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The snoopers at your shoulder

Posted on June 28, 2015 by

The “Clypegate” dossier didn’t bring Scottish Labour the scale of PR triumph they’d hoped for. Few papers bothered picking it up at all, with only a comically error-strewn Tom Peterkin piece in Scotland On Sunday (which amusingly specified the number of alleged offenders named as variously “50”, “almost 50” and “46”, never quite managing to get to the actual number of 45) doing much more than report its existence.

But the compilation, and the distribution to the media, of the list raised a number of far more serious questions about the branch office’s cavalier attitude to data protection law, detailed on Wings yesterday by expert consultant (and Labour voter) Tim Turner.

snoop

Individuals have already been subjected to threats as a result of being singled out and vilified by Labour, without having committed any crime. And anyone who’s ever posted a tweet or Facebook message in support of the SNP or independence – whether they’re members of the party or not – could be at risk of similar treatment.

If that alarms you – and it should – here’s what you can do about it.

Regardless of whether the “Clypegate” dossier is illegal in itself, Scottish Labour is obliged by law to provide anyone who asks with details of what information – if any – the party has collected about them for possible similar future use. Information relating to a person’s political views is regarded by the Data Protection Act as “sensitive” and has special requirements, as listed in Tim Turner’s article.

To find out you need to make a “Subject Access Request”, by writing to:

The Data Controller
Scottish Labour Party
Freepost GW4863
290 Bath Street
Glasgow
G2 4JR

Just type your details into this template provided by the Information Commissioner’s Office and send it off to the Glasgow address above (no stamp required).

[Your name]
Known as [@YourTwittername or Facebook URL]
[Your
 address]
[Phone number]

[The date]

Dear Sir or Madam

Subject access request

Please supply the information about me I am entitled to under the Data Protection Act 1998 relating to comments I may have posted on the internet, particularly social media such as Twitter or Facebook.

If you need any more information from me, or a fee, please let me know as soon as possible.

It may be helpful for you to know that a request for information under the Data Protection Act 1998 should be responded to within 40 days.

If you do not normally deal with these requests, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer. If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you and can be contacted on 0303 123 1113 or at ico.org.uk

Yours faithfully
[Signature]”

Scottish Labour must reply. They’re legally allowed to write back to you and ask for a fee, up to a maximum of £10, but if they do and you don’t want to pay it, you can simply abandon the request at that point.

Of course, having to even partially process hundreds or thousands of SARs might be extremely inconvenient, time-consuming and expensive for Labour, particularly in Scotland where it’s in total disarray after the mauling it took in the election. But they should probably have thought of that before they started putting innocent people’s security and safety at risk just because they called Blair McDougall a “fat twat”.

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    1. 28 06 15 17:22

      The snoopers at your shoulder | Speymouth

    2. 29 06 15 09:24

      The snoopers at your shoulder | Politics Scotla...

    229 to “The snoopers at your shoulder”

    1. alba says:

      many thanks Stu,

      not on the list but thinking of the cost, in terms of manpower and fiscal expenditure, I think I will send one anyway.

      🙂

    2. John Gallacher says:

      MMM, I’ve been wondering why Labour activists/candidates didnt call at my door while campaigning in our street recently despite absolutely nothing external to indicate my Yes/SNP views.

    3. Donald MacKenzie says:

      Letter done and will be on its way tomorrow.

    4. Kalmar says:

      Ironically, the reason I don’t want to do this is that I’d be afraid they’d then have my real name and address to put on a list.

    5. scotsbob says:

      Thanks Stu, letter printed off and ready to post first thing tomorrow.

    6. RogueCoder says:

      Bwha ha ha ha ha ha ha!! Oh, you are NAUGHTY Rev – and we do love you so 😀

    7. Cadogan Enright says:

      excellent article in Sunday Herald on this highlighting much worse abuse directed at YES and SNP folk

      Also that Unionist parties do not try to rein in thier supporters the way the SNP does

      Page 16 and 18 – hope you are all buying it or have a digital subscription like me (and National also)

      don’t know if you can see it here http://edition.pagesuite-professional.co.uk/launch.aspx?pbid=20d7b386-b2cf-4fb0-b6a8-224e212cb58a

    8. David says:

      Compare any data held to what their DP licence says and if it isn’t mentioned (and it won’t be) then you can make a formal complaint to the ICO in addition to a complaint that they have breached the DPA and IC code of practice in compiling your info and passing it to newspapers.

    9. Jimbo says:

      With their shameful dossier, Labour are not attacking the SNP. What Labour are doing is attacking ordinary people – the voting public. Rather than adopt policies that would attract these ordinary people over to voting for them, Labour choose instead to demonise and vilify them. Labour are acting more like puerile, vengeful brats rather than a grown up political party.

    10. Kevin Lynch says:

      Is this really worth the price of the postage stamp never mind the £10 fee? Maybe this is a sad ploy by Labour to extract some funding from the Scottish people. The SNP’s membership is around 100,000. So 100,000 x 10 = £1,000,000.

      Even if only half the SNP membership made the request and paid for it. That’d still be a cool £500,000. All for doing nothing more than surfing Twitter and pissing a few people off.

    11. a supporter says:

      Can I send the letter by Email?

    12. Me Bungo Pony says:

      At a possible £10 a pop and several hundred thousand requests, perhaps it is a much needed fund raising stunt by the Scottish (sic) Labour Party.

    13. Bob Sinclair says:

      It’ll cost them more than £10 to process the data, if they make just one mistake they’re toast.

    14. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “At a possible £10 a pop and several hundred thousand requests, perhaps it is a much needed fund raising stunt by the Scottish (sic) Labour Party.”

      If the cheeky bastards ask for money, just abandon the request.

    15. frogesque says:

      Don’t have twitter or FB. Can I still send a request since I use a number of message boards including WoS using this screen name?

      It is my online identity which I have used for some 15 years.

    16. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Is this really worth the price of the postage stamp”

      Address edited to Freepost one.

    17. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Don’t have twitter or FB. Can I still send a request since I use a number of message boards including WoS using this screen name?

      It is my online identity which I have used for some 15 years.”

      Yes, you can. Anyone is entitled to ask what info Scottish Labour hold on them.

    18. call me dave says:

      In the Herald.

      Unionist parties need to take the same tough line against online trolls as the SNP

      by Humza Yousaf

      https://archive.is/k35Ng

    19. karmanaut says:

      Isn’t there a freepost address? I’m sure there is. They pick up the cost of the stamp.
      Saves you a bit of cash.

    20. crazycat says:

      They’ll still have to reply to each request, stating the fee, using time and effort, even if most people then go no further. Then it is SLab who are out of pocket.

      Anyone who does persist is likely to acquire evidence of rule breaches, which could then be pursued – so it might be worth it.

      I don’t use social media, so there is no point in my writing to them. I do see that it might not be wise to give them information they might not already have, though.

    21. a supporter says:

      Kevin Lynch

      Man you really are into conspiracy theories! 😉 You can stop if they ask for £10. Meanwhile you’ve cost them hassle having to deal with your letter.

      The biggest drawback to making the request if you are not in the ‘dossier’ is giving Labour your address. But Labour already has the addresses of those in the ‘dossier’ so they don’t have that problem. If I were in the dossier I would do it.

    22. Macart says:

      OOFT?

      Yes, definitely ooft. 🙂

    23. Richardinho says:

      My suspicion about the Clypegate dossier is that it has been overtaken by the tragic events in Tunisia and elsewhere.

      Given the media’s love of reheating old stories I would be surprised if the dossier doesn’t resurface on a quieter news day.

    24. heedtracker says:

      Done. At the very least it’ll give one ukok propagandist with a slow metabolism, fast pie arm something else to clype about on telly.

    25. Robert Louis says:

      Labour have gone from a position of strength in Scotland, to one of near extinction and irrelevancy. Instead of addressing their own internal failures, they produce an infantile clype list of social media comments which are mildly entertaining, factual or slightly abusive. Either way, it is creepy.

      Do they think it will make people stop and think, ‘hey now I’ve seen the Labour clype list, I just know I must vote Labour’?

      In short, no. Grow up Labour, FFS.

    26. Colin says:

      Excellent idea, send the letter, if they ask for cash ignore their request and ask again for the information, they will have to respond twice and it will cost them twice as much before you abandon your request.
      There are four of us in this household, that’s eight costly letters from Labour for four Facebook accounts that will be set up this evening 🙂

    27. Jutemanr says:

      The Labour Party are at the cringeworthy stage now. They obviously have no young members to give much needed advice on this new interweb thing.
      They are the political version of watching your dad trying to dance.

    28. Iain More says:

      I certainly wont be sending the SLAB parasites a tenner. Out of curiosity who picks up the tab for their Freepost. I certainly don’t want to inflate the dividends of the greedy grasping Brit Nat shareholders in the Royal Mail either.

    29. Grendel says:

      I was being pestered with email and personally addressed junk mail through the post in the run up to the election. They already have my details. Maybe it’s time to see what else they have…

    30. Grendel says:

      Ian More, I’m fairly certain the Labour Party pick up the tab, which is why I’ll be including a copy of the Argos catalogue with my request.

    31. Denise says:

      Isn’t this UK Labour responsibility?

    32. Kevin meina says:

      Here in North Ayrshire during election wife received numerous Katy Clarke propaganda leaflets addressed to her.Myself as an SNP member received none and canvassers came nowhere near my door.I did wonder at the time how labour had come by this information as I had never been asked anything politically in a direct question.

    33. Albamac says:

      Can’t remember where I got this but I think their Data Controller’s name is Nazistasia McCarthy.

    34. Arthur says:

      36 addressed and empty envelopes ready to go to the freepost address. Should I tape them to bricks, I have a few laying about?

    35. Robert Bryce says:

      One would assume that if they held no information they would simply state so.

      If they were looking for £10 to send you something tangible then one could assume they have a file on you. It would be up to you at that point if you wanted to see it or not.

    36. chic says:

      [thinks]
      Hmmm…
      Now if I have a PO box, what’s to stop me sending a few thousand such requests for this information, using various identities trawled from the scottish interweb, with the PO Box as return address.
      That’d keep ’em busy!
      [/thinks]

    37. Turnip_ghost says:

      I did wonder if it being leaked early wasn’t deliberate on the part of the papers themselves to see what kind of reaction it got. By it being in almost no papers (so far) I’d say not the one they’d hoped!

    38. gus1940 says:

      Given that the hysterical co-ordinated assault that has been waged on Cybernats over the last couple of weeks has not been waged just by the media in Scotland but by The BBC and MSM nationally (i.e.UK Wide) in particular Andrew Neil’s disgusting performance on friday’s Daily Politics would it not be a good idea for The SNP to bring up the little matter of Clypegate in The Commmons.

      I understand that The Scotland Bill is up for debate again this week. Whether or not that will present an opportunity to bring the matter up I do not know but it could certainly be brought up at PMQs which might be better as the House will be full and there will be far more viewers.

    39. george mcgrory says:

      thanks for the info , had a lot thrown at me in past day as regards advice and info on what exactly to do . i have read a lot on this but can anyone say how long this list has been doing the rounds ? its just that ive had a few strange experiences regarding job interviews etc. especially since around november / december last year . thanks again stu and the team at wings 🙂

    40. peter says:

      How do find out if iam on there hit list.??

    41. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Done.

      Great initiative.

      I’d very much like to see us doing something similar to BBC Scotland PQ before the first anniversary of indyref.

    42. Tackety Beets says:

      Grendel ,

      Argos catalogue , mmmm sounds like a plan .

      Coffeeee spewed over keyboard ! LOL.

    43. Seasick Dave says:

      I just sent off a request to the Freepost address and then discovered the letter sitting on my desk.

      Silly me 🙂

    44. Seasick Dave says:

      Alternatively, you could always drop them a wee line, letting them know what you think, to the Freepost address.

      No swearing, mind…

    45. BuckieBraes says:

      @Richardinho at 4.33 pm

      ‘Given the media’s love of reheating old stories I would be surprised if the dossier doesn’t resurface on a quieter news day.’

      …Probably several months down the line, just before the Holyrood election.

      But, you know, the events in Tunisia serve to emphasise just how trivial this Twitter cybernat nonsense is. If the worst offence being committed in the Scottish national debate – on either side – is people saying rude things on social media, then we are doing pretty well.

      Labour ought to be ashamed, bringing their stupid ‘dossier’ out at a time like this.

    46. JLT says:

      Robert Bryce says:

      One would assume that if they held no information they would simply state so.

      If they were looking for £10 to send you something tangible then one could assume they have a file on you. It would be up to you at that point if you wanted to see it or not.

      I thought that also, Robert, but it’s more likely that they would need someone to wade through their various files to see if you do exist. It might not just be as simple as opening up an excel spreadsheet and seeing if your name is there under the alphabetical order.

      Chances are that if they have been pretty insidious in this matter, then they would probably need an hour or two to wade through a paper trail of emails; checking each one to see what was said, and even at that, check to see what was left out! Whoever has to do that is going to be cursing Mr McDougall as another one of his sparkling bright ideas goes up in flames.

    47. Wulls says:

      Cheers Stu.
      This will be the fourth best tenner I’ve spent this year (after the wife’s birthday, the crowd funding, & the donation to wings.
      Actually a bottle of single cask glendronach came close but knowing I’ve cost ScotLab hundreds is better VFM lol

    48. JLT says:

      RE : Robert Bryce

      And what I should have finished off with is, that due to the time and effort to plough through that paper trail, this might be the reason why SLAB would want £10. It’s not to say they have something on you, rather, it’s to cover the costs of admin time trying to find whether you are mentioned in any way through all their data.

    49. Iain More@ says:

      I suspect two of my neighbours are closet Tories,anybody think I should report them to SLAB?

    50. I tweeted Labour politicians and Labour spin doctors directly, I will certainly be sending them a request.

    51. Tackety Beets says:

      Kevin Meina

      I too received endless e-mails from Mags ,Murphy et tout in the run up to GE.

      I assumed my info was trawled from a 38Deg petition I had completed.

      Freepost letters, the real me & TB , will be posted and their answer best be correct as I know they have at least one of my e-mail details.

      Sadly I only have the one Argos catalogue.

      TB has a twatter account too so I can follow our Rev and a few others.

      I’m still totally flabergasted that the 40/50 pages of “Nothin’ much” is the vilest they could find.

      As said on previous thread where are all the Nasties @ JKR etc etc

    52. Sora Lochiel says:

      Just a niggling wee thought – since Labour can reasonably assume that everyone who writes to them demanding the information is at least an SNP *supporter*, would giving them all our names and addresses not amount to doing a free canvass for them?

    53. Al-Stuart says:

      EXCELLENT article Stu., Many thanks.

      If THAT Twitter bilge idea is the BEST that Labour in Scotland can do, then whatever embers of a chance they have at getting former Labour voters like me back from sticking with the SNP, they really are stuffed. Is this really Labour “learning” the lessons of their defeats in 2007, 2010, 2011 and 2015? Can’t wait for 2016 and 2017.

      I was speaking with a friend and we had a hypothetical conversation on what Labour would have to do to recover their position and get ex-Labour voters to return.

      After forensically going back to the apparent heady days of a young Tony Blair taking over from that dreadful John Major, and then what Blair did to betray so many – from his infamous illegal war in Iraq – to his war on the disabled – appointing his millionaire pals like James Purnell (now paid £295,000 PA at the BBC)…

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/corporate2/insidethebbc/managementstructure/biographies/purnell_james

      …to start the ethnic cleansing of those who are seriously ill. Let us not forget it was Labour who started demonising the disabled…

      http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/the-staggers/2010/11/universal-credit-purnell-brown

      The conclusion my friend and I came to?

      LABOUR WERE BORN IN SCOTLAND, AND THEIR SLOW SAD DEATH OF LABOUR HAS STARTED IN SCOTLAND.

      A lot of chickens coming home to roost. That’s what happens when millionaire ex-bankers like the current Labour DWP opposition secretary Rachel Reeves sneaks into parliament as a Labour MP, when her rhetoric of hate towards those with disabilities means she is a right wing Tory…

      http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/rachel-reeves-says-labour-does-not-want-to-represent-people-out-of-work-10114614.html

      Stu., given I have used the offensive word “hate”, does that mean I too am going on Blair McDougalls little black book of names?

    54. Lollysmum says:

      O/T
      Greek Referendum skype talk live now

      http://livestream.com/IndependenceLive/oxi1

    55. Gillian_Ruglonian says:

      Like others have said, I’ve been swerved by Labour’s canvassers and electioneering publications yet my partner’s had it all, with the only difference being that I’ve got an ‘online identity’ and he doesn’t. Now, not being (or never have been) a member of a political party and not someone who does surveys or anything else that generates spam, this seems rather odd!

      Now, firstly I would be concerned that by sending a request I would be confirming labours suspicions that I am not a potential voter, and secondly, I wouldn’t trust them to tell me the truth anyway!
      What’s to stop this branch office from just sending every request the same response…’we hold no data on you etc’?
      They’ve sunk so low as a result of arrogance, routinely dismissing the people as a necessary inconvenience, so we have no evidence to suggest that these requests will be treated seriously.

    56. Kejorii says:

      As I have used two different twitter handles – one of which I set up many years ago and have never used (it may even have been deleted by now) – would it be a good idea to send two separate letters, rather than making it easy for them by putting both in one letter?

    57. Extra Tuition says:

      If they aren’t careful, the Labour machinery could be clogged with requests from fake Twitter accounts and fake addresses.

      It would be a terrible waste of effort to sort through which accounts and addresses are real and which are fake. I hope nobody thinks of doing this.

    58. yesindyref2 says:

      If an organisation such as the Scottish regional office of the Labour Party stores information in any way on people, it must be registered with the ICO, and have an appointed Data Protection Officer – I’m mine for my business and it pays the £35 fee every year (oops, that reveals some company info).

      I presume Labour in Scotland do have a Data Protection Officer …

    59. heedtracker says:

      O/T but another day in teamGEnglandB media farts along, so from this raging nationalist rancid The Graun Editorial

      https://archive.is/EyU2l

      “The Guardian view on women’s football: put out more flags

      As England reach the knockout stages of the World Cup, recognition for the quality of women’s sport is long overdue”

      to this

      http://wingsoverscotland.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/salmondbell.jpg

      and this

      http://wingsoverscotland.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/bellend.jpg

      Confusing land of UKOK out there. Long to reign over us.

    60. G4jeepers says:

      To be sure your correspondence is quickly opened please remember to send in a “brown” envelope.

    61. broonpot says:

      My request is all ready to go.

      Not a very active tweeter but they definitely have data on me. I recently received a one word tweet from McTiernan followed by a couple of strange followers who then strangely & immediately un-followed (possibly cos I don’t use sweary words). 🙂

    62. yesindyref2 says:

      Freepost address, LOL.

      How much does it cost?

      You’ll need to purchase an annual Freepost NAME licence for each address that items are returned to. Then you simply pay 1st Class postage for each response you receive. Cost per item will depend on its weight and whether it’s a letter, large letter or parcel.

      For postage and licence prices refer to the rate card in the downloads section below.

      I suggest a few letters might need to include a couple of dozen old copies of the yellow pages, preferably over 2Kg.

    63. Itchybiscuit says:

      It’s very silly for SLab to have a Freepost address.

      I mean, if there were unscrupulous people out there, they might say, drop a 2p coin in an envelope and send it off to SLab and it’s free.

      I wonder if the standard cost which is applied to these letters would be met. Would they have to pay extra postage – just like all of those voters who received election material from SLab who then had to go to their local sorting office and pay a fee?

      I know it would be justice of a sort but would it be the right thing to do? You decide…

    64. woosie says:

      Letter on way. Great fun. Every action has a reaction – or are labs so sure of Scots’ insignificance that they assume we will just take this shit?

      Several comments coming through about SNP voters not getting visits from slab during ge; I awaited the chap in vain, and assumed they would know I’m an SNP member. I also assumed that this must be in the public domain, or legally accessible. Was I wrong?

      Love the Argos catalogue idea. I don’t know if John Lewis do one, but that would add a spot of irony!

    65. Ian Hamilton says:

      If Slab, return” we hold no data on you” then presumably, they would have no grounds for action against you in the future.

    66. Andy-B says:

      The Labour branch office in Scotland, would ask for more than a tenner, they’re currently paying McTernan out of Labour’s short money.

      Still it’s worth wasting Labour’s time.

    67. Heidstaethefire says:

      Is it possible to submit a request demanding to be put on the list? I feel I have been traduced by being ignored.

    68. Grouse Beater says:

      My only reservation about making my independence views public on the Internet – (I’m as a certain as I can be the odd fierce essay on my blog got me listed somewhere) – was taking on JK Rowling-Init with a well considered open letter over her patronising stance on the Referendum and Scotland ability to run its own affairs.

      Friend of Brown and Darling, loads-a-money to pay lawyers, I wondered what backlash I’d receive. My wife commented at the time I was not fearful of my standing in public. I consider I have none, so none lost.

      https://grousebeater.wordpress.com/2014/06/13/dear-j-k-rowling/

      Sure enough I got expected abusive responses, some as long as your arm, the last two nights ago, middle of the night. I thought about printing them out and dropping them into her letterbox but the plethora of security cameras around her fortified ‘castle’ put me off. I junked them. Hence, I have no evidence to back my claim of the length supporters will go to denounce her critics.

      To date, there’s been no reply from her.

      One new piece of information arose – I’m told by an Aussie reader she has property and land in Tasmania. I wonder if its planned as her last refuge from civilisation?

    69. galamcennalath says:

      yesindyref2 says:
      “I presume Labour in Scotland do have a Data Protection Officer”

      Wouldn’t surprise me if they didn’t. Under normal circumstances, why would a local branch office duplicate head office functions? What need would local Labour have of personal data separate from HQ?

      I’m not making a silly point about branch offices, I’m being totally serious. I doubt if they actually deal with very much at the local level. And, perhaps that is why they have stupidly gone so far off piste with this.

    70. Alan says:

      What a wheeze! Took only a couple of minutes, didn’t cost a penny, and if enough folk do it will create significant mischief!

    71. Ken500 says:

      Another Labour own goal. Showed how little cybernat abuse exists. Alongside Press reports of Unionist cyber abuse. Do they never learn.

    72. Ken500 says:

      Political campaigners visit their known supporters to get them out to vote. They don’t visit other folk. limited time and resources. They have lists of known supporters.

    73. Ken500 says:

      It would be really mean to send a cheque and then cancel it.

    74. A (reluctant) Labour Member says:

      You could also send the request to each registered constituency party… You know, just to properly waste time.

      Also, look at the registration for Scottish Labour. The section on transfers says:
      Transfers

      It may sometimes be necessary to transfer personal information overseas. When this is needed information is only shared within the European Economic Area (EEA). Any transfers made will be in full compliance with all aspects of the data protection act.

      Now a large proportion of folk use an email address from the folk at Google, Yahoo or even Microsoft, which means that any info sent to them is transferred outside the EEA in contravention of the registration.

    75. ronnie anderson says:

      Am sendin two letters wan fur Ronnie Anderson & wan fur Ronald Anderson ,well it is ma Sunday name & it is Sunday is it not LoL.If we canny get them wan wie we ,ll get them the other wie.

    76. heedtracker says:

      Anonymity for most if not all cybernats/voters is just the way it is. Politicians, journalists, celebs and athletes all have a professional personality that is often integral part of their jobs, otherwise they’d be be like everyone else anonymous and maybe thats part of the professional appeal for these jobs. And then we can choose whterh we like them or not, buy their products, back their team and vote for them.

      But they are still jobs. I like being a cybernat but my name isn’t heedtracker and if I am exposed by SLabour’s list takers, I’ll still be one of millions of anonymous voters, unless you’re trying something malevolent, like what SLbaour’s list takers are. Only in teamGB can the loser party even consider going after the voters that booted them out May 7.

      Even so, my real name is Arthur Penis but friends call me Arty:D

    77. donna barnstaple-stuart says:

      They know where I live, I was a member for years. Never come to my door anymore since joining social media…..wonder why?

    78. The Rough Bounds. says:

      SLP: Scottish Lemming Party.

    79. yesindyref2 says:

      Mmm:

      https://ico.org.uk/ESDWebPages/DoSearch

      Scottish Labour Party returns

      ” Registration Number: Z2089621

      Date Registered: 05 February 2010 Registration Expires: 04 February 2016
      Data Controller: SCOTTISH LABOUR PARTY
      Address:
      290 BATH STREET
      GLASGOW
      G2 4JR”

    80. One_Scot says:

      Can you imagine anyone actually voting for Scottish Labour. It seems inconceivable.

    81. Dan Huil says:

      Arthur Penis: Are you, or have you ever been, a member…

    82. heedtracker says:

      I say! TeamGB toryboy world’s holding not one but two EU referendums.

      https://archive.is/2qnkc

      Scotland however only gets one in every generation, on the basis of what Alex Salmond may or may not have said to a UKOK hack, obviously. What ho.

    83. Jim Hume says:

      I’m on the list, but it doesn’t bother me one bit. I’m aware of what Blair “Better Together” McDougall is and don’t care very much about this person. I know he Lied, Scaremongered and put the Fear of Hell into OAPs during the Referendum. He instructed his agents to tell Pensioners that if they voted YES on Thursday the 18th of September their Pension would stop on Friday the 19th of September. This was the work of this despicable man.

      I have no respect for this Mr McDougall at all. In fact the reason my name was on the list is because I stated on Twitter that in my opinion Brown and Murphy were Traitors. Now my opinion of Blair “Better Together” McDougall is not only a Traitor himself but a paid Quisling Of this Unfair, Unequal and Despicable Union.

      The difference between Mr McDougall and Myself is that I can put my head on the pillow at night knowing that I would be a martyr for my country in its fight for Independence. I would do it free of charge, McDougall demands payment for his misdeeds in defending this Tory Union of Greed and Corruption.

      Yours, Jim Hume (CyberNat)

    84. Rock says:

      “They’re legally allowed to write back to you and ask for a fee, up to a maximum of £10, but if they do and you don’t want to pay it, you can simply abandon the request at that point.”

      Complain to the Information Commissioner if they don’t reply within forty days.

      But if they do, abandon the request.

      Do not pay a penny to those liars. They will not tell you the truth. But they will be very happy to take your money.

    85. chris kilby says:

      Don’t know about anyone else, but I don’t want to just hand my name and address over to the Labour Party so they can add me to their shitlist.

      (I’m in enough trouble with the tattered remains of the Monklands Mafia already…)

    86. Lollysmum says:

      It’s threads like this one that make me remember why I love you lot? The ideas just flow from your keyboards & are so funny.

      BTW Labour cannot ask for more than £10-that is the legal limit for Data Subject Requests 🙂

    87. Dal Riata says:

      Last Thursday, June 25, the Scottish Daily Mail had on page four the following:

      “Yesterday, after the Daily Mail handed a dossier highlighting cybernat abuse to the party hierarchy, the First Minister said:….”

      The story about Scottish Labour’s dossier came to light on the afternoon of June, 26 (I think it was).

      So, the Mail said they had handed their dossier to the SNP “party hierarchy” on June, 24. The Scottish Labour dossier was known about on June, 26, two days later. Indeed, it was being said on social media that it had already been sent out on that day.

      Are they two different dossiers… or one and the same?

      If they are different, what are the chances that the Mail and Scottish Labour would come up with basically the same ‘Let’s smear the SNP and their followers on social media’ guff with a “dossier” listing names of SNP members being abusive [sic] on the internet?

      Naah, the whole thing stinks.

      More evidence of the UK’s unionist parties allegedly colluding with the UK’s MSM in attempting to smear and discredit the SNP and the Scottish people. That this time it is a supposedly Scottish party, ‘Scottish‘ Labour, once a party of the left, doing the dirty work with and for the ever-further right-wing press is utterly despicable. May this disgusting – and quite possibly illegal – behaviour bring about the demise of ‘Scottish’ Labour even sooner than than expected.

    88. Stoker says:

      Grendel wrote:
      “I’m fairly certain the Labour Party pick up the tab, which is why I’ll be including a copy of the Argos catalogue with my request.”

      LLF, love it, the humour on WOS never fails, my kind of thinking.
      🙂

    89. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Done, and sent.

      Great idea.

      Hopefully we can also do something similar with BBC Scotland @ PQ before the first anniversary of the referendum – if anyone’s been keeping tabs on us, it’s the usual suspects in Spook Central.

    90. Rock says:

      “Scottish Labour Party” does not exist as a legal entity.

      The Information Commissioner is toothless to hold a non entity like them to account.

      Ask them for the information, but do not send them a single penny.

      Do not fund the bxxxxxxs.

    91. Thepnr says:

      @Dal Riata

      My guess, just the one and only dodgy dossier, that’s why we never got the BIG Daily Mail expose of the Cybernats as expected on Thursday.

      There was nothing worth publishing as we now know.

    92. Stoker says:

      Dan Huil wrote:
      “Arthur Penis: Are you, or have you ever been, a member…”

      Awe, ffs, in the name of the wee man, i’m going to have to stop reading this thread before i pish mesel.
      🙂

    93. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Stoker at 7.59

      Yes. The recipient pays for items delivered to it on Freepost numbers.

      However the same can be played on the SNP Freepost number

    94. John Reid says:

      Letter all ready to post tomorrow, just checked the last tweet I sent was in May 2013, I hope they don’t waste their time looking for my tweets post May 2013.

    95. Grouse Beater says:

      Heedtracker: I like being a cybernat

      I don’t ever recall you being abusive direct to a single individual, but I guess the frequency and sustained tone of your posts in the Guardian and here was enough to get you blacklisted.

      “Are you, or have you ever been…”

    96. Dr Jim says:

      @Grouse Beater

      I wrote to Ms Rowling on the same subject, and may I say , very nicely
      I questioned her desire to relinquish her heritage as an English woman as she herself had stated she wished to be accepted as Scots because she had lived in Scotland for 3 decades

      I pointed out my own mothers life in Scotland for 60 years being an English woman and quite content to be so and was their a pride issue in that Ms Rowling wished to deny her own country (If she meant to say British that’s a different issue)

      I did also point out that were I to live in China for 3 decades no matter how much I may wish it or how hard I might try I would never be Chinese

      I have yet to receive a reply

      Polite or Otherwise

    97. annie says:

      Was looking at Kezia Dugdale’s timeline and it looks like she is giving #clypegate a wide berth.

    98. Petra says:

      O/T

      You couldn’t make it up.

      ‘Osborne to Cut Top Rate Tax in Austerity Budget’

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4bfZ5Iq_I4

    99. CatSilver says:

      It’s my job to respond to Subject Access Requests. Thankfully not for the Labour party, because you are all very naughty, but I sometimes have to write out to people who haven’t put enough information in their letters, and that doesn’t qualify for a fee so the £10 can’t be requested at that point. Maybe they have a common name and can’t be traced without a date of birth, or they’ve moved recently and don’t provide their old address.

      I know everybody here will prevent that happening by making sure their details are crystal clear on the requests. After all, you wouldn’t want to cause the Labour party even more unpaid work, would you?

    100. yesindyref2 says:

      @annie
      Good for her.

      Umm, are we sure it was actually Labour released the dodgy dossier? Maybe since Blair MacDougall’s name is on it he really is a sleeper agent, woken up for BT and Labour …

    101. saltire sally says:

      Absolutely brilliant article!!
      Well well done.

    102. Grouse Beater says:

      Dr Jim:
      Ms Rowling wished to deny her own country (If she meant to say British that’s a different issue)

      I feel any wish on her part to be ‘Scots’ another aspect of her patronising attitude. That said, good on you for taking the time to explain your position and hers.

      I know from my own life’s experience that I can have all the Royal baubles there is awarded to me and hanging on my lapel for all to admire but I will never ever be accepted as English by that hierarchy.

      For the rest of the population thankfully they don’t care, but then, they have their own country. They can walk tall. It is not subservient to another.

    103. scottieDog says:

      @Petra
      No surprise that Osborne ain’t an economist.

    104. Thepnr says:

      Blair McDougal and John McTernan, two pillars of the establishment that are now crumbling.

      They will succeed, either through ineptness or deliberateness to destroy Labour in Scotland and bring the whole rotting edifice to the ground.

      Well done, I salute your magnificence.

    105. Why oh why are we so concerned with what this group of careerist politicos say or do. They are history and finished forever in Scotland. We should address and concern ourselves with this parcel of rougues who are about to attempt to treat us all like we do not exist or matter under this corrupt union.

    106. Jimbo says:

      “I presume Labour in Scotland do have a Data Protection Officer”

      Wouldn’t surprise me if they didn’t. Under normal circumstances, why would a local branch office duplicate head office functions? What need would local Labour have of personal data separate from HQ?

      Totally agree, and I think when all of these requests land on their desks the folk in Labour’s London HQ are going to be really pissed off at the sheer stupidity of the Scottish Branch Office.

    107. ronnie anderson says:

      Hi Lo hi lo
      its Wingers work we know
      we work awe day
      its jist like play
      Hi Lo Hi Lo Hi Lo.

    108. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Grouse Beater –

      You’re the man for this query – how do you reckon BBC Scotland would handle a similar campaign of requests for disclosure of personal data?

      I’m thinking about the way McQuarrie/Boothman etc rubber-eared the Holyrood Culture committee until (allegedly?)instructed to comply by the DG – might they just bat away such requests to London HQ?

      In any event, one can imagine that the ‘real’ BBC bosses would never countenance allowing provincial branch managers responsibility for managing such a delicate and potentially damaging process.

    109. lumilumi says:

      I haven’t commented on WoS much in the past few months but I’ve been reading WoS and the comments almost every day.

      First of all, thank you Rev Stu for your intelligent, incisive articles, and secondly, thank you for providing a not-draconically-modded and cencored BTL of brilliant, funny, intelligent, ironic, informative, funny, frustrated, funny, very human comments. Which leads me to thank all the regular WoS commentators. So many laughs, so many well-thought-out contributions and all those links to facts. You restore my faith in the human race.

      This latest wheeze. SLAB collating a “list” or a “dossier” of people who “abuse” them (=disagree with them politically). Did SLAB never stop to think that their own actions actually smack of the worst kind of Stasi/Nazi/Stalinesque way of dealing with political opponents? Especially because most of their “evidence” was fairly mild – really, is that the best you can come up with, with supposedly all these thousands and thousands of vile cybernats apparently poisoning the whole of the Internet? Duh!

      Stupidity on stilts, as some ex-Labour person once said. And they want people to vote for them. Mind. boggles. What a way to win back ex-Labour voters. Intimidate and threaten them with being exposed on the Daily Heil unless they come back to the fold. Lovely.

      SLAB or the wider UK Labour Party just don’t get it. There are millions of people who’d welcome a party with more “left-wing” (actually “centrist” from the point of view of a Nordic country) policies to counterbalance the rampat right-wingery of the present UK politics. In Scotland, the SNP fills that role. That’s the key to their success in the GE, not rampant Scottish nationalism or independence dreams/demands.

      Who listens to the people in England and Wales? Labour are just red tories and the people there have very little choice. Plaid Cumry and the Greens are trying to bring about change (change! woo! scary!) but UKIP wants to take us back to the 1930s. The SNP wants to take Scotland to the 2020s with confidence, prosperity and true democracy. So a no-no in the British “democracy”.

      Finland became independent in 1917. After a brief but bloody and tragic civil war in 1918, one of the first things the independent Finnish Parliament did was to enact the new land law. Tenant farmers, crofters got fairly easy terms to buy their land, their livelihood, whether from big landowners or state (former “crown”) lands.

      Finland is a big and sparsely populated country. Historically, some people just went in the wilderness and cleared a farm for themselves and after a while got state-recognised title to it. And hated having “neighbours” within ten miles. Our national poet Eino Leino wrote a great poem about it. A pioneer getting into a rage after seeing woodchips floating down the river = someone lives up the river. He then goes upriver with an axe and… Well, we’re a bit… hm… reserved with newcomers and that story still chimes with most Finns even today.

      Our history is, of course, totally different because all the Scottish and English/Welsh land was already parcelled out by the 14th century or something. All of Finland wasn’t parcelled out to private ownership by the time Finland became independent. Most of the best agricultural land, especially in the southwest, is privately owned but the rest of the country is mostly “state land” (“Crown land”, you’d call it in a monarchy) with some small family farms. Historically, lots of “common land” and now made official because the state owns it.

      One thing I want to point out, especially now that land rights and access are becoming topical again in Scotland. My trekking buddies and I never wanted to trek in England or Wales because you’d have to stick to some preordained paths. Scotland is great because it’s the same as our native Nordic countries.

      The right to roam, or as we call it, Everyman’s right. We trek and wild camp anywhere. With right comes responsibility so you don’t litter, you don’t camp in someone’s garden, you’re mindful of crops and livestock, but the land belongs to all of us, even though somebody might own it. It’s a concept most Scots will recognise and most English will not. It’s to do with land ownership but also with what “ownership” means and entails. The Scottish take is pretty close to the Nordic one, the English one is very foreign, you cannot help thinking the Establishment bunnies want to exclude the rabble from contaminating their land (and their forelock-tugging staff).

      Sorry for the long digressions but the latest developments in Scotland are just scary. Dossiers and lists of people who disagree politically, passed on to rabid righ-wing press, to deflect from the Land Reform Act and other important things not favourabble to the establishment.

      The madness of past few days smacks very much like intimidation, trying to shut down dissenting voices. (Nazis, anyone?) It won’t work because half of Scotland is awake, a tipping point has been reached and most people will see SLAB’s desperate stab at a smear just for what it is. Desperate and pathetic and nasty.

      Vote SLAB and we won’t clype you!

      What a vote winner. Bring on Holyrood 2016.

      Oh, and thanks, Rev Stu for providing advice on how to combat SLAB.

    110. Big Jock says:

      This could be counter productive. We request data and Slabour get our names and do a twitter search.

    111. David McDowell says:

      I think this ill-advised farce is likely to backfire on Labour spectacularly if one of the named individuals finds themselves being threatened, attacked, or in any other way disadvantaged, such as losing their job, etc.

      Attempts to silence people using this kind of “naming and shaming” is the thin edge of a very dangerous wedge. The thick end includes book burning and jailing people for daring to tell the truth. And Labour have the cheek to call SNP supporters “Nazis”!

    112. galamcennalath says:

      Jimbo says:
      “… the folk in Labour’s London HQ are going to be really pissed off at the sheer stupidity of the Scottish Branch Office.”

      AGAIN!

    113. Andrew Haddow says:

      The Scottish Labour History Society http://www.scottishlabourhistory.org.uk/ are looking for a new name.

      I suggest “Scottish Labour Are History Society”

    114. Ian Brotherhood says:

      For anyone who hasn’t seen it, please check out this recent interview with Tom Devine. (It’s only had 747 views.)

      It’s superb. Please consider bookmarking it for future use, as and when you meet some BTUKOK diehard who claims to have the ‘historical’ high ground.

      Tom Devine, ‘Scottish Independence More Likely Than Ever’ –

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEJrsAc-sZ4

    115. call me dave says:

      The Herald:
      The Dark Side of Twitter: Unionist trolls exposed

      https://archive.is/9xIuL

    116. Short Changed says:

      It’s a Freeport address, thousands of empty envelopes sent to them will hurt.

    117. Thepnr says:

      @lumilumi

      I always enjoy reading your view on what is going on in Scotland. Don’t leave it so long next time please 🙂

    118. Steven M says:

      I would hesitate to do this as it is basically allowing them to get free canvassing data, potentially thousands of man hours worth. They also pay “activists” to collect this info in many cases so they may actually save money on this.

    119. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @lumilumi –

      What Thepnr says… 🙂

    120. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood 9.53 I watched it when it 1st aired I,ve shared it on Scot2.scot.

    121. Petra says:

      @ call me dave says at 9:53 pm ”The Herald: The Dark Side of Twitter: Unionist trolls exposed.”

      https://archive.is/9xIuL

      A copy of this and the dossier of ‘Unionist’ threats and smears, posted previously, should be sent to Andrew Neil. If he has any decency at all he should then make a public apology to Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP.

    122. Paula Rose says:

      lumilumi more honey xx

    123. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @ronnie anderson –

      Cheers mister.

      We’re in the process of laying an egg in O/T – your assistance would be much appreciated.

    124. MolliBlum says:

      Might send them a wee letter. No harm – after all, they do seem to have my details already (goodness knows how) because they kept spamming me with email in the GE2015 run-up, which I found incredibly annoying. First-name terms, too.

    125. Ian More says:

      Where have all the Cybernobs gone. Can I call Brit Nat trolls Cybernobs?

    126. ronnie anderson says:

      James sinclair says:
      28 June, 2015 at 9:15 pm

      {Why oh why are we so concerned with what this group of careerist politicos say or do. They are history and finished forever in Scotland. We should address and concern ourselves with this parcel of rougues who are about to attempt to treat us all like we do not exist or matter under this corrupt union.}

      Slab are not finnished as yet,& we are dealing with the parcel of rougues in our own sweet way . There again we have dissenters in whitchever way we attack them. Whilst there is one Lab councillor in Local Authority or as a Msp they are not finnished until they cease to exist.

    127. Grouse Beater says:

      Ian: How do you reckon BBC Scotland would handle a similar campaign of requests for disclosure of personal data?

      Probably tighter than a crab’s arse, as they say, the one you prize open to lift off the shell and scrape out the inedible brown stuff to get to the meat.

      I’m of the opinion, the greater the salary, the greater the secrecy. To answer you directly, at its highest level the BBC is a state within a state. Any attempt to wrestle blacklists out into the open will be met by denials any exist. But they do, in Personnel. Reports are composed like a primary school – ‘late on twenty occasions, argumentative, warned’, ‘given annual interview, told work effort poor, shown evidence’, et cetera.

      Freelance talent not to be commissioned is another matter. Choice comes under the province of the head of department, in my experience, passed word of mouth at weekly production meetings. Nowadays, the commissioning procedure is so convoluted, done at a distance via an Internet portal, you just never get to know why the portcullis was dropped.

      In general terms, there exists the expected respect for confidentiality but the dice is always loaded. Getting commissioned is akin to Strictly Come Dancing, never based on the elements of a good deal – BBC taking the role of a strict patriarch. Winner is the last man standing.

      PS: Am grateful for the Tom Devine interview. Peculiar when you realise he and the batty ‘History Woman’ are associated with the same university.

    128. ArtyHetty says:

      I suspect, Slab poss have a list of SNP members, could be wrong but the only personally addressed rubbish from them just before the GE was sent to the only non SNP member in our house, and it came from Liverpool.

    129. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Interesting footage here, from the day after the referendum result. Haven’t seen it before. (The dude at 4.10 did particularly well in the circumstances.

      Worth bearing this stuff in mind when assessing what the current round of wind-ups and abuse is really all about.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdvXA1J8Egc

    130. Big Jock says:

      I agree Steven we don’t want to assist them. Just ignore them. Most of us never post anything directly offensive. It’s sad and despicable that we live in such a country. But let’s be smart. We won the election despite them and will do so at Holyrood. If this is Labours new strategy then allow them to dig their graves and don’t distract them from their excellent Labours.

      P.S I agree Stu should be investigating this stuff. I just disagree that it matters to the electorate.

    131. cirsium says:

      O/T @Nana Smith, 7.12

      thanks for the link to “Where is my European Union?” Very interesting. Have you seen Mike Hudson’s latest on the Greek situation?

      http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/06/26/the-delphi-declaration/

    132. Grouse Beater says:

      A hellish pre-Referendum HIGNFY show repeated tonight in which the myth is promoted yet again that England saved Scotland from bankruptcy, and where we see ourselves ridiculed in the service of a cheap laugh for demanding parity of democratic structures. Scottish ambitions are depicted as a joke. Inevitably the ‘deep fry’ insult is scraped off the floor for another fling.

      This they term ‘satire’.

    133. heedtracker says:

      Grouse Beater says:
      28 June, 2015 at 8:22 pm
      Heedtracker: I like being a cybernat

      Graun CiF unionists were very rude indeed.It started to warm up on there around 2008 and some of the rudest are low to mid profile ukok red and blue tory unionists now but purely by their own choice. Well a certain vote NO or else Slovene might say otherwise, now currently raging vote YES to stay in the EU, oddly enough.

      Poor old Graun mods must have worn out their delete keys on all the swearyness of being a raging NO.

      This list makes it all very different now though. It was bad enough sitting watching the Daily Mail go after anonymous, decent, law abiding YES voters in Scotland they way did, but now SLabour have done the same is infinitely worse.

      Think about the work load just going through the 43 thousand WoS twitter followers, let alone Facebook likes for everyone SNP.

      Its not just very creepy, its barking mad.

    134. dakk says:

      Anyone with any intelligence and/or morals would have resigned from Labour by now,so a stunt like Clypegate should’nt really surprise us.

      I’d be surprised if many of Slab have even heard of the Stasi never mind have the self awareness to recognise the similarities in how they operate.

      If I may ‘Labour’ the point.It is actually quite easy to imagine many of the Slab Westminster casualties in Stasi uniforms.

      Murphy , wee Dougie , Magrit , Harris , Darling , Broonie et al. Wee Dougie’s eyes and nose in particular would strike fear into the bravest cybernats in the interrogation room.

      Perhaps if they want to keep themselves in gainful employment,they could get together and produce a West End show,perhaps entitled ‘Winter-time for Labour in Scotchland’

      I think if handled properly it would be a smash hit rivalling Cats 🙂 the show must go on !!!

    135. Peter Mechan says:

      Could Labour in Scotland not charge us all £10 each for the enquiry – thus we could be funding them just over a million quid on this…

    136. Tackety Beets says:

      Iain B @11.04pm

      Jeezo , I have only just got that nicht oot o am mind !

      A’l no sleep the nicht !

    137. Ron says:

      I surely can’t be alone in feeling that it is incredibly sinister that apparently records are being kept about individual citizens political affiliations……

    138. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Never mind the politics
      The Who are on BBC2 (I think Daltrey’s voice is giving out)

      We will never see their like again

    139. simoh says:

      Before sealing your envelope please check you have included:
      *One catalogue, ideally with a good selection of self help books available as we do want to be helpful.
      *Your request – best double check you’ve got your name and address correct, otherwise they still won’t know who you are and will still have to waste time following up on someone who doesn’t exist and we don’t want that do we.

    140. Still Positive. says:

      Ron@11.32.

      Couldn’t agree more.

    141. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Billy Sloane, on BBC Radio Scotland, at midnight – ‘The news is that there is no news.’

      🙂

    142. caz-m says:

      Ian Brotherhood 9.53pm

      That video of George Sq on the night after the Referendum was a sore one to watch.

      I was in George Sq that night, in amongst that shower of shit and I still get angry every time I see any footage of them “celebrating” their victory.

      The pain will only leave me when we finally win our Independence.

      I wonder how many of them will be singing and dancing on the 8th of July, once Osborne has announced his £30Bilion pound of cuts in his budget.

      Change of subject Ian, I was down Stevenson/Saltcoats way today.

    143. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      I hereby announce that “Won’t Get Fooled Again” is our campaign tune for the next referendum

    144. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @caz-m –

      🙂

      If you were down here for a run I hope you got the breaks – ’twas showery, on and off all day. Let me know next time you’re down, I’ll bring you a healthy isotonic drink or suchlike, and I’ll have a can of Strongbow thanks very much.

      Anyway, don’t let memories get you down mister – they are valuable fuel! Yeah, it’s a bummer, seeing it all again (and I wasn’t even there) but it’s an important reminder – the forces of ‘The Realm’, when you see them in reality, are actually quite pathetic. Unlike most Wingers, I’ve met you, and I know what you look like – I dare say not one of those braying bawbags would dare look at you the wrong way never mind take you on physically.

      We have a lot of work to do. The September BBC PQ gig you suggested – did you see my response? We should make a big effort on that one. Would you agree that Saturday 19th is the obvious choice?

      And there’s other stuff maybe brewing – please visit O/T if you get a chance. Any thoughts you have on what we’re discussing would be much valued.

      More power to ye brother – hope to see you again very soon.

      Hoots! 🙂

    145. G4jeepers says:

      Sad to not see one single saltire flying among the sea of flags at glasto 🙁

    146. call me dave says:

      It was either Al Capone’s car buried in Peeblesshire estate or fluffy ‘no brainer’ Mundell.

      Read all about it!

      https://archive.is/Gbkci

    147. Lewis says:

      Couldn’t any of these people exposed for something that doesn’t remotely constitutes a crime sue Labour for defamation?

    148. Dumb Unicorn says:

      I don’t even know where to start with all this. Been away for a few days and only just catching up so apologies if I repeat anything already said.

      WTF are The Labour Party in Scotland playing at!!!

      This latest dodgy dossier is like some McCarthy witch-hunt, outing ordinary people for being ‘vile cybernats’. And their definition of a ‘vile cybernat’ is anyone who is a member/former member of the SNP and says something which Labour arbitrarily decide is rude or offensive.

      I know very little about the law, but I would hope that there are common sense laws which mean that if an ordinary person has been publicly shamed/defamed without good cause (i.e. they haven’t broken any laws) then they should be able to take legal action against The Labour Party and/or the papers.

      Publicising someone’s twitter account to thousands and thousands of people when they have no control over it, is completely irresponsible. I know that in theory twitter accounts are public, but an ordinary person can reasonably expect to be able to make decisions about how much information they make public based on how many people they expect to see it. If you have 100 followers, and all of them are people you already know, you wouldn’t expect your comments to be that far reaching. If all of a sudden you found that you had thousands of new followers you didn’t know, or you noticed that your tweet had been retweeted thousands of times, you would be able to make a judgement call on whether you wanted to delete the tweet/your account, or change your settings to make your tweets private. Labour have taken that control away from people without warning and without any thought for the potential consequences.

      They have no idea about the personal circumstances of the person they are ‘outing’, they don’t know the context these tweets were made in.

      Just for the sake of argument…

      What if one of these people were suffering from mental health problems? The unwanted publicity could be incredibly damaging and the consequences could be unthinkable.

      What if they happen to already be known to someone nasty/dangerous who might see that information in the press and decide to act on it? They may be putting people at both physical and emotional risk.

      What if the person’s employer sees the dossier and takes Labour’s decision on what constitutes a ‘vile cybernat’ at face value and believes the person has done something illegal/wrong? They could be putting people’s livelihoods at risk unfairly.

      Whether or not it’s illegal, what they’ve done is morally wrong, irresponsible and an assault on freedom of expression.

      I sincerely hope that the law does provide some protection and if I were included on that list, I would seriously consider getting a lawyer.

    149. Foonurt says:

      Labour cabal, rifling through reams ah yoan undeid, in thoan smoke-fuullt shite-hoose. Fuck me, nae wunnurr they urr whaur they urr.

    150. Dumb Unicorn says:

      Dave McEwan Hill

      “I hereby announce that “Won’t Get Fooled Again” is our campaign tune for the next referendum”.

      Hear hear! Great minds think alike, that song came into my head on 19th Sept and for me it’s the perfect anthem – the words are very apt.

      And sadly you’re right, his voice did sound shot. Lucky for me I saw them two nights ago in Hyde Park and it was in it’s full glory then – which may be why it wasn’t tonight 🙂 .

    151. dakk says:

      Dumb Unicorn 12.36

      I guarantee that a supine msm and judiciary will allow this scandal to go unchecked.

      If they can bury war crimes,paedo rings at Westminster and Bae slush funds for Saudis this wouldnt come close to pricking the conscience of the creatures who run the show in Team GB.

    152. Dumb Unicorn says:

      Last post for the night.

      In 5 minutes on Google, I put together my own ‘mini-dossier’ but decided to stick to public figures rather than shaming any ordinary people.

      16/01/12 – Channel 4 reported ” Labour MP stands down after Nazi film spoof” when Tom Harris posted a video of Alex Salmond as Hitler.

      05/06/14 – The Independent reported “Alistair Darling accused of comparing ‘Yes’ voters to Nazis and says Alex Salmond is behaving ‘like Kim Jong-il’” after some mumbled comments in an interview with the New Statesman.

      01/07/14 – BBC reported “Hitler Youth tweet Labour candidate resigns” – when Labour party candidate for Angus Kathy Wiles compared people campaigning for Independence with their children to Nazis via a charming pictorial representation.

      04/12/14 – Daily Mail reported “Scottish nationalists accused of Nazi-style book burning” when Labour MP Jim McGovern compared SNP councillors to Nazis.

      If I had the time (and could be bothered), I’m sure I could find another 42 examples without even cracking open Ian Smart’s twitter account.

      You only have to read the comments on pretty much any post on ‘Scottish Labour’s’ Facebook page to find reference to Nazi’s from their supporters – usually with some spurious justification on why it’s true and why they think it’s okay to say it. And you wonder where their supporters get it from!

    153. Cadogan Enright says:

      @petra 10.27

      Write to him with it – they do reply

    154. JillP says:

      The wonderful thing about Subject Access Request is that they have to trawl for everything they may have on you and then send printed copies to you. They cannot just say they have nothing. I know they have my details on file because they sent me lots of rubbish emails during election campaign and got some very polite refusals from me.

      I requested SAR from PayPal several years ago. I have a very full envelope of pages and pages of documents relating to my complaint. It must have taken hours to produce. One of the best £10 worth ever.

      For every request they receive someone will have to take time to deal with the request. Those on the list might be advised to pay the fee as it is certain that they will have lots of your tweets on file. What they have published will only be the tip of the iceberg.

      As I have had a couple of spats with slab tweeters recently I’m sure I will be on their Twitter radar. I always make a point of being polite and criticise the action not the person. It really annoys those whose vocabulary is limited to common insults.

      For the fun of it I might just pay the fee.

    155. bjsalba says:

      Shouldn’t Facebook and Twitter be taking this matter up with the Scottish Labour Party? It is as far as I can see an unjustified attack on their user community.

    156. john king says:

      Lumilumi says
      “Vote SLAB and we won’t clype you!”

      Clype !
      olettodella ihana ihminen
      Lumilumi 🙂

      I DONT speak Finnish btw,
      Google speaks Finnish:)
      _____________________________________________________________
      Thepnr says:
      @ 10:02 pm
      @lumilumi

      I always enjoy reading your view on what is going on in Scotland. Don’t leave it so long next time please 🙂

      I wouldn’t put that Argos catalogue in the post to SLAB if I were you,
      it looks like Thepnr might tan your ar**,
      stick it doon the back o yer dungarees instead. 🙂

      btw He IS right
      ____________________________________________________________
      _

    157. john king says:

      If Macart asks I aint been here right?
      gotta go…. 🙁

    158. Macart says:

      I see Mr Mundell is attempting to slide out from under vows again. Boiled down he’s saying Westminster will vote against FFA for our own good. Oh and look at these shiny new tax powers worth £15bn.

      FFS! Seriously? Oh and the £7bn black hole has grown to £10bn now.

      If the Record say just one more time VOW Delivered…

      I’d love to know how the governor general and embassador to Scotland comes up with his £15bn, but putting that aside its not and never will be extra money, nor will those powers be fully usable without the other counter balancing fiscal levers. They are effectively worse than f**cking useless. That this tory knows this to be the case and is openly inviting a fiscal clusterfuck is beyond doubt. He simply does as he’s telt by his superiors.

      As predicted, the government are looking to squirm out from under any and all promises made during the referendum.

      So just to be clear: No permanence of the Scottish parliament enshrined in law. No powerhouse parliament with greatly increased economic powers. No near Federal solution or Devo Max. No VOW delivered.

      They lied to achieve an aim. Who knew? So for those who voted no but are now doubting their decision, what are you going to do about it? When a system you supported in good faith trashes your fellow Scots and their government on a daily basis through the press, when they refuse to deliver on ANY promises made in order to win your vote, just what will your response be? Perhaps if you’re lucky, you’ll get a chance to make your feelings known.

      2016 will be here soon enough.

    159. Macart says:

      @John King

      Ah know where t’find ye fella. Tellin’ oan me tae the heedmaister. 😀

    160. Effijy says:

      Scottish fighting spirit, resilience and ingenuity on display!

      The Labour Dossers, isn’t if funny how it crosses your mind now to consider if our attckers will know what a Dosser is, and will they add it to their “serious offenders” list, they obviously read
      everything produced on this site, as they have nothing of their own to read that doesn’t end in SNP Bad.

      With that thought, they may like to know that I intend to play fair with them, that one day they too might act like grown ups.

      I don’t want them to be out of pocket, other than with my Free post letter, and their reply, with 40 days or else, so I will enclose an old SNP pen, that can be used to write my reply.

      The 2nd Class postage tariff is 54p or if something 5mm thick,
      such as my pen is enclosed, the postage becomes 74p for a Large letter, even though it’s in a small DL envelope.

      Slabers! Would you return my pen after you have used it?
      Thanks.

    161. Patrick Roden says:

      So let me get this straight.

      If I buy say a 100 pack of the cheapest brown envelopes that I can find (perhaps on-line)

      Then send off my request to labour, but ‘forget’ to include some details, like my date of birth.

      And they write back requesting more details, and I reply with a further request and in good old Labour fashion, do not answer the question.

      So they need to keep writing to me to ask for DOB etc.

      Are you saying this will cost Labour a lot of man hours and money and will cause their beleaguered admin dept to go into meltdown.

      In other words, I will be able to ‘hit back’ at Labour for all the lies and smears that they have been throwing at me and my nation for the past number of years?

      Lovely! I’m off to order some very cheap envelopes.

    162. Valerie says:

      Not sure why the MSM haven’t picked up on the story, but Tunisia tragedy and Greece are dominating.

      The alternative is as Dumb Unicorn has explained, the papers may well be held responsible for any retribution printing material that they have not gathered and verified. I suspect that is why Hutcheon was tweeting those named, and asking if they stand by those tweets.

      Any one of those in the dossier may have had their account hacked, but then suffer any retribution seeking unionists?

      The other issue is that by reporting anything, the papers expose you to a wider audience, because your circle of followers etc May be fairly limited, and that was your intention.

      If the papers have any legal sense, I think they would be stupid to reprint the dossier, or pursue an individual that SLab deemed ‘rude’

    163. Nana Smith says:

      @cirsium thanks for that, makes grim reading. I am thoroughly disgusted by how the Greek people are being treated.

      Alexis Tsipras had this to say 13 hours ago

      In these critical hours, we must remember that the only thing to fear is fear itself.

      The dignity of the Greek people in the face of blackmail and injustice will send a message of hope and pride to all of Europe

      Could easily apply to us regarding Westminster.

    164. Nana Smith says:

      Don’t know if it’s true but there’s a rumour 3000+ new members for the snp. I do now of two for definite as they are friends of mine.

      So thanks again slabbers & co for your recruiting services.

    165. caz-m says:

      Ian Brotherhood

      Re: another PQ rally in September.

      I suppose we will need to wait and see if the previous team who organised all the other PQ rallies, get together and put something on.

      It will probably be the only chance we will get this year before the weather starts to turn. Hopefully it comes to pass.

    166. Grouse Beater says:

      With Greek banks shut, withdrawals limited and money circulation strictly controlled, how will the ‘something for nothing’ ex-pat Brits get their pensions?

    167. caz-m says:

      Nana Smith

      I remember during the Referendum Campaign that Better Together and BBC Scotland frequently reminded us that we could “end up like Greece” if we voted YES.

      You still get the feeling of a veiled threat coming from BBC Scotland news reports, that this is how Scotland will end up if you follow the SNP economic policy.

      Comparing Scotland with Greece was a favourite scary story of wee Dougie Alexander. (My “EX” MP).

    168. galamcennalath says:

      Nana Smith says:
      “Not going to archive as there is a poll.”

      A Wolverhampton news site.

      59.7 % say Scotland should have more economic powers.

      Interestingly, in another poll there, 77.5 % say no to Europe.

    169. Nana Smith says:

      @caz-m I remember it all too well. Muddle mundell is clyping to the papers this morning that rejection of FFS is for our own good. Seems the 7billion black hole has grown to 10billion since muddle became Sec of state.

      Methinks his brain is swelling, he should get that checked out in case of complications.

      https://archive.is/cynj4

      a couple more links…

      https://lightinthenorth.wordpress.com/2015/06/28/scottish-labour-meets-the-internet-clype-on-this-ya-tubes/

      http://energydesk.greenpeace.org/2015/06/28/new-adviser-to-amber-rudd-took-cash-from-fracking-lobbyists/

    170. Ken500 says:

      Mundell is lying again. Everyone who voted for him should be black affronted.

      Any ‘£10Billion deficit’ is as a result of Westminster mismanagement. Raise £15Billion? Scotland raises £54Billion in tax revenues. Could spend less on Trident/illegal wars, tax evasion, banking fraud. Raise more on a tax on ‘loss leading drink and a land tax. £10Billion? – the so-called deficit.

      The UK raises £466Billion in tax revenues. £54Billion (pro rata more) in Scotland The rest of the UK raises £412Billion and borrows and spends £90Billion.

      Westminster Unionists are despicable. £Billions have been (secretly) taken out of Scotland. The McCrone Report and Thatcher.

    171. ScottieDog says:

      @nana smith

      I think the onslaught against the Greeks, if they decided to default, will be, well massive and brutal.
      For once the we have out in the open, the battle between the money creators and the will of the people.

      What I think Greece needs to do is create its own debt free sovereign currency, issued amongst its people to rebuild its infrastructure and feed its people. Will it be tough, absolutely, but it’s probably the only path to take in order to prevent its destruction.

      Funnily enough, the American colonies created their own currency due to the shortage of sterling from the Empire. This was sternly resisted by Britain and the Bank of England and this is what eventually lead to the Declaration of Independence.

      If you can’t trade and feed your kids you will fight. This is what Greece must do.

      Interestingly, the debt free ‘greenbacks’ persisted for a long time in America before eventually the bankers had them outlawed post independence.

      I can’t recommend enough Bill Still’s ‘Secret World of Oz’ on YouTube. It talks about the battle between democracy and the establishment throug history and is very relevant to Greece.

    172. Breeks says:

      We shouldn’t have to do this. If they have broken the law then justice surely requires the law to act and defend the people.

      Its the same thing with these Banks and their Payment Protection Scam. If there was a proven fraud and it seems there was, acceptance of guilt, payment sums made available, then why should the actual delivery of justice for the victims require the victims to apply for it? Justice thus becomes simply a cash cow for all these parasitic law firms and advertisers to profit from the implementation of justice which should surely be implementing itself.

      The Banks treated me myself appallingly; much worse than selling me a product I didn’t want, but my efforts to secure justice were met with absolute contempt.

      When our Courts don’t implement the Law of the land, our “regulators” are a complete joke, our Council’s are rife with nepotism and corruption yet manifestly impenetrable by investigation, our banks are a law unto themselves, our media is a propaganda mouthpiece for a government hostile to our Natio9n’s best interests, and our taxes can be squandered with impunity by Scottish Enterprise on one white elephant after another while their chums laugh all the way to the bank, and our MP’s and MSP’s can’t be held to account, (try it, see how far you get), then where does the governance of our country physically begin? Where is the benchmark for acceptable conduct?

      We have such a diseased country here in Scotland, and it requires so much more of the Rev’s intolerance for “shite” to be commonplace.

    173. gillie says:

      To see the EU kicking the Greeks while their down has been horrific and it now makes me rethink my whole attitude to the European Union.

      What is the point of the EU if the bankers are in charge?

    174. gillie says:

      To see the EU kicking the Greeks while their down has been horrific and it now makes me rethink my whole attitude to the European Union.

      What is the point of the EU if the bankers are in charge?

    175. Nana Smith says:

      Lord Janner will face prosecution for child sex offences, Director of Public Prosecutions Alison Saunders confirms.

    176. Nana Smith says:

      Lord Janner will face prosecution for child sex offences, Director of Public Prosecutions Alison Saunders confirms.

    177. Nana Smith says:

      @ScottieDog

      Thanks for the link, will watch this evening

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qIhDdST27g

      I agree with your assessment re the Greek situation. Funny how forgetful some countries become after time.

      http://www.lse.ac.uk/researchAndExpertise/researchImpact/PDFs/germany-hypocrisy-eurozone-debt-crisis.pdf

    178. Fiona says:

      I think we should be aware that if we do vote for independence we will indeed be like Greece in this sense: the neoliberal de facto rulers of the world will do everything they can to destroy the Scottish economy. It is imperative for them to ensure that any government which rejects their agenda fails. TINA must be believed everywhere and anything which challenges it poses a threat.

    179. Capella says:

      There’s an interesting discussion between Glenn Greenwald and Noam Chomsky on the subject of the two tier legal system; one for the haves and another for the have-nots. This applies at an individual level e.g. bankers and an international level e.g. US wars against small countries.
      It is just over an hour long.
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs_xQ9d_IsQ

    180. Nana Smith says:

      Man the lifeboats…

      A third of Glasgow’s Labour councillors could quit before 2017 elections

      https://archive.is/7sQYw

    181. Donald says:

      I was surprised how little time it too to add 400 random names and addresses to a template and then send them FREEPOST to an address in Glasgow.

    182. caz-m says:

      Nana Smith 9.19am
      “Seems the 7billion black hole has grown to 10billion since muddle became Sec of state.”

      Any advance on £10Billion?

      I mean this £12Billion pound black hole will cripple Scotland.

      Mundell went on to say “I am very concerned that this £14Billion pound black hole would leave Scottish families in poverty”.

      Ian Murray, the lone Scottish Labour MP said that the £16Billion pound black hole was the outcome of FFA. He said that taxes would have to be raised and public services cut to cover this £18Billion pound black hole.

    183. Capella says:

      I agree about the terrible precedent the EU is setting in their attitude to Greece. Certainly makes me think twice about whether we should be in such an organisation. It also parallels the treatment we can expect from Westminster, as we already did wrt the currency union. Looks very much like an independent sovereign currency is essential.

      Greece needs all the support we can give right now.

    184. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Re: PQ demo on 19th September.

      As far as I’m aware, there is a ‘Hope Over Fear’ rally organised for that day, in George Square.

    185. Brian Powell says:

      Nana Smith

      Daily Mail is claiming credit for this. There was a move to proceed with a prosecution in Scotland after it was refused in England. I don’t know what came of that.

      Anybody know?

    186. proudscot says:

      I sincerely hope I have made it onto Labour’s McCarthyite List of Un-British Activities. I plead guilty to referring to the FatTwat half of Murphy’s Dynamic Duo of his SNP-BAD Black Ops Team, as Blair McDoughball and taking my cue from Greg Moodie’s excellent Monday cartoons in the National, to the other half as Tarantula McTernan.

      Seriously, what a pathetic rump of SNP haters Labour’s Northern Branch has become. Instead of having a genuine debate among themselves about the reasons why they have lost the trust of the Scottish electorate, they are still immersed in self-denial, factional infighting and blaming the hated SNP for having “duped” and “stolen” their once natural support north of the border.

    187. Macnakamura says:

      Grouse Beater says:
      29 June, 2015 at 9:03 am
      With Greek banks shut, withdrawals limited and money circulation strictly controlled, how will the ‘something for nothing’ ex-pat Brits get their pensions?
      :::::::::
      Strange sentiment, unless I am misunderstanding it.

      Pensioners are entitled to their pensions wherever they may be.
      Something for nothing? Pensions are a contributory scheme.
      It seems to suggest that in an independent Scotland, you would deny pension rights to expat Scots.

      If you want to have a dig at chancers and parasites then fine because there are plenty of them wherever you look.

      I

    188. Marie clark says:

      Macnakamura, I think you might have got the wrong end of the stick here. I take it what Grouse Beater meant was physically how do you get the cash to pay your pension from the banks. I don’t think it has anything to do with pensioners entitlement at all.

      Like others, I am horrified at the way Greece is being treated by the EU. It is certainly making me think about my position. I don’t think that I want to vote yes in an EU referendum to be treated like this.

      I reckon our own currency is a must, and at the moment I would most certainly vote no to staying in the EU.

    189. Luigi says:

      Nana Smith says:

      29 June, 2015 at 10:39 am

      Man the lifeboats…

      A third of Glasgow’s Labour councillors could quit before 2017 elections

      https://archive.is/7sQYw

      Not surprised. A bunch of Cowards.

      Ever wondered why Broon, Darling, Campbell and Bruce all suddenly announced their retirement before the GE? It wasn’t anything to do with that big yellow tsunami on the horizon, surely? The fact that Murphy and the Alexanders stayed on (long enough to be blown out of the water) indicates they sadly had nowhere else to go. My heart bleeds.

    190. Macnakamura says:

      Marie clark says:
      29 June, 2015 at 11:14 am
      Macnakamura, I think you might have got the wrong end of the stick here. I take it what Grouse Beater meant was physically how do you get the cash ………
      :::::::::::::
      I would like to think that but why the use of the term ‘something for nothing ex-pats’?

    191. Nana Smith says:

      Re the Greek crisis the more I read about the EU TTIP and the IMF the more disillusioned I am becoming. We were led to believe we were joining a common market and not the all controlling elite show we see.

      Here is a documentary on the events that led to the economic collapse of Argentina in 2001 which wiped out the middle class and raised the level of poverty to 57.5%. Central to the collapse was the implementation of neo-liberal policies which enabled the swindle of billions of dollars by foreign banks and corporations.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CzS6eHqtnQ&feature=youtu.be

    192. cirsium says:

      @scottie Dog, 9.46am. Good post. We need monetary sovereignty.

      @Fiona, 10.16. Agree. The ECB encouraged a bank-run to try and bring down the democratically elected government. I think Yanis Varoufakis puts it well

      “The Eurogroup Meeting of 27th June 2015 will not go down as a proud moment in Europe’s history. Ministers turned down the Greek government’s request that the Greek people should be granted a single week during which to deliver a Yes or No answer to the institutions’ proposals – proposals crucial for Greece’s future in the Eurozone. The very idea that a government would consult its people on a problematic proposal put to it by the institutions was treated with incomprehension and often with disdain bordering on contempt. I was even asked: “How do you expect common people to understand such complex issues?”. Indeed, democracy did not have a good day in yesterday’s Eurogroup meeting! But nor did European institutions. After our request was rejected, the Eurogroup President broke with the convention of unanimity (issuing a statement without my consent) and even took the dubious decision to convene a follow up meeting without the Greek minister, ostensibly to discuss the “next steps”.

      Can democracy and a monetary union coexist? Or must one give way? This is the pivotal question that the Eurogroup has decided to answer by placing democracy in the too-hard basket.

      Can democracy and the EU, as it is currently structured, coexist? When I think of the way in which the TTIP negotiations are being conducted in secret and the fact that the vote in the EU Parliament was cancelled when it looked like the MEPs were going to vote against TTIP, I have to answer in the negative.

    193. Bob Mack says:

      @Macnakamura,
      The pensioners may have their money paid into a bank ok,but accessing the full amount may be problematic given the ever increasing restrictions being put in place within Greece.No doubt they will become more severe..

    194. Robert Peffers says:

      @Nana Smith says: 29 June, 2015 at 10:11 am:

      “Lord Janner will face prosecution for child sex offences, Director of Public Prosecutions Alison Saunders confirms”

      And about time too. Even if the old git is demented he needs to be brought before the bench and have to prove it. After which, if he is proven to be demented, he should be removed from the Lords to, (another), OAP’s nursing home where he, and not the taxpayer, pays for his nursing care.

      Then we should demand the Metropolitan Police Force go after the rest of the abusers and the Crown Prosecution Service brings charges against anyone, of any rank, within either House of Parliament involved in the abuses.

    195. Macnakamura says:

      Bob mack
      @Macnakamura,
      The pensioners may have their money paid into a bank ok,but accessing the full amount may be problematic given the ever increasing restrictions being put in place within Greece.No doubt they will become more severe..
      ::::::::::::::
      I know of the practical difficulties but Grousebeater post was expressing something other than that, I believe.
      Again , why the use of the term ‘ something for nothing expats’ ?

    196. Marie clark says:

      Well said Mr Peffers Sir. 100% bang on.

    197. Nana Smith says:

      @ Robert Peffers Absolutely

      Lord Janner criticised justice system for excusing alleged Nazi war criminal who had dementia

      https://archive.is/DjGTe

    198. Bob Mack says:

      @Macnakamura.
      The only thing I can think they get for nothing is the sun.and reduced heating costs.
      Everything else they have earned over their lifetime of working.

    199. Robert Peffers says:

      @Brian Powell says: 29 June, 2015 at 10:59 am:

      “There was a move to proceed with a prosecution in Scotland after it was refused in England. I don’t know what came of that.

      Anybody know?

      As Scots law is independent and the offense the charge relates too occurred in Scotland the events in England should not affect the case being brought in Scotland – even if the English court rule the old guy is too demented to stand trial, (but I’m not a lawyer so very well could be wrong).

    200. Macnakamura says:

      The perpetractors will be demented, dead and gone before the rest of us get to know anything close to the truth about Establishment misconduct.
      Saville, Brittan, Fairbairn, Smith are some examples.

    201. Stoker says:

      Nana Smith wrote:
      “Man the lifeboats…A third of Glasgow’s Labour councillors could quit before 2017 elections”
      https://archive.is/7sQYw

      Well, well, well, as Karen Dunbar would say – “I smell shite.”
      I don’t think they are just running scared due to the hiding which awaits them, i think a lot of them will be shitting-a-brick due to the corruption which the new administration will uncover.

      Oh my, very exciting times await us, full steam ahead troops!

    202. Ken500 says:

      The Greeks are making the situation worse by transferring cash out of the banks and the country.
      How much is ending up in London?

    203. Nana Smith says:

      I am waiting & hoping for a supportive snp statement on the Greek crisis. After all they are against austerity.

      out of $284 billion in bailouts 92% went to the banks & financial institutions 8% went to the people of greece

      http://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/greece-referendum-troika-eurozone-by-joseph-e–stiglitz-2015-06

      http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2015/06/29/just-suppose-greece-was-a-state-facing-imminent-collapse/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+org%2FlWWh+%28Tax+Research+UK+2%29

    204. Petra says:

      @ Capella says at 10:48 am ”I agree about the terrible precedent the EU is setting in their attitude to Greece. Certainly makes me think twice about whether we should be in such an organisation. It also parallels the treatment we can expect from Westminster, as we already did wrt the currency union. Looks very much like an independent sovereign currency is essential. Greece needs all the support we can give right now.”

      Yeah the EU is behaving in an utterly despicable manner Capella and may ultimately contribute to botching up Camerons EU Ref plans. The only thing that we Scots can do right now to show our support / help them / their economy is to book a holiday in Greece (if you can afford to do so).

      @ Nana Smith says at 10:39 am ”Man the lifeboats… A third of Glasgow’s Labour councillors could quit before 2017 elections.” https://archive.is/7sQYw

      That’s why wee Matheson is bailing out imo Nana, that and the fact that GCC was absolutely inundated with complaints about him and his relationship with the Orange Order leaving him between a rock and a hard place (wouldn’t want to annoy the OO now would he?).

      And Nana I’ve had a look at all of the interesting links that you posted such as Gove, but if ever there was one that highlights we’re now close to living in a third World country it must be the one re. tampons – a female issue so with their narcissistic total lack of empathy Cameron, Osborne, Mundell et al wont be able to relate to or be too concerned about. I mean to say they’re not too bothered about people starving to death so this will be low on their list of priorities.

      @ Cadogan Enright says at 1:40 am ”Petra Write to him with it – they do reply.”

      I will do Cadagon. I contact them (BBC / STV / Newspapers etc) frequently complaining about one thing and another and wont give up no matter their pathetic responses. I’m always hoping that many others are bombarding them too with complaints but we’ll never know as the BBC wont reveal the figures. I’ve even heard that so many people have complained to the BBC that they’ve given up recording the count … (Professor John Robertson).

      For example I contacted the BBC last year in relation to their biased coverage of the Referendum. My complaint was detailed and I included exact quotes from some of their presenters and so on.

      This was their reply.

      ”BBC News has consistently reported on developments by both the Yes Scotland and Better Together campaigns on TV, on radio and online.

      At the BBC, we are determined to be impartial and fair in our coverage and to bring a range of views to our audiences. The referendum was a long campaign and we delivered comprehensive coverage across all of our platforms. Please be assured that bias plays no part in our reporting. We place the highest value on accuracy and impartiality within our own journalism and rigorous editorial standards are applied across all of our output.

      Thank you, once again, for taking the time to contact us.”

    205. dakk says:

      Macnackamura. 11.51

      I know some people who got retirement packages from the likes of BT and Glasgow City Council in their early 50s.Final Salary and index linked.

      They’ll certainly be getting something for nothing if they live a long life,that’s for sure.A return on investment that many of us could not even dream of.

      Am I jealous ? You bet !

      I think that may be what Grousebeater may have been alluding to – but I may be wrong.

    206. Fiona says:

      I have said many times that if Scotland gains independence we MUST have our own currency. I oppose the idea of using sterling, and I think that, or adoption of the euro, is a disastrous policy for all the reasons we can see in Greece and elsewhere. I hope that the Scottish Government will see this before any future referendum is held. I urge all independence supporters to look into the importance of sovereign currency, and to campaign for that to be adopted as the position

    207. Stoker says:

      The BBC complaints system is the biggest bar of fudge known to the human race. Very few complaints are upheld. The majority of complaints receive a bog standard ‘thanks but now you can eff off peasant.’ The only real benefit of complaining is if enough people do it at the same time and overload their system. The best form of retaliation against the BBC is refusal to pay the licence fee.

      @ Fiona (2.12pm).
      I’m with you on that one, us having our own currency.

    208. DerekM says:

      ouch thats going to hurt them, big Blair has certainly put his foot in it this time,i even read the Sunday Express(i know i know it was pretty creepy lol ) just to check see if those rabid loonies would pounce on it but even they can see a bad mistake when it rears its ugly head lol

      o/t And ive got to hand it to the Sunday Post this week for their oor wullie cartoon featuring the FM i had a good chuckle Nicola in a Saltire dress i reckon she could pull that off 🙂

      I wonder about the Post at times i havnt been swearing at them as much as i used to on a Sunday up at me old mums ,are they coming around ? lol

    209. Gary says:

      ‘Your names going on the list…’

    210. Dougie Bee says:

      I’ve got an old Screwfix mag thats on its way to the freepost data man, a few pages at a time..

      That should eat up a pound or two of their money..no a bad idea

      What do you think?…xxx

    211. A MacRitchie says:

      GREEK DEFIANCE

      Glad to see Alexis Tsipras still standing tall against the pressure his government is being put under. Greece will be put under enormous propaganda to remain within the EU a Greek version of project fear this week. I hope the referendum vote rejects this and gives two fingers to IMF, ECB and EU.

      Good for George Kerevan writing a good piece in todays TN.

    212. Grouse Beater says:

      Macnackamura. Strange sentiment, unless I am misunderstanding it.

      You’re new-ish here? 🙂

      It expressed wry humour.

      Westminster and the Labour party lied to pensioners during the Referendum in order to scare them witless. In short, they said, vote Yes, lose your pension.

      It was pointed out by me and a many other, pensions are guaranteed wherever you live, expats in Spain, Italy and the EU generally, consequently an autonomous Scotland will be included in that guarantee …

      … unless – shock, horror – the government of the EU country you reside in limits the cash you can take out on any one day, or has no money to keep banks open. Or you don’t have a bank card to use at an ATM. Nevertheless, Cameron has stated the British government – cue ‘Land of Hope and Glory’ – will ensure expats receive their pension payments come what may!

      Oo, er.

      Coined by the neo-liberals, ‘the something for nothing’ expats includes the annual heating allowance they take though they live abroad in much warmer winter climes.

    213. Grouse Beater says:

      The atrocities perpetrated in Tunisia defy description, horrific doesn’t get close, but one cannot listen to Westminster’s politicians condemning ‘mass murder’, terror’ and ‘twisted ideologies’ without thinking of the ‘shock and Awe’ they released on thousands of innocents in Iraq in the name of bringing democracy to the Middle-East.

    214. Stoker says:

      Dougie Bee wrote:
      “I’ve got an old Screwfix mag thats on its way to the freepost data man, a few pages at a time..”

      Gaun yersel, not quite civil disobedience but funny as feck!
      🙂
      ____________

      @ Grouse Beater (6.13pm).

      Couldn’t agree more. All this hypocritical minutes silence showmanship they were performing at Warminster for the tv cameras had me diving for the sick bucket and remote control.

      Nor will i be respecting or performing in any minutes silence for any victims of circumstances created by the warmongers of Warminster & Co.

      I shall continue to hold my own private thoughts and wishes for the victims and their families and shall share those thoughts and wishes with them if i ever get to meet those people.

      Not because a bunch of warmongering hypocritical bastards want to ease their collective conscience and want all of us to join in but because my thoughts are genuine and heartfelt.

    215. drawdeaddave says:

      As one of those implicated in the dossier for quoting Rabbie Burn’s parcel of rouges & as someone who has just returned from Tunisia three weeks ago & get this has just booked to go back to that area in Tunisia 5 days before the terrorist attack & have just been told by travel agent it will cost me £600 to cancel said holiday, i really don’t give a flying fuck right now about fat boy McDonuts pathetic dossier..

    216. macnakamura says:

      Grouse Beater says:
      29 June, 2015 at 5:18 pm

      It expressed wry humour.
      ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
      Everthing you said after that line I can agree with.

      Your wryness escaped me and several others, not so newish, who attempted to explain and or defend your post.

    217. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I got the ‘something for nothing’ reference.

      Jiss sayin’, like…

    218. Grouse Beater says:

      “Your wryness escaped me and several others”

      I suggest you begin by asking questions next time to avoid appearing unsophisticated.

      And don’t speak for others. Knowing my politics they knew your interpretation was rash. On something for nothing – Westminster plans we get nothing. Tories and Labour want the pensionable age raised to sixty-five or even seventy to ensure fewer of us live to get a pension.

      Even the slowest of expats will spot the irony of ‘guaranteed’ pensions.

    219. ts intersting reading some of the posts from
      people who either haven’t received leaflets
      through their door from Labour activists or
      didn’t get personally addressed mail shots while
      members of their family as part of the same
      household did.

      I am sure Labour have info on me and I would be
      dumbfounded if they had been stupid enough to have
      sent me any personally addressed Labour mail shots
      during the referendum and the general election campaigns.

      Because, besides writing letters to my Local newspapers
      I have stood about half a dozen times in elections as a
      local government candidate and over a thirty year period
      have leafleted every part of the constituency I live in.

      Being an activist you get to know the houses not to bother
      leafleting, for example people would come to the door and
      tell you they’re not interested and don’t want your leaflet
      or they may hand it back, throw it back out the door or
      make great a display of tearing it up hoping to upset you.

      Labour activists would also be gathering much of the same
      info as they campaigned.

    220. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I got regular emails from Labour before the GE, to an email address I have used for only two purposes; to register with The Herald, for the free pages, and to register at Linkedin.

      So I guess Labour farmed one or the other or both…

    221. fred blogger says:

      slabs, specializing in the micro management of grains of dust.
      ‘please take us seriously’, yeah right.
      🙂

    222. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      When I checked my emails at teatime, on getting home from work, I found one from “Brian Roy Scottish General Secretary”, asking me to ‘register as an official supporter of the Labour Party and get a vote’ or become a member.

      Methinks they’ve been farming…

    223. Grouse Beater says:

      Methinks they’ve been farming…

      All that expensive search and identify wasted. 🙂

    224. Neil McKenzie says:

      I replied to the request for payment using the original ‘Freepost’ address which they conveniently omitted from their letter, so they have to pay for this. I also forgot to send payment so I guess they will have to write back again and request the payment I ‘forgot’ to enclose… Oh dear!!



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