Nationalist of the week
From the Norwich Evening News, 4 March 2014:
“‘It is ridiculous that independence for Scotland is even being given consideration at all.
Much blood was spilled over centuries to bring the home nations together.
It’s disrespectful to the honour of those that suffered to think that a cross on a ballot paper can undo that. National pride and patriotism is what being a Scot is all about, and there is not a nation in the world that has more of it than Scotland. We don’t need economic independence to prove it.’
Blair Ainslie is managing director of Great Yarmouth-based offshore firm Seajacks. He hails from Dunbar, East Lothian and moved south of the border in 1979.”
That one’s making our head spin.
As best we can tell, Mr Ainslie thinks it’s more “honourable” to determine a country’s governance by war, treachery and the spilling of blood than by peaceful democracy.
Mind you, Norfolk IS pretty boring. If we lived there we’d probably be up for a ruck too.
Naw Blair we need economic independence to mitigate one of the most unfair society’s in the world..
Julie Elliott, MP, Shadow Energy Minister commented: ‘It was a great pleasure to visit Seajacks today.Blair Ainslie, CEO of Seajacks UK commented: ‘It is really great that the Shadow Energy Minister came all this way to visit us. Along with Cllr Trevor Wainwright (Lab) Great Yarmouth Borough Council, So Labour expat being disrspectful of the views of the Scottish people.
I missed the two for one broadsword deal @ tesco
As evidence of the quality of the newspaper this bit of fluff is in I give you the second headline on its front page:
Teenage girl tripped up by man in Sprowston
Apparently “A teenage girl was tripped up as she walked home.”
Oh dear,this is about more than nationalism and patriotism.
Twitter
L & M barbershop
Will #cameron do a #Putin and seize the oil fields if it looks like Scottish referendum might go the wrong way? Commonwealth games weekend?
‘Disrespectful to those that have suffered’ to have some dick presenting democracy as a bad thing. Oh how extreme must we Scots be!
OT
Alert – Bob Mills about to give us some ill considered ‘comedy’ on R4.
He clearly missed out on Thatcher’s Government in Scotland if he left in 1979 and the devastation that caused. We cannot change the past or take back the lives lost but we can learn from it and change the future. I’m sure there are few people in Dunbar who will miss him and his small minded attitude towards his fellow Scots.
“Teenage girl tripped up by man in Sprowston”.
Jeez I thought that was another pop at us.
I first read it as “Teenage girl tripped up by man in Sporran”.
Hoots,
Home nations.
Home counties.
#JustSaying
OT, but anyone else noted that Fraser has caught Darlings blink syndrome?
Methinks they are getting nervous, and regretting signing up with MI6/5.
Surely ‘democrat of the week’?
So the Scotland kit for the Commonwealth Games is black and grey?
Very apt for the Glasgow aristocracy.
Red and grey!
A cross on the ballot paper is preferable to a cross in the cemetery
This small point appears to have gone over this mans head does he not know Scots feel enough treasure (and I don’t just mean cash) has been squandered in war?
Stuart where the fuck did you get a copy of the Norwich Evening News?
Read the other contributions after clicking the passage,they are just the same,folks who have been away there for years.
croom,spy’s everywhere
Another I’m a proud Scot…BUT!
Love it when the ex-pats get outraged at their old country’s nerve at holding a referendum. It’s a wonder he didn’t refer to ‘these people’. Tube.
why do the English, who now bad mouth and denigrate us want to keep us under (not their wing to protect and shield us but) their cosh to use abuse rob and humiliate us and keep us in poverty and squalor. They in good old colonial fashion make the cannon balls and get some tame natives to do the dirty work for bobbles and pats on the head.
The EBC employs tame natives to spread the propaganda sent up from their masters (HMG ESTABLISHMENT) in Colonial headquarters LONDON. They stick the word Scotland as a prefix and then pass it off as unbiased and fair reporting.
In a court of law you swear to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
If only EBC could truthfully sign up to that statement.
The tragedy in all this is the people of Scotland have been so deceived over the years a lot of them can’t see anything wrong with that state of affairs, they have been brainwashed intentionally and are under the control of and by the establishment. The establishment mess about with their minds.
Exhibit A:
I’m not a racist, but…
Exhibit B:
I’m a proud Scot, but…
I read the page. A fine balanced article of a standard which you would only expect to see on the BBC. These people have been away for a long, long time, perhaps they should come back and live here for a while and have their eyes opened. Scotland has changed a lot since they went off to seek their fortunes. We should not have to leave the country of our birth just to get on in life. The opportunities should be just as attainable in Scotland. That is what we are trying to change with a YES vote. Lovebomb fail!
“‘It is ridiculous that independence for Scotland is even being given consideration at all.
Much blood was spilled over centuries to bring the home nations together.
It’s disrespectful to the honour of those that suffered to think that a cross on a ballot paper can undo that. National pride and patriotism is what being a Scot is all about, and there is not a nation in the world that has more of it than Scotland. We don’t need economic independence to prove it.’
Erm, excuse me Mr Blair personage but it is not us who are being disrespectful to anyone but it is YOU. Yes a great deal of blood has been spilt over Scotland and her INDEPENDENCE, which has regularly been under attack from England. The most notable attack being the corrupt and fraudulent deal that saw the signing of the Treaty of the Union.
Just remember Mr Blair personage that whilst London was lying to, conning and bribing the few rich landowners and M.P.’s they were also positioning SEVEN regiments along the Scottish English border. ( sorry folks I can’t confirm they were positioned along Tory Rory Stewart’s “border”
) If memory serves me right there were 4 regiments of dragoons and three regiments of foot, two of each along the Scotland/England border and the other three based in Northern Ireland. (as it is today) All these regiments were on standby to invade Scotland in the case we did not sign the treaty.
More over Mr Blair personage just remember, after this corrupt treaty was signed there were TWO YEARS of protests etc the length and breadth of Scotland, including ritual burnings of the “treaty.”
I suggest that Mr Blair whatitsisname sticks to his day job cause no one with the slightest bit of pride in Scottish history from Wallace to Bruce to the disgraceful treaty of the union should not be prepared to take any lectures from him about Scottish history and blood spilt. Above all we should never forget that “battles” like Dunkirk (51st Highland Division), Singapore (Cameron Highlanders) could never have lasted so long without the massive loss of so much Scottish life fighting rear guard actions, and never forget folks when push came to shove Churchill was more than happy to give up Scotland to Hitler in order to “save” England!
If anyone is being disrespectful it is NOT those of us who will vote YES in September but people like this idiot who uses the spilling of Scottish blood in a vain attempt to stop us from doing so!
@Papadox The tragedy in all this is the people of Scotland have been so deceived over the years a lot of them can’t see anything wrong with that state of affairs – that’s a big problem and why it’s difficult to turn a No to Yes our best hope is to win over the undecides
Fort William, Fort Augustus, Fort George; all British military monuments to keep the unruly Scots in line.
No one really knows how many were murdered by the soldiers who manned these colonial outposts but Blair Ainslie must think the sight of their blood running into the burns & lochs was worth it.
But if I can reverse the Union with the flick of a biro in September, I think I’ll oblige him.
This is banal unionism coming to haunt the no camp. The last 50 years, it was allowed to become invisible – part of the furniture and never really questioned. Maybe if they had done something with the spirit of 45, rather than piss it up a wall. hell maybe if the no camp and broken osbornes spine for traducing the nation. How does that old poem go – for the want of a nail the shoe was lost…
@GH Graham.
Until you justed posted that, I hadn’t really seen that my country has British forts all over it!
As a hillwalker, I always called Fort Bill the Garrison (an garrison) anyway.
To be fair Rev, there are worse places than Gt Yarmouth, used to visit there a bit whilst on oily business. Only thing was that the hotel I used to stay had connections to Oliver Cromwell which meant I had to have several beers to get to sleep at night…
There’s not a lot renders me speechless (ask Mrs Aikenheed) but “Much blood was spilled over centuries to bring the home nations together”
Aaaaaaaaaaggggghhhhhhh!
That’s called subjugation you……. aaaaagggghhhh
Now Rev, you’re being unfair to Norfolk. There are worse corners of this fair island than the lands of East Anglia.
But returning to Blair Ainslie’s views: isn’t it remarkable how often unionists tend to express their feelings in bellicose and pugilistic terms (blood being spilled in war, ‘punching above our weight’ and so on)? It’s all the language of aggression and violence.
‘Much blood was spilled over centuries to bring the home nations together‘…hmmm; what does that statement actually mean, and what kind of advert is it for the Union? I’m not sure if it’s true anyway. Plenty blood has been spilled in the UK’s name, but that’s not quite the same thing.
But what is Ainslie saying we ought to do – freeze ourselves in time, because to try to move on would be disrespectful to those whose ‘blood was spilled’ centuries ago in the name of a political union whose time has passed?
Battered wife syndrome.
‘‘It is ridiculous that divorce is even being given consideration at all.
Much blood was spilled over years to bring us together.
It’s disrespectful to my suffering to think that a signature on a decree absolute can undo that. Pride and loyalty is what being a wife is all about, and there is not a wife in the world that has more of it than me. I don’t need economic independence to prove it.’
Another Union Jock that needed to go elsewhere for success. Mind you his ‘offshore firm’ is a rather small player in the North Sea, four platform boats and a 100 employees..
“We could have set up our business anywhere in the world,” said Blair Ainslie, Managing Director of Seajacks. “But the decision to settle in the Great Yarmouth and Lowestoft Enterprise Zone is a no brainer.”
Yeah Scotland obviously wasn’t good enough for a base of operations #proudscotbut
Arbroath 1320
The 51st Highland division was sacrificed by Churchill. It was a deliberate decision, there were opportunities to get them out, but he decided he didn’t want to be accused of abandoning the French. An English regiment who were part of the 51st, miraculously managed to find enough abandoned boats in a Harbour which allowed them all to get safely back to Blighty, how very convenient. They must think we came up the Clyde on a banana boat!!!
Should there be a no vote on the 18 sept 2014 then be assured one and all the plans for the next campaign are already under consideration. WE AINT GOING AWAY! Ok
“But if I can reverse the Union with the flick of a biro in September, I think I’ll oblige him.”
That reminds me,
does anyone know if your allowed to use your own pen on the ballot sheet, I just don’t trust them with a pencil mark,
If i’m allowed I’ll make my mark in blood.
Aye you’re absolutely right JJ, the 51st was indeed sacrificed. Thing is it isn’t just the second world war, in almost every war it has almost certainly been the Scottish regiments that were sacrificed for the “union.” This goes all the way back to General Wolfe and his attack on Quebec when he sent the Fraser Highlanders up the mountain side first because, in his view, if they were lost there was no great loss. Funnily enough all this “the Scots are expendable” seems to have infiltrated all the *ahem* thinking ever since in the M.O.D. and Westminster thinking.
If anything, all these examples of the Scots being used to protect the retreat of the rest of the British army kind of makes me even MORE proud of being a Scot. To know that our military have always been seen as cannon fodder by the military and politicians of London is the sort of thing that drives me on to do whatever I can to ensure our current and future military are never treated so shabbily ever again!
@ Norwich Evening News
‘Much blood was spilled over centuries to bring the home nations together’
Perhaps more correctly: ‘Much Scottish blood was spilled over centuries to bring her under English control’.
The desire for ‘Unity’ is easily achieved thus – England applies to be subsumed into the Greater Scotland.
If accepted – Sorted.
I’ll hae a pint awe wit he’s hivin.
Does he not realise what this is all about?
Fairness and a just society. An end to those who have it all and those left to food banks.
Education on ability, not ability to pay.
An end to illegal wars and obscene WMD
I want to be proud of helping to build that – not being proud of being born somewhere.
Is it just me or is being thick a qualification for unionists. A pity they keep looking back instead of forward!
Cupcake Poll
bakery–dundas street,very well off area!ok result
£2.50 a cupcake
29% yes
20% undecided
51% no
link to edinburghnews.scotsman.com
My wife hails from Dunbar. She went to England with me in 1979 but came back in 1991 when we retired to Gala.She is glad that this guy left Dunbar otherwise she would go over and sort him!
@bookie from hell – £2.50 for a fucking cupcake! that’s where all bitter together’s money went big Bliar has ate all the fucking cupcakes!
Re: Cupcake poll. Any idea what size the sample was?
I read an interesting slant in the comments on Derek Bateman’s blog re Jim Naughtie.
It suggested that he was an anglo-scot, one whom had made his living in England and had no intention to return north of the border.
The comment then suggested that ex-pat Scots of that nature fear the backlash they would face should Scotland vote Yes and it is this fear that puts them so firmly in the unionist camp.
Blair Ainslie would seem to come into this category.
O/T but something I read on the Rev’s twitter – wow.
link to nytimes.com
Actually, I spent some time in Norfolk. It’s not so much that it’s boring, more that it’s too close to the Black Hole, more commonly called London. Close enough, that is, to partake of the material advantages of the metropolis, but (and here’s the rub) far enough away to attract the eccentrics who like to kid themselves along that they’re more than just walking careers, but who, in reality, would die if they couldn’t run up to the Groucho Club on the train. And there’s your problem right there.
I never bought a cupcake,but I asked where’s the mince pie for devo-max
This chap will be right behind Putin’s approach to Crimea then.
As far as I’m concerned, these Norfolkers (that’s what they are now) don’t really figure – I would prefer to hear the views of people from Norfolk now settled in Scotland, and voting Yes.
That would better illustrate the direction of travel.
O/T sorry about this folks.
I’ve just read this in a tweet from Business for Scortland.
Support for a Yes vote increased from 41% to 75% during our Edinburgh event last night. Half the undecideds moved to Yes. #indyref
Now what is it all those Muppets from London keep telling us again?
re Cupcake
What about the diabetics?
As an antidote we’ve been canvassing with 46-56% yes and 22-33% no but then that is just finding what the polls are showing that the poor are Yes and the rich are No. These have not been our very poor areas but we haven’t done any rich ones yet or even definitely middle class.
It just means that we have to work harder in our poor area to get our vote to the poll to make up for and overcome the ones that can afford £2.50 for a cupcake
I was visiting a mate in Portsmouth and she said she’d had lots of stick from people in her work over the referendum. Locals taking it personally.
@Garry Henderson – probably because we share a ‘Secretary of State’
re Cupcake
What about the diabetics?
As an antidote we’ve been canvassing with 46-56% yes and 22-33% no but then that is just finding what the polls are showing that the poor are Yes and the rich are No. These have not been our very poor areas but we haven’t done any rich ones yet or even definitely middle class.
It just means that we have to work harder in our poor area to get our vote to the poll to make up for and overcome the ones that can afford £2.50 for a cupcake
Apols if repeated: can’t spell my own moniker
£2.50 for a small cake! No thanks.
A chap has put up a fundraiser but I think the time of the appeal seems a tad short.
link to indiegogo.com
Spilt blood over centuries to bring the home nations together? Whuh?
Not much of a historian then.
Eejit.
He’s really not getting the whole concept of democracy is he?
This is why émigré Scots don’t get to vote in our referendum. (One reason, anyway.)
Got to love how some of those living dun suff see it only as us “cybernats” as reverting to demeaning rudeness. Just seen this on twitter.
Sadly when u debate with cybernats they run out of logic & then resort to their demeaning rudeness, Anyone else experience it? RT
When questioned about the fact that he implies it is only the “cybernats” who do this his response is:
Did I say that? U sound defensive?
Apparently when I suggested he read the gtweet I had responded to and confirm I was right in what he said his response was, unsurprisingly:
Read it, I didn’t
So I guess I must have made the whole thing up then!
I don’t get this attitude at all.
Not the silly ‘spilled blood’ stuff, but the ‘national pride and patriotism without independence’ attitude.
It just seems a bit empty.. We are cultural Scots only, but don’t want to govern ourselves..
What is there to be so proud about, if we don’t have the backbone to decide our own future as a country?
What is there to be so proud about in getting landed with Tory governments and policies we don’t vote for, and only having effective regional status.
I would feel a bit prouder if we had the confidence to stand up and join the world.
As far as I can see there are ethnic Scots some of whom live outside Scotland and some of whom live in Scotland, and there are Scots who are Scottish because they live in Scotland or were born in Scotland or have Scottish parents or even Scottish grandparents or like Rod Stewart fancy being Scottish. I don’t mind, after all, most Cherokees alive today are technically Scots and I like that about us, we’re not narrowly ethnically nationalistic.
None of which is relevant to the actual referendum which will be the people eligible to vote for a number of reasons (not the least of which is living in Scotland), voting to decide their future.
Everyone in the world is welcome to the debate however, and their views are certainly more relevant if they are eligible to vote, but the views of Scots, ethnic or simply believing themselves to be so, who do not reside in Scotland, like myself for example, should carry the same impact as non Scots to a certain extent. What we might have is a better understanding of the psyche of Scots, but not always, what we might have is ex-pat syndrome, where we believe in a homeland that doesn’t exist and never did. Ex-pats have a tendency to mythologise the homeland, I saw it in my grandfather who was Dutch and I watch for it in myself and nip it in the bud if I see it. Others may not be so insightful. It is unfortunate that in many cases because their opinions are pro-union, they are being heard more.
For a long time I’d call myself Glaswegian and then European, those were the places I felt at home and when I moved to London I realised it was a foreign country where things were done differently. Now I live in the NE of England and I think I’m probably turning into a Novocastrian, but weirdly I feel more Scottish than I did when I lived in Scotland, and that is because Scottish culture is alive again, Scottish democracy is growing and you can feel a country on the brink of something, maybe it’s harder to feel when you’re in amongst it, but from outside its obvious and it’s definitely scaring some ex-pats, because it challenges their mythology, their beliefs and often a major part of what they use to define themselves. That’s their problem not Scotland’s.
I’m a bit ambivalent about all this 51st Highland stuff.
My father’s elder brother’s elder son (my oldest cousin on my Dad’s side) was one of those taken prisoner that day. He spent a very unpleasant five years in a PoW camp in Poland.
But he came out of it alive. He ran a small business and had a happy life and died at the age of 85. At his funeral, I could see the War Memorial in the church. On it was the name of a cousin I never knew. The only son of my mother’s eldest brother, my oldest cousin on my Mum’s side. He was a couple of years too young to have joined up into the 51st with the rest of the “Millport boys”. He later joined the RAF and got his pilot’s wings. He disappeared over the English Channel not long before armistice day.
I can’t shake the thought that being stranded at Dunkirk like that saved my older cousin’s life.
Wouldn’t it be interesting to have a poll for these exiled Scots sprouting all this tosh from down south. They should be asked that if we vote No will they all come rushing back to the homeland that they all speak so highly off.
On second thoughts the return of The Krankies?? Now that is project fear.
O/T anyone know if there are any polls due this weekend?
People vary. There are people like Stu, and like me until a few years ago, who are Scottish and just happen to be living in England. And then there are people like Jim Naughtie.
No I don’t understand it either.
liz, thanks for the heads-up on the NY Times story…interesting. I don’t do twitter so link was appreciated.
Cheers.
Morag – I can part agree with you but as my Dad was also made a POW with the 51st HD at St Valery en Caux I know that he had a lot of experiences during those years that stayed with him for the rest of his life.
Incidently although obviously the 51st was a Scottish division there were a lot of English regiments in support with them and they are seriously overlooked.
“The comment then suggested that ex-pat Scots of that nature fear the backlash they would face should Scotland vote Yes and it is this fear that puts them so firmly in the unionist camp.”
I read that comment in D Bateman’s blog too. It is absolute nonsense. I live half my life in Cambridgeshire and I have NEVER heard any comment in the street about the referendum. Yes there are plenty in the MSM and the occasional moan in the local rags by activists but my close neighbours never mention it. They are just not interested/don’t care. And I certainly don’t have any fears about a backlash.
The views of my Scottish acquaintances in England range from either supporting Independence avidly like me or couldn’t care less.
Morag Between 100 and 200 officers and between 4,000 and 5,000 men of the 51st Highland Division were taken prisoner, A British Army Division consists of between 10,000 and 30,000 men. I cant find a figure for the composition of the 51st but the battalion was made up of the following units, it suffered thousands of men killed and wounded. Your cousin was indeed lucky, many were not and were deliberately sacrificed by Churchill.
Order of Battle on Embarkation
January 1940
Major General V.M. Fortune, CB, DSO
1st Bn. The Lothians & Border Horse (Yeomanry)
152nd Brigade: Brigadier H.W.V. Stewart, DSO
6th Bn. The Seaforth Highlanders
4th Bn. The Seaforth Highlanders
4th Bn. The Queen’s Own Cameron Highlanders
153rd Brigade: Brigadier G. T. Burnet, MC
4th Bn. The Black Watch
6th Bn. The Gordon Highlanders
5th Bn. The Gordon Highlanders
154th Brigade: Brigadier A.CL. Stanley-Clarke DSO
6th Bn. The Black Watch
7th Bn. The Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
8th Bn. The Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
Royal Artillery: CRA. Brigadier H.CH. Eden, MC
75th Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
76th Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
77th Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
51st Anti-tank Regiment, Royal Artillery
Royal Engineers: CRE. Lt Col H M Smail, TD
236th Field Company, Royal Engineers
237th Field Company, Royal Engineers
238th Field Company, Royal Engineers
239th Field Park Company, Royal Engineers
Royal Corps of Signals: Lt Col T.P.E. Murray 51st Divisional Signals Company
Royal Army Medical Corps: AD.M.S., Lt Col D.P. Levack
152nd Field Ambulance
153rd Field Ambulance
154th Field Ambulance
Royal Army Service Corps: Lt Col T. Harris-Hunter TD
Divisional Ammunition Company.
Divisional Petrol Company Divisional Supply Column.
Attached troops
51st Medium Regiment, RA
1st RH.A (less one Battery)
97th Field Regiment,
RA (one Battery)
213th Army Field Company, RE.
1st Bn Princess Louise’s Kensington Regiment (Machine-Gunners)
7th Bn The Royal Northumberland Fusiliers (Machine-Gunners)
6th Bn The Royal Scots Fusiliers (Pioneers)
7th Bn The Norfolk Regiment (Pioneers)
Sections of the RAOC and the RASC.
He’s got a point “It is ridiculous that independence for Scotland is even being given consideration at all.”
Why?
Because we shouldn’t have to have decisions for our nation decided by a corrupt institution based in another country.
In short we shouldn’t be in a position that we have to consider independence in the fist place. We should be a sovereign nation in our own right.
The question that should be asked given these circumstances that Blair finds Scotland in is why did it come to this?
Well Blair, in answer to my question posed for you is that your beloved London centric Establishment completely screwed Scotland and this is our opportunity to tell them in no uncertain terms, what we think of them and us.
To them; good bye.
To us; let’s build our own future.
Cheers Blair for being bang on the money!
O/T but we’re well in – was listening to a Waterboys song on Youtube and glanced down to the list of songs on the left and remembered one that I particularly liked back in the day – God can’t believe the lyrics to this song – did they have the second sight – ” Old England is dying ” just read the lyrics – spooky
In the times I’ve spent outside of Scotland I was more interested in my local politics, so I’ve concerned myself with London for a few years, then Demos Moussouron in Crete. I could vote in both places if I wanted to, but I only ever did in London. Those years add up to 14 out of 58 and still counting and apart from a brief flirtation with the Young Socialists and the like, I’ve been an independista all my grown up days. Had Scotland reclaimed independence while I had been away I would have partied as hard as the next exultant Scot, but unless I’d then been headhunted (unlikely in my old line of work) I wouldn’t have returned to Scotland any earlier than I did. I finally came home a couple of months after the 2007 Holyrood election and the feeling in the air was optimistic to say the least. Whatever happens on the 18th of September, this is one helluva exciting time to be here…
not up to speed with the links thing
Morag
Try and source Yeoman Soldier Prussian Farmer, by Richard Harvey. It tells the story of the prisoners of war, including those from the 51st. They spent the war in East Prussia. My ex neighbour and Grandmother’s bowling partner, a man from Invergordon, is mentioned in it. A moving account of men at their best. Their experiences will floor you.
Mr Ainslie is just another Scot who has lived darn sarf too long and has become a root and branch conformist Brit.
According to the guide dressed in 18th century kit Fort George only fired one shot in anger and that was at a cow.
Nice enough place to visit. Not really much history.
I lived in England for three years, Kilburn NW6, but never really adapted to it. That was 25 years ago so I sometimes had to go quite far to get a Herald then a wee shop started selling it in Nottinghill Gate.
After months of painstaking research and countless lonely hours traipsing the cold wet streets of central Glasgow, forcing myself to drink pints in places where the men are scary and the women are hairy, have finally found and booked a place for April 4th.
It’s The Counting House. It’s about five minutes walk from Glasgow Central, on George Square/St Vincent Place. I had to cough-up a £4000 deposit (only joking, it was £20) and we’ve got a spanking big patch called ‘The Library’ which is a sharp left as soon as you go through the main doors.
It’s booked in my name. They didn’t ask what it was for. All they asked was that I call them a couple of days before to confirm, and, if possible, give a clearer idea of numbers. (I’d said approx 50, but could be nearer 80). The space is ample – plenty of tables and seating, but loads of standing room between, and crucially, there’s no ‘door’, so if we do end up with 150? No probs, we just mingle with the punters in the main bar.
I’m delighted with the space – it should be ideal. All we need now is for folk to confirm they’ll be there. Elsewise, I won’t get me 20 sovs back unless, perhaps, I spend it on drink for meself. (You wouldn’t have me do something so extreme, would ye’s?)
It’s also nice that we’ll be occupying the side of the pub which overlooks St Vincent St – on a Friday night, it should be jumping, and passers-by will be able to see us – football colours are barred from all Wetherspoons pubs, but we won’t be bringing football colours, eh?
I really shouldn’t keep interrupting regular threads with this stuff, so please watch out for updates via Quarantine, or hopefully, a new Quarantine (QE2?) which Rev has been, aherm, ‘thinking’ of setting-up. (Please, Rev, please? – it’s a mess, especially now, after all the DDOS stuff.)
I also have some splendid news about another venue we may be able to use on a more regular basis, but that’s another bag of beans altogether and can wait for now – will flag it up here first, then provide full details on Quarantine.
Cheers all!
@Twenty14
There ya go!
The Waterboys – Old England
Sadly Mr Ainslie may have become what we used to call, when I I lived in the fenlands of East Anglia, “NFN” = Normal for Norfolk.
On the other hand he may just be genetically incapable of making political decisions, nor imagining that other Scots can do it either.
Things have changed a helluva a lot in Scotland since 1999, and even more since the referendum date was announced.
I’ll certainly pop in for a pint Ian. I’ll see if a collegue from work wants to go too. You never mentioned a time in your post?
I found a nice photo of the Counting House…
link to web.missouri.edu
That site’s pretty slow, it may be getting more visitors than usual. I took them up on the request for a pro-independence view in the comments (though they’ve thrown away all my paragraph breaks).
Is it safe to come out again?
Quick note, R4 Dimbleby and co are broadcasting from Edinburgh next Friday, where they “might” be talking about wait for it…
Scottish Independence!
@Alba4Eva –
Counting House have been told to expect us for 7-7.30, but I’ll be there earlier to make sure no-one nicks our seats, and also to give name-labels to anyone who wants them.
As any fule do know, Wetherspoons pubs don’t ‘do’ music. I didn’t say anything about it, nor did they, so I don’t know if anyone intends turning up with a guitar, a moothie, or even a tuba…I can’t imagine what would happen if we have no instruments at all but burst into song regardless?
By that time I’ll have reclaimed my twenty sovs, and will be half-canned, so won’t know, care, or even notice.
Peefect Ian. Leaves just enough time from leaving work to line the gut with some stodge in a pretendy attempt to offset the potential effects of the impending alcohol consumption.
Perfect even.
If blood was being spilled, and it certainly was, the facts of history are very, very, plain. As Scots were grossly outnumbered then most of it was Scots fighting and dying to keep Scotland independent. Not to form a,”Bloody” Union. It is often forgotten the perfidy of Albion was pre-Darien Expedition. Most Scots are deprived of their own real history. Darien was the result of, “The English Navigational Act”, 1651. It was designed mainly to punished the Dutch. All goods traded to English colonies, (and England), had be in English ships with at least 50% English crew but they applied it against everyone, including Scotland. It took England to war in Europe and helped lose them the American colonies. The several wars left England in deep debt which led to the formation of the BofE. Under the Act, the English Mercantile Marine could demand the Scots paid low rates to export but high rates to import from England and the colonies. Thus it led to the Scottish rich landlords bankruptcy and it was those landlords who set up Darien to give Scotland a colony of her own but they were also the Parliamentarians who signed the Treaty of Union when it failed. BTW: Scotland then had NO national debt. The English/Dutch had promised a 50% financial backing for Darien but withdrew after ships, crews and some stores were bought. Thus Darien begun underfunded. The English/Scottish Crown also refused RN and army assistance to the Expedition. That’s a very brief explanation but, if interested, look up the key words. English Navigation Act 1651.
@ian brotherhood
100% guaranteed that ill be there if thats ik with you.
@rab_the_doubter –
That’s you on the list mister. Your label will be awaiting uplift on the nicht.
Slainte!
Thanks and well done! Good beer good prices and most important, good company!
Maybe see you on the train into Glasgow?
Rober Peffers.
You may like to seek out a copy of Scotland’s Empire by Tom Devine.
It contains absolutely all we need to know about Scotland pre and post Union including Darien, as you have rightly mentioned.
It’s funny how Scottish history was never taught at school.
@Alba4Eva –
Can I put you on my list? (sorry, but I’ve got a thing about ‘lists’) – you and one other?
Cheers
‘He hails from Dunbar, East Lothian and moved south of the border in 1979.’
You have to wonder how many Dunbar residents would hail his return.
Yup. Stick me on the list +1 Ian. Ta.
@Alba4Eva –
‘Tis done.
Looking forward to seeing you, and the plus-one.
Slainte!
@Ian Brotherhood Absolutely epic venue The Counting House. Love the building and inside is amazing. Wish I could be there but maybe next time
I’m ever so humble. I know you are better than me, but please accept me. I’ll do my utmost to prove how worthy I am of you. Please include me.
@ Ian Brotherhood: I’m already on your list,you can tick me as a confirmed. The Counting House is a handy short stumble back to Central station. I guess I’ll just have to do a solo visit to McGinns I do like his impish music so a visit to his family’s pub appeals.
@ Ian Brotherhood – I’m glad you chose the Counting House have been there many times and it’s fine.
Since you were organising it I didn’t want to dis the Twa Heided man as I thought you might be a regular but put it this way I was there once and would not be in a rush to go back.
There seems to have been as many polis as customers.
Any way see you all on the 4th.
Okay Liz, that’s you added.
April 4th
Book me in
What time?
I notice with expats Scots they seem to either get Scotland as it is today or seem to think Scotland has stayed the same since they left it. I used to meet loads of guys like those featured in the Norwich paper when I lived in that area. The younger ones were a bit more clued up but the older ones still had that ‘White Heather club’ idea of scottish identity and hadn’t really understood the changes in the last 20 years. Funnily enough they all were one side or another of the old firm as well.
Ian, this boring auld bastard is still goin! Cannie wait.
Jingly Jangly and Morag, re the 51st.
Here’s a link to a song about the 51st at St Valery, which never fails to make me cry.
link to youtube.com
I too had a relation with the 51st, Captain Duncan MacInnes, MC, chaplain to the 8th Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders. He never made it as far as St Valery, but was lucky enough to survive five years as a POW.
We must never forget the Highland Division. (and all the others too) Just as it was their duty to fight, it is our duty to remember.
@Ian Brotherhood
Can my badge have a blue background, with an off white frame enclosed in a silver trim and be held on with one of those fancy catches – eh and all in capitals – If its done by one of they old fashioned plastic tapewriters then I’ll be drinking across the road
@ian brotherhood
Should be able to make it, Ian.
@Ian Brotherhood
Count me in for the Counting House Ian, hopefully wearing a t-shirt with my avatar on it.
Was there really the need to dis the whole of Norwich at the end?
Sorry, obviously not been paying enough attention.
Why will I be in the Counting House on the 4th of April?
Because I will be… I would just like to know what I’m there for that isn’t drinking…. sorry, just drinking.