The magic million
Something remarkable happened in the last couple of days, readers. After we told you about the imminent delivery of the print edition of the Wee Black Book, there was a flurry of orders for several thousand more copies. And that extra influx of cash took the independence movement past a significant milestone.
Since this very site set the ball rolling in 2013 with (as far as we know) the first-ever verifiable public pro-Yes crowdfunding campaign, scores of other Yes groups have followed the trail we blazed, most of them using the aptly-named Indiegogo.
And as of today, thanks to orders for the Wee Black Book the total sum raised by grassroots Yes campaigners – not the official Yes Scotland organisation, not political parties, just normal schmucks off the street like us – in those three years has now topped ONE MILLION POUNDS.
That’s a phenomenal, perhaps unprecedented, achievement for a political movement in a country the size of Scotland. We can’t tell you how thrilled and proud we are to have been a big part of it. While there are politicians involved, the Yes movement is far more than that – it’s a true movement of the people.
(The No campaign couldn’t come anywhere near this level of grassroots funding. In fact, outside of parties, the official “Better Together” campaign, big business and a handful of obscenely wealthy individuals like JK Rowling, it barely raised a penny.)
The full list is below. Everyone on it, and more importantly everyone who donated to any of the 63 different fundraisers, should take a bow.
————————————————————————————
Wings Over Scotland, March 2015: £117,345 (incl. “offsite” donations)
Wings Over Scotland, March 2014: £110,717 (ditto)
Wings Over Scotland, March 2016: £87,171 (ditto)
Wings Over Scotland Wee Blue Book, August 2014: £59,661
Bella Caledonia, May/June 2015: £53,880
Broadcast News For Scotland, autumn 2014: £37,700
Indy Adverts, Aug/Sep 2014: £33,493
Wings Over Scotland, February 2013: £33,014
Business For Scotland, June 2014: £31,265
Common Weal, autumn 2013: £25,584
Women For Independence, March 2014: £20,823
Scotland Yet, autumn 2013: £20,320
Margo Mobile 1, July 2014: £18,600
Alan Bissett – The Pure, The Dead And The Brilliant, March 2014: £18,431
National Collective, April 2013: £18,360
Women For Independence To The AGM, October 2014: £15,615
Women For Independence Last Six Weeks, August 2014: £15,186
How The BBC Stole The Referendum – The Documentary, Oct 2015: £14,510
Newsnet Scotland, December 2013: £13,801
Wings Over Scotland Wee Black Book, May/June 2016: £13,610+
Bella Caledonia, December 2013: £13,480
Generation Yes, May/June 2014: £13,415
Indy Cyclist – Rome To Home, May 2014: £12,090
Wings Over Scotland opinion polls (x2), 2013: £11,822
10,000 Flags For Yes, April 2014: £11,397
Margo Mobile 2, August 2014: £10,858
Spirit Of Independence, summer 2014: £10,779
Spirit Of Independence #2, autumn 2014: £10,404
NewsShaft And Beyond, summer 2015: £10,400
Radical Independence – The Final Push, July 2014: £8,995
Left Scotland (May 2015): £8,200
Scotland Yet Post-Production, May 2014: £8,200
Labour For Independence, March 2014: £7,031
Independence Live, March 2016: £6,680
Independence Live Going Forward, May/June 2015: £5,861
Edinburgh North & Leith For Yes, July 2014: £5,550
How The BBC Stole The Referendum – The Final Push, May 2016: £5,535
Yes Glasgow Independence Debate, February 2014: £5,465
Indy Cyclist 2 – 500 Miles In 5 Days, July 2014: £5,350
How The BBC Stole The Referendum, November 2014: £5,281
Yes Dundee Bus Adverts, April/May 2015: £5,135
Yes Borders, March 2014: £4,875
Delivery For Indy, March 2016: £4,803
The Indyref Graphics Book, March 2015: £4,800
Radical Independence – Another Scotland Is Possible, February 2014: £4,001
Scot Goes Pop!, May 2014: £3,425
Dateline Scotland, August 2014: £3,322
English Scots For Yes 2 (August 2014): £3,226
North British News, March 2016: £3,155
Yes In The Glen, February 2014: £3,121
Friends Of Wings Over Scotland 2, September 2014: £3,078
Indyref Yes Graphics (August 2014): £3,010
Friends Of Wings Over Scotland, June/July 2014: £2,568
Scottish Socialist Party, August 2014: £2,121
Yes Western Isles Campaign Office, July 2014: £2,050
Scotland’s Conversation With The World, May 2014: £2,025
Yes Stirling Office, June 2014: £2,005
Yes Edinburgh West Campaign Hub, July 2014: £2,000
Scottish Independence Live Events, June 2014: £1,640
English Scots For Yes, June 2014: £1,627
Aye Talks, May 2014: £1,520
Yes Bo’ness Shop, May/June 2014: £1,505
Yes Edinburgh Advert Trailer, spring 2014: £1,130
Total: £1,002,017
Wow, just wow…
and worth every penny.
It was more about Scottish democracy, rather than YES, but let us not forget the fantastic sum raised for the Orkney 4.
The total sum raised was £210,050 (!!) and some of the donations were around £2!
With Wings around £420,000 of it in total. Wow.
Since I fell on hard times, I’ve not been able to donate, but if I had the cash I would.
Even though I’ve been blocked, I have a wee blue book and read the blog and retweet links. This is a blog that is worth every penny donated. I apologise for not being able to at present.
I know it wasn’t Independence related, but the People versus Carmichael crowdfund raised over £208,000 in an act of unprecedented popular political defiance against our Establishment’s presumption of legal immunity, so it was in effect a show of the electorate’s independence of political thinking.
That’s a very clumsy sentence, but you know what I mean. I hope.
A staggering display of Scottish democracy in action. Hope it stops BBC style smears on YESers, that we’re only funded by lotto winners the Weirs. It should but it wont.
Heartwarming to think this came from ordinary people
who don’t have a lot of money in the first place.
Fantastic! And every penny declared!;)
What would we do without you?
Really fantastic.
I wonder how long it will take for unionist idiots to start claiming foul play.
I am neither European, nor Scottish. I want to thank you for your website and thank you for everything you do. I truly wish I could do more hands on work to help Scotland achieve even more greatness.
Forward to Independence!
@mrmchoohaa
And we’ll happily raise another million, if that’s what it takes…
Nice to see my group ‘English Scots for Yes’ there!
Math Campbell,our founder and all round great guy,is getting ready for a relaunch this Summer.
Its going to be an interesting year…
This is great news. One of the things which really struck me is the number of diverse groups aiming for the restoration of Scottish independence. It is indeed a movement, so let’s hope this summer once the Tory party leadership referendum is over, the campaigning for Scottish independence can start again in earnest.
It cannot happen soon enough, so we can be rid of these English Tory clowns who have ruined our country like Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson (who is actually a yank) for good.
I’d happily pay the same again (and continue to do so) if it funds REAL analysed, factual, linked, well sourced information reaching as many people as possible.
Yes I’m drawn to pro independence sites, because I agree with its narrative. But more than that I think sites like these and those listed above simply wake people up to the MSM. I love that people are more likely to see/read/hear a mainstream media story then go check the facts for themselves.
That surly has to be worth the donations in itself.
How empowering! Looking forward already to the campaigns ahead.
Rev – No one has done more online – ‘nough said !
..’just normal schmucks off the street like us’!?
How very dare you, sirrah!
Chris Cairns book?
So you should be and it gets a wee bit better. I just checked my bank statement and guess who still has to contribute to the ‘Great Leap Forward’. It’s a done deal and perhaps not necessary but I just have to contribute to that one.
Vanguards are cool Will, I can see why you were so snooty when I asked if independence supporters constituted one. I suppose the grass-roots Yes movement does lack that certain elitist ideology. 🙂
Not coming over all ‘holy wullie’, but when thinking of ‘Project Fear’s rich donors, I was minded, from Sunday school lessons lang syne, of the poor widow who gave everything to charity. Jesus argued the widow gave far more than the rich, because the rich would never miss their larger donations, whereas the widow would miss it.
Makes you kinda humble & proud.
I’m free!
We all know the “total” is probably a good bit more than the Rev’s officially quoted figure.
Each of the Yes groups campaigned with charity tins at street stalls, ran raffles, social events, auctions etc and donated to their own groups as individuals as well.
If we have managed it once, we can and will do so again.
From someone who made a few sacrifices to be part of the Indy Movement; it was, and still is, worth every damn minute and bawbee.
“Chris Cairns book?”
I didn’t count that, or Greg Moodie’s, because those were really just ways of ordering products rather than campaigns as such.
You could make the argument, I guess, but (eg) Chris had also already been paid to do the toons in the first place by us out of our fundraiser money, so in effect by including the book you’d be counting the toons twice.
I dunno, man, this isn’t a perfect science 🙂
Nice to see where my TV Tax that I didn’t pay went to. Well some of the places at least.
“We all know the “total” is probably a good bit more than the Rev’s officially quoted figure.”
Oh heck yeah. I only tracked stuff that was (a) in some way verifiable on Indiegogo or similar, and (b) made over £1000. Loads and loads of small/untracked stuff fell through that net.
Don’t want to be the carmugeon at the party, but considering the eye watering amount of money the BBC had in its Scottish budget over the same period,…. Well, let’s just say it’s a sobering measure of what we are still up against.
Then again, you can’t put a value on truth, and we certainly own that, and no BBC budget, however bloated it becomes, can match that truth for value.
Makes you think mind, when you see what one million can buy, what a truly golden opportunity there will be for our home broadcasting service once the BBC noise pollution gets kicked off our airwaves. Can’t happen soon enough.
Very well done to all the resourceful and generous people who have achieved this for Scotland’s democratic destiny.
@Grouse Beater
Should you no be piing us?
… and, money gathered in this way is usually spent more carefully and achieves more than big donations to ‘professional’ outfits.
Usual ongoing display of England only UK democracy just now, C4 teatime news, audience EU debate, not a Scots voice anywhere, Jon Snow tells one dude he’s the youngest MP in the UK, are you British, European, from Earth etc.
Certain Yoons are going to go mental, and all this just before the SNP Summer Indy tour and YES2 launch, what’s not to like.
Grousey,
Glad you found a good lawyer!
enough there to fund a battlebus I would have thought.
Any group on that list may want to have a look at the Yes Registry. http://nationalyesregistry.scot/ Stew,this is a good place to have physical bodies available for whatever.
Stuart, you need a wee lie down son.
You’ll soon be talking with an American accent and quoting bizarre statistics about page thicknesses vs pantone colour coded background tints to maximise returns of indiegogo campaigns if you don’t.
In other observations: Jings!
DebbietheBruce@6.37
More power to your elbow! Getting the support of English people in Scotland is absolutely essential in our quest for self determination. English people like Scots get a raw deal from our masters in London.
They don’t understand that you are potentially our greatest asset. If we can get a majority of English Scots to support independence then all hope is lost for the Westminster elite. They think independence is about identity and hating people when in fact it’s about democracy and fairness. Those things apply to everybody regardless of their origins.
They think migration of people from the rest of the UK will perminantly halt the march towards independence. Yet as migration has increased so has the desire for independence! If that is indeed their hope, it would seem they are mistaken. Most of the animosity I came across towards English Scots in the referendum campaign came from no voting Scots.
Lots of countries with large expat English/Scottish/Welsh/Irish populations have parted company from Westminster. Scotland is no different.
Sorry, Rev.
Fantastic results re fundraising. Glad to have played a (small) part in it. And I will again!
heedtracker says:
6 June, 2016 at 7:25 pm
“”Usual ongoing display of England only UK democracy just now, C4 teatime news, audience EU debate, not a Scots voice anywhere, Jon Snow tells one dude he’s the youngest MP in the UK, are you British, European, from Earth etc.””
I stayed tuned to CH4 news for about 5 minutes at which point some minor yoof-type celebrity who was supposed to be helping get the good to vote said something along the lines of: ‘We don’t have any MPs under 25’!!!!
Shades of Mhairi Black!
Jon Snow on about old men in suits leading both campaigns turning of the good vote but forgets Ms Sturgeon!
This is all about England. Wales, Scotland, NI don’t even register on their radar.
@Cal
Perhaps too the English in Scotland were put off by the “anti-English” allegations against the SNP. That needs to be better tackled next time.
Also more use made of pro-Indy English or English origin people – a short bio perhaps.
For me, born in Scotland of Welsh parents, moved to London (sarf-east) when 2 years old. Off to Scottish Uni (St. Andrews) when 18, lived in Scotland solid since 1978 apart from the usual working away months or years at a time but always with a flat or house and a vote in Scotland, Edinburgh then Ayrshire back to where I was bornded. English accent mostly (well, a travelled accent), except when I’m pissed as a fart. Not anti-British, it’s part of our history, and not anti-English in any way.
Oh, “Have supported Independence since about 1973, solid, never a single doubt in my mind that it’s the best thing for Scotland.”.
Cal
I appreciate “identity politics” has baggage but as I keep on saying, our identities are largely shaped by our environment (in the broadest sense), which is instrumental in forming our values and so influences our judgement.
I had an English granny you know but choose to play for Scotland. 🙂
Legerwood says:
6 June, 2016 at 7:52 pm
heedtracker says:
To be fair Snow’s C4 debate’s in Norwich. Good to see that generation of east anglians are no different from the same Scots age group, quite thick:D No they’re lovely kids.
The prelim had vox pop somewhere else in England land and a Polish dame was voting leave, C4 dude says, but it could mean that Poles could not immigrate to the Uk and she says, doesn’t matter, I am here now.
“The only way to persuadeis to speak the truth.”
I don’t know where the quote is from but I’ve always tried to live up to it.
Another point by the way about the English vote in Scotland is that if they feel Indy is anti-English, their friends, neighbours and workmates could be put off Indy as well. So for every 1 English NO vote, there could be a sympathetic Scottish NO vote as well.
I read Robin McAlpine’s article in the National and thought it was mince 😉 His answer to the NO vote? Make it even more left-wing next Indy Ref. Errr, I don’t think so pal.
Amazing effort. Well done to everybody for keeping the dream alive. Thanks Rev for providing a focal point. We may disagree on many things on this site, but we have one common aim.
Fantastic! What an amazing amount. Well done to everyone, especially you Stuart : )
Just amazing! 🙂
Just a thought but how will a brexit affect English people living in EU countries if they lose their EU status.
That could get a bit messy.
Oh and great job Rev and all the other guys,you wingers and yessers are just the best 🙂
Another bad poll for Stay out. I am just about to head out with the binoculars for a look at the Berlin leaving Invergordon.
It looks like the EU Ship is sailing away from England as well. Tick tock!
Fabulous — just fabulous!!!!!! Thank you Wings for everything and don’t you stop till we are free!! XXX
Amazing. Did you know BT’s My donate doesn’t charge any fees whatsoever for fundraising.
http://btplc.com/mydonate/index.aspx
We moved in to a new house recently in a lovely part of Scotland, only to find we have an obnoxious English UKIP-er for a neighbour. If I didn’t know better he’d have put me off English people for life. Then I come here and see “English Scots For Yes” on the list. Fair cheered me up it did. 🙂
@John H. – there’s quite a lot of us actually.
Yesindyref2,
Yup. That’s the other thing we need – a right of centre party that’s pro independence. There’s a serious right wing argument for independence to be made. We don’t hear it enough. Independence transcends left/right wing politics because it’s about democracy. Until you have the power to change things you can’t make right OR left wing policies. You can’t do anything. Like a child you must wait for someone to make the decisons for you. And like a child you moan about them when you don’t like them.
Shhhhhhhh!If the wife finds out she will kill me. lol
Congratulations Rev. You are one in a million!
@Michael Duvic says: 6 June, 2016 at 6:35 pm:
” … I am neither European, nor Scottish.”
Well Michael, here’s a thing. If you are a mainly permanent resident in Scotland and have registered to vote in Scottish elections, then while you may not be Scottish by birth, you will most certainly be, “One of the People of Scotland”.
We Scots have a very long history of opening our hearts to others. Here’s a little known historic fact. There is only one country in all of Europe that has never had an official pogrom against the Jews. That country is Scotland.
Then there was the Irish immigrants and the post WWII Polish Immigration. The strange thing about Scotland is that these immigrants rarely ever get ghettoised in Scotland and their next generation will mostly call themselves Scottish.
For example think how many Scots, with Italian names, have represented Scotland in various sports from football to Tennis to Formula I Motorsports.
All that donated money sure gives a guy that warm and fuzzy feeling.
But here are the cold hard facts of life. The brain dead SNP brainstrust sleepwalked through the election.
Didn’t energize the base by putting the fear of death (or Boris) up them.
So now we’ve got Deputy Premier Patrick Harvie to put up with for the next five years.
And all this money can’t make that sinister, smug snaphead disappear.
On another note, when do the knives come out for Kez? Been a couple of weeks now, hasn’t it? Pathetic performance at FMQs, wonkidoodle column in the Redcoat (although I bet she doesn’t write it). Tick tock.
Way to go, by the way Rev. Yer the man!
I am not English but, for me, ‘English Scots for Yes’ was one of the best and most encouraging things to emerge in the whole Indy campaign. Just what we need. And the best possible proof that this is what independence is all about. We are indeed building a new Scotland. All the best to everyone in ‘English Scots for Yes’. And more power to your elbow.
If the Friends of WOS are included its more like £430k.
If only Wings Over Scotland could be Scotland’s genuine independence supporting newspaper.
If an indy Scotland ever has an honours system the Rev should get the highest one. Guardian, maybe?
I read Robin McAlpine’s article in the National and thought it was mince ? His answer to the NO vote? Make it even more left-wing next Indy Ref. Errr, I don’t think so pal.
actually dads, i agree with cal and not you. to win indy, we need to appeal to everyone and while his message is probably unsuitable for the area i live in, ne fife, it is the message that goes down well in other more left wing areas, eg kirkcaldy. my views are irrelevant in this, i will push what every wins indy in the region i am campaigning in.
eg, craig murray was in english scots for yes, ex british diplomat etc, would go down much better in St Andrews than Robin MacAlpine
it takes all sorts..
mr Peffers, correct
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIraj7d3O2E
As young Mr Grace put it “Carry on everybody, you’ve all done very well”. And didn’t we just!
Jackie Baillie’s calculator probably exploded when she tried to divide one million smackeroonies by the number of people who voted YES in indyref1.
I am surprised Scot Goes Pop only raised £5k – I’m sure I’ve donated to more than one fundraiser.
@Breeks says: 6 June, 2016 at 7:13 pm:
Don’t want to be the carmugeon at the party, but considering the eye watering amount of money the BBC had in its Scottish budget over the same period.
Neither does it count the UK government’s direct use of, “Experts”, or of, “Neutral”, Civil Service persons or the Civil Service aid for, “Experts”, bought with taxpayer’s money. Then of course, the “experts”, and so called, “International Law”, specialists.
Not to mention the GB Sports persons nor the ‘Celeb Luvvies.
There is one other thing we have that they do not.
We are parts of a Grass Roots Movement and there are only two things that can stop such Grass Roots movements in their tracks official Genocide or ultimate freedom from oppression.
It would be properly LOL funny to see the equivalent amount raised be ‘genuine’ grassroots BTUKOK outfits like VNB and their memorable anthem, ‘Why Build Another Wall’:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BT9Ify40I_U
Remember when Blair McDougall announced that the No campaign wasn’t accepting any more donations because they had enough? Well, how much was enough?
….they said “put your money where your mouth is!”…so we did
Praise for Nicola Sturgeon from Tarquil Critchon , building Nicola UP supporting the EU, after 23rd June ,they,ll be back to pulling her down.
It would be properly LOL funny to see the equivalent amount raised be ‘genuine’ grassroots BTUKOK outfits like VNB and their memorable anthem, ‘Why Build Another Wall’:
How do you cost the BBC handing over the whole of their news 24 network to Gavin Estler for whole days of vote Nob Orders propaganda, to get the whole fraud out and into their Scotland region. Vopte nob orders on the hour and half hour over and over is probably one of their bigger examples of just how corrupt the BBC actually is.
One things for sure the whole of the BBC wont be turned over to a gimp like Estler to push a Brexit blast like vnb. Its too dodgy pissing off the EU Brexit winners and losers with level of corrupt public broadcasting .
@Schrodingers Cat
I have a lot of respect for Robin McAlpine, however I agree. It’s not about pulling a left or right wing agenda but it’s about sorting though the chaff and the neo-liberal propaganda to present the truth.
That truth is that a nation like ours is incredibly well endowed with human capital and resource to make more than just a fist of it as an independent nation.
Scotland’s potential can only become reality if it controls its own floating sovereign fiat money system. Iceland With its own currency weathered the recession but most importantly learned the lessons that it is answerable to no agency other than its citizens. Scotland should look closely at this small nation with a population the size of Edinburgh.
Good summation of what Iceland has done to protect its country and flourish..
http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=33707
SNP need to employ some (non-mainstream) economists – the ones who know how the economy really works – I.e not the myths peddled in classical textbooks.
OT Muhammad Ali’s “This is your Life” with Eamonn Andrews http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWZOBX1vE7A
Love the smell of Indy in the morning/evening.
WoS no BS
😉
Chic McGregor says:
6 June, 2016 at 9:17 pm
If an indy Scotland ever has an honours system the Rev should get the highest one. Guardian, maybe?
I suggest a great new job would be Editor of the Daily Record for life. This will of course incorporate The Herald and the Scotsmoan by then.
Weekly 5 page spread reminding them of all the propaganda over the years with detailed analysis from a lottery type draw from Wings posters.
Rev,
Just to say that after my fundraiser in May 2014, I did a 2nd in the July raising £10,700. Add it. Make the total even bigger!
Indycyclist
Brilliant. Now onwards and upwards. First maximising the fall-out from the EU ref. Then neutralising the Unionists in Holyrood. Finally the Local Authority clean-up.
After that, Scotland becomes an independent nation and we take peaceful possession of our country.
Will contribute further as required!
Fantastic! What an amazing list! What an amazing people! Proud to be Scottish. Independence is well and truly on its way folks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eyVkMtO8bM
@ Colin Doig 7.38pm Yes registary by Bella Caladonia no chance of myself signing up to that. Scottish Independence Movement will be holding there meetings at Hillhead Library 3rd meeting 19th Jun 12.30/15.30
Do you reckon there are sentient beings out there who are unaware that the BBC is a seriously Yoon organisation?
It was pleasing to read down that list, ticking off in my head the ones I’d contributed to.
The sad thing is the Dateline Scotland/NewsShaft project. Their videos during the referendum campaign were magic. I still have a NewsShaft sticker on the rear window of my wee French two-seater.
I’m thinking we’re all ready to explode into action again, once Nicola says “GO!”
Dunno if anyone has said this, but look what we managed with a million. Imagine we had two…
@yesindyref2 says:
“Another point by the way about the English vote in Scotland is that if they feel Indy is anti-English, their friends, neighbours and workmates could be put off Indy as well. So for every 1 English NO vote, there could be a sympathetic Scottish NO vote as well.”
————-
That’s true for sure. I remember talking about the referendum in a pub, and then one of the group was saying “Shhh, this guy’s English”.. His friend was arriving and he figured it would be offensive for him to hear people talking about the vote. Just crazy.
@ ronnie anderson
The Yes Registry isn’t by Bella Caledonia; BC is just one of a number of sites used for a synchronized launch of the promotional film.
I have reservations about the Registry, but not because they tried to launch in as many places as possible to avoid being associated with any one party/site/campaign.
Great total of donations but the tip of the iceberg. Don’t remember how much I donated to our local ‘Yes Group’ or our local ‘Women for Independence’ group. Not to mention the time we gave for the cause.
Onwards and upwards to an Independent Scotland.
btw, every word of that pdf I posted, was separated by a page break, almost as if the World Bank didn’t want oiks like myself doing what I just did. Oops. There was meatier stuff in the conclusion but I’d given up the will to live. I’ve now stopped breathing and will just molder in the corner from now on. 😉
The whole YES movement should be a broad rainbow coalition and this time let’s give some attention to a centre-right party. Can you imagine Nick Robinson’s face as he hears the right-wing case for Scottish independence?!?
One of the big mistakes I felt in indyref1 was when Nicola Sturgeon said “there will be no more Tories” (meaning in an independent Scotland we will have the sort of left of centre governments most Scots vote for and want).
But in an independent Scotland there WILL be a Scottish “conservative” (?)… “business” (?) party. A decent right-wing party could certainly command up to 25% of the vote and may even form a coalition with another party if the left is in disarray (who knows what will happen in the aftermath of a YES vote).
It is wrong to say there will be NO such and such a party in an indy Scotland. That is the great joy of independence: we ourselves will decide. YES is for all Scots and the movement should represent all “shapes and sizes” of Scots.
Time to reclaim Adam Smith from the clueless Thatcherites and not limit ourselves to just centre-left and left groups. Independence brings opportunity and let us show that to the centre-right and right groups…. *
[* A perfect example of opportunity: I always say we should have a YES Bank or a WINGS Supermarket, ready to take over for when RBS and John Lewis “threaten” to up and leave an indy Scotland — walk away from business? aye richt… that will go down well with yer shareholders!]
“Just to say that after my fundraiser in May 2014, I did a 2nd in the July raising £10,700. Add it. Make the total even bigger!”
Give me a flipping link to it, then! 🙂
If it was possible to even hazard a guess at the number of genuine hours worked by Yes supporters at a nominal rate of, say £2.67 per hour (i.e. what ‘apprentices’ are paid by some local councils) what kind of number would we be looking at then?
In their hearts, BTUKOKers know they lost Scotland on Sep 19th 2014, and the precise moment was David Cameron’s attempt to strike an historic pose with that bluster about EVEL.
Fat lot of good that’s done him – the most obvious results are a HOC ahop with bothersome SNP MPs and a unionist MSM in its death throes.
Bojo for PM asap – he’s next for a proper shaving, and it’s well overdue. (Blimey – some BTUKOKers must have come to loathe the original ‘parcel o’ rogues’ almost as much as some of us do…can we really be worth all this bother?)
ronnie anderson
Hi Ronnie. I was informed the yes registry had no affiliation and I liked the idea. I think I punted some money in though I am losing track- check it out and let me know your thoughts.
I don’t hate BC although I do think my posting on Wings killed the piece a piece Mike was wanting to run. Suddenly all cold.
Debbie the Bruce
Your group was vital. It tears apart the anti-English pish levelled at us. Good to hear new things are in the pipeline
A pound spent in Strathclyde is far more of value to the country than a pound spent in Croyden particularly when it’s spent on WoS / YES/ Indyref 2.
@ Brian Doonthetoon, 11:37pm
So many of us have dug deeply in our pockets and can’t really account for how much dropped out for the sake of our convictions, wee bits here, wee bits there and then the big appeals and events too. All done gladly and with hope.
It has been amazing. Who would have believed the connections that would be established via these efforts?
Thanks Stu, especially, for working so hard with our Wings, and many others for helping to bring so many together in common cause.
Just a wee reminder to Wingers who want to send Prince Philip a birthday card – best get it in the post by tomorrow evening, just to be sure.
He’ll be 95 on Friday.
Huzzah!
🙂
Ps if we get as high a remain vote as I hope later this month there will be more than a few lightbulbs pinging on to Yes amongst our EU friends living in Scotland.
It kind of goes without saying but I see them being much more favourable to yes EVEN WITH A REMAIN VOTE if the pro EU vote is stronger up here. If we face being dragged out of the EU I expect nothing short of 100% Yes next time round.
I address this to anyone on our side thinking of voting to leave.
The EU for all its faults is going to give us a voice we have never had. Let’s give it a try as a member state for a change then decide if we like it.
Now that the ship has steadied I am certainly interested in discussion about what a right of centre party would be about here in Scotland.
ronnie anderson
re- yes registry
as i said, it takes all sorts. indyref1’s strength was its diversity
i think anyone who is attempting to launch yes2 should be supported
my own view is a bottom up approach rather than a top down structural organisation
to that end, each indy group should launch by itself, speak for themselves and not scotland.
recently i asked wos for suggestion on who should lead yes2, the number of replies and people mentioned showed a depth to our organisation.
each individual organisation, from yes shetland, to ric in glasgow to wfi in the borders, should approach such people to do a relaunch of your own group, what could be a few photos with celebs on twitter could snowball back into a nationwide relaunch, with each group to its own
re the ssp, ric and rise, why not launch your own group ronnie?, you have a public profile, speak well, etc
it only needs 2 to start a revolution
if james kellys latest article is anything to go by, brexit is gaining traction, (nb, i didnt predict this) then yes2 activity will skyrocket in 2 weeks time
Id rather an article on how and what we should do next than backslapping ourselves on past victories, however much welcome they are.
I think we only need a starting gun to kick start yes2, after which, im not sure we need a central commitee to organise things
think first and foremost what you can do in your immediate location, who are the local celebs, personalities, businessmen, political commentators, journalists etc, then approach them to help launch your yes group. bear in mind the demographics and politics of the region you are in, not whether you neccessarily agree with them
eg, craig murray for st andrews and nef?
bear in mind folks, once yes2 is up and running, there is no left or right, snp or rise, tory or green
there will only be indy supporters. anyone criticising other indy supporters will be seen as a unionist troll 🙂
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEStsLJZhzo
@IanB
“Just a wee reminder to Wingers who want to send Prince Philip a birthday card – best get it in the post by tomorrow evening, just to be sure.
He’ll be 95 on Friday.”
As a kinda musical pun, we could hire Dolly Parton to sing “9 to 5′ to him.
On second thoughts, his ticker.
On third thoughts, what’s her number?
re reg by tim roth
blair gets savaged a few weeks before the chilcot enquiry
not accidental me thinks
more grist to grind
@Tam
“Ps if we get as high a remain vote as I hope later this month there will be more than a few lightbulbs pinging on to Yes amongst our EU friends living in Scotland. ”
OTOH if we get a BREXIT vote there will be more than a few lightbulbs pinging on to Yes indy ref voters that for the next indyref, as well as taking a positive stance over an indy Scotland we should also take a negative stance over remaining in the UK.
@cat
McAlpine, RISE, RIC, Greens should keep doing what they’re doing, but McAlpine was basically saying the whole Indy movement should ignore the right of centre vote. Well, that’s wrong, totally wrong, and one of the msot clueless things I’ve seen anyone writing. Wealthy Nation’s idea was they were voting YES asd conservatives not in spite of being Conservatives but because of it. In other words a Conservative would do better in Indy Scotland because of the opportunities, and I totally agree.
The more variety and the more sides of politics represented the better for Indy Ref 2.
@Chic
Guardian sounds good, or Protector. I don’t think Scotland has had that many over the centuries …
@Chic –
🙂
Aye, nice choice:
‘…whit a way tae make a livin”!
‘…it’s aw takin’ and nae givin’!
@yesindy2
I like ‘Protector’, we wouldn’t want the Rev to be associated with an MSM piece of lefty pretension like the Gruniad.
@IanB
🙂 I never even thought that far into the lyrics.
@IanB
Well, I must have spent at least 8-10 hours a day since Feb 2012, reading articles and postings, and researching reports, select committees, publications, 364 days a year. To the neglect of my business (many others were the same). And if there was an early sign of some Unionist rubbish breaking, making sure I knew what it would be before the Herald published an article on it, often with my posting ready in a text file. And then getting in with usually the first posting of the day at 3.20 in the Herald, after I moved on from the Guardian. Refreshing the main page until an article appeared, quick open in new tab, and put my comment in fast.
Occasional one on the Scotsman, a dozen or so on the Telegraph. No idea if it was worth it or not, if it achieved anything or not, I just did it as my self-appointed task. Shrug. A truly frightening number of hours in total.
@yesindyref2
Aye. Sigh. But like we had a choice?
Chic McGregor
I posted my last comment from the boozer and proceeded to engage with a polish guy who wants Brexit. Fuck- politics is complicated- the more I know I the less I understand
Talking about the reports that came out during Indy ref 1 as I was, the way it worked was similar for all of them. You had the full report which contained pages and pages of data and tables and comparisons, if then and else stuff. Then you had the executive summary of that report, which could take one or two pages. Then you had the report writer’s “press release”, which would be what they wanted the interpretation of their report to be. Then you had what the media took the press report to be. By this time it would ahve changed totally beyond belief “Indy Scotland is screwed”.
That would be the Unionist article, and the SNP / Scottish Government would say “this is a good report by the IFS”.
Well, when you delved into the data and tables it was indeed largely a good report for Indy Scotland, with provisos and what ifs, and a few downsides, but what the general public saw was the totally distorted unionist media article, and only the downsides in the report. The rest of the alrgely favourable report was ignored.
That was a big problem in Indy ref 1.
@yesindyRef2 –
I hear ye…
And how many on t’other side were doing likewise?
None.
Blair McDougall, famously, couldn’t get his arse into the BTUKOK office before mid-morning. Are we to believe that’s because he was up all night analysing data and devising brilliant strategy?
Your ‘handle’ sums it all up – as and when we get Indy Ref 2 there’ll never be need for another.
@ Tam Jardine
The Yes Registry is explicitly non-party political. It has no affiliations to existing organizations, though obviously individuals from lots of organizations support/have signed up to it.
When they had finished the promotional film, they sent it to lots of outlets, hoping for a synchronized release to demonstrate that lack of affiliation.
It sort of worked, since most releases occurred over the weekend, but it was a bit spread out as far as I can see; I didn’t check all the places they said they’d sent it to. These include Munguin, Common Space, and several others besides BC.
I attended the conference they held in Largs (my back view can be seen a number of times in the film) but my group decided not to take part at this stage, partly for financial reasons. We might change our minds later, depending on how it develops.
There was a Polish Lassie on the Ch4 debate intro vid which said the same.
I’m wondering if it’s similar to when you (i.e. me) used to find West Coasters of Irish immigrant descent who were anti indy. Drill down interrogation revealed that they seem to believe Ireland’s independence gave them at least by vicarious association, an upper hand over other Scots.
Thankfully, in recent years, that seems to have receded.
Could they be just wanting to feel better off than those back home?
Shades of Murphy pulling up the uni-entrance ladder.
Human nature has its ugly side.
@Chic
No, we had no choice.
What I said about those reports, just about all of which I read and analysed, what we need for Indy Ref 2 is semi-formal wee groups for all the different aspects. Currency, GDP, revenues, general economy, defence, foreign relations, EU, and so on.
Each semi-formal group then takes responsibility very fast for any new report, from IFS, IPPR, LSE, whoever, and rips into the actual data. It then produces its own executive summary and even press release.
Then people who post on media, attend meetings, even just talk to people in the street, work, pub, have somewhere they can go to check up the executive summary or press release corresponding to each new report that comes out, to counter the anti-indy media distortion. It could be a useful resource for the Rev as well.
Wealthy Nation had some good stuff I used once I discovered their resource, particularly on e.g. sterlingisation and the central bank (or not), but it was general articles, and the counter article to individual reports was hard to find, non-existent even. You had to then relate their stuff to the actual report points.
Here’s something Quite Interesting:
David Cameron wants to remain but his cousin Boris Johnson wants to leave but his cousin Harriet Harmon wants to remain but her cousin The Queen, well, we don’t quite know do we
All of the above descended from William and Mary and strangely coincidentally in parliament
I wonder how many more are related and from the same families
In case you’re wondering how I know, Stephen Fry imparted that info on the telly earlier
Queen Victoria was a Haemophilia carrier and passed on the disease to all males in the Royal Families in the world because they’re all related
That makes them all Bleeding Bastirts
@yesindyref2
The United Scotsmen approach.
Sounds like a great idea.
@Chic
(I forgot BfS as a resource). Indy Ref 1 was a bit haphazard. The Herald had an article that YES Scotland had a target warchest of £24 million, but only achieved £4.8m. Which could explain a lot. I remember for instance after the Ref, people saying there wasn’t even a list of YES organisations and shops, and they had to keep contact themselves. No central organisation of badges. And of course the leaflets were garbage.
Indy Ref 2 needs to be more organised, more central resources. There’s people out there, and perhaps it needs an overall conference – not left dominated – to work out the strategy, organisation and responsibilities. To hell with “warchests” and budgets, many many by far the most, did the whole thing for nothing, not £100,000 a year like the 10 or whatever directors of YES Scotland.
…looking forward to reading about this £1 million grassroots crowd funding in the Daily Record..
Thank you Rev!!
Thank you Yesers everywhere!!
What an astounding achievement !!
= )
Morning all.Heres a thought for you.If we want independence any time soon,we are going to have to be able to get the vote out.We will need an 85%+ turnout in the schemes where only 65% voted in 2014.We need to know the name and address of every Yes sympathiser in Scotland?That requires more activists and much,much more activism than we saw in 2014.Money is required,but it’s no substitute for boots on the ground.
‘Autumn Leaves’ short film… Songs for Scotland and Gig at the Oran Mor… Yes Campervan… Bonnie Badges… The list goes on.
Pretty sure you could quadruple the £1 million figure.
Sounds good Indyref2, but hitting the BBC strikes Unionism in the jugular vein. Its so very frustrating that committed people have so much of their commitment thwarted by such an uphill playing field sustained by the media. The genie never quite gets out the bottle and I genuinely fear it never will.
Before we really get our collective arses in gear, I would love see some highly co-ordinated strategy summits and fact finding initiatives taking place with the specific objective of tackling this hostile media monopoly.
Perhaps we should invite input from countries who successfully rid themselves of colonial shackles, not just the British Empire, but how the grassroots initiative for change survived under communism.
We should invite foreign journalists to critique the domestic garbage which serves as Scottish news journalism, and not be afraid to ask for their help and constructive advice on what they suggest we do about it. Seek help from people who have beaten this rigged game successfully.
I very much fear people greatly under estimate how powerful the BBC and mainstream media are in our supression, and as a result we fear the shadowy bogeyman we don’t properly understand. We should confront our fear and objectively deconstruct and fully examine the mechanism of propaganda and how it is being used against us. Keep doing so, and once we can strip it down and reassemble the process with our eyes closed, the spell over us will be broken.
Legally, and I mean in explicit legal terms, what crime if any is being committed against us by this wave of propaganda, and what can we actually do to defend ourselves? If we are truly powerless, then expose the sham which bedevils our democracy.
We cannot afford to merely ignore this issue and hope it has finally ground out a solution in time for the next Indyref. I do not want to experience the same sinking feeling which occurred when calls for foreign observers fell on deaf ears back in 2014, and control and arbitration of the process and media coverage was delegated to the Electoral Commission by the Edinburgh agreement. So much respect and misplaced trust in UK protocols…never again yeah?
At the time my misgivings were offset because I had such faith in Alex Salmond’s wiley eye from strategic masterstrokes, but where the media is concerned, that just never happened. Not just Alex Salmond, there were a lot of people who got it wrong. There were mistakes made, and too many deaf ears not listening to the warnings.
I have also mooted the possibility of the SNP creating two manifestos; a domestic policy manifesto for the daily drudge of slapping Labour and the Tories about the head with a wet fish, and a super-user manifesto dwelling upon sovereign issues. Frankly I have precious little faith in the SNP, but that is why during televised discussion an idiot proof sovereignty manifesto might steer them back to discussing the critical issues of Independence, and avoid the tiresome lengthy detours of one irrelevant cul-de-sac after another sponsored by the Unionist agenda. Sovereign independence trumps currency, EU membership, defence, broadcasting… whatever! Independence is THE main event, and everything else is chaffe in the wind. Keep it simple stupid. Keep it pure. There is much less volume to be printed or understood.
When the media blusters and demands answers that don’t actually exist or matter, you play your trump card that sovereignty is not about choice, but commanding the power to choose.
@Dr Jim says: 7 June, 2016 at 1:48 am:
Here’s something Quite Interesting:
” … All of the above descended from William and Mary and strangely coincidentally in parliament
I wonder how many more are related and from the same families “
And yet do you still ignore the true historic facts, Dr Jim? They are all members of the Establishment. If you trace out the royals & aristos you will find the old saying is indeed true. First son is heir to the title. Second son to the senior service, third son to the clergy and so on.
The Establishment are heads of the armed forces, security services, civil service, the church, the education system and the law, (as well as being the politicians).
It has always been thus.
@Robert Peffers 07/06/16 at 8:15
Robert even more worrying is that 54% of the top 100 newspaper editors are privately educated.
A wee bit out of date (2006) but this from the Guardian.
https://archive.is/WDmB5
Breeks says:
I agree with your comment, we need organised on many fronts, lessons must be learned from Indy 1. This needs motivation on the good points you have made. Make approaches to those anywhere in the world on how to defeat the media outrage we suffered back then, and still suffer from now.
We also need to have meetings and discussion with ALL Indy groups in order to make a joined way of progress.
|For example, I have long had the idea that all Indy groups, blogs/ website set up an ability to actin unison in reaction to the worst of UKOK propaganda. They work against us in unison, they all attack us on the scare of the day.As such they have success.
The banding together of all the above to counter the propaganda, would be a strong way to help undermine the UKOK policy.
As an example, say UKOK brings out their latest scare tactics, all Indy, let’s call it a movement, react to counter UKOK across all Indy options, Websites, Blogs, Social media, posts in comments etc etc.Websites and blogs keep their own formats, but lead on the scare tactics employed against us.
This could help blunt the UKOK scare effect. If someone could just set up this idea, and forget petty squabbles, and all work towards the prize. With this in place and our activists heavily involved, we could, if we are clever enough (and we NOT stupid), blunt the UKOK attacks,and put Indy2 on a good footing.
yesindyref2 at 8.04
Yes. I agree. Very disappointing piece.
Ones I contributed to that I don’t see on the list:
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ric-govan-branch-fund-raising/x/4033199#/
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/radical-independence-east-kilbride-summer-of-action#/
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/yes-scottish-independence-badges-and-more/x/4033199#/
Regards.
Well done everyone. Yes a crowd funding effort to take over Daily Record or other newspaper would be good but it should say it supports independence on the mast head as it should gradually, slowly slowly catch the monkey, include articles questioning the London establishment status quo arguments to persuade the soft unionists to vote for Indy.
O/T, but not entirely, Call Kaye on politically correct BBC Radio Scotland discussing under representation of ethnic minorities in Police Scotland. When did prime time TV / Radio discuss under representation of Scots in senior positions in our universities or even as head of Police Scotland?
Then Call Kaye inviting listeners to say which “home country” we will support in European football championships?
Another Union Dividend @ 9.33
Surely a new newspaper shouldn’t say it supports independence in order to seduce soft UKOK types?
On colonisation of our arts institutions and and universities, this recent article by Prof John Robertson is worth a read.
http://newsnet.scot/archive/arts-institutions-universities-colonised-case-cringe/
@ Robert Peffers
In your post at 8.15, presumably because you were, quite rightly, addressing a wider issue, you chose not to point out that no-one is descended from William and Mary, who both died without issue.
So I’ll do it now.
Dr Jim at 1:48, It may have been a Channel 4 thing, but not so very long ago, a TV documentary noted in passing that Haemophilia hadn’t been recorded in either of Victoria’s parents’ family lines. Inferences anyone?
Would those who frequently reference BBC Shortbread’s House Harridan, K**(e) A****, care to explain why they continue to fund Britain’s State Propaganda channel (BSP) while moaning about its Home Counties (“England is an island”) bias?
Recourse is really quite simple; stop funding it, stop watching it & stop listening to it. And ignore the computer generated & legally meaningless letters that use silly psychological gimmicks such as grainy red ink in an attempt to coerce you to pay the TV License Fee (still an optional TV tax).
Call Kaye? (Or Louise Whyte for that matter)
Her outright hostility towards anyone or anything to do with SNP, YES or Independence is beyond parody.
It’s Brit Nat, torn faced ugliness, with blood red butchers aprons rubbed in your face.
Anyone who can’t see through that is of the same ilk and will not waver in their Land of hope and glory, bow to your betters,Three cheers for the Queen, Three cheers for anyone privelaged by birth, what? what? Tug me forelock Guv, cor blimey, good old blighty, Britain, British, Great British, Better than anyone else, Loyal oompa loompa orange, No surrender. Up to my knees, ball sack, neck….whatever
Proud Scots my fucking ringpiece!They are Proud Brits! Nothing more!
I feel better after I got that rant out of my system.
The Unionists broke every rule in the book. Broke Purdah rules. Lied cheated and overspent the limit. Support for Independence is increasing within five years there should be enough support. The EU Ref could participate another IndyRef.
The Westminster Unionist intend spending £205Billion on replacing Trident. They are sanctioning and starving people to death.
The BBC spends £3.7Billion. Most of it on nonsense. Overpaid ‘celebrities’ and sycophants. Westminster controlled nonsense.
O/T
The Secondary School proudly,boasts,that pupils get to read extracts from published writers such as,Philippa Gregory,Philip Pullman,Michel Faber,Charles Dickens,Robert Westall,Sebastian Faulks and Erich Maria Remarque.
Now I like a ripping yarn as much as anybody,but I need to see balance,can anyone recommend authors,books that might be set in historical Scotland (for lads and lassies),by modern writers (Michel Faber,Irvine Welsh excepted).
I agree back at you Les Wilson 9.18am, and wouldn’t it be helpful if that core body of pro-Indy commentators were to be thrown bones on a regular basis from Mission Control in the SNP bunker? The SNP would not need to say a word in open condemnation of the BBC or newspapers, but could simply show a little preferential respect towards a fledgling mechanism intent on spreading the pro-Independence narrative. In an instant, these sites become vital, and potential sources for original news items and the launching of new initiatives; and in theory at least gain a higher profile and more traffic.
I repeat, and not for the first time, the Native American Cherokee philosophy that we are born with two souls from the wolf; the good soul and the evil soul. The soul which thrives and grows stronger to dominate the other is whichever one you feed.
Isn’t it about time our Scottish Government started feeding our pro-Indy wolves on a richer protein diet? Or is even that too radical a suggestion for the SNP? Mum’s the word eh? It’s all under control. Trust us. We’re the professionals. Frankly, I don’t care any more. I’m currently getting yet another SNP shit dropped on my head, and If the SNP won’t step forward and seize the initiative, then somebody more capable properly should. Be a double boost if I can also vote for them next election and not break faith with Independence.
@ Carjamtic
How about Diane Gabaldon’s “Outlander”? The author is American but theme certainly is Scottish historical.
Carjamtic
Murray Armstrongs – The Liberty Tree. The story of Thomas Muir. Can’t recommend it highly enough. There’s history, geography, society, all the big names in history, the French Revolution, the New World, battles oh and the fight for justice and reform
@ schrodingers cat
tam jardine
crazycat.
1st I dont want or need a profile,there are plenty more Indy people who can communicate much better than myself . I have always said the Grassroots Movement should have stayed together but the Election & the EGO’S of the leftist groups caused fractions & again we have Robin McAlpine via the National pushing the leftist agenda,from my perspective there is no left & right or right/left of centre, there are only People who want Independence, all these groups will continue & argue but when the chips are down its there way or no way.
Would any of these Political Party,s / Leaders make a commitment that Independence is 1st & foremost & willing to put they,re political view,s aside for the greater good of the People of Scotland ??????.
I,ve joined Scottish Independence Movement & will put my energies into that Grassroots Movement . I cant see Fox/Rise/SSP working with the only Political Party who have any possibility of being in Goverment in Scotland & that is the SNP . Taking a lesson from nature, a Tree in the Forrest sprouts branches as & when it needs to but only for the greater good of the Trunk & it then reaches for the Light, when will these Ego,s see the Light.
@ carjamtic again
Nigel Tranter not modern enough? His Macbeth and Wallace novels are historical.
“In his lifetime, Tranter wrote more than 100 books, most of them historical fiction, a few westerns and books for children. His magnum opus was a five-volume history of the fortified house in Scotland. His passion for castles and defensive dwellings was what first drew him to writing, and as his career progressed it was this unquenchable fascination that made him, for a time, one of Britain’s most popular historical novelists.”
https://archive.is/eaCNS
Now I like a ripping yarn as much as anybody,but I need to see balance,can anyone recommend authors,books that might be set in historical Scotland (for lads and lassies),by modern writers (Michel Faber,Irvine Welsh excepted).
This is pretty good.
Rob Roy Macgregor: His Life And Times (Canongate) By W.H. Murray
It’s a bit dry in places but sets out Scotland changing as the union with anther country really starts to kick in. The English kept being surprised that all Scots were literate and often spoke French. It just didn’t happen in 18th C England.
Also, Robert the Bruce died on this day, just along from Dumbarton. Its funny how Scottish anniversaries are never mentioned in teamGB.
Its not.
@Robert Peffers
The Establishment. The Many Headed Hydra.
It would be a welcome addition to Indie2 if we can detail most of the interconnections running the BritState. They are our enemy. I have no doubt. To win we must know our enemy. Knowledge is strength.
This time we shall triumph.
Soon!
@ Breeks I thought I was to long on my last post at 10.48 or I would have mentioned the lack of SNP support to the Grassroots Movement as I challenge every Snp MPs & MSPs as I meet them.
Breeks says:
I note what you say and broadly agree. Also, on one hand I am disappointed that the SNP are not assisting smaller groups to grow and take on the media, and of course Westminster propaganda generally. However, we live in real politics and that is what is also needed.
They do miss things that we, the people are angry about, but again in the real world they need to show the supporter and future supporter that they CAN govern, and govern fairly well.
The best Government Scotland has ever had, to date.
Nevertheless, they need to recognise that we are in a communal effort for Independence and others need to be in the big way of things. Support for a concentrated attack on all things coming from the UKPK media, and Westminster need to be attacked at the same time, all in Unison and across every way we can muster.
That could result in a potent force for Indy, but it needs a large meeting of all who want to take this idea on. Rather than be fragmented, we need to all speak with one voice for our mutual Indy 2 benefit.
Otherwise we get more of the same, and will be harder to beat. So drop the pettiness and growing distrust, that is what Westminster wants. The past is past, learn the real lessons and go forward together.
I you want to get into drama, David Greig’s “Dunsinane” is good. Set after the defeat of Macbeth it focuses on Gruach and the English military leader Siward. Radio 3 broadcast it in 2011 and it is available as a book.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunsinane_(play)
Breeks,
Here is something that may interest you, it does me. Scroll down past the photos on site and find The National Yes Registry video.
Let me know as a matter of interest what you think of it as a concept. I think it would be advantageous, if only all the blogs and those higher up the Indy chain would do the same.
Breeks
OOPs
http://munguinsrepublic.blogspot.co.uk/
Capella,Molly,Heedtracker
Brilliant,that’s me and mine,sorted for the next wee while,I would like to think that the schools,would include these books,(The Liberty Tree and Thomas Muir sounds particularly exciting).
🙂
This book gives an insight into the psyche of the medieval english ruling elite, not changed that much today, it goes a long way to explain why the Welsh are the way they are today.
A Great and Terrible King: Edward I and the Forging of Britain
by Marc Morris
462pp, Hutchinson
Scots historical aside, Scotland region wise, Multi millionaire SLabour donor Lord Willie Haughey, who led the 2014 Scottish Christians Faith in the Union vote NO campaign, splashed the cash this week.
http://www.glasgowlive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/gold-replica-european-cup-won-11414296
Wee Ginger Dug:
”If you wanted an illustration of the laws of karma you can’t do much better than to look at the Labour party in Scotland. It is in fact pretty much all that the party is good for. Having spent the last few decades telling Scotland that it’s too wee, too poor and too stupid to become independent, Labour has haemorrhaged so much support over the years that it doesn’t have a big enough membership base to fund itself, and is reliant upon tranfers of monies from the UK party in order to keep afloat. And it’s lost so many elected politicians over the years that it has long since gone through the bottom of the muddy puddle at the bottom of its talent pool and it’s reduced to touting the likes of James Kelly, Anas, and Jackie Baillie as big hitters. Intelligent and thoughtful young kids who were considering a career in politics once looked naturally to Labour as their first choice, no more.
The irony is that it’s Labour in Scotland which can’t become independent because it’s too wee, too poor and too stupid. Scotland will prosper without them.”
https://weegingerdug.wordpress.com/2016/06/06/too-wee-too-poor-and-too-stupid-for-independence/
Historical aside correction, vote NO 2014 or your going to hell Lord Haughey, actually paid £71,341 not £58k for that gold cup. There’s a 23% auction charge on top. Lord Haughey is a SLabour philanthropist and facts are sacred.
@Capella
Dunsinane is/was superb. Siobhan Redmond utterly spellbinding….. “I am Queen!”
Citizens Theatre, Glasgow was my viewing location.
http://www.citz.co.uk/whatson/info/dunsinane/
The embedded videos work!
“Ones I contributed to that I don’t see on the list:”
As I said above, I only tracked ones that made over £1000 or it’d have been an endless job.
@Robert Peffers
I myself am descended from the Duke of Beaufort, and I say that not because I’m proud of it because I wouldn’t really know how it felt to be or not to be, and I only know it because I have a brother obsessed by that kind of thing (He’s a Yoon of course and Soooo proud) but there must be loads of us and I don’t mean the Charlamagne theory
Not disagreeing with you Ronnie @10.48, but maybe tweaking your perspective.
Maybe we are unfair in asking so much of the SNP. By all means, embrace the SNP as the political voice of an Independent Scotland, but maybe we all got that wrong last time. For once I don’t mean that in an anti SNP way… Breathe easy one and all.
It’s not the stupid question it first appears, but is Scottish sovereignty merely a political issue? How many people do you know who simply switch off “Ach, it’s just politics. Same old, same old…” and never engage with the true significance of being our own masters? They are quicker off the mark changing channels than Alan Wells on hearing the words “There now follows a party political broadcast by the…”
For example, maybe we need a Farmers forum to set out the pros and cons of Independence as it affects farming. Maybe we need a Public Services forum, and armed services forum, construction, education…. The whole spectrum of Scottish life engaging in the neutral and objective summary of what Sovereign independence actually means for them and their “bubble”. Take the politics right out of the equation as far as that is humanly possible. In fact, we should go out of our way to make sure politics, and career politicians, do not interfere with the debate or colour the conclusions at all.
It’s not a new concept, far from it. The city fathers of Dundee had their “Nine Trades” to shepherd and structure the co-ordinated growth of their City. London and other cities did likewise, and many of these medieval livery companies still exist. Why should we confine Scottish Independence to a political debate and let politicians have all the fun? Why not have City Fathers for our Country? Too daft? Hmmm…
Maybe some of these “forums”, or guilds perhaps, wouldn’t come down in favour of Independence, but if that’s an objective and apolitical conclusion, then that’s fine. It’s kinda the whole point actually. At worst it’s a baseline for constructive debate, not something to be hi-jacked by political one-up-man-ship.
It could be a very positive initiative to pursue, but it should be rigorously apolitical in its conclusions if that is in any way possible. If we had that kind of structure to our society, it would survive well beyond our Declaration of Independence, and exist for as long as we wanted it to, to guide our society through periods of trial or uncertainty.
I’m sure I recall some debate about the Scottish Parliament requiring a second chamber… (Yawn, wasn’t really listening), but suppose instead we had the permanent “Twelve Guilds of Scotland” (or however many Guilds we need) to serve the function of City Fathers of the Nation.
Just imagine it already existed, and before the Brexit referendum, we would have our Guild deliver an informed objective summary of the issues for us to mull over and consider. Strikes me that’s a good deal more positive than a never ending procession of hysterical propagandists all talking through their respective arses and telling us nothing.
Know what? I’ve suddenly come over all red, white and blue. Not with Union Jackery, but I suddenly find myself appreciating the concept of America’s “Founding Fathers” in a whole new light…
If everyone stopped critising the SNP is might help. The (non) Greens wasting £Billions of public money hanging on to the SNP shirt tails and members money. YES campaign. Troughing liars.
Independence is coming. The SNP have side stepped the Tories, Labour and now will have to side step the (non) Greens. Reneging on their policies and colluding with the Unionists at every opportunity. Ruining City Centres, building grotesque carbuncles, that no one wants and getting the City into £Millions of debt. 2017.
The Labour/Unionists wring their hands about the Oil crisis. It is the Westminster Gov who have tried to destroy it. Taxing it at 60/80% when the price had fallen 75%. It is still 40%. They are total hypocrites. Losing thousands of jobs,
Shell are hypocritical liars. They are benefit from Scottish resources not the other way round.
mealer
We need to know the name and address of every Yes sympathiser in Scotland?That requires more activists and much,much more activism than we saw in 2014.
for 3 years, we collected info by canvasing, this data was fed back to yes scotland who input the info into YESMO data base.
on sept19th, they deleted it.
a criminal act of stupidity. we are in this campaign for the long run, make sure you keep a copy of the results of all canvasing done in your area
Investigatory Powers Bill:
‘Almost three quarters don’t know powers of Bill which will end online privacy and put our personal security at risk’
The Commons debate and vote on the Bill today and tomorrow is the final major piece of Parliamentary business before the EU referendum on June 23.
If the Bill passes, the new law will give security services and intelligence agencies more power to monitor the communications of every person in the UK. These include greater access to web browsing records.
Communications companies and internet service providers would have to store every single person’s communications data, including records of calls, texts, emails and their internet connection records – effectively their entire browsing history for a year.’
……………………………….
‘Joanna Cherry QC, MP: Some sections of Bill remain ‘concerning’
AT THE second reading of the Investigatory Powers Bill the SNP expressed grave concerns and abstained on the basis we would work at committee stage to amend it – and if it was not amended satisfactorily we would vote it down at a later stage. It appears that stage has now been reached…..
However, we are very concerned that some of the powers in the Bill run contrary to decisions of the Court of Justice of the EU and the European Court of Human Rights.They also significantly exceed powers provided for in other western democracies.
The retention of internet connection records and bulk powers, which have been the subject of criticism by the UN special rapporteur on privacy, both fall into these categories…..
In committee the SNP tabled numerous amendments to attempt to achieve these principles as a thread running throughout the Bill and to remove those provisions which were not in accordance with law and unjustifiable.
Not one was accepted……”
http://www.thenational.scot/news/almost-three-quarters-dont-know-powers-of-bill-which-will-end-online-privacy-and-put-our-personal-security-at-risk.18461
@schrodingers cat
Who made the decision to delete the database?
A deep-cover yoon in YesScotland?
Sorry (not) to keep on about the rancid BBC but that establishment organization really is the biggest britnat pile of… influence on the lazy and less-well-informed. The BBC specializes on misinformation designed to send the great British lovers of butcher’s apron-ness on spasms of imperialist glory. Don’t pay the BBC tax.
The Labour/Unionists wring their hands about the Oil crisis. It is the Westminster Gov who have tried to destroy it. Taxing it at 60/80% when the price had fallen 75%. It is still 40%. They are total hypocrites. Losing thousands of jobs,
What’s actually happening to oil and gas? Our imperial master baiters bleat on, we’re doomed but
http://www.hl.co.uk/news/2016/6/6/commodities-beating-global-bonds-and-stocks-in-2016
Oil has rebounded sharply from lows in January to about $50 a barrel as motorists burn record amounts of petrol and crude production declines in the US. Gold, often traded as an alternative currency, increased as the dollar began to fade”.
George Kerevan: ‘Vote Leave and you risk playing into the hands of the right wing.’
”… However, we cannot hide the fact there is another side to the EU project. At its heart, the EU was a creation of the capitalist elites of Western Europe who sought – and seek – a political and economic bulwark against the dominant US capitalism that emerged out of the Second World War.
Germany needed time to rebuild an industrial base pulverised by Allied bombing. France and Italy needed to modernise their peasant agriculture – in passing destroying the rural base of their local communist parties while sending millions to the big cities to form a new factory proletariat. A protected market was created behind whose tariff walls big European companies could emerge to take on the Americans. Welcome not to social Europe but to the Europe of the multinationals….
But by the start of millennium, the Big Brother EU of the multi-nationals had reasserted its hegemony. The age of neo-liberalism had dawned. With China back in the world market as a low-cost industrial competitor, and with US capitalism taking the technological lead with regard to the internet, European “managed” capitalism was suddenly on the back foot. Germany seized the initiative by undermining the big trades unions through draconian labour market reforms which reduced export costs.
Enter the eurozone project as a way of imposing fixed exchange rates across most of Continental Europe – with the rate rigged in Germany’s favour. Result: a shiny new German export model built on austerity, mass youth unemployment, and stagnant wages across the EU…..
So why vote to Remain in a Europe that is a citadel and bastion of global exploitation? An EU that has imposed mass austerity and trampled on the rights of small nations such as Greece? An EU that casually bombed Libya back into the Stone Age? The answer as to why I’ll be voting Remain, despite the foregoing, is very simple. In the present political balance of forces, a Brexit vote can only reinforce populist and right-wing forces across Europe – Tory Little Englanders and Ukip, the semi-fascist Front National in France, the unsavoury AfD in Germany, plus assorted racist parties across the continent…..”
http://www.thenational.scot/comment/george-kerevan-vote-leave-and-you-risk-playing-into-the-hands-of-the-right-wing.18153
Just In:
The MOD have admitted this morning they have run out of money and the type 26 Frigates promised to be built on the Clyde won’t happen until at least 2018, and have urged the UK Government to come clean over it
I’ll say no more
@Dan Huil –
Agreed.
The problem is that we cannot know how successful the ‘Don’t Pay’ campaign has been. The BBC will not divulge numbers of non-paying households, hypocritically using ‘commercial confidentiality’ as an excuse.
I don’t have verifiable stats, but someone like Prof John Robertson is likely to have a better idea than most. What he doesn’t have is any hard data to back-up estimates that approx 1 million household UK-wide have simply stopped paying it. If we apply the usual 10% to account for the Scottish wedge of that, then the BBC must be ‘losing’ somewhere in the region of £150 million in Scotland alone.
Perhaps someone could do a big, detailed poll to establish the extent of non-payment in Scotland? It could ask people why they’ve stopped. It could also ask licence-fee payers under what circumstances they’d no longer support it. It’s the sort of thing that the BBC must know already, but the PR damage of releasing such data would be catastrophic – they’ll never ever do it.
Re Yes registry
I think some of you have got the wrong idea about the registry. All the Yes groups do their own thing, it’s there for us to share ideas, show what works and what hasn’t worked.
It’s very social, and for the groups that still meet, ours is once a month, it gives us something to focus on while things are quite. What it could do is have a place where the still active Yes groups could be ready for…well anything we want really.
Petra @ 12.28
Investigatory powers Bill knocks the Named Person issue into a cocked hat. Do you thingMs Davidson and friends went big on the Named Person as a diversion from this horrendous Bill?
Petra sums it up for me!
“…The answer as to why I’ll be voting Remain, despite the foregoing, is very simple. In the present political balance of forces, a Brexit vote can only reinforce populist and right-wing forces across Europe – Tory Little Englanders and Ukip, the semi-fascist Front National in France, the unsavoury AfD in Germany, plus assorted racist parties across the continent…..”
We will fragment an organisation which we agree needi reformed into islands of Right Wing camps of isolationism.the next part of that journey will not be pretty.
@Ian Brotherhood.
I think it will be a dam-breaking situation where all appears fine until one more refusal to pay sets the destruction on its inevitable course. The BBC will, as you say, still pretend everything is fine but word will get out and people in England will say, well we’re not going to pay if they don’t.
carjamtic @ 10.30
Dorothy Dunner’s ‘And King Hereafter’
It is about McB. Fiction but full of historical detail.
O/T
School Books
Forgot to say
The thoughts behind this,I re-read a book last night ‘We Are Writers’ school kids (S3), encouraged to write their own, (historical fiction/non fiction)short stories,which were then all compiled into a book for parents to buy….all good.
68 Short Stories in total
Subjects
WW2 – 21
WW1 – 04
Ancient Rome/Greece – 15
Victorian London – 08
American History – 08
Scottish History – 06
Titanic – 03
Other Subjects – 03
From this little straw poll,less than 10% of the stories are about Scotland,not sure what that means apart from obvious perceived imbalance ?
Anyway a little bit of data,thought I would share,it seems a bit odd….but is it ?.
Breeks@12.14
There is a facebook page called Farmers for YES.
A £million. Fantastic!
Re my post @ 1.16 pm
Not McB…..MACBETH. Note to self: read the damn thing before hitting ‘submit’.
@Petra
I think GK puts into words how I feel about the EU debacle.
The moves of schauble and the troika over Greece disgusted me and the euro member nations dancing to a German tune but at some point Germany won’t have anyone to export to the way things are going and project will Devour itself.
Spain is only seeing growth because it has broken the stability growth pact rules worked out by Delors on a fag packet one afternoon.
Obviously the UK isn’t bound by the SGP but it is ‘desirable’ that its deficit sits along similar lines. If I thought for a minute that Bojo and co wanted to come out in order to undertake fiscal expansion beyond the levels desired by the troika I would be out campaigning for a brexit. I think however their motives are far more sinister.
@ Legerwood says at 1:05 pm …. ”Petra …. Investigatory powers Bill knocks the Named Person issue into a cocked hat. Do you think Ms Davidson and friends went big on the Named Person as a diversion from this horrendous Bill?”
Named person, EU Ref? Exactly Legerwood she’ll be working hand in glove with her southern pals. It also annoys me that no one else seems to be reporting this …. Scottish news SNP Baad, murder, mayhem and fitbae. Scots as usual being treated like mushrooms.
As to the named person policy the meeja should be connecting the dots between them (Tories, Labour and Libdems) overturning the abolishment of the Corroboration Law and trying to block the named person policy. I’ve rarely felt so annoyed about anything other than this. These morons using our children, leaving them at greater risk than anywhere else in the UK (the Civilised World other than the Netherlands), to score points with the SNP. Diabolical to say the least.
@ Clootie says at 1:05 pm …. ”Petra sums it up for me!
Sums it up for me too Clootie. I’ll be voting Remain and then we get out of the hellhole push for an iScotland EU Referendum (if we don’t get a deal that suits us) following analysis of all the facts (options / alternative markets) without having to put up with lying and scaremongering.
For the fans on here – Outlander get Series 3 and 4.
I know some think it’s a bit sappy, but it does adhere to the key Scottish events and players, so anything that gives some history, or prompts people to check out more is good.
SNP has just e-mailed to say they are holding a Local gov’t event at Ayr racecourse.
It’s an event for anyone thinking of standing next year, and will cover selection processes etc
Out of the traps early!
Fair game not to pay BBC licence fee but we have to challenge them and engage with it as it is the main source of UKOK propaganda.
The No Scotland nutters who write SNP baad letters to the Scotsman and other papers every other day do not have much influence compared to BBC TV.
The SNP’s mantra of positive campaigning is right for a progressive political party but others need to counter the UKOK propaganda and spell out their errors at every opportunity.
However it would if the BBC would have an SNP sympathiser on every press review / political comment spot. You can bet the BBC / STV / Sky always has a UK government supporter on EVERY newspaper review / political comment slot from London.
Double standards as usual from the UKOK brigade.
How often were the NO side challenged on their assertions during the Scottish referendum ? Contrast that with the balanced EU coverage.
@Dr Jim
I saw that delay on the frigates. I wonder if they are waiting to see if we leave?
On a related subject, info has emerged that work has already begun on renewal and upgrade of Trident warheads. Costs are still escalating.
Also read there are boots on the ground in Syria and Afghanistan. UK boots, that is. And not the secret kind.
Right, I’ve had it..
A puppet, and an embarrassment of a politician
(R.Davidson)..
..spreading distrust around our social services..
..while kissing the arse of
the current Pig-Fucker-General
(D.CAMERON)..
..who is enabled in this deliberate
mis-aporopriation of mis-trust.. by
the We Still Love Jimmy Saville and The War Broadcasting and Propoganda Executive.
(BBC)
Astronaut Howard Walowitz didnt take this photo of teamGB but look at the sheer scale of Scotland, compared to usual BBC weather and their tiny wee scotland region propaganda.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/timpeake/27499657575/
Robert Kerr
not a yoon troll, just blind stupidity by those involved. they have been shaving the walls and provaricating about the bush ever since i raised the issue.
the red faces just wish i would go away, spilt milk etc.. data protection etc…but my advice to those local groups who collect canvasing data for your locality, by all means offer a copy to yes2 scotland etc, but keep a copy for yourselves.
as i said, we are in this for the long game.
yes scotland should have input the electoral roll into a simple Office libre Base or MS Access, a lot of data inputing, but done by pros it could be achieved in short order, then email the local groups the relevent file for their area. canvasing returns can be input at a local level then a copy email back to yes2scotland.
since this info is already in the public domain there are no data protection issues
Joanna Cherry just handed Simon Hoare his ass!
Parliament channel on investigatory powers bill.
Bit of a rammy as the Tory is insulting Scotland’s MPs ..
@schrodingers cat
Thanks for that.
The Electoral roll data is the key. Public domain info.
Would be interesting to canvas again and find out how many have been disappeared with the new system.
As you say we are in this for keeps.
Colin Doig
Re Yes registry
spot on colin
during indyref1, yesnef got very little help from yes scotland, i didnt see anyone else in my area canvasing and delivering leaflets except us. certainly didnt see blair jenkins. the best literature and leaflets we got during the campaign was the WBB and the best campaign equipment was the 10,000 flags
the hustings were organised by us and we invited the speakers.
the ideas by the yes registry and others are about “putting the band back together” and firing a starting gun etc, but no one is niave enough here in yesNef to think that it will be anyone else other than us who will run the indyref2 campaign here.
re left or right wing indy supporters, celebs etc, it will be us who decides who represents yesnef, no one else
eg, i dont particularly like tommy sheridan, but if eg yes pollock want him to represent them, so be it. none of my business.
if the youth wing of the indy movement want ross greer to represent them, bear in mind he is only just out of high school and looks about 14, you get to suck it up and fuck off 🙂
@ ScottieDog says at 1:42 pm …. ”Petra I think GK puts into words how I feel about the EU debacle. The moves of schauble and the troika over Greece disgusted me and the euro member nations dancing to a German tune but at some point Germany won’t have anyone to export to the way things are going and project will Devour itself. ”
BOTH well worth watching.
‘The Nazi-Fascist Origins of the EU Superstate – Rodney Atkinson.’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yV-6pHdUpfk
The Brussels Business – Who Runs the EU?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMuUEd6w54E
pick up dictionary and look up
grass roots movement
One of my favourite reads set in Scotland is Kings of the Night by Robert E Howard,
it involves the Picts,Romans,Vikings,Scots,and King Kull,
Sword and Sorcery/Fantasy Fiction,
very much underrated writer,
Worms of the Earth which involves the Picts is also fantastic.
BOTH well worth watching.
‘The Nazi-Fascist Origins of the EU Superstate – Rodney Atkinson.’
Up to and through WW2, much of Europe was fascist, not neo, just plain old fascist. Pick any big European country including the UK and there was a whole lot of fascism going on. Italy’s one example, France, Holland, all were fascist to the point where its hard to work out who was Hitler’s biggest collaborator. Many were scared of Bolshevism but the fact is Russian Bolshevism defeated Nazi Germany and fascist Europe.
The US is commemorating D-Day this week but one of the great drivers for D-Day for the Allies, was the likelihood of the whole Europe coming under Stalinist Russian control by 1945.
Re the YES Scotland database of YES voters, if they have deleted it, it’s probably because of Data Protection. I had to fill in a standard form, which specifies the use fort personal data collected, and YES Scotland would have had to do the same. It’s likely it was for the specific purpose of the Indy Ref, which was on the 18th September, so in that case they’d have to delete it very soon after.
dads
i collected that data over a 3 year period in my area
if i ask my next door neighbour how he is going to vote and he tells me, i am able to write that down on a piece of paper
this data protection idea is a crock of ….
the snp were so cautious they wouldnt tell us who the members were in my area.. found out 1 day before may 2015 my next door neighbour was. an snp member. We can take this idea of data protection to such a degree, that we tie our own hands. do you think that the bt campaign focused their efforts on scaring pensioners without access to a data base?
the point i was making was, if you collect data from canvasing in your area, keep a copy
@schrodingers cat The act applies to hard copy data too.
http://www.bath.ac.uk/data-protection/data-protection-act/index.html
I think I might have typed “cat” instead of “act” – can’t see it yet because … internet/wordpress delay.
you could also ask why the snp or yes need such data since it isnt them who deliver any leaflets or canvas here. it is myself and a few others who do all of this work.
O/T
Just saw a news report of Cameron saying that there are lies being told about Britex!! How terrible, now who would do that to get their own way??
@cat
Strange, there’s no current ICO registration for YES Scotland Ltd – https://ico.org.uk/esdwebpages/search
I guess if they have no personal data stored, they don’t need one any more. But they would have had one, BT got into trouble becauase they hadn’t registered (a blunder):
http://archive.is/hWgc5
The main two orgganisations would be scrutinised, but a local YES group could hide below the parapet.
Interestingly YES Scotland Ltd is shown as having £75.1 K of funds left (or at least shareholders funds).
jim thomson
so the tories delete all their data files after every election?
Stu:
Here’s the link: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/500-miles-in-5-days#/
Mark Coburn
Would a toryboy world media led by the tory BBC, ever cover let alone mention democracy in action like this level of fund raising?
Instead, they strike back with
http://archive.is/O2l0J
From “Anti-journalism hysteria is polluting our civic spaces”
to
http://wingsoverscotland.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/bellend4.jpg
Its very a creepy trade that’s more than happy to dish it out but and etc…
Scot Finlayson 3 06
Are you suggesting it’s time to send for Conan The Cybernat?!
@Valerie
Bombs Goood! War Goood! Money to be made out of war and bombing folk and destabilising countries and selling the technology for doing it for lots and lots of Moolah to the Saudis so they keep pumping out masses of oil in order to keep the price down and then not complaining about them bombing Yemen next door to them, but if it were any other country they’d be labeled as terrorists, of course the UK couldn’t do that because they’d be labeling themselves as accomplices to a terrorist country
It all suits the good old UK of England though,
Probably just a coincidence on the price of oil and a coincidence on not building the ships and a coincidence over steel
I await with anticipation for more coincidences from our masters in the coming months
Not that I’m a conspiracy theorist or anything, or am I?
What I do know is the Tories of both colours have always been very good at the slow patient stripping of assets game in Scotland,
They promise, then strip, then say it’s all going to be OK then wait a couple of years and strip again, then promise again and on it goes
67 years watching it happen, and first learning from my Dad how they went about their business and they’ve not changed their modus operandi
People have always fallen for it because of this patient drip drip of promises followed by strip strip followed by threat of unemployment and poverty without them
The UK is a vile organisation of Imperialists who will hang on to their last vestiges of power and influence to the exclusion of all else
Poverty and death in another country means nothing to the UK, look at what they did to India, stripped it crushed it impoverished it beyond belief and then smashed in two in order to retain some control, and called them names and laughed at them while they did it
Sound Familiar?
Nicola Sturgeon influential?! My Slovene girlfriend will be furious
http://archive.is/rcwuR
Adam Tomkins MSP ?@ProfTomkins Jun 3
Adam Tomkins MSP Retweeted Kenny Farquharson
Strong. Conservative. Opposition.
Kenny Farquharson @KennyFarq
Can’t remember the last time SNP had a week as bad as this one. Falling standards in schools; fracking; NP. Entirely on back foot.
15 retweets 38 likes
@Sharney Dubs
Cameron should be telt!
These are “Political Lies” and are Legal.
Tested in court!
carjamtic,
Regarding recommended Scottish authors,I would recommend James Robertson he has written some great novels.
Joseph Knight is a great read the story centre’s around the first black slave in Scotland and his fight to be freed from his owner.
Also and the land lay still which covers Scotland’s political landscape from the early fifties to the present (there is a great chapter on Wullie McRae) also heard the Fanatic is good but have still to read.
Happy reading!
Dr Jim @ 4:19
Very familiar
Like witnessing,inebriated old Etonian Hooligans,attempting a tune on a Stradivarius….on being told,they have no talent,that they are useless.
They spitefully, smash it on the floor,before kicking it into little pieces,now they know Indy is coming,they are doing the same to Scotland…these twisted,little people cannot be allowed to govern our fantastic country any longer,let’s get them out,before it’s too late….while we still have the chance.
What they cannot master,they will destroy.
@cat
I went through the stages for registing a certain organisation at atlantic quay, which also had the trading name of SNPBad, and you come to this screen to which you have to answer “yes”:
“When collecting personal information, we tell people how we will use it”
“We keep records of people’s personal information up to date and don’t keep it longer than necessary”
The referendum is over, so they can’t keep it, and even if they weren’t specific, it was clearly understood the information was collected for Indy Ref 1 – not Indy Ref 2.
They’d be breaking the law if they kept the information “any longer than neccessary”.
The Tory party on the other hand gets the infor not just for one elction, but for a lifetime of them. Having said that, there was some dodgy use by both Tories and Labour during the Ref. Posters here complained about fundraising attempts, but have just put in a survey or something.
The Rev tweeted this “ABC1 demographic in Scotland back Remain 62-27. DE group is a much tighter 45-36.” from an ICM poll.
There is hidden significance there for Indyref2 if it is called because of Brexit.
ABC1 voted No, DE voted Yes. We therefore have the most pro EU people also pro Union.
This might mean many NOs will take offence at Brexit and switch to Yes.
Or, it might mean that Indyref2 could be on shaky ground if previous Yes people are anti EU.
Complicates things further!
dads
i understand the semantics of the argument
but it is a bit like H&S legislation, how far do you push hygene laws? do all girl guides now need a kitchen inspection before they can make chocolate brownies for the local jumble sale?
maybe yes scotland was a properly formed organisation but yesnef wasnt. i didnt sign anything.
the desire to do the right thing and follow the letter of the law is admirable, but i doubt the unionist destroyed their data??
the loss of the yesmo data is a huge loss to the indy movement
next time dont limit ourselves to a ref but until scotland is independent. sorted
Any bets that this latest attempt by Westminster re. data capture is intended to crack down on sites such as this? The English hate comparisons being made of them with their close cousins the Germans…but the same racial superiority arrogance and fascist attitudes suppurate out of their rotten body politic with every move they make.
Good Scottish literature?….try Raymond Campbell Paterson”s trilogy on Scottish history particularly ‘My wound is deep’ about the later Scots/Anglo wars..this has accounts of Scots armies in France and the execution of Scottish prisoners as ‘("Tractor" - Ed)s’ by the English. John Prebble is good for history also with ‘culloden’ etc. And of course ‘Sunset Song’ trilogy by Grassic Gibbon.
I have been wondering at who would run the No campaign in Indyref 2? In 2014 Labour were still arguably the political establishment in Scotland, with bulk of MPs. Now they lost the MPs, next year they lose councils. The Tories are crowing they are replacing Labour as the opposition.
So I don’t think the Tories will agree to it being the Darling and Brown show again, while Labour will not share platforms with Tories again. So how do they cobble together an organisation that the Electoral Commission views as the official No campaign. Will the EC have to choose between Labour and Tory campaigns?
One of many reasons I think we need Indyref2 asap.
whinge over
it probably isnt worth crying over spilled milk
just bear this in mind when canvasing in indyref2
Craig Murray @ 6:10pm
Interesting point Craig.
There’s the Labour Branch Office has-beens of Wee Dougie Alexander, Murphy and who can forget Magrit along with assorted failed councillors, failed MSP’s, failed MP’s and generally failures in life.
They have a veritable cesspool of excrement to choose from.
Lib Dems and Tories are the same.
We will see soon enough but the figurehead might not be a politician. McTearful or even the childrens story writer. Perhaps they’ll throw a spanner into the works!
craig
how about john barrowman, or eddie izzard?
Jacob Rees-Mogg’s walk about in dundee went well?
snigger
Or Lizzie Battenberg of Saxe Coburg Gotha. They could cut out the middlemen.
@Cat
Annie Lennox will bite your paw off for that gig.
i thocht oor annie came oot fur yes?
@ Schrödinger’s cat …… The last comment I heard from Annie Lennox before the Referendum was that the Union Flag was starting to appeal to her……… However during a BBC Scotland interview years previously she had made pro Indy noises……
“Here’s the link: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/500-miles-in-5-days#/“
Um, that one’s always been there (about 23 from the bottom of the list). I only counted it as £5,350 rather than £10,700 because IIRC the excess went to foodbanks, not indyref campaigning.
Craig Murray @ 6.10
It will be the BBC, same as last time. If they can’t find a new anchor, they’ll just do another “Have I Got News For You” and drop in a different celebrity stooge every week. I know I’m saying that tongue in cheek, but truth be known, any scarecrow ripe from any field would have sufficed as a stand-in for Alistair Darling last time around. To stretch the analogy, Better Together relaunched themselves every other week too. Thoroughly dismal, but that’s red herrings for you, and a measure of how superfluous Better Together actually was to our informed analysis and constructive debate.
More seriously, I know our YES 2 grassroots revival is the right approach and needs to be done, but I just get misgivings we are placing our faith in the same blunt “numbers game” as Saddams Republican guard did, while the BBC enjoys a similarly comparable technical superiority in the airwaves which Stormin’ Norman Schwarzkopf enjoyed in the air. We all know how that panned out.
Whichever way I look at this conundrum, the picture I see is always the same. It’s the media. That is the lynchpin. With fair and balanced media, we immerse ourselves in honest and informative discussion, then we win. With the status quo poisoned airwaves and Tokyo Kaye lowering the bar, well, the real debate never happens and struggle trudges on like the McEwan’s ad from the 80’s climbing the infinite Escher stairs.
If we are serious about winning, but the SNP government remains so unduly camera shy, then it will be YES2 which has to get clever and inventive, and resolve this media deficit. It won’t be enough just to be popular. To quote Blackadder’s Baldrick, we need a cunning plan… but stoney faced and with a heavy emphasis on cunning.
Annie Lennox came out for no. She talked about us having to get over our anti English thing.
Great performer ad good record re politics hat she is, I was hugely disappointed.
I still think the best possible “shot across the bows” warning that Scotland could give to the Propaganda Cartell is calling for a plebiscite, in part focussed on whether Broadcasting should be a reserved matter. Why not take a leaf out the Better Together handbook, play dirty, and subtly imply the abolition of the licence fee might be printed on the same ticket? Wouldn’t that be delicious fun?
Hell, I chuckle merely at the mischief potential of it… And we might just get lucky and land Indyref2 issues some neutral exposure and the fighting chance of reasoned objective debate which Indyref1 was denied…… Yeah, ok, let’s not get carried away.
But let the resulting hysteria be our red herring for the media to fret about, while we use their frantic distraction to quietly launch our stealthy deployment ready for the main pincer assault to rescue our sovereignty.
We do have a main pincer assault plan, …don’t we? How is it coming along?…
Annie Lennox
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk
Aaaghh
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/entertainment/celebrity/annie-lennox-scots-need-grow-4430006#bwo5jyvKXM4khIh2.97
Just back from sunnier climes, thanks for this, Rev!
In simple terms – we are a very broad church that’s why we argue so much amongst ourselves, the bitter together tosspots don’t have that problem, they all sing from the same hymn sheet, poor bassa’s!
Am away for a tune or two over on OT, thank’s again Rev!!!