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Wings Over Scotland

The Edinburgh Cringe

Posted on August 01, 2014 by

From this interesting documentary last month on Al Jazeera.

This is how they think they’ll win. 49 days left to prove them wrong.

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  1. 01 08 14 19:11

    The Edinburgh Cringe | Scottish Independence News

173 to “The Edinburgh Cringe”

  1. Defo says:

    Apres Buckie ?

    This Gadgie is a guaranteed non-voter.

  2. WeeGingerDug says:

    Did he say we can’t have sheep?

    Sometimes No voters just make your jaw drop to the floor. Or maybe he meant that we can’t be sheep after independence. That’s more like it, but Dolly will be devastated.

  3. RosiePosie says:

    His OBE will be in the post.

  4. RosiePosie says:

    Sorry to tell you this, weegingerdug, but Dolly’s deid.

  5. Defo says:

    Dolly isnae deid, she’s ‘resting’.

  6. Rory says:

    omg, ffs, lol. I’d like to see all of that video, how our man reacted et al

  7. Rory says:

    perhaps that’s what his diet consists of,

  8. Red Squirrel says:

    Sheep for Naw? Just can’t keep track of all thae grassroots campaigns 🙂

  9. Graeme Menzies says:

    Bright fellow!

  10. msean says:

    Luckily,I think there are more than enough yes voters to swing this,why would you vote no or not at all if you aren’t a billionaire?

  11. heedtracker says:

    That display will make for one very happy and glorious £200k per year director of the Scotland region

  12. galamcennalath says:

    Sigh. I suppose every country has them.

    @Defo – I hope you are right. Someone has to be among the 20% plus who won’t vote! Let’s hope they are all potential No voters.

  13. Colin says:

    Yesterday was my birthday, congratulation on living this long Colin, why thank you, and my sister in law came round with a card for me.
    She is marries to a, let’s just say a very staunch Rangers fan, so I asked her if she would be voting Yes.

    She replied, “I’m voting no because Scotland already governs itself, and we need to keep the queen, and anyway I don’t like Nicola Sturgeon or Alex Salmond”
    Nothing I could say would change her mind or even get her to stop and think about it.
    Talk about brainwashed.

    There are still a lot of people out there that we still need to reach.

  14. muttley79 says:


    Who is that in your avatar? I am thinking it is a Hollywood actress?

  15. Dan Huil says:

    He’s not intelligent enough to make an X never mind find the right polling station.

  16. Heather says:


  17. kininvie says:

    That’s a good documentary – worth watching the whole thing.

  18. Rosa Alba Macdonald says:

    Whisky IS almost enough to survive on (as an industry, not as a diet, not even w. sheep and irn bru)

  19. Marcia says:

    Muttley 79

    It is Clara Bow the actress.

  20. James S says:

    He’s severely lacking his daily Irn Bru.

  21. Defo says:

    Re defacing posters. Two can play at that game. ‘No thanks’ is the answer to so much.

    Eton Old Boys say….
    WMD ….
    Vote with the BNP…
    NHS privatisation…
    ect ect

  22. muttley79 says:


    Cheers. I will have to google her as I have not heard of her before.

  23. Onwards says:

    It’s pretty sad seeing cringers like that.

    But it’s the result of years of brainwashing from the Daily Record and the like.

    And if he really thinks Scotland is so poor and useless, then surely the logical answer is to get shot of the union and govern ourselves.

  24. JimnArlene says:

    Scotch, mineral water and sheep. Eh, whit, sorry haven’t a clue what he was going on about, apparently neither did he.

  25. ronnie anderson says:

    Thats they Whisky drinking Wellie wearing Sheperds Fked

    nae sheep wow.

  26. Rookiescot says:

    Marcia says:

    1 August, 2014 at 5:33 pm

    Defacing posters is the latest tactic by the No camp.

    Odd that the colour of paint used is the same as a certain backbench MP uses to dye his eyebrows.

  27. Les Wilson says:

    He does not have the brain to cringe, he is just clueless.

  28. Who needs “Spitting Images” when people like him are walking about the land without supervision.

    They live in some kind of nether world where Reality is an Illusion.

    Cannae get Whisky, sheep, or Highland Spring water etc but Buckfast Rules?

    The average “NO” – depicted and duplicated in 20 seconds

    Who will stand shoulder to shoulder with this idiot – only BT

    And this – is not a negative view of Scotland ?

    THE ONLY way BT can win is by RIGGING the IndyREF.

    We must hope this Muppet has a major role, but don`t let him run whilst holding scissors. Fuck it, gie him an open razor to trim his nose-hair in a cobbles road race.

    What is worrying is – he is not alone – in Scotland. OMG.

  29. Dorothy Devine says:

    Dear God! If that had another neuron sparking it would be well on its way to a half wit.

  30. Hardin says:

    He’s probably not registered to vote.

  31. Mat says:

    Another nasty wee (not so wee) cringe piece from Tom Gallagher in the Scottish Review.

    Too wee, poor, stupid, vague, and, it seems, too ‘optimistic’.

    This is a new touchy-feeling Scotland. The country appears to be full of relentless optimists.” (That’s bad)

    For many young people, with education and self-improvement on their minds, Britain rather than Scotland offers a passport to the future. (That’s good)

    History, right down to the present, has shown that a lot of people embrace the nationalist cause because it offers private advantage like few other things in politics. This is due to the potential for manipulating the emotions of so many people and shutting down their critical faculties.” (That’s … you know what that is)

    The belief that politics can improve the condition of the country is touching, especially when considering the quality of elected representatives which Scotland currently enjoys.” (That’s me off to scrub away the stench of naivety)

  32. You`ve got to admit, his mammy keeps him nice.

    Would anyone like to bet that he is wearing a more accurate GPS ankle-tag than any Ballot Box in Scotland ?

    Bet his buddies are not WoS fans.

  33. Ken500 says:

    Half pished

  34. Ken500 says:

    Great bowls, gymnastics. Fantastic

    Alex Salmond at the diving

  35. bookie from hell says:

    maybe he meant haggis

  36. CyberNiall says:

    How the hell does New Zealand survive without Whisky?

    Does the old guy walking past say “Suuure!” when he says “I’m an independent Scottish person”?

  37. TYRAN says:

    @ Marcia 5:33 Letters page in last week’s Fife Free Press, man had his prominent Yes sign stolen in Kirkcaldy. Was secure. Not just some idol lout who decided to take it down.

  38. Murray McCallum says:

    That level of cringe must cause the subject a back ache, ringing in the ears, and a general feeling of dread at the world.

  39. Ken500 says:

    50 medals

    Scotland can do it.

  40. john king says:

    Ken500 says
    “Alex Salmond at the diving”


  41. McQueen says:

    Is that Joan La Moan`s husband??

  42. Norman Russell says:

    Dons fans are up in arms, Scotland not allowed sheep!?

  43. Rookiescot says:

    As for the guy in the video ….. I’m surprised he was not wearing his collarette.

  44. macart763m says:

    Oh f**king wow! 😀

    Not enough sheep? Did I hear that right?

  45. TD says:

    This guy is more of a problem than you would think. He is representative of a significant number of voters who, for whatever reason, believe the nonsense that has come from BT et al and this guy is just expressing their message in his own way.

    So what do we do about it? Simple messages, powerfully delivered. We send £800 for every man, woman and child every year to the UK. Trident costs us (just our share) £800 million per annum. We will pay for HS2 to the tune of £200 million per annum for the foreseeable future. Our NHS will be destroyed if we vote No.

    For guys like this we need to keep it simple. But remember – his vote is just as valuable as ours. Target him and his kind with the sort of simple message that even he should be able to understand.

  46. Morag says:

    Defacing posters is the latest tactic by the No camp.

    Note how the BT spokesman tries to turn the complaint about damage to Yes posters into an accusation that Yes people put bricks through windows?

    Oh yes there would be millions of No posters except everyone is too scared of getting a brick through their window. Number of Yes posters actually defaced – rather a lot. Number of No supporters’ windows actually broken – none at all.

  47. Harry McAye says:

    His triple pike was a let down, just missed a bronze!

  48. john king says:

    “His triple pike was a let down, just missed a bronze!”

    I would have paid to watch that. 🙂

  49. Harry McAye says:

    TD – The stat I have is that Trident costs Scotland £163M annually. Still a whopping amount that is good to drop into any indy conversation.

  50. handclapping says:

    @Harry McAye
    But his dont tell him pike was comedy gold

  51. Ken500 says:

    Scotland could save £1.5Billion on Defence a year, cutting from average £4Billion+ to Westminster a year (illegal wars/Trident) to £2.5Billion.

  52. Ken500 says:

    ‘Alex Salmond at the Diving’

    Split second coverage. Blink you missed it. ‘Good?’ old BBC3. At it.

  53. Ken500 says:

    Nicola gave out medals at the swimming

  54. TD says:

    Harry McAye

    Just checking where I got that figure of £800 million per annum from and in doing so came across the page on wings under the “New Readers Start Here” – “Nuclear Deterrence FAQ” section and the figure there is £403 million. Still not my £800 million figure, but I will continue looking and post again when I find the source.

    But you are right – whatever the number it is still a lot of dosh that we could find a better use for. Like maybe doing away with the need for food banks.

  55. heedtracker says:

    “TD – The stat I have is that Trident costs Scotland £163M annually. Still a whopping amount that is good to drop into any indy conversation. ”

    It puts Scotland, Glasgow on the nuclear strike target list, right at the top too and in ways that nowhere in Scandinavia, Ireland or even England has to contend with.

    Then there’s Trident 2 on the way at whole life costs well over a hundred billion quid, which could actually be spent on teachers to educate the guy in the video.

    Never ever forget the extraordinary pressure the people of Scotland are coming under to vote NO from the BBC and all other UKOK media. It’s inhuman, frantic and desperate but that guys frightened and he’s frightened because raw propaganda tells him so.

    But maybe he’ll grow a pair before it’s too late and Fatboy MacD’s project fear waddles off back to London D

  56. Appleby says:

    The guy’s probably not looked into it beyond what he was told at football matches and meetings. He’s been deliberately kept ignorant by UK Gov and its supporters as they don’t want a populace that thinks too much. It’s hard work but possible to show people their true options available so that they can make an informed choice.

    It’s very sad to see someone with a case of the Cringe so deeply engrained.

  57. Craig Ral Ton says:

    A NED says what?

  58. Juteman says:

    Give the guy a break. He is probably a top casual, and any excuse for a fight is ok. Since he was 14 year old, fellow casuals have let him know that UKOK. Right wing nutters have been infiltrating football for decades, and low information folk are their prime target.

  59. heedtracker says: sent him a three quarters of a million quid 8 page pamphlet that said he’s safe and secure in the yewkay. If it works, he had better have a good job and good health insurance.

  60. Murray McCallum says:

    The guy is talking about industry which is probably outside of his area of expertise. I suspect he is a former student of modern German History at Edinburgh Uni, if you know what I mean.

  61. David Wardrope says:

    I blame Anas ‘big rid bus’ Sarwar and Jim ‘soapbox’ Murphy, going round the country telling folks that if we vote yes then we’re walking away from sheep. Or even Mags Curran, telling us that after a yes vote all sheep will be foreigners.

  62. David Agnew says:

    I remember the Glaswegian equivalent claiming it would be shite to independent as we’d have to live off £10 giros.

    This really is as about as much as I can stand of seeing this pride of the UK talking so much pish. This’ll be my last post here on this. I will dip in and lurk but for the sake of sanity and my keyboard, I will be refraining from posting.

    My vote will do my talking for me.

    1 month to go…see you all on the other side

  63. Cyborg-nat says:

    “Then there’s Trident 2 on the way”
    Given the US reticence on UK nuclear power reported in various places does the secrecy about the recently signed US/UK defense agreement in Westminster not suggest that all may not be well with Trident 2?
    Has Dave been found short of facilities or readies to satisfy Uncle Sam?

  64. Grouse Beater says:

    Since this year the thrust has been pensioners: their pensions are in jeopardy, prescriptions will cost a great deal more, taxes and rents will increase, savings will be at risk, operations won’t be available to them, relatives living in England won’t get access stopped by border patrols, cost of heating will go up, and so on, and so forth.

    Pensioners, a large and growing proportion of society as their main target, Scotland for the Inane campaign hopes to scare the most anxious – as they see them – with wild exaggeration and lurid claims.

  65. heedtracker says:

    We stopped and soaked up the fear of NO treatment from Jim Murphy Goes Wild in the Scotland region tour. Main frightener from Murphy is NO currency union, ever, so demand a plan B from AlicSamin. Murphyisms involved repeating AlicSamin every 15 seconds and oddly enough, a vote no or else Guardian CIFer sounds just like Murphy soap boxing project fear but it’s all just happy coincidence, surely

  66. muttley79 says:


    Poor old Tom Gallagher keeps getting worse somehow. In every article he gets more and more abusive about Salmond in particular. I don’t know how he manages it, it really is an extraordinary achievement on his part. Gallagher seems to be jostling with Ian Smart, in terms of abusing independence supporting politicians and supporters.

    He has written a article called Great Scot! The Madness of Late-Stage Nationalism. Of course the nationalism he is referring to is the Scottish variety, to people like Tom Gallagher British nationalism does not exist. The article is extraordinarily one sided and biased.

  67. Ghengis D'Midgies says:

    He is a sad case. Decades of anti Scottish independence propaganda and that is the result. Seemed a bit drunk which gave him the bravery to speak his brains. They should have asked him how many sheep he has and if none, how on earth does he survive without aforesaid relatively wise counsel 🙂

  68. G H Graham says:

    “Flipper” has wet dreams about these type of people.

    Oh, to be so proud of a people you have successfully convinced that they are shite at everything.

    Cult leaders around the world will swarm into Scotland on Sep 19th if its a NO wondering how they too, despite all the obvious evidence to the contrary, can convince their own flock to follow a bat shit, mental sociopath.

  69. heedtracker says:

    Scots pensioners to be, are going to have to work far longer for far less and they just lost even more money from their pension pot and all care of a Westminster who let’s face it, cant afford pensions now, or the NHS or student fees but they can afford WMD’s though.

  70. Andy-B says:

    The poor man’s had a wee drink and its upset his only brain cell, as for the sheep quote that was a baaaaaaaaaa!d idea.

  71. Ken500 says:

    9% of pensioners in Scotland are already working longer. In the rest of the UK 6%

    Gov pensions in Scotland (paid for by Scottish taxpayers) £6Billion in the rest of the UK £68Billion. (Pro rata) Scotland has a lower pension liability.

    Pensioners in Scotland have lost £30million a year because of ConDem Westminster benefits cuts/changes.

  72. BigRik says:

    A sad case of what happens when you start waving the Union flag on a saturday… it’s a slippery slope from there to hating your own country.

  73. Dan Huil says:

    OT Ladbrokes a few weeks ago offered 10-1 for over 55% Yes vote. Last week it was 8-1. Today 7-1.

  74. McHaggis says:

    Do union supporting blogs and sites have similar videos of ‘yes’ voting neanderthals?

    Just wondering, given I only ever seem to see ‘no’ voting knuckle draggers with IQ’s in the low-40’s (moderate mental retardation) in these kinds of clips.

  75. TD says:

    Harry McAye
    I have tracked down where I got the £800 million figure from. I had oversimplified it. The figure came from an item on the Business For Scotland website – you can access it from the Wings “New Readers Start Here” pages. Essentially, Scotland is currently charged £3.3 billion for our share of defence including Trident. The Scottish Government intends to spend £2.5 billion on defence, and of course we will not be paying for Trident. The United Services Institute estimates that £1.8 billion is the sort of figure Scotland should be spending so we would still be ahead of that.
    So I stand corrected – the £800 million is not all down to Trident, but is the total saving on defence proposed by the Scottish Government. I think the point is still valid though and perhaps the simple message to relay to No voters would be that we would save £800 million per annum, we would still be well defended and all of our expenditure would be spent in Scotland.

  76. Jock McDonnell says:

    Yup, a terrible indictment of the performance of the union.

  77. Matt Seattle says:

    Watched the whole programme – the host does include some No-hopers for balance, but Yes comes over very very well, the Glesca somosa party was especially good (despite A Sarwar).

  78. Matt Seattle says:

    And MUCH better than the BBC!

  79. Truth says:

    I really think some people would be ground shakingly shocked if they actually understood how the world works and how Scotland fits into that.

    They literally don’t have a clue.

    It’s such a sad, hopeless, barren world they inhabit.

    The even sadder that it doesn’t have to be like that. Vote Yes!

  80. Betty Boop says:

    @ Matt Seattle, 8:46pm

    I watched the entire programme too and I agree, it isn’t too bad despite some glaring inaccuracies especially about currency.

    Strangely, I thought George Robertson at the end made a great case for Yes because he showed he is not the least concerned about the interests of the people of Scotland, just world domination really.

    The man in the short excerpt above is no worse than many who try to give an impression of intelligence whilst not having an original thought in their heads – Jim Murphy had a few of them wandering about his soapbox the other day when his “holiday tour” hit town. No details/evidence, oblivious to history and current conditions, happy that Westminster knows what’s best for them, they just know that we’re “better together”.

  81. Quentin Quale says:

    Does the sense of superiority of Murphy and a host of others in the BT team maybe stem from the fact that the chap in the video is how they perceive the majority of Scots? Are they in for a rude awakening next month.

  82. james says:

    I am on Skye and have been putting up YES posters on the local bus shelter in our wee village, they are removed on a daily basis leaving me to tidy up the bits of tape etc before putting up fresh posters. Today I met a previous NO voter who was so pissed of with the poster removal they are VOTING YES.

  83. Grahame says:

    OT but if anyone is needing yes car stickers and window posters in Edinburgh you have 2 options at present to pick them up easily : – yes store on Easter Road or

    Blackhall Framing Gallery, 18 Hillhouse road, EH4 2AG

  84. Appleby says:

    I notice the Scotsman article on Ian’s blunder isn’t allowing comments. Hmmmm. Just imagine Rev Stu or someone else on Yes side had done this instead. It’d be headline news for the week and lots of comments.

  85. John H. says:

    A friend of mine who doesn’t get the full pension said that she would vote no in the referendum because Cameron is putting pensions up to £140 for everyone.I decided to check this out myself and it seems to apply only to those retiring from 2016.

    So she’ll now have to find another excuse for voting no.She said that she doesn’t like Alex Salmond either.

  86. John H. says:

    Sorry.Last post was off topic.

  87. Alex Wright says:

    His names Paul. He used to be a regular in a pub I sometimes frequent, until he was chased out for doing what he done on that clip, opening his mouth without thinking. Calling him a numptie would be a compliment.

  88. pete says:

    Just another ignorant fuck wit , But to be fare the people have been brain washed in thinking we are underachievers, that we don’t have a clue how to survive without ENGLAND what a fucking situation for a once proud Nation to be in !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  89. crazycat says:

    @ John H

    It’s also the case that a future Westminster government could put the pensions back down again, or introduce various conditions – they are already messing with the retirement age and the number of years of national insurance contributions required for the full entitlement (for instance, I thought I’d paid enough at the time I took early retirement; now it turns out I haven’t).

  90. Morag says:

    I had enough contributions, but fortunately hadn’t actually retired when they increased the requirement. Now I have to work till the end of 2016 to have enough. So I get to contribute as a taxpaying worker in a fully independent Scotland, I hope.

    And they won’t give me my state pension till November 2018, although when I began work I was expecting it in November 2013.

  91. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Jim “Friend of Israel” Murphy got ambushed in Greenock today and then came to Dunoon looking for a crowd to talk to. He ended up following folk up the high street trying to get a conversation. I wonder if we will see any of this

  92. Marcia says:

    I had lunch with a few fellow pensioners today and 2 who were very undecided are now voting Yes. So all of us now voting Yes. On the way to the lunch a former colleague who is still in the Labour party told me he was voting yes but asked me not to tell anyone!

  93. heedtracker says:

    Libby Carrell bites yer bum. It’s been a great week for Scotland in so many wonderful ways and all wet farts like the Graun is 14 point behind and when did we last hear that?

    Plus my Slovene girlfriend’s Aliesbadas is very angry too. Can’t think why.

  94. Albert Herring says:

    “Alex Salmond at the diving”

    Didnae ken he played fitba.

  95. Harry McAye says:

    TD – Cheers. I’m not sure where I got my £163m now. I’ve been making notes in my book since last autumn and I think I must have got that stat from either Wings or Business for Scotland. It came with what that amount could be alternatively used towards – “training 3880 nurses OR training 4527 teachers OR building 13-20 Primary schools (and it’s £250m if we include Trident Replacement Cost)”

  96. joe kane says:

    This is another example of the gloriously twisted mindset of someone colonised by the Westminster-Whitehall-Oxbridge-City of London elite.

    Native subjects of British imperial rule have expressed such sentiments throughout its whole history sounding like addicts whose supply is in danger of drying up. It’s got nothing to do with the material facts of their existence but on their deliberately cultivated psychological dependency which reduces adults to a state normally associated with children and babies.

    It’s not for nothing the wonderful Irvine Welsh was not just Scottish but from a European capital city that was ruled over by the elite belonging to another European capital city.

  97. heedtracker says: only professor of politics in Scotland region still pushing UKOK’s it’s only AlicSamin that wants democracy for the nation state of Scotland so vote no.if only Prof’s like this Prof knew how completely ridiculous their rule Britannia rules the annoying and expensive region of Scotland Has become. I prefer Prof Tomkins at Glasgow. At least he goes to a barber now and again and unlike prof Curtice, he’s happy to admit that he was completely wrong at last Holyrood GE.

    There’s only AlicSamin out there In Yes Scotland, so vote no says Prof Curtice.

    Prof Curtice said: “Unless Mr Salmond can begin to turn those numbers around, it looks as though Scotland will opt to stay in the Union, albeit perhaps by a margin that some unionists may find rather less than comfortable.

  98. TD says:

    Harry McAye

    Yes, there are so many worthy things we could spend our money on other than Trident. Defence expenditure is a necessary evil but I suppose we will always have to incur it.

    But one point that is often overlooked when it comes to discussions of expenditure is WHERE the money will be spent. If we spend say £1 billion on defence or anything else by sending it to Westminster and then supposedly receiving the “benefit” of that expenditure, that is one thing. If we spend the same amount of money by employing people in Scotland to provide the “benefit” – whatever that might be – then the impact on the Scottish economy is very significant.

    This applies to expenditure and the resultant jobs in Taxation, Defence, Civil Service and every other public service where we currently pay towards the creation of jobs in some other part of the UK. Even if we spend the same amount of money, if it is spent in Scotland the economic impact will be huge.

    I’m not sure if any economists have quantified this positive effect for Scotland – if anyone knows of any research or publications addressing this point I would be interested to know about it.

  99. Scott Minto (Aka Sneekyboy) says:

    There are several stats for trident.

    1) Scotland’s annual maintenance of the current generation of subs and missiles £163m for the 10 years the system has left to run

    2) Scotland’s replacement costs for Trident 2 – about another £200m a year for over a decade during development & build of Trident replacement

    (Making Annual Trident costs that £363ish million a year for over a decade if we stay in UK)

    3) But the £800m saving is based on the £3.3bn we spend now (including Trident – but not the Trident 2 costs)compared to the £2.5bn budget proposed post Indy (£800m saving)

    (Making annual defence spending £1bn cheaper a year for over a decade in independent Scotland! as savings + Trident 2 not being built)

    Hope this helps

  100. Conan_the_Librarian says:

    We can’t have sheep?


  101. Scott Minto (Aka Sneekyboy) says:

    You wrote ‘?’ instead of ‘to’

  102. Dr JM Mackintosh says:

    If the man had half a brain, he would be lopsided.

    North Country Cheviots for YES.

  103. Robert Peffers says:

    @muttley79 says:1 August, 2014 at 5:53 pm

    “Cheers. I will have to google her as I have not heard of her before”

    Whit! Nivver heard o the bonnie lassie?

    As Bing Crosby said to Frank Sinatra, “You must be one of the newer guys”.

  104. Mike Hamilton says:

    Just picking up on the two posts above re the BP Clair developments. It would appear that DC has gone to Shetland on the QT to put some pressure on BP to keep quiet about the latest results from the appraisal drilling. To send the contractors home on full pay and keep them there until after the referendum is highly unusual and suggests that there is something big happening. Clair Ridge is already a huge project but along with the recent news from Hurricane Oil of their Lancaster development strongly suggests that there is some seriously big news being suppressed, might one go so far as to say ‘game changer’?

    We already know AD’s comment about the oil running out in 2017 is a lie but news of just how much oil is there and ‘proven’ would be very useful info for AS prior to his wee discussion with AD on Tuesday. Watch this space…

  105. wee_monsieur says:

    Seriously? We can’t have sheep?

  106. geeo says:

    Dolly the sheep is not “dead”, dolly can be reborn any time we like.

    That aside, decent programme to watch, some stuff seems sourced from MSM outlets but are then scrutinised and a different picture is given.

    A guy from Al Jazeera can take time to do his job properly, and hats off to him, but it make it even clearer that our own MSM do not WANT to do likewise as opposed to cannot do likewise.

    Al Jazeera used to be called a terrorist mouthpiece by some, so what does that make our excuse for a media ?

    Free press indeed, my erse.

  107. geeo says:

    @mike hamilton.

    It has been my opinion for a while that there will be NO replacement nuke programme due to cost issues.

    The WM government are imo sitting on information about the suspected massive reserves of oil and gas under the West coastal waters.
    The WM government will not tell Scots about this oil and gas worth untold amounts of billions as even ‘sheep guy’ in the video might figure it out and vote Yes.

    A No vote will be followed by a ‘sudden discovery’ of West Coast resources and Trident2
    will have to be Scrubbed for now and current trident will be shifted after a new base is found and forced on someone else so the resources can be reached.

    In the meantime the huge amounts of revenue about to land after the current investment in the North Sea bears fruit keeps everything ticking over until the West coast can be exploited next.

    Or maybe i am just getting cynical in my old age…..

  108. john king says:

    That guy reminds me of this 🙂

  109. Ken500 says:

    Cameron is getting his Tory chums at the head of the Oil companies to stall production until after the Referendum. So Cameron and his Tory associates can line their pockets with £Millions of taxpayers money and tax evade.

    That is what the subversive trips to Scotland, costing £Millions in taxpayers money are about, sniffing about to see how much more Cameron and Osbourne and their associates can steal from Scotland.

  110. Ken500 says:

    The £3.3Billion spend on Defence this (last year) is a low average figure as Defence spending on average has been cut. To get a true median (medium average) It would have to be averaged over a number of years. Previous years it has been higher (illegal wars etc) An average would be £4Billion+ The Scottish Gov projection is without Trident/illegal wars the average (comparison) would be £2.5Billion. A saving of £1.5Billion a year.

  111. Ken500 says:

    Cameron has been secretly bribing his Tory chums at the Head of the Oil companies about their cut. An ‘honour’ or a continued tax evasion project. Stealing £Milions/Billions of taxpayers money to make themselves wealthy, while starving, killing and maiming people.

    Greedy, low life troughers. Helicopters are falling from the sky while private equity companies in the North Sea are not following health and safety guides. Getting away with murder,

  112. Ken500 says:

    Osbourne has been snaking in and out of Aberdeen. Incognito. Unionist/Tories are so despised in the North East he has to.

  113. Bugger (the Panda) says:


    Cyclist does a runner.

    An athlete from Sierra Leone has gone missing because he was frightened to go home with the Ebola outbreak.

  114. Grouse Beater says:

    Good article in the Herald decrying Labour’s Tammany Hall machine that is Glasgow council’s propensity to knock down good, solid buildings and build Brutalist high rise homes in their place.

    Lumps much of the problem on people who keep ‘voting Labour.’

    “The Secret History of Our Streets.”

  115. Grouse Beater says:

    Ebola outbreak.

    Seeing the success of the Games and the narrowing of the polls, I am surprised Bitter Together have not exploited the outbreak to cause panic and sour the event.

  116. Bugger (the Panda) says:


    The BBC tried with the story of the athlete who was hospitalised and quarantined because of the possibility of Ebola.

    Later in the day they said that the athlete was OK and had actually competed.

  117. Ken500 says:

    The Herald and Scotsman are rubbish. Don’t trust them or buy them. They are trying to subvert Democracy. The Scotsman Trolls disappear every Westminster recess.

  118. Grouse Beater says:

    I notice the Scotsman article on Ian’s blunder isn’t allowing comments. Hmmmm

    Well, at least the press has picked up on the cretin’s bigotry. Would they have noticed without Wings list?

  119. Grouse Beater says:

    Later in the day they said that the athlete was OK and had actually competed.

    I spotted that, BtP, and wondered which unionist bigot would attempt to ramp up the panic.

  120. Bugger (the Panda) says:


    We have so many choices.

  121. bookie from hell says:

    The Times

    The cost of rebuilding Afghanistan has surpassed the vast sums spent putting Europe back on its feet after the Second World War.

    As British and other western troops prepare to leave the country at the end of the year, a US government report revealed the unprecedented levels of corruption and waste that have pushed the cost of reconstruction beyond the total spent under the Marshall Plan.

    American taxpayers have provided £61.5 billion since 2002 and Britain about £890 million, for hundreds of development projects. The military operation has cost America a further £296 billion and Britain £22 billion.

  122. Bob Sinclair says:


    This quote from the Tom Gallagher article really jumped out and slapped me in the face:

    “History, right down to the present, has shown that a lot of people embrace the nationalist cause because it offers private advantage like few other things in politics. This is due to the potential for manipulating the emotions of so many people and shutting down their critical faculties.” 

    Well, I don’t know about everyone else, but my experience of the YES campaign is that it is all about the Collective advantage, nobody left behind, providing support and care for those in need, and generally striving toward a more compassionate & accountable form of Government.

    By contrast the NO campaign really is about ‘Personal Advantage’. The overriding response from their supporters seems to be ‘me, me, me’, ‘I’m alright Jack’ etc.

    Seems like mr Tom Gallagher hit the Conscience/truth pause button when writing this article

  123. Grouse Beater says:

    The cost of rebuilding Afghanistan has surpassed the vast sums spent putting Europe back on its feet after the Second World War.


    And all to keep the west in oil.

  124. Grouse Beater says:

    I don’t know about everyone else

    I agree absolutely with your reaction.

    He’s yet another demonstrating how chronically unable is his mindset to jettison his prejudices.

  125. IXL says:

    YES shop @ 38 Morningside Rd …IS NOW OPEN

    NB just around the corner from Darling’s house 🙂

  126. IXL says:

    Grouse beater…last time I looked, Afghanistan had NO OIL !

  127. Grouse Beater says:

    Our Saturday cartoon is unusually late in appearing.

  128. Bob Sinclair says:

    No oil, but i’ve heard that Afghanistan is rich in ‘Rare Earth’ minerals used in manufacture of modern electronics etc. Currently tha main supply of these is China. May be that this is where the financial gain lies.

  129. Robert Peffers says:

    @Grouse Beater says: 2 August, 2014 at 8:22 am:
    “I spotted that, BtP, and wondered which unionist bigot would attempt to ramp up the panic.”

    There really is nothing new about those Bitter Together tactics. I remember one General Election many moons ago when every chap on an elderly person’s door was met with them saying, “A canna vote fir the SNP or Ah wull loss ma £10 Christmas bonus”.

    Their weekly incomes were being cut by the Westminster government but the local Labour Mob had the poor OAPs in terror of losing £10 quid a year. Not even explaining to them how the already changed benefits system was robbing them every week could budge them. The Labour terrorists had done their job so well.

  130. Grouse Beater says:

    IXL Says: Afghanistan had NO OIL!

    The US’s recorded policy for being in Afghansistan and Iraq is: “to protect oil reseserves principally for US consumption and, as an adjunct, to tame the Middle East.” They are one and the same.

    In addition, large deposits of various minerals have been discovered in Afghanistan, gold, iron and copper, in particular, lithium, (batteries for our ipads, phones, and cars) £1 trillion in deposits, a dividend, and yet another reason for the US to maintain a presence there.

  131. KRackerman says:

    @Bob Sinclair…

    Yup – Lithium… google the uses for that – oh boy…

  132. Grouse Beater says:

    Of course, you don’t just ‘discover’ mineral riches in abundance in the middle of fighting an unjust war in a far off land thousands of miles from your border.

    You send in geologists to check the terrain … employed by the Pentagon.

  133. caz-m says:

    Has anyone else heard of a debate tomorrow on Clyde 2 with Nicola Sturgeon and Johann Lamont?

    I have checked the Clyde 2 website, but no mention of it.

  134. mogabee says:

    Watched the whole piece and thought it very balanced considering the presenter was not familiar with how the debate had progressed in Scotland.

    At least he engaged with both sides, unlike the dufus in the short clip!

    I also want to announce a YES shop opened yesterday in Campbeltown…

  135. heedtracker says:

    America’s GDP? 15.68 trillion USD (2012), so a few billion dollars spent slaughtering peasants? We are ruled by lying kleptomaniacs who in turn tell us countries like Russia are ruled by deadly kleptocrats, via their BBC/MSM shills. Russian GDP 2.015 trillion USD (2012)

    What can you do, twas ever thus, only sheep, water, whisky, dirt cheap hooch, lousy parenting, mind rotting tv, very very very poor teaching standards, rule Britannia.

    I love the smell of my own pomposity in the morning

  136. caz-m says:

    “YES shop @ 38 Morningside Rd …IS NOW OPEN”

    Well done, I hope many people call in and get material and advice on the Referendum.

    These YES shops are great and I hope loads more open throughout Scotland in the coming weeks.

    It’s all about getting the message out to those undecided voters. The YES shops are also a great meeting place.

    I know the one in Largs is also used for holding drop-in meetings.

    A big thanks to all you volunteers who run these shops.

    Everyone of us can do something to help out in the run-up to the Referendum, no matter how little.

    So get in touch with your local YES group and tell them that you are ready to help out the best way you can.

  137. galamcennalath says:

    Bob Sinclair says:
    Tom Gallagher

    Nationalism is a universal human emotion to be part of a group, and possibly to be associated with a specific place. It can be channeled for good or bad. It can lead to xenophobia, but it needn’t.

    I agree in this Yes campaign it has been focused on a civil collective nature. However, most people for most of their lives have been exposed to British nationalism which is about power and control. And, it’s always had barely veiled xenophobia.

    Those who still cling to BritNat ideas, just can’t get their head round civic nationalism.

  138. Grouse Beater says:

    “YES shop @ 38 Morningside Rd … IS NOW OPEN”

    Well now, come in. You’ll have had your Referendum.

    (Just joshin’!)

    I’ll give it a visit.

  139. Ken500 says:

    What most people want to know is where to get YES merchandise. Flags, posters/badges etc. There is a huge demand. YES It’s going to be massive.

  140. Robert Peffers says:

    I had been looking for a particular clip on YouTube and went to make a cup of tea. While drinking it I just clicked on a Nicola Sturgeon/Douglas Alexander debate.

    Wee Dougie said, “Scotland’s elderly population is aging faster than the UK’s elderly population”..

    So I sent a text to a friend who has a twin sister living in Plymouth. Strange thing is, believe it or not, his sister is still exactly the same age as he is, (give or take their constant 5 minutes different birthtime).

    Wonder why yon Sara Smith didna ask Dougie aboot that daft claim he made?

  141. Kalmar says:

    I would like some yes stickers – but I’ve never seen a yes stall (come to that I don’t think I’ve spoken to anyone who is outspokenly yes yet). Is there anywhere in dundee I could get some today?

  142. David S Briggs says:

    Revisited the clip and I’m inclined to believe this is staged. No one can possibly be that thick.

  143. No no no...Yes says:


    Anas being challenged ahead today’s debate:

    The Unite pamphlet is 24 pages of really good material.

  144. Grouse Beater says:

    Revisited the clip and I’m inclined to believe this is staged. No one can possibly be that thick.

    I recognise the guy .. but can’t recall from where.

  145. Cuilean says:

    Better to be a lion for one day, than a sheep all your life. That day is 18 September 2014.

  146. Col The Viking says:

    Hi All

    Getting very exciting, have to look after the kids today and it is raining so won’t be able to meet Jim Murphy in the high street at eleven.

    a cordial invite was extended to demonstrate that ‘we have a REAL grassroots campaign with momentum’……I wonder how he will get on…………

    Apols if slightly O/T

  147. galamcennalath says:

    No no no…Yes says:
    The Unite pamphlet

    I hope the NHS is made central in the campaign in the run up. It is under serious threat and everyone should know that. The Unionists have no defence on this, it seems to be a done deal in ENgland and the privatisation and cutbacks will spill into Scotland.

  148. Thepnr says:


    There is a Yes shop in St Andrews St.

  149. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Grouse Beater at 8.53

    You are right. The most persuasive case I have heard for our disastrous intervention in Afghanistan is that an Afghanistan under our control (as well as having gas and lots of other valuable mineral deposits) allowed access to the oil rich republics (the “stans”) to the north west of it. As they have signed up to Russia and China we are getting out – leaving Afghanistan in a much worse state than when we intervened in it (ditto Iraq and Libya).

  150. Croompenstein says:

    There’s a Women for Independence Coffee Afternoon in the Catholic Hall in Girvan this Sunday 3rd August 2-4 pm guest speaker is Dr Phillipa Whitford. It’s a free event hope they get a good turn out of don’t knows

  151. Dave McEwan Hill says:


    I finally heard it! A BBC journalst asking a successful Scottish competitor at the Games “And won’t it be nice when we are all together competing for Team GB at the Olympics?”
    Did anybody else hear it?

    Wish she’d asked me. I’d have pointed out that like most of the Scottish, Welsh and N Irish athletes I probably wouldn’t get into Team GB and I’d much prefer competing for an independent Scotland

  152. No no no...Yes says:


    David, not Nick, reporting this in the Daily Record, wow:

  153. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Strange days at the Record with a full frontal attack article on Trident and implied support for the SNP position (though a slightly confused editorial) and yesterday’s editorial in the Sun was definitely verging on YES support.

    Get your bets on now – before the odds shrink

  154. galamcennalath says:

    @Dave McEwan Hill

    Someone said that the tabloids like to be seen to be backing the winners. Perhaps they see the writing on the wall.

    They don’t need to come out firmly for Yes, fair and balanced reporting would be a good start!

  155. galamcennalath says:

    … and, I think the SUn and Record can safely assume a majority of their readers are Yes voters.

  156. Ken500 says:

    The Daily Record is more liberal than the Guardian

    The Garbage Press. The lot of them

  157. Robert Peffers says:

    @Dave McEwan Hill says:2 August, 2014 at 10:51 am:
    “Strange days at the Record with a full frontal attack article on Trident.”

    Evenstranger when you notice the Record aricle about Labour in Scotland crowing about succcess on forcing the SNP to answer questions abour armed police in Highland areas. Yet Lamont and mob are quite at ease with WMDS less than 25 Miles from Glasgow while worried sick about a pistol on a policeman’s belt. That strikes me as rather strange logic.

  158. willie fae kilwinning says:

    caz-m says:
    2 August, 2014 at 9:32 am

    Has anyone else heard of a debate tomorrow on Clyde 2 with Nicola Sturgeon and Johann Lamont?

    I have checked the Clyde 2 website, but no mention of it.

    Heard the same. Should be on local radio throughout Scotland on the Ally Bally show between 11am and 1pm.

  159. Robert Peffers says:

    Just cheered my head off as NZ pipped England by one goal in the last second of the netball game. The thing is I’m not anti-England and would normally have supported the British Lassies 100% but the BBC’s biased imported English commentators got right up my nose.

    I’m watching TV in my pal’s house and since I popped in to his house the BBC have shown nothing but England and they have now gone to a Badminton match involving England. I take my netbook with me and, as it’s just next door, can access my wireless router from his house. I don’t have a TV license in protest at the BBC bias even although I’m well over 75 and could have one for free. We really do need rid of those propaganda merchants.

  160. Muscleguy says:


    Well NZ used to make whisky, Lammermuir can still be bought in fact. Same old story, they made too much of it in too short a time. Sadly the whole thing is gone, including the stills. I used to run past it, sitting by the Water of Leith in Dunedin.

    Attempts are being made to get another one going but last I looked no dice. Part of the problem is NZ is not self sufficient in grain, the Canterbury plains are just not big enough and there isn’t much flat land elsewhere in quantity with the right aspect and soils. In parts of Canty they are arguing about water rights from an irrigation scheme.

    But, the land area of NZ is slightly more than the whole British Isles. Even with 1/3 of it in National Parks or other Reserves that is a lot of land to exploit economically and a truly vast marine area (the Chatham Islands way off to the East greatly extends it as do the sub Antarctic Islands) which means lots of fish and other kai moana. There are also a LOT of sheep, fewer than there used to be due to dairy conversions but about 40million.

    Old joke: aliens observe NZ from the heavens then land and march straight up to the dominant woolly quadrupeds who are attended by their bipedal servants and says ‘take me to your leader’.

    That’s from when there were 70million sheep and only 3 million bipedal servants.

    Being long and thin and oriented N-S a great variety of things can be grown and exported. Stone and pipfruit in the South Island, kiwifruit, watermelons and kumera in the North Island. Grapes almost the length of it.

    We once bartered, literally, butter for Lada cars with the Soviets when they were short of hard cash. The NZ Dairy Board became the local distributors.

    That is why the lack of enough land for grain doesn’t matter. We can swap lots of other food for it.

  161. Grouse Beater says:

    The bias comes from the BBC’s instruction to commentators to refer to England, Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland collectively as the ‘home countries.’

    That noun installs in the viewer’s mind the Union is good. It is also conveniently close to ‘home counties.’

    Few will question what ‘home’ means.

    Countries attached to which country? England?

    Personally, I wait for the rebellious commentator, lover of Westminster, thinking he’s ingratiating himself with his senior colleagues, to blow his cover – but maybe that’s happened already and I missed it.

  162. Ronnie says:

    @ Bob Sinclair 08.50

    “By contrast the NO campaign really is about ‘Personal Advantage’. The overriding response from their supporters seems to be ‘me, me, me’, ‘I’m alright Jack’ etc.”

    I’ve been thinking for some time that the ‘NO’ brigade are typified by a ‘me, me, me,’ attitude, whereas the ‘YES’ camp are very much ‘we, we, we’.

    This has to be the greatest community spirt ever!

    Let’s hope we retain it come what may.

  163. galamcennalath says:


    Some Lammermuir survived in bond and is sold as Milford in the UK. I have a few bottles 🙂

  164. Cactus says:

    Looks like that that Greg Hemphill from Still Game (in the still) winding up the interviewer.. If only Jack & Victor could do their own remake of this sketch.. but wait a minute.. here comes Ronald Villiers!

    Ronald Villiers ~ Thespian (Chewin’ the fat)

  165. Proud Cybernat says:

    Sheep, water and whisky. So our food and drinks industry are doing alright then?

    The problem with these types is they are BritNats to the core and nothing (not even their ‘Prod Scot’ bollox) will ever change them. They look for any old lame excuse to excuse themselves from proudly supporting Scotland. My concenr is what these BritNats will do when they lose?

  166. Dorothy Devine says:

    Robert Peffers , you and me both!
    To my English son in laws shock and horror I have adopted an anyone but England attitude.
    I explained why and I think he is mollified!

  167. Jim says:

    In an independent Scotland, the sheep will still be on fire!

  168. David S Briggs says:

    @Grouse Beater

    Sure I’ve seen the guy playing some part on TV, but can’t place him though.

  169. Croompenstein says:

    Sure I’ve seen the guy playing some part on TV, but can’t place him though

    Worzel Gummidge

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