ago, brilliant and spot on.
Crown Estate –
To Rev Stuart Campbell and
To Hood, heedtracker,Nana Smith et al
“MAIL ONLINE” of August 9th 2014 – today
“QUEEN celebrates £37.5 Million per annum windfall because she owns the seabed” – headline news.
She gets extra for renting the seabed for cabling from offshore wind farms.
Have a look guys.
Thanks Nana but it’s to use whilst driving so needs to be compact, 12 volts and able to accept microphone and MP3 inputs with a dirty great speaker to mount on the roof.
Used to use them in the Banff & Buchan area… superb for drawing a crowd and getting the message round the estates.
An online petition against BBC bias if anyone cares to sign up.
link to you.38degrees.org.uk
@Hood –
Doug did a good piece in April after Bertie Armstrong did some indy bashing..
link to wingsoverscotland.com
I wonder if this is breaking some EU rule on democratic process?
After all being a member of the EU carries real responsibilities on behaviour towards other EU citizens.
OT
Bateman Broadcasting has branched out an is now doing video as well as audio. He has a really nice wee interview with Billy Kay where Billy is not afraid to say that he is a nationalist motivated by the heart as well as the head.
link to youtube.com
and…
If you fancy hearing Billy in person he will be at Strathpeffer Community Centre on Tuesday August 12th at 6.30pm along with Mary Ann Kennedy, Louise Batchelor, Brian Munro and music by Ring o’ Fire. Should be a great night.
link to yeshighland.net
Croompenstein, yes saw that as well, have shown it to quite a few local Fishermen when they have been in my workshop.
WantonWampum
Yes, big money for doing nothing, she also makes money from leasing Salmon netting rights amongst other things.
Just in case anyone in the Ellon area is at a loose end on the 12th of August. 😉
link to tinyurl.com
I didn’t include the important bit: Labour, Conservatives and LibDems saying they would include blocking currency union in their election manifesto.
Croompenstien says
“@TT – because we just are, now go away please”
Not what they told my wife when she asked them to convince her to vote no their answer was, “we’re all one big family, we all help each other”
I got her on video btw the guy behind the stall wsnt too happy though, I think thats what got Alex Jonstone off his fat arse to waddle up to the wings stall,
Oh hush my mouth.
Not sure how well this Evening News poll was covered – buried deep in their site it gives a pretty solid lead to Yes before and after the debate. It may well be old news to you all.
Of course the headline “Scottish Independence: Evening News readers split on debate” carefully ignores the Yes vote winning before and after the debate by a similar margin. I wonder if, when we win, will the result be reported at all?
I’m no poll expert – anyone know if this was a poll on the EN site or a phone poll? Or numbers polled?
How did you intend to vote before the TV debate?Yes: 47.2%No: 34.6%Undecided: 17.8%
How are you intending to vote now?Yes: 54.1%No: 40.2%Undecided: 5.1%
Who do you think won?Alex Salmond: 37%Alistair Darling: 38.1%Tie: 24.3%
link to archive.today
To Croompenstein
Thanx for that link to fisherman Howard Mc Crindle.
His sadness and his fury resounds.
The guy is right – “it`s time to man-up and take our future into our own Scottish hands ” end quote.
@john king –
I think thats what got Alex Jonstone off his fat arse to waddle up to the wings stall
What?..like this….
link to youtube.com
Lesley-Anne are we shooting Unionists. Need to give them a sprting charce wot?
Re the use of the old-fashioned loud hailer from cars during election campaigns.
I was in Dunfermline on Friday and a private car towing one of these big advertising trailers with big Yes billboards on it, was going round the bottom of the High Street.
The passenger was using a hand held loud hailer so no need for speakers on top of the car or it wired to the car battery. It was very effective and got a lot of thumbs up that I could see.
Top marks to the two gentlemen in the car for this effort which I thought could be a great reinforcement of any High Street stands.
Croompenstien says
“What?..like this….”
Pretty much. 🙂
Archie etc
I don’t envisage a monolithic opposition.
That is old Punch and Judy politics from Westminster and needs binned.
I am thinking may 10 parties of varying size and political persuasions who carry with them certain core values, ideals and targets but who will work with other parties, large and small, to advance their agenda. I say really crusade for it, not only by holding the others to ransom in votes.
To that end all SMPs must take oath to advance the good of the scottish people before their own.
Bugger (the Panda) says:
Lesley-Anne are we shooting Unionists. Need to give them a sporting chance wot?
Why? 😉
Are they giving us one, a sporting chance I mean. 😛
How come BtPs avatar keeps changing?
One post it’s the panda,next it’s the pixels.
Dubbieside, thanks for the suggestion. It’s something I have considered but given that we usually travel solo it’s not really a goer.
O/T Whilst manning a YES street stall this afternoon in Callander I had an interesting conversation with a supporter from Glasgow who works for the giant oil services company Schlumberger. During a conversation about Scotland’s wealth he gave a heads up about further evidence of more very large scale oil finds in the area West of Shetland and totally unconnected to BP’s Clair field but which the company’s staff are discouraged from talking about for the time being. Perhaps someone here or the Rev might dig further and unearth some interesting information which Westminster will be anxious to bury until after September. Better to find out and expose now rather than see Scotland being deprived of our assets as per the 1970’s. Anyone got more information?
Goldenayr, beats me. I am posting from an iPad which gives me pixels. Some blogs blogger I think defaults to calling me Inner Bearsden.
One confused Panda but it is me.
The more spelling and punctuation mistakes reflect the progress from laptop to iPad to telephone.
That’s AWESOME news ian, my lips are sealed. HONEST! 😉 😛
On a related oil topic, I believe that B.P. is planning to use a new system of extraction for the Claire Ridge field, if I understand this video correctly. I’ll leave all you chemists out there to get your heads round the theory. 😀
link to tinyurl.com
If B.P. are planning to use this Losal sytem of extraction in the Claire Ridge field I was wondering if anyone had any idea if this system is easily transferable back into the North Sea oil fields. I only ask because by all accounts the Losal system enables more oil to be extracted so I was thinking by transferring it to the North Sea we could very well see a reverse in the decline of oil from the North Sea and an increase of oil available for extraction. 😉
Lesley-Anne,
“I’ve just had a wee thought whizz through my solitary brain cell”
Only those with a Scottish cringe have a solitary brain cell.
And someone with a solitary brain cell could not have posted about a million posts here.
So please get that thought out of your head.
But … but … but … how on earth can I do any of that thinking thingy stuff Rock that all those brainy folks do if I throw out my solitary brain cell. 😛
I had an interesting wee conversation about oil this afternoon too.
I was leafleting a farm which has a caravan site attached – just a wee row of stands for touring vans. I’m given to understand that the farmer is an undecided but his wife is a No. As usual, a barking dog alerted someone to my presence at the farmhouse and the farmer himself came out. I was wearing my Wings t-shirt and a Yes badge, and he took the material quite happily.
Then as I was leaving he asked if I had any spare booklets and leaflets. I was about to give him some, when he indicated it was for one of the caravans I had passed on the way in. He said, maybe I shouldn’t really, but he’s a very strong Yes.
I was slightly puzzled by his turn of phrase, but went to the caravan in question which was being drawn by a car covered in Yes stickers. The couple inside asked me in for a cup of tea, which I was very glad of by that time, and by the way the husband was wearing one of these absolutely enormous Yes badges.
By this time I had realised that the Wings leaflet (“I’m voting No because I don’t want anything to change”) combined with the “Your Choice” booklet which doesn’t advertise its Yesness, had been taken by the farmer for No material. He can’t have noticed my Yes badge, or caught the significance of the “A hundred of us – remain alive” t-shirt. So he was in for a wee surprise when he read the stuff, and I hope he did!
He did me a good turn anyway, because I had a nice cup of tea and a chat with the caravan couple. And one of the things they told me was that their son is in the oil industry and he had told them – apparently quite independently of all the internet rumours – that there is at least 50 years and probably 100 years of oil west of Shetland, but the oil companies had been told to keep quiet about it till after the referendum. They also said someone had been sacked for tweeting about it.
So there you go, just one more confirmation of what’s going on, sitting over a cup of tea and a chocolate hob-nob in a wee caravan on the side of the Pentland Hills.
Oh and by the way they were also going on about layers of coal under the oil reserves, and getting it out using gasification methods. I think – he wasn’t all that clear but that’s what it sounded like.
@WantonWampum. says: 9 August, 2014 at 6:06 pm:
“In 1997 Bliar,Brown, Darling and all their SLAB scab MP`s awarded 6,250 square miles of Scotland`s Ancient Inshore Fishery in the North Sea to England.”
Now I’m going to tell you something that is fairly feasable about the Scottish English Borders. There are several areas that can be disputed and the Town of Berwick is one of them. A long time ago when I lived in the Capital City my then girlfriend worked for a lawyer in a large legal practice and I got to know an old chap who ran one of their departments. Like myself he had a lifelong interest in history and we used to often chat in the nearby hotel lounge bar.
The old guy showed me copies of the texts of several of the Scottish/English Treaties. One in particular was quite startling as it dealt with the transfer of Berwick to the English. The startling thing was that Berwick as a bit of real estate was never actually given up by Scotland. Instead the arrangement was that Scotland retained the town as Scottish territory but transferred the administration of it to the English.
The old lawyer figured that Scotland could legally claim it back again. Now look at a map and the mean average of the border turns south round Berwick then if the people of Berwick voted to come back to Scotland the line extending out to sea would not only bring back those stolen lumps of Scottish waters but a sizable chunk of former English claimed waters. Now if you lived in Berwick and Scotland was a richer and better independent country – what would you want?
Brian Powell,
“I wonder if this is breaking some EU rule on democratic process?
After all being a member of the EU carries real responsibilities on behaviour towards other EU citizens.”
For the moment EU ‘democracy’ does not apply to Scotland because Scotland is NOT an EU member, but a mere region of the UK.
The EU has made it perfectly clear that it can only give its opinion on independent Scotland’s status if the UK asked for it.
The Council of Europe has made it perfectly clear that they can only send election observers if the UK asked for them.
Apart from the SNP government, there isn’t a single ‘democratic’ government in the EU, or in the world, which gives a damn about the democratic process in Scotland.
We, the people of Scotland, are the only ones who can bring democracy to Scotland. We don’t have any ‘democratic’ friends we can count on.
Did you notice how bitterly Darling pointed to the democratically elected First Minister of Scotland and said I didn’t vote for him but still got him?
If we fail, we might as well ban the word ‘democracy’ in Scotland.
I wonder if any of today’s inhabitant’s of Berwick know about this Robert. I’ll bet they would want to return to the Scottish fold in a flash if they did know. 😛
Lesley-Anne 11.10
Whilst starting to drill for information on these new oil fields I found this interesting (long!) piece on the massive wealth of new fields awaiting development off our shores.
link to scotsindependent.org
It is inconceivable that our fellow Scots will hand this incredible wealth over to Westminster in five weeks time? Or is it?
sorry about but I just realised Currency Union, No ThankS. Apologies for swearing, I will now go and sit on the naughty step.
@KennethC at 7:38
Good to speak to you today, thanks for turning up to support us.
@Dan Lee says:9 August, 2014 at 6:09 pm:
“Not sure the policy on youtube videos. My comment wont post without using tinyurl.”
Not sure if anyone has replied to you Dan but for YouTube only, and just for this site only, you have to NOT post the bit of the YouTube address before the WWW bit. Hope that helps. By chance I was on my big machine video editing a YouTube bit from the Salmond/Darling debate. examining the actual things that were said and done.
Going through the first section of that recording and adding text subtitles to point out the lies told by Darling I was more aware of the lies. Many of which were distorted, not by the camera or production team but by the audience reactions. Now there were several claims made here that the audience were rigged. I’ve edited first film, then video, since way back in the fifties – and yes it rather looks like a stitch-up with the audience primed to boo and cheer at certain things to give a false impression. I’ll post the video on YouTube but there are so many lies, evasions and distortions I cannot hope to cover them all as space between each one is too small to contain the scrolling and superimpossed subtitles. With that much things needing highlighted I won’t be able to cover them all.
That is amazing stuff ian. The problem we have is probably two fold I think.
First off the BT crowd constantly harp on about North Sea oil as if North Sea oil is the ONLY oil that Scotland has access to. Now we know they are not stupid people, I know we always call them stupid but that’s only because of the garbage they say. I think this is actually a deliberate ploy by BT cause they believe that if the Scots only ever hear about North Sea oil and its dwindling reserves then they will believe that an independent Scotland can not rely on North Sea Oil. I’m pretty certain they, BT, know full well about the West coast oil reserves and those going all the way out to Rockall. Let’s face it why else would Denmark be interested in Rockall?
The second problem we have is that we need to get the information out to the public about the West coast oil reserves and Atlantic oil reserves. I’d almost suggest to people FORGET the North Sea oil reserves they are NOTHING compared to what we are looking at tapping into in the Atlantic and off the West coast of Shetland etc. THAT will shut BT down stone dead in my view.
I know Alex Salmond and co. always say that the North Sea oil reserves are a bonus to Scotland but what we need to say to undecideds is that this is true BUT imagine what this bonus is going to look like when we start receiving oil from the oil fields WEST of Scotland from the oil fields that are HUGE compared to what the North Sea oil fields ever were when we first started drilling them. 😛
Morag,
Today at Arbroath, under the guidance of Paula Rose I discovered the power of the ‘I’m voting No because….’ leaflet.
I have to say when I saw it at first I was doubtful (well, I used to be Rab the Doubter after all) but the great thing about it is it draws the soft No’s in and then you can land the punchline, by flipping it over.
I’m certain that at the very least some No’s are reassessing their position based soley on that one A5 sized bit of paper.
@ Morag, 11:17pm
There is definitely something going on. Earlier this week I was reconverting a don’t know back to Yes (don’t ask, the reasons for this have been done to death on this site). Halfway through our conversation, out of the blue, he asked if I had heard anything about new, big oil finds in Scottish waters. I replied I had read some rumours online about new oil finds but couldn’t confirm anything. He then explained he belongs to a classic car online forum, it is for the high end prestige car market. On this forum there are apparently a lot of oil workers and all they have been talking about for the last week or two is the new oil fields that have been discovered.
@WantonWampum. says: 9 August, 2014 at 6:20 pm:
“Every lobster pot and crab pot and nets that are anchored to the Seabed requires a Licence bought from the Crown Estate.”
What you may not know, WantonWampum, is that, (from memory), in the 1800 Westminster removed the Scottish Crown Estates from Edinburgh and included them with the English crown estate. Now this has several implications that can be disputed. The first is that the United Kingdom, being a bipartite union, could have been regarded as a single entity kingdom from 1707, but was not regarded as such.
In other words it was being regarded as two independent kingdoms right into the 1800s. The second significant fact is that the Kingdom of England Crown estates were being treated as a single kingdom of England but included the countries of England, Ireland and Wales. Thus bearing out the fact as indicated by the 1707 Treaty of Union that the United Kingdom is indeed a bipartite treaty but the UK is now being claimed by Westminster as if it were a treaty of four different countries but, as Westminster is the de facto parliament of the country of England, it is now the country of England at Westminster running the show as the masters and treating the other three countries as their subservient underlings. Even to now devolving England’s powers to the subservient underling countries.
Lesley-Anne 11.49
The catalyst for highlighting this potential bonanza can only be this site or the other YES supporting sites because the MSM will avoid the issue like the plague until after 18th September. If this can be given some momentum in the remaining few weeks it could be a game changer for many of the undecideds, some whom I met today and who still believe ‘we canna dae it” . Perhaps the Rev can set the ball rolling?
Absolutely ian.
We need to spread the TRUTH far and wide on this site and everywhere else that we have contacts. Personally I’ve just tweeted the link you put up recently. In my view the more people know the TRUTH about oil within Scottish territorial waters the better. More importantly the more people know that North Sea oil is not the END of the oil industry in Scotland it is only the BEGINNING!
I suspect that Better Together are so focused on North Sea oil for one reason and one reason only to scare people into believing that our oil industry is on the down turn and we have limited supplies of the black gold left. However, as we have discussed tonight we know that is poppycock!
I know NODROG touched on this over on the other thread but he was also asking if anyone knew about the rumour that a DA notice had been issued about the news of the oil in the fields West of Shetland/ Lewis/Arran etc.
Just listened to Tommy Sheridan he was saying about when we vote we will be using a pencil to mark the card ,What steps are in place for monitors to be present in all the voting booths,Going by the London media up here i would not put it past them to rub oot oor x from AYE/YES and put an x own no insteed.
Any chance of looking into this Rev.
Cheers ,Who needs a paper when we have Wings keep up the cracking work .
ENGLAND the drowning man of EUROPE a conjoined SCOTLAND to suffer the same fate.
ENGLAND’S obituary Death by drowning.
SCOTLAND’S obituary Death by suicide
L-A – does DA (notice) stand for Dark Arts?
It would not surprise me it did T Jenny. 😛
@Patrician
I know a guy that is driving an hgv for a local haulage company until he gets asked to go back offshore.
He was asked to take leave from his rig for 3 months on full pay, nice work if you can get it, ending in October. He will be relocating south of Arran but more than this he does not know.
@Robert Peffers
What about that woman shaking her head in disagreement with Salmond, they kept panning the camera to her whenever he spoke.
Psychological warfare is what they are waging!
@ Chris cartoon hot of the Printer at Arbroath Seafest,we had plenty laughs & your cartoon added more. Keep em coming.
@Jim
@Patrician
“He was asked to take leave from his rig for 3 months on full pay … ending in October. He will be relocating south of Arran but more than this he does not know.”
What might be going on, just a guess, is that oil companies are going to be allowed to do further exploration and test well. But only after the referendum. Before, and we Scots might realise the potential in our waters beyong the North Sea. HMG might have been holding off for years, pending clipping Scots wings. A No vote and they can do what they want without worrying about us. The UK economy needs as much oil production as possible.
I know people suggest big finds are being hidden. Perhaps, but if the rumours are true then they would be effecting the share prices of oil companies involved. I can see no evidence of share price rises.
Guys, with today’s Sunday Herald interview with Eck now out, I am wondering if the FM is playing a double bluff here, and has been wanting a new currency all along? I’m against us using Sterling unofficially simply because the interest rates would be set by the BoE. Yes, it’s acting independently, but if the negotiations break down and there is bad blood and recrimination from both sides, I think we’d really be better off with a new currency altogether. Make a clean break. I mean, what better pretext for creating a new currency than rUK not wanting to take us up on our fair offer? Thing is, we’ve already paid more than our dues over the last decades and given how Westminster fleeced our pockets, I don’t think rUK deserves £5bn in interest every year from us. Again, I know it’s in our interests to help keepking rUK afloat but if it gets really nasty after a Yes vote, I’d say bugger them and abandon Sterling altogether. Anyone else feel that way?
@galamcennalath
I suppose they could afford to hold off until after a referendum because if there are new fields being kept from public knowledge they are not exactly going anywhere.
“We don’t actually want a currency that is that strong”
I don’t see how keeping the pound, just because it’s weaker, is a good thing.
If you have a strong currency. Investing it on something like housing, hospitals, energy production, should weaken it.
Your exports become more expensive and because imports are cheaper, local manufacturers snd providers of goods face competition from outside the country. Employment suffers but because of oil and whisky your currency remains strong
I should have said that Norway structured their oil investment fund in such a way that I believe it is illegal for the government to use more than the interest from the investments. (I’m sure that Wings has this stuff somewhere in ‘resources’)