Edging closer to the truth
Listeners to today’s “Good Morning Scotland” were treated (from 2h 7m at that link) to a consummate masterclass in the art of evasion from Labour’s Scottish branch-office manager Jim Murphy. The bulk of a 13-minute segment was devoted to Murphy’s claim that a Labour vote in this May’s general election would bring about an end to foodbanks in Scotland, although the pledge steadily degraded as interviewer Gary Robertson pressed fruitlessly for detail.
(Murphy refused to say if or when any money generated by a Labour UK government would be given to the Scottish Government, wouldn’t be drawn on when the need for foodbanks would be eradicated, shot down a straw man on benefit sanctions and eventually conceded that in fact there would always be foodbanks, by way of a brief diversion to “I do a lot of work for charity but I don’t like to talk about it”.)
Towards the end, though, Robertson asked Murphy the question Scottish Labour really don’t want to answer, and this time he almost landed a knockout blow.
Murphy at first tried the same approach as he had when we’d hijacked an LBC phone-in to ask him last week – waffling on about 1924, and even answering his own question when Robertson wouldn’t play ball. But with no producer cutting him off, Robertson wouldn’t be deflected and kept pushing for a meaningful response, and at 1m 11s in our clip above, he more or less got one.
ROBERTSON: So is the answer to my question “Yes, if Ed Miliband doesn’t have the most seats, he won’t be Prime Minister”?
MURPHY: No, Gary, that’s not what I’m saying, you know it isn’t.
We suspect that’s as close to an explicit admission as we’re ever going to get that contrary to what every Labour MP in Scotland is telling their constituents, the Labour Party absolutely IS prepared to form a minority government if it gets fewer seats than the Tories but is supported by the SNP.
We told you five days ago that Labour were laying the groundwork for a U-turn on the completely untrue claim that the biggest party always forms the government, and we commend Gary Robertson for his tenacity in helping to dig it out. The lie is now in shreds, holed on all sides as Labour try desperately to invent ever more tortured ways of phrasing statements to obscure the truth.
We can’t see it holding for five more weeks. And since it’s all Scottish Labour have to cling to, things should get pretty interesting when it finally sinks beneath the waves.
Welcome back Rev.
Hope your back renewed and invigorated.
It seemed like an eternity!
I noticed that BBC Breakfast are now easing the electorate into the notion that the “largest party won’t get into power”.
And I suspect that will be the drip fed info over the next 5 1/2 weeks.
Welcome back Stu. Good to have an article from you after your self-imposed absence.
Good to have you back Stu 🙂
I heard the interview this morning, and kudos to Gary Robertson for pressing Murphy for answers. Murphy did not come out of it at all well….evasive and contradictory.
Lies unravel when confronted with the truth – five weeks to continue truth confrontation and Labour lies unravelling
Good to see you back Stu!
Things are definitely changing (I was going to say ‘things are afoot’) if even the BBC is trying to hold Jim Murphy’s feet to the fire.
Mind you, even if Jim’s feet were on fire you’d not see the flames for the all the smoke coming out of his pants.
Next time you leave for a break, close the damn site. 😉
Good to have you back fella.
Any roads, yeah I wondered when Labour were going to fall over their own size twelves on that. In terms of unmitigated transparent bollocks it was right up there with Broon’s near federalism and trust me your pension is safe in my hands.
What a bloody fool he sounds. Give it Murphy. We the electorate have an absolute right to know, will Milliband be the next UK Prime Minister if Labour do not get enough seats for an overall majority?!!!
I rarely get to listen to all of GMS due to work but it seems Jim Murphy is on an awrful lot between 8am – 9am. I am sure it is almost on a weekly basis.
I don’t recall the SNP being on the show as much to discuss their part in the GE.
I think Gary might find himself on the redundancy lists again. This isn’t what his London bosses want. They will now be thinking that he didn’t learn his lesson the first time around when visits to the Benefits Agency loomed.
As I’ve always said, Gary Robertson can be a real pain in the ass, but occasionally he demonstrates that he can be a pretty good interviewer when he gets the bit between the teeth. This morning was a good example. I did not expect JM to concede anything, but “No, Gary, that’s not what I’m saying, you know it isn’t” was a real giveaway. Possibly JM was not a bit distracted by Robertson chaning the angle of attack, but said it he did, and gave the game away completely.
So now we know, if Ed Miliband doesn’t have the most seats, he may still try to be Prime Minister.
Well done to Gary Robertson. Some more of the same, please!
The most visceral anti-SNP group in Westminster are, of course, the Labour MPs who are threatened by them.
By definition, if there are a large group of SNP MPs, they won’t be there.
Ed Miliband is actually being quite smart by not saying anything. He can’t undermine his own MPs during the campaign, but leaves himself open to doing business after 7th May.
Always good to see Murphy hung out to dry, though.
I hope the people of East Renfrewshire heard his waffle. They must be embarrassed at having voted for him last time round.
Apparently 26% of people think he’s doing a good job. And, in fact, he really is: he’s doing a great job of helping people realise just how despicable labour have become in the eyes of clear-thinking voters in Scotland.
Just says what he wants to hear fingers in ears la la la la la ……… That question is hurting my wee brain what can I say next hmmm…………. Twiddling thumbs……. O it doesn’t matter the people in my country are too stupid.
Better get that last expenses form in before they find out I’m talking pash tally hoe.
Respect to Gary for doing his job well.
Scottish Labour dissembling on this point is driven by pure self-interest: if the SNP are in a position to do a deal, it will because they’ll have wiped out Scottish Labour. Post-election, Scottish Labour won’t have any power at all – thank God.
Labour’s flagship lie was spotted very early by the Rev.Stu and it is now holed below the waterline.
This is why this website is so valuable to the people of Scotland.
The MSM can no longer ignore London Labour’s falsehoods after hundreds of thousands of readers here have been well informed by the Rev.
Dim Jim exposed further yet again, welcome back Rev.
🙂
I heard the whole sorry saga this morning, Murphy must have been taking lessons from Hothersall in verbal evasion, it was very ball twisting.
The problem for Murphy is the closer the election is, the more he is going to be put under the spotlight, and he can’t dodge it everytime it gets uncomfortable.
Tough.
I’m certainly looking forward to the Scottish Labour Election Manifesto. There will be a separate one, fully costed, right?
Expose the lies and the truth unfolds!!!! Well done Mr. Robertson!
Hope you enjoyed your well deserved rest, Rev!
It’s the arrogant assumption that the Scottish electorate still want an omnipotent Labour party in power. No, we need a Labour Party moderated by the SNP. It’s the nearest we’ll get to democracy prior to independence.
Rev, Glad you are back in the seat. Good job by Gary Robertson, Jim cannot answer a simple question and voters have seen through him.
I’ve noticed that some Twitter account holders politely tweet direct to MSM journos to highlight inaccuracies, seek clarification and provide links to accurate source material. Journalists are better briefed and have a greater understanding.
I think this is a great way to get our message across.
Some journos may chose to ignore it, but there is a record of the contact and they cannot come up with lame excuses, especially after the most important GE in generations.
I’m putting myself in the position of someone who is only stating to pay attention listening to that, and poor old Jim isn’t doing himself any favors.
He might as well have said “I don’t want to answer that question Garry,here’s the one I want to answer regardless of what you want to know, haven’t you read the script?”
1924? Jim Murphy is a liar:
link to scottcreighton.co.uk
God it’s great your back,it’s like I needed a WOS fix
Snurfy always never answers any direct question and his technique to evade exposure of that lie is to answer a different question by posing that question to the interviewer.
That worked up to the Referendum when people started to listen to the words and see the lies by evasion.
Smurfy has dodged that lie in several broadcasts by using the same trick. It has lost its burnish.
P45 time for him cannot come soon enough, and his gang.
Good on Robertson to draw that out of him, and not a ‘visiting’ unionist reporter from BBC London on a day’s patronising trip to the provinces.
Listened to Murphy on school run with my young daughter.
“I don’t like that man Dad, he just sounds not nice”
Nuff said. Felt the need to de-slime my ears.
What, Rev’s been away? 😉
Thanks for not posting a recording of the whole interview! I listened to it this morning and it was very soporific, which isn’t good when you are driving to work at the time. I realised after he’d been talking for 5 mins (and he got a lot of uninterrupted opportunity to do that), that I’d not really heard a single word he’d said. So thanks for posting the only interesting bit I’d missed.
Good retweet by Rev Stu
So Gordon Brown unveils @Scottishlabour £800m “social justice” fund; am losing track. Didn’t @JimForScotland unveil £1bn last week? #GE2015
So Labour water down pledge by £200 million in a week… down to zero in five weeks time.
Welcome back Rev. I hope you enjoyed your wee break, short though it was. Gary Robertson is a perfectly capable interviewer when he wants to be. He just doesn’t seem to want to be sometimes, or he isn’t allowed.
What’s with this 1924 nonsense? Am I not right in thinking that in 1951 the Conservative Party, on its own, was not the majority party, yet formed the government with the help of the then independent Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party and others?
So all those millions of red rags delivered inside the Dominos leaflet with the header “the largest party” blah blah blah are lies? Who would have thunk it?
Welcome back! I think that is an excellent catch.
It will be interesting to see if the Scottish Labour message changes and, if it does, how the SNP and the electorate respond to this.
“Am I not right in thinking that in 1951 the Conservative Party, on its own, was not the majority party”
I thought that the Conservative party was the one entity then?
You’ve come back all invigorated Stu.. whoo hoo..
Someone pulled the wrong lever in Jim’s head and it resulted in him blurting it out. Live on air. (they’ll surly be busy soldering faulty parts in his brain the now)
Mad the results/answers you get if you keep chipping away.
MURPHY: No, Gary, that’s not what I’m saying, you know it isn’t.
Gotcha!
Socialists believe in rights, not charity. Then Murphy is no socialist. That is why the Tollies are backing him in a Tory seat.
Angus Robertson was not allowed to answer on the question of “red tories”. He should have said there are no red tories, not even pink ones, just red, white and blue, Brit Nats.
Welcome back Stu.
Have just listened to the extended version of the Good Morning Scotland interview with Spud. He seems to believe that his schoolyard logic is the height of political sophistication. Which smacks of self-delusion.
He has two objectives in each interview: to avoid answering any questions and to get his buzzwords and sound bites out there even if that requires shouting over the top of anyone else. Utterly, utterly dire. Who is it he thinks he is fooling with this?
I have worked in the oil and gas industry for over 30 years and I can tell you that any manager behaving in the way Mr Murphy does would soon find their career hitting the buffers.
On a positive note I sense we are edging closer to exposing the lie.
Gary Robertson demonstrates how to catch eels.
@MajorBloodnok
Dim Jim’s election leaflet doesn’t mention (Scottish labour)’ I believe it doesn’t mention Ed Miliband either but the money will come from the UK labour pooling and sharing election budget as usual.
PS: Tried the telegraph ‘which political party will you vote for’ on-line questionnaire. I know it was naughty..but it turns out I’m Scottish Green 🙂
Who knew, not me!
Glad we are back from all that navel gazing stuff on previous threads, I was tuning in to Morning Call I was so depressed. 🙁
PS: That programme is going down the pan big time, sat outside the chemists waiting for a prescription to be made up for my neighbour. (She can get about easily)
40 mins and no callers! I kid you not, filling a vacuum with guests now, maybe she and the BBC have been sussed at last.
Glad your back rev.Had to stop reading some of that pish fired out at the weekend.Thankfully there was still some excellent posts by the usual stalwarts.
As the election gets closer the interviewers will also be under close scrutiny.This is their chance to have some self respect and be asking the questions that are glaringly obvious.If this loses them their jobs then they can move on.Money can’t buy respect
I am actually glad Murphy has been given such a free ride up until now as he has set himself up for a humiliation.All it will take is for a run in with a top name interviewer to grow a pair on national tv and he will be toast.
After that he will hide.
Most bullies do.
Oh No Rev,
I was looking forward to Nicola skewering him with that question during the live debates.
Do you think Murphy can just keep it going for the next few weeks so she can?
If the latest party didn’t form the government in 1924 then that’s the precedent. It has happened, can happen and will happen again. In 2010 Gordon Brown had to be dragged out of Downing Street even though he got hummed in the election. We all know the truth. Murphy is desperate.
They’re going to need a new line. Once it catches on it’s going to get pretty excruciating for them trotting out this one. More than excruciating, it could be an electoral liability.
Jam for Scotlands guide to the galaxy the answer is 1924
Crash Gordon’s on the move again too, says Libby Carrell at rancid Graun. Not one of their shills are even daring to query Crash on their vote SLab or else sweaties fraud but
“Gordon Brown pledges £800 million more to Scotland if Labour elected: and shows his working #GE2015”
Where near on another billion quid’s coming from Crash? Noone cares, same London mansion owners that just love seeing their two and half grand+ a year extra tax buying 10000 shiny new SLabour Murphy nurses, for their Scotland region.
If the second and third parties have an overall majority of seats and are in accord on a number of policies then the largest party is onto plums. It really is that simple. There is no law that says the second, third or fourth party has to team up with the 1st party.
Gosh, telling the truth was easier than I thought, wish I had done it ages ago. Now all I have to do is hope that nobody, but nobody kept a copy of our leaflets that said it was the biggest party that formed the government.
Damn you Campbell.
Yours for Jim
Jim Murphy
HELP FOR JOURNALISTS
“When was the last time a party attempted to form a government that had the second largest amount of seats in a hung parliament?”
“Is it not the case, that every time there has been a hung parliament the two largest parties have independently attempted to form a government with the help of other parties?”
Don’t give up Lauren, the SNP are and should be just the means to an end.
Stu,
Can you keep a tally on how many times Gary Robertson is allowed to interview politicians from now until the election please?
Will be interesting to see how today influences his near future work scope.
Twitchers please look out for the Lesser Crested Robertson throughout Springtime.
Welcome back!
Timing is everything and if it wasn’t for your good self and this website this latest guff from Slab might have been played out long enough for them to sneak under the wire. Heh heh – but you’re on to them at every twist and turn.
The forensic journalism on here is top class and I’m sure everyone would support a weekly slot for Wings in the National – let’s face it we all know it was the main player in the referendum. Also you hold everybody’s feet to the fire and as such it’s a voice that is needed to reach those without access to the net and to those that look beyond a single party’s political stance.
MSM journos are keen to develop a line that the SNP are presuming to speak for Scotland.
And also, why should they deal with the Labour party after denouncing them as Red Tories?
Easy answer, if the SNP decide to deal with the Labour party it’s because it’s the closest thing to what a large majority of Scots want. That’s unashamedly speaking for Scotland even if it means dealing with rivals. If the Labour reject this, they are blatantly not speaking in Scottish people’s majority interest.
Just received my fourth Made in Essex glossy leaflet on behalf of the North British Labour Party.
As it costs around 50p per item for Royal mail to deliver these plus printing costs (but not supporting Scottish businesses) then Labour are fairly racking up Scotland’s deficit.
Thank God your back. You’ve got no idea how hard the past couple of days have been.
Sometimes it’s good that interviewers allow their subjects time to ramble on and then POUNCE.
It’s much more entertaining…!
Ross
The argument that they are both the same has been raised on the Groaniard. I said that it is like Marty Feldman’s remake of Beau Geste. Yes the twins are identical…but one was more identical than the other. 😉
2 things
‘We will abolish the need for poverty and foodbanks’. Does that mean that if they were needed, they wouldn’t be allowed to provide help?
When he tried to slip in his,”I don’t mention this but I helped out at a foodbank” , I was reaching for the eggs and more!
Jim Murphys line is calculated to try to keep Labours remaining support.This is now a damage limitation exercise.The unionist cabal will need to have a serious thought about how they’ll fight the Scottish election next year.
In 2010 Gordon Brown tried to form a government even though Labour were not the biggest party. Today, according to the Independent newspaper, Labour has asked its lawyers to look into ways of preventing Cameron attempting the same should the Tories fail to win a majority in May. Double standards from Labour. No surprise.
The Jim Murphy ‘hah’ of arrogance at 39 seconds is a good enough reason alone to bin Labour for good.
And still no one (I’ve seen)asks the killer question..
Ask James Murphy, or any branch/main office trougher this,
‘In the event of a confidence motion at the Queens speech, if the Blue wing are the largest party, but cannot command a majority, which way would you vote ?’
So how does the SNP winning libdem seats and then voting against a tory government increase the chance of a tory government?
Presuming of course all Slab MPs will also vote against it but that might be a presumption too far.
O/T.
POOP & CIRCUMSTANCE
Cameron Permission to disolve parliament ma,am
Quine Permission granted
All the quines horses & all the quines men,PEOPLE in this country being feed from foodbanks.
Six words costs Hundreds of Thousands of POUNDS.
link to youtube.com
Ian Donald is right. Good Morning Scotland is getting to be like the Jim Murphy Show, he’s on it so often
Robertson was pathetic this morning, apart from his attempt at pinning Murphy on the PM issue it was the Jim Murphy Show, he was allowed to waffle about food-banks till the bell went. He should have been crucified as a liar instead of which he would doubtless have been pleased with that encounter.
Welcome back Rev. This is a start I suppose, but I just dont trust the MSM, the one interview is meaningless unless it’s style is sustained over the next few weeks and labour are given as hard a time as they normally give the SNP. They will fall back into old habits before today is out.
At least this time round we have ONE newspaper actually fighting our corner… although the Scottish Sun is making a lot of anti-Labour noise. Curious.
“I do a lot of work for charity but I don’t like to talk about it”
Aural vomit.
The complete interview is one of the saddest and most desperate ‘dying political fly’ interviews I have ever heard.
You did have to double-take Gary Robertson at times…was he really gnawing the jugular as it appeared.
His relentless pursuit of the food bank question was indeed a master-class of how the likes of Murphy should be treated in an equal world of probing political journalism.
Murphy had attempted to pass off the party with the most seats issue right at the start, “yes, we’ll come back to that” says Gary…and as shown above, he did.
Just for once Mr Robertson…well done
Note : NS is on tomorrow, followed by Wee Willie on Wednesday
[…] Listeners to today’s “Good Morning Scotland” were treated (from 2h 7m at that link) to a consummate masterclass in the art of evasion from Labour’s Scottish branch manager Jim Murphy. The bulk of a 13-minute segment was devoted to Murphy’s claim that a Labour vote in this May’s general election would bring about an end to foodbanks in Scotland, although the pledge steadily degraded as interviewer Gary Robertson pressed fruitlessly for detail. […]
Correct majorbloodnok @12.08
And maybe interviewers will have to ask Mr Murphy if Scottish labour are prepared to go into a coalition with English labour and Welsh labour….no?????
It might be my imagination but over the last few weeks I’ve noticed that the media are giving Jim Murphy a much harder time and challenging him more.
Perhaps that they realise that the writing is on the wall and they smell blood!
I heard it. I would have turned off, but it started to get interesting.
Murphy sounded like a dodgy used car salesman from another era. Trying get unsuspecting gullable customers to bite, but unwilling to answer questions on mileage and past owners!
I cannot believe many people listening were impressed by his continual evasion.
But yes, we did get close to an answer on number of seats and government!
He kept saying “when was the last time … ” Aye, but, when was the last time the SNP might win 30-40-50 seats? When was the last time Labour faced wipe out in Scotland? When was the last time Scotland was centre stage? We are in a different situation than ever before.
When was the last time Jim Murphy claimed Labour could form a UK Government with less seats than the Tories?
Come on! Answer, when was it?
OK I’ll tell you, it was 2010.
“That’s what the naked numbers tell us, but what happens if we engage our brains for a minute or two?”
link to bailoutswindle.com
It’s absolutely correct that we and others should lavish opprobrium on Labour’s Scottish machine and its various gravy train gangster hangers-on – it’s fun too, sometimes! – but I thought Lauren Reid’s article was a fascinating development for Wings. I didn’t hapen to agree with the thrust of her argument because I feel some attitudes can be so deeply entrenched and culturally reinforced – sexism, racism, homophobia, etc. – that unless there’s a robust corrective in place, time-limited, then the in-built bias against anyone who isn’t a white, physically fit, hetrosexual male will pervade.
Regardless of the pros and cons of women-only shortlists, the more pertinent point here is that in just a few short years Wings has come to hold a unique and absolutely crucial role in our Fourth Estate and (without wanting to sound too grandiose) in the future of democracy in Scotland.
Picking fights with vile liars and cynical operators like Murphy, MacDougall & McTernan is exhausting, not just because they have huge resources behind them, but because they simply don’t care. If they did this would be an enitrely different kind of debate but we know they have no interest in truth or honesty, or democracy or making a better society for us all. These guys are only interested in one thing: Power.
Power is a narcotic to them and, I’d say, makes them deeply damaged sociopaths who will go to virtually any lengths to protect and pursue their drug of choice. Yet despite these odds you are beating them Stu, really landing serious punches that hurt, and they are mighty scared.
That’s a huge achievement amongst many others you should give yourself credit for, so please take time to acknowledge that. We were – are – all concerned about possible burnout so I hope you’ll heed the advice of others on here and take a day or two off every week. You didn’t plan to be here but now you are I hope you’ll be here for the long-term. More pertinently I hope you keep yourself well.
Commission other people for articles. Employ some people you can trust to take things on. Spread your Wings.
And thanks, Stu.
BBC World at One.
Some cheerful chap from the Institute for Government just enthusiastically laid out the entire process re. largest party/minority gov’t.
Precedent, procedure, constitution, monarchy, the lot.
The Big Lie, laid bare.
Sorry, I forgot his name ! (Around 35 mins in)
Peter Riddell of Inst of Govt has just confirmed on WATO that the largest party does not necessarily form the government. It’s the party which can command the confidence of the House. i.e. a party with a minority of mp’s compared to the largest party can, in conjunction with other smaller parties, form the government if they can win votes of confidence.
Just what Wings has been saying.
“Commission other people for articles. Employ some people you can trust to take things on. Spread your Wings.”
I don’t even think you would need to commission people in order to get a lot of good articles created that air slightly different view points from what Stu typically supports. Such pieces should be labeled as comment and checked over by Stu first but done properly it would only serve to help Wings grow.
We saw great examples of this with the start of the soapbox articles and I keep hoping to see more of them, perhaps written by different people from time to time. Failing that, the comments are also normally quite informative by offering a wide range of different opinions.
Wow this man is a tit can’t wait for him to
get the axe
Welcome back Stu! It’s great to have you back because it’s really kicking off with campagins here there and everywhere just getting underway.
This in my opinion shows exactly what is wrong with Labour. They are very much not operating on the same hymm sheet and show themselves up not to have an idea on who is answering the question or how to answer it.
More power to your fingers Stu over these next few weeks. I’m looking forward to us all being able to tell the rest of the country “See … we told you so” when so many SNP MP’s are elected.
The suspicion has now been raised, that the reason Labour keep plying the myth about the biggest party forming a government. Is in order for them to walk away from a deal with the SNP,should labour have a smaller number of MP’S than the Tories.
They need to maintain this in order to say that they are being gentlemen. When letting the Tories form a minority with them propping them up.It’s really because they will refuse to work with the SNP in a minority.
If Labour end up with more MP’s, they can also go into minority without the SNP, and the Tories backing them up.
Either way it’s a unionist alliance to prevent Scotland having any power. Watch this space! It’s the ultimate and last betrayal of Scotland.
Thank goodness you’re back Stu! It wasn’t a good weekend on Wings.
This is great stuff from you Stu. We need YOU to hold Murphy.s “feet to the fire”. No one else will!
Murphy is being very shifty and evasive as usual.
It is of no consequence whatsoever, whether the last time a minority party governed was 5, 20, 50 or a 100 years ago.
This, as always, is a new election and there are no rules or regulations which stipulate that only the largest party may form the government.
If two minority parties together can reach a majority and win the vote of confidence, they govern – full stop.
I have a question for you Jim:
“When was the last time that the Labour Party tried to form a government as the second largest party?”
That completely turns Jim’s own approach back on him. If he doesn’t answer then his own trick of supplying the answer for him can be used :
“2010, Jim”
Chris
Peter Riddell well done sir. Let your name and words be rammed down the throats of every lying SLabourite out there. This big lie is crumbling all around them. What’s that Im feeling in the atmosphere? Winds of change… hope.
There are 59 seats out there. The SNP are standing in all 59. Who says we can’t try to take them all? Lets believe, let’s be greedy!
Labour will certainly accept support from the SNP if they are required to by the parliamentary arithmetic.
They already accept support from the SDLP (Social Democratic & Labour Party), Northern Ireland’s nationalist party which wants , in unionist-speak, to ‘break-up the UK’ (i.e. democratically achieve a united Ireland: link to sdlp.ie).
SDLP MPs at Westminster have in the past informally accepted the Labour whip, an arrangement which Labour has never had a problem with despite the fact that the SDLP are clearly not a unionist party.
Obviously I see no reason for SNP MPs to accept a Labour whip but there is NO reason whatsoever for Labour to refuse the support of one social democratic political party which wants one part of the UK to withdraw from the union (the SNP) whilst it continues to accept the support of another social democratic political party which wants another part of the UK to withdraw from the union (the SDLP).
Big Jock says:
30 March, 2015 at 2:09 pm
The suspicion has now been raised, that the reason Labour keep plying the myth about the biggest party forming a government. Is in order for them to walk away from a deal with the SNP, should labour have a smaller number of MP’S than the Tories.
If they try to pull that one, the red tories are finished in Scotland, Jock. They would never be forgiven.
Gordon Brown has no prospect of offering anything to the electors unless he’s going against previous intentions not to accept a peerage. We should start calling him “Lord Brown of the Vow that never was”!
“I do a lot of work for charity but I don’t like to talk about it”
But I do like to tell everyone that I don’t like to talk about it!
In all the fuss about the “largest” party, everyone seems to have forgotten the aftermath of the 2010 election. When the Tories won 58 seats more than Labour, Gordon Brown was vainly trying to cobble up an electoral pact with any one who would listen – apart from the SNP. So if the “largest” party myth is true, why did he attempt to subvert this?
Good to have you back RevStu and great to see how successful your latest crowdfunding exercise has been, (including my humble tenner right at the start of it).
It was good to hear Murphy finally being badgered into almost backtracking on his repetitive “biggest party” soundbite.
On the subject of outrageous statements by Unionist politicians, Paddy Ashdown this morning was reported as having almost descended into hysteria by claiming if the SNP get influence in the HoC, “they will burn the place down!” Any suggestion who I send the petrol and matches to, RevStu?
The biggest Party always gets to form the Gov?
Black Swan alert.
[…] Edging closer to the truth […]
As Miliband, Darling and Brown head North to join Jim Murphy, clearly their tactic will be to replicate the mistrust and misinformation they peddled during the Better Together campaign. Brown will once again try and scare the pensioners and will undoubtedly promise more Labour cash into making Home Rule happen. Their strategy was perceived as a ‘winning formulae’ six months ago so guaranteed it will happen again.
My problem is that given the BBC and other MSM’s willingness to ‘assist’ them by giving them as much ‘unchallenged’ airtime as they can handle we will see the rapid erosion of the SNP poll lead by a party who lies to its voters to win seats. Sadly the same numpties that listened to them before will be the same ones who are taken in once again. Yes, some people are that gullable.
Aw’ra best
Alex T
——————————————————————————-
PLEASE SUPPORT MY LOCAL CANDIDATES CAMPAIGN
link to crowdfunder.co.uk
When reminded that labour are way behind in the polls, when reminded of his own plummeting rating among Scottish voters, when reminded that labour could face near wipeout in Scotland, the best Murphy can come up with is: “There’s a long way to go in this election.”
Aye, Jim, 38 sleeps. Or, in your case, 38 nightmares, as the light that you think you can see at the end of the tunnel turns out to be the headlights of an oncoming express train.
Dr Ew@1.43
You do not sound too grandoise.Democracy is indeed in trouble.
Chuka Umunna, the shadow business secretary, has added to the controversy over Labour’s immigration mugs by saying he would not buy one.
“I don’t wish to be photographed with any mug at all. I have been really clear about this we have got to have a sensible debate about immigration – that is what Ed has sought to do all along.”
bfh–Nicola just has to take a labour mug to tv debate and put it on her stand
McTernan may have worked out that a suicidal coalition
between Labour and the Tories can be avoided
if Labour back off just enough in canvassing
and allow enough space for the Tories to form the next Government.
That way, Labour will attract no blame,
the SNP will be deflated,
the gravy train will continue undisturbed,
and the Union will be protected for another 5 years
as the Tories degrade Scotland even more.
Labour has recruited two big-name actors to front its first party election broadcast as the battle for celebrity endorsements hots up in the weeks before May 7.
Just watched the new UK labour PP Broadcast. 2:45s of not very much. No mention of the biggest party forms the next government though.
————————————————————–
Herald: (not linking the video)
The short film, due to be aired tomorrow, features Sherlock and The Hobbit star Martin Freeman giving his backing to the party and warning the Conservatives have “sod-all to offer the young”.
“Really, for me, there’s only one choice, and I choose Labour,” he declares.
The voiceover is supplied by former Doctor Who and Broadchurch star David Tennant.
As serendipity would have it, the rustle of a postal delivery through the letter box, A3 sized red and shiny labour party leaflet extolling the plan for Scotland.
This was saying the ‘we get tories if they are largest party’
Oh aye! Printed in Essex… 🙂
Surely the rest of the day will get better.
Anyone else hear Laura Bicker on BBC National (sic) News this morning talk about the SNP possibly ‘stealing’ Labour’s Scottish seats ?
Where did this idea come from that these seats BELONG to Labour ? Why on earth do the BBC/Labour believe that our votes should only ever be cast in their favour ?
Political parties are just tools to be used like any other. If they don’t work or if they break then throw them away and get a new one.
You should have aske him why he told Mr David Arthur of Newton Mearns that the SNP are planning to get rid of the UK pensions. And if he denied it you could have shown him his campaign leaflet which shows Mr Arthur and quoting him saying so.
proudscot says:
On the subject of outrageous statements by Unionist politicians, Paddy Ashdown this morning was reported as having almost descended into hysteria by claiming if the SNP get influence in the HoC, “they will burn the place down!”
Intresting to hear that proudscot. Paddy Ashdown – to think I had some respect for that guy once upon a time. What a drama lamma he has become. I would love to see all the Lib Dem seats fall in Scotland. Good luck to any wingers trying to unseat one of these spineless Tory pets in your region.
jim the smurfff
“I do a lot of work for charity but I don’t like to talk about it”
have you any glue gary there must be some glue in the studio somewhere im clinging on here for some glue what about a stamp you must have a bloody stamp i will sniff that
gary robertson
sorry about that listeners uhu jim has just been taken back to the charity that helps glue addicts no wonder he doesnt talk about it would you
after the break we will be talking about airfix models thats if that f%^&*(g glue sniffer hasnt stolen the glue security search him on the way out
bookies favourites if all won their seats
LAB 280
CON 274
SNP 38
LDEM 28
UKIP 7
bfh–libdems holding more than predicted
snp–still good but not landslide
To a cynical old pub crawler like me,who has hung around in many a dive and met too many chancers to even recall their names,Smurph is the poorest excuse for a politician (apologies to fans of IDS) I have come across.
In NS however my cynicism has unexpectedly been halted in it’s track,I go to the political well one more time,for me this is last chance saloon.
SNP and Scotland really can drag politics back from the brink,I believe there is hope,please don’t let me down.
As for political journalists,Good to have you back Rev. never have you been so needed.
As other commenters are noting, the BBC are now saying “the largest party USUALLY goes onto form the government’ and then said quite explicitly that we MIGHT have an idea of who the PM would be by the next morning but negotiations would etc. If the BBC are no longer denying this then neither can anyone else.
From the SNP’s media page.
Exchange on Daily Politics / Monday 30th March
Andrew Neil
‘ I suggest you could work quite easily with the SNP – They want less austerity – they want a 50p top tax rate – so what’s not to like ?’
Lady Margaret Prosser
‘Over the last 5 years we have worked in the House of Lords to get a majority for things we want with whoever would work with us . So – on an issue by issue basis I am pretty certain that is likely to happen – -‘
Andrew Neil
‘ So you could work with the SNP on an issue by issue basis ?
Lady Margaret Prosser
‘That is a very different thing to saying they would be part of our decision making processes – a formal coalition –‘
Andrew Neil
‘ But no one is talking about a coalition’
Lady Margaret Prosser
‘ No , no absolutely…’
Andrew Neil
‘ But you would be prepared to deal ( with the SNP ) on an issue by issue basis?’
Lady Margaret Prosser
‘ Well , I think that is just how pragmatic politics works’
link to snp.org
Ya beauty
@ bookie from hell
I found two tory pollsters about four day ago utterly convinced based on yougov data that the SNP will get between 42-44 seats. I’ll try and locate them again. Personally I’d find anything below 40 seats disappointing.
@bookie from hell 3.25
The fact that the polls might show SNP votes going down in the next few weeks, has been debated long and hard on facebook. Do you think that they are setting us up! Trying the “don’t vote for SNP because they are losing votes” . It is a possibility.
Please don’t jump on me Morag! I know I’ve got a bee in my bonnet about this!
Everybody …. except ourselves … seems to be having real difficulty coming to terms with the probable outcome!
The SNP might be the 3rd largest party
Neither Lab nor Con are likely to have a majority
The Tories the de fact English Nationalist Party
LibDems destroyed themselves
UKIP are a damp squib despite all the past publicity
We are all entering territory without precedent.
The Establishment don’t like the way things look like unfolding. Tough! They need to get used to the new reality.
Unionists wanted a Union to continue. We all know they meant, continue as it was. But, they haven’t really taken in the changes around them
Brilliant, that is the hottest water yet that murphy has been in. What a disaster labour are allowing this ego so much free rein.
Proud Scot at 2.36 pm
On the subject of outrageous statements by Unionist politicians, Paddy Ashdown this morning was reported as having almost descended into hysteria by claiming if the SNP get influence in the HoC, “they will burn the place down!” Any suggestion who I send the petrol and matches to, RevStu?
Try Lord Watson of Prestonfield curtains fame
link to theguardian.com
It’ll be interesting to see if he uses this largest paty lie during TV debates. Cannae wait.
It looks as if the not so good ship Creepy Jim is starting to take in more and more water and is rapidly turning into an object of total ridicule as it heads for the rocks of political oblivion on the morning of May 8th.
Re all the Labour bumf coming through our letterboxes instead of binning it put it in an envelope, address it to the obvious place, forget to put a stamp on the envelope and pop it in the nearest pillar box.
Incidentally do the WM troughers continue to receive pay and expenses once parliament is prorogued?
I found one of the Tory prediction sites: this one says 42 seats to SNP and gives data as to why he believes this.
link to iaindale.com
Warning! Ads for unionist literature lol.
That’s the second time I’ve heard Jim wheeling out the line “I know I’m supposed to answer questions but…” just before he totally avoids answering a question – he said the same thing in the LBC interview. Obviously, he’s practiced the whole response to this line of enquiry.
I heard on the radio this morning, possibly radio 4 someone in authority explaining that the biggest block vote controls the parliament and senior labour officials are in talks with officials to get some guide lines for this procedure to be clarified. Smurphs lie is unravelling at speed now. Apologies if someone has flagged this radio interview already, it was not the one on radio Scotland. Labour are concern that Cameron could take a month to move out of no 10 after not having the biggest block vote.
ignore my last post when it appears Stu has got it here link to wingsoverscotland.com
I honestly cannot see why Labour are so stupid about this.
Why can’t they say: “If the Tories will get most seats, then Cameron will try to cling on, and even if his Queens Speech is voted down he may try to engineer a 2nd general election wher he would then blame Labour and/or the Nats for it, and win a majority. Do you want to risk this?”
This would not be a lie, but could be a powerful point as it would be not so easy to argue against.
Instead SLAB prefers to demonstrate every day how they managed to get to the position there are in (i.e. piss up / brewery)
Jim Murphy –
“Any man can make mistakes, but only an idiot persists in his error”
Cicero.
Murphy would be correct in his assertions ‘The Party with the most seats wins the election’, if only the duopoly counted that is. The wee Parties do exist though Jim. For once, they and not you and the Tories, hold the whip hand/ balance of power.
Suck it up Jim, through each and every orifice till you drown.
“We told you five days ago that Labour were laying the groundwork for a U-turn on the completely untrue claim that the biggest party always forms the government, and we commend Gary Robertson for his tenacity in helping to dig it out. The lie is now in shreds, holed on all sides as Labour try desperately to invent ever more tortured ways of phrasing statements to obscure the truth.
We can’t see it holding for five more weeks. And since it’s all Scottish Labour have to cling to, things should get pretty interesting when it finally sinks beneath the waves.”
I can’t see it holding for five more minutes.
The question isn’t how long before Labour is forced to do a U-turn on its Big Lie, but how long before Labour turns on itself and the bitter recriminations start BEFORE election day…?
@ Christian Schmidt
Under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act, if Cameron cannot pass his Queen’s Speech, there is a 14-day period during which anyone, including him, can try to form a group which could command a majority.
Only if no-one can do that is another election allowed. So if he did “engineer” a second election, it would have to be by persuading Labour not to try, or by persuading smaller parties not to support them. So it would be someone else’s fault if they let him succeed.
Welcome back and many thanks for all your hard work.
Murphy asks: “When’s the last time the biggest party in the house of commons didn’t form the government?”
He should know, it’s actually 1951:
link to en.wikipedia.org
Re Creepy Jim Murphy and his seemingly perpetual appearances on BBC Scotland, every time I hear his carefully modulated “Thatcher type” delivery in his creepy oily tones, I end up shouting at the radio and feeling the need to punch something very hard! He gives me what my old granny used to call “the dry boak”. I wonder if he really knows how utterly false and irritating he actually comes across to normal thinking people – which of course doesn’t include the likes of McDougall or McTernan!
I was speaking to a Labour voter at the weekend and he is reconsidering his vote for Labour as he can’t stand Jim Murphy.
@MajorBloodnok says: 30 March, 2015 at 12:08 pm
“I’m certainly looking forward to the Scottish Labour Election Manifesto. There will be a separate one, fully costed, right?”
But! But! But! As Labour don’t seem to have anyone who has got beyond Primary one arithmetic they would have to call upon that nice Mr Swinney to do the sums for their womanifesto’s un-costed promises, (It was going to be a manifesto until Labour brought in Woman only selection lists).
Unfortunately
theyLondon chose the right winger Murphy as the Scottish Branch office leader. Murphy, having failed his Uni exams for nine years, can’t do sums and has committed them to vast un-costed spending in an attempt to turn voters against SNP policies and has said that he will get the money from rich folks in London.Thing is – The Labour guys in London can’t add up either and no one knows how a Labour party in power at Westminster can afford their womanifesto. So now you know why Labour will have to do a deal with the SNP – How else could they get that nice Mr Swinney to correct their homework for them?
;-))
Oh! Dear! Cameron is being shown on BBC saying this classic, “I will be going to all four Nations of the UK”, but ends up with, “To keep our country together”. What one of those four countries is he calling, “Our Country”?
RE: possible defeat of Douglas Alexander?
Paisley & Renfrewshire South
2010 Result:
Conservative: 3979 (9.9%)
Labour: 23842 (59.6%)
Lib Dem: 3812 (9.5%)
SNP: 7228 (18.1%)
Independent: 513 (1.3%)
Others: 624 (1.6%)
MAJORITY: 16614 (41.5%)
Sitting MP: Douglas Alexander (Lab)
Prediction: Possible SNP gain
Recent March Ashcroft poll predicts an SNP victory by a margin of ten points. However, some pundits think Alexander high profile may still win it for him.
@bookie from hell says: 30 March, 2015 at 3:01 pm
” … –Nicola just has to take a labour mug to tv debate and put it on her stand”
Dinna be daft, Bookie from hell, if she put Murphy on her stand his weight would break it.
Late home , speed read the thread .
I find it incredulous that all these political interviewers have taken weeks to familiarise themselves with basic politics , bet you any 17/18 Year Old could explain how it works , FFS it’s simple muffs !
If I was interviewing Murphy and got the largest party crap …… Since 1924 my next question would be “ah yes I forgot , am I right Mr Murphy , in 1924 the smaller party formed the government ? ”
I appreciate here and last week it was posted that 1951 is a contender too.
@Caledonius
“some pundits think Alexander high profile may still win it for him.”
More like the UK/labour postal pochle will win it for him, methinks.
Sorry about last post, my D Alexander post was ment for a diffrent thread. Ignore.
Sorry about last post, D Alexander post was ment for a diffrent thread. Ignore.
I thought this was an excellent interview by G Robertson.
It covered the areas that were required, such as:
1. Jim Murphy’s dip in his own personal popularity.
(This is very damaging as it suggests that since he has been losing popular support, people are not believing him and don’t like him.
2. Where will the money come from, to pay for all the goodies that he has been promising.
3. What are the time scales for the implementation of his promises, Robertson asked at one point if these pledges would be degraded to aspirations, that may be delivered after the next election.
4. The ‘Biggest Party Lie’
I liked the way that Gary Robertson pressed Murphy for details and did not let Murphy keep taking him down rabbit trails, as GR would go back to his original question and ask for an answer.
It just shows that when they are ‘allowed to’ people like GR are able to put Labour politicians on the spot.
Has the Comments by Alex Salmond, about the BBC, been a bit of a wake up call for them?
@ X_Sticks
I’d love to laugh at that, but I fear you may be spot on sadly.
I notice car crash Curran was on Scotland Tonight insisting the largest party forms the government !
Thought she was going to go ‘pop’ !!
Gary Robertson gave Jim Murphy a good run for his money. I just wished GR would have asked JM something along the lines of
“Well if a Government was formed in 1924 by a party that had less seats than another, isn’t it POSSIBLE that it could happen again?”