A zero-sum game
Posted on
March 19, 2014 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
Remember, kids – nationalism is bad. Stay away from the evil nationalists, or they might steal your Union Jack flag, Union Jack t-shirt or Royal Standard.
The only number that can be divided to end up with nothing is zero.
What a wee man for such a big cringe.
Sorry, I was forgetting. Small, far away. Small, far away.
The suburbs of Newbury will be delighted to see him
Oh well – bye then!
its a form of brainwashing…
Starts young, and when a person is completely surrounded by this kind of mentality from the start, it becomes a ‘norm’. The poor man has no comprehension of what has happened to him.
There is no point in engaging or attempts at persuasion. Move along and find someone who is open minded.
I suppose the only thing we can take from that is when referring to ‘country’, they both meant Scotland.
I think.
Makes a change.
You should forward this clip to George and Dave. Will crack them up no end.
Toodle-OO-the-nOO
‘separatising’- don’tcha just love learning new words?
Aww i’d be sad to see him go…shoft
this mans in depth analysis of the referendum debate certainly has me asking myself some serious questions. do i want to be nuhin in an independant scotland or could i possibly continue living in scotland after a democratic vote for independance? this is the positive information people have been screaming out for to make an informed choice. rool britainnia ya bastirts.
Wish someone would unite Jim with a Yellow Pages so he could at least look that reporter in the eye whilst he spouts shite.
I am from this type of background, until I learned to think for myself.
I just hope him and Michele Mone find some common ground to chat about on the early train to London on the 19th Sept.
I think you are all being dreadfully unfair – he is a good deal more convincing that Johann Lamont.
I’ll help him pack.
The sad thing is, these are the people we are voting against. They do exist and are representative of Better Together’s support not as a minority, but as a majority.
So utterly indoctrinated that they aren’t concerned in the least about the argument, they only know that they are voting no, no matter what!
These are the clowns lining the streets cheering on the bigoted walks etc. I’d be delighted if they all left of their own accord.
His girlfriend there’s keeping her opinion of the bedroom tax to herself this time, or is that the SDL I’m mixing him up with link to edinburghnews.scotsman.com ah that’s right, this one fears god
One word
MADNESS
link to m.youtube.com
By the way rev, which tv program is this taken from? Is the full show on YouTube at all?
I can’t profess to understand. I like Scotland. I will stay Yes or No. It is my home and where my heart is.
I am sure he will be very happy wherever it is he intends to go though so I guess it isn’t an issue.
I just hope that this guy can give me a quick nod as to when he is planning to leave Wishaw, cause at the present time the M74/M6 junction will need a good few days hard graft to make sure that it is clean enough for him to pass over on his way South to pastures new! 🙂
Wahey, I hope they ALL go with him. Take your flags with you too.
BTW, I have family over that way and no word of a lie teenagers in the area think that there will be war between England and Scotland if there is independence.
Could an adult have told them this nonense?
Surely there aren’t any adults that idiotic in the West of Scotland.
One of Johann’s former pupils.
Or even nonsense.
Amazing considering the lack of a forelock to tug….
Perhaps someone could explain and define ‘unitedness’?
For 307 years it has meant Scotland plays 2nd fiddle, is the junior partner, Scotland has to ‘take orders’ – they must think we’re all waiters and no slight meant by that.
Just can the Unionists spell out exactly what they see in their notions of how it would be?
They ridicule ‘separation’ yet avoid clarifying ‘union’
Isn’t that strange?
I think you are all being horrible and grossly unfair to this individual. His progressive credentials are beyond reproach…after all he follows a gay man riding a big white charger!
He also mentions Yes four times whilst mentioning No a sum total of zero times. Could he be a double agent?
I genuinely dont understand why many hard core unionists have a penchant for sporting an England football top, or logo’d T shirt as modelled by the gentleman in the video.
What would a trick cyclist make of that ?
What sort of Scot would rather be English ffs?
Are these boys that far gone aye?
Unfortunately, I meet too many of these type of people. It’s all about the flag, the Union and Ulster says No.
And they call us the fanatics.
Ach, he’s just hoping for a walk-on comedy slot with Eddie Izzodd.
McHaggis says:
its a form of brainwashing…
Starts young, and when a person is completely surrounded by this kind of mentality from the start, it becomes a ‘norm’.
My daughter (8 or 9 at the time) was given an invite to a birthday party in the Orange hall featured in that video. The invite did not say it was the Orange hall, just gave an address. Had I known, I wouldn’t have let her go.
Start ’em young, and try to infect as many of their friends as possible. These people make me sick.
Why are the media trying to drag this form of Unionism into the debate? That’s not exactly going to help Better Together’s cause. The irony of listening to someone who belongs to an organisation whose whole purpose is to ferment dischord between the Protestant and Catholic communities, lecturing YES supporters about not being divisive… while keeping alive memories of a 326 year old war. I mean, really?
As an Aberdeen supporter walking past several pubs in Bridgeton Cross on my way back into Glasgow on Sunday teatime I’m pretty sure I saw this guy. If not him then certainly some of his friends, eyeballing everyone who went past definitely looking for a fight. Very proudly stuck my Yes badge as near their faces as I dared. Sad individulas.
@Garry says:
I think you are all being dreadfully unfair – he is a good deal more convincing that Johann Lamont.
I agree. Unlike Johann, he clearly has the genetic programming to answer questions.
Hijo de puta. Adios craphound!
I feel another indigogo fundraiser coming on.
I’d gladly pledge a couple of hundred to sweep the streets clear of quarterwits like this that can’t see past the football team they claim to support.
In the interests of balance I want to make it clear that im including both side. The south of Glasgow doesn’t have a monopoly on knuckle dragging stupidity.
When we’ve got rid of them here’s a thought – we invite the rest of the world to send us their smartest and best to work in cooperation with us.
Our Gala day,from the pictures,were part of the brainwashing.
Crown a Queen on a straw throne while all the kids wave Union Jacks.
Can we crowd fund his bus fare to Carlisle?
I live in Wishaw and work in Larkhall. I hear this kind of drivel almost on a daily basis and yes they really believe it. Hope they leave soon as the marching season is almost upon us again.
It’s important to not take the reasons people say they are no supporters at face value.
No one is strongly against independence because they don’t like Alex Salmond or Think indepdence would be a disaster. They hate Alex Salmond and think independence would have terrible consequences because they are against it.
They hate Alex because he is a threat, it would be the same no matter who was the leader of the SNP. The reason they say the consequences would be terrible is that if they admitted that indepdence could be a success, then all they would have is an emotional argument. And people always try to back up their emotional arguments with logic.
It’s all in yer heid Jim,
“Ye ken the auld sayin’ United we stand divided we fall”
“Of course you do realise if the Scots Unite all those divisions fall away”
Fae a very nice lady on the bus.
It just keeps getting better.
Question is – who’ll take the mug?
.. but what is it he likes about being condemned as subsidized? (While in fact Scotland has more than paid her own way – link to businessforscotland.co.uk)
What does he like about being held in contempt by the British media?
I had the misfortune to watch some, let’s say British humour, the other day. There was an Englishman playing the part of a Scot. I could tell because he was wearing a kilt and spoke with a mock Jock accent. This character was quite two dimensional he raged about how he hated the English. Later he was seen to be having his nappy changed.
So just your average anti-Scottish racism smacking Scots in the face in their living rooms.
Of course it’s wrong and counter productive to hate and its about time English people in the media stopped hating the Scots.
Odd listening to Scottish folk who hate Scotland and can’t wait to leave.
I hope they let him past Theresa May’s barbed wire, machine gun border check points. He seems to fit in with their UKOK requirements.
Coming from the east coast, I was stunned when I once found myself in a small town somewhere near Shotts, during marching season. All the streets were festooned with red, white and blue bunting and I genuinely wondered if I was still in Scotland.
Let’s make biggitory unconstitutional, or at least put something in the water supply. 😉
As a “Westcoaster” from NI Protestant roots this saddens me greatly.
I was raised in this bigotry and somehow managed to see through it at a very early age.
One thing I’m sure of is that the Scotland I seek will work to unite it’s citizens and not divide them.
That flag on the wall is not representing unity – enough!
I will say that I am glad these guys are on the No side even if Darling wouldn’t let them join Better Together.
They would have been a stick the Mail and Better Together would have been all too happy to beat us with if they were.
I once drove a bus-load of these people from a ‘hall’ in Rosyth to another ‘hall’ in the south-western part of Glasgow. They were all old and happy. I returned to pick them up and take them home and they were still old but by God were they angry. I got asked some pretty distasteful questions on that return journey. I also declined their tip.
There aren’t as many of these people as it appears. It’s just that they draw attention to themselves as much as possible, because they know deep down no one outside of their group cares what they have to say.
@Dan Watt @ 10.25p.m.
It was taken from WALES TODAY, the early evening BBC Wales English language News programme, from last night (Tuesday, 6.30p.m-7p.m.). The reporter, Jamie Owen, went to Motherwell to get a generalised view of a ‘typical’ place in Scotland that mirrors some industrial towns in Wales. He spoke to a man called Fox from the SSP (sorry can’t remember his first name), on the site of the old Ravenscraig. He was a YES and as you all are up there, fair do’s, very positive and upbeat. The reporter went on to remark on a few other general impressions…think there was more to come on further programmes (cos I can’t see 5 minutes spent in Motherwell will give you the referendum overview!). You can probably catch it on I-Player.
I remember being in the pub a few year’s back and being told by a couple of “acquaintances”, who were Orange Lodge members (I’m an atheist, but was sent to Catholic school, so it was always a somewhat uneasy night out with these two), that they could never vote for Scottish Independence because it would mean Scotland would have a new monarchy made up of Stuarts/Jacobites and that the Catholics would be be running the show, or worse they’d regain the English throne and topple the House of Windsor.
My inner mind’s eyes rolled furiously.
When he leaves (for wherever will be fortunate enough to have him)will he come back for the marching season or will he wander around the south of England,lost and bewildered looking for an orange parade and listening in vain for the sound of the flutes?
As for the mock jock in a kilt, even uneducated Englishmen know the correct form of dress for the kilt, so he shouldn’t have been wearing a nappy to be changed!
Its probably good old Riderooo. And he left Glasgow ages ago anyway, he says.
Live in Motherwell and work in Wishaw, like ruther60 come across this type of person regularly.
I asked one of “yer man’s” counterparts if he had read the McCrone report. He replied “Ah don’t need to read anything about independence I’m voting no”
I was speechless… don’t think for yourself just vote no.
I can see Jim ,small talk dinner party Essex
link to m.youtube.com
OT – despite all the media gloom about the Bannockburn Live event, it doesn’t seem the ticket sales are too bad according to this link.
link to ticketsoup.com
“If it does happen, I won’t be in the country.” – Thank goodness for that!
I lived in West Calder for some time and had,nt been there long when they had the big Orange walk there . We left the village for the day and when we returned,they had almost left it like a war zone . It was absolutely terrifying!
So on you go wee man , I will help you pack up! Scotland doesn’t need you or your kind!
Another independence dividend, we get rid of all the Orange cretins. And for the avoidance of doubt I’m a Scottish Protestant.
BTW Got my tickets for Bannockburn on the sat!
Listening to Scottish Questions. Looks like their latest attempt at driving a wedge and stirring up fear is claiming that the island communities are being neglected by the Scottish Government.
I just cannot believe how low these people are prepared to go in defence of a red White and blue dishcloth.
England is more than welcome to these utterly pathetic morons. Shameful backstabbers that they are, though becoming more and more of a minority as time passes thankfully.
Very sad and a product of the union. The union (empire) has divided this country for so long now. They sow the seed of fear and hatred between the people and the gullible foot soldiers do the fighting defending that imposed belief. Every country that the British empire has invaded and raped, they have employed the same tactic in order to seize control and impose a puppet regime. The puppet regime will obviously rely on the empire to support it administratively, financially and militarily to ensure it imposes the policies that are beneficial to the empire. The regime is happy to serve the empire (loyalist) even to the detriment of their own people.
He doesn’t want to stay? Oh well no great loss. I feel pity for the poor northern Irish town that has to take him though.
Sorry Tîm Criced i Gymru , he’ll probably be heading your way in the same chartered dustbin lorry as his fellow travellers the Rangers fans from Saltcoats (couldn’t find the link here but it’s on YouTube).
Its quite sad in a way they know nothing and are blinded by hatred. More to be pitied than laughed at.
Scottish Questions – a really unedifying sight, labour MPs working hand in glove with the Tories to talk down Scotland’s prospects. come the 19th September these people should be held to account for their treachery.
I dont think I’ve ever been more disgusted with the Labour Party.
‘Orangemen for Indy’ does (do?) exist.
I doubt if he’s a member.
theycan’tbeserious
Got your tinfoil bunnet on?
“Fabianism, Britain’s very own brand of socialism, joined the camp of liberal capitalist imperialism from the start, with Bernard Shaw’s Fabian manifesto declaring that China’s institutions were incompatible with British trade interests which is why the world powers, Britain and America at the forefront, had to impose a new order on that country – and everywhere else in the world.
The imperialists, Lord Milner above all, responded in kind by publicly coming out as devout followers of socialism”. Other “liberal capitalists” – Lord Rothschild, Sir Ernest Cassel, the Rockefellers – were more discreet about their socialist sympathies, contenting themselves with financing a network of socialist projects from the Fabians’ London School of Economics to the Lincoln School and Teachers College of New York…..
…The glue cementing this strange marriage of convenience between the political “Left” and the corporate “Right” has been the shared objective, already stated in Marx and Engels’ “Communist Manifesto,” of concentrating finance, economy and politics in the hands of a state controlled by the Socialist Party or by multinational corporations (depending on whether we look at it from the viewpoint of the “Left” or that of the “Right”).
The Milner-Fabian Conspiracy: How an international elite is taking over and destroying Europe, America and the World
link to amazon.co.uk
link to en.wikipedia.org
link to en.wikipedia.org
Re Scottish Questions:
If your job and your salary along with you and your family’s lifestyle was threatened, wouldn’t you do your best to defend it and attack those who pose a danger?
Just sayin’.
O/T New Panelbase poll apparently.
Yes 40%, No 45%, Don’t Know 15%
Yes 47%, No 53%, excluding DKs.
Great news over on Newsnet Scotland.
Their Panelbase Poll shows Yes on 40% , with No on 45%
Well done Rev spotting the numpties had the English royal standard up on the wall as opposed to the Scottish one.
I wonder if they even know there is a difference.
I hope we get to see the follow up on you choob of him leaving Scotland after 18th sept.
Well, I’m sure we’ll all shed a tear when that fine gentleman leaves but I reckon we’ll get by ok 🙂
Maybe it’s time to start a sister site to WoS in the same vein of Mark Thomas’ http://www.wewilldrivethemtotheairport.co.uk ?
How about http://www.wewillbusyoutotheborder.scot or http://www.wewillcartyoutocarlisle.scot ?
“Maybe it’s time to start a sister site to WoS in the same vein of Mark Thomas”
Ha, was just thinking that very thing this evening 😀
Jim McNab, noo diz he look like a man that could up sticks
& move anywhere never mind the bus fare tae Motherwell,his
baws will get squeezed if he did’nt have permission to allow
camera,s into that hall,not all orange men/women think like
him.
Great poll news, a swing of 2.5% to reach parity, it will be a pure doddle. Especially after the Dundee and Angus College results today, that was spectacular, it might even indicate the start of the devo max don’t knows jumping over to yes.
I’m sure that wasn’t Motherwell Orange Hall its to bright inside, Motherwell’s is a dark dingy damp smelling hole, I was at a funeral there a few years back, it might have been New Stevenson lodge, same bile different area.
Was asked about my Yes badges in pub tonight, a young couple wi dug on holiday, from Glasgow, she started off a probable yes but was definite by the time I had finished talking to them, I asked him what was it that most concerned him about voting Yes, he came away with the old labour pish about us all being in it together, were twtpts when I gave him the info he changed tack to all the politicians are the same, it will be no different, I said who do you prefer Johan or Alex, well Alex is a liar, chancher, etc, Johan is like us, fighting for us.
I asked if he had seen newsnicht last night, no but it would not matter he is not changing his mind. Scotland would not get better under independence, she said she would work on him, but ffs what is about these people!!!
I`m so looking forward to all these people sticking to their word and leaving Scotland after a Yes vote. The housing boom is going to be incredible.
Good riddance.
Also, good news about the latest poll.
I won`t get too excited though. I`m sure Ipsos Mori will have one of their ‘traditional’ 32 Yes 58 No polls waiting in the wings to give the anti-independence mob something to point and sneer with.
That`s how it works isn`t it?
Anyway, today`s been strangely rewarding. Feeling good about things.
G`night everybody.
Does it make me a bad person that I agree with him?
If theres a No vote, I’m toying with the idea of upping sticks and heading for pastures new.
It may seem like deserting the nation you love, but if these morons win in september, I’m not sure how comfortable I am sharing a country with them, knowing that they are in the majority.
O/T Just watched Sir David Jason on the Michael MacIntyre show explaining how they got the bar flap sketch ‘the funniest thing ever on British TV’.
Strange, I remember Rikki Fulton doing exactly the same gag, as ‘the traffic cop’ on his Hogmanay show before it appeared on OFAH.
The poor guy he will leave and probably go to the rUK, fully believing all the UKOK propaganda that he will be a foreigner there, all the people he left behind would be nasty foreigners to him too. An anachronism with a suitcase.
I’m not sure he could take it. So maybe a Darwin award is on the cards.
Busy week with Murphy and then Johann stepping on their respective political banana skins. Today’s budget fine print to come out tomorrow with details, then FMQ’s and the panel base polling fallout. Looks good for YES.
Finally at the weekend, popcorn in for the labour conference ferret fight. Can’t get worse for Johann can it…can it?
I come from Wishaw, or as near as makes no difference. I’m just going to go and sob brokenly in a corner now.
That type of attitude is slowly dying out, but the diehards cling on as best they can.
Most young people don’t believe in religion, or give 2 shits about Northern Ireland anymore.
And an independent Scotland will still be in Britain, with the Queen as head of state, so what’s left is a kind of deep inferiority complex with themselves and Scotland as a country.
NNS Story: 🙂
Claims Labour Devo-plans unravelling after criticism mounts.
In another TV interview, Ms Lamont was again unclear on the implications of one of her key policies when she appeared not to know how much her own income tax proposals would raise.
Asked how much a 5p increase in the top rate of income tax would raise, the Scottish Labour leader said, “We think it’s something like one hundred million pounds … you could get 3000 nurses for that”. Challenged that the £100m figure was for the whole of the UK, and the actual figure was closer to £10 million, Ms Lamont said; “I don’t think it is ten million”.
Can we re-name them the shocking naw campaign?
@wee 162 – LOL, I like it 😀
Winning the thinking vote is a lot easier than winning these guys over. They are either a lost cause or we need radically different tactics. Short of telling them that BT is run by the vatican I can’t think of anything. Personally, I think guys like this are a lost cause – just don’t wind them up and let them think the no vote is in the bag – don’t want them motivated to vote.
Here’s Labours Conference Slogan
Devo Max to Devo Axed
Explains labour,
Bile
noun
1.
a bitter greenish-brown alkaline fluid which aids digestion and is secreted by the liver and stored in the gall bladder.
2.
anger, bitterness, or irritability.
“his response was full of bile and hatred”
DEVO-LUSION
I must have a compulsive disorder. 🙂
“Lionel George Curtis, civil servant, Oxford academic and leader of the ‘Kindergarten’ of imperialist intellectuals that had originated round Alfred Lord Milner,
was a crusader for imperial federation and for Anglo-American friendship.
He attended the 1919 Paris peace conference as a member of the British delegation, and like many of his colleagues was appalled at how, in his view, an ignorant and
chauvinistic public opinion contributed to a draconian peace settlement. What would become Chatham House emerged from a meeting of British and American delegates at the Hôtel Majestic in Paris in May 1919, which both Curtis and Webster attended: this world was small and interknit.
Those present wished to maintain the interchange between specialists versed in ‘the facts’ that had emerged behind the scenes at Paris, and to cultivate a more enlightened public opinion….”
link to chathamhouse.org
“In September 1909, Curtis helped Sir Alfred Milner establish the Round Table. According to Alex May “The aim of the Round Table was deceptively simple: to ensure the permanence of the British empire by reconstructing it as a federation representative of all its self-governing parts.
Curtis depicted this as the logical outcome of the movement towards self-government in the dominions, and the only alternative to disruption and independence.” Curtis was appointed General Secretary on a salary of £1,000 a year. Other members included Leo Amery, Robert Cecil, Geoffrey Dawson, Philip Kerr, Reginald Coupland, Edward Grigg and Alfred Zimmern”.
link to spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk
Did I hear correctly when Osbourne said the deficit would turn into a surplice by 2018/19 ? The same guy who promised to slash the national debt, which was then £800 billion and now stands at £1.6 trillion. But the thing that got the most cheers from his Eton millionaire friends was the statement that by 2019 we will save £2000 per person in interest payments. So his incompetence is costing every person in the UK £2000 until the deficit is gone and we have to be happy when these payments stop,saving us £2000. And nobody challenged this. Labour too busy ripping Alex Salmond to bits.Pathetic.
Och, probably a mile OT but I might as well go for three falls.
Tragedy and Hope: Professor Carroll Quigley and the “Article that Said Too Little” by Kevin Cole
link to youtube.com
bigheed says
“I just hope him and Michele Mone find some common ground to chat about on the early train to London on the 19th Sept.”
I can imagine a conversation between him and Michelle Moan
she’d be saying “my face is up here 🙂
@David Wannel
I had to stop reading that report when I read
“I went too far, I only wanted to propose to her”,
my God what would that animal have done to that poor girl if he had been angry with her.
Krackerman says
“Amazing considering the lack of a forelock to tug….”
Oi Oi Oi forgettin somthin there?
you forgot to add,
beggin your pardon sor!
mind your manners!
Ruther says
“I live in Wishaw and work in Larkhall. I hear this kind of drivel almost on a daily basis and yes they really believe it. Hope they leave soon as the marching season is almost upon us again.”
Now how hard could it be to have the route of their march readjusted ever so slightly and before they know it they’ve marched themselves right down the m74 and find themselves in their ancestral homeland win/win 🙂
Diane says
” Very proudly stuck my Yes badge as near their faces as I dared. Sad individuals.”
Diane you are what this campaign is all about
hold your head up with pride.
Cameron B says
“Let’s make bigitory unconstitutional, or at least put something in the water supply. ”
Fit aboot some green dye? 🙂
Andrew Morton says
“Another independence dividend, we get rid of all the Orange cretins. And for the avoidance of doubt I’m a Scottish Protestant.”
Ditto for the Catholic knuckle draggers
and for the record brought up a Catholic 🙂
Flower of Scotland says
“BTW Got my tickets for Bannockburn on the sat!”
Who else is going?
Graham B says
“Sorry Tîm Criced i Gymru , he’ll probably be heading your way in the same chartered dustbin lorry as his fellow travellers the Rangers fans from Saltcoats”
Naha Im thinking theyll be hidden in lorries filled with tins of Baxters soup and Tunnocks wavers, and going by the British border agencies record they’ll get in nae bother
Bruce Wallace says
“Bile
noun
1.
a bitter greenish-brown alkaline fluid which aids digestion and is secreted by the liver and stored in the gall bladder.
Wtf is wrong with you people?
why is everyone intent on putting me off my porridge?
but your absolved bit only because ei yir name unnerstaun? 🙁
I mentioned it before, but the original Better Together launch video “Best of Both Worlds” contained an inordinate amount of people from Wishaw (and adjoining Craigneuk).
It’ll soon be the marching season again here when Mr McNab, and his fellow trumpets from Northern Ireland, will be given the right by North Lanarkshire Councillors at Motherwell Civic Centre to march up and down the main roads, holding up traffic for hours on end, and waking up whole neighbourhoods at 8.30 am on weekend mornings.
ps
The original BT launch video has be re-edited but you can still enjoy Ryan the student’s worthwhile Lamont-esque contribution to the debate here –
better together wee dugs sausage rolls
P.S. I think Kevin has been drinking too much coffee, which is unfortunate.
And my bet is …if it’s a Yes vote …guess who is going to remain in Scotland no matter what.
Seriously …some of these folk have no clue about William of Orange, Presbyterianism, Episcopaliansim and Catholicism. I bet if you were to ask that guy to place all of the above into context and ‘real’ historical meaning, he would struggle.
That is half of Scotland’s problem. They don’t know the real history of religion in Britain, let alone Scotland.
Bye then….
cynicalHighlander says:
‘One of Johann’s former pupils.’
Actually, I work with a guy who was taught by Lamont in the late 80’s. He says she was utterly dreadful when it came to teaching.
In fact, I’m extremely happy for this guy and all of his like-minded mates to leave Scotland if it’s a ‘Yes’ vote.
I believe that a couple of million Englishmen would jump at the chance to upsticks and come and live in an independent Scotland if given the chance.
So yep …fair swap in my book.
The grass is always greener on the other side – hang on…
One aspect I found interesting was the wee mans body language. I’m no expert but he had the body language of a man who knows he’s talking nonsense. I’m sure the brethern in the “OrangeforIndy’ group will be quite happy to remind him the lodge is monarchist not unionist and refer him to the appropriate part of their Articles of Association (possibly if they could find someone it that hall to read it ti him)
As regards Bannockburn I’m not going. Its our history and they expect me to pay well over the odds for sinilar events I’ve attended. In addition I regard the National Trust for Scotland as a bunch of tory baw bags. In banning YES campaigners from having a stall at the event confirms that. No getting my money now or ever.
Grrr. I hate endless glib vox populi going on about Nationalism & the SNP where in the interview we have another nationalism on parade. (What’s so bad about nationalism)
Luckily people with zippers up the back of their heid are a dying breed in Scotland. Every interview like that must increase the YES vote.
@Sneddon
I noticed that as well, the swaying and arms deliberately held behind his back.
But most damning was his lack of a Billy tattoo on his forearm…
An Orangeman I know is a Yes voter, so not all of them are like that.
Once again, the BBC/MSM manage to find the most intellectual ‘normal people’ to interview.
I think we should start collecting all the clips together of the BBC/MSM’s dubious airing of certain voices.
Where have all the normal folk I live beside gone?
Joe Kane says
“better together wee dugs sausage rolls”
Is it just me wishing that video would dissapear or is the camera man fading the picture, almost if he’s gagging for this to stop?
that poor guy is going to go through life with that crap following him around like his “wee dugs” poo!
Brian Nicholson says
“DEVO-LUSION”
DE vo LUSION
THERE FIXED THAT FOR YOU 😉
The population in Scotland has increased since Devolution. After an historical decline.
After Independence Scotland will boom. The Scottish revenues will be used to decrease poverty and increase investment in jobs and prosperity. Not Unionists ruining the Scottish economy. Osbourne/Alexander are deliberately ruining the Oil industry. Get rid of these two chancers, and the world is your oyster.
Osbourne have not paid off the deficit but has used the Royal Mail Pension fund to plug the gap. Now a public liability. The Royal Mail was sold off cheaply, so Westminster associates could make a £Billions from a public asset.
When this cretin leaves do you think he will take his wooden curtains with him?
Some local colour – but I’m pretty sure just round the corner from the Orange Hall in the video a well-known local “Rangers” pub closed its doors recently for the last time. It then re-opened as an exotic tanning boutique. It’s the same property and still peopled by orange people but not as we once knew them. There is a metaphor here for the way Scotland has changed in the past few decades.
ps
Thanks john king.
Even BT wishes the Ryan video would just disappear and die. It was subjected to so many takedown notices but would instantly make a re-appearance like some unwanted ghost at a banquet. Cybernats really are a twisted unforgiving lot.
“Some local colour”
ha ha ha ha ha pmsl
bitter and twisted though?
We’ll leave that to Jim Murphy 🙂
O/T New Panelbase poll apparently.
Yes 40%, No 45%, Don’t Know 15%
Consistent with trends. Looks like we’re seeing the >4/10 you get when you ask in a more roundabout way filtering through into ‘straight up’ questions.
is that a union jack crocodile on Jim’s shirt? Crocodile Dundick
Media scraping the barrel for unionist support.
Bye bye Jim, take your flag with you.
As for the oil. When anyone asks I just direct them to this:
link to oilandgaspeople.com
70% of North Sea Oil workers in favour of Independence
Then ask “Given that the 70% represents pretty much all the Scots working in the industry, who do you trust – them or George Osborne?”
Socialists are also bad. They’re out to steal your Labour neoliberalism.
Ayrshire Labour MP Brian Dononhue has been complaining about socialists in that great bastion of Scottish left-wing journalism, the Daily Record. The small comment thread is well worth a read through –
MP claims independence debate was hijacked by Yes mob
link to dailyrecord.co.uk
Billy you will be united and better together if Rangers were to form a union with Celtic and form Glasgow United.
@Dan Watt
This is sad. I noticed this film when on the internet and avoided viewing it as I knew what it would contain.
Your right this is what the Yes vote is up against.
As you point out indoctrinated to the extent they don’t really know the issues they are voting against. During a discussion with 4 persons recently these are the arguments for voting no/DK.
1. I don’t want to change the pound we have!!!
2. What is going to happen to the poor, foodbanks etc (DR reader and Labour man!!!
3. I don’t want to pay for a new passport!!!!
4. I don’t care if we are a bit less off being Independent it would be possibly better for Scotland to be Independent 90/10 DK so likely Yes.
These people with the exception of 4 are not getting into the various forums available on the internet etc to see the debates and I know they are only getting their views from the MSM and TV. Neither are they even getting involved in the townhall meetings on the referendum.
This is the challenge the Yes campaign is facing and I’m worried we won’t get through to enough of these types in the next 6 months.
Ha, was just thinking that very thing this evening
Please do, Rev.
In the meantime my ‘We Will Drive Them To The Airport’ badge will have to do.
M4rkyboy says:
A “proud Scot but”, perhaps?
M4rkyboy says:
A “proud Scot but”, perhaps?
M4rkyboy says:
A “proud Scot but”, perhaps?
You Beauty! Not only do we get independence with a Yes vote
we get a bloody good spring clean too!
Stu, I figured that was such a good joke I would post it three times.
Also, my trackball is fucked.
Strangely, while the Herald reports the new panelbase poll, it doesn’t give it a big headline like normal. Not so far anyway. Wonder why?
O/T. The conspiracy theorist in me is wondering if the cancellation oc the Rock Ness festival is in any way connected to ths referendum. Is someone afraid of YES having an influential presence and access to young minds?
Scottish Labour will get rid of Anti-Sectarian Laws brought in by the Scottish Government if they win the 2016 Scottish elections, according to Anus Sarwar.
Should suite the wee man above just fine. He can start singing songs again about blood up to his knees.
Scottish Labour, the party with their finger on the pulse of the nation.
link to dailyrecord.co.uk
Interesting Panelbase poll. I see Newsnet now using Panelbase as a pollster. It may be a good idea for the Rev to find out when they plan to commission polls to avoid doing them at the same time. Perhaps joint polls with them later on.
Prof C on whatScotlandthinks: There can now be little doubt that the No side’s lead has narrowed – and equally that last month’s currency intervention has so far failed to reverse that trend.
I’ve been saying this for like a year Prof. Slow but steady closure. No is very volatile therefore weak, Yes rock solid and rising steadily as once you’ve firmly crossed the line, you don’t go back.
Scottish Labour will get rid of Anti-Sectarian Laws brought in by the Scottish Government if they win the 2016 Scottish elections
Oh JESUS WEPT.
Not “retool,” not “amend,” REPEAL. They want to REPEAL an ANTI-SECTARIAN law. What’s next? Are they going to reinstate Section 28?
Do these numpties WANT the people of Scotland to turn on them?
remember in, when was it? early February, there was the Better together leafleting of stations? I went to Duke Street and this was their effort. Those that know the area will know that there are a couple of pubs nearby decked out in union flags. These folk know the dangers of nationalism. God save the queen, the fascist regime, that made you a moron …
link to i57.tinypic.com
@Scottish_skier
Will the latest Panelbase poll be used as a stat in the poll of polls stats.
Is it a poll the good Professor will comment on.
If so, I am going to send it out to all major news agencies like Sky and BBC England also ITV.
Cheery bye then. 🙂
No Morag. Be of good cheer!
Overtown is not Wishaw.
Neither is Craigneuk!
Joe Kane is correct. The West End Bar is no more. Even after a fresh lick of blue paint!
@Fergus Green
Wonder how the BBC will react if any of the artists say anything pro-indy during the live performances at this year’s T in the Park?
Arcade Fire are rumoured to be making an appearance at Balado this year and Win Butler made a pro-indy comment at the Barrowlands at the end of last year.
A man I meet sometimes when walking my dog and I stumbled into a conversation about independence recently. He, an O/O member, spouted the biggest load of bigoted nonsense I have ever heard on the subject.
After listening to him for a few minutes, I told him he had been fed a lot of rubbish by someone about independence. I told him that he needed to get educated about Scotland and her history.
His reaction was “I don’t want to be educated”. How do you argue with such tribalism?
Rev Have you seen this piece of intelligent debate “Rangers Supporters on Independence” sent to me by a friend who liked the Lady Gaga vid.
ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmGjiokfQ2Aoppoo
Correct link is link to youtube.com
@scottish_skier
Will the latest Panelbase poll be used a a stat in the latest poll of polls stats?
If so, I will be sending results to all major news agencies
like Sky News, BBC England, ITV, RT tv, Al Jezeera and the Scotsman newspaper.
Is it a poll the good Professor is likely to comment on.
@Linda
Your link doesn’t work but managed to find it.
Hilarious conversation near the end where the guy says he’ll leave for WALES!
Super find 😉
Once again I am heartened by the majority of responses on ‘Morning Call’ re: Budget , how will it effect your vote.
Lots of YESSERS with no buttons located at the back of their heads. They see the way forward. One man unfortunately quoted Osborne’s figures on oil and actually said
“Scotland is too wee to be independent” 🙁
I’m off to check my Stocks & Shares ISA and merge the Cash ISA to get the best of both worlds.
In the event of a No vote, my world will carry on much the same as now.
In the event of a Yes vote, his will disintegrate.
Another good reason for voting Yes.
HOOT! 😀
I’m confused…. Which one of them works for BBC Scotland News?
I dont want to see this guy and his like deserting Scotland after indy. The reason being that he and his like whether we like it or not are a part of our society and history.
It would be foolish and play right into the NO camps hands if we were to be perceived, wrongly or rightly, as bigoted and intolerant as some of the more hard line blue noses. (or bitter Catholics as they do exist you know)
We certainly wouldnt suggest some of the sentiments written here against Asians for the union, or English folks for the union etc, but it seems that because he is white and Scottish it is like open season.
I think we should remember who we are in Scotland, for all our good points and bad and perhaps not become who we profess to hate so much ourselves.
A fair comment?
Perhaps someone should tell him how the UK treats asylum seekers.
Err, on second thoughts, keep it to yourself. He might decide to stay here.
I think it would be worth while people voting Yes purely on the grounds that it would raise the average IQ of the Scottish public.
@John H
I was told ‘What do you know – all you ever do is read books’
@wee 162
Brilliant!!
caz-m
The Professor has written.
link to blog.whatscotlandthinks.org
caz-m
Prof C:
link to blog.whatscotlandthinks.org
Soda
I think it is reasonable, but I’ve been known to be wrong occasionally. 😉
To take a historical perspective on a similar condition, IMO, no de-nazification?
BTW, I hopefully I’m not one of the guilty?
@ john king
Got my tickets for Bannockburn for the Sat. I hope (regardless of/in spite of the organisers and whatever critisism is levelled at them) that it will be a good chance to counter the unionist Forces day and a chance to meet other Wingers and Yes people.
Labour Party Conference
Devo Max to Devo Axed
no mention of wee dugs and sausage rolls? i’m feeling badly let down
As a member of a Celtic website, can i ask the “And take the other lot with you” brigade to refrain from such comments, at least until the Rev posts such an article with appropriate subject matter.
And the slagging of the “West of Scotland”..is Larkhall in the West of Scotland or nearer the centre down the plumbline, is Shotts west enough?, Bathgate has marchers too I believe, is that in the West?
No drama but lets try and avoid impersonating Daily Mail readers if possible, we really are better than that.
Who would want, need or have this idiot?
Desimond
I didn’t mean to offend anyone when recounting my visit to the general Shotts area and I didn’t suggest Shotts is west cost, but coming from Dundee, I had never seen streets draped in red, white and blue.
I also think your comment is reasonable and hope I haven’t added fuel to any fire with my previous comment.
@ CameronB
I dont think you are wrong on this occasion mate but then again, you could argue that i’m biased slightly towards my own opinion 😉
I dont think independence for Scotland should be about ridding ourselves of any one group, no matter how stuck in the past or ignorant they are. It should be about dealing with what we are and not simply denying who we are.
To make references about people who have their own beliefs and attitudes that are different to yours or mine in the down right derogatory fashion that has been displayed here is tempting but nonetheless self defeating when we are trying to portray ourselves as a tolerant, worldly and inclusive society. As i said, no one here would dare say the same thing about Muslims for the union or Catholics for the union or indeed any other minority group for the union so i really feel we should all stop and consider for a moment why it is acceptable to do this against Protestants despite how idiotic, confused or ignorant they appear to be.
Whether we (or indeed the guy himself) likes it or not this is his country as much as it is anyones who lives and contributes here. His sense of self and his historical and institutional attachments are as valid and as real as anyone elses and to simply denigrate a whole section of our populace is counter-productive and somewhat hypocritical to an movement based on spanning all demographics and encompassing all social and political divides.
As for being guilty, i guess we are all guilty…. of being human 😉
That dude was staunch.
Anas Sarwar appealing to the lowest form of tribal hatred, Labour will abolish the anti-Sectarian laws for football matches, and a newspaper plays along with banner headlines.
There is an interesting document from the Council of Europe, A Manual on Hate Speech by Anne Weber, that has a lot of information that could apply to some of these headlines.
coe.int/t/dghl/standardsetting/hrpolicy/Publications/Hate_Speech_EN.pdf
Ah dont think the wee mans Mammy ( Jim McNab ) sung him any
nursery rhymes as a wain,I,ll send him the words tae Rock A
By Baby ( the winds of change blowing through Europe in the
1600 ) as somebody up the page said the man does’nt know
history ( & Orange History at that )as a X Secretary/Registar
( Royal Black Inst )Lecturer in both Inst. There are Band
followers,& church attending Orangemen/Women,I,ve been
out for over 25yrs ( punched the face of a District master/
Lodge master ) Twice times ) so dont take to much not notice
of that man.
I have no problem if they want to express there views in a open dignified way,they have a history they are pround of,and who am I to deny them.
The border line is when you abuse those with different views,whatever side
Soda
I agree, even though that might not have come across.
For years at Ibrox a small group called the Orange Order have lead the majority ordinary Rangers fans.
They lead with the thinking, which is that the Orange message is the only message. You are either in or out.
This minority lead with ALL the songs and the majority happily go along with it. They sing of walls that need to be guarded in Derry etc…
I would say to anyone that is caught up in this brainwashing to start to think differently. These people and their way of life are for another era.
It’s time to let go of that way of thinking. It’s for the past. It’s for Dinosaurs.
If it was to end up a NO vote, are the Orange Lodge going to pay for your children’s University Fees?
Are the Orange Lodge going to pay for your prescriptions?
They will not. You will be left with these bills and a lot more if you vote NO.
So the next time a fellow Bluenose tells you that a NO vote is the right way, have a real good think about what he has just told you to do.
Vote YES.
Anybody got a vid of Prof Neil Oliver on tthe wind of change
send it to Jim McNab ( Rocka Bye Baby ).
O/T AYE RIGHT LEAFLETS
The initial orders for 370,000 leaflets is on point of completion.
New orders of leaflets at £66/10K can be taken.
Contact gavinlessells AT yahoo DOT co DOT uk
caz-m
Prof Curtice is right in amongst the new poll and, with his usual caveats, pretty much sums up that the Yes vote is on the up and at a high.
By the time you are looking at a few percent it really is game on.
It also bears out what we are experiencing on the ground. There are a lot of people now saying Yes. What we need to do is encourage and enthuse those who are Yes. At the end of the day No is a dreary thing to trudge in and vote and it may be that many will leave it to others and if we can get our vote out we will win.
@CameronB
No worries at all…Soda put it perfectly into words I could not.
caz-m…I think the band is called The Blue Order at Ibrox… this made me laugh
The Blue Order: 2002-2014
The Blue Order was set up in 2002 by like-minded fans who wanted to see Ibrox return to being a stadium where every Rangers fan could take part in a fun, family atmosphere.
Little did we think that over ten years later, we’d still be bouncing away in the Broomloan Stand
Stay united, against separatism, don’t divide countries, …
The wee fella looking to leave Scotland sounds pretty much like George Galloway to me.
In this age of unionist public spending cutbacks, North Lanarkshire Council (which covers Wishaw) has managed to budget for an amazingly sized and brand new looking Union Jack flying in front of its Motherwell Civic Centre HQ. It also has a Saltire on a flagpole next to it but half the height of the UJ one.
@ CameronB
Naturally im glad you agree with me Cameron and sorry for the rather long winded comment, i just wanted to make myself understood lol
@caz-man9.07, Lab playing both ends against the middle its
not the 1st time they,ve played the Religious card.
Nth Lanarkshire Lab, vote SNP, get Catholic School closeurs,
we dont need to ban marches they will die out on their own
accord, young people are more savy, & have more to do with
their time.
Bye then, is all I can say. Used to have neighbours who played their Nationalism loudly, though most of it had to do with religion.
We can do fine without the Orange Order, the English are very welcome to the lot.
Oh and do not let them back when they find things tough there.
Was down in Glasgow for the Cup Final on Sunday, walking up Shettleston Road to our pub, passed 2 billboards and then grafitti further up, vote yes, then there was local activism with posters everywhere as well.
I am in no doubt that we will win this.
They aren’t going to know what has hit them.
Thanks for links to the good Professor.
He grudgingly admits that YES is on the move.
I wonder if he phones his best best mate Brewer at the beeb with these latest figures.
And will Newsnight Scotland report on it tonight.
Panelbase ‘full base’ / not weighted to turnout (which I consider rather dodgy as it is such an unknown) and with change since pre Osballs / dambusters:
Yes = 38.2(+4)%
No = 42.0(-4.4)%
DK = 19.8(+0.4)%
Gap = 3.8(-8.4)%
Looks like a direct swing from No to Yes which is to be expected. Panelbase No now matching TNS (41-42) and looking similar to Scotpulse (~41%).
O/T but i see my own council N. Lanarkshire, are to debate getting rid of COSLA on the 27th of March. Is this, along with the 7 or so other Labour controlled councils decisions to quit, linked to the plans by Labour to transfer power away from Hollyrood to local (labour controlled) councils instead?
I wouldnt say i was an expert regarding all of this by any means so if anyone has any thoughts on the subject i would love to hear from them.
link to aberdeencity.gov.uk Wishaw has a Saltire?! Here in Aberdeen there are no Saltires flying anywhere, by order. Even the word “Scotland” has been completely erased by unionist cooncilors from Aberdeen website, with much the same mind set as our friend up there. You’d think they had better things to do, like bankrupt bonny Aberdeen with huge oeverspends on a new £100 million+ council office they have no money for, garbage architecture, lousy roads etc.
Ronnie Anderson
If Scotland wants to be taken seriously as a civilised nation , then we need to get rid of this mind-set that EVERYTHING revolves around religion.
This bigotry has to go, along with “see you jimmy hats”
There has been talk of the fear that should the Republicans gain power in Northern Ireland ( the exodus of young protestants reducing the unionist voting power) that more of the extremists will head to Ayrshire like Mad-Dog Adair.
If we vote YES, will they all go to England instead?
F.A.O. anyone who might be interested in Trade Union Referendum Debate from last week, with Richie Venton of SSP:
youtube.com/watch?v=pSwBRQ-0y40
@heedtracker
Its just as well there isnt a big Robert the Bruce statue in Aberdeen, that would be terrible for that nice wee Council up there!
😉
Hi Caz-m,
I totally agree with the sentiment behind your post at encouraging Rangers fans to think about their vote.
However, I think you will be shocked at how many Rangers fans will vote YES in Sept. Please don’t be fooled by the likes of the Blue Order and a number of grown men and gullible kids doing the “bouncy” for ninety mins at the bottom of the Broomloan Stand.
I have a large number of friends from both parts of the city and all but one of my Gers friends are YES supporters. The crazy thing is that the majority of my Celtic mates are NO. Of course there is rampant unionism so if you go to support the football team it is not worth the hassle of starting with politics at the football but trust me there will be large sections of our support that will marking YES on their box.
Grassroots support, Rev, Social Media, Information etc will win us the day in six months. Always remember though we are on the right side of the argument but they will bring 1.3m to the booths to vote against their own country and they will reflect the entire cross section of the Scottish public not just one football club.
Loaded questions, staged location.
Who made this film and where’s the rest of the footage?
@heedtracker
Two Saltires flying above the Douglas Hotel on Market Street 🙂
I have to agree with Bigheed to an extent. Most of the Rangers fans i know are mostly YES or are sympathetic towards YES whereas a greater proportion of Celtic fans (even some within my own family, i’m a unchristened atheist…the wife is a non practising Catholic) are not so much pro-union but their Labour leanings and as a result ingrained hatred of the SNP seems to be swaying them towards a NO vote.
It is a truly unexpected and paradoxical condition. Or perhaps i was being naive in the past thinking a lot of Celtic fans and Catholics would be more republican in their outlook. Not that the SNP are inherently republican… perhaps they are just not catholic enough lol
@caz-man cant disagree with you there, we live day by day, all religions all colours,as we have always done,& I doupt if McNab only speak,s,or lives soley amongst protestant,s.
further to my other posts , It was Malcolm Chisholm MSP Lab,
who proposed banning Sectarian marches not SNP, Sarwar
suffers memory loss when conveinient ( unlike myself )oot &
in like a light bulb.lol
Scottish Skier, what are the tables saying about likely to vote?
Is it similar to the IPSOS MORI? No being 70 odd %?
What are figures when you take that into account?
O/T to the person that posted the Ian Hamilton QC video, thank you. I found this to be one of the most emotive reflections yet, simply wonderful.
@Soda
Ive had countless arguments with fellow celtic fans, especially on Twitter ( the fcraziest being with Terry Kellys daughter!). Some celtic fans, as you says cant see passed Labour. Some also buy into the fear generated by folk like George Galloway ( No i dont know why either) that the SNP are bad news for catholics purely because one former leader was a bit of a dick.
Its been a long long road to get this far, hopefully one day soon enough we can all listen to astonished future generations ask “Really?” when we tell them how sad things used to be.
Robert the Bruce’s statue is a hundred years old. Stunning as it is, my unionists Councillors just lashed out over £100 million on their new Marischal college offices, still rented from Aberdeen uni too. If you visit try finding any reference to the fact that their shiny new office is actually located in a region called Scotland.
Meanwhile in Saltireless Aberdeen, the waiting list for Aberdeen council house is over a decade long and rent for family sized homes is fantastically expensive. Councillor Willie Young, the dude that banned SNP Scots.gov from Aberdeen city council property, is a millionaire landlord here in Aberdeen and no doubt the total lack of council new build housing means sky high rent prices which is surely a happy coincidence, if your a millionaire landlord/councillor.
If you ask a unionist Aberdeen Labour councillor why they will not build social housing they say they have no money, buy a snazzy new house frae Stewarty Milne, shut up and vote No.
I wonder if this Britnat will be in Stirling this year to cheer on the British boys in UK Armed Forces Day. If you believe the Wright Stuff then apparently 640,000 of them will be leaving Scotland.
Haste yae pack.
“Did I hear correctly when Osbourne said the deficit would turn into a surplice by 2018/19 ?”
That may be closer to the truth than you think!
I take it you meant “surplus” and not a religious garment?
My home town has both Bruce and Wallace statues and a shameful council not fit to stand within a 1,000 miles of them.
@Soda says
Its all being orchestrated by new initiative ‘Revolting Labour’ (aka We hate the SNP). Still cannot accept the ass whipping at last election and they will ruin ‘Scots’ to get back at the SNP, (at all cost – even potential voters, in the pocket).
Labour councils (Aberdeen mainly) want to pin blame on the Scottish Government for lack of funding (which is actually a Westminster shortcoming for the moment). If they can get the SNP to let them raise Council Tax then its win /win. Bad for SNP good for Labour. Look how pathetic they have been claiming a Labour victory over Bedroom Tax, when SG have a majority anyway and don’t need their votes.
Its so childish, by leaving COSLA they think they are creating a civil ‘coup d’etat’ and will be able to strangle Holyrood, we’ll see.
Look how recent events turned out in Aberdeen for Messrs Crockett & Young (Lab councillors / massive climbdown). In the central belt thats known as a total ‘Arse collapse’, perhaps someone can help with the ‘Doric’???
@Square Haggis @9.40a.m.
CYMRU/Wales !!! HELP! Going to prepare the boiling oil and tar mix for the Shotton/Chester border barricades!
Can’t there be a small piece of off-shore land somewhere they can have to declare their independence – can’t ALBA at least give them Gruinard Island to keep them (deathly) quiet!
Instead of setting up an Oil Fund when we regain our independence perhaps we ought to set up a ‘Send Our Surplus Idiots Abroad’ fund.
I would gladly contribute to that and happily convey them to the airports and rail stations.
@The Rough Bounds
Surplus?…is there an accepable quota for idiots? ( wonders how many members of SLAB there are)
@ Desimond
Why is that mate? It would be perhaps to easy to explain it by a comparison with how strongly religion (it would seem to an outsider) plays a part in most aspects of a Catholics life. That unquestioning adherence to the faith that is educated into them from birth, all thru school and beyond.. into marriage etc. It is obviously far to simplistic a reason for why so many Catholics adhere to the Labour line, more so than Protestants (purely in my own experiences you understand)
What do you think is a more probable cause? Does the fact the most Catholics historically came from and even today live in the more urban and dare i say it poorer areas of West Central Scotland have something to do with it? Is it a class system throwback? A “never question the man attitude” so prevalent amongst the so called lower classes?
Please let me assure you mate that i dont think this mindset is by any means exclusive to Catholics. My own granny was a poor wee orphaned Protestant born in 1907 and lived in disgusting deprivation and poverty all her life but it was from her i first heard the insulting and defamatory attacks on the SNP back when i was a child in the early 70s.
How do guys like that cope with Ally McCoist being a Yes? (or was that Twitter thing a wee while back faked?)
“Labour councils (Aberdeen mainly) want to pin blame on the Scottish Government for lack of funding” but you have got to see how Aberdeen unionist councillors squander mountians of money to really appreciate why no council tax rise is so popular.
There’s only one bridge into Aberdeen off the dual carriage way and its 400 years old. For our roads they bought digital road signs at half a million quid a pop and they say stuff like put your sear belt on. They’ve let the usual mega rich “developers” build huge noddy box estates miles from Aberdeen with virtually no public transport to and fro which sums up just how awful they are at planning anything at all that might allow Aberdeen to grow and develop successfully. Or just ask billionaire Ian Wood how it works with dealing with unionist labour nut cases like Willie Young and Davey Crokkett.
@Soda
I think its all fading thank God(says the Athiest)
I think it harks back to Labour being seen as the Trade Union Party by workers for working classes…the hope was supporting Labour would help lift working classes up..which it did but now the Labour Party have morphed into something else and help only themselves. That didnt stop generations telling kids that it was Labour who was on their side.
The social rise of Irish Cathiolic in Scotland has also helped although i think parity was only achieved in 1991 so its been a long road but again positive steps
The SNP had Anti-Catholic perception troubles thanks to the Willie Wolfe issues( link to davidtorrance.com ), proving one bad apple could spoil a barrel, which still gets quoted today by some older Labour-minded and close minded folk. It may also contribute to the anti Salmond resentment which to most of us are deemed totally unfounded. The article link above covers it all very well and shows progress made.
With each year, and each SNP success ( and each Labour disaster or abandonment of social policy) we are getting away from those old alliances, it will still be a while to get to the end but we are getting there for sure.
Desimond says:
is there an accepable quota for idiots?
Yes. One per village.
(Westminster has a special exemption.)
Forget the road and miles to Dundee, I’ll gie this guy a Cuddyback tae Carlisle.
My God Ronnie, I had to look that up in Wikipedia.
If memory serves, Willie Wolfe eventually converted to Catholicism. It’s a funny old world. We had friends in common and I was occasionally in his company (this was long after his sojourn in the SNP). He seemed quite a sweet person.
@ Desimond
Thanks for the read mate. I had heard of this but was a bit low on detail.
The danger here is alienating any group. Altho the vast majority of Protestants in Scotland arent as, lets say, enthusiastic as the man in the vid it would be a shame if any person from a Protestant background (within the microcosm of the west central Scotland or without) who was genuinely undecided propelled towards no because of reading sentiments of a derogatory nature towards someone they share an affinity with (however backward and ignorant that someone appears to be)
This in a way brings me back to the point i made about other groups not being treated this way and the very real danger in vilifying of a whole group of people who may very well decide which way the referendum will go.
We should be engaging everyone, even those who appear bigoted, perhaps them even more so.
“Haste yae pack.”
Ha ha ha love it 🙂
@Soda
Yip..you summed it up perfectly in your initial posting earlier. lets put the ALL in ALBA. Lets get everyone involved, we can show them the light as the discussions progress 🙂
I know the Rev frowns on poems and song lyrics but this seems too pertinent to the current discussion about sectarianism etc to ignore.
Written by the late Davy Steel.
Scotland Yet (Davy Steel)
Gie nou a thocht tae whit we hae
In this land o the leal
The Heilan glen, the Doric stream
The fertile Lawlan field
Thae seem tae offer different views
Whan luikt on frae within
Can strangers be the only eyes
Tae see us aa as ane?
The choice will be upon us sune
Tae shape our destiny
We’ll drink a toast tae Scotland yet
Whitever yet may be
Our mither tongue spoke different weys
That past tae present ties
Each separate an yet entwined
That’s where our real strength lies
But should one strand unwind itsel
The ithers tae forsake
Then aa wad be forever lost
For aa the strands wad break
While we still seek tae blame our woes
An pains on someone else
We’ll never hae the strength tae solve
Our problems for oursels
In truth we’ve focht each ither mair
Learn this frae our past
Then together we can choose
For oursels at last
The choice will be upon us sune
Tae shape our destiny
We’ll drink a toast tae Scotland yet
Whitever yet may be
Ronnie Anderson
If Scotland wants to be taken seriously as a civilised nation , then we need to get rid of this mind-set that EVERYTHING revolves around religion.
This bigotry has to go, along with “see you jimmy hats”
I’m no fan of bigotry but I hate those hats with a passion beyond belief.