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When wishes father fantasies

Posted on January 25, 2019 by

Obviously this site will be making no comment on the criminal allegations now facing Alex Salmond for legal reasons. But amidst a frenzy of gleefully lascivious coverage in the Scottish media (the Daily Record in particular can barely contain its delight), there’s another thread of punditry that does need addressed.

Because it is, not to put too fine a point on it, bollocks.

The court case, should one ever take place – under Scots law the mere fact of the police bringing charges by no means actually makes that a certainty, it’s the Procurator Fiscal who decides whether to go ahead with a prosecution  – will indeed decide the guilt or innocence of Alex Salmond. But that’s all it will do.

Even normally-sensible analysts like Stephen Bush of the New Statesman have suggested that the case “makes it harder for Sturgeon to decide the timing of the next Scottish referendum based on her instinct on what maximises the chances of success, and increases the chances that she will have to call for another one at a moment not of her own choosing”. But it’s difficult to see how.

We speak to a lot of people in the independence movement, the SNP and the Scottish and UK media scenes in private, and among them there’s a wide range of opinion on Salmond and the allegations. But what we haven’t had a single person say to us is that the charges will make the slightest difference to their belief in independence or their determination to campaign in any new referendum.

The case for independence is unchanged by whether or not one person may have committed a crime or crimes. The merits of Scotland choosing its own governments and making its own decisions are entirely un-impacted by whether Alex Salmond is innocent or guilty of these or any other accusations.

The UK didn’t lose the right to be independent when its Prime Minister condemned it – on the basis of what were already widely known to be lies – to the disastrous and almost certainly criminal war in Iraq, costing hundreds of thousands of people their lives. The USA didn’t meekly come back and ask to be a British colony again when its sitting President was forced to stand down in disgrace.

On a practical level, the former First Minister has been a peripheral figure in politics since losing his seat in the 2017 UK general election, a member of no parliament. Even before these allegations arose last year, it was highly unlikely that the SNP would have given him a prominent official role in any second indyref.

(His opinions would of course have drawn plenty of attention in the media, but then Jim Sillars gets in the papers all the time and we trust nobody would suggest that if he were to be arrested for some alleged crime, anybody would be seriously claiming that it would affect the timing or viability of the next referendum.)

The key factor in the urgency and justification of a second indyref is the shambles of Brexit, in which five and a half million Scots stand to be dragged catastrophically out of the EU despite having voted overwhelmingly to stay in it. The democratic mandate of the Scottish Parliament to demand one runs until 2021. The fortunes of Alex Salmond are of no consequence in these regards whatever.

The Scottish press asserts on a regular basis that some essentially minor event or other has destroyed the prospects of independence for the next five or 10 or 50 years, and everyone sighs and rolls their eyes and gets back to reading the football reports. They’ve cried wolf more times than anyone can count, and nobody we’ve encountered on the Yes side is listening to them any more.

Independence is bigger than one man, bigger than one woman, and bigger than the SNP. Nothing about these events will change our minds or our desire to fight on until the objective is achieved. If the braying, sneering, dying Scottish media is so foolish as to imagine otherwise, it’s in for a nasty shock.

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  1. 25 01 19 13:56

    When wishes father fantasies | speymouth

341 to “When wishes father fantasies”

  1. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Hear hear!


  2. Ryan M says:

    Hail alba. I hope the man is vindicated and that the reports turn out to be false. The whole thing stinks to high heavens.

  3. Well said Rev.

    The Dream will never die!

  4. Liam says:

    And the sooner that nasty shock is delivered the better.

  5. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    That is the truth of the matter:

    “Independence is bigger than one man, bigger than one woman, and bigger than the SNP.”

    That is what the BritNats can’t get their heads around (and in truth if you look at the UKs Colonial History never could).

    It’s coming for all that.

  6. weegie42 says:

    The PF has decided that there charges to answer hence the appearance in court.
    Without commenting on whether the allegations are true or not the extent of the charges makes one wonder, ie going for alleged rape, if fails sexual assault, if fails breach of the peace; ie we’re gonnae get you.
    History has shown that if you can’t attack the idea you attack it via the principal proponents cf Parnell and Irish Independence.
    The newspapers are saying that it will take about a year before it comes to court. This will hang over the independence issue since NS involvement will be invoked by the media. Hear what you say about the issue being more than one man but this will be brought out as a distraction thereby deflecting any independence message.

  7. Merkin Scot says:

    My belief that we should govern ourselves does not come with reference to any particular party.

  8. Gary45% says:

    Looking forward to the ongoing SNP civil war.
    Indy Ref2 can’t come quick enough.

  9. Bob Mack says:

    I’m in this for Indy, not for Alex or Nicola.

    I want my grandchildren to live in a better country with freedom of choice to pick their own direction in life. I want them to enjoy the fruits of our country’s wonderful resources rather than be Iving in penury whilst paying protection money to England.

    This goes way beyond political personalities.

  10. fillofficer says:

    scottish msm are our best recruiters imo

  11. Gary45% says:

    Meant to add, who or what is a David Clegg???
    A typical Gutter Churnalist????
    Aye defo.

  12. Sunshine says:

    Exactly Rev. Cannot fault a single thing that you have written, unlike in our media.
    Alec Salmond and Independence will forever be intertwined, but none of them depend on the other for survival.
    No person, or thing, is bigger then a belief that your country should regain its independence.
    “The dream shall never die”.

  13. Jim McIntosh says:

    That’s weird, I just had exactly that conversation re the Iraq war with a labour voting pal on the golf course. His reply was “Tony Blair isn’t in charge of Labour now”. I could almost see the light bulb going on in his head as he finished saying it.

  14. Donald anderson says:


  15. ScottieDog says:

    And of course the brexit referendum stayed on schedule despite the murder of Joe Cox.

  16. Alastair says:

    Thanks for being the voice of reason, as always.

  17. Jamero66 says:

    I needed to read that, thank you.

  18. Margaret Tees says:

    Well said!

  19. Proud Cybernat says:

    The BritNat Establishment think that if they can take out the shepherd then all the sheep will scatter. Their big miscalculation is their utter failure to grasp the simple fact that most Scots are goat-minded and not sheep-minded.

    Indrefy2 – BRING IT ON!!

  20. Fireproofjim says:

    Well said.
    I believe the majority of Scots look upon the Media, especially the BBC, as contemptible lackeys of the Unionist establishment.
    Their glee in anything which could harm Scotland and the SNP is quite disgusting.
    Don’t let us be diverted or discouraged by them. They are on the wrong side of history and the peaceful, democratic Yes movement, headed by the SNP, will win.
    Keep the eyes on the prize.

  21. chocolass says:

    Thanks,Stu for wise words as usual!
    Spent last evening teetering on despair but between you and the WeeGinger Dug
    I’m on track again-bring it on!

  22. mike cassidy says:

    Does the charging of that Tory councillor in Aberdeen mean the case for ‘better together’ is out the window?

  23. yesindyref2 says:

    I think they’re getting their mince confused with our haggis.

  24. Cath says:

    Increasingly, I’m wondering if Scotland may end up in a scenario where opinion (at least strength of it, if not polling numbers) overtakes the SNP, and we end up like Ireland where the gradualists and federalists were simply steamrollered by events? Independence isn’t, and has never been, about the SNP: they’ve simply been the only vehicle for it. The media in Scotland should be very careful what they wish for in continually trying to destroy them, because what would take their place now won’t be a rolling back of support for independence: quite the opposite. If anything, it’ll be a more urgent, less polite, less gradualist kind of indy movement.

    As Scotland moves towards independence, as it’s doing, it will need a plurality of parties, not just one “pro-indy” and 3 useless and identikit unionist ones based in England. If the SNP does split and begin the formation of that prior to indy happening, it’s not going to be a split back to unionism; it’ll be more and less aggressive and impatient forms of pro-indy.

  25. yesindyref2 says:

    Anyways, with the anti-SNP media concentrating on Salmond, now IS the time for Indy Ref 2. The poor dears in the MSM will be so confused. They’re going to need more nurses.

    In fairness, the Herald article “Alex Salmond charges: A day that sent shockwaves across Scotland” was good, concentrating on the shock around Scotland and in the media, rather than politicising. It wasn’t expected.

  26. Like many, I am not a member of the SNP.I shall not rest until my country, Scotland, is a Self determining independent nation.
    The sub human pack who scuttle about in the serers of our Dead Tree Scrolls are our greatest recruitment sergeants.
    The uglier, the smuttier they get, the more reasonable people rally to our Campaign, AUOB, Free Scotland.
    I’ll dance a jig every time one of these rags goes to the wall.
    One glance at the newsstand today confirms what we all knew.
    Our country is a colony of England, and they’ll do anything, say anything, threaten anything to keep it that way.
    well, have we got news for them.

  27. defo says:

    Oceans of mud across the ‘newspapers’ today.
    Job done. They think.
    Wrong this time. The stitch up is just too obvious.
    Those who bought the Eck Bad garbage last time around might warm to it, but peeps (of all flavours) with a brain will be smelling shite here.

    No one said it’d be easy, but this is unforgivable.
    I hope Clegg & co choke on their own vomit

  28. Dr Jim says:

    Newspapers are no different to the *Loyal* Yoon in the street when it comes to opinions but newspapers can print their hopes and dreams and projections and opinions in big red letters and call it fact when it’s no more factual or weight carrying than than some knuckle dragging Saturday afternoon no surrender nitwit on the terraces of their favourite football vehicle club who’s sole invention was for supporting such drivel

    Disclaimer: Not all football supporters are nitwits

  29. Joe says:

    On the nose as usual.

  30. Macart says:

    Well said and couldn’t agree more.

    Simple reasoning tells you that it’s the normal state for the population of a country to decide its own wants and needs. Personalities, individuals, don’t enter into it.

    I’ll be voting YES to independence because as far as I’m concerned? I want my government to make decisions based on the needs of our population and I want a government close enough at hand to be answerable to the population of my country when it screws up.

    Where we are now? Brexit? Simply the most recent example of democratic deficit in a long, LONG, line of such examples. Governments we didn’t vote for. Legislation we didn’t vote for. Visited upon our population by people we didn’t vote for. That’s not and never has been right. We don’t deserve that situation. We’re better than that. We can be and do better.

    We’ve earned the right and then some..

  31. Proud Cybernat says:

    “…you can jail revolutionaries, but you can’t jail the revolution.” – Fred Hampton

    I think the MSM have made a massive strategic mistake with going full radio rental on this Salmond ‘story’.

    For years they have attempted to make Scots Indy all about one person, one man – Alex Salmond. But all you find now, all over social media, in pub and club conversations and in stairheid meetings is that “Independence is bigger than Alex Salmond”. That single message is now being heard more and more, all over the country. In effect then, the MSM by shouting this ‘story’ from the rooftops have effectively demolished their own strategy of making indy about one person because now more and more people are realising that that ISN’T the CASE.

    The “am no voting indy cuz a hate that Alicsammon” brigade will now be hearing more and more that Indy isn’t about “allicsammon” but something much, much bigger.

  32. Socrates MacSporran says:

    Excellent analysis Rev.

    The Unionists and their media running dogs MUST attempt to sow divisions in the Independence movement, and foster discord, it’s their only hope of staving-off the inevitable.

    Similarly, the Independence movement MUST fight them with everything we have, and WIN.

    I am confident we will, just as I am confident, that while the SNP will most-likely get to form the first independent Scottish Government post-Independence, that will probably be their only success, as their broad church breaks-up into different factions.

    However, if the blue, red and yellow Tories are to have any chance of taking over, they will seriously need to, post-Independence, realise they have to become genuinely SCOTTISH parties and sever all connections with their English head offices.

    We live in interesting times.

    As for Clegg and his like – I can only repeat what I hear all the time from old Record hands, about him and his fellow travellers at Anderston Quay: “They’d never have got in the door in my day.”

  33. orri says:

    The problem with rule by fear is that overdoing it can backfire big time.

    If Salmond is being framed, and that’s yet to be shown, or is simply having every conceivable charge thrown at him for the incidents alleged against him in the hope some stick, then it might be a malign attempt at cowing independence support into silence due to the threat of similar being done to them.

    Indeed in some cynical corner of the unionist mindset him being locked up for obviously trumped up charges might be seen as a worthwhile lesson to us uppity Jocks. Kind of reminiscent of the charges against politicians in Catalonia. A shut up or we’ll do the same to you.

    That or he’s guilty as sin and abused his celebrity status and finally an example is to be made.

    At least he isn’t Roj Blake.

  34. Wee Alex says:

    I went for a pint last night expecting a barrage of taunts, never happened much to my surprise.

    Not scientific, but it strikes me the Brexit mess is what’s on people’s mind.

    I was a Labour supporter back in the days when the SNP split left and right but what was delectable was their ability to hang togetht. Today’s political class and the press will neve be able to split the party, people come and go but there is a strong thread holding them together.

  35. Johnny says:

    I think you’re spot on, Rev.

    I remember once remarking, at a time some years ago when I would have to admit I understood a lot less, that the movement for independence might well die away if ill-health or some other misfortune were to strike Mr Salmond.

    Then the indyref campaign hit and it became obvious to me that I had been ill-informed, and that the movement for independence was the preserve of no one person and that vast swathes of the country wanted it and would never give up on it.

    I now feel stupid for having misunderstood so completely.

    But it was also apparent that a good many people still didn’t have this understanding and thought that if they just attacked Mr Salmond it would all go away (someone I was then friends with used to regularly post memes demeaning Mr Salmond to my facebook wall EVERY SINGLE DAY in the evident belief that attacking the person would make me vote No – it didn’t, obviously).

    Then 2015 happened. New leader and SNP resurgent. This should have shown people (including journalists) that it hadn’t only been about the previous leader at all but because people wanted what the party stood for. But instead it became ‘ah hate that Sturgeon’ as many thought if she just went away, it would all go away, despite it already being evident that this wouldn’t transpire (if you had any understanding of the situation whatsoever).

    Despite operating in a sphere where they deal with politics every day, so many of these journalists and pundits STILL don’t get what I used to not get – it’s not only about the individuals leading the charge at the head of the political arm of the movement, however important some might be at pushing independence forward at certain junctures.

    The most critical recent evidence of this is that the SNP leadership is not moving fast enough for many of its supporters. Obviously people have differing opinions about how helpful this divergence on timing sometimes is, but the point is that the impetus and desire for independence will not go away no matter who is in the vanguard of the political arm of the movement.The people at large have strong opinions about how independence ought to be pursued and they are not all led by the nose by the politicians.

    It’s time, if they are not just pretending not to for effect, that political journalists understood this if they ever again expect to be taken seriously as authorities on such matters.

  36. Dr Jim says:

    If Scotland has its own governement in charge of everything and they do a bad job we can vote them out

    No matter how many times we vote against governments decided by England’s ten to one majority vote we can’t vote them out

    That’s dictatorship

  37. raineach says:

    Ironically, Salmond’s great achievement was to create the Yes movement and render himself redundant

  38. ScottishPsyche says:

    Absolutely spot on.

    Humans are fallible. One small positive out of all of this is that the myth of the cult of personality has been destroyed. The tarnishing of Independence support as unthinking and devoted to a dear leader is completely blown.

    The scales have fallen from our eyes regarding how journos manipulate and deliver the information they have available. We see this for what it is no matter the outcome.

    Independence and whoever can deliver it – that is what is important.

  39. Patsy Millar says:

    Thanks again for saying succinctly what most sensible people think about this.

  40. robertknight says:

    If this had happened in January 2014, it would have sunk the Yes campaign.

    But this is January 2019, and for a variety of reasons, it won’t!

  41. Jon Musgrave says:

    I agree whole-heartedly with the article. Independence is far bigger than any one individual, even one with the reputation and standing of Alex Salmond.

  42. OddJob says:

    Well, despite that superbly written article, and the accuracy of the final paragraphs, it will not stop the pruritus ani of the media in Scotland producing the biggest load on unmitigated bollocks about it, in an attempt to remain obediant retainer serfs for the elite.

  43. Auld Rock says:

    As you say Stu Alex was on the periphery long before this broke. But let me repeat myself, a short examination of the history of Westminster and Englandshire will show that time and time again, when countries of the ‘old now defunct empire’ showed signs of wanting to run their own affairs the establishment quickly got its dirty tricks dept into full throttle mode, usually trumping-up some scandal over dodgy financial deals or a persons sexuality or an indiscreet sexual relationship usually someone else’s wife or a prostitute, there may be others but these will suffice.

    Back before the Treaty of Union in 1707, the Englishman Daniel Defoe came to Scotland as a spy and agent provocateur to spread falsities and to undermine the morale of the Scottish Parliament by warning them of English troops gathering at the border. In more recent times probably, in my opinion, the most heinous was the faux horror at the supposed indiscretion by Charles Stewart Parnell with the already separated wife of one Capt. O’Shea. This was in the hung parliament of 1885 when Gladstone’s Liberals and Salisbury’s Conservatives, with Parnell’s Irish Parliamentary Party holding sway. Now unionists saw him as a danger as they saw their power in Ireland slipping away. He was falsely accused of murders in Phoenix Park, Dublin and when that was shown to be a ‘stitch-up’ as we would say they arranged for his affair with Kitty O’Shea a married but long time separated from her abusive and bullying husband to be made public.

    Again we had ‘faux’ outrage from people who kidded on that they were very ‘conformist’ on a Sunday but where many of the so called upper classes were not averse to a mistress or two Monday to Friday. Needless to say Parnell was disgraced and an Irish State was put back in its box for another 30 years.

    I see the dirty hands of Westminster in all this and where Alex is just the Pawn and their true target is Nicola.

  44. Peter Macbeastie says:

    Pleased to note all comments thus far are of one mind.

    The movement is for independence, not Alex Salmond, Nicola Sturgeon or any other individual.

    If we want independence for any specific people the vast majority of us are doing this for ourselves and the next generations. A wee bit of me is doing it for my Mam, who would have loved the independence campaign and the political awakening of the nation.

    But it’s mostly for the coming generations.

  45. Artyhetty says:

    Well said. Yesterday was quite depressing, and the inevitable Britnat media glee is very telling.

    Independence, Scotland will go for it, and Nicola Sturgeon having met T. May seemed more determined than ever.

    England should negotiate with Scotland, for the good of all. The whole thing could be grown up, let’s hope the Britnats do grown up, it’s time they did, on so many levels.

  46. Richard Smith says:

    Lol at “Dead Tree Scrolls”.

    Did the UK lose the right to attempt a catastrophic disorderly exit from the EU just because David Cameron was revealed to have indulged in porcine encounters? I think not.

  47. yesindyref2 says:

    There’s a thing in science. Back in the old days people used to observe, experiment, theorise and prove (or think they did). So for instance some guy looked up for a time, watching the stars and moon turn in circles, and decided the earth was the centre of the universe and everything turned around it. On the other hand there was a guy noticed a frog’s leg twitching long after death and invented electricity. Or something.

    Nowadays all too often the theory comes first then the experiments and observations only of the experiments themselves. So meat is bad or good, depending on the end target. A lot of science is target driven, rather than “Let’s see what’s out there”.

    The parallel with journalism is clear. Very little journalism, a lot of churnalism, making some facts and observations try to fit a pet theory or point of view.

  48. Thepnr says:

    Point well made Rev. I doubt this will make even a tiny dent in current levels of support for Independence and in fact might even increase it.

    Now wouldn’t that be something lol.

  49. Stig says:

    The commenters here are sensible level-headed types not swayed by MSM.
    However, this all concerns me. The vote, when it happens, will still be on a knife’s edge with small numbers swinging it either way.
    I believe there will be some people who aren’t committed to indy but may be swayed – the type of voter we need to convince most of all. Some of these will believe somehow that going the same way as ‘the accused’ will somehow make them a bad person. (No matter if all charges are dropped and the accusers are proven to be making false claims, because mud sticks especially if applied by people whose profession is to tarnish reputations).
    I have no suggestions on how to get around this, unfortunately, apart from keeping all fingers crossed that here’s a big enough majority without these voters.

  50. TheItalianJob says:

    Great post Rev. Quite right the Independence movement is far bigger than any one person or entity.

    The Indy2 ref will be called soon and won.

  51. auld highlander says:

    Well said Revand I really really like that last paragraph.

  52. Scottish Steve says:

    If it was even remotely true that Salmond’s guilt or innocence would determine how Scots felt about independence then surely by the same logic, unionists should have been disgusted by the idea of staying in the UK because of all the paedophiles in Westminster.

    Or is that somehow different?

  53. yesindyref2 says:

    A couple of very good articles in the Herald last night, and in it’s in a curious state it seems to me. Basically it sees Brexit as a disaster, and I think it might be faced with a choice between Brexit and Independence for Scotland.

    This reflects the choice a lot of people in Scotland are having to think about even now.

    Bearing in mind the decline of the “dead wood media”, perhaps the Herald should take note of my previous comment and go back to total investigative and factual reporting journalism.

    There is a need AND a gap in the market for it in Scotland.

  54. sassenach says:

    Nothing less than I expected from the Rev, a true journalist.

    So many nails hit…..!!

  55. Cubby says:

    Excellent Wings article as is always the case. Agree with the BTL comments. The SNP is not the yes movement. Any one individual is not the yes movement.

    Can I appeal to any independence supporters who still buy the Britnat rags that are no more than Britnat propaganda leaflets please do not give them your money. Forget the excuse of the sports pages etc. How bad do the papers have to be for you to stop giving them your money.

  56. Yerkitbreeks says:

    I wouldn’t stop at the media – did you see FMQs last week ? It took Patrick Harvey to shame the Labour and Tory leaders.

  57. Sarah says:

    I have sent my message to my MP, MSPs – Green and SNP, and the First Minister. Nothing to do with the AS charges but what we are saying – Scotland must take back control and be a nation state again because Westminster is undemocratic and worsening rapidly.

    All posters above – I hope you are telling the Scot gov the same message.

  58. TheItalianJob says:

    At Cubby.

    No probs. Haven’t bought a newspaper for over 10 years going on.

    I get all my news including newspaper links etc (thanks Nana et al) from here on Wings.

  59. mountain shadow says:

    As I have already stated, committed Yes supporters will not let Alex’s issues have any bearing on whether they wish to push for Indy2.

    The point being missed though, is that we need to persuade approximately 2.6% of the population to reverse their decision of four years ago. These voters are not committed Yes supporters and may be persuaded not to vote Yes by the Salmond situation and the Yoon press saturation about the on going process.

    This is why great caution has to be shown and why the FM has not pulled the trigger yet.

  60. carjamtic says:

    Absolutely spot on,the beating hearts of the MSM cadavars are slowly stopping and with an occasional lazarus reflex….do not be afraid, they soon will be ‘no more’.

  61. Iain says:

    We have to expect that, before we achieve independence, almost all of the media in Scotland is going to favour the union.

    If you allow yourself to work for BBC Scotland, for example, your company HQ is in London, and that’s where you’d get a bigger job with bigger bucks, more prestige and assignments in other countries. (Glenn Campbell’s fruitless expedition to the USA to seek out people offended by the freeing of Megrahi was a one-off.) So it is with the print media. The promotion lies in London. So it’s London you think about, and you can’t think that way without being a unionist.

    Oh, there are unionist exceptions, like Jackie Bird, but she’s got a cushy number since she persuaded the bosses to oust David Robertson and leave her the as the No.1 newsreader. And she’d never get to No.1 in London.

  62. Thomas Valentine says:

    If the glee filled unionist think they have their Parnell moment they should remember what happened because of it. Particularly because it directly led to the issue of today.

  63. robert alexander harrison says:

    typical idoits never learn do they they unseated him and Angus Robinson yet Ian Blackford mhairi black and other snp mps stepped up in 2017 in the aftermath just shows there’s others who will step up when needed Alex salmond isn’t the only thing for the independence campaign britnats better learn that otherwise indyref2 yes will win by a landslide.

  64. Socrates MacSporran says:

    Yerkitbreeks @ 2.15pm

    You wrote:

    “I wouldn’t stop at the media – did you see FMQs last week ? It took Patrick Harvey to shame the Labour and Tory leaders.

    Fair point, except – the Labour and Tory leaders are utterly shameless, and lacking in self-awareness.

    They are Unionists – their creed is: “Don’t do what we do, do what we tell you, Sweaties.”

  65. Les Wilson says:

    Looking at the rabid media front pages in my local supermarket, it makes me ask the question of just how anyone can now gain a fair trial with their wall to wall demonisation tactics.

    I am not here particularly speaking of Alex Salmond, but of anyone the press wants to tarnish,this day shows how they do that across the board and will continue into the future.

    Sly innuendos are applied here and there thoughout and wording used that can be construed in several ways but used to deflect them from blame or prosecution.

    Something smells, we will find out just what that is at the end of the day. But it is a nasty tactic on whoever they want to harm and they need to be held to account for that.

  66. carjamtic says:

    Oops,Happy Tam O’ Shanter Day


  67. ali says:

    whatever happened to the Ted Heath enquiry

  68. Den Cairns says:

    You speak for the Many Rev. Spot on.

  69. yesindyref2 says:

    Aye aye or eye eye, check it out:

    A fresh vote on our membership of the European Union was backed by 53% in the online poll – well ahead of the second top option of no deal, which received 30%.

    Poll in the Scottish Farmer, a Newsquest publication.

  70. Helena Brown says:

    We spoke about the situation this morning, between us there is nearly one Hundred years of desire for independence. That doesn’t rest on either one man or woman’s shoulders.
    We also know not only our countries history but that of our neighbours. That they have caused trouble within their neighbours borders for years.
    Now what would they have done with Rabbie and his woman trouble, just as well that was then, this is now.

  71. starlaw says:

    Scottish Nationalism is not a political party or person. Its the wish to live in an normal country.

  72. yesindyref2 says:

    That’s 53.26% who want a second EU ref, 39.55% who want to leave the EU regardless. Eliminating those wanting a GE as we don’t know which way they stand, that’s 57.4% for EU Ref 2, 42.6% against. Which may or may not correspond to being against Brexit.

    Amongst farmers.

  73. Dr Jim says:

    When HRH the Queen’s out of the picture is that the end of England then

    come to think of it it probably will be

  74. geeo says:

    All we need to know about the media in one short sentence:

    “Even if the uk government were willing to grant permission”

    The fact they promote such an obvious fallacy says it all.

  75. HandandShrimp says:


    The fact that the case is now subject to process and can’t be discussed, perhaps for quite some time, means Nicola has a clear window to focus on Indyref2. I think the charges make an imminent announcement more likely and if we career towards a no deal in the next few weeks an absolute racing certainty.

    I think what we are seeing is a unionist wet dream projected on a big screen with Dolby surround sound.

    A retired politicians alleged proclivities or indeed quite possibly complete lack of them has no bearing on Brexit and Scotland’s place in the EU and the world.

    I say we should be getting ready for battle.

  76. Fergus Green says:

    Great analysis Stuart. The events of yesterday will focus minds and harden the resolve of YES voters and I just wonder if they might just shift a few ‘soft No’s’ away from the dark side. Maybe a few eyes are being opened as people start to explore the possibility of state sponsored dirty tricks coming into play.

  77. Yes Pensioner says:

    Once the MSM have wrung this story to death over the next week or so there will be nothing else they can say since it is now a live case. That would be a good time to get on with making the case for independence.

  78. admiral says:

    Les Wilson says:
    25 January, 2019 at 2:29 pm
    Looking at the rabid media front pages in my local supermarket, it makes me ask the question of just how anyone can now gain a fair trial with their wall to wall demonisation tactics.
    I am not here particularly speaking of Alex Salmond, but of anyone the press wants to tarnish,this day shows how they do that across the board and will continue into the future.

    Agreed – look at the way they demonised the two individuals who were wrongfully arrested for the drones at teh airport farce.

  79. ScotsRenewables says:

    I joust regularly on another forum with committed Brexiteers and Yoons with no time for Salmond or the SNP.

    One amazing consequence of recent events is many of these people commenting on how odd the timing of these complaints is. Most of them don’t see why it would affect voting patterns in any Indyref.

    ‘Mountain Shadow’ strikes me as a concern troll.


  80. Dr Jim says:

    This just in:

    The Branch office of the Labour party in Scotland have called for Alex Salmond to be proclaimed guilty as charged by writing to RT to have the Alex Salmond show removed from the airwaves as they deem it inappropriate to broadcast the programme given the nature of the charges against him

    RT have as yet not responded to the Branch office of the Labour party in Scotland

  81. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “The PF has decided that there charges to answer hence the appearance in court.”

    No he hasn’t. That’s factually wrong. That’s not how it works. Read the link. People have to be careful what they say now, including blog commenters.

  82. Cubby says:


    Likewise I only buy a few Nationals now. I decided that the excuse I told myself that I liked reading the sports pages justified buying the Britnat paper. Glad I ditched them a long time ago. Didn’t even buy the Sunday Herald during its independence period as I didn’t trust them. I remembered the Sun doing the same.

  83. Dr Jim says:


    He’s been weasling for days

  84. Bobp says:

    In 50 yrs time alex most probably wont be here. But an independent Scotland will always be here.

  85. frogesque says:

    Hersel’ and I have spent the afternoon painting YES stones.

    One small step for Scotland, one giant leap for freedom.

    Will be out on motorway bridge tomorrow and Sunday. Gie us a beep!

    To a large extent Alex is irrelevant as Rev Stu has outlined and even Brexit is something of a sideshow. Indy is the goal then we make our own decisions on everything.

  86. Ken500 says:

    Going by the number of Daily Record’s left on the shelf. No one is buying it.

    Even more support for the SNP/Indepenence

  87. Arbroath1320 says:

    I think that the Britnat media have absolutely NOTHING to throw at the Cybernat army anymore and so attack the indefensible because they know neither Alex Salmond nor anyone else wanting to avoid jail time can say anything about the situation he currently finds himself in. The Britnat media can therefore spew tons of shite in the certain knowledge that a) there will be little or no come back and b) it will stick no matter what.

    The Britnat media are all over this story in a pathetic attempt, in my view, to divert eyes ( and ears) away from Feartie and her Titanic episode that is Brexit! Nothing to see here move along now .. oh look squirrels. The best way to achieve this … run up a monster of a story about Alex Salmond, Nicola Sturgeon, the S.N.P. or 2nd independence referendum. At the moment they have all fixated their gaze on Alex.

  88. Socrates MacSporran says:

    Chris Musson, the Scottish Sun’s Political Editor has been tweeting widely on what he sees as inconsistencies in the Scottish judicial process.

    Of course, Mr Musson is not a specialist court reporter – a now endangered species, working in an area of journalistic law which is quite complex.

    Indeed, as an aside here – the lady who is today’s leading Scottish court reporter has, famusly, on several occasions had to correct sheriffs over incorrect rulings they have made.

    But, my post here is more-esoteric. I accept, Alex Salmond is a somewhat divisive person. I am sure, there are those in the Unionist community who have already decided he is guilty of all charges. Also, I suspect, even if Alex is eventually found guilty of even one of the charges against him, there will be those in the Independence movement convinced of his innocence and seeing such a verdict as proof of an Establishment stitch-up.

    However, either way, some mud will stick, and that is why, in such cases, I feel there is a case for a total news blackout, in as much as identifying the accused, right up until a guilty verdict is returned.

    Anonymity of alleged rape victims is guaranteed. Indeed, unless charges such as perjury or wasting Police time follow a Not Guilty verdict in a rape case, the alleged victim in a rape case is never named.

    I would make the same case for anyone, even if he was not a public fgure such as Alex Salmond, being accorded anonymity in rape or seual assault cases, right up to an eventual finding of guilty – just to prevent mud sticking.

  89. galamcennalath says:

    Helena Brown says:

    We spoke about the situation this morning, between us there is nearly one Hundred years of desire for independence.

    So, not many of you 😉

    (I consider myself to have 50)

  90. Jockanese Wind Talker says:


    Brexit reaches the 2 World Wars and a World Cup phase.

    More proof that Brexit is a very English Project.

  91. Moira Morrison says:

    I’m almost afraid to state my opinion here as it seems only those in favour of Indyref2 are responding, or perhaps they are the only ones reading this. Now before you assume that I am against one, I’m not. I simply like to look at all sides of the argument before I make a decision. This article is absolutely right in that Independence is far bigger than any one person. However, the comments on Tony Blair suggested that he would have a say but when the Labour Party were in the process of appointing a new leader, I seem to remember Tony Blair stating that no-one in their right mind would vote Jeremy Corbyn in. Clearly no-one is particularly influenced by what he has to say.

    The whole political system across the UK seems to be in such a desperate state of affairs at the moment that the timing of any such referendum would have to be carefully considered as I think that most people are so fed up with the present chaos, that a second referendum may possibly result in people not bothering to vote at all.

    One comment made by a reader of the article actually made me feel nauseous: people in Scotland are ‘goats’ not ‘sheep’. Please tell me that this does not refer to Freemasonry- I would be terrified of a living in a country run by the brotherhood. This is definitely something that would determine any future vote I may (or may not) make. Is this what an independent Scotland would mean?

  92. yesindyref2 says:

    Amen to that.

  93. This analysis is only a sample of what we’ll face and have counter during the next indy referendum.

    The British nationalists have absolutely nothing positive to offer Scotland to remain part of this failed and damnable union state.

  94. winifred mccartney says:

    I really hope for all concerned this is over quickly and justice is done and in the meantime the rest of us will get on with indy.

    Never interrupt your enemy when they are making mistake/s!

  95. you couldn’t make it up
    The BBC considers a move to a EU member state needed for a licence to continue broadcasting across continent.

    This after having given anti EU Farage all the publicity could ever have hoped for to peddle his poison here in the UK.

    I hope if this move does take place Europeans will sun the BBC

  96. Abulhaq says:

    Scottish nationalism is as disparate and diverse as Scotland itself. Independence is what we all want but we do not necessarily all share the current prescriptive, Sturgeonite PC themes and social liberal picture of what an independent Scottish state would be like.
    No person is Mrs or Mr Scotland. We have had our fill of these heroic, albeit clay footed, incarnations in nationalist politics.
    We need choice, variety, a plurality of voices and a wider existential perspective. Time the old ‘thou shalt conform’ matrix was smashed. We’ve simply outgrown it, or at least some of us have.

  97. Albaman says:

    Thanks for the warning Rev,
    I was about to let rip with both barrels,in a comment, instead I’m off outside to do some “Town Crying” as loud as I can !!.

  98. Artyhetty says:

    Take note, the BBC ( social) getting us all telt, re Scots law. Hmmm.

  99. revjimbob says:

    The Republican candidate for the presidency was caught admitting to sexual assault during the campaign. He still won.

  100. Muscleguy says:


    In science having a hypothesis to test is not considered, for good reason, a problem. What is a problem is holding to it when the evidence suggests it is wrong.

    I recall during my PhD I came across good evidence that the current understanding in the field, in large part established by my supervisor, was inaccurate due most likely to methodological limitations not fully understood or appreciated (perfect knowledge is impossible). I had to hand a more ‘perfect’ natural experiment than any of the interventions had managed and I therefore discovered things and understandings denied to previous methods.

    I took these data to my supervisor and explained all the ways I had tried to refute them and failed. He said ‘that’s very interesting, we should make a time to discuss what to do next’ which we did and we understood better.

    This idea that you cannot have a proposition to test because that biases you is bogus. All good scientists are prepared to discard their hypothesis if it fails the test(s). In fact disproving your previous understanding is good because it shows there is more science and understanding to be achieved.

    This is why repeated measurements to test the Theory of Relativity are still going on at every more degrees of accuracy. Thus far it has passed every test and that depresses physicists as it does not suggest any new way forward.

    It was the same with the discovery of the Higgs field as predicted mathematically. If it had been different from predictions we would have learned more.

  101. Arthetty

    Probably the same article from the BBC

    Contains this advice:

    These Contempt of Court laws tend to be more strictly adhered to in Scotland than they are elsewhere in the UK, and are designed to ensure that the accused – no matter who they are – is able to receive a fair trial without jurors being swayed by media speculation.
    This is particularly tricky for a high-profile figure such as Mr Salmond, and the Crown Office has stressed that the contempt laws also apply to social media and blogs – meaning anyone who tweets or posts anything that could potentially prejudice the case could face prosecution.

  102. Albaman says:

    Meg merciless @ 3:47,
    Wonder if that extends to the Record and the anti Scot, Clegg ?.

  103. Janet says:

    There’s a smell. You know what I mean.

    Play the man not the ball: but folk aren’t that daft.

  104. mumsyhugs says:

    Aye the numties still believe our heids button up the back and this will stop the 45% dead in their tracks and vote to keep the union. (sigh) Whit eejits 🙂

  105. Graeme says:

    The best thing we can do for Alex is win our independence as soon as possible.

    He has brought us to the ring now we must dance

  106. Alba woman says:

    Many thanks for your excellent piece…..I glanced at the newspapers in my local newsagent…they would just as well have printed Guilty over their headlines.

    Alec Salmond is innocent until proven guilty guys…they are so out of control….

  107. Haggishunter says:

    That’s it in a nutshell, Salmond isn’t Scotland or the SNP.
    The whole thing stinks of dirty tricks anyway, which is Westminster and the British government

  108. Artyhetty says:

    re; Meg merciless @ 3.45

    Indeed, but they are particularly talking about ‘social media’ here. What is that saying, goven the daily rags already have AS judged and guilty? Some of them are surely in contempt of the law. The case is already hugely prejudiced by way of that alone is it not?

  109. Jack Murphy says:

    Yerkitbreeks said in Post at 2:15 pm:

    “I wouldn’t stop at the media – did you see FMQs last week ? It took Patrick Harvey to shame the Labour and Tory leaders.”

    Here’s the link:
    Well worth a look.

    Just scroll along quickly to 12:24:30

    Scottish Parliament TV.

  110. We are where we are.

    It seems to me that regardless of what happens in coming months, the movement for Independence in Scotland has reached this point because of Alex Salmond’s efforts – perhaps more than anyone else’s.

    The greatest tribute we can give the man is to continue his life’s work and strike onwards to achieve independence.

    When is the next march?

  111. lumilumi says:

    Hear, hear, Rev Stu. A very good, measured piece of writing.

    On a more philosophical note, I have a problem with retrospective rules, regulations, laws, whatever. Lots of people have done things that have since been deemed illegal or against rules, regulations, whatnot. They might not have done those things had they been illigal/against the rules, regulations etc. at the time.

    Take the smoking ban, to give an example. Had smoking inside pub premises been illegal prior to the 2007 smoking ban, I’m sure most smokers would have gone outside to indulge their unhealthy habit – myself included. However, smoking inside was perfectly legal and even socially acceptable before 2007. Nobody in their right mind is going to pursue a retrospective criminal case against the people who smoked inside before 2007.

    Regarless of the rules, regulations, laws etc. in question, making them retrospective is problematic for this philosophical dilemma. Would an individual have acted the way he/she did had that particular action been illegal/against the rules or regulations at the time?

    If people can be prosecuted retrospectively, my parents should be charged with gross negligence or traffic safety violations or something for not placing their kids in car seats or even safety belts! Once safety belts became the law (and there was a big education campaign), they’ve been very conscientious about safety belts.

  112. Robert Peffers says:

    I’ve supported independence and the SNP since I was hardly out of short pants in the mid to late 1940s. I lived through all the many setbacks, disappointments and the many, many times the SMSM claimed, with their able assistance, that the SNP and independence were finished for good.

    Yet here I am, in 2019, still firmly convinced in the case for Scotland being free from Westminster. the movement is not really led by Nicola Sturgeon nor by the SNP it is led by the burning desire for a free Scotland.

    It has been said many times, and said when things were at their lowest ebb – “The dream will never die”.

  113. geeo says:

    As said earlier up the thread, as soon as Nicola announces the indyref date, and the media realises that actually, they have been caught telling their readers a load of tosh about no indyref due to AS situation, you will not hear the words, ‘Alex Salmond’ again.

    The media have actually created a potential problem for themselves and the No campaign.

    By constantly preaching there is “no appetite for indyref2” or “no indyref while AS case is ongoing” or “no indyref before 2021 election” and so on…there will be an awful lot of listeners/readers going to be asking a rather obvious question shortly (“in a matter of weeks”- NS) like…

    “if the media/unionist politicians have clearly been talking mince about a referendum not happening, what else have they lied about”?

    And that is a question which can only help our cause.

  114. Scott says:

    If this poll is correct I wonder what the likes of the MSP Tory farmers have to say about it,if we leave the EU Chapman will loose money poor farmer that he is,remember when asked if his subsidy was late in being paid,did not like to answer.

  115. Eppy says:

    I had thought that tonight (Burn’s Night) would be the ideal time for Nicola to make her long awaited statement.

    Tonight many Scots, unionist, nationalists, those in between or simply not interested will join with people throughout the world in commemorating a man of genius. Rabbie Burns is remembered, despite his flaws, for the way his words tell universal truths and he has helped over the years Scots retain their own language and sense of identity.

    So tonight, over the haggis, neeps and tatties I will raise a glass to Rabbie and to the independence of this country which is coming soon.

  116. Arthetty

    Have to be careful how I reply to this now…

    I would include blogs and social media if I was trying to stop particular things being discussed or possibly even exposed, like maybe lies or more importantly the truth.

    Of course, in order so to do, I would need to spend a lot of time and effort surveying a lot of the aforementioned social ways of interacting.

    Can’t imagine anyone would be bothered to do that …

  117. Marie Clark says:

    Very well said Rev, a few of us said much the same yesterday. The Indy movement is not one person or political party, it is US, the people of Scotland.

    I’m extremely sorry for Alex Salmond and his wife Moira at what has happened. But it will all come out in the wash. They think that they have muzzled Alex, and that has shut down the rest of us.

    The Britnat parties who are currently in Holyrood, will no longer exist after Indyref 2. They are not needed, they’re loyalty was and is to England, so there will be no place for them in Scotland. Why should we want these clowns who are so against their own country and people.

    I only buy the National, the others can disappear as far as I’m concerned. But, and it’s quite a big but, these people in the MSM and the Britnat politicians that are having a field day at what has happened, they have used up their ammo, and the main thing that they seems to have forgotten, is, that we on the indy side, HAVE NOT YET BEGUN TO FIGHT as somebody once said.

  118. Douglas says:

    I think this is a situation where it would have been very difficult for a Police officer (no matter how senior) to decide not to refer to the Procurator Fiscal. Regarding the decision of the Procurator Fiscal, we will find out soon. Procurator Fiscals are fiercely independent and will make the best decision. Attempts to influence and intimidate the judiciary and legal process (‘Enemies of the People’ type crap) are straight out of ‘Fascism for Dummies’ -and will not work. Some papers are currently sailing dangerously close to the wind in this regard.

    Totally agree that we must say nothing more about the allegations. This needs to run it’s course in a way that is fair for the complainants and the accused.

    Regarding the impact on the Independence. I agree that it will have as much less effect than the British hope. Not because Independence supporters don’t care, but because our motivation is the failure of Britain and hope for a better Scotland -not the leadership of any one person.

    Alex Salmond is not a King (never was), but even the Declaration of Arbroath written in far more deferential times makes it is clear that if leaders falter (whether guilty or not Alex Salmond will be effectively out of play at a crucial time) it will not change Scots determination:

    ‘Yet if he should give up what he has begun, and agree to make us or our kingdom subject to the King of England or the English, we should exert ourselves at once to drive him out as our enemy and a subverter of his own rights and ours, and make some other man who was well able to defend us our King; for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule.’

    (I would substitute Britain/British for England/English and try to make the language more gender neutral and republican).

    To take a different (far more extreme, damaging and unlikely) example, if Alex Salmond turned round and said:

    ‘Guess what folks, I’ve changed my mind. I think we should stick with Britain’

    …it would not change our reasons (although I hope that rather than ‘drive him out’ we would encourage him kindly to seek urgent medical assessment).

    In this climate, I expect that there will be more casualties and frantic hunts for even more who can be brought low. There may even be a few well placed people who have ‘second thoughts’ about independence.

    I guess this is where we find out how much strength in depth we have.

    I’m confident.

  119. Albaman @ 3.53

    I like my new warrior name!

    Meg Merciless!!! has a nice ring about it.

  120. euan0709 says:

    Scotland has changed a great deal since 2014.The 3rd Rifles ,marched into Dreghorn Barracks Edinburgh, the 1st Bn the Royal Regt of Scotland was moved to Belfast and the 4th Bn moved to Catterick Camp in England.
    Teresa May has treated the Scottish Government with total contempt and along with the assistance of Ken Mackintosh and a London Court she has ignored the will of the Scottish Parliament and clawed back a shed load of powers to Westminster.
    As for the Vow and Evel! I wont even go there.
    One thing the British have been good at is using the Union Flag to spread propaganda and there has been a marked increase in this since 2014.
    British industry flies the flag, our Driving Licences now bear a Union Flag instead of a EU flag, leading Supermarkets now package Scottish Fruit and Veg in nice Union Flag plastic packaging. Indeed Waitrose in Newton Mearns, while having little plastic Welsh flags in their Welsh lamb ( they don’t do Scottish Lamb)insist on sticking the UJ into Aberdeen Angus Scotch Beef.Which is I believe a contravention of the EU Protected Geographical Indicators List 2004.There are over 20 TV programmes, with the word British, Great British or UK in them. Every Soap Opera seems to have a Union Flag, cushion, teapot or wall plaque on display. Evan Buchannan’s the sweetie maker “the fine taste of Scotland Est 1856” has on the back of the sweetie poke a Large Union Flag with the words (in bold type) “Made in the UK”, right next to their address in Greenock. Proud Scots indeed !
    Unfortunately in the last few years the wearing of the Union Flag by Police Scotland Officers under the guise of a Police charity has increased greatly. It is not uncommon to observe Police officers on normal street duty wearing a Union Flag. Indeed yesterday I saw a BTP officer in the Central Station in Glasgow wearing a large Union Flag. We live in interesting times and the Police Service must be impartial and trust and confidence in Police Scotland is paramount. The wearing of a Union Flag by a Police Officer does not reflect that impartiality.
    I can think of six Police Charities that assist Police Officers in times of hardship. However if Police Officers wore all the badges that these charities represent , then the Officers would look like the Winning Racing driver on a Grand Prix Podium !
    It seems that the Union Flag in the guise of the Police Firearms Officers Association, was first worn by Police Scotland Officers on firearms training exercises in England and given the blessing of ACC Bernard Higgins. My concern is that some of the Officers wearing the Union Flag and indeed ACC Higgins may view themselves as some sort of British Police Paramilitary Unit. Last year firearms units from around the UK and Scotland, held a much publicised, Training Exercise outside Edinburgh and invited the Press and TV. Many of the Police Officers wore the Union Flag on their upper arm or on their chest.
    My fears increased when a recent article in the Guardian newspaper revealed that 1000 Police Officers from Scotland and the UK, would begin training this month to perform Police duties in Northern Ireland. Rather ironically PSNI Officers do not wear the Union Flag on their Uniforms.
    Police Scotland Uniform Regulations are fairly straight forward. Police Officers may wear the Poppy for a short period up to and including Armistice Day. They may also wear a Diversity Badge Association as a lapel pin or similar. The SPA now admits that “there appears to be inconsistency to Police Scotland’s approach to the wearing of badges and logos”. The “Charity” Union Flag comes in different colours, from an ordinary Union Flag to a dark Military type. They measure about 2 inches x 3 inches. Way much larger than a Pin type badge.
    ACC Bernard Higgins was a senior officer in Strathclyde Police, stationed at London Rd Police Office, which is halfway between Bridgton Cross and Celtic Park Football Stadium.It beggars belief that ACC Higgins would be unaware of both the Political and Sectarian loyalties behind the Union Flag and the serious unrest that these Loyalties can produce. While a Police Scotland Officer, wearing a Union Flag may be welcome at a Rangers FC game or indeed a Orange Order March as “one of the Boys”. I doubt very much wither the same bon Amie would be extended at a Celtic FC game (or indeed other teams) or at a Yes March.I mentioned to ACC Higgins that some people perceive the Union Flag as the Flag of right wing political parties and of Rangers FC. Indeed the Conservative MSP Murdo Fraser referred to Rangers as the “Queens eleven”. The only other person I heard use that term was a Senior Officer in the Firearms Unit at Jackton. I received a reply from ACC Higgins, in it he stated , “I do not necessarily agree with the conclusions that you have come to, nor the impact this Charitable Emblem! On the groups you have mentioned”. Seems the Union Flag represents a Charity.
    I have spoken to and reported three officers for wearing the Union Flag and one Officer for attacking the Independence movement on and Official Police Scotland Twitter. In all of my complaints the Local Police Commanders backed me 100% and ordered the Officers concerned to remove the offending flags.
    With regards to Union Flags not being a Political Symbol, I can only point to the News every day and the large crowd outside Westminster waving EU and Union Flags. I can also remember 12md in George Sq, Glasgow Friday 19th Sept 2014. Two girls were attacked by several hundred right wing thugs waving Union Flags throwing flares and burning the Saltire. Police Scotland made no arrests.
    I also contacted the then Justice Minister Mr Mathieson. re the Union Flag. He was not in the slightest bit interested and referred me to The CC.
    I was a Police Officer in Glasgow for over Thirty Years. During that period, there was a joke doing the rounds that to become aa member of the “Branch”, you had to be a season ticket holder at Ibrox. Seems that’s not funny anymore.
    Since its inception Police Scotland has been a rudderless ship with no firm leadership. It appears that while the British Government can see the advantages of the Union Flag. The Scottish Government, The SPA and Police Scotland don’t. let me make this clear I do not want any flags on a Police Uniform. If the Police want any type of Badge I suggest the type worn by the former Regional Forces. The City of Glasgow Police was established in 1800 and was the first Police Force in Scotland and arguably the first in the rUK.In 219 years Police Officers in Scotland never wore a flag on their Uniforms, not even during Two World Wars ….Why now ?
    I will leave the final word to the United States National Academy of Sciences, it states………..
    “subliminal exposure to National Flags, affects Political Thought and Behaviour.

  121. Luigi says:

    The BritNat Establishment seem to believe that the Scottish Independence movement is like a snake – chop off the head and all is well.

    Well, sorry to disappoint you, Cheps: Our Indy movement is more like a Hydra – with many, many heads, and each one chopped off is quickly replaced by two more.

    Ye cannae win, but keep busy- after all with the Brexit disaster and constitutional meltdown all around us, there’s no much else to fuss about, eh?

  122. Marcia says:

    The internal polling for what would be the No side in the next Scottish Referendum must be spooking them.

    This will have no effect on the Yes vote in the next referendum. Wishful thinking on the Unionist side. The younger generation of independence parliamentarians are now showing their strengths and it will be them that will carry the day. We thank Alex for getting us where we are. Old foggies like me now make way for them.

  123. ABBAMAN @ 3.53

    That’s so funny!

    The website has change your name too!!!

    I typed your posting name and it has come up with the Roman equivalent of the first four letters hence I’ve had to re-christen you Abba man

  124. Macart says:


    They hope it’s 45%. 😎

    Absolutely and demonstrably, UK politics is broken. It’s practice is openly disenfranchising, overly adversarial and manipulative. It favours only a binary choice which totally alienates and disempowers national demographics/cultures/partners with needs and priorities all their own.

    The only reason it still hangs on to those practices currently? That’d be a few centuries of brainwashing and the aid of a compromised media.

    Hopefully not for too much longer. 🙂

  125. Foonurt says:

    JokeS F. fae yoan ‘T. Liar’ – Haunz AffYa bass (nuvuhll).

    Wheiy diz yoan J. Curtice Esq., jist tak nummurrs fae polls fae 18.9.2014 tae early Dec., 2018. Iz spoutit last nicht tea-tum, oan Radio Union.

    Whit diz Scoattlin’s thochts, luk lik, richt noo?

  126. Dr Jim says:

    An awful lot of media going to an awful lot of trouble to tell us not to talk about what they’re all talking about

    I guess they figure that’s the only way they can keep it boiling by continuously mentioning this thing we’re not supposed to mention

    What do they think they’re going to do arrest the entire country for doing what the media is doing every day

    Must be just those and such as those who are allowed opinion prejudice and bias, the rest of us not so much

    Well Naw!

  127. With all their lies just remember what it says on the bottle STAND FAST

  128. Flower of Scotland says:

    Who buys these BritNat newspapers? Not Independence supporters, that’s for sure.

    Good article, the Rev.

    Looking forward to regaining our Scottish Independence.

    The British are feart! They know “It’s coming yet for a’ that”

  129. Clootie says:

    Independence will deliver the future of many, many generations to come. Why would anyone try to suggest it is linked to a individual or even current affairs in general. It is on a par with suggesting that Independence should be shelved if a a person died or left the campaign.

    WE, yes WE, are the Independence campaign. The media are on the side of the Unionists and hence the spin to help assist their case.

    The movement is bigger than any individual and that is just plain common sense.

  130. yesindyref2 says:

    Yes that has its place, the problem I saw years ago was that more and more research was, well, product related. So business parks at or connected with Unis. Nothing wrong with that in itself, as long as the more pure research continues – which it does.

    Nothing wrong either having a hypothesis to test out, including a null hopothesis with the intention of disproving it if possible. But there is also a place for pure observation as the origination. Quite a lot of astronomical theories come from that, e.g., why is this data “wrong” or inconsistent?

  131. Luigi says:

    This could backfire badly on the BritNats. After all, AS was very much the face of 2014, and many NO voters would just shrug “Here we go again” if the big man was dominant again (and let’s face it he would be given his natural gravitas).

    No, Alex has done an incredible work for Scottish independence (which will never be forgotten), but I do believe it’s time for others in the movement to step up and do their part.

    This could actually work out well in the end, as long as the SG doesn’t take fright and backs off from its’ planned trajectory. They will be gunning for Nicola now, of that I have no doubt.

    As I said, the MSM attention on AS will soon ease once Indyref gets into full swing and the establishment realises that it is making no difference to people’s decision to vote YES or NO.

    With regard to Brexit however – be afraid, BritNats, be very afraid. 🙂

  132. Pietro_McM says:

    The curious case of, Jimmy effing Saville

    An interesting case study in which those foundation pillars of the UK establishment, the BBC and the Tories, actively aided and abetted his myriad depraved crimes… Yet they are both still effing us over with total impunity.

  133. ScottishPsyche says:

    To link with another item today, the death of Hugh McIlvanney and memories of his interview with Muhammed Ali after the Rumble in the Jungle. The article doesn’t cover it but after the fight, George Foreman hated Ali for years but then came to love and respect him as a fighter and a person

    He recounted after using up all his power and coming up against the ‘Rope-a-dope’, ” I hit him hard to the jaw and he held me and whispered in my ear: ‘That all you got, George?’.

    I like to think we are able to say that to Clegg et al – ‘That all you got?’

  134. Republicofscotland says:

    Yes very well put Rev, regardless of the outcome, of Alex Salmond’s trial or non-trial for that matter, independence is not about Mr Salmond’s predicament, and the push will go on.

    The unionist media et al however see the two matters as indistinguishable.

  135. Albaman says:

    Meg merciless. 3:53
    It looks O.K. my end as it leaves,
    but being associated with ABBA is a plus for me!!

  136. Arbroath1320 says:

    I’ve just had a wee “outside the box” thought here. 😉

    I wonder if all the media going apeshit about Alex and the current court case is a result of them realising that at some point soon Nicola Sturgeon is going to announce date for indy ref 2 and THEY have NOTHING to fire at us so they hope that Alex is found guilty so THEY can go “aha told you so!” as another of their “nothing to see here move along now … og look sq

  137. yesindyref2 says:

    @Meg merrilees

    I didn’t get it at first!

  138. Arbroath1320 says:

    WTF happened there?

    Let’s try that again shall we? 😉

    Arbroath1320 says:
    25 January, 2019 at 4:32 pm
    I’ve just had a wee “outside the box” thought here. ?

    I wonder if all the media going apeshit about Alex and the current court case is a result of them realising that at some point soon Nicola Sturgeon is going to announce date for indy ref 2. THEY have NOTHING to fire at us so they hope that Alex is found guilty so THEY can go “aha told you so!” as another of their “nothing to see here move along now … oh look squirrels!” moments.

    The Britnat media are shitting themselves. Not only is Brexit “no deal off the edge of a cliff moment” fast approaching but running in parallel is the fast approaching independence referendum. When the date is announced the Britnat media know THEY are dead!

  139. yesindyref2 says:

    I see Wishy Washy’s at it again in The National, albeit in connection with an EU Ref 2.

  140. wull2 says:

    What they forget, it is most of the Scottish people, not a few.

    Tell everybody you know to vote YES this time.

  141. Bill Glen says:

    Nemo me impune lacessit
    No one provokes me with impunity”

    The People Are Independence

  142. Robert Peffers says:

    @Dr Jim says: 25 January, 2019 at 1:40 pm:

    ” … If Scotland has its own governement in charge of everything and they do a bad job we can vote them out.”

    Aye! Dr Jim, and I came across an old quote from when the people were rioting in the streets of Edinburgh against the signing of the Treaty of Union. It came from a quote from the rioters by what passed for the SMSM in those days.

    “The antecedents of newspapers were news-sheets which were small booklets of between two and 16 pages made from a single sheet of paper. One of the first was ‘The heads of severall proceedings in the present Parliament'(shelfmark: F.7.d.33) (Edinburgh, 1641) which reprinted news on parliamentary debates from London. ‘Mercurius Caledonius’ (H.1.e.26) which appeared briefly in 1660 and 1661 was arguably the first Scottish newspaper.”

    I’ve come across it several times since, and I paraphrase, “Wi dinna want oor pairliamint doon in London. Fir, whan oor pairliamentarians dinna dae whit wi want, wi kin stane thaim here in Auld Reekie. Wi canna dae yon in London.”

    So, Dr Jim, you have just written a modern version of that sentiment in the above quote.

    Mind ye, Ah’m muckle auld farren an swear bi the guid auld stane thaim wey o daein. :-))

  143. geeo says:

    @Arbroath 1320.

    Spot on (at 2nd attempt granted, lol) post there.

    “Hey Scotland, see that utter disaster of no deal brexit we are heading for, and the media are telling us will be the coming of the 4 horsemen of the apocolypse? Well, you can avoid that outcome by simply voting Yes To independence”.

    Going to be hard for unionists to counter such a simple and stark choice.

  144. Maria F says:

    “But what we haven’t had a single person say to us is that the charges will make the slightest difference to their belief in independence or their determination to campaign in any new referendum”

    Sorry Rev, I must be the exception to that rule.

    The sequence of events involving the leak to the rag pre-police involvement; the act of deliberately breaching the data protection Act and the UK civil service in Scotland code of conduct; the feast of the pro-union rags desperately attempting to change public opinion; watching how, opportunistically, Labour, tories and libdems capitalised on it; the miraculous evolution in the nastiness and number of those charges; the dubious historical charges and its breathtaking variety; the fact that the civil service breached the Data Protection Act, its own code of conduct and procedures and no investigation to this day has been started; the convenient and timely change of the complaints procedure and the unlawful way that procedure was conducted, has changed my belief in independence:

    it has made it even more entrenched, much stronger and much less tolerant to the dirty antics of a desperate English establishment.

    It has also awakened a feeling of revulsion, rejection and decreased tolerance for the cowardly useful idiots of the English establishment in Scotland willing to lick the boots of a bully for the sake of personal gain.

    It has also accentuated the utter contempt I have for the pathetic and hypocritical domesticated vultures of such establishment: tories, labour and libdems.

    It did not however escape my attention the evident disparity and inequality in the treatment of Whitehall subordinates compared with those under the control of Holyrood.

    2 of the most senior UK civil servants in Scotland linked to all that monumental mess are still in post, never mind that the procedure was declared unlawful and tainted by apparent bias by a court of law. Let’s not forget here that the Civil Service is bound by its own code of practice that demands political neutrality. Yet, there they are, still retaining their jobs.

    Should a quarter of all this had happened in NHS Scotland, which incidentally is under the control of the Scottish government, and the establishment’s vultures and all useful idiots in Scotland would have been hissing and circling around the NHS until it killed over. Yet, we saw nothing and heard nothing from those vultures and useful idiots towards the civil service because it happens to be controlled by Whitehall, not Holyrood.

    This discrimination is completely unacceptable and absolutely ridiculous. Any public service in Scotland should abide by the exact same rules, the same standards of diligence and performance and disciplinary measures.

    The Civil service may be under Whitehall control, but that cannot possibly give it a licence to break the law, to leak confidential information like a sieve, to breach its own code of conduct and poo poo all over their standard procedures so it can be used as a political hammer to destroy the character of a politician Whitehall does not like.

    It is time for the Civil Service in Scotland to be under the control of Holyrood. The antics we have witnessed with regards to Mr Salmond and memogate have made undeniable the fact that a Civil Service in Scotland under the control of Whitehall is not longer fit for purpose and lacks integrity, trustworthiness and political impartiality. The civil service cannot be repeatedly used as a political weapon to save the backside of unionism. The people of Scotland deserves better, much better.

  145. Dr Jim says:

    @Robert Peffers 4:58pm

    Probably more luck than judgement Robert, our ancestors had the insight to prepare for the future by inserting clever clauses into their deliberations, I on the other hand only have the benefit of their wisdom to make comment

    Would that more people were aware of just how insightful and clever our forebears were

  146. panda paws says:

    I’ve supported Scottish independence since I was in secondary school when I, and indeed most folk in Scotland, had never heard of Alex Salmond.

    That’s not to diminish his influence over the years but it’s the nation not the man that is important.

  147. John Jones says:

    I have just joined the ” metoo” movement, just realised that all those years ago when I took a girl home from the dancing I committed sexual assault, how about all the men out there admitting how disgusting we all were trying to get into a woman’s knickers. I’m glad it won’t be long until I retire from this oh so easily affronted world, A large dose of reality is required to all these idiots jumping onto bandwagons.

  148. Fireproofjim says:

    Maria F
    Great post. I hope some SNP leaders are thinking along the same lines.
    I also agree that the disgraceful behaviour of Westminster appointed civil servants must be punished. It seems to have been ignored.
    Anyway my determination to see an Independent Scotland is stronger than ever.

  149. Johnj says:

    Spot on Rev.

  150. Ahundredthidiot says:

    effn hell yeah!

    Let’s get this party started (in a week or two)

    I Cannot Wait!

  151. Gfaetheblock says:

    True believers will not waver, but their votes were in the bag. Two more critical areas may be impacted, to a greater or lesser extent as things play out.

    The SNP may be impacted more than Yes. Who knew what when questions will remain around the party until all inquiries and court cases are concluded.

    Indyref2 will be won by converting soft Nos. It will be easy to link the Indyref1 offering to Salmond, and then raise questions of trust while these charges hang over him. Not nice, but a obvious tactic. Therefore indyref2 would need to think how they distance themself from the Scotland’s Future, and that well take more than deleting salmond name from the SNP website

  152. gus1940 says:

    Is it not possible that it has been the case all along that the Guys In The Black Hats and their fan club in the media have gone out of their way to ensure that a fair trial is impossible with the result that the accused is not cleared of the charges leaving the suspicion of possible guilt effectively ending a political career?

  153. ronnie anderson says:

    mountain shadow why dont you pack up your Tepee

  154. Aaron Blue says:

    Indy supporters are a thrawn bunch. This episode will actually help support grow for independence.

  155. galamcennalath says:

    A Telegraph headline …

    ” There’s one way for England to achieve Brexit – and that’s by achieving independence from the UK “

    The rest is behind their paywall.

    Geez, they haven’t been keeping up, have they? Scots, including of course WoS, have been proposing that tidy solution for two years!

    I have never liked the ‘People’s Vote’. The 2016 vote was clear – England voted for its Independence and Scotland and NI voted to stay in the EU. The wishes are clear. The solution is simple.

    The problem is of course the Greater Englanders who still expect the whole UK to jump off the cliff with them!

    Implicit, but not explicitly stated, in the 2016 referendum was that England cannot have a hard EU exit and expect the UK to survive. That was and still I still the fundimental truth of Brexit. To think otherwise is just delusion.

  156. ian stewart says:

    Its not the Independence movement they seek to influence with their mud slinging and personal attacks. Like us they know that movement is solid. This is clearly aimed at former No voters who are now considering crossing over. They have fired all their heavy guns in 2014 they have nothing left but personal assassinations. Its gonna get very messy…

  157. Mary McCabe says:

    I’ve no idea if Alex Salmond is guilty of anything or if they can pin anything on him (not the same thing.
    The feminist in me thinks: No smoke without fire, especially if there are lots of women complaining as opposed to a couple of (possibly bribeable) women.
    The nationalist in me thinks:Tall Poppy Syndrome.
    I do know that it will be impossible for them to find a fair jury who don’t have prior opinions on him, or on the SNP or on the independence movement.
    I also know that this case has NOTHING whatsoever to do with the pros and cons of Scottish Independence.
    I was campaigning for indy before Alex Salmond joined the SNP amd before Nicola Sturgeon was born. From the weekly stall I run (Pensioners for Independence) I see signs that the electorate are also developing the ability to see past media attempts to personalise the whole issue as somebody’s vanity project.

  158. Capella says:

    Thanks Rev for another skewering of the lying yellow press. Once they sober up after their smear fest, they will notice that the indy supporters are calm and focused on freeing Scotland from the truly corrupt rule of Westminster.

    Another day another example of exactly what is wrong with living in the democratic vacuum called the UK. The best way to show support for Alec Salmond is to press on with the independence campaign.

    The dream shall never die.

  159. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    HandandShrimp @ 14:56,

    Yes, I think NS must have had the timing of this as part of her reckoning.

    While the mill wheels of justice grind ever so slow, and the other potential distractions expire from evident lack of HoC support, very soon now will be time to act.

    It’s so easy now to spot the BritNat wet dreamers – they are the ones who are trying to punt the futile line that the current stushie around AS will fatally delay IR2.

    They wish.

  160. Maria F says:

    gus1940 says:
    25 January, 2019 at 5:19 pm

    “Is it not possible that it has been the case all along that the Guys In The Black Hats and their fan club in the media have gone out of their way to ensure that a fair trial is impossible”

    That was my thought too Gus. A quick trial where the man is cleared is quite possibly not what they were really after, hence the leaking to the press. No, if they want to finish him politically it has to linger in the minds of the voters and linger for long enough to make him irrelevant. Never mind if the actual charges stand or not, that is academic. It is the opinion of the voters what counts, hence the unionist rags and broadcasters churning article after article.

    I thought the day Mr Salmond walked into RT with his program the establishment would start shitting themselves big time. It looks like it didn’t take them long to react.

    Such is the viciousness they have gone after Mr Salmond, that, I have to say, it very much looks like the establishment does not have any confidence whatsoever in that idiot that is currently holding the Gordon seat!

  161. manandboy says:

    Great article, Stu. In such pieces is stature increased, toward true and recognised leadership. Just keep going, you’ll be fine, for when you look round, we’ll be right behind you.

  162. Mik Johnstone says:

    awe, the poor wee souls, it’s incomprehensible for them to even contemplate that anyone outside of the SNP wants Independence… the independence movement is more than one man, it’s every damned one of us, even Gandhi was jailed several times…. highly suspicious to even try to take Alex to court at this time… it’s like something is aboot tae happen… Hail Alba my friends… stay frosty, it’s coming

  163. shiregirl says:

    I’m totally down about all this.
    Been seeing some of the swivvel-eyed comments on twitter and they are having a field day.
    Hoping Mrs Salmond is being supported at present.
    I am inclined to agree with Craig Murray about the current goings-on. It’s going to be very messy.

  164. Robert L says:

    I went into the newsagents this morning to collect the national and the conversation turned to A.S. I said these allegations dont ring true.His response was to say he had heard that A.S. had previous. When I pushed him for his source, he replied with the name of a labour councillor.What kind of country are we living in when elected politicians carry on like this.

  165. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    galamcennalath @ 17:20,

    Which does rather suggest a possible line of attack, namely find some way for Scotland to stall Brexit and just watch the English yellow press take up that line in a big way.

    English independence – never mind the pathetic EVEL tweak, chaps, take a leaf out of our book and go the whole hog! =laugh=

  166. Iain mhor says:

    Yup, I’ll add my “SNP, merely a tool for the job” to the list.
    I’ll also mention a lot of people with no experience of the law and courts have a strange idea of the PF.

    There are occasions the PF may take an interest in a particular case, but pretty much they just get shifted in a bundle from the inbox to the outbox. Especially where a case is brought by any ‘Authority’
    So you can and will unhappily find yourself in court on entirely spurious charges invented by the stupid or vindictive several times. That is until your case is dismissed via lack of evidence, or no evidence whatsoever or even a complete absence of the 3rd party or their solicitors for all the diets.
    No ‘Not guilty’ or ‘Not proven’ or any piece of paper to wave to your family, friends or employer saying “Yes it was all shite, thus man is entirely blameless” You’re just at the bus stop in the pissing rain wondering if you still have a job.

    To put another way – The Polis can happily lift you, process and refer you to court. It is not the Polis’ job to decide if their charges are correct or justified. They view that as the Court’s job. Their job is just to lift you. You may therefore be in court charged with “Wearing a loud shirt in a built up area”
    You may write in advance to a PF pointing out these charges are nonsense and why, but the chance of the Fiscal reading said missive is slim. Similarly, the chances of your case being one of the random handful the Fiscal reads that week for something to do while on the shitter are also slim. You will apear in court.

  167. Robert Peffers says:

    I’ve said it before but I’ll say it again.

    The great thing about the YES movement was that it came about spontaneously right across Scotland and no one nor any party were its promoters.

    It just miraculously happened right out of the Sky Blue of the Saltire.

    You know something? Since this Alex Salmond thing happened I can detect a different mood right across the Wings blog. Folks are beginning to pull in the same direction again. Not before time either.

  168. Colin Alexander says:

    Whether AS is innocent or guilty is irrelevant

    Whether the SNP led colonial Scot Govt are good, bad or indifferent is irrelevant to

    the many good reasons why Scotland’s people should exercise their sovereignty and dissolve the Union, instead of allowing the UK state to treat Scotland like a colony.

  169. Republicofscotland says:

    Meanwhile the Scottish Tories and Labour branch MSP’s are calling for Alex Salmond’s RT show to be removed from RT. Claiming it’s not appropriate for RT to broadcast it under the circumstances. That fine orator Annie Wells relayed the message via BBC Scotland.

    On the BBC’s website, the BBC added on another matter.

    “In the meantime, prosecutors and Mr Salmond’s legal team will continue to prepare their respective cases and it is possible that some or all of the charges against him will change, or even be dropped completely.”

  170. Bill McLean says:

    Robert is the man – “Folk are beginning to pull in the same direction again”. So true and so needed! Not all folk in England are gullible either. My Brummy wife’s best pal phoned from Brum this morning. The usual about how they were. and how their pals were, and out of the blue the pal asked the wife “what do you make of this Alex Salmond situation?”. My wife simply replied “we don’t believe it” and chum retorted “neither do we – it’s shenanigans”! I know we all want none of this to be so but it is heartening when someone with no horse in the race sees it the way we want it to be. Hoping Alex and Moira are bearing up well!

  171. Liz g says:

    Even yet the BBC show their true colours..
    The link from Republicofscotland @ 6.43 has them
    Quoting “The Crown Office” an office that has not a thing to do with Our Legal system!!!

  172. North chiel says:

    “Pathetic Quay” , usual Britnat stirring over Teachers pay offer and encouraging “ other public service employees” to compare with themselves , and also over Russia today ( not RT ) continuing to broadcast the AS show .
    ( under Scots law surely the man is innocent until proven otherwise)
    Reporting “ North Britain” the U.K. “ Britnat today “ state broadcaster ( BT)in their Scotland region.

  173. IZZIE says:

    My no voting son is going to vote YES he is a Tory at heart I asked him about the AS news he said and I quote ‘what has that got to do with anything?’ I think we are going to keep our converts

  174. Listen folks – let not dwell on any up coming court case. If there is a court case it must happen within the year, but the Procurator Fiscal will decide what happens next.

    Meanwhile, we have to keep focused on Independence.

    Alex himself said to Nicola that she should focus on Independence.

    The best way we can support him and Moira is to keep pushing for Indyref2. That is Alex’s legacy to us and to Scotland.

    If he can see and hear our efforts to keep the Saltire visible and Yes stalls out on the streets it will give him courage and strengthen us.

  175. Shinty says:

    What’s the figure on convicted criminals sitting in the HOL?

    84 comes to mind, but I could be wrong.

  176. Liz g says:

    Bill McLean @ 6.46
    It is indeed good to know that their are others who are awake to the Establishment shit too!
    It’s not even ( to us ) relevant whither or not it’s a British Establishment stitch up,that’s for the Court’s.
    What matters is that we are living under a Government where such a thing has credibility.
    A Government we cannot trust and cannot vote out!
    This is the issue that should concern us.
    We need to bring our Government within slapping distance….. and that we cannot trust them and cannot get rid of them is reason for Indy

  177. I don’t recall these ‘journalists’ calling for the entire English music industry to be shut down when Sir Cliff Richard was arrested.

  178. North chiel says:

    Good article by Peter Kelly on his “ Scot goes pop “ site.
    “ Scotland’s shame : the disgraceful behaviour of the Daily record and David Clegg”

  179. Robert Louis says:

    Agree with the article. It matters not one jot if they try to intimidate every single independence supporter, the people of Scotland are not going to stop wanting independence. That is what unionists and the clowns in Downing street should grasp. It matters not one jot what London decides to say or do, we will ALWAYS want democracy restored and the end to English colonial rule.

    I and many other Scots will drink a toast to the bard tonight, in the full knowledge, it is coming yet for a that. Just waiting for the starting gun in a few weeks.

    Hey London, We’re not going away. This time we will win. Scotland WILL be independent. Get over it.

  180. hackalumpoff says:

    @ Robert Peffers 6:10 pm

    “You know something? Since this Alex Salmond thing happened I can detect a different mood right across the Wings blog. Folks are beginning to pull in the same direction again. Not before time either.”

    Well said Robert, not only on Wings, responses on many other sites look similar.

    Keep the heid everyone, don’t bite. I’m going out tomorrow to face them on a stall and I’ll be as nice as pie to the soft noes but the yoons will get “oh look, a squirrel move along please”

  181. Dr Jim says:

    I seem to remember they jailed Ghandi

  182. Colin Alexander says:

    Scots, wha hae wi’ Wallace bled,
    Scots, wham Bruce has aften led;
    Welcome to your gory bed,
    Or to victory!

    Now’s the day, and now’s the hour;
    See the front o’ battle lour;
    See approach proud Edward’s power—
    Chains and slavery!

    Wha will be a ("Tractor" - Ed) knave?
    Wha can fill a coward’s grave!
    Wha sae base as be a slave?
    Let him turn and flee!

    Wha for Scotland’s king and law
    Freedom’s sword will strongly draw,
    Freeman stand, or freeman fa’,
    Let him follow me!

    By oppression’s woes and pains!
    By your sons in servile chains!
    We will drain our dearest veins,
    But they shall be free!

    Lay the proud usurpers low!
    Tyrants fall in every foe!
    Liberty’s in every blow!—
    Let us do or die!

    Happy Burns Night.

    Scotland shall be free of the chains of UK colonial slavery.

  183. Ian Foulds says:

    Bob Mack at 1.11pm ‘I want my grandchildren to live in a better country with freedom of choice to pick their own direction in life. I want them to enjoy the fruits of our country’s wonderful resources rather than be Iving in penury whilst paying protection money to England.

    This goes way beyond political personalities.’

    Ditto in spades.

    I particularly like ‘…paying protection money…’ and your last sentence.


  184. Dr Jim says:

    How about Nelson Mandela

  185. Dan says:

    One wonders if Theresa is now ruing her time as Home Secretary when she had a UK Schengen opt-out at her disposal.
    She chose to play “the immigration game” which it appears she has managed to use to great effect as a divide and rule tool down in the Kingdom of England.
    How and ever, after decades of blue and red tory governance decimating our industries many thousands of young Scots made the decision to leave and build their lives elsewhere.
    Those political decisions that caused this emigration meant a lot of low paid employment positions were then filled by hard working eastern European economic migrants who were only doing the same as our own that had left. IE.Trying to build a better future for themselves wherever they could.

    The trouble for May is that over the years these migrants have integrated into our Scottish society, and with the Scots being generally of fair mind we are now standing up to support and defend our new found friends and family members.

    Westminster’s ongoing antics are causing ripples of increasing magnitude that have reached Scotland which has an abundance of water.
    They have unwittingly woken from slumber and continue to agitate the many headed hydras that live in these waters which are the Indy movement.


  186. laukat says:

    I got stopped by a colleague at work today who I had previous political debates during the independence referendum. He was an abolsutely ardent Unionist so when he stopped me to ask what I thought of the Alex Salmond case today I thought I was in for some gloating.

    However the conversation quickly turned to him telling me that if there was referendum now that he would vote Yes due to the chaos Brexit has caused. The person was such a Tory, Unionist and Royalist that it would be the equivalent of Ruth Davidson saying she was going to vote Yes. Seriously caught me buy surprise and if its someone like him has changed their mind then we really need a Indyref now.

  187. Legerwood says:

    Liz g @ 6.51pm

    I think you should revisit your assertion that the Crown Office has nothing to do with the Scottish Legal System.

    It is very much an integral part of it along with the Procurator Fiscals

  188. Ron Maclean says:

    Contempt – Extract from Opinion of the Court in The Lord Advocate against Scottish Daily Record and Sunday Mail Ltd. [2018] HCJAC 32

    ‘Counsel recognised that the statutory test, namely whether there was a “substantial risk that the course of justice in the proceedings in question will be seriously impeded or prejudiced” had been met. The matter was one of creation of a risk. From the point of view of whether a contempt had been committed, the fact that no actual prejudice to a trial eventuated was irrelevant.’

  189. Ian Foulds says:

    Colin Alexander at 7.19pm.

    Thank you.

    Words so apposite to our current situation.

  190. Dr Jim says:

    Throughout history the British government has been awash with incompetents in positions of power and they just keep replacing them with more of the same, nothing ever stops them does it

    Take a long look at the Tory party it doesn’t matter who’s in charge nothing stops them, they will themselves to win and stand together for the sake of their party

    We’ve got a whole country to stand for

  191. yesindyref2 says:

    Talking about twitter checked out the usual suspects, I don’t know a full list, don’t bother with them usually. Using the word twonk of course 🙂

    Stephen Daisley – good guy, pinned tweet and run down of COPFS contempt of court
    Alex Massie – twonking twonk – retweet of DR cover, not even the guts to do anything himself. Ball-less twonk!
    Chris Deerin – no mention
    Severin Carrell – twonk, tweet has the full list of charges
    Haggerty – twonk – retweets Carrell which is bad enough in itself.
    Loki – twonk, tweets CM with sarcasm. Make it a twonky twonk.
    Philip Sim – twonk, full list of charges on twitter
    Euan McColm – twonk, retweets Sim.
    David Torrance – good guy, nothing at all about it!
    Fraser Nelson – good guy – nothing about it
    Andrew Neil – good guy – one single line tweet

    I feel so dirty after being forced to do the last one, that’s it folks!

  192. Kenny says:

    Have’nt read Stu’s piece yet, but here is some good news I
    bumped into last night.
    Saw the front page of the Record this morning as I passed at a distance. So quite appropriate.
    Circulation figures for the Record and the Sun. Mail. Yipee.
    This is year on year, and apologies if it has been posted before.
    October 2017 to 18
    Record 121,710 Down 15%
    Sunday Mail 126,409 Down 15%

    Record 121,474 Down 15%
    Sunday Mail 125,499 Down 15%

    Record 118,603 Down, you guessed it 15%
    Sunday Mail 122,653 Down 15%
    How many years do they have left, not many, I hope.
    The Sun tripled it’s losses to £91.2 million in 2018.
    And in Nov., a survey of over 2000 British adults by Yougov and Cambridge Uni. found that only 2% put a “great deal of trust” in churnalists. 77% said they had little to no trust in journalists. Good to know.
    After May’s GE, I got really sickened by everything. Just getting a bit of heart back, as long as there is “no deal”.

  193. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @laukat (7.27) –

    Very encouraging – I wish yon Phantom Power would get a hold of some of those who were amongst the angrier No voters. They don’t have to be erudite or well-kent, they just need to tell the truth about why they’ve changed their minds.

  194. tom says:

    Going to the pub tonight?

    Don’t get drawn into any “Alex Salmond Bad” mince.

    Change the story quickly to the Brexit fiasco.

    As Manuel of Faulty Towers once said in his broken Barcelona accent,

    “I know noooooothing”

  195. geeo says:

    Coco says:

    “Whether the SNP led colonial Scot Govt are good, bad or indifferent is irrelevant”

    Still bleating on with this pathetic, repetitive rubbish, coco ?

    If Scotland was an English Colony, we would never have had one indyref, never mind staring down the barrel of number 2.

    If Scotland was an English Colony, we would never have had devolution never mind a Scottish Government completely opposed to WM rule, what self respecting colonial power would tolerate such insolence ?

    If Scotland was an English Colony, we would be seeking UDI to become independent.

    So, coco, instead of gibbering ‘rock style’ pish, perhaps you could tell us all YOUR take on the LEGALITIES which YOU think makes Scotland a Colony of England ?

    Lets start with the Treaty of Union.

    Where in said Treaty, does it suggest or state, that Scotland is a Colony of England ?

    Go on coco, unless you are admitting you are dribbling again ?

  196. Dr Jim says:

    At last the teachers are finally realising they’re being used as tools for the Labour party

  197. Liz g says:

    Ledgerwood @ 7.37
    Oops…. Good catch,Thank You,I think was thinking of the CPS.
    Speed reading,and a built in bias…. I could get a joab wi the Record..LOL
    In ma defence though… The media have been guilty of conflating the two systems in the past!
    But your right to point out that they actually didn’t this time,we should always try to be accurate.
    Or or put another way…. Not be like them!

  198. Phil says:

    We will see Dr Jim. I know one suite of teachers – mostly retired now – who roll their eyes at this manipulation of EIS members. These friends have seen it all before and just hope members do not get led into losing pay / kids losing learning for the sake of political hanger’s on dreams.

  199. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi Colin Alexander at 7:19 pm

    You typed,

    “Scots, wha hae…”

    Perhaps Wingers, at some point tonight, could sing the words you pasted, while listening to the nearest to the original tune, that is available on YouTube?

    And give a wee nod in the direction of The Auld Alliance…

  200. Pete Barton says:

    @euan0709 4:12pm:

    Thankyou for that informative and very relevant information.

    And all the others who contribute similarly.

    Please keep this coming.

  201. Liz g says:

    geeo @ 7.52
    Re … It a TREATY arrangement
    Well I’m afraid …
    Ye can explain it To him.
    But ye can’t understand it For him!

  202. Big Phil says:

    @Brian Doonthetoon.
    Love it . As soon as them pipes play I’m tearing up. cheers. 😉

  203. marga says:

    Just a note from Catalonia. Scots may not all know about documented secret service black ops against Catalan nationalism stretching over years. Just put Operation Catalonia in Wikipedia, and you will see a reasonable summary. It’s not “alledgedly” any more, it’s proven.

    “Operation Catalonia (Operació Catalunya in Catalan) is the name of a covert police operation allegedly driven by the government of Spain which aimed to curb the Catalan independence process. The operation consisted of research and information gathering about Catalan independence politicians without judicial authorization. The operation allegedly included the creation or use of false evidence, data manipulation, irregular reports, secret agents, leaks to the press and the use of threats to obtain confidential information. ”

    The operation was preceded with the blackmailing into confession of tax offences by senior Catalan Catalanist politician Jordi Pujol, according to El Pais daily “considered the father of contemporary Catalan nationalism.” Wild allegations of political corruption shook Catalan society. That was in 2014 but now it’s 2019 and Pujol’s corruption has never been proved nor come to court. Curiously, CNI and political culprits haven’t been investigated either.

    Does any of this ring a bell? Catalans were called paranoid until secret recordings were leaked to prove what was happening. Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean you’re wrong.

  204. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi Big Phil.

    Had the same effect on me (and still does) when I first heard it. Can’t even remember who originally posted the link for it.

  205. Dr Jim says:

    Remember when Unionist MPs and MSPs told us if Scotland owed any money to the UK on Independence we’d have to pay up or be a pariah state with nobody wanting to trade with us

    Funny how they don’t want those *rules* to apply to them with any debts they owe to the EU

  206. Dr Jim says:

    @marga 8:28pm

    It’s good to be paranoid it keeps you alert

  207. Rock says:

    Peter Macbeastie says:
    25 January, 2019 at 1:52 pm

    “The movement is for independence, not Alex Salmond, Nicola Sturgeon or any other individual.”

    There is no independence movement without a leader, never has been.

    They have ZERO fear of Nicola but are terrified of Alex Salmond.

    Whether found guilty or innocent, Alex Salmond has now been successfully removed from indyref2.

    This is my personal opinion and I do not have any evidence for it.

  208. Legerwood says:

    Liz g says:
    25 January, 2019 at 8:03 pm

    After I posted the link I wondered if you were getting the Crown Office and the Crown Estates mixed up. All those Crowns.

  209. The English captured and murdered Wallace(with the help of the tractor Sir John Menteith of Ruskie and Knapdale),

    they must have thought that would finish of the fight for independence,

    all it did was galvanise Bruce,who took the throne a year after Wallace`s murder.

    Saw/seen the north brutish press front pages today,

    the north brutish journalist is a grotesque twisted abomination.

  210. Tinto Chiel says:

    I hear Comrade Flanagan is urging teachers to reject the SG offer.

    Unfortunately for him, I have two hard-working teachers with a bolshie backbone in the family who think John Swinney’s offer is eminently fair and they will happily vote to accept the offer. That being the case, when this rejection is put to the main, non-confrontational body of the profession, I’m afraid Larry will be on to plums.

    Memo to Thin Controller Tricky Dickie: BLiS______d ain’t working.

  211. Malcolm Macdonald says:

    Dan says:
    25 January, 2019 at 7:27 pm
    One wonders if Theresa is now ruing her time as Home Secretary when she had a UK Schengen opt-out at her disposal.

    The UK and Eire are not in the Schengen treaty area, we have the CTA (Common Travel Area) which allows free movement between UK and Eire


  212. Thepnr says:

    As for what might happen now? We move on don’t we, today’s news is tomorrows wrapping for fish suppers.

    This will hang about like a bad smell for a while I’d guess but we have more important things to focus on now in the immediate future.

    Judging by the posts today I don’t think many have lost sight of that.

  213. Ruby says:

    If which seems to be the case they believe that bad news about Alex Salmond will damage the case for Independence you can understand why they might be tempted to conduct a smear campaign or worse.

  214. Robert Peffers says:

    Just been watching a YouTube clip of an RT Programme. The EU is set to fine the UK over unfair tax reductions for London Commodities Dealers. The London financial expert lady also comments about the big companies bailing out of London and moving to EU Countries. Seems, it just takes a couple of hours to arrange and a week to do the move:-

  215. Petra says:

    Thanks for being the quiet voice of reason, once again, Stu amidst a cacophony and minefield of MSM misinformation and doleful wishful thinking. Alex Salmond is more than capable of dealing with the situation that he has found himself in and no matter when the case is heard or the outcome it won’t affect the timing of IndyRef2, as is “their want”. The last thing that Alex would want right now is for us give up and throw in the towel which will NEVER happen, as well he knows right enough. This army of ours is on the march and we’re not for turning back now. And like Scottish armies in the past we’ll be joined by others along the way.

    We know that Alex and Nicola can’t have any contact, or all hell would break loose, but I reckon that Alex could see how his case was going and sent out a message to her last week, to the effect of, “no matter what, focus on Independence” – Go, Girl, Go. She is of course focusing on Independence hence the fact they’re targetting her now too, however they seem to forget that we are extremely fortunate in that we have a number of absolutely superb SNP politicians who are well able to take over the role of SNP leadership, if need be, unlike the London controlled Unionist parties in Scotland that are stuffed full of dumb-clucks (bar Andy Wightman). All I would say is that those working in London shouldn’t think of boarding the same plane or train, enmasse, until we’ve got this done and dusted.

    Meanwhile Westminster’s policy with regard to individuals accused of sexual harassment, etc, is to maintain their anonymity initially and as far as “retrospective” claims are concerned you can forget about anything going back to 2013. One wonders if this also means that they can also stop searching for, aye right, their “lost” paedophile-ring dossiers now? Handy, eh?


    Someone on here mentioned that the number of complainants seems to have escalated when in fact all charges could relate to two complainants only.


    Great posts Maria F. Will the ins and outs of this case, such as the part Civil Servants have played, ever be made public or will the data be locked away in a vault somewhere in London for 100 years?


    @ euan0709 at 4:12pm …….. “Police Scotland/Union Flag badges.”

    Thanks for your very informative post euan and well done to you for taking steps to deal with this situation. Maybe we should all think of becoming more pro-active and start complaining about this too, that is Scottish Police wearing Union Flag badges. I see that you say that NIrish Police don’t wear them. How will that go down if Scottish cops are sent to Ireland wearing such badges? They probably won’t because it could / would ignite the already volatile situation, but if that’s the case in relation to NIreland why do they think that they can get away with wearing them here when we’re still dealing with sectarian issues?

  216. Bobp says:

    Someone on here posted that the scottish police are under the control of the SG. If thats the case they should be wearing saltire badges, thats the country they serve in.

  217. jfngw says:

    As far as I can see the MSM has only ever seen this case as a way to stop an indyref, they have said as much often enough. The accusers and defendant seem to be just collateral damage as far as they are concerned.

  218. jfngw says:

    Rumours are the Queen is keen on Brexit because of the belief they will get India back. In fact they have ordered a supersized tin of pink paint in preparation.

  219. stewart Forbes says:

    Independence is not about one party or one person it is about let me say it as the brexiteers would – its about taking back control, now what the brexiteers dont want, Scotland keeps it wealth for Scotland’s people and not for westminster to squander

  220. Ghillie says:

    Aye Rev Stu, bollocks indeed.

    Maybe it’s useful that the MSM are so easily distracted.

    Independence for Scotland is coming yet for a’ that 🙂

  221. Petra says:

    Thanks for that North chiel …….

    What goes around comes around and I can’t wait for it to happen to him …. Clegg …. the nasty wee beastie.


    @ Ron MacLean at 7:40pm ….. “Daily Record / Mail.”

    Very interesting Ron. Do you have a link for that?


    @ Marga at 8:28pm …

    Thanks for popping in Marga and outling what’s been going on in Catalonia. Let’s hope that your people manage to achieve independence in the very near future too X


    Hope you all have a great Burns Night folks X Thinking of Alex and Moira tonight and sending them all my best wishes XX Nicola and Peter too XX

  222. orri says:


    If someone deliberately derails a high profile case in order that the accused can never be exonerated can they be sued in turn for the reputational damage that might never be mended?

  223. Gfaetheblock says:

    Curious how the Salmond story was playing internationally, google ‘CBC salmond’ for a Canadian view.

  224. Cyber-Corroboree says:

    To use a well worn axiom, that incidentally made no sense: Brexit means Brexit.

    Similarly, Independence for Scotland, means Independence for Scotland.

    There is no mention of political parties, leaders, or prominent personalities.

    The idea transcends them all.

    It was the same idea in 1314, 1320, and 2014 it will be the same idea in 2614, and indeed in perpetuity.

    As one of Scotland’s greatest sons once said “The dream will never die”.

  225. Ron Maclean says:

    @ Petra 9.44pm

    Google [2018] HCJAC 32

  226. Ghillie says:

    Robert Peffers @ 6.10 pm

    Well said 🙂

  227. Giving Goose says:

    Remember Indyref and the proudscotbuts who personalised (or made a cowardly excuse) their No votes by saying “I don’t like that Salmond” or “I would vote for independence but I don’t like that Salmond.”

    Every cloud….

    Just saying…

  228. Stoker says:

    All of this Alex Salmond business isn’t aimed at us ‘Yessers’.

    They know they’ll never convert us to ‘No’. What it will do is have a very big impact on certain ‘soft No’ groups such as no-voting pensioners.

    It will also form a very effective subliminal message from the shelves upon which The Dirty Redcoats rag will be displayed.

    Remember, they’ve spent the last several years portraying Scottish independence as Alex Salmond’s baby, as his idea, that he’s responsible for all this “division” etc etc etc.

    Now, guilty or not, the damage has been done. They’ve painted him as a dirty little sex criminal and therefore, by association, independence as a very bad thing too.

    A lot of folk *will* buy into that way of thinking, that’s why they do it. They, the BritNat establishment, are extremely well organised, miles ahead of us *and* they work in a multi-pronged attack system.This is just one of their prongs.

    But no doubt there will still be so-called pro-indy folk out there who will help to aid & abet their BUM rags in one way or another. Then they wonder why we’re not independent.

    BTW, i’m extremely annoyed to say, there are still quite a few among us also who believe indy is almost in the bag. All i can say to that is try & get out more. It’s not what i’m seeing or experiencing outwith the internet & social media bubble.Please stop the complacency, it’s dangerous.


    Pete Barton wrote on 25 January, 2019 at 8:16 pm @euan0709 4:12pm:

    “Thank you for that informative and very relevant information.”

    Just like to reiterate those sentiments. Excellent post euan. Thank you!

  229. mike cassidy says:

    A link to what’s available of that Telegraph article about England leaving the UK.

    If only!

    “Why should the English, by far the largest proportion of people in the UK, be denied the Brexit they so clearly want?

    Yes, there are some who feel more British than English, for whom leaving the UK would be deeply hurtful. But they’re a dwindling minority….”

  230. mike cassidy says:

    Meant to add

    If Telegraph writers are claiming the British identity is going in England

    it will surely vanish from Scotland like breath on a window.

  231. Mogabee says:

    I’ve been arguing this very point last couple of days. Of course we know this to be true but many poor souls as yet are trying to pretend that this movement belongs just to one person.

    Those fools are shitting themselves.

  232. Robert Peffers says:

    @Ruby says: 25 January, 2019 at 8:55 pm:

    ” … If which seems to be the case they believe that bad news about Alex Salmond will damage the case for Independence you can understand why they might be tempted to conduct a smear campaign or worse.”

    My Gran, who brought us up would say when we bairns went greetin aboot the bigger bairns ca’in us nems or botherin us, “Ach! Weel! Gin thir getting at ye, thir leavin some ither puir biddy alane wha disna hae a Grannie tae rin tae.”

    So perhaps, while they are wasting their time trying to derail the indy movement by trying to take down Salmond the Indy movement will get on with finishing Alex’s life’s work and gaining independence.

    I have always been of the opinion that Alex, besides being a really caring person, is well able to look after himself. Furthermore, unless I’m proven wrong, I just don’t see him being guilty of such actions as he is accused of doing. He and his wife always seemed more than happy with each other.

  233. Simon Curran says:

    I think like many others I was shocked at the severity of the charges brought against Alex Salmond yesterday. However, whether he is guilty or not, the case for Scottish independence remains the same and will not go away.

  234. I will need to stay up all night to read these comments.Everyone right this is about Scotland,s independence,the personalities are just a small part of the picture.Robertson Blackford, Mhari Black.Joanna Cherry,Mike Russel, keeping those sleekit bastards in their place. When will the Unionist=(B.N.P/E.N.T. National Front/English League, U.K.I.P. Blue/Red Tories. imprison their corrupt bankers(Money tree)previous slave owners and lobbyists.When will Theresa May stop using the votes of sex pests to keep her in power,and keep hiding their offshore accounts,and their offshore havens for their papers.

  235. Just for the sake of argument, the case against Mr Salmond put you off supporting independence, cant think why it would, but suppose it did.

    Who would you vote for?

    Labour in Scotland?
    Tories in Scotland?

    Ha ha f**kin ha just wet myself sorry excuse me.

  236. K1 says:

    If part of the aim was to ‘reduce’ support for the SNP along the lines of ‘they’re ‘aw corrupt, this proves it’, then not voting for ‘any of above’ would be your only option. Perhaps that is an angle too.

  237. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    James Kelly, at ‘Scot Goes Pop!’ seems to be attracting a particularly ‘in your face’ category of yoon, btl.

    Good for JK – keeps them from polluting WOS.

  238. Giving Goose says:

    Being responsible for millions of dead in a famine never tarnished Churchill’s reputation.

    Thatcher is worshipped even after she ruined mining communities, rubbished Mandela and cozied up to nasty monsters like Pinochet.

  239. Mary miles says:

    Hi from Tassie

    To Robert Peffers and all other Scottish Independence supporters

    Don’t let the accusations against Alex Salmond dishearten you. I know I was born with such a great love for Scotland and wish for Independence which has been there all my life and is indeed part of my DNA. It is something which cannot be explained and will always be there. It is stronger than any dirty tricks put into the public arena by a rotting English establishment and the Anglo Scots who will not see what is best for Scotland and have always followed the path of lining their own pockets first. We see poison all around us and everywhere. Here in Australia Alex Salmond did indeed make the news after the happenings yesterday – funnily enough not much of anything else comes through to the ABC here as to what is going on with Scottish Independence but still I come into contact with those who understand the need for Scottish Independence. Whatever the story is about AS the man still echos the cause for freedom we carry in all our hearts and that is an issue apart from anything he may or may not have done in his private life. If he is guilty that is a matter for his conscience but does not distract from what he has done for Independence and which politician actually is free from guilt of some sort – certainly not the Tories in Westminster.

    It will come Robert if goodness and decency is left in this world, it will come. I hope it happens for us to see in our lifetime and it feels so close now!

    We must keep smiling, think of our ancesters and know that Independence is almost here. My heart is with you all in your fight to the end of my life and I have a feeling I will be over there dancing in the streets as freedom obtained very soon!

  240. ronnie anderson says:

    Aw FFS no anither Bridge West Dumbarton council objected to this now rectified by the Scottish SNP Gov , they’ll be asking questions in Holyrood over this new infrastructure

  241. geeo says:

    Liz g says:

    25 January, 2019 at 8:17 pm

    Ye can explain it To him.
    But ye can’t understand it For him!

    Nearly spat out my rather expensive malt whisky when reading that …!! Belter, bravo liz.

  242. yesindyref2 says:

    There was once a time, but old Time was then young,
    That brave Caledonia, the chief of her line,
    From some of your northern deities sprung,
    (Who knows not that brave Caledonia’s divine ?)
    From Tweed to the Orcades was her domain,
    To hunt, or to pasture, or do what she would :
    Her heav’nly relations there fixèd her reign,
    And pledg’d her their godheads to warrant it good.

    A lambkin in peace, but a lion in war,
    The pride of her kindred, the heroine grew :
    Her grandsire, old Odin, triumphantly swore,-
    ‘Whoe’er shall provoke thee, th’ encounter shall rue !’
    With tillage or pasture at times she would sport,;
    To feed her fair flocks by her green rustling corn
    But chiefly the woods were her fav’rite resort,
    Her darling amusement, the hounds and the horn.

    Long quiet she reigned; till thitherward steers
    A flight of bold eagles from Adria’s strand :
    Repeated, successive, for many long years,
    They darken’d the air, and they plunder’d the land :
    Their pounces were murder, and terror their cry,
    They’d conquer’d and ruin’d a world beside;
    She took to her hills, and her arrows let fly,
    The daring invaders, they fled or they died.

    The Cameleon-Savage disturb’d her repose,
    With tumult, disquiet, rebellion, and strife;
    Provok’d beyond bearing, at last she arose,
    And robb’d him at once of his hopes and his life :
    The Anglian lion, the terror of France,
    Oft prowling, ensanguin’d the Tweed’s silver flood;
    But, taught by the bright Caledonian lance,
    He learnèd to fear in his own native wood.

    The fell Harpy-raven took wing from the north,
    The scourge of the seas, and the dread of the shore;
    The wild Scandinavian boar issued forth
    To wanton in carnage and wallow in gore :
    O’er countries and kingdoms their fury prevail’d,
    No arts could appease them, no arms could repel;
    But brave Caledonia in vain they assail’d,
    As Largs well can witness, and Loncartie tell.

    Thus bold, independent, unconquer’d, and free,
    Her bright course of glory for ever shall run :
    For brave Caledonia immortal must be;
    I’ll prove it from Euclid as clear as the sun :
    Rectangle-triangle, the figure we’ll chuse :
    The upright is Chance, and old Time is the base;
    But brave Caledonia’s the hypothenuse;
    Then, ergo, she’ll match them, and match them always.

  243. Footsoldier says:

    stoker@10.10pm “there are still quite a few among us also who believe indy is almost in the bag”. Not too many converting to indy where I live.

    Nothing has been done since 2014 to promote the benefits of independence. All we hear about is the mechanism, where is the message? Where are the bill boards? where are the catch phrases? It’s dull and who wants to vote for dullness.

  244. JLT says:

    If the British State was to analyse Scotland over the last 24 hours, it must be sitting back at the moment with a certain amount of self-doubt and pondering with disquiet at what it has surveyed.

    Nothing has changed. If anything, the Indy Movement, rather than be broken-hearted with the lowering of heads at possible surrender, has instead quietly steeled itself and developed a more icy stare of determination.

    With what has happened in the last week; first with the current First Minister, and then with the ex-First Minister, the British State must be wondering what exactly it will take to break the nationalist spirit. Personally, the only thing left in their armoury is shutting down Holyrood.

    Possibly, Scotland has crossed a line …a moment in time …something that has happened since the inauguration of the Parliament in 1999. That something has changed. When was that moment? Was it through the rather ropey governance under Labour and the Lib-Dems? Was it the SNP taking power with a minority government in 2007? Was it the Referendum and the near moment of victory in 2014? Was it the stunning SNP win in 2015? But somewhere in those 20 years …we passed a point where ‘something changed’.

    As we all know, the Tories never wanted Scotland to have devolution. And if they had their moment, they would shut it down in the blink of an eye.


    Well, since the devastating defeat at the hands of the British-Americans in 1783 (after the declaration of independence in 1776), the British State learned that handing devolved power to administrations in other British-held territories, meant that one day, the territory would be lost. Devolution or semi-self-governance creates identity. It creates confidence. It creates resentment. The British-Americans didn’t want to be governed by a Parliament where they had no representation, let alone be taxed by it. The defeat by the British-Americans was a harsh lesson to the British State. The loss of the 13 Colonies was truly earth-shattering to the British State.

    Same with India. The British wanted the Indians to be ‘more English than Hindu’ after the Indian Massacre of 1857. To control them, they learned that they needed to look after the Indian elite (which they did not do with the British-American elites prior to 1776. The British-American elites were part of the vanguard in ridding British rule in the 13 colonies). By allowing the Indian princes to administer their own territories (under British guidance), they introduced British law, culture, language and government. All very well, but once again, it was devolution to an extent, and by the early 20th Century, India had discovered its national identity. They wanted independence. The British refused. But inevitably lost in the end.

    It was the same with various nations in Africa. All developed ‘identity’ after being given levels of self-governance.

    And here we are in Scotland in 2019. In those 20 years, Scotland’s national identity has never been stronger. The nation ripples with pride over its culture, newly built architecture, the future possibilities in energy, the riches from oil that could do so much.

    For the Tories, the age-old problem has returned. Losing the 13 Colonies was devastating. Losing India was devastating. Losing Africa was humiliation. Losing Hong Kong was truly the ‘end of Empire’. Scotland is next. And when Scotland breaks away …it’s all over. All that will be left is England, Wales, a rump part of Ireland, a rock in Spain and 2 rocks in the Southern Atlantic. That’s it.

    But back to the original question. Where did it change for Scotland? when was that moment? When was it that for the vast majority of Scottish people (including Soft-No’s) that they learned that no matter what Westminster did to Scotland, the Scottish nation wasn’t going to blink and go back into its shell. Instead, the nation seemingly now stares back unimpressed, glaring and unabashed.

    For me personally …it was 2015. The return of 56 SNP MP’s shattered the glass ceiling. It was not what the British State expected after 2014. It thought it had killed nationalism. Instead, for a year, nationalist-confidence rose like a phoenix from the ashes of 2014 and made the nation ponder about an alternative future when it sent 56 ‘nationalist’ Scots to Westminster at the GE in 2015.

    And now, in 2019, as the British State breaks itself in a trap of its own making with Brexit, it must terrify some in certain buildings in London, knowing that Scottish nationalism after taking two big hits in a week, has only resolved itself to dig in deeper, and that just possibly, Scotland is now lost …and therefore …so is the British State.

  245. Gavin Alexander says:


  246. TheItalianJob says:

    @JLT at 10.57pm

    Very good post and well described. I do think Scotland has reached it’s turning point in its rich history.

    Time to go back to being and Independent country again.

  247. Heart of Galloway says:

    Going to a public meeting tomorrow being held to support EU citizens in Dumfries and Galloway.
    Retaining these (mostly) young people is especially important for the south-west, given our demographics.
    Many of our smaller rural schools are under threat because, not to put too fine a point on it, the supply of children in drying up.
    In the pub the other night a union jack-ite was braying to the gallery about ‘all these immigrants coming in’.
    I said, ‘ok, what would you prefer – Polish weans or Spanish weans or Syrian weans keeping the school open or nae school?’
    He spluttered an incoherent response and turned away.
    The interchange did not go unnoticed. I would like to think it struck a wee blow for a welcoming, dynamic indy Scotland in the EU.
    It’s our ace card – and will trump the ‘our precious union’ any day of the week in the coming battle for hearts and minds.

  248. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @JLT (10.57) –

    Fuckin brilliant comment man. Love it.

    Please try to get to Glasgow on March 2nd, we’re having a pow-wow.


  249. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Maria et al –

    Hope you don’t mind me copying-in this comment. It was at the arse-end of the last thread but it’s a belter.

    Maria F says:
    25 January, 2019 at 2:34 pm
    Craig P says:
    25 January, 2019 at 12:10 pm
    “but for them to have generated it as some kind of secret service plot in 2013 – and then sat on it all this time?”

    Bigger walls have fallen, to be frank. So many questions remain unanswered regarding the first case:

    1. how and when did the complainants found out about the change in the Civil Service complaint procedure that would allow them to complain? Were they informed directly by the Civil Service?

    2. The previous court case indicates that Judith McKinnon had contact with the complainants. Was this contact BEFORE, AFTER they placed their complaints under the new procedure or both?

    3. Why didn’t these complainants came forward before?

    4. When did Evans and McKinnon find out about the complainants?

    5. ARe there any other links between Evans, McKinnon and the complainants?

    6. Why is it only now, at the cusp of the worse possible political moment for the English establishment in recent political history, at the time when the treaty of union, democracy and actually credibility and trust in the union are collapsing under the weight of the systematic abuse of power and abuse of Scotland by the UK government, these historical charges, 5 years old, come to light?

    7. How exactly 2 counts of harassment evolved into 14 charges of serious sexual offences? Do sexual offences now self multiply and transform spontaneously like poorly evolved virus do?

    8. Why did the civil service settled so quickly Salmond’s previous court case? What information were they trying to hide? Why is the public not allowed to see the email/letter exchanges between those 2 senior civil servants and the complainants BEFORE they placed the complaints to assess if this is indeed credible? We are being fed crap by the pro-union press and broadcasters and the waffle from labour, tories and libdem politicians. Those documents would provide an accurate perspective. The case is over, so why those documents have not been released?

    9. When and Who came up with the idea of the change in complaint procedure? Was it from Leslie Evans or from her UK civil service boss? What was the role of McKinnon in such change?

    “Do you not think that 2014 would have been a more effective time to bring Alex Salmond down, when he was FM and we were ba’ deep in an indy ref campaign?”

    No more effective because the arrogant and self-entitled establishment never for a second entertained the idea that they would lose that referendum. The role of the postal votes in that result is still unsettled.

    Now, considering that Mr Salmond is quite possibly the most hated and most watched man in British politics because he is outspoken, refuses to toe the line of the English establishment, is knowledgeable and resourceful and managed to dodge the ridiculous election system in Scotland specifically designed to keep the SNP out of power and it is indeed the man mostly responsible for where the support for independence is stubbornly today, ANY opportunity to bring his character down and ensure England continues sucking happily and for the forseeable future from Scotland’s revenues and assets would have been taken. This and the timing of it leads to question marks the size of the EVerest about the veracity, credibility and of course convenience of those accusations. Follow the money, they say. Who benefits the most from Mr Salmond being out of the game?

    “Use your common sense, people”
    And We indeed ARE, thank you. Nothing in this farce meets the threshold for rationality or common sense. This stinks at a desperate stitch up for political purposes.

    “I don’t know what actually happened between Alex and his accusers”
    Nor you or any of us here need to. That is none of our business.

    “but to see it as a UK government plot is laughable”
    I, on the other hand, consider it laughable and naive to see it as anything else, when during 5 years nobody knew about these cases, that incidentally, appear to have spontaneously multiplied in number and virulence since those 2 senior UK civil servants were caught with their hands in the kitty attempting to taint the system.

    Now, what is really laughable is that the smokescreen of Mr Salmond keeps growing and growing to cover up, what for me is a far more important matter:

    The fact that the UK civil service is unfit for purpose in Scotland and it is time, like it is in NI, it passes to be under the control of Holyrood because:

    1. it is unable to keep confidential information of a sensitive nature protected and has now breached the Data Protection Act by releasing/allowing to release confidential information to a pro-union rag
    2. it has breached its code of conduct with regards to political impartiality, allowing private information to be leaked for the purpose of tarnishing the political reputation of an individual for the benefit of British nationalism
    3. it has breached its own procedures by establishing contact with complainants during the investigation in a high profile case involving a politician.

    This is very serious because it completely portrays the civil service as totally corrupt, untrustworthy, unreliable and as being used to the UK gov of the day’s disposal just as another pathetic political tool. Yet, no investigation to this day has been announced. The public is expected to suck it all up. Well I refuse.

    Questions remain unanswered:

    1. who leaked that confidential, personal information from the guts of the civil service to a pro-union rag?
    2. who authorised the leak?
    3. Was the data controller from the Civil Service aware of the leak? When did they become aware?
    4. What about the data controller of the newspaper? When exactly did they become aware of the newspaper/newspaper reporter being in possession of illegitimately acquired personal, confidential information?
    5. Who authorised the use of that illegitimately acquired confidential information for the article?

    As I said before, with so many unanswered questions, the miraculous spontaneous multiplication of historical charges, the spontaneous growth and transformation of those charges from “harassment” into something far more politically toxic, the laughable inclusion of a historic charge of “breach of the peace”, the really dubious coincidences and politically convenient leaks of confidential information to pro-union rags that precede the release of the charges preparing the public in anticipation for the charges, considering this anything other than a political stitch up and active manipulation of public opinion is, quite frankly, hilarious.

  250. tom says:

    Our next vote will involve choosing between the words Yes and No.

    It will not be asking you which Party you would like to vote for,,,it will be asking you if you want Scotland to be an Independent Nation, Yes or No.

  251. Stephen McKenzie says:

    JLT @ 10:57

    Well said and much better than I could have typed up late on a Friday!

  252. tom says:

    C’mon Nicola,

    Five years is long enough for any man to be treading water.

  253. Dr Jim says:

    If one government cannot bind the hands of the next then five years is a political generation is it not

  254. Liz g says:

    Ian Brotherhood @ 11.30
    Thanks for copying that over I hadn’t seen it,and your right it really says it…

    Maria F… Brilliant take on what’s going on!
    A well argued case for why we need our own civil service,and not a second hand one from the country next door.
    Sloppy seconds isnay our style… We can do better!..
    The civil service workers on the ground need to be able to reach their full potential,to work for the Country they live in, and not be caught in the Westminster time warp.

    Scotland has moved on politically from Westminster,and their Civil Service model no longer fits.
    In fact nothing much about Westminster fits in Scotland anymore!!

  255. Karmanaut says:

    It’s been interesting to see the unionist media indulge in so many increasingly mad “wish fulfilment” pieces recently. We’re used to the regular “SNP honeymoon is over” articles, but lately it has seemed much more desperate. There’s a real sense of fear.

    I actually went and read the Record’s “Yes was just a personality cult, which is, thankfully, over because we got him” piece. Where do you start? Sadly, shamefully, it’s not surprising. Yet I still found the level of furious glee from the Press gobsmacking given the nature of the subject.

    It’s like as their puddle dries up, they find themselves wanking in increasingly concentrated vinegar.

  256. Cubby says:

    The low life’s at Reporting Scotland manage to repeat ad nauseam A Salmond this that ddddd de da on the weak pretence about Britnat politicians complaining about Salmond show on RT still being broadcast. Lost count of the number of times Moscow controlled Russian controlled was used. Out and out propaganda.

    Annie Wells the wee crawler says it’s inappropriate for RT to broadcast the show. The low life reporter doesn’t actually ask her why of course. That would be too difficult for the intellectually challenged Tory to explain. What an inappropriate person to be sitting in a Scottish parliament.

    The hospital is crap story as usual was then followed by a report that Burns cottage is falling apart as well. Everyone get the message -Scotland is crap. You wonder why the low life’s in Reporting Scotland don’t emigrate to their true love England.

    Anyone remember any story Reporting Scotland has ever run promoted by the Scotgov or SNP.

    Anyone still think they are not a British state propaganda broadcaster. Disgusting people on a disgusting programme. What a way to earn a living.

  257. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Craig Murray –

    Yes, I did read it, night before last, before all the AS-related drama. It made me feel sad, but today everyone seems very upbeat and united.


    Please, if you can, consider joining us in Glasgow on March 2nd. We’re having a ‘Rehearsal for Independence Day’ in Sammy Dows. Ronnie’s already booked the place and we’re bringing our own food, doing our own music etc, it’ll be a good one.

  258. Cubby says:

    Getfaetheblock try loooking at Craig Murray@11.58pm.

  259. yesindyref2 says:

    Ach I give up. I was being cheeky and trying to write the next 8 line stanza of that to bring us to the present but first I’m no poet, and even if I was, how can you match his use of words, and keep it upbeat and positive. I got 3 lines and they ain’t good.

  260. Cubby says:

    Being British is rapidly going out of fashion. What are the Britnat Scots, Irish and Welsh going to do when the English nationalists say sorry – Britain is no more – England means England. Pretty easy for them as British = English anyway but Britnat Scots Irish Welsh?

    Adapt and survive.

  261. Lenny Hartley says:

    Frankie Boyle on twitter
    Burns nicht we raise a wee libation
    Tae folk wha voted gainst being a nation
    Instead we bend in single file
    For a pack o sleekit paedophiles

  262. Iain Dawson says:

    Absolutely right! I have wanted Indy since the 80’s, when I got old enough to vote and realised that my vote meant SFA in GB! Hadn’t even heard of the SNP then, beyond the tartan Tories shite from older Labour voters! The democratic deficit was more than enough for me to want Scottish votes to have some meaning in my own country, everything I learned from then onwards has done nothing but reinforce that belief, especially the realisation of the deep betrayal we have repeatedly suffered from Labour! Now, more than ever, Independence is a necessity for Scotland!

  263. Shinty says:

    @ Lenny Hartley

    Love it.

    Never forget his quote after the 2014 vote.

  264. Petra says:

    Some really brilliant posts on here tonight .. and not being knocked out with the rocks, macs, danny’s etc. Great.

    As Robert Peffers says we are really pulling together now. UNITED WE STAND FOLKS. MORE SO THAN EVER. Stuff that in your pipe, Westminster / BritNat MSM.


    I see the Daily Rag in Scotland has been up before the Courts previously (thanks to Ron MacLean). New one on me. Clegg is from Ireland. Does anyone know if he is a member of the Orange Order?


    Fantastic post JLT (10:57pm) …

    However you say, ”With what has happened in the last week; first with the current First Minister, and then with the ex-First Minister, the British State must be wondering what exactly it will take to break the nationalist spirit. Personally, the only thing left in their armoury is shutting down Holyrood.”

    I don’t think that they are finished with us yet JLT. FAR from it, imo. We’re talking about the loss of their cash cow, relocating Trident (bombed off the UN top table) and finding somewhere else to dump their bl**dy rubbish. Add to that the Scottish BritNat elite’s concerns that the Scots may carry out some kind of French (revolution) attack on their ”holiday”estates, scupper hunting, and of course Queenie will be wondering where her family will be ”welcomed” in future. If in fact they’ll be acknowledged at all in Scotland. And then there’s the Brexit concerns of what on earth does England on it’s own-i-o have to trade? Arms? In light of the seriousness of the situation I think we’ll be hit with even more dirty tricks JLT, such as a wee bomb being dropped here and there with Westminster rushing to our rescue (we cannae dae it, even although the SAS constitutes 75% of Scots). And additionally finding a terrorist network from Wick to Dumfries would also help the Better Together cause led by Gillian McGregor. Why on earth would someone like her be relocated to Scotland?


    @ Craig Murray says at 11:58 pm … ”Ian did you not read this?. It tells you who knew what, when.”

    Back on here again, Craig? Your latest blog doesn’t actually tell anyone who knew what, when, imo, in particular Nicola Sturgeon unless you have a crystal ball (but that’s my vicinity and you have got it wrong). You should have stuck to the Civil Service data / facts, but no you couldn’t resist trying to bring Nicola Sturgeon down. Now where have I heard that before? Oh right from Unionists!


    And what a message from Mary miles from Tassie. …. ”We must keep smiling, think of our ancesters and know that Independence is almost here. My heart is with you all in your fight to the end of my life and I have a feeling I will be over there dancing in the streets as freedom obtained very soon!”

    Aw Mary thank you. Thank you. I hope you will join us when we are dancing in the streets because when we do it’ll be the best ever party in the history of the World. People like you have been a shining light, in times of darkness, for us all in Scotland X So once again thank you X

  265. Big Phil says:

    Craig Murray .
    Nae offence big chap but I dont trust you.
    You have a thing about the SNP, and I bet you wer thunpin wan aff when the AS story broke.
    If you are Mr know it all, then go after them arseholes in westminster that fecked ye off .
    Youre either for US or against us , and all yer nice words means bugger all,as above I dont trust ye… prove me wrang. 😉

  266. Cactus says:

    Independence Live radio is ALIVE!

    Here’s how they do it on America’s talk radio:

    Previously on Cairnstoon:

    Cairnstoon ’19 Saturday imminent…

  267. Liz g says:

    Petra @ 2.22am
    While your spot on with most thing’s
    I think you have Craig Murray all wrong.
    As I’m sure you will agree,we have to be most careful of the infiltration that surely has and is going on.
    But… I don’t think that Craig is a part of it..
    We ( the Yes Movment) are a very diverse church,and I think that Craig Murray is just one part of it!
    Yes (don’t ye jist love that word) he speaks out,so what?
    You,—- forgive me if I’m talkin out of turn— ,would, I think,be the first to agree that we are not a “cult” ??
    I like to be exposed to an other opinion,and believe me I don’t agree with him on many, many thing’s!
    But that’s only because we have different politics…
    I don’t think for a minute that his claim,to want an Independent Scotland is insincere.
    We are going to need different voices after the Yes vote is in,and while we have good reason to be cautious…
    We have to trust some …
    Don’t be forgettin, once we have Indy we can get rid (politically)of anyone who is not “actually” serving Scotland .
    Craig Murray, has, so far as I can see, not done anything but question…
    Let’s wait and see…Aye!!

  268. Liz g says:

    Big Phil @ 2.35
    Hey Phil…. How are ye my friend?
    As I was just saying tae oor Petra….
    Hang Fire wi Craig Murry..
    Come tae the night out ( it will be lovely to meet ye) and we can discuss it… And more….
    Do ye think he will make it??
    And how’s that daughter of yours?

  269. ScotsCanuck says:

    I totally agree with the Rev …. this stinks !! … not even the presumption of INNOCENCE until proven guilty in a Court of Law … now we have the confluence of Alex Salmond – Nicola Sturgeon & IndyRef2 …Independence is their objective (doh !) .. it reads like a second rate “B” 50’s “who done it” script … and it pains me to say it …. there are many Scots who will “buy it” … keep throwing shite and some will stick …. Clegg ? … a mercenary reptile.

  270. Cactus says:

    Regarding the article, already noted keyword tags could and should include:

    – Over-done-it
    – Over-played-it
    – Over-cooked-it

    Definition as in:

    “They appear to have overdone their tatties”
    “They appear to have overplayed their hand”
    “They appear to have overcooked their turkey”

    The UK is not a united kingdom.

    Cheers to ye’s y’all Craig and Liz xx.

  271. Liz g says:

    Hey Cactus
    Where you at?

  272. Cactus says:

    Mornin’ ma’am, ahm @ ten to six, how’s about and how’s you…

    Did ye get a wee listen to the GTAV talk radio linky abovey? 😉

    Think ah’ll go furra sauna-steam later with Olbas…


  273. Dr Jim says:

    Until I *know* different I’ll throw no mud at Nicola Sturgeon
    Because of her and her alone Scotland is on the world map, there’s no one she hasn’t spoken to and nowhere she hasn’t been to promote Scotland and Independence

    Anyone who thinks they can mind read the FM and come up with negativity is just making it up and projecting themselves rather than promoting the country

    No political leader can satisfy 100% of the people 100% of the time but Nicola Sturgeon knocks it out of the park in the high 90s she a star performer and we are on the verge of Independence and aware of our country like never before

    Alex Salmond was great he got us to the point of self belief Nicola Sturgeon has got us to the point where other countries now believe in Scotland

    No journalist, blogger or ex journalists or detractors will make me alter my opinion of the FM (try though they might) until or unless she does that herself and so far I see no signs of anything worth criticising given the lack of power she has as opposed to the imaginary power some people demand she should be wielding

    It’s really easy to talk big when you don’t have the responsibility of doing anything, the Labour party do it every day with their very own big mouths so we should be used to it and expect it from other sources as well

  274. Liz g says:

    Ah did have a wee listen
    Bit their too cheery fur me at this o’clock ..
    Ahm doing great cause the plumber actually turned up the day and fixed the lavvy pan.
    It wiz better than Christmas let me tell ya.
    How sad is that…
    But enjoy yer sauna… and think of me steam cleaning the bathroom….lol..
    I kid ye not

  275. Cactus says:

    Sounds good, guid luck wae yer bathing room renovations.

    Gimme Three Steps a playin’ on Independence Live radio NOW:

  276. chasanderson200 says:

    Re Craig Murray
    For the avoidance of any doubt, Craig turned up at our Wingers do at Woodside in Glenrothes last April and joined in with the general merriment and gave no indication whatsoever of any anti feelings re Nicola, Alex, SNP, or Independence in general. Personally I found him to be very personable, knowledgeable, sociable, having access to contacts not available to most of us, and pro-independence without any doubt whatsoever.

  277. Breeks says:

    Stop… press… Dumfries Gazette… February 1306…. breaking…. story…

    Leadership contender of Scottish Nationists accused of murder… Robert Bruce arrest warrant… Church suspends membership pending review… Resignations expected… surely twilight for the Honeymoon period for Independence movement…

    SNP unavailable for comment… Now over to Jackie Bird BBC Glasgow for the sport and the latest on Rangers…

    Opinion polls showing a huge swing towards the G… I… R…. the eh, “GIRFUY” party… (The who? Is that French or Gaelic??)

    England renews demands for Scotland to exit Auld European alliance with France….

    Pigeon shits on new Stirling Bridge spreading rumours King Robert has caught leprosy…

    Route for Under One Banner Rally at Bannockburn facing objections from Stirling District Castle.. Possible clash with English armed forces day planned for 1314…

    The problem with Scotland is its full of Scots…

    Ye Olde Worlde Bullshite eh? And they say history repeats…

  278. Cactus says:

    NOW playing…

    Excellent LS shout Independence Live radio:

    Freebirdy. 🙂

  279. Liz g says:

    Chasanderson200 @ 4.23
    Yes he did and I was chatting to him too…
    It was a really good night wasn’t it?
    You are correct, the guy came across as genuine and if I remember right..
    He was looking for some friendly faces because he had been getting a hard time over something he’d said…AGAIN…
    We really need to welcome everyone unless and until they demonstrate that we shouldn’t..
    I hope you are coming to the next night out (March 3rd, I saw you asking) and I hope Craig turns up too….

  280. Liz g says:

    Chasanderson …
    Oh fuck ( oops disnt quite cut it)… It might be march 2nd
    Don’t listen tae me… Check wi people who really know..
    Sorry.. Ahm too bathroom orientated right now

  281. Cactus says:

    Hey Liz, ye could fit one of these to the room achwhilst orientating:

    Would be good for listening to Independence Live radio:

    Broadcasting to Scotland and beyond 24/7.

  282. Cyber-Corroboree says:

    Listening to Indy live from sunny Brisbane in Australia at the mo. The song acknowledgement needs a wee bit of adjusting. Beethoven’s “moonlight’ in c minor is another classic you might consider. A steamy 32 deg. Just about to go for a bike ride to burn off some excess fat. Might stick this on my blue tooth earphones while I ride.

  283. chasanderson200 says:

    Liz g
    Buggeration, you had me worried for a moment there about the date of the swally because I had literally just booked my hotel for the night(with an extra day for recovery and a hair of the dog before travelling back to Fife on Monday)!!!

    Quick check carried out and panic over. See you there on the 2nd.

  284. Liz g says:

    Cactus @ 5.30
    Aw naw…. Much too posh fur me…Have ye even met me..
    The bathroom in this hoose is fur reading,in quiet
    contemplation and education…
    Cept … When ye hugg the pan in appreciation of the cool porcelain against yer cheek… and spew…
    Don’t tell me you’ve no been there?

  285. Liz g says:

    Chasanderson200 @ 5.53
    Your worried…. Your worried..
    Try livin in ma heid…. Then EVERYBODY should worry

    See ye there my friend. X

  286. chasanderson200 says:

    Liz g
    You are beginning to worry me. You still up steaming the lavvy that is). I am lucky enough to have a tame plumber who always cleans up. Sorted.

  287. chasanderson200 says:

    Ian Brotherhood,
    Is there anything I can do to help the night along, eg quiz, raffle tickets/prizes,food, name badges, etc. Or should I speak to Ronnie?

  288. Cactus says:

    Hehe, yeah ah find baths are good for contemplation and education too (avec candles)… showers work well with the mobile radio disco music.

    Aye indeed, the cool porcelain against yer cheeks works well ‘apres event’ (to begin with) and then followed next onto the cool ceramic or lino of a tiled bathroom or kitchen floor…

    Ahhh, the comfort of the cool.

  289. Liz g says:

    Chasanderson200 @ 6.23
    Aw you’re so nice…. Dinnay fash…
    The new pan just looked sae nice and clean I’m tryin tae make everything else match!!
    I live in hope!!!

  290. Liz g says:

    Cactus @ 6.32
    Aye … But ONLY cool people ken the comfort of the cool!

  291. Liz g says:

    Right …this conversation has gone right doon the pan..
    We are descending into toilet hummor…
    Jist because I’m so chuffed that I have a working toilet (yes it really matters) again,doesn’t mean we should get distracted from Indy…
    Before ye know it “concern trolls” will be askin personal questions…. I dread tae think where this will take the site.
    So I’m proposing that we never speak of my new,bright,shiny lavvy pan again…
    Anyone who is really interested can question me on the night oot!!
    By then I’ll know much more about the success( or not ) of said new pan!!!

  292. Iain says:

    The brittish state has truely kicked a sleeping tiger.

  293. orri says:

    The trouble with infiltrators to any cause, at least the good ones, is they’ll bide their time before moving the conversation in the direction they want.

    A good one wouldn’t brief against someone until an opportunity presented itself. A smart move would be to present it as a change of heart as that would say it’s OK for their audience to do the same.

    Never mind a known rebel being allowed freedom till the time is right to inject just the right dose of venom.

    The trouble is it’s hard to tell if your being cautious or paranoid.

  294. JLT says:

    @Ian Brotherhood

    Will try and do, mate (March 2nd). At the moment, I’m 3 months out from completing the degree. Literally no time in my life (forgotten what the wife looks like). At the moment, it’s working full time, doing a ton of overtime and then studying the minute I get home.

    Will go off-topic looking for location and time.

    Cheers again, mate!

  295. Nana says:

    Oh this is just incredible. Are you ready for this? We’ve been trawling Hansard for examples of hypocrisy by our Brexit overlords & found this. In the debate on Scottish/Welsh devolution, Iain Duncan Smith tabled a Commons amendment pushing the option of… A SECOND REFERENDUM

  296. Nana says:

    Today, EMA staff lowered the 28 EU flags and symbolically said goodbye to their London offices. Guido Rasi expressed his thanks to the UK for its contribution to the work of the Agency and for having been a gracious host of EMA since 1995.

    Mark Carney, governor of the Bank of England, says at #wef19 that the central bank has been preparing for a hard #Brexit with no transition. Follow latest #ReutersDavos here:

  297. Nana says:

    Ignored by US UK media, a new batch of leaked Institute for Statecraft documents raises yet further questions and concerns about the UK govt & Nato funded #IntegrityInitiative covert influence operation

    Trump ally Roger Stone arrested on seven charges in Mueller inquiry

  298. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    Yesterday, The European Medicines Agency staff lowered the 28 EU flags and symbolically said goodbye to their London offices.

    Today the fact that it happened at all hasn’t been reported in UK either on TV or in Newspapers.

    Propaganda by omission.

    It appears that “No Deal Brexit must happen and the UK Union must be maintained” is the order being followed by the UK Media.

  299. Brian Powell says:


    “Where have all the leaders gone? The non-leaders ignore the real leaders, such as we have in Scotland.

  300. Nana says:

    Tory donors (hedge fund managers, vulture capitalists are stepping away from funding the party because they’re too fed up by Theresa May. It’s like the last days of Rome.

    So not only does @theresa_may have a 0% corporation tax with the oil giants and also gives them millions back in tax rebate, now this…….

    Independence is no longer a nice idea, it’s a necessity

  301. Gfaetheblock says:

    Cubby, thanks for the steer to the link, but I can’t take Craig Murray seriously. His claim that he speaks for the collective consciousness of legal Edinburgh is ridiculous.

  302. robbo says:

    Lot of people mentioning 2nd march on here regards meet up – like where is that?

  303. Grendel says:

    Airdrie for Independence are delighted to announce that our next guest speaker will be Dublin based Scottish journalist Jason Michael McCann, writer for iScot magazine, host of the Random Public Journal blog and known to the social media political world as @Jeggit.

    Jason will be touring a number of Scottish Independence groups in the lead up to the Brexit deadline, and we are delighted that he will be stopping off in Airdrie to address us, where he will be calling on the Yes movement to create the environment where Scot’s demand their independence, and to encourage the SNP to seize the day and call Indyref2.

    The event will take place on Wednesday 30th January at 7pm prompt in the One Wellwynd Centre, Airdrie, ML6 0BN. Admission is free and unticketed. Arrive early to guarantee seating.

  304. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi robbo at 9:56 am.

    You asked,

    “Lot of people mentioning 2nd march on here regards meet up – like where is that?”

    It’s in the upstairs function room at Dow’s, Dundas Street, early evening onwards.

  305. yesindyref2 says:

    Ooft, that Pickard / Hughes thread: “In 1982 [Moran] became the first person in 300 years to be expelled from Lloyd’s of London for “discreditable conduct”

    Llloyd’s nearly fell, that and losses – very large claims – which the Names didn’t want to cover, the troughers having been content to feed off the fat they didn’t want to give up their homes as they were supposed to give unlimited cover. It’s never been the same since in my humble opinion.

  306. yesindyref2 says:

    “Oh, I may have been getting hundreds of thousands a year for doing absolutely nothing but why should I have to give up my mansions because of some silly oil tanker spillage or disaster. Woe is me, it’s SO unfair”.

    My cup of sympathy did not runneth over. It tainted the whole City.

  307. geeo says:

    In response to a labour supporting facebook page whining about tory media feeding us a brexit nobody voted for.

    Hi, I would just like to point out a few glaring contradictions in your post.

    Labour in Scotland and its media propoganda wing, The Daily Record, work actively AGAINST Scottish independence, despite tories slashing £3 BILLION from our Devolved Parliament budget since coming to power in 2010, despite a naked, non disguised power grab of returning powers in devolved areas from the EU, pushing legislation through WM by using the ‘rapists charter’.

    WM requires express permission (legislative consent) from Holyrood to pass legislation at WM affected by Scots Law, yet passed the Withdrawal Bill without Legislative Consent, instead passing an amendment stating that if Holyrood said Yes (LC) that means Yes, if Holyrood said NO, that meant YES, hence the name, rapists charter.

    Was there outrage from Labour in Scotland over this?

    Was there feck.

    The Daily Record, who laughingly call themselves ‘the people’s champion’ surely, were equally outraged huh ?

    Were they feck.

    Labour, their pet unions and the ‘scottish’ media, hate Scotland so much, they actively, complicitly, work AGAINST the best interests of Scotland and her people.

    Labour are an utter sham of a party, they are worse than the Tory Scum.

    At least you know what a tory gov will do to you if you are stupid enough to vote for them, yet it is STILL a more honest vote than voting labour.

    Only the SNP and The Scottish Greens have Scotland’s best interests at heart, a fact reflected by elections in Scotland.

    Pro indy majorities in the last 2 Holyrood elections, and 2 landslide WM election wins by the SNP in Scottish seats. (95% of seats and 60% for the latter).

    Unionists trying to spin an 11 seat absolute majority of SNP seats (double that for margin of victory over the tories in 2nd btw) by comparing the 2017 result to THE biggest multi party democracy victory in history is frankly, pathetic.

    The electoral reality is, Scotland has rejected unionist politics at both Holyrood and WM, we no longer get the UK Government we vote for and have not had a WM Gov we actually voted for since the 2005 General Election, nearly 14 YEARS ago.

    Yet, despite this glaring democratic deficit, labour in Scotland and the ‘scottish’ media, STILL refuse to support Independence for Scotland, and the absolute CERTAINTY of electing a government we not only voted for, but one which we can hold accountable.

    Can you imagine if England voted say, labour by huge majority, but the Tories were declared the government instead and the English voters were told to shut up and get on with it ?

    Well, that is the Scottish experience of WM elections over the last near 9 years, and all Tory election wins in the near 60 years previous to that.

    All actively backed by so called ‘scottish’ unionist parties and ALL the media bar ONE paper.

    And people wonder why we want independence, it’s not really a mystery, is it ?

    Independence is inevitable, despite the propogandists like The Daily Record and the WM apologists like british labour in Scotland.

    ‘Look out the windae, here comes Indy’ !!

  308. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @chasanderson & JLT –

    Thanks for the interest -please keep an eye on OT for details. We’ve a lot of prep to do so there’s plenty for folk to do if they want to help on the day, even just setting the place up etc.

    It’s gonny be a cracker!


  309. Cubby says:


    I’m not asking you to love him or to agree with all his comments just read the points of information you seem so keen to ignore to keep on script with the Britnat media. So I cannot take you seriously either.

  310. Petra says:

    @ Liz g says at 2:53 am …. ”Petra – While your spot on with most thing’s I think you have Craig Murray all wrong. As I’m sure you will agree, we have to be most careful of the infiltration that surely has and is going on. But… I don’t think that Craig is a part of it. We ( the Yes Movement) are a very diverse church, and I think that Craig Murray is just one part of it! Yes (don’t ye jist love that word) he speaks out, so what? You,—- forgive me if I’m talkin out of turn— ,would, I think,be the first to agree that we are not a “cult” ?? I like to be exposed to an other opinion,and believe me I don’t agree with him on many, many thing’s! But that’s only because we have different politics… I don’t think for a minute that his claim, to want an Independent Scotland is insincere. We are going to need different voices after the Yes vote is in,and while we have good reason to be cautious… We have to trust some … Don’t be forgettin, once we have Indy we can get rid (politically) of anyone who is not “actually” serving Scotland. Craig Murray, has, so far as I can see, not done anything but question… Let’s wait and see…Aye!!”


    Thanks for your honest response Liz, which I value. I don’t know if I’d call Craig Murray an ”infiltrator” at all. Maybe he’s just someone with a big ego, an axe to grind, craves attention, is a loose cannon, an angry man, daft, crazy or is out to prove something? I don’t know or care to attempt to establish what motivates him exactly, however when you get right down to the nitty-gritty he’s the BritNats BEST friend right now coming out with allegations that even they wouldn’t dare voice. Highlighting that he’s received leaked information about Civil Servants in Scotland … ”Secrets that are sealed and kept from the public are shared in whispers amongst the legal brotherhood” (in Edinburgh), which may lead to him giving evidence in Court.

    As far as Nicola Sturgeon is concerned we know that he’s had it in for her / the SNP since he was rejected by them, so is his latest ”contribution” just another case of him exacting revenge? Or something else? Now he’s aired his latest, libelous imo, opinion of her far and wide. That opinion when you clear away the dross is that Nicola Sturgeon was involved in the stitch-up of Alex Salmond, an extremely serious accusation to make, especially at this time, and this with absolutely NO evidence whatsoever to support it: Just speculation and his pseudo-psychological gobbledygook hypothesis. Now if that had been anyone else behaving like that we would have been all over them like a rash and ripped their article to shreds.

    You say Liz, ”Craig Murray, has, so far as I can see, not done anything but question” … ”he speaks out, so what?”

    Well I don’t see it that way Liz. He’s not done anything but ”question” at all. Rather he’s made an outrageous allegation against Scotland’s First Minister. What he’s said, when ”he speaks out” is an absolute disgrace, imo, besmirching Nicola Sturgeon’s reputation with the potential of impacting negatively on SNP / independence support. If he actually supports Independence, why would he want to do that? Be a liability to the cause? His site after all is the most popular in Scotland. More popular than Wings in fact and he uses that platform to undermine Nicola Sturgeon in the vilest of ways, in the lead up to IndyRef2. Additionally Nicola Sturgeon is not in a position to protect herself from his ”wild speculations” … accusations (or too bogged down right now to deal with it). And this from a man who’s complained bitterly about his treatment in the past. As far as I’m concerned she’s, Nicola, the person who’s at the forefront of getting us our Independence, she’s working her butt off for ME, and if I (we) can’t / won’t support and protect her from this kind of abuse who will?

    I’ve had great admiration for Craig as a whistleblower and in fact donated to his crowdfunder, because I can’t stand unfairness and injustice. His latest conjectures now have however left me wondering how much of what he writes, on all else, is actually valid. As I see it, in trying to discredit Nicola Sturgeon, he’s actually just undermined his own integrity and to my mind there is no place in an Independent Scotland for people in power who tend to bend over backwards to turn ”fiction” into ”facts”. We’ve had enough of that.

  311. Cubby says:


    An absolute stoater of a post. Of course if the bampot mike was still about he would say I was just praising myself. LOL. Happy to confirm the post is all Geeo’s.

    Talking about bampots thanks for your work in getting rid of some of the bampot Britnats that have plagued Wings recently.

  312. Cubby says:


    Very interesting post. It is always interesting to see different points of view. Better watch out mind someone may accuse you of paranoia.

  313. Tony O"neill says:

    Anyone willing to wager that the English establishment isn’t planning to shut down our Parliament, and reinstate direct London rule??. Why then the megabucks being thrown at fluffy’s new offices, 3000 new civil service jobs etc. Not to mention taking powers from us, this is their main brexit objective imo, remember that well used phrase taking back control?, aye of us.

  314. Petra says:

    Ha ha ha!

    As Marga from Catalonia would say, Cubby, ”Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean you’re wrong.”

  315. Bibbit Blair says:

    BBC & the British Nationalist MSM is now trying to get RT to pull ‘The Alex Salmond Show.’

    They’re afraid.

  316. Liz g says:

    Petra @ 3.43
    Och well I suppose time will tell
    I just believe in giving everyone a fair chance till they prove me wrong.
    As far as I can see there’s quite a lot of people trying to place themselves as the Alternate parties in Scotland after Indy and that’s the group I’d put Craig Murray in at this point in time.
    He also might be useful for the voter’s who don’t like Nicola.. Who knows…
    Anyhoo Petra I’ve only met the man once for 5 minutes so I’m only really speaking in general terms and I just posted to say that I’m not seeing what your seeing….
    Are you coming to the night out??
    It would be lovely to finally meet you!

  317. Petra says:

    Fair do’s Liz (can’t do a ”smiley” on this). We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

    The night out? No I’ll not make it, Liz. We’ll just have to continue to communicate as pen pals on here, lol.

  318. Liz g says:

    Petra @ 7.32
    Aw that’s a shame ye canny make it

    Pen pals on here it is then…..(smiley face thing)
    I canny do them either did one once but then promptly forgot how…LOL

  319. K1 says:

    colon : dash – right hand bracket )

    Now altogether no spaces 🙂

  320. Gfaetheblock says:

    Petra, 3.43, well said.

    Craig is so plugged in with insider info he exclusively revealed that Alex Salmond was arrest for compempt of court.

  321. Petra says:

    The word “conman” comes to mind, Gfaetheblock.

  322. Liz g says:

    K1 🙂

  323. Ghillie says:

    Petra @ 3.43 pm

    Thankyou for saying what you did because I really wanted to say somehing along those lines after reading CM’s article but my mum’s needs pull me away at times.

    I felt that Craig Murray’s article about the gossipiness of the legal fraternity and his, in my opinion, also gossipy and ill founded, opinion on Nicola Sturgeon left a bad taste.

    And I have learned to trust my instincts.

    You explained, very clearly, why you were unsettled by his words and I concur.

    I do feel from what I have witnessed over time that there is a desperation for attention, acknowledgment, being at times a bit of a loose cannon and a hint of revenge.

    Mr Murray’s conclusions seem to me to be subjective, not based on evidence or fact, and close to libelous. And even if that is his strongly held opinion then surely even he,in his quest for his unadulterated truth, would realise that his thoughts, accurate or not (I really think NOT!) are not at all helpful to the Independence Movement at this tense time.

    I think Craig Murray, especially given how widely read I hear he is, has to slow down and ask himself what purpose would airing these thoughts serve? Who do they benefit?

    On top of that, I do very strongly feel that Craig Murray is completely and utterly wrong and misguided in the conclusions he reached.

    Nicola Sturgeon has integrity. Her feelings on feminism would, I believe, based on how I have seen that woman conduct herself throughout her time as First Minister, NEVER cloud her judgement.

    I add to this that I hold Liz G in high regard (not just because she has a new lavy!) and having read many of her posts and having met Liz over supper after our Edinburgh march,I believe her to be of very sound opinion so respect her thoughts on Craig Murray too.

    I have a feeling that if I was ever privileged to meet Mr Murray I might caution him on the loose cannon bit and then thoroughly enjoy his company and expertise and experiences.

    But I was discomfited by his article. I think it was ill judged.

    As an ex-diplomat, surely Craig Murray should know better.

  324. Ghillie says:

    Ooooh. Wee correction to HOW I worded the above.

    The legal fraternity CAN be very gossipy!

    And need to be taken with a huge pinch of organic Waitrose pink Himalayan sea salt. (is there a sea in the Himalayas? No. Must be mined pink salt?)

    Any road,they are a daft bunch. And that is an informed opinion based on personal experience but entirely subjective and merely opinion.

  325. Breeks says:

    Ghillie I see where you’re coming from, but have a different perspective.

    Craig Murray has the proven capacity to be “cage rattler” of considerable potency and no little courage. He literally has the courage of his convictions, and a wee black book of connections and sources which forms quite an impressive wee matrix.

    He will speak out against torture and rendition because it’s torture and rendition FFS. He will challenge the bogus UK state narrative on the nerve of Russian Agents. He will expose the sham of the White Helmets in Syria He will condemn the Israelis for the treatment of Palestinians. He will accuse the Saudis of murder. Rhetorical question,…. would you?

    Don’t forget the London Calling video either. You could ask the loaded question what has the SNP actually done to challenge the BBC propaganda?

    I find it difficult to reconcile the paradox between taking a stand on principle, which has direct and profound ramifications upon his personal career, with the self promotion of an egotist. Yet, even if there was a degree of egotism involved, is it actually inappropriate egotism or might it instead be a necessary component of a whistle blowers character? It’s not an egotistical cry for attention, but the courage to stand as one against the horde, if that is what it takes. That’s brave in my book. I’d suffer a brave egotist any day of the week rather than a cowardly jobsworth toadymundell.

    But I think people are suspicious of whistle blowers, because no matter how vitally important the whistle needed to be blown, no matter how righteous and altruistic the action, there is a primal instinct in all of us which winces at the “heretic’ and fire starter. Nobody likes the clype, even when it’s imperative there is one.

    I know nothing of Craig’s history with the SNP, can’t comment, and frankly don’t care.

    Craig Murray is like a bottle of concentrated “conspiracy cordial”…. only the bravest would dare take a glug neat from the bottle, because they may not like it, but in measured amount diluted to taste, its powerful good medicine.

    I firmly believe Craig Murray has a good heart, and is a tremendous asset to our cause. I’m not suggesting open access all areas, nobody is, but maybe the SNP should roll with the criticism and be a little more discriminating in who it listens to and who it dismisses.

  326. Petra says:

    Oh surprise, surprise, Not!

  327. Tony O"neill says:

    Some people it would appear, don’t like ns and the snp leadership being criticised ever, and you wonder why the opposition call us cultists.

  328. Petra says:

    Criticised Yes. Lied about No.

  329. Ghillie says:

    Breeks, thanks for replying =)

    Hear you too and still trust my instincts that CM’s final comments were ill judged and personal and subjective.

    Interesting thoughts on his exposure of many wrongs in the world.

    And if I had chosen his career path into diplomacy followed by investigative journalism, then I would hope I would have the courage to expose evil where I found it as I do try to live this life that I live to the very best of my ability and with integrity and courage =)

  330. iainmore says:

    MI6 or whoever they are well they are all over this like flies on a long dead fish or a yoon media whores gash! They are getting more desperate to keep their oily ever grasping mitts round our necks.

  331. Tom Platt says:

    Please forgive me. I have only just encountered these masterful words:-
    “…Independence is bigger than one man, bigger than one woman, and bigger than the SNP. Nothing about these events will change our minds or our desire to fight on until the objective is achieved. If the braying, sneering, dying Scottish media is so foolish as to imagine otherwise, it’s in for a nasty shock.”
    I can just visualise Alex Salmond saying exactly the same thing himself.
    Has he already done so?

  332. Bill Hume. says:

    Is it just my computermachine (or it’s dumb operator) that has screwed up the dates and times of postings at the end of each comment?

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