Here comes the love injection
Supporters of independence are enjoying an unusual feeling this morning – enjoying an issue of the Daily Mail. A screaming front-page headline warns of a “CRISIS” in the No campaign, and a double-page spread inside lays into “Better Together” chairman Alistair Darling, while Professor John Curtice lambasts the work of the ex-Chancellor and his team of “Abominable No Men” to date, noting that:
“To be effective, a campaign message needs three qualities. It needs to tell voters something new about a subject that matters to them, it has to be delivered by a credible source and it should not be widely disputed. The No side’s messages have fallen flat on all three grounds.
The No side often gives the impression constant criticism of independence will win the day. Maybe it is time for it to think again.”
And in fairness, the Unionist camp has reacted positively.
Having pledged not only “lovebombing” but also a “love injection”, we’re not sure the political and media advocates of the Union will be getting a job at Hallmark any time soon. Mindboggling as it may seem to anyone sane, barbed wire and chains – as seen in the Times on Monday and the Daily Record this morning – appear to be their idea of a “positive” message likely to “woo” voters put off by two years of relentless negativity back to the No side.
The Mail front page is just one of a number on a similar theme in the right-wing press in recent weeks. Despite polls continuing to show a lead for No, slow but steady progress for the Yes camp since the turn of the year appears to have caused an outbreak of nervousness. The voices of complacency are now the exception rather than the rule, and are castigated by their own side with increasing anxiety.
But it’s difficult to see how “Better Together” can credibly reverse their entire strategy at this late stage. Having been claiming to offer a “positive case” all along, while doing the exact opposite – to the extent, of course, that the campaign’s own staff infamously dubbed it “Project Fear” – it’s going to look absurd if they suddenly come across all cupcakes-and-kittens-on-Union-Jack-cushions now.
And frankly, we doubt that even their own colleagues would have a great deal of faith in the ability of Blair McDougall and Alistair Darling to pull that particular act off. Whatever regard some people might have for certain of Mr Darling’s personal qualities, “feelgood cheerleader” is a little-seen part of his repertoire. Both men also score poorly in “trust” ratings. And having spent the last 12 months insisting that asking (loaded) questions isn’t scaremongering at all, how can they now stop doing it?
This week’s papers show just how much difficulty the official No campaign, its constituent parts and its media supporters have with positivity when it comes to the independence debate. Even trying their best, their language and imagery is that of war and their speeches are unhinged, obsessive attacks on the SNP and Alex Salmond in particular – the most popular politician in Scotland and the leader of a government that’s still well ahead in the polls three years into its second term.
Angrily insisting that the politicians and parties Scots have elected and continue to support are evil, dishonest dictators seems an obviously foolish strategy, because it amounts to telling voters that they’re idiots who keep being hoodwinked over and over again by wily Nats.
But for the parties of the Union, it seems a very hard habit to break.
daily record poster looks like Scotland in chains?
I spotted that barbed wire snagged UJ while out and about last week. It’s the one at the main gate of the BAE shipyard in Govan.
Old habits die hard
Strangely can’t see it on their online edition! I wonder why……
….or am I being too cynical?
So, whose hand is that on the chain?
I think we need a caption competition.
I think it’s the dead hand of ‘The City of London Corporation’ the unrepresentative cancer that sits in the middle of the UK capital. So independent the monarch has to stop on it’s borders and await permission to enter. A body that has a person, the Remembrancer who sits behind the Speaker’s chair, in the shadows, ready to object to any bill that harms the ‘interests’ of the City.
Read Nicholas Shaxson’s book Treasure Islands for more.
Getting away from the City is a very, very, very good reason to vote Yes.
Sounds like it’s a rallying call for the NO side to mobilise (with guidelines supplied). Too late though, the impact they have to make is within the next 16 weeks, during that time there will be a Euro election with a media UKIP frenzy with Nigel Farage getting chummy with policies completely alien to Scotland. The No campaign would have to put in serious dosh and time implemented by very talented people, the three things I don’t think they have. Better Together are stuck in a nightmare of their own making.
On topic, they’re all at it; ‘demented ultra Unionist’ Cockers is asking Charlie Kennedy to come on board the good ship Bettertogether to provide a bit of positivity. Bizarrely he thinks negative Al ‘has done a brilliant job of demolishing Alex Salmond’s preposterous assertions about what a post-independence Scotland would look like’ but he thinks it’s time for a carrot.
I smell panic.
Rev, the “Abominable No Men” link is to a different item than intended.
I have probably got that wrong.
Anas Sarwar launched what looks like this campaign on his twitter feed last night. With a photo of him and JoLa, inviting people to join Labour for £5.
When I looked, his timeline was full of people pointing to his vote in favour of the Benefits Cap.
They really are utterly shameless.
I just don’t see how BT can now put together a positive message. We know from polls that the majority of Scots want major change at the least, and Labour certainly haven’t offered that with their recent devo-nano efforts.
It’s clear that voting ‘no’ will be a complete leap of faith into some bizarre hope that Westminster will elect Labour in 2015 and they will somehow manage to deliver a significant devolution package whilst at the same time, delivering austerity measures in line with Tory policy.
It’s delusional to believe that Labour are working for Scotland. Their own published research shows that Scotland is the 3rd wealthiest region of the UK and the Labour policy is to ‘pool and share’ across the UK. That means only one thing, Scotland will see even more of it’s wealth heading south.
Time for more of the undecideds to to think hard about what is really being offered by Labour and BT.
Quite apart from their hatred of the SNP, or anything anti Union, even if that means denigrating their own people’s democratic rights. There is really no positive message they can give.
Forget love bombs by nobody that counts, or love injections of any kind, having had two years or so of lies, threats, media manipulation, none of this will work now. They have shown their faces, and their hatreds, nothing will change that now, they are tainted goods.
We do not need them, we want to be in charge of ourselves, what is so hard for them to understand, it is democracy, it is not rocket science.
If they eventually come to understand that it is not for belittling them, it is a natural inspiration of all peoples. Then, just maybe, we can work as good neighbours and benefit each other.
Has anyone(Stu) read the positive alternative on their website, i would, only I’ve just eaten and I don’t want to heave it all back up
Had a wee drive down to physio earlier. Spotted a couple of New Saltires up and a fresh Lion Rampant. Deeside is getting behind Yes.
The “blue” text links in the articles are well worth following. Whilst I am aware of the content of many of them I find refreshing my memory of them useful.
Here’s a link to the Abominable No Man
link to facebook.com
Was i the only one who saw The Times and thought “Better Together are setting up Camps…they’ll stop at nothing!”
As for Labour…notice how the bold strong font is used for the ‘IN THE UK’ section. Scotland, know your place.
They really do NOT get it do they?
Together we can prosper.
Aye, right.
Too little, too late.
To about face now on any level is simply dishonest. They’ve spent two years telling us how crap our chances are of making a success of an independent Scotland. They’ve spent two years accusing supporters of independence of being everything from xenophobes and bigots to leftist fantasists and narrow minded flag waving bravehearts. Two years of sticking their fingers in their ears and point blank refusing to acknowledge that Westminster politics has failed and that the electorate is set on change.
Their start to the year was dramatic and the fearbombing came thick and fast from the very highest levels of each of the unionist parties. The smiles on the faces of Osborne, Balls and Alexander should be an image burned into everyone’s memories by this point. THAT is their attitude toward Scotland. THAT is how they see our relationship.
To believe otherwise and consider a no vote is to invite disaster.
The reason why the Better together anti independence campaign is so negative, is that there simply is no positive case for the union.
I often say to people, imagine Scotland is an independent sovereign nation right now, and somebody suggests giving up our nationhood, to instead be run by a Parliament in southern England (Westminster), where Scottish MP’s will make up just 9% of the total, effectively being out voted on ANY matter, oh and which will regularly insult our nation and our culture. Try to tell me the benefits?
The answer of course is there are no benefits to Scotland from this unwanted and undemocratic union, which sees Scottish taxes and oil money sent to London to pay for illegal foreign wars, unwanted nuclear missiles based adjacent to Scotland’s largest city, A high speed rail line from Birmingham to London (HS2), the building of the channel tunnel, the building of the M25, the renovation of St.Pancras train station and waterloo, London drain system renovation, the renovation of the east end of London, and so on.
So, I guess better together will have their work cut out, trying to tell us all just why letting an undemocratic parliament in England, dominated by English MP’s run Scottish affairs is a really good idea.
Honestly, it’s gonna be a real tough sell.
“TOGETHER WE CAN PROSPER” Says Anas Sarwar……
The Labour Party have had more than enough opportunity to help Scotland prosper in the past without any real success. In fact, the only success they have had is to retain a number of robotic voters who place an X at a red rosette. They have led Westminster and Holyrood, but have singularly failed to change anything of substance due to the constant string-pulling by Westminster. Their hearts lie in another place (in the case of Sarwar, that place is often thousands of miles away).
“TOGETHER, THE SCOTTISH PEOPLE CAN PROSPER” is much closer to the truth. Only a YES vote will make a change. The only people profiting from the union are the very Labour MP’s who developed this poster.
My attitude to the unionist Right love bombing Scotland is the same as if I were up a ladder and looked down to see a complete stranger climbing up towards me.
What the f…?!
Together we can divvy up the £1.5 trillion debt and the cost of the H2S (which is not coming to Northern Britain).
Thanks, but no thanks.
Chains?!? Cause obviously nothing says “positive” like chains! Total face palm! Carry on the good work lads and lassies of the bitter no campaign.
misteralz says:
“Deeside is getting behind Yes”
Trust me, you ain’t seen nuthin’ yet, but it’s coming!
I regard the Tories love of Scotland as Norman Bates with a briefcase and a pin striped suit.
Tartan Tory,
Aye, this will be Anas Sarwar and the Labour party, that this week, voted with the despised Tory Government in Westminster, to approve Ian Duncan Smith’s benefits cap. The Anas Sarwar, who decided NOT to bother attending a vote in Westminster against the bedroom tax.
I don’t think a positive No campaign would make much difference. The referendum is about the location of power not a popularity contest.
Can’t see how they can effectively promote a positive message to the masses. They can to the ultra rich.
Their message of positiveness has been restricted to past events, such as wars and glory of the empire. If the UK polls show a tory lead over labour, then real fear of the union will become a huge issue for the majority.
It must be too late now to replace Flipper and MacD but maybe they could slide someone more positive in beside them starting with a low profile and increasing to almost take-over point in a month or two, but does such a person exist?
O/T (not too early I hope) I see Barroso has lost out on the top NATO job (link to newsnetscotland.com) to a candidate from a small, oil-producing, non-nuclear nation. He takes over from a Dane, another small, non-nuclear nation.
@ Graham B
A pleasing irony.
The headline, “Together, we can prosper,” appears to have omitted, to whom “we” refers. I take it that they mean “we” Scottish MPs, who are elected to Westminster.
BT have no positive case for the union, they wanted to dominate and control the union and Scotland would be allowed to wither on the vine and be absorbed into greater England. London and Westminster were the nerve & control centre of greater England, and the outlying regions, including Scotland, Wales & N Ireland.
All the politics over the last 60 years have been spun to achieve and enshrine this control and draw the wealth from all the regions to consolidate London as the lynch pin of the union.
The only way we will get a better quality of life is by creating it ourselves, not by allowing London to treat us like a charity case using our own resources to bribe us and skimming off the regions wealth to support London.
This union is finished whatever the referendum returns, it’s only a matter of time.
Fear, slavery and poverty how do you sell that as an attractive proposition?
Im half English and live in Aldershot. I cant vote in the indyref, but ive asked all my family in Falkirk to vote yes. Cant stand the idea that my little brother will grow up in a country ruled by tories that couldnt find Falkirk on the map.
But were winning over the wrong people, looking at the polls the average age for a no voter is about 50. If were going to win, we need to assure them over pensions…
Before all this started I would never have believed a campaign could be so consistently cack handed and awful. I don’t know if BT are embarrassed themselves but they’re certainly embarrassing me.
Just had a thought about any reversal of BT policy. What would they then expect Westminster to say to all the world embassy’s where they denigrated us?
I do not think that their pride could handle the laughs that would confront them!
Try as they may, they have made their bed now. So any “local” change would just be manipulative lies. But we all see that,right?
So they’ve found a positive case for the union?! I’m not holding my breath.
It will be a step change for Better Together to move away from Project Fear. I see no sign of it yet.
They did say on GMS that there will be a Better Together meeting this morning to discuss this new strategy. It will be interesting to see who gets the memo
since all of labours scottish activists have been ditched and or ignored, westminster is now running the referendum in scotland. every other political campaign has been left to the unionist party activists to carry the campaign to the scots. this is the first time thay have ever been in this territory and they havent a clue,
“Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.”
Napoleon Bonaparte
@ Red Squirrel
“So they’ve found a positive case for the union?!”
Yes, it’s made of concrete guaranteed to sink to the bottom on entering the water.
After a YES vote, I would be keen, as we progress to make stronger ties with Northern England in terms of trade.
They are not so different from us in regards to their need to improve their lives. We can help with that, and forge strong friendships in business and commerce with that area.
In the long term, I really think it would be beneficial to us,and to them.The Geordies are beginning to think that way too, it should be encouraged.
Somehow the empty slogan “Together we can prosper” mouthed by unionists has the distinct air of sleaze about it.
Here’s BT’s biggest problem. For at least 18 months they believed that taking journalists for lunch and getting their press releases reproduced in the MSM was the same thing as running a campaign. They were and are so utterly complacent and arrogant that they imagined that Yes was failing because it wasn’t doing the same thing as them. But Yes was building a massive network of grassroots supporters, quietly empowering and energising many tens of thousands of folk in communities across the country. Now that No is losing support they’ve nowhere to turn for help. Instead of getting their activists out and campaigning they are beginning to have to firefight, there’s no-one on the ground and their communications strategy is already beginning to look like one of the biggest failures in political history. Their online presence is dismal, they are miles behind Yes on both the big social media sites. They have no energy or creativity, nothing like Wings, nothing like National Collective, nothing like the hundreds of local groups that Yes has. Just an over-staffed office, jam packed with middle aged men imagining that just one more Daily Record scare story will do it, oh that and sending (cough, splutter, chortle) LETTERS to punters, of course.
Oh to be a fly on the wall at one of the very few BT campaign meetings being held around the country…
“So, let’s get positive with our message to the plebs, who wants to start?” says the chairperson
“”, followed by blank stares, nervous fidgeting, shifting around on chairs…
Do you think the penny is dropping with them that they’ve backed the wrong horse?
It must be hugely worrying to them when they can’t articulate to each other what exactly they are FOR.
That must be incredibly demoralising and depressing and coupled with the direction and movement of the polls now, many will start to lose any enthusiasm that they may once have had…
We live in very interesting (and exciting) times
Kittens and roses on a union jack cushion might have worked if they’d started with that two years ago. It ain’t gonna work now. Anyway, we’ve been here before. It would be funny (but tedious) to compile an archive of all the re-launches of the “positive case for the union”. Every single one has caused no change at all in the level of fear, doom, gloom and threat. I don’t really see this one being any different.
Love Bombing = too violent
Love Injection = TOO CREEPY!!!!
and if the swing to yes continues, the unionists only option will be to return to the table with devo max,
a list of all of the unionists saying no to devo max on the ballot paper from 12 months ago will be helpful. also a list of clips from the yes camp supporting devo max would be helpful. If, as i believe this will happen, then the unionists will rue the day they ignored their own supporters and opposed it being offered as an option on the referendum paper. especially if they are forced to offer it up front? lets face it, they would all rather just ditch their devo hee haw proposals right now, but they may be forced to come back and try and sell them to the scottish electorate. Im sure i rememvber the unionists saying it was yes or no and nothing else. does anyone have any you tube footage of this?
Oh gawd all this talk of kittens made me realise who JoLa reminds me of – Deloris Umbridge!
Here Stu, when are you setting Panelbase loose again?
BTW, Great work with the Metro Ads, Rev.
Result+++, Edinburgh’s lovin’it!
link to twitter.com
If we are independent,then we as a nation again will live long and prosper,of that I no have no doubt.
If they didn’t have every newspaper, ITV and the mighty unbiased and impartial haha BBC, where would be Project Fear really be? Struggling in the polls, lying to Scotland every minute of everyday, in fighting, creepy love bombing and sinking in the polls. Wait what?!
That photo of the ad makes it seem as if Samuel L.Jackson is part of the ad lol.Better do what he says.
Have the online newspapers changed tack ? ive noticed that the anti independence articles are not the lead any more ,or am reading to much into this .
Talking of the Daily Record, they don’t have the wit to be deliberately amusing, but they did make me smile today.
link to order-order.com
@schrodingerscat says:
Dave Cameron, told us there would be “no devo max question to please Alex Salmond,” ( ha ha big smile). “It will be yes or no. We are not going to play Alex Salmonds game.”
I am of the opinion we should not tell unionists their campaign sucks and is a gift to Scotland’s ambitions, but instead praise it and them to high heaven.
I’m lovin the Scottish Labour poster “Together We Can Prosper” with the partial image of a bairn on a swing.
In the light of Scottish Labour MPs’ unequivocal support for the coalition government’s benefit cap which will send nearly half a million more children into even deeper poverty in the coming four years, on top of the already appalling levels of poverty and inequality in the UK, they should rename their new spring/summer charm offensive “Children In Chains”.
Reference –
Welfare cap will push 345,000 children into poverty in just four years, warns Save the Children
link to independent.co.uk
ps
A quick word count of Scottish Labour’s April 2013 document “A childhood for everyone? Child poverty in Scotland”, it mentions the SNP 28 times and “welfare” 16 times. It should be obvious by now where the red troughists’ priorities lie –
link to scottishlabour.org.uk
“It will be yes or no. We are not going to play Alex Salmonds game.”
what will they say when it moves from YES or devo hee haw to YES or Devo Max?
i fail to see the logic of this result by the unionists
The only ” positive” for the union that I’ve heard is the old….we punch above our weight on the world stage…thing.Trouble is,most ordinary Scots don’t really see that as a benefit.Its not them who get to swan off around the world,staying in fancy hotels whilst pretending to be a big shot,is it? And we have to spend billions on trident to keep up the pretence.That maybe suits Jenny Marra,but it doesn’t play well with ordinary folk.
Allen,
Not sure that the papers have changed their tack, more likely that recent bad news for BT, the polling figures and a disastrous Labour devolution offer have given a false impression of balance.
They’re still running plenty of scare stories – currency and EU etc repeatedly.
O/T – apologies.
Just had a conversation with a Scots-Canadian lady who is returning to Scotland in order to vote YES in the referendum.
We’re gonna win this thing.
By jove old boy I do believe I’ve cracked it what?
I do believe I have uncovered the source of this new ‘enlightenment’ that has come across Better Together all of a sudden. It would appear, to the untrained eye, that the Liberal Democrats have now taken up the cudgel of leading Better Together from the front. As we all know, whatever Nick Clegg says then it will happen, right?
link to tinyurl.com
@ GrahamB, 12.03pm
“It must be too late now to replace Flipper and MacD but maybe they could slide someone more positive in beside them starting with a low profile and increasing to almost take-over point in a month or two, but does such a person exist?”
Who’s left?
“O/T (not too early I hope) I see Barroso has lost out on the top NATO job (link to newsnetscotland.com) to a candidate from a small, oil-producing, non-nuclear nation. He takes over from a Dane, another small, non-nuclear nation.!
Hope the UK government at least paid his fare and expenses when he came over to misrepresent his lack of authority and threaten about the EU. It would seem the UK doesn’t have the clout he might have thought when he “applied” for the NATO job. Amazing how the little, non-threatening countries are deemed to have the right people for important diplomatic roles.
Don’t forget some of these No folk really aren’t the sharpest tacks in the box. Add in to the mix that they have no shame, and that they are quite happy to indulge in Orwellian double-think and double-speak, they have their launch pad for the new “positive” campaign. It should be a hoot casting up all the nonsense from the last two years (even though they will probably believe that they never said any of this).
As for how long they will maintain it…I could probably hold my breath.
No reply yet from Catherine Stihler MEP or Richard Simpson MSP.
@ Red Squirrel, if Labour have found a positive case for the Union they probably know where the Holy Grail and the Ark of the Covenant are too.
“To be effective, a campaign message needs three qualities. It needs to tell voters something new about a subject that matters to them, it has to be delivered by a credible source and it should not be widely disputed. The No side’s messages have fallen flat on all three grounds.
The No side often gives the impression constant criticism of independence will win the day. Maybe it is time for it to think again.”
So everyone now knows that Prof Curtice is the only expert on referendums in the world ever but if I was running BetterTogtherBBC or say that oil trader UKOK donor that paid Serb warlord Arkan a million bucks, I would now be asking the Prof stuff like “WHY DIDNT YOU TELL US THIS YEARS AGO!” Did Ian Taylor donate any more hard-earned anyway? bet he didnt
Actually bettertogether project fear is so bad, you’d think I was running it.
if it wasnt for the polls at the moment
the offer of devo nano wouldnt even be on the table
yes or no, remember that?
depending on the polls in the next few weeks will depend on who comes forward
tory, devo nothing
labour, devo promise of nothing
libdem, devo promise of somthing
i predict we will be seeing more of ming the merciless in the coming months, we should start digging for quotes now and head the no camp off at the pass.
Darling and Macdougal are not cutting the mustard, they must be replaced immediately with the Rt Hon Iain Davidson and Scottish Labour Legend Johann Lamont. Its the only feasible option we have to keep Scots in their box.
If, according to the Westminster Government legal opinion, Scotland was extinguished in 1707, how can the Unionist referendum campaign claim we are better together, or that together we can do it, or that together we can prosper. If Scotland was extinguished, that only leaves greater England. So who is this ‘we’ they keep referring to? And how can greater England be better together with itself?
Their arguments need untangling. Though the result of that might be more folk seeing through them and seeing them for the convoluted scare stories that they are.
Incidentally, saw on Facebook two women, claimed to be business women either with their own businesses or in partnership, saying they didn’t trust our First Minister or anything he stood for. They’re voting no as they trade with England and hope to expand to Ireland and Canada. Perhaps Business for Scotland might think of putting together a presentation aimed specifically at business women. They should be swayed by their present arguments…but perhaps not. Perhaps they need to be tweaked to appeal to women who appear not to be engaging with the positive pro indy business material.
New OneNation Labour need to get proper people who stand for this weeks set of core principles running the campaign.
My suggestions are Malcolm Rifkind and Michael Gove. I appreciate they are a big more “left wing” compared to Darling, but needs must.
@schrodingerscat
Think often how Cameron can re visit devo max as I think he is now aware of the position he has got himself into, and that escape route is no longer an option for him, now that yes is on a positive move and no is slipping.
Will be very interesting to see how low and grovelling this lot can go.
Together We Will Prosper!
Mark this in the Diary…the day the unionist parties announced a “Free shares in Scottish Water for a NO vote”.
Give it 6 weeks and Vince Cable will be on air saying “Its the right thing to do!”
YES Campaign:
We are a positive grass-roots movement, we have an online presence, we have won the core arguments, we are winning the debate, we have momentum in the polls, and we are more likely to get our vote out on the day.
Project Fear:
No grass-root involvement, Tory funded, Labour led, completely dependent on the unionist news media and broadcasters, a negative, scaremongering, hectoring, Westminster knows best campaign, NO support soft.
The Daily Mail has been front and centre in supporting Project Fear. It is ironic that it now complains the NO campaign has got it’s strategy and tactics completely wrong.
The Unionists are panicking.
I read somewhere last night that Blair McDougall in his last campaign had started with a 28% lead which he ultimately lost. In this campaign he started with a 24% lead. Now I know why every time I see him on T.V. he looks like dour so and so who’s dropped a fiver and picked up 50p.
Meanwhile, in another part of ‘the Union’, the director of the Wales Governance Centre at Cardiff University is warning his compatriots to beware a Labour Party that throws Wales to the wolves noting: “Scottish Labour seem to have no compunction about throwing Wales, one of the poorest parts of the Union, under the bus to shore up their own position” see link to archive.is
Here again is a call for Scotland’s Barnett funding to be cut by £4bn because Scotland (and London) are apparantly the only parts of ‘the Union’ to have “proven economically resiliant in the face of recession and austerity.”
Hmmm, tell that the 400,000 Scots in poverty.
Apparantly, Welsh FM Carwyn Jones assured the National Assembly that he had told Ed Miliband that Barnett should be reformed. So who’s Miliband ‘playing’ then, Jones or Lamont?
I feel prophetess Alison Moyet was thinking of Scottish Labour and Scotland when she sang Love Resurrection back in the day. I fear even this is beyond the Almighty.
Lets be optimistic, lets say that we won’t toil in vain
If we pull together we’ll never fall apart again
We all need a love resurrection
Just a little divine intervention
Grouse Beater says:
“I am of the opinion we should not tell unionists their campaign sucks and is a gift to Scotland’s ambitions, but instead praise it and them to high heaven.”
Aye, GB, we should all pretend we’re voting No. As someone else suggested a while ago if we do this, get the betting odds up on a Yes vote we could all make a killing as we left!
Devo Max, just isn’t possible though.
Think of the tax issues, every reason Labour gave for no more tax powers, was down to having Scotland competing on the British stage, it ain’t gonna happen unless we get independence.
They are now trying the same trick they tried in ’79. Let’s not let them fool anyone living in Scotland who is up for Devo Max, Labour have said it themselves, they are one nation and they don’t want competing tax regimes in their great nation fk’ing up London. That’s without even mentioning the hypocrisy that would exist over currency union if devo max was muted (but not actually implemented)
The end is nigh and oh how we will rejoice as our nation throws off the restrictions of devolution and rises to it’s natural place in the world. Alongside other nations of peace and prosperity. They’ve been keeping our seat warm for a very long time, let’s not keep them waiting any longer.
Speaking of Wales, the Royal Mail privatisers at Benefit-Cappers Together seem to be at odds on whether to be nice to Wales or carry out a war against it –
UK Labour lovebomb Wales
link to leftfootforward.org
Together we can prosper does not contain the implied guarantee contained in, Together we will prosper.”
He was no-one but he worked hard.
He even got promoted. No one really knew why.
He just kept his head down and got on with what was asked.
Then one night the enemy came.
He knew he could fight but he didnt.
He joined them instead.
They gave him a car.
They gave him riches.
They put him on TV.
When you go to vote on Sept 18th.
Think of Danny Alexander and vote YES.
Popped into bookies’ earlier, got 7/1 in Ladbrokes for OVER 55% Yes (must be over – on the nail won’t do) but there’s a £200 cap. The first lass I asked couldn’t find the odds, no-one’s ever asked her for them – the second lass knew where it was as she recently took a bet on a Yes win.
Nipped into William Hill’s, and they offered a flat 10/3, no ‘under or over’ options.
Popped into bookies’ earlier, got 7/1 in Ladbrokes for OVER 55% Yes (must be over – on the nail won’t do) but there’s a £200 cap. The first lass I asked couldn’t find the odds, no-one’s ever asked her for them – the second lass knew where it was as she recently took a bet on a Yes win.
Nipped into William Hill’s, and they offered a flat 10/3, no ‘under or over’ options.
Joe Kane: “Benefit-Cappers Together”
Excellent
So, after spending a couple of years telling us we’re too, poor, wee and stupid, ye cannae do this and ye cannae do that… or else!… being abused, debased and belittled, basically, by Better Together, we’re now supposed to be taken in by some kind of love-smothering campaign…?
The case of the abuser and the abusee is an oft-used analogy, but it is difficult to escape the similarities in terminology when discussing the UK(Westminster)-Scotland relationship and the way in which Better Together has conducted itself.
After all the attempts at controlling behaviour (We’ll say whether you can use the pound or not!), the insults (scroungers, subsidy junkies, namecalling), the humiliation (too wee, poor, stupid), the alienation (you’ll be thrown out of the EU, etc.), the instilling of fear (numerous and daily scare stories), the threats (too numerous to mention) among others, which haven’t had the desired effect, and now that it seems like the abusee (Scotland) has had enough and, no matter what, is leaving the relationship for good, we get to the final stage: the abuser will panic, they will say that; they really, really love you (lovebombs), they’ll change their behaviour (Because we’re just so good together!), they’ll offer up the world (devo-everything and lots of jam tomorrow), they’ll ‘show’ how wanted we are (celebrities, etc. ‘It was just a joke! We were kidding… Come on, what’s wrong with you, can’t you take a joke!?’) and etc.
All fairly typical abuser behaviour.
And if we are stupid enough to be taken in by the false promises and ‘It’s going to be great – you’ll see!’ lies by voting ‘No’…?
Like all abusive partnerships, there will be a short time of sweetness and light… and then the abuse will start up all over again as if it had never ended.
I have faith that the good people of Scotland will not fall for the sleekit weasel-words of Better Together’s upcoming vacuous and false we-were-only-kidding-we-love-you-really campaign.
A ‘Yes’ will put an end to it once and for all. Then the people of Scotland can be truly free. They deserve nothing less.
@Grouse Beater
Its both a vacant promise and shows up their desperation. They are trying to once again use Obama style “Yes We Can” campaigning. That was so so long ago and if they think Scotland wants to be America, well more fool them.
dmw42 at 1.31 pm
I read the article
link to archive.is
and the following comment and this caught my eye:
“Welsh Labour presented themselves as “Standing up for Wales”.
Here is Welsh Labour in action:
link to bbc.co.uk
Nothing like Democracy then……..
Ian Davidson will be allowed to lead the no campaign if they can’t find a donkey to take the job on!
Regarding the “Unionist facing press” don’t be surprised that there will be a change of tack from the Sun and Daily Record. No-one wants to be associated with losers, which is the NO campaign. Nothing positive for the Union just relentlessly negativity which really puts people off. When the polls show that the YES campaign is in front, which in my opinion it already is. They will get behind the YES campaign.
We have ONLY one option, between a brighter future where we will make some mistakes, but smaller countries can turn things they get wrong, around much more quickly, Iceland is an example of this, as is Ireland.Point is WE made them WE fix them.
Or we keep getting robbed by an ever desperate UK, on top of that, they will remove any small powers we currently have, make no doubt about that.
They know,that not to, is to allow this to happen again, so they will make us WHOLLY dependent on them.
We would be back to being too small, and we will have proved, that we certainly are too stupid.
We have more emerging faith in what we can do, our aspirations are leagues above theirs.
So what should we choose, you guess!
YES that is the right one.!
Papadox says:
Ian Davidson will be allowed to lead the no campaign if they can’t find a donkey to take the job on!
Hee Haw! Hee Haw! Hee Haw!
I’ve been thinking more about today’s Daily hate mail front page about better together and i have to say, am I alone in smelling a rat, of the better together kind.
Let’s consider, over the last few weeks, we have had better together going to the press to OPENLY claim they cannot compete with the YES campaign, and that they cannot get enough money. Now we have the uber right wing and uber SNP hating Daily Mail telling us just how awful better together actually is.
I’m just not sure about all this, is it possible that BT are trying to lull independence supporters into a false sense of security? Is something afoot?
I simply don’t think this all adds up. Not for one second.
Ian B,
I am amazed that they are still offering that, although they have lowered the cap. It was 300 a couple of months ago.
O/T Response from SPT regarding complaint about removal of Wings advert:
“Thank you for your comments, please see below a statement released by SPT.
“SPT advertising contract guidelines state that Subway sites should not be used to campaign or lobby for political benefit. Our advertising agency applies that standard to all commercial bookings but unfortunately this particular ad slipped through their net. The ad was taken down as a result.”
Extract from contract states:
3.22 Approval of Advertisements
…..any advertisement of a political, religious, sectarian, racist or sexual nature or which is likely to bring SPT into disrepute will not be permitted or approved.
I trust this information is helpful in explaining why the advert was withdrawn.
Sent on behalf of complaints”
So, in conclusion, carrying adverts on the subway for a legitimate pro-independence website, adverts that use facts and inoffensive language, is likely to bring SPT into disrepute.
But carrying adverts on the subway (via the Metro, which SPT gets paid to distribute) promulgating the pro-dependence views of ‘An Ordinary Man’ that contain slurs about the Government of Scotland (‘defined by what they are against’ etc) will not bring SPT into disrepute.
Question is, disrepute with whom?
The answer looks unmistakably like: the Scottish division of the British Labour Party.
Robert Louis says:
“I simply don’t think this all adds up. Not for one second.”
Is it not just them trying to scare the apathy out of the unionist side RL? That and trying to get more dosh out of their ‘supporters’. Good luck to them with that one.
Interesting to read here Blair “Not Rising but Falling” MacDougall ran another campaign once and lost. One suspects in this one he hopes to redeem himself.
Caught Alasdair Gray interviewed last night by a rather po-faced journalist. His body eccentricities are of the kind you might expect from a wee blushing boy contorted with embarrassment and sexual awakening when his Aunty is about to kiss him but is unable to run away.
He anwered questions with usual falsetto squeak and verbal clicks and ticks to pronounce a few good one-liners. But it took some discipline not to look away, rather like a rabbit is fatally entranced by a weasel leaping about.
Some writers are better read than heard.
SPT = Labour quango.
As I’ve often pointed out before, Labour run Glasgow city chambers, is Scotland’s very own Tammany hall.
X_sticks,
Maybe, you could be right. I just wonder though, it does all seem to be very honest and open, which is not typical of BT.
0/T
Some resource material. Much is made of the size and time spent on the White Paper but I wonder how many people are aware of the time and effort spent by Westminster. To date 12 documents at over a 1,000 pages have been produced. I suspect there will be more.
link to gov.uk
Guess who spoke at The Cowal Conservative lunch club, Argyll Hotel, 7th Feb 2014?
Jackie Baillie MSP
link to tinyurl.com
Who’s the tartan Tory now then?
Oops! Looks like we have awoken the sleeping giant folks with our constant calls for Scottish independence. In fact the sleeping giant is now making so much noise even Willie ‘bus driver’ Rennie is getting in on the act., courtesy of Severin Carrell of course.
link to tinyurl.com
I’m still waiting for a phone call from relatives down south begging Scotland to stay.
Surely I can’t be the only one?
Robert Louis . I think the Mail are in desperation trying to rally the Unionists . Trying to scare them into action. If you do not get off your backside Yes will win.
Just another fear tactic only the flip side I think instead of trying to lull us in to false of security , it will raise our morale encouraging us to work harder. Its also may encourage those who still believe we cannot do it to come on board
Welcome to the first-timers here!
Here’s a snippet from todays Times, with a ‘deeply worrying development for the No campaign’ (can’t archive cos it’s behind a firewall)
Scots’ support for the First Minister’s position is underlined by separate evidence in the YouGov poll showing that he and his deputy, Nicola Sturgeon, are trusted by voters more than Alistair Darling and David Cameron.
Asked to think about the statements the senior politicians have made in the independence debate, a total of 36 per cent trust Mr Salmond, compared with 56 per cent who do not. Ms Sturgeon’s ratings are 38 per cent and 52 per cent. Ms Sturgeon, who leads the referendum campaign for the government, has seen her trust level increase by three points since a similar YouGov poll in September, while Mr Salmond’s has remained level.
In a deeply worrying development for the “no” campaign, Mr Darling, head of Better Together, is less trusted than he was last September. Only 28 per cent now trust him, down from 31 per cent, while 61 per cent do not trust him, up from 55 per cent.
Faith in Mr Cameron has increased by two points, but is at 22 per cent, while the percentage of Scots who do not trust him is also up two points and is at a damaging 71 per cent.
1,072 Scottish adults took part in the poll, carried out between March 20-24.
Why am I voting YES? Simple – the Union side has NOTHING to offer other than cuts, austerity, derision and contempt. I see absolutely no benefit in Scotland remaining in the Union. It’s as simple as that and I suspect many feel the same. It’s something that BT does not understand. That and the Scottish sense of humour!!!
@ GH Graham
Extraordinary – that Labour will get into bed with the Tories to spite Scotland.
I’m tempted to call such unprincipled politicians whores.
Muscleguy
You are aware that the Corporation of the City of London has an MP. This MP is elected by residents who enjoy tenuis tenure conditions, as well as workers nominated by the major employers?
G H Graham
Aye, the FM had some fun regarding that at FMQ’s yesterday. I never thought I’d see the day, when Labour in Scotland were so cosy with the Tories, that they would speak at Tory meetings. Labour really have just become the RED tories, and have betrayed all the Scots who used to vote for them.
A message to BT: Please keep up the good work with the abuse, insults, isolation, fear stories, alienation threats and everything else you have been throwing at Scotland over the last two years. It’s doing a great job for the Yes campaign and good regular reminders of why we must all vote Yes!
For those who haven’t read it yet, there is an excellent piece on the Scottish press over on the wee ginger dug today:
link to weegingerdug.wordpress.com
@cearc –
Aye – still 7/1, although, strangely, you get the same for 50 – 55%.
Was talking to a friend a couple of weeks ago who is probably more of a Don’t-Care than a Don’t-Know, but is very good at the horses, fixed-odds football etc. When I told him the prices (and I think I quoted 4/1 for a straight over-50% Yes vote) he just shrugged his shoulders and said ‘Well, there you are. It’s going to be a No vote.’
For him, it’s cut and dried – you just cannot make any other logical deduction based on those prices for a straight FPTP two-horse race. Like you, I can’t believe they’re still so high – either the bookies know something we don’t, or they’re in for the Mother of all Doings come Sept 19th.
@ Ian Brotherhood
Aye, I mentioned some days ago my Dublin acquaintances had asked what bookies were offering. “Da’re usually roight predictin’ how day won’t lose.”
Anyone shed any light on the Scotsman run story re the pensions funding?
@ Grouse Beater
You don’t think Mr. Gray might have been quite cunning in presenting possibly the only interviewee I’ve ever see who couldn’t be interrupted? Just a thought.
I was in on an interesting conversation yesterday evening. A man in his 70s talking with a woman of similar age. A couple of weeks ago, in conversation with me, the woman expressed surprise at the number of people she knew who were seriously thinking of voting ‘Yes’. The man in his 70s said (more or less): “You know, a few months ago I was for maintaining the union and voting ‘No’. But I’m looking at what’s going on, and it’s not about Alex Salmond. It’s about Scotland, and I just feel we can do better than this. I’m seriously thinking of voting ‘Yes’.
There are many people who are taking a very serious look at the options, and waiting to see what happens over the next three to four months. So far, BT have not managed to look as though they are presenting a positive case. Lab/Con/LibDem are now coming forward with proposals for a new settlement within the union, but it’s probably too late. They ought to have got together and come up with a firm proposal six to twelve months ago.
Of course, much may still happen, and the closer we get to September 18 the less time either side will have to recover from a mistake. But, as things stand, it’ll be a close run thing. And Labour in Scotland are not going to recover from this in anything like the short-term, and maybe will never again dominate in the way they have done for the past thirty years.
This referendum campaign has changed Scotland, whatever the outcome.
Argyle and Bute conservatives recently held their meeting in the Argyle hotel. Guest speaker Jackie Baillie. Whit yi couldnae make that up
jon esquierdo says:
Argyle and Bute conservatives recently held their meeting in the Argyle hotel. Guest speaker Jackie Baillie. Whit yi couldnae make that up
To be fair jon you could make it up but no one would believe you they just start calling you a crackpot.
@ John B
The more people are open about their doubts over a union run by Westminster, the more the convinced proclaim they are voting for Scotland, the more will join us.
One of the greatest impulses in human nature is the herd instinct.
The way to begin reversing the neo-liberal assault on our democratic rights, the way to roll back globalisation that destroys rights and communities, the only way we can stop colossal wealth residing in fewer and fewer hands, is to react in mass protest.
Scotland voting for Scotland is a tremendous step to attain that ideal.
@Seasick Dave
strangely enough, I’ve not had a single phone call either, with pleas from relatives and friends south of the Border to vote ‘No’. Of course, it may be that I am overestimating the number of friends I have in the south (though I could hardly do the same with my relatives, unless they’re all dead and no-one told me); or it may be that they wish they were living here and had the opportunity to escape from Westminster control and live as a free, responsible Nation.
Hubby phoned me this morning to say:I have the biggest smile on my face this morning,and im reading the metro!The Rev.is a genius!
Couldnt agree more.
The bookies are London based and are in receipt of very inaccurate information. They took a tanking in 2011 on the Scottish election and I can go back to 1967 where they lost a lot of money on Hamilton. Winnie Ewing started at 100/6 (16/1)and at the end it was 7/2 and a lot of folk I knew among local bookies made a lot of cash because they knew what was going on. Similarly myself and not a few others landed pretty substantial bets for Jim Sillars victory in Govan – again because we knew the score and the bookies did not.
At the moment were I very rich I would be putting huge sums on any score above 41% which is offered at 5/6. As I am not very rich I am putting moderate sums on at 55% or more at a very generous 7/1.
The odds do not properly reflect recent polls which are putting us in the middle to upper 40s so we should be at well less than 2/1 for a YES rather than 3/1 and 7/2.
The bookies are taking very little money on NO – perhaps because the odds are prohibitive, though if they are convinced it will be NO result that’s what they will do to keep taking money on YES votes. It is not all to do with volume of bets
@jon esquierdo – FM got a good wee dig about this in FMQ’s
watch from 11:19
link to scottishparliament.tv
@Robert Louis, that is the very best persuasion I have read, because of course nobody would vote for that.
@Simon MacDonald, I don’t think you realise how many of us oldsters having been waiting on this day coming. I will be much worse off with my pension,OAP, if we remain attached to the Union. My second pension is one hundred percent Scots but the State one is in one helluva state believe me. Scotland can look after it’s own and it is those in the 80 age group we really need to persuade, they are the ones who believe the lies they are being told, most of the younger ones like me and Husband have access to the internet and as you can see, use it.
Re Daily Mail.
The BT Crisis article is only in the Scottish edition (circulation 100k, Wikipedia). The English DM has a splash about four people catching TB from their cats. More people will be reading the Wings ad in Metro today! (circulation 124k)
It’s a warning shot. The Daily Mail are telling BT to pull their fingers out and do something. As BT are congenitally incapable of sustained levels of positivity there will be more DOOM by Monday. It’s all they have. Flames, smoke and booming metallic voices (“naw, ye cannae”).
Remember though, it’s just a wee scaredy man pulling levers from behind a curtain. Curtains he claimed on expenses when he flipped his house.
I had a response from SPT to my complaint (reproduced at the end of this post) and here is my reply:
‘Thank you for your reply to my complaint. I am puzzled as to your comment regarding ‘Political Benefit’.
The Wings Over Scotland News site, whose adverts you have banned, concerns itself with news and comment on Scottish politics and the referendum from a pro independence viewpoint. The Daily Record (to give an example) is a newspaper and online news and comment organisation which offers news and comment from a pro Labour and anti independence viewpoint.
Can you therefore confirm to me that you would also refuse advertising which promotes the Daily Record?
I look forward to an early reply.
Yours faithfully
Andrew Morton’
On 28 Mar 2014, at 13:12, complaint wrote:
Thank you for your comments, please see below a statement released by SPT.
“SPT advertising contract guidelines state that Subway sites should not be used to campaign or lobby for political benefit. Our advertising agency applies that standard to all commercial bookings but unfortunately this particular ad slipped through their net. The ad was taken down as a result.”
Extract from contract states:
3.22 Approval of Advertisements
…..any advertisement of a political, religious, sectarian, racist or sexual nature or which is likely to bring SPT into disrepute will not be permitted or approved.
I trust this information is helpful in explaining why the advert was withdrawn.
Sent on behalf of complaints
@Helena Brown
I receive regular emails from my company pensioner group about what disasters may befall our pensions come indy. The latest one was about the reversal of the EU proposal regarding relaxation of cross border rules. In reply I fired off the link to Derek Bateman’s excellent post of today on this very subject. In my opinion Pensions is the one issue where we risk losing big time and we need to start concentrating our attention there.
Any truth in the story that the funding of any further devolution to Scotland,Wales and the English regions,proposed by the UK parties,is to be based on population?
A few people on this thread have commented, with appropriate contempt, on Jackie Baillie’s fraternisation with her Tory mates at the Cowal lunch club.
If you haven’t watched the First Minister chew her up and spit her out on this one then give yourself a treat on the Scottish Parliament website.
Well, here’s another little example of that heroine of SLAB “red socialism” in action.
At a recent independence debate, in Helensburgh, run by the local newspaper; where the unionist case was being fronted by dear Jackie and Tory MP David Mundell, someone made a critisism of David Cameron – in a flash one of the unionist speakers leapt (somewhat ineptly) to his defence. Was it Mundell – was it hell he wasn’t quick enough – it was Jackie Baillie !
Only a small incident but what could be a better symbol of just how degenerate Scottish Labour has become ? After independence we need to be rid of Jackie and all of her ilk !
‘how can they now stop doing it?’
That’s the thing Stu,they can’t.
They genuinely believe Salmond is a dictator,Scotland is too wee and too poor and that the sky will fall in.Those are their heartfelt beliefs and they would have to deny themselves to not do it.
I am pig sick of this tired line they deliver that the FM doesn’t ‘answer the question’ it is a ploy as the FM always answers it’s just that JoLa and JaBa don’t understand the answers.
After independence we need to be rid of Jackie and all of her ilk !
Unfortunately as Jackie is an MSP we have to hope her constituents kick her erse oot. Flipper and the Chairchoob on the other hand…..
Another response from SPT. As expected they ain’t going to admit they’re wrong, however something very interesting in their copy /paste of an extract from the local government act – see item (3).
Anyone from Aberdeen want to challenge Aberdeen cooncil regarding their breach of this item?
‘Thank you for your email.
SPT advertising contract guidelines state that Subway sites should not be used to campaign or lobby for political benefit. Our advertising agency – Primesight – applies that standard to all commercial bookings but unfortunately this particular ad slipped through their net. The ad was taken down as a result not due to any complaints received.
We cannot give you names of anyone who has complained to SPT as that would be a breach of data protection rules.
SPT follows terms set out in the Local Government Act 1986 – for all local authorities – and in particular we refer to the following as best practice:
2. — Prohibition of political publicity.
(1) A local authority shall not publish [or arrange for the publication of] any material which, in whole or in part, appears to be designed to affect public support for a political party.
(2) In determining whether material falls within the prohibition regard shall be had to the content and style of the material, the time and other circumstances of publication and the likely effect on those to whom it is directed and, in particular, to the following matters—
(a) whether the material refers to a political party or to persons identified with a political party or promotes or opposes a point of view on a question of political controversy which is identifiable as the view of one political party and not of another;
(b) where the material is part of a campaign, the effect which the campaign appears to be designed to achieve.
(3) A local authority shall not give financial or other assistance to a person for the publication of material which the authority are prohibited by this section from publishing themselves.
SPT does not distribute the Metro newspaper, nor do we have editorial control over the paper and its contents. The paper is available at the entrance to the Subway and it is entirely up to customers if they choose to take it to read or not.’
I’ve now had a pro forma response from SPT regarding my reply to their original email. I’ve fired one back pointing out that they’ve completely failed to address my point and would they like to have another go.
Something tells me the picture editor at The Times and the sub who wrote the headline weren’t working together…
In fact, I guess we have a secret sympathiser on the picture desk. Certainly that crumpled union flag caught on the razor wire of Scottish obstinacy sums up the BT campaign.
O/T a bit.
Anent the “more powers” nonsense.
Advise to all pupils and students. And now to voters in the referendum.
Read the paper and answer the question!
Ian Brotherhood – I put a bet on yesterday for 55%+ in Glasgow. I’ve now got £250 @ 7-1 and an early doors bet for £100 @ 9-1 and just to be safe I’ve taken £50 @ 7-1 for 50-55% to cover my outlay. I’m more than certain it’s gonna be 63%+ so here’s looking at you!
Ian Brotherhood, maybe everyone’s been taking Frankie Boyle’s advice and been ‘lying to the pollsters so we can shaft the bookies’
Schrodingers cat says
” Im sure i rememvber the unionists saying it was yes or no and nothing else. does anyone have any you tube footage of this?”
Cant find any utube video Schrodinger(how odd because I can clearly remember cameron saying exactly that he would not give Salmond a consolation prize) will this do
link to exacteditions.com
I believe our next “love bomb” is a visit from Ex PM John Major, the man who had an affair with Edwina Currie.
Sorry about that folks, the very vision of that almost made me throw-up myself, so if Major starts to tell us about how much ‘better together’ we are by voting NO, just think about who he was ‘banging together’ with as PM.
Oh No where’s the bucket.
@Davy – I’m glad it’s a ‘lovebomb’ and not a ‘loveinjection’..oh no going to throw up too..
@ Grousebeater
There you go:
link to motherearthnews.com
The whole question of what BT can do next is a good one.
Apparently BT broadband is THE most complained about service provider.
Further evidence BT is a toxic brand..
Seriously though, the whole unionist shambles is becoming more laughable by the day, could that be the plan, get us so used to laughing at their latest nonsense we start allowing some of their garbage and lies to sneak past unchallenged ?
Stay vigilant people, BT are no longer on the run, they are backed into a corner, this is when they will fight harder.
Stay on their case and finish them off once and for all.
When folk realise that project fear has been going on for about as long as the union has been maybe they might think twice about voting no. Just a thought.
@john king says: 5:58pm
I’m sure it was on EBC news that I saw it, don’t know whether it was on ENGLISH version or colonial version or more likely both. It was round about the time the wording of questions was announced by ECK, think that was Cameron’s response.