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All the way down

Posted on August 03, 2017 by

Today’s edition of The Times contains a textbook example of a phenomenon that we highlight regularly: how newspapers gradually unpick their own dishonest headlines to grudgingly admit a truth which is often the polar opposite of the initial claim.

Or as we more punchily tend to put it, “The Headline Is Always A Lie”.

This won’t take long.

So here we have the headline “SNP ORDERED EXPERT TO ALTER REPORTS”. The obvious implication is of a bullying and dictatorial governing party suppressing and distorting the facts. But as early as the first two paragraphs we learn that that isn’t true:

In fact Eisenstadt was asked to alter a draft, and agreed to do so. But why was she asked and why did she agree? It takes several paragraphs of irrelevant cherry-picked figures designed to obfuscate and confuse, and “SNP BAD” quotes from the opposition about something else entirely, before right at the very end we find out.

Eisenstadt had in fact specifically requested that the Scottish Government check her draft version report for accuracy before publication, and accepted a factual correction they made. The Times article makes absolutely no suggestion that the alteration was in any way inaccurate.

The headline SHOULD, then, have read “Report Released With The Correct Facts In It, Thanks To Scottish Government”. But that version wouldn’t have hurt the SNP, and it wouldn’t have sold any newspapers.

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    1. 03 08 17 10:57

      All the way down | speymouth

    200 to “All the way down”

    1. yesindyref2 says:

      Yeah, the Herald reported in a similar, though not as bad fashion.

      It seems the Unionists really don’t like factual reports and professional independent experts. Quelle Surprise!

    2. Albaman says:

      Nice one Stew,
      If only the likes of the “National”, would do similar, and take on the Unionist papers head on.

    3. Scott says:

      The dishonesty of the mainstream media just goes on and on.

      Keep up the good work exposing this kind of deliberate manipulation.

    4. Macart says:

      The meeja haven’t exactly covered themselves in glory this week.

      Still, support us because… reasons.

    5. Short Changed says:

      This must be where the BBC get their journalists from

    6. Proud Cybernat says:

      It’s almost as though the entire MSM thoroughly detest the SNP Government or something.

    7. MajorBloodnok says:

      Reports are NEVER just submitted to a client and then they just have to accept it. They ALWAYS go through a review process that often involves accepting feedback from the client and indeed others (depends what the report is). Just shows how hacks can make any normal process seem sinister and disreputable for propaganda purposes.

      If only these third rate hacks penning their SNP-bad stories actually sent them for review for fact checking purposes; would save us all a lot of bother.

    8. McDuff says:

      Is that headline not actionable as it is a lie.
      I am thougherly sick of this daily diet of lies and deceipt which is why we all have to back the rev big-time in his case against Dugdale.

    9. yesindyref2 says:

      What gets me most is that Sturgeon appointed Eisenstadt in an anti-poverty czar role precisely to pick out flaws in the SG policies, and Eisenstadt duly did that in a full and critical report – exactly as specified by Sturgeon.

      Then the media are all over it to pull the SNP apart and try to discredit them. But hold on a wee minute, that’s precisely WHY Eisenstadt was appointed – to highlight the flaws in the system.

      But then, having used Eisenstadt to discredit the SNP, the disgusting media are completely happy to trample all over her as an “independent expert” and allege that she isn’t independent, is weak, and walked over by the Government. A government tool in fact. Rather than the independent and very professional expert she clearly is, who wants facts, not errors. Well boo, that doesn;t suit the agenda of the anti-SNP media who will use and abuse anyone to get at the SNP.

      Media has no respect for individuals, experts – or the truth.

      the anti-SNP media was

    10. Andy Anderson says:

      Stopped reading printed media twenty years ago due to comic style and lies and half truths. I remember when our press was held in high international regard. I do get the National however as it is more accurate and less sensationalist. Electronic news is also suspect.

      When we do get independence I hope we have a law written the stops this. Facts only plus sensible editorials. I like to dream sometimes.

    11. brian says:

      Another fine piece of analysis. I expect you are suprised nowadays if the meat of the article is genuinely reflected in the headline.

    12. Ian McCubbin says:

      Keep exposing these Stuart. Seems unionist press have no bottom depth for lies.

    13. gordoz says:

      Now if your trying to say SNPgood Stu, you’ll get flack and Donalda will be cracking the whip to get those facts distorted further by tonights news. Just wait and see.

    14. gordoz says:

      Oh and has anyone asked Kez for her version of the facts in this case, as her facts always seem to be like Grouchos principals.

      Thinks she calls them alternative facts or something?

    15. Street Andrew says:

      More BS exposed, Stu.

      Good work. I don’t know how you have the patience.

    16. Dr Jim says:

      The great “Scottish” media again

      How about this one,
      Apparently there’s too much “Scottishness” at the Edinburgh Festival now, you know that festival, the one in Edinburgh which is in Scotland the country that is Scottish

    17. Brian Powell says:

      The Times once had a reputation as the most accurate reporting, now it manufactures lies but avoids defamation claims by putting the real story somewhere in the text.

      It is sad to see a major paper lying but sadder that it is subverting democracy.

    18. Valerie says:

      Disgusting.

      Don’t know if I’m just needing a break from social media, or it IS getting worse right now.

      We have some charity decrying baby boxes, so Mark McDonald setting out the rebuttal.

      SNP have their policy unit actively looking at a public bid unit for the Scottish railways, so yoons jumping around at that.

      Then this bs.

    19. crazycat says:

      @ Major Bloodnok at 10.27

      If only these third rate hacks penning their SNP-bad stories actually sent them for review for fact checking purposes; would save us all a lot of bother.

      A few months ago I went to the launch of a fact-checking service, which overall was a waste of my time and travel costs. But I did “learn” something – several of the panel members were hacks (I’m sure they wouldn’t class themselves as third-rate, though!), and one of them made a claim, which was nodded at by the others.

      This claim was that every article she wrote was checked multiple times, including for accuracy, by more senior staff on the newspaper concerned, and that she had to be able to justify everything. I’m almost certain that the newspaper in question was The Times.

      As an Alert Reader, I didn’t find her assertion credible, though I ought to be able to believe what someone says about themselves, especially at an event like that. The fact-checking service itself seems to be reasonable – she isn’t part of it, but was just a guest at their discussion/self-congratulatory back-slapping event.

    20. Peter Macbeastie says:

      O/T slightly, but related.

      Listening to Radio Scotland this morning; must be a masochist or something.

      Just after seven they have an interview with a mental health specialist; their lead report is on mental health patients not being discharged after hospital treatment because no suitable care package was established.

      It took nearly the whole interview of the interviewer having said ‘mental health patients in Scotland’ to clarify it’s actually a UK wide issue AND allow the guy being interviewed to praise the Scottish Government as they’re already trying to take action on it.

      I expect neither the praise or the clarification made it into later bulletins, but the handy criticism from some Labour non-entity criticising the SG will.

      Just as with the papers; broadcast news is very much the same with the headline is always a lie but the truth will likely be buried somewhere in the following piece. Thus the BBC will claim they’re bring impartial when anyone with half a brain knows that, above every other porkie, is definitely a lie every single time.

    21. Its the same old unionist mentality,they simply don’t like nor accept any report which doesn’t undermine what the Scottish Government is doing to make thing better in Scotland.

      So they are reduced to telling lies and making up fake news headlines such as Naomi Eisenstadt being ordered to alter her report.

      Maybe instead of calling them unionists, maybe they would be better describe them as Trumpeteers, after all they have got so much in common with him.

    22. yesindyref2 says:

      @Valerie
      Don’t be disheartened, there’s a change a-coming. The SNP have indicated they are moving to the next step putting all the hints together.

      I’m ready.

    23. heedtracker says:

      UK hackdom are such shits really. Today’s UK bizzaro world of tory journalism is mainly terror, lots and lots of BBC says be terrified of terror, the coming war with North Korea and oh yeah, UKOK gimpery is all about Venezuela bad. Also, baby boxes don’t actually kill babies, but they probably do, says BBC r4 gimps. Best beeb gimp line today, North Korea can launch a nuke strike on the UK and its meant to be the silly season.

    24. Glamaig says:

      Peter Macbeastie says:
      3 August, 2017 at 11:18 am

      ‘I expect neither the praise or the clarification made it into later bulletins’

      You are right, they didnt. The expert was explaining the facts and praised ScotGov for the alcohol minimum pricing policy. and GaryR was going ‘but, but, broken promise etc’. That bit wasnt on later bulletins.

      I just love it when the experts they invite on dont play SNP Bad.

    25. Clapper57 says:

      One can always rely on MSM to be duplicitous as it is a prerequisite to the writing of any article regarding the SNP and indeed Scotland ever gaining independence….and the very fact that this blatant deceit is, once again, being exposed by WOS is justification of the importance and necessity of sites such as this being supported.

      The establishment are frantically trying to confuse people into thinking social media supports fake news and therefore cannot be trusted as a reliable source…..while ignoring the very culprits, MSM, who regurgitate political agenda driven fake opinions disguised as news…where headlines sensationalise and mislead and whose content is so ambiguous that tis hard to find the truth among the ill informed and biased opinion of the hack that has penned the offending piece of horseshit.

      Unfortunately for the press and the establishment….. people are now wise to the political leanings of various media outlets and thus read these articles while in sceptical mode. So a pinch of salt is taken on the validity of claims and assertions made within their content….note how the Daily Express conveniently goes into front page ‘medical breakthrough’ or ‘weather’ mode when there is any negative news in respect of e.g. Brexit , Brexiteers or positive news relating to EU….deliberate or coincidence ?….Hmm.

      We are wise to their modus operandi and see it all for what it is …..PROPAGANDA.

    26. Movy says:

      I hope that Naomi Einenstadt will write to the Times pointing out the exact sequence of events and taking exception to a spinning headline. After all her reputation is also questioned by this type of spin.

      Off topic, I had missed the Gove statement about fishing. Is there a case for crowdfunding a poster campaign and putting up posters all over Moray etc. giving the direct quote. I’d be more than happy to contribute.

    27. Tombee says:

      It is infuriating in the extreme, to learn of this continual deception by this completely irrisponsible and corrupt propagandist media. Further exacerbated by the fact that the excellent disection by Wings challenging their veracity, doesn’t enjoy the same coverage to expose their corrupted version. A version of what they print, and broadcast, purporting to be news.
      The disgraceful conduct, particularly of the BBC, in reporting spurious allegations against Michelle Thompson,is a prime example of their deliberate campaign to destroy the character and reputation of the SNP it”s members and a SNP MP.
      Will it ever end ?. They seem to have little regard for possible admonish ion and act with apparent impunity. A free press ?. Free to lie, obfuscate, deceive and injure the reputations of honest citizens more like it.

    28. Petra says:

      O/T (to some extent)

      Thanks for the links Nana (last thread) and I see that amongst them is one from indyref2 outlining the latest about The National and Ross Greer.

      http://indyref2.scot/the-media-we-need

      As Ross Greer complains about the National we’re all faced with a daily dose of propaganda from practically every other newspaper on the stands, ALL as far as I can see, and of course the BBC and STV.

      We all seem to be agreed on the fact that we need broadcasting to be devolved to Scotland to ensure that we control our own broadcasting service / s, however until that day comes around, better still independence, we’re TOTALLY reliant on sites like this to get the message, truth, out there.

      We’ve recently supported sites like weegingerdug, iScot and so on for that very reason and yet one of the MOST important daily outlets of all for us is REALLY struggling. Not helped by the fact that some independence supporters, for some obscure reason, want to do it down. Ross Greer as an example complains bitterly about a front page of the National from last December, that is ‘ENEMIES OF THE SCOTTISH PEOPLE’ which featured Theresa May and David Davis dressed up in ridiculous judge’s wigs (a send-up of the Daily Mail original).

      A Mr George Mitchell wrote into the National on Tuesday (1/08/17) praising the newspaper, stating his astonishment on reading that the team producing the ‘excellent publication’ consists of 10/12 people only and that he was saddened by the comments made by Ross Greer. He went on to ask how we could help as he didn’t want to be faced one day soon by a ‘LAST DAY OF PUBLICATION’ notice.

      He got a response from Callum Baird, editor, which read:

      ”Thanks George – it’s frustrating as we had a great six months up until the election. In fact, our sales were actually UP compared with the previous year – pretty much unheard of for papers these days. As for what you can do to help? I’m open to suggestions. We’re already delivering bulk copies to Yes groups to give out at stalls and into hands of potential readers. What else could our readers do to help? Answers to feedback [at] thenational [dot] scot, please!”

      Note the ”PLEASE!”

      Now this as we know is the ONLY newspaper right across the UK that affords a platform for people like weegingerdug, Gordon MacIntyre-Kemp, Richard Murphy, Alyn Smith, Lesley Riddoch, George Kerevan and so on. It’s also akin to Professor John Robertson’s site in that it publishes more positive Scottish news that’s downplayed (suppressed) elsewhere and of course has articles on Scottish history etc. Do we really want to lose this newspaper? Do we really want to see the opinions / information from some great influential supporters of independence being quashed? Do we really want to see the Unionist supporting newspaper editors rub their hands in glee?

      If not you can subscribe to the newspaper online for as little as £1.74 a week. In other words for less than 30p a day.

      http://www.thenational.scot/my/why/subscribe/?ref=tnav

      If you can’t afford to pay, and even if you can, maybe you could come up with some constructive ideas to keep this newspaper going by sending an email to feedback [at] thenational [dot] scot

      Or if you go into a store that doesn’t sell the newspaper complain or email their head office asking them to do so.

      Whatever the case we REALLY need this newspaper and it’s in our power, ONLY, to do so. Yesterdays front page alone was the only newspaper showing any sign of really supporting Michelle Thomson and Ross Greer (had tweeted previously that the National does more harm than good) was also afforded the opportunity to have his say followed by Callum Baird’s response to him …. ‘One newspaper can’t be everything to all people in the Yes movement.’

      Whatever your opinion (if you consider it to be lacking in some way …. help it) of the National PLEASE support it.

      Some readers comments:

      ‘Letters II: The National dares to be different and that is to be welcomed.’

      http://www.thenational.scot/community/15449827.Letters_II__The_National_dares_to_be_different_and_that_is_to_be_welcomed/

      ………………………………………………………

      PS This is not a post promoting negative comments about Ross Greer, as that’s the last thing we need, it’s solely about supporting the National.

    29. David McCann says:

      WE should all be taking action and reporting any questionable stories to the Independent Press Standards Organisation (IPSO).https://www.ipso.co.uk/
      And keep doing it.

    30. Valerie says:

      @yesindyref2

      I really hope so. Perhaps yoon private polling is dire, and numerous trolls have been deployed. New Twitter accounts attacking, are getting the norm.

      This baby box thing is quite despicable, and again, look at the timing we are well into the implementation.

      Having looked at the profile of CEO of Lullaby Trust, London based, she loves London, but went to Stirling university. Coincidence?

      Someone has asked if she is a former Labour Spad, but not found that so far.

    31. galamcennalath says:

      This is not bad journalism, it is part of the widespread conspiracy to undermine the democratically elected government of Scotland.

      Much puzzles me about the anti Scottish Independence campaign in many of its manifestations.

      I obviously understand why political organisations of Unionist persuasion campaign. I also accept that instruments of the ‘British State’ fight for the survival of said state i.e. the BBC.

      Also, certain commercial organisations may decide to get involved in constitutional politics because they fear Indy will harm their business. Similarly there are individuals with personal interests i.e. Dan Snow.

      Then of course we have to deal with blood and soil ‘British’ and English nationalism which operates beyond logic.

      The Times is part of News Corp. That organisation appears to be strongly anti Indy. Why? What has Scotland done to offend Murdoch!? He’s an Australian of Scottish descent, and US citizenship I understand. Why are they/he fighting for the Union? Nobbled by the ‘British State’? What’s the kick back?

    32. TheWasp says:

      The Daily Record printed a story about me on the front page with a colour picture and everything. That was in September 1975. Every single statement in the article was wrong, the interview I gave to the stringer from Ayr was twisted into the records view of what happened, with no concern whether it was true or not. I haven’t bought a newspaper since.

    33. Scott says:

      I see that these crap BBC have still got this up on the Politic page.

      Michelle Thomson: Fraud case against former SNP MP dropped

      Complaint away to BBC but just expect usual answer.

      What would we do without you Stu

    34. Robert Peffers says:

      Apology for this coming a bit late in the comments as it took a while to write- sorry also it is rather long but cannot be covered in a short form.

      In the mid 1930s there was widespread sympathy for Nazis and Nazism in the British establishment. A, “British ‘Establishment”, that included key figures of the aristocracy, and the press were also keen supporters of Hitler right up until the invasion of Czechoslovakia.

      They much admired Hitler feeling that he offered the best means of preventing the spread of communism. At the same time they turned a blind eye to anti-Semitism and the attacks Hitler made on communists, socialists, and other of Germany’s internal opponents.”

      Until the outbreak of war, in 1939, upper-class, debutant, “British”, girls were doing ‘the season’ in Germany, attending balls, learning about art and hunting for husbands. Among the upper echelons of British society intermarriage was seen as a way of preserve the peace of Europe. In fact, “British”, high society in the 1930s had a love affair with Nazism just as serious as that of people of Germany around that time. Many in the British high society who had a great affection for Germany and liked what they saw and the intermarriage between British and German high society went right to the top. Remember that the British/English Royal Family were then called the Saxe-Coburg-Gotha until changing their name to Windsor at the outbreak of World War I in 1914.

      Factually Germany was thriving and few in Britain were unaware of the official German policy of anti-Semitism after the 1936 Olympics. In which Jewish athletes were banned from the German team. Many upper class Britons ignored these signs in the German country where there was an extraordinary economic and psychic revival after being a downtrodden and humiliated nation throughout the 1920s.

      By 1938, unemployment in Germany was almost eliminated after dropping to 30% when Hitler came to power. The British upper classes, never famous for racial tolerance, were impressed by Hitler’s Germany. These cultural exchanges between Britain and Germany were greatly driven by the behaviour of upper class, often Hereditary Peer’s peers’ daughters who, for most of the 1930s sent pretty debutant young ladies of the great houses of England to Germany for “finishing” – a combination of art, music, balls, and husband hunting, (mostly in reverse order).

      Even in 1939, these tours were still taking place, It is on record that Lady Elizabeth Montagu Douglas Scott, the debutant daughter of the Duke of Buccleuch, (who later married the Duke of Northumberland), spent the last two months before World War II in Munich. There she learning the German language in time to be debuted to society’s before the shooting season in Scotland and hunt balls at Christmas. Lady Elizabeth told Rachel Johnson, (sister of Boris Johnson), “I’m afraid I didn’t give a thought to what was going on outside. I was sleeping, eating, chatting, dining, dancing and that was all.”

      So the Nazis had many friends in high places in Britain. Such as the influential Harold Harmsworth, (Lord Rothermere), who owned of the Daily Mail in the 1930s. In January of 1934 Rothermere’s Daily Mail editorial was titled “Hurrah for the Blackshirts”,. It praising Oswald Mosley for, “sound, commonsense, Conservative doctrine.” At which an editor in the Spectator responded by writing, “the Blackshirts, like the Daily Mail, appeal to people unaccustomed to thinking. The average Daily Mail reader is a potential Blackshirt ready made.”

      Rothermere also congratulated Hitler on his invasion of the Sudetenland, and secret papers declassified and released in 2005 showed that he also wrote to Hitler in 1939 congratulating him for the annexation of Czechoslovakia, praising his “great and superhuman work in regenerating your country,” and encouraging him to invade Romania.

      King Edward VIII, (who abdicated in 1936), was a Nazi sympathizer, as was his lover, Wallis Simpson. They visited Germany in 1937 and were entertained by and photographed with Hitler and other senior Nazis. It was this, and not his marrying a divorcee, that saw him forced to abdicate the throne of the United Kingdom. A year after war broke out, the USA FBI sent a memo to President Roosevelt outlining the agency’s worries about the British Royal couple. It reads, “It has been ascertained that for some time, the British government has known that the Duchess of Windsor was exceedingly pro-German in her sympathies and connections and there is strong reason to believe that this is the reason why she was considered so obnoxious to the British government that they refused to permit Edward to marry her and maintain the throne.”

      Another aristocratic young woman who fell under the Third Reich’s spell was of Unity Mitford. Unity Mitford was the second-youngest Mitford girl. Her older married sister, Diana , (in 1932), had an affair with Oswald Mosley. Mosely had then just founded the British Union of Fascists. Both Unity and Diana Mitford travelled to Germany as part of the British delegation from the BUF for the 1933 Nuremberg Rally, and they met Hitler for the first time. Mitford said, “The first time I saw him I knew there was no one I would rather meet.” She went bach to Germany in summer of 1934, having set her heart on getting very close to Hitler. Not really a hard thing for any well-bred, well-connected, British girl to do. After this she wrote to her father, “It was the most wonderful and beautiful day of my life. I am so happy that I wouldn’t mind a bit, dying. I’d suppose I am the luckiest girl in the world. For me he is the greatest man of all time”. Hitler and Mitford did become close and Hitler apparently was using Mitford to provoke jealousy in his new girlfriend, Eva Braun.

      Mitford became a virulent and public anti-Semite, writing in a German paper: “The English have no notion of the Jewish danger. Our worst Jews work only behind the scenes. We think with joy of the day when we will be able to say England for the English! Out with the Jews! Heil Hitler! P.S. please publish my name in full, I want everyone to know I am a Jew hater.” When Hitler announced the Anschluss in 1938, she appeared with him on the balcony in Vienna. A confirmed part of Hitler’s inner circle.

      After Britain’s declaration of war on Germany in September 1939, Unity shot herself in the head with a pearl-handled pistol given to her by Hitler for protection. She survived the suicide attempt, was flown back to the UK, and died in Scotland in 1948. Unity’s suicidal act is symbolic of the shame of much of the British aristocracy at their support for Hitler and the Nazis when the war began. Only then did then did they recognise they had been very near to actual treason.

      The really strange fact is that such things as the home movie the current Queen of England and her family that was taken in the 1930s and showed her making a NAZI salute in the 1930s was not destroyed. Incidentally the Queen’s husband, Prince Philip, is Battenberg, but had to take his wife’s surname of Windsor but which is actually Saxe-Coburg and Gotha.

    35. Legerwood says:

      The Herald reported this yesterday.

      According to their report Labour had put in an FoI request to get the draft report and final report. Cleaarly they then went through them and found this single sentence difference.

      I actually thought the replacement sentence was a tad stronger than the original version

      In other news. Scotland in EU top ten in relation to elderely care. Can’t remember exact details. Story in Today’s Herald. Maybe Nans linked to it. Nit at home so cannot access it

    36. Albert Herring says:

      @galamcennalath

      This is not bad journalism, it is part of the widespread conspiracy to undermine overthrow the democratically elected government of Scotland.

      Fixed.

    37. call me dave says:

      So many good posts this morning debunking the news where we are.

      Heard all about it on Radio shortbread this morning as I lay in bed contemplating another dismal day in Scotland.

      Discharging patients (Scotland NHS)
      Baby Box (bad etc) Says Charity
      Danish fishing oh what a surprise
      The ‘British’ Open lost says Trump who knows nothing about the Home of golf and the R & A St Andrews being in Scotland.
      It hasn’t been the ‘British’ Open for years. Ask Peter Alliss.

      Radio shortbread and BBC news pages darn South fire fighting all that is good or progressive in Scotland.

      Par for the course! 🙂

      Oh wait! Space module made in Scotland which is the size of an Iron Bru can still holding up yet.

      Shurley it will be brought back down to earth in the John Beattie Programme.

      Off to the womans golf Kingsbarns 🙂

    38. Dr Jim says:

      I just read a report that said the British Press came in 40th in the world regarding factual and dependable reporting of news, that includes the BBC

      There was no identifying body to name who claimed this reports accuracy but North Korea was only six places behind the UK

      Whether it’s true or not who knows but you have to say it does sound very reasonable and I like it, in terms of I don’t like it if you see what I mean

    39. Phil Robertson says:

      “Eisenstadt had in fact specifically requested that the Scottish Government check her draft version report for accuracy before publication, and accepted a factual correction they made. ”

      How naïve! You accept the word the uncorroborated word of “a Scottish Government spokeswoman”.

      There is no factual correction since there was no factual error, there is simply a gloss of spin. The draft report was and remains entirely correct that funding to colleges has not kept pace with universities. Students numbered at colleges fell from around 380,000 to around 227,000 between 2007-16.

      The SG has form here with earlier reports from “independent” bodies and officials. Mind you, it hasn’t quite yet matched up to the response to the 2016 NHS staff survey. The results of that are to be hidden for two years and the exercise has been discontinued for future years.

      Transparent government ?

    40. Ken MacColl says:

      I subscribed to The Times for a period several years ago accepting that, as a London publication, it would be short on Scottish news but had a firm reputation as a trusted source of informed comment and truthful reportage.
      Sadly I found out very quickly that it was little more than an expensive Red Top with the same SNP Bad agenda as the vast bulk of the YUK media.

    41. Robert Graham says:

      phil – show us the evidence – until you do its just another SNP bad comment . Over to you .Spill the beans for all to see .

    42. galamcennalath says:

      Robert Peffers says:

      In the mid 1930s there was widespread sympathy for Nazis

      The UK could have easily ended up ‘in bed’ with Nazi Germany. And it would have been a popular move by more than the toffs.

      My own grandfather, who died in the 30s, expressed sympathies with fascist ideas (according to my mother).

      He was OO, a mason, and working at a professional level in heavy engineering in Glasgow.

      The moral is that far right ideas can often be beguilingly simplistic. They enchant by offering superficial solutions. However it never ends well. England take note!

    43. colin alexander says:

      O/T after 38 comments, so respecting the rules. Not trolling.

      Serious question:

      Would Scotland be independent if it shared a currency with England and the Bank of England controlled Monetary Policy?

      The pro-indy economist Richard Murphy clearly says no.

      I say no.

      Monetary Union. How independent was Greece when sharing the Euro?

      Maybe Stu Campbell could invite Richard Murphy to do a WoS article on this?

    44. @Robert Peffers says:
      3 August, 2017 at 12:21 pm
      Good post.

      Though if I correctly remember from my reading about the naval history of the time, Prince Louis of Battenburg had suffered much anti German feeling before the start of the war.

      He resigned from the admiralty early in WW1 after the disaster of the broad fourteens, when the obsolete armoured cruisers Aboukir, Hogue and Cressy were torpedoed and sunk by the U9 with the heavy loss of life.

      I also think that’s when they changed their name to Windsor to make it sound more English.

    45. Valerie says:

      Quelle surprise.

      Francine Bates, OBE was a Spad to Ed Balls.

      Now head of the Lullaby Trust, trying to rubbish the Scotgov baby box. The only non commercial baby box in the world to receive British Safety Standards accreditation.

      Non commercial is important, because I know of a new Grandad who paid over £400 for a Finnish baby box to get delivered last year.

    46. Doug McGregor says:

      Don’t forget that the owner / controller of the rag discussed above also owns / controls the Scottish Sun and probably Sky News. His pound of flesh from Westminster for his efforts will be expensive for us , encourage people away from these media , BBC is not our only foe.

    47. Song42 says:

      I have written to Michelle Thompson offering her help if she chooses to go for crowdfunding about this untrue fiasco.

      Thank you Robert Peffers. It’s always good to see n read this education out here on Wings again and again esp’ for new readers.

    48. Phil Robertson says:

      Robert Graham says:
      3 August, 2017 at 12:47 pm
      phil – show us the evidence

      To fill in the gap in your knowledge, other than the above, you could continue with Ms Eisenstadt’s report that advocated an end to the council tax freeze, the Scottish Child Abuse inquiry and the Auditor-General’s report on our colleges.

    49. galamcennalath says:

      Dr Jim says:

      British Press came in 40th in the world regarding factual and dependable reporting of news

      Probably referring to this …
      https://rsf.org/en/ranking

      Which is actually about government interference and restrictions on freedom of the press. An index of government’s behaviour rather than the press’s.

      Still, interesting stuff.

      Norway, Sweden and Finland are top. We could have guessed that!

      claimed this reports accuracy but North Korea was only six places behind the UK

      NK is actually 160th out of 160.

    50. Artyhetty says:

      This morning I thought, I wonder what is happening in yoon world today? Popped over to WoS and
      bob’s your uncle, more britnat lies exposed, they just can’t help themselves can they.

      Re;Dr.Jim@10.51am

      O/T. Yep, you can’t be outwardly, brazenly ‘Scottish’ it’s ‘too parochial’. I heard that said by a friend who’s partner had come up from Eng (!) and who was working in the arts and commissioning artists to produce work for the Commonwealth games. When I heard they had gone to, er, NewZealand among other far flung parts of the globe, to find some artists, I asked why not look at commissioning some artists closer to home, ie Scotland? ‘Scottish art(ists) is too parochial’. I kid you not this was what they said.

      What they mean by that is anybody’s guess, but it is a negative attitude, deliberate and all too common. It undermines Scotland, Scottish artists, and culture. We should all wear loads of tartan during the festival, I must look for a nice kilt.

      I wonder if making pictures about Trident is too parochial!

      Ooohhhh Scotlandddddd. 🙂

    51. Robert Peffers says:

      @David McCann says:3 August, 2017 at 12:03 pm:

      WE should all be taking action and reporting any questionable stories to the Independent Press Standards Organisation (IPSO).https://www.ipso.co.uk/

      Did you really, really imagine the, “Independent Press Standards Organisation”, were actually independent?

      “… And keep doing it.”

      Now what was it old Albert Einstein defined as the signs of insanity, again? Oh! Now I remember :-

      “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results,” by Albert Einstein.

      IPSO will pay as much attention to Indy supporters complaints as the BBC or BBC Trust does about their complaints about BBC obvious lies.

    52. 2017 is the anniversary of the Department of Information,

      formed in 1917,

      later the Ministry of Information,with connections to MO7/MI7 and Special Operations Executive,

      ‘To promote the national case to the public at home and abroad ’ by issuing ‘National Propaganda’ and controlling news and information.

      Beaverbrook (Daily Express) became responsible for propaganda in Allied and neutral countries and Lord Northcliffe (owner of the Daily Mail and The Times) became Director of Propaganda with control of propaganda in enemy countries.

      Lord Reith admits that the BBC`s independence was compromised by UK Gov during 1926 general strike,

      the UK Gov/establishment have using the media to manipulate opinion and attack what they perceive as any threat to their control of UK for a long time,

      SNP is seen as a legitimate target.

    53. Petra says:

      O/T (to some extent)

      Thanks for the links Nana (previous article) and I see that amongst them is one from indyref2 outlining the latest about The National and Ross Greer.

      http://indyref2.scot/the-media-we-need

      As Ross Greer complains about the National we’re all faced with a daily dose of propaganda from practically every other newspaper on the stands, ALL as far as I can see, and of course the BBC and STV.

      We all seem to be agreed on the fact that we need broadcasting to be devolved to Scotland to ensure that we control our own broadcasting service / s, however until that day comes around, better still independence, we’re TOTALLY reliant on sites like this to get the message, truth, out there.

      We’ve recently supported sites like weegingerdug, iScot and so on for that very reason and yet one of the MOST important daily outlets of all for us is REALLY struggling. Not helped by the fact that some independence supporters, for some obscure reason, want to do it down. Ross Greer as an example complains bitterly about a front page of the National from last December, that is ‘ENEMIES OF THE SCOTTISH PEOPLE’ which featured Theresa May and David Davis dressed up in ridiculous judge’s wigs (a send-up of the Daily Mail original).

      A Mr George Mitchell wrote into the National on Tuesday (1/08/17) praising the newspaper, stating his astonishment on reading that the team producing the ‘excellent publication’ consists of 10/12 people only and that he was saddened by the comments made by Ross Greer. He went on to ask how we could help as he didn’t want to be faced one day soon by a ‘LAST DAY OF PUBLICATION’ notice.

      He got a response from Callum Baird, editor, which read:

      ”Thanks George – it’s frustrating as we had a great six months up until the election. In fact, our sales were actually UP compared with the previous year – pretty much unheard of for papers these days. As for what you can do to help? I’m open to suggestions. We’re already delivering bulk copies to Yes groups to give out at stalls and into hands of potential readers. What else could our readers do to help? Answers to feedback [at] thenational [dot] scot, please!”

      Note the ”PLEASE!”

      Now this as we know is the ONLY newspaper right across the UK that affords a platform for people like weegingerdug, Gordon MacIntyre-Kemp, Richard Murphy, Alyn Smith, Lesley Riddoch, George Kerevan and so on. It’s also akin to Professor John Robertson’s site in that it publishes more positive Scottish news that’s downplayed (suppressed) elsewhere and of course has articles on Scottish history etc. Do we really want to lose this newspaper? Do we really want to see the opinions / information from some great influential supporters of independence being quashed? Do we really want to see the Unionist supporting newspaper editors rub their hands in glee?

      If not you can subscribe to the newspaper online for as little as £1.74 a week. In other words for less than 30p a day.

      http://www.thenational.scot/my/why/subscribe/?ref=tnav

      If you can’t afford to pay, and even if you can, maybe you could come up with some constructive ideas to keep this newspaper going by sending an email to feedback [at] thenational [dot] scot

      Or if you go into a store that doesn’t sell the newspaper complain or email their head office asking them to do so.

      Whatever the case we REALLY need this newspaper and it’s in our power, ONLY, to do so. Yesterdays front page alone highlighted that the National was the only newspaper showing any sign of really supporting Michelle Thomson …… and Ross Greer (had tweeted previously that the National does more harm than good) was also afforded the opportunity to have his say in the newspaper followed by Callum Baird’s response to him …. ‘One newspaper can’t be everything to all people in the Yes movement.’

      Whatever your opinion of the National (if you consider it to be lacking in some way help to make positive change) PLEASE support it.

      ……………………………………..

      PS This post relates solely to supporting the National. It’s not being used to further negative comments about Ross Greer, as that’s the LAST thing we need right now.

    54. Fred says:

      Fascist sympathisers included the earl of Errol, duke of Wellington, duke of Bedford, duke of Buccleuch & his bro, marquess of Lothian, earl of Glasgow, the father of “Taxi for McLetchie!” lord Redesdale, duke of Kent, earl of Portsmouth, baron de Clifford etc,etc, ad nauseum. Many of them members of “The Right Club!” & many also who wrapped themselves in the Union Jack once the war started!

    55. Fred says:

      @ Petra, mebbes the National would have been better advised to give space to Andy Wightman & leave Ross to worry about global warming.

      Anent the folk who buy the Record only for the horses & dugs, I believe it published the wrong race card a couple of weeks ago, plus the results!!! there were punters in the bookies who thought they had cracked the system at last! an apology followed the next day.

    56. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Fast forward to today @Robert Peffers says at 12:21pm and all that has happened is that The Establishment have substituted Fascism vs Communism for Scottish Nationalism vs UK Unionism.

      All about protecting their interests as per usual.

    57. AndyH says:

      So, is it a different YoonTroll each day then?

      Or do they sometimes come in a full pack?

      This one is a condescendingly flavoured one.

      No actual substance to the ‘points’ he makes, just a haughty air.

    58. AndyH says:

      The National is a decent wee paper.

      I buy it nearly every day from the wee shop at the Inverkeithing train station.

      I like how it’s balanced and has differing views from the likes of Michael Fry and Mckenna.

      It’s also, given that it’s a Nationalist supporting paper, very even handed in the articles, quoting both sides without any perceivable bias.

      I think it needs a bit more fun and humour in it though.

    59. Robert Peffers says:

      @Phil Robertson says: 3 August, 2017 at 12:32 pm:

      I saw the name, Phil Robertson, and I expected utter pish!

      What did I get – I got utter pish.

      ” … The draft report was and remains entirely correct that funding to colleges has not kept pace with universities. Students numbered at colleges fell from around 380,000 to around 227,000 between 2007-16.”

      Yes, Phil, of course it did. For the very good, (and planned), reason that the SG instigated a policy of free University education. This, of course. has increased the numbers of Scots students being further educated at university who would otherwise have struggled to go to the inferior standards of colleges of further education.

      Thus there are fewer Scots students wanting to take the lesser qualifications that colleges have on offer and, hopefully this trend will continue, with students opting, and encouraged, to take up university qualifications. These would otherwise have had to settle for the poorer college qualifications.

      Mind you most Indy supporters don’t actually expect the brain dead unionist supporters who, to a man, (or woman), are prone to accept that Scots are only genetically programmed to cope with allowing a foreign country to run Scotland for them as they, (the Scottish YoonYoonists), feel, and probably actually are, an inferior species only fit to kowtow to their English superiors in another country.

      If Jesus Christ’s second coming saw him return as an indy supporting Scottish person these Scots YoonYoonist numpties would instantly become anti-Christian Muslims.

      Illogicality just doesn’t describe these numpties thought processes.

    60. Andy-B says:

      O/T

      The Lullaby Trust and BBC Scotlandshire having a go at the Finnish baby boxes.

      I can’t find much on the CEO of the Lullaby Trust. Apart from she has passion for London.

      https://mobile.twitter.com/francinebates1?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

    61. Dan Huil says:

      Britnat liars. Thankfully these britnat “newspapers” are dropping in circulation. Thank god for sites like WOS.

    62. Song42 says:

      @Artyhetty,
      I regularly wear my Kilts that I have done for some 35 odd years, not just because of Independence or the Referendum, simply because I am of Scottish heart through and through and I look pretty damn cool in it…and for obvious reasons it keeps me warm in winter. However, because of the Referendum and Scottish bias, I now get a few looks which is fine. Putting on a kilts in some places like festivals or rallies is cute shows somewhat togetherness. (Or defiance I’m sure) depending on the onlooker. Yes or no’s.

      I find now, (when and where I travel) it opens up (or closes) conversations quickly, not only about what myself and Scotland is fighting for but through these conversations it then allows the other to consider/wake-up to how bias our media is and how a Westminster establishment is towards Scotland really is and why we want our Independence.

      Right now I have a different tartan waiting to be made into a kilt! For me, It’s not for fancy dress, not just for festivals or rallies, it’s not for xmas…like the dog 🙂 it’s an opportunity to educate.

      Find a nice Wallace kilt then you could tell a story n educate. There a plenty of shops in the west-end of Glasgow with secondhand kilts. Great western rd, next to Roots n Fruits and the wee shops off Byres rd. Starry Starry Night. Go get yer kilt. 🙂

    63. AndyH says:

      @Robert Peffers

      You owned that fool Mofo!

    64. Iain says:

      Does anyone believe the total garbage printed by the dead tree rags.
      If you did you would be incredibly nieve.

    65. Socrates MacSporran says:

      A couple of decades ago, while freelancing, I wrote a story about one of Scottish football’s legendary players.

      I will admit this now, I misunderstood something I was told, and didn’t check-it properly. It didn’t help that I could not get hold of the legend personally.

      I sent it to The Sun and the Daily Record. The Sun journalist counter-checked it, and came back to me; which is when I realised I had misunderstood what I was told, so I agreed with the alternative fact as outlined by The Sun.

      The Record never got back to me, but, they took my wrong fact, “spun it” outrageously and did a character-assassination piece on the football legend.

      He then sued The Record, who of course blamed me, everything they had printed had been written by me – they insisted. They stuck with this story, until the legend’s lawyer produced a “black” or copy of the original story I had filed.

      At this point, The Record caved-in and the legend got a nice little sweetener. Of course, they still tried to blame me.

      I have never written-for or assisted The Record since. It is an evil paper.

      Some years later, working full-time for another paper, I saw Record thinking in action. We had an Editor who had come from the Record News Desk. He was in the habit of dashing-off a headline, then telling his journalists: “Get me a story to justify that headline”.

    66. Robert Peffers says:

      @AndyH says: 3 August, 2017 at 1:23 pm:

      “So, is it a different YoonTroll each day then?

      Or perhaps the same troll with different personas.

    67. Petra says:

      @ Fred says at 1:18 pm …. ”Petra, mebbes the National would have been better advised to give space to Andy Wightman & leave Ross to worry about global warming…..”

      Fred I reckon that the National was being fairminded when it gave Ross Greer the opportunity to have his say. Unlike any other newspaper of course. What we find there are either the person in question is given no say / opportunity for rebuttal at all or their comments are edited to suit the newspapers agenda. All we have to do is look at the VAST number of SNP Baad stories whereby no one from the SNP is involved in replying / correcting.

      As to Andy Wightman well he’s contributed a number of excellent articles to the National and his voice will be another we won’t be hearing from, that’s for SURE, if the National folds. He actually wrote an article about Holyrood Palace for the 7th July edition which was extremely ILLUMINATING and would make your blood boil. Made mine boil anyway!

      ‘Andy Wightman: We need to have clarity on affairs at historic royal property.’

      http://www.thenational.scot/politics/15395936.Andy_Wightman__We_need_to_have_clarity_on_affairs_at__historic_royal_property/

    68. Andy-B says:

      Thank you Albert for the link, that kind of clears up why they’re doing down baby boxes. Usually when you search the web you find something to link the nae sayers to the Britnats.

    69. Andy-B says:

      Thank you Albert for the link, that kind of clears up why they’re doing down baby boxes.

      Usually when you search the web you find something to link the nae sayers to the Britnats.

    70. Movy says:

      Wrt the baby boxes, have they actually been proved to have a negative effect? The way this has been presented it’s as if they are down right dangerous; yet if you read the articles, it seems somewhat less than clear. Have they contributed to deaths in Finland?

    71. Buffalo Bill says:

      Can we just leave The UK one night and not tell them.

    72. Sinky says:

      Anti Baby Box Report piece is by former aide to Ed Balls.

      Meanwhile all you subsidy junkies?

      Did you know over the past ten years government public spending in London has been double the UK average and annually £150 per head more than is spent in Scotland.

      London now pushing for £31 billion to build Crossrail 2

      https://www.ippr.org/north

      https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/25/north-crossrail-conservative-northern-rail-chris-grayling

    73. stu mac says:

      @Brian Powell says:
      3 August, 2017 at 10:59 am
      The Times once had a reputation as the most accurate reporting, now it manufactures lies …… It is sad to see a major paper lying but sadder that it is subverting democracy.
      =========================

      That’s what happens when you get bought out by Murdoch.

    74. Robert Peffers says:

      @Iain says: 3 August, 2017 at 1:54 pm:

      “Does anyone believe the total garbage printed by the dead tree rags.
      If you did you would be incredibly naive.”

      Maybe, we should treat it as the new dreaded Britnat disease.

      A bit like Tuberculosis before the days of antibiotics such as streptomycin, and later steriomycin. Like British propaganda the Tuberculin disease has been around since before history was recorded.

      Thing is that there will always be naïve people around and even if we manage to inform enough of them to gain Scottish independence there will be some other Britnat disease along to replace it and the naïve among us will catch that new disease.

      We will probably need to invent a really good new antibiotic to beat whatever new strain of Britnattery is set to come along soon.

    75. Phil Robertson says:

      Robert Peffers says:
      3 August, 2017 at 1:35 pm
      ” … The draft report was and remains entirely correct that funding to colleges has not kept pace with universities. Students numbered at colleges fell from around 380,000 to around 227,000 between 2007-16.”
      Yes, Phil, of course it did.

      Firstly, glad to see that you agree with me that SC is wrong in asserting that there is a factual error is Ms Eisenstadt’s report needing correction.

      Then you continue, “For the very good, (and planned), reason that the SG instigated a policy of free University education”.

      So which policy is this? Is the same as the one that stated “We will maintain full-time equivalent college places and protect Educational Maintenance Allowances”.

      Or was it part of the 2007 fairytale that promised to eliminate student debt by “removing the burden of the debt repayments owed to the Student Loans Company by Scottish domiciled and resident graduates.”

      Strange then that, in 2015, the student debt became the Scottish Government’s largest asset, being worth £2.7bn with around one in six Scots between 18 and 60 in debt to the government in this way. 

    76. TheItalianJob says:

      @Robert Peffers

      Many thanks Robert for your usual informative posts this morning including setting the record straight on Scottish further education.

      Keep up the good work.

    77. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Artyhetty 1.13.

      Yup, nothing more parochial than a metrovincial, in my experience. I never give them any peace now when they start their patronising crap.

      Unfortunately the Embra Festival and Fringe has degenerated imo into an orgy of Establishment scent-marking of their Scotland region (sorry for the product-theft, heedtracker). All those lovely luvvies and their dire wee shows in Morningside church halls really get on my nazzums.

      No mwaah, mwaah from me, I’m afraid.

    78. Petra says:

      O/T

      I reckon that one of the first things that we have to do is clarify EU ‘free movement of people’. I say that because it seemed to be a key factor relating to Brexit (and could be influencing Brexit supporting Scots) and I’ve come across individuals who are extremely concerned about immigrants coming to Scotland for any number of reasons. Whether you agree with them or not it’s still an issue that should be explored, imo.

      For example I’ve read that Westminster had the power to send people home, like other EU countries, if they didn’t have sufficient funds to support themselves and / or if they hadn’t found a job within three months. They didn’t do so because they didn’t have the resources / staffing due to cuts.

      Meanwhile no one seems to want to mention the fact that Westminster is so desperate to recruit NHS and Home Care staff that they are now recruiting in India, Pakistan and the Phipipines, via agencies, forking out £5000 per head compared to £2500 for EU nurses (Channel 4). Numbers of EU nurses applying for jobs in the UK have dropped by 96% and of course some have already headed home. Add to that T May’s deals with countries, such as India, whereby she’s promising to release even more visa’s. In other words how exactly is Brexit cutting the number of immigrants coming to the UK, more so Scotland, and are the populace in general aware of this? Maybe it’s something we could focus on in the near future.

      ………………………………………………….

      ‘Alyn Smith: We must work together to correct harmful immigration falsehoods.’

      …”And Labour’s turmoil centres on immigration. We need a serious debate about immigration and freedom of movement, into these islands. Note, they’re two different things. Immigration is when people come to live or work here, freedom of movement is the right we all have to go live, work, study, travel or retire across the whole of the EU, from the Algarve to the Arctic Circle. Freedom of movement may become immigration, but the two are different…..”

      http://www.thenational.scot/politics/15447268.Alyn_Smith__We_must_work_together_to_correct_harmful_immigration_falsehoods/

    79. Robert Peffers says:

      @Movy says: 3 August, 2017 at 2:07 pm:

      ” … Have they contributed to deaths in Finland?”

      No they have not. I read somewhere, just this morning, that the SG had issued a statement, (I cannot find it again now), that the cardboard boxes used in the Scottish Government scheme had been checked and had passed official safety checks and that is more than those used in the Finland scheme have gained.

      This story looks very much like a propaganda item from the ever present SNPBAAAAD Britnat propagandists. It has Westminster’s discredited name written all over it.

      AAAh! I Just found a different reference by the SG on the matter:-

      https://www.holyrood.com/articles/news/cot-death-charity-questions-credentials-baby-box-reduce-rates.

      So Yes it is indeed a trumped up false-news story by Britnat gimps – Including, “The Lullaby Trust”, whose owners seems to have some rather suspect political connections.

      Who knew?

    80. Alex Clark says:

      Here are some facts about the “reduction” in college numbers from 2007/08 to 2014/15 straight from the source. Emphasis in bold is mine.

      4. There were 66,667 full-time students in 2005-06, and 79,565 in 2014-15. Although the 2014-15 total does represent a slight fall from the high of 81,373 in 2011-12, full-time numbers have shown an overall increase of 19% from 2005-06 to 2014-15.

      5. SFC expected to see a decrease in headcount from 2008-09 as colleges were asked to prioritise more substantive courses designed to improve students’ employment prospects and reduce the number of students enrolled on leisure programmes and very short (less than 10 hours) programmes of study.

      This policy is the main reason for the continued reduction in headcount from 379,233 in 2007-08 to 226,919 in 2014-15. To illustrate the impact on headcount, based on 2014-15 figures a single full-time Further Education (FE) student is approximately equivalent to 140 students on these short programmes.

      6. This prioritisation led to an increase in the average hours of learning per student from 249 hours in 2005-06 to 401 hours in 2014-15. That is an increase of 61% across that period.

      7. In academic year 2005-06, 9% of learning hours were delivered on courses that did not lead to a recognised qualification. By 2014-15, this had decreased to 3%.

      http://www.sfc.ac.uk/web/FILES/Statistical_publications_SFCST022016_BaselineReportforAcademicYear201415/SFCST022016_Baseline_Report_2014-15.pdf

    81. MGallagher says:

      Living in NI has few benefits, but one is the ability to tune into Irish radio as a means of avoiding this kind of endless Britnat propaganda.

      Imagine my dismay then this morning listening to Newstalk on the way to work to hear Edwina Currie being interviewed over the border issue. Within a few minutes of her patronising and clueless waffling I was practically irate. Her first condescending statement was that Apple and Google, with bases in the Republic, should assist with their high-tech border controls.

      What got me most was her airy explanation of why people voted for brexit – its a romantic idea, the Dunkirk spirit (a film which is ‘capturing imaginations’ and ‘filling houses’). Thankfully the presenter gave her a hard time, challenging on most points and reading the angry listener responses, something you sadly wouldnt hear on radio Scotland.

      What planet are these tory types living on?

    82. Proud Cybernat says:

      “Dunkirk Spirit” = “Glorious Failure”.

      Scotland is looking to the future, no’ the past.

    83. Dan Huil says:

      Dunkirk: another England victory. And of course they went on to win the war, all on their own.

    84. To me having a draft checked and proof read is normal practice in organisation.

    85. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      O/T

      2017 has lots of Great War Centenaries @ Scot Finlayson says at 1:07 pm

      9th September 2017 is the 100th Anniversary of the Etaples Mutiny

      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Étaples_mutiny

      Wonder if it will get the full Rwule Bwitania treatment (Royalty, Heads of State, Senior Military etc. etc.)

      Probably not seeing as it all kicked off when a member of the Royal Military Police shot a Scottish Soldier dead.

      240120, Corporal W B Wood, 1st/4th Gordon Highlanders (born Pitsligo, Aberdeenshire).

      When his unit heard the news they fixed bayonets and went looking for the perpetrators
      and it descended into anarchy for a bit.

      British High Command feared an uprising (think Russia).

      Anyway convienietly ignored and the ‘British Army the only one not to revolt during WWI’ myth still exists to this day.

    86. Robert Louis says:

      Buffalo Bill at 210pm,

      Can we just leave The UK one night and not tell them.

      That is kind of what New Zealand did – they just gradually started making their own decisions and basically ignored London.

      My best guess, is if Scotland wants to sneak out of the corrupt undemocratic UK, then the best time will be just after ‘The Queen’ on Christmas day, just as the propagandist BBC man tells the enthralled Brits, ‘….and now, after her Majesty, next on BBC one, a tale of great British spirit, British heroics and British glory, settle down now with all the family for the BBC blockbuster British Christmas day film, ‘DUNKIRK’.

      So, we’ll be leaving around 310pm, 25th Dec, 2017.

    87. Hamish100 says:

      Oh for someone called an editor to review Sandersons drivel report.

    88. heedtracker says:

      Dan Huil says:
      3 August, 2017 at 3:58 pm
      Dunkirk: another England victory. And of course they went on to win the war, all on their own.

      BBC r4 Today show this morn had a long thing about how incredible British women’s sport is today, with long in depth interviews with British women athletes, football, cricket etc.

      All of them were English, all they dicussed was English women and English women’s sport. It is all on the up too, but about Scots women? Absolutely fuck all, in this triumph of Britishness in the world of Englishness.

      Why so many Scots tolerate being treated like shite by our chums in the south and then have only to change channel to listen to BBC Scotland radio gimps shit all over them, is a very odd thing to witness, or listen to.

      Have they really lost all self respect, in this demented union?

    89. velofello says:

      Well done Alex Clark, providing the facts on Further education at Colleges. Why wouldn’t/couldn’t the SNP do same?

      The Lullaby Trust – nowadays whenever I see trust tagged on, I’m wary.

      The National: I really rate the paper highly and would willingly pay a higher price than 70p, but then I may be in a substantial minority. The dialogue between Michael Fry and Kevin McKenna is fun. and not to overlook the other lady contributors, Tasmina, Carolyn, Cath,and the new kid on the block Shona Craven – doubt she’ll be on BBC again after her assured performance recently.The Sunday Herald at £1.80 I’m increasingly finding to be “flick thro'”. A crowdfunded to advertise the National on STV, and of course the Glasgow subway? – that went well for Rev Stu.

    90. Robert Graham says:

      Robert Louis & buffalo bill – good point about leaving very funny ” just leave without telling them ” priceless ,
      re- new Zealand if my memory serves me Australia for about two years were actually independent but someone forgot to tell them , i know it sounds daft but Whitehall was involved so makes sense .
      Better brains and memory might might help out .

    91. Lenny Hartley says:

      Re College students falling, do ya remember Ian (where’s the money from an oil fund coming from” Gray standing up in Parliament and ask during FMQ’s “what’s the FM going to do about the cut in College Courses for those with Learning Difficulties” ?

    92. BBC RESEARCH = FOI applications. ‘The BBC has uncovered – – -‘ What!

    93. BBC RESEARCH = FOI requests. ‘The BBC has uncovered – – -‘ What!

    94. SOG says:

      Further to RP’s comments about the rightward leanings of the upper crust, the abdicated king was made Governor of Bermuda fom ’40 to ’45, a role that would keep him safely out of the way. Churchill was no fool.

      Most people will know of the flight made by Rudolph Hess.

    95. galamcennalath says:

      The inbuilt denial of the BritNat mind is astonishing.

      It’s beginning to look like EU flags at the Proms is going the way of Saltires at sports events … something to censor out!

      http://archive.is/7RRGV [text only]

      This line is astonishing ….

      ” … the BBC is famed for trying to stop the Proms from being politicised … “

      … WTF! The proms, that annual display of rampant British Nationalism with Butcher’s Aprons being waved as everyone sings “Rule Britannia”, “Jerusalem” and “Land of Hope and Glory”!

      Could it be more politicised than that!?

    96. Macart says:

      This falls under the heading of ‘no shit Sherlock’. (sigh)

      http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-uncertainty-mark-carney-uk-eu-economy-future-wages-eu-single-market-customs-union-bank-a7874956.html

      (Independent doesn’t archive properly)

    97. Lenny Hartley says:

      The Whisky Indsty is going to be saved with tariff free trade with India says the BBC ,

    98. galamcennalath says:

      Macart says:

      This falls under the heading of ‘no shit Sherlock’. (sigh)

      A soft Brexit will make things worse, a hard Brexit will seriously damage the economy, services, and as a consequence, society.

      That message isn’t really getting through to a lot of folks!

      I do wonder when enough eyes will open and a majority to begin to pressurise politicians? If that is even possible.

      It is UK wide. Enough English need to see the awful mistake they have made, and enough Scots have to see that Scotland would be best uncoupled from a crashing rUK.

    99. Robert Graham says:

      re – the comment i made about Australia being independent for two years before anyone told them ,oops it was actually about 55 years yep fifty five years ,
      They became independent some time after 1931 – but did not have full recognised independence until the third of march 1986,

      Whitehall was still trying to pull the strings , as far as i gather it was when some states started accerting their authority and some bods in Whitehall reminding them their requests had to be approved by H. M. Queen , That was when questions started being asked , OOPS thats a f/n big mistake eh ? .

      Trust Westminster AYE i wouldn’t piss on them .

    100. Famous15 says:

      Reporting Scotland gets a mention in the grown
      up London BBC.Whisky deal with India eh?

      Mental health services in Scotland attacked to be on par with failing England NHS.

      Baby boxes are rubbish says charity unaware of quality chosen by SNP Government but RS BBC still say SNP baaad.

      Fife children deaths terrible but no mention of saving possibility of the Named Person scheme shamefuuly opposed by Labour and the other Unionists

      BBC foaming at the mouth in hyperdrive BBC baaaaad.

    101. TheWasp says:

      Reporting Scotland should just put SNPbad and Scotland is Shite on a loop and play it for 30 minutes at 18.30 every night, as that is what the “news” has been tonight

    102. Alex Clark says:

      @Macart

      Some of the comments btl on that article are a right good laugh though. You do have to admire the certainty of the Brexiteers that everything will turn out to be hunky dory for the UK once it takes back control LOL.

    103. sinky says:

      Missed Reporting Scotland. Did they report on Michael Gove and Danish access to Scotland’fishing grounds after Brexit

    104. Legerwood says:

      stinky @ 7pm

      Not sure if reporting Scotland mentioned Gove and fishing access but there is a piece about it on their online site but you have to scroll down passed the riveting story about Ruth Davidson running through a field of wheat.

      Clearly channelling her inner mayhem. Hope she compensates the farmer for damage to the crop.

      BBC also reported on whisky industry and how they were a bit more hopeful about the benefits of Brexit for the industry.

      India was mentioned and the hopes for a reduction in tariffs.

      I found some figures for whisky exports for 2015. Six EU countries accounted for £911 million of sales
      India accounted for £85 million of sales.
      The UAE, Moslem country, accounted for £125 million.

      That is going to be some deal they strike with India to bring it anywhere near what is sold to EU.

      Note: could not find figures for 2016 but sales to India had increased a bit.

    105. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Believe it or not @sinky says at 7:00 pm

      “Missed Reporting Scotland. Did they report on Michael Gove and Danish access to Scotland’s fishing grounds after Brexit”

      YES THEY DID.

      Mike Russell was on and gave a great performance.

      “Shady back room deals”,

      “We learned that Michael Gove can’t be trusted, but that isn’t new information”,

      “Fishing is Devolved and SG should be involved in discussions”,

      “Tories and this is a direct quote said that Scottish Fishing was expendable in the 1970s and they are going to do it again”,

      “Ruth Davidson and the Conservatives campaigned that there would be no foreign access to UK waters out to 200 miles”

      These are just some of his highlights.

      Didn’t let the BBC Laddie talk over him either.

    106. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      @Me at 7:21pm

      Not Reporting Scotland

      It was Radio Shortbread about 17:15hrs

    107. Artyhetty says:

      Regards the whisky, it’s bad for you, said my Labour loving pals in 2014, we are making people turn into ‘alcoholics’ with our whisky, like our oil was er, ‘dirty’ .

      I dunno, all that wine these folk drink, must be thinking places like, Spain, Italy, should stop making the damn stuff it’s making people everywhere into alcoholics.

      Oh, so much to be grateful for for Brexshit. Oh aye,

      Aussie, (immigrants from Eng) relations just cannot get my determination to make sure Scotland becomes independent like they are. Much to my frustration!

      Aye they would never return to live in Brexit England though, too savvy, nice people of course, but bankers you see.

    108. K1 says:

      Aye Alex, Phil’s gone affy quiet since you posted the actual facts regarding reduced college places. Of course we’ve all known this for years, and it’s been discussed on Wings many times before. But good to have the information repeatedly stated for anyone who has just come onto Wings for the first time

    109. Calum McKay says:

      So the thunderer will dress up a non story, spin it and present it as SNP BAD.

      Where as it will not run with the story that the british government has sold the Scotish fishermen down the river before negotiations have even started on brexit. michael gove has told Danish fishermen they will still be able to fish in uk (Scottish) waters post brexit.

      This is despite saying last month Scotland’s fishermen would take back control.

      It is all the more duplicitous and down right stupid as he has not even used it as a bargaining chip, he has just given Scottish fisermen’s rights, earning potential and communities future sustainability away!

      Scottish fishermen, you were warned the tories would sell you down the river, please don’t be surprised. The choice was Angus Robertson and Alex Salmond in your corner and you chose michael gove, a failure and a right wing free market nutter.

      What other Scottish natural resources will be given away by the uk government remains to be seen, but given away they will be and the list will be long and paid for by the Scottish people, through the deterioration of the NHS and public services.

    110. Alex Clark says:

      O/T I think some damage may have been done to Common Space following the attack on Wings and its cult following. Olive branch being held out by Robin McAlpine this afternoon it looks like.

      https://archive.is/DNZ0V

    111. Alex Clark says:

      @K1

      It’s a shame that courses such as flower arranging and furniture restoration have had to be sacrificed at some Scottish colleges during this time of austerity max. Having less money to spend does make for difficult choices.

      It’s a shame that the Scottish government have had to focus resources on giving more meaningful education leading to worthwhile qualifications and hopefully gainful employment especially in the 16 to 24 age group. You know increasing the number of full time FE courses by 19% since 2006 that might help young people get a job.

      Choices, choices. Not to worry, once Scotland is Independent and has full control of it’s budget and all resources I think the leisure courses carried out in the past at our colleges can make a comeback.

    112. Scott says:

      auld highlander says:

      3 August, 2017 at 7:36 pm

      Gove and fishing.
      https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/03/eu-fishing-boats-can-still-operate-in-uk-waters-after-brexit-says-gove

      I waited with bated breath to hear someone on RS at 6.30 to report on this story where were they all.

    113. galamcennalath says:

      Give and fishing. There needs to be a leafleting / billboard campaign targeting the fishing towns of the NE. Not by the SNP but by another pro Indy player. “You voted Tory, and they sold you out almost immediately”.

    114. Derek Rogers says:

      Tonight’s BBC story on ‘Whisky industry sees new opportunity in Brexit’ was utterly false:

      htpp://www.scotlandisdifferentwordpress.com

      Breathtaking!

    115. heedtracker says:

      Other news, 12h’s ago. Fracture?

      http://uk.businessinsider.com/comres-poll-british-people-believe-united-kingdom-split-after-brexit-scotland-northern-ireland-2017-8

      Concern about the kingdom splitting is high. Polling last year found that 62% of Scottish people and 53% of all UK voters, believed the country will fracture over the next ten years.

      Comres / BBC poll: The United Kingdom will no longer exist as either Scotland, Wales, or Northern Ireland will be independent:

      Net Likely: 53%
      Net unlikely: 45%

    116. galamcennalath says:

      Derek Rogers says:

      Whisky industry story

      Aye, stretching the mythical positive side of Brexit just a bit too much there.

      Brexit is a very hard sell economically anywhere in the UK after you strip out the lies! They lied to get their Leave vote and now they are having difficulty back tracking.

      And, Brexit is an especially hard sell to Scotland on any aspect! Not once, not anywhere, never have I heard a believable benefit to Scotland. This BBC attempt was pathetically shallow.

      In fact, there’s a challenge to any passing Unionist ….

      Come up with one genuine benefit of Brexit to Scotland!

    117. Artyhetty says:

      So with the fishing it must be what the brexiters wanted when they said, ‘ taking back control’.

      Aye, that must be why they went for Brexit then. Oh dear, wrong, so much wrong with the whole thing. Who knew eh.

    118. Macart says:

      @Alex and galamcennalath

      Beaut isn’t it?

      Customs checks, stagnant wages, rising inflation, more expensive weekly shop, job losses and capital flight.

      Just the beginning.

    119. galamcennalath says:

      Macart says:

      Beaut isn’t it? …. Just the beginning.

      A veritable shite show, and the South British ruling party seem to have lost the plot. Or have they?

      There seems to be a consistency in the EU attitude to Brexit negotiations. Basically it amounts to .. “we didn’t cause Brexit, you [UK] did, so what solutions do YOU propose?”

      That seems to be the Irish position where they are waiting for UK proposals and won’t do the border design work for Brexiteers. As far as they are concerned, they simply want an open border with no changes. Fair enough.

      It does look as if the other two of three essentials ie citizens’ right and the divorce payment are also in limbo waiting for a UK proposed solution. The UK opening position on citizen’s right didn’t impress the EU.

      Perhaps the problem is that the ToryUKTeam wants to be seen to have solutions imposed by the EU so they can grudgingly accept them as a necessary evil for a trade deal. Blame Johnny Foreigner.

      Everything seems to revolve around appeasing the far right and selling an outcome to voters who were promised something different.

      Quite a challenge!

      We should be wary of a ‘blame the others’ get out plan. If it all falls apart, or any deal is unpopular, you can bet someone other than Brexiteers will get the blame. Perhaps this is what they are preparing the ground for.

    120. Artyhetty says:

      Macart@8.43

      When you put it like that, the reality, it is like the summer weather and it ain’t too joyous.

      Scotland has to escape before it’s too late.

    121. auld highlander says:

      Re Brexit.

      Tonight I was talking to a guy from the central belt and he told me that the work for tipper lorries is drying up, he has only had three days work this week and the drivers are convinced that another recession is on the way.

    122. Tinto Chiel says:

      All the way UP, it seems for Scotland. Apologies to Nana if she’s already linked:

      https://munguin.wordpress.com/

      And all this on Westminster’s pocket money, too.

    123. heraldnomore says:

      Ooh, cracking start to Outlander tonight. Get over to More 4 right now.

    124. Artyhetty says:

      Heedtracker@9.14

      Not sure I can bare to read that. It’s all so fckd up. We really need all the strength we can get, to weather the UKOK, UKIP Tory brexit don’t we. If only 2014 could be magicked back so we could all vote for an independent Scotland eh. A forward looking, modern, 21st century country, it’s al, we asked for, and look what we got. Fandabby doos eh. Thanks no voters, and sorry, to blame. but to be so taken in by the lying toads. Never again?

    125. galamcennalath says:

      @heedtracker

      Cunning plan or chaotic incompetence?

      Probably the latter!

      Though I do wonder if they are paving the way for crashing out and blaming the EU, which isn’t exactly cunning. A crude plan which he Mail and Express will go along with.

    126. Macart says:

      @galamcennalath

      Oh I don’t think there’s much doubt they’re lining up a fallguy. Tories are never responsible donchaknow? It’s the poor, the disabled, Johnny Foreigner, the Tartan terror… It’ll be somebody for sure. It’s pretty much S.O.P. for these folks.

      It won’t however, be those truly responsible. The governing party of the UK. In fact several successive governing parties, but more specifically the actions of the current incumbents. You’re either in charge and responsible for the care and governance for ALL of the population in your care, or you’re not.

      The buck stops at Westminster and in particular No.10.

      This is their omnishambles and no one else need apply.

    127. Alex Clark says:

      @Macart

      Yes and that’s just the half of it, look at the the EU citizens that are heading home already.

      Fruit will rot on the bushes and trees as there will be not enough to pick them. The NHS in England will be mauled as fewer want to come and those professionals already here are leaving in droves.

      Our Universities will be starved of EU research funding and many of the best brains working in Scotland will drain away, so too will Scottish farmers suffer when their grants are reduced to zero.

      Scottish fishing rights will be bargained away if a way can be found to benefit the financial sector in London, Europeans will look at us as if we’re mad when we go on holiday abroad. You’ll no longer be covered for your costs if you take ill in the EU under the reciprocal health agreements.

      Madness. What kind of an idiot voted for that crap?

    128. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @MGallagher (3.29) –

      Re Edwina Currie – your description of her delivering an ‘airy explanation’ is bang-on, and typical of her.

      She seems to be making a living these days as a freelance gobshite, doing a lot of radio, and has become an unfortunate fixture on R5Live at weekends.

      If you haven’t seen the following, you may find it interesting. It’s an interview she did on RTE’s Saturday Show just a few years ago.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxZ_On7Z6CQ

    129. colin alexander says:

      Socrates MacSporran said:

      “I have never written-for or assisted The Record since. It is an evil paper.”

      If only the SNP – and SNP MSP Joan McAlpine in particular – would listen to you.

      But £400 per article or approx. £20,000 a year can creative a different perspective on The Daily Record, if you’re the one getting all that easy money for prostituting the independence message to give credibility to an anti-independence rag.

    130. yesindyref2 says:

      Yes, good articlde from Robin McAlpine.

      https://archive.is/DNZ0V

      But I had to read it all the way through, the start looked too much like a one-sided half defence.

      First comment btl there though does raise another serious point – the abuse of other people’s postings / tweets.

      I’m glad I’m not “out there” in real life. As a very active btl poster I get far more respect and less insults from Unionists, than us Indy campaigners seem to give each other.

      At the end of the day I’m back in my real world, totally insulated from what goes on “below the line”. Many don’t have that insulation.

    131. jfngw says:

      Reporting Scotland, here is the summary to save time watching to it.

      Social Services – bad (not wanting to blame individual, but if we can get a name to crucify it would help, hopefully has some SNP connection).
      Baby boxes – bad (SNP Gov idea)
      NHS – bad (SNP Gov problem)
      Brexit – good (UK gov idea, whisky industry agrees).
      Weather – rain

    132. Macart says:

      @Alex

      The effects will be felt through every strata of our society and economy Alex. For instance, I doubt if a great many folk are aware that some 30% of the UKs food requirements are sourced from the EU.

      As yet there are no contingency plans in place to either facilitate continued food import or indeed provide replacement for this requirement.

      Somehow I doubt Mr Fox’s super cunning trans Atlantic cheap food deal will be in action anytime soon and even if it were, what would the introduction of cheap product do to the UK producer who couldn’t compete?

      Chuck a brick in a still pond… etc.

      The examples we’ve listed between us are pretty much just scratching the surface.

    133. colin alexander says:

      yesindyref2: How do you feel about the use of “dickhead” and “dickwad” being used against another pro-indy commenter?

    134. colin alexander says:

      @yesindyref2: How do you feel about the use of “dickhead” and “dickwad” being used against another pro-indy commenter?

    135. Ian Brotherhood says:

      It might be to abody’s benefit if Colin Alexander posted his ‘thoughts’ to the Daily Record. If they discern any marketable merit in them he could get a few quid. ‘Easy money!’

      Then he needn’t be arsed sending them here.

      😉

    136. colin alexander says:

      All the bleeding hearts for the EU nationals is nice. I like that compassion for them.

      I just wish those overwhelming number of EU Nationals who voted NO rather than YES had had more compassion for people in Scotland in 2014.

      Hopefully, they have learned, and hopefully the fishermen and their families will learn too.

      When in Scotland, you should put Scotland’s interests first. Backing WM domination of Scotland only helps the UK / Scottish ruling elite stay the ruling elite.

    137. Rock says:

      Albaman,

      “Nice one Stew,
      If only the likes of the “National”, would do similar, and take on the Unionist papers head on.”

      You would need a genuine “independence supporting” paper to do that, not a fake one whose aim is to milk gullible independence supporters to keep the poisonous Herald and Sunday Herald alive.

      Truth Always.

    138. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      @ Colin Alexander: “All the bleeding hearts for the EU Nationals is nice.”

      Ha, yeah.

      Bleurgh.

      _________________________

      Anyways, was just reading an article in Holyrood.com about Naomi Eisenstadt on the ‘roots of change’, and she really impresses me. Strong, and very, very clever.

    139. MGallagher says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood

      Don’t know whether to thank you or not for that link lol, but yes it’s a very revealing interview. Seems just a bit more interested in chatting about herself than the fate of people who were under her remit. Don’t think she’d disagree too much with her idol Thatcher’s comment of ‘boys will be boys’.

      Hoping that’s the last interview I hear from her in the near future, or it’ll be the dry boak again!

    140. yesindyref2 says:

      @IanB
      Probably already does 😎

    141. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @MGallagher –

      If the BBC was the slightest bit concerned about the whole Savile disgrace, it would’ve made an effort – however ‘token’ – to distance itself from the major players (no pun intended) involved.

      It hasn’t, and we can all draw our own conclusions from that. Currie is just one of many who have many questions to answer but it seems that no-one has the balls to even dare ask them.

    142. crazycat says:

      @ MGallagher

      Seems just a bit more interested in chatting about herself than the fate of people who were under her remit.

      ‘Twas ever thus; there was an interview with her in The Guardian recently, which I didn’t bother to read, but the headline was something like:

      “The love of my life? Most people who know me would probably say it’s me.”

      So she has some self-awareness, but no urge to reform.

    143. pacman says:

      These types of articles are the printed form of clickbait, shock headlines designed to grip in people flicking through newspapers to buy them. The people who buy these newspapers are so cognitively biased that it doesn’t matter if the actually news item contradicts the headline, they still believe it is correct.

    144. Robert Peffers says:

      @K1 says: 3 August, 2017 at 7:38 pm:

      “Aye Alex, Phil’s gone affy quiet since you posted the actual facts regarding reduced college places.”

      I had a wee laugh at Phil when he fondly imagined I had agreed with him. The guy is a puckle aff his heid. I didn’t bother getting back to him as i realised long ago that there is nothing in the World that could ever convince him that his political loyalty could ever be wrong or even have a wrong policy.

      In Phil’s wee bubble the Union is greater than God the Father, The Holy Ghost and Jesus Christ all rolled into one and like the Pope is omnipotent. The guy is a numptie of the first water.

      You can believe me that I have in years gone by, argued politics with senior members of Westminster cabinets. The only one that it was totally useless to engage in debate, as you cannot debate with those who only consider one opinion – their own). That one was none other than the Tory Secretary of State for Defence, “Michael Ray Dibdin Heseltine, Baron Heseltine, CH, PC.” a.k.a. TARZAN.

      Such people cannot make logical arguments because they have no logical thoughts on matters. It is all dogma and everyone else is wrong no matter if they can furnish logical reasons that prove the dogma is mince.

    145. PacMan says:

      Going o/t, I wonder if the recent headlines about Pro-Catalan groups protesting against tourism is the start of a Catalan style project fear ahead of their referendum in October?

    146. Robert Peffers says:

      @heedtracker says: 3 August, 2017 at 8:35 pm:

      ” … Polling last year found that 62% of Scottish people and 53% of all UK voters, believed the country will fracture over the next ten years.”

      What country might that be, heedtracker? The United Kingdom is, by definition and by its official title, a bipartite united kingdom that contains four countries. It is not now, and never has been a single unified country.

    147. Robert Peffers says:

      @Artyhetty says: 3 August, 2017 at 9:00 pm:

      ” … Scotland has to escape before it’s too late.”

      Ach! Artyhetty, it was too late for Scotland 310myears ago.

    148. Alex Clark says:

      @Ian Brotherhood

      That interview with Edwina Currie was something else. What a complete buffoon and liar. Yes I was in charge of Broadmoor but I never gave Jimmy Saville the keys. It’s true he was wandering around unsupervised in the wards abusing young female patients but it wis nothing to dae we me. I was just the person in charge.

      Oh and he took me too a club a very exclusive club in London and he was recommended for membership by Cardinal Hume no less FFS.

      These upper class twits are what is holding Scotland back, they are ignorant of real life and real people. Please Scotland when you get a second chance to gain Independence grab it with both hands for all our sakes.

    149. Col says:

      We really need to play on the fact that most people think we will be an independent country within ten years. With brexit we should make it clear that while everything is up in the air we must hit the ground running and grasp what opportunities arise from it.
      I also think we should state very clearly that Scotland is moving in that direction and if the UK government doesn’t like us having referendums then every election from there on in shall be about independence for Scotland.
      Surely folk would think to themselves let’s just get it over and done with.
      Only independence will make Scotland equal with England because of their in built majority in Westminster as things stand and we will obviously work with them where mutually beneficial.
      Also, we will be the laughing stock of the world if we made the wrong decision twice in a few years. This should not be understated.

    150. Dr Jim says:

      I’ll bet my house it’ll be sooner than ten years

      Any Tories want to take that bet?

    151. Cactus says:

      Okay SO let’s start making plans for our iScotland then…

      1) In which city should we set up our own version of the DVLA?
      2) Let’s make the 25th January & 30th November national holidays.
      3) What kind of programs would you like to see on ScoTV / ScoRadio?

      Who else has ideas for iScotland?

      Look to and imagine your future.

      Let’s go forward to the future in our independent Scotland.

    152. Cactus says:

      Where will this go, where does that go, that’s the kind of idea.

      All the things that WILL happen upon i.

      Play them out.

    153. Cactus says:

      Paint a picture, gather interest and encourage input.

      Try a blueprint.

      LSX.

    154. galamcennalath says:

      @Cactus

      4) What should we commemorate and celebrate with our first post Indy postage stamps?

    155. galamcennalath says:

      @Cactus

      4) What should we commemorate and celebrate with our first iScotland postage stamps?

    156. Cactus says:

      Excellent galamcennalath, thanks.

      5) Where will we celebrate on the first anniversary of our iScotland?

      Anyone for six?

    157. Smallaxe says:

      6)
      We shall celebrate on the beaches, we shall celebrate on the landing grounds, we shall celebrate in the fields and in the streets, we shall celebrate in the hills; we shall never stop celebrating.
      🙂

      Peace Always

    158. Smallaxe says:

      Nana; Good Morning. Thank You, for Your lovely links, there is weather here today. Kettle’s on!
      🙂

      sìth an-còmhnaidh
      😎

    159. manandboy says:

      Nana says: at 7:26 am
      SNP calls for council leader to step aside while police investigate
      http://archive.is/oER8l

      “The Labour leader of North Lanarkshire Council should step aside while he is being investigated for corruption, the council’s SNP group said last night.

      Councillor Jim Logue is the focus of a Police Scotland inquiry following allegations of corruption in connection with his directorship of two companies that he failed to declare.

      The National can reveal that Airdrie councillor Logue may have been targeted because of his stance last year against the former leader Jim McCabe and his deputy Jim Smith who were replaced by Logue and Paul Kelly amidst findings of a massive £20m overspend on contracts awarded to companies with Labour connections. Officials were also disciplined. ”

      Depressing, but not surprising.

      Thanks Nana. Always on the ball.

    160. Fred says:

      For the benefit of this thick bastard, we do not have our own independent newspaper, we do not have the money for our own independent newspaper & nobody is going to give us the money for our own independent newspaper. You apparently lack the cash to help support Wings! never mind a fucking independant newspaper.

      What we do have is the National and if it’s a cash cow, even Joseph couldn’t have dreamt up a skinnier wan.

      Now fuck off & gie us Peace, Always!

    161. Robert Peffers says:

      @galamcennalath says: 4 August, 2017 at 4:50 am:

      ” … What should we commemorate and celebrate with our first post Indy postage stamps?”

      How about we commemorate Scottish Independence, or is that far too obvious?

    162. Robert Peffers says:

      @Cactus says: 4 August, 2017 at 3:17 am:

      “1) In which city should we set up our own version of the DVLA?”

      None of them – how about we site it in somewhere with good transport links that does not have exceptionally high office space costs nor high housing costs for a large workforce.(It keeps commuting workers to a minimum).

      “2) Let’s make the 25th January & 30th November national holidays”, Also whichever day we officially become independent.

      3) “What kind of programs would you like to see on ScoTV / ScoRadio?” Scottish programmes. (spelled with the USAism, “Programs”), all made in Scotland and with Scottish presenters, actors and production staff.

      However, before we set up Scottish broadcasting we need to set up an independent of government regulator of broadcasting and public service information.

    163. manandboy says:

      bellacaledonia.org.uk/2017/08/03/red-tape-brexit-shock-and-bluff/#comments

      This piece on bella contains 2 videos of Professor Michael Dougan of Liverpool University on Brexit. The first is from a year ago, the 2nd is his most recent. To say he dismantles the Tories ‘version’ of Brexit is an understatement. Do have a listen, but be prepared to be left wondering about Westminster’s authenticity in the whole Brexit process. It is easy to conclude that the Tories have always planned to run the Brexit ship onto the rocks. An idea which is gathering pace.

    164. skintybroko says:

      6) Give Stu the keys to Aberdeen in recognition of his unwavering support for an Independent Scotland.

    165. wull2 says:

      3) What kind of programs would we like to see on scoTV, easy true ones.

    166. colin alexander says:

      “Michael Gove” said.

      Is that the same Michael Gove that repeatedly and strenuously denied he would stand for election to be leader of the Tories, then stood for leadership?

    167. gus1940 says:

      Stunning news of the amazing new initiative to campaign for a reduction in tariff on Whisky imposed by India after Brexit.

      Unless I am mistaken a campaign aimed at achieving this has been running for as long as I can remember with zero success. However, suddenly after Brexit a magic wand will be waved and the tariff will disappear due the the Indian Government’s gratitude for their former colonial masters’ Empire 2.0 initiative.

    168. Robert Kerr says:

      Indian whisky is good. Try some Amrut malt and be pleasantly surprised.

      Link

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amrut_(whisky)

      or google for local supplier.

    169. Mr Gove. Anyone brought up in Aberdeen who calls rowies ‘rollies’! obviously can not be trusted.

    170. One_Scot says:

      This is another problem when it come to Scotland regaining her Independence.

      I remember trying to explain to my father a few years ago that the papers especially the Scottish Daily Mail and Scottish Daily Express. which he buys, (I know, I know), that they have it in for the SNP and make up stuff to damage them, and that they protect their own politicians, but he just looked at me as if I was daft.

      Unfortunately some people will always believe whatever crap they are told, and in some cases are more than happy to be fed SNP bad stories.

      But hopefully the younger generation will save us.

    171. galamcennalath says:

      Robert Kerr says:

      Indian whisky is good. Try some Amrut malt and be pleasantly surprised.

      Amrut is a good malt whisky. Made properly.

      However, I understand there are many other Indian ‘whiskies’ which are very poor.

    172. Smallaxe says:

      One_Scot says:

      “But hopefully the younger generation will save us.”

      Hopefully, we will save the younger generation.
      🙂

      Peace Always my Friend

    173. First it was the farmers who were told by Gove that they will have to prove they need subsidies.

      And now its the Scottish fishermen turn to learn that foreign boats are still going to be allowed to fish in Scottish waters.

      Its seems some people never learn.

    174. Dr Jim says:

      Sky news

      As soon as the Irish Prime minister says he agrees with Nicola Sturgeon and Carwyn Jones on Brexit Sky news cuts away to infinitely more important crap Trump from America

      Definitely no agenda there eh Fox news

      Brexit Gooood Inglind Goood Nicola Sturgeon Scotland Scottish stuff Baaad and totally not important

      All of which we’re used to, but when they keep telling us how important Brexit is and then avoid it when it’s got something to do with Scotland it makes their bias kinda obvious

    175. Dr Jim says:

      Unionist politicians exist to create and then not serve a people with memory loss

      Over and over and over and…..did I say over?

    176. ronnie anderson says:

      A little to late.

      https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/11455/robin-mcalpine-kindness-or-cruelty-its-your-choice

      {I beg you to mistrust those who say this bit or that bit isn’t the ‘real’ movement.}
      { What is so wrong with shutting the fuck up, just now and again? }

      I’ll give Mr McAlpine the same advice he gives to Ross Greer , your columnists could have lifted the Phone or Emailed WoS/National/iScot/WGD/Marie Black .

      {What is so wrong with shutting the fuck up, just now and again? } Your words once again Mr McAlpine, why dont you take the same advice you proffer to others .

    177. Robert Kerr says:

      @galamcennalath

      Oh dear you are using BBC/MSM seeds of doubt ploy.

      “Amrut is a good malt whisky. Made properly”

      Are you implying that some Amrut is not made properly?

      I know from personal experience that some Scotch whiskies are also “very poor” but to name them openly could start litigation so I shall decline.

      That’s now both of us in breach of Rev Stu’s training guidelines.

    178. ScottishPsyche says:

      O/T

      Just catching up with the commentariat view on Twitter spats and who is allowed to speak for Yes. The usual voices putting their unsolicited views forward.

      Ironically these are the people who completely dominate the MSM when a supposed Indy voice is wanted. Yet they seek to make that dominance even more overwhelming. They want a sanitised middle of the road unified voice that does not exist and was responsible, in my view, in part for the failure of the 2014 campaign.

      It seems that a box ticking exercise of being seen to decry all but their own -isms is what is more important now than anything else. Pointing out the hypocrisy of the angry intolerant voices seeking to shut down any other view is frowned upon. Minutial differences in the minefield of gender politics have become more important than broad beliefs in fighting discrimination and intolerance.

      More than anything else it shows that there cannot be another official Yes campaign when those in charge are so dismissive of others views.

    179. Dr Jim says:

      @ronnie anderson

      Ditto….. silently

    180. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      There cannot be another YES campaign with a chance of succeeding until all those who want to bake special cakes understand they have to get into the kitchen first.
      Of course our enemies who control the media will give lots of coverage to divisive “radical” voices while us stupid guys knock doors and raise funds and maintain a unity of purpose.

    181. galamcennalath says:

      Robert Kerr says:

      some Scotch whiskies are also “very poor”

      Every country needs its cooking whisky 😉

    182. Robert Peffers says:

      @Dr Jim says: 4 August, 2017 at 11:01 am:

      ” … did I say over?”

      No, Dr Jim. You said, over & over.
      ;-))

    183. Dr Jim says:

      @Dave McEwan Hill

      Ingind doesn’t care who’s in charge as long as they win
      By the time Scotland’s finished arguing with itself about how to win before we win…. we’ve lost

      and then we argue all over again about why ????

    184. Sinky says:

      BBC Radio Scotland lunch time news didn’t mention Irish Prime minister says he agrees with Nicola Sturgeon and Carwyn Jones on Brexit.

      Just as BBC TV news failed to mention Gove’s promises to Danish fishermen. Mentioning it on radio does not have the same impact as TV coverage.

      Their bias can be judged by the news they ignore and as complaints to BBC are ignored Wingers should embarrass them in press as right wing papers don’t like BBC and these are the places to plough seeds of doubt among unionists.

    185. Chick McGregor says:

      Sadly, the one left wing guy who had the nous to keep the horse frightening stuff on a peep was smeared out of the picture.

    186. Sinky says:

      BBC Radio Scotland’s Gregory Graham now having a go at SNP Glasgow City Council over transport/planning issues. Normally they don’t mention council political make up even when Labour was in charge for generations.

    187. Phil Robertson says:

      Alex Clark, K1

      The figures you missed – FTE student numbers 2007/8 122,000, 2014/15 118,000. How does that figure with the promise “We will maintain full-time equivalent college places”?

      Robert Peffers
      “Such people cannot make logical arguments because they have no logical thoughts on matters. It is all dogma and everyone else is wrong no matter if they can furnish logical reasons that prove the dogma is mince.”

      That rich coming from someone whose usual response is “utter pish”. And I do try to avoid sweeping generalisations and patronisingly disrespectful comments like “to settle for the poorer college qualifications.”

      If YOU are so capable of putting up a coherent response, try informing us how far we have got along the road of “eliminating student debt”.

    188. Billy says:

      The Herald has been at it for a long long time, along with the Scotsman, read the section – Scientific Racism on Wiki.
      We never have been good enough for them.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highland_Clearances#Social_engineering

    189. Fred says:

      @ Ronnie Anderson, spot on….out loud! 🙂

      Just saw a wee white van in Dennistoun, covered in saltires, Yes stickers n Hail Alba it was, made my day!

    190. Robert Kerr says:

      @galamcennalath

      Indeed, for Scotch cooking whisky I refer to the expert.

      https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martine_Nouet

    191. Cactus says:

      The Queensferry Crossing Digital Countdown Clock:
      (time remaining until our newest bridge opens)

      Bringing Scotland closer together…

      In just 30 days.

      LSX.



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