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Make yourselves useful

Posted on September 27, 2013 by

One thing we noticed over the last week or so was the near-total lack of campaigning on the streets of Scotland’s cities and towns, from either side. So if you were inspired by the rally and fancy making a more active contribution, why not pop to your local printers, make a few copies of this excellent wee leaflet, and get busy?

You can get 1,000 A6 copies printed for £22 here (5,000 for £40). Hand ’em out or just leave them in strategic locations (with permission, of course). Let’s get the word out.

ayer0

Right-click the image to get the full PDF version, ready for printing.

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    251 to “Make yourselves useful”

    1. gavin lessells says:

      Thanks Rev.
      I know that atleast 20,000 are being distributed in Govan.
      Anyone interested, please contact Bob Allan, Oban
      on 01631562571 He can supply pdf by e mail.
      The leaflets are currently printed as A6 on glossy 299gm paper.

    2. The Water Beastie says:

      🙂  More subversion!!  Pointing the public towards sources of information other than BT-approved BBC & MSM – that constitutes ‘scurrilous’, surely….?
      Keep it up!!

    3. gavin lessells says:

      CORRECTION
      Bob can ALSO help. Paper 200gm A6 glossy.

    4. Tim F-G says:

      Excellent idea, Rev. Will take a batch of those to the YES meeting in Leith this week (as well as filming it, Nicola Sturgeon, a Green councillor, Aamer Anwar and Margo McDonald will be making speeches).

    5. CameronB says:

      Why not pool our resources a get one large print run done, rather than as individual projects? The unit costs would be significantly less and the supplier would be able to deliver to more than one strategically chosen location. Any savings may be swallowed up by further distribution, but this could be rationalised to a minimum. It may still work out cheaper if the print run is large enough.
       
      Just a thought.

      gavin lessells
      I was going to say that 299gsm was possibly overkill. 🙂

    6. Albalha says:

      And this new post from one of the sites on the leaflet
      http://drderekbateman.wordpress.com/2013/09/27/who-will-fill-a-cowards-grave/

    7. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      Any savings may be swallowed up by further distribution”

      I think that’s the issue. Paper is heavy and costs a fortune to post. Printing, especially if done online, can be cheap as chips. You can get 1,000 copies on A6 (at a perfectly decent 130gsm) here for just £22:

      http://www.cheapestprintonline.co.uk/Gloss%20Flyers/A6%20Double/130gsm%20Gloss/5day-nodesign.php

      (Or 5,000 for £40 if you think you’d use them. Whatever you do don’t get 10,000 – for some reason it’s £14 more than getting two lots of 5,000…)

    8. gordoz says:

      Excellent material rev – keeps the troops active !

      Thanks for the contact info for Bob Allan too

    9. CameronB says:

      Does it show that I’m from the east coast? 🙂
       
      The 10,000 possibly cost £14 extra, because there is likely to be another plate involved. (techy details – not important). Either that, or the 10,000 require two slots in the run, there likely being a number of different print jobs being run at the same time..

    10. Gordon Bain says:

      Maybe I’m being pedantic but doesn’t “aye, right”, a double positive, over the Saltire create a negative impression? Just asking.

    11. Juteman says:

      Too Weedgieish Stu. Naebdy in Dundee sez Aye. It’s ‘Eh’. 🙂

    12. robert Louis says:

      Caesar!lha,
       
      Thanks for highlighting the excellent piece by Derek Bateman, regarding feartie Cameron, the UK prime minister.  Indeed, we should from now on no longer call him David Cameron, just feartie Cameron.
       
      As regards the way feartie Cameron, has punted Labour’s Alistair Darling into the role, it is abundantly clear why that has been done, as I and other have pointed out before.  If NO wins the referendum, feartie Cameron as UK prime minister will take the credit, keeping Britain togther etc…etc….  If YES wins, feartie Cameron as UK prime minister, will simply blame Scottish Labour, as it was their responsibility.  Either way, the Tories win.  I am just astonished that this glaringly obvious piece of Bullingdon boy manipulation does not seem to have registered in the minds of the Labour party yet.

    13. CameronB says:

      Or the 10,000 are run on a larger press, so a larger and more expensive plate is required.
       
      Or it may just be that they have to peel more tatties. 🙂

    14. gordoz says:

      Did anyone see the performance of the ‘Laybur’ candidate for Dunfermline (STV) ?
      The local councillor had a bit of a disaster – all over the place. Wee Johann did not look pleased with her – but then it’s hard to tell sometimes.

    15. Sneddon says:

      How much would it cost to have 500 of them done as stickers?

    16. david says:

      i thot the same as gordon bain initially

    17. Albalha says:

      @Sneddon
      As @gavinlessels said at the top Robert Allan, Oban, (see the Seagetgrip comment in this Newsnet article from 23/09, it also includes an e mail), is behind this so he may know what other options there are and pricing.
      http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/8064-scottish-independence-just-why-are-scots-so-poorly-informed

    18. Andy-B says:

      Well thought out leaflet REV.
       
      Here’s a site with many many more independence leaflets, though might I add, not as well thought out as yours.
       
      http://www.indyposterboy.info/scottish-independence.asp

    19. Juteman says:

      OT, but nobody seems to have picked up on the latest census results.
      Only 18% of Scots class themselves as Scottish and British, whilst 62% class themselves as Scots only.

    20. The Man in the Jar says:

      @Juteman
      Eh?
      😉

    21. Thepnr says:

      In 2011 I well remember classing myself as one of only 8% who said they were British, considering 9% of the people living here are English I must have been one of the few Scots to do so!
       
      More shame me, my eyes have been opened and since these results yesterday the missus has given me pelters because at the time she classed herself as Scottish and I insisted she was wrong.
       
      Forgive me Wingers for I have sinned.

    22. Juteman says:

      The 2011 Census results, o jarred one. 🙂

    23. dee says:

      Regarding the David “Feartie” Cameron saga was a topic on BBC Reporting Scotland tonight, the report showed Cameron explaining why he would not appear with A.S. yet when the reply from Alex Salmond came along, it was another quote. This has happened countless times on BBC Scotland. You get the video of the unionist explaining his point and you get the quote read out for you from a BBC studio presenter.  How balanced is that.
       
      In the census yesterday, 62% said they were Scottish, I would bet not one of them work at Pacific Quay.  Scotland hating ("Tractor" - Ed)s, the lot of them.

      Also on the subject of BBC Scotland, if Mr Bateman is really “coming out” then why doesn’t he spill the beans on what exactly took place at those production team meetings prior to shows going out. Who is at the back of all these scare stories and who is against them. Come on Mr Bateman Speak up.

    24. twenty14 says:

      Rev – other people would call this emotional blackmail – yer a crafty one Rev Stu 🙂

    25. Bella Caledonia says:

      ‘One thing we noticed over the last week or so was the near-total lack of campaigning on the streets of Scotland’s cities and towns’.

      This just isn’t true. I don’t quite understand how you can be so disassociated from the many people campaigning. I don’t understand.

    26. scaredy cat. says:

      Thanks Stu. Someone gave me one of these on Saturday and I wondered how to get a hold of some. Do we really need permission though?

    27. helpmaboab says:

      We have  a seperatist insurection on our hands. (According to the BBC.)

    28. McNic says:

      Or you could get active with your local SNP/SSP branch and start leafleting with their new newspapers.
      They carry the YES masthead but contain their own info, get to it guys.

      Ayrshire was an industrial hotbed at one time but sadly the carpets, textiles, mines, whisky, fishing are almost all gone…. and with them the support for Labour.

      My area is mirrored across the country and people are interested in change and disgusted with what has happened to their party.

      It really is ours for the taking, but it needs the info on the doorstep, dont get angry get active :o)

      Had my BADGE on this afternoon while posting SNP papers, cheers Stu!

    29. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      Well thought out leaflet REV”

      I had nothing to do with the design of it, other than suggesting that Business For Scotland really needed to be on there.

    30. CameronB says:

      Jings crivens. Can you post a link please, helpmaboab?

    31. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      This just isn’t true. I don’t quite understand how you can be so disassociated from the many people campaigning.”

      Um, it IS true. I should know, I was the one noticing it.

      I’m not saying nobody’s campaigning. I’m sure they are, and dedicatedly so. All I’m saying is that I spent 8 days tramping the centre of Glasgow, the centre of Edinburgh and a bunch of other places, and other than one BT woman with leaflets at Bathgate train station one evening, I saw nothing (outside of the rally, of course) that suggested there was a referendum happening. And I was looking.

      No canvassers, not one person wearing a badge, not a single sign in a window or a sticker on a car – nothing, from either side. It’s not a criticism of the campaign teams, it’s an observation about the amount of impact the referendum seems to have had on the public consciousness at this stage. I didn’t expect to see much at this point, or really until after the Euro elections, but I did expect to encounter a wee bit more than I did, ie nothing.

    32. Seanair says:

      Tim F-G
      Must have missed this. Where, when in Leith?
      Thanks in advance

    33. The Man in the Jar says:

      @Juteman
      Coincidence! I was referring to your earlier comment. 😉

    34. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      Do we really need permission though?”

      Well, depends where you’re leaving them, I guess. But if you just dump them somewhere without asking, they might end up going straight in the bin.

    35. JLT says:

      Or if your sneaky …print off one, photocopy it a 1000 times (using the works printers, and when no one is looking), and start leaving them lying about here and there…
       
      No, but seriously, I probably could get away with the first part of my sentence (ie the printing and photocopying part – this is the beauty of working inside a major financial institution. Arrive early, print off say a 100 at a time every week) and then hand them out to folk at work whenever the conversation of independence strikes up!

      I couldn’t leave them lying around in the offices; there would be a massive manhunt as to who is doing it, and a fair few folk know my allegiances! My name would eventually crop up, and then I would probably face the firing squad!

      Thing is Stuart. This I could do (as in photocopy them), but they will be in black and white. Now, if I could distribute them by hand, I’m going to guess …that you wouldn’t be too bothered if they were in black and white when I hand them to folk. Getting the message across is the real main point.

      I’m just clearing this first with yourself, Stuart, just so I’m not upsetting anyone. You okay with this?

    36. Bella Caledonia says:

      You can imagine though that if you are one of the many thousands of people who have been campaigning that this description of ‘the near-total lack of campaigning on the streets of Scotland’s cities and towns’ might irk, a bit?

    37. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      I’m just clearing this first with yourself, Stuart, just so I’m not upsetting anyone. You okay with this?”

      Well, it’s nothing to do with me – I didn’t make the leaflet and have no rights of any kind over it. But *I* certainly don’t mind folk photocopying it in b&w and getting it out there. It’s the content that counts.

    38. Bawheid Bragg says:

      gordoz says:
      27 September, 2013 at 6:22 pm

      Did anyone see the performance of the ‘Laybur’ candidate for Dunfermline (STV) ?
      The local councillor had a bit of a disaster – all over the place. Wee Johann did not look pleased with her – but then it’s hard to tell sometimes.
      Do you know what programme this was, and if it’s on the STV iplayer?

    39. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      You can imagine though that if you are one of the many thousands of people who have been campaigning that this description of ‘the near-total lack of campaigning on the streets of Scotland’s cities and towns’ might irk, a bit?”

      I don’t think folk are so sensitive as to take unintended offence at an honest factual and personal observation.

    40. Juteman says:

      @The jar.
      Eh dinnae ken wit yir onaboot. 🙂

    41. Simon says:

      Does your “major financial institution” no have colour photocopiers? Or even better colour printers you could print direct from the PDF? Or better still, an expense account to order 1000 for £22 using the Rev’s link?

    42. Juteman says:

      @Bella.
      I drive to work and back, and haven’t seen a single indy banner, apart from a house last week on the bus through to the rally.
      Folk are ‘grassrooting’. but the indy campaign is still invisible to the general public.

    43. tartanfever says:

      Dee – with reference to your appeal to Derek Bateman regarding ‘spilling the beans’ about the BBC, remember, like many other professions, there is a confidentiality clause in his contract that he will have signed.
       
      Breaking it would leave him liable to prosecution.
       
       
      While I, like many others, would be extremely grateful to a whistle blower coming forward and exposing the BBC for all that it is, unless hard and irrefutable evidence is made public, the chances are that the media would ‘circle the wagons’ and launch an all out smear campaign on Mr Bateman.
       
      All media have confidentiality clauses and none of them want to see any whistle blowers as it could potentially could lead to many more coming forward.

    44. tartanfever says:

      Bella & Rev Stu –
       
      that’s it, no more campaigning from me ! I’m voting No.
       
      Stuff your bloody leaflets 😉

    45. Thepnr says:

      Rev
       
      Printing the leaflets really doesn’t cost very much the hard work is in distributing them. Remember the little posters you did a month or so back with the graphics showing how better off Scots could be with Independence and I quote “I could do these all day”.
       
      Can you post 1 or two of these in the sme format as I would like to deliver all of them together, we all know that for many Scots to be convinced the economic argument is the dominant one.

    46. heraldnomore says:

      Excellent.  We must direct folk to the places where they will learn the real facts, for the MSM are playing to an agenda.  Thankfully Mr Bateman has timed his retiral perfectly and will, I’m sure be quite busy for the next year.  His post today, on the PM’s fear and his fears  his former  colleagues in the media, is one of those ‘must reads’; brilliant.
       
      i’ll arrange some of those leaflets, and distribute them.

    47. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      Can you post 1 or two of these”

      I’ve actually just compiled all of them together into one double-sided leaflet with the Union Jocks poster on the front. Will post it up soon.

    48. Albalha says:

      Dave’s letter to Alex on why he won’t debate
      https://twitter.com/holyroodmandy/status/383540918994739200/photo/1

    49. JLT says:

      Cheer Stuart. I wasn’t sure if it was your ‘design and idea’, and therefore, using and manipulating it in the wrong sense. As you say …it’s about getting the message out there!
      I think there are quite a few folk, to whom, I can pass these on, and then hopefully, they can do the same!
       
       
      I’m going to take a risk here! If folk are struggling to get copies, then give me a shout. If you live in Edinburgh, and you are after a batch, I can arrange to meet while I’m out travelling about between buildings, and I might be able to meet at an arranged time (say Charlotte Sq. at 3pm). Give me a shout here. We can discuss and I’ll see what I can do.

    50. McNic says:

      Ah pure loved it that 1.5m o’ us said we talk Scots, ma weans ur broad, when thur no wi thur Gran !
       

    51. Juteman says:

      I hope this makes sense.

      Most young folk only want to get pissed and shag. I know this statement has probably annoyed the mostly middle class readership of the site.

      Trendy blogs, and ‘right on’ politicos are known as wankers by most working young folk. “Go and get a life” is their response to folk that spend hours torturing themselves over words.

      Anyway, bringing my ‘trendy’ son on the rally last week is paying dividends. His Pusbook thing is seemingly being liked a lot. This is a good thing. ‘

      Many of his friends are now going on the next rally, and voting Yes.

      Sad, but if it is ‘cool’, folk will vote for it without understanding what they are voting for.

      Banners and free drinks work.

    52. TJenny says:

      Tim F-G
      Like Seanair I too have missed hearing about this. Where, when in Leith?
      Be good to see you there.

    53. Morag says:

      Did I mention I’m in love with Derek Bateman?

    54. jim mitchell says:

      There has been no focused campaign yet, as you would find in an election campaign, people and organisations are trying to pace themselves, this might mean they get it wrong sometimes or even be sitting back at the same time just by coincidence, it can also be that workers are doing the area you have just left!

      Like the leaflet and if it gets some more folk out working so much the better, but if possible try and pick an area you know for definite has not been done yet.

    55. john king says:

      thepnr says
      “Forgive me Wingers for I have sinned.”
      do three declarations of Arbroath and a mccrone report and you shall be absolved my son ,now go in peace 😉

    56. call me dave says:

      Morag
      Too much information!
      @:0)

    57. muttley79 says:

      @dee
       
      Also on the subject of BBC Scotland, if Mr Bateman is really “coming out” then why doesn’t he spill the beans on what exactly took place at those production team meetings prior to shows going out. Who is at the back of all these scare stories and who is against them. Come on Mr Bateman Speak up.
       
      Give the guy a break!   Seriously though, he has not long stopped working for BBC Scotland.  As someone else said, Derek Bateman probably had to sign a confidentiality agreement, or something similar.  He probably has to think about the kinds of things he can say on his blog.  We should be grateful that he is already contributing to the campaign. 

    58. jim mitchell says:

      Hot of the press: Better Together Falkirk – Launch Event (Local Group Launch Event)

      Better Together are launching the dedicated Better Together Falkirk campaign group and we would like you to join us.The event will take place on Saturday 2nd November 2013, at 12noon, in Falkirk Parish Church, Kirk Wynd, Falkirk.This public meeting will give you and other members of the community a chance to hear about Better Together, ask questions or raise issues and to get involved in the campaign to keep Scotland a strong part of the United Kingdom.

      Our campaign is all party and non-party, so regardless of whether you are a seasoned campaigner or have never been involved in something like this before, we would love to see you on the day.

      In order to allow us to plan the event properly, it would be helpful to let us know if you can attend by joining this event and confirm you are going.
      Any chance someone can go along and see what takes place, Major Joyce might turn up, and a fine chance to hand out some of those leaflets 

    59. Gallowglass says:

      Where can I get Scottish Not Brittish Saltire stickers?

    60. Gallowglass says:

      Oh and for the record, I’ve seen four Yes Scotland stalls in the last couple of months and only a solitary youth standing outside Haymarket handing out BT leaflets..

    61. Albalha says:

      @Gallowglass
      Found this site, not sure what it’s like, just a quick search
      http://www.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk/p/we-are-scottish-not-british/

    62. gordoz says:

      @dee
      Derek Bateman is doing just fine in my view !
      Any Scots journalist supporting YES is going against the grain of the establishment & MSM, so more power to him. Folk get where he is coming from and he is a huge irritation to the BBC even with what he is saying to date.

    63. Silverytay says:

      Gallowglass   
      The other site to try is Zazzle and then just type in Scottish independence and they have everything from T shirts to Bumper stickers .
       

    64. dee says:

      @Juteman
       
      Remember, we are a classless society, but a good point, I to had my son and daughter there and they to will spread the good word of an independent Scotland.
       

    65. kininvie says:

      O/T (just for a change)
       
      I see the UK is going to host the NATO 2014 summit to soothe DC’s ego, and bugger the cost to the rest of us (28 heads of state plus hangers on, all at taxpayers’ expense)
       
      https://www.gov.uk/government/news/pm-announces-britain-will-host-2014-nato-summit–2
       
      The interesting question is where will DC choose. Could we be about to see another Glasgow moment to go with the WWI celebrations (and to remind us how lucky we are to be part of the UK as the Obama cavalcade rolls into town)?
       
      Or will he be too feart?

    66. Andrew Morton says:

      Handouts good. Go one step further, crowd fund a poster campaign on bus shelters in the main town centres. Have some of those little black and white squarey wossnames that people can scan with their mobile phones and go to the sites without typing stuff in.

    67. Albalha says:

      @AndrewMorton
      Looking at that very thing, watch this space.

    68. Jingly Jangly says:

      Rev, plenty going on in Arran including a raffle to win one of my limited edition pics
      entitled Lochranza Sunset , and other Photographic works by Local Arran Photographers
      £5 per book draw on 30th November anybody interested email me at info [at] jinglyjangly [dot] com
      this is link to main prize photo its on canvas and measures 48 inches x 14 inches
      http://www.jinglyjangly.com/p452865260/h52227a60#h52227a60
      All proceeds to YES Arran

    69. david says:

      i shouted to him on saturday that i liked his blog, he called back, thankyou, very polite

    70. gavin lessells says:

      Leaflets
      Bob Allan in Oban has details of printer who will print 50,000 for £445  which is about £8 per thousand. His number on first post. The printer is a supporter.

    71. Edward says:

      tartanfever
      Actually…Someone should ‘interview/discuss’ with Derek Bateman on an off the record basis, some background and information, that doesn’t necessarily be attributable to Derek.  Then ‘leak’ out into the blogosphere in such a way that those within think the ‘leak is coming from within the BBC. Sometimes you can connect pieces of information that is already known with bits that are not and complete a picture. Sounds devious, it is . But when your fighting a propaganda war you need everything to help counter act the devious propaganda that’s being thrown at you

    72. farrochie says:

      I’m a great believer in one-to-once conversations. Met a couple of lads in Montrose tool shop, one mentioned that he’d seen my YES lapel badge the day before. I asked about what the young were thinking. Basically they have little information. I went through the case for independence from a couple of angles, raising our own taxes, not sending all to W/minster in return for a grant, making our decisions, deciding what government we want.

      One of them, still at school, will be first time voter. I told them to get as much info as they can, talk to people about the issues to come to a decision and that nothing to fear from managing our own affairs.

      I think those are two potential YES votes. We need to do these chats, people are nervous to admit their views, or maybe to admit they have no clue how politics works in this country. They can’t even distinguish Party, Government and Parliament.

      The YES poster on my motorbike is getting thumbs up and waves fae drivers; and possibly scowls, but I never saw one yet!

    73. Andrew Morton says:

      Re Derek Bateman. I think that Derek is revealing all that he can in his own humorous way. We can join the dots.

    74. Tim F-G says:

      @seanair & T Jenny: it’s called UNDECIDED ABOUT THE REFERENDUM?, and takes place at The Halls, 6 Henderson St, EH6 6BS, 7.30 to 9.30pm on Thurs 3 Oct. Official Facebook blurb says: ”

      The case for a Yes vote and the gains of independence will be outlined on Thursday 3rd October at a participatory event in the heart of Leith.

      Undecided voters will have the opportunity to ask a top panel – including Nicola Sturgeon and leading human rights lawyer Aamer Anwar – why they should vote Yes on September 18 next year. Also speaking at the event will be independent MSP Margo MacDonald and Leith’s Green councillor Chas Booth.

      All four will speak, listen to your questions and reply with their thoughts as to why Scotland will be a better and fairer with independence.

      The event is hosted by Yes Edinburgh North and Leith who are part of the biggest ever community-led campaign in Scotland. As part of the Yes Scotland campaign, they will bring the positive message about Scotland’s ­­future being in Scotland’s hands to every household in Edinburgh North and Leith.”   
      Say hi if you see me there (I’ll be the bearded bloke with the camcorder and tripod and mike)

    75. Colin Dunn says:

      @ Andy-B says
       
      “Well thought out leaflet REV. Here’s a site with many many more independence leaflets, though might I add, not as well thought out as yours.”
       
      Ouch 😉

    76. Sneddon says:

      Right I’ve can get a deal on getting stickers printed.  Now all I need is ideas on locations in Edinburgh.  Pub toilets strike me as one place with a ‘captive’ audience. Any other suggestions (keep ’em clean folks)  Let’s reach the places where other campaigns can’t reach 🙂

    77. dee says:

      @gordoz
       
      I am glad we are having a wee chat about Mr Bateman. We have been waiting years for someone to come over to the Nationalists side to tell us exactly what is going on in that shit hole at Pacific Quay and when we get one you don’t want him to tell us who the scumbags are that are behind running down of my country.  BBC Scotland want you to feel ashamed of being a Scot. Yet you are saying he is doing just fine. Well IMO he has got a lot to tell us before he can be accepted.

    78. Albalha says:

      @Colin Dunn
      Did you get my message? No worries either way, just wanted to check. And for what it’s worth I think you’re posters are just as good.

    79. Colin Dunn says:

      @ Rev. Stuart Campbell
      “You can get 1,000 A6 copies printed for £22 here (5,000 for £40).”
       
      I’ve been using Saxo for my indyposterboy stuff (http://www.saxoprint.co.uk) which prints in Germany. They’ll do 5,000 double-sided A6 for £39.12 including delivery. Turnaround is not the fastest, not surprisingly (though they do an express delivery charged extra) but it’s the cheapest I’ve found.

    80. ianbrotherhood says:

      Spotted a UKOK car sticker this afternoon – first time I’ve seen one. On the rear window of a big Honda 4×4 in a Saltcoats supermarket car park.
       
      The belter driving it stopped right in front of the taxi-rank, clogging the one-way exit system while his buddy disembarked. I was stuck right behind him, was about to give him a blast when I remembered I’ve got the Yes stickers on the back – a wee reminder to be careful, if you’re sporting Yes material, to be civil. Don’t give them any excuse.
       
      (And the ‘UKOK’ logo really is every bit as Carry-On daft as it’s been described here and elsewhere – makes the driver a laughing-stock.) 

    81. Albalha says:

      @dee
      What is this about being accepted, ‘who’ is it people are to be accepted by?
      YES supporters come in all forms and we certainly won’t all agree on a lot of things outside the obvious, getting over the line.

    82. boorach says:

      Re Mr Bateman I think there’s a lot more being said between the lines than actually appears on the screen.
       
      Not only that but his Naughty Briefing/debriefing blogs were pretty close to the knuckle stuff.
       
      Only my opinion for what that’s worth.

    83. Colin Dunn says:

      @ Caesar!lha says:
      “Did you get my message? No worries either way, just wanted to check.”
       
      I’ve been expecting it but didn’t receive it. Can you try via my contact form again, please? Thanks. http://www.indyposterboy.info/feedback.asp

    84. Albalha says:

      @colindunn
      Will resend, I sent the day we exchanged posts, will try again now.

    85. benefit scrounnger says:

      i’d love to help out, but folk like myself on benefits and low income. We don’t have £22 to waste on printing out leaflets. £22 is almost the amount i have to spend on a fortnights shopping. 

    86. dee says:

      @Caesar!lha
      “Accepted” as a Nationalist. Mr Bateman worked for the BBC for 40/50 years, so he has enough ammunition for us to attack them with that it would blow Pacific Quay off the face of the earth.

    87. Seanair says:

      Thanks Tim F-G. Couldn’t find anything on Yes Scotland website and don’t do Facebook.l
      Sounds interesting, but could be disappointing if “doubters” don’t turn up and the big names are  left preaching to the converted. Hope not.

    88. Linda's back says:

      Late back from work via a hostelry.
      Can someone put the Labour candidate in Dunfermlie’s performance on youtube?

    89. McNic says:

      I mentioned Wully Rennie on Mr Batemans Blog and have gone into moderation?

    90. Morag says:

      I’m not convinced Mr. Bateman is very net-savvy.  I doubt if he knows how to put someone on to moderation.

    91. Albalha says:

      @dee
      I wonder how many SNP folks you think are cheek by jowl with BBC folks, I agree the BBC is taking an establishment stance but the links between the SNP and BBC people is there. Let’s not forget Blair Jenkins was the Head of News and Current Affairs, yes a job now held by a Labour man, unfortunately, and in my view wholly inappropriate.  I worked there in the late 90’s, the Editor of the Lesley Riddoch phone in, I don’t think we could have been accused of being anti Scottish in the same way as some parts of the organisation display now.
       

    92. Shinty says:

      Mr Bateman worked for the BBC for 40/50 years,
      What? he doesn’t look a day over 50!

    93. boorach says:

      Dee
      Derek Bateman has taken early retirement, for whatever reasons personality clash, health sickened to the back teeth with corporate attitude, personally I don’t give a damn.
       
      What he is doing is to be admired, read and digested. He will tell us a lot, perhaps not a kiss and tell but much more interesting for all that.

    94. call me dave says:

      dee
      Derek Bateman ran a good debate programme for years and it was obvious to any listener that he and also Isabel Fraser were not the normal BBC bias presenters.  

      We should be grateful for the work they do and wonder why they were both  sidelined to slots at none peak times.  OH maybe…because they did not give the better together shower an easy time.

    95. TJenny says:

      Tim F-G, thanks for info. i’m a member of YES Edin N+ Leith and don’t remember being emailed re this although maybe if it was headed up ‘For Undeciders’, I wouldn’t have paid much attention, as I’m not – if you know what I mean?
      Anyway, I’ll maybe go just for the speeches and to hear what undecideds are undecided about – could be iluminating, or do you think maybe Yes voters shouldn’t be there? If I go, I’ll say Hello;-)
      Are The Halls the building on the r/h side in Henderson St, just round fron Greggs?

    96. muttley79 says:

      @dee
       
      You and the rest of us on here are simply not in the position to know what Derek Bateman’s contractual obligations in leaving BBC Scotland are.  I have to be honest and say I don’t think this whole ‘he has to do such and such to be accepted’ is helpful at all.  Would you prefer it if he had not started writing his own blog?  Already it is a welcome boost, and important addition to the Yes side on the internet.

    97. McNic says:

      Morag- i’m no net-savy but i have been moderated for an innocuous comment?

    98. Albalha says:

      Derek Bateman is in his early 60’s worked in newspapers before joining the BBC.
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0079g3m/presenters/derek-bateman

    99. Thepnr says:

      Nationalist now that’s a word that can upset many depending on which definition you choose to accept. This is why occasionally in the MSM you will see reference to the Scottish Nationalist Party implying something sinister.
       
      We all know that the correct name is the Scottish National Party but others may not. I support Independence but do not see myself as a Nationalist, simply because it could be misconstrued as someone who believes we must all be of the same ethnic or religious origin.
       
      In my view we are all supporters of Independence, that does not necessarily make you a Nationalist. 

    100. Robert louis says:

      Or….. you could also volunteer to help YES Scotland distribute leaflets.  The big advantage, is the YES Scotland ones are already printed.
       
      http://www.yesscotland.net/join-in
       
      I agree with the criticism by Bella Caledonia above.  Is it really constructive to make such a statement? 

    101. Robert louis says:

      Mutley79,
       
      well said.

    102. iain taylor (not that one) says:

      On public visibility, I agree it has to be stepped up a gear. My son (fast approaching 20) is regularly out canvassing & leafleting locally, but may be a bit sidetracked by the Dunfermline by-election.

      I’ve bought one of the Yes courier bags which I intend using for the next year instead of my usual (ancient) laptop bag. When not using it (when at the supermarket, ice hockey, horse racing & other frivolities), I’ll be wearing a Yes pin badge.

      I don’t see any other badges out there at the moment.  

      Did some political campaigning in New York when I lived there, so I know how much hard work goes into just a wee bit of visibility.

    103. Robert louis says:

      Saw some posters regarding the Leith meeting in a shop window, whilst down there today.  Sounds like an interesting meeting.   it’ll be interesting to see the turnout. 
       

    104. dee says:

      @

      McNic says:
      27 September, 2013 at 9:24 pm

      I mentioned Wully Rennie on Mr Batemans Blog and have gone into moderation?

      Why?.
      As I have mentioned above, he still has a lot to answer for. Anyone that could work with that lowlife at Pacific Quay for so long must be tainted in some way.

    105. call me dave says:

      Here is a post from the Record.
      It’s a rant about BBC Scotland and Bateman is mentioned.
      ——————————————————-
      Martin James
      12:28 PM on 17/7/2013
      how about this for an ” EXCLUSIVE ”

      CAN SCOTLAND TRUST ITS OWN MEDIA ???

      In Scotland the media is overwhelmingly pro-Union. Few would argue that our press are vehemently anti-independence, anti-SNP and anti-Salmond. The Sunday Herald’s recent conversion to quality journalism is a welcome media ripple in an otherwise partisan tidal-wave.

      Last week in the immediate aftermath of Andy Murray’s phenomenal Wimbledon triumph, the pro-Union media machine ran with an anti-Salmond narrative alongside the euphoric celebratory coverage. 

      In few countries would a media attack its own leader for holding the nation’s flag at such a momentous sporting triumph – but in Scotland, such is the fear of a rise in Scottish national confidence, that any embrace of such by the nation or its leader has to be dealt with.

      One BBC programme, ‘Call Kaye’, hosted by Kaye Adams actually questioned whether Scotland had a right to claim credit for Andy Murray. The show for once relegating its regular attack on the Scottish health and the NHS to second spot.

      The pro-Union leanings of our media have made it easy for the anti-independence campaigners to get their message out there. Broadcasts and headlines have been dominated with all kinds of claims, from EU membership to mobile phone charges.

      Some of the headlines emanated from the media themselves, with BBC Scotland stoking EU membership doubts by cherry picking and, sadly in some cases, misrepresenting the views of some foreign ministers after the politicians were approached by reporters based at Pacific Quay.

      Over the last few weeks the relentless negativity has appeared to backfire with the revelation over the MoD’s plans for Scotland’s naval bases at Faslane and Coulport coming hot on the heels of ridiculous claims over mobile phone charges.

      There is now evidence that the Scottish media is beginning to realise that the incessant reliance on extreme scares is having an opposite effect to that which was hoped. 

      It’s prompted a subtle change in approach which will now see the Yes campaign presented as equally negative. By presenting both sides as being negative the media will deflect from the No campaign’s self inflicted Achilles’ heel.

      It will most likely be accompanied by a new strategy from the No campaign that will seek to emphasise the ‘extra powers’ on offer if Scots stay in the Union.

      BBC Scotland

      BBC Scotland will play its part in this new ‘as negative as one another’ narrative as evidenced by Glenn Campbell’s overtly partisan analysis of Alex Salmond’s speech on Friday and again with Andrew Kerr’s comments on the Sunday Politics Show.

      The departure of respected journalist Derek Bateman two weeks ago from BBC Scotland was a blow to those of us lamenting a lack of in depth and qualitative analysis of the independence issues. It followed the side-lining of Isabel Fraser from flagship political programmes in favour of the aforementioned Kerr.

      Bateman’s voluntary retirement as part of the corporation’s redundancy scheme effectively means there are now few high profile presenters left to challenge the overtly pro-Union and powerful clique at Pacific Quay.

      Glenn Campbell, Raymond Buchanan, Douglas Fraser and Gary Robertson are joined by Sally Magnusson, Mhairi Stuart and Jackie Bird. The gender balance being the only balance we are likely to see at BBC Scotland.

      A Radio 4 programme to be broadcast at 8:30pm tonight [Monday] about the SNP, is presented by Business and Economy editor Fraser and contains the following in the preview:

      What do its plans for continued close links with the rest of the UK mean for its vision of a separate Scotland?

      Not surprisingly the conclusion of this writer is that the media in Scotland, by and large, cannot be trusted in terms of the independence debate. They will continue to promote the stories fed them by Unionists and some will use, wherever they can, the language of the anti-independence campaign.

      But what if they fail, what if Scotland votes Yes?
      ……………………………………………………..

      LABOUR FOR INDEPENDENCE
      VOTE YES IN 2014

    106. Robert louis says:

      I see there are now some serious shenanigans developing over at pathetic Quay…..
      Sounds like the NUJ is seriously peeved at compulsory redundancies, at a time when money for 50 new posts has been made available.
       
      http://www.newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-news/8089-exclusive-eleventh-hour-redundancy-reprieve-fails-to-remove-bbc-scotland-strike-threat

    107. Thepnr says:

      @Robert louis
       
      No offence but what’s the point of criticising each other?
       
      For what it’s worth I too have seen no evidence of campaigning personally in my area other than a solitary letter from YES and evidence of the hard work done by LFI through personal knowledge. It doesn’t make it visible though.
       
      Through sites like this I’m aware of the work being done by those volunteering to man the stands in places such as Dundee and Dunfermline. Speaking of which I seem to remember the Rev giving much publicity to the problems the Dunfermline YES campaign had in getting their voice heard.
       
      This site gave them a voice and to be fair the Rev was just saying it as how he saw it.

    108. Dcanmore says:

      All the printing prices seem cheap enough, but the important thing is distribution this includes anything else such as newspapers. Design and print in my mind is the easier part, it’s getting into peoples homes that is the tricky thing, covering wide areas and be consistent needs a do-able strategy. For impact there is little point in delivering 5000 leaflets one week then revisiting the area four months later with another leaflet. It maybe is hard work but consistent strategic distribution is the key. I would distribute a 12-page newspaper once every two weeks as the main carrier of information and debate then do a leaflet drop in between which can target local issues as well. A big task but it’s the grassroots where the campaign will win.

    109. McNic says:

      Morag – my post is up now, I was only questioning who can now stand up for the unionist argument in Scotland?

    110. Bingo Wings Over Scotland says:

      Well done Rev, I’ve been thinking along the same lines but using Vistaprint. You can get a couple of hundred business cards printed for around a tenner. Once you’ve placed an order you get sent all sorts of special offers for free and cheap cards, flyers, rubber stamps etc.

      You can use their templates and write your own text, or upload your own pic. That could be the one at the top of this page, or any image you’ve seen on Facebook. Just right click and save. As someone has mentioned above, IndyPosterBoy is a good start.

      Once you’ve got a pocket full of cards leave some everywhere you go. Be discreet and leave a couple on the table when you get off the train, drop a couple on the bar and tables in pubs, clubs, sports centres, cafes, scatter a few on top of the newspapers in Tesco’s. Post them through random letterboxes or through every door in your street. Hand them to friends and get them to use the same tactics. As many have said, if we all convert just one person each to a Yes voter then we’ll win.

    111. Albalha says:

      @dee
      So you’re saying that anyone that has worked for the BBC in Scotland is tainted, somehow has to prove their ‘nationalist’ credentials? It’s patently not true. Let’s please get some perspective.
      And Pacific Quay has only been there since 2006, maybe that’s the problem.
      Clearly things are not great now but it hasn’t always been as bad, that’s my point.

    112. david says:

      i hope there is an enquiry into the medias coverage of the independence campaign after the yes vote romps it and those who have fearmongered and lied brought to accound.. exposed

    113. McNic says:

      Ah’m no sure if this is allowed but I just want to say that “Ah pure love you guys, and have a good night!”

    114. Robert louis says:

      Thepnr,
       
      I praised REV earlier today for another piece, but in this case I am sorry, but making bland statement such as the one in the article is just not constructive at all.  It serves no good.  Bella Caledonia made a valid point.
       
      Just for the record, this site is not the only website working for independence, and many others, such as Bella Caledonia or Newsnet Scotland have been around a heck of a lot longer and were in many ways, ‘trailblazers’.  As I have said previously, ALL the groups play their part, and all the varied websites provide information in different ways for different audiences.  

    115. Albalha says:

      @RobertLouis
      That’s the point YES voters come from all walks of life and backgrounds, getting over the line is what matters. All hands to the YES pump whoever, wherever, then the real debate begins.

    116. ianbrotherhood says:

      @dee-
       
      We’re none of us perfect, eh? It’s maybe why a lot of us ‘ordinary’ punters are so averse to getting involved in mainstream politics – a nexus of elites has somehow managed to perpetuate the myth that only the squeaky-clean can find a place in public life.
       
      We all know that’s dangerous drivel – if anything, the reverse is probably the norm: Machiavelli’s ‘The Prince’ was, allegedly, required reading for Blair’s govt-in-waiting, and we’re still witnessing the fall-out.
       
      I’ve no doubt that Mr Bateman knows where a few bodies are buried, will have cut a corner here and there, made ‘compromises’ from time to time which made him uncomfortable. No-one’s saying the man should be deified – but he’s doing something valuable. Let’s be ‘pragmatic’, take his new work in the spirit with which he appears to be offering it, and exploit each and every revelation as productively as we can.
       
      If we become as cynical as the No Scotland mob – and there’s really no need for us to be – then we sink to their level. 

    117. Thepnr says:

      @Robert louis
       
      I read them ALL!
       
      I’m not here to defend anything the Rev might write, just pointing out that he is not the only one to note a lack of campaigning.
       
      It doesn’t bother me, after all there is a year to go and things will really only heat up in the last six months. I don’t believe though that what the Rev said was a criticism of anyone or any group, just a fact.
       
      Other than us “cybernats” most folk, so far, are clueless. We will change that, especially by working together.

    118. dee says:

      @Caesar!lha
       
      We are drifting from my original point regarding Mr Bateman.  He knows who is at the back of “Project Fear” at BBC Scotland and who their contacts are in the Labour Party. Between these two bodies the agenda is set for attacking Scottish Independence. He has this knowledge and I would like him to tell everyone who they are.

    119. Macsenex says:

      Great wee leaflet, Gavin

      Being delivered to every home in Dumbarton constituency

    120. velofello says:

      South Ayrshire purchased 2000 of the Aye Right leaflets this week.

    121. call me dave says:

      School closures planned by Fife Council labour.
      Other tweets on facebook.
       
      http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2013/sep/dunfermline-labour-candidate-posted-missing

    122. Bill C says:

      Derek Bateman is a very welcome addition to our cause.  Today he calls Cameron a coward, he is one journalist who is a credit to his profession.

    123. Linda's back says:

      Thepnr
      YES it is up to every Yes supporter to persuade 100 others to vote YES.
      Don’t rely on others, the info is out there.  It is cheap to publish 5000 leaflets and get your friends to deliver them in your local  area.
      Lots of info at http://www.yesscotland.net/  log in and download leaflets etc
      This is not a political top down campaign  its up to you.

    124. Murray McCallum says:

      To be honest Derek Bateman can march around his house singing the BBC employee anthem (I hope there is one) as far as I am concerned. His blog is just great – funny, sarcastic, serious, emotional …… good for him.
       
      I’m not a member of any party. As mentioned above the priority is a Yes vote. People from across the political spectrum are on the Yes side.

    125. Thepnr says:

      @Linda’s back
       
      Don’t worry i will put in the footwork. I’m in my 50’s now with a full time job but that won’t prevent me from doing 100 houses a week for the next 50 weeks. 5000 in all then.

    126. Albalha says:

      @dee
      So he names John Boothman, it is all out there, as I’ve said SNP people know that too, what are they saying, I’m not seeing much, indeed some of them were at University with him. Of course London folks were involved in his appointment, says it all really.
      I’m just struggling to understand what you expect D Bateman to say that isn’t out there or could not be as well explained by, for example, Blair Jenkins. 

    127. Andrew Morton says:

      You do realise that Wings is probably required reading for Project Fear. There’s probably someone monitoring this thread right now. Loose talk about some kind of witch hunt of journalists is exactly the sort of thing they’d leap on.

    128. mrbfaethedee says:

      FFS Rev don’t start upsetting activists.
      Lol!

    129. JnrTick says:

      Some good and bad points about this leaflet.

      The initial look of impartiality, please feel free to inform yourself look will no doubt appeal to many. Not having VOTE NO or VOTE YES on the front is a big plus, people don’t like being told what to do.

      On the down side, people unfortunately need spoon fed, especially those who have a dislike or disinterest in anything politics related so listing the names of some websites means folks having to actually actually hold onto the leaflet, take it home, remove from pocket bag briefcase etc., type address into address bar etc., unfortunately way too much work for some of the easily lead.

      Maybe some hard bold facts would have been more punchier, still, if the distribution of this material directs some more away from the sound bites on telly and the misleading headlines in the rags then job done. 

    130. Albalha says:

      @MurrayMcCAllum
      Sorry but no BBC anthem!

    131. ianbrotherhood says:

      @Thepnr (10.21) –
       
      Aye, ‘a year to go’, but it’ll fly-in.
       
      Consider this – same time last year, as we went into winter, SSP was street-stalling on ‘apprentice-wages’, then, closer to Christmas, we were doing stuff on the big power-companies ripping everyone off. But then, looking ahead, post-New-Year, we started highlighting the impending Welfare Reforms, ‘Bedroom Tax’ etc.
       
      It was the dead of winter – Feb, March – and no-one knew just how long it was going to last. We all ran out of thermals. Locals in Irvine are still talking about our being there, week-in, week-out, at our pitch on the Bridgegate – the kindlier worthies would approach our wallpaper table, not so much because they wanted to sign the petition, but because they wanted to poke us, check that we were still alive. At times, our presence there wasn’t so-much political activity, more Performance Art. It is believed that several testicles have been forever buried beneath the renovated pedestrian thoroughfare. (Decency decrees that I don’t divulge what horrors the female comrades endured.)
       
      Now? ‘Bedroom Tax’ will, in all probability, be in the Oxford English Dictionary. Everyone knows what it means – some more acutely than others – but only five, six months ago, we were having to explain it because very few understood what it really entailed.
       
      By the time we get through this winter (please, all the known Gods, don’t give us a repeat) and reach springtime? 
       
      Let’s be optimistic and say that Scotland defrosts around late-April/early May 2014.
       
      We’ll then have approx 12 WEEKS before the WW1 ‘Commemoration’ at Glasgow Cathedral – that event will tell the world whether or not Scotland has had enough of the Union. 
       
      I’ve no idea how long it takes to organise an event like the Calton Hill Rally, but we’re now chopping at one end of a relatively short sausage, and we have to get it right – no ‘rehearsals’ are allowed.
       
      If anyone wants to get involved via the SSP route, please e-mail me. Doesn’t mean you’ll get bombarded with SPAM – you’ll just get added to a mailing-list notifying you of upcoming events, no membership required. We’re an easy-going lot. Nae hassle – guaranteed:
      ian [at] stevenston4 [dot] fsnet [dot] co [dot] uk

    132. dee says:

      @Caesar!lha
       
      I think you worked at the BBC too long.  You honestly don’t think that Mr Bateman has anything to say regarding the production of their one-sided bias anti-independence views on every news bulletin, every political debate programme, eg. who is it that decides the balance of guests on each show, where you would have one pro independence guest against maybe three pro union guests.  Who writes the scripts for them?. I could go on but you get my point.
      I bet you are sitting there with your “I love BBC Scotland” T shirt on.
       

    133. Thepnr says:

      @JnrTick

      Maybe it’s just me but “Aye Right” sounds like NO?
       
      At least here on the east coast it’s short for “Aye that’ll be fecking right” i.e No chance.

    134. mogabee says:

      JnrTick  are you the same  jnrtick on forargyll? I gave up on that site through sheer frustration. Well done you for sticking at it!

    135. Taranaich says:

      Funny this post should come up: just a few days ago, my mam and I were in contact with Yes Inverclyde to see about delivering copies of the Yes! newspaper.  Naturally, we were given the roughest areas of our town to patrol, but mam’s made of sterner stuff, so we’re not worried. After all, she was a paperboy when she was wee (boy as in tomboy!)
       
      And aye, we have Yes stickers on car and button on person, and try to carry wee indy fact sheets on person. We’ll definitely print out a few of these. 🙂

    136. Albalha says:

      @dee
      That’s it, here I am in sitting in my BBC Scotland livery from head to foot. But then I’m a YES voter, funny that.
      As others have said it’s up to D Bateman to say what he wants, never met him as it goes.

    137. cath says:

      Now, now @wings and @bella please stop fighting!
       
      I’m very involved in my local yes campaign, as well as with Wings and National Collective and others. I sometimes do feel frustrated that the local campaign is not yet hugely visible. BUT we are growing and developing. From a very small core a year ago we now have a lot more people, we’ve had a very successful local launch, people are out canvassing and leafletting. I’m frustrated because with less than a year to go I don’t think that’s enough and aside from the campaigning and various groups I’m personally involved in I’ve also seen very little activity. I suspect if I wasn’t involved in the campaign I wouldn’t have seen anything beyond a fairly scrappy leaflet through my door.
       
      Wings and all the other online sites – Bella included – are what give me the materian and the confidence to go out with my local campaign, and I often share material from such sites with others in it.
       
      But beyond that, we also need things like this post suggest to get people in pubs, workplaces and other places interested and looking at the material. I believe we can win this next year but we need everyone working together on their own strengths and what they can do. Many people are beginning to turn purely on debates with friends, family and work-mates, and at the moment those yes people are getting their arguments primarily from sites like Wings, NNS, Bella etc rather than the on-the-ground Yes campaigns. Heck, when we meet an undecided, those places are gererally where we send them!
       
      But, that said, Rev, it’s not true there is no campaigning – there is loads. Is just isn’t necessarily visivble to people walking along the street. And at this stage perhaps that’s not a bad thing. 18 months of being assaulted by a political campaign wherever you go might not endear that campaign! We’re in a phase that I hope is kind of slow build. And it is building. Lack of visibility isn’t necessarily a bad thing right now for various reasons. For the same reasons polls being pro-no are not neccessarily a bad thing.
       
      So please don’t go criticising each other. Just do what you can, positively. Wings and Bella are sending people to the Yes campaign, and local Yes groups are sending people to Wings and Bella. The more each supports the other the better.

    138. ianbrotherhood says:

      @dee-
      ‘I bet you are sitting there with your “I love BBC Scotland” T shirt on.’
       
      That’s out of order.

    139. Thepnr says:

      @cath
       
      I really respect your posts, voice of reason.

    140. Murray McCallum says:

      Any telecoms people out there know what’s behind this Wall st journal story:
      “The U.K. plans to push back against parts of a European Union plan to overhaul telecommunications rules at an EU summit next month, according to a paper seen by The Wall Street Journal, a new stumbling block for regulatory proposals that have already run into opposition from telecom companies.”
      WSJ – “Britain Is Wary of Adding to Companies’ Regulatory Burden, Says Diplomat”
       
      This seems a bit ironic given what Vince Cable was on about a few months ago?

    141. Albamac says:

      @gordoz
      The local councillor had a bit of a disaster – all over the place
      The eyes have it.
      Watch her eyes roll and close as she trawls her memory for the appropriate section of her script.

    142. Bill C says:

      ‘Unity is Strength’ folks. 

    143. cath says:

      @cath
       
      I really respect your posts, voice of reason.
       
      Why thank you. If there are any diplomatic posts going post independence in anywhere sunny… 😉

    144. rabb says:

      Murray,
      I believe that Westminster aren’t happy with a single EU telecoms market. Not only does it mean the end of rip off roaming charges it also opens up the UK market to telecoms providers from all over Europe.

      I suspect Brave Brave Sir Dave who bravely ran away has been lobbied by the big boys.

    145. dee says:

      @anbrotherhood
      @dee-
      ‘I bet you are sitting there with your “I love BBC Scotland” T shirt on.’
       
      That’s out of order.
      Completely agree, every time I say something against BBC Scotland, this guy is jumping to their defence.
       

    146. Murray McCallum says:

      rabb
      What are they like eh? Westminster out on a limb protecting multi £million banker bonuses and now trying to ensure we get ripped off when we go on holiday and make a phone call.

    147. Albalha says:

      @dee
      ‘This guy’ is a woman and I don’t remember jumping to their defence every time you mention the BBC, it’s all about perception I suppose.
      Anyway I won’t bother engaging again.
       

    148. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      So please don’t go criticising each other”

      I didn’t criticise anyone!

    149. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “it’s not true there is no campaigning”

      I didn’t say there wasn’t. I said I’d spent a week in Scotland’s two biggest cities and several towns and seen no evidence of an independence debate, which is true. It was, as I’ve already said, an observation about the public consciousness, not a criticism of anyone – I specifically said I’d seen nothing from either side.

      I’ve no idea why folk are suddenly trying so hard to be offended, except that every now and again we do seem to get a night where people get themselves in a grump for no reason.

    150. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Maybe it’s just me but “Aye Right” sounds like NO?

      At least here on the east coast it’s short for “Aye that’ll be fecking right””

      Yes, that’s exactly what it means. What it’s implying is that what you hear and read in the media is cobblers (“The Scotsman says we’d be too poor to afford buses? Aye right!”), and here are some places you might want to go for information instead.

    151. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Maybe some hard bold facts would have been more punchier”

      Hngh. If you have constructive criticism about the design or content of this particular leaflet, I’m sure the designers would take it on board. Saying “It should have been something completely different” isn’t very helpful.

    152. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Just for the record, this site is not the only website working for independence, and many others, such as Bella Caledonia or Newsnet Scotland have been around a heck of a lot longer and were in many ways, ‘trailblazers’. As I have said previously, ALL the groups play their part, and all the varied websites provide information in different ways for different audiences.”

      Um, yes, I know. That’s why I link to them, and why I’m publicising a leaflet TELLING PEOPLE ABOUT THEIR WEBSITES.

      FFS! Some nights I start to empathise with Newsnet’s moderation policy.

    153. Murray McCallum says:

      “we do seem to get a night where people get themselves in a grump for no reason”
       
      Bring on funny dog …
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xEX-48RHCY

    154. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Well done Rev, I’ve been thinking along the same lines but using Vistaprint.”

      Yeah, I used them for the business cards I had done for the rally. Good quality, pretty fast, and (unfortunately) much, much cheaper than using a High Street printer.

    155. Morag says:

      If you stay put in one place, campaigning will come to you, but not that often.  Maybe not at all from the No campaign.  I’m not that surprised that a single person didn’t happen across any of it in just a few days travelling around.
       
      Does that mean we’re not doing enough?  Well, whatever we’re doing it’s a lot more than the No team is doing.  And although I appreciate that we’re into the last solar revolution before the big day, many people still feel it’s too early to bother too much about it.  These people might even be put off by too much in-your-face campaigning.
       
      I don’t really know how to tell if the intensity is too low for the stage of the campaign.  I do know that if we don’t keep up a gradual crescendo right to the wire next year, we could lose in the last week.  Like the SNP in 1992.  Sometimes people have to pace themselves.

    156. scottish_skier says:

      I didn’t say there wasn’t. I said I’d spent a week in Scotland’s two biggest cities and several towns and seen no evidence of an independence debate, which is true.
       
      You’ve been away too long Stu.

    157. Morag says:

      Yes, he probably has.  I recognise the symptoms.  But we need him chained to his computer for the next year, and that’s easier to accomplish if he’s out of the country.

    158. dee says:

      BBC Scotland at Pacific Quay touch a raw nerve with every true Scot with their continuous lies regarding Independence. So when their is even the hint that someone is trying to defend the stance that they take, then it is not surprising when you get a heated debate.   It cleared the air this time and now I know where certain people stand., but don’t think for a minute that this will be the last debate we have regarding BBC Scotland and the shit that oozes from it’s walls at Pacific Quay.

      @Caesar!lha,,, I thought you were male.

    159. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “I’m not that surprised that a single person didn’t happen across any of it in just a few days travelling around.”

      Not even in the city centres of Glasgow and Edinburgh, in the actual streets where both campaign HQs are and around the Scottish Parliament? Not ONE person wearing a badge, out of tens of thousands? Not ONE car sticker or window poster?

      Anyway, I’m going to bed before anyone pisses me off any more. I came home bursting full of enthusiasm and determination and positivity, and this thread makes me want to take a six-month holiday. The post above it, let’s remember, was an attempt to help promote other people’s websites. If that’s going to cause THIS much insane griping, I promise never to do it again.

    160. Tim F-G says:

      @T Jenny, “Are The Halls the building on the r/h side in Henderson St, just round fron Greggs?”
      yes, that’s my understanding. walk past Greggs round the corner, keep on walking past the parking lot and the building is in front of you.

    161. ianbrotherhood says:

      @dee (11.41) –
       
      Caesar!lha’s already clarified her position, so I hope you’ll leave it at that.
       
      The ‘BBC in Scotland’, howsoever it presents itself, is a reality. We may not like it, but it has a muckle HQ on Clydeside and appears to be digging its heels-in over all this ‘referendum’ palaver.
       
      It also stands as physical, intimidating justification for x-number of million £s being extracted from the Scottish people every year via the anachronistic License Fee.
       
      ‘BBC Scotland’ is real enough, but if we vote ‘Yes’ then it ceases to exist. No debate there – it’s no longer ‘British’.
       
      It is ludicrous to imagine that a fully-formed and functional national broadcaster could spring, unaided, following a Yes vote – some will stay, some will go.
       
      One way or another, Scotland will have a fledgling national broadcasting ‘organisation’, and it will need ‘professionals’ at at levels to make it a success – would you bar someone like Bateman from involvement in a new start?

    162. TJenny says:

      Tim F-G – Thanx 🙂

    163. Patrician says:

      Hey Stu, for what its worth I agree with you that neither side is very visible on the streets. In the last year I have seen 2 Yes Scotland tents in Airdrie town centre. I travel to Glasgow every day and spend lunch time out doing my daily constitutional around Glasgow City centre, during this time I have seen 2 other people apart from myself wearing YES badges and 1 wearing a No Scotland badge (OK it said Better Together, but you know what it really means).  I have not seen any Yes posters anywhere but a couple of months ago there was a rash of small No Scotland stickers on lampposts in Glasgow and even they have disappeared now.  At the moment it is very much a grassroots campaign working by word of mouth so far and these small leaflets will be very handy.

    164. ianbrotherhood says:

      @Rev (12.22)
       
      Don’t get down mister – I’ve had those Yes stickers on the car for, well, must be kicking-on for two months, and the car’s not been scratched, the windaes are intact.
       
      If you could only know the ‘supposed’ vibe about where I am? Your sadness would be lifted on seeing the ongoing reality…
       
      Just imagine, for a split-second, that you are my unmolested motor, and that you are his happy owner – then let yer heart gladdened be.
       
      (Okay, it might not last – but then again…)

    165. Thepnr says:

      @Rev. Stuart Campbell
      “Anyway, I’m going to bed before anyone pisses me off any more”
       
      You take it easy man, have a good kip, us dolts need you here.

    166. cath says:

      “I didn’t criticise anyone!”
       
      No, that’s true, you didn’t. Apologies.
       

    167. Patrician says:

      Re: the BBC debate on here.  I personally don’t think that BBC Scotland is anti-Scottish, I think it is very much pro-Labour.  A small difference perhaps but it will be worth keeping in mind after a Yes vote.

    168. ianbrotherhood says:

      @Thepnr-
       
      Cheers – details saved.
       
      Hope to see you anon.
       
       

    169. Bill C says:

      @Rev- “Anyway, I’m going to bed before anyone pisses me off any more. I came home bursting full of enthusiasm and determination and positivity, and this thread makes me want to take a six-month holiday. The post above it, let’s remember, was an attempt to help promote other people’s websites. If that’s going to cause this much insane griping, I promise never to do it again.”

      For various reasons I have not had time to follow what has been going on here tonight, but I would suggest that some folk on here need to wake up, smell the coffee and realise that this struggle (for that is what it is) is much, much, bigger than any of us. The Rev and I don’t always see eye to eye, we had a belter of a rammy on here a few months ago but give the guy his due, he didn’t barr me and I didn’t take the huff.  Vigorous debate is healthy but when Stu Campbell is driven to post the above, I know we are all skating on thin ice. This site has become a daily read for thousands seeking Scottish self determination, is feared by our enemies, is a tremendous source of material for arguing our case and is now a port of call for the millions seeking information on which way to vote. For Scotland’s sake get a grip!

    170. Albamac says:

      Just for the record, this site is not the only website working for independence, and many others, such as Bella Caledonia or Newsnet Scotland have been around a heck of a lot longer and were in many ways, ‘trailblazers’
       
      Oh,aye.
       
      Back in the days when I ‘made myself (very) useful’, the ‘trailblazers’ soon persuaded me of my own stupidity.  That’s why I comment little, these days, having almost completely abandoned the web.  I don’t like cliques, or backroom intrigue.  That’s exactly the kind of behaviour that we witness from those on the Yes side who have attacked Wings. The ‘clique, claque, yackety yack’ crowd whose real interests are exposed as soon as they snuggle their bums into a chair in a TV studio.  Their main ambition is membership of the ‘in crowd’.
       
      I support this site because of the quantity and quality of Stuart Campbell’s work, his unquestionable dedication to our common cause and his ability to get at the truth where most of us wouldn’t even know where to look for it.
       
      His adversaries hate him because he has teeth attached to his gums and some of our ‘friends’, through shame or envy, have joined the chorus of calumnies in a despicable attempt to discredit him.  I’ve been there!
       
      For me, an independent Scotland will have a voice of its own and it won’t be raised in a ‘West-end Trendy’ accent. We have BBC Scotland and the Labour party to shout from that end of the park.

    171. TJenny says:

      O/T – Dr Feelgood (Keep it out of sight) on BBC 4 right Now! – Just saying:-)

    172. ianbrotherhood says:

      @Bill C
      Hear, hear…
       
      ‘…a port of call for the millions seeking information on which way to vote.’
       
      …nay, thrice – hear the man!

    173. Daughter of Evil Reindeer says:

      Nice clear leaflet. I will get some printed up.
      Rather than attempt a mass leafleting of Edinburgh I will leave some in places such as buses where people are bored and will read anything (even The Metro free news paper).
      Useful list of websites so also good to give to folks I meet, saves trying to remember the url’s.

    174. TJenny says:

      What Bill C and Caesar!mach said.

    175. ianbrotherhood says:

      @Caesar!mac-
      ‘Their main ambition is membership of the ‘in crowd’.’
       
      Brilliant. Spot-on.
       
      A friend of a friend was a brief-time live-in lover of Brian Ferry (20-odd years ago, when he was still ‘cool’)  but she chucked him because he was ‘unbelievably boring’.
       
      All hearsay. Of course.
       
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JY60kPY49UQ

    176. Edward says:

      Slighty O/T – Your never going to believe it, but the Scotsman have an article in which they have ‘has seen internal e-mails’ from Paul Sinclair, Lamont’s script writer and spin doctor complaining to the BBC in Scotland about bias.
      One e-mail complains about the BBC dropping Margaret Curran form the Inverness debate (the BBC already had two unionists versus two independence people.
      Also during the Labour conference, Labour MP’s and ‘Scottish Labour figures’ berated BBC Scotland representatives over the ‘unfairness’ of excluding Labour people from debates
      You really couldn’t make it up, well apart from Labour that is!

    177. call me dave says:

      Edward

      Labour calls foul!
      You couldn’t make it up.

      archive.is/KlBeu
      Reply | Reply with quote | Quote

    178. TJenny says:

      WAAAAAY O/T (Sorry Rev, but you’ve gone to bed anyway) but Indepenent Scotland have just tweeted:
      Scottish independence: ‘BBC in cahoots with SNP’ – Scotland on Sunday: Scotland on SundayScottish ind… http://bit.ly/161ck7v  #indyref
      Don’t know how to do the archive thingy, so haven’t read it yet, but reeeaaally??? In what parallel universe?? 
       

    179. Albamac says:

      @ianbrotherhood
      I knew a young soldier who had a relationship with a beautiful Eurasian girl whose father was a millionaire.  They spent many a happy day sampling her dad’s booze by the pool.
       
      He went home on leave where he met the true love of his life, in Govan, and they’ve been together for almost fifty years.
       
      Ain’t life strange? 😉

    180. ianbrotherhood says:

      @Caesar!mac –
       
      Brilliant. That’s the stuff legends are made of.

    181. call me dave says:

      Caesar!mac:
      Must be a film in that story.
      —————————————-
      Meanwhile 
      MP’s worried about how Scotland is to defend its self!Just love the comments..archive.is/HQugm

    182. Thepnr says:

      I lived in Govan at one time, the night we moved in my mother electrocuted herself by taking hold of bare wires  hanging from the wall saying “we need to get these fixed”. She was not killed thankfully.
       
      That was in Copeland Rd, we spent the night with the neighbors.

    183. The Man in the Jar says:

      @TJenny
      While reading that I had to do a double take as I thought that I was reading a spoof newspaper. “Labour accuses BBC of being in cahoots with the SNP” well it is the Scotsman. But honestly how deluded can you get?
      Paul Sinclair (Johann Lamonts special advisor) must be in need of some serious medication if he is imagining stuff like that.

    184. Paula Rose says:

      Hey all, I tried to get folk interested in running a Yes stall in Brechin, but some folk would only do it if their bunch had ‘recognition’, this is a difficult path – we have to learn to work together.

    185. FAO TJenny

      Drop us an email to yesedinburghnorthandleith [at] gmail [dot] com and we’ll make sure that you’re on the mailing list !

      See you next Thursday night …
       
       

    186. TJenny says:

      call me dave – Thanx for the archive link to Scotsman article. Just read it, still to read comments. Is this just Slab + BBC Scot in cahoots so that BBC Scot can state that they obviously aren’t biased as they get complaints from both sides? But, as someone commented on a previous thread, if they were really being fair and unbiased there would be no complaints from either side. Eek – am I confused or paranoid, or both? weebewilderedfacedthingy

    187. molly says:

      I’m not sure if this has been posted already and I don’t know how to link the page but lets hope David Cameron does’nt select Stirling next year for his next big shindig.WWW.Clans 2014 .com explains how Stirling Council, fully aware of the Bannockburn connotations ,deliberately scuppered The National Trust for Scotlands plans for The Clans at Bannockburn, citing costs, only to apply later for Armed Forces Day to be held in Stirling.
      The sad thing is their are Australians,Americans etc who had already made plans to attend. 
      Can I just say to anyone reading this from  Aberdeen Council and their petty’ Alex Salmond went to my school’
      Falkirk Labour Party Councillors and 1 MP whose party problems have now spilled over to Ineos with the threat of strike action
      Now Stirling Council attempting to undermine the NTS  and SG “even when asked directly about event clashes ”
      People in Scotland will put up with a lot of your  petty political shit but don’t embarass us. The same cringe that holds us back can also become very thrawn when the sense of unfairness becomes noticeable to the majority .
      Referendum aside , we desperately need a decent newspaper /TV channel in this country who will actually reflect what is happening around the country .

    188. For anyone else wanting to join the Yes Edinburgh North and Leith (YENL) community and keep in touch with local upcoming public events, then drop us an email at:  yesedinburghnorthandleith [at] gmail [dot] com
       
      Facebook us at: https://www.facebook.com/YesEdinburghNorthAndLeith
       
      Go to our website at: http://www.yesedinburghnorthandleith.net/
       
      or follow us on twitter at: @YesENL
       
      Thanks !

    189. Albamac says:

      @ianbrotherhood
       
      It’s also the stuff that seven weans, sixteen granweans and five great-granweans are made of. 🙂

    190. molly says:

      Jings , if the BEEB are in cahoots with the SNP , the next thing they’ll be trying to tell us is the Labour Party are socialists !

    191. Paula Rose says:

      And now everyone knows each other – so another clique forms, time to wake up, this site is read than more than those who shook the Rev’s hand.

    192. Albamac says:

      @Paula Rose
      Not sure what you mean, Paula.  I take it that your reference to cliques was spurred by one of my earlier comments.  I rarely have anything to say here and I’ve never met the Rev or anyone associated with this site.  I’ve no idea how a few strangers engaging in a brief conversation constitutes the formation of a clique.
      I’m puzzled.  Help me out.

    193. TJenny says:

      Paula – I’m with Caesar!mac, what are you on about?

    194. Keef says:

      I’ve posted here for over a year now (admittedly sporadically due to Uni. studies). I would say there is the recognised ‘usual’ bunch of ‘hard-core’ contributors, but I’d never say there was a ‘clique’.
      The Major – humour
      Doug – Smart and insightful
      S. Skier – Poll results translator
      CameronB- Slightly conspiricists theorist but very well informed
      Mutley 79 – fun and mischievous
      Handandshrimp – Not one to blether but always has a valid point
      Morag – fanatic
      Cath – intelligent additions
      The list goes on. I hope none of my observations offend, it was not my intention.
      A broad church, all in the pursuit of the YES vote and the better lifestyle it will allow the people of Scotland to enjoy.
      I love you all. 

    195. K Mackay says:

      Thanks for the leaflet Stu (I know you didn’t design it but if you hadn’t posted it I wouldn’t have found it)
       
      This is exactly the sort of thing I want to get out there. Also really glad I found indy poster boy’s site recently, can’t wait to get going with distributing his designs.
       
      I’ve been laminating and putting up the odd poster but angry unionists (or just people who hate posters) seem to rip them down pretty quick. Just means I’ll have to increase my efforts. Shame you didn’t look up going past my flat on your search of Edinburgh, you’d have seen a Saltire and Yes poster in window and another Saltire, Rampant and 6 Celtic nations flag flying from a bit of roof I get access to. I know it’s overkill but can’t help myself 🙂
       
      I saw an awesome car (a wee peugot) covered in Yes stickers (I really mean covered) a few months ago near my flat. When I finally achieve driving license and get a car I’ll be doing the same, tempted to do a ‘dukes of hazard’ style Lion rampant on it.
       
      I find groups of people a bit daunting (except for the march, that was amazing) so for me postering, leafleting and stickering are ideal ways to do my bit. Always great to see new designs to print. Keep em coming 🙂

    196. Patrick Roden says:

      @ Dee, I understand your anger bud, because the BBC are nothing short of a propaganda arm of the British establishment, but this has only really came to the fore in such a blatantly obvious way since the referendum date was agreed.
      I don’t think you realise that Derek Bateman is indeed letting everyone know what has been happening inside the BBC, but he is doing this using a method that he probably believes is going to be the most successful insofar as getting the message ‘out there’
      He isn’t just writing a funny blog Dee, he is doing this for a very serious reason. I think he is now writing two and his work rate suggests he is spending a whole lot of time on his writing, so make no mistake Derek will do a whole lot more damage to the BBC and the MSM in general, than he would have done by causing a spat within the BBC then after being discredited and mostly ignored (apart from Yes supporting blogs) he would have lost his credibility as a serious threat to the BBC.
       
      Anything he said after that would have very little impact, as it would be painted as the vengeful ranting of an employee scorned. The BBC/MSM are expert at this tactic and the British?/Scottish Public have been taught to swallow this type of trash.
      Don’t worry, the time will come when he will release more details and perhaps even a leaked memo or three may find it’s way into the media, but for now he is doing the right thing and the response from the MSM is about the same as they did when LFI first came on the scene, they are trying to ignore him.
      This will change when they realise he is doing them real damage.
       

    197. Bill B says:

      I’m not so sure, many were very quick to pounce when I gave my Trident views, one even called me a unionist troll. Maybe the group has matured and more open to debate but otherwise its still the best site by far. The posts often put into words what I feel and think . Wisht I could write like that.

    198. Albalha says:

      @KMckay
      I am always on the look out for windows like yours, not too numerous yet. Which street in Edinburgh are you in, no need for specifics! A general skiffie is fine.
      Anyway here are a couple of images I took near Dunphail, in February, heading to Forres. Probably still the most prominent I’ve seen. Any other ideas welcome of similar images, wherever in Scotland.
      http://www.flickr.com/photos/albalha/9976961496/
      http://www.flickr.com/photos/albalha/9976907955/

    199. Boorach says:

      @Patrick
       
      Thank you for articulating exactly what I was trying to say last night. Derek, actually, puts a whole lot into his blogs than is apparent just with a cursory read and he manages to do it with humour.

    200. john king says:

      seems I’m no longer welcome either on the Heralds comments page, 🙁
      when I logged in the comments were not visible when I logged out there they were, so it seems if your Scottish you comments are not welcome but if your from Woking and have an O.B.E or from Slovenia (stop sniggering) and have a flawless grasp of English your more than welcome but I suppose you would be wouldn’t you?
      the herald don’t want to be paying wages and not getting a days work out out you John/Jerzna do they?
       
      CLICKBAIT ANYONE?

    201. Luigi says:

      It is a great idea to drop a few copies wherever the opportunity arises – buses, cafes, libraries (sneaky!), student hang-outs and other public places.  Another thing I would suggest is to keep a few copies always handy in your car/bag etc.  There has been a few times unexpected opportunities when speaking to people that I really wished I had a leaflet or info sheet to leave after the discussion.  This is particularly important for the “I don’t have enough info” or “Independence would be good, but…” people.  You never know when the next opportunity will present itself.  Be ready!

    202. twenty14 says:

      Morning all – my, my some of us were having a little spat last night.
      Our opinions won’t give us our Independence but others will – lets concentrate on changing theirs.
      I met Caesar!lha at the “march ” and a very well informed lady re: matters concerning the b b c so I’ll take all she contributes on board any discussion.
      We all had a chat, over Guinness/beers about how the Unionists will up their evil, cunning plans and I’m sure the headlines re: b b c biased against Labour is all part of their next move and was probably discussed over a coffee between both of them.
      And I’m one of the many who think/say – give Rev Stu a break I think in this thread all he did was ask us to print some leaflets – end of. There will be a lot more threads were we will have reason to disagree but this wasn’t one of them. Anyway I’m of out to earn a corn and chat to people about how good it will feel to be in an Independent Scotland

    203. Tattie-boggle says:

      O/T but does anyone else think the blue is getting smaller
      http://t.co/iO8W9M0an1

    204. Gordoz says:

      Bawheid Bragg:
       
      The show was STV news at 6.00pm; they.ve picked a stoater honestly
      watch the clip !

    205. Gordoz says:

      dee says:
       
      Point taken but dont want to drive him (D Bateman) back out of site. (If you see what I mean, some info is better than nothing). 

    206. Gordoz says:

      Caesar!mac :
      She is a stoater of a candidate for yes; (bit of a loose cannon methinks)

    207. call me dave says:

      Mr Bateman:
      I guess he don’t like Darling much.
      Plain speaking.
      ‘So we now have the disgraced Chancellor, a man whose morals evaporate when money is mentioned – half a million from the revolting Vitol source, more than the First Minister’s salary in outside earnings and flipping his house four times – on the stage as a Tory puppet, his mouth opening and closing as Cameron pulls the strings.’
      http://drderekbateman.wordpress.com/

    208. Juteman says:

      Re Banners.
      I’m looking for a vertical YES poster to place in a very visible window, Something around 80 cm wide x 130 cm tall.
      I’ll maybe just make one myself.

    209. Linda's Back says:

      Call me Dave
      Alistair Darling also cheated on his first wife… so much for Better Together,

    210. Sneddon says:

      Juteman – DIY is the best way.  Self reliance = self respect. Too many people whinge but do nothing to address the whinge.  Which is true in all aspects of life not just this independence debate.    
      I’d love a poster in my window but alas I live on the 11th floor, mind you if birds had the vote  I’d poster all my windows 🙂
      I’ll get my stickers done next week .  So look out for them around the bars, student unions, libraries and coffee shops of Edinburghin the next wee while.
       
      In regard to the wider YES campaign I think we’re all straining at the bit but as other posters have pointed out pacing ourselves is important.  Once the winter is passed I think the real hard work will begin.    I’m prepared to do the walking and talking day in day out.  Until then I consider myself ‘in training’ in doing the current talking to friends and family at the moment.
      Otherwise until nest year I think I would be boring the undecideds to tears 🙂

    211. David Smith says:

      I’m not sure how useful they will be in Cumbria but I’m going to order some yes stickers to plonk strategically on my person, bike or static objects during my bike rides over the border whilst trying to avoid being mowed down by UKIP extremists in Range Rovers!

    212. McNic says:

      Labour appear to be copying SNP typeface and format with their by-election material, is this a new ploy to confuse us?
      We should be told.

    213. scottish_skier says:

      Man you are taking your time with the poll results Rev.
       
      With regard to my comment last night; I’ve always felt Scots don’t tend to wear their politics on their sleeve. Hence everybody not walking around with wee Yes or UKOK stickers on. I’ve also found it rare at elections for people to advertise their preferred party, e.g. by stickers in windows etc.
       
      I also see patterns in polling data which can only be explained by a fair section of people saying ‘No’ or ‘Yes’ depending on the current climate, i.e. they say Yes when it seems ok to do so (e.g. 2011), then ‘No’ when they feel that the media is portraying that as a bad thing (2012). You see exactly the same trends in polls, yet No is exaggerated in non-anonymous ones (telephone and face to face) and Yes under-represented compared to anonymous (online) ones. One can only assume this is a ‘shy factor’. Certainly in my experience talking to people, the average person who supports Yes only tends to admit so in private and once they’ve firmly established you do too.
       
      It’s down to the demonisation of Yes by the pro-union campaign/media. What the pro-union campaign don’t appreciate however, is that this approach won’t stop people voting Yes, it just makes then quiet about it, even to an extent in polls. After all, when you tick your box in the polling both, it’s private.
       
      Personally, I happily walk around with a Yes badge on. I have a Yes sticker on my car and a saltire draped over the boot cover / shelf and rear headrests (well if lorry drivers can, why not for my car). There’s also a saltire flapping over my car port. In this sense, I don’t expect BT will bother leafleting me or chapping my door.
       
      With regard to the little Yes badge, it’s never caused anyone to frown when they spot it on my jacket; instead, if it causes an effect, it’s a positive one with smiles brightening and, not uncommonly, a sudden use of more Scots in the conversation.

    214. AmadeusMinkowski says:

      IRONY ALERT:
      Scotsman carries article with the strap line:
      SCOTTISH Labour has ­accused BBC Scotland of being “complicit” in a “co-ordinated campaign” by the SNP to manipulate coverage of the independence referendum.
      Orwellian DoubleSpeak is alive and well in Bitter-Together Land!

    215. Sneddon says:

      SS  Good post I think you’re touching on a combination of the cringe and the general ‘calvinist’ scottish attitude to shouting about things.  I got mine ‘cured’ by spending some time in the states but it’s understandable in others.  Plus who likes being the object of scorn in the MSM. That is changing.  Most folk who see my YES badge use it as an opener to ask stuff along the lines of’Can we afford it’; ‘Can we do it’;’what about…’.  Wear yer badge with pride and  it’s the invitation for people to ask questions because they know you are not going to disparage them.

    216. Jeannie says:

      @scottish skier
       
      Certainly in my experience talking to people, the average person who supports Yes only tends to admit so in private and once they’ve firmly established you do too.
       
      Yes, that’s my experience too.  I’m trying to make sure I’ve got something on now like a badge on my collar or attached to my bag so that people can identify where I stand and decide if they want to approach me to talk.  If so, I’ve now got my Aye Right leaflets in my bag so they can take one away with them.  I’ve also got a Yes sticker on my car.
       
      For all our bluster, many Scots are quite shy underneath and just need something to open the conversation.  “I like your badge” is a good opener, but the conversation probably won’t happen unless you wear one.

    217. scottish_skier says:

       the general ‘calvinist’ scottish attitude to shouting about things
       
      Scotland is a strange place in that it is both very radical and small c conservative simultaneously.

    218. Jeannie says:

      I’m always banging on about the lack of good Yes or saltire jewellery, but had a brief conversation with a stranger at the rally last Saturday about her beautiful saltire earrings.  The earrings were the conversation opener.  I wanted a pair and asked her where to get them.  She said she’d e-mail me the contact details of the lady who made them, but so far I haven’t hear from her, so Kate, if you’re reading this, and you’ve lost my address, could you even put a post on here telling us where we can get them?  I’m sure it was somewhere like Bellshill or Motherwell.  Women might be too shy to start a conversation about independence, but they WILL start a conversation about jewellery…..and the rest will follow.

    219. liz says:

      Re lack of visible Yes stickers etc, I know of one person – admittedly only one – who is a committed Yes voter – “Nothing will stop me voting Yes” who for their own reasons think it is too early to come out visibly.
      I know some people will disagree with this but he thinks that some people have short attention spans and will be bored.
      I’m not saying I agree with this position but the point is everyone thinks differently.
       
      Personally I come onto this site to be cheered up and encouraged as eg, the headline on BBC Scotland last night -had left it on inadvertently after pointless – had me reaching for the remote.
       
      We can all feel up and down because it is a long campaign but I think we should lay off others for having different opinions.
      Remember the black ops have long arms and we don’t want to supply them with ammo.

    220. Jeannie says:

      Interestingly, I was in a DIY shop last night and as I was coming through the self-serve checkout, there was an assistant standing there who just smiled at me…and kept smiling.  Being as I’m nearly old enough to be his granny, I assume he didn’t fancy me……maybe he noticed the big YES badge on my bag.
       
      It doesn’t always matter whether the badge leads to a follow-up conversation – just seeing people wearing them helps “normalise” the idea of voting for independence.  The more we can “normalise”, the less taboo the subject will become.

    221. Jeannie says:

      @Liz
       
      I agree that too much “in your face” stuff can have the opposite effect from the one you intended and actually put people off.  I’m always worried I do that on Facebook.
       

    222. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Man you are taking your time with the poll results Rev.”

      As I’ve said – the poll hasn’t actually been done yet. We’re giving people a wee break both from being asked their opinions and reading about polls after the mad two-a-day splurge around the year mark.

    223. Daughter of Evil Reindeer says:

      The small c is likely the case here in Edinburgh, the fantastic Scottish writer Laura Hird said something along the lines of – People in Edinburgh talk to you about the weather until they decide what it is they don’t like about you.

      I think with political stuff there is this thing that we are going to either agree and maybe become friends or we are going to have to have a big heavy discussion and fall out, is it the  progressing of the relationship that is the problem at least in ‘reserved’ Edinburgh?

      it is different when doorstepping people there are clearly defined roles that of Canvasser and Householder it is impersonal.

      Great discussion, last Saturday I moved from “passive yes” to “yes activist” more please.

    224. scottish_skier says:

      As I’ve said – the poll hasn’t actually been done yet.
       
      <Accepts rap on knuckles for not paying sufficient attention in class.>
       
      If the final Q’s haven’t been set and it’s possible, as I’ve said before, asking the census identity question ahead of any political ones (i.e. just part of age, sex checks etc) would be great. You could ask it to be weighted to that to compare with normal weightings. Even if they don’t try weighting, just seeing the numbers would be very interesting.
       
      Clearly, MORI are getting something totally unrepresentative with their phone polls (due to reasons I’ve eluded to in the past). Now that we have solid census data it might be worth pointing this out to them.

    225. Maureen Luby says:

      Hi Jeannie, I found this website and they have quite a lot of saltire jewellery, earrings, rings, cufflinks, dog tags, pendants. All at very reasonable prices.
      http://www.judesjewels.co.uk/ourshop/cat_228948-Scottish-Jewellery-and-Gifts.html

    226. Jeannie says:

      @Maureen Luby
       
      Thanks for that, Maureen – love those kiltpins.  If only I DIDN’T have the hips for a kilt!  You could wear the kiltpin with a scarf, though, couldn’t you?  They don’t have the earrings I want, though.  Was on Zazzle as well and saw some nice stickers and a t-shirt and a bag.  There’s definitely a market for good indy-wear for women – subtle stuff you can wear to your work, not just for rallies.

    227. DonDeefLugs says:

      re: “Aunty’ Caesar!lha
      I was one of the group with Caesar!lha last Saturday and can confirm she is part of a BBC cult.
      It all started innocently enough with her handing around a small bronze statue of Ken MacQuarrie while trying to get us to sing the BBC anthem “I vow to thee, my bbc, all earthly things above”, flashing her Lord Reith underwear and making promises of arranging private audiences with Sally Magnusson.
      It  was only when she said that Gordon Brewer was an SNP supporter that I realised she’d gone too far and I made my excuses and headed for the nearest exit.

    228. K Mackay says:

      Caesar!lha, if you go to Nicolson Square (near festival theatre) and look up you should see it 🙂 I think some folk do notice it as last year someone stuck a butcher’s apron to the outside of the stair door, they must’ve known how much pleasure I’d get from binning it 🙂

    229. velofello says:

      ” Jeannie: You’ve taken the wind right out of my sails.Walking through Edinburgh after the  the rally last Saturday i found young lassies smiling at me, and since then too. At the rally  my son bought me a Yes baseball cap, is that the reason for the smiles?

    230. Jeannie says:

      @vellofello
      At the rally  my son bought me a Yes baseball cap, is that the reason for the smiles?  
       
      Well, damned attractive as you and I undoubtedly are, I’m thinking it probably is the other thing we have in common that’s getting us noticed – the Yes gear!  And for once, I’m glad 🙂

    231. Bugger (the Panda) says:

      CameronB at 5 someting yesterday. Excellent idea for a Wings crowd funding idea. They economies of scale are significant on print runs.

    232. Juteman says:

      With the colder weather coming in, I would love to buy one of the YES fleeces on their site.
      Unfortunately, I couldn’t wear something with the submissive ‘please’ on it.
      What idiot was responsible for that?

    233. gavin lessells says:

      CameronB and the Panda 
      We have a quote by a sympathetic printer of £445 for 50,000 and £765 for 100,000
      printed on 200gm glossy A6 (quarter A4)
      Direct thoughts to Robert Allan, Oban as detailed in first post.
       
       
       

    234. Bugger (the Panda) says:

      I am up for € 100 for the flyers but I need bank details so I can send from abroad.
      I need some verification of name and IBAN number so I can transfer.
      Anyone up for it and which flyer?
      I am up for 100,000?
       
      BtP

    235. gavin lessells says:

      Bugger(the Panda}
       
      Suggest you e mail Robert Allan on soarsa [at] me [dot] com . Sure he can make arrangements for transfer. Greatly appreciate your interest.

    236. velofello says:

      Ah Jeannie, you are a wee cracker, My son and me really enjoyed our time with you at the rally, but is it only only because of my Yes cap that “the lassies smile on me when coming thro’ the rye”?

    237. JnrTick says:

      @mogabee
      That’s me, there is not the remotest chance I for one am willing to allow one of two news sites dictate hard core ‘NO’ bile to our region of Argyll & Bute.
      I reside in Dunoon, a relatively recent SNP member (just converted the wife)
      ForArgyll is excruciatingly hard work but the way I see it, although arming ourselves with ammunition/info from sites such as this, it is equally important to know and tackle the enemy, preaching to the converted is futile and time wasted. hence my irregularity on here. 
      R.e ForArgyll, all I ask is for a level of impartiality, an even handed approach, that’s all.
      My only regret through persisting on their forum is giving the site a hit but if I can at least influence an undecided or two think again its worth sacrificing both my time and adding to their sites hits.
      All the best
      JnrTick
      @Rev
      Re My suggestion of some hard facts and something punchier belonging on the leaflet.
      Those yourself and everyone on here know exactly what “Hard facts” and “Something punchier” would entail. Nobody requires me to spell it out so your suggestion that my post “Isn’t exactly helpful” is unfair and un-called for imo
       

    238. Paula Rose says:

      JnrTick – We’ve just got to be useful, win it xx

    239. Jeannie says:

      @vellofello
       
      🙂

    240. I have added a QR code to the leaflet, which links to a blog post that includes the leaflet text and live links to the listed sites.
       
      This should make it easier for folks to get straight to the sites when they pick up a leaflet.
       
      I’ve checked with Bob, and he’s OK with this.
       
      Links:
      Blog post
      Leaflet with QR code (for reading)
      Leaflet with QR code (for printing)
       

    241. Haggistrap says:

      I did send an email to Wings recently suggesting leaflets that could be printed at home showing  pro websites. Just wondered if this was already on the cards.
      The printer selected is based in England. Is no Scottish printer able to compete and if not, why not? It’s likely the printers name and location will be on the leaflet which will be spotted by the No’s.
      I cannot get the leaflet to convert to PDF by right clicking. Was going to print a few hunderd at home in black and white with my laser printer.

    242. Boorach says:

      @ Haggistrap
       
      If you look at the first post you’ll see it dives details of a printer based in Oban. I’m sure that yellow pages/google will give details of more local printers.

    243. JnrTick says:

      @Paula
      “JnrTick – We’ve just got to be useful, win it xx”
      It would be folly to underestimate the task ahead of us ‘Yes’ voters Paula.
      Of course “Useful” is great and has its place but a steely determination, well articulated points put forward to friends neighbours acquaintances etc, thinking outside the usual parameters, being cleverer and thinking on our feet adapting to situations are all extreley important if we are to gain some ground.
      Appreciate your thoughts though   

    244. Johnnie McMillan says:

      I’m new to this site, and enjoying reading the posts and learning more.
      I have to say I do not understand this poster with Aye Right’ on it against a Scottish flag.
      It is contradictory to the message of pro independence. And why does a pro independence poster have to get all colloquial?  Poor marketing in my opinion,  created by politicians who don’t understand the craft.  
       

    245. Albalha says:

      @johnniemcmillan
      I’m sure they’d be interested to hear your thoughts. All their details at the top of the comments. Though I think the people and groups they’ve distributed thousands to, so far, are getting it.
      But of course it will take all type of campaigning, leaflets etc to get us over the line.
      Different things work for different people.

    246. Desimond says:

      Was in Aberdeen yesterday….used some spare time to walk around Apple Store setting as many browsers as possible to wingsoverscotland.

      Try it, its cathartic.

      Also, if you are at your train station early morning… leaflets placed into Metros?

    247. Jenny says:

      @Desimond.
      “Was in Aberdeen yesterday….used some spare time to walk around Apple Store setting as many browsers as possible to wingsoverscotland”
      Heavy “Like”

    248. naebd says:

      I think the flyer should be updated to list derek bateman’s serious blog, which is http://drderekbateman.wordpress.com/

    249. tartanpigsy says:

      have just found out about this
      http://www.indyposterboy.info/index.asp
      loads of useful downloadable material for groups or individuals to distribute,
      and all this time thought it was just a handle doh
      also Yes Scotland have redone their website. it seems much more user friendly and also carries links, which may or may not have been there before, to a range of downloadable and web related material.
      The Aye right leaflet is also now available on Newsnet’s article about their own leaflets.
      Plenty to keep us all busy on the autumn nights.
      Any plans on putting a Wings leaflet together Rev?
      My own preference which we discussed at the time of the BBC rallies would be a shortened version of Gavin’s list , say 5 or 6 weblinks bold and bright on an A5: NNS,Wings, NC, Bella, Biz for and Yes Scotland.
      All bases covered, all tastes given at least something they can relate to….



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