but my passport is out of date,was waiting for a shiny new Scottish one, dammit
Where is here … so that I can avoid it?
These SNP Pouters are a real shady lot. These seem obsessed with comparing the SNP to the Nazis. Can anyone give a rational explanation for this comparison? It is completely bonkers, they may as well start barking at the moon.
I despair. I really do.
I console myself with the fact that even if the Arch Tories of Kilmacolm and the Champagne Liberals of the West End tactically vote for New Labour (as alleged New Labour activist Andrew Skinner has hinted) it might not be enough to stop the massive SNP tide in Inverclyde.
Key word: might.
(gets back to work)
Would they then call anyone who is going to vote for the party that best represents their interests ("Tractor" - Ed)s or ("Quizmaster" - Ed)s?
The SNPout lot seem to do their cause more harm than good. Total tinfoil hat brigade stuff.
Who is behind SNPOUT? Some other political party BAMPOT no doubt. Most likely Labour as they have tried every other approach.
Maybe it should have read “are you prepared to vote tactically for the rest of your life”,because you will need to.I am not changing any time soon.
– hmm, that’s rather existential. Maybe all this #snpout stuff is a parody designed to get us all thinking really deeply man!
William Hague, the Conservative former foreign secretary, said he rejected Forsyth’s concerns.
“We have to sound the alarm here,” he said. “We have the danger here that people who want to break up the United Kingdom will be running the United Kingdom in a few weeks’ time if there is a Labour government with a large number of Scottish nationalist MPs. And it’s not the Conservatives who have talked that up. It’s the story, whether of opinion polls or of what everybody’s talking about on the ground.”
There is no ‘Break-up’ of the United Kingdom, there are no ‘separatists’. We are simply a country that is tired of Westminster hegemony and wants to end a disadvantageous and wholly unfair contract, with another country who are determined to keep their advantageous contract.
@muttley79 6.51 p.m.
Yes, I know it’s strange but I think psychologists call it projection. The SNP Outers give themselves away with these bilious rants.
All the smiles seem to be on our side.
I think you’ll find i’m here, it’s you that’s there
unless i come to you then it’s possible i might be…no I’d still be over there, that’s why one shouts Hello there and not Hello here
Am i making any sense here, Hoi you there I’m talking here
Clutching at straws
There are only 3 seats where tactical voting would work, according to Curtice.
If Tory vote Labour and Labour vote Tory, it will be the same 50/50
If everyone votes SNP Scotland will be happy.
Anent the latest febrile rantings of John Major, this is the clown who regards Scotland as a rich-mans playground and whose government exempted Scottish sporting estates from paying Business Tax in 1994. How can anybody take seriously a buffoon who tucks his pullover into his drawers, as was gruesomely revealed to the nation by his bidey-in Edwina Curry. Pass the sick bag Alice.
Will the news teams around Scotland pick this stuff up ??
Creeps and keyboard cowards –
Eh, what? I’m not there, I’m here. Am I where I’m supposed to be? Feck, I’m lost and confused now.
here in NE Fife we are being deluged by leaflets from the 3 unionist parties saying: ‘we are the only ones who can keep the SNP out’, or ‘NO you must vote for us to keep the SNP out’, or ‘No! No! it’s only us that can keep the SNP out’. So, hopefully the unionist vote will be nicely evenly divided between them.
“You should not be here”
That could be interpreted in a very ominous way!
but I am here, along with hundreds of thousands. suck it up #snpout
I’m not very impressed with this #SNPout crowd. I mean here we are being told if we haven’t, aren’t or wouldn’t be prepared to vote tactically to stop the S.N.P. winning then we shouldn’t be here.
The problem with this buch of *ahem* intelligentia is that they do not seem to have figured out that WE need to be informed where WE should not be!
I’m in, soon to be, Fluffy free country so should I not actually be here?
Where should I be?
Perhaps I should move to somewhere that is a wee bit more S.N.P. friendly but where, answers on a postcard to #SNPout! 😀
I’m not too worried about this. They are outnumbered.
I don’t see anything wrong with tactical voting, I’ve done it myself to try to keep the tories out. People can vote for whoever whyever they want. I’m just very pleased that for once I can vote for something I believe in this time AND expect them to win.
Personally I would rather ignore snout, I think they get more than their fair share of coverage.
– Here – is snpout’s twitter ganghut / cardboard box where the sad boys recount Boys Own Adventures and Biggles before their “Mother” / long suffering ” partner ” shouts at the screen in the darkened roundel festooned corner for delusional grandiose Brit warrior to take out the rubbish and check on the kids.
The SNPOut Manifesto:
1 Everyday to begin with full rendition of God Save The Queen.
2 Orange Walks every Saturday morning before kick-off.
3 New National Anthem to be ‘Too Poor, Too Wee, Too Stupit’.
4 Disband parliament and turn Holyrood into Museum of the Empire.
5 Only Lodge members can stand for public office.
6 Rangers to automatically win treble very year.
7 George Sq to be renamed Union Jack Square
I left Scotland about eight weeks ago. I determined that I no longer wanted to contribute taxes to the UK as it stands. I cancelled my TV license previously and I closed my business.
The sickness of UK politics was ruining my health and happiness. I feared if I stayed longer I may have been driven crazy by the madness of Milliband and Murphy, and the shallow callousness of Cameron and Clegg.
Enough is enough.
Last night I met a guy in a bar ‘Canadian by birth, American by choice’ he said. Stupid by nature I thought, and that was before he told the group that ‘Scotland suckled on England’s teat.’
The propaganda fest of Westminster parties has damaged the UK far and wide. And for that alone I rejoice.
I never thought I’d say this, but my experience of the Referendum lies and fear stories has made me hate everything British. The country disgusts me. It is an embarrassment to have a British Passport.
Britain bullied and terrorized a small part of its own people. And for that I will never forgive this Establishment.
Are they run from outwith Scotland as well?
I think “bombskare” nailed it.
I got a letter from my current MP Robert Smith (Lib Dem) it was hand written and asking people of all persuasions to vote tactically and all vote for Lib Dem to keep out the good guys, my god he must be shitting myself as he had a huge majority over the SNP and alot of people voted for him to keep out the Tory gobshites. I can send it on to you Rev if you want it, otherwise it will come in handy if i run short of Bog roll
I suspect the writer means in their own head/thoughts, or maybe their secure cell.
I’ve often wondered whether the “SNPout” crowd were an elaborate parody.
The constant analogies to fascism and communism. The barely-concealed contempt for Scotland. The complete absence of any sense of humour.
But there doesn’t seem to be any good evidence for this. They’re real people expressing real opinions. It’s no coincidence that the most popular member of the circle is that Archbampot of Britishness, “Effie Deans”.
You should not be here is oddly metaphysical though, for these dopes and I would rather be anywhere else than here with you #SNPout. For all the tens of tactical voting tory boys out there, this is for you and get yourselves an occupation.
The Pouters have been a fantastic if somewhat dark comic relief in the election. I think they have managed to produce some of the most offensive posters so far. I’m only surprised they haven’t recruited Katie Hopkins (probably find out she is their grand wizard or something).
frantically search online for lemming’s, come up with nothing but lemons.
some severe wire crossing going on in their world.
i think they need a plumber.
Take a history lesson..you know, the constitutional history of any modern nation..
See how people hold the power to choose..( The Left has been voting tactically for years, hence 1Tory despite 15%suppprt.)
See how educated populations demand progress and reform..
See how counterproductive fear is, once hope becomes more powerful..
See how silly you are..
SNPout are effectively those people who have not yet worked out that Westmonster have privitised the National debt from Government to the people, thus ensuring the elite continue to get their cut.
I would go to God’s country but I am already there but the job in hand is to sort out those little scheming devils that are in Westmonster. Come on England, wake up.
I actually pity them.
Bless them, totally delusional.
Reinforcing each other’s prejudices.
Remember SNP bad, repeat SNP bad. Must stop them, exterminate, exterminate.
Sorry, just been watching repeats of Dr Who. Seriously though, it would take thousands upon thousands voting tactically to make any difference. Can’t see it happening on a scale that will have any effect. I certainly haven’t come across it in any canvassing. A lot of don’t knows who are probably Tory but too ashamed to admit it.
Let them tweet each other to their hearts content, it ain’t gonna make a blind bit of difference.
And where exactly might I ask is, ‘HERE’?
The tactical voting won’t work. It will probably kill of the lib-dems entirely, which tbh I think is the whole reason for it. But when it fails, I suspect these people will become some deranged Scottish version of UKIP. Campaigning for the abolition of Scotland as a nation being their main aim.
Gordon Brown is doing a closed doors, private, don’t tell them Im here meeting tonight EastKilbride in the Calderwood at 7.30
Perhaps he’s talking to the snpouters lot.
Dr Jim @ 7.12
or is it
there there? 🙁
Actually I think this lot must exist in a parallel universe – or maybe they’re neither here nor there! Just trapped in a black hole somewhere from which nothing can escape! 🙂
To use an expression best understood in Scotland, these guys are “no aw there.”
The 2015 General Election
The Existential Election..are you really here?…place your X..if you can
SNPOut are about as real and as relevant as Vote No Borders were in the referendum.
They’re fun, aren’t they? Wired to some planet or another, possibly a small moon somewhere in orbit around Jupiter.
Small side point. Is that Bombskare profile anything to do with the band of the same name? Coz if it is they’ve just gone even further up in my estimation.
1,340 followers on Twitter (prob not all supporters).
An average of 22.7 per constituency. Yep, that should do the trick.
Um sorry dears – whats an SN pout, been a bit busy engaging people with the democratic process.
Anyone else hearing Mr Chumley-Warner saying “Scots..know your place!”
For the snpouters it’s “Here today, gone tomorrow”.
We’re gonna miss the laughs.. 🙂
@stewart fae stoney says:
21 April, 2015 at 7:21 pm I got a letter from my current MP Robert Smith (Lib Dem)
I got that one today too, look closely it is a printed copy of a hand written letter. Did you also get the “hand written” one from Alexander Burnett (Con)? It has a P.S. “Independant pro-union groups are advising voters in this constituency to vote for me to stop the SNP.” According to his letter he has knocked on 20,000 doors and talked to thousands of us. I take it that about 18,000 of those doors were slammed in his coupon. I just drove through Milltimber this afternoon (one of the richest areas in the UK) and there was a great big SNP poster about 1 x 3 meters in the garden of a very big house. 🙂
I’m sorry for dragging this up again … *YAWN* but I think it is quite appropriate to the #SNPout idea that we should not be here but should be there. 😉
I wish the voting was on Thursday. We have over a fortnight still to go. Seems a very long election campaign…To be honest I suspect the Scottish electorate in general will start to rapidly lose interest until voting day, watching the results, and then the aftermath. The results and the aftermath could well be spectacular and memorable though. Given the length of the referendum campaign, then you cannot really blame voters for getting election fatigue.
I assume this will be the leading news story on the BBC news tonight. Vile hated etc.
It was Stanly Unwin wot rote it for em!!.
But I am here, where are you?
You should stay there. Don’t come here.
Another Lib Dem leaflet (NHS/Highlands themed) through the door today along with my postal vote here in Danny Alexander’s former constituency. Fully 1/3 of its content is slagging off the SNP/ its “record” but, more noticeably, whilst we’ve had quite a few Danny-themed LD leaflets, this 2-sides-A3 leaflet doesn’t mention Danny at all nor feature him in any of the 12 photos!! The only MP/MSP mentioned by name is “Highlands champion Charles Kennedy”, and photos feature only Messrs Kennedy, Moore and Carmichael. Maybe their internal polling is telling them something about Danny – or they’ve simply got the wrong constituency!
Apparently, Gordon Brown is sending out personal letters to people in Edinburgh, telling them why they must vote Labour.
The letter, which I have seen, even has a picture of a smiling Gordon Brown on it. In it he tells us how awful the SNP are, and why only Labour can save the NHS in Scotland. He says, Labour will spend an extra billion pounds on the NHS in Scotland, with 1000 extra nurses and 500 extra GP’s in Scotland. All apparently raised from the mansion tax in the UK. (Did he check all this with Ed Balls??).
This of course he will amazingly do, despite not being an MP or MSP, or even councillor, as he has now left the house of commons. And it will apparently be be done from Westminster which has NO CONTROL WHATSOEVER OVER THE NHS IN SCOTLAND.
Given that Gordon Brown knows all this, one can only assume that he is yet again deliberately lying to the people of Scotland.
Then they wonder why nobody is voting Labour.
Down with that sort of thing.
OH my, sad people. By the way have we discovered where “here” is yet.
Yet another lib dem leaflet today.. Via the post as usual.
At first thought it was SNP
(DUE TO YELLOW FRONT PANEL AND PICTURE OF MR SALMOND)
Same old cut n paste rubbish… With upgraded anti SNP content..
.. . But with Alex on the cover this time there is no attempt to shift emphasis relating to policies.
There’s a picture of Charles Kenmedy with supporting “Scotlands’ Champion” BUT THE PICTURE IS DWARFED BY THE GIANT SALMOND..
WHY SHOW YOUR CHAMPION IN A SMALLER PICTURE THAN YOUR RIVAL….?
I think “here” on the SNP out site is twinned with the A*se end of nowhere,
if anyone is wondering where it is.
Vote SNP get SNP, wooohooo
Down with this sort of ting
Up with the other sort of ting
The Unionist strategy which is unfolding now, was almost certainly known to Murphy weeks ago. He will also know what plans are afoot for the postal votes, and for the climax of their campaign. It is this foreknowledge which gives him his self assurance.
He believes he has a real chance of a better result than the polls are forecasting.
Trying to persuade some people to vote tactically, why waste it with a petty insult to those whoe are not (going to vote tactically)???
According to YouGov, all their poutery is pointless
It’s no way to persuade people (to vote tactically).
From the torygraph:
“John Major: Conservatives would be better off without Scotland”
“Sir John told a journalists’ lunch in Westminster two weeks ago: “From a purely partisan political point of view, the Conservative party would be much better placed without Scotland because some where down the line we have mislaid our Scottish votes.
“From a purely political point of view we would be better off without Scotland but the UK would not – the UK needs Scotland it ought to have Scotland.”
“If Scotland went, the UK would be diminished. Heaven alone knows what we will do for an army without Scotland, that would be a big loss. And also there is a huge amount of Scottish talent.”
Can anyone tell me what the hell is going on with the IFS? Only yesterday they were predicting that Scotlands deficit would be halved by the end of the decade.
Today they pop up again to say that Scotlands deficit would be greater than 7 billion, and would be around 9.7 billion,
What is going on with these number crunchers?
Aren’t these SNPout guys the ones with a predilection for accusing Scot who support independence as being NAZIs and Communists at the same time?
Now according to my on-line copy of the Oxford Dictionary these terms mean : –
n. (pl. Nazis)
1 hist. a member of the German National Socialist party.
2 a person belonging to any organization similar to the Nazis.
adj. of or concerning the Nazis.
So the Nazis claimed to be, not only the National Party of Germany, but to be Socialists too.
However, both of those claims are obvious lies as the NAZIs were attempting to take over the whole World so were internationalists and, being Fascists were obviously extreme right wing which is the very opposite of socialist.
Now what of Communists?
communist / n.
n. a person advocating or practising communism.
And a commune is a communal system of living that shares everything so it is extreme socialism.
Are these congenital idiots attempting to claim the SNP and politically extreme right wingers and extreme left wingers at one and the same time?
Now that’s what I call extreme, or congenital, idiocy.
Can people really be so stupid?
Regarding Tebbit saying Tories in Scotland should vote tactically to oust the SNP
Seem to be the day for bringing out the clowns. First Major and now Tebbit.
Here’s some breaking news, they had better make tactical voting the norm in elections because Scotland is not going back to the farce that is the Westminster politics game.
The cockroaches will be whistling through these old dinosaurs bones in the years to come and they will die wondering what went wrong. Like Thatcher they just don’t get it, the trust is gone.
I’m here forever to vote SNP and nothing they can say will make me ever vote for a party that wants to sit in Westminster to sup out of the gravy train.
Don’t you realise that useless though they might be, they are preparing the ground for Curtice to explain to us on the 8th how Labour managed to hold on to 25+ seats?
Is there any independence supporter posting on this site who will accept it as perfectly legitimate if Labour hold on to 25+ seats?
You mentioned “highland champion”..
My lib dem junk suppprts Alan Reid… You know..
Argyll & Nuke…
But on mine.. C Kennedy is “Scottish champion” cc
Can’t remember where I caught this one, but worth disseminating anyway:
“The British Establishment Is Losing Its Shit at the Thought of a Labour-SNP Government ”
“Short of some major reversals in the polls, one way or another we are about to enter the realm of serious constitutional breakdown.”
Tory candidate election address for Stirling constituency delivered. Double sided A3 size publication with lots of text on issues, promises including the token castigation of the SNP and including a prominent half page message from Ruthie. Guess what? Not a single mention anywhere of their great and noble leader David Cameron and that says it all – toxic or what?
Thanks for earlier Nana – just back from canvassing
I am confused as to where the IFS are too as Rev had the toons at the BBC quoting them in support of SNP only this week – check /wingsoverscotland.com/a-short-documentary/
If this true it is fairly major
Where did the nice man at the BBC get his pro-SNP facts on IFS ??
Okay SNPOut..for one final time..
This real Scotland is Here!
Your Fantasy Scotland is Very Far Away
I won’t accept it rock
It is this foreknowledge which gives him his self assurance.
He believes he has a real chance of a better result than the polls are forecasting.
I am really not sure what you are on about here. Murphy’s demeanour has got more and more angry as the campaign goes on. He seems to veer between the angry and the absolutely furious/ranting etc. This kind of indicates to me that things are not going well for Labour. If they were really going well, why on earth would Murphy not be a lot calmer?
Rally details: This Saturday, 25th April, 11 am Freedom Square with feeder march from Glasgow Green at 10.30 am. The rally will run all day until 4.30 pm with live music, speeches and the Yes Bikers and pipe bands.
Come to the press call. Come to the rally. Award winning actor David Hayman will speak at the rally on Saturday
The only tactical voting that has been evident in Glasgow North so far has been to get rid of Labour. It has mainly been lifelong Labour voters coming to SNP, although that’s not so much a tactical move as a complete strategic shift, but we’ve had LibDems and tonight some Greens prepared to vote SNP to get rid of the useless old guard.
I must admit, I’ve pondered over this tactical voting theory, and in my heart of hearts, I can’t see it really coming into play in Scotland.
The problem is, that for those who raise this as a method of defeating the SNP, face a number of problems that damage their cause.
First, their primary aim to damage the SNP is flawed almost instantaneously since one of the major problems that the perpetrators face is that of the First Minister; A lady who is commanding great respect throughout these islands, speaks with authority, and has explained (in great detail) of the SNP’s plan for making the UK a fairer place.
Secondly, this tactical voting will not go down well with more than half of the Scottish population. Half of Scotland is going to vote SNP, and to see some of the electorate tactically voting …out of sheer spite …would not only be held in contempt, but it would only create a new level of animosity. However, I don’t think the numbers will add up for this to become a factor.
Thirdly, the key problem here. Getting the electorate to vote for another party …especially if it is a party that goes absolutely against the grain. We are told by some that their families have voted Labour since forever. Being asked to vote Tory (if it is possible that a Tory may win that seat) will stick in the craw. It is a concept that will be alien to that persons very DNA.
Same with Tory supporters. Being asked to vote Labour will also be difficult. Probably not as difficult as someone who is Labour through and through voting Tory, but it will still be an effort; especially if they perceive the local candidate as a complete idiot, or believe Miliband is just completely weak.
And because of that; because that politics can be tribal, I can’t see the numbers adding up. I think some will buy into it, but not an entire constituency. You would have to be talking as though it were Gary Glitter or Pol Pot that were standing for the SNP before folk would do tactical voting.
Personally …and it’s just me …I don’t worry about this too much. I think a good many Scots can see through the nonsense being spouted by the media. I think many of those that voted ‘No’ in the referendum will have been angered by what they see as an attack on the will of the Scottish people.
Maybe I’m wrong …but somehow, I believe the vast majority of people will do the right thing, and vote as they should …and as their heart tells them.
Rock dear – where are you? I think you need some love.
Hope Over Fear reveal 18 foot banner and rally line up at tomorrows press and photo call ahead of the ‘Seize the Day – Lend Your Vote 2 the SNP’ on Saturday.
Please share all the posts I have just put up.thanks People.
All very cryptic…why shouldn’t I be here? I can’t be anywhere else when it comes down to it…I’m always here wherever I am…at least I think that’s right…sorry what was I supposed to do again? I got wrapped up in philosophical thoughts there or here…or wherever..anyway, I’ll just vote SNP like you SNPouters suggest.
Paula Rose wrote:
“been a bit busy engaging people with the democratic process.”
What sort of response have you been getting Paula
One sided? Bit of a mixed bag? What?
Thanks .Explains much
The Guardian having another go at tactical blue tory voting SNPout in their Scotland region. Might work, the UKOK shill bashing out this #SNPoutConservative is even more desperate than vote SLabour red tory Libby Carrell
“party supporters should consider voting tactically for Labour in most areas of Scotland as the best way of supporting the UK, the former Tory chairman Lord Tebbit has said.”
Far right boot boy Norma Tebbit, boosted by rancid Graun. Its like the end of days in teamGB journalist er, psych.
Just read this on Twitter posted by Peter Smith. 😉
Youth delegates at @ScottishTUC tell me they staged a walk-out at the president’s dinner tonight in protest at Jim Murphy attending.
Is it just me or is oor wee Murph the Smurph really NOT as popular in his own lifetime as he seems to think these days. 😀
Take nothing for granted..except our own resolve.
Keep the heid,
keep the faith,
keep the nutters at arms length..
“On them! On them! They fail! They fail!”
Sir John Major – “If you want to talk about de-legitimising, I would like to know what someone who isn’t even a candidate for the House of Commons is doing talking about her party changing the policy and politics of the government of the whole of the United Kingdom”
So why indeed is Sir John Major talking or Ruth Davidson, or even Wee Willie Rennie.
According to Sir John, surely the political heavyweight Mr Mundell should be the Tory figurehead in Scotland.
Anyone for a drink ? a satnav ?
Thanks! Just finished cleaning up the sprayed coffee!
yea i thought that as well Nana ,is it a coincidence flipper is about i can just see him screaming at the IFS “no you must revise it higher they must think they will be broke if it wasnt for England ,we will be bringing crash out to scare the pensioners this week”
snpouters lol who cares ,watch out chaps you dont get squashed by the Juggernaut heading your way.
“I won’t accept it rock”
That makes it two of us then.
Because the rest won’t find any “evidence”.
As if the British Establishment would leave “evidence” behind in Scotland.
reply to the dog philosopher who says:
21 April, 2015 at 7:21 pm
The SNPOut Manifesto:
The Existential Election..are you really here?…place your X..if you can”
Which reminds me that one day I really must ask EffieDeans how she got from the philosophy of Kierkegaard to the politics of Franco.
“Tactical voting may help deny the SNP a few seats, but in truth it seems incapable of recreating on May 7 the unionist coalition that succeeded in defeating independence last September.” – Prof Curtis.
“Labour also look particularly foolish referring to the IFS, as the IFS said of Labour’s manifesto: ‘Literally we would not know what we were voting for if we were going to vote for Labour.’
According to the LibDems FFA will leave Scotland £40 billion worse off.
The degree of revisionism and manipulation of figures is straight from the ‘Think of a Number’ School of Mathematics. An example is the recent figures on the NHS apparently showing that the Scottish Government is not increasing spending on the NHS to the same extent as the UK Government is increasing spending on NHS England.
Remember Yoda’s much repeated increase spending NHSs up 8.1%; NHS increase 11.7%.
Well look at it another way:
NHSE budget £97 billion population 53.9 million
Spending per head of population £1799
NHSS budget £12 billion population 5.3 million
Spending per head of population £2264.
Hmm. Picture looks a bit different when viewed from that angle. Furthermore:
Spending on NHSS increased from £9 billion in 2009 to £12 billion this year an increase of 33% over a period when the block grant was cut by around 10%.
So taken together it suggests that the Scottish Government does not need to increase spending on the NHS to the same extent as the Westminster government because SG is already spending more on the NHS.
It also shows, if my working is correct, that the SNP is looking after NHS rather well.
I see Yoda’s still on shift; have the other two gone home for the night, or are they just taking a comfort break?
Jim Stirling is this snpout?
John Pirie (@johnpirie66) | Twitter https://twitter.com/johnpirie66
The latest Tweets from John Pirie (@johnpirie66). fiance, father, biker, hill walker, helping others and all things … Scottish Labour @scottishlabour · Apr 12.
booked my 1st appointment with a ‘skillful head wobble’ choreographer today.
rave reviews, so i thought i’d give it a try, nothing to lose, eh!
SNP mini leaflet too.. this afternoon, hand delivered… as always
Wee foldout leaflet.. Big text, so as not to require reading glasses…
I’ve said before Argyll & Nuke is hard to call with Helensburgh & Lomond existing in another dimension to the rest of this most rural of constituencies.
Ps.. The new slogan to attract tourists to the West Highlands..
VISIT ARGYLL.. EXPLORE IT’S NUKES AND CRANNIES..
@Sinky that was my first thought but as the person listed themselves as a non-trading individual whois has no address etc
Metaphors and emotion are used as important persuasive tools by political groups -if constructed well they can encourage political negotiation. What do the metaphors of disaster, violence and criminality emanating from the unionist camp and MSM tell us about their collective mindset as they ramp up the vitriol about the SNP surge?
Who cares-happily and because the YES movement is resistant and adaptive- those in the YES movement are hard wired to mentally map Scotland’s right to shape its civic democracy with positive emotions- aspiration, hope, enablement, empowerment. This is the result of hundreds of thousands of people putting their time and energy into a cause worth thinking about.
Meanwhile the unionist factions are dysfunctionally attached to each other and verbalise a remarkable degree of psychopathology in their metaphoric soundbites. Long hours of CBT are in order and a large contingent of SNP MPs to ease the political transition.
Rather than read snippets of the ISF article, read the whole lot here..
The SNPouters are a nasty little clique of British Nationalists. Lacking the wit to see the irony in their stance, they denounce “nationalism”, and seek to defeat it with the rallying cry “Country before Party”. Of course they mean the UK, their nation, and it is their duty to protect the red-white-and-blue against the Scots and this horribly unfair thing called democracy.
Their calls of “If you don’t vote the way I want, you shouldn’t be in this country” would not be out of place in the BNP. Nor would many of their other comments. They lack the capacity to argue coherently, so resort to branding their opponents “nazis”, “scum”, “seperatists” etc.
One of them, Effie Deans, argues that the idea of a country being independent is too good an argument to refute, so they must convince people that Scotland isn’t a country.
This sort of thinking is right out of 1984.
Other pouters imply that they might actually take up arms and use violence. I remember one charming young man saying he had a shotgun and was ready to use it.
I don’t go into that room in Twitter. It’s dark and malodourous and the floor is slippery with spittle.
Leave them to their colour wheels and their vitriol.
On tactical voting.
I do not think this will work. It seems to me that the whole idea rests on one of a couple of narratives and those narratives are built on unspoken assumptions.
One tale is that the union is under threat in this election and voters of all unionist stripes believe that and also consider that is the most important issue. This is what underpins all the rhetoric which reruns the referendum debate. It may play in rUK, for all I know, but I do not think it plays in Scotland. This is a perfectly bog standard general election, quite unlike the referendum, and I do not think many Scots are at all confused about that. They know that their vote cannot lead directly to independence: it follows that cannot be the most important issue for them, no matter how unionist they may be in sentiment. I can see no unifying force for voters of different persuasions in that tale, and I do not think they will even consider it, for the most part.
Another story is even less likely to succeed. It rests on accepting that the plutocratic policy of recent years has saved the country from bankruptcy, and any change of direction threatens the progress made. I think that all three MSM parties do think that the neoliberal stance is essential, and I am prepared to believe that their core support agrees with them: indeed judging from the number of people on here who are also wedded to the importance of debt and deficit, as presented by those parties and by the macromedia, I cannot but think that this is very widely accepted even in the SNP part of the forest. But I do not think that helps, for the simple reason that the attack made in this narrative is an attack on the Labour party. I cannot see core labour supporters uniting with tories and lib dems on that basis: for they presumably believe what their party tells them: that we must continue with the plutocratic agenda, but not in the way that the tories (and lib dems) consider essential. If they did believe that they would not be labour supporters any more: and perhaps that is what the other mainstream parties and the media believe accounts for the labour party’s apparent lack of support now. But since that support has broadly gone to the SNP, I do not think that can be true. So where is the common cause which would lead to tactical voting?
I rather think that this is an imbecilic approach, demonstrating a total failure to understand what is happening here. It occurs to me that it can only found on a fixed conviction that the plutocratic view of the world is the only one which anyone can accept: they truly believe TINA, and they imagine that the rest of us do too.
In this I think they could not be more wrong.
Love that slogan, it should be quite a draw, given how fond of it a lot of people down sarf are!
My 81 year old mother who has voted labour all her life as her father was a founder member of international labour (precursor of the Labour Party) and met Lenin. has for the first time decided enough is enough, and is voting SNP! I nearly fainted when she told me! I actually feel sorry for the Labour Party. But you reap what you sow!
Isn’t there something rather sad about Norman Tebbit calling on Tories to vote Labour in Scotland?
What would his beloved Maggie say? And surely his whole reason for going into politics (and, by definition, his whole life) has been shown to be completely meaningless???
[And it shows a complete lack of knowledge and acumen, because if anything it is the other way round and there are more constituencies where Labour voting Tory or everyone voting Lib Dem might, in theory, mean a non-SNP winner — in theory, because someone showed on YouTube how tactical voting does not work and actually, bizarrely, pushes UP the SNP vote!]
As for John Major, he showered himself in corruption, left a legacy of zero Tory MPs in Scotland and did not even have the b@lls to stab Maggie in the back himself, but let others do it. What a weed!
Oops should be on Off Topic – Hi cearc and kisses to Natasha.
@ Karmanaut, its actually very funny watching #SNPouters like the dope you mention. He’s retweeted a shot from Zulu with Michael Kane etc fighting off the Zulu and if there’s a bigger misunderstanding of that movie, the imperial history behind it, well it doesn’t get much UKOK dumber than a tweet like that. Its the complete lack of self awareness that makes them so funny.
Tactical voting is basically another name for Political corruption, which is sadly now become the norm for the corrupt British society we are now forced to live in.
The UK is now really no more than a toilet hole of a country.
The question is now this, ‘do we really want to settle for this when we know it could be much better.’
It would seem that the IFS are having a second bite of the cherry to try and do a bit of scaremongering. You do wonder who is funding them to produce these reports when there are far more immediate figures to examine in light of all the election pledges.
I note also that they happily predict the fiscal deficit clearing for the UK which is why they are able to generate the gap they have.
I tend to view all think tank material as politics disguised as numbers. I doubt any of the figures are right. They will all be overtaken by events.
Well, I know I am here… but I also know that some tactical voters are not all there.
Just watched Rennie and Ponsonby on STV, I have to apologize as I could not stand it had to switch off after about 10 seconds. If you think Spud Murphy is delusional, well Wee Willie Rennie and Spud would make a right good pair of bookends, wooden ones at that!
I can’t understand how such people think they are actually improving the lives of Scots throughout Scotland. Why don’t they just cop a plea and admit they are in it for themselves. Vote these barstewards out, we don’t need crap like this, Scotland demands better, merit before cronyism.
Scotland deserves more and We will make sure this time. Vote for a stronger/cleverer Scotland. Vote SNP!
Snouters or is it Snoters ? I think we should be allowed to paintball them with their own shite. Just a thought.
I have posted several times in recent months regarding tactical voting and as yet nothing has changed .
To me its very simple and clear.
Regular Tory Voter will not/never vote Labour as that would add another MP to their direct opposition ?
Labour Voter in Scotland vote Tory ?
The only floaters are the H@@rs AKA the Libdums . ( Had to switch of Our Wullie on STV , OMG !
So that leaves some Labour & Tory who may vote Liberal .
There will naturally be a portion of Floaters/ un decided but no more than in any election.
The thing is that all this Anti SNP / Anti Jock stuff from DC , JM etc is hardly going endear anyone to vote for any of the Unionist suspects .
Aye , Muttley it is getting tiresome .
They Just don’t get it !
TheSNP may win Argyll and Bute but we’ll really struggle to win the Helensburgh and Lomond bit. Why the thd SNP win in Moray for generations whose major employer is the MOD and Helensburgh SNP fails?
The reason is quite simple: in your face nationalism doesn’t work. The SNP is very active but largely talks to itself. It fails to make common cause with people who don’t normally vote SNP yet it could just talk to theses folks and build confidence. Morag failed to deliver a YES vote but does consistently diver an SNP one.
Just go wiki the ifs and if ya dig a little into the director and other staff members it doesn’t take long to start to see the establishment influence weather its partners or university classmates and so on.
It(SNP) fails to make common cause with people who don’t normally vote SNP
Really?…you been watching debates and interviews?
Gonna watch The WALKING DEAD on Netflix to get some normality.
Morgatron , thanks for the “paintball them with their own shite” comment I just spit my tea all over the keyboard laughing
I didn’t watch Wee Willie Winkie on TV James Barr Gardner but have read that Bernard Ponsonby asked him how many seats he, W.W.W., thought the Lib Dems could win in Scotland. W.W.W. answer was … “We can win every seat in Scotland!” 😀 😀 😀
OK, IFS forecasts for Scotland’s deficit shortfall:
Note that the absolute number gradually increases from £7.6bn to £9.7bn, which is the “black hole” that the Unionist parties are delightedly trumpeting from the rooftops.
However, the percentage of GDP almost halves from 8.6% to 4.6% as Scotland’s economy grows. That’s the number that really matters, because the lower it gets, the easier it is for the country to make its payments on the resulting debt.
This is what the SNP mean when they talk about growing our way out of debt, and that’s why the Unionist parties will never, ever mention it.
Finally, the IFS forecasts are made on a “business as usual” basis. In other words, they assume that Scotland will move in line with Westminster’s current mix of austerity and wasteful spending, taking no account of the SNP’s plans to adopt new policies that focus on economic growth.
All figures are from the IFS by way of the BBC (yes, really). I’ve archived the BBC article – ironically, you can find the important bit by scrolling down to ‘Irrelevant snapshot’:
Anyone have links to decent footage of Murphy’s media huddle in Glasgow today?
I’ve noticed this over several months now, but can anyone explain why virtually every (including political) programmes on Iplayer are immediately available to view…..but not Politics Scotland or predominately Scottish based comment ? i.e “Available Soon” Message. Am I paranoid or is it just another subtle eroding/blocking by the MSM on genuine information from the SNP and Allies? I’ve tried to ignore it but it is rapidly becoming abundantly clear to me and would be good to have some confirmation from fellow like minded peeps. To hear Nigel Farage saying the BBC was left wing in the earlier debate was an absolute joke.
Stephen Paton has a fundraiser running to fund a Left Scotland Digital Channel. Explanatory video here:
Plenty Ian dear -but if anyone is disparaging my dear Morag, well you ken how I feel about that, after all I’ve had to rap your knuckles before now.
25% of Helensburgh folk are English born. Very few vote SNP. They switch their vote among Labour, Lib Dems and Tories depending on the election being fought.
The 2 SNP councillors were successful because they didn’t talk up independence but mounted highly personal campaigns on local issues and they both had a gravitas and are respected in the wider community for getting things done. They are nationalists through and through but know how to nuance the message.
Jackie Baillie lost to theSNP in Dumbarton and the Vale in the last two Holyrood elections but Her Helensburgh vote won her the constituency and there isn’t even a Labour branch in Helensburgh.
Look out folks the S.N.P. have enrolled a new cheerleader for them. 😉
Ian Brotherhood, C4 news were right in that weird Murphy thing this evening. Its actually an embarrassment watching C4 camera man trying to kid on it was a huge crowd of s few activists and balloons. So who is Morphy roaring his head off at? No one’s there to listen to him shouting.
Would you care to provide evidence to back up your assertions that
a)20% of Helensburgh folk are English born
b)very few of them vote SNP?
I’m assuming that you have actual figures to prove this? Or did you personally interview every single resident of Helensburgh, checking exactly where they were born and how they voted in every election for the past, say, 20 years?
Surely you’re not just assuming that anyone in Helensburgh with an English accent
a)was born in England (it doesn’t always follow, you know)
b)doesn’t vote SNP?
That would smack of anti-English stereotyping and prejudice, and I’m sure you aren’t that type of person.
Wingman. 2020. 7.21
Not far off from the way I feel at times.
The downer that the Brit Nat’s put on Scotland reaches far and wide.I reckon I would have to go to Ladakh or Outer Mongolia to get away from the bad vibe it gives me.
All we want is to regain our country’s self respect, whilst they belittle and denigrate us.
Hope you find solace wherever you are.
Re: tactical voting increasing the SNP lead.
If this refers to a recent YouGov poll, it’s not bizarre, but a consequence of the questions they asked.
Respondents were first asked how they intended to vote (SNP 49%, Lab 25%, Con 17%, LD 5%).
The second question asked how they would vote if only the SNP and Party X had a realistic chance of winning.
Anyone who hated Party X more than they hated the SNP would then choose the latter – resulting in an increase to the SNP percentage.
What the poll shows therefore is that where Labour is the challenger they gain 13% of votes from Con/LD/other and the SNP gain 1%.
Where Con is the challenger 20% of voters are prepared to switch, but they switch equally to Con and to SNP.
Where LD is the alternative, they get a whole 19% extra, but there are still 9% of people who would desert their first choice for the SNP rather than let the LD in.
That seems to mean that Labour can attract anti-SNP tactical votes without sending a significant number the other way; the Cons are so toxic their potential to win sends as many people to their rival as they attract; and the LDs benefit most but were so far behind it doesn’t really help.
(So, tactical voting won’t work – probably.)
If you ask me, he’s trying to incite trouble. What else would he be trying to achieve?
He’s a very naughty messiah!
I fear we are being distracted by how bad labour are while some of the smart ones are furiously number crunching so see how many votes they have to ‘swing’ to hold on to quite a few labour seats.
@ muttley79 says:
If they were really going well, why on earth would Murphy not be a lot calmer?
Nothing would make me happier, than to see SNP win 50 plus seats on May 7. And I think they would, in a fair election. GE15 will not be conducted in an honest and fair way by the Unionists.
But, moving on. Going according to plan is what I said, Muttley. I think Murphy is merely doing what he’s told and is acting a part. The three Unionist parties are pouring huge resources into trying to hurt the SNP. They have a plan of attack – it’s not all off the cuff.
It’s a game of poker, in which they think, after the successful hand they played at Indy, that they can win again using the same hand.
The polls don’t yet reflect the Unionists’ final push – with threats and a bribe and really nasty stuff smearing Nicola. Richard Walker at The National is in no doubt about what might be coming down on the SNP. It’s three v one – Indy again.
With the full force of State Propaganda to be deployed over the next two and a half weeks, and with control over the postal vote, all I’m saying is, it is far too early to think this is a done deal.
I was convinced we had won Indy. In fact, I still am. I’m just sayin’ like, if they can nick it once, they will have a go at stealing this one too.
When I was introduced to the ‘roostie nail’, it was 2 Glenfiddichs and a Drambuie – and a lump of ice, if required.
Of course, as a matter of principle, you may avoid Grants’ brands but I believe a perfectly acceptable ‘roostie nail’ could be concocted from almost any whisky.
I think Teachers or Bells would work well…
I was telephone canvassed, from London, by my Trade Union yesterday. I assume they know which constituency I live in.
After asking me what issues were important to me, the woman wanted to know which party I would be voting for, whether I thought it was acceptable for the union to be campaigning for Labour (which was a bit odd, maybe; they officially support them), and finally whether it was ok to pass my responses on to the Labour Party!
I told her that I did not approve of their campaigning for Labour and I absolutely did not give them permission to pass on my answers, but I don’t know if I can trust them. They might be breaching the data protection laws, but I couldn’t prove I asked them not to.
Wee piece of the nightshift team … the more you watch Miliband the more depressing it becomes. This guy will say and do anything for votes now … except go home to the base.
If it’s any consolation, we’ve canvassed several Tories who are voting SNP to keep Labour out!
Tactical voting works both ways, or maybe all ways…
@Ronnie et al,
Cheers. Interesting stuff.
Saw FB comment that people walked out of the STUC dinner, protesting at Jim Murphy’s presence. Anyone able to confirm?
Read something the other day in one of the right wing rags, possibly the Dailly Snail, that these groups are really shadey and secretive. Thinking back to their antics during the referendum, it would not surprise me to find the hands of the “tangerines” all over this malarkey .
You may be right to be concerned with assumptions about English accent hotspots but the point was made anyway.
The likelihood is however that those English
accented friends ftom Helensburgh will be very
interested in protecting their property value and
pension pot and less interested in their neighbours
and countrymens need for better and more
Argyll stretches out to the Isle ot Tiree and waaay down to Campbeltown…
Why throw Helensburgh into that constituency?
Its a mistake.
Almost impossible for businesses to interdepend on each other as population centres are few and far between.
Bells it was. Which is why after three attempts at the recipe, I’ve just woken up on the couch in the middle of the night.
Xsticks @ 8.43
John majors comment
“. Heaven alone knows what we will do for an army without Scotland”
Hang on I thought it was us who were going to be defenceless if we went independent?
now it seems the reason they dont want us to leave is they’ll lose their cannon fodder nothing could more clearly display the disdain the Tories hold for Scotland,
the only real purpose we serve is to pick up the dead birds and die on command!
Norman Tebbit in today’s Guardian telling Scottish Tories to vote Labour.
It was used extensively by No campaigners right through the referendum campaign – both plebs and high heid-yins alike. It was used against Wings (several times – once just for the logo and once for some kids standing under a banner), the SNP (by purposely using the term ‘Natz’ – with a ‘z’ so it almost looks a bit Nazi-ish), and pretty much everyone that claimed to support the Yes campaign at some point or other. You are just seeing a continuation of it now.
It’s recognized in debating circles as an indication that the opponent committing the logical fallacy has essentially run out of cogent, rational arguments – and all he has left is to hit the Hitler panic button in a last ditch attempt to discredit his opponent!
It’s used quite often in religious debates (Tony Blair even once tried it against Christopher Hitchens – and got his arse handed back to him in tatters).
There’s no rational or logic to it. On the contrary it is completely irrational and illogical – but they’ve essentially got nothing else!
Hope that helps.
IFS SAID OF Labour
” ‘Literally we would not know what we were voting for if we were going to vote for Labour.'”
Seems to me that these rabid ex Thatcherite ministers, being raised from the dead to denounce the SNP and pray for tactical voting, have the most to lose from us Alexamining the books circa 1979-1990. Ditto for the dusty old Blairites. They fear the light of truth being shone on their lying miserable souls.
Tweet by the @FT:
: Era of coalition government threatens to undermine democracy
It’s getting more ridiculous by the day
Call me paranoid but I’ve a sinking feeling that the Scots are being set up. Murphy’s recent behavior makes me think that he was never a serious choice but was picked specifically BECAUSE he would go to pieces and his London puppeteers knew that. What worries me is what’s going on behind closed doors while we’re being distracted by the dancing puppet. Many have described Murphy’s antics as ‘the gift that keeps on giving’. Aye well, I’m minded of ‘Beware of Greeks bearing gifts.” Would Labour really hand its fate in Scotland to someone so clearly unsuitable?
The astonishingly unanimous anti-Scottish vitriol coming out of the establishment right now – I’ve seen nothing like it in half-a-century – may also be a distraction. Is there really not one, single mainstream paper or journalist who would go for fame by defying the mob, or even just do it out of sheer bloody-mindedness? But no; with two exceptions, every media/government/establishment voice is chanting the same threnody. It surely cannot be reasoned opinion; anyone who actually thought like these people would be a candidate for sectioning, but it gives Scots a nice big target to react to.
The degree of hysteria exhibited is ludicrously out of proportion to any so-called threat posed by a group of democratically-elected MPs who cannot, by virtue of being hugely outnumbered, force Westminster to do anything but will simply act as a moderating influence in order to mitigate the worst of its monstrous cruelties and stupidities. You’d think that most people would welcome a moderate voice for a change but the SNP (by which the MSM mean the Scots) are spoken of as though they were about to rape and pillage the land, bringing terror and destruction to the innocent. Dear god, all they’re going to do is vote!
What are they so scared of? Is that the sound of reports and files being shredded I hear? I am also minded that on the eve of the re-opening of the Scottish Parliament; again, while Scotland was distracted; hasty legislation pushed through on the quiet redrew Scotland’s maritime border to the ridiculous extent that from Carnoustie you can now look out on English waters. What little gem are they cooking up right now?
Like I say; call me paranoid but…
I switched on Radio 4 this morning at 0700, eagerly anticipating an anti SNP fest.
Nothing in the first 40 minutes.
Are they now Bigging down the SNP?
I think we should be told.
Was told at a hustings in West Dunbartonshire by Gemma Doyle that IPSA had said that no Labour MP,s had anyone employed on zero hours contracts
I think she is being disingenuous , any info to contradict this for future hustings tonight and tomorrow?
What the hell are Radio Scotland playing at now?
Wall to wall Willie Rennie.
Is this a BBC backdoor way to push strategic voting upon the terminally hard of thinking?
So labour is voting tory, tory is voting labour, both of them are telling the libdems they are voting for them (wink wink), the libdems are voting for a second cup of tea with their manifesto in that nice cafe they found.
Yep, thats a lab/tory/libdem coalition in action.
Its a bittie different with the SNP, we actually canvass folks to actually vote SNP, and 20 plus of us were doing that yesterday evening in PortGordon, a real good turnout.
I suppose thats the difference between the SNP and the london controlled parties.
So the folk in london want to change the system now because it’s not working for them. Coalition is anti democracy they say.
Here’s me thinking that the AV referendum was the settled will of the people. Lol.
If any SNPout people are reading this, please put some more signs up around Gordon, I’ve enjoyed ripping them down.
Good job on the laminated paper btw, makes it weather proof but unfortunately not nat-proof.
They will never be.
Looking at Ashcrofts marginal polls from last week in Renfrewshire, the ‘turnout weighted’ poll suggests SNP would have 41% of the vote with Labour at 26% and the Tories at 27%.
I see that even John Curtice is conceding that the gap is widening in Scotland in the SNP’s favour, with polling suggesting support for the SNP heading north of 45%.
Assuming a standard deviation of 3%, factored in on a worst case scenario basis for the SNP, with their vote falling 3% and their nearest rivals rising 3%, the SNP would still won over 45 seats.
Whilst I wouldn’t advise us to go back to our constituencies and prepare for government just yet, it would be unheard of in statistical terms for these polls to turn dramatically with 2 weeks to go. Recollection tells me that 90% of voters will usually have made up their mind by this stage with wavering voters typically amounting to 5 to 10% at most.
Boris Johnson on LBC right now – phone in style. Mair drivel!
Robert Peffers says:
“What the hell are Radio Scotland playing at now?
Wall to wall Willie Rennie.”
Clearly introducing and talking up tactical voting to “stop the SNP”.
In all fairness to Rennie, he dismissed the BBC attempts to direct wayward LibDem voters to other Unionist parties.
I’ll believe they are serious about tactical voting when they start withdrawing candidates wholesale.
Fred Dibnah is not deed. In the Scots language if deceased he is deid.
I appreciate that people are attempting to write in Scots but misspellings do not help. A concise Scots dictionary can be purchased at a reasonable price and will be of great assistance or, just write in English.
No great mystery here. The anti-Scottish vitriol we see coming out of London and its satellites in Scotland? That’s what the British establishment really think of us. No conspiracy, just the unvarnished truth.
It’s only now they’re under threat as never before that they no longer care to try and disguise their hatred (not that efforts in that direction were too great before).
I saw Fred Dibnah down at the chip shop last week.
Robert Peffers wrote:
“What the hell are Radio Scotland playing at now?
Wall to wall Willie Rennie.
Is this a BBC backdoor way to push strategic voting upon the terminally hard of thinking?”
And then you go and post a direct link to “The Mirror”.
Oh the irony indeed, eh!
Wullie Rennie still claiming the LibDems will retain all LibDem Scottish seats on Radio Against Scotland.
What reality does this wee nyaff exist in?
“Wullie in Wonderland”?
“Wullie Through the Looking Glass”?
“Wullie Doon the Rabbit Rat Hole”?
Just heard om Forth2 news;
Tesco have announced 6.4billion loss. Highest ever for a British (sic) company.
Kind of puts deficit figures for a small country into perspective. No?
Just heard on Forth2 news;
Tesco have announced 6.4billion loss. Highest ever for a British (sic) company.
Kind of puts deficit figures for a small country into perspective. No?
Training Day says:
“The anti-Scottish vitriol we see coming out of London and its satellites in Scotland? That’s what the British establishment really think of us. No conspiracy, just the unvarnished truth.”
… and it’s directed against No voting Scots just as much as Yes voters. And therein lies the Union’s inevitable demise.
Chalks at 8.46am
Well done & keep up the good work 🙂 You are providing a valuable service!
@Mosstrooper says: 22 April, 2015 at 9:09 am
” … A concise Scots dictionary can be purchased at a reasonable price and will be of great assistance or, just write in English.”
Great point, Mosstrooper. However the CSD is not really the best for the more casual student. The, “Scots-English/English-Scots Dictionary”, is far more handy for translations as, unless you already know the Scots word to look up, you will have a job finding it in the CSD.
The ISBN is ISBN 0-947782-26-5
Bear in mind also that most of the Scots words the average Scot will encounter will probably be, “Scots Standard English”, which is actually a dialect of Standard English rather that a dialect of Lowland Scots.
For example – “Ah’m gaun through the gate tae walk/dander doon the Road”, Scots Standard English.
“Ah’m gaun ben the yett tae stravaig doon the gate”, Lallans Scots.
wingman claims, “There is no ‘Break-up’ of the United Kingdom, there are no ‘separatists’.” So taking part of a country out of a country is not breaking up the bigger country? And calling for the creation of a separate country is not separatism?
And white is not white.
These are highly speculative and is predicated on two things really:
1)That the Tory spending plans will be implemented and UK spending will fall
2)The price of oil won’t recover
It’s extremely unlikely that either of the above two things will come to fruition (unless the Tories are somehow able to get back in).
It’s likely to me at least that the UK’s deficit in particular won’t shrink to anything like the levels projected (Labour will spend more if they get back in with whatever “partnership” they end up in), and that the price of oil will start to rise (at some point) once the Saudi’s have dampened down the US shale industry.
Colin Rippey at 10.15
The second part of that report of course points out that if GDP increases at its present moderate rate that would half the 2019/2020 projected deficit.
NB Little of the above has any specific relevance to the very different economy of Scotland if it were independent
Nice to note that oil prices are steadily rising again
MSM of course generally is not reporting either of these facts.
Some peeps may find this of interest:-
Dictionary of the Scots Language
Dictionar o the Scots Leid
Scotland – country
England – country
UK – union of 2 countries (not a single country)
One country leaves.
Other one is still a country. Nothing broken, just no Union.
Even unionists should be able to grasp that: No?
O/T (but far enough down the thread to be forgiven?): Just phoned the office of my local MP – Ian Murray – to ask about the alleged “air-rifle attack” on his office, as told to me by a Labour canvasser recently. Obviously, I googled this incident the moment I closed the door, fully expecting it to be splashed all over the front page of the Mail / Record etc. But nope, nothing. So I called to ask (and express my concern). Nobody in the office had the faintest idea what I was talking about. So now, in a way, I regret alerting them to this – as they might actually try to rein in some of their more “imaginative” canvassers, who seem to be doing a grand job of alienating swithering Labour voters all by themselves.
O/T (but far enough down the thread to be forgiven, I hope):
I just phoned the office of my local MP – Ian Murray – to ask about the alleged “air-rifle attack” on his office, as told to me by a Labour canvasser/leafleter recently.
Obviously, I googled this heinous incident the moment I closed the door, fully expecting it to be splashed all over the front page of the Mail / Record etc. But nope, nothing.
So I called to ask (and express my concern — after all, that really would be beyond the pale, no matter who you intend to vote for ). But nobody in the office had ever heard of the incident, nor had the faintest idea what I was talking about.
In a way, I regret alerting them to this – as they might now actually try to rein in some of their more enthusiastically imaginative canvassers, who otherwise seem to be doing a grand job of alienating swithering Labour voters all by themselves.
@Colin Rippey 10:15 am
Well, if the BBC’s percentages do correspond to the total deficit, as you’ve indicated, then that actually constitutes an even more effective argument for Scotland being able to grow its way out of debt. After all, having the total deficit fall as a percentage of GDP must be better than merely having the deficit gap fall by that measure.
It also flags up a new point: for the percentages to come out that way, the IFS must be forecasting a slight budget surplus for the UK at the end of the five year period. The interesting thing about that is that it eventually makes the deficit gap percentages bigger than the actual deficit percentages.
For example, in 2019-20, the deficit gap is forecast to be 4.9% GDP, but the UK is forecast to have a surplus of 0.3% GDP, so the Scottish deficit would actually only be 4.6% GDP.
No wonder the Unionist parties want to concentrate on any number but that one. Why settle for 4.6% when they can blow it up to 4.9%, then make it look even scarier by converting it to £9.7bn and rounding up to hit the magic £10bn mark?
Oops — sorry for the double post there, folks!
Yes, the IFS are predicting that the UK will have a surplus and that’s Scotland’s deficit will drop down to 4.6%. The IFS are making big assumptions about the UK not having a deficit at all, and the fact that the UK’s overall expenditure will fall and fall also means that Scotland’s expenditure should fall and fall (massive cuts in other words). But this is predicated on the planned Tory spending cuts being implemented, something that could be quite damaging for large parts of the population.
The reason the IFS are predicting that the deficit gap will increase/stay almost the same is because they believe that any fall in spending will be offset by falls for Scotland in apportioned oil revenue based on the assumption that the price if oil stays the same. Again, it’s likely that oil revenue will recover to some degree.
The key for Scotland (and for the SNP’s ambitions) is that the deficit gap with the rUK narrows down to a point where it is negligible. In a way it doesn’t matter if the deficit for both the UK and Scotland is big (of course not too big), it’s the deficit gap that really matters as it is the deficit gap that Scotland would have to bridge were it to become economically independent from the rUK.
If Scotland has a big deficit gap then the issue of borrowing becomes a challenge, the rUK won’t be too happy with Scotland borrowing more than it does as this will have implications for the £ in the wider currency markets and the rUK will want strict control over this.
So even if this IFS prediction were to come to fruition and the deficits of both the UK and Scotland were to drop and drop, as long as Scotland’s deficit gap closes in relation to the rUK then the economic reality of independence is not as scary as it seems.
That’s OK then. I thought they were all out to get me 🙂
I am not surprised that this SMPout is organised by the Labour Party, as I wrote the day after the referendum SL were finished, and still they continue on with the very tactics that’s so alienated them from their core support, Jim Murph sent up from England to revitalise Labour gave me the best laugh I have had in years, they don’t get he is not the solution he is the problem!
I honestly hoped that it would never get to the stage where they were only two camps in Scotland! Unionists and Nationalists, but that is where we are at, every single statement from the SLP is framed this way, honestly I don’t know where they can go from here, The SNP no longer has a credible opposition in Scotland, look at Nicola, statesman like in her approach, Jim Murphy a lout! Iron brew, football. really Jim that all you got! Take your policy from project fear, quote selected figures from IFS, and you will bury the Labour Party in Scotland for a generation!
@ Brian Doonthetoon, I was very, very drunk once on 50/50 Rusty Nails, nae ice, never again.
Will Podmore still trodding the same auld British Imperialist path I see……
If Fred thinks that Scotland is the victim of British imperialism, he is running down Scotland. Scotland is not some poor, underdeveloped, exploited colony. It is a part of one of the world’s most successful economies. Any failures are not due to the Union, but to the capitalism which the SNP adores.
is that no Vote rigging ?
You’re one to talk — you block anyone on Twitter who dares to disagree with you.
“You’re one to talk — you block anyone on Twitter who dares to disagree with you.”
No, I block idiots and arseholes. Otherwise I’d never get anything done. Polite intelligent disagreement is always welcomed and usually engaged with constructively.
Do tell me what I did that made me an idiot and/or an arsehole, then. (@alexcfisher). I’m guessing it was that time I mentioned Bath…
I didn’t re enter the realms of sobriety to be greeted by this pish!!
funny thing is he is steve sayers neighbor and site along with @stevesayers1 @snpout twitter feed all have sayers memes on them john number 1 sayers number 5 coincidence?
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