Don’t you forget about me
Posted on
July 26, 2014 by
Chris Cairns
The world's most-read Scottish politics website
-
About
Wings Over Scotland is a (mainly) Scottish political media digest and monitor, which also offers its own commentary. (More)
-
Recent Posts
- 11-12
- 11-09
- 11-06
- 11-04
- 11-03
- 11-02
- 10-29
- 10-26
- 10-26
- 10-21
- 10-19
- 10-16
- 10-13
- 10-11
- 10-10
- 10-07
- 10-06
- 10-05
- 09-28
- 09-26
A tall tale
Wee Books
Video
Probably a robbery
Transphobia
@Chris Cairns, awe did ye hiv tae bring the Dung Heap into oor living room.Crowdfunding fur a New Carpet for WOS.
Well done Chris, top form ma Manny.
I walked through Brigdeton with a Yes badge and got thumbs up including train staff.
Spoke with many visitors this week to Glasgow and they were Yes voters and are thinking about 18th September.
It does bear some resemblance of flipper. Nice one Chris.
With most of our country talking about the Referendum, to pretend it’s not happening for two weeks is just silly.
Let’s hope it’s a massive turn out at PQ tomorrow, and show the world we are not just bending over for the BBC to shaft us. See you there peeps.
Yes, currently Scotland’s future is a kind of elephant in the room – we’re here to replace its tusks taken illegally.
Good cartoon as always.
That which must not be spoken off ( in the context of the Games).
TeamYes has stuck to the moral high ground.
You can’t really say that about TeamNo. Their politicising is everywhere, and sometimes not particularly subtly. As always, we can hope their size twenty boots trampling everywhere just generates more Yes voters.
This time I’m kinda struggling Chris?
If the referendum didn’t get full frontal at the games; by the way, it certainly didn’t stop NO’s chums getting some worldwide exposure, ie, Tunnock’s Tea Cakes, John Barrowman, BBC Sport, Red, White and Blue Red Arrows etc., but the crowd, the Saltires, the Scottish athletes and Dan Wallace sure put it there, right in your face.
How BT, the BBC and the No-ists must really hate the open displays of Scottish feeling at T-in-The-Park and the Games – it’s a pure delight to see something that can’t be countered by propaganda and lies. It’s win-win-win!
Re- EnQuest
“EnQuest, through it1s wholly owned subsidiary – EQ. Petroleum Production Malaysia Ltd – has agreed to acquire Exxon Mobil Exploration and Production Malaysia.
As the largest Independent in the North Sea, portfolio =
Heather/Broom oil fields
Thistle/Deveron
West Don
Don Southwest and Conrie
Alba oil field
Alma/Gallia
Kraken
Don Northeast acquired in March 2014
Other SEVEN licences in Malaysia,Egypt,Norway and Tunisia.
EnQuest Press Release on Feb 11th 2013 – as follows :-
“EnQuest donates much neede Outdoor clothing to Aberdeen children.” headline ends.
Wasn`t that kind of EnQuest after they have plundered Scotland of hundreds of billions of our Mineral Rights.
Keep yer fuckin charity and we will clothe our own weans AFTER Sept.
I can visualize that elephant in every cabinet meeting, in every committee room at every meeting between civil servants and politicians and affecting every decision by a hostile Westminster government.
I would say that there is no danger of people forgetting the Referendum. When you have the BBC English Team up here patronising the Jocks, every might on the tele there is one or other little programme with Scotland or Scottish in the title. I think the Scots are very good at seeing through things.
Damn, meant to say another Great Cartoon.
Re-EnQuest
“Greyfriars Bobby” would need a licence to dig into the graveyard, a licence from the “Crown Estate” which owns Scotland`s Mineral Rights onshore and offshore.
Has there ever been an international sporting event that has contained no politics?
There have already been calls for a boycott of the 2018 World Cup just a few weeks after the last one finished.
This expat is talking about the referendum
link to thedrum.com
Flash baffies!
Are you sure you’re allowed to do that during the Games?
Weel done, cairnstoon.com! And of an instant all was licht
[…] « Don’t you forget about me […]
lmao nice one Chris i just fell off the chair laughing at this one ,once again you hit the nail right on the head more power to your pencil 🙂
Hogarth lives.
Listening to the commentators during the games, they can’t help themselves to say British as often as possible can they. Take that programme last night hosted by Claire balding with the proud dad’s and so on they got 1 scot judo player and 3 English judo players on the sofa, then they got another 1 scot and then again 3 English athletes and asked one of the English athletes a question about patriotism and feeling proud. Why not ask the Scottish athletes that question? The simple answer is let’s try and make this as much about England and deflect the fact its in Scotland as much as possible.
Brill as usual Chris.
And if you want a bigger smile,read this.
link to thedrum.com
I had to turn off the CWG this morning when watching the swimming. Non stop talk about the English swimmers, then effected surprise when Cameron Brodie (who they had ignored) beat the entire field, including Chad Le Clos, in the heat. When he was interviewed afterwards, excited and pumped up for the final, the panel said ‘Aye, don’t get your hopes up, son’.
Have turned to Radio Scotland, who are actually making a stab at covering this properly.
link to theguardian.com
Scotland wiped from British history again, which is weird considering they’re kicking off their £50+ million WW1 celebrations in Glasgow and that’s got nothing to do with the referendum either. Scotland doesn’t really exist but if it tries to, it’s an outrage.
Nice cartoon, Chris. Pachyderms ?–Us.
Ach! The revers R is not printing. It shows in the preview but not in the finished post.
It is a disgrace how they hijacked the CWG I have stopped watching it, the 18th September cant come quick enough now I know when it arrives we will all suffer in England but the goverment are all to blame, mum will send me food parcels.
A bit O/T , but i see Darling is raving again in Fife Today…apparently the travel restrictions at the border will cost Scotland 8 billion, and 250,000 jobs. What a tool.link to fifetoday.co.uk
@WantonWhampun
In point of fact, the Crown Estate owns the mineral rights with the exception of hydrocarbons (Westminster rapidly removed them from the CE when they realised the value!)
Not sure what you beef is with Enquest. They’ve acquired their license from the UK govt (agree these ought to be in our posession), and pay their tax (ditto). Even if we set up a ScotNoc – as I hope we do – we’ll still need independently owned companies to take much of the massively expensive risk of exploration and development. Having the taxpayer take the full burden would be to tie up a lot of money in a high risk area – not good.
May I advise you to look more closely at the way Norway manages the relationship between state and private enterprise when it comes to oil explo. It provides a good model – and a much better one than WM
Great cartoon.
This is also very good from Jim Sillars
link to news.stv.tv
Tried posting a bit from this, but it’s not appearing.
link to thedrum.com
David Speedie going ‘off (establishment) message’.
O/T, just back from Airth Highland games (daughter dancing, 3rd ta for askin)
Both sides were represented with stall but I was slightly disappointed by the number of “no thanks” stickers,badges and balloons in the crowd.
I don’t know the area, or indeed if Highland dancing folk are more No inclined, but nuff respect to the guys and girls who were Manning the Yes stall. Quietly chatting to anyone they could and giving info and knowledge.
@ turnbul drier, the number of no thanks balloons etc at any Highland games is because unionists love that side of Scotland, proud Scot buts. I know some very wealthy unionists vey no voting here in Aberdeen but they love their kilts for weddings etc
It’s like the common wealth games opener with Barrowman, unionists loved it, Yes voters not so much.
Check out another old man dead apainst change and doesnt vote No Graun love him for it
link to theguardian.com
Posted on link to ibtimes.co.uk
“£8 bn ? Has the man now commonly known as ‘Flipper’ due to his creative expenses claims now totally lost the plot ?
A quarter of a million jobs ? Come off it, not a single job will be lost, apart from the jobs of those who peddle such utter tripe.
The total, and absolute media compliance with the No campaign has backfired badly on those who dubbed their own campaign “Project Fear”, and has shown up Westminster as the sham of a democracy they purport to represent.
Only at online blogs, such as link to wingsoverscotland.com will the impartial reader find the true state of the referendum campaign.
The UK is finished, Flipper knows it, and this ridiculous article is the end product.
link to telegraph.co.uk ”
And why am I bothering ? Because, they need to know. 🙂
Minty @ 1.43 me too, just so flipping biased grrrr. Also referring to Angerland as ‘ home team’ ,what’s that about. Nana excellent article thanks.Great cartoon Chris
And in the Scottish Sun: Wells blasts Darling for union push at Games
link to thescottishsun.co.uk
Defo – 3.54
“The standard you walk past is the standard you accept” Lt General David Morrison Australian Forces …. that’s why I also cannot let go past me.
Spent this afternoon not defending but promoting the numerous reasons for the support of our Gaelic language at a rather boozy g
— sorry don’t know why my comment jumped.
cont. garden lunch with some very loud NO neighbours. Left on good relations and hopefully judging from their less aggressive attitude some truths, understanding and cultural appreciation were appreciated. I despair over some who you would assume were educated and rational – but it always inspires me when these people are asked to explain their views regularly fall short. I enjoyed the wine however.
Clarinda, Hope it’s fun.
I was ripping off a section from Guy Garveys (Elbow)
6music show called Beckypedia.
It’s a weekly diatribe on some v obscure, and not so obscure music.
She signs off every week with “and why am I telling you this ?, because you need to know !”
For all the BBCs crimes against democracy, 6music, and this show in particular, are outstandingly good. But still not recompense.
Nicely done, Chris! 🙂 You’ve a way for summing up things.
Great cartoon Chris.
What the television coverage is doing is reinforcing the view that the BBC is a media organisation from a foreign* country. Can you imagine Canadians watching a major sporting event in their own country being broadcast only by a media company in the USA, or Australians only being able to watch from a New Zealand viewpoint. The commentators can’t help themselves but treat England as their main focus and I would have no problem with that if the programs were only being broadcast in England. However, it is disrespectful to the host nation to have their current focus on other teams.
Even worse is the TV cameras roaming the crowd looking for UJ flags. Especially pathetic was yesterday when during the medal ceremony for the para cycling, they cut away to show someone taking a photo from their phone as it had a UJ skin on it. The framing was deliberate to have this UJ centre screen as there wasn’t a UJ flag anywhere else to be seen in amongst all the saltires on show.
*apologies for using the “foreign” word but I don’t think any other word is appropriate in this context..
From the SUN
SPRINT king Allan Wells blasted No campaign leader Alastair Darling yesterday over his clumsy bid to make political gain from Team Scotland’s gold glory.
Olympic legend Wells hit out as the Better Together boss used our first-day medal haul to argue for keeping the Union.
Former Chancellor Mr Darling insisted the total won by the home nations showed we can “do an awful lot” as the UK.
From the Torygraph, who also warned Salmond to keep out of the Games but not far enough for them and just jump in anywhere with this chap’s unionist anger at Scottish democracy
link to telegraph.co.uk
“The kilt, the tartan, Balmoral, the novels of Walter Scott – almost every famous emblem of Scottish self-consciousness – arose from the defeat of Scottish independence, not its assertion.”
Also check out torygraph poll of polls with Tories getting further and further ahead of Labour. Even with his Labour in Scotland MP’s, Milliband is probably never going to be prime minster of what ever they’ll the UK after 18th Sept. awe.
Susan says:
in the Scottish Sun: Wells blasts Darling for union push at Games
There is still a bit NaeSayer giggery pokery in the way the Sun presents the story. Look at the headline ….
Marks, get set ..NO
Wells blasts Darling for union push at Games
That big capitised NO is there to impart a message!
Similarly, spelling union with a small ‘u’ seems odd.
Up playing the ‘no’, down playing the fact it’s about the ‘union’.
An appropriate and accurate headline would have been a simple..
Wells blasts Darling for Pro-Union push at Games
Foreign is actually the correct word to use given it’s not about technicalities but about what you, and a lot of us for that matter, feel.
That torygrpah ligger is on form. Talk about a propaganda battle in the teamGB media, Flipper’s certainly a gift, sorry future UK Lord Flipper, plus expenses.
“On August 5, the television debate between Mr Salmond and the leader of the No campaign, Alistair Darling, will take place. Everyone expects the former to shine and the latter to plod. But Mr Darling is actually a living embodiment of one of Scotland’s gifts to the whole United Kingdom – cool-headed good sense. It is a curious feature of this debate that he is somehow seen as the underdog when actually he speaks for the majority. That might work to his advantage.
To be quite honest, in some ways, I think turning the referendum off for a few days might not be a bad thing, and I’ll say why.
Right now, everyone is watching the games, and to be honest, they have been excellent. Scotland has seriously punched at a level that has boosted the feeling in Scotland. We are 3rd in the table behind Australia and England. That’s excellent going. The nation is proud at what our athletes have achieved.
Can you imagine it if Scotland had an absolute stinker at these games. The Unionists would be crowing how Scotland can’t do it by itself, that it needs the Union.
For the hardcore Unionists, this is a nightmare. The last thing they want to see is a ton of Saltires being waved, Scottish Saltires on shirts, football tops, Glasgow 2014 shirts, Scots doing brilliantly at the games, and Flower of Scotland being sung 2 or 3 times a day at the medal ceremonies. I’ll put money on it, that a few of them were praying that we would have a nightmare, just like the unfortunate Welsh. It hasn’t happened, and hopefully, we’ll finish the games with at least 40 to 50 medals. A record for Scotland.
If that does come to pass, and Scotland finishes 3rd or 4th in the overall table, then we will count that as a roaring success. England will finish top, Australia 2nd with possibly Scotland, India or Canada third. The nation will be proud, and there will be a very positive feeling throughout the land.
And then the referendum begins again. For the Unionists, I think it is going to be quite hard to try and pickup where they left off before and to try and put Scotland down. Any crass or below par comments will be sneered at by the public. The positivity from the games will last for weeks. How can Scotland be that bad? If we can do that; a small nation of 5 million against 50 million Englishmen, 22.5 million Australians, 35 million Canadians and 1.2 BILLION Indians, then how could we not stand on out own 2 feet? It’s going to be very hard to shoot Scotland down. The ultimate Unionist nightmare; a buoyant Scotland! We’ve seriously taken on the likes of Australia and England and given them more than a run for their money.
I think with the games, and (hopefully) Salmond’s demolition on Darling will finally turn the tables.
Plus and also Torygraph, this Scottish gift to the UK is English, in wiki anyway
Early life[edit]
Alistair Darling was born in London[2] the son of a civil engineer, Thomas, and his wife, Anna MacLean. He is the great-nephew of Sir William Darling, a Conservative (Unionist) Member of Parliament for Edinburgh South (1945–1957).
@heedtracker
I know this is childish, but I will take great delight in watching how the Telegraph, and many others, come to terms with the situation if a Yes win is announced on the 19th
@JLT
Well made points.
there will be a very positive feeling throughout the land
I agree that could translate into a positive vote!
@heedtracker
That quote from the Torygraph is pure comedy gold.
“Balmoral” is an “emblem of Scottish self-consciousness”?!
It just shows you though the mindset of your average North Brit : the natives are not to be trusted with determining their own future. But give them a few tartan trinkets & a monarchical castle in their own backyard to ensure they still feel Scotch.
I suppose one good thing about all of this is that we only have 53 more days of being a colony of England.
Hazel Irvine is ex St Andrews uni, just like Toodle oo the noo.
Is that where the state picks them?
OT
Has anybody actually added up all the job’s they claim Scotland will lose if we vote YES
Because it sound’s like it’s all of them.
The whole BBC coverage of the Games is implying that we are contesting them as “the Home Nations”
It is not only Scotland that is getting a bad deal because of the Referendum but Wales and Northern Ireland as well
Look for the silver lining;
Red Arrows: only red white and blue colours can be trailed – sees the Wings article on the non-political Games.
Wee flags given out showing the Saltire on one side, the Butcher’s Apron the other – whose idea was that? Glasgow City Council?
Anthem at the Opening ceremony? Anthem at medal presentations?
BBC English commentators flown up to entertain and inform us. Crisp salesman Lineker – staggered intellect – talking about piss and Dan Wallace.
They are rubbing your noses in it folks. Penny dropped yet? Angry and quietly determined to assert yourself on 18th of September?
What is it with Hazel and her ‘weegie word of the day’ today it was squinty, you patronising erses. Did you have cockney words of the day at True Brit 2012? I’m just taking the trouble and strife up the apples and pears!
@dave
I suspect what will happen with the BBC is that if England finish top of the medal table they will not stint in reminding us of that fact, but will probably take a tack which says ‘but if you combine all the medals won by all of the home nations it shows a total which outstrips Australia, Canada and South Africa combined..’
You can fill in the rest of the pish yourselves.
Has the mystery of who commissioned and paid for the two-faced flags ever been solved?
I watched the women’s Triathlon and heard the commentator say the English contestants were doing well because they were running on home soil.
Regards the Commy Games.
Lots of mentions from the English regards the Aussies as being their main rivals too. Must baffle many Scots as I don’t think we have any ‘rivarly’ with them in sport.
Hearing Home Nations a lot.
England of course number 1 with the Beeb. What’s the demographics, must be over 90% of the presenters, commentators, experts are mostly English.
All our Scots presenters are up at Carnoustie or away on Radio Scotland. I did hear Paul Mitchell doing the Bowls and we’ve got wee Vipond on BBC 3.
Scotland – we’re getting a bit of coverage, but mainly down to the hosts. It’s toned very much like “Oh, didn’t those plucky Jocks do well” – much like when BBC/ITV commentated on Eire qualifying for the Euro 2012.
Northern Ireland and to a lesser extent Wales have been practically ignored. We’ve had the drug scandal in Wales and their lassies winning in the Gymnastics, but can you recall them showing anything showing Northern Ireland? I cannot at all, apart from the young lad in the Boxing.
Also, a lot of questions to the ‘Home’ Nations if they want to beat their Team GB pals or wish them well. Notice also that if they like the Welsh cyclist there said “I want to beat them all as we are seperate countries” END INTERVIEW!
@alastair seago
Sometimes its malicious, more often than not it’s actually just ignorance, arrogance, stupidity and disrespect!
Ronnie Anderson
Come back Ronnie Anderson.
I have got a table for tomorrow and YES stuff, also bringing the new YES magazine to hand out.
See you about 1pm big man.
I see we are now collectively the home teams.
@heedtracker
Darling’s comments about the success of the home nations at the CW being due to the”UK” are not only fatuous, but ignorant & disrespectful to the individual athletes.
Daniel Wallace left the UK & went to the States to study & train.
Lineker complaining on twitter about getting pelters for not being Scottish.
Be aware folks. I’ve noticed that folk are discussing what would happen after a No vote across most of the indy blogs.
This isn’t a coincidence. Momentum is everything, and the state is trying to stop that momentum by deploying folk to talk about a No vote.
Fuck a No vote. It is going to be a Yes landslide!
Home teams! BBC trying to set the agenda of the language used, just in case any of the second-raters thought they might be seen as individual members of the Commonwealth, even for a moment.
I now understand about the furriner business.listening to BBC they make me feel a foreigner in my own country of Scotland!
@juteman.
I’m with you on that.
YES…63%
Cracking cartoon Chris, the indyrelephant is all around Scotland, it makes and leaves big YES tracks! I was thinking of something similar.. allow me to share:
The thing with ‘independence’ is it’s a word, one word. By putting words into pictures we’re then able to quantify and understand the meaning better.
There’s a box that sits on a table, it has the word ‘independence’ written on the outside.. what’s inside the box you curiously ask? Inside there is a book called ‘Scotland’s Future’ (check it out) Unfortunately the box and contents are being subjected to ongoing abuse by Westminster.
Infact the table this particular box sits on seems similar to that of a courtroom in session. Our pro politicians are having to defend indy.. whilst Westminster point the prosecution finger. The thing is, independence is innocent all along!
You, me and we are the jury present, the press are in the gallery, Rev Stu’s the judge and hey hey, Chris Cairns is the illustrator.. have I missed anybody out?
Infact CC, be my guest to muster up something on this theme if ye fancy, cheers.
Have a great time in Scotland’s Glasgow tonight all citizens and visitors aboard.. show em what we’re made of, party on!
I seem to recall that AS and Flipper agreed to call a truce during the games. I haven’t heard very much from AS , and an awful lot from Flipper… so WHO is politicising these games?? He can almost see his seat in the Lords , beside all the other irrelevances.
@turnbuldrier, 3.21
The Highland Games phenomenon is part of the Victorian development of tourism and of the Scottish Highlands as a playground for the Imperial establishment. The Empire may be dead but the establishment still exists, is still playing the Highlands (also the Borders) and is funding BTUKOKNT.
Another Victorian relic is the Tartan subculture of sentimentality with music hall acts such as Harry Lauder’s, songs like “Granny’s Hielan Hame” and the Kailyard school of literature.
This is the patriotism which “Proud Scots” are happy to encourage. Modern examples of this “pawky couthiness” include calling websites “Labour Hame” or “Tory Hoose”, and having slogans such as “Vote Naw”. The best recent example is the opening of the 2014 Commonwealth Games. The Wee Ginger Dug has the best description – Kailyard Kitsch on Acid.
I’m trying very hard to ignore the BBC coverage of the CWG and continuing to try and persuade as much of the no’s or dk’s as possible.
Between my son and myself we achieved 4 more converts this week, even went as far as getting one guy to call his local electoral register to send the appropriate forms to register.
Looking for more possibilities next week.
Another Gold for Neil and Craig in the velodrome 😀 Go Team Scotland, another misty eyed medal ceremony
Cameraman catching Chris Hoy singing ‘be a nation again’. The irony of it.
Sorry, but just watched Scotland getting another gold in cycling, but am I the only one who thinks the BBC are buggering around with the sound when Flower of Scotland is played?
The sound is definitely being muted when Flower of Scotland is being sang.
Don’t suppose the corrupt media are broadcasting the occupy parliament square which has been happening today.
There is a livestream
link to occupylondon.org.uk
Someone smuggled something in to the Athletes village and was caught by some of the Welsh athletes..
link to i59.tinypic.com
Juteman says:
“Be aware folks. I’ve noticed that folk are discussing what would happen after a No vote”
I suspect some are agent provocateurs. Trying to insight violent language and threats.
They just can’t take democracy, can they?
Juteman says:
I guess stuff like that, will be their last shot at spoiling the YES vote. Trouble is Scots do not like being threatened and it will result in more YES votes.
That is how to beat them, watch, note, be careful, voting YES is YOUR REVENGE.
On mixing politics with sport.
At Tynecastle this afternoon, Annan supporters had a Annan says YES banner tied to railings behind the goal but it was removed at half time.
Did Labour MP Ian Murray complain to the stewards / police?
Fundraiser from Edinburgh for YES…
link to new.livestream.com
At Glasgow green live event and merchant city, plenty of people wearing “yes” badges, a couple of wings badges, stickers everywhere and a few flats with Yes
Not one Unionists did I see displaying anything
@galam etc
Well somebody has to talk about it cos the other side aren’t 🙂
Visit from a pal from glasgow today. Telling me out of 15 of his pals on a night out last nite, 14 were voting yes. I shoulda asked if the other one was a dont know.
That Telegraph story about “the famous emblems of Scottish self-consciousness” is superb. Speaking as someone from the South of England, I have to say that people around those parts generally really do think that is what Scotland is like.
@Les Wilson
I mentioned this yesterday too. You can hear the crowd very faintly when they shout “”gainst him”. Compared to the normal crowd reaction it’s pretty obvious it’s been turned way down.
O/t sorry. Ronnie A, Caz m, Gerry P.
Couple of weeks ago you asked if anyone could bring any spare leaflets to PQ3. I have some spare LFI and some Aye Right leaflets. Do you guys still want me to bring them down tha’ morra.
I’ve got a good bundle of Aye Right leaflets which i’ll bring, courtesy of David whos doing the Shawlands Yes stall – had a great early afternoon there helping out.
Yes Saltire in Tollcross at the swimming, the EBC cameraman will getting his books 😀
Just saw the big YES Saltire at Tollcross 🙂
They may have tried to Brittify the whole shebang but they missed to most obvious trick with allowing them to sing two verses of the national anthem.
Every gold, everyone that’s singing along, out loud or in their heads, is saying “we can still rise now, and be a nation again.”
Over and over, every…single…one!
Flower of Scotland is getting a fair few plays at these games. The team seem to be doing rather well.
The BBC is bloody awful. they’ve just missed the start of ‘some winning ceremony’ to interview a losing english judo player. Then when they cut to the ceremony they thought Ewan Burton had won ‘the bronze.. no the silver… no the gold’.
They then cut short the celebrations to look at a dredger boat on the Clyde.
I have decided that I will travel to Glasgow tomorrow from Dundee for the anti BBC protest
I’ve also noticed the BBC doing everything to quash any sense of individual nations, with their ‘Home nation’ crap.
castle hills chavie
All material and people will be welcome at PQ3. See you tomorrow. We will be there about 1pm.
Did spot a YES Saltire flag, think in the Judo arena(?)
Camera panning stopped briefly at the YES flag, before whisking off, no doubt the producer screaming as he /she realised what it said on the flag
Brian McHugh
I’m corrected it was at the Swimming at Tolcross for the big YES flag, thanks Brian 🙂
Cheers Caz-m, see you all tha’ morra.
No further comment required on this one:
link to twitter.com
Arabs for Independence
Well done. Hope to see you tomorrow.
@Marcia
Fantastic!! What a clever little chap.
Don’t know if any of you have seen this crazy rant from Alistair Darling yesterday.
You really must check this out, the guy is losing it fast.
He is now officially an out and out fruitcake.
link to scotsman.com
Ind-scot at 6.22
I wouldn’t assume anything about Chris Hoy.
When asked at one point he replied that had Scotland been independent he would of course have been proud to represent Scotland but as that was not the case he was proud to represent GB.
The first half of that was thrown away and the second half promoted to Chris Hoy’s great annoyance and he has refused since that point to make any comment on the constitutional issue.
The No side hoping that Scotland would not win much medals – well Scotland have just won 3 more golds.
link to twitter.com
4 Golds for Scotland today so far, 3 at the Judo and one at the Cycling. Great stuff.
What runs through the mind of any first rank Scottish athlete is the hope that they will receive funding and support to compete at international level, wherever that leads them. The last thing they want is sidelined.
Usain Bolt using the games as a practice run, and the insulting Mo Farah avoiding the Games to conserve his best for better, confirm to Scottish athletes anything held in Scotland won’t be seen to have the same status as elsewhere.
I like the way all the competitors seem to be enjoying the Games. There seems to be a great atmosphere at all the venues.
On the Games subject.
Take a peep at the BT facebook page.They seem to be arguing it would be better if all the home nations competed as one and increased the medal count…sad gits.
re Highland games:
I’m not a frequenter so can’t comment with any authority but I do recall meeting Donald MacLaren, a diplomat in Ukraine around 10 or so years ago. He told me he was chief of the clan MacLaren. He struck me as a guy who had rarely set foot in Scotland but to check on his lackeys working on his estate. Nonetheless he was a proud Scotsman it seemed, as was his daughter with an American accent. Now I really don’t know the guy so I shouldn’t make assumptions, but I’d be 99% sure he’s not voting Yes (assuming he gets a vote as clan Chief).
For me, independence is quite strongly class based. I’m sure polls must have been done covering different demographics. Anyone got any links? I’ve met many comfortably off professional and generally ‘better’ off people who are voting yes, but they’ve been very salt of the earth types, very humble. I’m not sure I’d put clan Chiefs and Alistair Darling in that category.
There was one medal ceremony yesterday, I forget which one, where there was a very rousing crowd singing FoS loud and clear but that has been the exception. I’m sure the rafters must be rocking but it’s just not coming across.
crisiscult
Then history will repeat itself in that demographic.After all,not all Chiefs,Lairds and landowners voted for the union.
There is still some honour amongst thieves,the Duchess of Hamilton springs to mind.
annie – Lineker must surely have been told by now that he’s been pronouncing Maclean wrongly. I’ve tweeted him twice for a start! The cycling commentator eventually got it right and only briefly lapsed today. Lineker must expect stick if he can’t be bothered to get the winners names right.
It’s as if he hasn’t heard of Dundee United’s famous manager, Jim McLean, whose side once knocked out a Barcelona team containing a certain crisps salesman!
Quote from Alistair Darling regarding Scotland’s medals, from the link at 8.27pm,
“What it demonstrates is that each of the countries of the UK can do an awful lot on their own, but they can also do an awful lot being part of the UK.”
@Grouse Beater
Until we’re independent it will always be thus.
Until then I’m afraid we’ll have to put up with the patronising from the BBC and their commentators.
Hope thousands turn up tomorrow for the demonstration.
caz-m
That Darling quote is put into perspective by English lassie being interviewed by Lineker earlier.
Can’t remember her name but she won gold for athletics in Manchester.
Anyhoos,she couldn’t talk about any other countries athletes but Englands.And when asked about team GB,she replied that it was “nice” but competing for your own country is something special.
Thank you lass,you cut through the beeb guff perfectly.
@goldenayr
I didn’t want my post to sound bigoted, and hope it didn’t. It just seems logical in any case that those who are doing well out of the current constitutional arrangement are, on a purely narrow minded view of risks and rewards, probably going to vote no. Those with a wider perspective, and those who like to increase their opportunities, might be different.
Why does England have their flags with “England” written across the middle? Lol. No one else does this odd practice.
Darling claims: They can also do an awful lot being part of the UK.”
No they can’t. That’s a lie.
If not selected for Team GB, particularly if they are better than English athlete in Team GB, their career are effectively stymied because they won’t get financial support. And if the athlete has children …
crisiscult
You didn’t,it’s my writing style.Too aggressive and wandering.
Should’ve just said,materialistic fuckwits who’s motto is “I’m Alright Jack”.
Their emblem is the Vicky against a wad of cash.
English swimmer Rebecca Adlington and me have something in common.
The two of us burst oot greetin every time England win something.
Waving the Saltire with Yes at the Commonwealth Games seems not too popular with the Games Officials:
link to twitter.com
caz-m
You owe me a glass o’wine…fecker.
Marcia
Officials though quite happy for people wearing Union Jack tops (next to YES Flag holder) and at other events people waving union jack flags (at 5 a side)
Another Union Dividend says: at 6.40
Can anyone from Annan says Yes confirm what happened to their banner at Tynecastle this afternoon?
Scotland’s got 25 medals. Pro rata top of the tables.
YES
Watch it with the sound off. Not hearing the greeting faces. (Irvine explains all) Greeting coupons aka BBC commentators.
Saw a man being interviewed on BBC with a Yes T shirt but it was a very quick flash before being cut to a head and shoulders shot. Remedy, T shirts with Yes on shoulders and a built in battery pack together with mobiliser button to illuminate T shirt unexpectedly.
O/T – The opening credits for the upcoming ‘Outlander’ TV series (starring YES-supporting Sam Heughan) can be viewed here:-
link to insidetv.ew.com
Mrs Calgacus says that while Braveheart made Scotsmen look brave, Outlander will make them look sexy.
I’ve no idea what she is talking about.
Outlander on IMDB – link to imdb.com
Commentators at the swimming, ” We are going to add the British medals up,and see how they did against Australia”.
Arabs for Independence
See you there. The more the merrier. Just leave me a parking space!
@Marcia says: 26 July, 2014 at 8:21 pm:
“No further comment required on this one:
link to twitter.com
Now that one I like. I’ve got sore ribs with laughing.
I laughed so loud the wee papillon shot in behind the settee in fright and not a lot frightens her.
Update on ‘Make Alba Shine’ : The Strathspey & Badenoch Herald of 24th July has a feature on the IndyRef ‘vote YES’ song by Gilly.
http://www.makealbashine.com
The headline is “A musical challenge to No campaigners”.
This is in Danny Alexander’s constituency. Just sayin’
What a day I had in Glasgow today.
Got off the train at Bridgeton and walked along London Rd. Wasn’t long till I spotted a “Vote Naw” sticker on a wall. Was taken a bit by surprise (I know – Bridgeton), but decided I’d pick it off on the way home. Did see a couple of yes stickers as well.
Met up with an English mate in town, and checked if he’d got himself on the electoral roll. He has and is voting yes. A couple of his mates from Sweden were over. Though you’d never tell as they were bedecked in brand new Scotland rugby tops and “I love Scotland” bags filled with whisky etc. Handed out some Yes car stickers which will now be proudly driven around Stockholm.
Oh, and on the way home somebody had already removed every last trace of that “vote naw” sticker. Magic.
When Chris Sherrington won gold tonight for Scotland in the judo, he turned and saluted the crowd (he is a marine), however, in one of the crowd shots, there was a guy in a green T-shirt doing what appeared to be a nazi salute? He had arm out front, hand stretched flat, thumb under palm, held stationary.
Did I imagine that? Was it a nazi salute? nobody else appears to have noticed.
Brian Powell, the English are obssessed with Australia. I’ve heard lots of wee digs/jokes at beating the Aussies and so on.
And it’s alien to Scotland. We have no history with them. It’s such an English – cricket/rugby thing that has nothing prelevant about Scotland.
It’s much the shame with England and their rivarly with France and Germany in sporting terms. I just shrug my shoulders at this.
“Home nations” – yet I’m hearing nothing of IOM, Guernsey, Jersey, Gibraltar, N.I. Just lots of England, a few token ”Ach, didn’t they do well” patrionising towards us Jocks and the wee clip of the Welsh.
Folks, posted this on here a couple of times before but worth repeating. If you’re going to the BBBC demo tomorrow, I’m reliably informed that it’s now £15 to park at the Science Centre.
I was waiting on Reporting Scotland coming on at 10.30pm after the BBC English News, but I completely forgot that nothing happens in Scotland on a Saturday.
Silly me, what am I like.
I have just enjoyed the rugby – more because we had three Welsh lassies who were going to Ibrox tonight in our YES shop yesterday getting YES stuff and window posters.
I have no doubt that had we been independent or had we had a Scottish Broadcasting Service the Scotland v Canada rugby match would have been a major feature.
BBC London are doing a great job of the coverage of the Scottish Commonwealth Games… don’t interrupt them. 😉
cal
“I’m reliably informed that it’s now £15 to park at the Science Centre”.
You posted that yesterday as well.
I called into the Science Centre on Thursday and they told me that they will be charging just over £1 per hour.
They have done away with the £3 for the whole day tariff. So if you are there three hours you will be charged about £5.
. . . – – – . . . SOS
Am trying to source a decent 12 volt amplifier with 2 inputs (MP3 player and microphone) and vehicle roof mountable speaker(s).
Would be grateful if anyone can point me in direction of supplier, cost of course, is a factor.
@ Faltdubh
Its more the other way around with England/Australia really but there’s a fair bit of bad blood there for sure.
The only time I ever supported England was when they won the Rugby WC in 2003. It was frankly more a case of “anyone but Australia” as they were just such arrogant tossers. I have a fair few Aussie mates* & we have some “discussions on such matters 😀
*interestingly they come from Croatia, Holland, South Africa, Germany & the USA – there is one native Aussie. They all support Australia now.
So I sort of disagree – sport is inherently competitive & nations with cultural/language ties will ramp it up. Provided everyone has a grip on reality then its all good fun.
@Faltdubh says: 26 July, 2014 at 10:14 pm:
““Home nations” – yet I’m hearing nothing of IOM, Guernsey, Jersey”
But! But! But! Faltdubh, none of the three are part of The United Kingdom. All three are, “Crown Protectorates”. certainly all non-UK.
Darling’s remark indicate how stupid he is.
Had we contested the Commonwealth Games as GB most of the Scots, Welsh and N Irish competitors wouldn’t have been there for the great experience.
Someone should ask him if he thinks that is a good idea and whether he thinks the Scottish football team should similarly be wrapped up. (It might well be if we vote NO)
Robert Peffers,
And the Isle of Man isn’t even in the EU, has a parliament more powerful than the Scottish one, and sells electricity to England. Yet astonishingly, it uses the pound – in a currency union!!
Quote from Wikipedia: “The Isle of Man is in a sort of one-sided de facto currency union with the United Kingdom, where the Manx government has decided to make UK currency legal tender on the island”
Source link to en.wikipedia.org
@Vestas,
Interesting to hear that. I’ve never been so I can’t comment, but I do recall Wilko’s kicks and SIR Clive Woodward and so on.
@Peffers,
They are ‘Crown Protectorates’ yet somehow claim Cavendish as BRITISH when he’s cycling for England/GB 😉
Aye – the elephant in the room. Exactly what I was thinking during the opening ceremony.
Tonight after watching Chris Sherringham pick up a wee guy in celebration then pick up the gold medal, the third judo gold of the evening it occurred to me that Mr Cameron and Mr Darling will be watching these medal wins for Scotland through their fingers. Particularly when the medal is presented and the crowd sings Flower of Scotland with passion: the ultimate indy song.
Every victory, every celebration, every time the national anthem is played and every saltire on show makes me feel like we are a wee bit closer. That overused term ‘game-changer’ could be appropriate if the feel good factor keeps cranking up for Scotland.
…and be a nation again – I like the sound of that.
Dave McEwan Hill,
Exactly, most of these Scottish athletes would NEVER be in a team GB, as the selectors have the 10X larger pool of people from England to select from. Only a few scots would get picked (they made up approx. 10% of team GB at London).
In fact, most of the Scottish competitors at the games would be better off with a permanent Scotland team, for the commie games and olympics, as would be the case once we are independent.
re competing as a UK team (or even a British team, taking in Isle of Man, Channel Islands etc):
A guy I knew was ex Army bloke from edinburgh who worked in security for foreign office. He told me he supported England and never followed Scotland in football. I asked him why (I admit I was surprised, not so much to find a Scotsman who didn’t mind seeing England do well, but who actually supported England instead of Scotland). He replied that ‘at least they have a chance of winning something’. Now call me Mr International, but if I was going to choose a team to support on that type of basis, I’d be supporting Germany, Spain, or perhaps even Greece! My point is that a British football team would be sh1te. I’m up for an EU team (eh, before we get kicked out and have to form an EEA team with Norway and Iceland), but think Scottish involvement will be minimal, other than having the best fans!
Stu
Please tell us they have not completely lost the plot down there?
link to bbc.co.uk
Soryy if I’ve got that £15 charge at Science Centre thing wrong but it was a work collegue that told me. If you’ve phoned to check that must be right. I just didn’t want people turning up then getting hammered for parking. Cheers.
Tonight’s sofa at the games – 3 Scots and 1 Welsh. 3 of them have English accents though (the Welsh and 2 Scottish reps).
Interesting day today on the Shawlands Yes stall. Talked to a lot of people who are over for the Commonwealth Games or on holiday and they were very supportive of Yes.
Of course they were saying that they don’t have a vote but what I told them is they may not have a vote, but they do have a voice. I asked them, when speaking to Scots, to casually mention the referendum and ask questions about it, reason being If we can get people to start talking about it their reticence to talk about politics might be overcome. They might decide to research it and, as we know, people in possession of facts are more likely to make the right decision.
@Faltdubh
You don’t have to go, the attitude in a lot of sports is “we won’t win but we can beat the poms” & that’s fine.
Wilkinson is a decent guy, he’s embarrassed by all the hero shit. Woodward was a good coach in terms of getting better performance, I don’t remember him ever beating the union drum around that time. He was English and leading his team.
Enjoy the sports people, take a week or so to chill. The Brit imagery is going to happen – its long been planned no doubt. It’ll backfire so we don’t need to go biting at every real or imagined slight.
Enjoy the games but keep your focus & always be reasonable even with the unreasonable.
The most important month of most of your lives is coming up.
I envy you.
New Sunday Times Panelbase poll:
Yes 41 -2
No 48 +2
DK 11 -1
Excluding don`t knows
Yes 46%
No 54%
Fatboy’s new Scotlandshire anthem, Its funny because its true.
O weed of Scotlandshire
When will we see, an indy ref again
You bottled and voted for
Rule awe Westminster an’ Big Ben
And stood against Eck
Proud David’s Tories
And sent him Londonward
Tae rule again
The oil is gone now
And nukes replaced, just for the thrill
Instead you’ve got foodbanks
And beans so dearly sold
And stood against Eck
Proud David’s Tories
And sent him Londonward
Tae rule again
Those Jocks amass now
And in the crowd, they wish again
But only a naw vote
Saw English rule retained
And stood against Eck
Proud David’s Tories
And sent him Londonward
Tae rule again
link to bbc.scotlandshire.co.uk
James Kelly on the latest poll
link to scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk
Yesitis
Yes 41 -2
No 48 +2
DK 11 -1
1% of the electorate is about 42,000 voters.
So the Sunday Times is trying to tell us that since the start of the Commonwealth Games we have lost 84,000 voters to the NO camp.
Yesitis – Not sure where or who these bollocks polls are based on as the reality is quite different
@crisiscult says: 26 July, 2014 at 11:01 pm
“at least they have a chance of winning something.”
As one who stood and watched a Scottish team not only defeat the English World Cup winning team but make them look very, very ordinary and very, very stupid too. I could suggest that one very good reason why Scotland’s sporting wins had declined is that the sports-persons of today are only now once again beginning to believe in themselves again.
These modern sports-persons have grown up being told they are Scots and an inferior race. Too wee, too poor and too stupid. It is only with the campaigning for independence that they have, at long last, found out that they have been lied to all their lives.
Think what they, and their children can achieve when Scotland does, “rise and become a nation again?
Visit some of the websites, try the Telegraph for example and listen to the absolute claptrap these numpties keep spouting. I was there tonight and I tore into a couple of their more idiotic posts. I was not insulting but showed up the idiotic beliefs they posted. I got perhaps three replies then found I couldn’t post and was asked to verify my registration. Now if they had not recognized my long term registration how did I manage to post some replies?
So just why do you think the Telegraph were shutting me down? These people are not just lying to you and I they are brain washing the more gullible English readers. Some of the stuff they come out with is quite unbelievable.
Independence is going to come as much more of a shock to the English folks system than it will to the Scots naysayers.
Having great fun on the beeb site.
They have a search function at the top of the contact section,I asked…
Who’s the smarmy,I hate Scots,Tonight at the Games”
Came back with Scott Mills.
Done a full query asking how their search function knew this,or is it the default position of all beeb presenters.
Went and asked a second Q.
“Who is Scott Mills?”
I don’t have a clue,be interesting to see if they do.
Here we go.. Splitting hairs over the latest Uk MSM commissioned poll to prove that, actually, a drop in the Yes vote is actually – no, actually – good for Yes.
When is the message going to get through? No polls – anywhere, anytime – will ever show Yes ahead. Not ever. They are gearing us up for a rigged No vote.
Robert Louis – spotted that salute too.
Was very weird, and BBC cut away fast.
The optimist in me hopes it was just a clumsy (tight-fingered) attempt at a high-5 wave… and not a nutter.
Sunday Herald front page;
link to twitter.com
Time for a Wings poll.
Training Day
They’ll have to start forging the postal votes now.
The streets say different.
Tomorrow’s Dunday Herald front page (cracking collectable)
link to twitter.com
or even Sunday Herald 😉
Edward
Is the Judo guy on the front page of the Sunday Herald a YES supporter??
Re latest Sunday Times Panelbase poll
Chins up people, James Kelly’s (Scot Goes Pop) view is that there is no change in Yes & No since the last directly comparable Panelbase poll.
@caz_m could you meet us at the entrance , we have a lot of stuff to unload
caz-m
Would be nice if he was
I would imagine the Scotland squad are under orders not to do or say anything (ok Daniel Wallace, the swimmer did come out with the ‘for Freedom’ shout)
Front page stunner from Sunday Herald, fantastic Scots athletes, Trident cost us a billion quid, UKOK lying over Scots oil reserves, I will take that action!
@goldenayr
And that’s exactly what they’ll do.
This obsession with dissecting MSM polls to find a straw to clutch at for Yes is a waste of time and energy.
You are right – the streets say different. But we can win the vote and ultimately lose the vote thanks to the Electoral Commission and the MSM.
Do you think that we will still be on about 40% of the vote right up to polling day?
If so, that would make a lot of NO voters take it for granted that they are odds on to win it and they just don’t bother turning up to vote.
Thanks Marcia! Great front page too!
Ronnie, what time u planning on being there?
Hello Ronnie,
What time will I get you at and what entrance, the car park??
What is this shit the London experts are coming up with now “the home nations” these clowns really are shit stirrers “mouths for hire”. EBC & SKY have obviously been getting some advice and direction from the establishments back room technicians.
While their payed political puppets run around shouting keep politics out of the games.
I just want Scotland to be an independent country, unfortunately I am now beginning to despise the Westminster establishment and all it’s hangers on, and the sleekit snobbish way they go about their dirty work.
Euan Burton is a YES.
The earlier,edited,interview merely gave the impression he is proud to represent his country.
The lack of interviews and lame questions on Tonight at the Games tells you the rest.
don’t worry about polls just yet 🙂
www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2013/12/15/the-2011-holyrood-election-when-scottish-labour-moved-from-a-14pc-yougov-lead-to-being-18pc-behind-in-just-11-weeks/
@Caz_m we,re leaving Airdrie about 12 so should be there 12.45, if you can hook up with Bob Sinclair that would be good,mind a top with plenty pockets to hold Badges 4 diff badges.
Training Day
I’ve been keeping tabs on some data from a certain source since October last year, at that time Yes had a very slim lead of about 4% over No.
Currently the lead is 13% over No and showing a constant growth
This backs up what we see on the streets
If for some remote reason No win by what ever margin, then I will know that the vote has been rigged
We don’t have any mass parades/protests/gatherings for support of retaining the union, so the guff that comes from the likes of Cameron or Darling or Blair Mcdougal is simply that , complete and utter guff
2nd attempt
link to www1.politicalbetting.com
more…
link to holyrood.com
@ Bob Sinclair see my post to caz_m,gerry is traveling up from Dunoon he might be there 1st I,ll Email him in the morning to meet you,s sus out where we can park if poss.
The only way the outcome of the referendum could be a No vote is if there is postal vote fraud. Surely Labour and Better Together would not lower themselves to that level.
Papadox
You’re just beginning to despise the Westminster Establishment.
Welcome to the party.
Give it time, you will end up going completely mad, the same as the rest of us.
Slight exaggeration, but you get the point.
There is a cure for this illness and that is to VOTE YES on the 18th September.
Caz-m I’m planning on being at the Science Centre Car Park at about 12:30
They can’t rig the vote. What they are doing is psychological, they are rigging the polls to make it look like they are still ahead and because they are masters of propaganda, they know that in the past this has always been a very effective technique to create the ‘impression’ of strength. This is really just a sheep herding tool that they are employing.
But, think about this realistically we are in the misdst of one of the biggest democratic grassroots movements that there has ever been on these isles. They have no control over reality. Unless we give them it. Don’t buy their narrative, keep very positive, stop being paranoid about what they are doing and focus on what we are doing…people are not stupid. We are winning, all we are waiting for is the result on the 19th. Let’s not unravel and certainly on this site let’s remain confident and assured in our outlook regardless of their trickery.
You guys are fantastic on here at stripping back the arguments as well as bringing some excellent satire and humour to the issues as the antidote to this powerful poison that is being chucked our way. The undecideds will start flocking to this site in the final lead up…let’s remain confident and positive, we are going to win.
We are Team Scotland. (topical) 😀
Bob Sinclair
OK I will be in the car park area about 12.30pm.
@ Indy_Scot. Oh aye they wid,rUK has to much to lose wey to much,U know what happens on the Day of Judgement The DEED Will RISE an there,s a lot of Deed people.
@ Bob Caz good men, Together Again Nae Grey Sky’s Falling lol.
‘They can’t rig the vote’
Yup, just as they couldn’t in Glenrothes.
Jeez., I’m starting to think I may be a troll..
@ Bob N Caz, if you,s have a blue skip caps we can tak the Ambassidor Badges on ( no wie tacks, wie thread ).
@Training Day
lol
The polls have got me so worried that I’m going to put another £100 on an over 55% YES win.
Ladbrokes are giving 8/1 on over 55% win.
@ Training Day, If we didna know U the Troll Alert would have sounded, a Big Clackston Horn lol
Ronnie
Are we going to a protest or a fashion parade.
A skipped hat and a jacket with lots of pockets. LOL
See ye ra morra Ronnie.
@ Caz_m as the say in the Scouts be prepared Dib Dib.
Flooplepoop at 12.05
Anybody who imagines that the betting odds are a reliable guide to the likely result of the election should think again.
The YouGov poll that showed Labour miles ahead less than two months before the 2011 election was bollocks. I posted on lots of sites at the time that it was bollocks and I bet an SNP victory at 11/2. YouGov has been exposed as Labour supporting recently anyway
Recent YouGov polls are bollocks. And does anybody think that the UK government would turn a hair about putting £1 million on a NO vote to manipulate the odds.
I believe the recent widely reported £4000,000 bet on NO was probably a fiction (and the two supposed previous £200,000 bets).
And no bookie would take a £400,000 bet, They take it it stages like £50,000 at a time and change the odds after every £50,000 taken. There was no sign whatsoever of this
The odds are being fashioned for political reasons – which is why they were mentioned on Scotland 2014 on BBC the other night. In fact the Government doesn’t even have to put money on. It just needs to act in collusion with the big bookies who are always very eager to please Government.
I keep going on about this.
Get your money on. The fiddled odds are meaning YES is being offered at ridiculous odds. A tenner for a YES result gets you £50 and a tenner for over 55% YES at Ladbrokes gets you over £100
Y’know I listened to Alex Salmond, he said, two campaigns, if negative, the worst wins, if one positive and the other negative, then positive wins. He expects to win. I went to the executive meeting thingy were Bair Jenkins addressed this issue, vote rigging was a question from the audience. His thoroughly relaxed stance, was and is something to behold, I don’t know anyone who walked out of that event that didn’t feel assured about this.
I’m very confident simply because we would never be here if it wasn’t already time, and I hasten to add I actually trust that our government is on this too, as well as people like Stu organising along with thousands of others to have people deployed at the polling stations etc.
We are winning. No doubt and it’s much bigger than we realise. I think sometimes that it’s hard to really believe this, especially for many who have strived for this their whole lives. They of course because of being fully in the know from past experiences make valid points about past elections.
This is very different, this is all and none of political stripe. This is much bigger than elections. Scotland has changed in this past year or so, it really has and will continue to do so. As more and more become engaged this has engendered momentum, the likes of which has never been seen or felt here. It’s unstoppable. It’s infectious. It’s time!
James Fenimore Cooper in his novel “The Last of the Mohicans” printed 1826, had Munro say to Heyward, regarding Scotland, ” Ay, sir, that is a curse, entailed by her unnatural union with a foreign and trading people.” It is easy for me to say here in Australia, have we Scots learned nothing in nearly 200 years?
@ ronnie, the skipped hat and badges had a wee run out at Ibrox tonight to watch the rugby. Go team Scotland and the streaker who scored one of the best tries of the night 😀
O/T
Great programme on early this morning with John Beattie talking to people in atheltics, football and so on and he spoke to an official for sports Scotland who was at pains to point out that Scotland would fail to qualify for the next olympics as thier application to join the UN would time out leaving them out of the games,
When asked if he would be proud to represent an independent Scotland he replied NO,
Beattie then speaks to a young judo hopeful who when the sad old mans opinion is put to her that she may miss the one and only chance she’ll ever have to compete in the olympics if we vote for independence,
The wonderful young lady replies to the effect that there are more important things at stake than her future and she’ll vote for independence even if it means she wont get to the next games,
NO THATS WHAT SCOTLAND IS ABOUT!
he spoke to an official for sports Scotland who was at pains to point out Scotland would fail to qualify for the next Olympics as their application to join the UN would leave them out of the games. When asked if he’d be proud to represent an independent Scotland he said ‘no.’
Which begs the question, what in hell’s name is he doing representing Scotland now?
A certainty Scotland won’t make the next Olympics? Is he a UN official in his day job? What a terrible attitude.
Thankfully his pupil is intelligent, and isn’t prepared to wipe out the future of others by concentrating on self.
I think we should pick up the on the idea that a Yes vote is the Gold Medal, the first prize.
NO is for those that give up and accept their fate. NO is for those that are content to play second fiddle. For Scotland, no reward, no victory but disgrace and ridicule on the world stage.
I switched from google chrome to firefox and I dont have a spellchecker, just noticed I misspelled athletics, anybody know how I get spellchecker back on?
using 8.1.
After we become an Independent Nation, athletes have the choice of either representing Scotland or they can STILL represent the UK (Team GB).
This is because of the dual nationality clause. They will be Scottish and, if they are that way inclined, British.
So, it is just more scaremongering from the NO hopers brigade.
Patrician
Hope to see you and your good wife at Pacific Quay later on.
Andrew Marr and Londoncentric unknown guests, just on trying to put Scotland down… “Favourite bit being the dancing Tunnocks tea cakes”, “Moving away from nationalist feelings” and “Bringing people together”, were the statements in the very short ‘and finally piece’.
Quite telling that Andrew Marr referred to ‘John Barrymore”
…fair play to Marr on that one though, I had no idea who John Barrowman was until he turned up in a tartan suit a couple of months ago.
@Faltdubh says:26 July, 2014 at 10:54 pm
“They are ‘Crown Protectorates’ yet somehow claim Cavendish as BRITISH when he’s cycling for England/GB”
Remember that they, the English, also use England, Britain and United Kingdom interchangably. So Andy Murry can be any of those terms depending on how well or poorly he is doing. Just like Cameron speaks of the British Government when there is no government of Britain.
What of, “Who do you think you are Kidding Mr Hitler, if you think old England’s done”
“England stood alone against the NAZIs”
Even when the Scots, Welsh, Irish, free Europeans and the Entire British Empire all fought alongside them. In their minds we were all English.
Ps. See you all at PQ later.
Ah wiz up at 5am ready tae take on the world, and then I
remembered its only the Bbc we’re taking on today,so I
went back tae bed fur anither 3 hrs sleep. Good morning
all ur you,s fighting fit fur PQ demo.
Stu
You’re on Crossfire on radio Scotland.
Calgacus MacAndrews says @9.47pm, Tell the wife I agree with the sexy bit. Not sure I am about to let my big strapping Scotsman go anywhere without me after this comes out. Sad though that the Union shortened many Scots, brought them down to size with malnutrition and if we let them they will do so again. So the only way to keep our sexy Scotsmen at home and back to being the size of Jamie is to Vote YES.
Robert Peffers, that song drove my Father in Law up the wall, he fought in that War and he said it wasn’t liked during it far less after they started to use it for Dad’s Army.
I you need to be a full member of the UN, hpw come Hong Kong competes as err Hong Kong and not China?
Watching the marathon in my mate’s house. There are more Saltires in evidence with fewer St Georges’s crosses and the odd other nations flags too. Not many UJs though. Mind you I’m on the netbook too so not watching his TV screen all the time.
If my impression is correct then it indicates that where the BBC/games stewards have no control it is quite a different picture, (pun intended).
Dave McEwan Hill
The new big bookies, on-line ones anyway are all speculators from the money markets who took their algorithms from spread betting on currency movements to playing horses and dugs and so on.
Look at the biggest donors to the Tory party.
Just another ordinary mum:
link to bettertogether.net
http://gregwilliamslabour.blogspot.co.uk
Caz-m
Did Ronnie say you are bringing a table?
While interviewing Usain Bolt just after he arrived in Glasgow last night, the BBC couldn’t wait to ask him if he would be wearing a Kilt and eating Haggis while he was here. FFS.
So the next time Usain Bolt visits England, will the BBC be asking him if he is going to put on a Morris Dancing outfit and be eating Jellied Eels during his stay.
Another day another Scotland monstering from Graun, Scotland’s a police state now, girlfriend Aleisbdasa Tomkins is up early with his reams of No and here’s a Scottish Labour activist from London explaining how he’s going to commit electoral fraud in the referendum, for everyone interested. Simples apparently. The Labour Party, clinging on like the wall nuts they are.
link to id.theguardian.com
Bob Sinclair
Yes Bob, I will be bringing a table.
Caz-m
I’ve got the irn bru. See u there.
Heedtracker – I suspect such No voters will be balanced by Yes voters doing the same.
If the unionists win this referendum using postal vote fraud, I will not be very happy.
Missing post so one more for luck
ACJB of the Guardian explaining how he’s going to commit electoral fraud on the 18 the Sept
BetterTogether already bussing up activists from England and have millions in donations unspent, so it’s not difficult to see a serious fraud issue,,how to explained here from a Labour activist in London. Who wants to visit Mum and Dad in Scotland for two days?
You do know that it is pretty easy to get a vote in September if you can be bothered? Do you have friends or relatives who live north of the border? Register to vote at their address on the 18th and then vote. You can even apply for a postal vote if you are not going to be physically in Scotland on the day, altho’ folks like me are planning to take a couple of days off and spend the night at the place they are registered to vote. On the 19th you just switch your electoral registration back to where you normally live. Simples.
If you feel strongly enough about the whole thing, of course …
Mair pash.
link to express.co.uk
Hi Paula Rose, but it’s still illegal. Or is it? Anyway, it’s the first time anyone’s actually confessed to a serious criminal offence on CIF, or have they?
It must be legal but BetterTogether are obviously focusing on marginals, so if you get a few hundred incoming day trippers up for the day?
But as our responsible citizen/Graun CIFer says, it’s even easier to register for a postal vote once you register back at Mum and Dad’s house AND you don’t actually need to spend money and time traveling home. A few minutes trot to the post box twice and bish bosh, you’re a electoral fraudster that’ll probably never get your collar felt. As the electoral register numbers suddenly jump in some areas of Scotland, who’s got the manpower to investigate the how and why?
Houston we have problem.
Goldenayr, saw this from your link too…
link to express.co.uk
“We always fly the red, white and blue. That’s what we do.”; Flight Lieutenant Stew Campbell.
link to photos1.blogger.com
@Grouse Beater says: 27 July, 2014 at 6:52 am:
“He spoke to an official for sports Scotland who was at pains to point out Scotland would fail to qualify for the next Olympics as their application to join the UN would leave them out of the games.”
This is just as much an idiotic bit of Establishment propaganda as their EU membership claims. There is not a shred of evidence to back up their claims. The legal situation is exactly the same :-
A – The Treaty of Union that formed the United Kingdom is not only legally bipartite but is between two equally sovereign kingdoms.
B – The United Kingdom is a Kingdom or royal realm, it is not a country.
C – All bipartite unions can end and when they do the legal term, “Status Quo Ante”, applies and the Status Quo Ante is two independent kingdoms and two independent parliaments.
D – Legally when a bipartite union disunites neither partner is the continued union.
E – Both former partners are thus still members of any treaty or agreement made by them while in union. That is unless the organisation refuses them both as members.
F – Why on Earth would any organisation dedicated to uniting members in common cause expel any member that they were not forced to? The logic dictates they strive to retain both parts of a former member that disunites.
G – Scotland holds a very strategic location for any international body. None of which, EU, NATO, UN, Council of Europe, WTO or any other will willingly wish to lose either former UK kingdom as a member and allies.
Now can anyone find a single legal ground for the Better Together unfounded beliefs that there can be a United Kingdom when the only two kingdom that signed the treaty that formed it disunite? What other kingdom is there in Britain for England to be united to?
I just realised I missed a trick in that last post… Oor flight Lieutenent Stu Campbell says; “Naw they dinny always fly red,white and blue… an ah’ve got mah Wings”…
link to photos1.blogger.com
😀
Heedtracker – perhaps someone here can give us an answer as to is it illegal, then if it is that person should be reported!
link to electoralcommission.org.uk
Old ACJB in. London is dead right. The only way the referendum vote fraud this activist is advising will only be officially detected via spikes in electoral register numbers around Scotland, probably from now until the 18th Sept.
But they will recorded and reported to the Scottish public when?
Not until the next UK census, due in 7 years time?
Paula Rose, I don’t think you can prove fraud like this. Electoral commission works like HMRC, they take our word for it because it’s too costly to do anything else. Obviously they act if fraud Is blatant, provable and they know they have a good case for conviction.
However, if say ACJB of the Guardian CIF does get caught, all he does is say he’s moved back to Scotland or is in the process of moving.
It’s just more ghastly teamGB BetterTogether irony that vote NO Guardian savages Police state Scotland, while a Labour activist then displays just how we’re as far from a police state as you can get, without living in the Wild West!
On the subject of electoral fraud and the people planning to register for an address in Scotland
Is being a resident not also linked to paying council tax?
In other words you can pay council tax and not be registered to vote, but if you do register to vote you need to pay council tax?
Just asking as I’m not clear on this
So – my earlier point that Yes supporters may do this, could well cancel out such fraud?
@Edward
The only requirement is to be resident and have the appropriate “national” qualifications eg Polish in, Yank out.
Edward
It isn’t as there could be more than one or two people at an address
If you know of any electoral fraud irregularities then it should be reported to the Electoral Registration Office in your local authority area, don’t waste your time on the EC. Involving the Police at the same time should make the Council take action.
On a lighter note – some on the No side haven’t twigged this is a parody account: link to twitter.com
@ Edward
Council tax applies to the property, not to the individual. If you applied to be registered to vote at a previously empty property, I believe that would make you liable for council tax, but if several extra people registered to vote at my address, they wouldn’t have to pay anything. I would lose my single adult discount when the first one was added, but after that it would make no difference.
Today’s Sunday Herald is full of good stuff including a great letter praising Wings over Scotland.
No doubt about their allegiance to the Yes cause today.
As to residence
link to electoralcommission.org.uk
Edward, no Council tax is paid by head but legally it’s paid per hoose. So If you live alone, you can claim the single person residence allowance but after that, you can have as many relatives and friends registered as occupiers at your home as you like.
Don’t over do it though, prospective electoral fraudsters! Houses with ridiculously high numbers of occupants is just about the only way vote fraud can be detected. See Glasgow a wee while ago and someone called anus might fill you in.
So call mum and dad, get them to register you, get them to send you your referendum postal vote down to say what his name in Graun CIF in London and it’s as easy as that. Unless you do get nicked and have to do some very fast talking to the cops, and move too, back to the Scotland you don’t want to live in but think you have a right to vote in her future.
Welcome to teamGB
So basically any party, with enough activists could bus everyone in , having registered them to vote in that area and tilt any election or referendum?
Let’s hope the Electoral Commision and Councils fire a warning shot across the boughs of anyone attempting to do this- ie anyone found doing this will be subject to Criminal law.
Being allowed to vote for whoever, whatever strikes right at the heart of democracy and if we don’t have that or even the perception of that , what do we have?
Helena Brown says: 27 July, 2014 at 9:12 am:
“That song drove my Father in Law up the wall, he fought in that War and he said it wasn’t liked during it far less after they started to use it for Dad’s Army.”
I was just a schoolboy during WWII and spent a while as a schoolboy in a school in Hants. My father ended up with a broken wrist in a fight with an English soldier in a pub. That over the English guy trying to kiss my mother. When Dad told him to make himself scarce the English guy said, “Oh! We can share the woman, after all we are all English”. By chance I had been sent home from school that same day for taking on a much older English boy who had picked on me because of my Scottish accent.
Thing was I’m just a wee lad and he was big and the aggresor while I was the one sent home, (after getting caned), for beating the s…. Err! Stuffing out of him.
Now that was the real state of things while we were supposed to be all British together fighting a common foe. We Scots were even then being treated as enemies of England. Anyway I never blamed all English folks for the attempted bullying by a few. There are bully boys in all nations. The thing that did affect me was that the English Headmaster just automatically assumed the Scottish boy was the bad guy. It was my first lesson of dealing with, “The Establishment”..
Wee Ginger Duggie’s own but not unique opinion poll sampling;
link to weegingerdug.wordpress.com
link to news.bbc.co.uk one of Crash Gordon’s Lords, and completely innocent of anything ahem, naughty.
Last time this UKOK Lord was in the news, he was pushing for a teamGB only football team for in World Cup and then he renounced his UK citizenship. His son Anas fights on for teamGB, the union, student fees for Scots kids, the Lords, trident and trident 2 etc etc bleh.
That teamGB football team World Cup thing from Sarwar and his fellow lords was made even madder when TeamGB football coach Stewie Pearce refused to pick any Scottish athletes for the UKOK London Olympics squad, and then they got thrashed. Rule Britannia
And another ordinary mum (at least one day)
link to twitter.com
Edward
I kind of wondered about that too.
I wonder also if those Scots who live in England or other parts of the UK are really going to run the risk of Electoral Fraud. Getting caught will lead a major fine if not prison. For those doing it, there is always the doubt that they will get caught out. Folk suddenly registering to vote when they have obviously lived outside of Scotland for quite some time would raise warning flags.
It’s a dangerous game to play, especially when you can’t see who might be watching.
@Helena Brown
that song drove my Father in Law up the wall, he fought in that War and he said it wasn’t liked during it far less after they started to use it for Dad’s Army.
Old men forget; it was written in 1969 by Jimmy Perry as the intro to Dad’s Army
‘Home countries’ is comfortably close to ‘home counties.’
Dave McEwan Hill at 12.39
I’ve got to agree with you about the bookies and the odds. I have felt this for a while now.
I think they have got this one wrong on two points.
1. They have no form to assess the outcome of this vote except to use politically commissioned, skewed polls. No word on the secret polls then yet?
2. They are betting on us and as my grandfather once advised me on betting ‘Never bet on anything that can talk’.
A two horse race with one of them closing on the other at those odds is a mistake IMHO.
Every time one of the leading dimwits open their mouth for No we get more Yes voters.
It wouldn’t surprise me if the BT thinktankers had done some psychological profiling – ‘Those Jocks like to drink and gamble tell them they are not the favouites and their drink is going to get dearer and they will believe it’. Remember the betting stories came out in the same week that so-called drinks firm directors tried to say they were ‘doubtful’ about staying in an independant Scotland or some such drivel.
As you quite rightly point out a new agenda of “You are not favourites and you are behind in the ‘polls'” emerged this week from TV commentators. Look
Unfortunately, I don’t have £50 spare to put on this but instead of doing the ‘National’ lottery every week I intend to put my £2.00 on Yes for the next six weeks at 5/1 if that remains. Then I intend to give the winnings to my local foodbank (£60 hopefully) and it also cuts out the Camelot good causes administration fees.
Not that I’m para or anything Dave but I hope you are not on here representing Mr Ladbroke. I may have to see those betting slips.
O/T Brendan Foster is commentating professionally as usual on the Marathon with insight and history of racing in and around Ibrox and admiration of the Burrough Collection ‘a must-see’. Meanwhile back to the studio ‘Scotland hammered by Australia in hockey’ and last night ‘Scotland demolished in ..blah blah’. Subtle as bricks.
Good luck to all at PQ today.
And on another note, folk sometimes can’t help crowing when they’ve done something stupid or illegally. I can just see it now. Wee Bob who lives in Leeds either says something on Facebook or Twitter by saying that they’ve pulled a fast one, stuck it to Salmond, and are going to vote in the Referendum. With the way information flows freely these days, everyone can see who is typing what in the social media network. Wee Bob suddenly finds someone, and not even necessarily a friend, grasses him up.
Will there be postal fraud? I think it will be to a minimum at the most. I think folk outside Scotland will be too fearful in case they get their collar felt.
Off to the bbc bias protest in Inverness, hoping for a good turnout.
I’m sure there will be many more at the PQ one so good luck everyone.
The South African flag held sideways is a sodding great Y. If V for victory is understood then Y for Yes should be just as easy.
If you fancy a bit a sleuthing, sleuthing for Scotland, go to your local library and read the local electoral register there. It has every adults name and address at every single home in your area, and Scotland of course, but probably just the local area.
If houses and flats have more than say three or four adults registered, well that’s an anomaly as it’s usually only parents and children and parents who’s children have left home. I know there’s usually one that won’t leave the nest etc.
But, if there is sudden spikes in occupant numbers, they will still have to be recorded after the 18th Sept 2014, m’lud. So if say the fraudster giving advice in Guardian CIF this morning on how to commit fraud registers for a day of two in Scotland, but then goes home to London, it’s all on public record that he is a fraudster and that his normal place of residence is in fact. London.
Take him down.
Anyway people like us live pretty similar lives so if you do see something odd going on, report it. Even student Halls of residence are registered, if the students up for a term have registered to vote.
On polls, I definitely find that the responses in canvassing are at odds with the newspaper results. In Dundee it was Yes for the majority, in Cupar it as Yes for a majority, in St Andrews it was more half and half, with very aggressive, angry Noes.
Incidentally in Dundee even the Noes were good-natured.
The figures I read about from the Borders, is in some ways understandable, because it is a Conservative rural area. It used to be in farming areas the farmworkers voted according to why the framer voted.
But on the there hand there was the report in the Farming magazine, a few months go, of the debate, Alistair Carmichael involved, where there were 400 farmers and the vote at the end was a Yes majority.
Then we hear anecdotally that the North of England would quite like to join an independent Scotland, though also in real situations I have relatives in Yorkshire saying go for it, and they would like Yorkshire to be independent.
So my overall impression is that Yes will win, if there is not a huge electoral fraud. Unfortunately both Labour and the Conservatives have real form, including prosecutions for this.
In moments of speculative thought, I have wondered if the disparity of the newspaper polls and what I find in real canvassing, may be setting up a situation for passing off fraudulent results as the real result.
There was the interesting observations from Jim Sillars, that in the past, whenever there was an upsurge in the move for Independence, by an amazing coincidence, the Tartan Army would turn up and destroy a PO post box or some other act, and that would be in all the papers, and a lot of ‘isn’t this terrible’ discussion would ensue.
Given that real independence is on the cards, how far would the establishment and the Labour Party go in terms of electoral fraud.
Handclapping with reference to that bleeding song. Well you are right he obviously thought it was familiar, perhaps the sentiment and all that. Hated it did a disservice to the many many people who fought on the British side who were not English.
@ Brian at 11.45 am. I too think that the polls are being manipulated in order to “legitimise” a rigged result in September. I fear they’ll do a “Gelenrothes” on us and then say “see the results are what the polls have been saying”. I would not trust the British establishment any further than I could throw it.
@ Brian Powell
@ Andrew Brown
The way to counteract attempts to rig the ballot by manipulating the polls is for the SG to start releasing – officially – the canvass returns that are being collected showing Yes significantly ahead.
Sure, it runs the risk of galvanising the No vote to an extent, but we have to establish in the public consciousness that the polls are not reflecting reality and therefore cannot be used to justify a rigged vote.
@ handclapping at 11.09 am. It was my Father and the song wasn’t the theme to “Dad’s Army”, it was “There’ll always be an England”. Didn’t go down too well when sung in pubs when there were soldiers from other parts of the Empire present. Perhaps they felt that their part in the war effort wasn’t quite appreciated. Apparently there were dozens of countries (who knew?) on the allied side – some from as far away as Scotland (they must’ve arrived by spaceship as it’s really, really far away apparently).
@Joe Swan
It doesn’t work that way mate.
The bookies are called “bookmakers” because that’s what they do – balance the books in their favour so they (over the medium-term) always win.
A friend once “beat the book” (Ladbrokes/Wm Hills) on the Grand National but in order to do so he had start betting 6 months in advance and across two bookies. Ended up he won about £25 so it wasn’t really worth it other than for saying he managed it.
Given that it looks likely we’ll be returning to tax on betting I doubt any of the bookies are feeling friendly towards the Brit govt.
@handclapping says:27 July, 2014 at 11:09 am:
Old men forget; it was written in 1969 by Jimmy Perry as the intro to Dad’s Army
Nice sweeping generaisation there, handclapping. I know for a certainty that I have a far better memory than any of my three natural and adopted sons.
In any case I knew the songs history and author and assumed that it was not the song, as such, that made the old Soldier annoyed but the very common abuse of the phrase, “Old England” for Britain, Great Britain, The British Isles, The UK or even the entire British Empire.
Joe Swan at 11.13
To put your mind at rest I use Ladbrokes’ odds for two reasons. 1) William Hills has been the bookie complicit in the manipulation and press reports and 2) Ladbrokes odds have been a little more generous.
I have all the slips with all my little bets but if we get 55.1% of the vote or better I’ll be a couple of thousand richer on 19th September (and I’ll pick up a happy sum on any YES vote as well)
Another little bet is planned for tomorrow though I see the 10/1 for over 55% has become 8/1.
If I had a lot of money I’d put £400,000 on YES at over 43.5% of the vote with Paddy Power at even money (1/1)and another £400,000 on YES at over 42.5% of the vote at 10/11 with Ladbrokes. Both of these bets are presently absolute certainties
Moment of the Games so far for me, came this morning, after “Tattie” Marshall nicked the Bowls Pairs semi-final from England with the very last bowl, to give him and Paul Foster a one-shot win.
He turned round and gave the GIRFUY signal to the English support.
Priceless.
A few questions for the polling gurus.
Is telephone polling still the most widely used?
Is random telephone polling considered to be the most reliable/robust as oppose to say internet polling?
Do any of the major polling companies have staff based in Scotland to carry out these polls or are most staff who will contact you on the phone based in England/Wales?
Fraudster vote rigging –
Each ballot paper issued to voters in Polling Stations has a Ref number applying to every voter – and the Returning Officer puts an INK LINE through your name – as having been issued a ballot.
A further TRACE is supplied via “PERFORATIONS” on each ballot paper that signifies you are you.
(you can feel the perforations)
These perforations Match the stub held by the Returning Officer, supposedly, a triple-lock system versus fraud.
Geo DUBYA Bush won Florida ON “Hanging Chads” via a similar system, and SLAB WON Glenrothes via the current flawed system that will operate in Sept ??
When Ballot Boxes VANISH after a vote, and when the Electoral Commission make ZERO effort to find them – we must all worry.
GPS and/or that funny ink that shows-up under dark light ?
However, the Registration Period for a vote in the IndyRef – ENDED – long ago.
The 3 x month period to Register for a vote AND the 5 x year qualifier negates any such attempt to commit electoral fraud. Maybe.
Therefore, ANY fraud committed – would already have taken place, long before Sept 18th 2014. (Check Voters Roll)?
Mostly, we “YESSERS” Know that neighbours children and family LIVE and work south or abroad.
When electoral fraud is being committed – it is still a serious crime and the police must arrest the perpetrator.
“The Voters Roll” is available to all and we must take advantage of this resource to check – ONE MONTH BEFORE – the ballot on Sept 18th 2014
@Brian Powell says: 27 July, 2014 at 11:45 am
“On polls, I definitely find that the responses in canvassing are at odds with the newspaper results.”
There really is no big mystery of why the word on the streets not only gives a different result but that doorstep to doorstep poll are usually more accurate for an area. Not, though, often for the bigger picture.
It’s down to way the pollsters collect data. Many, and in particular YouGov, maintain a list of registered people they poll and some even pay the people on their register. They thus know the politics of their members.
Then we have random Telephone polls. How many of the poorer people in the UK actually can afford a land-line telephone? They use pay as you go mobiles. Thus random phone polls are naturally biased. Random stop in the street polls – how many are in High Streets and how many in run down areas of deprivation?
On the other hand, in a referendum situation, the reports of YES footsoldiers include all sorts of areas and thus are likely to be far closer to the truth.
Juan P, most pollsters have a register of voters that signed to be polled by said polling companies. Also the weighting techniques are wrong as they’re not based on a referendum like this one. And as much as 90% voters in Scotland intend to vote Yes 18th Sept because voters for a status quo don’t tend to appear from nowhere.
All UKOK polls are integral part of BetterTogether pressure to vote no, they wish. UK.gov private/secret poll showed clear Yes win because if it was an actual No win poll, they’d have blasted the result across the yewkay!
90% voters in Scotland intend to vote 18th Sept, oops!
I think there is a distinct possibility that people will try to register to vote despite not living in Scotland. You would think the electoral commission would be on top of that kind of thing but as we saw in Labour’s errm controversial candidate selection in Falkirk a while back, just becuase a party is political doesn’t mean it will play by democratic rules. I’d like to raise something which I have noticed over Renfrewshire way. The last important vote we had to set up the Scottish Parliament something odd happened. Now I’m not a great one for filling out forms so I tend to ignore stuff that comes through the door from Electoral registration. After all I’m a householder and on the CT records as the house occupier and although there is an obligation on the Electoral registration officer to compile a register every year I’ve never seen in law the power to remove people from the existing register just because they haven’t filled in a form. It’s only happened to me twice in all these years of non form filling. Back in the vote for the Scottish parliament and this year. Time was when the officials at the polling had a complete register of all the households in the neighbourhood. In those days it was perfectly obvious that I was the householder for the house concerned. These days the register provided by the authorities doesn’t have all of the addresses, only those registered to vote. It is hugely open to gerimandering and it’s always going to be painted as “the fault of those who didn’t fill in the form”. That isn’t my understanding of our right to vote but I’m old fashioned that way. Now I can see some people will say it is your fault if you don’t get a vote but sometimes it’s important to find out how your democracy works.
As we have already had an election this year it should be easy for someone who has access to the “Full register” to see how many have been added to the register but really I think that it has the potential to be manipulated. Certainly I don’t think there should be the right to join the register and simultaneously obtain a postal or proxy vote. I don’t think we should be taking the ECs word for it that all these things are above board. It is an offence to be registered to vote in two places I think but I’m sure that Alistair Darling will be registered to vote only at his main residence. Errm isn’t that in London?
@heedtracker
Thanks for that. Appreciated.
Many thanks to all regards the voter registration clarification
I’m confident that there will be a decisive majority for Yes, but its important to get the vote out
We have the combined forces of SNP/Green/SSP etc political parties election machines plus all the pro independence groups across the country that have to work together to ensure maximum turnout, maximum result
Last time I checked it’s not an offence to be registered twice. The offence is in voting twice at the same set of elections. I don’t know if that’s a recent change or not. I kind of doubt it as simply registering at a new address doesn’t guarantee you’ll be de-registered at your previous one.
The cut of date is 2nd September. So as long as Darling flips and takes up residence the he could register for a vote, or he could already have a postal vote. Hell if Cameron felt like it he could register.
Dave McEwan Hill – Thanks for the tip. I’ve just tried to put £500 on at PP but the maximum allowable for over 43.5% Yes is £359.60 so put that amount on instead. Like you, I stand to win a few thousand if we win and may recoup a large part of my losses even if we don’t with this sort of bet.
My relatively recent experience is that when you move house, you are asked for your previous address when you fill in the registration form, and they then take you off the register there automatically. (I suppose you could give a false previous address, I don’t know what would happen then.)
Even more recently, when my mother died her name was taken off the register automatically. Which was good because it meant I didn’t have to cross her off, though it did give me a slight turn to receive the annual form without her name. (It didn’t stop the LibDems sending her personalised electioneering material though.)
Longer ago, yes it is possible to move to England and not remove your name from the register at home. It was possible to keep this up through the change from the rates to the poll tax and not get a poll tax bill. It was possible to keep it up through the change to the council tax, even after one parent died and the other was getting the single occupancy discount (with two names on the electoral register). When a separate form from the council asking how many people lived at the address arrived, ostensibly to manage council services better, and that was filled in as one, still nobody queried the electoral register.
And then when one moved right back home, just shy of 25 years later, well that was one less form to fill in, wasn’t it. Just told the council that the single-occupancy discount for the council tax was no longer applicable, and paid the resulting bill.
So yeah, that’s all in the past, but it all happened. So I don’t really have a lot of confidence that anyone is on the ball on this. They basically take you at your word.
Dave McEwan Hill,
“The whole BBC coverage of the Games is implying that we are contesting them as “the Home Nations””
The BBC’s sneeky way of hijacking the Games for the union.
Scotland is an after thought in their reporting by their English commentators. Three examples I noticed on Sunday:
They interviewed the 10th placed Englishman in the marathon and not the 9th placed Scot.
In another event, the reporter commented “England behind Scotland”.
In the men’s 5000 metres, they mentioned the English runners (and the feart one) quite a number of times but the Scot just once and quite late into the run.
test
link to tinypic.com