Take, take, take, take, take, take, take
Posted on
January 23, 2015 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
Tonight’s Question Time for some reason featured a question about the SNP, which Labour, Lib Dem, Tory and UKIP representatives got to discuss at length with nobody from the SNP (or even from Scotland) there to respond. It was an enlightening insight into England’s attitude to the Scots as a whole, not just the SNP. Here’s how it went.
We recommend all of it, but UKIP’s Paul Nuttall is the star, from 3m 42s.
.
If any SNP representative uttered such rasict twaddle there would be a media bloodbath like you have never seen. But suck it up “jocks” get back in yer box.
Is it really TRUE?
I mean is it really true that Paul “I’m a real nutter” Nuttall is actually in reality a secret agent working on behalf of the S.N.P. ?
How can these people be scared of the SNP but happily vote in UKIP? Mental.
And we give nothing back! Don’t forget that,
Aye, and the impartial BBC allowed it to be broadcast unchallenged. Utter scum.
I wish Paul Nuttal was a star,preferably one with a Douglas fir rammed up his Khyber.What a dick.
Sorry “RACIST” so angry into my third large glenfiddich
Talking about the SNP without an SNP representative? That’s bad enough.
Talking about the Scottish government without anyone from the Scottish government? That’s worse.
Talking about anything to do with Scotland without a Scot on the panel? That’s a complete and utter disgrace.
Did someone slip us DevoMax without us noticing? UKIP are beyond mental. How can anything think “Yup, those guys are rational and will run my government fairly and equally”.
With every vile, contemptible utterance they bring independence a day closer.
“That vote was a unanimous vote, it was 10%”
And that wasn’t the dumbest statement made…
In fairness, a couple of them understood the folly of such yammering.
But understanding the situation and not challenging it doesn’t make any of them less culpable.
I sense something; a presence I’ve not felt since…
Superb although Esther’s nonsense about everyone on the planet voting No or something even had Fallon holding his head in his hands
Nemo me impune lacessit
I watched this. Yes, I know. But my other half was worried about not paying the licence fee.
I want to go on Question Time and tell them. If we are so much of a burden, so needy, and all we do is take, take, take… then why do you lie to make us stay part of the Union?
Surely if this is how you feel you would only be too delighted to see the back of us.
A total disgrace of a programme.
Nice.
Oh Dear.
This is typical of how the EBC think of Scotland. I growled when that Tory woman said “Dundee Cake” for a second time.
It’s time to get off yer arse, we really should not be submitting to this. We are not their servants, we are a nation.
It’s a slap in the face they need before they will recognise that.
Let’s slap their face hard on 7th May 2015. Cheeky bastards.
Yeah watched this earlier. Says it all about UKIP really. It undoubtedly shows the normal attitude the English establishment and sadly the English politico’s attitude to Scots in general. What a condescending F***wit Ester McVey is – stupid and ignorant – disgusting!!!
Apparently, BBC Question Time will have someone from S.N.P. on in a couple of weeks, don’t know from where. Two things spring to mind here.
a) I hope it is in Scotland, Glasgow say
b) Paul “I’m a real nutter” Nuttall is one of the panellists. (Well it will have been two weeks since a UKIP appearance so he would surely slip straight in without any problems.)
I would just LOVE to see the nutter try and get out of Glasgow unscathed.
I think the English Mask is starting to slip.
Perhaps we are not really Better Together after all.
” they, they, they…” hardly the united family language of better together. The undercurrent of colonial attitudes pervades the whole panel, and the BBC employee allows it to go unchallenged.
In the referendum, what was voted for was a continuation of this. Surely enough NO voters are now seeing stuff like this with shame. Surely even the dimmest No voter can also see the mainstream media rallying behind Murph in an obvious, propagandist attempt to set him up as a viable opponent to this ‘English superiority’. It’s obvious that he’ll be as compliant to it as is necessary to further his career and keep the expenses rolling in.
This clip in indicative of the horrible bed the No voters have made, which sadly we all have to lie in. Shame on every last one of them.
I still can’t believe that we voted David Coburn into the EU,wonder what his thoughts on this are.
The SNP proposed to take all Scottish MPs out of Westminster and never bother them again. They lied and threatened us and latterly bribed us not to go, with fine words about all one family and so on.
So now they don’t like the idea of Scottish MPs voting on English-only legislation. Funny, they don’t seem to mind it when Mundell does it, or Murphy or Alexander (either one) or Curran or Sarwar or Kennedy or any of that lot.
So have I got this straight? It’s fine for Scottish MPs to vote on England-only legislation, so long as they’re not SNP. But if we decide, democratically, to elect a significant number of SNP representatives, then our representatives should become second-class citizens and be barred from exercising their votes?
Is somebody explaining this to Better Together and do they still think we are?
UKIP are a very ugly party. That was horrendous.
I’m not a fan of Labour, but I can’t help but like Diane Abbott. God knows what she’s doing with that crowd. I just don’t get it.
John Walsh says:
23 January, 2015 at 1:12 am
Sorry “RACIST” so angry into my third large glenfiddich
You should not be drinking Glenfiddich, John – Glenfiddich gave £150K to Better Together.
My blood is still boiling. All the old crap was trotted out, as if the referendum debate had never taken place.
1. Nationalism is dangerous (we’re all racist Nazis)
2. Take, take, take, take… The subsidy myth AGAIN
3. We shouldn’t be allowed to vote on English issues – never mind the fact that Westminster has been voting on Scottish issues for 3 centuries, and still wants a veto over these new ‘powers’.
Grrr!
I shouldn’t have tuned in, I knew it wouldn’t be good for the blood pressure.
@Morag
Certainly Gordon Brown isn’t going to stand for being a second class citizen.
But Murphy is / And Murphy also isn’t (delete according to your choice from the MSM), apparently.
So they tell us we are useless scroungers but they want us to stay anyway because they just love us & want us all to be one big happy family. Then as soon as the vote is in they suddenly start talking about EVEL a.k.a. English Nationalism and now they are somehow pissed off when want to vote
Are they to ban all those not on the HS2 route from voting because it doesn’t concern them?
They really are mixed up bunch but not to worry as JasU says:
With every vile, contemptible utterance they bring independence a day closer.
I’d just love it if the SNP got a shedload of seats and that was used to drive through EVEL legislation. Which shut out the non-SNP Scottish MPs of course. And which everyone would know wasn’t going to be repealed in 2020 even if Labour did get back in big in Scotland.
They’re playing a blinder here. I just don’t understand why the referendum was pretty much thrown away from lack of these sorts of tactics. It’s the same people we’re talking about.
One must assume that Mr Nuttall is referring to the amount of shite delivered by Westmonster. We mate, no more we’ve seen through you.
Was that British or English nationalism on display there? Whatever, apart from DA, they all exhibited an easy, gut instinct, bellyfeel about their comments, don’t cha think?
Was that a test to see if a ‘two minute hate’ would work? Was DD suggesting the entire UK should get to vote on Scotland’s future constitutional settlement?
Had there been any Scots on the panel,
they might not have spoken so freely
and we would have been denied the pleasure
of listening to how they really feel about Scotland.
So much better than watching them lie.
Watched it first time round. I’m still stunned.
To be fair, Paul Nuttall obviously has a brain thing wrong with him, so it’s wrong to laugh.
It is surely obvious now to all Scots whether they voted Yes or No that the opinion of the people of Scotland means nothing.
We are subservient and will do as we’re told. Fuck that!
Karmanaut says:
UKIP are a very ugly party. That was horrendous.
I’m not a fan of Labour, but I can’t help but like Diane Abbott. God knows what she’s doing with that crowd. I just don’t get it.
In fairness to Diane Karmanaut she is the M.P. for Hackney in East London and therefore never really had much of a choice of political parties to join … Labour … Tories … or Lib Dems.
Nowadays she would also have the choice of the Greens but I don’t think they were really much of a party at the time she took up politics and of course everyone’s favourite party … UKIP
Oh dear, this is indicative of just how the level of ignorance regards the whole political machinations of the so called uk functions, or doesn’t. Most people are so ignorant of how things actually work, and it suits the English boys and girls elite down to the fg ground!
The delusion is so damaging, that when reality hits, westmonster might find a few folks knocking quite hard on their corrupt, fraudulent, lying scheming doors with no exit. Hmmm.
Judging from these posts, I’m glad I ditched my licence so I wasn’t watching.
Esther McVey is known in England as McVile-right hand person to Ian Duncan Smith at DWP-architects of welfare reform, sanctions etc.
Diane Abbott might have come across as reasonable but don’t forget she was part of the Murphy 1,000 nurses spat when Murphy was trying to prove he was independent of London Labour. Diane is very like Jim with the softly spoken tones cultivated so they appear calm, rational & intelligent. She is better at it than Murphy though
These people are to be pitied rather than criticised. They’re like demented sheep, poked and prodded and confused. It’s quite surreal watching that, not having had a TV for years.
Is there some vast social experiment going on down south to test how stupid you can make people?
Almost seven years in London now and I’ve met them all, Labour, Tory and UKIP voters that you couldn’t put a ciggie paper between them when it comes to Jock-bashing. They all seem to be cloned ie. over 50s, middle-class income, angry at whatever the Daily Mail tells them to be angry at.
But then they despise anyone that’s not like them. My straight-talking Yorkshire mate gets right to the point, he says [when they talk about Scotland] ‘they like the scenery but they don’t want the people that goes with it’.
Thing is whichever way they turn they feel they are being threatened, whether it’s the Jockos, foreigners, terrorists, islamists, fat people, young people, Greens, Lefties, the poor and downtrodden, the homeless, crisis-NHS, more bloody foreigners. This lot in Middle Englandshire are force fed on a daily basis that everything is against them, the squeezed middle (thanks Ed), they believe it because they feel they have more to lose than anyone else… cue victimhood.
Of course it is all distraction from the real crooks that are having an adverse effect on their livelihoods and pensions, namely Westminster and the corrupt financial system it supports. And yet it’s Middle Englanshire who feel hard done by the most: ‘you know I had to downsize from a BMW 3-series to a VW Golf GTI last week, isn’t life terrible’. That’s the sort conversation opener that gives the unemployed, poor and homeless a kicking over brunchies at eleven.
There’s just no reasoning at all anymore, the one-time altruistic citizens of The Good Life are now Mr and Mrs Angry Taxpayer lashing out in the most reserved way possible, seething in front of the telly tightening the grip on the remote as they ‘tut tut’ and nod in agreement at right-wing shouty populist. One thing for sure the MSM know their audience very well.
In the end though, they get they governments they deserve.
Is it just me or is there a sense that they’re just a tad p****d off ???? We’ve had this sad excuse of a union telling us what we can and can’t do for the last 307 years, we have only suggested what we may or may not do after the GE and they are squealing like pigs. Isn’t it just the best fun watching them squirm. I can hardly wait to see this corrupt union die a slow and painful death. It would’ve been easier to just allow Independence to happen, they must be wishing they’d not interfered with the Scots…who said politics was boring, I’m soo enjoying this ????
You’ve just got to hope all the NOs see these type of exchanges and start to wake up to how we’re thought of in our Better Together paradise of love and affection.
I love it when they always say “i’ve been to Scotland” coz you know then that they really and truly understand us, it’s a bit like David Attenburgh realizing dolphins have a language and explaining that they’re really quite intelligent for swimming mammals.
We are obviously reasonably clever even though we like to eat, i think it was re-heated Dundee cake or something, i was busy wiping the tears away at that moment
What it does show however on a serious note is how afraid and jealous they really are, pumped up more by a willing media because the opportunity to raise fear and alarm in the English and a good dose of racism can’t be passed up, it makes good telly, Political Big Brother if you like. Lets join together in our hatred of the Scots and their SNP, forget about the nasty foreigners this week, band together against the common enemy…
“Scotland the take”… i feel another song coming on
None of these people seemed to understand the issues that were at the heart of the referendum. Paul Nuttall came across as a stereotypical ukip windbag, spouting nonsense and inaccuracies, and Esther McVey proved she is politically inept. Clearly she failed to understand Nicola Sturgeon’s point that many English issues will indirectly affect Scotland and she doesn’t realise that a %10 majority does not equal a unanimous decision. Also, her inability to grasp the fact that only people in Scotland voted in the referendum was laughable. Well done David Dimbleby for not letting her away with that one.
This was a set up tonight to combat the fact that draft legislation was published today. Swinney, Hosie & Nicola & Angus mcNeil have all been making headlines in the papers about the watered down proposals.
Making the last question one on Scotland, the question & comments everyone will remember as the programme ends was designed to stick in the audience’s minds & reinforce the nasty nats meme forged by Westminster & pumped out through BBC & MSM day in day out for the last 30-40 years in England.
The last thing any of them want is to see/hear SNP MP’s in the debates or in Westminster because they know that the things SNP does for Scots is what rUK listeners would want for their own families. WM have created a problem for themselves by monstering nats with the aim of destroying them. Their calculations were way out on that on & as SNP messages resonate with UK voters, folks will know they’ve been lied to for years. There will be a backlash & WM knows it.
The editor of The Independent admitted that WM are frightened of the SNP.
They have stirred the Hornets’ Nest and now don’t know what to do to prevent the stings.
They do not like it up ’em. They DO NOT like it UP ‘EM!!!
Ah, there’s that English over inflated sense of self importance showing again.
It probably never entered their heads that people in Scotland actually own television sets and if we did we would be completely dazzled by their towering intellect.
No voters need reminding that this is what they voted for.
Well that’s something else the SNP has taken tonight, Kircaldy East council seat has been taken by the SNP from Labour in a by-election.
SNP share of the vote gain 8%
Labour share of the vote loss 41.4%!
Turn out may be the main factor but still, 41%..WOW!!!
Did anyone really expect anything different? Westminster is running scared and knows it will fall. Very soon. As for UKIP that is a very dangerous party for any true English person to follow. Nazis in all but name
Question time:
We are ALL thick, selfish uneducated bums (even the PSUDO Middle class scum and Loyalist O/O)
There you go NO voters there’s what your hero’s think of you, ar’nt you proud?
Why don’t these ignorant snobbish racist bastards just cut us loose to fester away in our own shit?
Why do they want to hang on to us, nead some white kafirs around to make them feel superior.
The end is nye THANK F***.
Dianne Abbott and the Lib guy were black affronted Dimbumby having set the hare running tried to take the bile out of it. To take the very bad look away from his show. The EBC OWE AN APPOLOGY. BIG TIME!
To be fair to the panelists they do get their news from the same people we do. Anyway, as someone who’s called for the SNP to disengage from the BBC I thought it all went rather well.
There’s a lot of people on here who still seem to hold out some hope that No voters can now ‘surely see through the lies’, as if they’re going to have some damascene converion. They won’t because they don’t care about you. When will people wake up to this fact?
Oh just to say, that the figures I saw for the drop of 41% for labour seem to have been from 2012 to now, so the drop from the last election will be less.
@Morag
You hit the nail on the head about the attitude to SNP voting if you are not a Unionist MP you should not vote! . I had a bizarre Twitter exchange at lunchtime yesterday with @SpinningHugo
Hugo:
If you support the union, then Scots voting on rUK matters involves no hypocrisy. (see also Sinn Fein).
Me:
So it’s OK Scot Unionist MPs 2 impose tuition fees on rUK; but not for those opposed to WM 2 vote either way?
Hugo:
Exactly. Which is why the SNP has been absolutely right (until now). You can’t oppose something and then do it yourself.
After watching Ch4 interview it started to dawn on him…
Hugo:@ On that (wholly new) basis we should have no devolution as all Scottish spending decisions inevitably impact rUK.
Worthwhile posting this article to our European media and further afield, we had a lot of support from other countries by what the columns of exPats wrote in The National and UK not well thought of in many countries anymore, I’m sure they’d love to see the real ugly face of BBC media and the unionist politicians..let the world see what a bunch of racists they are towards their neighbours.
Better Together
walofs
HOW many times now has Dimbleby chaired a programme like this and he and the BBC have allowed the broadcast? This was bad though, and they really have a lot answer for. Like others (I agree) – I just hope many BTs saw this.
The unbridled contempt is scarey.
Draft Scotland Clauses 2015
20
4.The Scottish Ministers may not exercise the function of making regulations to which this section applies unless—
(a) they have consulted the Secretary of State about the practicability of implementing the regulations, and
(b) the Secretary of State has given his or her agreement as to when any 5 change made by the regulations is to start to have effect, such agreement not to be unreasonably withheld.
We,ve went from £1200 to £1400 now £1600 per person subsidy from Engerland,were realy no worth the money, let us go , let us go,and give us our OIL/GAS REVENUE.
Another attack on the Scottish people but there again it is broadcast by the Bbc,I hope that the people of the No vote persuasion were watching,there must be some of them with Scottish Pride,use the loaf people.
What is the point of Question Time if misinformation is just reinforced? I know, it’s the BBC and that’s what they do (or are for). Could you imagine a Scottish politics programme coming up with shite like this against the English?
DD had a feeble attempt to say the SNP would vote on NHS issues because it had a knock-on effect but other than that the implication is the SNP are going to vote on all English-only matters which is simply not the case. And the’re doing it out of spite too!
This was just the same old Unionist spin and denigration that we are so used to by the BBC.
Someone above said it already – don’t expect No voters to get all riled by this; a sizeable amount don’t give a shit because ‘I’m alright Jack’. With others Dimbleby could shite through their letterbox & they’d still sing Rule Britannia. Blinkered doesn’t cover it.
Soooooo, we’re still subsidy junkies then?
Weapons grade fuckwittery all round. Politicians, one or two of whom actually know the funding and constitutional situation, still spreading the manure in an attempt to whip up their own support through anti Scottish feeling.
Tired and jaded I know, but did it not strike anyone in that audience that with true devo max or independence that they wouldn’t be ‘giving’ Scotland anything anymore? That there would be no more problem of Scots voting on English only issues? That Scotland would be financing itself?
Truly, utterly depressing just how many were prepared to applaud anything which was a soundbite against Scots. Worse! They were still trotting out the same utter horseshit that the referendum was all about the SNP.
Arrogant, condescending, inane, shallow, racist nonsense. The politics of the mean of spirit and utterly ideologically crippled. If I want any of that I’d subscribe to the mail. As for Mr Farron and his continued insistence that we’re all one country? Oh Jeez, where would you start on that?
No sonny we’re a unitary state, a partnership under treaty an’ some of us think the terms of that treaty need rearranging. On evidence of what we’ve just seen, long overdue rearrangement.
Thought the audience didn’t like what was being said though?
Hoping that they saw the raceist overtones!
Or am I being to optimistic ?
Dimbleby and the BBC set this up. As Dimblby asked the question he had a snigger on his face. The are manipulating the mood in order to create significant tension when a SNP representative does appear on the programme.
The nationalism of the UK is good. Warmongering force projecting legacy of an Empire is to be celebrated. However a national wishing to have a fair society is bad.
The London elite want us to stay OK providing we do so as quiet second class citizens.
The LibDem rep Fallon was every bit as bad as Nuttal.
This proved to me just how critical a strong SNP representation at Westminster is!
Good old Paul Nuttall, killing UKIP Scotland in its infancy forever and wrecking whatever credibility they had left among English people with any sense. I wonder how Wee Davie Coburn feels about Nuttall’s claim that we just “taich, taich, taich, taich, taich, taich, taich”? Probably approves, patriot that he is.
And wot had Murph’s publicity food bank posing have to do with the vote?
Ukip knows all about take take take. Just ask the EU parliament.
The SNP is funded by it’s members. The Unionst Parties are funded by Hedge funds. Evil Max.
Lie, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies.
Ah! QT HAS NOTHING ON W@ONE. Consider Tory Defence Minister Anna Soubry appearing to threaten the person of First Minister Sturgeon.
Anna Soubry on FM’s announcement on BBC Radio 4’s The World at One: “She puts our Union at risk again. I think she plays with dangerous stuff”
“She is playing into the hands of those people who get much more irate than I do about ‘English votes for English laws’. ”
alt Ire says
““That vote was a unanimous” vote, it was 10%”
And that wasn’t the dumbest statement made…
In fairness, a couple of them understood the folly of such yammering.”
1st the “unanimous 10% vote! eh?
does that mean by McViles calculator the next time the Tories are beaten by 10% it will be the settled will of the whole of the electorate we can expect to see them fold their tents and fuck off?
2nd Dont kid yourself Salt Ire that little shit from the lib dums was (attempting)to play both sides against the middle there and Abbot was searching for the door, shaking her head silently doesn’t cut it,
That clown from UKip should have been closed down and they all sat silently while he had his rant, noticeable that the applause from the audience was less than fulsome,
Would you like a wee Glasgow kiss wi yer (twice cooked) Dundee Cake there McVile?
I see though that Nutter, eh Nuttall trotted out the old 78rpm
one about £1600 more (eh I thought it was £1200, thats inflation for you, Buckfasts no cheap ye ken) than the poor downtrodden English, its a puir shame soinitis!
btw does anyone else think McVile has been to the “William Hague” school of speech making?
_______________________________________________________
Lesley Anne says
“I would just LOVE to see the nutter try and get out of Glasgow unscathed. ”
When there finished with him the only place he’ll be able to walk in a straight line is across the Squinty Bridge.
How long is it since the BBC have had a chance to tell us WHY its called the squinty bridge?
They must be getting withdrawal symptoms since the Commonmwealth games.
You could just see the wee thrill the London “luvvies” got explaining the oh so cute local colloquialisms, AT EVERY BLEEDIN OPPORTUNITY
__________________________________________
M4rkyboy says
“I still can’t believe that we voted David Coburn into the EU,wonder what his thoughts on this are.”
I can tell you right now he would be in 100% agreement!
Self awareness is not those creatures strongest suit.
___________________________________________________________
Rouge Coder says
“My blood is still boiling. All the old crap was trotted out, as if the referendum debate had never taken place.”
Revenge is a dish best eaten cold”
___________________________________________________
“I’m not a fan of Labour, but I can’t help but like Diane Abbott. God knows what she’s doing with that crowd. I just don’t get it.”
Dont be fooled by her Karmanaut, she’s one of the worst self serving opportunists in the labour party.
________________________________
Patrick Roden says
“Well that’s something else the SNP has taken tonight, Kircaldy East council seat has been taken by the SNP from Labour in a by-election.”
Woohoo!
whats that sound?
link to youtube.com
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I wish Liz.
If we’d heard crickets and saw tumble weed rolling after every anti Scottish, anti Scottish government soundbite …,
but we didn’t.
The problem is the government and media narrative which has been running at full tilt for several years in order to derail the independence campaign. Its taken deep root in the public consciousness. They truly do believe they fund us and that we’re asking for more than our fare share. We’ve become yet another scapegoat for Westminster’s economic incompetence. As far as many are concerned we’re right up there with their other pet hates of strange furren immigrants and the poor in general.
Convincing the UK public otherwise in the teeth of a media blockade is nigh on impossible. Only the actuality of a Scotland financing itself and asking for nothing of a Westminster parliament would bring the truth of the matter home.
Attitudes won’t change so long as Scotland remains a willing part of the lie.
“You should not be drinking Glenfiddich, John – Glenfiddich gave £150K to Better Together.”
Indeed not. Glenfiddich is politically toxic. Drinking it will damage your Nationalist credentials. I think you need to send it to me for safe disposal, John.
They really are stirred up by six MPs stating an intention to exercise their right in the parliament. Maybe all the parties from devolved UK countries should join with the SNP in solidarity. Scottish, Welsh and Irish Votes on English Laws.
They want EVEL, we tell them SWIVEL.
Patrick Roden wrote: “Well that’s something else the SNP has taken tonight, Kircaldy East council seat has been taken by the SNP from Labour in a by-election.”
.
They’re going to spin it as an SNP HOLD: “Move along now, nothing to see here”.
I starting to feel as if Im posting on the Scotsman,
my post goes up my post disappears,
whats going on?
Have I transgressed an unwritten law?
Is my head about to be nailed to a coffee table?
Scotland raises £53Billion+ in taxes. The rest of the UK raises £437Billion. Westminster borrows and spends approx £100Billion more (Trident/HS2/debt repayment) and puts £10Billion on Scotland’s bill. The Scottish Defict is £2Billion. A tax on ‘loss leading’ drink would cover it. Historically Westminster secretly, squandered a £220Billion+ Oil Fund. Illegal wars, banking fraud and tax evasion. Westminster secrecy and lies.
Dimbley likes to sail his yacht, viewers paid for, around Scotland.
And now its back again!
I swear Im losing my mind.
link to youtube.com
Lesley-Anne says:
“Apparently, BBC Question Time will have someone from S.N.P. on in a couple of weeks, don’t know from where. Two things spring to mind here.
a) I hope it is in Scotland, Glasgow say ;)”
The next three from the 29th Jan are Wrexham, Finchley and Norwich.
The majority of the rest of the UK are not keen on Trident/HS2, either.
Scott Borthwick says
“They want EVEL, we tell them SWIVEL.”
Dammit!
I knew I should have got up earlier.
And for our Russian friends.
link to tinyurl.com
Westminster increased Oil taxes 11% (£2Billion) in the 2011 Budget, losing Scotland £4Billion+ a year – £16Billion+.
MacArthur @6.28
Thought as much Hun
But I live in hope that our English cousins are better than their MPs or broadcasters and I really thought that audience tonight weren’t completely on board with the racesist guy
But..Hey…you are correct in you’re interpretation of that BBC set piece I can only say back to you that
“I WISH TOO” that one day they will wake up and see that parliament in it’s true colours as we do. x
Ian Watson BBC political correspondent suggests
“Im not sure the broadcasters have thought through their proposal to CRAM seven politicians into a studio for the televised debates”
How small are those studios?
and for that matter just how large are those politicians?
who invited you Jackie Baillie and Eric Pickles?
GET OUT.
The David Dumbeldore Q/T set must be massive,
have they considered remaking Cecil B DeMille epics on them?
link to youtube.com
Well done Marie Penman in Kirkcaldy East, despite the efforts of ex politician Broon and his pals, a fantastic SNP win:-)
liz g
Thought the audience didn’t like what was being said though?
Hoping that they saw the raceist overtones!
Or am I being to optimistic ?
If I was being kind, I’d suggest a good number didn’t like what they were hearing. If I was being less kind, I’d suggest a smaller number weren’t happy, but this was still enough to suppress the ‘attitude’. Not that I’m disagreeing with Macart about how the scrounger narrative is being used, IMO, to undermine the credibility of Scotland’s economy.
Westminster successfully kept us all British.
SNP Mps are BRITISH politicians. Restricting SNP MPs role in the British chamber will not only be hypercritical in our democracy but discrimination.
To balance the Union, England should have her own Parliament for her own laws. Just like the rest of the UK.
Imagine this kind of telly just before 18th Sept 2014. Its a long way from them begging Scotland to vote NO. England’s completely controlled Scotland for 300 years and as it’s started to lose control, this is the backlash.
The lying and extremely insulting LibDem buffoon chastising the lying and extremely insulting UKIP buffoon is really funny though.
This latest ‘Question Time’ helps throw into sharp relief a fundamental contradiction which exists between the ruling Westminster class and the rest of England’s 50 million population.
For while QT says one thing, Sir Nicholas McPherson states the exact opposite by assuring the great and the good at The Strand meeting, that Scotland is vital and winning the Referendum was an extreme necessity.
One does wonder does one, if the true value of Scotland to Westminster is known ONLY to Westminster.
In the same way that the McCrone Report was known ONLY to successive Westminster Governments.
Nah! It’s just my imagination runnin’ away wi’ me.
Better Together is a truism. But only, and solely, for the English.
I thought the LibDem bloke was more offensive in that someone who comes from a ‘liberal-thinking’ party should spout a whole lot of narrow-minded, uninformed nonsense, basically playing the old ‘nationalist = nazi’ card. Then he comes out with some remark about ‘knowing’ Scotland, because he ‘lives next door to it’. Eh?
Has it not sunk in down south as to what the Independence movement is really all about? This was, ironically, touched on by the UKIP bloke: no tuition fees, free prescriptions, free hospital parking. I’m sure many people in England will be scratching their heads, thinking, ‘hey, that actually sounds like quite a good idea!’.
was really impressed with DA. Murphy should take note. Looks like liebor are setting up to go minority with SNP help
@ Liz
“But I live in hope that our English cousins are better than their MPs or broadcasters”
They are, and by a country mile.
People really aren’t that stupid, but by and large you only know what you’re told and on a daily basis they are told just what poor neighbours we are. I don’t believe for an instant that the entirety of the UK believes what the media and politicians are feeding them about Scotland, but enough are divorced from our world in decision making areas and amongst specific demographics to make the odds. The narrative becomes a vote winner amongst those demographics. This of course is the real audience which was being played to last night by those on the panel ranging from the barking kipper to Mr Farron and his ‘country’ speech.
No, the vast majority of English people, I too believe, see through the utter nonsense on view last night. They’re good folks, badly governed. Our upside is that we have a way out.
@ Cameron
They were playing to a specific audience Cameron and jings didn’t they have their collective sound bites down pat?
I wonder if they attend classes?
That’s the BBC for you.
The programme was tainted – unfit for broadcasting.
With no SNP representative on the panel there was no way to offer a balanced debate. The question put to the panel was entirely inappropriate. Indeed, the panelists kept confusing the Referendum with the SNP, as if democracy is the sole ownership of Westminster.
What we witnessed was a typical kangaroo court where the racists get to say they we’re better united but without the troublesome Scots.
Shameful and shocking – naked racism.
The programme is made by an independent company but the BBC has the power of veto if executive producers think content inappropriate for broadcasting. The BBC broadcast it, nevertheless.
This is one serious transgression for the Broadcasting Complaints Commission to investigate…
Incredible ignorance but sadly a lot of English people truly believe this tripe! The media collude and conspire to perpetuate this view of the Scots and do nothing to correct the misinformation. The English are led to believe that they subsidise us and this creates a climate of resentment!
I’m angry but not at all surprised by this.
@Patrick Roden
41.4….or hopefully soon to be known as Murphys Constant
The UKIP-wallah has made the clearest case for Scottish independence I have heard for a long time.
If ‘they’ hate NS and AS so much – then let us go…
A gentle reminder to those talking about “the English”. They don’t share nasty attitudes any more than we do. That BBC & Dimbleby are nasty bits of work, like Nutall and Farron is no reason to copy them!
I’m sure the irony of a Liverpudlian saying “they take” seven times was lost on Nuttall.
O/T
Andy Wightman’s blog, showing how Scotland can use the Income Tax control to grow the economy;
link to andywightman.com
Remember Alex Salmond in the Liverpool QT show?
While some Little Englanders sleep walk into oblivion, others recognise fine when something is a beacon of hope rather than a dark greedy threat.
Last night SNP Marie Penman won the Kirkcaldy East bi-election. This is in the constituency of Gordon Brown (Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath)
We get a better understanding of Browns reason for standing down.
Not the best way to start the morning.
How many morons can you cram into a BBBC programme? – 6 + x
I really cannot believe that anyone viewing that set piece in any media outlet of Scotland cannot take offence on the part of the people of Scotland or can allow lie upon lie to trail on – where are you honest journalists?
I think the only good thing is that there are those cosy toed NO voters , trusting of Westminster and the BBBC , just might have had their blinkered wee peepers opened.
Where did all that LOVE go?
Better Together – my arse!
Macart
Are you suggesting a background search on the audience, to establish the involvement of any political activists, or counselors and such?
Grouse Beater
The taint of a corpse that refuses to lie down.
The problem with Question Time is you have to be a bit of a political anarak to watch it. In Scotland politically aware people tend now to be pro-Indy. Those less informed, more likely to retain UKOK ideas.
This clip should be compulsory viewing for everyone in Scotland! This IS UKOK.
Any chance Wingers can drop the infantile ‘Jockos’?
We get calls ‘Jocks’ and ‘Sweaties,”chippy,”bare arsed whingers,’ and I suppose Jewish among us can be accused of ‘kvetching,’ but self-styling our own insults – ‘Jockos’ – is beyond the pale.
Say it like it is. Don’t soften the blow with baby talk.
41.4%? Looks like Labour’s electorate are following their MPs and abstaining from voting…
Scots take and take and take? Take what? Is it Holyrood taking and taking and taking Lots of English oil? Oh wait! These English politicians (not English people) were acting very smug straight after the referendum last year, well guess what! You’ve got what you wished for, Scotland is still a part of the UK but what they didn’t bank on was the rise and rise and rise of the SNP that could potentially effect the course of UK politics as a whole. In their eyes, the UK is better together but Scotland should know their place in that relationship as should Wales and N. Ireland. Westminster may have won the referendum, but it could soon turn out to be a pyrrhic victory for the establishment parties. I should also point out that this absolutel lie of violent nationalism is just that: A total lie. I was at some of these Yes voter get together’s in Glasgow and the atmosphere in all of them is electric, completely buzzing with positivity. You’ll never hear that on the BBC. Also,when the No camp won, there was rioting on the streets of Glasgow but it was thugs draped in the Union Jack that were doing it – live feeds to the city centre of Glasgow available to anyone could witness it themselves. Because nothing says “I love my country” more than destroying a small part of it. Again, you would never that that on the BBC.?
I shouldn’t have watched that! its only really annoyed me.
Diane Abbott’s attempt to “stick up” for us – effectively “look, they’re not all haggis-munching Jocks who watch Braveheart all day while wearing their kilt, some of them voted Yes for proper reasons (although obviously they were WRONG, the naive idiots)” – reminded me of this Alan Partridge excerpt:
Alan: Yeah. I think the Irish are going through a major image change. I mean, the old image of Leprechauns, shamrock, Guinness, horses running through council estates, toothless simpletons, people with eyebrows on their cheeks, badly tarmacced drives – in this country, men in platform shoes being arrested for bombings, lots of rocks, and Beamish. I think people are saying “yes, there’s more to Ireland than this”. A good slogan for the tourist board – [does the bad Irish accent again] “Dere’s more to Oireland dan dis.”
Dimbleby did prove he’s still the king, in the final seconds of that clip! Unnatural, but sneaking regard for Diane Abbot also….
Nuttall seems to be reading his rant – If so this implies he knew the question was coming up – BBC must have told him – Bias in bringing question up and encouraging anti- Scottish feeling.
Would they do the same in reference to Northern Ireland politics ?
The BBC at its corrupt anti-Scottish best. Nothing that wouldn’t be expected from UKIP but the comments from the Willie Rennie clone, Tim Farron, were disgraceful. It’s going to be great waving the LibDems goodbye in May.
Thanks Rev for highlighting this. A bit sad really. I wish they would stop whinging. They wanted us to stay together and sadly didn’t understand or realise that we will not stop fighting against the injustices that bedevil the whole UK as well as Scotland. Mind you with the misinformation they are fed by MSM it is hardly surprising.
@manandboy
The same MacPherson that referred to Scotland being used as a labratory for taxation ideas…..similar to what Leon Brittan said regarding the poll tax…
More things change, the more they stay the same.
The blog about income tax from Andy Wightman is very interesting…they should do it.
Diane Abbott’s idea of the average Yes voter sounds more like Jim Murphy. Which just shows you that Jim Murphy has no idea what Scots are actually like. At least Diane has an excuse…
Scott Borthwick says:
Bravo!
As for Glenfiddich – from a purely personal taste point of view, you shouldn’t be using it for anything other than cleaning drains.
OT But the Herald is doing an Eleanor Bradford and claiming it campaigned for the NHS and writes to inform us how it undertook said campaign over years by regurgitating all criticisms.
Ain’t that helpful?
Arithmetic not Esther McVey’s forte – unanimous vote won by 10%
No wonder employment statistics are flawed
That’s a parallel universe if ever I saw one.
@ Cameron
No way Jose, would I question the selection process of Beeb. Moi?
The very thought.
I was thinking more the telly audience in this instance rather than the sit ins.
Manandboy at 8.02
This is the nub of it really. I like to use this argument as it encompasses all.
I love it when the RUkers go all “man in the pub”. They think they know what the country(their country) is feeling. It’s because they are fed the same media as us. Some of them are simply racist, some stupid and others genuinely not interested but affected by lie bombs.
My approach is always the same. I ask them if they are in fact privy to more information than the government of the day.
I ask them why on earth no RUK politician is asking for an English parliament. I ask them why no one has yet set up a rival to the SNP in RUK.
I ask them why it is vital, no, crucial that the RUK taxpayer pays for all of Scotlands “free stuff”.
I ask them what is the point in a union if it is not equal.
Uppity Jocks get loads of freebies AND get to make laws in their parliament and RUK politicians are ok with this?
Do these politicians know something that man in the street doesn’t?
I think that we all know the answer to that. At least 45% of Scotland does.
And growing by the day despite anything the media can throw at us.
It’s a strange tactic to quell the snp tidal wave – let’s big up Scotland’s influence if they vote snp.
Vile programme: makes me want to complain again to the bbc and get a reply back saying the panel were balanced and Dimbleby chaired it well.
May can’t come soon enough. As I said in the last thread: Nicola has them foaming at the mouth and she’s 2 months in. She’s barely started.
Poor audience have been fed this cack for years – no wonder it has sunk in. They’ve been conditioned.
Vow broken = referendum result null and void.
There only so much pish Scotland wil take take take take take take take and take.
Not only do that panel feel they are entitled to their opinions, they clearly believe they are entitled to their own facts! That’s what BritNats do, though. Their wee world is different from the real one everyone else inhabits.
Three good articles in The National on how Smith Commission proposals have been watered down
I just can’t understand why we sometimes make it so easy for this sort of crap about the 1600 (sic) quid to be spouted out with impunity.
Whenever this argument is brought up in talkshows, debates etc. we very seldom react with the fact that we first pay in 1700 quid.
Somtimes (seldom) it’s “Ah, but our revenue is higher”.
This is economist talk and not the short, sharp answer that most Joe Bloggs understand.
The second part of the equation is never hammered out.
We get 1400 quid but first pay 1700 which means WM is subsidised by Scotland to the tune of 300 quid. AND we can prove it.
As for the rest of QT, that was the ignorance of the English chatting to themselves about an unknown country far, far, far away up near the arctic circle beyond the “Wall”.
How embarrassing for the Better Together gang that the programme was broadcast north of the border!
Diane Abbott is one of the better ones with a dangerous habit of telling the truth from time to time. It is not Dimbleby’s job to contribute to the debate so he shouldn’t be expected to. He still bears the scars from a previous Scottish QT where he did so.
I think quite a lot of the audience were not at all impressed.
In general terms they are shitting themselves about an invasion of the SNP to Westminster. So far, so good. And the Kirkcaldy result is quite startling. How much longer had Murphy got?
Nuttall does accept the three amigos offered DevoMax as a referendum bribe. The three amigos themselves won’t admit it now.
But for heavens sakes, where did he get the notion that Scotland has been given anything like DevoMax?!
Of all the stupid ill informed things said in the clip, that has to be the daddy.
Schiehallion! Schiehallion! says:
“That’s a parallel universe if ever I saw one.”
Indeed!
Eat yer cereal..but not yer Dundee cake.
This, allied to the comments from the impartial Treasury about ‘people who threaten the fabric of the state’ and ‘impugn its territorial integrity’, seems to demonstrate that the establishment is heading full speed to a really ugly place..
“Patrick Roden says:
23 January, 2015 at 3:16 am
Well that’s something else the SNP has taken tonight, Kircaldy East council seat has been taken by the SNP from Labour in a by-election.
SNP share of the vote gain 8%
Labour share of the vote loss 41.4%!
Turn out may be the main factor but still, 41%..WOW!!!”
Patrick, I saw the figures on an SNP tweet. SNP were around 15 percentage points up, Labour about 15 percentage points down. I don’t know where your 41% comes from. A good result nonetheless.
Farron – “You ( Ukipper) talk about the Scottish people the way the SNP talk about English people”.
So wrong on many levels.
On the point about us take take taking.
It’s not true it’s the other way around. Westminster spends our money on infrastructure and weapons and Politicians an Civil servants IN ENGLAND. They then add it to our account and say “Look how much you have spent. We’ll just add that to your deficit”
There really is only one fair way to settle this. We need to be at least two separate and independent countries.
Isnt it great they hold us in such high regard lol. Just a few months back the same perfidious scumbags were on there knees pleading us to stay, now they show there true colours!!! Better Together? Surely that must be one of the biggest pisstakes of all time. Which has bought the moribund unworkable union some time but thats all, the writing is on the wall for it……………..tick tock.
Funny how I can live in Scotland and be welcomed, raise a family, enjoy the scenery, the customs and banter…and appreciate the many things Scotland has to offer. Being English, I see QT and am left with a sense of embarrassment re the ignorance of the political westminster ‘elite’. Dimbleby was setting Scots up to be mocked. My Scottish wife once wrote to Have i Got News For a You about the racist antiScots so called humour and got a snooty reply that offence should not be taken as it’s all in fun. That she should be less sensitive. I was outraged and my wife said, ‘that’s the crap I’ve had to put up with for the past 40 years. Now you know what Scots have to put up with.’ When I see Danny Slugface Alexander squirm on TV and say the Scots have HUGE new laws and SUBSTANTIAL news powers I want to bang his head on the floor and say You are being played for a fool by the WM establishment… I know many English folk who can see through this political shite and are turning to the Green Party.
boglestone: at 1:55 am
Aye boglestone, it’s called a Frontal Lobotomy, apparently its part of the UKIP indoctrination upon becoming a member (allegedly).
This is what UKIP want to do with the NHS. Once completed in the rest of the UK the Scottish NHS will be history… much like Scotland if we stay with the UKOK rotting corpse.
How many Scottish MPs have voted on “English” matters up to the year 2015? I would imagine all of them (apart from the SNP) including David Mundell. Does that not make them hypocrites for saying the SNP should abstain? And would a Scottish UKIP MP, heaven forbid, vote only on Scottish matters?
I have a feeling that the whole panel, like many people, ‘love Scotland’ – they just despise most of the people who live there. I’ve always thought if we cleared all the Glaswegians off into some kind of internment camp, we could have a nice golf course, country lodge, and introduce some grouse and deer.
“I still can’t believe that we voted David Coburn into the EU,wonder what his thoughts on this are.”
David Coburn? Thoughts? They certainly wouldn’t be rational. This is an openly gay man who campaigns against equal rights and same sex marriage, who claims that equality nazis in Labour and the Lib Dems will make gay sex illegal but that is all okay because he refers to himself with homophobic terms.
Yeah, David Coburn’s thoughts are going to be anything but sensible.
That QT though was awful. It just struck me as totally racist and I couldn’t see such a discussion being held if it was targeted at some other minority group.
I’m half English and have lots of English family and they do not think like those on Question time. I was disgusted by QT because it was the same old, same old BBBC trying to party politic.
They were at it again on call KAY with an E. I should have continued listening but couldn’t hack this women again. I heard the annoyance in her voice when any SNP like minded folk said their piece.
The BBBC Political Party are in full throttle now , so we have to work hard round the doors and give them the TRUTH (as we see it)
They don’t like us.
I was at the theatre in London last week. An anti Scottish joke didn’t just get a laugh,it got a round of applause.They really don’t like us.
Isn’t QT one of the few programmes funded by BBC Scotland?
An idiot called John on Call Kaye this morning, ranting about the SNP, how he “despaired” at his fellow scots, for continuing to resist after a decisive NO vote blah blah bah.
If he really wants to despair at his fellow countrymen and women, perhaps he should just watch last night’s QT.
I’m looking forward to that moment when many people in England (those who are still sleepwalking) wake up to the fact that the SNP is not about jingoistic flag-waving, or isolationism, or being anti-English, but about delivering a fair, decent and just society in Scotland – which can then be, hopefully, emulated/implemented by like-minded ‘radicals’ such as The Green Party in England as an alternative to the totally corrupt WM system that exists at present. This would be a powerful message to get across.
I still can’t believe BT had Obama ‘on their side’. If the guy only knew what, and who, he was siding with!
crisiscult says:
23 January, 2015 at 9:44 am
I have a feeling that the whole panel, like many people, ‘love Scotland’ – they just despise most of the people who live there. I’ve always thought if we cleared all the Glaswegians off into some kind of internment camp, we could have a nice golf course, country lodge, and introduce some grouse and deer.
“The trouble with Scotland, is that it is full of scots!”
[Edward I, Holywood version]
My Scottish wife once wrote to Have I Got News For You about the racist anti-Scots humour and got a snooty reply that offence should not be taken as it’s all in fun.
So, their claim to be the pre-eminant political satire show is bullshit.
All it is, is more puerile jokes.
I think they fancy a war
Lollysmum @ 2:27am
Yes, very correct. If the SNP get too much airtime, then people down south, in Wales etc might realise that they question ISN’T ‘why do these Jocks get free whatever’ but ‘why is there no will amongst the Westminster parties to give us these things as well?’. Scots deserve better, but so do all other ordinary citizens in the UK.
Why do UKIP people look like that?
As Lollysmum has said, don’t be taken in by Diane Abbot, she is of the Jim Murphy school, and colluded with him over the nurses stunt. She is running for Mayor, so everything is calculated, which is fine, but it’s all in her interest.
UKIP are dangerous bigots, and Nuttall was par for the course, and it was one of the party’s more polite performances. The clip is doing the rounds on FB.
Let’s hope lots of No voters see it.
It beggars belief we would support a Union that grinds us down so much, must be Stockholm syndrome.
Having no representatives from the SNP was actually a good thing.
It allows the unvarnished, unfiltered attitudes to be displayed.
Had any MSP from Edinburgh been on the panel, the entire room would have rounded on them & made them the problem.
It is then much better just to let the playground politics be broadcast so that anyone in Scotland who watches it, can see the true meaning of “Better Together”.
I’ve always thought if we cleared all the Glaswegians off into some kind of internment camp, we could have a nice golf course, country lodge, and introduce some grouse and deer.
The reason so many Glaswegians live on top of each other is land, mountain, and island outside the city is owned by the few.
The amount that is added to our account (supposed public spending ~by~ Scotland) varies each year.
Our accounts in GERS this year will look bad for Scotland due to the drop in oil revenues taken by Westminster.
So be prepared to be condemned as subsidy junkies all over again.
Nice UK. Nice culture.
Can I ask you all, or those that do this, but why on earth do you listen to Call Kaye if it pisses you off so much?
Surely turning off and not giving them the ratings would send a bigger message and might actually get them off the air?
Call me crazy.
With every passing day and every utterance from the establishment and it’s pathetic servile “proud scot but” scum, my respect for the IRA grows, and coming from an ex british soldier that’s saying something!
Do these fuckwits learn nothing from the history of imperialism and oppression. Demonise, belittle and dehumanise your enemy to justify your abusive criminal actions (jacobites/clan system/clearances), only results in anger, contempt, resentment and then conflict. Remove representation and democracy then armed conflict is inevitable “no taxation without representation”!
For those of us who are feeling slightly hurt by that QT ambush, I’m pretty sure Dan Snow and all his luvvy mates will be along real soon to console us with more of that squelchy emotional stuff.
Goodcop/Badcop? Which is worse?
@Brian Fleming says:
Yes I should have made my post clearer Brian, the 41.4% figure is the Labour Party, share of the vote drop since 2012.
The SNP share has increased by 8% since 2012, so an overall swing of 49.4% !!!
Gordon Brown visited East Kirkcaldy 3 times to ‘boost’ Labours vote!
Worked out well for them, lol.
I watch in amazement at how much ignorance and arrogance can be held in such small minds. Insulting and calling people names is no kind of grown-up tactic, politically or otherwise, and reflects badly on those who have nothing better to offer. Really, really sad!
Slightly O/T
I know 38degrees are not our favourite petition site, but they are running a questionnaire / poll thingy on the Smith proposals. Thought some might like to contribute..
“New Scottish powers: What do you think?”
link to secure.38degrees.org.uk
“I’m half English and have lots of English family and they do not think like those on Question time. I was disgusted by QT because it was the same old, same old BBBC trying to party politic.”
Its not exactly relevant where you happened to be borne. YES Scotland is nothing but POWER TO THE PEOPLE of Scotland:D
Which is why our teamGB establishment despise us, as shown last night by the grotesque that is the BBC. All they had to do was NOT ask such a loaded question, yet they pick them because they are fighting to stop losing their power, privilege and elitism and this is just one of many creepy ways to do it.
Another example was the neutral Queen intervening as she did with her threatening us in that Balmoral church carpark and then purring when she won. The Queen would still have been queen of Scots but the point is, power in the hands of the people of Scotland might well have spread to the people of England too and that just can’t be allowed to happen.
@chalks 10:13am
In addition to turning off, cosider using the “Editorial complaints” procedure here link to bbc.co.uk
Don’t complain about bias, complain about their appalling standards and the crappy presenters/interviewers/anchors. Make sure you have examples to quote and don’t just embark upon a generic rant.
I noticed at the outset of today’s programme that Kaye was trying to re-position herself as a “stupid woman” (apologies to all for any offence that term might cause) following the complaints last week that she was coming across as an “expert”, but patently wasn’t.
Totally transparent and despicable.
This is the calibre of host that we are expected to tolerate for a THREE HOUR DAILY programme come May this year when they change the schedules.
Oh, and don’t expect the “corporation” to provide you with any succour following your complaint. I would lay money on you getting a boilerplate response that has been ground through their politburo.
PS I didnt know Eddie Hitler from Bottom had joined the Ukippers.
Far more important than last night’s Question Time is the way BBC Scotland have reported yesterday’s SNP by-election win.
Spot anything wrong here…
link to bbc.co.uk
It’s what they don’t say that hurts us.
Liz g @ 5.41 a.m. and desimond @ 8.23 a.m.
I agree with you both.
My impression last night was that the audience were rather subdued at points in this particular debate. It was the same when Alex spoke in Liverpool, at the start they were rather cool towards him but warmed up once they heard him speak.
I take a degree of comfort from this for Scotland and for England.
One of the unintended, for us, consequences of having Scottish editions of newspapers as we have seen is that the same paper can run different and totally contradictory stories on the same day North and South of the border.
Quite simply I think the English are like us in that they are fed what MSM wants them to hear and read. Thereafter few make any attempt to question what they have been fed.
You do not need an army of foot-soldiers knocking doors when your propaganda is dispersed by a compliant and enthusiastic team of editors and broadcasters.
Just like the English only woke up to the Referendum when the three amigos panicked they will slowly but surely waken up to the idea of a Labour SNP coalition – despite the fact that that is not what it will be.
Can I ask you all, or those that do this, but why on earth do you listen to Call Kaye [BBC Radio] if it pisses you off so much?
Do you mean, ignore the sociopath screaming abuse at you outside your house, and just get on with tending to the pot plants? And done with the help of our broadcasting company established to serve Scotland?”
I have to deal with this crap every bloody day from my ‘friendly’ English colleagues.
“What? Another Scot? Why should we elect another Scot when there are talented people here in London?”
“I’ll tell you why. You were given the charter ‘British,’ and you happily proclaim yourself a ‘British’ institution, ergo, by accepting that brief and the responsibility that goes with it, you cover all of the fucking British Isles!”
As a scot now living in Northern Ireland. The whole English voted in the English Parliament sickens me. Shows the the mentality of Westminster MPs where they can chose to ignore 2 of the other countries making up thier UK to argue against Scotland but simultaneously including them when talking about the Union.
At least the ukip fool said it was all English.
Have MPs always been this dumb? Shocking.
The best line in Braveheart, from Edward I: “The only thing wrong with Scotland is that it’s full of Scots.”
Aye, and it still is full of Scots. So get used to it, ya expletive deleted.
Tim Farron claims he is only “a stone’s throw away from Scotland”.
You know that is very tempting.
Yeah K with an e tune out i accidently tuned into bbc scotland the other afternoon and they had a kinda glaswegian version of the archers on all done in posher than river city pish accents any way the point is, it was shite but still better that kow with a k
Personally…education is the issue and the evidence is clear as shown by these alleged politicians?
Sadly the panel of “politicians” have no real grasp and or idea of what the referendum was actually about as for me it was self-determination.
The lack of understanding toward the scottish people is at best xenophobic and the fact that the political view is becoming non-secular is abhorrent and undermines the “better together” nonsense.
Roll on the May GE and an opportunity to increase the scottish voice and balance the right-wing ideology that has been on the rise over the past decade in England!!!
Watchiing and listening to that nutter Nuttall on QT, I was reminded of a joke I was told by a Donegal man, with whom I worked on building the M11. This was back in the days when you could still tell “Irish” and “Pakistani” jokes.
The joke:
Yousef and Paddy worked together on a building site, doing the same job. One Friday, by mistake, Yousef got Paddy’s pay-line in his pay packet, and noticed, the Irishman was being paid far-more for doing the same job.
So, Yousef asked for an explanation, and was told: “The Irish always get paid more”. He then asksL “Well, how do I become Irish?”
Paddy explains: well first, to become Irish,you have to have half your brain removed. Yousef says he is up for this, so, it is arranged that O’Reilly, the ganger-man, will do the operation and remove half of Yousef’s brain during the lunch break.
O’Reilly duly does the operation, but, when Yousef wakes up, he is told by Paddy, before he can say a word: “I’m terribly sorry Yousef, but, O’Reilly got carried away and instead of taking our half your brain, he removed three-quarters.”
Yousef sat up, looked at O’Reilly and said: “Ok yah, mistakes happen, think nothing of it old boy.”
Watching Nuttall last night, I think he had that operation from an over-enthusiastic O’Reilly.
The wrong drop in the Labour vote is being quoted above for the Kirkcaldy East by-election, here are the correct figures. I thought Labour would win on a low poll due to their postal vote but hey I was wrong.
SNP 47.3% (+10.9)
Labour 35.3% (-14.7)
Conservatives 7.2% (+1.2)
Greens 4.1% (+4.1)
UKIP 3.8% (+3.8)
Liberal Democrats 1.3% (-1.5)
just under a 13% swing. Considering the effort Labour put into holding it, I am sure this will really worry them.
Was watching the audience,a few nodding heads,but very quiet
and no hands went up.
They mostly know something is not right with what’s being
said,but maybe not interested enough to find out what.
The english need a (wings over scotland)
not bbc question time.
If they get one….were do the liers hide?
If the english wake up to all this crap…it’s party time.
Let’s not interrupt them while they’re making arses of themselves
As for K with an E do phone in to the programme, just don’t answer when it’s your turn or keep scrunching up the crisp poke into the phone whilst mumbling…Or…do what she does when she pretends not to understand…turn into the wee wifie…”ooh ah dinnae ken son hen, ahm no sure whit tae think but ahve goat a wee bitty fish fur ma tea”
As for the NAW people they’ll never change, but some of the NO people are, bit by bit they’re getting it.
Keep smiling we’re winning
Lets not beat about the bush here folks. Diane Abbot is a fuckwit of the highest order. She is meeting a quota. I find her new accent shameful.
Mayor of London? She’s the wrong type of stupid. She’s housing estate stupid as opposed to Oxbridge stupid.
I’m surprised Portillo never shoved over the back of the settee. I swear Brillo and Michael sniggered when she made comment.
Just like on Googlebox a couple of weeks ago, when they watched some news of the Referendum. We really are lesser beings.
Let us not forget 2 things:-
1) QT is billed as a BBC Scotland Production.
2) It is not normally transmitted live but recorded in the early evening of transmission – so there is no reason why the nasty racist stuff from last night’s edition could not have been edited.
This morning’s Kaye adams prog had extensive coverage of QT which surprisingly was allowed to be overwhelmingly critical thereof and the listeners were even told of the early Sat. repeat and that it would be on the iPlayer.
Why can’t we have our own weekly Scottish version of QT. Given the BBC’s unionist agenda I can understand why PQ would be against the idea but surely STV could do it (I can’t see why there should be any copyright problems with the format but if there was surely they could tweak the format slightly).
While I’m at it PMQs every week gets a half hour preview and half hour post mortem on the Brillo Show. As for FMQs all we get is the actual question and answer (frequently truncated) followed by about 20 seconds of comment from Flubber before he hands us over to Brillo and what is normally a discussion of matters of little interest to Scots.
Let’s have our own FMQs preview and post mortem plus coverage in news bulletins and the late evening political programs.
After all the monthly WM Scottish Questions is both transmitted live and has a highlights program in the evening – but of course as it is normally just an extended attack on The SNP I can understand this level of coverage by our wonderful unbiased state broadcaster.
Kaye Adams this morning conveniently admitted that she missed last night’s BBC Question Time when the subject was raised, she also conveniently missed the details of Broon’s Vow when that matter was debated. She apparently gets a phenomenal salary for being what must be the worst-prepared chairperson on the wireless. Ex-Bullingdon Boy Dimbleby could teach her a thing or three.
OT:
anybody else think Leon Brittan has been silenced?
I wish I could just go to sleep now and wake up again in thirty years when all this shite has run its course, the union has long since crumbled and we’re an independent nation. But as it is I’m just going to have to put up with it.
Paul Nuttall strongly reminded me of Ade Edmunson in Bottom..
malicious gossip that’s what it is, with no foundation in fact.
Scott Borthwick says:
Scottish, Welsh and Irish Votes on English Laws.
They want EVEL, we tell them SWIVEL.
Congratulations Sir, fine wordplay
Diserves to go viral –
infecting now
badgerboydarling @ 10.28
Ha, class! I was thinking he looked like him too. Only Eddie Hitler is more tolerant and sensible.
You know, it’s all to do with the British Empire, its in their blood or upbringing. I could never imagine myself or anyone I know shouting about the Welsh getting too much, or having the cheek to want out the UK. I would wish them well. It’s because they think they own us. And as for the “one rogue poll”, how about the six polls since the referendum putting Yes ahead, are they all rogue polls? Nobody on that panel or in the audience mentioned the recent polls or the fact the SNP has now almost 100,000 members. Surely if you are in politics it’s your job to know these things, but if your only source of information is the Daily Mail then its understandable. And where does that clown get £1600 per head from? Another outright lie totally unchallenged. And calling Nationalists dangerous then going on a British Nationalist rant against Scotland. They just don’t see it. Roll on May. These clowns ain’t seen nothing yet.
Here in England, my English boss is very politically aware he thinks, and he says stuff like ” yes the Scots get a lot more tax money than England but so what, this is what our country is all about, we’re all one country.” He’s a lovely bloke and he is rather typical and explains quite a lot about why they can’t bear the idea of Scots running Scotland or even having proportionally more power than the Scots population dictates in Westminster. Scotland is not a country to most of England and the Scots are a tiny minority in their country.
OMG how is it legally possible for people like this to be given air time who are so ignorant and so badly misinformed they clearly should not be allowed to use a knife and fork unaided.
I still cannot believe our country is controlled by these people.
For the love God and our children, we have to get these people to France as soon as possible.
It’s time to wake up Scotland before it‘s too late.
OT but noteworthy in Kirkcaldy East
The LibDum got 40 votes out of 3085, 1.29%! They are finished.
Yes is still alive and well, Marie Penman got over the winning line at stage 6 thanks to 69 of the by then 150 votes for the Scottish Green who got 4.08% at the first preference stage
Please please stop referring to we Scots as second class citizens. What you heard expressed is the English colonial attitude to all non-English. A ludicrous attitude of course but it is their comfort blanket when face with superiority be it in sport, politics, art, etc.
The Football League;The Rugby Union.The Mother of Parliaments.
And remember, Queen Liz was reduced to boating up the Thames in a barge to celebrate something or other. freezing cold day, and her hubby caught a cold.
The Establishment is vainly clinging on to memories of past colonial robberies of other nations.
I happened to have it on and must admit I enjoyed watching it. Farren with his own nonsense, then looking horrified as the UKIP guy went way over the top. The Tory lady with her Dundee Cake thinking she was so parochial and smart she deserved the Home Counties fruit biscuit of the week award, Diane Aboott shaking her head at what the bad people were saying, having said biased stuff herself, Dimbleby saying apologetically of course the SNP aren’t present but not carrying it through and saying “we shouldn’t do this without the SNP”, then carrying on with a little look of naughty fear on his face realising he was showing the BBC’s bias, allowing Scots to be slagged off. To be fair, most of the audience looked a bit disgusted at the whole sordid affair. The people of England are OK, it’s the straitjacket plonkers they have as politicians and presenters on the BBC.
I thought the pantomime seasons was over. Oh no it wasn’t.
Handclapping
The LD candidate is well known in Fife and Leslie being a common name in that part of Fife I would have expected some relatives to have voted for him but to get just 40 votes does tell you that the LD’s will struggle on 7th May.
Complain if you want, but it must be done on-mass if you want them to notice.
There isn’t enough complaints going in for them to warrant it.
If the SNP complains, which they regularly do, it only counts for one complaint.
Pull pin…roll in hand grenade (marked ‘provocation’) and away we go!!
Sorry folks, but as I said to my teenage son last night “calm down, this is just the beginning of this campaign and a continuation of the referendum”
It’s almost as if comment does not need made about Nuttall’s remarks. And there is certainly no need to keep banging on about it ad nauseum. We need only have it reported.
The folks that we need to convince…the doubters, the insecure, the ‘traditionalists’…all these people can see and hear it for themselves.
I think it’s time to put a little more faith into our fellow humans as the lies, arrogance and outright manipulation is taken apart bit-by-bit…more often by our ‘enemy’s’ own mouth.
Take Murphy’s cynical and wholly bad taste photo op yesterday with the food-bank charity. The fact that he actually had the audacity to put on one of their fleeces just takes your breath away; compounded with his banal remarks about having such facilities like that all over Scotland.
C’mon people!!
The English colonial attitude says it all about them really. I just laugh at their nonsense, they are quite pitiful and insecure people really.
I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest they don’t really like us.
I think they may have lied in the referendum. Maybe they would miss giving out the abuse?
We’ve lost the referendum so we should no longer have a say in how the country is run?
In his defense Paul “I’m a real nutter” Nuttall read it all from a script he was given. He just reads his notes.
Happy now, NO voters? In case you don’t realise it,they are also talking about YOU as well! This must be the best of both worlds they voted for,best of both worlds for Westminster where they take,take, take, take, take Scottish resources and get to slag us off free of charge. Indyref 2 incoming methinks.
Ms Abbott is correct in one thing,YES was about making different choices,not hatred of the English, UKIP feeling the fear now as it looks like they won’t hold the balance of power,UK staying in Europe,get used to it,European votes for UK laws.
They didn’t think that they could steal a referendum without consequencies, did they? Voting NO does indeed seem to have consequencies,for those that vowed home rule and near federalism come May.
That McVey woman really enjoyed saying her ‘Dundee cake’ ditty, she didn’t get the big snigger she wanted the first time and so went for it a second time…it’s a shame she must’ve really thought it was a winner when she practiced in the mirror…the audience didn’t in my view mirror her back.
Distort, Divide and Conquer piece by the Broadly Biased Creeps writ large all over this. My how worried they are. What will they do now? They are running out of propaganda, we’re aw propagandared oot in Scotland having been thoroughly propagandised by the masters of manipulation.
And still….we will not lie down. Ever.
Question Time? It’s only a question of time.
It was clear by the Kippers response that he had prepared for the questioning in advance. (Despite the programme’s claims that the panelists don’t hear the questions beforehand)
And it’s is now confirmed, if anyone was in any doubt – UKIP is a racist party.
Meanwhile QT will contribute to the acceleration of disunited Kingdom. And for that it should be encouraged and applauded.
Ester McVey should tell Cameron he can’t have his Pontefract cake and eat it.
It seems that disparaging the Scots in public is now an acceptable pastime for Westminster Unionists. Their triumphalism at winning the referendum is there for all to see.
Firstly, I have never heard a member of the SNP talk about English people in a derogatory way and the SNP should be doing something about this unfettered broadcasting of utter bullshit lies on national television.
Seven excruciating minutes of unadulterated SNP/Scotland bashing with no right of reply given to the SNP but never mind, Nicola Sturgeon will be here next week so bash away, it’s all good.
It is harridans like Esther Mcvey that want their “Dundee” cake and eat it, i.e, they want a union for the sole purpose of using Scotland’s wealth but do not want Scottish Mps having a say on how that money is spent.
Evel, English parliament, bring it on as it will only expedite our removal from this hellish union.
Also, Paul Nuttall going unchallenged by David Dimbleby, a supposed impartial presenter, is an absolute disgrace but never mind, at least he pulled Esther Mcvey up on her cake reference which was a very, very subtle try at an insult which she probably sat up all night practicing and thought it was so good and subtle she would say it twice, stupid bitch.
any one who ignores history will have same done to them again, yeah well long list things they taken for us over the years. nuke base right next to major city, nuke power stations, poll tax, anthrax island in north of Scotland no one can walk on as UK government done all testing up there. They came to Scotland done highland clearances which in turn the wiped out massive forest in Scotland. Moved North sea boarder so that the GDP of England would look better on paper so they can say Oil in England…….
underlying it all is their intense dislike of democracy, they obviously feel threatened by it.
the snp was not on the ballot paper, stop insulting us for voting yes for democracy.
england is a country, scotland is a country, the UK is not a country.
i am proud of what the saltire represents, i know many norwegians are equally proud of what their flag represents.
the saltire is the official flag of scotland.
Just remember folks, the people who were in charge of the ballots and their transport from the polling stations to the counts ARE STILL THERE!
Don’t expect fair play when it comes to the GE count either.
It bugs me when the Bullingdon boy states at the start of the programne”you can intervene using twitter etc” when the truth is,… the programne was recorded earlier in the evening.So in reality there was no way for anyone to remark on any points at all about the comments of he panel.
I wonder when the penny will finally drop for the people of England that it’s going to be very very difficult to have only EVEL when your parliament is part of a union.
I wouldn’t be surprised at some point in the future to see the English calling for a referendum to break up the union and go it alone.
Can you imagine the look on no voters faces if they voted for it?
Tick Tock Tick Tock Tick Tock Tick
Just wondering here,under English votes for English laws,does that now include Scottish MPs elected to English seats not turning up to Scottish Questions and such in Westminster? That sounds a bit like English votes for Scottish laws to me.
@KennyG 12:03pm
I’d suspect that Londinium would go first. The rest of Englandshire would then realise how THEY’D also been sucked dry by Borisville for centuries.
Welcome to Question Time, and tonght we’ll be talking about the parts of the UK we can’t elect, and trying to decide if we should be able to stop them from having a say in their own national parliament.
You can Tweet to #undemocratictossers or e-mail us stirringbastards.bbc.co.uk
Never mind ‘Better together’ When the election comes in May we had ‘better get together’ and kick these people into deep touch!
Take, take, take?? Hang on, it was WM promising to give, give, give just days before the referendum that won them the vote, and now that that promise to Scots of significant new powers is clearly not being delivered, the SG is merely pointing out the fact that WM have lied massively and can never ever be trusted again.
John Walsh says:
23 January, 2015 at 1:12 am
Sorry “RACIST” so angry into my third large glenfiddich
Jesus H John……
Glenfiddich donated heavily to better together.
I will never drink that stuff ever again.
This complaint by Nuttal that England got nothing from devolution is because the English have not been agitating for it.
Interesting that IPlayer subtitles shows a much more reasoned discussion – “Dundee Cake and eat it” is as offensive as it gets.
Now I wonder why the BBC’s transcriber would do so much un-balanced editing?
Time for tea and a complaint to BBC I think.
Marcia
Kirkcaldy East:
The 41% was the drop in Labour votes from 1856 to 1088
SNP rose 8% from 1352 up to 1460
Turnout was down 7% so if Labour stay at homes turn out at the GE for Labour they could move the swing from 14% in this vote to 7%. THAT would save many Labour MPs
The Westminster crooks have basically shat in their own bed as regards saving this broken union for the time being. I call it delaying the inevitable, the genie is out of the bottle and it isnt going back in! The headless chicken unionists have basically jumped from one sh1tstorm to another, we are going to leave them but in the meantime we are going to deliver some karma to the brit establishment.
Well, watching the clip it is obvious they were all playing for the audience, English is good, Scottish spongers are bad.
While knocking what comes back to Scotland, there was no mention of how much we pay in, Dimbely would have known but not a murmer.
So we can clearly see how the BBC manipulates people to their way of thinking,with no Scot there to question these sort of claims. they are a disgrace.
As for the Ukip nutter, he was trying to stir up an anti Scottish feeling, in the audience and the viewers.
The Union is finished folks, but will get messy before it ends.
Could some o ma freinds in Dundee run ower tae Clerkie’s an order me a Dundee Cake a plenain, nae Nuts At All.
Wee tip dont re heat ah Dundee Cake in a Microwave or you,ll end up wie ah Soggy Bottom. Ester McVey getting confused between Dundee Cake & Christmas Cake, her fairy lights are still up ,but no switched oan.
Sad that the propaganda issued by UK Gov PLC during the referendum has been swallowed and is now being regurgitated reheated then dished up and eaten by the masses and the leaders of the mainstream UK parties… Diane Abbot as always almost the voice of reason …the whole session was quite shameful and ignorant..
@Jim Thomson 12.11pm
That may not be a bad thing. Then the rest of England would surround Londinium. It would then only be a matter of time before it was reclaimed by England and Westminster would be abolished.
SNP beat Labour by over 12% in Kirkcaldy East Council by-election.
SNP 1460 47.32%
LAB 1088 35.26%
TVC = 3,085.
Bring it on.
I’d like to congratulate all of the panel members. That was the best party political broadcast for the SNP I’ve seen in a long while.
O/T
Does Cameron intend that Welsh and NI MP`s should not vote on ENGLISH legislation? If not, why not!
Just an idle thought.
They are trying to stir up trouble but the only way to deal with them is at the ballot box.
Yesterday Kev McKenna commented on released papers about the miners strike and how the establishment had place folk at the top of the NUM, so don’t rise to the bait.
Also I really do believe the audience were having none of it, don’t forget they will be hearing all about Prince Andy & the cover up of the paedophiles, for some reason the Daily Mail has it’s teeth in to this – Andy must have pissed off Dacre at some point – so they are not happy with WM either.
English trash-talking Scotland (Question Time) provokes Scots trash-talk the English (Here). And both sets of bigots think they’re perfectly reasonable while the others are racist scumbags. The referendum in a nutshell – loud voices and little self-awareness. I voted Yes but some aspects of this ‘discussion’ make me feel quite dirty by association.
I have to agree with liz g and others that I do not think all that audience was as anti-Scottish votes as the politicians and the BBC would have liked them to be.
Remember that NS said she would vote to protect the English NHS from privatisation. I think that would be welcome by several in that audience. I got the impression that they were listening very carefully and got information they probably didn’t get in the MSM, how many SNP MPs there are now and how many there could be after the election.
The question on the veto on our laws could have been in favour of the SNP, also the reaction to the statement of Scotland not sticking around if England indulged in Scot bashing.
Remember there has been a big increase in Green membership recently in England. It is just possible that some of the English are waking up.
This just keeps running round my brain, I will not quote it all, I’m certain that it can put smiles on all our faces…bring on GE15.! Here goes see if you can finish it.
“As long as 100 of us remain, we will NEVER submit to English rule.”
This seems to be written in our DNA. It’s what gives us the courage to keep on going, we all want to honour those who have gone before, it’s about being true to yourself and your fellow man. I am so proud that my fellow Scots have kept the flames alive and peacefully too. Let’s finish this, let’s take this to a vote in May. We can make a difference for thousands of Scots by voting for those who are fighting for the people of Scotland. We can do this, the union is dead, it just doesn’t know how to die!????????
Hi Dave, I have read all of the comments here and yours is the only trashy one. Soz;-)
I am English, live and work in Scotland AND am a member of the SNP.
Some of the least racist comments come from the SNP. For true racism – veiled or otherwise – step forward UKIP and Conservatives.
For me, being in the SNP is about democracy. End of.
@Donald Urquhart says:23 January, 2015 at 1:37 am:
“In the referendum, what was voted for was a continuation of this. Surely enough NO voters are now seeing stuff like this with shame.”
I’m not so sure about that, Donald. Both on the street and even on this forum I’ve detected a measure of false flag flying among a portion of claimed SNP or independence supporters. They mainly go along with the flow but every now and again they cannot contain themselves and come out with some doubtful stuff.
They may seem to overstep the mark in a sort of hate the English slant that seems more intent of engendering us to hate the English than express a false hate they hold themselves. I’m glad to say, for the most part, supporters of independence do not bite and they know the crucial difference between hate of the English Establishment and hate of the good people of England who often suffer at least as much under the establishment as those in Wales, N.I and Scotland.
These false flag wavers try to be subtle but are really quite stupid. More to be pitied than hated. I’ve seen some true indy people describe this as, “They just don’t get it”, (the they being the Unionists), but they leave just what the, “It”, is they don’t get to the reader.
The, “It”, being the simple fact that a detestation of the Establishment, Westminster, The Union or UK political party politicians in no way equates with a hate for our fellow UK citizens or other Britons. The difference being that we Scots have both the will and the way to do something about it.
In the end this seeking for Scotland’s independence should be for the good of the entire British Isles including the four that are already not part of this detestable United Kingdom whose claimed broad shoulders have sloped quite steeply for a considerable time.
The only ones to benefit from the UK’s claimed Broad Shoulders have been the rich who, even throughout the long dire recession they caused, continued to become even richer while everyone else has continued to become poorer. It indicates the rich have become richer at the expense of the poor and it is the rich who hold the reigns of power.
I’m going to pour myself a stiffner and try to make it through Esther McVey although quite honestly I would rather listen to nails going down a blackboard than her horrendous voice. The UKIP guy I can live with, you expect that although it didn’t stop me shouting at the telly last night. When it cut to Esther I had to leave the room!
Calgacus – Oh the irony
A fair crack of the whip for Diane Abbott, she did save the life of the baron Cardowan when the dastardly George Galloway had him on the deck outside the Commons, knocking seven bells out of his lordship,
Just for wicked fun talking about Dundee Cake, have a wee Wirral at this, search for “Oh I say, minister! The photo shoot rising Tory star Esther McVey might rather forget” warning it’s the DM. Perhaps more for the guys …
@Ronnie
“her fairy lights are still up ,but no switched oan.”
Pure comedy
@:Lollysmum says:23 January, 2015 at 2:03 am:
“Diane Abbott might have come across as reasonable but don’t forget she was part of the Murphy 1,000 nurses spat when Murphy was trying to prove he was independent of London Labour.”
I’m with you, Lollysmum, Diane Abbot had me fooled too for a brief spell when Labour were in power but closer inspection on what she did instead of what she said soon rectified that and exposed her for what she is.
Hackney North and Stoke Newington MP Diane Abbott had been bitterly critical of other Labourites who sent their children to fee paying private schools. This bitterness included then Prime Minister Tony Blair who sent Euan, his eldest son, to the selective London Oratory. Saying of Blair, “People voted Labour because they believed in equality. It is inconsistent, to put it mildly, for someone who believes in a fairer and more egalitarian society to send their child to a fee-paying school.”Then, after then Solicitor General Harriet Harman, sent her son to the selective grammar school in Orpington Kent, Ms Abbott said: “She made the Labour Party look as if we do one thing and say another.”
However, after Diane Abbott sent her own son to a £10,000-a-year private school instead of a comprehensive she described her own actions as, “indefensible”, and added, “I had to choose between my reputation as a politician and my son. So the woman, who became Britain’s first black woman member in 1987, said her constituents would understand, ”particularly black mothers who know the position I’m in”, continuing with, “You can’t defend the indefensible – anything you say sounds self-serving and hypocritical. It has been a “shame” to throw away my reputation for “political consistency but I threw it away in the best possible cause.”
So that is indeed Diane Abbott who, by her own admission, is, “Self-serving and hypocritical”. She thus fits well with the other Labourite scum.
The key difference is that only one set of “bigots” has power over the other group. Despit the heinous accusations of the Lib Dem speaker, anti-English bigots do not have power over the people of Scotland or England: anti-Scottish bigots, however, have power over the people of England AND Scotland. In the UK, anti-English sentiment is soundly condemned: anti-Scottish sentiment is fostered for cynical political gain. This, by the way, happens on both sides of the border, among Scots AND English.
When the SNP do criticize “England,” it’s solely and unambiguously Westminster which they target. When UKIP criticize “Scotland,” it’s the subsidy-junkies, the “free” tuition and parking and bus fares, the “welfare scroungers.” One group attacks the government, another group vilifies the ordinary people.
It’s also disengenous to present a huge amount of anti-Scottish bigotry which was broadcast and largely unchallenged on national television, to a tiny amount of anti-English bigotry entirely unrepresentative of the hundreds of comments on a website.
@Patrick Roden says:23 January, 2015 at 3:16 am:
“Well that’s something else the SNP has taken tonight, Kircaldy East council seat has been taken by the SNP from Labour in a by-election”
Not strictly true, Patrick, The SNP held the seat. It is a multi-member seat and the SNP came third to two Labour Councillors last time round. However, the sitting SNP councillor had gone abroad to live but was still doing his council work and claiming his council expenses and pay.
Labour made an issue of it, as usual, and the by-election was caused because the sitting SNP councillor stepped down. It is thus quite outstanding, that under these circumstances, the SNP not only held the seat but held it by winning the by-election hands down. Furthermore, the votes cast for the unionist parties all took a nosedive while the SNP’s soared. This in Gordon Browns back yard bodes well for the coming GE. Remember Gordon Brown is expected to stand down for the GE so his admittedly large personal following may not support his Labour successor. If that constituency were to prove to be winnable there is no more safe Labour seats in Scotland
I’ve been very busy & not able to devote as much time to Wings as I’d like but on watching that I can see I’m going to have to redouble my efforts. The extreme Olympic Class idiocy shown by Nuttal & McVey is just jaw droppingly awful & they CANNOT be allowed to get away with this. The BBC in allowing this to happen have once again shown their dark side. Us SNP members should be demanding that a full apology for this propaganda is broadcast at peak viewing time.
I’m F**king raging at this.
Horribly ill-informed panel.
@ElaineS says:23 January, 2015 at 3:51 am:
“Worthwhile posting this article to our European media and further afield …
I’m trying to work on that, Elaine, I can video edit and have a YouTube channel. Trouble is that downloading and editing video is a fairly long drawn out process as you have to sit through the whole clip several times getting sorted out how you will edit the video. Your audience won’t stick with too long a resultant video. It also takes time to do the downloading of the original clips, editing and then uploading the results. Add to that I’ve been indisposed since referendum night.
The next problem is that I don’t do twitter or Facebook so getting the information out to the twittersphere relies upon the rest of people such as WoS commenters. However, I hope to be a bit more able now that things are beginning to heal up from the accident I had.
As I commented yesterday –
Is there anything that could be put before Westminster for a vote, where
the SNP vote would be detrimental to the interests of the majority in the kingdom of England?
The figures used in Question Time and above are incorrect.
We Scots pay in £1700 more per head, and in 2012, the latest figures available, when Westminster knows these figures are going to be used in the referendum, they gave us back £1200 per person
more than the English get.
No one use the those stats in this fashion, but in a good year every single Scot Gave £500 more into Westminster’s coffers that the English.
Can someone from SNP make it clear, all we want is control of our own finances, not 1p in subsidy from Westminster, nothing on those broad UK shoulders that have disappeared from Aberdeen, and you can still say that we are united in Foreign affairs and defense. Why, why, why won’t they allow this? Because they are robbing us blind and we are easy mugs to use and abuse.
Has everyone signed this petition?
Day in and day out we complain about the blatant Bias on the BBC.
They are their own Judge and Jury if you complain to them directly, so they can confirm that they are never wrong, only wonderful. We are less than 14,000 signatures away from the 100,000 we require for a guaranteed Public Inquiry into their Biased Propaganda. For the sake of Scotland and Democracy,sign up
link to you.38degrees.org.uk
After all those years since George Rosie’s expose on the distribution of ‘unidentified expenditure’ we still have a situation where this ‘hidden’, or at least effectively ‘buried’, London subsidy is alive and well.
And it is not just Scotland, but the other English regions which suffer too.
Currently ‘capital infrastructure’ funding for London runs at £5000 + per head, whereas in the NE of England it is around £220 per head.
A Black Hole protected by a White Hole media machine.
@David Osborne says: 23 January, 2015 at 7:35 am:
” … To balance the Union, England should have her own Parliament for her own laws. Just like the rest of the UK.
Yes, David, there’s someone on the forum who has long been preaching that fact saying the Westminster parliament is the de facto parliament of the, “Country” of England and only nominally the parliament of the United Kingdom”. Pointing out the only Tory MP from Scotland said, “The Treaty of Union”, extinguished the Kingdom of Scotland and renamed The Kingdom of England as the United Kingdom. Even although the actual Treaty of Union is legally a bipartite union and thus the united Kingdom will end when one partner leaves and the two kingdoms that signed the treaty must return to the Status Quo Ante.
Damned if I can remember who the guy was … Oh! Wait up! It was me.
The only way the Establishment could make a democratic four country United Kingdom work is by freeing Wales and N.I. as countries and getting the parliament of the country of England to hell out of the United Kingdom Parliament.
Trouble is the Establishment has always believed that the Kingdom of England made Scotland a region of England just as they had with Wales in 1284 and Ireland in 1542. Thing is that Scotland was not conquered but signed up as an equally sovereign partner kingdom and the wording on the actual treaty is very clear on that matter.
BBC BS continued on R4 ‘Any Questions’ once again no Scottish rebuttal panellist present.
Usual amazing impartiality from the BBC. No wonder they don´t want the SNP in any TV debates – quite happy to slag off Scotland and SNP with no right of reply. Some reward for staying part of this great “family of nations”. I would still hope that the usual bunch of Westiminister cronnies on show do not represent the view of the majority of England regarding Scotland.
I am from Merseyside and when watching QT last night I was embarrassed and disgusted by the attitudes of Esther McVey and Paul Nuttall. I was searching online to see what others made of their performance. Please don’t believe that all English citizens think the same way.
@RobertPeffers @8.20pm.
Sorry to hear you’ve been poorly, I hope you’re on the mend as I enjoy reading your posts. In your earlier post you said that both kingdoms had signed the treaty as equally sovereign partners. What happened? Did they just ignore us from the beginning or was there a trigger that turned it all to s***. I’m asking coz I want to understand what it was that turned us into a non nation(in their eyes)and why can’t we just walk away. Westminster certainly knows how to keep a nation of 5 million in chains,but just when did we put those chains around our legs. Why is Scotland prepared to live this way? Have we been brainwashed..
@tartanarse says:23 January, 2015 at 9:08 am
“My approach is always the same. I ask them if they are in fact privy to more information than the government of the day.”
Here’s some wee hints for you, Tartanarse, from one who went to work in Rosyth Dockyard when actual Scottish Dockyard Maties were as rare as diamond mines in Argyllshire. You had to learn to deal with Englanders. The very first thing to do is to wrong foot them. This is much more simple these days for we have much more information than ever before.
For example claims of Scots getting lots of freebies for example. When they will make the idiotic claim English taxpayer are subsidising the Scots it is an opportunity to make them look like the fools they are. Point out it is not free but paid for by our tax payments.
Do not then attempt to justify anything. Instead look shocked and say, “I didn’t know that! How does that work? Whatever the numptie then says will be balderdash as whatever they say must be wrong. It usually goes along the lines of, “It stands to reason – there are more English taxpayers so we pay in more tax than the Scots”. This is what you want to hear. You now have them dead to rights. Remember the numptie thinks you an ignorant, uneducated sweaty sock who eats fried Mars Bars for breakfast. Innocently say, “Oh! Brilliant! I never though of it like that. You must have gone to a really good English school to learn to do sums like that”?
Then before they have time to think about it hit them with both barrels, “In our much poorer quality education system they not only taught us to use logic to identify exactly what the actual mathematical problem we are attempting to solve is. They also taught to do both sides of the equation and to do the same to each side of the equals sign.
Therefore we reason that if there are more Englanders paying tax there are also more Englanders to support on that English tax take. Thus the real problem is identified as being on a per capita basis. Would you believe the Scots per capita GDP is higher than both the average English per capita GDP and the average UK per capita GDP? Not to mention that the Scottish per capita employment figures are better than the UK & English per capita figures.”
All that without even mentioning oil, gas and other Scottish exports means the average per capita value of exports is what makes those Scottish per capita figure higher than those of England.
Keep the coup de grâce in reserve. There is no such thing as an English budget as England is funded and taxed as the United Kingdom and has no block grant and, last time you looked, Scotland voted to remain part of that United Kingdom so pays for much of what Parliament classes as UK infrastructure.
@ronnie anderson says:23 January, 2015 at 5:30 am
“I hope that the people of the No vote persuasion were watching,there must be some of them with Scottish Pride,use the loaf people.”
Nah! Ronnie, the kind of people who vote no fall into three basic categories :-
The more better off ones who are greedy and know the truth but wish to maintain and increase their wealth.
Those who are either Unionist Political figures or are related to unionist political figures who gain, or hope to gain, by being so.
The thickos who goggle the box but immediately switch off, go and make tea or change channels when any news or political programmes come on. These also only read headlines and the sports/celeb or page 3 content in newspapers. Furthermore this last lot wouldn’t understand political stuff if they did watch it.
@Christian Wright says:23 January, 2015 at 6:39 am:
“They’re going to spin it as an SNP HOLD: “Move along now, nothing to see here”.”
It actually is an SNP Hold, Christian. The seat was vacated by the sitting SNP councillor who had moved abroad to live but was still claiming his council expenses and pay. He was, though, still doing his council job but Labour as usual backed by the media made a scene. The Councillor resigned and that was the reason for the by-election.
The point, though, is that he had originally come third behind the two sitting Labour councillors in the multi-councillor ward in the original council elections. This makes it even more astonishing that Maria Penman should win, and by a fair old margin, after the perceived scandal of the original SNP councillor living abroad. I warrant Labour now feel very, very sick at the outcome and wish they had remained quiet.
If this is an example of how things are swinging around these parts politically then Gordon Brown’s Westminster seat is far from unwinnable.
We have things like free prescriptions and no tuition fees in Scotland because we have democratically voted in a government who choose to prioritise these over other things.
If these policies sound so desirable to the Ukip man maybe he should reconsider what his priorities are. And if people in England like the ideas they should be demanding them from their MPs.
England used to have free prescriptions and free education too but they have been tricked out of them now and told that they can’t afford them. Of course they can,
it just depends what you choose to spend your budget on.
Laverock says:
23 January, 2015 at 11:03 pm
We have things like free prescriptions and no tuition fees in Scotland because we have democratically voted in a government who choose to prioritise these over other things.
If these policies sound so desirable to the Ukip man maybe he should reconsider what his priorities are. And if people in England like the ideas they should be demanding them from their MPs.
England used to have free prescriptions and free education too but they have been tricked out of them now and told that they can’t afford them. Of course they can,
it just depends what you choose to spend your budget on.
I’m a wee bit foo, but agree entirely with your sentiment, they just need tae get of their erse and do something about it
Away with you, Dave at 1:40pm on the 23rd, yir patters like watter. I see almost no ‘trash-talking’ about English people on this site, and I wonder if you actually read all the comments before posting your nonsense.
I am also quite sure that the English, or English-born) people who post here (such as Lollysmum. Paula Rose and Angie Phillpotts) would slap down anyone trying on such rubbish. If they don’t, I am equally sure there are many other posters who will.
Where people were born is not the issue, it is about how we want to be governed.
“I wasn’t born in Scotland, but I got here as soon as I could.”
Hearing opinons you disagree with can be hard. But that’s democracy, get used to it!!!!!!
I still maintain that UKIP are basically a party of trolls and button-pushers
I have not seen anyone else mention it, but a ‘well done’ is due to the lady in the audience who makes a comment at 3m 25s, just before the UKIP rentagob starts up. She has obviously done her homework on what is happening as regards Scotland, the Smith Commission, and the ‘command paper’:
“Doesn’t this (i.e. the arrangement that has been announced today) contradict the draft paper that gives Westminster the power to veto Scotland’s decisions on their own welfare system?”
She has informed herself about the true state of events, so congratulations to her, and I wonder how many others in EW&NI are finding out the truth behind the headlines.
OK it’s maybe sunstroke, but @BBCQT did us all a favour,
we heard what UKIP really thinks of Scotland.
And, that is a good thing.
WE have to re-educate England,
as they have been deceived by the UK media,
just as much as we were last year.
So to the English I say, you know its not true.
And to Scotland I sing
“won’t be fooled again”
Effijy at 0726pm
Regarding you admirable attempts with 38 degrees. I and many others have posted repeatedly here and elsewhere, that 38 degrees is a waste of time regarding the issue.
Many years ago a group of like minded people got together and raised the requisite number of signatures regarding bias in Scotland, and the BBC. The response from 38 degrees was that they would do nothing, with mutterings along the lines of ‘it was not a UK issue’, or some such similar rubbish.
Then we had the petition following the referendum, demanding the ‘vow’ be honoured IN FULL, which many yes supporters signed. 38 degrees then took it upon themselves to give this petition to Gordon Brown (the man who had just lied to and betrayed us and Scotland) to do with as he wished, including telling the media about ‘his’ petition.
Seriously, you are wasting your time with 38 degrees. I do however admire your dedication.
As an aside, below is a comment I posted on wings around that time, which includes the First Minister’s comments regarding Gordon brown’s petition bull;
‘I see The First Minister, Alex Salmond has today commented on Gordon Broon’s latest nonsense;
“This is an astonishing development. How can Gordon Brown call for people to sign a petition urging Westminster to keep its promises on more powers for Scotland when he himself has already said that is a vow which will be honoured?
“He is now calling for guarantees on the delivery of something which he himself said during the referendum campaign was already a done deal.
“The ‘Tory trap’ is not the proposals on income tax which Gordon Brown talks about – it is the Tory trap which he and his colleagues are leading people into, in which the issue of more powers for Scotland becomes entangled in a row between factions of the Westminster establishment.
“Scotland has been promised very substantial new powers, regardless of Tory attempts to link the issue to that of English votes for English laws.
“Many of the people who voted No in the referendum did so in the belief that those new powers would be delivered, and that is what now must happen.”‘
Source : link to snp.org
Robert Louis
I appreciate your advice regarding 38 Degrees.
I intend forwarding your comments to them and demanding an answer.
If indeed this is the state of play, We, WoS, would surely
form our own petition regarding BBC Bias?
The principle is sound that if 100,000 signatures are gathered an
Inquiry into the matter must be delivered.
Would anyone offer their thoughts on how such a petition could be
set up on this site, and would the Rev Stuart concur with it?
link to epetitions.direct.gov.uk
you submit it then publicise it.
Everybody signs it. That’s the first hurdle.
Scottish government has a site for submitting petitions too but Broadcasting is a reserved matter.
@Taranaich
“Talking about the SNP without an SNP representative? That’s bad enough.
Talking about the Scottish government without anyone from the Scottish government? That’s worse.
Talking about anything to do with Scotland without a Scot on the panel? That’s a complete and utter disgrace.”
So why is the BBC building still standing ?
Why is it not in flames as we speak ?
If it is allowed to throw out such evil propaganda to the Scottish AND English people with impunity we are going to have a re-run of the Referendum.
It is Enemy Country. Burn it.
I am absolutely flabbergasted by a discussion I had this morning. I sent the you tube link to a work colleague who was a ‘No’ voter and helped the BT campaign with leaflet drops etc. I only sent the YouTube link and not the WoS link as I thought I would get a more balanced opinion from him rather than getting his heckles up at some of our analysis of the clip on here. not only was he not bothered about the fact that there were no Scots anywhere near the discussion but he actively supported what Paul Nuttall said and thinks that we were taking more money that we contribute and want more powers than we need. I try my hardest to have balanced and factual discussions with this guy but it is getting more and more difficult. He is a Scots Tory supporter but likes Jim Murphy, especially his tour of Scotland on a crate nonsense. What hope do we have if this is the majority of our country?
so cosy to feel so understood