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Wings Over Scotland

Something to think about

Posted on April 30, 2014 by

STV Sport has tonight broken the news that Scotland will play England in a friendly international at Hampden on November 18 this year.


Would you like to imagine, readers, the songs the visiting England support might sing if Scotland had voted to continue being ruled by them exactly two months earlier?

If you feel your strength sapping between now and September, remember that.

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345 to “Something to think about”

  1. goldenayr says:

    I know what we’ll be singing..

    Goodbyee,goodbyee,please don’t cryee.

    In our best Spike Milligan of course.

  2. Arbroath 1320 says:

    I wonder who they talked to, it wasn’t by any chance Gordon “British jobs for British workers” Brown by any chance?

    No doubt on the day of the match Brown will be there, assuming he has nothing else of significance to attend to, wearing his union jack suit and waving his union jack flag to cheer on the boys. That will be the boys from SOUTH of the border that is. 😉

  3. Seasick Dave says:

    I’d imagine that they might be singing “The Laughing Policeman’.

  4. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Makes it all seem that wee bit sharper, more real, eh?

    Plenty of DKs’ ears will prick up when they hear about this.

  5. Paul says:

    I usually agree with you Rev but not on this. What about the English people who will vote Yes? Stories like this will alienate potential Yes voters who aren’t Scottish and have their own, non nationalist reasons for considering a Yes vote.

  6. Murray McCallum says:

    I remember that day very well:

    NZ All blacks 62 – 31 Scotland
    Scotland 0 – 2 England

    Oh yes, … and my daughter was born at 5.30AM.

  7. tartanpigsy says:

    Let’s just remember they’ll have every right to sing whatever they want if we vote No.

    That should keep us focussed.

  8. ronnie anderson says:

    Just had a TV licencing guy at ma door,cheerio, the fuckers are carrying recording machines, ah canny even vent
    ma spleen on them. GGGRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

  9. Paula Rose says:

    A proper international match!

  10. CameronB says:

    Hope the English remember they will need passports and entry visas to get past the border posts. 😉

    This is a piece of nonsense, that just screams ‘the union is safe’. Who the f### agreed to this. It’s not going to be pleasant, which ever way the vote goes.

  11. handclapping says:

    and if Sepp Blatter has his way it won’t even be an International.

  12. goldenayr says:

    You know,if I knew how to do links.I’d send this to Brian Burnett as a theme for “get it on”.

  13. Paula Rose says:

    @ CameronB – watching young men running around kicking balls is never very pleasant, but when it happens under a strict regime it can be enjoyable.

  14. Lewy Tee Bee says:

    Can’t see this being anything other than a glorious opportunity to welcome our closest neighbour and oldest rival on to pitch as sovereign country for the first time.
    Until we rise again indeed.

  15. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “What about the English people who will vote Yes?”

    By definition, none of them will be in “the visiting English support”…

  16. Paula Rose says:

    Us English people who vote Yes will be supporting under the Tebbit rules!

  17. Horseboy says:

    Paxman quits BBC2 Newsnight.
    Hope this is start of BBC unraveling.

  18. Paula Rose says:

    Sorry I meant ignoring…

  19. Iain Gray's Subway Lament says:

    Just a head’s up that C4 News might be doing a series of hit pieces on scottish independence if their attempts at an ‘impartial’ introdcution to them are anything to go by.

  20. Tommy says:

    You only sjng when your indy You only sing when your indy!!

  21. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    Will we still have a separate football team in November if we vote NO in September?

    A NO vote would ‘extinguish’ Scotland, and we’d all be British/English* thereafter.

    (* Interchange as normal )

  22. BuckieBraes says:

    It’s not what the English fans will be singing that I’m thinking about.

    It’s the ‘Proud Scots’ who, having voted No, will then proceed to belt out ‘Flower of Scotland’ without batting an eyelid.

  23. Seepy says:

    handclapping says:
    30 April, 2014 at 7:01 pm
    and if Sepp Blatter has his way it won’t even be an International.

    ^ This

  24. scottish_skier says:

    ‘we can still rise now, and be a nation again’

    I’m going to miss singing this bit.

  25. Bugger (the Panda) says:

    Take the blazers out of the Game. please

    Eats blazers and leaves

  26. Gerrzo says:

    England fans at Hampden…..and you think they would be heard?

  27. haud on the noo says:

    As a regular member of the Tartan Army, I was reluctant to go to London for the recent game at Wembers. To be fair that turned out fine but given the media inspired bile now may be different…

    If we vote NO I seriously doubt I would be going to this and I know a good few hardcore mates who may take a similar viewpoint.

    Please remember the SFA are a good bunch of Unionists as far as we all can tell.

  28. goldenayr says:


    Don’t forget the Diocalm.

  29. daddyo says:

    BuckieBraes says:
    30 April, 2014 at 7:12 pmIt’s not what the English fans will be singing that I’m thinking about.

    It will be the Strawbs “Part of the Union” that they and the English will be singin

  30. alexicon says:

    @Arbroath 1320.

    Funny you should mention the great economic guru o0n this thread.
    The celebrations (dentist’s chair) of the goal, scored by Gazza, was Gordon Brown’s best ever goal, he said.
    Dum, dee, dum.

  31. heedtracker says:

    “if Scotland had voted to continue being ruled by them exactly two months earlier?” CiF that on CiF anywhere in and or near Englandshire and the wires melt with “we/they don’t rule you!!!”
    “Don’t cry for us Scotlandshire, you know we never loved you…”

  32. John Smithmaybe says:

    I agree with Paul – as long as it’s not obscene or illegal, in the context of the september stakes, it’s simply irrelevant what is sung and who, what or when anything is played by a scottish national team. we should hear and quietly celebrate i.e. tolerate with good grace many cheers for various teams in an independent scotland, including our nearest neighbours – and simply enjoy the richer mix of different and often complementary layers of identity and affection. i’m voting for YES to a confident scotland engaging on an equal basis with all countries, not falling back into an annual ’90 minute patriot’ parody. if scotland votes ‘no’, wondering what some football fans will sing will be the least of our worries and as Paul points out, the same fans may be our fellow citizens here in scotland. let’s keep the doors wide open for everyone. football is an important part of culture and often sociologically tied up to complex identities – but i’m hoping we can take a new and fresh approach to many things post-YES and all things ‘auld enemy’ should be on that list, i feel. vote YES, then discard all that outdated rubbish. choose self-responsibility, cultural confidence and mature respect and co-operation with all nations in all walks of life, sport included. keep up the good work Rev. – your analysis and detail are second to none 🙂

  33. CameronB says:

    Sorry, but I think this is highly irresponsible. If we vote Yes, there will be a lot of cheesed off English fans, who probably won’t take kindly to songs like “cheero, cheero, cheero”. Conversely, inviting a load of English fans to gloat at Scotland’s cowardice, does not appear the most sensible decision.

    I think they should of waited at least a year to let the MSM generated animosity cool down a little.

    I was getting on fine with the reggae compilation, until I found another couple thousand track by Lee Perry and friends. Oops. 🙂

  34. Arabs for Independence says:

    We’re no British, we’re no British, we’re no British anymore, we’re no British anymore

  35. ronnie anderson says:

    Have we goat a BT trollyboy in the nite

    Rev that wiz a bloody short story, are you still hung over

    fae yer nite oot wie Nigel, dont burph people like that

    Paul i’ll no like it.

  36. Paula Rose says:

    @ CameronB – Scratch!

  37. Training Day says:

    If the vote is No, there’s plenty folk, me included, who’ll ask why a team masquerading as a sovereign nation deserves our support.

  38. goldenayr says:


    You’ve made the most salient point yet.

    We’ll need to find something else quick,we’ve only got 140 days to decide on a post YES relevant one.

  39. Geoff Huijer says:

    We’ll have a national team?

    After voting to be a region?

  40. ronnie anderson says:

    @paula rose, go on go on go on you tell him Paula dont

    come on here & abuse oor family, say it in the nicest

    possible way lol.

  41. Flooplepoop says:

    @scottish_skier says:
    30 April, 2014 at 7:15 pm
    ‘we can still rise now, and be a nation again’

    I’m going to miss singing this bit

    new line
    `We have rose now, and are a nation again` ?

  42. Charles Kearney says:

    Should there be a No Vote, I’d hope the 90 Minute Patriots would never be allowed to sing ‘Flower of Scotland’ again! I’m damned if will Throw-Up over my new Shoes!

  43. jingly jangly says:

    Channel Four news, the one and only person who was a yes and now is a no has been found, apparently we wont be in the G7 g20, Nato, The Un Emm Security Council. FFS
    no more comment, some folk are too stupid.

  44. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    Will the Scottish footballers be able to tie their own bootlaces if we have voted NO?

  45. Grouse Beater says:

    I will cheer on England … to show I am not prejudiced.

  46. Paula Rose says:

    Songs they will sing? “You’re just too wee, poor and stupid, you’re just too wee, poor and stupid…”

  47. goldenayr says:


    Panic over..well done!

  48. Buster Bloggs says:

    Flower of Scotland should be banned and everyone singing Rule Britannia will be the order of the day, IMO, if it’s a no vote Scotland should be booted from all international competitions, I don’t want wee pretendy countries playing in such events and that would include Scotland.

  49. TheItalianJob says:

    @Murray McCallum

    Yes I remember it well too. One nil down to a first half Shearer goal, Scotland came back into the game after that and missed a penalty, by captain Gary McAllister. Upto that point Scotland were coming well into the game then the miss, heads down and then Gazza’s goal. Game finished.

    Could have been so different if the pen had gone in.

    Is this game all about building bridges following the referendum?

  50. goldenayr says:

    “That stood against him

    Against who?

    Proud Camerons morons
    And sent them homeward
    Tae count the cost”

  51. Robert Peffers says:

    I just watched Channel 4 News,(You can get it on Channel 4+1 in an hour).

    Warning!!!!! – please do not watch with heavy objects in your hand. TV’s are expensive items.

    They are doing a, “Scottish Islands view on the independence referendum”.

  52. bjsalba says:

    Entirely indifferent to fitba (sacrilege I know) but there it is, so I don’t care.

  53. gerry parker says:

    @ CameronB.
    Reggae, you got any Prince Buster?

  54. goldenayr says:

    jingly jangly

    Channel 4 do “news”?

  55. goldenayr says:

    Next you’ll be telling me Sky do news as well..tchh,as if.

  56. Paula Rose says:

    Boys – I thought our Rev wanted to know what our English friends would sing if we chose to remain ruled by their overlords… just asking like.

  57. ronnie anderson says:

    @scottish skier, and we will all rise now we are that nation again. ( rise as in stand up ) let me know if you need any other songs reworded lol.

  58. Greannach says:

    If Scotland votes No, I can’t see any logic in having separate football, rugby or other teams. A No vote is for regression, not the status quo, and logic suggests full assimilation: no parliament, Scottish Office, separate legal or education systems. I can’t see a rational argument for wasting time, effort and money on sham cosmetics.

  59. Paula Rose says:

    What’s a goal?

  60. Brian Powell says:

    If the vote were No and the fans still sang Flower of Scotland or S the Brave, it will be like the time I watched the last runner in the 4X100 metres relay in an international competition, who completely blew it, losing the advantage, fumbling the handover, his hand waving about like a semaphor, then he lost.

    But he still did the triumphant pulling off of the vest that says I’ve won, and strutting around.

    My reaction was, you dumb, empty headed buffoon.

    Of course it would be much, much worse if the English fans started singing Flower of Scotland.

  61. goldenayr says:


    If those that had came before had that view,we would not be on the verge of redressing a 300yr old democratic deficit.

  62. CameronB says:

    gerry parker
    One or two tracks I think. I’ll see what I can find. Bring a devise if your meeting up in Dundee.

    You must be a Scotland supporter. 🙂

  63. Restlessnative says:

    A chorus or two of “Oil right now” by FREE wouldn’t go amiss…

  64. Dan Watt says:

    What’s this about Sepp Blatter wanting it not to be international?

  65. goldenayr says:

    What will the English fans sing in the event of a no vote…hmm?


  66. Zen Broon says:

    If Scotland votes No, all the ‘Better Together’ guff will disappear like snaw aff a dyke.

    England will have the bragging rights and Scotland will be the butt of English humour for a generation or more. We’ll never hear the end of it.

    It will be seen (rightly) as a crushing historic humiliation of Scotland, England’s revenge for Bannockburn, 1966 all over again, winning the Battle of Britain, etc etc.

    And of course it will be Cameron’s ‘Falklands moment’, his reputation, leadersip and historic legacy assured.

  67. handclapping says:

    Why describe it as a Scotland v. England friendly? Surely it will be no more than a chance for the TeamGB manager to give a few of the younger 2014 World Cup winners and some of the already picked 2018 side an outing against one of the regions to see if they have produced anybody who might grace the subs bench. No big deal, I won’t be going.

  68. goldenayr says:

    Definitely need a reply button.

  69. Jamie Arriere says:

    “You’re as Cold as Ice” by Foreigner?

  70. Luigi says:

    Not a great idea so soon after a divisive referendum, whatever the result on 18 September.

    A YES vote will result in a lot of very angry England fans, and a team intent on showing us how wee and useless we really are.

    A NO vote? Well, the tartan army would be advised not to turn up – they only have humiliation, on and off the field, to look forward to.

    Either way, this “friendly” on 18 November is not a good idea.

  71. Thepnr says:

    I can think of two or three sungs that might be aimed towards the Scottish support (if there is any there)

    “We’ll neglect you evermore”

    “Jimmy Hill… he’s laughing like fuck”

    “We’re eating all the pies”

    And a brand new song just for us:

    Too wee…Too wee…Too wee…Too wee…Too wee Too wee Too Ooo Wee

  72. goldenayr says:

    Jamie Arriere

    I take it you’re referring to the second line of the chorus?

    “And willing to sacrifice your love”

  73. CameronB says:

    gerry parker
    Sorry, only on vinyl and I don’t appear to have gotten them back after lending them out. I’d completely forgotten about them. Cheers for reminding me.

  74. jingly jangly says:


    Your right, just wasted an hour of my life I wont get back again watching that drivel. I recon it was about 3% YES and 97% No, one guy with a huge union jack tie claiming he was independent….

  75. heedtracker says:

    C4 news from Lewis there, YES voter articulate, confident, very attractive young Orcadian and the No, a grey haired old man project fearing it with same ol UKOK lies. I think we’ll win!

  76. Indy_Scot says:

    Is it just my imagination or are more and more companies using the words Britain or British in their adverts.

  77. Luigi says:

    And of course it will be Cameron’s ‘Falklands moment

    Multiplied by ten.

  78. goldenayr says:


    Just shows why I don’t go to football.Just can’t fit a tune into your last one.Mind you,most football songs leave me baffled,even though they’re definitely superior to Rugby chants..



  79. scottish_skier says:

    If it’s a Yes, I suppose we can sing:

    you can still rise now, and be a nation again’

  80. galamcennalath says:

    I do wonder about the wisdom of having such an event just after the referendum.

    It would give the ‘winning side’ (referendum, not match) just too big an excuse to be offensive to the ‘loser’. Raised tempers could lead to a situation no one really wants to see.

  81. caz-m says:

    If it turns out to be a NO vote in September, then we automatically give up the right to sing
    “Flower of Scotland” ever again.

  82. Jamie Arriere says:


    Haha don’t really know the song – the joke was ‘Foreigner’. However, by that time in November hopefully the ‘sacrifice’ will have been a fait accompli.

  83. CameronB says:

    If this was SFA generated, it confirms to me that they are a totally corrupt organisation that is not fit for purpose. We need to know who’s idea this was and what the decision making process was. This could turn into a bloodbath.

  84. goldenayr says:

    jingly jangly

    You never know,the guy wi the tie might be using it as a bib for his soup..or a bet.

    “Ah bet y’ll no embarrass y’rsel in front oh millions”

    “Richt,£1 doon noo,or is that tae much fir ye?”

  85. kendomacaroonbar says:

    O/T STV punting the story that SNP MEP Alyn Smith was criticising SNP HQ for not taking his advice on Europe. summit smells here.

  86. alexicon says:

    @heedtracker & others.

    Read Jon Snow’s article here.

    Good comment from Mike Harland.

    Jon Snow certainly gives the game away from the straight off.

    The TV programme is a hatchet job to bolster a flagging no vote.

  87. CameronB says:

    I was going to ask earlier if Peter Snow had any involvement. He has always had a sneer for Scotland.

  88. Paula Rose says:

    A yes vote means that we can welcome a foreign team with the same courtesy that we show any other international team, if its a no vote we can continue to be beaten.

  89. sneddon says:

    On topic- I think the few thousand english support (and welcome they are) will sing the usual stuff cos to be honest most of their support will be indifferent (except the frothy mouths in the media) to the result of the referendum. The only english people pissed off will be the ones who voted YES. And any scotsman turning up after a NO vote win to that game are two faced beyond belief and deserve the shit storm a NO vote will mean (at least the feckers will suffer with the rest of us) and I can spend all the time until the next referendum pointing and saying “No job,I told you so, NO benefits, I told you so, NO free prescriptions, NO free tuition, NO free NHS, NO free child care, No democracy, another expenses scandal, I told you so…you get the idea. Rant over…carry on chaps and chapesses 😀

  90. Tam Jardine says:

    The Last fixture at Hampden had a rather unfortunate semi riot between rival hooligan gangs around Buchanan Street and the largest police presence I have ever witnessed, including a cordon for Scotland fans at central station maybe fifty cops long… as if this fixture needed any more spice. Not one to introduce the kids to the wonders of following Scotland I think.

    Seems insane to hold it when one side is going to be so raw. Pretty irresponsible as well. I’d rather make the euros and get drawn in the English group then once the dust has settled.

    There will be the violent element from various clubs overjoyed by this. I’d love to know the logic behind it.

    Of course if we vote Yes I would go – after a no vote I will not be in the right place for fitba or anything for a while.

    And with regards to Gazza’s goal I have no problem with Gordon Brown claiming it to be the best ever. I do have a problem with him scaring the shit out of pensioners based on lies.

  91. CameronB says:

    Sorry Jon.

  92. Thepnr says:

    What I like most about this site is the diversity of opinion you can have on so many topics. Their is no way an article can be written everyday which will satisfy the views of the huge variation in the beliefs of its range of readers.

    The main thing we have in common is our common goal of believing in and helping where we can to achieve Independence. Other than that readers here are from all backgrounds, and of the full range of political opinions.

    This is why we are winning, because WE are better together and understand what that means.

  93. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    @alexicon says:
    Read Jon Snow’s article here.
    Good comment from Mike Harland.

    Everybody should read the Mike Harland comment.

    (Reading Jon Snow’s article is optional)

    Mike gives what Jon has written a major showing-up.

  94. heedtracker says:

    @ alexicon, Snow’s stuff on wartime sacrifice of both Scots and English so vote no, really creeps me out. People from all over the planet fought in both world wars but their home countries are not run by Westminster. And even if their countries were owned and run by the British empire, is their sacrifice used for politics the way bettertogether does?

  95. Paula Rose says:

    In the unlikely event of a No vote will England be playing Yorkshire?

  96. goldenayr says:


    Exactly…Whatever they sing in the Revs scenario,you can be assured it will be answered with one voice.All the pigeons coming home to roost will be an eye opener for many blinkered views.Might be a bit late for the no voters to have woken up but it means the next refs a dead cert.

  97. goldenayr says:

    Paula Rose

    Yes,anything north of Watford and west of Southampton will be North Britain.

  98. Croompenstein says:

    Yer Blue, Yer White,
    Yer pants are full o shite

    Yer White, Yer Blue,
    And we f*ckin rule you,

  99. Greannach says:

    @goldenayr 7.44

    The point is that this is the first chance for the population to have their voice heard in whether Scotland is a nation or not. The past 300 years are irrelevant as we all know how the union came about. This is about our future: a country or a region. If we vote to be a region let’s drop the silly fripperies and stop kidding ourselves.

  100. bookie from hell says:

    God Save The Queen 90mins + injury time

  101. Ken500 says:

    A crofter who needs EU Grants is voting No. Westminster just took EU farming subsidies intended for Scotland. As part of the UK Scottish farmers receive the lowest CAP payments in the EU.

    The Islands want a higher share of the Oil Revenues, so some are voting No?

    Even if Scotland was not in the EU, Scottish farmers would be better off, than as part of the UK.

  102. tartanfever says:

    Stuff the singing Rev, I’m waiting for the next Darling scare story:

    ‘The offside rule will not be allowed in an independent Scotland.’

  103. Paula Rose says:

    @ Ken500 – the crofter and many others are working their socks off to make a living, I wonder where they get their news from? No need to answer, I’m obviously making a salient point. (btw do the English play shinty?)

  104. ronnie anderson says:

    Am sorry if am spoiling the fitba game warm up

    Jim Murphy’s a SFA referee. whit side will he be on.

  105. When you vote yes, will someone please set up a fake border control and ‘check papers’ on trains?

  106. Alba4Eva says:

    New vid from Guy McV (at his best)…

  107. heedtracker says:

    Whataboutery bettertogetherC4 news reportage with UKIP funding space cadet Demetri Marchessini

    Just more raging hypocrisy from UKOK media with their rage against this Marchessini’s £15k funding for Farage. When vote no tory boy Ian Taylor, chief executive and president of Vitol gave bettertogether over 500 grand, Snow and co never said a word but that guys money’s so dirty only teamGB takes it.

  108. handclapping says:

    100 up, is it too soon to go O/T?

    Astra Zeneca (used to be ICI) is opposing a bid from Pfizer (biggest drug company in the world) on the basis that bigger is not better. Has anybody told BT (campaign not telephones)?

  109. goldenayr says:



    Not for my children,my childrens children,my childrens childrens children.

    Democracy and equality are not commodities to be tossed aside because you get pissed off with it.Right now I’m seriously worried about my 13yr daughters future outlook if there is a no vote.I assure her that I’ve already lived through one disappointment when I was a bit older than her in 79.
    Hope and grief go hand in hand in any struggle.The hard part is believing,and knowing,what you’re doing is right when so many forces are ranged against you.

    What you have to keep in mind is Stu’s litany,courtesy of Ghandi.
    Don’t let emotion cloud,what may be,one more defeat.

    Think Robert the Bruce.

  110. goldenayr says:

    Welsh not British (@welshnotbritish) says:
    When you vote yes, will someone please set up a fake border control and ‘check papers’ on trains?

    Consider it done.

    “Nae Daily Heils,Nae Daily Express,Nae Torygraph…richt,whits that paper y’ve got?..The Beano?..richt,y’oan go.”

  111. bookie from hell says:

    If England hav won the World Cup ,2014,I will sing along with them

    mare chance Scotland winning and were at home

  112. ronnie anderson says:

    @Welsh not Brithish, border post already, check out my

    Yes Scotland page,Ma Wee Shed ronald anderson.

  113. Paula Rose says:

    @ handclapping – bigger is not better? wtf!

  114. bunter says:

    Secret eaters on CH4 says Scotland is second only to USA in the obesity steaks, er stakes.

    Ive heard this afore and im sure it was pish the first time.

    Oh I get it, were too fat to be independent.

  115. Dcanmore says:

    If Scotland votes YES then I doubt many England fans will make the journey fearing they might be the victims of something or another, the right-wing English newspapers will make sure enough hatred and fear will be stirred up after a YES vote. All the decent England fans will just watch it on the telly. After a NO vote they’ll probably come up in droves to give us a verbal doing at least.

    Paxman has left Newsnight but will probably stay with the BBC to replace Dimbleby on QT.

  116. goldenayr says:

    bunter says:
    Secret eaters on CH4 says Scotland is second only to USA in the obesity steaks, er stakes.

    Ive heard this afore and im sure it was pish the first time.

    Oh I get it, were too fat to be independent

    I’ve got a cheek but hey ho…I hope your first names not Billy?

  117. Alba4Eva says:

    ArabsForIndependence, we will still be British after independence but.

  118. goldenayr says:


    Would they not be better replacing Dimbelby with a cardboard cutout for all the good he does.Think of the amount of licence fee that would be saved.

  119. Alfresco Dent says:

    @ JohnSmithmaybe – 7ish.

    Aye right!

  120. Thepnr says:

    The fattest people in the UK are the fat cats. No sign of them getting thinner anytime soon.

  121. X_Sticks says:

    Paula Rose says:

    “What’s a goal?”

    A place they lock up drunken football fans 😉

  122. haud on the noo says:

    Obviously not a huge % of football people here… no problem of course. The match has been in the offing for a while as a return game after we played in London last year. The initial date was February/ march next year.

    Now whether there is anything behind the date change to bring it forward…

  123. goldenayr says:

    So far croomps winning the song battle. I thought my U-KOKs was a good one.

  124. alexicon says:


    When someone brings up the wars, fighting together and all that. I always quote, or print off, this for them.

  125. Paula Rose says:

    @ X sticky – ah now I understand – that’s to do with football hooliganism becoming a thing of the past.

  126. goldenayr says:



  127. Paula Rose says:

    Are Millwall fans a large part of the English fan base? They do sing about not being liked.

  128. Paula Rose says:

    Oh – I’ve just looked at the rules for association football, apparently you’re not allowed to use your fingers to touch the balls.

  129. call me dave says:

    Glasgow debate.

    Should have said, who ever has stepped up to the plate, good for them.

    All Spanish footie final Chelsea being given a lesson.

  130. Ian Brotherhood says:

    It’ll be that 2Unlimited song (which I think is actually used by fans at some club?);

    ‘No no, no no no no, no no no no, no no there’s no Scotland.’

  131. goldenayr says:

    Paula Rose

    Just because you’re from there doesn’t mean you can put them down.

    OK you’s the bloody smug arrogance that gets up my goat at Twickenham or Murrayfield every year.

    “hahahahaha we’ve got a better team than you”

    I should bloody well hope so.You’ve got 10x our population and all our taxes pay for training facilities where you live.

  132. Jamie Arriere says:

    I reckon they’ll only sing “Eng-er-land Eng-er-land Eng-er-land” – are they really any more imaginative than that?

    The Tartan Army should sing “We’ll no be Coming Doon the Road”

  133. goldenayr says:

    Ian Brotherhood

    Refer to my dialogue with Greannach.

  134. john king says:

    Zen Broon says
    “England will have the bragging rights and Scotland will be the butt of English humour for a generation or more. We’ll never hear the end of it.”

    Its not going to happen because

  135. What numptie from the SFA is responsible for this piece of idiotic scheduling? Regardless of the Referendum result, my concern is for our Police Force (who presumably haven’t been consulted) and any decent Anglo Scots of either Yes/No persuasion.
    If this reliable information it is a piece of incredibly poor judgement.

  136. john king says:

    Paula Rose says
    “Oh – I’ve just looked at the rules for association football, apparently you’re not allowed to use your fingers to touch the balls.”

    does anyone have Maradona’s phone number?

  137. Paula Rose says:

    @ goldenayr – darling I put them down because I can, I live in a beautiful country full of potential – they don’t, bless.

  138. goldenayr says:

    Archie Hamilton

    Probably somebodies idea of reconciliation whichever way it goes.

    However..if it’s a no vote..???

  139. goldenayr says:

    Archie Hamilton

    Probably somebodies idea of reconciliation whichever way it goes.

    However..if it’s a yes vote..???

  140. Paula Rose says:

    @ john king – us angels have a lovely touch.

  141. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Why would they have to sing anything anyway? They could just point at us and laugh for ninety minutes, and rightly so.

    Even the thought of it is really quite sickening.

  142. JLT says:

    Scottish_Skier says:

    ‘we can still rise now, and be a nation again’

    I think we may need to change the lines for Flower of Scotland. I think that line would become redundant!

    However, on a more serious note. One thing that bothered me over the years, is that I noticed that we had no major Classical composers when compared with other nations. When we talk of Britain, we see the usual British composers such as Britten, Vaughn-Williams, Holst, and of course, Elgar.
    I could never work out why there was no standout Scottish composers.

    Should our nation be reborn on the 19th, I hope that the Classical Arts, as well as all our national art institutions really flourish, for I believe that a nations culture is truly signified in its Arts and Music. Classical music is the mountain peak of all musical forms as it is truly refined, pure, dignified and sweeping in score. All nations have their own classical pieces that inspire and embody the emotive spirit of their people. Courage and Fortitude are two virtues that define the Scottish character, and for myself, I would hope that in an independent Scotland, that our Composers would be inspired to produce works that would exemplify and portray the Scottish nation as a nation of supreme cultural qualities and high artistic values.

    We have some fine institutions such as the Royal Scottish National Orchestra (RSNO), the Scottish Chamber Orchestra (SCO) and the BBC Scottish Symphony Orchestra (BBC SSO). We already have composers such as Craig Armstrong, and musicians such as Nicola Benedetti. I would hope in the years that come, that with the shackles of the union thrown off, that our musical talent will flourish, for I believe that the power of the Union stopped classical works that would have truly defined Scotland from ever being produced, as it might have inspired and raised a sense of Nationhood.

    Therefore, in the years to come should we win the day on the 19th of September, I really hope that our finest and best, are inspired and allowed to flourish, and thus be emboldened to follow the dreams and aspirations of a people, and produce works that could only inspire those that follow in their path.

  143. Ian Brotherhood says:

    On a more positive note – this scenario is going to come in very handy for street work with so-called LIVs.

  144. Paula Rose says:

    New anthem for Scotland –

    O fearties of Scotland
    When will we see our like again
    That gave up the fight for
    our own independence
    And cast a no vote to continue
    Westminster rule
    And sent the money
    Down south again

    The tills are bare now
    And politicians lie through and through
    We all did our duty
    Which we so dearly held
    And cast a no vote to continue
    Westminster rule
    And now we love being
    A region for sure

    18th of September is passed now
    A genetically challenging day
    But we can still vote now
    In our wee pretendy parliament
    And cast a wee vote
    For B-list MSPs
    And make sure we never
    forget our place again

  145. Fairliered says:

    Scotland’s first ever international fixture was against England. In the event of a no vote, it will be appropriate that our last ever international will be against England. As a member of the Tartan Army, I don’t believe we will have any right to have separate international teams – whether football, rugby, athletics, or any other sport – after a no vote. No Six Nations, no Commonwealth Games, no Scottish teams in any international competition, because we will have told the rest of the world we are not entitled to them, don’t deserve them, and that we are happy to support England, Team GB, or whoever our betters wish to call themselves.

  146. goldenayr says:

    See what I done there?

    Seriously,if it’s a YES,then it could be really ugly.You will have all the Orangemen out trying to stir up as much aggro as they can to reinforce the Scottish stereotype from an uninformed,south of the border,position.And all the EDL out looking for “revenge” for their 5 mates in the SDL.

    I nearly wrote 50 mates in the SDL and then remembered that 45 of them have to get bussed up from deprived areas in England.

  147. call me dave says:

    Annabelle Goldie returns to Hollyrood to lead the Conservative motion to keep the union. 10mins speech.
    Was Ruthie elsewhere today?

    Goldie tried to make the case for the union but it was the usual uric acid. Nicola Sturgeon demolished Goldie in her speech that followed. 🙂

  148. goldenayr says:


    I refer you to my conversation with Greannach.

  149. Paula Rose says:

    @ JLT – don’t be silly, we have many greats in literature, music and other arts – do you not visit off-topic?

  150. john king says:

    “@ john king – us angels have a lovely touch.”

    Harrummpphh cough,
    yes lance corporal Jones that will be all for now.

  151. Democracy Reborn says:

    “A nation again?….you’re havin a laugh,
    A nation again?….you’re havin a laugh”
    (Repeat ad nauseum)

  152. goldenayr says:

    OK croomps,you’ve just been bested by a non football supporting lass.

    Nice one Paula Rose.

  153. goldenayr says:


  154. JLT says:

    Paula Rose

    I never said Literature. I’m talking Classical Music. If you look at the main composers of Britain, they are all English. I could rattle off the names very easily. I could easily name famous Classical pieces that are ‘British’. I struggle to think off any famous Classical pieces that could be described as Scottish. I’m not talking about Scottish Highland Music, or folk songs. I mean …Classical pieces!

  155. caz-m says:


    Another little Englander asshole member of the Snow family on TV at the moment telling us of the Birth of the Empire.

    It’s Dan Snow this time.

    Is it not his uncle that gives us such a balanced and impartial view on the Scottish Referendum.

  156. call me dave says:

    Paula Rose

    That’s a good effort on the anthem 🙂


    Fair point, who could argue?

  157. goldenayr says:

    Try again


    If you’d bothered to read further that subject has already been done and recently trounced by Paula Rose.

    PLEEEAAASE Rev..can we have a reply button?

  158. Murray McCallum says:

    I think Scotland and England should play a football match every year.

    I don’t see a problem Yes or No being the outcome.

    In the dire event of a No outcome, my only request would be to have a better together choir sing “Flower of Scotland”. We will need proud, passionate Scots like them.

  159. goldenayr says:

    call me dave says:

    Fair point, who could argue?


  160. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Sorry to take over the thread here Stu, but I’ve tried to contact Ken McDonald regarding his Wings Over Scotland stickers but my e-mail has been bounced back as undeliverable. So Ken if you see this can you please contact me.

    We have a couple of events coming up in the next couple of weeks for YES South Annandale and they would be ideal if we could have some more Wings stickers to give out, every little helps don’t you know. 😉

  161. JLT says:

    If you’d bothered to read further that subject has already been done and recently trounced by Paula Rose.

    I’m still lost? What subject?

  162. Clydebuilt says:

    I’m surprised it’s not before the vote. B.T. might have thought if our boys (Engerland) can give the Scots a right doin, the resulting heids down lack of confidence would help the NO vote.

    Yje fact that the games after the vote shows the confidence they have in the England team!

  163. The Rough Bounds says:

    Awful case scenario.

    No vote wins. The whole country becomes depressed and commences to turn in on itself. Margo McDonald’s words regarding reconciliation fall on deaf ears. We are disgusted with the No voters for their cravenly attitude.

    Two months later Scotland plays England at football. England wins. The country becomes more depressed. We are regarded as Jock Jokes and nobody in Europe takes us seriously.

    Labour wins the Scottish election in 2016. Free prescriptions, bus travel and education are scrapped.

    Three years later the SFA is wound up and the Scottish football team is amalgamated with the English F.A.
    The Scottish Parliament sees many of its powers removed to London. The Scottish Health Service is combined with the English NHS and is privatised.

    In 2017 the British Isles vote to leave the E.U. Chaos reigns. Riots in English cities. English people look north.

    English and European migration into Scotland increases exponentially. Scottish culture is in dire straits and over the next 50 years dies out completely. The Gaelic language quickly becomes extinct as does Scots.

    By 2064 Scots have become like Picts: we are nothing more than a half remembered dream.

    So much hangs on this vote.

  164. Paula Rose says:

    @ JLT – if we are talking about symphonic and other forms of ensemble music, then yes Scotland is not a major player. History shows that at such developments in music Scotland was in a disadvantageous position. You are correct within a narrow understanding of “classic”, I regard the contribution of Scotland to the music of the world’s people to be extraordinary – I’m not a relativist, but – country and western is the white woman’s blues.

  165. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Aw Jeezo Rev, this is one of the hardest ‘competitions’ you’ve ever had. It’s just torture, imagining it…I’m giving up trying to think what England fans might choose to sing, but I do know this…

    If we vote No? Two months later I’ll still be slumped in a puddle of tears and whisky-scented pish, replaying every tragic song I’ve heard during four decades of pining for Scotland to stand up for itself.

    Don’t know why, but this one always brings a wee tear to the eye: Pet Shop Boys with Dusty Springfield – ‘What Have I Done To Deserve This?’

  166. Democracy Reborn says:

    “We’ll keep ru-ling over you!,
    We’ll keep ru-ling o-ver you,
    We’ll keep ru-ling, we’ll keep ru-ling,…..”

    Closely followed by a rendition of ‘Rule Brittannia’

  167. JLT says:

    Paula Rose,

    That is what I am talking about. Classical Music.

    The point I was really trying to make as we laughed at Scottish Skiers point on one line in ‘Flower of Scotland’, that if we become independent, I think Scotland should move on from ‘Flower of Scotland’, and hopefully, someone will produce a classical work that will become our anthem (or even a score of them).
    I’m not denouncing the whole of the Scottish Arts or our massive amount of Literature. What I am saying, is that I hope it flourishes like never before!

  168. caz-m says:

    If this is a Unionist ploy, then what do you think their grand plan is?

    Is it the cunning of Better Together along with the two FAs or what?

    Why announce this game to be played shortly after the referendum.

    Do they really think it is a “NO” vote winner?

  169. Paula Rose says:

    @ JLT – I’m convinced it will.

  170. Mary Bruce says:

    Paula Rose: excellent anthem, much enjoyed. “The tills are bare now” LOL Brilliant.

  171. Arbroath 1320 says:

    scottish_skier says:

    ‘we can still rise now, and be a nation again’

    I’m going to miss singing this bit.

    Sorry if someone else has already suggested this SS but how about this? ‘)

    “we DID rise now, and we ARE a nation again.”

    How would that do as a wee replacement? 🙂

  172. Fairliered says:


    I feel sorry for your daughter. In the event of a no vote she may not be allowed another chance, because our generation blew the chance we were given, and we won’t be allowed another. We have to win this for all our families.

  173. Brian Powell says:

    The No politicians who have spent so much time extollling the virtues of Togetherness, will, in the event of No vote, immediately start attacking each other to win the next general election.

    This is whay makes No voters seem so strange to me, that is OK with them.

  174. goldenayr says:


    There is another flaw in your argument,for I must ask your forgiveness for not seeing on my first scan of your earlier post.

    A “classical piece” must subscribe to set norms.None of which take local cultural interests into account.It’s reminiscent of something I said earlier,on an other thread,to a poster who was fed up with learning Gaelic from people who supported the union.

    Music is the purest form of art.There is no other medium by which your emotions can be pulled,thrown,hugged,discarded or owned in an instant.

    To fulfil your ambition we would have to discard ourselves,our heritage,history,hopes,dreams and aspirations in order to conform to your “norm”.

    I agree that “classical is a pure and unadulterated prisctine form of art.

    But is it us?

  175. TheItalianJob says:

    C’mon team. Too much defeatism on this topic. Just think following a Yes vote how sweet this game is going to be.

  176. jingly jangly says:

    Who cares if we have classical composers?
    Its not our tradition.

    We do Folk Music. It spans the same timeframe as the European Classical tradition. Therefore Folk Music is our Classical Music.

    I for one would far rather that the Scottish Government subsidies that go into Classical Music, Scottish Opera, etc, went instead to our own indigenous arts.

  177. goldenayr says:


    Well thank fuck my father never said that to me.

  178. galamcennalath says:

    OT Sadly, we won’t be able to see the look on Jeremy Paxman’s face on Newsnight on 19th Sept after a Yes vote.

  179. Paula Rose says:

    Nevermind the football – the music will be brilliant.

  180. Democracy Reborn says:

    “You are our Jock-land, you are our Jock-land,
    You make us ha-ppy, when you vote no,
    We’ve got your oil now, we’re gonna keep it,
    Then you can whine your Jockland away….”

  181. goldenayr says:


    Don’t know about defeatism but it’s certainly displaying certain poster telltales from the heretical websites.

  182. CameronB says:

    You had your chance and you blew it
    You had your chance and you blew it
    You had your chance and you blew it
    Now Scotland’s a country no more.

    (repeat until the riot starts)

  183. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    If we vote NO, we will have to give back the turf from Wembley.

    If we vote YES, and lose to England in November, the Hampden turf will get stolen.

    Or something like that …

  184. goldenayr says:


    Mibees that’s why he’s taken the big pay off gig?

  185. Paula Rose says:

    Now boys – lets get classy –

  186. kendomacaroonbar says:

    @Arbroath 1320

    Hi !

    You can reach me on kenmcdonald1@btopenworld(dot)com

  187. caz-m says:

    Paula Rose that is Brill.

  188. goldenayr says:


    Are y’mad?

    Nae main emails,set up a duff one like I did with arb and then give it piecemeal.

    Good Luck with the spam.

  189. caz-m says:

    Paula Rose,

    Are the two guys in the video Blair McDougall and Alastair Darling??

    We need to know these things.

  190. dan says:

    Sunset on leith ?

    Speed bonnie boat like a bird on the wing
    “No thanks” the voters cry.
    Carry the man that’s born to be king
    Over the sea to Brussels

    Sorry, doesn’t rhyme, but it’s the spirit that counts.
    In a friendly spirit by a Scotland-loving Englishman (returning to Skye for a week on Saturday) who respects your right to vote but hopes you vote no…

  191. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Paula –

    That Stan/Ollie clip is brilliant. Saw it when you first posted it in off-topic.

    For anyone who hasn’t seen it, check out the old guy in the chair on the porch towards the end – he’s right into it. Great stuff.

  192. Paula Rose says:

    Thank you boys – I’m pretty vacant, but I do ken a classy country when I meet one.

  193. Proud Cybernat says:

    We won’t be in G20? What did Maryhill ever do to upset anyone?

  194. kendomacaroonbar says:


    I live life on the edge me..:-)

  195. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Sorry for causing you problems there about your address Ken.

  196. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Here’s the half-hour Naughtie package about the referendum broadcast this afternoon. Worth a gander…

  197. goldenayr says:

    OK Stu

    If not a reply button,how about a numbered link?

    Can’t watch Paulas vid just now but would like to later.The difficulty is trawling through all the posts to find it.And don’t say just save it,you know how computer literate I am.

    Typing this is my pinnacle.

  198. CameronB says:

    Is that the ‘Helensburgh effect’? 😉

  199. kendomacaroonbar says:


    Hey, no problems whatsoever. 🙂

  200. kendomacaroonbar says:

    @Cameron B

    It’s the glow in the dark sand castles wot dunnit 🙂

  201. Papadox says:

    How many people would allow their next door neighbour to control and oversee the running of their house, family, finances and welfare?

    Yet there are many people in Scotland who advocate and would vote for this proposition for their country and think that is normal. Very strange insecure people?

    That is nothing many people would admit to, hence you get their 2 stock answers.

    “I don’t like Alex Salmond” and “just because”. The honest answer is far to embarrassing. What price FALSE PRIDE!

    That’s is only my honest opinion.

  202. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Thanks anyway Ken, e-mail sent. 😉

  203. Paula Rose says:

    Whatever happened to the footsie?

  204. goldenayr says:


    The message was for others as well.

    Awright lass,apologies if you’ve emailed.Not seen the ipad since yesterday,the oldest has it up in her pigsty somewhere and I’m not raking through that for anyone.Hopefully I’ll get it back tomorrow.

  205. Paula Rose says:

    oops – I meant footie.

  206. CameronB says:

    Paula Rose
    Na, you’ve been rumbled. 😉

  207. Paula Rose says:

    CameronB – calm down dear.

  208. Thepnr says:



    Paula has just shown that Scots do classical music, might not be classical right now but…give it a century or two. Yew Choob will will no doubt be held in the same esteem.

    Never forget what is classical in the future is created in the now. Us Scots have never been so busy creating!

  209. Arbroath 1320 says:

    No problem goldenayr. That’s the problem though when we lose contact details it is always kind of difficult to regain contact. 😉

    We’re not as computer literate as you you know. 😛

  210. kendomacaroonbar says:


    Not received it yet, however just FYI I have 30+ stickers left. I will happily forward them to you FOC, so pls send me your postal address and I’ll ship them out tomorrow.

  211. Ian Brotherhood says:

    If I make it to Dundee you can all give me a slap for constantly annoying you with this, but just another four to hit 900…

  212. CameronB says:

    Paula Rose
    Sorry, It’s this Prince Buster I’ve just downloaded. I bit suggestive is an understatement. 😉

  213. kendomacaroonbar says:


    Still no mail received… pls ensure you replace the (dot) with a . in the email address :-):-) sorry I can imagine how that reads…no offence meant.

  214. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Oh dearie me Ian Smart is now on newsncht. Think it’s time to switch channels. 😛

  215. Democracy Reborn says:

    On a more upbeat mood, & assuming a Yes vote (please let it be so…):-

    “Enger-land, are you happy?
    Now we’re free, we’re the daddy
    We’re rich wi our oil, & you’ve got f**k all
    Walking in a Scottish wonderland…”

  216. Thepnr says:

    That gut on Newsnight Scotland just said that LFI were mainly full of ex-SNP councillors with no whatsover.

    Denying reality doesn’t make it unreal. Total FOOL.

  217. Paula Rose says:

    @ Ian Sisterhood – make it to Dundee darling and we’ll all be queueing up to give you a kiss.

  218. Flower of Scotland says:

    O/t Newsnight, Bettertogether moaning and drivelling on about the YES side are getting more money that them! He is claiming that Labour for Indy are just SNP councillors!!!! Gary Robertson just letting him talk rubbish!!

  219. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Thepnr says:

    That gut on Newsnight Scotland just said that LFI were mainly full of ex-SNP councillors with no whatsover.

    Denying reality doesn’t make it unreal. Total FOOL.

    Always remember Thepnr that THAT guy was Ian Smart. I’m sure the good Rev is just sitting back just now biting his lip about how to respond. 😛

  220. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Paula –

    You sure know how to flatter a man, unlike JaBa, who only knows how to flatten a man.

  221. Alba4Eva says:

    Wings just got a mention.

  222. Angus says:

    Wings and Newsnet on Newsnight Scotland eh?

    What the papers say indeed!

  223. X_Sticks says:

    Newsnicht just mentioned Bella and Wings!!! WTF! Is it to cover up their very biased article on referendum funding?

  224. haud on the noo says:

    News night , wtf?

  225. caz-m says:

    We’re famous, Wings gets a mention at the end of Newsnight Scotland.

    And Bella got a wee kick in as well.

  226. bunter says:

    Wings got a mention on newsnicht followed by a Hootsmon headline front page Salmond accused of nation of drunks quip.

  227. mogatrons says:

    ***WoS just got a mention on Newsnight Scotland headlines review ……. ***

    We might win this yet . 🙂

  228. Indysteve says:

    Am feeling a bit dizzy! Did I just see that correctly? Newsnight Scotland on their end piece review of tomorrow’s news shows Wings and Bella site articles! What is going on!

  229. ronnie anderson says:

    Rev did you give Newsnight permission to use this page

    in the proggrame.

  230. twenty14 says:

    Shock, feckin horror – Wings and Bella mentioned on Newnight – what cunning plan does the BBC have under their damp, musky cloth sack.

    Does this mean by mere mention of pro – indy websites they are now a non bias, anti- CBI organisation and therefore they can continue as norm – ma fuckin arse

  231. Dr JM Mackintosh says:

    I have just fallen of my seat !

    Wings and Bella on BBC Scotland newsnight.

    The NUJ meeting must have been very interesting on Monday.
    That is more like it.

  232. Paula Rose says:

    Wings – What Is News Good Scots.

  233. Alba4Eva says:

    …the whole broadcast tonight to me seemed to be nothing more than a deflection of the BBC’s continuing membership of the CBI.

    That’s the real important story… and the BBC are sweating.

  234. Indigo says:

    Newsnight?! Wtf! Nearly fell off the sofa!

  235. haud on the noo says:

    Are the winds shifting? I never thought that websites would get a mention before the torygraph

  236. Arbroath 1320 says:

    I’m shocked!

    I mean Wings and Bella getting mentioned on Newsnicht. Whatever next, BBC withdraws permanently from CBI? 😛

  237. Craig says:

    “Small part of England, you’re just a small part of England”

    or if we vote Yes, ours could be:

    “You’re not British anymore, you’re not …”

  238. Clootie says:

    Hewsnight Newspaper review


    Nearly choked !

    We must be winning.

  239. Alba4Eva says:

    Hope Stu gets a good story up now for the extra footfall.

  240. caz-m says:

    BBC Scotland trying to lovebomb you Rev, don’t fall for it.

    You’ll be in the studio next Rev.

  241. Fairliered says:

    At the last election, the ballot boxes were full of SNP votes from ex Labour voters, That’s what sticks in Ian Smart’s craw!

  242. Ronnie says:

    Well, well, well, Rev, now you really are famous!

    Definitely deserves one last wee dram…

  243. goldenayr says:

    Watched “Lord McConnel of Glen Corrosdale” on Scotland Tonight.
    He was asked why he supported the “Live on the Line” campaign.An org that requests you to live on the same as someone in a 3rd world country,£1 a day inc fuel and clothing,according to charities.

    Affluent fuckers is what I say.Bought a leg of Pork today for £2[reduced,was £10],rice 1kg 30p,pasta 1kg 32p,salt 500g 40p,tinned toms x4 36p a tin[my toms aren’t ready]

    That has to feed me and the kids for days.Sod the wife,she costs a fortune with her veggie mince.

    What I wanted to say was..he couldn’t give a monkeys and is only interested in lowering wages i.e.

    “Like all Tory politicians before me,I stand in front of you as one of you.For I have been through the hell of forsaking my chardonnay at dinner and port and brandy after.”


  244. CameronB says:

    Is it not illegal for publicly funded organisations to finance political lobby groups?

  245. Les Wilson says:

    Yes, Bella and Wings FULL page shown on Newsnight by Brewer!!!

  246. Mary Bruce says:

    Newsnet saying on twitter that they had a legal challenge to make BBC show indy sites as well as the papers. Maybe it has paid off and this is a regular feature. Brilliant, magic, fantastic. Excellent news to end the day!

  247. Clootie says:

    Hewsnight shows how excited I was!

  248. mr thms says:

    Newsnight Scotland took a look at Wings a Over Scotland and the Bella Caledonia blogs before tomorrow’s papers

  249. goldenayr says:

    Nice to see Wings mentioned on Newsnight Scotland as part of their “paper” headlines.

  250. Ian Brotherhood says:

    C.B. (female) in Beith? – hard to tell precisely when you signed, and no idea whether you come here, but you’ll know yourself if it was you. Cheers!

    Just 99 more before tomorrow evening (9.41) and we’ll have raised 1000 signatures in a week. No sign of BBC caving yet, even after saying (yesterday) that they were ‘considering their position’ after the NUJ statement following the PQ meeting on Monday.

    Be in no doubt friends – they’re bricking it, and don’t know what to do. Each and every signature we get will help them make their minds up. They’ve run out of corners to hide in.

  251. CameronB says:

    Fourth in search list (Startpage search engine).

  252. Paula Rose says:

    oops – hope our discussion of footie wasn’t a feature.

  253. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    @Ronnie anderson says:
    Rev did you give Newsnight permission to use this page

    Is Wings Over Scotland a CBI member?

    (Sorry, I ask everybody that now.)


  254. Papadox says:

    The news night Scotland presenter Garry Robertson is either extremely ignorant or arrogant or both. He constantly interrupted, badgered and cut off the man he was “interrogating” shameful and disgusting. The EBC just keeps digging itself into the bottom of the shitwhole it has dug for itself.

    The one thing that is beyond doubt is his commitment to the better together grouping. Nasty piece of work. I’m sure he will climb the greasy EBC pole as his reward, if the EBC is still in existence, which I sincerely doubt.

  255. twenty14 says:

    Don’t believe this newsnight statement for a second – Does this, for one moment, make you think the bbc are impartial.

    Look how good we are we even mentioned two pro – Indy websites . No chance , they’ve had a quick meeting and said ” this should stall things for now “

  256. goldenayr says:

    Saying all that… fine.

    Ian however is not tv candy.They need to put someone else forward at peak times sorry to say.

    Sorry Ian.

  257. F1dddler says:

    Wings and Bella Caledonia both shown on Newsnight at the newspapers front page bit at the end. I can’t believe what I’m seeing. It’s starting to work folks…..!!!

  258. Thepnr says:

    @Arbroath 1320

    I just switched it over and it was almost the first line I heard. These guys will be taught a lesson. A severe one I hope is the meaning of democracy.

    How much hotter can this rhetoric get without overheating and then exploding into so million billion of atoms with not a trace left?

    I really believe their campaign is doomed to eventually self destruct especially when the stakes are highest in the final weeks. No One. No One. Can keep the amount of lies and bullshit up forever without giving the game away.

    They have no faith in what they preach, no confidence in their position. They know they are only trying to save their own skin. That’s why when questioned, their brain goes into overload and they can’t find any sensible answers. People are switching off to their constant crap.

    Just today my boss, who had no idea of my affiliation said when I was standing there, to a Dutchman in his office. “That will all change though when Scotland votes Yes”.

    Being a little taken aback, I asked. “Are you for Yes then?”

    “Your dead right I am”. That put a smile on my face.

    So lets keep plugging away, people are becoming more open. There’s a wee hole in the dyke, when Blair McDougall gets his finger pulled out! The dyke will crumble and the votes will flood in. Every article and post here and on other blogs makes that hole in the dyke a wee bit bigger.

    Lets wash them all way. Keep pulling at that finger.

  259. goldenayr says:

    Taught Bill Gates and Steve Jobs everything they don’t know.

    Hence windows8,and mac incompatibility issues.

  260. caz-m says:

    I asked on this site over a year ago, why indy websites were not getting a mention on Newsnight Scotland and also the paper reviews on GMS.

    Lets hope they have finally had a change of mind. Better late than never.

    We’ll see in the morning if they have changed.

  261. goldenayr says:


    If we all put at that finger,it’s going to be one almighty fart!

  262. mr thms says:

    During an item on Newsnight Scotland, the Better Together spokesman referred to Labour for Independence as a front for the SNP?

    Newsnet Scotland has put up on their website, the original un-cropped photo which shows someone rolling up a Yes Scotland banner to the side of the photo, that was widely circulated by the mainstream media. They also show an earlier photo of both banners being held up by supporters of Yes Scotland and Labour for Independence.

    Labour for Independence should demand a retraction and an apology from the spokesman, and the BBC.

  263. Alba4Eva says:

    To any newbies having found Wings tonight from the BBC, here was a big story from just yesterday, that you would never hear in the Mainstream Media…

  264. goldenayr says:

    Ah crap..whit a waste.

    Not “put” ..pull.

    I hate this laptop.

  265. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Aye, the tide has now turned.

    What Morag was on about t’other day regarding badges etc? Just had a scout about on Ebay, and you can’t get a smart, small enamelled badge for less than £6, and even then, don’t expect delivery before mid-June. What’s that all about?

    I thought we were in a ‘capitalist’ society? Any individual store or chain that starts stocking reasonably priced ‘Yes’ material will make a killing. Expect to see it soon, in the smaller markets. We want this stuff. There is demand – small traders, please note, and get your cut before the big guys move in.

  266. JWil says:

    It is an achievement to have Wings Over Scotland and Bella Caledonia featured on Newsnight Scotland. I don’t know what it all means or how its come about, but it is very welcome. Whatever motivated the BBC to do it, at the very least it puts awareness of these two publications out to a wider audience which might even be curious enough to read them.

    It’s a change from the good old days when Brian’s Blog wouldn’t allow comments on certain articles (for editorial reasons we were told) and definitely would not allow links to publications which supported independence.

  267. Papadox says:

    Re Bella and wings being shown on newsnight. IMHO they are setting us up for one of their back stabbing plays.

    Believe HMG/establishment/MSM/EBC/BT have been a bit quiet of late, think they have been plotting and planning underhand attack which will develop over the next four weeks prior to the start of monitoring period. This will be a proper shit storm, which will be very nasty and very very dirty.

    I don’t want anything to do with these morons in GB/UK or what’re they call themselves I just want my own country. There is no going back from this old man. YES YES YES

  268. ronnie anderson says:

    Am no lulled by any means, of newsnites impartiality

    Bella an Wings being flashed up on screen, this is dirty

    tricks dept sayin Big Brothers watching you,s.

    Watch out for more BT trolls on here,& there anti

    Welsh/Irish/English rhetoric,& throw EU intae the mix as

    well. dont be fooled & dont provide them with amunition.

  269. goldenayr says:

    Because they’re sending a message out to all those who oppose free speech.

    The wannabe beeb guys at Newsnet better get onboard.

  270. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Thepnr –

    I’d love to hear the closing paragraph of your last post being read by Frankie Howerd. Ooh-er missus!

    If JaBa ever ‘gets the finger out’ it’ll be spectacular – we can wave her off as she rises up, drifting with high-altitude winds, getting smaller and smaller, with final glints as the sunlight reflects off her sweating foreheid…

  271. Thepnr says:

    Ian get along to the barras, they get will get them them online I’m sure if there’s money as well as kudos in it.

  272. kendomacaroonbar says:

    @ Ian Brotherhood

    re badges…please watch this space 🙂

  273. goldenayr says:


    If you’re right,then bring it on,will be nice to “debate” man to man.

    No offence ladies,we’ve just got bigger dicks to waggle in front of someones face.[say it in a John Wayne voice]

    Can someone explain why we do this?

  274. goldenayr says:

    Hey Thepnr

    Mind when you mentioned paranoia and I replied it’s a way of life for the wary?

    I think a lot of Wingers are proving my point.

  275. ronnie anderson says:

    Cmon people an awe the Techi’s on here,spread Ian

    Brotherhood’s BBC/Cbi membership withdrawal, and if you

    havent signed Please make that a priority. Keep the

    pressure up.

  276. ronnie anderson says:

    @Calcacus MacAndrews, Noo in ma best Mavis voice, oh I dont

    know, i’ll need to ask Reeta.

  277. Thepnr says:

    Hay goldenayr

    Are you pissed again tonight or just being a prick cos it’s what you do?

  278. goldenayr says:

    ronnie Anderson

    Done yonks ago,plus others emails.

  279. goldenayr says:


    Read me how you like.

    Doesn’t stop me being wary.

  280. Mary Bruce says:

    Regards Yes badges and other goodies, my Greg Moodie indy badges arrived the other day, lots of fun, link here:

    Other good news (via twitter): it looks like the Glasgow debate has found representatives to fill the no seats. I don’t think any of them are Duncan Hothersall.

  281. goldenayr says:

    Richt,oichde mhath since there’s nae answers.

    Whatever happened to Cynicus from The Scotsman?

  282. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Ronnie Anderson –

    re: Support for the petition.

    Cheers faither, you are a special man.

    Yeah, it’s all bollocks, but 1,000 is a big number in any language, and to get that in a week would be great. A lot of the comments have been brilliant, and genuinely angry.

    It’s just a bummer that so many folk here use ‘handles’, otherwise I’d have been able to identify a lot more WOS readers. (The whole ‘use your real name’ debate is a tricky one, I know, but sometimes I wish more people would.)

    We can be sure that some minion in the domestic Security Services has been charged with keeping an eye on this, and similar petitions (the poor soul’s Line Manager maybe deals with WOS, NNS, Bella etc) but I hope, whoever s/he is has enjoyed it.

    One way or another, the BBC is going to have to resign from the CBI, and that’s when the proverbial will hit the fan – the BBC will then have to explain why it was a member for decades, unbeknown to its own staff/Union reps. At what level of management within the BBC were staff (and Union reps?!) informed about the connection? From the sounds of it, we’re talking pre-Birt days…

    The BBC is finished – fifteen steps, and then a steep drop. As said, when news of an unpopular family member’s demise hit the grapevine: ‘Nae big loss.’

  283. Thepnr says:


    Here Mister, I’m a bit wary too. But 99.9% are sound, maybe we can sometimes read too much into what might be in reality nothing at all.

    It really is best to come on and exchange ideas, I’ve learned this lesson. This is why I mentioned diversity earlier, you are never going to agree nor disagree with everyone.

    So I don’t try to, all that matters is your view. How you might put it is what matters.

  284. ronnie anderson says:

    @goldenayr,re your John Wayne,come doon aff yer horse

    an drink yer milk,an pit yer waggler away. Your granwains

    I’ll see these post in later years,

    Whit did you do in the Referendum campain Grandad

    oh ah wiz a waggler,how dey you explain that lol.

  285. JGedd says:

    Dear JLT

    Just felt I had to lend a little support. You made the mistake ( sigh) of mentioning classical music. I learned from my teens to keep my love of classical music a secret. Best to keep quiet about it.

    Anyway Peter Maxwell Davies is for independence I hear. However, that other premier Scottish composer, James MacMillan detests Scotland and occasionally offers us a rant castigating us. Recently he had a go at Alan Bissett for being a fascist. You can tell that he’s not a supporter of Scottish nationalism so no anthem from him then.

    But Maxwell Davies might do it. He’s nice and I like his music too. ( Whisper it. Classical music is not elitist.)

  286. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Ian Brotherwood at 11.43

    Wee Badgers (online) do badges to order in the size and design you want, very reasonably priced. Phil and Margaret Greene in Glasgow are selling a very nice enamel badge but I’ve misplaced their contact. I’ll dig it out

  287. Famous15 says:

    It is not paranoia if they really are out to get you.I was struck by the mention of Wings and I had a twinge of regret that the current discussion was one of the “shallower” or light hearted,if you will,of recent times.

    Personally I would never countenance failure in mid campaign and therefore do not make any suggestion of songs to be sung in the event you describe.

    If I were religious the only song I would suggest is a hymn of praise for a YES vote.

  288. CameronB says:

    Ian Brotherhood
    I really hope it is the end for the BBC. If they have broken the law in term of using public funds to support the CBI, for 30 odd years, that is a very serious matter, IMO.

  289. tartanpigsy says:

    Re Newsnet featuring on Newsnight,
    I can’t see it happening.

    Newsnet have dug a lot of dirt on our friends at Pacific Quay.

    The last thing the BBC will want to do is direct people straight at the evidence of their own wrongdoing.

    If however they could be pushed on grounds that Newsnet differs from Wings and Bella along lines mentioned in admin comment here

    then maybe they might?

  290. twenty14 says:

    The bbc are playing a game – we just have to be that little bit quicker than them

  291. X_Sticks says:

    Fired off a last tweet for your petition Ian – I hope it makes the 1k tomorrow 😀

    Indy dreamland calling, night all.

  292. Mary Bruce says:

    It really is starting to look as if the BBC membership of the CBI was just a way of sending £22k a year of taxpayer subsidy to a right wing business lobbying group.

    Does anyone know how much other businesses paid to the CBI in membership fees to compare?

  293. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Thepnr/Goldenayr –

    I’ve been on this thread all night and I haven’t the faintest idea what you two are falling out about.

    Anyway, I got stuck on the roof of my shed yesterday. I was replacing the roofing felt, and my boy was helping me. I don’t like heights (seriously) and I can’t use normal ladders. I have to get up there by stages – I step on a chair, then on top of the blue wheelie bin, then heave meself up, lie flat, get one knee up, clambering for a grip. It must be a truly pathetic thing to witness.

    Anyway, yesterday, my boy was helping me. We were making good progress. I was on the roof of the shed, then realised I had to go back down to get something, but the wee man had gone and he’d moved the wheelie bin away. I finished the cup of tea I had, rolled and smoked a fag, waited, waited. He still didn’t come back. That was me stuck. No way I was jumping, so I tried to ‘dreepy’ i.e. lay face down, eased the legs backwards over the edge…then the weight of the legs kicked in, and I had to locate the shed door with my toe – managed that, but then the fucking door swung open, so gravity took over and that was me scuppered – the body went down, the belly and chest went rasping over the edge of the exposed roof planking…it could quite easily have become the first case of ‘seppuku’ using a garden shed.

    As it happens, I survived, although my belly looks like a well-skelped arse.

    The moral of this story?

    Be patient.

    Turns out my boy had gone to the lavvy – he emerged from the kitchen door approx three seconds after I hit the deck, howling, grasping my savaged gut. There was no need for it to happen if I’d just sat tight and rolled another smoke.

    I’ve learned a valuable lesson, and the wee man is still chuckling.

    Ponder this well, all ye young ‘uns…

    What a total mess. The

  294. ronnie anderson says:

    I,ve noticed a few times when I klik on a link Y/Tube ect

    & others, I cant return to Wings,without closing down,

    & starting again, some of those links have tracking

    cookies, newspaper links more so also links to Bbc,does

    anyone else notice that.

  295. Horseboy says:

    I’ve stopped watching BBC News longtime now, only to monitor and criticize. BBC is Establishment tool.

    Started watch Russia Today TV(Channel85) and Aljazeera.

    RT has bias, but they do stuff which never broadcast on UK terrestrial TV.

    George Galloway is on RT, his Sputnik show every weekend. Strange fellow, but again comes out with stuff.

    WingsOverScotland, BellaCaledonia and NewsNet must get on RT’s UK programs. RT do lots of interviews over Skype. KeiserReport, GoingUnderGround and BreakingTheSet are my top shows.

    On Aljazeera found its HeadToHead show. An Oxford Union audience grills an invited guest. General Sir Mike Jackson, and Martin McGuinness were guests.

    Again we don’t get this on UK TV.

    ps. I watch BBC Parliament and C-Span on TV channel81 over weekends, gets very informative.

  296. TJenny says:

    CameronB – as the BBC have been a member of right wing lobbying org, the CBI, for nigh on 30 years, and are thereby in breach of their impartiality clause, are they not therefore also guilty of eliciting monies by false pretenses (licence fees) for all these years?

  297. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Does anyone have any links to BBC statements confirming how long they’ve been CBI members?

    (Last one I saw was the vague ‘more than a decade’.)

  298. JGedd says:


    Actually RT’s London agency reporters generally spout the same kind of stuff that you get on BBC when it comes to Scottish independence. We can’t use the currency, we’ll struggle with debt etc.

    However, today there was a slight change of emphasis in their report about what it would mean for the rUK economy if Scotland left. Maybe the recent little spat over Ukraine has had some effect on the way they might report from now on? We’ll see.

  299. TJenny says:

    Ian B – James Cook BBC Scotland reporter tweeted yesterday that BBC had admittted being a CBI member since at least 1980!

    Not sure if this link to his tweet will work or not but it’s about 3rd tweet down on his timeline.

  300. Mary Bruce says:

    Ian: It was James Cook who tweeted that the BBC had been in the CBI since 1980.

  301. twenty14 says:

    if it becomes fact that the bbc are in breach of their charter is their any legaleagles out there that could draw up a template letter to allow us to withdraw from any license fees until case against has been shown as much or otherwise

  302. a2 says:

    That would remind me of the flags now flying outside the hotel opposite Pacific Quay. (I’d swear they weren’t there yesterday.)

    There’s The Butchers apron, flying high overhead, with a rather patheticly situated Saltaire at half the height.
    must make those at the BBC gazing out over the Clyde proud.

  303. call me dave says:

    I read (on a NNS thread) BBC membership goes back to beyond miners strike & includes poll tax protests.
    At £22k annually that’s a pile of dosh, even accounting for lower costs in the past years.

    CBI formed and Royal Charter 1965

  304. call me dave says:

    Mary beat me to it. 🙂

  305. a2 says:

    That all seems a safe enough way of doing mr brotherhood, I’d like to see the risk assessment though. Careful though yours may be the one note that makes the difference.

    May I also just point out that in the world of black ops, that’s just the kind of silly accident that might happen to vile cybernats as they are known to be clumsy.

  306. call me dave says:

    Jeez! Meant to mention new thread NNS updating BBC / CBI and reason that Bella & WoS mentioned on Newsnight tonight.

    Seriously think the BBC have been found out not just on bias but on dodgy links with one side of debate using public money.

    Shoogly nail time for their management, thought that they were untouchable a few months ago, if heads roll soon then ‘the games a bogey’.

  307. Thepnr says:

    Ah Mr B shouldn’t be climbing on roofs if you not comfortable with heights. Hope your injury is not too serious.

    I’m not falling out with goldenayr, only asking that he thinks before he leaps. He has a voice, cant hear it if he is arguing rather than holding his tongue now and again.

  308. Alan Mackintosh says:

    Next instalment of McV. Well worth a watch.

  309. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @a2 –

    That’s the shed done now anyway. They had their chance, and missed it – but if they get to me, who knows?

    I still have to dig over the patch at the back and stick some onions in there – if I’m discovered planted alongside them, only legs visible, please raise a hue and cry.

    (I’ll tell someone, via our CyberNat code, where the Labrokes slips are planked, just in case…)

  310. goldenayr says:

    Ian Brotherhood

    The youngest is up,so am I.

    Don’t know either what the prob is but whit the fuck,we’re aw deid the morra.

    Re the trust and reliance metaphor.

    Been there,done that,wore the tshirt,baked the cakes…you get the pic?
    It’s as I said earlier and Ronnie alluded to[while I think it was me he was trying to blame]about comparing phallus sizes.
    It would be better all round if we had a reply button so folk could get a gist of the conversation instead of coming in halfway through and making snap decisions on how people are.
    The original angst with thepnr and me was one night when I’d had too much and was doing my usual trying to be funny and clever[definitely not smart].I can’t remember if he was there but Arbroath 1320 was.
    I accused her of being a tory plant,partly in jest but also to flesh out something I’d,mistakenly,picked up on.

    Unsatisfied with the reply I pursued it with all the drunken zeal I could muster…isn’t it strange how we keep saying never again?

    Anyhoos,Thepnr took exception to this,John King took the piss and Arb and I now keep contact on email trying to synchronise calendars so she and her other half can visit.

    Apart from that,this is really a long winded way of saying..if I was on the shed roof,I’d have,kicked the ladders[bins] away after planking a few bottles of red in the gutter and then finished my pouch of baccy.

    P&Q is not something you can buy.

  311. Morag says:

    Thank God we don’t have a reply button. It’s hard enough work trying to keep up here these days just reading in one direction without having to be constantly scrolling back up to see what has been added above while you were reading.

    Not to mention the hordes of prats who write long comments as “replies” to the first comment so that they get to be near the top, and in the end the second comment made is half way down the page.

    Not to mention cluttering up the comments with personal badinage that tends to go off-topic, all forming a huge barrier between the casual reader and the rest of the comments.

    Thank goodness Stu has said there will be no reply button and if he changes his mind on that I may just drive down to Bath and duff him up.

  312. goldenayr says:

    Re the CBI

    The organisation was formed in 1965 out of a merger of the Federation of British Industries (known as FBI), the British Employers’ Confederation and the National Association of British Manufacturers.

    The CBI opened an office in Brussels in 1971, to open up opportunities in Europe. International Offices have opened in Washington (2002), Beijing (2005) and New Dehli (2011).

    It’s the 71 office that intrigues me.Who in Brussels are “beneficiaries”,and for how long,of their business when they’re seeking advice?
    Arms length govt bodies are always to be avoided and this one has HO all over it.

    My Father when he was employed at the War Ministry used to despise the HO for their interference and [I kid you not] war mongering stance.

    He still tried to wash blood from his hands that was not his till he died demented and in pain from the “generous”[their words] flu vaccines the Ministry gave him from Porton Down after he’d been asked to investigate a spate of scientists deaths.

    I’m voting YES for him and all like him who’ve stood against fascism.

  313. goldenayr says:


    Aw diddums,did I upset you?

    What’s all this guff about wanting to get on top?

    A reply button merely allows a discourse to evolve naturally and stops misunderstandings such as those which have occurred between myself and Thepnr.

    If you’re dissatisfied with the level of our freedom of speech then ban me.

  314. Rod Robertson says:

    However if we have been sensible can you imagine the atmosphere, and we will be invincible.

  315. JLT says:

    JGedd – Thanks mate. Someone gets it! Classical music is not elitist. It’s the purest sound.


    To fulfil your ambition we would have to discard ourselves,our heritage,history,hopes,dreams and aspirations in order to conform to your “norm”.

    I do not agree at all with this statement. Culture and folk music can easily appear in Classical Music.

    Tchaikovsky’s 1812 Overture – Begins with the Russian melody of the Eastern Orthodox Troparion of the Holy Cross (also known as “O Lord, Save Thy People”) and also contains strains of La Marseillaise, the French National Anthem.

    Rodrigo – Concierto de Aranjuez – has a piece of music ever defined the very soul of Spain as this piece of work

    Various Freench Artists – Songs of the Auvergne – These are folks songs of the French. Each piece is fantastic, and who cannot be moved by the piece, “Baïlèro”.

    German Opera / Italian Opera – sung in their respective languages.

    Grieg and Sibelius – works that define Scandinavia.

    England – Elgar, Britten, Vaughn Williams, Holst, Arne …all produced music that defined England, if not Britain

    And for some to say ‘Is this us?’ …well, that almost has an element of the Scottish cringe in it.

    But yes! That is us. We do have fantastic orchestras. I would love to see them get more exposure. There is nothing to stop a Scottish composer from producing a work that might have strains of ‘Sky Boat Song’ or hell …even Scotland the Brave!

    …and on that note. I’m done.

  316. Caroline Corfield says:

    Ian Brotherhood, they report it here themselves, although they put ‘since 1980’s’ in quotes, it was their own reporter who reported it, regardless of method, so pretty much by their own admission now. I did try to find independent proof but it was impossible, tried Google, Lycos and Yahoo search engines. Not very impressed with Google’s trawl of links, found what I was looking for on the Yahoo search, the conspiracy theorist in me thinks Google have been nobbled.

  317. john king says:

    Paula Rose says
    “@ Ian Sisterhood – make it to Dundee darling and we’ll all be queueing up to give you a kiss.”

    No me, ah’ve still got stubble rash from the last time 😉

    Ian Brotherhood says
    “We can be sure that some minion in the domestic Security Services has been charged with keeping an eye on this, and similar petitions ”

    They wont have to delve too far to find me,
    I was sent by my company in about 1984 to do a job in Harwell in Oxfordshire (UKAERA United Kingdom Atomic Energy Research Authority) and when I reported to the gate police I was taken inside the gate post and asked to wait while they, ahem got my contact in the complex to come and escort me in,
    Half an hour later the desk Sergeant could not stop himself from showing off by telling me they had been running a security check on me and he rattled off facts about me (some I didn’t know myself) and reminded my of my membership of the SNP , which he was at pains to point out “wasn’t a crime”,he told me this came from “Special Branch” a fact which I already knew because of the type of places I used to have to work in,

    Due to the security clearance I needed to have I had signed the official secrets act on several occasions and had to fill in security forms with details of the usual name address etc,
    But it was interesting just HOW much they knew about me, I felt a little like Richard Hanney.

    So don’t anyone imagine for a minute that stories of MI5 are a romantic fantasy, just ask people in Belfast

    Historical fact, During WWII Harwell was an airbase, from where the Dakota aircraft took off to deposit British paratroops on Arnhem during operation “Market Garden”
    Harwell after the war became a nuclear weapons research establishment.

    Famous15 says
    “Personally I would never countenance failure in mid campaign and therefore do not make any suggestion of songs to be sung in the event you describe.”

    At last! I was beginning to think I had slept in for the referendum and WE HAD LOST! dear god lets not talk of defeat while we are on the rise, if a waiverer takes a snapshot look here they’ll go away thinking “well if Wings think were f**ked”,

    I know people are just trying to remind folk who are wavering just how embarrassing a no vote would be for Scotland but I can just hear the football chant scribes in England sharpening their quills as we speak,

    Don’t give them an effin excuse folks!

    “Ian B – James Cook BBC Scotland reporter tweeted yesterday that BBC had admittted being a CBI member since at least 1980!”

    Anyone else starting to think James Cook is wan o us? 🙂

  318. john king says:

    bLOOdY cAPs loCk

  319. Macart says:

    In the history of dumb ideas, this one is right up there.

    What idiot thought this would be a good plan so soon after the vote?

  320. Bugger (the Panda) says:

    @ Macart

    The Men in Blazers

  321. Desimond says:

    Will there be a full Armed Forces representation before the game and at half time now doubt?

  322. Desimond says:

    I was at Hampden the day they booed Maggie….will we boo Nigel Farage now?

    I hope we do more than just boo at Danny Alexander.

    Has Tavish Scot asked England to play the Shetlands yet?

  323. Proud Cybernat says:

    “Something to think about.”

    It really, really doesn’t bear thinking about. The cage door was opened and the Scottish lion didn’t roar–it just sat on its rear.

  324. Walter Scott says:

    I once heard English fans at a Scotland v England game singing “Shit part of England, You’re just a shit part of England” I had to laugh

  325. Hewitt83 says:

    I cried when Gascoigne scored.

    I was only 9.

  326. Desimond says:

    Hope the Tartan Army sing the theme tune from Neighbours

  327. Desimond says:

    Possible chants for Tartan Army

    “Shows your debt!, shows your debt!, shows your debt!”

    “We’ll fix your boats for yo…on the Clyde, on the Clyde”

    “You can keep the Scottish Lords”

    “You said No!, we said yes!, you can keep Danny Alexander and keep your debt”

    “Where’s yir Empire gone?, where’s yir Empire gone?..far far away”

  328. Phil Robertson says:

    Scottish football and STV – there’s two examples of how well Scottish independent authorities do with control of “all the levers”. Neither could be said to be setting the heather on fire. Compare and contrast with English football and ITV which are both world players (and coping without a Scottish component).

    Something to think about, indeed!

  329. Auld Rock says:

    I believe we could adapt a great Paddy Reilly anthem that I first heard at ‘The Point’ in Dublin, the song ended the performance and just before ‘The Soldiers Song’ and it was – A NATION ONCE AGAIN, great tune as well.

    Auld Rock

  330. CameronB says:

    Now no booing me, but I thought Gascoigne took his chance well. I was still gutted and although older than nine, it might not have been obvious at the time. 🙂

  331. Macart says:


    Those halfwits in blazers at both FAs should get out more.

    No exactly sensitive to the world around them. 🙁

  332. geeo says:

    If my post was deleted for the language used then I apologise, but the question was asked and I merely answered it with a dose of reality and wee bit humour.

  333. Ryan Wilson says:

    Two points.

    1. Surely Flower of Scotland as a national anthem has to cease after the referendum? In the event of a No vote, it becomes a parody of itself. In the event of a Yes vote the lyrics become less relevant in the context of the rebirth of our nation and the nostalgic sense of defiance isn’t appropriate for a forward-thinking country who will have just voted for independence. What do other readers think?

    2. If it is a No vote, then all the Yes voters should boycott the game as a big ‘up yours’ to the 90 minute patriots who come along to Scotland games and have the brass-neckedness to sing the national anthem but will still know in their hearts that they voted No. It’s surprising how many Scotland fans have this mentality, and I suspect that this is why we don’t seem to have seen large-scale Yes flags and posters at the games. If it’s a No, I certainly won’t be taking up my ticket allocation. I won’t even be annoyed at the English fans who’ve earned the right to slag us off via songs and banter but I’ll have an internal rage towards the tartan-clad hypocritical clandestine Uncle Tam no-voters within the stadium.

  334. haud on the noo says:

    The best I heard was “I’d rather have a Panda than a prince”.

  335. lochside says:

    @Phil Robertson re. Scottish Football and STV comparing poorly with English counterparts despite control of ‘all levers’..What are you talking about man?

    This is in microcosm an example of the whole Indy argument. English football is funded by overwhelming amounts of SKY, BBC and I.T.N. money.ALL of which we contribute to (circa 10%) but receive a tiny percentage back. Similarly, STV do not have a budget to cover Scottish football properly.

    As for reviving the Scotland v England fixture…obviously only an idiot would want this game revived and played at the end of this year, of all years. Has everyone forgotten this fixture came to an end due to organised English hooligan trouble in Glasgow?

    It will provide an excuse for the EDL to come up and join up with the hundred odd SDL camp followers here and cause disorder in our streets. Diverse groups of local neds will provide plenty of opposition for them. In addition to all the mayhem, no doubt we’ll have to suffer another dubious brave defeat.

    Forget it! let’s get on with celebrating our Independence or if not..well would we want a further reminder of our nation’s cowardice and irrelevance?

    On a happier note: New Anthem, how about ‘From a Distance’?
    I like the idea of 50,000 tartan army basso profundos trying to sing this little ditty.

  336. magicpants says:

    Lots of posters rabbiting on about “if there’s a no vote”, ex Ryan Wilson’s Point 2 above etc etc ad nauseum.

    One of the most negative threads I’ve ever encountered on this site.

    Hopefully it’ll get put to bed soon.

  337. CameronB says:

    The Rev. asked us to imagine which songs the English might serenade us with, following a no vote.

    Would you like to imagine, readers, the songs the visiting England support might sing if Scotland had voted to continue being ruled by them exactly two months earlier?

  338. Desimond says:

    Man with tongue in cheek speaks!

    “Salmond hopes England team does well”

  339. Tam Jardine says:

    Ian Brotherhood

    Have been beavering away trying to get snp to send the cool lapel yes badges to their 30K members. I found a website that can do bulk for what appears to be as little as 28p for enamel and 11p for cheaper ones.

    Might be worth a look (though if there is a Scottish manufacturer then that’s a nobrainer). Site I looked at was

    And if I get anywhere then I will see if the Greens and SSP can do the same. Imagine if you start seeing people everywhere wearing yes badges and never a soul with a BT badge? People are the big advertising tool in this referendum.

    The SNP are about to flood the country with car and windows stickers but not the humble badge. To hell with fundraising, this is advertising.

    You may be able to tell: this has now become the main task of my life.

  340. Phil Robertson says:

    lochside says:
    What are you talking about man?

    This is in microcosm an example of the whole Indy argument. English football is funded by overwhelming amounts of SKY, BBC and I.T.N. money.ALL of which we contribute to (circa 10%) but receive a tiny percentage back. Similarly, STV do not have a budget to cover Scottish football properly.

    The point is that the SFA, SPFL and STV are current examples of what life will be like post-independence. The Scottish football authorities negotiate their OWN deals with BBC, Sky etc (with no interference from London)and they gets peanuts because there are just a small country with no financial clout and, as far as football is concerned, no decent product to sell. Scottish football is where it is through its own INDEPENDENT efforts.

    You’ve seen the future.

  341. msean says:

    Complete with English main commentator on STV. Hard to win when over half your country thinks you shouldn’t exist. 🙁

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