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The missing story

Posted on November 23, 2015 by

The Daily Record has this on its front page today.


And that’s fine. The tale of a five-figure sum of money which might (or might not) have gone missing from the accounts of Women For Independence, who’ve promptly called the police to investigate an apparent discrepancy between their donated income and their expenditure, is entirely legitimate news.

But we couldn’t help wondering something.

Because last month there was an almost identical story involving Scottish Labour.


The Edinburgh Evening News reported that:

“Labour activists have called in police after getting fed-up waiting for party bosses to investigate how £10,000 went missing from local party coffers.

The Evening News revealed in July last year how Labour had launched an inquiry into the Edinburgh Eastern constituency party after the cash disappeared.

The seat is the one where Scottish Labour leader Kezia Dugdale is due to stand in next year’s Scottish Parliament elections.

Local party treasurer Karen Rennie was suspended from the party while the inquiry was carried out and remains suspended today. But the investigation has dragged on without any result and now a group of local members has approached the police.”

(The same paper had reported the original suspension in detail too.)

The revelation also made The National and the Daily Mail, which is unsurprising, as you’d think that by any reasonable interpretation of news values it was an even bigger story than the WFI one. Another five-figure sum involved, another police inquiry, but this time an inexplicable delay of a year and a quarter, and all in the local party of the Scottish Labour leader.

Weirdly, though, we haven’t been able to find a single mention of the story in the Daily Record. We’ve been right through the 5th and 6th October print editions of the paper – which have plenty of criticism of the SNP’s selection policy and demands for “more answers” over the T In The Park affair, but nothing on Labour’s missing £10K – and we’ve searched the website, but there’s not a word.

It’s all the more strange that the Record didn’t consider the involvement of the police to be newsworthy, because it HAD covered – albeit briefly – the original suspension of Karen Rennie in July 2014.

Perhaps our Googling just isn’t up to scratch. Can any readers help us out?

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  1. 23 11 15 13:21

    The missing story | Politics Scotland |

246 to “The missing story”

  1. Itchybiscuit says:

    The only help I can give is to remind you not to look for truth, integrity or even journalism when you immerse yourself in ‘DR World’ – it’s not excellent but it is (Labour) Party Time!

    Would you like me to anchor your rope as you descend into the pit? ;o)

  2. Bill Fraser says:

    Another typical “lets bash the Indy lot” with only the vaguest hint of impropriety in the Labor Party fiasco.

  3. Sharny Dubs says:

    Same old same old, what did you expect? Integrity?

  4. McBoxheid says:

    What else do you expect from the Union’s defecazzi?

  5. Macart says:

    They do double standards to Olympian levels dontchaknow.

    That and I’d say right about now Scotland’s Chumpion, is looking for any remotely damaging story against independence or the SG to divert from the clusterfuck they helped mislead Scotland’s population into.

    Every story of hardship, every job loss as a result of central govt. policy, that’s on them. They were quick enough to claim credit for delivery/non delivery/delivery/non delivery/delivery of the vow they cooked up? They can carry the can for the non delivery of near federalism and every closure that comes Scotland’s way.

  6. Ian McCubbin says:

    It seems the Record is selective in what it reports. Just like other pro Union media. Am sure they have directors linked to Labour Party, and or other unionist parties.

  7. Lesley-Anne says:


    Is it me or are things getting a wee bit uncomfortable for Labour branch office and its print media arm a.k.a. D.R. 😀

  8. heedtracker says:

    On balance though, these staggering bullshitters and the BBC creep show across the Clyde, STV, all the rest of the UKOK media, likes of neo fascist Voice Of the North Press and Journal in Aberdeen, all are part of the opposition to SNP in Holyrood , so it’s kind of a democracy in their Scotland region.

    Not saying it’s a very pleasant one and clearly it’s not very effective.

  9. galamcennalath says:

    I agree with Stu. Exhaustive search and I also conclude that the DR never reported the missing cash problem from its political wing 🙂

  10. Farnorthdavie says:

    It’s hard to believe that there are still folk out there who spend their money on such a waste of natural resources on a daily basis.

    Even worse there are ‘journalists’ who choose to work for this type of gutter press company, they have zero integrity all that matters is something to let them run a scare tactic headline.

    Their readers must be a totally confused group of people; a tactic in its own right of course.

  11. galamcennalath says:


    Aye. Chicken and egg. Is Labour the political wing of the DR, or is the DR the media arm of Labour?

    Mind you, when one goes down, they will both go down!

  12. Jimbo says:

    It’s good that you’re prepared to look into the abyss on our behalf, Stu.

    I try to avoid going there at all costs. Any time I look in there I feel dirty.

  13. Lesley-Anne says:

    galamcennalath says:
    23 November, 2015 at 1:41 pm


    Aye. Chicken and egg. Is Labour the political wing of the DR, or is the DR the media arm of Labour?

    Mind you, when one goes down, they will both go down!

    What can I say galamcennath … my daily smile-a-thon has just got just a wee bit bigger! 😀

  14. Murray McCallum says:

    If the incident with Labour funds was in July 2014, I don’t understand why there was no action (let alone prompt action).

    “The Scottish Labour Party” accounts submission for the year ended 31 December 2014 is very clear about their record keeping and respionsiblity for such things.

    “The Registered Treasurer is responsible for ensuring that adequate accounting records are maintained that are sufficient to show and explain the party’s transactions … He also has delegated responsibility from the NEC for safeguarding the assets of the party … and hence for taking reasonable steps for the prevention of fraud and other irregularities.”,

    This was signed by a Brian Roy (Registered Treasurer)

    Surely the investigators simply had to speak to him to get the matter properly investigated and an explanation found?

  15. caz-m says:

    Too much Daily Record bullshit is seriously bad for your health.

    That’s two DR posts in a row Rev AND we also had that lying bastard David Clegg of the Record being interviewed on the telly yesterday by Gordon Brewer.

    It’s enough to drive you nuts!

    A hate the Daily Record.

  16. Macart says:

    @Lesley Anne

    Were I in DR editorial, I’d be shitting red hot conkers right about now.

  17. Training Day says:

    Wait now.. ‘your child’s height in books’?

    Nah.. ‘height of the shite spewed out by the Daily Record in books’? Now you’re opening a Bodleian library.

  18. caz-m says:


    The holy trinity of Unionist’s in Scotland are,

    Scottish Labour
    Daily Record
    BBC Scotland

    These three pillars of the British Establishment all need each others support.

    Take one down and the rest will fall.

  19. Luigi says:

    The unionist triumvirate:

    BBC Scotland – Daily Record – Scottish Labour

    A well-established three-way relationship, fully intertwined. The boundaries between these three unionist institutions, if they exist at all, are highly obscured and impossible to define. You will find that they are connected by multiple layers of spouses, partners, close business associates, relatives and old friends within. There are also a number of figures who have worked for more than one of these institutes during the course of their careers, further cementing the bonds between them. A classic example of corporate incest. The Free Masons are like an open book club compared to this lot.

    They prop each other up. And that is their Achilles heel. Destroy one and the entire unionist structure will come crashing down. And all three legs of the stool have been damaged by recent events and are quite shoogly at the moment. Keep the pressure on, folks – something will give eventually.

  20. heedtracker says:

    Red and blue tory media equally mad as

    Vote NO or else Glasgow Herald headline

    “David Cameron denounces ‘ridiculous’ Lords Prayer advert ban as Michelle Mone offers help to Church of England”

    Lady Mone of UKOK Mayfair, to the Church of England rescue. At least that lot cant burn people at the stake anymore.

    You pays your money, you choose who’s going to bullshit you.

    Or get adblock:D

  21. Lollysmum says:

    And it’s that lack of integrity around their reporting that has led to many of us on Twitter to block the DR as an attempt to deny them advertising revenues. By blocking them my timeline has improved considerably 🙂

  22. Sorry I can’t help either, one of my local libraries gets the daily stranger every day and I often flick through it to see if there is something that might draw my interest.

    Unless I missed it at the time, I don’t remember reading the story of the missing 10k in that rag.

  23. Dan Huil says:

    Next to Scotland regaining its independence my most fervent hope [after world peace and a clear complexion, of course] is for Scotland to be free of such BritNat rags.

  24. Bill Hume. says:

    Off topic I suppose, but I’m depressed by all the hurt coming from Westminster and the MSM.

    So….to cheer up everyone like myself who is feeling a bit down today, the ‘scores on the doors’

    Ruth Davidson (Crowdfunder)..£3855 from 87 donors.
    Stuart Campbell (Indiegogo)..£4276 from 543 donors.

    Lololol. Feeling a bit better.

  25. kailyard rules says:

    More Daily Clegg straw clutching.

  26. chic says:

    Farnorthdavie says:
    “Even worse there are ‘journalists’ who choose to work for this type of gutter press company, . . .”

    Imagine you were the editor of a reputable news outlet, and someone came to you for a job with a spell at DR in their CV . . .

    Nope, neither would I!

  27. Sassenach says:

    Quite good to watch Scottish Labour and English Labout showing their ‘brotherly love’ on the BBC Politics programme today.

    Popcorn for tomorrow’s debate already ordered.

  28. paul gerard mccormack says:

    it wis Showbiz Sam and Diner Tec wot dunnit.

  29. Bob Mack says:

    I have a good story for them. It’s called


  30. Capella says:

    I wonder what the DR and BBC Scotland will do after the May election? If there’s a clean sweep in Holyrood there will be nobody for them to interview unless they resort to Labour Councillors. Even then, they will be gone by 2017.

  31. galamcennalath says:

    caz-m says:

    “The holy trinity of Unionist’s in Scotland are,
    Scottish Labour
    Daily Record
    BBC Scotland”

    There is a pecking order, though.

    Daily Record gets about 180000 sales daily.

    Labour got about 700000 votes in the GE

    Reporting Scotland gets about 500000 viewers. However more watch BBC London output which must twist their world view away from Scottish affairs.

    Not sure what to make of the figures. I think one observation is that the DR is probably far less important in opinion forming than the BBC. So perhaps an unholy alliance of Labour and BBC is our biggest threat.

  32. Graham MacLure says:

    capella @2;18

    BBC will just show repeats as no one will notice and the DR will be inventive much the same as they are now.

  33. Lesley-Anne says:

    I think you may be right there Macart. 😀

    Absolutely Caz. Pick one … any one and pull it away and the rest will tumble down in short order. 😀

  34. Petra says:

    OMISSIONS: This is a well- known propaganda technique (one of many) used constantly by the Daily Record in an attempt to brainwash their readers. In this instance they’ve omitted to mention the (whole) story at all.

    If you read through any of their articles relating to the SNP you’ll find that they always OMIT to mention key factors such as in their, Clegg’s, article about Nicola Sturgeon’s first year in post they say that she has achieved ONE thing only … Party gender balance / equality …. when in fact there are over a dozen ‘achievements’ to be found if they care to look (and don’t they know it). Then there was the latest Lords Halt the Scotland Bill Process. If you read that you’ll see that they’ve omitted to mention that economists have said that in its current state it could be financially detrimental to Scotland. Their version reads as though the Lords and SNP just can’t agree.

    When they were duping the Scots, in the main Labour supporters, with regard to their ’13 prestigious economists predict doom and gloom’ pre-referendum they omitted to mention that they were members of a TORY Think Tank.

    The power of this technique is that not presenting the whole truth / leaving out important information is not easily recognised by the reader and they will then jump to their own conclusions with the (lack) evidence presented.

    Professor John Robertson of Paisley University (YouTube .. BBC Bias: The Bigger the Lie) could have a field day with them. I wish he would take this on board (maybe he is doing so already?) and let the whole World know what we are dealing with here. Followed by their sales plummeting to zero.

    Additionally Stu you could think of posting their ongoing articles on here, over and above your usual contributions, and we could analyse them and point out the propaganda techniques that are being used, information that is missing, has been distorted and so on. May enlighten some visitors on here but more than anything will get right up Clegg, Chrichton et al noses.

  35. K1 says:

    Despicable bastards.

    ‘Labour Cash Scandal’ story ‘spiked’ by ‘Labour Supporting Daily Record’.

    When Mr Foote was asked why this story regarding the missing 10,000 pounds, from Labour’s Edinburgh Eastern constituency offices and the subsequent police probe that is underway, was not reported in the Daily Record, but had been reported locally in The Edinburgh Evening News, and nationally in the National and The Mail, he replied: “I…er..we, don’t see why the west of Scotland needs to know about this. Most of our readers are dimwitted Labour voters who traditionally hail from these Labour ‘heartlands’. I…erm…we don’t want to encourage them to ‘think’ too hard about any potential problems that exist in the Labour party”

    Mr Foote went on to say “…look, I’…we, are not in the business of providing clear, factual and unbiased information so that readers can make up their own minds, especially with political stuff. I…er…we…support the Labour party and in many ways we write a lot of their stuff for them, it’s just easier that way. I then…I mean we, then decide what is important to put into the paper, it just makes it simpler for the reader. I…er…umm..we know that most people get the paper in the morning and are just eating their cereal and don’t want to ‘think’ about politics. So…we…er…yes…we just tell them what to think about politics in Scotland.

    So as a Labour supporting newspaper, we obviously don’t support anything the SNP does, and so I…cough…we will always highlight what is ‘bad’ about the SNP and will never publish anything that may give even a hint that the Labour party is anything less than the only ‘People’s Party’ in Scotland. We…er…I…I mean…we are after all the ‘People’s Champion’ championing the ‘People’s Party’ for the People.

    There’s yer headline and story right there.

  36. Petra says:

    Oh and by the way has anyone else on here heard anything about the rumour going around about GCC missing millions following the Commonwealth Games?

  37. Neil Cook says:

    You mean to tell me their are 180,000 lunatics reading the DR and we are worrying about ISIL. Time to gtf out of Scotland as the asylum door must be left open!!

  38. michael diamond says:

    Even down here in deepest engerland, at rs mcoll, they tried to give me today a free copy of the daily telegraph. Which in my best scottish accent, i politely declined. The quicker these rags are consigned to the dustbin the better.

  39. Malky says:

    Reporting it would need the Daily Rangers News to acknowledge that Scotland extends further east than Junction 6 of the M8.

  40. John Young says:

    OT re. The Wee Blue Book, I struggle to read small print on paper as do many other older folk. Could WBB2 please have larger print.

  41. michael diamond says:

    It seems like in scotland you can fool 180.000 people all of the time.

  42. Thepnr says:

    @John Young

    Fair enough request of course if there was sufficient funds, the Rev tried to help cover this type of thing by making the WBB available in many versions.

    Maybe the audio book version or the pdf or kindle versions in which you could increase the text size yourself might better suit your requirements and others that have difficulty with small print.

  43. bobajock says:

    Too many times.

    The Daily Labour is a farce. Tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but Labour Party propaganda. Must be sad being a journo there, only imbecilic morons read your work – lets not forget those who buy it though.

  44. Dr Jim says:

    Maybe the Daily Record don’t have Google Search Engine

    Maybe they just use “Boggle” and then they play Operation and Buckaroo for the rest of the day until the BBC Labour Party meeting tells them what to write before they send it down to “Dan Dan The Printing Man”

    Who’s got a big Red Printy Typey Machine

    With some Blue on it…and White

  45. Dr Jim says:

    Forgot to mention:… Daily Record? Burn It

  46. Last Legs says:

    So if someone steals from me, it’s straighforward theft, but if Women for Independence report a potential theft, it’s now a scandal?
    (And of course, by implication, they’re all up to no good and cannot be trusted and so ends the yes campaigns hopes for an independent Scotland etc… etc… )

  47. Lesley-Anne says:

    Dr Jim says:
    23 November, 2015 at 4:16 pm

    Forgot to mention:… Daily Record? Burn It

    Nah Dr. Jim it aint worth the match! 😀

  48. Capella says:

    On OMMISSIONS. Funnily enough, the BBC also omits excerpts from interviews with foreigners. Here is RT on the BBC Newsnight interview with the former Ukraine President, Victor Yanukovich.

    But you can’t watch the embedded video.
    “This video contains content from BBC World Service, who has blocked it on copyright grounds.”

    unless you speak Russian:

  49. heedtracker says:

    Ferocious ongoing smear campaign ongoing. this one from rancid The Graun. Good example of UKOK unionist attack hackdom really.

  50. Conan the Librarian™ says:

    I see The immediate linking of Natalie McGarry MP, with the news that WFI are missing some money on the Guardian.

  51. muttley79 says:

    The Guardian has this article on Natalie McGarry on their website:

  52. Flower of Scotland says:

    @caz-m 1.58pm

    Please don’t forget STV! They are getting worse in their SNP bad. I even commented on their Facebook page that they were as biased as BBC in Scotland now and got lots of likes.

    I notice piles of Daily Records left each day in shops and supermarkets. Well they deserve it!

  53. heedtracker says:

    “That number has since been reduced to 55, after Michelle Thomson stood down as SNP business spokeswoman and withdrew from the party whip at Westminster when it emerged that Police Scotland were investigating 13 property deals to which she was linked. Thomson has denied any wrongdoing.”

    Rancid’s Libby Carrell also rather nasty smear Thomson, usual UKOK way, same report.

    But nothing on the Clyde ship yards getting stiffed today.

    Unionists are go!

  54. Robert Peffers says:

    It is my belief that the evil triumvirate have actually been counter productive for the Scottish Labour Party Accounting Unit.

    Sometimes the apparent putting of the cart before the horse turns out to be putting the horse before the cart.

    Perhaps what was planned as an aid for Labour has been a main factor in the decline of the party and their supporting media.

  55. Tamson says:

    The McGarry link started in the DR, who McGarry had a real go at 2 days ago.

    I note they have been careful to attach an “allegedly” to the claim that she had sole access to the account. From my own experience of running the money side of things like clubs, you never have financial control with only one person, for purely practical reasons.

  56. Thepnr says:

    How is it that UK newspapers can say anything they like about any allegation without revealing the evidence supporting the allegation.

    Where’s the full story?

    “Questions have been raised about the role played by Natalie McGarry, the Scottish National party MP for Glasgow East, after Women for Independence (WFI) contacted the police on Sunday night because they believed substantial amounts were missing from the group’s donation income.

    The Guardian understands it has been alleged that McGarry was the only person with access to the PayPal account used by WFI to collect the donations and from which it is believed the alleged discrepancies have arisen.”

    “Questions have been raised…” “The Guardian understands…”

    Trial without a jury, if the allegations later prove to be entirely false as with Nicola Sturgeon and Frenchgate will this feature so prominently in the headlies (sic)?

    Well, so far Nicola Sturgeon, Michelle Thomson and now Natalie McGarry. Guess they have it in for the female politicians in the SNP. I guess they are hoping that mud sticks in particular with female voters.

    Who might be next? For there will be a next.

  57. arthur thomson says:

    I think the DR and any other parts of the media trying to smear Women for Indy are making a serious mistake. I don’t think they understand who they are messing with.

    Very gradually people in Scotland are waking up to the truth and the fact that the media do not tell the truth. This is a key step in helping people to understand that independence is the only way for a decent future.

    We have to be really patient. Once people turn to independence they will never turn away from it. That is the way we have to proceed. Our support has to be rock solid, impervious to all lies and deceit pumped out by the unionists. We have to see an end to wondering what the don’t knows will do. I believe that if we can successfully eradicate Labour from influence at Holyrood and then in the councils we can achieve a majority who will want independence regardless of counter arguments.

  58. galamcennalath says:

    arthur thomson says:

    I agree with what you say.

    “…will want independence regardless of counter arguments.”

    Thing is, everything I have heard over the last umpteen years against independence can be debunked. I have never ever heard any proven argument which says we are better in the Union than with independence, nothing.

    That is not to say lots of ‘counter agruments’ fly around, but I have heard nothing which stands up to scrutiny. At best they are unsubstanciated opinions, and at worst downright lies and propaganda.

    There are unknowns about Indy, and everything won’t go smoothly, and we will encounter hurdles … would the future be any more certain under the Union? On balance, if we make decisions in Scotland for Scotland, the outcome will generally be better.

    So, back to the ‘counter arguments’ … they need debunked at every opportunity!

  59. Muscleguy says:

    I got put on pre-moderation on the Graun in part for asking Severin Carrell why he was ignoring the Labour missing £10k story. My post was deleted too. It contained a link to The National story on the issue.

    The MSM do not want us to know about it.

  60. Thepnr says:

    Pot calls the kettle black. Ed Miliband on Tory election tactics from the Independent exactly two years ago tomorrow:

    “The Conservatives’ tactics of fear and smear raise serious questions about the type of politics we want in Britain today. David Cameron used to claim he wanted to change his party and lead it back to the middle ground: one that cared about the environment and all Britain’s citizens – including the poorest – one that wanted an end to the worst adversarial aspects of Britain’s Punch and Judy politics.”

    “They have nothing to say about the cost of living crisis and have no vision for a better Britain. All they have left is resort to the lowest form of politics: that of division, of smear and character assassination. David Cameron cannot resist a low blow when the British public craves a politics on the high ground. His main political strategy is now to sling as much mud as possible in the hope that some of it sticks.”

    Little has changed it seems.

  61. ronnie anderson says:

    @ Robert Peffers 5.25. [Sometimes the apparent putting of the cart before the horse turns out to be putting the horse before the cart.]

    Robert their horse is in the cart, on its way to the knackers yard, no need to thank me for the fix.

  62. muttley79 says:

    @The pnr

    I reckon the SNP leadership have prepared themselves for this backlash after the general election result. There will be powerful people looking to damage the SNP in any way they can. We know from the independence referendum that they operate in and through the MSM. Journalists like Brookes are there to do the bidding of her newspaper’s owners.

  63. caz-m says:

    Flower of Scotland 5.21pm

    Agree, it should have read,

    BBC Scotland/STV
    Daily Record
    Scottish Labour

    These are the real enemy of the Scots and all forward thinking YES voters.

    Next Pacific Quay protest will have to include a visit to STV, who are right next door to BBC Scotland.

  64. muttley79 says:

    Having said all that…Gerry Braiden has said on Twitter that:

    it’ll be gone by Wednesday. But I think this natalie McGarry thing is gonna go Boom!

    He seems to be a honest and balanced journalist, so this maybe might not be too good after all…

  65. Al-Stuart says:

    Galamcennalath – 23 November, 2015 at 2:26 pm says:

    ‘Daily Record gets about 180,000 sales daily.’

    Yup, that must be about right. In March this year DR was at 192,222 with a rate of decline around minus 11% per annum – so they are probably at 180,000 or less by now.

    Galamcennalath it is worth pointing out that the Daily Record appears headed toward oblivion.

    This Unionist-paper-circulation-over-a-cliff-edge-syndrome becomes starkly apparent when you look at the facts.

    These are the audited circulation figures for that newspaper…

    Daily Record 1992 circulation: 755,026 falling to…
    Daily Record 2002 circulation: 584,290 falling to…
    Daily Record 2005 circulation: 471,708 falling to…
    Daily Record 2014 circulation: 192,222 falling to???

    Anyone care to bet what year the Daily Record ceases to be viable?

    In 10 years the Daily Record circulation has dropped by a whopping 60%.

    The alternative is for the DR to star employing balanced journalists instead of Nat-bashing Unionist hacks.

    It is elementary. HALF of Scotland voted SNP this year. So the Daily Record in it’s utter stupidity decides to cut off HALF of it’s market. The rest of that rag’s decline can be found in the abysmal quality of their journalism.

    The Daily Record seems as doomed as Scottish Labour, and if Stuart’s recent research about BBC Scotland viewing figures is anything to go by they are looking at P45’s all round as well.

  66. Marie Clark says:

    Well, well. They have smeared Michelle Thomson, had a go at Richard Arkless, who it’s fair to say got waded right in bout them,and now it’s Natalie McGarrie’s turn.

    As Tamson said in an above post, no one person ever has control over over finances. I have acted as treasurer for a few organisations, and you always have someone else to act as co signatories for signing cheques. You usually have to have a financial statement ready for each committee meeting as well.This is all done for practical reasons and to safeguard committee members, especially treasurers.

    As others have said, what about the ten grand that Labour cannae account for in Edinburgh East.

    The auld double standards at work once again. No surprise there then.

  67. Bob Mack says:

    Breaking story folks. Natalie McGarry more or less accused by Guardian of taking money from WFI. as she had control of pay pal account

  68. bookie from hell says:

    wow–bbc Reporting Scotland leading with this 2nd/3rd item

  69. heedtracker says:

    Journalists like Brookes are there to do the bidding of her newspaper’s owners.

    There is no actual need to explain just what it is hacks like Carrell are doing to Scottish democracy. Ans the Graun has no owners.

    This is an ongoing four to five year campaign by unionist hacks and politicos to get the SNP out of Westminster, neuter Holyrood and end Scotland’s progress towards self government.

    Blue and red tory UKOK unionists are as determined today to end Scottish democracy, as their predecessors were to keep Thatcher in power, destroy the miners, and look how it turned out for them. This applies particularly to the BBC, who recruit propagandists directly from the Graun.

    Editor of part of the Graun, top BBC job, £150k/year bish bosh.

    Guardian editor Alan Rusbridger to become principal of Oxford college
    Outgoing editor Rusbridger, who last week announced he will step down after 20 years, will become principal of Lady Margaret Hall after he leaves the Guardian in the summer

    Mess with these henchman, they will end your cruel threat to establishment UK and get very well rewarded in the process.

  70. David McDowell says:

    “The BBC’s political independence has been gradually eroded, according to the corporation’s director general.”

    The BBC admits they are politically compromised to get a longer Charter period – but continue to fob off the “thicko Jocks” with bullshit about being “politically independent”.

    Their pile of bullshit is now touching the exosphere.

  71. John Young says:

    OT this is a long watch but very worthwhile as this group of experts in Toronto fully explain the deception behind the 9/11 attacks.

  72. Morgatron says:

    Oh naw! Jackie Vulture and a breathless Catriona (need my roots done) Benton covering thd missing women for independence money. The excitement in the sudo dyed blonde bomb shell voice when she reports labour said its a serious matter. Laugh , i nearly shat. I really do despair with the state of the mono sided media in Scotland.

  73. Valerie says:

    BBC – 18 mins ago

    Solicitor Aamer Anwar, who is acting for Ms McGarry, said the MP was “aware that suggestions of reported discrepancies in the accounts of Women for Independence have been passed to Police Scotland”.

    Mr Anwar added: “This morning I contacted Police Scotland at Natalie’s request to advise them that she is ready to meet with them should they wish to.
    “Accordingly I have advised Natalie that it would be inappropriate to make any further comment until the conclusion of that inquiry, other than to state that she is certain that there has been no wrong doing on her part.”

    A spokeswoman for Police Scotland confirmed it had received a report and the matter was currently under investigation.
    A spokesman for the SNP said:”We are aware of the reported discrepancy in Women for Independence’s accounts. We are yet to see the details behind the claims.”

    Tories calling for her suspension of course

  74. See Alex says:

    The Record is an abomination, they used to be on the side of the working class, now they are all about propping up a delusional, discredited Labour Party. is it any wonder their sales are plummeting.

    The day isn’t far off when Labour gear rid of Corbyn, what then for the Record.

  75. Tamson says:

    The bit of the McGarry story that smells big time is the notion that McGarry was “allegedly” the only person with access to the WFI PayPal account. I can’t believe a large campaign group would have a structure like that: in fact, I’m not sure it would even be legal.

  76. Al-Stuart says:

    Stuart’s article says…

    …last month there was an almost identical story involving Scottish Labour.

    Weirdly, though, we haven’t been able to find a single mention of the (Labour expenses) story in the Daily Record. We’ve been right through the 5th and 6th October print editions of the paper – which has plenty of criticism of the SNP’s selection policy and demands for “more answers” over the T In The Park affair, but nothing on Labour’s missing £10K – and we’ve searched the website, but there’s not a word.

    Then Mutmuttley79 at 23 November, 2015 at 6:17 pm writes..

    Gerry Braiden has said on Twitter – I think this Natalie McGarry thing is gonna go Boom!

    He seems to be a honest and balanced journalist, so this maybe might not be too good after all.

    Mutmuttly I just took a look at Gerry Braiden’s postings – forgive me but I’d prefer to wait for FACTS rather than the opinion of some journalist, no matter how honest you think he might be.

    Especially as all of us reading WoS have just witnessed the Electoral Commission levy a fine on WoS for a ridiculous case of the wrong kind of paperwork – Stuart could PROVE invoices were paid – with an audit trail for money via bank statements. But the wrong kind of “paperwork” notoriously gives rise to this sort of political yammering.

    I would be spectacularly surprised and disappointed if Natalie McGarry MP., has done anything wrong, other than POSSIBLY submitted the wrong sort of paperwork.

    Best regards.



  77. galamcennalath says:

    Al-Stuart says:

    “they are looking at P45’s all round”

    The sad thing is, it won’t just be those complicit in the lying and propaganda, it will be all sorts of innocent staff.

    I know it’s difficult for individuals to speak out against their employers’ policies, but where are the trade unions? They should definitely be putting members interests first and telling the employers they are committing suicide with their heavy bias.

    No one is asking for the media to switch their bias the other way. What we want is unbiased, balanced and truthful reporting. And, a bit of investigative journalism or at least fact checking! It’s not even sophisticated bias often – they just regurgitate the PR for one side only!

    Or, am I old fashioned and these places no longer have union representation? Sigh.

  78. James Anderson says:

    Braiden telling folk to bet on this resulting in a by-election?

    If this has been rumbling for months as suggested, why has this not been dealt with ‘internally’? How could Natalie possibly be in a position where she cannot account for thousands, WFI be investigating, and the Party not be aware and taking interventionist action to clarify the role of one of our MPs? I find it utterly incredible that in such a hostile media environment this has been allowed to fester!

  79. Andy-B says:

    I wonder how the Trinity Mirror group owned Daily Record, editor feels, knowing half of Scots know the gutter rag is biased,when it comes to producing fair and proper journalism.

  80. Harry McAye says:

    This is a SCANDAL now…STV’s political editor Colin Mackay said so. Mind you, he also twice in one report recently said that the phone call to police over the M9 crash was a 999 call when it was in fact a 101 call. So forgive me if I don’t put a lot of stock into what that fuckwit says.

  81. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Al-Stuart & Galamcennalath –

    The National is about to celebrate its first birthday – if only it would include a decent racing form spread then a lot of lifelong DR readers would happily drop it, no probs. I know plenty of workies who buy the DR for the form and nothing else – the indy movement also has a prominent and (supposedly) pretty astute punter in the shape of Alex Salmond, so it’d b a no-brainer for the National to invite him to be a regular pundit.

    If he’s anywhere near as good as some claim he is, punters would get the paper to find out what he’s tipping.

    I can’t think why they haven’t done it – perhaps it costs too much to sign-up for that data? Me no know…

  82. frogesque says:

    As a past tresurer of a small group I insisted that not only were at least 2 signatures required for issuing cheques, it was also my own personal policy that I would never sign a cheque for myself. Always had to be two other approved members with no personal connection to me.

    This not only protected the group but myself as well.

    Also, although a small group, annual accounts and a treasurer’s report were given at our AGM with actual receipts available for any member to look over should they wish.

    Don’t know how it would work with regard to a PayPal A/c as we never had dealings with them.

  83. heedtracker says:

    Scott Arthur ?@DrScottThinks 49m49 minutes ago
    Thomson fooled pensioners.
    McGarry fooled women.
    SNP fooled Scotland.

    Hard core red torboy unionist explaining the next four years BBC/STV/all UKOK press vote SLabour attack propaganda.


    This is the test.

  84. Tamson says:

    @James Anderson:

    Held back to distract from other stuff such as the defence review today, obviously. Or being put out now by the DR as simple revenge: McGarry had a go at Murray Foote on Twitter last week.

  85. Craig P says:

    I can see the day when the Scottish corporate media get their hands on a genuine SNP bad scandal and we’ll all dismiss it because, like the boy who cried wolf, we’ve stopped believing a word they say.

    (I don’t think today is that day.)

  86. Capella says:

    Re Natalie McGarry

    “The Scottish Conservatives said that Ms McGarry must be “suspended immediately” by the SNP if it is the case that she is being investigated by the police.

    So was Ruth Davidson suspended while her involvement in opening postal ballots was being investigated by the police?

  87. Luigi says:

    Lots of bad news for Better Together today, and the porkmeister is about to go to war. Suddenly, by amazing coincidence, a coveniently timed story breaks about WFI and another SNP MP under investigation.

    Aye, right.

  88. ArtyHetty says:

    Wow just catching up with all this regards WFI. These daily, lying rags have nothing else to report?

    The one by one attacks on the SNP MP’s is so obviously orchestrated pap. It’s a kind of verbal bullying, verging on abuse, and I say that because it is the only tactic they have at their disposal at the moment. I mean, how does a pseudo democracy get rid of the obstacle to their bastion of power while keeping the people, zombie like, ignorant and unarmed mentally at least, regards the real facts, while remaining compliant to their demonising of the people they are intent on attacking, or even destroying. Scotland is a threat, the more I learn about countries with any resources worth having the more I see that Scotland poses a few major, and strategic problems with the uppity Scots not getting back in their box as was supposed to happen.

    Hmm, let’s see what the next few weeks, nevermind months brings eh.

  89. Could it be that the only “crime” Michelle Thomson and Natalie McGarry have committed is to be members of the S.N.P?

  90. Thepnr says:

    Controversial I know and if I get pelters then fair enough.

    During the Indyref campaign I handed out leaflets and the small business cards promoting WFI, this is despite not being fully behind one of their main spokeswomen whos opinions I often found myself disagreeing with.

    Just wondering aloud who is making the allegations against Natalie McGarry that the Graun gleefully report and we possibly can expect to hear much more of in the coming days.

    One thing that does really piss me off as posted by Valerie above is that once an investigation by police is underway your solicitor will advise “no further comment”. This allows a smear to grow legs while we await the conclusion of the investigation.

    Just like Michelle Thomson nothing has been proven, I really wish that this “trial by media” just wasn’t possible, it is all conjecture and innuendo until a case of wrongdoing has been proven in a Scottish court.

    I think it makes sense that by law, newspapers should not be allowed to speculate and possibly compromise any trial of someone eventually accused.

    In fact I thought that was the law. Guess i’m missing something?

    Oh yeah, no one has been charged with anything, just allegations from persons unknown. That’s alright then!

  91. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi Thepnr.

    You typed,
    “Well, so far Nicola Sturgeon, Michelle Thomson and now Natalie McGarry. Guess they have it in for the female politicians in the SNP. I guess they are hoping that mud sticks in particular with female voters.

    Who might be next? For there will be a next.”

    Too true! They are throwing so much $h¡† at the SNP’s wall, in the hope that some will stick.

  92. Capella says:

    @ Thepnr
    I’m not a solicitor (Nicola Sturgeon is) but defamation seems to me to be the most appropriate defence against our lying press and political enemies. As I understand it, you don’t have to be too specific about what you are accusing someone of. Innuendo can be construed as defamation. Even if you don’t name the person, if a reasonable member of the public could guess who you are talking about, that is still defamation.

    Any solicitors out there who could clarify this point. Lallands Peat Worrier?

  93. Gfaetheblock says:

    McGarry’s culpability or not will become clear in due course, but unless we think WFI are lying, surely tens of thousands of pounds in donations from people like the folk who fund this site going ‘missing’is a scandal, irrespective of who did it?

  94. James Anderson says:

    Tamson – DR ran the story this morning as a speculative smear. It is no longer speculative in the sense that WfI have clarified THEY called Police Scotland; not the DR. WfI is – to an outsider – a credible and committed organisation. I suspect (only a suspicion) that it might also be liable to a bit of positioning and factionalism as result of its rapid coalescence – lots of confident and opinionated individuals coming together as a group. So it wouldn’t surprise me if Natalie was the subject of some jealousy.

    However, as a long-standing SNP supporter I was concerned during the GE15 candidate selection process that the Party acquiesced to calls for prominent Yes supporters to be given priority over long-term party members. I truly hope we are not now living to regret that choice. She is one of our MPs – if this has been a common-knowledge within WfI circles then it can’t have escaped the attention of the Party hierarchy. That being the case why wasn’t this taken on as a serious issue requiring arbitration or mediation prior to the inevitable media onslaught?

  95. Dr Jim says:

    Sandwich scandal exposed in Holyrood as the SNP deny reports of donated snacks being removed without prior agreement and payment, Sturgeon must answer…..Fuuuukc !!!

    Whit next? these newsy chumps are going too far now, at least to the sane of mind it’s obvious tripe but there are the complete dummies out there who’ll lap this nonsense up

    Scotland Today: A wee shop stewardy manny decided it was good news that the thirteen type 26 frigates were being cut to eight because at least it was still something to be thankful for (giant fukcing cringing little B’stard)

    Cameron in answer to Angus Mc Neill says: “Other smaller vessels “CAN” be built on the Clyde “IF” the conditions are right”

    Well ye kin be a bigger Arse than ten Arses to know what that means (you Jockys better bend the knee and tug the forelock or you’ll get Nout)
    Now do a wee Scottish jig for your Inbred Betters you Sweaty Jock Shipbuilders and you’ll mibbees get a wee Tin o Shortbread in your Christmas Box as a Bonus
    My patience is almost endeth with what I used to think were my fellow Scots, They’ll be on their knees with clasped hands shortly Pleeez Pleeez Geez a boat tae build

    Well they can’t blackmail Fergusons yard can they, Scotlands National Party along with Jim McColl are building our own Shipbuilding business bit by bit, Imagine that, and with no UK promises of thin air as well

    Honest tae God….Westminster Burn it !!!

  96. caz-m says:

    BBC and STV Scottish news headlines:

    Natalie McGarry and the missing money, bla bla bla.

    Oh, and the Clyde shipyards have just lost five frigates from an MOD contract.

    The loss of the Frigates was almost as if it was of little importance. In their eyes, the SNP Bad story was the main news tonight.

  97. mealer says:

    Thepnr 7.41,
    I take anything I read in MSM with a large pinch of salt but if WFI have had to seek assistance from the police to get to the bottom of an issue it is very serious and very disappointing.

  98. muttley79 says:

    @James Anderson

    Natalie McGarry has stood for the SNP in a by election in Fife before, or at least during the independence referendum. You are arguing that the SNP should not have picked people involved in the Yes campaign because some were not long term members of the SNP. But that would mean losing out on people like Tommy Sheppard, Mhairi Black etc. You also seem to be assuming that McGarry is actually guilty of something. It does not matter if the SNP are guilty of anything or nor, the MSM and unionists will jump on it anyway.

    The truth is it does not matter what procedures the SNP put in place or what their policies are, as long as they support independence the MSM/unionists will always be finding fault in what they do, or don’t do.

  99. Ken500 says:

    They should try GCC anc all the other Unionist controlled accounts. The corroption never gets investigated because the Police were in the Local Authorities committee pockets. That’s why the Unionists politicians want control of the Police.

    Every Unionist/Green controlled council in Scotland is corrupt. Wasting £Millions/Billions of public money. Against the majority wishes and the Public interest. Thry need a good clear out. Coming very soon.

  100. Ken500 says:

    Murray Foote broke Purdah Laws. He should be investigated. .

  101. Capella says:

    @ John Young 6:39 pm
    That is a long watch but I’ll give it a go. But what on earth has happened to Canada?×76

    “A UN General Assembly committee has passed a resolution ‘combating glorification of Nazism,’ with 126 countries voicing their support.

    Meanwhile, the US, Ukraine and Canada voted ‘against,’ raising eyebrows. Moscow has called the decision ‘regrettable.’…

    A total of 126 member-states supported the resolution, while four countries — the US, Canada, Palau, and Ukraine – voted against it. Another 53 countries, including the European Union nations and NATO members abstained from the vote.”

    What’s to like about “glorification of Nazism”?

  102. Ken500 says:

    A Crowdfunder to bring Murray Foote to book for breaking Purdah Laws, illegally, gerrymandering and trying to influence the Referendum Result.

  103. Cadogan Enright says:

    City Political Economy Research Centre reported on RT pointing out that Welfare Cuts will crash the UKOK economy and prolong depression while not resolving the deficit.

    Nothing on the BBC website on this as far as I can see

  104. scott says:

    Police probe missing £10,000 from Labour party coffers

    Can someone tell me if this has been reported by BBC Scotland in the same way the Burd and Renton did about the story about SNP MP Natalie McGarry

  105. X_Sticks says:

    @Ian Brotherhood

    “if only it would include a decent racing form spread then a lot of lifelong DR readers would happily drop it, no probs. I know plenty of workies who buy the DR for the form and nothing else – the indy movement also has a prominent and (supposedly) pretty astute punter in the shape of Alex Salmond, so it’d b a no-brainer for the National to invite him to be a regular pundit.”

    Tweeting that post straight to the National.

  106. tamson says:

    @James Anderson, 7:49

    “DR ran the story this morning as a speculative smear.:

    You’re not seriously suggesting the DR knew nothing was about to happen, are you?

    Regarding your suspicions concerning WfI, I agree. And another thing about it – putting my tinfoil hat on for a moment – if I’d been a senior MI5 operative planning to disrupt the pro-indy movement during the referendum, WfI would have been a prime target.

  107. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Have a look at the latest tweet on the WOS feed – Corbyn sitting alone as Cameron delivers statement on the SDR.

    There may yet be some decent individuals in Labour, but as a supposedly ‘democratic’ party? They are – at all levels – a total fucking disgrace.

  108. Petra says:

    Every Unionist and his granny are rummaging about searching for something to smear SNP politicians with and it’ll never end unless Nicola Sturgeon takes strong action to deal with it.

    If reports are true Women for Independence have been trying to get to the bottom of the ‘financial discrepancy’ for months now. If Natalie McGarry was the only person dealing with finances, which is absolutely ludicrous and the Guardian knows it, she would have been identified as the culprit long ago and the Police would have been hammering on her door. Rather what has happened is that she contacted Sarwar to represent her and he in turn contacted the Police, yesterday, no doubt in an attempt to clear her name.

    The Tories are demanding her suspension. Why her? What happened to Davidson and McTernan re. Ballot papers and wee Willie Winkie with the £800,000 unpaid Police Scotland Bill? And of course there’s the SLab missing £10,000 and loads of other cases I / we could dredge up.

    On a day when it’s clear that the Tories are shrinking the State on a ‘GDP’ par with the Czech Republic but can find billions for the Military, preparing to take us to War and cutting the shipbuilding contract, the big news …… Scandal … Natalie McGarry …. based on an allegation by an unnamed person (as usual).

    Many people in Scotland will have no idea either of who / what Women for Independence stands for at all other than noting the word ‘Independence’. They’ll have no idea of the great works that they’ve been involved in, such as with refugees and food poverty, because newpapers like the Groan and Daily Liar have made a point of not informing anyone at all … omitted to mention.

    When the issue /s relating to McGarry and Thomson have been resolved, and if they are found to be innocent, Nicola Surgeon should support her colleagues and take Legal action (defamation of character) against the relevant newspapers. If deemed to be too expensive I’m sure SNP members would gladly contribute to the costs. If she does nought this biased ‘witchhunting’ fiasco will surely continue.

  109. Ken500 says:

    Trinity Press is doing so badly there were reports It was looking to merge with the Mirror Group to cover losses. There would be less staff and bosses. Jobs would go to cover the losses.

  110. Thepnr says:


    Agree totally, tens of thousands missing from any organisation raising money is a scandal and should be reported.

    Why haven’t the Daily Rag reported the missing £10K from Edinburgh East constituency party funds which is what this article is all about? Anyone creaming off funds from ANY orginisation is a disgrace and it should be investigated by police.

    Corruption is a cancer that feeds on us, the public, for the betterment of the rulers and elite. Corruption, though is more widespread in other parties than it is in the SNP, just look at the HoC expenses scandals.

    Six Labour MP’s and two tory MP’s were jailed, none from the SNP.

    The speaker of the house resigned, six members of the cabinet resigned, 11 backbench Labour Mp’s and 6 Tory MP’s resigned.

    Just one small scandal, yet there are 100’s more waiting to be revealed. Our government is corrupt whether it wears a blue or red tie. Cash for questions? Or how about Straw and Rifkind who famously stated:

    Sir Malcolm had previously claimed that his salary of £67,000 a year for being an MP was not enough.

    He said in the video that he received “£5,000 to £8,000, something of that kind” for half a day’s work doing presentations in the Middle East.

    As I said, all we have is allegations and until proven are nothing more than a smear attempt. Political propaganda UKOK style.

    Wee question. Selling the Post Office for much less than it was worth. Was that corrupt or just business?

  111. James Anderson says:

    Mutley79. You are correct re McGarry’s Party background. I’m conflating a nagging concern (just or unjust) that we might have fast-tracked some folk into Westminster on the back of high profile Yes campaigning minus full ‘due diligence’.

    Where I disagree with you is on the basis of this story and its potential impact. It is a given groupthink will drive any sniff of an SNPBad story. However, there is some significant differences with this tale. Firstly, it is WiF who have found the matter SO irreconcilable they’ve had to call in PS. Secondly, they state the matter relates to unaccounted for donations into the thousands. That would be misappropriation of funds. That would be theft. That would be really friggin serious. Thirdly, they called in PS because the internal review stopped, by WiF accounts, at Natalie’s door.

    The point I’m making is less about “did she, didn’t she” and more to do with a sense of frustration that this has been allowed to get as far as a call being made to PS!! There’s so many associated elements to this specific case: we managed to unseat Curran, it took us 80 years to win Glasgow, we campaigned on financial and economic injustice. To see that potentially trashed within 6 months breaks my heart and that is feck all to do with the DR, BBC, or Graun reporting. If key folks in the Party and wider movement (WiF) did not foresee the potential damage this could do and take the trouble to sort out in-house then that is both a failure of judgement and of leadership. Someone should have been in about this if it has been rumbling for months. This one affects us all – not just the constituents of Glasgow East.

  112. Gerry says:

    I applaud this investigation, and the open and transparent way that WFI have handled the financial discrepancy. It’s surely a better look than being dragged kicking and screaming into a courtroom to argue over what kind of lie you told the electorate.

  113. Ken500 says:

    Westminster is full of criminals who have abused, children, lied to start illegal Wars, killed and starved innocent vulnerable people at home and abroad. They have illegally wasted £Billions and have just spend £Billions on weaponry they can’t afford. Increasing thevNational debt. Now £1.5trillion. Nothing is ever done to end the corruption which they hide under the Official Secrets Act.

    The SNP officials need to tighten their vetting procedure which are too lapse.

  114. heedtracker says:

    Nice display of The Graun’s world famous progressive liberal hypocrisy. UKOK media is getting quite stinky these days

    “The Guardian’s coverage has been pretty restrained – it’s not true that the paper guns for the Tories for the sake of it – since no great issues of public policy are at stake, just alleged bad behaviour and bad management.”

    Rancid’s Natalie McGarry report’s their front page headline now, theyre first up in google search too.

    Red toryboys eh?

  115. Cadogan Enright says:

    @Ken500 9.24

    A very odd post. Do you know something the vetting committee don’t know?

    Have you been on the team investigating this issue? – do you have some inside information?

    OR ARE YOU JUST SPECULATING like the record?

  116. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Ken500 at 9.24

    The SNP’s vetting procedures are very rigorous indeed.

    Are you assuming some guilt here on Natalie’s behalf?

  117. Quinie frae Angus says:

    Someone on Twitter- well, actually the rather excellent and often very funny “DialM for Murdo”, has just tweeted something very interesting that he just saw on Reddit:

    the suggestion that this missing £30,000 could actually simply be the 3% charged by PayPal? i.e. if WfI raised between £600,000 and £800,000, through PayPal, then PayPal would have docked their 3% off that and that might account for the bulk of this missing money?

    Sounds too far-fetched? Or a possibility that whoever was in charge of the monies didn’t appreciate how PayPal works?

  118. Thepnr says:

    This is the hypocrisy of the media. What of the revelation of Cameron with his penis in a pigs mouth?

    Didn’t upset the blue rinse brigade because they never knew about it. LOL

    If an SNP member of parliament buys a poke of chips then we will hear all about that. I find that funny, sort of.

    In my view, let’s get a couple of things straight as to why the “Scottish” papers will be full of this tomorrow. It’s a distraction.

    1. There will be a vote in Parliament shortly to bomb Syria.

    2. Osbornes Autumn statement will have extremely bad news for Scotland.

    3. The English electorates support is required before they do this.

    The Scottish viewpoint in Westminster politics no longer matters, we really are a colony and will do as we’re telt no matter how many politicians we send to their Parliament.

    I think, in time they may find they have fucked up in their evaluation.

  119. thomaspotter2014 says:

    RE:Natalie McGarry SMEAR

    This SHITE about yet another unprovan unsubstantiated nonsense of SNP BADNESS is just that.

    Headline is all the Corpmedia need.

    Looks like we only got 54 dodgy smears still to go before May.

    No doubt the smears will coincide with detrimental BTUKOK stuff they want to hide or divert attention from.

    Funny that.

  120. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Natalie McGarry is the niece of Trish Marwick, the speaker in the Scottish Parliament, and is far from a recent recruit to the SNP having contested at other levels before. I’m sure the party had every trust in her and it would be a good idea for comments on here to reflect the actual situation and not discuss rumour and insinuation.

    Significantly there was internal personalised strife in the SNP in her area during the election campaign with suspicions raised of plants in the local SNP.

    Talking widely about this issue without possession of any facts is silly.

  121. Dennis Webster says:

    A tweet tonight said PayPal charge 3% for transactions. This could account for 5 figure sum discrepancy. I hope this is the case. So simple an explanation which could be true.

  122. Petra says:

    @ Ken 500 …….. Foote and Purdah.

    Ken I don’t think that Breach of Purdah applies to newspapers ….. just politicians and civil servants, however I’m sure that a half decent Solicitor would find that they’ve breached some kind of Law, SUCH AS Defamation of Character, on more than one occasion (dozens).

    @ James Anderson at 9:11pm …….

    You say ”Thirdly they called in PS because the internal review stopped, by WfI accounts, at Natalie’s door.” Can I just ask what makes you think that James? As far as I can make out WfI were carrying out their own ‘in-house’ investigation but hit a brick wall. If they were 100% sure that M McG was the culprit and could produce evidence of such PS would have approached her first rather than the other way round.

    Additionally if thousands of pounds have gone missing WfI wouldn’t have been able to hush it up at all and why should they? We don’t want to bring ourselves down to ‘their’ level in trying to cover up criminal behaviour. In saying all of this I share your total frustration and anger. Anger towards the person who has stolen donated money, if that is the case, and sheer frustration at the organisation for not ensuring that a number of people were involved in keeping an eye on the ‘purse’.

  123. Gary45% says:

    Just watched reporting misery with wiggy burd.
    As no surprise the SNP get a wee stab in the back regarding this story
    Wiggy does the usual, labour and tory no very happy and demand Ms McGarry is suspended, because of a possible police investigation.
    Here’s a wee question, did Ruthie ” check oot the size o ma gun turret Davidson” get suspended when she was under police investigation?
    No I didn’t think so either.
    YET ANOTHER NON STORY, keep reeling them out, because the establishment make a total ar*e of themselves every time they do it.

  124. Hamish100 says:

    Dave McEwan Hill says:
    “Natalie McGarry is the niece of Trish Marwick, the speaker in the Scottish Parliament…”

    Isn’t this the problem of the larger snp at the moment. Issues outwith our control are now the snp problem. NS and hubby must put in rules or constituencies put in for the next spring conference against nepotism and jobs for the boys and girls! Wifes and hubbies, niece and nephews. We want a vibrant party that debates issues such as NATO, Trident, Fracking, IN/Out of Europe etcetera. Not pat each other on the back how wonderful we are.
    Lets NOT fall into the Labour trap of complacency. Also new members welcomed but should after a few months be selected as MP’s/MSP’s on year after next councillors?
    Our focus is Independence and good government. No-one should divert us from that.

  125. Grouse Beater says:

    McGarry is the next sacrificial victim of the British press.

  126. Cadogan Enright says:

    I cannot find Ponsonby Post – is it my IPad or is the site missing ?

  127. Proud Cybernat says:

    Stop using the term Mainstream Meedia/MSM. The term gives them legitimacy/authority. Call them what they are: Unionist Media, State Broadcaster or Corporate Media (CorpMedia).

    Stop using terms that gives them any form of legitimacy.

    On-topic. This is a complete non-story and nothing more than a diversionary tactic by the Unionist CorpMedia and our beloved State Broadcaster.

    Yer no getting tae build any frigates. We conned you. But don’t worry ’cause SNP still bad.

    Think we’re fecking stupid. Not to worry though. I can’t wait to see all their sickened wee smilers when the next poll comes out and still shows no dent to the SNP Holyrood lead.

    GIRFUY CorpMedia / State Broadcaster.

  128. Still Positive. says:

    I recognise that there could be charges of nepotism within the SNP but until fairly recently people who wanted independence were treated as “suspect” to say the least.

    Isn’t it then likely that independence supporters stick together and there friendships and romance blossom?

    I am happy to say that my sons voted yes despite, some claims, that they did not know of my long-held belief that Scotland should be independent.

    I am happy that I did not influence them but they came to the same conclusion through research, although one son nearly did vote No but changed his mind at the last moment.

    Maybe genetics plays a part too.

  129. Dr Jim says:

    Natalie McGarry was not fast tracked, shoe horned in,or in because of nepotism, she’s there on merit and deservedly so
    She’s been a SNP supporter almost as long as she’s been alive and she worked her little cotton socks off to win her seat from early AM to late PM under a lot of duress and no little abuse from the YOONS and Media

    No matter what her connections Peter Murrell and the team would never let anyone through the selection process they didn’t think could do the job
    To be a SNP representative you don’t have to be as good as any other party you have to be better than the rest

    That’s why they hate us so much, we’re the real McCoy while they’re stuck with Muppetland

  130. Iain More says:

    Too much British Nationalism can damage your mental health. I am so much calmer for having given up on all their Press and Media outpourings.

  131. James Anderson says:

    Petra. I understand that prior to formally constituting itself as a registered org, WfI founders ‘adopted’ operational roles (perhaps through necessity but without formal qualification). If Natalie was CFO in lieu of anyone better qualified, then the buck stops with her in the reporting year under investigation. And PS wouldn’t necessarily have been called-in in the first instance where lack of confidence in accounting procedures rather than suspected wrong-doing was at play. Discrepancies were identified months ago that WfI Exec Committee sought to clarify. WfI have said they are not satisfied with explanation received for those discrepancies.

    If those are where the facts to date end, I think it is ridiculous beyond belief that a high profile MP has found themselves in this position; we are not novices. We know the media agenda. This should have been resolved months ago. Tonight should have been all about broken promises on the Clyde not this sideshow. Yes I am frustrated and not just with the Redcoat and the Beeb.

  132. galamcennalath says:

    Iain More says:

    “Too much British Nationalism can damage your mental health.”

    In a free society we can’t stop adults buying CorpMedia rags of their choice.

    Maybe it should be like fag packets? A good compromise would be – keep the Unionist rags out of plain view, no printing in the outside except mental health warnings. 🙂

  133. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Dr Jim at 11.05

    Well said. I hope some others on here making foolish assumptive remarks take full note.

  134. caz-m says:

    Gary45% 10.23pm


    I’ll second that Gary.

    Message tae oor rotten media, GIRFUY

    The harder they hit us, the stronger we become.


  135. Iain More says:

    Totally Off Topic

    It was pointed out to me that that ahem several British Nationals have been arrested in Belgium. When do the Americans start carpet bombing us ???? Maybe the French can use their Nukes on us ????

  136. Shagpile says:

    My recollections exactly Rev., not surprised the “record” has been clarified. An objective journalist would do nothing less.

    Was there not a “wings” poll re: “Believability” regarding MSM “news” or did I just dream it?

  137. heedtracker says:

    Murray Foote ?@murrayf00te 11m11 minutes ago
    Murray Foote Retweeted Wings Over Scotland
    The most worrying/pleasing thing is it has 9 likes. Murray Foote added,
    Wings Over Scotland @WingsScotland
    Murray Foote has an erection so large tonight I can hear it knocking stuff off his desk from Bath.

    Daily Record headline’s Tuesday demanding to know where the 30 grand is Natalie?

    You have to hand to UKOK hacks sometimes. Its more than just the dregs, their highly professional UKOK attack propagandists. This crew may well have ended Scottish independence for good, with their historic The Vow fraud, not alone but even so. UKOK corruption is still a sight to behold sometimes.

  138. caz-m says:

    Finish the night on a wee high.

    EU poll in The Independent shows

    52% to leave.

    48% to stay.

    This result would trigger a Scottish Independence Referendum.

  139. Thepnr says:

    “If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face—for ever.”
    ? George Orborne, 2015.

    Apologies to Mr Orwell.

  140. Hamish100 says:

    Dr Jim and Dave McEwan

    Our last Conference discussed sweet hee haw and was news managed. That’s not what I am in the party for. I am highlighting potential dangers that we should take cognisance of! Or should we stay quiet? We need a vibrant live party. Compared to the others we are better but I don’t wish us to be lulled into complacency. As for this story – how long has it been floating around for?
    Do we have the best selected candidates or some who get through on a nod and a whim?

  141. Ronnie says:

    @ Proud Cybernat

    ‘Stop using the term Mainstream Meedia/MSM. The term gives them legitimacy/authority. Call them what they are: Unionist Media, State Broadcaster or Corporate Media (CorpMedia).

    Stop using terms that gives them any form of legitimacy.’

    How about-

    ‘Establishment Media’?

  142. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Hamish100 at 11.50

    “Do we have the best selected candidates or some who get through on a nod and a whim?”

    In a word – no. Competition was fierce and if you are not aware all our members vote for our candidates,they are not appointed.
    Doesn’t guarantee against wrong choices, but there is no nod and a wink

  143. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Completely O/T

    Does any SNP or YES shop have any of those big black SNP umbrellas left for sale?

  144. Gerry says:

    Hamish 1150
    “get through on a nod and a whim?”
    Away ye go and boil yer empty head.

  145. Cath says:

    They have names for all of this now, you know?

    * Pointing out something is wrong, bad or unfair – “grievance”, “grievance hunting” “grievance stoking” etc

    * Actually opposing that thing in a democratically elected parliament – “a stunt”

    * Picking up journalists for the hypocrisy of finding a story massively, saliva-inducingly newsworthy when it’s involving one group of people and absolutely non-newsorthy when it’s involving their own mates – “whataboutery”

    All those words mean the same thing – “shut the f*** up, get back in your box and eat your cereal”. Why aren’t you listening, Rev?

  146. Ruby says:

    frogesque says:
    23 November, 2015 at 7:25 pm
    Don’t know how it would work with regard to a PayPal A/c as we never had dealings with them.

    Ruby replies

    To make payments from a Paypal account all you need is the Paypal account password.

    The weird thing about this story is that there is no mention of a Paypal scam

  147. Dr Jim says:

    @Hamish 100

    I don’t know which party you’re in or branch but if you’re in the SNP and are having difficulty talking to anyone about what you want to talk about, the party has a number of facilities for any member to make their voice heard, you can even talk to the First Minister if you want, although you may not get an instant reply, she will respond

    You’re MP or MSP will be only too happy to respond to communication from you, you’ll have their email numbers and phone numbers

    Conferences are a Media circus it’s what they’re designed to be, you couldn’t have prolonged debates with thousands of people, it’s a show of unity for the Media and potential members and the country in general

    You perhaps should remember though Hamish, Wings is an Independence site and not everyone is in the SNP, there are Greens and, well I’ll not list them all I’m sure you know

    As to your last comment about nods and whims be assured it doesn’t happen
    Nobody’s perfect, but in terms of strength in depth of knowledge and experience the SNP are Jet Fighters compared to the competition who are like Gypsy Moths

  148. Sandy Henderson says:

    Consumers rights: Daily Record, not fit for purpose, printing lies. Can one demand one’s money back.

    Further: STV asking people in Scotland who have been scammed to get in touch. How about those of us who have been taken in with their political bias? Look at the mess we’re in now.

  149. Gonnaejustsayaye says:

    I find this a bit odd.During the referendum surely the accounts for WFI must have been scrutinised quite intensively for submission of donations expenditure to the Electoral commission. Why was no discrepancies or concerns raised at that point.
    I quite believe that something like PayPal or Indiegogo fees are the reason for the discrepancy and when the books were passed over the new treasurer might not understand how it works.I don’t doubt Natalie McGarrys integrity whatsoever I am convinced this will be an administration or accounting error
    To me the Kezia Dugdale is a bigger story .£10k missing ,that must include big donations over £500 from Union branches.This must be declared to the electoral commission .I wonder given that going by reports that no accounts have been submitted for years by that constituency.I wonder if any donations have been reported to the Electoral commission. It seems that North Branch Labour rules insist on proper scrutiny off branch accounts.So Kezia constituency was not following Labours rules and she an MSP ignored it and never reported it to London head office .Now if Kezia can’t be trusted to ensure her own constituency party finances how just be trusted to run Scotland’s block grant worth billions if elected First Minister

  150. Ghillie says:

    Msj for Natalie MaGarry:

    Natalie, you are not the first and certainly won’t be the last to be attacked in this way.

    They think they are choosing soft targets. BIG mistake.

    You know the truth. We, your supporters, have a fair idea of the truth. And I for one, believe in your integrity. This too shall pass.

  151. caz-m says:

    And what does Ian Murray, Labour MP (Red Tory), think of the missing five Frigates?

    What does Ian Murray think of Trident renewal?

    Will Ian Murray turn up for the Trident debate in Westminster today?

    Why is BBC Scotland not asking Scotland’s only Labour MP these questions?

    It is also another “Tory Free” day at our state broadcaster.
    Ruthie is STILL calling in the favours from her EX employer (BBC Scotland).

  152. galamcennalath says:

    Macart says:
    “Worth a read.”

    From National

    … senior committee of peers, who say the permanence of the Scottish Parliament risks undermining parliamentary sovereignty.

    … from an English constitutional perspective, but in Scotland it is the people who are sovereign, not WM nor monarch.

    That constitutional elephant in the corner, which WM tries very hard to ignore, might just have been poked with a big stick!

  153. Tackety Beets says:

    Ronnie @ 12.00

    I tend to agree EM “Establishment Media” is more appropriate.

  154. Macart says:


    There are a few very telling quotes from Lang in that piece, but the killer blow comes from Mr Swinnie’s office at the very end.

    ‘The House should consider whether to delay progress of the bill until a new Memorandum of Understanding is published setting out how the UK and Scottish governments will work together to manage areas of shared and concurrent powers, and how they will resolve disputes between their administrations.’

    “Ultimately, the key vote that matters will be in the Scottish Parliament – not in the unelected House of Lords – and we will never support anything which sells Scotland short.”

    Kinda let’s you know where both sides are coming from and make no mistake there ARE sides here. Those who are fighting for our sovereignty and those who are fighting for parliamentary sovereignty. Those who are fighting to retain ultimate control over our futures and believe such power should rest in their hands and those who wish to return that future and those powers to our care.

  155. Macart says:

    WGD back from his break in grand form. 🙂

  156. Dorothy Devine says:

    I see that wondrous intellect , that ” expert ” on all things SNP ,Ms Sturgeon, Mr Salmond and Scotland , Mr David Torrance has penned yet another anti article with twists and innuendo in full flow.

    This particular corporate media article is to be found in the Independent.

    Quite why so much malevolent ignorance is penned in the dead tree press remains a mystery to me as I watch their circulation figures plummet to very satisfactory levels.

  157. nainatal says:

    OT just a bit,but anyone else note the advert on telly for a hotel room company where the driver of the car has aTory rosette, and has pigs ears and snout?
    Just asking?

  158. Macart says:

    @Dorothy Devine

    It was another piece entirely which caught my eye in the Independent. Seems that for the first time Brexit is showing a lead in popularity.

    As for Torrance? (shrug) New day, same old… etc.

  159. Bob Mack says:

    Turkey shooting down a Russian su24 this morning is just an example of what can go wrong at any time.Tin hats on folks.Turkey is a member of NATO and will be defended if Russia takes umbrage.

  160. Robert Peffers says:

    @Hamish100 says: 23 November, 2015 at 10:27 pm:

    ” … NS and hubby must put in rules or constituencies put in for the next spring conference against nepotism and jobs for the boys and girls!”

    Balderdash! Hamish 100. Neither Nicola Sturgeon nor her husband, (nor indeed any other official of the SNP), has the power to either encourage or discourage nepotism. The party is a truly democratic party and everyone in it has exactly the same number of votes and exactly the same opportunity to propose or oppose any matter right down to branch level.

    “We want a vibrant party that debates issues such as NATO, Trident, Fracking, IN/Out of Europe etcetera. Not pat each other on the back how wonderful we are.”

    And that, Hamish 100, is exactly what we have. You have actually chosen to highlight the perfect example in your criticism that proves you wrong. National Conference was shown on World Wide TV channels debating and voting upon the SNP NATO Membership question. The then leader of the party, Alex Salmond, was shown sitting there while the delegates from the branches debated and voted upon NATO Membership. He had the same number of votes as everyone else at conferennce.

    It is the Branch members who can be bothered to attend and participate in branch business who make the policy and rules of the party and it is these who select candidates from the approved list of candidates. If a close family member is chosen it is because the members know them as worthy of the position and not because family members have chosen them.

    ” … No-one should divert us from that.”

    I assume that means people like yourself who are not aware of how the SNP works. The party is mainly funded by the members, unlike any other party. Labour is funded by the Trade Unions, the Co-op and big business and the Tories and LibDems by donors who all demand a say.

    The SNP is a grass roots led party and it is national conference, not Nicola Sturgeon, who dictates policy.

  161. Dorothy Devine says:

    Macart, I hadn’t realised that he wrote in anything other than the disgrace called the Herald.

    It was my surprise at his appearance in the Indy that caused me to peruse the article – so sorry I bothered.
    As you so rightly say , new day ,same old!

    Mr Peffers, that’s him telt but I’m sure he’ll need telt again.

  162. Ken500 says:

    Lang was Thatcher henchman who knew Thatcher was illegally and secretly taking the equivalent of £Billions out of Scotland. Leaving Scotland in poverty and deprivation. Lang was part of the cover up. A complete and utter crook. He knew but kept the sffairs secret. Thatcher wrote on the documents ‘This must be kept secret’ Released last year. Kept secret for thirty years. A self serving trougher who has has abused public money all his life. Don’t for one second believe he or any other Member has Scottish best interest at heart. Lang et al are part of the problem. The reason for Scottish Independence. If the truth had been known, Scotland would have been Independent long ago.

    The unelected crooks in the HoL will do anything to stop Scotland having tax raising powers. They will try to stop the Bill using any means. They are the tax evading crooks who will be targeted when Scotland has tax raising powers, They will pay their full share. They are the unelected enemy of the People. That is why they support the Union to tax evade and abuse public funds, The HoL should be abolished. These crooks should be put out to pasture. They will do anything to stop the Scottish Bill,tax raising powers or any power for Scotland. Scotland needs to have a tax system to collect revenues and establish tax offices. It will pay for itself, creat jobs and be cost effective. Experienced staff are being made redundant by Westminster.

    HMRC is not fit for purpose. A complete shambles. Westminster protects tax evasion. The Treasury does not enforce the Law because Westminster and their associates are tax evading with impunity. HMRC hound individuals and businesses to death. Compound the stategy and mistake right at the top. The Head is still the woman who Westminster Committees (Hodge) has criticised and sanctioned.

    The Scottish Oil sector is being taxed at 75% costing thousands of jobs in Scotland and the supply chain. More Oil has to be imported putting up the balance of payments and increasing the deficit/debt. The Tories are ruining the UK economy. Scotland is not being treated equally with exorbitant tax rates being imposed, while (Foreign) multinationals making vast profits illegally tax evade through the City of London.

    The HoL caused the troubles in Ireland. A Home Rule for Ireland Bill was passed in the Commons in April 1914. The Unelected Lords used delaying tactics to try and stop the Bill. It would not have come into statue until September 1916. The HoL caused the Civil War in Ireland, and the escalation of the Troubles. The HoL can only delay a Bill twice. Then it becomes Law in the UK. The 1WW 1914 – 18. Killed and impoverished millions of people and badly affected the European/world economy. The inbred European Royals were responsible for the 1WW. Ie ‘the divine right of Kings’

  163. mealer says:

    Bob Mack 9.12
    So,what’s the situation here? I take it Turkey is anti Daesh,but are they pro or anti Assad? Can this be considered something of a “friendly fire” incident? I can’t seem to keep up with who is supporting who in this bloody kirn.Who are the baddies and who are the goodies? A wee while ago we were to be bombing baddie Assad and thousands of innocents.Now we’re to be bombing his enemies and thousands of innocents.Maybe we should just bomb the innocents,so we’re not on the wrong side?

  164. Robert Peffers says:

    @Dr Jim says: 24 November, 2015 at 1:22 am:

    “I don’t know which party you’re in or branch but if you’re in the SNP and are having difficulty talking to anyone about what you want to talk about, the party has a number of facilities for any member to make their voice heard …

    Aye! Dr Jim, and the real Biggy is that all members have the right and are encouraged to attend and take part in all branch meetings. In the SNP it is the ordinary members who make the policy and the rules.

    Nothing can be made party policy by the leadership unless they do so from their branch. Branch members make proposals, and if seconded, must be dealt with. If opposed or amendments proposed then branch must debate and vote upon them and they then go forward.

    At conference these are treated in the same manner and if opposed or amended are debated and voted upon. It is every members right and that includes those chosen as officials and leaders. It also includes all elected to government or council seats.

  165. Kevin Evans says:

    Nice there giving away high viz vests to the kids – it makes it easier for Westminster to identify what kids to put into poverty.

  166. Valerie says:

    I’m on a number of SNP MP Facebook pages – they are INFESTED with unionist trolls.

    They are having a field day on this and banging on about Daesh.

    Seriously depressing.

  167. Jim says:

    I see the sun is lying about Michelle Thompson.

    In calling for the suspension of Natalie McGarry they state that the SNP dragged it’s heals beforew eventually suspending Michelle Thompson when in fact she left the SNP of her own account during an investigation of which she played no part.

  168. Helena Brown says:

    I expect the EM will be trying this corruption thing on everyone in the Parliamentary SNP, so eventually like the Alex Salmond lied, it will just roll over the electorate. I have every confidence in Natalie, I know her parents and I know how she was brought up, she is no thief.

  169. Bilious says:

    Your Karen Rennie and “Search for 10K” links seem to be the wrong way round.

    Though I’m sure I’m mistaken in that, and next time I look it’ll turn out they’d been right all along.

  170. Bob Mack says:


    Turkey and Russia have no love for each other at all.Several incidents over the past few months have exacerbated that situation.

    This may however make the Westminster hawks pause somewhat,as the pilots appear to have been captured by rebel forces who may be pro isis.
    It emphasises that they all want to work together,but will instantly shoot each other down if venturing too near their “allies” territory.

  171. Alastair says:

    Does anyone know the estimated value of the contracts for the 13 frigites so we understand the monetary value of the 40% cut.

  172. Macart says:

    @Bob Mack

    I said it before Bob. This whole situation is a powder keg surrounded by monkeys playing with matches.

    This won’t be the last such incedent.

  173. heedtracker says:

    I have every confidence in Natalie,

    She’s actually irrelevant now. BBC, Record etc will make her guilty, all part of their ongoing attack making SNP and Scottish politics as toxic as they possibly can.

    Its a double assault on SNP and Holyrood. They want a red tory Scotland under a blue tory UK/England but Holyrood has to be damaged so badly, Westminster power remains unaffected for the seeable.

    Its a lot of responsibility for newsrooms like Pacific Quay and they showed their ability and power with Project Fear last year. They know they’ve got it wrong so far since May this year, to its back to all out Project Smear and Fear again.

    SLabour are not elected anymore and Scottish voters are irrelevant in newsrooms like the Record.

    The Graun monstering of Scottish democracy, complete news black out on anything Scotland/full on smear attacks.

  174. Big Jock says:

    Macart you are correct. The Turks are no friends of the Russians. The border they are bombing is a Turk/Syrian enclave. That’s why they brought it down. Who knows where this is going but we live in very dangerous times.

  175. Alastair says:

    Think I found it.
    The value of the contract to the Clyde yards for 13 frigites was £859m.
    Reducing it to 8 is a cut to the yards, the local and Scottish economy of £343.6m.

  176. Bob Mack says:


    The situation with Ms Thomson and Ms McGarry is what it is.

    It will not stop me voting double SNP whatever the outcome.

    The Unionists thumping the tub about Daesh may have cause to ponder this morning with the news of Turkey shooting down the Russian fighter jet.

    Cameron will certainly have to review his decision in light of events,and decide if there is too much risk of operating in such a theatre.

  177. Haggis Hunter says:

    Whole thing stinks of Ml5.

    Time will tell, but the Brit media is wrong to start naming names before any investigation has been completed.

    No wonder the LabServativeDem and BBC STV unionist media party rejected the Levison recommendations.

  178. Ken500 says:

    Everything is not as transparent and straight forward, as some suggest.

  179. Macart says:

    @Big Jock

    Too many folks out for blood and/or profit Jock and not enough fearful of the repercussions.

    Like the world hasn’t seen enough suffering, we seem hell bent on repeating history every chance we get.

    So yeah, I’m afraid, afraid for all of us.

  180. frogesque says:

    Dear Daily Record,

    Could you please send me one of your high vis vests . . .

    With a YES2 logo on!

  181. Capella says:

    O/T Good John Pilger article on RT which suggests that the Syria mess will be ramped up as planned in London 2 years ago.
    “From Pol Pot to ISIS: the Blood Never Dried.”

  182. Petra says:

    @ Dorothy Devine at 8:49am …… circulation figures plummet to very satisfactory levels …

    I get really irate with the CorpMedia at times and then I think to myself just carry on doing what you’re doing because it seems to be working in our favour. Their sales are plummeting and large numbers of staff are being paid off (sad if they’re half decent).

    The Daily Rag as an example has crossed the line. There was a time when they were ‘smart’ enough to hide how blatantly biased they are but that’s gone now and many people, including more and more Labour supporters, can see right through them. People remember how they trundled out one person after another, Labour and Tory, last year day after day, making threats and promises. Threats as to what would happen if we voted yes have come to pass through voting no. Promises made have been broken such as the Vow that is lying in tatters. They’re sitting on the edge of their seats now hoping that somehow or another the Vow – Scotland Bill will come right in the end and until that time will have little to say about it rather will try to deflect by focusing on continuing to discredit the SNP.

    People all over the country would clearly see on the news last night that a Government, Tory and LABOUR, that said that there was no money in the pot to help the poor can find billions to bomb the poor elsewhere (alongside Daesh). I would think that this issue alone will convince thousands more to support Scottish Independence, realise that backing the Union was an extremely bad idea: a bad idea promoted by newspapers like the Daily Record.

  183. Andrew McLean says:

    Hi Hamish, I was pondering whether to respond to your posts, mainly due, well to be brutality honest, you sound extremely inexperienced or you are an agent provocateur?

    Ok let me tell you how party conferences work. In 1970s and 80s labour and to a lesser extent Tory conferences were racked with divisions and demonstrations, booing and walkouts. No mater how heart felt and fundamental to those taking part, it was just pure comedy gold to those looking in, our wonderful press had a field day, making well Labour in particular look like a party that you wouldn’t let run a chip shop never mind the country. As cool as an old man wearing donkey jacket and a man in a suit walking on a beach then getting soaked was, to the press this was all the ammunition they needed to say look they are a bunch of Idiots and by definition you will be too if you vote for them.

    To be honest this shouldn’t have been a surprise, ever since the four TV showdowns between Richard Nixon and John F. Kennedy in 1960, the value of stage management, of appearance was well known regardless of the fact that on radio Nixon was deemed the winner, more people watched TV. This is why Laurence Olivier persuaded Thatcher to have elocution lessons, and Aquascutum designed power suits, to portray the Conservative leader as a stateswoman. Gordon Reece, Lord Bell and the advertisers Saatchi and Saatchi produced and coached her on her television and stage presence. And the result, landslide!

    Labour only became credible once they controlled, stage managed the conferences, Tony Blair was staged managed within an inch of his life, including make up, committing speeches and audience member’s names to memory, to add to the personal touch. Much of this was down to Alistair Campbell who was trained in the dark arts of political spin. And the result Landslide!

    So this leads us on to the nub of your complaint, is the conference staged managed, well yes. If it weren’t imagine the headlines! But you don’t have to travel far to be reminded of how easy it is to be portrayed as a party ranked with division, my own branch hit the press recently due to a constituency twined town wanting to set up a branch of their own. If this was agreed behind closed doors, would this be portrayed as control from above?, In any case it was presented as a independence party that cant stand independence, dammed if you do dammed if you don’t .

    Nepotism, no. The problem for the SNP is the historical small numbers of members, a lot of whom were friends and relations. So looking in from today, where again for my branch we have over one thousand members when before we had well I don’t know but I once went to a meeting and counted 5!

    So this is party politics in the 21st centaury less Dialectic more harmonious, as benign and boring as this appears it stops our party becoming the latest joke for the press, strangely from the party of Blair Madelson and Campbell they seem to be ignorant of that fact.

    But the incompetent Corporate Press now are left with no recourse but to just spin and sleaze bag their way through the day, And if you think that’s not true just look at the You tube film of Jim Murphy deliberately walking into a protester, then look at the headlines that one action sums up propaganda mistaken as news today. Just imagine Alex Salmond put his dick in a dead pig it would still be front page in the so called Scotch Press.

  184. Ken500 says:

    Clyde Contracts are spread over a number of years. Scottish taxpayers money back. Scotland’s Funds. £4Billion of Scottish taxes are spent on UK Defence a year. Most of the activities are based outside Scotland. personel and services. £1/2Billion+ wasted on Trident. It will be increased to £1Billion+ a year with escalating costs. With more contaminated subs at Rosyth. A complete waste of money. They are exporting unsafe nuclear waste to Africa.

    The Tories are overspending. There are not enough taxes raised in the rest of the UK to cover the expenditure. The expenditure is going on the Debt. Now £1.5Trillion. The Tories are cutting £12Billion from welfare and essential services and spending £12Billion more on Defence (attack) Any illegal invasion in Syria will increase the Debt.

  185. Bill McLean says:

    I agree with Proud Cybernat at 1103 last night. “Stop using the term Mainstream Media/MSM. Let’s call them the BUM instead – that would give them”legitimacy/authority” they deserve. British Unionist Media. Imagine! or maybe not!

  186. heedtracker says:

    Nice display of UKOK political corruption normalising day after day.


    Long after they’ve got McGarry out, and the SNP too obviously, we’ll have Mone in power.

    Its like a dystopia, endless war, terror on the streets, GCHQ multi billion funding hoovering up all online/phone activity, poorest monstered by media neo fascist goons, useless nuke weapons costing unimaginable amounts of money, super rich royals and tax evaders funding a toryboy currently in the process of anihlating Scottish democracy via their thug BBC newsrooms, Vow shyste binned out of hand by unlected Lords, weak old man like JC left to present opposition so tired and empty he’s pointless.

    But will it affect ones house price UKOK?

  187. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Valerie at 9.45

    Indeed. But they are usually shot down very easily and in many cases so inane are their contributions that they are actually helping us

  188. ahundredthidiot says:

    Don’t worry, don’t worry, frigates order will be placed when all just get along and be British for the big fight coming our way with the Evil Eastern Alliance who are coming to ‘take away our liberties, wealth and enslave our Nation’

    Oh, wait…..

  189. Petra says:


    We all knew that someone would bring down a Russian jet or vice versa sooner or later and that such an action could escalate into dragging us into a World War.

    Well it’s happened now and maybe the timing is opportune? Does anyone else think that this will dissuade Westminster from voting to bomb Syria?

  190. Hamish100 says:

    Andrew McLean

    I am neither an agent provocateur or inexperienced. Have a look at previous posts and work it out for yourself. You accept conference was news managed. Good at least you may understand my and many party members frustrations. Proper open debate will attract new members and keep existing. Sterile back clapping may be good for those on high but the danger is they think everything is aok and take the eye of the ball. Many hingers on will clap all day to gain positional advantage. Independence for Scotland, good governance for our country is our goal.
    You then divert into imagery I would prefer to ignore and is inconsequential . I am saying quite clearly to our leaders focus. As for the allegations I didn’t report the matter to the Police WFI did. They obviously have concerns. I hope the issue is cleared up soon and a satisfactory answer provided.
    Closed doors and apparent secrecy fuels the right wing press, openness flushes out any dead wood and the Scottish people will recognise us as the party to lead warts and all.

  191. Capella says:

    Re Russian jet – RT are doing live broadcast on this.

  192. Petra says:

    I have to laugh at Michelle Mone! Christian values and all that! I wonder if the hundreds of Chinese people that she employed in her sweat shops, rather than Scots, recited the Lords Prayer every night …… praying for half-decent wages and working conditions. One thing for sure is that she’s found her true place in the World sitting amongst a bunch of gluttonous hypocrites in the House of the Rising Sun.

  193. Dan Huil says:

    The BritNat media made up its mind years ago: it will do everything in its power to stop Scotland regaining its independence. Frankly it doesn’t matter whether the SNP [since it’s the main pro-indy party] is squeaky clean or not, the BritNat media will still “find” stories to discredit it and the independence cause.

    Thankfully more and more people in Scotland are seeing the BritNat media for what it is: reactionary propaganda.

    I don’t agree with everything the SNP says or does, but it is blindingly obvious that supporting and voting for that party is the best way to achieve independence, along with supporting and funding sites like WOS.

    Vote SNP/SNP next year.

  194. Glesca Keelie says:

    Anybody see STV Newsnight Scotland last night.

    Natallie and the missing £30,000. £30,000, I’d be surprised if it was 3,000, given the difficulty of raising funds, WOS excepted of course.

    However Colin ? new politics reporter and I think from Edinburgh went on to mention Labour’s missing money. Claimed it was £5,000 and Dugdale had initiated the police action herself. Flat out lies, both of them. Very disappointed.

  195. schrodingers cat says:

    turks bring down Russian SU24

    plane crashed and pilots landed in Turkmen territory in ….Syria.

  196. Andrew McLean says:


    Hamish don’t get me wrong I agree debate is good, but not in the face of 110 biased professional journalists who are itching to show division, this would never be portrayed as debate but as confusion and the old favorite Crisis or Meltdown.
    As I tried to explain conference is not and has not been the forum for the type of debate you seem to want for any party for a very long time.

    As for imagery, sorry if you don’t understand, but look how the imagery of Corbyn is, did he bow, and how far, where is his tie, did he were a suit? Not inconsequential, but fatal to his chances of his party being elected.

    As for the allegations, lost me there I never said you did report the matter, in fact I never mentioned any allegations?
    And this openness you speak of warts and all, for that you would require a free press, and as I said the press in Scotland, Herald, Scotsman, Mail and Record will twist and spin and lie and distort till all that is left of the independence movement is two guys a dug in a pub pondering it as a good Idea.

    Here is one for you, a Woman buys a house from someone who sells a house, then later her Lawyer is struck off for paperwork irregularities. Front page splash day after day after day on the Lawyer, or the person who bought the house, interviews with the victim, cheeky bissim oh the horror, we wus robbed!

    Again Hamish you seem to have an axe to grind, what with your closed doors and apparent secrecy?

  197. HandandShrimp says:

    I am intrigued as to how an MP offering to speak to the police if required becomes a probe into that MP and no one else. Most papers are playing it cautiously taking care after the SNPbad guff to note that the MP denies any wrong doing, the Record’s take is a bold move. The Record is effectively accusing her of theft and is jumping a lot of guns in their desperation to make something stick on the SNP. If/When exonerated I hope she takes them to the cleaners.

    That said, the Record is so crass that they will likely still run with it as their headline even if Russian were to declare war on Turkey. The only thing that matters to them is to get one over the SNP. Less newspaper more SLab vigilante.

  198. schrodingers cat says:


    video shown of a dead pilot, confirmed by Russia, to be wearing Russian airforce uniform

    disappointed, china also has declared war on isis. UN resolution by 5 permanent members is destabilised by turkeys action,

    while I am against bombing Syria, a coalition of us,russia and china against isis would help avoid escalation between super powers and such a common agreement between them would cool the arder of isis and their supporters.

  199. ahundredthidiot says:

    I am sure there is no connection between Russia bombing shit out of Isis oil infrastructure last week and Turkey shooting down one of their jets over, well, Syria (where the pilots landed!).

    Isis supplying a member of NATO with oil…! Surely not.

    Assad said no to oil pipeline and all of sudden Isis armed to the teeth……oil flows.

    No connection whatsoever. None. Ziltch.

  200. roughian says:


    Laterooms advert.
    Last voice over as car reverses into shelves is “Pig face has ruined the cabinet”

  201. galamcennalath says:

    Re Russian jet. As always there is a bit more to the story.

    The Russians attack those opposed to Assad, not just ISIS. There are umpteen factions fighting Assad. These are backed in various combinations of US, Saudi, Qatar and Turkey.

    Over the last week they have been bombing ethnic Turkish groups opposing Assad very close to the Turkish border. Turkey has told Russia not to attack these ethnic Turks in Syria.

    It looks like Russia was bombing these Turks today. If they ventured over the border, the Turkish forces proper were likely to act.

    The mess just got messier!

  202. Andrew McLean says:

    Schrodinger’s cat says:

    Yes we did say that the close proximity of Russia and NATO in Syria was a recipe for disaster, I hope the pilot’s get rescued soon, its reported one has been captured, I would hope they see sense and release him to the Russians, before this escalates.

  203. ahundredthidiot says:

    Schrödinger’s cat@11:45

    Yes, let’s get all the main players to the front line….I am sure nothing will go wrong.

  204. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Can’t believe what I’m hearing…

    …Call Kaye has invited Edwina Currie to comment on Nigel Lawson’s weekend comments re saving dosh by closing down child-abuse investigations.

    Edwina Currie?

  205. galamcennalath says:

    This article predates today’s plane downing by a few hours.

    “Turkey has warned Russia it has every right to retaliate and take necessary measures in the event its border security is threatened as a result of the Russian military’s operations targeting civilian Turkmen Syrians on the Turkish-Syrian border. “

  206. ahundredthidiot says:

    Andrew MacLean

    Too late, footage on YouTube of one dead pilot, and looks real.

    This type of mobile phone video footage of real dead human bodies happens quickly on YouTube, you know, like the incident in Paris.

    Oh wait….

  207. heedtracker says:

    The Record is effectively accusing her of theft

    Graun too, or how many ways to say she stole £30,000, without saying it out loud. Also usual vicious UKOK Graun smear on Thomson

    “In a letter to the SNP leader on Tuesday morning, Baillie refers to former SNP MP Michelle Thomson, who withdrew from the party whip at Westminster in September when it emerged that Police Scotland was investigating 13 property deals to which she was linked. Thomson has denied any wrongdoing.

    Ouch, when you consider how corrupt SLabour have been proven to be, the amount of lies Baillie spouts day in day out etc

  208. Andrew McLean says:

    Schrodinger’s cat says:

    A coalition of us and US, Russia and China in fact the rest of the non Islamic world is just such a common agreement that the death cult of isis and their supporters want. the idiots think this is a end of days scenario when their god will fight the last holy war on earth or some such crap, just like the nutters in America who pray for the second coming and again the end of days.

    Int it funny how may nutters when questioned say God told me to do it? As if God needs a bunch of inbreed reprobates to fight his wars!

  209. Dan Huil says:

    Don’t worry, folks. Call Me Dave, and the BritNat media, will soon sort out these nasty non-Aryan types. By gad sir, yes!

  210. Fred says:

    Natalie denies any wrong doing so let the polis get on with this business “toot sweet” and don’t let this allegation be allowed to drag on like the Thomson debacle. Labour have been mired in corruption for as long as I can remember, our MP’s & MSP’s need to be like “Caesar’s Wife.”

    Natalie McGarry is my MP & I’m more than a little rattled about this.

  211. Government does not need the elected House of Parliament to vote for going to War,

    The PM/establishment has the `Royal prerogative` to declare War without the consent of the elected House of Parliament.

    Such is our democracy.

  212. Macart says:


    The Record, much like the rest of corp media are awfy big on building and destroying careers and lives. They do so love that ‘moral high ground’ and the whole protection of freedom of speech thing. They also like the fact that folk rarely have the right of redress when they get it wrong or are found out to have been doing wrong.

    Must be great to have your cake and eat it right enough.

    If Leveson should have taught us anything, its that the press are merely human beings who pull their trousers on one leg at a time just like the rest of us. They have no moral high ground all their own and their opinion is no better than anyone elses and most certainly less considered and empathetic. In point of fact Leveson uncovered systemic and endemic malpractice throughout our media. They’re human, just dislocated from society.

    The difference between citizen journalism and corp media? What corp media do, they do for a bottom line and because some chain tugger sets an editorial stance. The more politically motivated are no different from us, with the exception they have a bigger soap box and megaphone. They also have no regard for the damage they do. So used are they to their media/political bubble, they’ve neglected to notice that for the rest of us this isn’t a game with a winner and a loser, its our lives and futures.

    This is why we need a watchdog with teeth, backed by a constitution with bigger teeth. When politicians or the media willingly mislead, lie or manipulate a set of the Revs hammers come down on them and they are made to pay up in full and to the fullest extent of the law.

  213. Socrates MacSporran says:

    I sincerely hope the Nippy Sweetie and the SNP ranks at Holyrood finally take off the gloves and get tore intae SLAB at FMQs this week.

    Point-out the manner in which Michelle Thomson acted when the storm broke around her: resigning the SNP whip even before she had ever been interviewed by the Police – and compare that with Action Krankie NOT standing down even when she actually was the subject of a Police inquiry.

    Point-out the manner in which Natalie McGarry has co-operated with the Police with the: “A big boy did it and run away” which appears to be Dippity Dug’s response to the similar scandal in her constituency.

    And, to Hell with Parliamentary protocol – just call Ollie Hardy’s twin sister the Liar she so eveidently and so-often is.

    Go for the jugular – they don’t like it up ’em Captain.

  214. ahundredthidiot says:

    Schrödinger’s cat

    ‘Isis and their supporters’

    You mean us don’t you? The West.

    Who fund them, supply weapons (Inc chemical ones), buy their oil, provide us with a bogey man image so we can pass draconian laws, limit freedoms like the internet, etc

    Isis are on our side and Russia, Iran and now China are having their patience tested.

    But I am sure people still think we’re the good guys.

    The race for oil has just stepped up a gear.

  215. galamcennalath says:


    Thomson was being accused of acting unethically. There are differences of opinion on the activities. There have been no allegations of illegality whatsoever, in my understanding. While an investigation is ongoing Thomson chose to leave the SNP.

    Mcgarry is being accused of absolutely nothing. An police investigation has begun about missing cash. I see no reason for her to leave the party at the moment.

    Of course, the CorpMedia by innuendo imply all sorts of unsubstantiated nonsense. That should be ignored by all sane people.

  216. schrodingers cat says:


    a consensus between the super powers, regardless of who they bomb, is the best chance to bring the war to a conclusion.

    turkey is trying to poison relations between the super powers and scupper the chance of a un resolution uniting the 5 permanent members

  217. Tam Jardine says:

    Ian Brotherhood

    Call Kaye was bizarrely horrible- to summarise: lets stop bothering investigating historic child abuse allegations… get over it move on. Its a waste of money… The phonehacking scandal? Waste of money- get over it. I hope Mr and Mrs McCann were’nt listening as the investigation into their daughter’s disappearance was treated, I thought with real callous flippancy by Currie.

    Lets focus on the war on terror, on IS, on Rochdale: anything except what Edwina Currie’s mates were up to. Very nasty- the lawyer guy was there to provide balance: he was talking about a cut off so after the age of 28, if you hadn’t come forward you’d have missed your chance. Get over it- move on and stop wasting money… lovely place the UK has become.

  218. Proud Cybernat says:

    We all here pretty much know what the Unionist CorpMedia are about. SNPBAD. INDYBAD. They will manufacture an anti-indy/SNP story wherever and whenever they can and often when there is not even any direct linkage to our Indy Movement or, indeed, to the SNP, the principle vehicle of the Indy Movement.

    Make no mistake, folks. We are at war with the Corporate Media and the State Broadcaster in this country. They are churning out their lies and their bile not to convince you or I–they gave up on us long ago. No. It’s being pumped out daily simply to ‘hold the line’. To prevent NO-voting waverers from learning the truth and moving towards indy.

    Nicola Sturgeon threw the gauntlet down a few weeks back when she said that the people of Scotland will decide when there will be another IndyRef and added that should there be a majority seeking indy in the polls for a year then she could not prevent nor would stand in the way of another IndyRef (or words to that effect).

    So there is a battle going on right now folks. And the Unionist CorpMedia and the Unionist State Broadcaster are in the frontline of this ‘truth war’. We have seen their tactics and know them only too well. They will do everything in their power to halt the drift towards a permanent majority wanting indy. That is all they are trying to do right now–plug the leak. And they have, as we can all bare witness to, seriously ramped things up. And the propaganda they will spew forth into our papers and onto our TV screens will only get worse as they try to prevent an SNP majority in Holyrood next year for they know only too well what that will mean. It will give Nicola Sturgeon the mandate to hold an IndyRef as and when the people demand it. The CorMedia and State Broadcaster are doing everything to stop that happening.

    But they will fail. They will fail because we can see right through their tissue of lies and deceit; their empty promises and rhetoric. We can see their lies–we know what they said and promised before IndyRef#1 and we can see the result. And yet still, STILL some of them try to tell us the pre-IndyRef promises have been delivered. Like we are unthinking idiots like them. Most of us here, I’m sure, will know what an empty plate looks like and can smell keech a mile off. Their utter arrogance blinds them to the fact that it is US who will tell THEM when we are satisifed with the constitutional settlement.

    And they will fail because of you reading this very post and many others like it and sharing the truth all over the internet. They have no power to stop that. A solid 49% is probably where the indy movement is at right now and it will only go up–hence their panic.

    In response to this we must, at every opportunity, demonise them. For that is what they do and are continually doing to our movement. How many times do you hear the term ‘vile cybernat’ in their propaganda sheets? We have to vilify their tabloids and broadsheets and TV/Radio broadcasts at every opportunity. In short, we have to make these truth-benders toxic not just to the 49% but to the rest of the population.

    And we do that by getting the message out that the media in Scotland is totaly biased and corrupt. We make it toxic. We ridicule it. And we keep on ridiculing it. Eventually the message will filter through to those who still read these rags that only idiots read them. We make them the ‘Idiot Media’ (or ‘Idiot Press’). When the label ‘Idiot Media’ sticks and permeates through the population, people will eventually think twice about why they are reading such an ‘idiot’ publication. Most people (instinctively) won’t want to associate themselves with the ‘Idiot Media’ – the media that are idiots and if you listen to what they say could make you an idiot too (especially in the eyes of your family, friends, work colleagues etc).

    So we use terms like ‘CorpMedia’, ‘State Broadcaster’ and collectively the ‘Idiot Media’ (‘Idiot Press’) in everything we write online. We stop using the authorative term ‘MSM’ which actually confers a level of ‘legitimacy’ onto these rags which is wholly undeserving and is to be avoided. We have to poison their well. And we do it with pejoratve terms of our own. And when ‘Idiot Media’ catches on, watch the readership of these rags tumble even more.

    And, of course, where do we direct people for a more informed and enlightened political perspective? To the ‘Smart Media’ – the online media.

    Imagine down the pub, your pal says “I read this story about the SNP in the Record th’day….”

    You interject. “You’re no’ still listening to the Idiot Media, are you? Get to the Smart Media. Get yourself online.”

    It’s subtle but, in the long run, should be highly effective. Your pal will begin to question why the tabloid is known as ‘Idiot Media’ and will make them think (well, those that DO think), “Guilty by association.” (The Idiot Press know all about that little trick). And, hopefully, should make many of them think twice about what rags they are buying, who they are listenng to.

    So that’s the strategy. We have to ridicule and malign the CorpMedia – the ‘Idiot Media’ – in this country because, as stated earlier, that is who is at war with our movement. So – let us ramp up our own war of words against them.

  219. Andrew McLean says:

    schrodingers cat says
    I agree the Turkish government has provided IS with military intelligence, weapons, logistical support, financial assistance, and medical services. the defeat of IS if Russia has its way will cause problems for Turkey, maybe that’s why the protocol for engagement with Russia overflights was changed, we have regular incursions by Russian aircraft, but our military is order not to fire under any circumstance, we may even have a Russian sub sitting of the west coast, waiting?

  220. galamcennalath says:

    schrodingers cat says:

    “a consensus between the super powers, regardless of who they bomb, is the best chance to bring the war to a conclusion.

    turkey is trying to poison relations between the super powers and scupper the chance of a un resolution uniting the 5 permanent members”


    Another scenario is to consider ISIS as a side show. The real issue is about whether Assad goes or stays. Russia has firmly backed Assad. It seems Russia has spent most of its effort not on Isis but on other groups opposing Assad. These groups are all backed by the West, one way or another.

    A target of the Russians over the last few days has been the Syrian Turkmen Brigades …

    … and this has really pissed off Turkey. Cynically you could interpret today’s events as the West, through Turkey, of sending a big message to Russia saying – stop hitting our proxy forces in Syria, and Assad is not going to be allowed to win outright.

  221. Grouse Beater says:

    What motive has McGarry to purloin public money?

  222. Andrew McLean says:

    Associated press has quoted a rebel commander saying the two Russian crew members had tried to parachute into a government-held area after they ejected, but came under fire from members of his group.
    So they shot at them, don’t think Putin will like that?

  223. galamcennalath says:

    @Andrew McLean

    I think you are lumping too many groups under the IS banner. This is something the CorpMedia have been doing.

    IS is now quite distinct from the likes of al-Qaeda and al-Nusra Front who are also involved in Syria. Most (all?) of the groups fighting Assad also appear to be fighting IS.

    Al-Nursa Front is backed by Qatar and Saudi, I believe.

    There seems to be attempts by the CorpMedia to reduce the Syrian conflict into a much simpler scenario than it actually is. Playing up ISIS and ignoring other groups. This is part of an agenda!

  224. schrodingers cat says:

    isis present supporters are turkey, Saudi and other gulf states (Taliban and usbekistan and Turkmenistan are supplying soldiers as well)

    the us and the uk armed the fsa, many of whom then defected to isis and took the arms with them

    the us and the uk armed the Iraqi forces, who ran from isis in Ramadi and left all of the arms to isis

    at the beginning of the conflict, the us and the uk armed all of the rebel groups, including isis, al nusra and jaysh al islam, but subsequent actions by such groups has now shown the folly of such a policy. so you are quite correct, it is us who have supported them… in the past.

    it is the recent change in us and the uk policy wrt to isis etc, which Russia has taken advantage of and which the uk msm is so desparate to either ignore or as stu reported in a recent article, try and change history completely.

    I am not defending uk or us policy in the me. we are directly responsible (along with others) for the creation of these Wahhabi jihadists.

    what turkey is doing is undermining nato and un chances of an agreement, resolution etc, which would at least unite the super powers in a common goal and a common enemy…the Wahhabi jihadis..

    this is the only way the Syria conflict will come to a conclusion

  225. schrodingers cat says:

    Al-Nursa Front is backed by Qatar and Saudi, I believe.

    and also al Qaeda

    google al nusra execution of civilians and Syrian army prisonners… defend them if you wish. I wont. I group all Wahhabi jihadists together for a good reason.

    the reason the uk and the us are bumming up isis only, is to conceal the fact thay we were responsible for arming al nusra and other Wahhabi jihadis

  226. Andrew McLean says:

    galamcennalath says:

    Yes what I mean is that whilst Turkey has openly supported other jihadi groups, such as Ahrar al-Sham, and Jabhat al-Nusra, they have also supported IS playing one off against the other!
    Erdogan’s ultimate purpose is to destroy the Kurdish power base and finish of Assad, but to do that he needs shot of the Russians, easier said than done.

  227. schrodingers cat says:

    It seems Russia has spent most of its effort not on Isis but on other groups opposing Assad. These groups are all backed by the West, one way or another.

    except Russia just bombed isis oil fields

    and the other groups are no longer backed by the us and uk,

    see also the revs article about the hearing with the us republician senator a few days ago

    the Turkmen initially supported al Qaeda

  228. Onwards says:

    ahundredthidiot says:
    24 November, 2015 at 11:47 am
    I am sure there is no connection between Russia bombing shit out of Isis oil infrastructure last week and Turkey shooting down one of their jets over, well, Syria (where the pilots landed!).

    Isis supplying a member of NATO with oil…! Surely not.

    Assad said no to oil pipeline and all of sudden Isis armed to the teeth……oil flows.

    Yes, There is obviously far more going on than simply taking on ISIS. It’s about who ends up controlling Syria, building gas pipelines into Europe from Iraq and Qatar, and surrounding countries wanting to carve out more territory.

    Russia also has interests in building a southern gas pipeline through Turkey, bypassing Ukraine, so their response to this incident may be limited. Long term geopolitics will always take priority.

    The Paris attacks are a big complication in that much of the public now want to see a coalition against ISIS, rather than the focus being on replacing Assad.

  229. heedtracker says:

    BBC tv national lunchtime news text book pro blue toryboy propaganda on Osborne sudden switch and now brilliantly pumping several billion into English NHS.

    No question why, how much toryboy’s cut last five years or actual point of NHS cuts, with out of blue tory policy flip flop, or Osborne’s “deal today” BBC shill explains.

    BBC Vote SLab Scotland, full on monster ting of McGarry stealing 30 grand, at a guess.

  230. ahundredthidiot says:

    Putin has just labelled Turkeys actions, ergo NATO, as, associates of terrorism.

    How right he is. Putin is the produce of a democracy with around 70% approval rates. Paraphrasing bill Clinton ‘there’s a government behind the government’ which is the USA and possibly the UK, now the BBC making suggestions ‘one man’ makes all Russia’s decisions.

    Corp media in full swing reading off the neo-con hymn sheet.

  231. schrodingers cat says:

    seems like it was Ahrar al-Sham who captured the pilots

    Ahrar ash-Sham leader Hassan Aboud stated that Ahrar ash-Sham worked with Nusra Front and would have no problems with Nusra as long as they continued fighting Assad, Aboud also said Ahrar worked with Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant in some battles but that their agenda was disagreeable. Aboud also said all parties shared the same objective of establishing an Islamic State, whether they were ISIS, Al Nusra, the Islamic Front, or the FSA but they differed as to the “tactics, strategies or methods”. Aboud noted that in Syria “there are no secular groups”

    Hassan Aboud condemned democracy in an interview with Al-Jazeera, saying that “Democracy is people governing people, according to rules they please, We say that we have a divine system whose law is Allah’s for his creatures and his slaves who he appointed as viceregents on this Earth

    another rebel Wahhabi jihadist group funded by turkey and supported by ….well… us

  232. Jack Murphy says:

    OT.Trident Debate LIVE NOW from Commons.
    Debate put forward by Brendan O’Hara SNP MP,Defence Spokesperson.
    To catch the start of the debate just scroll back to 12:5:48.

  233. Jack Murphy says:

    Trident Debate—-sorry,that Scroll Back Time should read:- 12:52:26
    Apologies. 🙁

  234. heedtracker says:

    BBC Vote SLab Scotland, full on monster ting of McGarry stealing 30 grand, at a guess.

    BBC national news shill outside McGarry office in Glasgow, full on BBC smear attack, including Tomson and Sturgeon and the dude ends with “so SNP landslide started with 56 MP’s, now 51. because of Tomson”

    That’s NOT my usual typo, BBC says it 51 SNP MP’s now, not 54. Although its probably the discussion BBC targets for the SNP, by the new year no doubt.

  235. Foonurt says:

    Dave McEwan Hill – big black SNP umbrellas, tae keep awe yoan ten thoozin in notes (urr mibbae thirty thoozin), flutterin doon oan yurr heid.

  236. Dorothy Devine says:

    Bill McLean – BUM it is!

    I do wish someone would sue the bum off them.

  237. Petra says:

    @ Proud Cybernat say at 12:06 ………

    Great post and I love the ‘idiot press’ idea. A bit like using Daesh versus Isil. I’ve been trying to get the term ‘idiot press’ across in my own way for example when shopping if I see someone pick up the Daily Rag I’ll strike up a conversation and then bring it round to ”I see you’re buying the Daily Record” and launch into whatever I think may influence them such as if a pensioner … pensions and so on. On a few occasions it’s worked … ”Is that right? Right enough?” and they’ve put it back down. It’s a bit like every one of us trying to convert one person at a time to vote for Independence. If we could all convince one person each to stop buying these rags, like the Daily Record, they would be out of business within a couple of years.

  238. Rob James says:

    I agree with the term ‘Idiot Media.’ Makes it an embarrassment to be caught reading it, or admitting to watching it.

    On a similar note, I have finally convinced my partner to renege on paying the TV tax. Does anyone have a link for cancellation of the licence fee regarding removal of access rights etc?

  239. jcd says:

    Was wondering what the point of using different name for msm was, however Idiot Media has the advantage of being totally true!

    From now on, for me, Idiot Media it is. If it gets used widely and often enough, it WILL catch on.

  240. gerry says:

    Alastair says:
    24 November, 2015 at 10:02 am
    Does anyone know the estimated value of the contracts for the 13 frigites so we understan…….

    Good info on this here
    Total estimated cost for 13 type 26’s would be 4 billion sterling, but a lot of this will go to BAE and the like for the systems.

  241. Gary45% says:

    News just in.
    The labour party have just cancelled their next conference.
    The reason being,members were given a vote on the dates and everyone of them.
    They Truly are pathetic.

  242. yesindyref2 says:

    Aye, so the possibilities including the only one the Guardian, the Herald, any other rag, the Labour party and uncle Tom cobblers and all concentrate on are:

    1). Natalie McGarry done the dirty deed
    2). Someone else with access to the Paypal account or McGarry’s computer / laptop, done the dirty deed
    3). It wasn’t a Paypal account any more, it went direct to a bank account / post office savings / bank of america account
    4). Someone at P did the dirty deed
    5). McGarry’s computer was hacked or the Paypal account was hacked via any number of scams / phishes
    6). It wasn’t McGarry had access during the period, someone else had been appointed. So repeat options 2 and 5 for the someone else.
    7). There was a chargeback by the card company which Paypal honoured and charged back the Paypal accoount. They have 6 months to do that.
    8). There isn’t £30,000 missing after all
    9). Probably loads of others
    10). Planet Earth is blue and there’s nothing I can do

    It should be noted that over $10,000 USD total for donations it seems Paypal require some kind of organisation verification to give any discounts.

    And why does nobody say anything more detailed? Because there’s a police investigation underway.

  243. Jenni says:

    For what it’s worth I personally do not believe Natalie McGarry has stolen any money. Why would she? And how stupid would she have to be – and she is a smart lady – to do it just before becoming an MP? It’s just not plausible.

    I’m a member of WFI and Natalie has always impressed me with her commitment to public service – anyone less likely to be out for personal gain, I’d be hard put to think of right now.

    I’m ignoring the MSM stories and waiting patiently for the outcome of the investigation which will clear her name.

    I’m not a committee member or anything like that so I have no knowledge of the group’s accounting procedures but it seems likely to me as an ex-accountant, that there has been an error somewhere along the way. It will all get sorted out.

    Just my opinion of course but one I hope others will share.

    And to put my money where my mouth is, if it does actually transpire that Natalie Mcgarry is proved – emphasis on actual proof here and not trial by media – to have misappropriated funds – then I will donate £100 to Wings. (I’m on a low fixed income so that’s a LOT for me.)

  244. yesindyref2 says:

    From an article in the Herald, though the fearnought Paul Hutcheon is still claiming £30,000 is missing, it appears it might actually be £16,000, near enough the same amount as the October 2014 fundraiser.

  245. Robert Peffers says:

    @galamcennalath says: 23 November, 2015 at 5:57 pm:

    ” … Thing is, everything I have heard over the last umpteen years against independence can be debunked. I have never ever heard any proven argument which says we are better in the Union than with independence, nothing.”

    I’ve tried to re-find the old quote made at the time of the Union being signed but I must have filed it under the wrong heading and can’t find it. It was written in old Lowland Scots and went something like this :-

    “Whan wi haed oor ain politicians in Auld Reekie wi could stane thaim if they didna dae whit we wanted. We canna throw stanes a the wey tae Lunnon”.

    Says it all really.

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