Wings Over Scotland

Another belter Chris.

Doubtless the usual suspects BTL will be along directly to monster you for your temerity in criticising the performative emoting of the Hamas fluffers who expressed their disappointment in Rev Stu’s lack of commitment to “the cause” in his post yesterday.

Absolutely brilliant Chris.

Well Done Chris.

10,000 babies dead and counting while Westminster does want to upset the killers.

Overwhelming public support for Palestine but they couldn’t care less about the public.

500 needless deaths each week because they won’t pay what the medics highlight as fair pay

10,000,000 procedures on health waiting lists.

People pulling out their own teeth as they can’t get a dentist.

6,000,000 living in abject poverty in the U.K.

Innocent Post Office mangers criminalised and bankrupted waiting 25 years and counting to find justice.

Record levels of debt mortgage rates continuing to rise.

Rishi states that we have turned the corner?

Scotland needs to keep its people as far away as possible from the people in Westminster.

The last few months have been a graphic demonstration, in panoramic widescreen technicolor, that virtually every leader of every political party across the ‘West’ is completely servile. It is one thing to suspect but this has proven it.

The second demonstration is that the so called mainstream media are also completely servile.

I honestly suspect the SNP were quite happy to strut out like enraged peacocks but quietly happy it all amounted to nothing.

Isr@el is the ‘third rail’ in UK and UK politics because of the Isr@el Lobby. You touch it, you die. They bought the media and then they bought the political systems. And it is being demonstrated in the most clear way, right now.

I found this a helpful guide to what happened in Parliament. It seems Mr Speaker simply lost his head.

link to edwest.co.uk

I think it also says something that this ethnic cleansing and incremental genocide (that has been going on for decades and has only accelerated post Oct 7th) is of the descendants of the Holy Lands.

Let that sink in…

Ethnically cleansing the Holy Lands.

It does not get much more ‘Evil’ than that does it.

I must admit I am a bit confused with this cartoon. The art and workmanship is excellent, and the way it displays the level of unnecessary devastation caused by an overly violent and blood-thirsty Israel on Gaza is second to none.

But I do not quite catch the message behind it. I do not know if it was meant to be irony at the charade in Westminster and the fact due procedure would have made little difference to the situation in Gaza, or if it genuinely shows concern for the shocking lack of care displayed by the labour leader and speaker towards genocide and democracy itself. This confusion is obviously the result of my shortsightedness and lack of wit, not the author’s.

Parliamentary convention might not have made much difference to Gaza, but it would have made a big difference to the way Scotland is perceived to be treated in this union, what that parliament is perceived to be and who it is really working for.

Is it still the UK parliament or has it been transformed into a USA and Israel proxy? If the latter, and it is increasingly looking that way, what is the point in it to continue? Why are our representatives legitimising it to continue in its present, aberrant form by continue to sit there?

One wonders what the point of continuing this political union is when representatives of England in the so called UK parliament, and the leaders of England’s political parties are, as shown with their actions, far more concerned about not upsetting Israel than about not upsetting Scotland.

One wonders what the point for Scotland to continue participating in UK general elections is when in the so called UK parliament Israel is granted a bigger voice than Scotland.

What Starmer and Hoyle did was suppressing Scotland’s voice in the UK parliament in a disgusting and disrespectful manner. It was akin to impose absolute rule. So why are our MPs signing a motion of no confidence against Hoyle but not against Starmer and actually the entire parliament itself for allowing Starmer and Hoyle them get away with this abuse of the House?

Wasn’t Starmer the instigator of the change in procedure to suit his, and Israel’s needs at the expense of Scotland’s voice, democracy and due process? So, why is Starmer being allowed to hide like a coward behind Hoyle?

Why is the union still standing after this magnificent display of absolute rule involving the gagging of Scotland?

Why are our MPs turning a blind eye to this by simply seeking a vote of no confidence against Hoyle but not the end of the union after such blatant breach of the Claim of right?

Until when are our MPs going to force Scotland to continue enduring this level of abuse and humiliation?

Who are Scotland’s representatives representing and speaking for if they are not prepared to stand up and act for Scotland every time England’s representatives abuse the treaty of union to put the interests of England, USA or Israel before those of Scotland?

“Islamists are bullying Britain into submission’, says Suella Benjamin.
We have known this for a number of years. When muslims used knives and bombs on our streets and in our public buildings, we put guards around their mosques.
Not then, and not now, have there been any real intentions to curb the numbers pouring into our country, legally and illegally.
When we natives vote for a politician it is in the fond hope that they might do what they said in their election pamphlet.
Muslims are apparently prepared to use threats and violence to ensure that their elected politicians do as they are told.
Labour are now finding out that “who rides the tiger can never dismount”.

It is really hard to see how this stops.

No one in Isr@el is going to stop it. The general public strongly support it and even if Bibi went the next PM will be the same or worse.

No one in the US is going to stop it, Biden is not in charge and there is no accountability when you don’t know who is really pulling the strings. Both houses are completely controlled by the Israel Lobby. Pretty much same in the UK and EU.

Trump if he wins is nearly a year away from office and the world has changed since he was last in office. I am not sure he has. He could be a real disaster second time around. Bull in a china shop potential.

V@dP recently said something like he would prefer Biden to Trump as Trump was more ‘unpredictable’. By that I think he also means volatile.

Trump has got a massive ego, it is truly enormous, and I very much doubt that is going to help here, if he wins. And as Doug MacGregor says, Trump has good instincts but has a bad habit of surrounding himself with bad people (neocons). Trump appointed John Bolton remember…

Bottom line, it is bleak. There is no one in the West to stop it. All the real leaders have been eliminated from positions of power.

If a country can go insane then Isr@el has gone insane.

Where will it all end. In defeat. It is an absolute certainty. I see the break-up of NATO and the EU and maybe even the US itself and that is after the collapse of the state of Isr@el.

There is no one left to stop it, put the brakes on and reverse direction.

It is a runaway train and we are all on-board.

Mia. Perfectly explained and reasoned. Our (so called) reps are a complete waste of time and money. It’s time to move on from the rotten corpse of Westminster and Holyrood.

There comes a point when «fundamentalist» style preaching to the rocks and mountains becomes pointless and that one must first come to understand what they are and why they are there.
This is not compromise but the beginning of a wisdom that may possibly bring an end to repeat cycles of anguish and wailing.

For SNP folk watching the house of commons this week.
The labour and conservative parties worked together to keep the SNP motion away from the floor of the house and the Speakers did what he was telt.
Both UK parties support the killing in Gaza and they will not allow any sharp moves on this subject.
If the SNP ever held the balance of power in the HOC the Conservatives and Labour would work together to manage them. Any expectation of getting a referendum is “on to plumbs!”. It will never happen they will work together to stop it.

@Mia.

Israel of today is a manufactured State ? It sits exactly where it did in the days of David and Solomon before falling to conquest by the Assyrian Empire.

Does Scotland not exist in reality because of being assimilated into the UK for the past couple of hundred years .A lot of Scots feel it does

Mia

Well said.

As for the cartoon – it may have been seen as pointless in the grand scheme of things happening in Gaza but not here at home. The mother of all parliaments shit the bed lol

England has moved into full dictatorship where there is absolutely no point in electing anyone. Just pass & decline shit without the bother of any pesky consultation or vote.
648 ornaments can just watch on as just two eejits run the entire shit show. Labour & Tory now on the same page of just ushering stuff through without the need for anyone else being there.

That should anger & worry everyone but apparently not.

Mac

Ruskies probably prefer Biden cause he forgets what he did five minutes ago.
Trump has too big a mouth. He just doesn’t know when to shut up – as his defamation cases prove. He just keeps digging. £83 million instead of knowing when to put a sock in it..LOL POTUS isn’t in charge anyway. CIA is. They do as they’re telt or the push up the daisies. Don’t all presidents have to sign something on entering office?

Ellis objects to the use of ‘the great satan’ well who else causes death, destruction, famine, betrayal, corruption, pestilence, war, greed, gluttony, envy, covet their neighbours goods & have the brass neck to sing God Bless them..lol

OMG people have gone mad!

What on earth has happened the hysteria is even worse than when Diana died.

I’ve been commenting on topic on the previous. Silly me I should have followed the trend and come here to post off topic. Maybe I should try to improve my ego.

It’s all here Ellis with his ‘usual suspects’ and Mia dropping her article into the comments which are supposed to me about a cartoon.

Bob Mack

“It sits exactly where it did in the days of David and Solomon before falling to conquest by the Assyrian Empire.”

They fell to conquest. That doesn’t mean it was theirs forever because some voices in their head say it is. There were Arabs their too.

Ellis will be along in a minute to say they should’ve fought harder.

They were given a land. That wasn’t good enough. They now want to expand. That’s a pretty big deal everyone seems to sidestep.

Scotland never gave an inch of territory. The dunderheids in the SNP should be aware of that cause this is how shit happens. The more they take while Scots reps say nothing, the more they assume it’s theirs.

Ruby

Mia commented on the cartoon.

You have not..LOL

Geri
You being milk monitor now?

I’ll answer you comment about England on the previous thread where it will be more or less on topic.

Surely Chris is saying that all the hoo-ha in our media is about parliamentary convention and NOTHING is being done to help the Palestinians? That is not distasteful, imo.

Of course, the SNP members should leave Westminster. The only time this convention has been broken is when it is the SNP’s day for a motion. It hasn’t been done against any other party, ever, so Westminster is laughing at Scotland again, as they have done since 1707.

Sorry but I think this one is in very poor taste.

The fact this is annoying all the usual suspects just shows how on point it is.

The least scrutiny and the ghastly bullshit soufflé baked by RoS and his wee coterie of Russki fluffers and Hamas apologists collapses faster than Sturgeon’s credibility.

More of this please! 🙂

link to wingsoverscotland.com

Bob Mack

Many similarities between Scotland and Palestine

Balfour Declaration = Treaty of the Union
(Maybe that’s where Balfour got the idea from)

Expansion of Territory = 6,000 square miles of Scottish sea to England in 1999

What about the extra-regio or whatever it’s called.

link to wingsoverscotland.com

WTF are the usual suspects?

Wot no mention of the franchise to day?

You really do get your rocks off winding up people ‘Andy’ or is it ‘Andrew?’

Maybe it would be easier for you to make a list of the posters who aren’t ‘the usual suspects’

With regard to the mention of the Building Bridges with Israel lobby group in the previous thread and Jamie Greene being a member, he was a vocal supporter of the GRR. When looking into supporters in the Labour Party of trans woo woo what kept coming up was also membership of Labour Friends Of Israel and/or connections to Stonewall.

With regard to ownership of the media, during the Harvey Weinstein trial the Guardian ran a puff piece on his lawyer. On looking her up I found that she had contacted Mia Farrows son who is an investigative journalist and who had amassed evidence against Weinstein, and said that she was a woman looking for justice against him and that they should pool their resources. When he gave her his evidence she gave it all to Weinsteins defence and then announced that she was a member of same and when he said to her “you have given all of my evidence to his people” she replied “he is our people.”

Anyone familiar with Scotlands public sector and in particular the Arts will be aware that there is an over representation of his people there and that they are actively hostile to Scotland as a nation and people, see also the funding for the John Smith Institute.

Gaza is and always has been kept in squalor. The Egyptians who controlled it till the six day war did not allow Palestinians who lived there to enter Egypt. It was tightly controlled and kept in stasis. Subsequent to that the victorious Israelis did the same. The Israelis handed it to the Palestinian Authority in 2005 because of International pressure and since then both Israel and Egypt refuse to allow unsupervised travel across their border.

Why is nobody criticising Egypt?

To add to the chain of money and influence for the trans lobby, Google and/or employees of gave money to the editor of Pink News, Benjamin Cohen and to the pro trans Womens Equality Party ran by Sandi Toksvig.

Excellent cartoon, Chris. Says it all. A mob of over-privileged virtue-signallers worrying more about parliamentary conventions than about the on-going killings in Gaza. You do not have to take sides to understand the human suffering which has taken place on both sides. However, the wholesale slaughter has to stop. That is what all our politicians here and in the West should be concentrating on – and especially in the toothless UN.

Breeks says: 24 February, 2024 at 12:02 pm

Antoine Bisset
Ignored says:
24 February, 2024 at 9:34 am
“Islamists are bullying Britain into submission’, says Suella Benjamin.
We have known this for a number of years….

But it’s bullshit.

Agreed. Other than the pages of the Daily Mail, there is no evidence that all of these actions are being done by ‘Islamists’.

For example, the Rev published the previous article highlighting how Ross Greer was ‘bullying Britain into submission’. Is Greer an ‘Islamist’?

Off Topic: an interview with Sara Salyers of Salvo/Liberation will [should] be in the Sunday National tomorrow. I hope someone who can access the paper will share the article on here.

It will be very interesting to see what the journalist’s angle will be. Will it be open-minded and encouraging or will it be a hatchet job?

When I wrote a letter to the National just after Salvo’s launch sharing the good news, as I saw it, with other independence supporters, I got some very hostile responses e.g. those old laws are irrelevant; sorry you are wasting your time with such stuff [as the Claim of Right and the Acts and Treaty of Union].

Has the view of the “Yes” movement changed? I hope so.

@RoS 2.33pm

Doubtless Chris’ work lends itself to many different interpretations, including perhaps some he would disagree with himself, or not even thought of. Such is the life of an artist, and no doubt he can speak for himself. Perhaps he agrees with your take on things. Perhaps not.

I’m sure lots of people as you say have seen and sympathised with the plight of those in Gaza, just as they sympathised with those on the receiving end of the Al-Aqsa Flood, or Uncle Vlad’s Special Military Operation.

Two years to the day since Uncle Vlad started his 3 day war. Odd that none of the usual suspects are calling him out for being a genocidal maniac. Perhaps there are other reasons for that than just their fondness for Muscovite culture.

Given the choice between being in thrall to that or part of the neo-liberal Man”, I know where I’d rather be. Luckily for us it’s where the vast majority of ordinary folk who don’t share your deeply regressive worldview would prefer to be. Cope.

Ellis calls himself a neo liberal man???

Given the context I suppose he follows the ex-Trotskyites Irving Kristal and Donald Kagan who became the neo conservatives and then the neo liberals but always Zionist Imperialists.

Alternatively, with his head stuck in the 50s maybe neo liberal means something else to him, perhaps a free, open market, kind of thingy. Currently the market run by bankers, big pharma, military, media conglomerates and billionaires.
A bit presumptuous to claim ‘the majority of ordinary folk’ are with him in that case.

The end of the USSR is going to shock him when he hears about it.

Hey Andy, would you sit next to your daughter in the pub seeing as she sports the pronouns so is one of those fringe nutters pushing the woo woo with wedge issues you wouldn’t want to be associated with because they are so at odds with your own world views on how things should be.
Mind you, I recall you weren’t big for going out to public spaces seeing as there might be lots of unvaccinated folk knocking about. Still getting the boosters and pushing that woo woo are you?

Ach, maybe it’s time for everyone to get Strutter Bubbles so we can co-exist without the conflict.
3 min vid which contains muchos swearing, which you wouldn’t here from within the confines of your own Strutter Bubble… 😉

link to youtube.com

@Dan

Quand on parle du loup, on en voit la queue…..Covidiots gonna covidiot.

link to wingsoverscotland.com

What did you talk about in the ‘old days’?

You haven’t told me yet who the ‘non nutters’ are?

Are you referring to yourself, John Main & Chas?

Oh man you are a hoot!

Not one of CC’s best.

It’s not parliamentary convention that’s stopping Hamas crawling out of their holes with their hands up, bringing the hostages with them.

Sure, that would mean going down to defeat, imprisonment, and maybes the victor’s summary justice too, but it would also mean that the killing of the innocents would stop dead.

The only reason this solution is permanently off the table is because Hamas see the killing of the innocents as acceptable collateral damage.

As to why this solution is seldom or ever discussed on here, alert readers will draw their own conclusions.

Takes two to tango, and takes two to fight mercilessly for 4 months. Israel has made its intentions crystal clear, Hamas will be eliminated. Hamas, and some of the regular posters on here, really need to get their heads around this, whether or not they like it.

Whether or not it’s fair, or justice, or all the other nice ideas that need to be binned as irrelevant when the blood is flowing.

Oh, and BTW, it’s not genocide, and the constant lying about that only serves to muddy the waters about the most straightforwards process by which the killing can be stopped, and the humanitarian aid brought in.

John Main
Ignored
says:

Oh, and BTW, it’s not genocide, and the constant lying about that only serves to muddy the waters about the most straightforwards process by which the killing can be stopped, and the humanitarian aid brought in.

the most straightforwards process by which the killing can be stopped

I missed that could you possibly repost?

More people are seeing the light.

Poles won’t fight. They’d rather leave than be signed up as fodder despite what their leaders say.

What Andy doesn’t grasp is that our elected politicians go off script. Rather than them reflect the mood of entire nations & the population that elected them – they get it into their silly wee heads they’ll take advice from an unknown, unelected entity & start gobbing off on the world stage completely against what they were elected to do. 404 is a classic example – they were elected on a peace ticket LOL! SNP on an Indy ticket & so on..

So Andy, your views aren’t reflective of *the majority* There are leaders & there are followers & you are definitely a follower. What you despise about btl comments is we’re not as gullible as you are & you can’t handle it. As demonstrated by yer constant name calling, tantrums about moon howlers & nativists & elevating yerself as some sort of all seeing, all knowing mystic meg of what is happening in the world.

Keep reading yer BBC. Everything is going grand..

Surely its about time this murdering/regime changing anarchy causing terrorist group is proscribed.

“An ongoing inquiry has been confirming a BBC investigation which revealed that an “SAS squadron killed 54 people in suspicious circumstances on one six-month tour,” then falsified evidence to frame them as armed insurgents.

In February 2011, following the British special forces’ killing of eight unarmed Afghan civilians in a raid, one officer privately wrote to another, “whilst murder and the [SAS] have oft been regular bed-fellows, this is beginning to look bone!” His colleague replied: “I find it depressing that is [sic] has come to this…Ultimately a massive failure of leadership…and when the next Wikileaks occurs then we will be dragged down with them.”

Britain’s most senior military figures took part in a concerted attempt to suppress allegations that SAS troops committed war crimes in Afghanistan.

And a government minister who successfully campaigned to protect soldiers from prosecution believed some of the allegations were true.”

link to thegrayzone.com

“This is the remarkable evidence about a “culture of omerta” – a code of silence, originally attributed to the Italian mafia – within Britain’s Special Forces that emerged this week at an independent inquiry in London.

It is examining the conduct of elite SAS troops in Afghanistan between 2010 and 2013, including the killing of 33 people in eleven night raids in 2011.”

link to declassifieduk.org

OK Sarah

I’m out early to-morrow morning. I’ll be back mid morning when I’ll check for your post.

Ellis (who seems rather upset): “The recurring theme in here is of a coterie of nativists, anti-immigrant bigots, Kremlin loving vatniks and fluffers for Hamas if not outright anti-semites, whose sickening worldview has laid this place low in comparison with how it used to be in the old days.”

Okay, let’s go through all that and see where it leads.

On the last point, “how it used to be”, you don’t specify a date. My recollection is that the place used to be full of people who were stupidly and unquestioningly “with Nicola” and the SNP. I’d bet you were one of them. We all make mistakes, I suppose, but how far back do you want to go?

I’ve never to my knowledge expressed any support for Hamas or the Kremlin. The reason for that is that I don’t support them in any way. My general opinion is that we should keep our hypocritical noses out of the affairs of others — our military interventions have only ever made things worse.

The arguably genocidal attacks on the people of Palestine is a separate issue. I condemn it just as I condemned the decimation of Grozny. For me this is a principled position based on universalism (as enshrined in international law and human rights).

I am generally isolationist and think we should let people in other countries do what they want, except where they violate universal laws and rights and/or are attacking other states. Intervention and military action against other states should only be possible when it is authorised by the UN or a country is under immediate threat. That’s the rules.

And that makes me ultra-conservative since it’s how the international system of laws, the rules of conflict, and intervention are meant to work, with almost everything done through the UN. The wars, policies, and people you support are at odds with all that — they’re criminals — which means you are the radical and lawless nutcase here.

Calling me of all people in here “anti-immigrant” is diabolical. I really doubt if anyone on here is more pro-immigrant than me. Thanks for the laugh.

As for anti-semitism, that’s just a baseless slur. The only time I have referenced Jewish people on here was when I pointed out that some of the most scathing criticism of Israeli policies and Zionism that I have ever read has come from academics who are actually Jewish themselves — Finkelstein and Chomsky being obvious examples.

Where did your rant take us, then? Nowhere.

Hats 8:29

So you’ve never posted on here, in connection with the ongoing imperialist ethnic cleansing celebrating its 2-year anniversary today, that they “had it coming”?

My, my, how recollections differ, eh?

Maybes you should tell us how that’s a “principled position based on universalism”.

Or maybes you’re just taking your pro-immigrant enthusiasm to the next level.

Whatever, for 2 years now you’ve been full of shit.

Ready to add your condemnation of the October 7 attacks to your list of condemnations? Last time we discussed them, you were claiming they were exaggerated, or just made up propaganda for the diversion of the gullible and thick.

I’m not really a rugby fan, but I understand Duhan van der Merwe played a blinder at Murrayfield today in our defeat of the auld enemy.

Wait til he hears the usual suspects would disenfranchise him. 🙂

A wee reminder we are a small country of just over 5.4 million. Enthralled and captured by a political party that wasted every opportunity over the last 10 years to gain Independence. Sucking on the teat of Westminster Politics to secure short money. And the coming Speaker election standby, Pete Wishart or a House of Lords appointment standby,Ian Blackford. I rather liked the response of Kenny at an Alba meeting the other night. He was asked how would he vote in a vote of no confidence in the speaker of the HoC Hoyle. He replied he is not my Speaker.

Andy Ellis
Ignored
says:
24 February, 2024 at 9:02 pm

@Hatuey

I’m not upset, I’m having a whale of a time. Interesting to see the scales fall of more people’e eyes like Turabdin getting Ruby’s number on the other thread.

You are easily pleased Andy. How come you John Main & Chas didn’t managed to get the scales to fall off people’s eyes with regards to me? You certainly tried hard enough.

Do you think ‘Turabdin’s’ post is going to do the trick.

What exactly is ‘my number’? Is it a large number?

I’ve got your number? It’s quite a small number. Want to know what it is?

Weird that you are not able to specify what you mean by the ‘old days’

Are talking before or after 2014?

Were there zero nutters here in them good old days?

I’ve been here for ages I even remember Cameron Brodie who drove you completely nuts. I don’t think you have ever recovered from that experience.

Andy Ellis @ 9:16 pm

“at Murrayfield today”

The reality is van der Merwe is a South African national and played for South African schools team before playing professionally in France, England and Scotland. He apparently “qualified for Scotland by three years of residency”! That’s a new one on me.

Clearly the limited private school reservoir is no longer sufficient to maintain a half decent Scottish national rugby team hence players from other countries are having to be ‘bought in’ and somehow magically transformed into Scotsmen.

Some might say that’s not quite cricket but I appreciate you ‘civic nationalists’ seem to think you can manufacture the national identity of people even quicker than changing their gender.

@Alf Baird 9.41pm

Presumably 3 years is enough to qualify to play for the national team? Didn’t folk used to joke you get play for Ireland if you’d flown over it?

We civic nationalists would doubtless be happy that someone might want to come and live here, represent their new country of residence and make a positive contribution rather than reject them for being mud bloods and go out of our way to make sure they weren’t allowed a say in their country’s future.

Perhaps we’re just better people than nativists?

Lolz, guessed correct with that post catching moderation…

lol @ Alan

I don’t think I said anything that Scott Ritter would disagree with, so I have no idea what you’re talking about. However, I also have no idea what his views are on the decimation of Grozny, and I don’t really care, although I do agree with about 90% of what he says on other stuff.

Why do we always get bogged down in this sort of “good guy v bad guy” crap when we all know that Governments like people are never entirely one or the other? It’s beneath me even to spell this out but please grow up, Alan of Neilston.

The honest grown-up truth about YouKraine is that the country is divided, with some people wanting to align with the West and others wanting to align with you-know-who.

Western interference has done nothing to help the situation and resulted in untold destruction. Thats a recurring theme when it comes to our interventions. It has also backfired and made every country in Europe if not the world much less safe and secure, and caused huge economic problems.

There’s a serious conversation to be had with regards to issues of “spheres of influence” v “self determination” in the world. The west wants to deny the idea of “spheres of influence” has any relevance when it “baits the bear” and others, whilst at the same time demanding respect for its “spheres of influence” in the Americas and the Middle East. It is from the hypocrisy and lack of clarity on this specific issue that a lot of tension and conflict in the world derives.

Another big factor that is making everything worse is the substandard quality of Western politicians who are generally making total fucking idiots of themselves in the world right now. I suspect I’m preaching to the converted on that point in post-Sturgeon Scotland.

Anyway, I’m naturally inclined to be an anarchist, I don’t see why I am meant to assume any responsibility for the evil that States and governments do. All of them are wicked, to one extent or another, and that’s why I (unlike Ellis) support rules-based systems generally.

Now, time to get back to Call of Duty, where playing by the rules doesn’t spoil the war-fun.

@Dan 10:39pm
Scottish Independence is not a theoretical proposition. Influencing media? I am not on Tik Tok but I could be part of a steering group trying to save Grangemouth with not one politician on it. And there is the answer. Forget the MSM. Forget politicians. They are hopeless. Self Interest rules OK
Except it doesn’t. Holyrood is sleep walking towards a theoretical net zero desert. Depopulation of the Highlands followed by Depopulation of the central belt. The only people making a living are Holyrood politicians their Spads and their spin Doctors. Census? I have the cover up of The NRS but try posting that on any free media.

George Ferguson @ 11:23 pm

“Scottish Independence is not a theoretical proposition”

Of course it is, it has to have a theoretical basis:

link to salvo-cor.s3.eu-west-1.amazonaws.com

George Ferguson @ 10:18 pm

“You didn’t mention the numbers of International Rugby players who have a tenuous link to the motherland.”

I suppose that for enough money some people may be willing to change their national allegiance. The question is if this is a good basis for national loyalty. Personally A hae ma doubts.

Clearly the limited private school reservoir is no longer sufficient to maintain a half decent Scottish national rugby team…

Indeed…

2023 figures…

France : 4 “ringers”, or foreign born players in squads.
England : 5
Italy : 6
Wales : 7

Scotland : 21

link to ruck.co.uk

Maybe want to hand back that Calcutta Cup eh? Or maybe start playing in black and white as the Barbarians.

I witnessed how the “professional” game cocked its leg on the “amateur” Borders Teams who had kept Scotland, and I mean Scotland, relatively competitive for generations. Ok, ok, occasionally competitive. That’s not the point.

The last straw for me was PE teacher Frank Hadden embracing defeat before kick-off and putting out a “B” side to play the All Blacks in the Rugby World Cup. What disgraceful cowardice. I don’t believe any Borderer would have done that in a million years.

The wee Border toons had built a prestigious reputation for decades on achieving victories against all odds with the barest minimum of resources… Jed Forest, Selkirk, Kelso, Hawick, Gala, …. Langholm, Duns, Peebles, Melrose, Boswells…. skinny wee lads with wiry limbs half frozen in the sleet, but each with the heart of a tiger. How could it come to this? No defeat or humiliation, even losing the terraces to posh knobs in debentured seating had ever been as painful to endure as surrender against the All Blacks. What brought this disgrace down upon us? Oh aye, …professionalism.

What’s the point of it all when the sacrifices you’re prepared to make for “victories” include trashing your whole domestic network and generations of tradition? Reap what you sow, imbeciles.

Don’t misunderstand me, I don’t blame or seek to discredit any Van der Merwe. The man’s a prestigious athlete, and I enjoy the spectacle of Scotland winning at sport, but it’s just a spectacle, mere commercial entertainment, because greed and professionalism destroyed it’s capacity to be anything more.

Would I rather see a rag-tag hotchpotch of amateur Scottish players being fkd off the park by a team full of professionals and ringers? No…. Well yes actually. Because supposing there were decades passing between victories, and maybe there’d be zero chance of any Grand Slam, it would just be all the sweeter when it did happen, and so much greater credit upon Scotland and all those skinny wee warriors serving their Scottish apprenticeships in the horizontal pissing rain.

Nobody likes mercenaries.

Being Scottish either means something or it doesn’t. It’s not a thing you can casually throw off and on like a jacket. There’s a responsibility that goes along with ” … for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule.” It would seem the Scottish Rugby Team needs help to raise it’s hundred these days.

Oh, you can play mind tricks in your head; “they’re not ringers, it’s Scotland’s diaspora coming home to defend our Nation… Aye, whatever. But in ma hoose, I go with gut instinct, and Frank Hadden will always be to Scottish Rugby what Nicola Sturgeon is to Scottish Independence. These are not fondly remembered as the good times.

Good times? I remember once being lifted off my feet as a wave of euphoria swept the packed Murrayfield Terraces when poor old Dusty Hare missed his third penalty kick. What a time to be alive…. and Scottish.

So Scotland won the rugby today did they? Beat England too did they? Oh good, that’s nice.

Talking about parliamentary convention.

From 2018
‘The Knesset has no limitation which prevents it from legislating extra-territorially anywhere in the world,…’

link to mondoweiss.net

America agrees. So that’s ok then.

Sigh

I find it maddening and demeaning when the SRU appoints the likes of Field Marshal Ruth Davidson to its Board. Maybe she’s there to stop those pesky Scots stealing stuff. Giggle, giggle, chortle, chortle,… laughs in British.

I like to think the SRU is out of touch, but truth be known, I suspect it’s well connected with those it wants to be; and riddled with gatekeepers who couldn’t give a shit about Scottish rugby and nurturing home grown talent. Still, it’s not the means but the ends eh?

Maybe one day we’ll even beat the All Blacks if we stuff our team full of enough Kiwis and Springboks… and don’t put out the “B” team to meet them of course.

@Andy Ellis

“and simultaneously boast about Scotland being for the Scots,”

I haven’t seen such a thing on this site – maybe I’ve missed it.Evidence?

I do see quite a lot about the voting franchise being limited to Scots. Whether or not that might apply to “foreign” rugby players is unknowable. They may all have left, retired or died.

People are never, ever, anywhere 100% rational. That includes you. Your own hypocrisy is on view blaming others for inconsistency (and hypocrisy) when your own inconsistency is present in your post.

@ Andy Ellis

The situation is the same because the power of broadcasting is still reserved to London Rule, and the MSM “newspapers” are still owned by the same entities that are pro-Union.
Project Fear won the day because it could use elements of the wide franchise as levers to influence the vote outcome.
EG. EU citizens voting no. Most EU folk I knew from 10 years back have fucked off back to their mainland Europe homes as they had a get out card unlike Scots.
Immigration is a power reserved to London Rule too so Scotland has no way of controlling current immigration to ensure it is a positive and not a negative in the short and long term.
Why can a country not view its census data…
The Healthy Demographics article I linked to gives some indication into internal UK immigration. Also 200 newborn children in my area yet only 20 bairns with both parents Scottish kind of stands out as well.
I fully understand Scotland needs a degree of immigration, but we have no effective way to manage that at the moment and it is utterly naive to think UK state interests aren’t aware of this and it’s influencing what they are doing.

Polling may well be around 50 / 50 for Indy / Union but it’s controllable to a great extent, plus there isn’t a campaign on or even the democratic mechanism in place to actually deliver a vote on that matter.
And I don’t believe for a minute you actually think that all manner of influencing factors haven’t already been gamed out and will be initiated should the countdown to a date re-asking the question on whether Scotland should return to self-governance with all that would mean for The Kingdom of England.
The State protects itself, have you forgot what happened to Corbyn?
Closer to home have you forgotten what happened to Salmond and how the electorate can be so easily manipulated.

link to wingsoverscotland.com

Dan

Sorry to hear about your bust spring.

I can sympathise, sick of replacing springs myself, still growing out a black thumbnail from the knock I took a few months back when the compressors slipped. Could have been a lot worse I guess.

Looking on the bright side, I find the growth in potholes is matched by the deterioration in road and lane markings, so I no longer feel bad about weaving all over the road to avoid the holes. “In the wrong lane for turning left officer? I’m sorry, I couldn’t see any lane markings – they’ve all worn away”.

And dinna fash about the voodoo. I leave that to the “New Scots” (and yes, I know from first hand experience that’s a thing with some of them).

If England held an indyref do you think they’d give Ellis a vote?

No.

Because they impose restrictions on the franchise.

I don’t know why that thicko thinks Scotland *MUST plat the game differently & why he continually lies that Scots didn’t vote for independence the last time.

Also, London Calling gave a pretty damning view of the BBC, Better Together, the Yoons & the tricks they played. From running fake *no borders* bullshit to running hatchet jobs.

BTW, wasn’t that fake No Borders bullshit traced to I*_real donations & the Hot Cup of warm Cocoa eejit now in the Lords?

What do we gain from winning the Calcutta Cup?

What has this South African being doing for the last three years?

Do you actually get a work permit or whatever it is you need to live & work in the UK if you say you are coming to play rugby?

That seems a bit strange. Rugby players aren’t what you would call key workers.

This looks a bit like cheating on the part of ‘Scottish Rugby’

I bet they checked if he was a NO voter. Probably had that written into his contract.

Still what the hell it could be worse they could have imported him to play in the women’s team.

Scottish-South African???? Yeah OK Whatever!

Never mind all that what about the paedo from the ‘Robert Burns World Federation’ & the Cat Killer.

Vladimir Kara-Murza.

There’s an innarestin article about him on BBC Online right now.

So let’s admit the often repeated trope on here that everything the BBC publishes is lies.

Still, Mr Kara-Murza will likely be dead quite soon.

Our side is far from being perfect, and we even have some deaths and imprisonments of our own (Epstein, Assange, etc).

But we’re not yet at the point where everybody “awkward” winds up dead, locked up, or exiled (soon to be dead too).

Makes you think, eh? Makes me think that if parts of the world regard what’s going on as so important that anybody in the way must be topped, maybe it’s time for us in the west to start taking it all very seriously indeed.

Poland will be in trouble.

404 Refugees want to vote in Polish elections.
404 wants to merge with Poland in a union LMAO!
404 is corrupt & skint. Poland is richer.
404 wants Poland (who has invested in weapons) to hand them over.
404 wants this no borders pish – but obviously not with Ruskies. Just between them.
Poland is dead against it, bad history, but Polish government thinks it’s a brilliant idea.
Germany & France not so keen either but not publicly just yet.

I wonder who gave 404 this crazy notion of establishing a Union & just stealing the neighbours resources? Hmmm..
It’s a great gig eh? Just fck up the franchise & yer country isn’t your country anymore.

See how stupid it is? People are not stupid tho. It’s devious & isn’t in the slightest full of good intentions but for malicious intent.

@Dan 9.46am

The situation is the same because the power of broadcasting is still reserved to London Rule, and the MSM “newspapers” are still owned by the same entities that are pro-Union.
Project Fear won the day because it could use elements of the wide franchise as levers to influence the vote outcome. ,/b>

Conjuring the bogey of an all powerful MSM, and the British nationalist dark state, MI5 and the 77th Brigade are all just cop outs. there are no short cuts to indy, and in the final analysis nobody else is to blame if we can’t persuade a majority of Scots – all Scots – to support it.

“So let’s admit the often repeated trope on here that everything the BBC publishes is lies.”

By Jove, I think Genocide John is finally getting it !

Andy Ellis
Ignored
says:
25 February, 2024 at 10:21 am

@Sam 9.23am

Because you’ve not seen the evidence of it doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist Sam. I don’t know how long you’ve been posting or reading, but it can’t have been long if you aren’t aware of those arguing in here for the franchise to be restricted to various degrees, from full on blood and soil nativism insisting only those born here be enfranchised, to various shades of residency requirements ranging from 2 to 20 years.

It was a discussion that took place ages ago.

The discussion is over.

Different people had different ideas at the time.

The only person arguing was you. Maybe arguing isn’t the correct word maybe ‘dictating’ would be more appropriate.

Everyone else was just putting forward their ideas.

You hate ideas don’t you Andy?

You made me think of this story.

link to archive.is

60 years after the war ends, two soldiers emerge from the jungle

Ruby – I have looked everywhere on the National’s site today and cannot find the Sara Salyers interview. That is a great pity. I have emailed the person who alerted me to the interview happening to see if they know what has happened.

If we’re going to chuck them out as lacking in some kind of “ideological purity”, let’s at least wait until they’ve played their part in turning this backwards dump around, eh?

I didn’t think East Kilbride was that bad. Maybe John Main lives in a particularly bad part.

Not quite sure how a South African rugby player is going to help with that. Maybe time for John Main to take some action himself. Like joining ‘Neighbourhood Watch’ or it none exists forming one. He could even go out & pick up some litter. Nothing is going to happen if you just sit there 24/7 in front of your computer Johnny. The is probably out there as we speak doing burpees, squats, and lots of bending & stretching. You should do likewise every time you squat you could pick up some litter and put in your back pack.

Just out of interest why does a smart guy like you live in a ‘backwards dump’?

‘Scottish South African’ rugby player’

that’s very weird.

I think it would be more accurate to say

Scottish Rugby Team player who is South African.

What does being ‘South African’ mean? His name sounds Dutch.

Sarah

I did have a wee look myself but found nothing.
I did however come across this

link to archive.is

Why does ex-colony the Falkland Islands have rights Scotland doesn’t?

and this:

link to archive.is

Scottish Nationalists plot ‘rebellion’ in bizarre plan to see Scotland recognised internationally as a ‘colony’

The reaction from the BritNats would suggest this plan is a bloody good idea.

Johnlm, watch it and see what you think and whether you change your mind over anything you mentioned.

P.S I hope that DOTOTHY was a fat fingered misprint!

@Alf Baird 11.39am

You still haven’t made the case that Scotland is a colonised country though Alf. It certainly isn’t accepted as such by the UN. You asserting it and hiding behind quotes from writers on post colonial theory doesn’t render your assertions more factual.

The vast majority of Scotland’s population is Scots born. New Scots and their sons and daughters are no less Scottish just because they don’t speak Scots, which most native born Scots either don’t speak or have a very limited understanding of.

Most rational people will see your florid talk of our nation and people perishing as the hyperbolic nonsense it is. If we can’t persuade a majority of Scots to have the balls to put an X on a scrap of paper, we deserve whatever is coming to us.

As for me not seeing this asserting imminent death of our nation or people, or actually craving it, you couldn’t be more wrong. I don’t see it because I don’t believe its remotely true.

@Andy Ellis

“You still haven’t made the case that Scotland is a colonised country though Alf. It certainly isn’t accepted as such by the UN.”

Has anyone or group put a case to the UN that Scotland is colonised? If not what is the point of your claim?

Have you read the research by Iain MacKinnon of Coventry Uni into the internal colonisation of Scotland, done with the approval of England?

The research and other research identifies the long lasting effects of colonisation in Scotland (colonisation everywhere has long lasting consequences).

In Scotland, the effect includes the attempts to extinguish Gaelic culture as well as the Scottish cringe.

@sam

I don’t know if anyone has put the case to the UN that Scotland is a colony. Perhaps Alf and his mates should try? Generally to present things formally to international organisations like the UN you have to have standing to do so, so if you’re not an independent nation, another independent nation would have to do in on your behalf.

The point is I’m not the one asserting ad nauseam that Scotland is a colony or subject to imperialism. Take it up with Alf and those who pander to his fantastical worldview.

No, I haven’t read the research by MacKinnon you reference.

Is Scotland in charge of its own resources? No.
Is Scotland in charge of its own immigration? No.
Is Scotland in possession of a military & foreign policy? No.
Can Scotland hold a referendum to leave? No.
Can Scotland stop inwards migration? No.
Does Scotland have a parliament? No.

It’s not fcking rocket science we are a colony.

Dictionary:

1. A country or area under the full or partial political control of another country and occupied by settlers from that country.

You going to argue with a dictionary now, ya eejit.

An English friend of mine who has lived in France for 25+ years and has been a French citizen for 10+ years informs me that while he gets to vote in local elections etc he would be excluded (and always will be) in any constitutional type referendum such as the dodgy one that Scotland was ‘allowed’ in 2014. He has no problem with that. Just saying, like.

Maybe our resident expert should get in touch and inform my friend that this is an outrage, and those French nativists should be forced to allow any and all incomers a say in the future of France, even if they’re there temporarily, have just arrived or just own a holiday home there?

I agree with Ruby. The hysteria over the goings on in the Commons the other day is off the scale. I have to hand it to the SNP though, they have weaponised a terrible conflict in the middle east in order to orientate sympathy and focus on to themselves and terribly hard done to Scotland. Other parties played their supporting roles very well too, their focus equally on themselves and their motivations, venal. All deserve Oscar nominations.

Meanwhile the horror in Gaza continues and most of the population in the UK have zero interest in the goings on the HoC on the matter (yes really, the frothing about it in certain incestuous circles is not replicated outside those very small bubbles), and rightly so: what happened there was nothing to do with Gaza which people *do* actually care about. The cartoon is very apt.

As for the franchise..no reason it should be different from the UK.

15 years+

If people have lived here that long then they are obviously staying.

If they haven’t then there is absolutely no control over them being bussed in especially, a short let, & then piss off home once the vote is over.

Same with EU citizens. They have their own independent country to return to should they have a craven wish to start amending constitutions & Sovereignty. Nothing stopping them from starting on their own.

I dunno what kind of person you have to be to take part in another countries referendums. It’s not normal & is wide open to abuse. Hence why there are rules on residency.

“from full on blood and soil nativism insisting only those born here be enfranchised, to various shades of residency requirements ranging from 2 to 20 years”

Please explain exactly in what way any of those requirements you are poo pooing over depart from those of any other independent state in the world (that is not overtly or covertly subjugated to the UK, that is), when it comes to constitutional matters.

Please explain exactly how those requirements depart from those stipulated by the UK government itself during the EU referendum.

Please explain in what way those requirements depart from those of constitutional referendums for Gibraltar with regards to the Spanish people, that can vote in those referendums.

Please explain in what way those requirements depart from those of constitutional referendums for “Las Malvinas” with regards to the Argentinian people who can vote in those referendums.

You appear to be a fervent supporter of Israel and USA. Well then, please explain how any of the requirements above depart from the requirement in Israel or USA for somebody to become a citizen and being able to cast a vote in constitutional matters.

Let me help you:

In Israel:
“The right to vote in the Israeli elections is reserved for Israeli citizens who are 18 years or older and whose name is registered in the voters’ registry. People whose legal status at the time of the elections is only that of a permanent resident do not have the right to vote. Likewise, Israeli citizens staying abroad will not be able to vote, aside from the exceptional cases of civil servants and their families, who can vote in Israeli embassies and consulates abroad”
(From Decker, M (2022) “Who has the right to vote in the Israeli elections? (Legal Guide)”

In the case of USA:
Non-citizens, including permanent legal residents, cannot vote in federal, state, and most local elections.
U.S. citizens residing in U.S. territories cannot vote for president in the general election.
(From USA gov (2024), “Who can and cannot vote”)

You can leave out the example of the Quebec referendum. We all know it was as big a stitch up as it was Scotland’s indy referendum from 2014, both with an exceptionally open franchise designed to frustrate the right to self-determination of the natives.

To confirm this, both, in Scotland and Quebec, the pro-independence vote of the natives was frustrated by the vote from the incomers. You appear determined to force us to close our eyes to that rather crucial piece of evidence.

You have been told this many, many, many times in these threads by many different contributors. I distinctly remember writing about this several times now in response to your obstinate determination to dishing indiscriminate insults to others who hold a different opinion to yours.

All this, of course, while those with a different opinion to yours kept providing credible arguments and evidence to sustain their stance, whereas you, time and time again, simply refused, like now, to provide a single credible argument or supporting evidence to defend your position, other than resourcing to faux arrogance and appealing to emotional blackmailing through insults.

“In what way am I being inconsistent or hypocritical?”

Goodness, in what way you are not?
You are ignoring the default rule for constitutional referendums in the ENTIRE WORLD, including the UK itself, its dominions, even your beloved Israel and USA.

This can only be either because of your own ignorance or because you wish the Scottish natives to remain ignorant so their right to self-determination can continue to be frustrated. It is obvious this suit your particular needs, whatever those may be, rather than those of Scotland or the Scottish people.

I distinctly remember how in many occasions you have attempted to sell here that you are a pro-independence supporter. Yet, at the minimum hint that a franchise for indyref should follow the default guidelines of every independent state in the world, even UK dominions, you immediately throw the toys out of the pram and switch on the emotional blackmail mode, even on occasion going as far as claiming that you would stop supporting independence if the franchise changed.

That does not present you as a credible pro-independence supporter at all, and rather suggests you are not one but instead you have an agenda linked to the imposition of a demonstrably rigged franchise, which has now seen both Scotland’s and Quebec’s natives denied their right to self-determination despite a majority of them voting for independence.

You NEVER provide a sound or credible argument to support your stance. The only thing you do is to dish out blanket insults to either deflect from the real reasons you are so keen on the imposition of a knowingly rigged franchise, to deflect from the real reasons behind your unfair and self-serving demands to impose a knowingly rigged franchise on the Scottish people or to silence those who hold a diametrically opposite opinion to yours and who, by the way, and differently to you, have provided multiple times arguments and evidence to support their position.

By the way, only somebody rather slow and with rather poor peripheral vision and critical thinking skills could ever suggest that not knowing the actual demographic distribution of the population, in particular how high a proportion of the total population the non-natives represent, is irrelevant for something as constitutionally crucial as an independence referendum.

If somebody attempts to impose a rigged franchise while at the same time seeks to pull the wool over the natives’ eyes by hiding the importance of how the number of non-natives that rigged franchise would be inviting to vote could frustrate the native’s vote, it becomes obvious even to a child that they are pursuing a parallel agenda which does not include granting the natives their right to self-determination.

P.S.You have often complained about the length of my comments. If you find difficult to read this comment because it is too long for your attention span to keep up or for your grey cells to process in one go without going into melt down, just shout for help. I can divide it up in baby bite-sizes for you, so you can digest it a wee bit better.

So the English PM gave a speech condemning anti-Semitism, whilst a Tory MP Lee Anderson, clearly expressed his Islamophobia.

Sunak even had the chutzpah to say:

“Our democracy cannot and must not bend to the threat of violence and intimidation or fall into polarised camps who hate each other.”

The UK a democracy don’t make me laugh.

Oreillette La Vache Qui Rit?

She’s not looking too happy about being surrounded by riot police.

Mia

Excellent!

Chas

As ever missing the point entirely.

Scotland should be training & funding it’s own home grown talent. Starting with excellent sporting facilities you know, like the ones we built/funded for English.

How much tea & jam sales did those cost?

Norway , considered the most democratic country in the world,
only lets citizens vote in national elections,

Generally speaking, you will need to have had legal residency in Norway for at least seven years to be able to apply. You’ll also need to be at least partially fluent in the Norwegian language.

Blood and soil nativists ?

James

The big difference between ourselves and the French is that there is such a thing as French nationality. Because Scotland is just a colony there is no such thing as Scottish nationality. As a matter of fact it would appear that there isn’t even a Scottish ethnicity any more.

Anybody can be Scottish just in the same way as anybody can be a woman.

I’m not going along with any of it.

Duhan van der Merwe is South African and transwomen are men.

There is no such thing as Scottish South African, Scottish Asian, Scottish English, Scottish African.

All these folk for the most part who call themselves Scottish Asian, Scottish English etc are British and their ethnicity is Asian, English, Chinese, South African or whatever.

In the event of Scotland becoming independent they will be Scottish (probably) but their ethnicity will stay the same.

That’s fine I don’t have a problem with that but I do have a problem with folk trying to erase my sexuality and my ethnicity.

To say I don’t have a problem with that isn’t exactly accurate in that I don’t think multi-culturalism works. I think it was forced on people whether they liked it or not. Any peep out of them they would be branded racist just in the same way a people are being called bigots & transphobes. As a result people just pretend. Anything for a quiet life.

If the multi-culturalism worked you would not have our British Asian first minister and his mate the British Asian Labour leader greetin’ continually about racism and screaming WHITE! WHITE! WHITE!

They think they’ve got problems with identity try being a British Scottish Woman.