The media they don’t like to talk about
Posted on
December 31, 2015 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
Below is a very interesting 13-minute chat from this afternoon’s John Beattie Show on Radio Scotland, also featuring Stuart Cosgrove (presenter of the excellent footy prog Off The Ball) and Eamonn O’Neill, who we presume is this Eamonn O’Neill.
(The John Beattie Show, BBC Radio Scotland, 31 December 2015)
.
Naturally we like it because there’s mention of Wings, which – for just about the first time we can recall on broadcast media in our four-year life – isn’t about how vile and awful we are, but the whole thing is much more wide-ranging and well worth a listen.
(The line “The media the media doesn’t like to talk about” is Beattie’s, not ours.)
I thought he was stuck in there alone today.. 🙂
A chink is exposed in their armour.
Wings and others are too well supported to ignore any more .Sites like this are now a fact of Scottish political and social life, and they had better get used to it.
From little acorns——–
That noise is the sound of the dam busting.
Glorious.
“The media the media doesn’t like to talk about”
That’s going into the Wings Twitter bio I hope?
Well it only took them to the end, the very very end of 2015!!!
Jeez – does this mean you’re becoming “respectable”? Heaven forbid! 🙂 But just maybe there’s the tiniest chance of one of them somewhere becoming a bit more like you – and actually tell the truth. 🙂
For as long as I can remember I have always wanted an alternative TV media news channel which just gives you real facts and balance, rather than the propaganda the State unionists ones give you.
I do like the idea of someone coming in and scooping up all the decent truth seeking journalistic talent in Scotland, because it would seem to me like a real wasted opportunity if it didn’t happen.
Clink–Tinkle–Clink:_ the sound of pennies dropping.
They only discussed it cos they know the Bath One is on holiday and wont be listening….
Oops!!
What an excellent grown up debate, touching on many issues re new media versus old. Just shows what you can do if you dont invite the likes of Gardham, Clegg, Crighton, Cochrane etc on to your programme to poison it.
Heard it. Refreshing and about time.
Eammon guy nailed it. Many intelligent people want to participate and places like here (and Twitter) enable us to do that coz we were/are unable to do it anywhere else.
2016 going to be interesting.
Big thanks to Stu for keeping it going.
YOU have done this. Yes YOU Rev and all the commentators here.
Well done, there is hope at last.
In other words scrap BBC Scotland, it breaches the trades descriptions act, sack the lot and keep Alba.
just to explain what I meant in case you never seen it…
link to twitter.com
might explain why we got some decent press for a change cheers JB
Independence Live has just hit their fundraising target right now.
That’s what we need more of, I will raise a glass tonight to the new media. Well done all, many thanks.
link to indiegogo.com
“I thought he was stuck in there alone today”
He says at the end that the interview was a pre-record 🙂
Very good points from Mr Cosgrove re Wings, partiality, web culture, etc.
Good to hear “cybernat” called out for the cliche it is.
How odd it is to hear politicians (some unelected), journalists (some state funded), political pundits, etc use this dismissive and condescending term.
Storm Frank has been busy of course and people have ‘suffered’ but if you look for the possible positives…
GOSH people talking sense on the BBC.
Surely shirley a first, lets hope that continues into 2016 and beyond
Lets hope some entrepreneur picks up the idea that they floated there if only to spread the word wider than here…..
Talking to ourselves was where we went wrong, before ‘we’ were sure we had it in the bag until all the people that dont come here voted no.
@al urquhar says the penny has dropped ?
They can’t turn a deaf ear or a blind eye to the internet media any more. 🙂
Onwards and upwards. Well done Rev.
Remember SNP x 2 is best.
Excellent! I usually listen to big John when I’m doing my delivery rounds. I think he and Stuart Cosgrove are about the best there are in BBC Scotland.
I suspect they may have seen a window of opportunity whilst the regular Zampolits were away on holiday to get something more balanced in.
Back of the net with this one!
“More people consider the BBC an accurate and newsworthy source of tv than any other but not rated as highly as C4”, is not much a benchmark.
It was the BBC wot won it. But it was all for our own good, saving Scotland from a fate worse than too poor, wee, stupid Scotland actually running Scotland. Much better to be run by another country. And we’re forever and ever grateful to the whole yearly £4+bn BBC UKOK shyste of it all.
On the subject o the media (sort of) someone (I want to say Petra) posted that we should lobby Aldi’s to put The National in their shops, so I did, @ about 08.00 this morning using their website, @ 09.10 this morning I get a phone call from a lovely young English girl calling from… yes you guessed it Aldi’s and she thanked me for my feedback and it would be passed up the line for the management’s attention,
I’ve contacted Aldi’s in the past and I have to say I am very impressed by their swift response time.
Interesting to note the comments on the ability to interact and comment on the news. Is there any valid or official reason as to why BBC Scotland don’t open up their articles to comment? The main BBC website does?
A ‘Scottish Spring’ in my step after that one. (See what I dod there).
Slowly but surely the truth is getting out thanks to sites and blogs like this. I hope you appreciate just how vital the work you and the many informative contributors do is to the cause of independence for Scotland.
People need the facts and you provide them!
Thank you and the regulars on here for keeping us going through the tough times and here’s to more inspiration in 2016.
John Beattie.are you there? Let’s have more of this type of discourse on your programme. There is a thirst for it “out here”.
Well I am up for another crowd fund for the new year and the fund expanding your readership.
Expanding your readership from yes supporters to maybe supporters is essential
They have awoken!
Attitudes have changed, guess we’re doing something right. When the BBC start paying attention you know we are having an impact.
Just made my day that has and bodes well for 2016. Have a good one.
It’s about time you got a mention Stu.
Compared to the BBC’s policy on on-line commenting, which is like a 7 year old sticking its fingers in its ears while shouting ‘I’m not listening!’, Wings is full of intelligent comments above and below the ‘line’.
They’re going to get a massive wake-up call come May. Mind you, they’ll probably ignore it like the wake-up call they got LAST May.
All the best for the coming year and beyond guys, I always enjoy reading your comments. :o)
[…] The media they don’t like to talk about […]
Ken McDonald used to have a weekend morning radio programs that included a round up of headlines from political websites including Wings. The plug was pulled on that programme a few months before the referendum. Yet another reason to STOP PAYING YOUR LICENSE FEE.
The sound of pennies dropping?
Or the sounds of slim divi cheques from the SCUM blowing in the wind as their revenues dwindle even more?
You cannot insult half the population of a politically erudite country like Scotland and get away with it any more. Lazy churnalisim is no longer tollerated.
Well done Stu, you are getting though to them!
This segment of BBC is the one that I try not to miss.
Always interesting and never like the stuff served up on TV and all of there other press reviews.
Also, although he is not perfect, slowly John Beattie has become one of the BBCs broadcasters.
That was indeed well worth listening to. Especially in this week when it is a very good time to hide the dirty washing of the Dirty Laundry Basket that is Westminster.
This week we also have Labour castigating, (I said castigating – not castrating), The Tories for rewarding their strategist, Lynton Crosby, with a Knighthood but a Labour Party whose own former strategist already has the ermine jaikit.
Then we have the Labour suspension of Simon Danczuk for sexting a 17 year old girl. Danczuc claims there is no fool like an old Labour fool.
Then we have Financial Conduct Authority who are shelving an enquiry into the culture, pay and behaviour of staff in banking. Is there an authority to enquire into the culture pay and behaviour of Financial Conduct Authorities? Enquiring minds wish to know.
Then there is the sneaked in little item about, thick as pig shit, Labour MP, Toby Perkins. Toby has gained a Westminster debate and vote upon an English National Anthem. Doesn’t the numptie know that England already has a National Anthem. They have had it since 1745. It is titled, “God Save the Queen”, which is erroneously claimed as the “British National Anthem”. It was only briefly the Anthem of Britain as the British Republic of Ireland was formed in 1800/1 and thus it became wrongly claimed as the United Kingdom’s National Anthem.
The origins of both words and the music are obscure but the earliest copy of the words ever to be found were printed in, “The Gentleman’s Magazine”, in 1745. The tune, though, is much, much older.
In that same year, 1745, “God Save the King” was performed in the Drury Lane theatre and other London Theatres. Then, in 1746, George Frideric Handel used it in his, “Occasional Oratorio”, which was about the English tribulations during the Jacobite Rebellion of 1745.
From that point on the tune was frequently used by composers making, “British references”. For example by Ludwig van Beethoven, who used it in seven variations.
From Great Britain the melody was passed to continental Europe, Ironically becoming popular in Germany and Scandinavia, with, of course, different lyrics.
Even later Samuel F. Smith (1808–95) wrote “My Country ’Tis of Thee” (1832), to be sung to the, “British tune”, where it became a semi-official USA national anthem, second only in popularity to “The Star-Spangled Banner”.
Not bad for a prayer, or prayer-hymn, originally written when London was messing its collective drawers as Bonnie Prince Charlie was Marching upon London and a Hymn that originally contained as the fifth verse in 1945: –
Lord, grant that Marshal Wade,
May by thy mighty aid,
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
and like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Scots to crush,
God save the King.
Isn’t English History wonderful?
What isn’t pure fiction is political spin, downright lies, omissions and half-truths.
Can you actually believe a Labour MP is really so ignorant that he imagines the average Englander if asked to name the Queen of England would reply Queen Elizabeth II and to name the English National Anthem would reply, “God save the Queen”.
i heard this in the car earlier.
My impression then was that Eamonn O’Neill seemed to have too high an opinion of journalism in general and what he was saying wasn’t coloured enough by newspaper ownership and them having definite conservative political angles to grind.
I didn’t see where his world of journalists verifying ‘facts’ would quite fit into his view of the future, given the real politik of blatant lying, and distortion that goes on.
It was not a world i recognised. Looking at the link, he definitely lives in an academic world. The trouble is, no one else seems to recognise it. I may as well read the Guardian, if i would want to be that deluded, whereas i do recognise the world presented by the rev and contributors on WOS.
All the more reason to stop paying the telly tax.
We are hurting them.
Make cancelling the telly tax your new year resolution.
Interesting to hear Stuart Cosgrove sitting in BBC Radio Scotland studios and admit that the BBC blocks news content from around the world, one would hope that normal mainstream listeners picked that up and paid some Effing attention to it
The same scrutiny applied to online digital media as the BBC is subject to, well that leaves an enormous amount of scope to lie consistently then as that’s what the BBC get away with on a daily basis and use our money to do it and then answer to no one, even FOI requests which they reject out of hand most of the time or find themselves not guilty of any wrongdoing
Nice to hear Wings get a mention, although more people probably read Wings than listen to Radio Scotland I would like to think
Newspapers: To frightened to include the Daily Record in his condemnation of partisan papers (Stuart Cosgrove) I wonder why, because he only mentioned the right wing rags
and not the “Daily Labour Union Football Orange Walk God Bless The Queen Record Advertiser”
Not to sound like I dislike Mr Cosgrove, I don’t, and I’m not a big Footy fan but I do sometimes have a wee tune in
“Fur the Banter” as far as radio shows go, if you’re a Footy fan it’s a good one because it’s not all the Big Two
and that’s got to be good
@al urquhar says: 31 December, 2015 at 3:01 pm:
“They only discussed it cos they know the Bath One is on holiday and wont be listening….”
The Rev Stu is like New York. NY. The city that never sleeps.
He has many ears, they are called wingers.
He has many eyes – called alert readers.
I listen to the media review every week and they mention Bella and wings often. Their best ever was the Thursday before Indyref 1 when they both went to town on the blatant BBC and MSM unionist bias, was brilliant and inteligent as always. They show other media reviews like Shereen (at the weekend) up for what they are.
Eamonn O’Neill.
social media enables people to publish replies where as tradition media, like the bbc, doesn’t……
um…. im sure there is an answer to that…..let me think…?
Dr Jim said at 4:03pm:
………………..”Newspapers: Too frightened to include the Daily Record in his condemnation of partisan papers (Stuart Cosgrove) I wonder why, because he only mentioned the right wing rags”……………….
Yes Dr Jim that omission jumped out at me and no doubt many other listeners. 🙁
Anyway,I don’t post on here often but many thanks to Wings Over Scotland for the great site,and to all you Winger’s posters and readers:A Real Guid New Year to you all. 🙂 Jack
Hi Mr Peffers:
Your comments on National Anthem stuff very interesting as always:
‘Radio 5 live breakfast’ English national athem was discussed on a call in this morning (I avoid Call Kaye) heard a few minutes while having a shower.
Anyhoo! They decided to try for a ‘UK National anthem’ and some songwriter to compose one in about 30 minutes.
I never heard the outcome as I was away for my paper and a coffee.
From 6 minutes in for those willing listen. 🙁
Don’t get too angry 🙂
link to bbc.co.uk
Fantastic to hear this at last. Almost surreal. I hope to see more of the Newsshaft guys one day, I liked them and always felt that’s what I would like Scottish TV to look like.
I’d also like to see the Rev put in charge of Pacific Quay 🙂
@Itchybiscuit says: 31 December, 2015 at 3:42 pm:
” … I always enjoy reading your comments. :o)”
I do hope, itchybiscuit, that you do realise we enjoy reading your comments too?
(I do hope no one is going to contradict me for speaking for everyone, (just this once)).
It should have happened fairly early in the referendum campaign, there should have been a campaign to stop paying for the BBC to lie on Westminsters behalf. It would have highlighted their behaviour to everyone in the country.
Never too late though, it’s not like they are any better post referendum is it?
Robert Peffers @ 3:56pm
Think we’ll find that the “English National Anthem” debate will turn into an English Votes for English Laws type SNP Bad whine from those involved.
Let them have it if they want and consign God Save the Queen to history.
I would suggest an X-Factor type contest for their new National dirge hosted by Ant and Dec with phone in voting.
Just had a wee listen to this.
Was it Beattie who mentioned the BBC would be following the face book news agenda?
This would never work under the control of the state run media. It would just be the same old biased garbage, only on a trendier platform.
It was good to hear Wings getting a mention on the mainstream, I have always had admiration for Mr Cosgrove, it sometimes sounds surreal when he gets a wee dig at his employers.
As far as Beattie goes, “One breath away from Fuddery”, never to be trusted, him and Brewer wouldn’t even make decent book ends.
Ayup, not too bad at all. 🙂
A good new year to all Wingers when it comes.
All the very best for 2016.
@Robert Peffers:
‘I do hope, itchybiscuit, that you do realise we enjoy reading your comments too?’
I never gave it a second thought my friend. Perhaps my own wee personal ‘Scottish cringe’ is that I always think everyone who contributes to Wings ‘BTL’, is smarter/more erudite than I. I doubt that’ll change any time soon but I appreciate your comment. :o)
A good new year to all Wingers when it comes.
All the very best for 2016.
From me too, to all vile separatists everywhere, cant wait for 2016!
Oh dear, Oh dear, a link on Dr. Eamonn O’Neill’s facebook page about the fragrant Lady Mone. Seems she is vacating the terrace with views of Tower Bridge, did I mention the views, and my motivational speaking on the terrace, Oh the views, I must tell you about them, Oh I have already. Oh well.
Well, its goodbye to all that,sighs, Tee Hee. GIRUY, milady.
link to m.heraldscotland.com
Croopenstein, thanks for the link – Colin Clement ?@arabstar2 @BBCJohnBeattie @WingsScotland
“John that’s the way most of Scotland has been feeling for some time now”
Stu., that was an incredibly interesting discussion on the radio. Appreciate the heads-up.
Does this mean Wings Over Scotland is going to go plc or mutualised soon 🙂
For what it is worth IMHO the chronic media assault against the SNP is like a dam leaking. They are keeping the vital SWING 5% from voting YES. With the penny dropping, it is now only a matter of time.
When the MSM/social media become more representative of what the majority of Scots feel about our democratic deficit and repatriating all our powers to our country, then that will be the tipping point. Then we see stable polling with YES at 58% to 62%.
At that point IndyRef2 will be put to the test and we shall have our country back.
@Itchybiscuit says: 31 December, 2015 at 4:51 pm:
“I never gave it a second thought my friend. Perhaps my own wee personal ‘Scottish cringe’ is that I always think everyone who contributes to Wings ‘BTL’, is smarter/more erudite than I.”
Och! Itchbiscuit, what makes Wings such a great read, instead of just a good read, is that the Rev Stu kicks off a debate. He doesn’t just write an article.
Then the wingers can all have a say and they can disagree, not only with Stu, but with each other and no one counts who is knowledgeable or not.
Unlike many forums we can, and do, disagree with each other. That is what makes for more healthy debate and understanding of each other’s views.
It usually ends up with a far better understanding of the issue of the topic and of each other too.
I think what I’m trying to say is that Scottish Independence is a very broad church and there is room in it for everyone.
In my lifetime there has never been anything in Scotland that came even close to the amazing growth of the YES campaign. It seemed to take on a life of its own.
Such movements can only happen when people actually listen to each other.
I get the feeling that Mr Beattie was very uncomfortable with the BBC coverage of the whole referendum campaign.What did he think of the Jackie Bird/ Alistair Darling Devomax interview?
If Mr O’Neill is right and a serious investor is going to enter the arena,our Rev is going to have some soul searching,head scratching and important decision making to contend with in the new year.
The National top 10 popular stories of 2015…
link to archive.is
Wonder what Wings top 10 is.. Stu?
Seems Labour have seen the light on the constant SNP Bad nonsense with latest leaflets thru doors in Argyll & Bute.
No mention at all of SNP whatsoever. That has to be a shift in position surely ?
Forced myself to glance at all parts 2 times need a stiff drink now. Thank christ its hogmany !
All the best for a successful 2016 for WoS and Scotland
Partisan ?….On Here ?….seen some right dust up’s here,that’s just the regulars and how it should be.
As always the truth will out,best wishes to the Rev. and all the wingers,(every day’s a school day).
Once a winger always a winger :-))
Will toast you all tonight.
Happy Days..Slange
Beattie was a member of the Scotchland rugby team who’s aresholes stood up before the referendum and told the country to stay in the UK.(I was once very proud of that generation of the Scotland rugby team, now I wouldn’t piss on them if they were on fire)
Never to be trusted.
Now and again I listen to his “show????” on the wireless.
It is Shit, He is Shit and the EBC will always be Shit.
What exactly is a Wullie Rennie??
I think a key bit in the interview is around the 2 minute mark where O’Neill states ‘that many of the new organisations are going to have to change, …if they are smart if they are going to be the verifiers’.
That is literally a smack in the face to all the main media outlets at the moment, ranging from the BBC, STV, the Newspapers and even the political journalists that we see on our TV’s each night. Right now, I can think of a couple of our female newsreaders who would be hissing and spitting blood at the thought of being ‘impartial’ towards the SNP.
There are two points here then.
First, many of the journalists now need to stop just attacking the SNP, or anyone supporting the idea of independence. Half of Scotland wishes independence whether these news outlets like it or not. Continual deriding of half the nation does them absolutely no favours. We have seen it too many times now, when we have a nationalist involved in a debate, and it’s a case of ‘attack, attack, attack’ from the other three candidates along with the host-presenter.
Secondly, and more importantly, when news items are being discussed, or once again, if there is a debate on it, the coverage needs to be balanced and should be placing the factors that are being discussed into context. It doesn’t help these outlets to only be telling half a story, or just one side of a story.
As a recent example, the fiasco over the structural damage of the Forth Road Bridge, damaged not only the Labour, Liberal and Tory MSP’s because they fed off what the media reported, but due to the misinformation that was rolled out daily by the media itself, it left everyone who had accused the SNP of financial and incompetent decision-making left looking like laughing stocks and complete dithering idiots when it turned out that the SNP had done nothing of the sort. Worse still was the bridge opening up two weeks earlier than planned which left the SNP opponents not only reeling in shock, but left absolutely speechless.
The media caused this because it did not do the required journalistic integral reporting, and thus place things in their proper context for evaluation, and therefore, left those that the papers usually side with, looking like incompetent fools that are completely out of their depth!.
What is shocking though, is that not one of the opposing parties stood up and point out that it was not the time for bickering, nor accusations, and that the focus should be for all parties to get behind each other so that the economy of Central Scotland can be protected. This they all failed on …as was their presentation of the facts.
Robert Peffers
I agree. The Yes campaign was an astonishing phenomenon and there has been nothing like it anywhere in these islands.
But without that other astonishing phenomenon, the modern electronic media, it would not have come anywhere near 45%, and Wings was the standard bearer, as it still is.
All power to your elbow Mr Campbell.
Thanks for everything and may 2016 bring you and all Wingers what we all wish for.
The 15 mins of media review with these two guys is the only time in the week where the Pathetic Quay windows demist and they can actually see outside. An oasis in the desert…until McQuarrie scrambles out his office and pulls the blinds down again.
They know balance, they know integrity – but choose never to apply it in their news coverage
JB will get his knuckles rapped for this and I cant see a repeat. The beeb is too establishment and the people who work there subservient to disagree with policy so it will be status quo in 2016.
All the best to wos team and all wingers and lets see Labour, toalies & the lieb Dems even further decimated next year in May.
For the first time – a serious BBC discussion about the alternative political and news media. I never understood why Yes and the SNP were so ready to dismiss “Wings Over Scotland” during the Referendum campaign. From the very earliest, it seemed to me that “Wings” would deserve the credit for a large proportion of the Yes vote. As others have said, the dam is breaking, the establishment propaganda is being rumbled and there is real optimism at the start of a new year.
O/T
I put this on the end of the last thread but not sure anyone will see it.
Tam Jardine/YesIndyref2
Where did you find download links on the National Archives site? I’ve gone through PREM/19/1922 pages & can’t find download options any anywhere. All I get is an image file viewer but even looking at individual pages on full screen they still aren’t that easy to read particularly the handwritten notes on some of the pages.
YesIndyref2-re OCR If you have updated to Acrobat Reader 11 on your pc, you can copy text out of a .pdf document into a Word document which is why I wanted the download files. You can also use AR11 to highlight sections of text in the .pdf -a very useful function for me.
We better make sure the “investment opportunity” in the new Scottish media isn’t corrupted. The interview talks about why sites like Wings, Bella etc exist; we feel they are necessary as the corporate media is failing in what should be its purpose. Lets not let sites like these exist just to make money.
I suppose thats why I still don’t quite trust the National. It feels to me like a bit of a money spinner. There are good articles appearing in it for sure, but I’m not sold on the paper as a whole. Perhaps I’ve set my standards too high by reading Wings, Bella, Scot Goes Pop, AAV etc. for years!
@ Lollysmum it’#s a series of clicks
You need to add the item to your basket. Then click the drop down list at the top right hand bar which says “sign in, register, 1 item”. Click View Basket, and then click on the checkout link. If you aren’t already registered you will be asked to register i.e. supply an email address and password. Then click the Submit Order link. Click on Download to get to the page with Download Now. Then you have a page with two Download buttons. One is the larger document the other is the smaller annex.
link to discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Happy New Year folks.
Things can only get better?
…The BBC is still very much in the game, and it does a lot of things right, but it also got some things wrong…’
I beg to differ!
The BBC reports what it …wants to report, and in doing so, it leads one to ask, who is it doing this reporting for?
Being the main News outlet for the entire British state, BBC Journalists should be questioning our politicians not only harder, but more directly, over matters that affect everyone in the UK. As an example, the way that the BBC reported how Westminster voted for the bombing of Syria, was not only wrong, but it treated the people of the UK with contempt. To portray it as though Britain was doing a good thing here without looking at factors and context, was like something out of Orwell’s novel, 1984.
In its proper context, the first BBC journalist that got a hold of Cameron should have questioned him severely on not only what Britain intends to do after the bombing campaign against IS, but what was Britain’s intentions towards the Assad regime going to be afterwards? Would there also be feet on the ground since air strikes do diddly-squat in creating regime-change? (the bombing of Britain in WW2 proved that theory. Without the army, the Luftwaffe bombed Britain silly with no sign of revolt, weariness through attrition, let alone surrender. Wars are won through battle; nothing else). And what of Syria itself? How was it to be rebuilt? What is the future of the Middle East?
No BBC journalist asked any of these questions. It was literally a ‘joyful punch of the air and look at how Britain is dealing with the IS terrorists’. Yet, most people in the country were quietly asking themselves what it really meant …and no journalist asked the questions, nor provided the answers. They may believe that they are delivering news, but it is news that can be viewed as bland, as it only tells of what has just happened; not what it truly means, nor the context of what is being presented to the people.
Yes, an unusually grown-up conversation for Radio Scotland. But as invariably happens when the state broadcaster hosts a discussion on the subject of the media, it is careful to utilise the opportunity to propagandise on its own behalf – in Beattie’s rather odd rendition: ‘more people consider the BBC an accurate and newsworthy source of TV than any other’.
Even by the BBC’s own figures (and, as we know, the body that analyses and sits in judgement on the BBC, routinely blocking FOI requests about how it operates, is, er, the BBC) people in Scotland no longer trust the state broadcaster – only a minority of the population now believe it accurately depicts Scottish reality. Stuart Cosgrove chose the Daily Mail as an example of a media organisation that is ‘partisan on behalf of the institutions of the state’, which is true but also a perfect description of the state broadcaster. The independence referendum exposed the state broadcaster like never before for what it is: a propaganda organisation. A large section of the population of this country will never trust it again.
And that, as well as the trends knowledgably explored in the discussion, is why for the state broadcaster the future will be characterised by continuing decline.
Interesting. Where is the new money they hint at, Bezos-style, likely to come from?
“First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, and then you win” ??
HNY all, from the oasis that is Leela Palace, Mumbai.
Robert Peffers
…isn’t English History wonderful?
Robert …first …brilliant post! Really enjoyed reading it, especially about the variations on the National Anthem.
However, that one line left me wondering. For me, this isn’t English history …but should be deemed as ‘British!’ ….…isn’t British History wonderful?
English history is a helluva fascinating if we look at it before the Act of Union. The Plantagenet’s, Henry V, occupation of France, War of the Roses, The Tudors, The War of the Three Kingdoms, etc. Hell …even the wars with Scotland!
The history of England moving through time from late medieval and into the ‘modern’ age is actually, as I’m sure you would agree, gripping stuff.
What I believe angers us all here, and as you point out in your post, is the fact that we rail against what is the perception of British History! I don’t blame England for creating the ‘Britain of today’, nor do I blame them for the British History that is rammed down our throats as gospel. I blame all of that that on the ‘British’ Establishment who promoted such ideals of what Britishness truly meant. It was a form of control; designed to keep the masses not only in their place, but the Establishment at the pinnacle of society. Modern day feudalism.
As said though …still a brilliant post!
Well done Rev. Fame (or is it infamy) at last. Keep uo the good work
Robert Peffers
Interesting article regarding GStQ (can’t even bring myself to writing that crap !!) but one wee inaccuracy ….”Marching upon London and a Hymn that originally contained as the fifth verse in 1945″ …… think that should be 1745.
I’m surprised that this discussion was allowed to slip through the net – are the bad guys responsible for bias and SNPbad all on holiday?
I hope that this doesn’t mean that JB gets posted to join Izzy Fraser at the BBC equivalent of Limoges.
What they’ve missed, and me too until just now, is that radio and the telly take too long. That was 13 minutes, it could have been read in less than 5 so there is a much denser content in these written blogs. The main problem will be finding the content that suits your prejudices.
However Wings and wingers will do for me and I’ll wish you all the best for 2016 as I’ll be off air till then. 🙂
The reason I trust WOS over the newspapers is that they always provide links to who said what, when and where. How come I never hear this aspect mentioned in discussions on the rise of the internet at the expense of print? For me, and I know for many other people, it’s the primary reason. I always point this out to people who’ve been given the impression that the whole on-line thing is just a Nat. rant-fest.
HNY,
FTBBC.
On my last post…
I believe that what I am trying to say is that English History should be treated differently from British History, just as we do with Scottish History against British History. I think we are looking at three different historical aspects here; English, Scottish and British.
Sure, it can be pointed out that British History is an extension of ‘Greater English History’, but is it really?
In many aspects, both Ireland and Scotland had a major impact on British History, and therefore, this nullifies the argument that it is English History in greater format. After all, the ‘English Civil War’ is now perceived to be wrong terminology used for the Civil War that erupted throughout the entire Islands. As said in my previous post, it is now known as the ‘War of the Three Kingdoms’. I think we need to do the same with British History, and not take it as purely a greater English history.
Capella
Thanks for the detailed answer. I have the downloads now.
Cheers m’dear very kind of you.
Woohoo-so much easier to read on a 22inch screen instead of a laptop 🙂
Going to enjoy myself in the next few days picking out some juicy quotes to use online
Could be a new meme: the media the media doesn’t like to talk about.
I would not be too optimistic. At various times recently I think (maybe I hope) that I can see a semblance of reason, a chink of light peeping through and some common sense will prevail. But, no, no sooner do I think that and the door slams shut, the wagons resume their circle, the draw bridge is hauled up – and any one of many alternative metaphors gets employed, and the SNPBaaad meme resumes.
To be realistic, though not sympathetic, this may be a generational problem. For far too long there has been, documented elsewhere, a revolving door between media, especially the BBC, and politics. Maybe part of the SNPBaaad bleating is because some see that particular gravy train hitting the buffers. It would have hit the buffers anyway, but the new media, especially Rev dot Stu and the list down the right are, hopefully – hopefully – please, making it happen somewhat sooner. Good.
Many thanks to WoS and contributors for helping me maintain sanity during 2015. Keep up the good work and enjoy 2016 when it turn up, as it probably will.
Great to hear this discussed on the BBC but being a cynical old bastard I get concerned when I hear the phrases scattered through the discussion like, “write a cheque” and “gather up a lot of the people in the alternative media”, “scoop it up”, “an investment winner for someone”. Using the “Huffington Post business model and monetizing it with google adds”. Sorry but bollocks to that.
Get the right person with the right reason and more journalistic truth might reach more of the Scottish public.
Get the wrong person and it may end up gagging and twisting the message. We already have enough “single owner” newspapers. Beware of Greeks bearing gifts.
I like the idea of giving the talent in the alternative media an outlet to gather their stories together in one place. It should be in parallel with Wings etc though and not at the expense of shutting them down.
As far as financing I have far greater faith in this being provided by crowdfunding than a single source cheque writer. If someone with a pot of money truly wants to help, as opposed to control, they can contribute a stash to the crowdfunding.
Very nice listen, thanks for putting it up, Rev Stu.
I’m thinking of this from the media angle, not so much from the Scottish independence struggle angle. It’s nice to hear questioning of the old main stream media model on BBC airwaves.
Very insightful comments from the two guests as to the way the Internet and all its various platforms have sort of stolen one on the traditional MSM and the MSM is playing catch up, if they want to survive.
Very accurate about there being a vast hunger for alternative current affairs content, as opposed to state propaganda among “serious-minded” people (who can still have a sense of humour, BTW). WoS is unashamedly partisan and open about it. WoS trusts the readers to make up their own minds, unlike much of the MSM, who hide their affiliations and pretend “impartiality”.
Eamonn O’Neill was actually amusingly careful not to mention WoS or others by name but Stuart Gosgrove wasn’t that shy. 😀 I suspect Stuart Gosgrove reads WoS regularly. *waves* Hi, Stuart!
The fact is that WoS is important and influential, it’s about time it gets properly and seriously acknowledged in the MSM, instead of sticking fingers in ears and going “la-la-la, cybernat, la-la-la!”
Now, the question is: what will you, Rev Stu, do when that corporate guy comes waving his fat cheque book to buy out your very successful Internet presence? (As predicted by Eamonn O’Neill.) Aah, decisions, decisions… I trust the answer is no, with maybe a suggestion where to shove that cheque book. 😀
The Thursday John Beattie programme’s Media review is usually very good. Stuart Cosgrove and Eamonn MacNeil are pretty “on the ball” when it comes to media. So much so, that I worry they will be shunted off into outer darkness as has happened to so many others.
Ken MacDonald, Isobel Fraser, Derek Bateman and Ricky Ross have all suffered from the cold shoulder of Plantation Quay. If Stuart Cosgrove an Eamonn O’Neill are going to join them then I hope this “white knight” steps up soon to fund a genuine Scottish broadcaster.
We have plenty to discuss after all!
I began my essay blog because my wife asked me to stop shouting at the TV screen, and at right-wing friends and acquaintances who kept mouthing clichés and slogans. At first it was only for my own benefit, to test the strength of my argument.Praise soon pushed them out into the open.
I knew those preaching to us were lying, and lying through their yellowed teeth, and that any debate on regaining independence would be skewed by the BBC, and the morally bankrupt red tops.
But I don’t see essays as unfettered free speech. Writing essays that could in effect be published elsewhere as columns, or published in compendium form, means keeping an eye on satire and lampooning to avoid straying into libel.
I chose the essay form because blogs tend in the main to be a daily diary with some opinion, often haphazard in theme. Essays allow you to develop ideas and include research. To the reader long-form essays give the best evidence of whether a writer can actually write, and has something to say that’s worth reading and assimilating and passing on.
To produce more than one or two a week I’d have to become a keyboard monk, and lose contact with the outside world, the very stuff of good essays.
In any event, a single voice soon becomes predicable. When social sites take over as the newspaper of the day they’ll employ many voices and researchers all enriching content.
Anyhow, that was a good BBC Radio broadcast on the subject but … are Cosgrove and O’Neill, articulate as they are, the only two people in the whole of Scotland equipped to speak on the subject?
Why not invite the sites they discussed to contribute? Closed shop time again? Speakers chosen by Rolodex?
That said –
I hope friends here have a healthy and productive 2016. I am still full of hope. If I had none I’d be in a gite in the South of France moaning how much Scotland is a small, backward country unable to punch its way … blah, blah, blah.
Aye, interesting conversation right enough. I don’t accept that the BBC gets things right. They don’t. Totally and utterly biased and compromised as far as I’m concerned.
Looks as though we really have the buggers worried. Well done folks, keep it up.
To Rev Stu, who works so hard to keep all of us informed and up to speed, well done, and thank you. Enjoy your new man chair.
To all of the rest of you wingers, thanks for the fun, the information, and, the sense of a real community, Aye, arguments an awe.
A guid New Year tae a’ o’ ye when it comes. See you next year.
Slange.
Good stuff!
I’ll be raising a glass at the bells to you Stu and all the Alert Readers – bring on 2016!
@ Lollysmum
Welks! and Happy New Year’s reading to you.
We have Tam Jardine to thank for the original revelation. And many hours of broadcasting far and wide to come in 2016 – Year of Revelations I hope!
And since nibbles preparation now calls and I might forget, Happy New Year to everyone when it comes and especially to Rev Stu “the Revelator” in chief.
Nuggets O’Pish
Spot on there. That’s the reason I use Wings. Its one of the few places where every statement is backed up by a link for us to follow & check for ourselves.
I came here when looking for news of the 2014 Commonwealth Games & the Referendum because they weren’t really covered at all in SE England news. I knew that couldn’t be right but I also knew (thanks to working in London) just how prone BBC/MSM et al were to covering things up that they didn’t want the plebs to know.
I’ve been here every single day since & can’t imagine that’s likely to change any time soon.
We can’t see any Scottish broadcast output in my area but I can get it online with no problem or via digital radio.
Gave up my TV licence in disgust at the poor & very biased output & have not regretted that decision once. My licence fee now goes to Wings, WGD & IndyLive- I wouldn’t have it any other way 🙂
Good listen Rev. Some very good points made, although the Established media will never change.They are incapable of change, like the Empire they protect, they will slowly wither and the new green shoots will thrive and replace them.
All the best to all my fellow wingers, for 2016. Onwards and upwards. 🙂
A happy and prosperous new year to all wingers
A Happy New Year to all wingers & lurkers & of course Rev Stu. I’ll be raising a toast to you all at midnight. Wish I was in Scotland to celebrate it as it should be celebrated.
Enjoy yourselves 🙂
I’ve always had a lot of time for John Beattie, well he’s an ex rugby player, so that at an advantage for a start eh, I remember one of his “phone -in’s”, where he said to the listeners, and to the people waiting to phone in to put thier point, he told them NOT to make it political, well of course quite a number did try, but John stood no nonsense and cut them short, before any of them could start to develope thier point.
Yes, you could tell that most, if not all who tried to put a political point forward, were complaining about the S.N.P., but John was not defending the S.N.P., rather he was defending his own stance of neutrality, regarding this radio programme anyway, contrast that to “Call Kay”, Christ !, you can’t get her to shut up, to give someone else airtime, (don’t listen to her anymore ).
I’m surprised at the lack of awareness on here of John Beattie’s show, every Thursday ‘Media Watch’ with Stuart Cosgrove and Eamonn O’Neill, it’s been on for the last year atleast and it’s easily the best News and current affairs programme on Radio.
It’s the highlight of my News week listening to them. Both are incredibly analytical, competent, incisive yet warm and not without humour.
And John Beattie, IMO, has grown into an excellent, impartial and honest host and his programme on a daily basis is worth listening to.
Everyone should tune in from 12:30 every Thursday after FMQs. It’s a great programme. And you don’t need to pay a licence fee 🙂
Well well well!
Who’d have thunk it? 😉
Wings over Scotland gets a … sort of … good review sort thingy on a BBC Radio Scotland programme thingy. Well done Stu … it does appear after all that you may have been doing something right after all! 🙂
I guess we can all look forward to 2016 with a newly re-invigorated step in the sure and certain knowledge that, after such a glowing praise from this Radio Scotland thingy, we can expect to see oor Stu making regular appearances on BBC Scotland 2016. 😀
Oh in case I fail to turn up again before the bells can I wish everyone on here, particularly yon Stu fella 😉 , a very happy new year. 🙂
Bring on 2016 WE are marching ever closer to OUR ultimate goal! 😀
Best wishes to you all for 2016.
Well done for all your work this year Rev. I believe your diligence and integrity has much of the establishment media on the run and is the reason Wings is so widely read.
Well done also to all contributors. You’re a bright lot.
Keep up the guid work. We’re winning.
happy new Year to rev Stu, his collaborators and all Wingers I meet on here
link to eurofree3.wordpress.com
The most telling thing that I took was the ref to Columbia and he wanted to find the actual facts from the ground through social media rather than the BBC view.
I managed 6 mins 35 secs before I got fed up, and that’s because I was reading postings with Impractival Jokers in the background.
Which is of course the problem, short, sometimes very short, attention spans.
Putting money in to get together good hourmalists? I do wonder about Hunter, he has the money, he pretended to be neutral in the Ref, he set up a website with mostly unionist “experts”, but if he could persuade himself to be truly neutral, his sort of money and contacts with access to money could do it.
Stuart Cosgrove has actually posted on this site.
uno mass, to verify your assertion, in the Wings manner: Link?
(jist nosy, what’d he write? when? 🙂 )
Rev’s posted on Twitter:
‘With a few hours left, Wings pageviews in 2015 are at 58,966,440. That’s 5.4m up on 2014, amazingly. You’re the best, folks.’ (that was @ 2hrs ago)
He’s now away oot so we may not hear from him before the bells but here’s a Happy New Year to Stuey, the remaining wee separats and Wingers one and all. Here’s hoping for all the best in 2016 and our dreams and hopes come true.
See you all in 2016. 🙂
See thon media? We like it 😀
I do want to wish Stu. and all Wingers “all the best” when it comes. My glass will be raised to all…:D
*To 2016*
On another happy note to end the year –
“LabourList readers are clearly prepared for a tough year for Scottish Labour. More than two-thirds said they felt concerned about the party’s chances at the Scottish Parliament elections in May, with 38% saying they were “very negative”, and a further 31% saying they were “quite negative”.
But one in four people who took part in the survey are upbeat about the Labour’s prospects in Scotland: 21% are “quite positive” about the outlook for May, while 4% are “very positive”
Happy Hogmanay,Terry Kelly, Ian Smart and Kezia!
it’s like the fuckin’ waltons in here the night….
to all wingers
Lang may yer lum reek!
Wi’ ither folks coal!
Bliadhna mhath ùr!
I’ll keek in again after the bells so a guid new year all who read and post on WoS. Here’s to absent friends too!
Bring it on… 2016. 🙂
Hear from you on the other side.
wow, the rev just tweeted 2015 stats
just under 59 million views, up 5,4 million on 2014!!!
beaten by 2 million page views, just, by the spectator….ooofff
Och, Happy New Year schrodingers-sue, and to all the other mary-bobs and john-girl Wingers 🙂
A happy new year tae one and all, yes and no voters alike, but especially to our new Scots fleeing from wars and finding shelter on these shores. Know that ye are among friends.
Let 2016 be the first year when the yes movement is in the majority. In 2015 we went from around 48% to 50%.
Onwards to independence — and nae looking back!
schrodingers cat says:
31 December, 2015 at 8:31 pm
wow, the rev just tweeted 2015 stats
just under 59 million views, up 5,4 million on 2014!!!
beaten by 2 million page views, just, by the spectator….ooofff
What’s the problem Schrodinger … I mean we STILL have three and half hours to go I’m sure we can get over 2 million page views in that time. 😀
Well, another year gone bye…..still enduring the misery of Westminster rule. Another year of Scotland’
s wealth draining south. Another year of fear over hope. Still, come May we can hammer another nail in the unionist coffin.
SNP x 2
To all on Wings, have a Happy New Year.
Re. Labourlist gloom over elections: sorry, I forgot the link …
link to labourlist.org
Onwards folks, every damn one of you.
Large dram raised, nods to Bath.
More of the same in 2016. We’ve an election to win.
So the alternative media does not always get it’s facts right, I think it is a shining light in comparison to the BBC etc.
I may have missed it but was the question put about why people are turning to Wings etc? or does the BBC think that simply polluting Twitter etc with it’s stink is a winning formula?
All I heard was the BUMS need to get into this digital age melarky
Wishing you all, Stu, Chris, visitors, the many amazing people who post on here, Alex, Nicola and our fantastic SNP politicians all the best for great health, wealth, peace and happiness in 2016 x
Let’s all, from near and far, raise our glasses at the Bells and make a toast together for a brighter future for all who will be living in an Independent Scotland, sooner than later.
”You wrapped her up in iron chains
You thought you’d tied her up
You placed a ball around her feet
Thought you’d tame her like a pup
Your winter winds so dry, aye
You stripped her back so bare
And then u looked her in the eye
And said “it’s only fair”
Now is it any wonder why
We treat you like we do
You strut about your mansions like
You didnae have a clue
But you know who your are, Aye
And you know what you’ve done
So don’t act so innocent
When we rise and end your fun
What will you do when the drought comes forth
And you cannae bleed the north
What will you do when your lakes dry up
Will you turn and beg your pup
What will you do when your houses freeze
With nay oil in your seas
Aye will you turn in blind ignorance
And beg forgiveness please
So maybe now you realise
Just how you treated her
Cause now she’s mighty and she’s strong
It’s too late to right your wrongs
But maybe in the future, Aye
She’ll free you from your shame
And then you’ll look in awe of her
Aye, Scotland is her name
Cause then you’ll look in awe of her
Aye, Scotland is her name.’
link to youtube.com
You would think somebody attempting to burn down oor wee parly might make more news. Makes one wonder what the motive was;
link to bbc.co.uk
I feel humbled to be in the presence of so many wonderful contributors to this website and to know that my own contributions have been shared by so many. Thank you Stuart and your support team it has given me so much hope that our cause will be successful. As we now know there is only one direction for Independence and it is only a matter of when not if.
No doubt many of you will have noticed a change in the MSM and BBC,as I have, in the last week of the year. More critical of the Establishment and even reporting the “Juicy target ” story. Briefly on the BBC website in case you missed it.
Well done to all of you and in particular to Wings over Scotland, you and we are changing our World.
May next year be a giant leap forward to Independence. Happy new year to all when it comes.
Easy folks. It’s only one broadcast. They still want to dominate us and haven’t changed their goal.
However, a wee bit of recognition is cool, but don’t let it go to your head. We still have a fight on our hands.
Sorry if I’m taking the shine off the celebrations.
Petra – Thanks for that link to ‘Scotland was her name’ by Albanach. It was absolutely moving and lovely. Never heard it before. Real tear in the eye stuff. Superb.
The figures for page views on this site are truly incredible, but absolutely understandable.
Wings has become a major factor in my daily life because of the contributors, the Rev, and the depth of knowledge that exists within the commentariat.
It has replaced both paper and broadcast media as my choice of political viewpoint.
Tonight, I will, just after midnight raise a glass of fine malt and dedicate a silent toast to my fellow wingers who have ignited my pride in being one of them.
We fight for a better Scotland my friends.
We’ll said Kenny @ 8:33. It’s been a gud year, let’s make 2016 even better. Cheers Rev.
My tribute to the Unionists, Labour in Scotland and the Media.
Come May, GIRUTFLOY:
link to youtube.com
Have a kool New Year when it comes everybody.
It’s coming for a’ that.
Kennedy says:
31 December, 2015 at 8:54 pm
Easy folks. It’s only one broadcast. They still want to dominate us and haven’t changed their goal.
Your right, of course, we should not get carried away with only 59 million views versus 3 unionist MPs!!! Aye Right!!!
@Petra
That’s a great up to date version of Burns Caledonia – a Ballad:
There was once a time, but old Time was then young,
That brave Caledonia, the chief of her line,
From some of your northern deities sprung,
(Who knows not that brave Caledonia’s divine ?)
From Tweed to the Orcades was her domain,
To hunt, or to pasture, or do what she would :
Her heav’nly relations there fixèd her reign,
And pledg’d her their godheads to warrant it good.
A lambkin in peace, but a lion in war,
The pride of her kindred, the heroine grew :
Her grandsire, old Odin, triumphantly swore,-
‘Whoe’er shall provoke thee, th’ encounter shall rue !’
With tillage or pasture at times she would sport,;
To feed her fair flocks by her green rustling corn
But chiefly the woods were her fav’rite resort,
Her darling amusement, the hounds and the horn.
Long quiet she reigned; till thitherward steers
A flight of bold eagles from Adria’s strand :
Repeated, successive, for many long years,
They darken’d the air, and they plunder’d the land :
Their pounces were murder, and terror their cry,
They’d conquer’d and ruin’d a world beside;
She took to her hills, and her arrows let fly,
The daring invaders, they fled or they died.
The Cameleon-Savage disturb’d her repose,
With tumult, disquiet, rebellion, and strife;
Provok’d beyond bearing, at last she arose,
And robb’d him at once of his hopes and his life :
The Anglian lion, the terror of France,
Oft prowling, ensanguin’d the Tweed’s silver flood;
But, taught by the bright Caledonian lance,
He learnèd to fear in his own native wood.
The fell Harpy-raven took wing from the north,
The scourge of the seas, and the dread of the shore;
The wild Scandinavian boar issued forth
To wanton in carnage and wallow in gore :
O’er countries and kingdoms their fury prevail’d,
No arts could appease them, no arms could repel;
But brave Caledonia in vain they assail’d,
As Largs well can witness, and Loncartie tell.
Thus bold, independent, unconquer’d, and free,
Her bright course of glory for ever shall run :
For brave Caledonia immortal must be;
I’ll prove it from Euclid as clear as the sun :
Rectangle-triangle, the figure we’ll chuse :
The upright is Chance, and old Time is the base;
But brave Caledonia’s the hypothenuse;
Then, ergo, she’ll match them, and match them always.
It’s been one fantastic year.
The unionists have thrown everything at us, the kitchen sink and even the wee plastic plug that stops the water, and we have taken it on the chin, and are STILL STANDING.
One day the unionists will cease to be delusional and will come to realise the only vision for Scotland is Independence.
Me and the wife are technically orphans, so we would like to hold out our hands and wish our extended family (that’s you lot), a very Happy New Year.
Even the trolls who frequent Wings, Happy New Year to you also.
It is only a matter of time before we reach our Utopia.
We might let you in (only of you promise to behave yourselves, and accept you were wrong.)
All the best to you and yours !
Iain Martin will be wearing garlic when listening to that. 🙂
Happy New Year to you all.
EBC: beware of Greeks bearing gifts. EBC is WOLF in sheeps clothing, their job is to protect & defend the state at ALL or ANY cost no limits no rules.
Thanks to stu and all wingers happy new year.
Tae the uni whingers, NAE LUCK.
I just thought to see if that was on youtube and it is, sung by James Malcolm
link to youtube.com
I’m more into dance I’m afraid, but this is good.
John Beattie was a Scottish hero on the rugby field. And he’s one at Pathetic Quay.
If you cut through Eamonn O’Neill’s waffle, all he is saying is that in the future journalists will be expected to factcheck. And no doubt dairy cows will be expected to produce milk.
As for his ‘prediction’ about someone trying to buy up the alternative media for financial gain, it was fun listening to him go into an uncomfortable ‘more waffle’ mode as soon as JB asked for specifics.
Personally, I cant wait to go to the shop for my copy of “Wings Over Bella’s Ginger Dug”.
I am amazed that so many contributors here don’t seem to have known about this review of the week’s news on Radio Scotland, which has been going on for ages each Thursday with Stuart Cosgrove, Eamon O’Neil and John Beattie.
In spite of what many here suggest, there is nothing new about the excellence of what they do – they aye have a bloody good no-holds-barred discussion which is incisive knowledgeable and sharp. I look furrit tae it every week. It is very much a three cornered conversation – John Beattie has a really positive part to play in getting the best out of these two really smart clued up guys. They work as a team.
@JLT says: 31 December, 2015 at 6:42 pm:
“However, that one line left me wondering. For me, this isn’t English history …but should be deemed as ‘British!’ ….…isn’t British History wonderful?”
Ah! Yes! Actually that was the main point. What is projected as English History is mainly NOT English History. Seems both irony and sarcasm don’t come across too well on the internet.
It is indeed properly British History.
When David Cameron claims he is, “Prime Minister of Britain”, he is actually telling lies.
He is in fact, “Her Majesty’s Prime Minister”, of, “Her Majesty’s Government of her United Kingdom”. Yet Cameron often speaks of, “His Government”.
He also makes claims of, for example, “Sending in British Troops”. They are Her Majesty’s Troops. In fact The Royal Navy, The Royal Air Force and The Soldiers of the Queen. They are no more, nor no less, British than those of The Republic Of Ireland.
The truth being that legally, in the three country Kingdom of England, Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth is sovereign but not legally so in Scotland. We, the people of Scotland, are legally sovereign in Scotland. This is the kind of lies that English History has spun as British History since ever there was an England.
There has never, since history was recorded, has there ever been a unified Britain. Roman Britain was never all of Britain and no one else has ever unified it all. Yet England has always claimed all Britain.
Just as an example of how English History has been spun. What of the claims of, “The Union of the Crowns”, (1603), that never was?
It was two independent Crowns on the same person’s head. Yet when the English Parliament had its, “Glorious Revolution”, of 1688 and deposed the King of England they assumed to have also deposed the King of a still independent Scotland.
Which is why they still refer to, “The Jacobite Rebellion”, but Scots could not rebel against a monarchy not their own. It was Jacobite Uprisings and they were still killing Scots at Culloden, in 1745, almost 40 years after the forced Treaty of Union of 1706/7.
Note also the Edinburgh-Northampton Treaty of 1328, and the never mentioned battles such as that of, “Old Bylands”, (go Goggle it).
Britain is composed of eight countries of which only four are governed by the United Kingdom Parliament but the three Crown Protectorates are part of Her Majesty’s United Kingdom, (her realm), but not part of her UK Government. Then there is also the Republic of Ireland that is part of Britain but not either part of the United Kingdom Government nor Her Majesty’s realm.
Spin, lies and omissions are what passes as British History and a great proportion of the people of Britain are confused as to what is England and what is Britain.
Tucked away on the ‘world’ middle East link of the BBC.
Saw it when I was reading about the hotel fire in Dubai.
link to bbc.co.uk
Happy new year 2016 everybody!
(I,m 2 hrs ahead of you all and already in 2016!)
Posted this on the quiz article, but probably better suited to this comment section…
“So…speaking to a friend tonight and we get on to the subject of how rotten the Scottish MSM is,
I ask her if she’d heard that the Scotsman newspaper had started allowing scammers to advertise in their paper.
She hadn’t of course (she isn’t all that ‘informed’) but she was shocked and said they surely can’t do that!
Well I continue you would hope they wouldn’t but they have lost so many readers over the past few years, they have become desperate.
I then ask her if she knew that if you pay the Scotsman they will allow you to spout almost anything (especially if it’s SNPBad)
Eh??? you have to pay them to write an article! aren’t they supposed to pay you?..she replies.
Well, of course, I say, that’s what newspapers used to do, but that filthy anti-Scottish rag is so short of money, they will print almost anything you want as long as you pay them…of course the article can’t be pro Scottish or anti -British, but anything attacking Scots who want self determination will definitely get published.
wow she says…that’s disgusting!
yep…they certainly are…
I know people from that filthy rag read Wings,
Yet another person has found out the truth about the garbage that you print every day..
Won’t be long now, tick tock.”
Noo chaps an fella cairters,dinna get ower fu.
Ye ken ye wull hae a muckle sair heid if ye dae.
Mind ye, if ye dinna get ower fu, ye wull hae mair room fir mair drink the morn.
Hae a guid ain.
Hi Stu and all here at Wings. Hope you all have a successful, productive and most importantly, a happy 2016.
You guys are the best.
BTW:
Another thing that became apparent during 2015 was a greatly increased number of contributions from the lassies.
Here’s tae the lassies! Both those here on wings and the wonderful contributions from the elected ones at Holyrood & Westminster. Scotland owes you a great debt.
clochoderic says:
31 December, 2015 at 8:37 pm
Re. Labourlist gloom over elections: sorry, I forgot the link …
link to labourlist.org
One of the comments…..
“sammy gravano • 5 hours ago
This whole ‘The 45%’ business of the porridge w0gs makes me laugh.
All we heard before the vote was,
‘the sovrinn wull o thu sco-ish peepul’.
When said ‘sovrinn wull’ didn’t suit the Nats, suddenly ‘The 45%’ felt they should prevail.
It’s a comedy show, fuelled by ‘wreck the hoose juice'”
Porridge Wogs is a new one on me but great to see how the socialist comrades view their brothers.
SNP x 2 come May.
Loved ever second this year Rev, all the best for you and yours in 2016, and to all wingers new and old I wish you every happiness and joy.
Happy New Year Everyone X
@ Robert Peffers
‘dinna get ower fu’
Perish the thought. 😀
Charge your glass Robert, an awe the best.
Near forgot in my earlier post.
Lurkers lurk no more. Make 2016 the year you talk to folk and know that we’re here tae help. 🙂
A good new year.
Ha! Ha! just tuned into Hamish and Dougal and James Naughtie Hogmanay Special Radio 4 extra DAB. He’ll have had his tea. 🙂
Not long to go now!
A guid New Year to all Wingers, lurkers and posters alike.
Lookin’ furit tae a braw 2016. It’s onward and upward to May. I suspect mostly uphill against the media.
I’ll be a rough ride and we’ll need to hold steady through the storm. We’re getting quite practiced at it now though.
Slainte.
Not long in from the Indycamp, Have a Guid Hogmanay Everybody.
A happy New Year to you all
May 2016 bring us as much good cheer as 2015
Happy New Year Folks.
Stephen Roney.
New years resolution vote SNP twice in May 2016, Happy New Year to all.
Slainte
Happy New Year to you all let’s work harder this year our dream is in sight.
Happy New Year Rev Stu and all Wingers. Onwards and upwards in 2016. 🙂
Happy new year to you all!
Happy 2016 to all at Wings
Happy New Year y’all!
Must admit to first-footing my own house this year (out the back door before the bells, in the front after), haven’t done that for a few. Time to take charge of our own destiny 🙂
Happy new year, one and all.
Happy New Year Wingers. The only sane people on the planet.
I also wish for world peace , climate control and-abolition of all cruelty particularly to furry and cuddly human beings.
Quietly and outwith the control of our cult leader just vote SNP x2
Haud one pal,how can a cult leader have followers doing something behind their backs?
OMG I do not belong to a cult at all at all just a crowd of sensible folks who see an independent Scotland as a logical and moral imperative.
All bestest tae a’body (except ‘Sir’ Danny and Foulkes – youse can just FRO.)
Slainte!
🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂
Happy new year, looking forward to a good one for all wingers!
Happy New Year Stu and all our wingers..
Big 4 months coming up.. let’s wipe them oot…
Happy New Year to all Wingers-
let’s reach ramming speed in 2016
@Tam Jardine –
*’ramming speed!’*
Soo-perb.
You can be Heston, and I bags the wee dude who gives it proper prize-winning ‘die’ at 1.57.
link to youtube.com
Happy New Year to Wingers one and all…here we go, here we go, here we go…let’s wipe them oot in May folks! 🙂
I turned of the BBC ’90 minute patriot’ guff after about 5 minutes… STV was much better despite it being all women (I’m a dude, but have much more respect for Elaine C Smith and our First Minister than the Burd on the BBC)
I know, I should get out more.
Happy new year Wingers and Wings.
…one more year closer to Indy. ?
For all you folks who don’t have a television license just to let you know that we’ve all (around 30) just watched the WORST TV programme of our lives …… Elaine C Smith bringing in the New Year on STV. It was totally cringeworthy. She was cringeworthy. Beyond belief in fact. WAY BEYOND. No music, groups, dancing or firework displays etc, etc. To make matters worse the only guests (other than one individual talking tommy-rot) were Nicola, her sister and mother who of course didn’t let themselves down but by God STV have let them down VERY badly indeed. What are they playing at? SO, SO annoyed about this I had to let you all know.
Anyway we all support Independence here so raised our glasses, and the roof, to that effect.
The music (and stomping) is calling me. Husband too! One of my nieces has been taken into hospital in labour so very excited about that. Another Independence babe, boy, for our family.
Better go. Happy New Year to ALL x
Am suffering fae the Scottish Cringe efter watching Bbc Hogmany show Jackie Tans bad enough, but Auld Lang Syne wiz dire, Ally Bain Phil Cunningham must be on long term contracts, then the top of the bill Bay City Rollers.Come back The Laird O Coocadens alls forgiven.
Big hugs and kisses to you all – I once was lost but now am found. Ronnie A rescued me – Paula Rose massaged me into paroxsyms of delight – Quinie frae Angus just smiled and that was enough. Happy 2016 to you all
Happy New year to everyone.
@ Archie [not Erchie] If I found you & rescued You might be better aff staying lost lol.
Happy New Year Archie, see you soon.
Happy New Year everyone, and may the force be with us for our ensuing struggles.
Good to see Wings getting some reference on the British State broadcaster:)
Happy New Year to all
Elaine C Smith was much better than the Burd.
Inverclyder, I think “porridge wog” might be an army insult.
I’ve noticed plenty of new names posting in the past couple of weeks.
Anyway, from someone who hardly ever does, a good New Year tae us awe. And the election is approaching a wee bit quicker now.
Where, and I’ve said this before, as lots of others have, where would we be without the Rev. Thanks, Rev.
I wish you all a very Happy New Year.
Elaine C Smith was fine and funny and Nicola’s presence was worth five QTs.
But STV have to do better than that which could have been any night any time.
Actually Elaine C Smith instead of Jackie Bird on BBC would have been a better idea
Happy New Year to Stu and everybody on Wings.
Just a thought…..Elaine C Smith….on STV ……might have have gone over some folks heed…..C’mon the women. ……..HNY
Happy New Year Wingers!
Thank heavens we have BBC Alba! Good stuff!
Happy New Year to the Rev. Stuart Campbell and all independence supporters posting here.
Happy New Year to all wingers. Enjoyed a guid nicht wi hubby sister in law and Alba ceilidh. Brilliant. Enjoy yer ain culture withoot the bliddy cringe.
Awa tae bed noo. Good nicht folks.
BBC Alba Hogmany show very good.
Best wishes for a happy new year to you all, kind regards from the drams.
Happy New Year to Rev Stu and all Wingers.
link to youtube.com
To all at WoS I wish you all that you wish yourself.I came to the party late.
I therefore feel that my comments should be be measured and duly respectful to people that I admire and respect.
We will overcome, we will prevail, an idea whose time has come cannot be thwarted . I wish you all whatever you you wish yourselves and a prosperous new year to us all.
Only an excuse–dreadful.I think its time to call it a day Jonathan.Jackie Turd ,she would gie you the boak,nothings changed there then.
HAPPY HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!!!
Wishing you all joy and peace in 2016!
Another year closer to our Independence = )
Happy New Year to one and all and may Wings Over Scotland continue to flourish in 2016. My thanks to the Rev Stuart Campbell and to fellow Wingers for their contributions and general insights.
Would also like to personally thank Robert Peffers for his vast knowledge on matters, so thank you Robert for educating me. Hail Alba and Alba gu snooker loopy!
Stephen… Only an excuse should just have been half an hour of Charmichael repersenting all that 2015 was… done in a style by Greg Moodie. 😉
We are one and we will win because of that. Happy New Year Rev.
Happy new year to all Wingers.
Today is a new day and a new year.
The fight for a free Scotland begins at dawn.
Never give up. Never give in and never stop.
Hail Alba
Stop paying the BBC Licence fee ffs.
“Charmichael repersenting all that 2015 was… done in a style by Greg Moodie. ?
Now I would PAY a licence fee to watch that.
Happy new year btw Brian.
May yer lum lang reek jdman 🙂
I think 2016 and every year after should have a “National no-Lying Day”, and every politician should have to face 20 questions, with no hesitation, deviation or repetition allowed. Penalty for not getting 20 out of 20 – stripped of office.
Whoohahahaha
Pishin masel
who’s that wifie on Elaine C Smiths “Burdz Eye Veiw”?
says
“remember Jeans boy/ everybody thoucht he wis gay, turns oot he wis a Canadian”
“we didnae hiv a hoover we hid a dug”
pure dead brilliant soinitis!
Am a wee bit emotional the noo sniff
Aa cannie tell ye how proud I am that ma furst Minister’s as common as muck
They forgot to mention the Press owned by tax evading NonDoms. Mail, Express, Telegraph Times, Sun. Not held to account. Paul Dacre is chairman of the Organisation which is supposed to scrutinise the Press. Phone hacking, bribing public officials, illegal investigations on biased political grounds. A totally biased, Westminster controlled media. Toe the line or the Editors are threatened and the Robocops are sent in to smash up the mail room. The Guardian is the only paper of any Independence of Editorial and it is under State control as well.
No wonder no one believes a word anymore. People have to turn to ‘foreign’media to get a balanced view of what is going on.
Thanks again for all Wings have done to scrutinise the Media. Plus hoping them to account from all the contributors. Thanks to Tam Jardine for the latest revelations. No mention in the MSM.
Thanks a billion to Rev Stu. Pure Genius. Let’s make 2016 a guid year. May 2016.
Mack @ 4.22am
I also catch their media review segment most weeks on the JB show. I agree with you that both Stuart and Eamonn are a real breath of fresh air from the usual guff thats force fed to us by nearly every other media source . They have touched on our skewed msm before and highlighted Bella and wings previosly . Both guys are witty, inteligent and speak a bucket load of sense and so refreshing to hear opinions that are not the usual Pacific Quays SNP bad script.
Happy New Year Stu and to all my fellow Wingers. Roll on May 16.
Can’t say I was very impressed with either offering from the EBC or ETV last night. I did like Nicola’s common touch though. The grammar slipped slightly as she was talking to her Mammy. Lol.
How about a crowd fundin effort to get Rev Stu doing a Ricky Fulton Last Call sketch next Hogmanay. Now that would be worth the licence fee (?) C’mon guys, post some sketch ideas.
Happy New Scotland to One ane Awe
Just put the BBC in Scotland’s Radio Station on …….. Recorded discussion between Simon Pia (Unionist )and for balance Alex Bell (who doesn’t see the reason for Independence) hosted by Kaye Adams followed by the sad case of a family with very handicapped kid not getting the level of support they need (very difficult situation) …. Sounds like a lack of support from the Scottish Government…… SNP Bad…….. Obviously hoping to turn drink addled brains
Massive thank you to Stu and all the contributors here at wings for their excellent work in debunking the peddled myths of mainstream unionist media. I don’t contribute much here but I do read every word and am eternally thankful that WoS exists to challenge the mainstream narrative so effectively.
I bought a domain last year “thescottishview.com” as a direct result of my own anger at the ways in which the news on Scotland and the SNP was being presented by mainstream media groups and because of my own censorship when presenting a contrary narrative on certain newspapers comments sections BTL. (The Guardian being a particularly notable example) (I’m William Wallace on there btw).
I’ve not done anything with the space as of yet but I wanted to create a space for article writers and commenters that was free of the tightly controlled discussion on other media platforms and with minimal moderation. I also wanted to use it as an archive of sorts regarding any stories about Scotland on the mainstream and alternative media outlets.
I’m not sure that the space is really needed given the excellent job done here in particular and on other alternative outlets but, felt I wanted to do something that contributes to the future independence of Scotland. (I suppose I was tired of feeling powerless against an onslaught of hostile media and unionist commentators )
This would not be a top down approach but rather a collective effort to build on the great work being done here and elsewhere. To confront mainstream media bias with informed and reasoned debate and to share that debate with the wider public through social media sharing etc.
If anyone is interested in utilising such a space either by contibuting articles, assuming a more editorial role or indeed contributing their tech expertise please get in touch. (thescottishrebels@gmail.com)
All that aside can I just take the opportunity to wish all of you at Wings a happy new year and all the very best for the year ahead. Thank you to all of you for the excellent work that you do and long may it continue.
Happy New Year to all Scottish independence supporters. One year closer.
Unionists – it’s time to wake up and smell the coffee.
@ K 1 31/12/ 8.16pm
I wouldn´t know how to find Stuart Cosgroves post. It was two, maybe three months back.
There was nothing special in the content of the post itself, if I remember correctly he provided some information pertaining to the topic being discussed on the thread however what caught my attention was that he was willing to post under his own name and not use an alias as most do (K 1—Uno Mas).
He was one of three contributors to the thread that were posting under their own name, the other two being Stuart Campbell and Robert Peffers and I remember thinking to myself, midfield trio…. Cosgrove—Pfeffers—Campbell… aye go on that´ll do it!!
Happy New Year Wingers all, and specially to our Leader the Rev. Onward as someone else here said and upward, we will be Independent soon.
Happy New Year and every happiness to all. I hope you are right Helena – tempus fugit!
The quotation:-
It is credited to be by Victor Hugo. It has been much paraphrased but here is as quoted in the original French :-
Perhaps when Big Ben struck the new year of 2016 it heralded the hour when the idea of Scottish independence has finally come.
Love the comment from itchy biscuit about the wake up call
If they didn’t hear the last one they will not hear anything.
They are indeed the epitome of the 7 year old stamping their feet and not accepting it’s bedtime.
Tick tock.
Happy new year everyone.
@Clydebuilt
Yeah stuck it out for a couple of minutes in the car but it sounded like a repeat version of yesterdays interview at tea-time so clicked over to radio 5 to listen to how England won the ashes FGS!
No ‘The National’ today either so when no one was keeking bought an under the counter Daily Express to read Ben Borland asking if Ruthie could be the next leader of the opposition in Scotland.
“the high heidyins of labour in Scotland (who they?) are seriously worried about losing out to the Conservatives”
And ‘Hark the Herald’ as it has a similar article
link to archive.is
In short, one the first day of 2016 naught has changed in the papers or on the BBC. 🙂
Anyhoo! Steakpie and peas with tatties soon… and me lost 19lbs since October.
Happy New Year to all.
‘Slàinte mhòr agus Bliadhna Mhath Ùr’ :
All the best for 2016 to all contributors, readers & supporters of ‘the media they don’t like to talk about’ (AKA WoS).
All the best Rev Stu
Gordoz
For some reason I have a strange feeling of anti-climax this cold and frosty New Year morning.
The BBC and STV New Year offerings were both dire. UK Radio stations were much as usual and only Alba seemed to have put some effort into commemorating the ancient traditional Scottish Winter Festivities.
Seems the newer English Traditions of celebrating the ?Christian, “Christmas”, are uppermost in the minds of the Scottish unionist controlled media outlets.
Is there nothing traditionally Scottish these unionists will not disrespect?
Hi peeps.
A Happy New Year to all readers and contributors!
If you want to see Stuart Cosgrove’s post, it’s here:-
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Happy Yoon Ear. And may the Yoons learn tae yaise them!
Happy New Year everyone. Look forward to May, but take nothing for granted.
Roll on 2016. It will be an interesting year with many challenges.
All the best to everybody on here, even our precious trolls. The fact that they contribute actually means they must be reading and in due course the truth will get to them.
I sincerely hope we can get through the election remaining on good terms with our friends who are not with many of us in the SNP. It might not be easy but nothing would satisfy our enemies more than discord among us.
My regret is that we are not going into this election as a single national movement. That of course is what was formed when the SNP came out of an amalgamation of different strands of Scottish politics in 1934 and that is actually what it still is though the demonisation and vilification it has attracted on a continuous basis from unionist enemies has miscoloured it in the eyes of many.
I would rather we were all on the one ship until we got independent.
Roll on referendum 2.
A Guid New Year tae the Wingers & mony o them!
Yesterday I came across a link showing top 100 wings stories and I looked forward to a wee browse later and now I can’t find it….help
Does anyone have any thoughts or views on what is happening with the church of Scotland and england
Cosgrove & O’Neill been doing good stuff like this on the JB show all year. Credit where credit’s due. We need a lot more though to balance the execrable 3 hours of Kaye Adams 4 days a week – a shockingly poor waste of precious airtime.
Happy New Year Stu. The MSM finger is still firmly lodged in the dyke but it is getting very sore.
I’m glad Stu highlighted this. Both these guys are the only Trojan Horse within the Plantation Quay, its the only programme I listen to on EBC.
As the old tune says ‘when the mode of the music changes…the walls of the city shake’….a metaphor for the media future?
Thanks for reply Uno, I wis being a bit tongue in cheek though, but I see Brian has in fact provided us both, wi a link to Stuart’s comment. 🙂
Which reminded me of an article that I didn’t read but saw on the Herald’s online front page from a few days ago, the headline along the line’s of ‘Michelle Greetin’ Face ‘calls in lawyers’ to defend hersel’ fae people sayin’ her company wis ‘at it’.
It’d be of a minimal and vague sideline comedy ‘interest’ value to see how ‘that’ pans out over the next wee while 😉
Ta Brian (Wings ‘go to’ man)
Marianne Taylor.
Little evidence put forward for her statement in her article:
Still in makes a change from Torrance whining.
————————————————————-
Scotland is a country that is hungry for change, particularly around poverty and equality of opportunity, where frustratingly little progress has been made despite plenty of rhetoric. On some measures we’re even going back the way.
—————————————————————
Faint praise for Sturgeon Something must be done… Aye 2 x SNP
link to archive.is
Bruce Morton also commented btl on ‘the apprentice’ article too…Moanin’ mini me wis a celebrity magnet that day 😉
Elaine deighan says:
“Yesterday I came across a link showing top 100 wings stories and I looked forward to a wee browse later and now I can’t find it….help”
Here you go Elaine
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Just popped on to say Happy New Year to all wingers and the Rev for making it all possible.
As for the above, I’m one of the ‘beware of unionists bearing gifts’.
Pirate readio was a great success until Radio 1 took over all the DJs then it became bland and establishment.
Social media blogs such as WoS, IMO, are best when not having corporate input.
Happy New Year all, especially to John Beattie if he is checking this site out. Since he mentioned the unmentionable on Brit Nat radio he will be no doubt be getting his jotters soon.
And a belated happy 2016 from me to you all.
I’d like to think that 2016 is full of promise and Scotland will take another big step towards independence.
I’m knocking on and I want to pop my clogs knowing the children and grandchildren of Scotland are on the road to a much better , fairer ,safer and kinder country.
Bliadhna Mhath Ur dhuibh uile.
X_Sticks thank you so much x
O/T
Labour try to blame SNP for floods. Lying Labour say cuts to SEPA caused problems.
SEPA is not responsible for flood protection but only for detection and warning system.
There were no cuts to that element in SEPA budget but Labour try to conflate the two but John Swinney slaps down the lie.
Gardham on Politics Scotland agreed that the Scottish Government were blameless. Wow!