Wings Over Scotland

BRILLIANT

Cumon then Ed whats it to be?
make up your mind man!

The Daily Record’s Ultra-Unionist political editor, David Clegg, couldn’t hide his hatred for the Scottish Government when he wrote this piece in his daily comic.

link to dailyrecord.co.uk

Notice how refers to the Deputy First Minister as “Sturgeon”.

You can just imagine him foaming at the mouth as he wrote the bile.

He also seems to forget to mention how bad Scottish Labour were in Scotland when they were in power.

The Daily Record is part of the Political Holy Trinity in Scotland, they are,

BBC Scotland, Scottish Labour and the Daily Record.

We have the power to bring down the three of them.

Weegie to ED Are you man or mouse?

Ed pass the cheese please

There’s also a lot more very hacked off former labour voters watch him now. The whole ConDem Lab Naw thanks devo max fraud is just not on.

Munguins Republic has a great DR front cover with the VOW “I shall never vote for any of these three parties again”
link to munguinsrepublic.blogspot.co.uk
@caz-m I’m not going to click on that link to the vile DR above. If you put up an archive version I might.

Who’s all going out today? Glasgow? Edinburgh? etc…

I am now started to wonder if YesScotland were too quick to accept defeat on the 19th. It was an unconditional acceptance of the result. Perhaps it should have been acceptance with the caveat that the Nae Sayers actually deliver on the promises they made at the last minute. The Unionists breached the Edinburgh Agreement when they broke purdah. The obligation to accept the result outright was removed IMHO.

lets try to put the bbc in a hard place aswell

sign this petition for an investigation

link to you.38degrees.org.uk

Clegg at the DR is an ass, no a mule actually. If he did any research he would know that the funding for the A9 improvements was sidetracked by Tory and Labour council in Edinburgh for their Tramlink white elephant.

When you look at the voting demographics of the referendum, two main reasons for labour dominance become clear. First traditional labour voters still believe they are a social Democratic Party ( lie ). Second is that the comfortable / middle class have long known the reality that they are a centre right party. Many traditional lab. Voters now know their Big Lie and our task to get them to vote SNP ( true social democrats ), in the General Election. 🙂

Does anyone know what is happening in George Square, Glasgow today???

I heard Tommy Sheridan is to make an appearance either in Glasgow or Edinburgh on Saturday or Sunday.

It’s all a bit confusing, can anyone nail this weekends events please in a couple of sentences.

As I have mentioned in another post, we need a bit of clear leadership from someone the top.

Whether it is about rallies or the YES logo, we are needing clarification from someone.

@Capella
I will try to archive the Daily Record rant for you.

Look at from the project plan of DR and everyone at Pacific Quay. They won the referendum, they got rid of Salmond so next stage, bury devo nano, get Lamont and Labour back in. So what are they going to offer Labour in Scotland as a bribe? Better housing, scrap pensioner free bus travel, free prescriptions, council tax hike on middle class Scotland that lives in a different universe compared to working class Scotland.

Surest way of stopping Scottish democracy for good is the BBC etc getting Joahan Lamont or whoever succeeds the virus spotter, back in total control of their Scotland region.

@ Caz-m and others

I agree with you and the comment. 🙂

But posting the open link to the Record only gives them money everytime someone clicks on it.

Instead copy the link:
link to dailyrecord.co.uk

onto link to archive.today

and then you get:
link to archive.today

Everyone can then click on it and read it. It’s spread far and wide BUT the Record gets not one single penny from it.

We expose their crap and keep the money.. 🙂

link to archive.today

Archive link for that DR article

Caz m

I commented on another thread a few days ago that I thought it might be an idea to have a page on Wings wi list of us coming demos/events so we don’t have to chase info.

Don’t know how viable an option this is given it might take a bit of organising.

The devo for England may also be a con. Have you ever met anyone in England other than UKIPsters that want “another layer of government” because I haven’t. I was in England in the last week run up and there was real anger at 3 things, Scotland actually becoming an independent country, the English economy losing out and the whole notion of devo to English regions.

They really do not like their politicians and or but this anger was rather unrestrained at times as they all think that Westminster is the UK gov and the UK is England. So they are untroubled by the farcical house of a Lords, they love royalty and England is booming economically in many areas. So what if Scotland’s a scrounger region. So are some other parts of England, like Wales.

UKIP may gain some ground using racism and anger at immigration but it’s probably only because the BBC and co think they can use them. England has no real further interest in Scotland. They won so it’s over but if you still want a reaction, ask them the how and why they have a booming English economy based on colossal supply side debt, and then we come back to Scotland and not Scots oil. Working class Scotland had a chance to rebuild Scotland’s economy and they blew it.

Thanks for posting the links. I see from the front page highlights Balaargh that the DR has several attack pieces on the SNP. “Labour legend” John Reid, jack McConnell accuses SNP of telling a “big huge lie” over NHS etc.
@Midgehunter’s link is to the actual article, a shopping list of attack points for the SNP hating DR reader. link to archive.today
This is why we need to keep u the task of getting information out there.
I’ve been in the process of detoxing from the BBCand MSM. Removed all quick links to BBC on bookmark bar and rplaced with Aljazeera. Will look for more news outlets (notSKY!) later. Weather now from the Met Office. added Democracy now link for videos etc.
Catalonia has now set a rferendum date of Nov 9th. Let’s support them.
link to tinyurl.com

@Graeme Doig

We need some definite information posted somewhere Graeme.

Do YOU know what is happening in Glasgow today. Hopefully see you at one of the rallies.

Scot goes Pop has voting intention figures to play with. Feed them into the Electoral Calculus
link to scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk

Guys the SNP membership has increased dramatically supposing we do manage to get 30-40 Snp MPs in Westminster what could we achieve? I have heard about the possibility of declaring UDI but nicola has more or less ruled that out. (Can’t see it as a viable course of action anyway) SO what would be the consequences of having this SNP representation in Westminster?

I posted this on the previous thread but maybe you missed it – @Faltdubh -yes I did, I only watched it on iplayer cos someone mentioned how good Lesley Riddoch was.

Rory said Scotland will get tax raising powers and welfare powers devolved – Lesley said that’s devo nano.

I hope Rory is allowed no where near the discussions. I believe that we would have a case for declaring the ref null and void if we don’t get full fiscal autonomy cos Broon offered Home rule and federalism.

It would be useful if we could get the exact % that changed from Yes to No after the vow.

Also Tommy Sheriden’s event in George Sq is on the 12th October

@Fortbill – the point of having a large presence in WM is that the SNP will be able to sit on or ?control, the Scottish committees.

Also as seems likely there will be a coalition – there will be deals to be made.
We have to play the WM game to get as many concessions on ‘devo max’ as possible

A great cartoon, trouble is a brewing for “Red” Ed, now the flame thrower is on him as I cheerfully predicted whether we won or lost. Nigel is on the Tele all day today, all day on Parliamentary Television, beloved of the BBC methinks.
I have not been watching the news and as I do not read newspapers have been a bit out of the loop, but noticed that people like the DR and the DM judging by their headlines seen as I walked past the news stand, that they had now turned their attention to trying to destroy the SNP. I think they think they are invulnerable.
As for the disrespect shown to the SNP Government, I will be showing the same respect now for anyone from the now opposition who we have the misfortune to see occupy the office.
Mealer, those people who are still in Labour are not worth worrying about, these are those who would swallow any crap for the party. To gain respect you must show it, they have shown none.

Dr JM Mackintosh
“Sums up Labour’s problems perfectly.”
Agree, but to be fair if the rock and the hardman had been left out it would scarcely have diminished the appropriateness of that statement.

Another great cartoon.

Edinburgh today the fight continues.

@Fortbill

What has Labour done for Scotland in Westminster?

I personally dont think that “no” propoganda nor, for that matter, “yes” arguments made much difference to the 55%.

I think most of these Scots were always going to vote no.

I could never fathom how so many of our nation adopt a default position of being for the union, when most clear thinkers know we are being taken for complete mugs.

In that respect, Scotland must be unique amongst nations in being the only nation which has turned down the chance of winning a multi billion pound lottery!

A strange nation indeed…

Stuck between a rock and a jock 😉

Whenever you feel the energy to fight for the ideal waning just take a look Michael Heseltine’s crummy car website, the ‘political’ forum.

EDL, BNP and airhead hatred English for Scot in full spate.

The scum of the toilet bowl all in one place, and that’s just the moderators who sit back and enjoy the spectacle.

@nigel says:

I personally dont think that “no” propoganda nor, for that matter, “yes” arguments made much difference to the 55%.

I think most of these Scots were always going to vote no.

No only 70% of those are hardNo’s which leaves 15% open to persuasion or 1 in 11 no voters if my maths is correct.

Remember those in Trade Unions -ask what proportion of your sub goes to the British Labour party. Unite are having difficulty according to Herald, of their members challenging them on their sub, another great way to raise awareness.

@nigel
“I think most of these Scots were always going to vote no.”
Disagree. Ashcroft’s post ref research showed that 25% of NO voters believed the promises of more powers after a NO vote. That’s 500,000 people duped by Gordon Brown, Alistair Darling, George Galloway and the BBC. Others, pensioners in particular, reliant on the BBC and MSM for information, were frightened into believing their pensions would be stopped if they voted YES. So that leaves a small core of Unionists – perhaps 30%.

Stuck between a rock and a jock

To use current English colloqual:

A cock stuck between a rock and a Jock.

‘The Betrayers’ – BBC Scotland Drama Series – grousebeater,wordpress

Capella, thanks for the link to the Daily Retard, just love the way they talk about upgrading the A9, no mention of the fact that ALL the unionists prevented that by diverting money to the Edinburgh Tram way back in 2007. We also see nothing about the fact that the A9 was needing upgraded during the terms of Donald Dewar, Henry McLeish and Joke McConnell. We should remember they were too busy making themselves “popular” with Westminster and sending money back which was desperately needed to be spent in Scotland. Having had Thursday driving up and down that road, it is a top priority, but how can you spend it when there are people who desperately need help.
As for the NHS, looking at what they, the Labour Party were up to prior to 2010 with NHS England, I would not trust them for a moment with ours. Alistair Darling has big investments in Private Medicine and he will be looking forward to seeing them pay out as will many of his and his Government Masters. God we do breed a certain type in Scotland, seem to have always done so.
I wonder how the 55% like being able to say they were either so concerned with their pockets or if they think it is nice to be run by a government who use terror on what they describe as their own people. Parliamentary dictatorship is what we have here.

@nigel

The ashcroft survey showed that only 27% of the 55% voted No due to a strong attachment to the UK.
The rest were because of risks or the promises of extra powers.

With the final week media blitz..with all the banks and shop scare stories.. a large number of people basically shat it.

The YES campaign didn’t seem to have any big stories left in the last week.
I was expecting the SNP to come out with something. Maybe a promise to start a national energy company, which would have been a vote winner.

But all we got was Salmond accusing the government of leaking the RBS story, which was true, but not really the issue.

The BBC bias protest was just spun as angry street mobs, to add to the egging ‘scandal’

Andy and Jamie Murray came out for Yes, but too late to make the papers.

Something major should gave been held in reserve.

Capella – I use yr.no for weather. It’s excellent.

I’m sure I know that guy next to the Tory politician.

Someone posted this: link to parliament.uk “Scotland: Devolution Proposals” by the Parliament and Constitution Centre. In it there is this:

“Alistair Darling, Chair of Better gether, clarified that:

no new powers would be put on the table beyond those already announced by the three main Westminster parties earlier this year”

Alistair Darling is not an official spokesperson for the Labour party, let alone the Conservative or Liberal Democrats. He can therefore not “clarify” anything to do with the VOW.

Herald nice attack on the SNP voting against bombing Iraq. Fails to mention the 5 /6 Scottish Labour MPs who also voted against – who were they anyone?

There’s going to be a sustained attack on the SNP over the next months from the Labour press and journos, and one of the worst of the latter as I worked out during my Herald posting days is Settle. I had a few totally on-topic and moderate comments deleted on there, or “held in moderation” (I’m post-moderated), and the only reason I could see would be that Settle didn’t like them. He’s a Carrell, for CiF posters.

@yesindyref2
Rebels in Iraq vote.
link to newstatesman.com

I expected Salmond to give a major inspirational speech the day before the vote. Something the BBC would have had no choice but to cover. They gave Brown’s intervention enough air time after all.

@ Elizabeth Sutherland
Any questioning of the validity of the vote whether at the counting or through the Postal Voting procedure has become anathema on this site.
You will be ridiculed and called a conspiracy nut and that you wear a tinfoil hat.
A civil unbiased discussion of this topic on Wings would until recently have been expected by most of the regular posters I suspect.

interesting poll here
Can England survive without Scotland’s wealth

link to dailypoll.co

Morag: I expected Salmond to give a major inspirational speech the day before the vote

You’re an enigma – too many odd negatives, too many personal disappointments expressed.

You can make your rabble rousing speech claim of many another Yes supporter – Professor Tom Devine, for example, the one man who had all the historical facts at his fingertips, and eloquence too. As a once upon-a-time No voter with no political axe to grind he got a lot of press and media coverage in the last days.

The democracy triumph was, and remains, a grass roots movement, albeit activated by the SNP’s manifesto promise of a referendum and a debate.

By the end it belonged to the grass roots movement, not to Salmond.

@YESGUY – in order to achieve that we need to get info out refuting the MSM cos they will be going for the SNP and other Yes parties and dishing the dirt whether true or not to turn the voters back into Labour voters.

I think in the poorer areas of Glasgow for instance there would be more of a chance of getting folk to vote for the SSP in place of Lab.

English Parliament fine, but not spending UK money. No taxation without representation. English Parliament raising and borrowing and spending English money and paying back the English debt.

Eg Scotland raises £60Billion. Gets back £45Billion. Rest of the UK raises £540Billion + borrows and spends £100Billion Scotland pays back £4Billion on rest of the UK debt. Pro rata the rest of the UK borrows and spends £10Billion more of public money spent on private sector.

Just a thought, but why don’t people who still want to fly kites about vote rigging go and do it on the thread under Doug’s article. Maybe reading the 1000+ comments first.

IMHO.

We need to be coordinated and cooperate in our efforts and not miss the goal.

The three main points of unionist resolve are riddled with lies and misinformation and their credibility is already on a shoogly nail.

Westminster – daily record – and BBC. Their propaganda and lies need to be brought to the attention of the general public, and hammered home for the lies and deciet they spout.

As for the Labour Party (scottish branch) they are in self destruct mode, let them cut their own throat.

Home rule candidates should join forces and push for all Westminster seats.

We need coordination cooperation and a single voice for HOME RULE. THEN WE CAN GET BACK TO PARTY POLITICS.

Thanks Capella. I was tempted to be first in on the Herald thread with a one-liner but went to bed instead as I didn’t have a list or exact numbers.

Scottish Labour MPs who voted against Iraq action:
Anne Begg
Mark Lazraowicz
Katy Clark – my MP
Ian Davidson
Iain McKenzie

3 perhaps 4 no surprises. Ian Davidson is a strange one. The only person that controls him, is himself. Katy Clark is often a rebel, I like rebels. She could consider moving to the SNP …

I guess my view is that there is no clear objective, and no exit strategy, which is sufficient in itself for voting against it.

This is fascinating stuff. I’m just nosing around the whole referendum process stuff, not believing it, but keeping an open mind. I read a few days ago, that officials in a Govt. dept. in Dublin, were aware that pressure was being applied to come out in favour of No. I suppose the thinking being the more Govt. types the better.

link to celticleague.net

liz (EM?) I probably will do the odd post on the SH, just to help keep the momentum going, though there are plenty of good ones including Shona, an earlier convert from NO to Yes and a good keen poster, as well as many of the old gang. The Herald is already backtacking on its promise to hold Broon & Co to the “substantial powers” as a reason for its NO, and gone back to knocking the SNP. Pathetic. I just scan the headlines now, don’t bother logging in to to get my 6 articles or so.

Grouse Beater
YES Scotland could have done with Morag on its board and another critic as well. I’d nominate her for next time. There was also an article H or SJ I think, saying Salmond wqas surrounded by people who said yes to him, and that’s possible too. Criticism, rather than blame, makes sure we all get it right – next time. Acceptance of such as a sub-standard YES website just perpetuates the errors.

link to scottish.parliament.uk

Postal votes are opened starting on a set day then every morning thereafter. Polling agents are permitted to be there to observe the process. The agents are not supposed to be able to see the fronts of the papers, but sometimes it’s possible to get a glimpse or to see where the vote is placed from the back. People tally these, it’s called sampling.

You’re not supposed to do it but it’s commonplace. The real offence is to communicate the information to anyone else. Ruth clearly admitted some No agents had been doing it and passed on the information. That’s what’s being investigated.

Mhairi Hunter already tweeted her annoyance that Ruth’s gaffe probably means they’ll clamp down hard on this in the future – “spoiling it for everyone”.

Morag: We constantly had the Braveheart thing thrown at us

I’m sorry, your opinion often veers wildly from waffle to making obvious the obvious. The emotional cause, as you put it, was everywhere. What do you think waving Saltires and painting them on faces constituted?

That magical camaraderie was everywhere, the infamous Scottish cringe nowwhere to be seen. Confidence and the ability to relate to others is an emotional maturity.

For some reason you are projecting your disappointment onto one man, when we are the people who lifted the up the Saltire and were running with it.

In any event, Salmond did make keynote speeches in the last days. However, he is barred by electoral rules from introducing any new offers in the last days, unlike the opposition who brazenly tore up the rule book.

Tell us how you think the movement for genuine democracy can capture the ideal? What do you propose?

To reiterate, I’ve already explained why I’m quite convinced the ballot boxes were not intercepted on the way to the counts. Several times. I’m not doing it again.

crazycat
Davidson as Chair of the select committee nailed Murrison then MOD minister, to the wall over TFEU 346, patiently, persistently, forcing him to admit that TFEU wouldn’t prevent the rUK having warships (T26) built in Independent Scotland. He might have been anti-Indy, but shipbuilding on the Clyde came first. In fact he persisted with a lot of witnesses, forcing them to express views that weren’t anti-indy – then the summary reports ignored all those witnesses’ testimony.

Kay Clark – yes. Anti-monarchy and wanting infant boys to play with dolls, and girls with hammers, but OK. In 2010 I voted SNP to keep the %age up, but would have voted for her if there was any chance of her losing her seat. It’ll be sad in 2015 to vote SNP and see her go, maybe I’ll write her to suggest she changes parties …

Tired of this. It’s fantasy. Didn’t happen, couldn’t have happened. Completely sick of explaining why.

@ Morag, yes you see its not good is it really? No legislation info just postal ballot’s can be opened everyday.

So who gets to open them and why?

Is it the decision taken on the say so of a council or councillor or the polling count officer in charge?

If they decide to open ballots everyday, do they open every ballot coming in, all 800,000 from 1st Sept 2014?

If they open ballots everyday, did both YES and NO agents head to the polling stations each and everyday too, to NOT record the result?

Effectively, both sides were taking their own exit ballot poll long before polling day and if they were, this clearly gave the NO campers a staggering advantage considering they held all the cards, if you get my UK.gov drift. Wonder how many NO people monitoring and reporting daily results for Davidson/Bettertogether were also popping in to the local William Hill too.

This ain’t no democracy, its a giant insane fraud or its all lovely and fine and nothing to worry our silly little heads about.

Grouse Beater
Indeed. I had my self-appointed task and stuck to it with no prompting or control. If I could go back I might do a little differently, there again I probably wouldn’t.

Next time though I do different, and the same has to go for the official campaign, and the only way for that to happen is for us to kick it up the proverbial – now.

Och well, spoon, cereal…

Heedtracker: Tory Ruth Davidson stated specifically that they had seen ballot results over “weeks” running up to the actual polling day.

That has to be investigated and I believe actually is.

The only planned and open attack on the democratic process came from the three Westminster parties colluding to block any prosperous relationship Scotland with England, and calling upon business partners, banksters, the press and media to batter that message home.

There is nothing democratic about their tactics, making next time around a certainty we employ a ruthlessness of purpose to achieve the desired liberty for Scotland’s people.

Paul Alexander Mills ?@rathoCC

So now it is juvenile to vote against killing people. Good Bye #ScotLabour you do not know or care about Scot wishes link to heraldscotland.com …

Khaled Z ?@der_bluthund

Only two political parties voted against military action in Iraq as whole parties: The #SNP and the #Greens. Remember that come May 2015

@Grouse Beater – and that’s why we will not respect the vote. If it had been won fair and square it would be a different matter, we wouldn’t have liked it but would have accepted it.

Even my youngest who doesn’t get upset by much was furious about the interference and is at a rally in Inverness today.

We cannot allow our anger to dissapate

Catalonian independence referendum announced for 9th November. Fingers crossed for a positive outcome.

With another defection to UKIP this afternoon there will be another bi-election coming soon. I think UKIP will try to engineer these in the months up to May’16 to gain widest publicity.

I only wish we could refer to them as rUKIP!

Well, perhaps we could as David Coburn MEP is not registered to vote in Scotland.

Chic, I agree with you about that video. It seems to have gone quiet as people realise it’s likely to be a hoax – either by the guy himself, or someone using him.

It would be very easy to photocopy a postal ballot form and set up a scenario like that. I fear that’s what has been done.

With Grayling aiming to take the Britain out of the EHR, Labour back to backing wars and backbenchers coming over all UKIP it seems we didn’t have to wait long for the UK to lurch back to the right.

It will all end in tears.

Liz, that way lies madness. The actual vote was fair, honest and transparent. The minor fiddle Ruth admitted to is something routinely done by all parties at elections and it didn’t change the outcome.

We need to be getting angry about the dirty tricks in the campaign. The approaches to banks and supermankets and foreign governments and so on to speak out against us. The blatant breaching of the Edinburgh agreement. The false scare stories and the final false promise. The role of the media and in particular the BBC in destroying the Yes campaign.

Imagining there was vote rigging is only going to suck energy from the real problem.

Chic
Yes, I saw a post about that. Left beside a bin – how convenient is that!

liz
Anger is good, directed anger is much better. Devo-max not delivered, GE2015, SE2016, Indy ref 2, 75% YES, onwards and upwards.

I would agree Morag, it was the constant uphill battle of fighting the media with the BBC and ITN sneering at every Yes story and devoting hours of uncritical coverage to even the least credible of Better Together’s press releases.

In the face of almost Soviet era style propaganda what is incredible is that 1.6m voted Yes. The number of people who voted No as Union Flag waving loyalists was small, a greater number voted against their inclination because they feared the outcome would be as awful as the picture painted by No.

People don’t like being forced to vote against their heart, that is why Labour needs to think long and hard about what it is they have done…although I think they are too late on that score.

OK, once more. The referendum was run by local councils. They printed their own ballot papers, which is why there were some minor differences in layout.

All these councils included SNP councillors. Some were actually SNP controlled. They used council officials, workers and locally-recruited volunteers to carry out the necessary tasks like polling clerks and tellers.

These people weren’t some shadowy “they” under the control of Ernst Blofeld or something. They were your friends and neighbours. The retired schoolteacher next door, the bank teller who counts out your money. Some of them voted Yes and some of them voted No. Since most were under 65, the chances are that most of them voted Yes.

They were all watching each other, in a friendly and polite way of course. Nobody was alone with the opportunity to create mayhem. This idea that some enormous country-wide conspiracy could have spirited away boxes on the way to the count and tampered with them, with nobody finding out and nobody squealing and none of the counting agents realising that the votes from the individual boxes weren’t what the voters put there – it’s fantasy. It’s paranoia.

Liz, I misunderstood your post. I see we’re on the same page here.

Interesting piece from Tarf Advertiser which basically says Scotland can vote against Iraq 2 and Libby would be in a constitutional cesspit.

@ Morag Agreed. How?
We need a free and fair press in a democracy and that we plainly don’t have. Bella are having a fundraiser to get an independent media for Scotland set up.
link to bellacaledonia.org.uk. I’ll be contributing to that.
Is anyone building a case about the breaking of the Edinburgh Agreement conditions about purdah period?
Newsnet have the record of the “Devo Max” and “Home Rule” and “Federalism” statements from Gordon Brown, Alistair Darling and I heard that George Galloway also promised Devo Max on a televised debate where he took the place of the Better Together spokesman.
What happens if these promises are not kept to timetable?

So here they go, only labour can beat the tories…

link to cumbernauld-news.co.uk

I hope to goodness this waste of space gets the boot…

link to strathspey-herald.co.uk

yes rally edinburgh 27th september 2014 scottish independence
link to youtube.com

Fabulous!
Furrie!
Skedaddle!

Not to make a habit of riding on Wings’ tail feathers!

But I’m on a roll with another blog piece, of interest because it features an article from a media outlet in Malta.

VERY revealing and very insightful in its take on the UK media’s treatment of the indyref.

Might provide some entertainment while the Rev is on holiday!

link to pictish.ninja

Onwards!

Some education by Max Keiser.

Black Hole of Debt

from 1.30 sounds like Zeig heil

link to bbc.co.uk

Meanwhile, Scottish Liberal Democrat leader Willie Rennie has warned nationalists not to seek an “ultra-extreme” form of devolution.

Willie lives in a state of perpetual terror that Holyrood might have some real powers and that one day he might actually have something to do.

😉

Hi Morag,

I think you’re right. It won’t happen.

But, if there were irregularities, even slight ones, I do think it should be re-run.

Why?

Well, the UK claims to be this great purveyor of democracy (which some of us would dispute).

But if it wants to live up to those claims, it has to do things by the book, take it to an extreme of sqeaky-cleanness, to prove it does what it says on the tin.

But, you’re right. It will never happen.

I do like the way we’re putting pressure on the establishment, though.

(Thanks, Rev, for putting up with my cheekiness above – again!).

I’m off for a pint. Have a good Saturday evening everyone!

Pictish Ninja.

really enjoyed that. Will visit again. cheers.

I’m deeply concerned that any genuine quest for truth regarding the voting issues might be dismissed as conspiracy theory or victim mentality. That’s the equivalent of saying “Move along, folks, nothing to see here” or worse – “Leave it, it ain’t worth it”.

But surely by highlighting and investigating any and all underhand tactics there’s a chance that they won’t be repeated at the GE, or at least that they’ll be easier to identify – and counter. So if there’s an allegation of electoral impropriety, let’s insist it’s investigated.

There’s a whole list of other individual issues which left people feeling outraged, each of them involving scaremongering on an appalling scale.

Each time, the cry went up: “They can’t get away with this! Something must be done!” But the apparent lack of a robust response from official campaigners seemed to say, no, let’s just keep going. Let’s not get distracted by holding people to account.

I sometimes wonder if it wasn’t the relentless positivity that left the Yes campaign open to continual attack – the idea that to keep smiling through ever-tightening clenched teeth would eventually win the day.

So yes, by all means move forward, think positively, act decisively, BUT…
the best way to heal wounds is not to leave them to fester, but to flush them out, clean them up and get some smarter armour for the next time.

@HandandShrimp

Greens have chosen Patrick & Maggie Chapman