Let’s make this simple
We’ve written a number of extremely, painstakingly detailed articles in the last few months explaining why list votes for the SNP at next year’s election will be wasted, and will serve only to elect Unionist (and in particular Reform) MSPs.
Unfortunately, some people still don’t get it.
And that’s understandable, because super-detailed articles are long and people have terribly short attention spans nowadays, especially if there are large tranches of fiddly arithmetic involved. So let’s go the opposite way.
Here’s the latest poll. Constituency vote is on the left of each coloured pair of bars, list vote on the right.
We’re not interested in the constituency polling here (except for how it’ll impact seats, which we’ll get to in a second), so here it is with the list-vote figures alone.
And here’s the seat projection as calculated by Sir John Curtice, where the SNP win 57 constituencies because they have a 14-point lead over their nearest rivals in the constituency vote, which works under First Past The Post.
That’s just over seven constituency seats per region (there are eight regions), so the SNP’s list vote gets divided by eight (7+1) at the count. So when it comes to allocating list seats, the actual vote shares are approximately these:
Clear enough?
– The Tory list vote is 3.5 times higher than the SNP’s, so they’d get three list seats in a region before the SNP got one.
– The Labour list vote is almost five times higher than the SNP’s, so they’d get four list seats in a region before the SNP got one.
– The Lib Dem list vote is almost three times higher than the SNP’s, so they’d get two list seats in a region before the SNP got one.
– The Green list vote is almost five times higher than the SNP’s, so they’d get four list seats in a region before the SNP got one.
– The Reform list vote is over five times higher than the SNP’s, so they’d get five list seats in a region before the SNP got one.
– The Alba list vote is 1.5 times higher than the SNP’s, so they’d get a list seat in a region before the SNP did.
That means that when it came to allocating the list seats in any given region, the SNP would be in TWENTIETH place (behind five Reform candidates, four Labour ones, four Green ones, three Tories, two Lib Dems and an Alba). But since there are only seven list seats per region, what you’d actually get would be, in order:
1st seat: Reform
2nd: Labour
3rd: Green
4th: Tory
5th: Lib Dem
6th: Reform
7th: Labour
Now, we’ve been generalising here because in reality the votes and constituency seats won’t be split absolutely equally in each region (and also because we think the poll seriously overstates the Green vote, as Holyrood polling historically does and because this particular poll had a slightly oddly-worded question), but it doesn’t matter because as you can see, the wiggle room is the size of a galaxy.
(So even if, say, the Lib Dems picked up a couple of constituency seats in Highland, which they will, taking them out of the running for a list seat there, there are a dozen Unionists in the queue behind them before the SNP would get a look-in as a result.)
If Jeremy Corbyn’s new party ever becomes a reality (something which looks less likely by the day as it dissolves in acrimony) it might damage Labour and the Greens a bit, but would make no meaningful difference to anything else.
On these figures the SNP aren’t coming within a hundred thousand miles of a list seat. Every single list vote cast for them will count for nothing. Scores of gleeful Unionists will troop into Holyrood sniggering at SNP voters’ stupidity.
Three brightly-coloured bar graphs. If anyone still doesn’t get it, they’re beyond help.
Is there not some adjustment required to Reform/Labour/tory/non-SNP list votes after the constituency seats they win?
Thanks Stu. I get it.
The public are not getting this message because the big parties are not telling them. Likewise the media.
Can we make the message even simpler? For instance, show the constituency vote and how many seats that represents. Then show the list vote and how many seats that represents. And then one graph showing the totals. Add in somewhere that the list vote for the SNP is a wasted vote etc.
To make it clearer, state at the top of the List vote ballot in huge red capital letters, that if you voted SNP on the Constituency ballot, then you are INELIGIBLE to vote on the List ballot. There’d be no change to the outcome, but at least it’d be clearer about how it works.
Have a look at the Alba party video on this (ISP have something similar). Explained in 2 minutes.
link to albaparty.org
Conclusion based on 2021 figures is that the SNP would lose 2 list seats but Alba would pick up 30 – so net improvement of 28 seats.
If split between multiple pro indy parties it could slightly dilute the effect, but you’d still be sacrificing 2 SNP list MSPs to get 20 plus “other indy” people
What would happen if for instance all snp list votes went to isp and alba equally?
That’s how it is and nothing will change it.
The Unionists, Greens or Reform won’t do anything to inform the population because they profit massively from it.
The SNP won’t do anything because they think their voters are mugs or sheep who just need to X the constit. box and f..k the list, who cares. Nicola proved it.
ALBA can only squeak in the background and nobody listens.
As for the plonker Scot goes something or another…….
There’s good reason why SNP HQ are not in a rush to bust the ‘Both Votes SNP’ myth.
Creating a bogey man Reform Party in Scotland is the only credible way keeping the Gravy Bus going.
5 more years of ‘Protecting Scotland’ from Farage’s mob is the ideal scenario.
Everybody gets paid.
No need to do anything on Indy.
5 more years of controlling the narrative & keeping the truth buried.
Indeed.
There’s good reason why SNP HQ are not in a rush to bust the ‘Both Votes SNP’ myth.
Creating a bogey man Reform Party in Scotland is the only credible way keeping the Gravy Bus going.
5 more years of ‘Protecting Scotland’ from Farage’s mob is the ideal scenario.
Everybody gets paid.
No need to do anything on Indy.
5 more years of controlling the narrative & keeping the truth buried.
There’s good reason why SNP HQ are not in a rush to bust the ‘Both Votes SNP’ myth.
Creating a bogey man Reform Party in Scotland is the only credible way keeping the Gravy Bus going.
5 more years of ‘Protecting Scotland’ from Farage’s mob is the ideal scenario.
Everybody gets paid.
No need to do anything on Indy.
5 more years of controlling the narrative & keeping the truth buried.
BroughtyBoy @ 13.57 & Previous.
Oh dear, I hope our host doesn’t, in fact, kill you to death with hammers ! More so as I suspect you’ve got a good point re the SNP tactics.
Death by hammer or five more years of this cabal?
Hammers it is..
Someone asked the question as to what would happen if all the SNP votes went to Alba and ISP equally… well there is a small mathematical advantage to splitting the SNP vote over all the Indy supporting parties, however, there is no way to coordinate who votes for which party so no way to ensure the allocation to party A v B is correctly distributed (in a region). For the sake of a simple message, vote SNP 1 and Scottish Greens 2. If you cannot bring yourself (for whatever reason) to vote Scottish Greens 2, vote Alba 2 or ISP 2. Just don’t throw your second vote away by voting SNP 2 – it won’t earn any extra SNP seats
Every extra Indy supporting MSP is one less unionist MSP.
“If you cannot bring yourself (for whatever reason) to vote Scottish Greens”.
How much political capital does one invest in a party that doesn’t even know what a woman is?
The Scottish Greens think that if I throw on some lippy, slip into my favourite size 12 summer frock, squeeze into size 10 heels, and insist everyone calls me “Roberta”, that makes me a woman, despite all evidence to the contrary, and society must, under penalty of law, treat me as such. (Except on a weekend, when I might take a couple of days off from being Scotland’s ugliest woman).
Cold day in hell when that bunch of biology denying zealots and assorted blue-haired social anarchists gets my vote!
Same applies to the charlatans in the SNP, who wouldn’t recognise a path to independence if they were dragged face down along it’s corrugated gravel surface.
Agreed.
Presumably the people who are beyond help are the ones that wrote the description at link to parliament.scot which, although lacking brightly-coloured bar graphs, is, I am quite confident, correct.
If you are not beyond help, perhaps you should have a look at it
BroughtyBoy
When you click to submit your comment there is a delay before it appears to be viewed. It has it seems an algorithm in the system which can work fast or slow.
Wait a few minutes and then renew again, sooner or later you get to be famous…!!
That’s when the site yoons crawl out…
Thanks Graf for the heads up…rarely get involved because of the Yoons tbh
It’s really quite simple. Sigh!
The Constituency Vote determines who “wins”, but only wins prior to the modification fix; a modification that’s a lot like a race handicap being applied after the race is finished.
The List Vote is the “Leveller” mechanism. It is designed to reign in the strong, and provide safe haven for the under-represented. Not bad in theory, but in Holyrood, the seat ratios are messed up, and the List Component is far too strong.
So, the more you win in the Constituency Vote, the more you get penalised in the List Seats, as in, securing more List votes does not translate into more seats. The better you do Constituency-ways, the steeper the hill is getting List seats.
Do poorly in the Constituency Vote, and you can expect to be favoured with List Seats to be sure your puny voice still gets a turn at the mic.
A strong SNP which hoovers up Constituency Seats, shouldn’t expect much from List Seats, because it is “the” strong party needing to be reigned in, not augmented with even more List Seats. You don’t find balance adding weight to the heavy side. Duh!
Hence the obvious strategic advantage of a List Party Ally DESIGNED to perform weakly in Constituency Seats so it is looked upon with favour securing List Seats. The “Alliance” thus sweeps the board in both categories, and you have a Holyrood Supermajority which wants Independence… No Alliance? It doesn’t work.
It’s like a fkg see-saw. If One Party has all the Constituency votes, it becomes the fat kid at one end, and the skinny wee kid is stuck in the air bawling his eyes out. The “2nd prize” List Seats are designed to favour the skinny kid stuck at the opposite end, so the see-saw stays “middling” and everybody gets a go on the see-saw that can actually tip. But for Scotland, it means an outright majority is effectively thwarted – by Westminster design.
“Both votes SNP” applies the same strategy to different political arenas where seats are won in different ways. This is fundamentally stupid; indeed so manifestly stupid and designed to thart an outright majority that it can only be a deliberate con, the type of con ordinarily delivered by Unionist Parties. Go figure…
I would go on to describe what a Supermajority is and why it matters, but frankly, I’m currently trying to reach the stupid SNP kids who can’t figure out the Constituency Seat handicap, so explaining a Supermajority would require crayons, a diagram and patience,… none of which I have.
Breeks
A good summary.
I would be briefer; DHondt was implemented to make gaining a majority next to impossible and to keep the Jockonese squabbling amongst themselves with pocket money externally decided budgets.
Problem solved for the status quo and the Union, minimal risk to it..
Also if Provost Swinneys and the Gradualists seriously think they are going to even maintain their numbers never mind add to them next year at HR then he really is incapable of reading the room over the events of the last few years courtesy of his puppet master controller SHE whose name shall not be uttered’s disastrous policy legacy.
Or maybe he suspects the SNP is due a pumping in the constituency vote whereupon reliance would be needed on the “also-rans” List..
“Every single list vote cast for them will count for nothing. Scores of gleeful Unionists will troop into Holyrood sniggering at SNP voters’ stupidity.”
Has it ever occurred to you that’s maybe what they want?
The SNP was captured by unionists a long time ago.
When you think about it over the last few years it makes perfect sense.
Plan B = rejected.
Ash Regan Leadership/Plebiscite = rejected.
Super Pro indy majority at Holyrood = rejected.
Greens = hell no! Rejected. Fck independence – TRAs 1st.
Ask for Devo then? = rejected.
This is a win, win situation for Westminster. The current shower are a permanent road block not even pretending anymore that they’re not interested in Independence & having Holyrood stuffed full with other yoons, of various shades, doesn’t actually bother them cause they’ve hee-haw chance of challenging them like an indy party wood.
Personally, from what I’ve seen across Europe, I think the elections are rigged, tampered with or whatever. I refuse to believe Alex didn’t fair well when he returned to politics.
I think Starmer may even just halt elections altogether cause he’s intent on going to war & things aren’t going his way in the popularity stakes. He has just the right kind of donors to make it happen too, imo.
D’Hondt isn’t that bad in my opinion, but as I said, the balance is all wrong.
The impact of List Seats should be to ensure representation, as in give lesser voices a presence, – NOT to empower the losing parties to be kingmaker.
If they were to halve the number of List Seats, D’Hondt would probably work well enough. Maybe halving them is too drastic, but the influence definitely needs curtailed. I don’t like the revolving door for scumbags rejected at the ballot box either… I’d stop that and have List candidates named and fixed in advance.
But Holyrood, as we know, is deliberately skewed to prevent outright majorities, and thus obstruct Scotland from taking any worthwhile initiative which Westminster would then have to cynically derail and upset everybody.
Holyrood is typical British “Government”; delivers the illusion of democracy, claims all the bragging rights and ceremonial pomp, but holds on to both ends of the string so real power is neutered to choosing one tame puppet or the other.
Holyrood is just a sand box and always will be, until or unless it recognises the people of Scotland are sovereign, and starts acting accordingly.
Fat chance with the current regime of gravy slurpers.
I daresay Scotland’s foremost pishologist will be reverting to mean very shortly.
I would suggest the message news to be simpler
Graph with two columns 1. Pro Independence 2. unionists
Graph 1 shows SNP 1. & 2 result
Graph 2 shows SNP 1 Alba 2 result
Question is . Do you ignore the greens or count as unionists as they will support any party that offers them a deal.
Not helped by politicians (started by the libdums, but I think the SNP also do it now) putting out leaflets saying “only we can win here” or “vote x to keep out y”, instead of saying anything positive about what they will do if elected.
Alba need 8.5% on the list to start winning seats (as the Greens learned). I will be voting Liberation 1, Alba 2. I will not be voting for a child or anyone who hasn’t had a real job.
Aye, it’s ALL negative campaigning.
I’d like to see a positive one, rather than endless negative ones.
When it comes to sniggering at SNP voters it’s pure schadenfreude. Nothing at all to do with voting.
Maybe sending this message to SNP in Brazil, Morse Code, Semaphore and Smoke Signals perhaps it might sink in through their gravy sodden skulls?
Och, you’re jist being silly now 😉
Nae chance of the message hitting home.
From listening to RADIO SAORSA it would now appear the SNP really worried about the list vote and for good reason. He’s been saying SNP 1 and any other party 2. Have listen and see what you think, fast forward passed the music, its worth a listen after whats Wings is saying.
youtube.com/watch?v=SBG5JSSocDo
If you watch the video their/he advocating you vote for the SNP on the list as its going to be used as a plebiscite and this is the alternative thats being put forward as alteration to Swinney’s plan, I had to give up watching.
This calls for a Wings leaflet to be delivered throughout Scotland, as the WBB was.
Sara, leaflets never work, less than 10% actually read them.
The WBB worked!
It’s incredible. I don’t know how they except people to believe it in 3D!
This can be made much simpler without worrying about arithmetic.
The D’Hondt system treats the list vote as the “true” seat entitlement of the parties. The list phase tries to bring the overall seat allocation as close to this as possible while being as fair as possible to all parties and never removing any seats already won.
So if the SNP list vote is 25% and they ALREADY hold more than 25% of the seats then the list phase will NEVER give them any more seats (because other parties will always deserve extra seats more).
Obviously the SNP were asleep when the D’Hondt system was explained to them. (but I repeat myself)
Dear Honest John,
The list seats were specifically designed to make sure the minority parties got some seats. Got that?
So unless you want to do badly in future elections (oh, repeating myself again) then you won’t get any list seats. Any list seats.
You need to form an alliance with a smaller party with the same dreams of independence as you, and encourage a vote list for them.
No, not the Greens.
Better still, why not put your party into permanent hibernation and we’ll start again. (cos none of your MSPs seem capable of running a tombola)
“SNP call on Keir Starmer to launch inquiry into Morgan McSweeney donations row”
——————————————-
Is this the same SNP that has not revealed where £600,000 of donations went?
That’s a different story.
Morgan, allegedly, has been taking in secret donations from wealthy donors to destroy the labour party from within. For his grand efforts in getting Sir Keir into power on a tissue of lies (he’d already harvested labour opinions in order to polish his presentation as leader) He was made his right hand (unelected) man. A very lucrative & powerful role & his connections are equally as shady & given one in particular we can see where all the fascist, censorship & crack down bullshit is emanating from.
UK politics is as corrupt as fck…what a nest of vipers.
Watch Double Down News vid for full details by the investigative journalist who is actually a journalist for once & not a typist for the government.
“That’s a different story”
Naw, Barbs, it’s really nae.
“UK politics is as corrupt as fck”
Wee, progressive Scotland is still leading the charge. No other part of the UK has yet conspired to imprison a former leader on trumped up charges.
Starmer has had a nightmare year, but every one in his government who has been found wanting has been shown the door. If the accusations against Morgan McSweeney stick, he’ll be shown the door too.
Compare and contrast the situation in Scotland, where the only things shown to the Salmond conspirators, the jam jar bolloxers, etc. have been pay rises, lucrative pensions or generous pay offs.
“getting Sir Keir into power on a tissue of lies”
More nonsense from you. Starmer got into power because he’s not the Tories – no less and no more. Tribalism at its worst. Another curse that Scotland excels at, with you being an exemplar, as we see daily when we are fire-hosed with your verbal diarrhea.
Here’s hoping that the Hateful McHate is an early riser and today’s breakfast consists of a family sized portion of STFU.
If I am an early riser, Bob, that’s strictly between me and the missus.
Awa an bag a few Munros or something else that will exhaust you. Take your mind off things. Your over-active imagination is leading you into some verra strange places.
“Wee, progressive Scotland is still leading the charge. No other part of the UK has yet conspired to imprison a former leader on trumped up charges.”
Haven’t they? Are you sure about that? Their long, long history of overseas activities would suggest otherwise & I’m sure Corbyn & Corbynites within the Labour party would challenge your bullshit too. They were hounded out the party on jumped up charges as well as them & their family receiving death threats.
& You know for a fact do you that they weren’t the architects of the Salmond affair? Their wee permanent secretary sitting head of their wee admin outpost, throwing copious amounts of money despite legal advice they’d kack aw on him worth a shit. Go ahead anyway – would also suggest otherwise.
Off you trot, ya rocket. Lawfare, unless you haven’t noticed, is rife. It’s the new tactic by Oligarchs. If they can’t buy politicians then drown them in legal wrangling for years & get them off the scene.
The new Corbyn party needs to clean house immediately cause its looking like they’ve already infiltrated & found it’s weak spot. That’s what the UK establishment is good at. No flies on them. Someone else is paid handsomely for their services – usually a title & a seat in their glorified day centre.
“Haven’t they?”
Naw. They hivnae.
“Are you sure about that?”
Quite sure.
Heart-breaking that your dream team of Jezza and the dried fruit bint hasn’t worked out, Barbs 🙂 But now that G@za has been recognised, perhaps they could both go there and explore the tunnels for a year or two.
I hear they’re just about the only places left that still have roofs!
It’s the same thing – only it’s not. The missing SNP money is just outright theft (in my opinion). The Labour Party being financially manipulated to produce a political outcome and push the party into radically different ways is far more sinister.
Every MSP is a Unionist, when they all swear allegiance to the UK’s head of state / English Crown and uphold English Crown in Westminster sovereignty – so they can rake in the cash.
I’ll try this one again….
“Every single list vote cast for them will count for nothing. Scores of gleeful Unionists will troop into Holyrood sniggering at SNP voters’ stupidity.”
Maybe that’s what the want. No challengers. No one pushing them for indy.
Look at their record & all the chances they’ve blown. Not just the party but the membership too.
So I guess the question is, who would that regional vote be for if not the SNP. I despise the SNP, but I will never ever vote for a unionist party. Last Scottish election, I didn’t vote at all, but that feels wrong.
Alba are a joke, I have never seen ISP on the ballot in my area, and there might be a couple ragtag groupings who have split from Alba. So its all very well to say that the list vote is wasted on the pathetic SNP, but I don’t see where else it could go.
“So its all very well to say that the list vote is wasted on the pathetic SNP, but I don’t see where else it could go.”
There will be numerous ‘Liberate Scotland’ candidates standing, with one thing on their agenda – independence:
link to barrheadboy.com
The SNP policy of promoting the second vote for them is a policy designed to prevent an independence majority
It is a pro unionist policy.
In 2021 some 1.9 million SNP list votes delivered 2 seats. Had that vote been given to Alba it would have deliver around 25 to 30 independence seats and a super independence majority in Parliament.
But no, the SNP policy was to denycand independence majority, and use the system to support Tory and Labour unionists.
And they are still at it. But on many ways the electorate have been stupid in allowingvthemselves to be duped by a pernicious ipso facto anti independence SNP.
A super independence majority can be won in 2026 but you don’t secure it by giving your second vote to the SNP.
SNP 1 yes to maximise the constituency seats and independence candidate 2 to maximise the list seats.
I’ve had a look at that link, Alf. It doesn’t tell me very much (spotted an obvious typo, so it does tell me a better proof reader could help).
What does “one thing on their agenda – independence” actually mean?
If we wake up on the morning after the May 2026 HR election and discover that a majority of MSPs are members of Liberate Scotland, then what happens?
UDI? Cap in hand to WM to ask for a referendum? 5 years of futile gum bumping and stuffing the salaries into ISAs? What?
It seems to me, that if the hope is to seize hearts and minds, and not just preach to the already converted, that ordinary apolitical Scots will want to clearly know what their vote is intended to achieve. (They might also want to know that their everyday concerns are in good hands – the SNHS, the bins, the potholes, all that good stuff that is part and parcel of the daily responsibilities of our MSPs).
I recognise that this can be complicated, and there is always the risk of turning off those with truncated attention spans. But I’m sure our generous host would be up for giving you some space to lay out how this is all going to work.
One thing on the agenda?
We have the What and Why. Give us the When, How, Where and Who as well.
“What does “one thing on their agenda – independence” actually mean?”
Independence means decolonization, according to the UN, which is why the UN has committees designed for that purpose; and this is also what I found in my research of the Scottish situation including a review and a analysis of postcolonial theory drawn from the experience of many former colonies now UN member states, as outlined here:
link to cpb-us-w2.wpmucdn.com
Willie
I think it’s more sinister than that.
They prefer Unionists. No one to challenge them in Holyrood or push them down an independence road they simply don’t want to go down.
We all know too that the membership has been captured & they’re Unionists. Time & time again they’ve rejected a Plebiscite approach & rejecting the leaders offering it.
The SNP also has it’s unionist voters because they like their policies, safe in the knowledge if a ref was ever to occur – they could still vote no. To them, SNP is the new Labour party 2.
Every party needs to start somewhere so ppl should give the list seat to a real Pro indy candidate if they’re Pro indy. Just not the Greens & SNP – that’ll end up in the bin.
So if the SNP were a party of independence all they need to do to squeeze out the unionists is don’t stand candidates on the list. Jeez.
Ochone! Ochone! Ochone-a-me! Help ma boab! Some yin caw the polis… thers been anither MURDER – and this time the victim is… the English wit. Stone cold deid it be, may God receive wi a wee bit kindness its hertless and humourless soul.
I’m a 99 and 3/4 years frail auld pensioner (it seems like just the other day I was a spritely 80 years young and posting ma drivel on here) with health issues who has been threatened – multiple times now on this place – with MURDER MAIST FOWL!
I’m no chicken, but I’ve been made terrified and doddery, shaky and shoogly, wobbly and discombobulated by aw the thriets o’ MURDER made agin me here.
I can barely turn the pages o’ ma wee and weel-thumbed pocket bible (written maistly in braw Scots wi a smidgeon o’ Aramaic and a dash o’ Greek here and ther and signed by the heid yin himsel) such is the state o’ ma nerves.
Sometimes, though, just putting up with all the colonialists swaggerin’ aboot this place is in itsel pure MURDER – especially when some of them have a go at telling jokes or try to be clever or humorous or logical or rational in any way.
I’m fast approaching my last few puffs of steam on here, I think.
Unfortunately, unlike Holyrood and aw it’s wee – I suspect stinky and smelly and unhygienic – mingin’ hingers-oan aw liberally doused in the scent o’ yon ‘parfum de Westminster’, and Scotland’s public institutions and… ach, the list goes on and on, my train disna run on imperial gravy and I’m low on common coal for the boiler.
Ach, I might soon enough be checkin’ in tae the Chatanooga Choo Choo Hotel fir a guid nicht’s sleep.
“I’m no chicken”
You were posting like one just the other day.
Hateful one.
Under the belt, even for your (extremely) low standards.
As a novel once said;
“begone foul sprite to the lowest level of hell your black soul slithered out off”..
Basically means yer a sh1te noising up genuine posters with genuine interests in Scotlands future.
You?
Nah; yer a troll sado dancing to Unionist strings..
If you can’t handle truth you might be better off finding a new hobby, YC.
NC was squawking like a chicken over some imagined threats he thought he read on here. Threatening to inform the moderators.
You were encouraging him to get the polis involved.
The Clype & the Dobber. That’s you two.
Not playground insults – facts-based descriptions.
Incidentally, my “genuine interests in Scotland’s future” involve doing my bit to ensure that the utter feckwits who have been dragging the country down since 2014 are shunted right out of the way. Them and their congenitally feckwitty supporters.
There is no advantage in the real world accruing from wanging oan aboot Picts. Nor is there a hope in Hell that forcing the majority of the population to learn and use a language they know nothing of (Scots) will materially advance Indy or help with our everyday problems in any way whatsoever.
Have you tried crochet? I hear it’s very relaxing and the needles are blunt – no risk of anything unpleasant happening. Maybe you and NC could swap patterns. Even knit each other reinforced codpieces to ward off the below-the-belt blows you read online!
For those who do not read the comments on Wings everyday I thought it would be helpful to summarise the salient, pertinent, helpful and accurate postings from the likes of Geri, Cheyne, Confused, The Twat, Northcode, James and Young Lochinvar over the last couple of months-
That should about cover it.
And your point is caller?
Anyway I thought you were going to the US?
Don’t tell us they knocked you back!?
Oh dear..
LIBERATION SCOTLAND GENEVA REPORT via IndyScotNews YouTube.
Informative and encouraging feedback from panel with Alf Baird, Sara Salyers, Craig Murray, and Alex Thorburn. Chaired by Norrie Hunter.
Well done guys. You have raised a bright torch in the night. Watch your backs.
youtu.be/nUYURD6RUYk?si=gBuEuRh6L04eKJVD
YOUTUBE OF GENEVA SPEECH by PROFESSOR ROBERT BLACK KC.
[Robert Black KC FRSE, Emeritus Professor of Scots Law at the University of Edinburgh, General Editor of ‘The Laws of Scotland: Stair Memorial Encyclopedia’ (25 volumes) from 1987 to 1996.]
In the panel discussion linked to in my previous comment, in answer to Norrie Hunter’s question about just how consequential Professor Robert Black KC’s public commitment to the cause is, Craig Murray has the following to say (about 1 hr 26 mins ff) —
« I think it is very important for people to understand just who Robert Black KC is. And, I mean, he is the greatest living authority on Scots law — he literally wrote the book — he has been the editor of the compendium of Scots Law. He’s an extremely authoritative voice. The fact that he states that he is very definitely a convert and that he was brought up to believe the standard legal narrative about what happened with the Act of Union, the Treaty of Union, and how subsequently a new state was formed, and that he has come to find that on the basis of fact – and this is important – on the basis of the facts of what actually happened, the standard narrative is factually untrue and the British government claims are factually untrue — that really has been ground-changing. And it makes it very difficult for most people who want to claim we are daft or inventing things — when you have the greatest authority on the very subject under discussion stating that we are correct. So it has been something of a a game-changer. »
youtu.be/8cGi7Q-EcyU?si=7UpghUT1-tnMoXSl
Interesting article, Stu. Clear enough for most, one imagines.
One thing that is less clear though: who should Scottish voters be giving their second vote to – and why?
You’ve already discounted the SNP for entirely pragmatic reasons of their not getting any list seats (under Holyrood’s absurd D’Hontd methodology, gimme FPTP any day of the week). In addition, there’s the more germane point that no sane person with eyes to see with should ever countenance giving the SNP their first – let alone their second vote, for self-evident reasons, which I know you advocate very strongly and with good reason.
However, what of the other alternatives? We can pretty much discount the Scottish Greens, again for self-evident reasons, and I’d argue the woke Lib Dems also. Labour are making a bigger fist of government than even I dreaded, so that’s them emphatically out too.
That leaves the right wing Conservative and Reform parties – and Alba. Do you honestly see present-day Alba as an electable party of government? Do they even have the resources to field a candidate in every constituency? I thought they were list votes only (at best).
The Conservatives are (rightly) finished as a party, so that pretty much leaves Reform, who I expect to make a major electoral impact even in Scotland. People up and down the land have had enough; the political sea change is palpable.
From an Indy Scot perspective, there simply isn’t a capable and credible political party out there to successfully navigate and execute such an undertaking, for anything like the foreseeable future (i.e. within at least a 10-year timescale and probably much longer).
Reform are Tories who inflicted Brexshit on Scotland despite 62% voting remain.
They’ve no intention of removing cheap labour & every intention of flogging the NHS & green lighting fracking in Scotland to their chums I’ll bet.
They’ve hee-haw chance of removing immigration either. To do so would upset their secret donors who require cheap labour.
What has Reform done so far in Westminster, Wales, Scotland , local councils, London assembly & police commission so far? Can you name anything ground breaking?
“green lighting fracking in Scotland to their chums I’ll bet”
If you bet, take your money oot the bank, Barbie, and invest now. You’ll make a killing.
“What has Reform done so far”
Saw a bloke in a frock and called him a man.
That’s more than the SNP ever did. That’s enough to get the first million or so Scottish votes. No doubt they can build it up from there.
Brexit again, Barbie? For a so-called Scottish patriot you really do seem to wang oan and oan about the good old days when we were ruled from Brussels.
That, and any possibility of my country being starved of your precious Navids, are recurring themes.
Anything you want to get aff yer chest, Barbs?
@Geri
I agreed with your post of 11:45pm
But now you made the same mistake as John Swinney did at FMQs. Blaming it on Brexit, Covid and so on. The staff shortages that result in the poor performance stats in the SNHS are caused by indigenous educated Doctors leaving for foreign shores. Even Lesley whatishername got frustrated on BBC Scotland FMQs. These are solvable problems the “Do Nothing” is no longer a viable option. 819 apologies by the FM is that a Holyrood record?.
“Reform are Tories”
Well, that’s (literally) not the case, but aside from being demonstrably factually incorrect, the spirit of your comment is also similarly flawed. Yes, Reform is a right wing party and so are the Conservatives, but that doesn’t make them the same. Labour, the SNP, the Scottish Greens, Alba and Lib Dems are all left wing parties (painfully so), but no sane person is ever going to claim they’re all the same thing either.
Besides the obvious, it is clear that Reform – and Farage in particular – loathes the Conservative Party, and there are highly distinct policy differences between the two (insofar as the Tories have any discernible policies under Badenoch, or indeed her recent predecessors who proudly sported blue rosettes but did not deliver right wing policies).
No doubt you also allude to recent (limited) high profile Conservative defections, but these have hardly been en masse and the individuals concerned all hark from the hard right flank of the broad Conservative church. Perhaps my memory fails me, but I have no recollection of mainstream Conservatives talking about large scale deportations of many hundreds of thousands (and not even in glib terms, but with very specific actions such as withdrawing from the ECHR among other things – a clear methodology as opposed to meaningly aspiration or wishful thinking). There have been high profile SNP defections to Alba, but Alba isn’t the SNP either, far from it (not in a good way btw).
“who inflicted Brexshit on Scotland despite 62% voting remain.”
That’s democracy for you, Geri. I didn’t support Brexit either (albeit now, with the full benefit of hindsight and in particular, noting the even more parlous state of key EU economies, notably France as a basket case, I’m far more agnostic about it).
It really is a case of sucking it up, moving on and making the best of it – being grown ups, basically. Fat chance with the current Political Class, especially in Scotland’s case. I’m sure even you and I can agree that they’re a bunch of total no-hopers one and all.
“They’ve no intention of removing cheap labour ”
Again, categorically wrong. If Reform wanted cheap foreign immigrant labour, why are they going to such extraordinary (high risk) lengths not only to stop the influx, but reverse it via removing the so-called (and aptly named) “Boris Wave”? If they are indeed pro-immigrant then they’ve got a bloody strange way of showing it (lol). You can’t actually be serious?
“every intention of flogging the NHS & green lighting fracking in Scotland to their chums I’ll bet.”
No, what they are (rightly) proposing to do is radically reform the NHS to emulate the best-performing private sector insurance-based European systems, as opposed to the awful 1940s nationalised money pit healthcare system we do have that’s inarguably unfit for purpose. Good! It is needed! We NEED politicians to have a PLAN, a discernible direction and to be brave!
As for “green lighting fracking”, you honestly see this as a bad thing? You prefer Ed “bacon sandwich” to switch off all the offshore oil as well – and Scotland’s refinery whilst he’s at it – all in the name of “net zero” BS even as China builds more coal-powered power stations than ever (look it up) and the rest of the world laughs at us? As our pensioners freeze, and even hardworking people can’t afford to run their central heating AND feed their families? And after all that, we still just buy someone else’s oil and gas, transporting it halfway around the globe?
People like me, and millions like me, have had enough of this childish sub-6th form lefty garbage. As I said in my OP, the sea change is palpable and finally – the British public is sufficiently minded for change. The absurd woke zeitgeist is done, on all fronts. GOOD.
“They’ve hee-haw chance of removing immigration either.”
They’ve provided a tangible route map for achieving this; removing ourselves from the ECHR and repealing key Acts of Parliament. With predictable shrieks of horror from the metropolitan left Guardian crowd. Neither you, nor anyone else can therefore claim they have “hee haw” chance of achieving their stated and planned for aim. We shall see, won’t we?
“What has Reform done so far in Westminster, Wales, Scotland , local councils, London assembly & police commission so far? Can you name anything ground breaking?”
Well, it’s a bit difficult to do that with 5 MPs in WM (and none at all in HR), wouldn’t you say? Ask me the same question in a year or two (yes that’s right), when Reform has 250+ MPs.
As for ground breaking, I’d say their vocal, high profile, radical policies such as those I mention above are fairly eyebrow-raising, wouldn’t you? Very much in stark contrast, say, with the SNP under Swinney, or Alba for that matter.
Btw, I note that neither you, nor any of the other respondents here has answered my question: who should Scottish voters be giving their second vote to – and why? Do you honestly see present-day Alba as an electable party of government? Do they even have the resources to field a candidate in every constituency?
Shilling for FishFace again, cave dweller?
The useless Tory c*nt that brought us Brexshit?
Be great to see the clown chased out of our capital city again….
George
The sonographer I recently spoke to was packing up her family & moving to New Zealand. She was done with the NHS & COVID sealed the deal. She’d have better pay & conditions elsewhere & her young family have better prospects.
Another full time nurse was also packing it in. She was fully qualified to serve in any hospital department she was sent to, yet during COVID vaccination program she’d to listen to dentists buying their second home out the proceeds they were earning from volunteering. Her words “I’m obviously in the wrong job – all we get is a round of applause”
I dunno how Scotland can fix those problems on an allowance.
What reasons do they give you for wanting to leave?
The UK is a crap place to live. Especially for young ppl just starting out. I think I’d move too.
“I think I’d move too”
Send poot some more pics. Maybe spice them up a little more this time.
Never give up on your dreams, Barbie! This time next year you could be living it big in Mos cow.
How about you show him there’s more to you than just smouldering desire by outlining a plan by which he can stop our fighting friends in the east shredding his oil and gas infrastructure every night?
He’s never gonna build that big pipeline to his Covid pals when one cheap drone will blow it to bits, is he Barbs?
Grok & DeepSeek
Q.
In the 2026 Holyrood election, how should I use my two votes (constituency + list) to maximize pro-independence MSPs and secure a supermajority?
A.
Scottish polls show slim indy majority for 2026 Holyrood.
But here’s the hack:
Shift SNP’s “wasted” list votes to Alba,
SNP still crushes 57 seats, Alba grabs 24 lists—pro-indy supermajority of 93/129 MSPs.
Game-changer for #IndyRef2
“…salient, pertinent, helpful and accurate postings from the likes of Geri, Cheyne, Confused, The Twat, Northcode, James and Young Lochinvar… ”
Yes, indeed.
The magnificent seven ride again to help liberate local independentistas from a bunch of thieving bandits.
Sane, rational, reflective readers must always avoid the temptation to jump to conclusions when faced with something like Northcode’s post here.
At first glance, it’s a standard tongue-in-cheek, yah-boo, tribal shout of belonging. The writer is saying: “Look, I know they’re all utter and irredeemable douchebags, but they’re MY douchebags, and because they’re MINE, I HAVE to love them as if they were my own kith and kin”.
But there’s a far more intriguing explanation that we shouldn’t discount:
It’s possible, (concerning, frightening, implausible, ultimately deeply dispiriting), but possible nevertheless that the writer does really mean what he has just written.
Don’t rush to write off my post until you have thought about it for a little longer. Seriously.
The, if you think I am right, weep for what Scotland has become.
When a friend of mine went on holiday to Cyprus, I emailed his hotel and asked them to remind him to administer an anal douche. This post reminds me of that although I don’t really remember it anyway and I. Not sure why.
With courage, camaraderie and the will for independence
I will be James Coburn, the rest of you can improvise, it’s all good anyway, just cool dudes being cool, with a ripping soundtrack …
I see CHAS has had a good feed of late
– top tip, you have to put him on your shoulder (Ellis, Main, talking to you), to “burp” him
And Beggan, buzzes like a fly in a room – SOMEONE OPEN A FUCKING WINDOW
the “nigels” are not sending their best. Or maybe they are, which is why this country is so fucked up.
“we deal in lead, friend …”
Voting in Scotland becomes very complicated when they are all unionist parties faking a different colour rosette,
Behind the scenes there in it together,
And if you do not happen to have anyone in your area standing on simply independence and our representatives are not registered in Scotland but in England,
Our Scottish devolved government is also under the legislation and statues of Englands parliament, and the crown of England,
Scottish representatives parties to vote for in Scotland will always bring english unionist registered representatives parties running the Scottish devolved parliament along with the same civil servant selection and Secretary of State for Scotland the England registered SNP and the same colonial overlords.
The screen and mirrors devolved parliament in Scotland could not have a better replication of a Sheep in wolves clothing when it comes to voting for Scottish democracy.
If it was not a Faux parliament but a real Scottish parliament, we would have independence already would we not?
And pointing that anomaly out for a corrupt voting system for a devolved parliament to Scotland candidiate parties representation for Scotland can only bring enlightenment at the way things are colonised here.
A real Scotland parliament if a parliamentary union is the belief and not a dissolved one in the 1700s might be the soluting.
seeing as England has retained its parliament for hundreds of years since prior to the supposed parliamentary union in 1706/07.
We faking it, and England is faking it. And the political parties in Scotland are faking. And how long we will all go along pretending we have a real Scottish parliament, goodness knows.
Just saying.
We by default, are voting for English registered political parties representation for Scotland. That probably will never vote for Scotland to become independent while they run the pretendy parliament under England parliament instructions, registration, legislation, Statues, and reserved matters.
That includes the SNP. And all that sit in the devolved parliament.
roundup, selected
arsonist, calls for review, after spate of fires
link to archive.ph
most american prods are mad bastards, but this pastor nails it
link to x.com
“go there!” – it is hard to explain politics in the west, the things they do; but it all makes sense if our democracy is just a blackmail operation
trump “drain the swamp” is in the swamp up to his armpits, with probably a terabyte of mpegs of him performing; then he gets money from miriam adelson
palantir is this hideously insidious spying software which is being employed by the world’s spooks to slurp up all data, then do a maximum entropy bayesian analysis to conclude, via statistical analysis that because you clicked on link a, and liked post b then … you are a fucking terrorist, and the drone is on its way
link to archive.ph
– also being trained to hunt for “anti semites”. Trouble is, the way issy is going, this will be the entire human race by next week.
This is a long read; TLDR – the internet, especially social media, is a sewer and you need to be very careful about how you use it; all of this activity is not random, and it must cost a fortune, so there is a malign intent about it all. The author goes swimming in places I wouldn’t even dip my toe in; use the index to skip to personal relevance.
link to archive.ph
the internet is a surveillance and disinformation network, but it was designed that way; all the investment in computer tech stems from when the UK and US tapped the soviet phones lines in berlin after ww2; they got a vast trove of data, the challenge being to organise it – hence the huge contracts to develop the chips, the memory, the algorithms. Telstar was a spy satellite, and from that moment the americans went big on “sigint”, since they were so bad at “humint” (which the soviets excelled at, and the british thought they were experts at, but weren’t). Brezinski wrote a prescient book in the 70s talking of the “technotronic era”, he knew what was coming down; when you know that moore’s law will continue to hold for another 3 decades, you can extrapolate accurately. Nowadays everyone carries a tracking device, which they enthusiastically paid for, and most of whom could not live without.
“this will be the entire human race by next week”
And there we have it. Unless Confused is claiming Da Dews are going to turn antisemitic by next week, we get a window opened into Confused’s world view.
Da Dews aren’t part of the human race.
Maybe the drone idea isn’t so bad. Anybody who ever enthused about building their own gas chambers might be on the target list.
Plenty of people really don’t want to see the gas chambers again.
Imagine if India had been offered independence in 1947, only for Jawaharlal Nehru to admit sheepishly that he wanted the British to stay in charge after all. Or if apartheid had been abolished in South Africa, only for Nelson Mandela to say with an embarrassed cough that it would be best if it actually carried on for the foreseeable. The SNP (and their supporters) seem to be exactly like this, only real.
Labour in freefall. It’s a very long time till May especially if your Starmer the self reliever. I have very confidence in this politician to totally mess up.
Interesting to see that Gordon M Hay has now completed, after some 17 years, the mammoth task of putting the entire Bible into Doric, which it seems is experiencing a revival in the Scots language stakes.
Another contender for a new national language to finally lead us to independence, perhaps.
Scotland cannot vote for independence whilst under a Colonial infrastructure , legislation and Statues of Westminster parliament of England, no matter whom is in the devolved parliament, with small clauses such as we cannot vote on Union matters being reserved, nor do we have a say on wether it would be binding or not if we did all vote for independence,
It has nothing to do with how Scots vote. Doh.
That is why Scots are coming to the conclusion that they are Colonised rather than in a voluntary 1706/07 parliamentary treaty of union,
Whom would vote for a party that knew rapists were active as gang members. Before labour did,
And whom would vote for the previous party that had phedophillia asociations And whom would vote for a party that promised that Scotland would not become independent on there watch.
Whom would vote for a green party that makes one of the highest energy bills….. in Scotland.
And whom would vote for a party that has had umpteem mandates for independence but still pretends it is a SNP.
And all registered in England
That is not a choice in Scotland for Scotland,
Bravo!
Ignore the uni-trolls btw..
Just a wee reminder,
The parliament of Scotland was dissolved from the political parliamentary treaty of union by the parliament of England and the monarch of England.
The parliament of Scotland has not been in the treaty for hundreds of years.
Asking for friend. Can I go and do something else when we get 20 posts from Cheyne? Everytime a thread has prospects and genuine debate. It’s nullified.
Don’t be a troll. Scroll on by.
Your behaviour on here recently, George, isn’t too good imo.
Sam you need to get out there and meet people.It’s a big world out there. Make some friends, interact with humans, make eye contact. It’s a fascinating experience.
@Sam
The young totally conditioned some might even say brainwashed are represented by Sam. Forget evidence from the Royal Emergency College of Emergency Medicine of 800 plus avoidable death’s. My behaviour on this site goes back to my dead Mother. An Independence supporter. The Scottish Government have 23 Genders I have 2. So you asked me the other day about evidence on the SNHS? My son has gone (Reckoned to be one of the Best A and E Doctors in Scotland) . My niece nurse has gone. Another niece has given given up. We have 2 GPs left and 2 working nurses and none of them will be in post this time next year but let’s Do Nothing! It’s working not!
Aye, sam. Some seem rather too eager to shut down discussion they don’t approve of, whilst adding little if any other discussion stimulating content of their own.
I thought George would be too busy organising his visa and or immigration papers to the USA to post on here…
Meanwhile, we head towards another winter when far too many Scots will yet again have to endure cold living conditions in a country with a myriad energy generation sources.
George I notice you get very angry at James Cheyne’s posting so many comments but I have not noticed the same anger at the numerous repetitive drivel in EVERY post by hatey mcfuckwit or mark beggar, James is posting historical information albeit not all correct, hatey mcfuckwit and the beggar are just posting constant NEGATIVITY and insults, I know what I prefer
@Twathater
I am not very angry at Cheynes posts but it does block reasonable debate. We are in a whole lot of trouble. Stu put up a post that was worthy of debate. I got there a long time ago. I couldn’t make the numbers work for me but my wife has changed her opinion on me standing as an MSP. 100 votes it doesn’t matter. That’s why we have been married for decades.She gets the Independence passion.
Don’t tell me!-do you actually read it’s mince? The sane and sensible stopped doing that years ago.
However, I do agree, that there is nothing worse than looking at the comments section and seeing the name Cheyne again and again. Almost as bad as seeing Geri, Confused, the Twat etc.
“Chas”; If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you, and may posterity forget that ye were once our countrymen.
The free ticket offer still stands.
Do us all a favour and do one.
What’s so wrong with James C. I don’t follow all she says, however she’s posting researched arguments in favour of achieving an independent Scotland (possibly she’d say recognising that the position already exists) on a site dedicated to that end.
Besides, I like her. If her posts don’t appeal just scroll on by. I’ve yet to see her insult or abuse other posters, which puts her way ahead of many of the intemperate BTL posters on here.
@Dan 6:07pm
That’s a hugely disappointing post from you. Of course I now have permission from my wife to stand as an MSP. (its a bit late but its her money as well) Will you ? You can laugh at my returns but I as my wife says I have to get Independence bug out of our system. It’s a truly seminal moment for Scotland. You won’t be able to blame 2014. A vote for Independence candidates instead of the SNP in 2026. Let’s put in to test.
@ George at 6:07 pm
I’ll tell you what were disappointing posts… A couple of months back, someone stating you’d have to spend around £120k to stand for election next year. Which was just crap that would put people off standing.
link to electoralcommission.org.uk
And yet more disappointing over the years is that pretty much nobody on the supposedly most read Scottish politics blog has bothered to thrash out the rather important detail of just what election to use as a plebiscite for returning Scotland to self-governing status.
The poundshop devolved parliament next year with little time to properly prepare for, significant issues of franchise / voting system comprehension of electorate, double the number of elected personnel, and erring into reserved matters.
Or keep it simple stupid option of Westminster with FPTP, 56 candidates, and more time to prepare.
Years wasted to progress Scotland’s cause, and yet my post is hugely disappointing. Maybe some perspective is needed.
The plebiscitary election route was a policy endorsed by Ash Regan during her leadership bid in early 2023.
That will be 3+ years in the past by May 2026.
So I’m not buying the “little time to properly prepare” excuse.
Anybody seriously wanting to use this as a democratically fair way of pushing for Indy has actually had all the time since 2014.
Update yer bot, crappyface.
It was actually rejected before that. Angus B McNiel proposed plan B for 2019 GE.
It was perfect timing. We were out of the EU the following January & the prospect of a thumping Bojo majority loomed large off the back of a disastrous term by Mayhem.
That’s when it became obvious the takeover of the SNP was complete. Sturgeon bottled it & so did her delegates. He was literally booked off stage.
The following Holyrood elections (2021)- She was more interested in projecting all her own traits & faults onto Salmond & actually admitted live on telly that she’d rather work with Unionists than Alba. When folk show you who they really are – believe them the first time.
Totally agree, Sven.
James Cheyne is lovely and a true supporter of Scotland, the Scots, and Scottish independence.
As Sam says – folk only need to scroll on by if they aren’t interested in the subject matter. And that’s true for every comment posted here.
This is Ignore/Scream in action.
Your second example doesn’t work, Andy.
There’s plenty of justification for saying that most of the indigenous peoples of the Republic Of South Africa would be a lot better off today if the ANC had been defeated by the then established government.
We could argue all day what the fundamental differences between Indians and Africans might be. Perhaps it all comes down to politics. If a people can’t rustle up decent political leadership, then they are fecked.
When we look at Scotland and our political leadership we see that everything is going pear-shaped. Maybe we Scots are just not capable of running our own affairs like the Indians can.
Cue the usual playground insults. But ask any of the playground kids to name one outstanding Scottish political leader, other than Salmond, then it’s tumbleweed time.
@Dan 7:27 pm
I will tell what disappoints me. Somehow that doesn’t have the intellect to understands Electoral Commission rules. I could spend £10 million now. What is important is the long and short spending rules after, I say again, after the Notice of Election. The SNP have been at this for years. I should know I delivered all their Christmas Calendars totally undeclarable in their subsequent Election. My quote was for a professional marketing strategy but we can’t afford that so I will stand and get the innovative strategy that was lacking in the latest Scottish report today. My wife thinks I will get 100 votes but then again you are not even standing on Independence ticket. No excuse after 2026. Are you Morgan McSweeney? He didn’t understand the rules either.
Good on you, George, and Mrs Ferguson for backing you. Will you be joining up with the other independents under the Liberate Scotland umbrella? In my view that would maximise your chances, and those of the cause.
@Sarah
Perhaps Sarah I will stand on an Independence ticket. And will communicate with others doing the same. My wife understood her husband was unhappy when we pulled out. I have a limited budget but let’s be optimistic like you always are.
@ George: you have to try. “If not me, who? If not now, when?” kind of thing. Scotland is in desperate straits as the UK establishment gets worse and worse, ethically and economically.
I hope to see a crowdfunder before too long. The independents, ISP and others all ran them – quite rightly.
You will get a great deal of practical as well as moral support by being in a group. Sally Hughes comments btl here from time to time – her Perth experience may be useful.
Lord Palmerston once said:
“Only three people have ever really understood the Schleswig-Holstein business – the Prince Consort, who is dead – a German professor, who has gone mad – and I, who have forgotten all about it.”
@sarah 9:46 pn
I realise that and thank you I was ordained as an Elder in 1987. I have three degrees but when I see my seed leaving this country. I have to get involved. I will stand in 2026 as an Independence Candidate, after that the SNP have to explain why their not an Independence party. And yes I am also a combat service veteran.(Spearhead Battlion) Let’s see if I get over 100 votes.
Well George, well done for your service.
The Tories on here are generally the first to denigrate someone’s service, or in my case, active service with 3rd armoured airmobile brigade awaiting the Ruskie hordes some tw8ts on here still fantasise about as well as pounding the streets in op Banner.
Don’t always agree with everything you say but support the whole concept of independent independence candidates/ elected members.
@ George Ferguson: Sally Hughes 679, Eva Comrie 881 – both Independents for Independence in 2024 election. I reckon you’ll get over 100!
I am very sorry that your children have left Scotland – for you and the family, and for Scotland. As I said in a letter to my local paper, if we were independent, Scots abroad would flock back as there would be so much work available. Let us hope your children will be coming home before too long.
@Young Lochinvar 11:07
Royal Green Jackets myself. Sent to Northern Ireland by a Labour Home Secretary Roy Jenkins. Labour Governments love Wars. Mid 70s at the height. An invaluable experience for me. Taught me discipline.
I think we can understand each other brother.
@ YL 11.29pm funny enough I don’t see the same denigration or derision posted by Hatey Mcfuckwit about George Ferguson’s service in the army as the denigration and derision meted out on your service record YL , perhaps Hatey Mcfuckwit being a member of the 77th brigade respects George’s unit but doesn’t respect your service
Ye’ve goat the wrang glasses oan, Twat H.
These are yer lookers. Ye need yer readers. They’re oan yer heid, durrrr! Man, fit are ye like?
Mind yer distance pair. They’re doon by the po. Ye dinna want tae …
Awwww, too late. That’s gonna reek fer days noo.
I assume neither of you has the Gaelic.
‘No great mischief if they fall’
Has the Gaelic what?
If it has disappeared, almost certainly some bid bad English barsteward took it and ran away.
TH @ 2.53
I get where you are coming from; but given he/ she/ it/ bot is a full-on f4ckwit then best ignored.
As for military service; I’m not hanging on by my fingernails waiting for the approval of an armchair warrior who either wouldn’t, couldn’t or daren’t cut the mustard to do something more than just cheer on wars vicariously from the sidelines.
As for the gibberish it spouts, just see its efforts to your post!
Total roaster and mong..
@Young Lochinvar
I think we can. I think about the people (brothers) I served with, as you have called all the time. Although we called them buddies back in the day. Still thinking about them 50 years later.
Pass Laws folks whilst we witter about independence.
That’s what is apparently being announced today by Starmer – mandatory ID cards.
Mandatory ID required of everyone is the absolute basis of the hated apartheid South Africa pass laws.
It is the basis of control.tThe basis by which people can be restricted and controlled.
Access onto transport be it bus, train, plane or boat denied or allowed depending on status.
Access to services be it medical centres, a hospital, shopping mall, a schools, colleges, banks, or the purchase of certain goods. All controlled, granted or denied and all tracked.
But its for our good. To stop the boat people. But who are the boat people – us?
That sadly is the reality of where we are headed. Like South Africa of old, pass laws coupled with today’s electronic and all pervasive surveillance will be more effective than folks can imagine.
Independence, aye right. That boat has sailed.
Good post, Willie.
It goes without saying that any legislation such as this could be stopped in its tracks by the opposition making a cast-iron promise that when they get in, probably in 4 years time, it will be repealed.
And that therefore, all the expense and effort will have been a total waste.
Yet the opposition never does this. Makes you think, eh?
That aside though, I’ve gone from being totally against ID cards to reluctantly in favour. Nobody knows how many illegals there are in the UK. Some suggest there are millions.
If this is the only way to flush them out, then so be it. ID cards won’t do that on its own though – we will need our very own ICE.
Somebody wrote that our enemies have learned how to weaponise our freedoms against us. Sadly, we now have no alternative to sacrificing our freedoms if we are not to let our enemies win.
Willing to have a debate, which or what piece of information is not correct,
That the Scottish parliament was dissolved from the 1706/ 1707 political parliamentary treaty of union maybe?
Or
That the parliament of England continued to this present day.
Prior to the debate you will find both records in Hansard and on the Westminster Parliament site for homework purposes.
Willie,
The ID idea was tony Blairs mantra, and it has not gone unnoticed by many who support Scottish independence,
But if Scotland is in the treaty of union? Then in Scotland Private rights Apply, that would inlude the things you mentioned.
Because that is wrote in the treaty of union under the claim of right and the monarchy agreement not to have a dispotick head of State,
Both the bill of rights under and passed by English parliament law and the Scottish Claim of Right under and passed by the Scottish parliament law are terms, conditions and articles of the treaty if union.
Discussions on the reality of wether Scotland is in the treaty or not are detrimental to the future of protecting Scotlands people from a ever increasing dispotick government
And I was mentioning this on wings a few months back,
Ya salam!
Compulsary Digital ID for Brits and Blair Pasha of Falastin…..truly the asylum is in the hands of the inmates.
Re ID’s.
As I recall Starmer nor the labour party in general had this in or part their manifesto during the run up to election, , and no one voted them in On the basis of of IDs.
I could see the labour dispotick government being eliminated before the next general election had its due date,
There is a lot of animosity around the rest of Britain and Isles towards this idea and dispotick over reach from government, before the trial out period that is tested on the smaller nations as it usually is.
But if they cling to the idea that Scotland is in the treaty, then Scotlands people have private rights from that treaty wroteinto that treaty.
I wondered if somebody would write in to suggest that, as per usual, progressive Scotland could go its own unique way.
I foresee two possible outcomes:
1) After much huffing and puffing and spaffing of scarce Scottish taxpayers hard-earned up against the wall, the posturing eejits at HR will do their familiar climb down. Again.
2) Against all odds, our doughty fighters for our Sovereign rights succeed and as hated England sinks into the Nazi dystopia, we remain free to go about our business without ever having to present ID. And as a direct result, some millions of undocumented migrants swarm north across the border!
All things considered, if ID cards come to pass, I’m hoping we in Scotland will get with the programme. We already have our own undocumented migrants to eject.
But if we decide to “fight”, please let it be Option 1 that prevails.
Willie.
If Scotland is considered to still be in the 1706/ 07 as a international treaty then we have “Private Rights”
If Scotland is no longer in that treaty then Labours or any other political party on ID idea cannot pass into Scotland.
What Westminster cannot do if it is a international treaty, is to consider Scots law obsolete, repeal, alter, or change wording and textual words or Scots laws, after it was signed to create the State of Great Britain,
As it would breach international law of treaties.
And Westminster parliament cannot do this on its own as the parliament of and for England and Wales,
it would require the reinstatement of a real Scottish parliament, not a devolved one.
Which Westminster parliament would not wish to happen, and would avoid at all costs.
Which returns the debate full circle,
Why is there still a continued parliament for England and Wales in the created State of Great Britain, but not NO real Scotland parliament in union.
Labour, tories or any other political party may find themselves backed into a corner of their own making soon, providing the people in Scotland pay attention to the details. And apply them.
There is no treaty of Union not one that’s been ratified by England, we have no right because we do not have any form of democracy. Next year well go to the polls and vote for a lying party and when the election is over nothing changed even though we have just voted for it, its the same as our life’s we go out to work and send our money to England and before we send it we all get paid in monopoly money.
I’m embarrassed to be a Scot because we don’t ever question or seek answers to the questions we just move on as if nothing has ever happened.
Will photo ID change my or your life, no. How can we all come on here every single day and moan about the Union or the SNP and be spoon fed lies and then talk about voting in next years election, its the same circle we keep going round and round for me next years election I’m getting of this circle I’m not voting at all I’m going to stay at home and have a glass of wine and think thank god I haven’t been taken for a fool again.
Quite honestly James, what does it matter if ID and surveillance were not in the Labour Party’s manifesto. Totalitarianism and control needs no manifesto.
Was it in the manifesto that people over 65 years of age could be restricted in taking out there own money to £300 per day, with £1,200 a week maximum. And if they want more they will have to book an appointment in a bricks and mortar bank to show not just their bank card, but also ID to get money – after of course they have explained what the money is for.
That’s only a small beer of what is coming down the line.
Or the right of government to use A! to trawl everyone’s bank account to profile and assess what monies have gone through their bank account and what the profile of the spending was on and where it went. Was that in the manifesto?
Or the profiling of people’s internet behaviours, what sites they have visited, and with the ubiquitous mobile phones, where they have been. The police regularly secure tower data dumps of everyone with a mobile phone on a demonstration.
or what of the record of every car and where it has been as it passes the many tens of thousands of PSNR camera so ubiquitous on our roads. These machines can track in real time and of course the records of all vehicle movements are retained for 7 years.
Or what of the facial recognition systems that can both record and track in real time. Many folks don’t kow this but Glasgow city centre has a facial recognition system in place. And of course mandatory ID cards, integrated into the system/s will ensure a digital ID picture of everyone.
And of course police are now going to be equipped with the facility to stop and identify everyone, and pull up their history – who they are, where they stay, a person marked as to being of interest etc etc. Well they do that at border just now, so why not on the streets of Glasgow, or Edinburgh or Portree.
Only a rotten and corrupt individual like an independence supporter or an anti war supporter would object to these controls. Not many, because save for a relative few, most would walk in to the concentration camps of their free will, or more appropriately, are they in one already?
It’s maybe something folks should consider more widely or are they simply comfortable in our open, fair and democratic society as it is.
Another good post, willie.
Let me simplify, if you don’t mind.
Rather than reduce the human rights of the migrants, by getting rid of the ECHR stipulations that makes it impossible to deal with them, our government is choosing to reduce our own human rights instead.
Legal, mostly law abiding people are easier to target than illegal criminals.
So remember, the incomers rights trump yours.
And if anything kicks off, the government will preferentially go for the soft targets – the tax paying and law abiding.
Don’t anybody ever say this wasn’t obvious a few years back. At the same time everybody was creeping about in their masks, terrified in case they got a mild dose of flu, voluntarily locking themselves up for weeks on end, tens of thousands were brazenly marching about because the Minneapolis police got a bit heavy with a small-time criminal.
And nobody in authority lifted a finger.
I predict nobody will get much change out of £100 for their ID card. That’s the going rate for a passport.
I predict the rubber dinghy boys will be handed theirs for free.
I predict there will be a thriving black market in fakes for the millions of crims who are already here.
I predict the government will bring in more immigrants to “set up and administer the ID card scheme”.
I predict that before very long, some lad who you are certain could never have gone to school with you will be stopping you on a street corner, asking who you are, and wanting to know your business.
They won’t be adopting any kind of profiling – that would be against the human rights of the immigrants.
Willie,
I don’t think the polis are going to be as actively involved as that.
The digital ID will be required to prove the right to work in the UK. This means that all workers must have a digital ID to be legally employed. So it will be employers who will be checking prospective new employees.
It will be used to monitor access to services like benefits, childcare, driving licenses.
It will contain personal details like name, date of birth, nationality, residency status, and a photy.
Individuals will not be required to carry their digital ID or present it unless verifying their right to work.
My guess this system will be as fucked up as all the current systems it integrates with
“Individuals will not be required to carry their digital ID or present it”
Another of these comments that provokes the response “this boy’s having a larff!”
Because the alternative, that he sincerely believes what he just wrote, is too ridiculous for words.
It’s Palantir.
They’ll control every single aspect of daily life. What you browse. What you buy. What you can & cannot spend your own money on. The great plan of just switching off bank accounts if you don’t do as yer telt.
Any glitch in the system will be handled by an unsympathetic, unfeeling computer manning the helpline ‘The computer says no’
Start using cash again. Under the mattress is looking far safer for what these control freaks have in store.
GREAT THING ABOUT ANYTHING DIGITAL is the ability to fake it and hack it.
Hacking is the new cool thing to do in YouKay.
Contemplate a mal AI assault on your ID.
Identity gone in a nano second.
«Sorry, we have no record of you. You do not exist»
Civil Rights in total suspension.
«Happy to Help…Have a Nice Day you non person»
«Ah! mr Mickey Mouse, a thousand welcomes!»
O/T DIGITAL ID PETITION [against the idea]:
link to petition.parliament.uk
BLAIR….the guy who conspired in the totally illegal invasion of my birth country which has turned it into fiefdom of theocratic Iran.
BLAIR….the guy who believed any Scottish legislature should have no more powers than an English county council.
BLAIR….the guy with close links to the old Libyan régime for which Sarkozy is being jailed.
BLAIR….the guy who dreamed of a digital ID’ed BritState.
BLAIR….the guy touted to oversee a new Levantine state.
and Holy BLAIR…..the Catholic convert who thinks Jesus got some things wrong.
BLAIR…..the Humpty Dumpty ready to fall?
Blair who stole millions from the lottery fund.
Who stole billions from the NHS in the big Covid swindle.
And don’t say Michelle Mone. She was only a Johny-come-Lately slag who skimmed a trifling £100m or so whilst the big boys cleaned up big time.
And oh how the animals peered in the window.
Ah, how good it is to live in the fabulous democracy that we do.
The name ‘Britcard’ has unfortunate connotations for me. I think of drunken yobs on Spanish beaches or far-right supporters at rallies. I’ve never liked being called a ‘Brit’. It sounds like an insult. It’s bad enough that my EHIC card has a Union Jack draped all over it. And never mind the Scots, Welsh and Northern Irish.
Is this a squirrel to distract us from Tony Blair being put in charge of Gaza? OMG!
A bit off topic. It’s being reported that Greta’s Global flotilla had been hacked and ABBA is constantly being played.
Regarding the plan for digital I d is an abomination and must be opposed and defeated on principle that it is the government intruding into the personnel lives of the people.
Around 2013 during a period of unemployment the staff at the job centre demanded to have a copy of my bank statement which I refused and told them unless I was suspect or participant in criminal offences including possible fraud to get a warrant.
This is a bigger example of overreach,how much will each person have to pay for their card and as taxpayers to introduce and operate when we are often told of limited budgets money can be found for this obscenity.
Peter, the ID is the final part of the surveillance plan.
Access to everything from trains, planes, ferries and buses to access ofcservices be it doctor, hospital, benefits, banking, employment or access to certain areas will be linked.
This is the last piece in what can only be described as ‘ pass laws’
There will be no escape.The system is all in place. The establishment have control.
If our southern called democratic government can arm, supply, support the Israeli holocaust in Gaza, whilst featherbedding big neo liberal corporate interests, does anyone think that somehow all of this surveillance and control is for their own own good.
Economic apartheid is here and the masses are getting it whether they like it or not. And that will sadly include you Peter.
@ Wee johnny
“Another of these comments that provokes the response “this boy’s having a larff!””
“However, for students, pensioners or others not seeking work, having a digital ID will be optional.
Officials also stress it will not function like a traditional identity card: people will not be required to carry it in public.”
link to bbc.co.uk
Opens his mouth puts both feet in.
Sam believe me when I say it goes against the grain massively to agree with the Hateful tax moaner that this ID farse will seriously impact EVERYONE’S freedom and democracy for EVERYTHING
The earlier news was broadcasting that there has been an increase in the uk’s population of almost 1 million people ,that is unsustainable where are they going to house them, how are our services going to cope, how is the NHS going to cope with another million people,ALL successive governments have been claiming POVERTY and cutting back on ALL services, cutting back on things that are essential for normal life YET their answer is to introduce fucking ID cards, how will that STOP illegal people flooding our shores
I am sick of incompetent politicians and incompetent political parties telling us that there is NO WAY to stop these people coming here, I am sick of people confusing refugees and asylum seekers,I am sick of being called a racist when I VEHEMENTLY object to virtue signalling arseholes deliberately ignoring the THREAT to our communities, culture and religion
Our politicians and political parties should address the REAL problem , THEIR constant interfering and bombing other countries which is CAUSING worldwide movement of refugees and asylum seekers
ID cards to address the ability to seek employment,social services, housing,health services, is the reason put forward by Stammer and supported by the globalists, so IF refugees and illegals don’t have an id card they will be REFUSED said treatments, yeah right they will refuse NHS treatment to illegal pensioners or children
You may well be right. I’m not saying you are wrong.
my take on it is that it will be prone to error, hacking and generally make worse what it is supposed to facilitate.
I was going to write a long comment about this proposed ID scheme but the link Sam posted beat me to it.
Nearly every European country has ID schemes of some sort but this still have problems with illegal immigration. ID will only work it is fully enforced with sanctions that we are currently seeing in America with ICE and there is no way that will happen here in the UK even if Reform got a large majority at Westminster.
Labour have always wanted to get an ID scheme here in the UK and it is solely to stop ordinary working people from avoiding paying tax. They are using the current immigration debate to get it through this time and there are enough gullible people to allow it.
Yup. Typical of Labour (and the Left in general) to use the immigrant crisis to facilitate their ID cards Trojan horse. Wankers.
Lefties. Not happy unless they’re controlling everything and everyone (badly), snooping, stifling free speech, banning and condemning. They’re a miserable, joyless bunch.
My politics is to the left and I don’t believe in this proposed ID scheme. I’m sure that some on this forum who have criticised it as well is also politically to the left. If you go onto the Guardian website about this, there are a lot of people who are against it.
It is driven by parties who are traditionally seen to be from the left but it doesn’t mean that all left wing individuals are for it.
Lets be honest about it, we have an unofficial ID scheme now. You are identified by your passport, driving license and bank account. The information from these entities are shared between multiple public and private sector bodies.
It may be a good thing to have a unified ID scheme as while there is a lot of crime, it was a whole lot worse in the olden days which you harken back to where somebody could commit serious crimes and just move to a town or city about 10 or 20 miles away and nobody would know about your past life.
However, to push for a unified scheme under the radar by linking it to the immigration debate without proper debate or scrutiny is completely wrong and you are right where we could be sleepwalking into a dystopian future where the state and private sector entities have unchallenged power over us.
Lets not make this a political issue between left and right or unionist and independence or pointing fingers and unite with a coherent argument against what this ID scheme could be.
My politics is to the left and I don’t believe in this proposed ID scheme. I’m sure that some on this forum who have criticised it as well is also politically to the left. If you go onto the Guardian website about this, there are a lot of people who are against it.
It is driven by parties who are traditionally seen to be from the left but it doesn’t mean that all left wing individuals are for it.
Lets be honest about it, we have an unofficial ID scheme now. You are identified by your passport, driving license and bank account. The information from these entities are shared between multiple public and private sector bodies.
It may be a good thing to have a unified ID scheme as while there is a lot of crime, it was a whole lot worse in the olden days which you harken back to where somebody could commit serious crimes and just move to a town or city about 10 or 20 miles away and nobody would know about your past life.
However, to push for a unified scheme under the radar by linking it to the immigration debate without proper debate or scrutiny is completely wrong and you are right where we could be sleepwalking into a dystopian future where the state and private sector entities have unchallenged power over us.
Lets not make this a political issue between left and right or unionist and independence or pointing fingers and unite with a coherent argument against what this ID scheme could be.
(Got an error message when trying to originally post this but used the backwards one page option on my browser to post again so apologies it is posted twice)
Que a “Reform” shill from the cave dwelling Tory bumsniffer…
It’s cue not “que”, you porcine imbecile.
Cut him some slack, CC.
Remember he’s mostly typing his posts one-handed!
UK Border Force staff have told me first hand that their French counterparts have for years said that the primary reason the UK is the ‘go to’ for illegal immigrants is the lack of National Identity cards, which are prevalent elsewhere throughout Europe.
In other countries you need ID to access social services, heath care, housing, education, undertake employment etc. and may even require to have such on your person at all times in case plod stops you and demands to see it.
The UK? Nah… just run up the beach and next stop Deliveroo, Just Eat, Uber, car wash facilities, fast food outlets etc. etc. and a small room shared with 8 other guys, or a hotel if you’re one of the lucky ones.
Add a sprog or two shortly thereafter and your right to a family life in the UK is secured by an army of smart arsed human rights lawyers just waiting to help you for a fee covered by John Q Taxpayer.
Alternatively, say you’re a Christian or you’re gay and that’ll work equally as well.
The ‘stans’, ‘nams’ and ‘dans’ can’t keep on decanting their 20-something males into this country by the hundreds of thousands indefinitely.
What’s the alternative to stem the tide? Live ammo?
Robert national identity cards may be a rational way of monitoring the needs of the population, eg social security benefits,social needs, school attendance numbers and requirements, NHS hospitals, clinics and doctors surgeries, the problem is that the politicians and authorities, police and justice systems cannot be TRUSTED to use the information properly, look at the current situation with the woke agenda where the police are turning up like the gestapo to charge and arrest people for HURTY words
TBQH ANYTHING that BLIAR,BROON or KID STARVER proposes I would automatically vehemently OPPOSE
Ok twathater, given that your points are valid, what’s your alternative?
We’re already monitored through smart phones. internet use, use of credit/debit cards, ANPR/LEZ cameras, CCTV, etc. etc. so unless you’re prepared to live in a cave what difference will an electronic ID on your smart phone make?
Your smart phone can have a permanently hot mic’ even when supposedly turned off, (why criminals use old ‘burner’ models where the battery can be removed easily), and the camera can be accessed too if you’ve the right piece of kit/software, so to me a smart phone is far more insidious given we’ve all, with few exceptions, got one.
The battle for privacy was lost some time ago.
The immigration debate is a highly contentious and emotive issue. What you are saying about ID cards is absolutely correct but what do you think will happen if it implemented here tomorrow?
There are continued outcries about stop and search schemes by the police because they are deemed racist as they target young men of ethnic minorities. They police aren’t doing that for the good of their health or they are racist. What do you think will happen if young ethnic minority men are stopped in the street and asked for their ID card?
To be charitable, the UK is now in a state of dysfunction. ID cards will only work if it is properly enforced. That won’t happen in the current climate we face in the UK where it is fashionable to say our society is institutionally and historically racist.
It’s going to take a whole lot more than ID cards to fix the problem of immigration.
Reform has already plainly set out the practical, tangible steps needed to stem the tide and also prevent many hundreds of thousands attaining indefinite leave to remain – and also the ability of foreign nationals to collect UK pensions. It’s plain enough, in black and white: withdraw from the ECHR immediately and repeal other pertinent Acts of Parliament to ensure that lefty lawyers are simply unable to stymie the will of the sovereign (then Reform) Parliament. All that is required is political steely will, courage, ability and vision: none of which Labour (or the Left in general) has.
Conversely, we should note that the use of ID cards has not prevented these types of problems in those (vastly more competently run) EU States that have them. What on Earth gives us any confidence that this would somehow be different under Starmer, a “human rights lawyer” and a man whose administration couldn’t be trusted to brew a decent cup of tea, let alone finance, contract out and administer a pan-UK ID scheme. Apart from anything else, imagine the vast, vast sums of yet more taxpayer’s money spaffed: this would make even those past catastrophic public sector IT disasters look like nothing by comparison. (As for hacking potential, that’s another issue entirely).
This is a left wing government that purposely jails people – sometimes for years at a time – for saying stuff on Twitter. If the thought of ID cards under the likes of them doesn’t terrify you, well, it bloody well should do.
Where was this in Labour’s manifesto? Who voted for this? This is blatant opportunism on the part of Starmer but it won’t wash. Just hastens his and his party’s demise and departure all the sooner. Goodness me, it’s needed.
@ Captain Caveman
Everybody remembers or is at least aware of efforts of campaigners over the past couple of decades to get rid of Freemasons out of the police and other public bodies over allegations of corruption, using influence to shape policy and cronyism.
I don’t know the extent that Freemasons had on our public bodies but it is evident now that there are elements in our public bodies who are shaping policy to fit their own agenda as seen with the Trans movement and I have not doubt the same is happening with immigration policy.
Do you honestly think that if Reform got into power and they changed a few laws that this is going to solve the problem?
I don’t have the answer on how to deal with the systemic bias in our society that is favouring immigration to the detriment of large parts of our society but I doubt very much that getting Reform who is stuffed full of Tories who did nothing to fix immigration when they were in power for the 14 years they were in office is going to single-handedly solve it.
What the fuck are you on about with Freemasons, what has any of this got to do with my last post (or any of them), or indeed the price of fish?
Random mate.
“Flibble!”
/Roger Irrelevant
I see from the article that there an area in Edinburgh that is flying Scottish flags from lamposts like they are doing down England.
link to archive.is
I don’t know about that part of Edinburgh but where I live, it is solid Labour but it also contains affluent area’s which are Tory and I’ve seen similar in these affluent areas.
It looks like the immigration debate is having an effect on Scottish politics as well but not in a good way for the independence movement.
The saltire is an expression of Scottish national identity and national consciousness is an essential feature of any independence movement.
In the context of a people moving ever closer to decolonization and liberation: “culture is the expression of national consciousness (and) the most elaborate form of culture” (Fanon).
The colonial oppressor really wants us to fly his flag, which many of us now realise is a symbol of oppression, and a falsehood.
link to jpti.ch
I don’t know the area of Edinburgh mentioned in article but judging by the comments made in article who lived there, it sounds like a solid unionist Labour stronghold.
With the areas where I live that are flying the Scottish flags are strongly unionist Tory. They are not interested in Scottish independence and are only doing this to show they are a no-go area for immigrants.
Associating Scottish flags with this immigration debate is going to harm the independence cause because these idiots don’t have the guts to fly the Union Jacks on their patch because everybody will see through their motivations.
The only oppression you suffer from is self inflicted Marxist ideology. The Saltire had been hijacked by the Indy movement for long enough. The Saltire has now been reclaimed by the Scottish people. The flag at present now represents Unity in Britain. If you are Scottish it is your flag not some political ideology. The Left are finished and on the run. All over the world people have reclaimed their sovereignty and fly their respective flags for freedom.
The Left wanted to destroy identify and borders which they have failed to do. People have had enough.
If you were wondering where the Grass Roots of Indy went. They are flying Saltires along with the Union flag on lamp posts all over Scotland.
@ Mark Beggan
So the people are taking back the Saltire for your political ideology that will do nothing to fix the problems that the people are facing?
It’s nothing but sheer face political opportunism.
You’re hearing the voices again aren’t you, Mark?
Go and have a lie doon in a darkened room with your prince Jobby glossy mag.
You’ve reclaimed hee-haw, Beggan.
The UK is not a sovereign nation & not likely to be anytime soon. Yer Tory chums sold everything thinking their hegememony would last forever – oops!
It’s other countries that are taking back control & ending the grift. That’s two empires you’ve fckd LOL!
“hegememony”
Making stuff up again, Barbs?
Try not to make it so obvious!
Sadly the Yoon telescreens have mobilised the eejits across the “UK”….
The funny thing is that all these patriotic social media influencers are selling a message that is commercially packaged for consumption that is no different from Disney or any other American entertainment company and they are making plenty of profit from clicks, subscribes and merchandise.
Great British sovereignty is just another commodity for sale in UK PLC.
Oh, so you reckon we should just avoid discussing and dealing with a problematic and contentious issue for fear of it being divisive and negative.
Simply put, a self-governing Scotland would be able to develop our own specific immigration policy to best suit our society’s requirements with regard to economics and demographics.
That’s something London Rule has clearly failed to do whilst Scotland has been in the Union.
“a self-governing Scotland would be able to develop our own specific immigration policy to best suit our society’s requirements”
Nice try, Dan.
The only plausible ruling administration for an iScotland is and will remain the SNP for the foreseeable future.
Their clear and settled policy is that iScotland will be in the EU.
So our immigration policy will be effectively settled in Brussels. EU freedom of movement, majority voting and the unstoppable surge in climate and war refugees that is just around the corner will see to that.
Do you think wee Scotland (population 5.5 million), hoaching with lebensraum, is going to negotiate opt outs?
Get real.
Piss off troll.
The whole point of returning Scotland to self-governance is so we can begin to address the myriad issues so many folk (both pro-indy and pro-union) folk highlight.
It’s blatantly obvious it’s impossible to even start this process when the current UK political setup is a farce with the mainstream parties being infiltrated and captured by grifters and charlatans that get elected on a ticket for certain things, then ignore dealing with what they were elected for and instead drag us down a different path with their own agendas.
Just because you seem to be content spending so much of your sad existence complaining about everyone and everything btl, doesn’t mean others share your view, and instead they’d likely prefer to work towards actually fixing things.
@Dan says: 27 September, 2025 at 4:24 pm
“Piss off troll”
Aw man, Dan! There was me convinced you’d post a reasoned and polite response, dealing in a sober and sensible manner with the points I raised 🙂
Fit am I like, eh?
Maybe it takes repetition to get things intae yer heid.
“The only plausible ruling administration for an iScotland is and will remain the SNP for the foreseeable future.
Their clear and settled policy is that iScotland will be in the EU.
So our immigration policy will be effectively settled in Brussels. EU freedom of movement, majority voting and the unstoppable surge in climate and war refugees that is just around the corner will see to that.”
Read it a bit more slowly this time, Dan.
Then try to remember you’re nae 12, it’s nae a schoolday, and ye’re nae screaming childish abuse in the playground.
Nathan Gill, Reform’s leader in Wales at the last Welsh parliament election, has pled guilty to 8 bribery charges, taking Russian cash while he was one of Nigel Farage’s MEPs to speak in favour of Putin’s Russia in that parliamen
Nathan Gill, Reform’s leader in Wales at the last Welsh parliament election, has pled guilty to 8 bribery charges, taking Ru$$ian cash while he was one of Nigel Farage’s MEPs to speak in favour of Pouting’s Ru$$ia in that parliamen
The both votes SNP is simply to deny any other Indy Party traction. The greatest fear at SNP HQ is that the blind loyalty to the SNP brand is lost. The List vote for the SNP has never been about additional SNP MSPs. It is about preventing any drift to alternatives.
@ Captain Caveman at 9:01 am
Link to your post, seeing as this site’s comment setup is fucking useless to respond to and who has 15 minutes spare to wait and see if their post will actually appear.
link to wingsoverscotland.com
So aw this shite the UK is dealing with is a result of a Labour government voted into power just over a year ago.
Aye right, but guess if folk have the memory of a goldfish they’ll buy the shite you’re selling.
Reform making political capital out of migrants, but folk really need to look a bit closer at what they are all about.
link to barrheadboy.com
It’s a false narrative that people who coming here to the UK because we are bombing their countries and selling arms to oppressive regimes.
They are coming here because of state benefits not enjoyed in other countries, being able to operate in the black economy without any repercussions and being able to follow religious ideologies that aren’t tolerated in the countries they were born in.
I don’t trust Reform and believe any of their BS. You just need to read the comments of their supporters on this forum to see this.
I’ve got a feeling that immigration is going to be another of the subject that the Rev rightly discourages on this site as it is far too contentious.
Scotland knows all about economic migrants, most of them Tory voting pensioners.
You don’t trust Reform? Fine. I don’t trust Labour, the SNP or indeed the Left.
Guess we’re even.
@ James
Precisely. We Scots have experienced economic migration far longer than that in south of the border but in the eyes of Unionists they are the right economic migrants 😉
“in the eyes of Unionists they are the right economic migrants”
Putting it a bit strong, Bilbo.
In the eyes of sane, rational Scots – the ones who don’t wake up every morning with the voices in their heids telling them to slay all the English – the migrants you refer too are an order of magnitude, maybe two, preferable to the alternatives.
White, Christian heritage, mostly law abiding, fluent in Scotland’s majority language (English), no extensive unproductive family running into double figures to import too, might enjoy looking at your teenage daughter, but probably wouldn’t drug her and pass her around their mates.
In other words, other than being a bit loud and easily irritated with whinging self-pityers, just about the most perfect neighbours any sane, rational Scot could hope for.
Feel free to disagree though, especially if the voices in your heid telling you to slay all the English are giein it laldie.
@ Hatey McHateface
That’s one perspective. Another one is that the UK is a magnet for these types of immigrants much in the same way that some SE Asian countries favoured by old male westerners.
If the grooming gangs phenomenon was actually taken seriously here rather than swept under the carpet, do you think they would come here?
@Bilbo
“do you think they would come here?”
We’re a soft touch. Even if we castrated every underage lassie rapist, we’d still be offering free accommodation, free health care and the likelihood that a life of crime would go un-reprimanded. Look at the shop lifting epidemic for an example of how our authorities deal with crims who make retail theft their lifestyle choice.
That and guaranteed, two-tier human rights and the chance to import extended family too. If I was in France, the pull factor of all of this would be irresistible.
Reform and President Trump have the right idea. Deport every one of the illegals. Deport every one of the legals who commits a serious crime in the first 30 years of residence. Theft, rape, violence, murder, insurrection. It doesn’t matter what your ethnic background is. These are all bad in every culture. Practitioners need to be harshly dealt with to deter others.
And as the craven, yellow apologists who never tire of telling us that deterrence doesn’t work will never admit to, harshly and permanently dealing with the crims takes them off our streets and makes the rest of us a lot safer.
One strike and you’re out – makes good sense to me.
Excellent article by Roddy, there.
Dan
Weren’t you the one that complained about the new layout? It was faster, better at replying & for posting links.
I wish it would return.
Aye, I wasn’t a fan of the new layout because it had the nested comments setup and the facebook style like / dislike post function, which was clearly used for factional reasons and folk could like or dislike a post without having to type anything, so the only person that knew why a particular post was liked or disliked was in the head of those that clicked the function. Pretty much a useless function in aiding proper discussion and discourse.
But yes, the “upgrade” did indeed have improved functionality with posts appearing quickly and link posting simplified, but the nested comments were and still remain a pain to follow for anybody that doesn’t have time to spend clicking refresh page all day.
It may actually have been my complaining that initiated the initial “upgrade” because of the long delay in posts appearing prior to the “upgrade”.
But now we are back to long delay but with nested comments, the two things that make it hard for folk with limited time to follow btl activity.
While watching the Anti illegal immigration Unity demonstration in Glasgow last week I noticed along with the Saltires and Union flags the Vexillum Beli. A War Banner of the Knights Templar. The Black and white banner with the the red cross in the centre. The black represents the fierceness towards their enemies and the white symbolizes the light and friendliness towards friends. The red cross symbolizes Christs martyrdom. The Knights Templar along with the Knights Hospitilars both played a pivotal role in the defeat of Edward II of England.
In a previous comment, I had talked about areas about where I live that are solidly Tory and have Saltires flying from lampposts. I know this because I have seen it when traveling through by my car.
The part of the area where I live has seen a lot of none-white immigration and these immigrants living in the street where I live.
Most of these are families and cause no trouble but there has been trouble with young male immigrants and I have experienced it personally where I have felt intimated by their behaviour including the thousand yard stares. I learned fast to avoid eye contact with these individuals.
I don’t have a strong view on this debate but it is noticeable to me that these immigrant families are getting housing which obviously are being denied to people born here. I also notice that there isn’t many of these immigrant families in these affluent areas where I had described.
If I felt strongly enough about immigration I wouldn’t be organising demonstrations in city and town centres but in these affluent white ghettos like Bearsden and Milngavie that are so much in support of immigration because they aren’t personally affected by it as much as the rest of us.
You do know that Tories can be independence supporters, right?
Not everyone that supports independence votes for the SNPEE..
Far right in the good ol USA are using the Saltire as their symbol. The League of the South is a white supremacist group that promotes a “Celtic” identity
In the UK the Patriotic Alternative, a far right, white supremacist anti-immigrant and British group uses the saltire to try to attract Scots.
The Scottish Defence League (spin off from EDL) also does this and I would say the NF too.
Councils should be taking Saltires down from lamp posts if permission was not given.
Historical facts.
The Southern Cross flag commonly knows as the rebel flag originates from the Saltire as does the burning cross which started in Scotland.
The popular music we enjoy today comes from rhythm and blues which originates from Celtic reels and jigs mixed with African rhythms. Notably the modern drum kit originated from the end of the American civil war when after the Gettisburgh address a surplus of drum equipment was acquired by the then free African slaves who adapted these instruments for their blues music. Culminating in the modern rock drum kit. The symbols, however, originates from Turkey and their skill in producing symbols.
@ sam says: 27 September, 2025 at 11:51 am
“Councils should be taking Saltires down from lamp posts if permission was not given”
I can’t decide what is most pathetic about this post.
Is it that a so-called, proud, patriotic, Indy-minded Scot, a supposedly Sovereign Scot at that, thinks he should be obliged to go cap in hand to meekly request permission to fly his country’s flag?
Or is that 4 hours after his puerile post was put up, not one so-called, proud, patriotic, Indy-minded Scot, a supposedly Sovereign Scot at that, has seen fit to take the time and trouble to tell sam tae GTF?
Nobody could make this stuff up. Real freedom fighters would trample this lot into the mud and never even notice they had been in the road.
According to the REform Party it has 442 members with a criminal record and 237 of these are serving a sentence. Reform is going through its books.
So, 400-odd members out of over 250,000? Less than 0.2%?
How many out of the 2,000 odd (non-deceased) remaining SNP membership?
What’s the percentage of the general population with such a record?
Answers on a postcard (lol).
Corporal shit for brains WHAT exactly did YOUR tory party do over the last 1.5 decades to control immigration,so now you want people to vote for reform because they are as adept at LYING as the tories and Labour, if you think wee nige will do ANYTHING to stop immigration you’re as stupid as I first thought,reform are more interested in SELLING OFF the NHS to their Yankee pals for a share of the profit
YOU greed driven monsters are the ones who ENCOURAGED immigration in the first place because you wanted a cheaper workforce outside of the unions but when they organised you sit yourselves, Labour encouraged immigration for votes until the immigrants started taking over their party and TELLING THEM what to do, ditto with the snp gay ,lesbo ,and tranny party
A smidge negative there, Twat H.
Twat H will be along in a mo to have a word.
He’s got a bit of a bee in his glengarry about negative posts.
Erm.
Haud oan, is this right?
Que a “Reform” shill from the cave dwelling Tory bumsniffer…
The Knights Templar fleg is used by far right group in the USA withhin the GOP.
Also used in the UK by Britain First.
You are missing the point Sam. These flags all have origins. They have history and a lot of blood spilled on their behalf. They represent our ancestors our faiths and shared beliefs. They bind people together in a way that’s far beyond politics.
What does the Antifa banner or the Trans table cloth represent? What’s it’s history? Made up in the spare room. No roots, No meaning. Then there’s the flag of a state that doesn’t exist except in a few Lefty and terrorist minds. This flag is being flown to represent a patchwork of ideologies and Islamic hate groups.
@ Mark Beggan
” They bind people together in a way that’s far beyond politics.”
Not always so. Clearly, they are sometimes used deliberately to create division which was a point I was making.
been to Athelstaneford?
Throughout the years the wingnuts of the right have thrown about slurs to those who disagree with them like Marxist Leninists, cultural Marxists, Common Purpose etc.
There could be some truth to that due to subversion by the Soviets during the cold war years in academia which then subsequently filtered through the various institutions of our society.
Whether there is truth to that is one thing but the truth is that this woke ideology is solely American identity politics imported from the good ole US of A and now we have this right wing flag waving ideology imported from the same country.
Both of these ideologies are foreign, no basis in reality and not organic to our society. As Woke ideology is slowly rejected, so must this right wing ideology as well.
The night of the long knives has begun in Westminster. The Labour ‘together’ a patchwork of ideologies and groups at odds with each other as their true agendas surface and split the already damaged face of Labour. It begs the question. What orders has grupenmeinfuhrer at branch office North received?
Oh dear me, all these many decades I’ve been happily and innocently wearing a St Andrew’s cross lapel badge and cufflinks, often with my kilt in daily use, I’ve been inadvertently displaying my closet inner white supremacist tendncies it seems.
Between that and my conviction that women don’t have penises … what am I like.
And all along you were a White supremacist, colonialist baby burning fascist.
Mark Beggan @ 13.25.
Seems so, Mark. Still, won’t stop me giggling at some of your jokes. (Or wearing my kilt or Saltire cufflinks).
Name tagging a society or the people of a country as far right or far left or central this or that, is a government position to disown the 80% of people that disagree with policies they bring in,
It is a method of de-humanising the populations for control.
Any person that in reality copies this political mantra has been capable of being brainwashed by the state, as he or she eventually stops seeing individuals as humans but rather as a group blob to attack.
That is the psychology of politics, and the first steps on the road to control people.they encourage people to to dislike each other through deliberate positions to partake in division.
There is no far right or far left in people other than what the politician and media have taught you, this used to happen in the playgrounds when a child. Except the politicians are well aware how to manipulate this ingrained childlike behaviour into adults,
You are either with us or against us politics, is a tool of great benefit and asset to politics.
In Britain this happens very often when voting in elections, for one party side or the other,
This is not a choice for people, it is what is presented as a Choice.
Behind the party colours however they are more often than not friendly to each other, arriving at the same dinner parties, going to the same meetings, drinking at the same bars,and all jetting of to the same global with an all inclusive think tank base.
It is easy to continue the childlike playground psychology on people.
Make it about Scottish people not liking English people for instance, rather than political actions dislike,
We see this often being used as weaponisation on here. But at the end of the day both sides want culture and there Countries back in amongst the mass ordinary peoples.and this is playing out across the world.
The division should be focused more directly on the politicians and governance betraying the people and nations.
What I see is politicians and todays politics creating division amongst the people and the nations, incitement is encouraged by policies. New laws, legislation and Statues,
Whereby the politicians have adopted the mantle that they own the people, rather than they work for us.
A selection rogue dispotik intervening State control run by finances.for ultimate totalarian control over the peoples, nations and cultures and countries around the world.
Scotland was early under that control by deceit of a faux treaty, as with many other countries.
But this is now happening to England, and we see this with crazy France- Westminster treaties of thousands in and one out.
Any nation that is tied to old treaties and wants its Country back from around the world has to agree and recognise Scotland revert away from being Colonised to become independent
As this automatically frees other nations from the yoke of old treaties that have bound them for years by default. And from new global treaties.
There is a all encompassing larger picture for the would in its meaning and holds ramifications around the world today if Scotland was recognised as not being in the 1707 treaty of union, and other nations are at present waking up to this,
As the politicians would say, your either for us or against us,
My personal opinion would re phrase that.
You are either for the people…. or for a dispotick state governance that has gone rogue.
And by the way, where is that monarch that sits in Westminster that took an oath to protect his people in England and his religion, and nation.
He is rather quiet is he not ? in amongst all this last few years of Chaos.
Just wondering.
‘Citizens of Somalia, Sierra Leone, Togo, Cuba and Sri Lanka, among others, are currently held’
‘speaking about other prisoners-of-war, he added that “most African states show little interest in the return of such citizens and do not wish to take them back”‘
If anybody offers you a free ticket to Orcland, don’t accept it!
link to bbc.co.uk
Two lost Scottish soldiers from the Great War, finally identified and laid to rest in marked graves:
link to bbc.co.uk
According to Mary Spencer on Independent Scotland Facebook, the contact for ID cards is very likely to be awarded to the company, Palantir. They already have the NHS digital contract, police force contracts and other surveillance work. Check out Palantir.
It gets worse and worse, doesn’t it. I just can’t see Holyrood 2026 getting enough of the right kind of people to make a difference UNLESS enough noise is made in support of the Liberate Scotland umbrella independence group.
The NHS data in England is absolute crap. The apparent reduction in waiting lists could be because of unreported removals from the list and unrecorded referrals to the list.
A lot of the ONS data on every kind o public service provision is questionable already. The ID stuff probably will compound what is already a mess
@Sam
The daily SNP Communique. Argue about data, keep process front and foremost. Never mind the delays to people’s operations or trying to get a GPs appointment. Unluckily for you I going to stand as a real Scottish Independence Supporter and you don’t know what is coming your way as an ex SNP member.
@ George
What constituency are you planning to stand in?
It would be handy to know, so folk could start communicating this vote casting option to the constituency, and also strategically, so there wouldn’t be a clash and vote dilution with another pro-indy candidate from the likes of Liberate group that may be considering to stand.
It wouldn’t surprise me that this ID card policy is being announcement came so soon after the Trump visit and the agreement of the American investment in AI in the UK.
All those billions of bits of personal data from the UK ID card scheme will be a god send to these Yank tech companies.
The best thing for independence is for a uniionist coalition to take charge at the next election.
There is a crash coming, they will take the blame regardless if the causes are global, European, British or Scottish. Not enough people are working and the price of energy is too high. It’s inevitable. They might even manage some good by clearing out the SNP placement throughout all the institutions.
But the fight between partners during the collapse will be monumental.
An indy majority even with a token Alba presense will not achieve anything, there is nothing but a steady erosion of everything to come.
@George Ferguson
Your comprehension is severely lacking. I was replying to a post the subject of which was Palantir a company that does data analytics for the UK government.
So you start trolling me about the SNP and the Scottish NHS.
I haven’t been a member of the SNP for over 30 years, I don’t vote for it and I don’t campaign for it.
Standing for any public office is a waste of your money and time.
@Dan 8:07pm
Great comment Dan and I agree. I am going to stand in the newly formulated Central Scotland West Lothian Constituency. So Grangemouth and Falkirk and so on. An industrial community. My first policy, an SMR at Grangemouth. But you are right if they are six real Independence candidates then we should coordinate. Otherwise we will not maximise the vote.I am an anti queer, anti trans canidate with lots of shit on the SNP. My opening gambit to stand.
Central Scotland West Lothian Constituency? Is that not a Region so you’ll be standing on the list for the Region rather than in a specific Constituency?
link to en.wikipedia.org
According to the link, the 9 Constituencies in the Region are.
Airdrie
Almond Valley
Bathgate
Coatbridge and Chryston
Cumbernauld and Kilsyth
Falkirk East and Linlithgow
Falkirk West
Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse
Motherwell and Wishaw
Uddingston and Bellshill
@Dan 8:42pm
Dual Candidate standing in my own Constituency and the Central Scotland and West Lothian Region. With an integrated Industrial strategy policy and as you can see, getting the Central Belt back working again in high technical, high value jobs might not be universally popular. It’s the SNP Government that is blocking an SMR being sited here. Going ahead elsewhere in the UK.
FYI, there are already a few Liberate Scotland candidates standing in some of the Constituencies in that Region.
link to barrheadboy.com
link to barrheadboy.com
@Dan 9:13pm
Thanks Dan that was what I feared but I think I will stand for the Constituency and the Region. I don’t want to compromise my principles. I will get over a 100 votes. A special love in promised if I do.
A nuclear shill eh? Nuclear that Scotland neither wants nor needs. I seem to recall you’re pro “freeports” as well?
I wouldn’t vote for you in a month of Sundays.
Just saying, like.
@ George
Energy policy is reserved to London Rule, and therefore building nuclear in Scotland is contentious for various reasons.
This linked article is almost 20 years old.
link to lawscot.org.uk
The timescale involved to get a new nuclear generation setup built is likely longer than you, or I have left to live.
link to no2nuclearpower.org.uk
Ach, maybe Ferguson Marine could diversify away from “building” shite ferries and instead knock together a couple of reactors. What could go wrong…
At least that way a few hundred years down the line when they are finally built, humanity might have worked out a better way of managing the waste.
Mind you, by that time Grangemouth will be underwater due to global warming, so maybe should have just gone with a tidal barrage across the Forth.
If energy policy is reserved to London, how have the SNP/Green government managed to commit Scotland to Nutt Zero 5 years ahead of the rUK?
Aye, it’s odd that energy policy is reserved yet so much is badly handled by the devolved administration. It’s almost like they are working hand in glove on delivering the same objectives… Which is pretty much the case seeing as Holyrood parliament and UK civil service working here are instruments of the Scotland Act.
ScotWind giveaway auction, and similarly for a devolved administrator negotiating this hydrogen deal.
It’s almost like those that don’t appear to work to improve and protect Scotland are infiltrators, or somebody has leverage on individuals and can get them to do their dirty work.
link to robinmcalpine.org
link to robinmcalpine.org
@Dan
Rolls Royce are saying the first SMR will take 5 years to build including Regulatory Consents. Thereafter because of the standardised components approach, expected build time will be around 3 years. Jim Radcliffe at Grangemouth was passed the feasibility stage but he encountered resistance from the Scot Gov. The transferability of existing skills at Grangemouth is what makes this an attractive option. Plus the Freeport status etc. Of course it would be beneficial if the manufacturer of SMR components was based here. We don’t want to miss out on the Supply Chain again. I am off to put the garden into hibernation and watch the Ryder Cup later. Catch up sometime.
Good luck with all of that, George.
You will have to contend with the likes of James below, who presumably believes the wind blows 24/7.
Or maybe believes that on these extended periods of calm, high pressure in January and February, when it’s well below freezing, we can all huddle in bed to keep warm for days on end while the power is off.
Cheap, reliable, consistent power is the corner stone of any flourishing first-world economy. It has to be defendable and owned by that economy too.
@George Ferguson
You are undeniably right that the deaths of 800 people waiting for treatment is the responsibility of the Scottish NHS and ultimately the Scottish government.
How did things come to this pass?
In 2010 just before the Tories took power, the UK government’s spend on England’s NHS was below that of most European countries. The spend per head was about 18% lower than the average EU spend and about 26% less than France.
In 2010 the English NHS was also understaffed compared to other European countries.
Austerity brought further cuts, underfunding and understaffing with the cuts being reflected in Scottish funding through Barnett.
Barnett is not based on need. If it were Scotland would get more money for health. England has a younger and more healthy population than Scotland which also has a much more dispersed population.
Austerity caused hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths in England and Scotland. Also, it worsened the health of people.
Inflicting poverty on the most disadvantaged has been the deliberate policy of UK governments since Thatcher. Poverty causes ill health.
Scotland’s drug problem began with Thatcher.
Life expectancy decreased and so did the period of life free from disability which is now 47 years for the worst off compared with 71 years for the best off.
Post Tory austerity the Labour party continued austerity
Now you have NHS workforces in the UK facing unprecedented demand. A workforce that has been under pressure for at least 40 years and feeling burnt out, undervalued and moral distress.
Moral distress is the psychological effect on healthcare professionals when they know the right action to take but are unable to act due to institutional constraints or resource limitations. In the UK NHS, it has become prevalent
Many doctors have told the Trade Union they experienced moral distress with the pandemic making it worse.
As you know well, doctors and nurses have had enough and are leaving. They cannot be replaced quickly so the problems associated with decades of poverty, austerity and the pandemic are not going away quickly.
Indeed the problems may worsen as more people get thrown into the water upstream than can be pulled out by a struggling workforce.
That’s how we got here. Deaths while waiting for treatment happen in both England and Scotland. Just over 800 in Scotland and 120,600 in England.
Where does most of the responsibility for this lie?
Little wonder Unionists dismiss comparisons that don’t suit their narrative as “irrelevant” or “beside the point”..
Why aren’t we hearing about this on MSM?
Irony laced question incidentally..
“Austerity caused hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths in England and Scotland”
At the very least, citation needed, eh?
But then the UK spent tens, maybe hundreds of billions of pounds it didn’t have “protecting” healthy people from an infectious illness a little less severe to most than the flu.
Some balance might be good from you, sam, but hey! Pigs will undoubtedly fly.
You like to post interminably on here about how it is the responsibility of “government” to keep you alive forever. Fine, that’s undoubtedly one of your rights. The posting, I mean.
So why don’t you devote some time and effort to costing this all up? Put some numbers on it.
Tax rises – tell us the basic and higher income tax rates increases.
Services cuts – tell us what we could do without to redirect the spending.
Personnel – tell us where they come from.
Plausibility – tell us which cadre of experts and politicians with a solid track record of success could make all this happen, within a reasonable time scale, and with a high probability of success.
My money says you won’t. My money says you can’t.
I’m confident my money is safe.
Here’s an example of an alternative revenue raising system.
link to annualgroundrent.scot
“Here’s an example of an alternative revenue raising system”
Sure, Dan. It’s already wildly popular with those Scots who don’t own so much as a square foot of land.
With the rest of us, maybe less so.
And I would say it fails another fundamental test too – the no representation without taxation test.
Put simply, there will always be an enormous constituency in favour of being free to vote on how to dispense other people’s money at no cost to themselves.
That’s what historically brings down all democratic systems.
I actually recently had a conversation (over a few pints) with a senior ex-government economist about this idea, and I’ll put the same challenge to you as I put to him – given the misalignment between taxpayers liability and ability to pay, how do you raise enough money to fund public services?
I’ll give you a couple of examples, so farming for example is land intensive but very low margin, would that still be viable? Conversely, JP Morgan’s technology hub in Glasgow – would Scotland be capturing enough revenue from what I am sure is a very profitable site, given that the land footprint is probably a similar size to a large supermarket.
On a non-corporate level, a single person or a childless couple who might work in high-paying jobs in finance or tech would find themselves with a substantial windfall compared to today if they lived in a 1 or 2 bedroom flat in Edinburgh, whilst a large family (say 3 to 4 children) on a modest income would face a very significant additional tax bill for the larger property they need.
@ Aidan
Maybe lay off the pints and go and read up further on the evolution and details of Graeme’s AGR proposal. There are different rates for different land uses.
I only posted the link to it as an example of how taxation could be done differently. Put your question to Graeme, as he is the individual who has developed the proposal.
Being a union man, are you happy with the way taxation systems are used and abused within the UK paradigm. And if not, what do you suggest needs done to better serve the majority of folk in the UK.
Yes Dan – there are four different rates proposed, that doesn’t really deal with the issue does it. I almost thought that given you were putting this idea forward you might have some idea about how it might work. I can see this is going to descend into another one of your general trademark rants where you divert onto about 20 different irrelevant topics so I think I’ll leave it there.
I left out Brexit effect.
Estimations suggest about 4000 doctors left the UK as a result of Brexit.
The number of EU nurses in the UK dropped from 87,000 (the likely number on a trend without Brexit) to about 29,000 by 2021.
A study estimates that Brexit has led to 1,485 additional deaths per year due to the loss of EU nurses
“Brexit has led to 1,485 additional deaths per year”
No way! It can’t be more than 1,483.
So the UK doesn’t train and retain enough medical staff? Is that your point?
My offer from above is repeated. Crunch the numbers. Tell us how much it will cost your average Scot to “put things right”.
Of course, if you do, you’ll see why no professional politician is committing career suicide by standing for election on a platform of “we will tax you this amount extra to finally fully fund the unreformed SNHS”.
Which is exactly why you will never have a plausible policy to fix the unfixable.
‘I left out the brexit effect’
‘Modesty is arrogance by stealth’ who are you trying to kid here. Numbers add up to nothing when you are defending the undefendable.
‘Scotlands drug deaths began with Thatcher’
What planet politik are you orbiting? I can recall ones like,
‘Thatcher the milk snatcher’
and old classics like,
‘Maggie Maggie Maggie Out Out Out!!
but no one can recall the,
“Maggie sells Smack” chant.
You really think the whole of life comes from politics. The source of every sickness in society comes from politics. Only Marxists think like that. There’s not even a place for God in your rhetoric.
Beggan – you forgot “Tory scum out”.
I always liked that one.
Away and play with your royals.
Hey Fatso, here’s a novel idea for you:
Maybe – just maybe – people should take responsibility for their own poor life choices and decisions, instead of blaming politicians or any other proxy for that matter.
Life’s about choices.
Aye, and you chose to be a Tory Unionist.
Go figure, peabrain.
Yeah mate, as opposed to some washed up fuckwit with nowt.
I’ll consider myself blessed.
STFU James – you are arguing with a man who eats HOTPOT
the master race chosen people lost tribe
bow down and obey
“STFU James – you are arguing with a man who eats HOTPOT”
Probably not the most effective line of attack here, I’d say. I reckon Fatso has eaten more pies than the both of us.
And the solution to the NHS deaths is Plantir.
Heard of them for most of us its suspect not. Plantir provide Kill Chain AI technology to the Israeli military to identify and kill targets in Gaza.
Owned by a billionaire libertarian Trump supporter plantir also has a £330m NHS AI contract to provide technology to make the NHS more efficient in its decisions.
Doctors and the BMA have objected and opposed the AI introduction as unethical and against patient interests. Data security and misuse is another concern.
Palantir is also one of the many technology companies that recently met the justice secretary, Shabana Mahmood, to discuss ideas to help solve the crisis in prisons and probation, from inserting tracking devices under offenders’ skin to assigning robots to contain prisoners.
All linked to Sir Keir Starmer’s enthusiasm for such systems whats good for the IDF and Gaza is no doubt good for here.
It’s something that folks should maybe take an interest in.
And digital ID I wonder how that ties in. Or is that just for boat people.
DRONES ARE THE NEW LANDMINES and more efficient at killing.
Starmer BritState will go into production to defend Nato against *****
Red Alert: Abandon UK.
They should be using the drones for homeland security.
We will drone them on the beaches, we will chase them from the hills. We will never surrender’.
Your Country needs Drones!!
If the Reform party were to introduce legislation criminalising Transgenders would they get even more support than they are at present! If all the Self ID group were to be sectioned and secured in Carstairs would this change people’s minds to vote for them?
Starmers ID Card policy is becoming a Poll Tax moment for Labour.
I agree, Mark, let’s hope so anyway.
Tick tock.
interesting article on degaulle (but its not a great article and you should read wider than this)
link to archive.ph
– degaulle was a great (french) nationalist who was all too aware of the pernicious nature of the anglo saxon
he conceived of europe as a counterweight to overwhelming US power
and he tried to keep the english out of it as he knew they would “shit the place up from day one”
– but they got in, they were desperate since they were so fucking poor, then shat the place up from day one, complained about everything, got a special deal, then still flounced off in a huff (mainly because they could not get their own way and their narcissism could not handle power being shared among 26; they thought they should be in charge, along with the germans)
deGaulles suspicion and opposition was well founded; during the war it was suspected (and he would have been well aware) that churchill may have seriously considered doing him in, seeing him as a pain in the arse; not incredibly far fetched since other members of the “awkward squad” had untimely accidents – Patton, for one, and Sikorski.
the orignal day of the jackal is a great film, but there is more to it; France kicked out NATO around that time – why? Nato had its own terrorist branch called Gladio which was giving aid to the OAS, trying to kill deGaulle; he wouldn’t tolerate people like that on french soil, which took a lot of balls
nowadays the EU has gone to shit, and why? Because there are no deGaulles anymore – no more leaders who want to have an independence away from the Anglo/American/Zinist influence; it is completely taken over and may as well be run by the CFR; the german leader is an employee of blackrock ffs; the EU may well be shit, but the enshittification was down to england, the US and the shitty terror state and its agents. Being in the EU is still miles better than being in the union since brussels doesn’t take away all your money and hand you back peanuts, nor does it park nuke missiles next to your cities, etc. In any case, for us, EFTA would be the natural choice, the cool kids club, for the small rich nations.
DeGaulle was interested in Scotland and the Auld Alliance, (made a speech at Free French House in Edinburgh celebrating it in 1942) and thought that Scotland, Ireland and Wales should forge an alliance and tell Engerland to GTF….
Wise man.
I realise that historical facts are of little consequence to the likes of you and your ilk, as within your collective intellectual vacuum, but in fact, the English saved de Gaulle (and the militarily lacking French state) by providing him with a platform and support to establish his “Free French” government-in-exile in London after he necessarily scurried off from France in June 1940, enabling him to continue his fight against Germany. Moreover, Churchill directly supported de Gaulle’s efforts to rally the French (those who weren’t collaborating that is). Ireland, by contrast, was neutral.
So if it is indeed the case that de Gaulle was “interested” in the things you describe (I doubt it), then shame on him under the circumstances in that case.
The “English” saved DeGaule? Really, peabrain?
Like they won the war and invented penicillin you mean?
Fucking idiot.
Away and educate yourself. Or better still away and take a flying fuck to yourself.
I literally paraphrased Google’s output in my response…
You really can’t handle basic facts can you, fuckwit? What part of his being given safe shelter in London during the course of the war didn’t you get?
Just when you think you couldn’t make a bigger arse if yourself on here, you double down again. Stick to stuffing junk food mate.
yeah, it’s terrible when ingrate foreign invaders, an invasive alien species just come over here, shitting the place up, disrespecting us, freeloading … I mean tell us about it, english-man, about how bad it is … did ye, aye?? … imagine having to put up with that
self awareness, is something considered a prerequisite for having a soul …
we need nigel farage to send all the wogs back to bongo bongo land, take back matabeleland and make england great again – the good old days, with an eton homosexual on a white horse instructing a kilted scotch to stab the barbarous orientals and negroids in the face
then we need hector mcfarage of that ilk to send all the morriss dancers back to shitty water flatland, where they can drink tea and be among their own kind, eating their bland food
the hottentots, picanninnies, street shitters and oirish need to start appreciating the good the empire did for them
ireland 1840 for the “better together”-tour and the “at least we aren’t speaking german” jamboree
crazy story
link to youtube.com
the moral of the story?
– never fight for your enemies
– this guy fought too well, excited envy
– then they called him a bummer; but with them, every accusation is a confession – public schools, sodomite city, butthole banditry for breakfast lunch and dinner, an arsehole like a welly top by age 9
it has parallels; the english love to do all this ripping yarns pish, mainly to get away from their ghastly wives, but it all goes a bit pete tong, then a scotsman has to save their arses, something they never forgive : the ingrate incompetent shackleton comes to mind, and his joiner, a Scot, who kept them all alive and the only man who did not get a medal at the end
– then the franklin escapade, to find the north west passage (ooh er); they totally fucked up and ended up resorting to cannibalism – a scottish explorer Rae went off to find them (found the north west passage) then returned and, reluctantly, told them what they had got up to – for this sin, franklins widow went after rae and destroyed him
– the english never forgave amundsen for beating scott to the south pole; scott was a fool with funny ideas, amundsen spent time among the eskimos learning from them, but no englishmen ever needed to listen to anyone else. Amundsen got to the south pole in about as good style as such an arduous task is possible, scott and his lot, dead – but a lot of anglo mythologising was indulged in
david livingstone was one of the good guys, but his story seems to be being fucked with, mainly because he doesn’t fit into any standard narrative; for a start he is not some flashman type doing the standard “man who would be king” shenanigans, he is really a good guy and spends much of his time battling slavers – arab slavers who are enslaving the africans. When I was kid a malawian came to my school and talked of the links between our countries – Livingstone was seen as a great man by them … white man fighting against slavery … it just “doesn’t fit”. His museum in Blantyre was shut for a long time, for refurbishment and it seems, a rewriting of history; the feminists got hold of it and have now written his wife into it all, so it probably reads like “outlander”.
early himalayan exploration had a lot to do with the great game, anglos pushing up from india, the rushans pushing down from asia. A lot of these early explorers were really just doing military surveys, and in contrast to livingstone, treating the locals with the harsh supremacism of the anglo; one guy, younghusband, went exploring with a small platoon of troops, while he was making maps, he was also wiping out villages, for no real reason since these mountain peoples had no guns, or were any threat … no one would ever have known about this, but a member of his expedition, so disgusted by what went on, leaked it … younghusband became persona non grata, his behaviour just a bit too ungentlemanly even for the great men of empire
I went to Blantyre and the David Livingstone Centre many years ago and was most impressed by the Scots doctors involved in parasitology around that time and beyond . Livingstone was definitely one of the very good guys.
Livingston was a colonialist no doubt about that. I agree that the natives liked him and honoured him. A very successful colonialist is a man who gets the natives to honour him. I bet the other colonialists wish they had thought of that.
That’s the “Zinists” and the shirt lifters dealt with to Confused’s satisfaction for another day.
Did anybody else feel the earth move?
That was a surge in Indy support, strong enough to register on the Richter scale.
Cheers Confused! Half a dozen more of this caliber and we’re there.
Prick.
James felt the earth move.
His rather deaf and rather unworldly auld neighbour thought she heard him say he was away for a plank.
Digital ID
link to x.com
That’s what the donkeys down south wanted – an exodus of EU scum bag doctors and nurses here to steal pur jobs and steal our benefits.
So tens and tens of thousands of doctors and nurses left not to be replaced.
And the donkeys brayed the bray of the brave Britania. Well they are supping ot up now.
Spot on, Willie. Sadly we are having to sup it up as well. As usual dragged along by their ideology.
Sadly, you are correct. Donkey’s braying is about right given the size of their brains, though I have known cleverer donkeys: ‘Emergency! I need my life saving by a medical expert; oh you are brown, no thanks, and leave the country immediately’, said no-one ever (except these dolts). Expect more of this kind of brain dead shite from Farage’s mob that will be lapped up by the ‘patriots’, or c**s as I call them.
‘Emergency! I need my life saving by a medical expert; oh you are brown, no thanks, and leave the country immediately’, said no-one ever (except these dolts).
It won’t work mate. (Or rather, it doesn’t work anymore, you’re *so* 2021).
The Left, smearing any and all Reform supporters as default racists (and/or some “-phobe” or other), in preparation for “cancelling” (or worse).
Reform has 250,000+ members and will soon be the UK’s largest political party membership. Perfectly decent people up and down the land (including many in Scotland) have had enough of the Left and all the horrendous, truly absurd baggage that comes with it, and you’re all about to be given your marching orders, never to be seen again with any luck.
Looks like the “Donkey’s” [sic] have woken up, and not a moment too soon.
Also “Southernbystander”, as a Lefty living in England(?), you didn’t get to vote SNP, so presumably you voted for Starmer’s mob. How’s that going for you?
“Brain dead shite” you say…?
Yeah, totally reasonable to suggest potentially deporting tens of thousands of people, settled with family, jobs, pay taxes for years, who are here legally under rules already set, that they abided by and applied legitimately under, the majority of whom are not white. Yeah, totally not immoral or racist. If Reform voters really want this, it does not make them ‘reasonable’. In fact I suspect there are quite a few Reformers who will not like this policy as yes, they are reasonable. So do you support this policy then – let’s have some honesty?
If Scotland has any sense left it will reject Farage, he is now pedalling policies the BNP would be proud of. He is an arch British nationalist and unionist and a nasty piece of work to boot: in virtually any interview I have seen, if the questioning is going ways he does not like, where he is genuinely challenged on what he is saying, he attacks the questioner. It is a clever but transparent tactic, straight from the US hard right, and beyond – ‘enemies of the people’ who dare to do their jobs and hold people like him to proper account.
And yes, I voted Starmer and am left wing, so f*****g what? Marching orders, what do you mean? I am a citizen like anyone else and governments come and go, but I am going nowhere and will argue against people like you without fail. Caveman? Yeah.
If Farage gets in, it will be chaos as Reform are incompetent chancers, who have no real policy agenda at all apart from on draconian immigration rules. Granted they could do damage but there will be millions of us voting them out next time, and certainly plenty this time too and reducing any potential majority could be crucial to what they can enact. Or are you thinking of them ending our democracy with Vance and his ilk egging them on?
“… And yes, I voted Starmer and am left wing“
Nothing further to add.
Caveman by name….half wit by nature. etc
Being called a “half wit” (halfwit for the literate) by you is irony personified.
Regardless, however, at least I can read and understand a sentence (and correct context), unlike you pair of roasters.
Ooh. Touchy! lol
What a Tory clown you are.
@Southernbystander
If they are of the religion of peace, then yes, totally reasonable.
They prioritise their religion over everything. They have to – their co-religionists will kill them if they don’t.
It’s not compatible with our culture and heritage. We’re not going to change – they can’t change. It’s our country, so they have to be the ones to go.
President Trump is right about this.
So you are going to single out all Muslims for deportation from those who have permanent leave to remain, or just from the general population? Would they have to active, or just born into it? You think that would go well? Whatever way you size it up, whatever the rationale, it is based on a very extreme view and is a measure that would cause severe civil unrest. I have Muslim friends, some with permanent leave to remain, and I would hang my head in shame if the country I lived in enacted such an action.
But at least you answered the question, unlike Caveman who doesn’t have the guts.
It’s an aggressive, conquering movement, SBS.
You should read and understand more about why the “G@za Flotilla” is falling apart. As is the new party with Corbyn and the rest.
The Westerners have a fashionable omnicause. But so do the Islamists. It’s not some fad with them – it’s who they are.
I was never asked if I wanted Halal food stuffs served to me in public facilities. Nor was I ever asked if I wanted the re-introduction of medieval blasphemy legislation.
We all got both of these regardless. I want them revoked and there is only one way to do it.
“a measure that would cause severe civil unrest”
That severe civil unrest is coming regardless. Best for it to happen on the terms I favour.
You just don’t get it, is the best gloss I can put on your post. I won’t speculate with the worst.
Look at Shitface projecting again.
How many Western countries have been invaded by Muslims?
How many illegal invasions/regime change has the West conducted so far?
Here’s a handy wee list for you. Not many there look anywhere near the USA or the UK. Plenty meddling in their countries tho & the death of millions & countless more displaced.
link to x.com
“But at least you answered the question, unlike Caveman who doesn’t have the guts.”
Go on on then, show me a reputable source where this is Reform’s intended policy as you’ve stated it, in its entirety:
“… suggest potentially deporting tens of thousands of people, settled with family, jobs, pay taxes for years, who are here legally under rules already set, that they abided by and applied legitimately under, the majority of whom are not white.”
Talking of “guys” (no, not Fatso’s ample waistline), at least I don’t have to make shit up and/or try to falsely smear my protagonist in a debate. You’ve provided more than enough bona fide material for my purposes, you utter berk. Away with your pearl-clutching, hysterical nonsense.
Touched a nerve again, eh Barbs?
“How many Western countries have been invaded by Muslims?”
Well now. There’s this one. And France. And Germany. Italy. Greece. Belgium. Sweden. Holland. Denmark. Austria.
Even Norway.
Didn’t you read Rev Stu’s latest article? Didn’t you twig some of the included documents were in foreign languages? Didn’t that give you some clues?
Oh Barbie! Dinna say you just thought it was a screed of big, complicated English words you can’t understand!
Caveman – Reform’s policy was clear – it would include those already here with leave to remain. Do you support this retrospective deportation policy or not?
Here is some of the actual detail you claim does not exist:
‘Reform UK has announced it would abolish the right of migrants to qualify for permanent settlement in the UK after five years, if the party wins the next election.’
‘Reform said it would replace ILR with visas that force migrants to reapply every five years. That includes hundreds of thousands of migrants currently in the UK’
‘Hundreds of thousands of these migrants, who have come to the UK since 2021, will soon qualify for permanent residence under the ILR scheme’ and would qualify by the time (if) Reform get into power.
‘Farage said he accepted the policy would split families and remove people integrated in their communities “but that’s why we’re giving people advance notice of what’s coming”‘.
‘A person can currently apply for British citizenship 12 months after they have been granted indefinite leave to remain.
‘Reform said the changes would not apply to EU nationals whose settled status is protected under the European Union Withdrawal Agreement – and who make up the majority of benefit claimants by people with ILR.’
Reform policy chief Zia Yusuf argued the changes would lead to “hundreds of thousands of people having to apply and ultimately losing their settled status in the UK”.
‘”Those that don’t [comply] will be subject to immigration enforcement as part of our mass deportation programme.”‘
‘Reform’s announcement is noteworthy for its extraordinary implications for a huge portion of the current UK population.
Retrospectively applying the policy to those already here is particularly contentious. The rights of hundreds of thousands of individuals would slip away under this policy unless they meet strict rules.’
link to bbc.co.uk
Worrying about this policy is pearl clutching and the concern of an utter berk? Fine I am a pearl clutcher and utter berk then, though I prefer to think of it as simply being a decent person, something you reduce to meaningless insulting clichés.
Do you know the rough percentage of SNP votes Alba need to maje geadway
Is she nearly there yet?
Greetin Greta is still somewhere off the Greek coast. I reckon they must be paddling extra slow in the hope it’s all over before they get there. Then they can turn back and scoff all the good stuff along the way as they return home:
link to bbc.co.uk
They’ve been delayed. They had to get rid of a homosexual coz the hamas dude was getting pissed.
Apologies, Mark! I thought you were making an obscure joke.
I have only now got with the programme:
link to unherd.com
It’s interesting what the article’s author says about the possible linkage between what’s happening on the high seas and the internal fractures between Jezza, the dried fruit bint, and the other 4 “local” boys.
It’s not a good time to be lefty, progressive and a flag-waver for the omnicause.
Ahahahahahahahahaha!
So I have just read on Unherd.
Brain teaser:
Which ABBA song mentions a Scottish city?
I know that one.
But you have to tell me what currency iScotland is going to use first.
Venezuela arming pensioners to defend their country against Uncle Sam:
link to bbc.co.uk
There’s a catch though:
‘Benigno Alarcón, a political analyst at the Andrés Bello Catholic University, says Maduro’s plan for the militia is not for it to engage in battle but rather to act as a “human shield”.
Prof Alarcón argues that by calling up civilians, the Maduro government wants to increase the human cost any potential US military action would incur by making the possibility of human casualties much higher.
According to Prof Alarcón, it therefore does not matter if the militia are not well trained or even if they are unarmed’
What is it with governments these days seeking to maximise the casualties within their own people? I blame the ham assholes for starting it.
Erjecito Popular the Venazualin Volksstrum. Operation certain death. It’s a habit of dictators to make their people pay the price of government failure. The Venazualin government have had it coming for quite some time considering the country is run by MS-13.
I guess then that for the ordinary Venezuelan, their fate all comes down to whether they have a colourful and distinctive flag that will appeal to the young.
And if they typically wear a comfortable, practical and versatile fashion item that can be made to look cool, rebellious and designer pricey to westerners.
What are the chances, eh?
Lacking these critical accessories, an enemy will be able to slaughter Venezuelans in the hundreds of thousands and the rest of the world will just look on, saying “meh, whatever”.
Just skimmed through WoS looking for news of several news topics of real significance: anti Alex Salmond conspiracy, James Hynde, Mark Hirst.
See that (with honourable exceptions) the comments have reached a disappointingly low standard. Makes me think of ‘The News Quiz’, a first rate radio comedy until it was turned into the witless and vacuous Andy Zaltsman show, serving as a platform for a twerp. Regrettably, with so many contributions from the fake Scotty McScottface, Stu Campbell’s good work is undermined in a similar fashion.
‘Bye.
Awww, diddums.
It’s a mystery though, why you would expect a bunch of havering septuagenarians and octogenarians to have discovered startling new facts about the Salmond conspiracy, or anything else happening in the real world.
Just as it’s a mystery why you would expect BTL to be rammed with comments of the sort “I agree with Rev Stu so much it hurts inside”.
But if that’s what you want, why not post a few yourself? Make yourself useful.
BTW. You do realise it’s perfectly possible to read Rev Stu’s articles and not bother reading BTL at all?
Oh but wait. Maybe you don’t. That will be something just the smart people have sussed.
Just for Jay.
Here’s a fantastic article about the realities facing all of us in September 2025:
link to unherd.com
Of course we can bury our heads in the sand and pretend it’s still 2014.
But the real world is never gonna play along.
Andy Zaltzman has made the News Quiz consistently listenable again! Often he is the only one who is actually funny on the show. He’s almost as good as Basil Brush as a presenter, who would be an excellent News Quiz host.
England made a Treaty in the name of Britain with the Netherland states the first being in October 1709 to Secure the protestant succession to the throne of England and the House of Hanover…..
In Exchange England promised to act as a buffer zone and protect the states from France and catholic King James and king of Scotland.
This first treaty was made two years after the faux 1707 treaty of union and was called…. The Barrier Treaty.
Just another one of those treaties of England down in records as a british treaty, due to England calling itself Britain.
The Barrier treaty and the gist of what the agreement was about can also be found in Google books under the title…
The Barrier Treaty vindicated.
From the earliest dates The Westminster parliament of England and political class has held the political belief that the name of England was Interchangable with the name of Britain,
In this treaty it is continuing as the Great Britain parliament of England for the securing the Monarchy of England and the religion of England succession to the English throne against Scotland, king James and France, two years after the faux treaty of union with Scotland,
Stupidity and arrogance are a potent mixture and Mark Beggan has plenty of both.
This is what public health research in Scotland says about the effect of Thatcher.
“Since the 1980s the Scottish economy has undergone major changes, such as the substantial loss of heavy industry jobs, and the financial crisis of 2007 and subsequent imposition of austerity measures, significantly affecting employment and income levels. The links between economic opportunities and mortality from drugs, alcohol and suicide have been made before. The impact of economic recessions on suicides and alcohol abuse is well documented [35, 36] and evidence also suggest increased disorders from illicit drug use during economic downturns [37]. In addition, those of lower SES may be more likely to experience depression or substance use disorders during recessions [37, 38], supporting our findings of high socio-economic inequalities in mortality from suicides, drugs and alcohol. The impact of economic change on health can also be very long-lasting. For example, the cohort of men born in Scotland between 1960 and 1980 and affected by the neoliberal policies of the 1980s have experienced high drug and suicide mortality also in the 1990s and early 2000s, decades after the economic changes [30, 31].”
Mirjam Allik, Denise Brown, Ruth Dundas & Alastair H. Leyland
Deaths of despair: cause-specific mortality and socioeconomic inequalities in cause-specific mortality among young men in Scotland
International Journal for Equity in Health volume 19, Article number: 215 (2020)
“Junco Partner”
“Down the road came a Junco Partner
Boy, he was loaded as can be
He was knocked out, knocked out loaded
He was a’wobblin’ all over the street
Singing six months ain’t no sentence
Yeah and one year ain’t no time
I was born in Angola
Serving fourteen to ninety nine
Well I wish I had me one million dollars
Oh, one million to call my own, call my own
I would raise me, and say, “Grow for me baby”
Raise me a tobacco farm
Take a walk, take a walk
Junco Partner
Well, when I had me a great deal of money
Yeah, I had mighty good things all over town
Now I ain’t got no more money
All of my good friends they’re putting me down
So now I gotta pawn my ratchet and pistol
Yeah I’m gonna pawn my watch and chain, chain, chain
I would have pawned my sweet Gabriella
But the smart girl she wouldn’t sign her name
Down the road, down the road, down the road
Down the road came a Junco Partner
Boy, he was loaded as can be
He was knocked out, knocked out loaded, loaded, loaded, loaded
He was ‘wobblin’ all over the street
Take a walk, I can’t walk
Down the road came a Junco Partner
Hey mister he called out to me
And it was three things he said
Junco Partner
Well I’m down, yes I’m getting thirsty
Pour me out a good beer, when I’m dry
Just, just give me whiskey, when I’m thirsty
Well give me headstone when I die
Down the road”
Half a second’s thought tells us that the incidences of serious drugs misuse, serious alcohol misuse and suicide among all those millions of “New Brits” who have rocked up on our shores since Thatcher must be through the roof.
After all, they can’t possible be magically immune to de-industrialisation, “austerity” and the financial crisis of 2007. (I thought it was 2008.) They’ve even got a lot more to thole, what with being in a foreign country where most of the indigenous people hate their guts.
We’ll all wait with baited breath for sam to link to these studies too.
Or, we’ll accept that just like the agenda-pushers who cherry pick statistics to maintain their own funding streams, sam’s arrogance relies on the assumption that we’re all too stupid to think for ourselves.
Forgive me as this is completely off topic but I have just read in the Guardian that a woman was raped in a churchyard by ‘a group of men’.
Now I can almost understand a man raping a woman – almost, as it seems the male of the species has less control over his sexual urges- but I cannot understand a’group of men’ getting together and raping a woman and presumably thinking that was an OK thing to do.
Where were the good guys?
I know nothing of the detail of this story.
But why should that stop me commenting? It never stops anybody else!
You have to understand that in the hierarchy of victim-hood, women have been officially demoted several places over the last decade.
If there were any “good guys” around, it’s possible that they evaluated whose official victim-hood level trumped whose. If the rapists were all higher up the hierarchy, then to interfere would only get the interferers into deep doodoo. A bit like when some punter tackles a shoplifter and then gets charged with assault.
But we’ll have to wait for all the details to come out. That’s if they ever do – for the crimes committed by the denizens of some hierarchy levels, we aren’t allowed to know the details, just in case we get angry.
link to sciencedaily.com
“Dr Alex Scott-Samuel and colleagues from the Universities of Durham, West of Scotland, Glasgow and Edinburgh, sourced data from over 70 existing research papers, which concludes that as a result of unnecessary unemployment, welfare cuts and damaging housing policies, the former prime minister’s legacy “includes the unnecessary and unjust premature death of many British citizens, together with a substantial and continuing burden of suffering and loss of well-being.””…
…””Towards the end of the 1980s we were seeing around 500 excess deaths each year from chronic liver disease and cirrhosis. We also know that there were 2,500 excess deaths per year as a result of unemployment caused by Thatcher’s policies. And these premature deaths represent just the tip of an immense iceberg of sickness and suffering resulting from Thatcherism.””
“just the tip of an immense iceberg of sickness and suffering resulting from Thatcherism”
What’s bigger than an iceberg then? An ice sheet?
Because the millions of immigrants since Thatcher’s day must be suffering all the ailments blamed on Thatcher, but to a much higher degree.
Honestly. They should distribute copies of sam’s posts on the Calais beaches. Somebody needs to tell Reform to get this kick-started.
They could stop the boats in an afternoon, armed with just these posts.
That’s if they were true. Obviously.