“Bruised Salmond denies lying as rows engulf SNP” (Magnus Gardham, the Herald):
“Ministers, who have always insisted membership would be automatic and that Scotland would not have to join the euro single currency, refused to say. In July, Scotland’s Information Commissioner, Rosemary Agnew, ordered them to reveal whether any advice existed.
The Court of Session was due to rule on the Government’s appeal but yesterday Ms Sturgeon admitted ministers had “not sought specific legal advice”. She said there was “now no need” for the Government to continue its appeal, which to date has cost £12,000 of taxpayers’ money.”
“Salmond’s darkest day in government” (Herald View, also in today’s Herald):
“For months the Nationalists have attempted to close down debate on the issue by insisting it was done and dusted. Unexpectedly yesterday, Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon revealed no specific legal advice had been sought.
If this is the case, taxpayers are entitled to know why the Government has spent £100,000 of public funds going to the Court of Session in an attempt to prevent the publication of whether or not such advice had been sought.”
Our emphasis in both cases. Crikey, that must have been an expensive taxi ride.
(We did, of course, post a comment asking which of the figures was correct. The Herald has so far declined to publish it for some unknown reason.)
Tags: arithmetic fail
Category
disturbing, media, scottish politics, stats
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Clearly one of the writers is a barefaced liar.
SNP accused of late payment of £88,000!
Maybe the Scottish Government needed to keep Dave and mates in the style they are accustomed to while they were up here to sign the agreement?
Looks like well over two grand for this lot alone:
link to tinyurl.com
Bet it was a cracking knees up that.
‘Closing down debate’ for months or not breaking the ministerial code? Depends on your interpretation I suppose…No mention of the Labour MEP either who requested the information in the first place.
I’m confused about whether this day is ‘darker’ than the budget ‘crisis’, the release of Megrahi, Lunchgate, being best buds with Rupert, the council elections in Glasgow etc etc. Let us ask the Herald/Gardham if they can clarify the levels of darkness in each case.
Ach, let us no bother wur erse.
“let us no bother wur erse”
I might have to put that on a t-shirt.
@Training Day
You could add in Trump, selling off forests for windfarms (oh no I forgot that was a lie by the Herald), and the worst sin in the eyes of the media, thrashing the undisputed, absolute rulers of Scotland, the unionist Scottish Labour Party last year.
£100k wouldn’t even cover the yearly expenses of ONE Labour MP, MSP or MEP! Amazing much work still goes into this regional (mostly West Glasgow) Britnat newssheet.
Interestingly, STV today quotes Nicola Sturgeon as saying the cost so far is under £4,000.
link to news.stv.tv
@Rev Stu
Time to urge a boycott of the Herald?
“Time to urge a boycott of the Herald?”
That’s a bit like urging Felix Baumgartener to keep falling downwards after he jumped out of his balloon.
Given that the unionists have compared Alex Salmond to virtually every well-known dictator in history, including Robert Mugabe, perhaps it’s no surprise that they also want to imply that the rate of inflation in Scotland is comparable to the rate of inflation that, until quite recently, used to prevail in Zimbabwe under Mugabe. Alternatively, maybe, once again, The Herald has got its sums wrong, but they can’t be arsed doing anything about it because they have such a low opinion of their readers that they just assume none of them will notice.
Cameron at PMQs “It turns out now they didn’t have any legal advice at all”.
The Scottish Government surely did and had quoted from it in their documents. There is plenty of general legal guidance publicly available
They had not sought specific advice from their own law officers – but that is a different issue.
Rather a misleading statement for the PM to make to the house, what?
Embradon,
Cameron did use words to the effect of ‘In my opinion’ while making that statement.
I wonder how quickly said legal advice will appear.
You never know, it might be sitting in someone’s out box just waiting to be ‘received’ pronto…
“the Government has spent £100,000 of public funds going to the Court of Session”
Taxi drivers and Apple Maps are a nasty combination, so I’d recommend going by bus next time. You can get a day ticket for £3.50*.
link to lothianbuses.com
* £29.17 in Herald money
I’ve really really tried, but i still can’t make out what the positive case for the union is in all this tumult of shite.
Are the unionists saying that all answers to questions will be twisted in the union? Is that the positive message they are trying to give us?
‘The man o independent mind, he looks and laughs at a that’
@Rev Stu
Yeah, its just very annoying when they come out with all their nonsense. Why is the media so hostile to independence anyway? I take it is because of what their owners think. I don’t really get why people don’t think their country could not run its own affairs.
Magnus Gardham
http://wingsland.podgamer.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/arcoftwat-460×260.jpg
Mini Magnus
link to heraldscotland.com
Do you know, by next Monday this story will have gone away without having any effect at all on the SG; and then they’ll just have to go and make up some other shite to throw at Alex Salmond (though the barrel must be well scraped by now). Two years to go!
Juteman, I think this could be the positive case for the union.
link to bbc.co.uk
link to cstihlermep.com I suppose if one has never had a proper job other than filling in FOI forms for the Labour party, enough said.
Adrian B says:
Cameron did use words to the effect of ‘In my opinion’ while making that statement.
Not if you believe STV’s transcript:
“You ask a baffling question about a truly baffling situation which is that we were told by the First Minister in Scotland (Alex Salmond) that he had legal advice about Scotland’s place in the European Union in the event of independence.
“It turns out now they didn’t have any legal advice at all and I think what this shows is when you shine the spotlight on the case for separation the SNP put, it completely falls apart.”
See: link to news.stv.tv
OK, then he said “we were told I believe….”
That is Cameron’s belief – but that doesn’t make it true now does it?
is this the same david cameron who gloatedthat he’s aiming to crush scottish separatusm?
Somewhat lightheartedly I have been thinking about the referendum result. What happens if we win? Do we get to have a Spanish-style festival, where they go around pelting each other with tomatoes? If it is, hopefully we get a joint parade of politicians and media, such as Forsyth, Cameron, Murphy, Alexander, Gardham, Cochrane, Glen Campbell etc to run the gauntlet of tomatoes and other food products. This is not lighthearted, this is the very serious part. On the other hand, what if we lose? What do we do? Does not bear thinking about….
Is it just me or was Ian Davidsons rant orchestrated so that in response.. subtely.. The BBC could appear so blatantly anti-SG that there would be no question of it being Anti-Labour, if that makes sense?
I notice that the unionists, including Cameron seem to have some sort of allergic condition to the word “independence”, instead using this ridiculous subsitute “separation” at all times.
@Arbroath.
I’ll be working till i drop, the way my pension/donation to the financial industry, is performing!
I was trying to work out the whole porky pies strategy…
Dave: The NHS is safe in our hands.
Nick: We pledge to remove tuition fees in higher education.
Scottish Labour: This is our 2011 manifesto
Maybe the idea is to try and portray AS as a unionist? Would tie in with Mr Smart’s musings.
Adrian B says:
October 24, 2012 at 6:36 pm
OK, then he said “we were told I believe….”
He did not in any way qualify his statement that “they didn’t have any legal advice at all”.
I stand by my original post but am now losing the will to live.
Anyway, one of Dundees finest passed away last night. RIP.
Do not buy The Herald.
Sadly, Scotland has no quality newspapers worth our time & money…what a state for a country to be in….
Labour Party’s press statement paraphrased the interview, omitting some 27 words.
The press release said: “When asked by Andrew Neil on 4 March 2012, ‘Have you sought advice from your own Scottish law officers on this [EU membership] matter?’ In response, Alex Salmond said: ‘We have, yes … You know I can’t release the legal advice of law officers, Andrew.’
I see they have mastered [the use of ] square brackets since Iain Gray’s day.
Could someone please explain the difference in attitude to the SG and Westminster
link to thecourier.co.uk
link to ukpollingreport.co.uk
Of course, to some extent this all academic as currently the boundaries look unlikely to go through, with the Liberal Democrats repeatedly stating they will not do a deal on the boundaries. However, there was slight movement on another front yesterday. It is broadly assumed that the Conservatives could strike a deal with the DUP to support the changes, as well as the SNP, who do very well out of the boundary changes themselves (they are the only party who wouldn’t lose any seats at all). However, this would be not be enough to get them through. Yesterday, however, Plaid Cymru said they were also open to a deal to support the boundary changes in exchange for greater devolution to Wales.
[Whistles innocently].
Heaven forbid that the Labour party should release a press statement that actually told the truth Embradon. Where would we be if wee ever got the truth out of a Labour M.P./M.S.P./M.E.P?
Some how I think the sun will go out before that happens.
On the subject of The Herald:
“The editor-in-chief of the Herald and Evening Times newspapers has left the company.
Jonathan Russell, who took on the post two years ago, stood down from his role after being absent from the Glasgow offices of the publications in recent weeks.”
link to local.stv.tv
Probably just some automated unionist-robot editing Mr Gardham’s poor journalism.
Embradon,
I got Cameron’s wording from the STV video link.
We are not going to get Westminster’s advice released on an Independent scotland joining the EU.
We do have the SNP vision on what may very well happen. Certainly they have been very clear that we can join. The final decision has to be made by the EU themselves. Any legal advice that may have been gained upto now would be subject to if/mabe/but/perhaps type clauses. Westminster are aware of this! Ruth Davidson stated about 22 mins into last weeks Question Time that the Tories knew that the SNP hadn’t applied to the EU for legal advice. Strange then that this story has now become about SNP lies?
I stand by my original post but am now losing the will to live.
Sometimes we all need a bit of quiet time out as the onslaught of Unionist propaganda becomes to much. If you can stand back from this story in which the Unionist would like to smear Alex Salmond and the SNP. One thing becomes very clear – The only people paying any attention are more of the political nerds who watch Newsnight and contribute to sites like this one.
One other thing that I would just mention is if Alex Salmond had been failing the Scottish people in dealing with unemployment, crime or poor schooling then that might be a real story.
The mud is not sticking – in fact, I am sure that ‘Scottish_skier’ may be able to show that relevant polls actually show that in the electorates mind the ‘Yes’ side is gaining further momentum.
Lets all calm down and try to put a bit of perspective on what has been happening in the last week .
The unionists and their allies in the m.s.m tried the same tactics in 2011 and it did not work then so why should it work now .
Unfortunately I was out of the country on holiday last week when the S.N.P conference was on and from what I can gather it was a very successful conference to such an extent that even enemies of the S.N.P were going on about how refreshing it was .
Given that the S.N.P had a good conference along with the results of a very good opinion poll , it would explain why the unionists are getting their knickers in such a twist .
Even the 2 m.s.p,s resigning will give a refreshing look about some politicians to the average man and woman in the street .
I would also agree with others that it is beginning to look as if A.S is deliberately winding up the unionists to react this way and I can see a few benefits to the yes campaign in this .
1 The more the unionists and m.s.m react this way , the more foolish they look and the easier it is to refute their lies .
2 The more outlandish the stories against A.S and the S.N.P the more people will debate things and the bitter together mob cant afford that .
3 The more the unionists play A.S and the S.N.P , will make it easier for us to get the message out that Independence is about the people of Scotland and not the S.N.P .
Just remember that it is a 2 year race and not a sprint to the finishing line .
If the unionists and their allies intend keeping this up for the next 2 years , then the public will be heartily sick off them .
Do not overdose.
link to 4.bp.blogspot.com
The “bare faced liar” is on Scotland Tonight at 10.30 tonight. Give ’em hell big man!
I wonder if it would be possible to initiate a long-term campaign against the MSM? Just to warn the public that they are being fed a constant diet of spin and lies.
I suppose a boycott is the only weapon really available, but how do you get that out to the public?
“I suppose a boycott is the only weapon really available, but how do you get that out to the public?”
The public is already achieving that goal pretty well by itself.
The Labservative-Libs and their tame media are really starting to get me angry.
Let’s see. After months of asking by the Labservative-Libs, “Has the Government received legal advice on EU membership from its Law Officers”, the answer from the Government is no.
And now the Labservative-Libs and their tame media are all jumping up and down shouting, “But you told us that you’d had advice!”.
Well if they believed that why did they keep asking? A real logic failure there.
more tiresome than the definition of tiresome and more life sapping than any textbook of analytic philosophy-yeah,that bad.this just wont play and is really a sign of the utter poverty of the unionist campaign.Blows over,we move on and there is no stopping us.risible or,as its also known,”gardham”.Tomatoes at the ready!
AdrianB,
You have a point in that the most of the public will not be following the twist and turns of Holyrood with much interest. Not everyone lives and breathes politics. A lot of people will be totally unaware of what has been happening on the political front in the past month. However misinformation and spin from the MSM are getting too common these days and that could be just what the ordinary public might only hear and see. It is good to have sites like these that expose the spin. In the 70’s the press and TV were king and that was the only way we got our information. Now we have the internet – the people’s press. They no longer have a monopoly.
Marcia,
Thanks for the comments. Please also remember that in the 1979 devolution referendum. The yes vote was just shy of 52% of the vote – the reason we then lost was the controversial 40% rule was not met as only 33% of those registered to vote, voted for yes.
In 1979 we did not have twitter, mobile phones or the internet.
We had the following representation of Scottish MP’s
16 Conservative
41 Labour
3 Liberal
11 SNP
The SNP suffered badly at the following elections in May that year, something that the Unionists today think will be repeated. I don’t think so.
I wonder if any unionists will be ‘unlucky’ enough to be on the receiving end of any ‘technical glitches’ tonight from Gordon “cut your mic” Brewer and Newsnicht?
Seems as unlikely as a Herald apology for printing untrue sh*te.
So Salmond confirms SG’s expenses over the legal process re. FOI appeal around £4000. That’s less than a week’s worth of Willie Bain.
Deeply comforting to see the calibre of spinner available in Pia & Jardine; explains a lot about the unchanging Unionist chorus.
Newsnicht doing some hidden mic stuff on Rangers. Somewhat ironic considering last night’s bizarre and outrageous microphone fun and games.
Unbiased and impartial interview also coming up on Newsnicht with wee Willie Rennie the smallest man in scottish politics. You can guess what that will be about.
The Guardian’s resident MSM stooge, Severin Carrell is still plugging away, dishing out as many FUD interpretations of the ‘He said, She said, They said, No-one said’ MSM invented non-story as he possibly can before it fritters away into the ether. Today’s effort has no comments allowed BTL : a fairly regular occurrence, of course, with Carrell’s ‘articles’ as the Guardian and Carrell don’t like his lies and Unionist trolling being exposed for what it is.
Anyway, here he is FUD-ing away with yet another ‘Scotland might not attain EU membership after independence’ scaremongering story.
Notice the use of ‘scare’ words and phrases: “chaotic attempts, suffered another setback, potentially long negotiating process, contradicting, intensifying the pressure, significant setback, bruising allegations, lied, difficulties escalated dramatically, shocked, angrily denied, accused Salmond [ROFLOL!!] (my brackets), raised substantial questions”
A UK unionist troll/flamer-combo masquerading as a journalist – another fucking disgrace to his profession.
link to guardian.co.uk
Saw Salmond on ITV about half an hour ago. Impressed with his interview, definitely think he is trying to wind up the media and opponents. Law of diminishing returns for both scare stories and personal attacks on him will soon start to kick in. Each time they do it the less effective it will be the next time.
Another hit piece by Newsnicht followed by Gordon “cut you mic” Brewer delivering the softest of softball questions to wee Willie Rennie then gushing lavish praise on wee Willie.
Laughable.
“cut your mic” Brewer acting like a lunatic now questioning whether the SNP participant wants independence. Happily the weasel then got slapped down hard for yet another bit of selective misquoting from Brewer.
Wee Willie Rennie now talking absolute shite about having to join the Euro.
And of course “cut your mic” Brewer now brings up the Herald. You cant’ make this shit up, well you can and they do but that doesn’t make it any less laughable.
I’m not greatly concerned over EU membership. From a trading viewpoint Scotland has for sale to the world oil.gas, power,agricultural products, and fish. Basic essentials and so either within the EU or not these products are in demand. If Scotland’s main trading assets were financial trading and sporting events then it would be a different matter and I would be concerned as these can be readily moved to some other country.
I’m more concerned at the prospect of fools getting the reins of political power. One fool stood up in Westminster today and quoted the £100,000 legal expenditure incurred by the SNP, seems it is in fact £4000. Didn’t he check or his he content to be a stooge for the PM Cameron? Another fool stands up at Holyrood and on the basis of six words extracted from a transcript of 27 words believes he is enabled to call another a liar. Didn’t he read the transcript, or fail to understand it? Or was he also content to be a stooge?
After the last couple of days,it really is blatantly obvious that the anti -independence brigade can and do at a whim have the resources to strangle any debate.
While I realise we all arrived at this site for different reasons most of us have in common the one theme-Independence.
I saw the suggestions above to boycott some of the printed press (already do ) but wondered how people would feel about something like a large mobile advertising board .
You know the ones that drive round the city ,basically with a message like ‘are we getting both sides of the story from our media?’,kind of a grassroots thing ? You can hire them for a reasonable price and if everyone threw in a couple of pounds , got a talented printer etc….
Molly,
I understand your sentiments – the idea has been brought up a number of times before. The problem is that people need to see things about 6 times on average to take in the message – thats if they are paying the slightest bit of attention. The amount of money required do achieve the sort of numbers required would be crazy. Imagine having a campaign in every town and city around the country.
I think that Margo McDonald had the right idea when she spoke at the Rally for Independence in Edinburgh – if we each convert one other person – it’s in the bag.
The opposition parties have their own agenda (as well as losing their own popularity)
The print media have their own political stance (as well as sliding sales)
BBC & STV – Both have certainly been nieve in their place within releasing a story – I do think that this may change further – not going to tell you that everyone will be happy – because they clearly will not.
Sometimes you just need to roll up your sleeves and get on with the job in hand and sometimes you will be able to take a break and let others get on with things.
Don’t panic folks!
Don’t panic!
It would appear that poor wee Westminster is getting its knickers in a wee bit of a twist. The pair wee darlings are starting to panic over what to do with their nukes when we go Independent. Looks like they are beginning to think that the rUK may end up being nuclear free for around twenty years until they can find some place to put them.
link to telegraph.co.uk
link to bbc.co.uk
Could we be witnessing the reality of Scotland’s Independence beginning to settle in to the wee brain cells of the “high and mighty”?
Yes folks I know we all could tell them where to put their nukes, but then again it is not up to us is it?
After all if they don’t remove the nukes then we all know a place where we can sell then don’t we? 😆
I think it is completely unfair that Scotland is expected to house these monstrosities on the Clyde. I wonder if they are planning to use this as an attack against the SNP, claiming thousands of lost jobs?
I genuinely think thet Brewer thinks he is impartial, although he needs to play back the last few interviews to see how he comes across.
I cannot understand why Salmond did not bring up the UK position with the EU on matters legal, mentioning he had discussed this very issue with Mundell and Cameron if applicable, adding that they were both in agreement that information provided to governments is privileged and that has been the case for a long time. Finishing by saying as the questions and answers to and from Mundell were essentially the same then he hopes Mr Martin and the rabid MSM will be more circumspect about these issues and Mr Mundell’s viewpoint than they had been speaking to him, and knowing the MSM he would be surprised if they even bothered to cover it as it is such a non story except if you are aiming to show that you have a biased agenda.
They have already tried that one Adrian and got short shrift in response. Mind you it will not stop them trying again. Let’s face it when you are flogging a dead horse what other option do you have except to keep flogging the dead horse.
I do worry about these unionists though. If they continue to spin at this rate for much longer then I’m sure they are going to knock the earth off its current axis. 😀
I have came to the conclusion that unionists are a strange breed indeed .
On one hand they profess to be for the union while in the other hand they appear to be doing our job for us .
1st we have cameron telling us that he wants a decisive victory over us uppity Scots in the referendum , this is despite the fact that it is Scotland,s referendum and nothing to do with him .
Then we have a pickled lord suggesting that O.A.P will have to work in the voluntary sector if they want to receive their full pension .
The piece de resistance for me has to be this wee gem in the telegraph .
Devonport has to large a population to store nuclear .
If devonport has to large a population to store nuclear , WHAT THE HELL IS GLASGOW ?
Many thanks must go to Arbroath for posting the link to the telegraph story .
Given the fact the most Scots want to get rid of trident , lets hope that the m.s.m will run with the fact that there is nowhere for trident to go if the Scots vote for independence .
Ah good I see that Iain above spotted the £4K quote from the FM. So where did the Legion of Doom get the other £96K from, Westminster admin? Oh bugger, they’re running the economy. 😮
By the way, saw the papers on the stand this morning at the Co-Op and not one was leading with the “Salmond’s a liar” story. Dearie me, can’t have been as fatal a story as they’d all hoped.
Silvertay,
Faslane is about 30 miles from the centre of Glasgow.
Devonport is about 2 miles from the centre of Plymouth.
Apples and pears.
@Willie Z
If it’s all nice and safe, what’s the difference between 2 miles and 30 miles?
Are you suggesting it is best to keep the base far from centres of human habitation? That’s rather worrying.
@Willie Zwigerland says:
‘Silvertay,
Faslane is about 30 miles from the centre of Glasgow.
Devonport is about 2 miles from the centre of Plymouth.
Apples and pears.’
Actually around 20 miles as the crow flies (or wind-born radiation drifts), and on the edge of a metropolitan area with a population of around 2.8m.
You’re right, comparing Plymouth and its surrounding population to greater Glasgow is apples and pears.
All this negativity in the MSM. There are two things that interest me.
The first is the principle of diminishing returns. The more the MSM and BBC spout negative headlines (most/all of which are later shown to have been, politely, exaggerated) surely the more limited the “success” of the headline? Or is Goebbels’ line more accurate that the lie MUST be maintained, and if so will prove to be successful? At some point the lies will become obvious, and then, surely, the damn of trust will burst, and the MSM/BBC seen for what they are.
The second point is almost a contradiction. For example the Guardian only sells about 12,000 copies in Scotland, so what does it matter what Carroll says anyway? Other papers are in terminal decline. Will anyone REALLY change their minds based on newspaper headlines?
So, on the one hand I DO get frustrated and angry at the lies in the media, especially the BBC, but in the end, am I worrying over nothing? Is there any empirical evidence that sustained negativity is ‘rewarded’ or actually causes a backlash?
The SNP victory in 2011 appeared to ‘buck the trend’ of negativity, should I expect the referendum will do the same?
O/T.
I’m watching BBC News 24, and just heard the commentator remark on the performance of the 2 ‘British’ football teams playing last night. I can’t remember English teams being referred to as British before? Deliberate?
o/t have just looked at Bill Leckies demented scribblings in the Sun today. He is saying that the independence referendum has now been lost because Alex Salmond lied to us about this legal advice on the EU.
He goes on to say that we are better off with the lying b@stard politicians we have just now , rather than a new set of lying b@stard politicians.
he also states that if he is wrong about this and we do choose independence, he will eat the paper he has written it on. May I be first to volunteer myself to force feed it to him come 2014. Crackpot!
@Alex Mcl
I was under the impression it was the Olympics and Jubilee that had killed off independence. Seems I’m a bit behind.
Is Bill Leckie predicting a spectacular Tory revival in Scotland with overwhelming demand for a return to direct Westminster rule? It seems unionists are utterly convinced this will happen, although I’m not entirely sure on what basis.
Aplinal,
Yep, the principle of diminishing returns for the MSM has been evident for a number of years, since 2007, if we consider anti-SNP stories. They have two more years to cry wolf and desensitize the people, so little prospect of that working much as the YES campaign starts to motor ahead. Furthermore, there comes a point when the returns go negative, and people start to get really annoyed with blatant scare-stories and negativity, and determined to punish those involved. Common sense should tell the MSM to stop the negativity, or at least tone it down for 18 months, but they won’t, they just cannot help themselves. Alex Salmond will keep providing the rope.
@Alex Mcl
Leckie is a committed – how shall I say this? – adherent of the body currently known as Sevco 5088. That may or may not have something to do with his views.
This story is dying even quicker than I expected.
link to bbc.co.uk
With cool heads versus headless chickens this is hardly unexpected
From NNS:
link to newsnetscotland.com
However, in an official reply to Newsnet Scotland, a spokesman for EC President José Manuel Barroso confirmed that the then on-going negotiations on the details of the referendum were indeed the reason the Commission was not commenting on the Scottish situation.
Responding to questions posed by Newsnet Scotland over two weeks ago, EU spokesman Mark Stephen Gray, a press spokesman for Mr Barroso said:
“In the Scottish case, the discussions are taking place on the modalities of a referendum; Timing, wording etc not yet known. That is why the Commission is not commenting at this stage.”
Well that’s hardly a surprise now is it. Now we have the Edinburgh Agreement, we can move on and discuss things openly with the EU.
“Leckie is a committed – how shall I say this? – adherent of the body currently known as Sevco 5088. That may or may not have something to do with his views. ”
We can agree that Leckie is talking shite but its not necessarily a direct correlation to his football team , although no doubt the Aberdeen fans on here will be fertile ground for such nonsense.
I don’t support Aberdeen, Kenny. I did say ‘may or may not’ though 🙂
“Willie Zwigerland says:
Silvertay,
Faslane is about 30 miles from the centre of Glasgow.
Devonport is about 2 miles from the centre of Plymouth.
Apples and pears.”
Are we suggesting we leave the nukes out on the Mayflower Steps? There are safer places in Plymouth to leave them.
Seriously, however, the polulation of Devon (1.1m) is not dissimilar to Greater Glasgow, Renfrewshire and local parts of Argyll and Bute (>1.5m). The ‘immediate’ population around Faslane still matches Plymouth (at over 200k).
The ‘too close to a local population’ argument is total bull (unless you seriously consider the risk of ‘glow in the dark’/dead Scots to be a minor one?)
@ training day, c’mon I’m a Sevco man myself, and as far as I knew Bill Leckie and wee Chick Young are Buddies lol.
As Kenny says above, I think he just has a propensity of shite talking, and I’m still first in the queue after 2014.
@Alex McL
Fair do’s Alex, can’t say fairer than that!
I’m a Jags man myself so am on a (no doubt temporary) high 😉
Re Leckie. I remember in 2007 that Iain McWhirter had to eat his words. He said he would eat a hat if the SNP took power in 2007. His first words after the win were ‘direct me to a hat shop….’
Willie Z @9.54
I am sure that the residents of Glasgow , Airdrie , Coatbridge , Falkirk , Stirling , Livingston , Edinburgh etc will be relieved that we now have winds that can differentiate between 2 miles ,30 miles , 50 miles , 100 miles etc .
Given that the first the west knew about chernobyl was when a Swedish nuclear plant found contamination at their plant 680 miles away and the contamination from chernobyl reached 1900 miles and contamination from Fukushima reached the west coast of America 5,000 miles away it is not unreasonable to assume that an accident at Faslane would contaminate the entire central belt of Scotland depending on wind directions etc .
The other scenario is that since britain and america have been threatening iran for more than a year it is not unreasonable to assume that iran has been looking at ways of striking back at britain and america in the event that we were to launch attacks on iran .
Doug says:
October 25, 2012 at 1:11 pm
“Willie Zwigerland says:
There is nowhere around Plymouth where a facility like Coulport could be accommodated. It is enormous and hideous. The Faslane facility could be relatively easily accommodated but not the missile handling complex. Much of it is underground and devastated the landscape of the whole area with retaining walls, watchtowers, floodlighting and razor-wire.
For those unfamiliar with the area it is clearly visible on Google Earth on the west side of the Roseneath Peninsula opposite Ardentinny.
At least the weapons dump further north at Glen Mallan/Glen Douglas is relatively hidden.
I may be wrong in the last post. Perhaps the complete destruction of Mount Edgecumbe would be acceptable. Aye right.