A simple misunderstanding
Scottish Labour, having seemingly faced up to their shortcomings as a political branch office and thereby despaired of being able to win any arguments, have now resorted to what appears to be a final strategy: telling undecideds to vote No for no reason at all.
“If you don’t know, Vote No” is the very basest sort of political message. A direct appeal to people’s fear of change, a call for blind faith in a party that’s proven itself unable to earn that faith from the Scottish or British electorate for the past nine years and shows no sign of doing so in the future. It’s a message that has very little going for it other than a sort of crude animal simplicity.
(Emphasised by the fact that “If you don’t know – vote No!” is the very first line, but Johann and Gordon feel the need to batter it into what we must presume they think are their voters’ thick, primitive brains by repeating it as a PS mere moments later.)
But Scottish Labour being Scottish Labour, they can’t even get THAT right.
The Express, of course, faithfully reports the press-release line:
The only problem was that Lord Reid hadn’t read his script properly.
He told the audience: “If you don’t know, genuinely, don’t vote.”
We can’t help thinking that the No campaign suddenly makes a lot more sense if you work on the assumption that when they say “No”, they mean “we haven’t got a clue”.
With only 3 days left, STILL, no positive case for the Union so vote NO because someone said so.
Labour: A bankrupt party, representing a bankrupt idea in a bankrupt country.
Meanwhile, I shall be attending the First Minister’s final speech before the referendum at Perth Concert Hall on Wednesday from 8pm to 10pm to listen to a positive, up beat & aspirational message.
Booking required but open & free to ANYONE !
link to eventbrite.co.uk
Reckon the Reid dinosaur still thinks it’s 1979…
My God! If this is the best they can throw at us, it’s pathetic.
If Brown and Lamont are the future, I want off.
WE HAVE TO WIN THIS
Why the obsession withb Alex Salmond?
“We’re not genetically programmed in Scotland to make political decisions” says Johann Lamont
?!?!?!?
If you don’t know, don’t you think you should find out?
A party having ditched social justice now so clearly devoid of hope, vision or aspiration.
I saw the BBC clip of John Reid and Johann Lamont frightening young apprentices at a shipyard where they had been dragooned into meeting the pols and supporting their script. Pathetic.
link to bbc.co.uk
I read about the opposition’s shenanigans in disbelief.
That letter mentions Alex Salmond 11 times and democracy not at all. Nuff said.
Oh hello there, I’m from … ( lots of whispering off mike heard ) … I’m from Labour and my name is … ( lots more whispering off mike heard ) … my name is Lord Reid of somewhere no one has ever heard of. I’m here on a very important mission. I’m here today to tell you all that if you are undecided about whether ASDA or ALDI offers … ( even more whispering off mike heard ) … I’m here today to tell all you undecided voters that if you are still undecided after listening to me today and remain undecided on the day of voting then you should NOT vote. Indecision is not something to be taken lightly, I should know I’ve hade decades of practice at being indecisive! š
No Thinks
My take on this:
Her Majesty urges Scots to ignore Labour pleas
link to logicsrock.blogspot.co.uk
I was fortunate to be able to get my photo taken with Nicola Sturgeon in Hamilton this morning. The energy extended by all the Yes campaigners was almost tangible. There is a vibrancy in the air which, I believe, can only bode well for Thursday. Keep the faith. Believe.
They really are pathetic. Why don’t they train up the 900 un-elected Lords see if they can persuade us.
In a truly bizarre and ironic sense, the only way Scottish Labour, and BBC Scotland can survive, is with a YES vote.
Just seen Cameron’s suicide speech. Seriously, he either has to follow through (which he can’t because he can’t stop us using Sterling, removing our passports or from taking our ‘British’ pension).
And if he comes out with that drivel at 7am on Friday if Scotland has voted Yes, then the Sterling will be going into a kamikaze nose-dive straightaway, even without Salmond going ‘well …err …no debt then’.
The Labour Party is becoming ever more of a parody of itself. The endless repetition of “Alex Salmond” is comical enough but then they throw in “Proud Scotsā¢” buzzword too.
I’ll refrain from pointing out that the unelected lawmaker, Lord Reid, is asking us not to vote…
honestly these people are seriously deluded.They have learned nothing from two Scottish elections where the Scottish people stood up and voted for the SNP.In the first one the SNP did not have a majority, so in the second election they went out and made contact with the voters and guess what they got a majority, what was Scottish labour’s answer to this? they elected Johan Lamont as their leader.They have now shown themselves up as the bunch of clowns they are,they have no credibility whatsoever and why anyone would listen never mind vote for them is beyond me.
Does Lord Reid of Kandahar still sing his Irish rebel songs and support the IRA or is that from before Year-Zero?
Is there not a legal question over that “slogan” ?
Forgive me if I am wrong, is this not the same John Reid whose parliamentary expense claims were under scrutiny some time ago? If this is the case, why would anyone take his views seriously?
If you don’t know look at who is asking for your vote.
Tories slashing social protection whilst enriching their friends, corporations and supporters!
Labour promising more cuts than the Tories and backing bosses instructing their workers to vote no. They were formed to protect the rights of workers. They were supposed to fight for the protection of workers pensions! The are happy to take billionaire bankers money to tell you vote against your best interests.
Look who they line up beside, reactionary bigots, racists, right wing fanatics and Corporations.
What do we want? Democracy, equality, commonweal, security in education, health and work, safety in old age.
Who promises to try and deliver those wishes, the Yes movement.
This is about sovereignty and democracy, not the price of fish nor the cost of living!
It is about freedom, to decide, for our children to decide, for our chance to change our country for the better.
Labour are acting as Tory mouthpieces, puppets for Corporate bankers. They should be ashamed for their scares and lies!
Mentions of Alex Salmond: 12
Mentions of the SNP/ Nationalists: 3
Mentions of poverty: 0
Mentions of socialism: 0
Good to the know that the Labour Party have their priorities right.
Vote Naw cause Alex Salmond farted wance and it was fuckin rotten
O/T (though perhaps not)
Interesting blog post by Craig Murray. He says that David Folkerts-Landau, chief economist of Deutsche Bank, is a friend of David Cameron:
link to craigmurray.org.uk
I’ve got a Yes on my winndae and back door.
BT put a letter through the door with my full name on it!
hahaha – someone must be at it.
I got that same ‘vote no to Alex Salmond’ letter a couple of days ago, except mine was from Anas Sarwar…
If only Slab could see how ridiculous and off-putting their hatred of Salmond & the SNP is. If at any point in this campaign they had tried to argue the actual issue we’re voting on here, I might have been receptive to it, but instead they’ve just focused on this inanity.
To be sending out letters days before the vote that mention Alex Salmond eleven times, but present no vision of the direction they want Scotland’s future go in, says it all really.
It’s a serious insult to the intellect of the electorate. I hope it costs them.
I see according to Kelner in the Guardian, YouGov are going to a large sample poll in the Sun/Times on Thursday. I always thought that polls were not published on polling day…or did I dream that? If the poll favours us the No side will not be pleased and vice versa.
If you don’t know, then please don’t hold the rest of us back.
Trust in your fellow Scots.
O/T
Every No voter should be very careful what they are voting for. The UK future is bleak.
link to davidhencke.wordpress.com
As long as Reid didn’t say the referendum would pass by without a bullet fired….that would be pretty scary.
‘Proud Scots’.
More powers, aye right…
link to newsnetscotland.com
Anyone know if Labour for Independence are planning a mailshot to counter this?
I got a Scottish Labour Party “If you don’t know vote no” postcard through the door this morning quoting 8 newspaper headlines from the Herald, Daily Express, The Times, Daily Mail, Sun and two from the Financial Times. There was one from the Daily Record.
Socialists my arse.
#redtories
I thought there would be a poll spun heavily against the yes side by now,I’m sure it will be along soon.
is the Yes banner still up on the castle?
Lots of people are genuinely undecided still; they see people from both sides on the telly and each sounds “convincing”.
I think that actual human interaction with a real live speaking human on the doorstep goes a long way to sorting out their confusion!
On the other hand I think there are a lot of people who in their heart know that “Yes” is the right answer. It’s just they are scared to admit it even to themselves. What happens when they get to the polling booth and lift that pencil…
Treating the electorate as complete idiots is the main reason for the utter failure of the Better Together campaign.
Real FUDS stand up please.
“…IT WON’T LAST FOREVER” Yes it will,and Boris and Nigel will be along soon to ensure it will. Tories may only be 34% but ukip are on 19% and a rump libdem on something.All that adds up to over 50%,we’re out of here lol.
Lord fancy pants Reid says blah blah blah.Most Labour voters want rid of the House of Lords.
Brian Soutar on form,straight talking on Sky,but two total Mr Wood drops in immigrant when talking oil somehow.
they have scraped the barrel so thin now, it has collapsed.
yet they still haven’t noticed.
š
It would be great if the Scottish Labour Party put as much effort into getting rid of mass unemployment, mass poverty and foodbanks as it is putting into its vote no campaign and demonising Alex Salmond.
When was the last time 100 London Labour MPs got off the gravy train at Central Station and walked through Glasgow city centre in support of people forced to live off poverty wages or people fraudulently sanctioned by the DWP and left with absolutely nothing whatsoever to survive on?
Charlie: is the Yes banner still up on the castle?
No. Removed within 48 hours.
Salmond and PM present rival visions
Lovely bit of BBC bias in one 6 word headline.
And I see that JMOBE wrote that Labour begging letter. Nobody has ever shoehorned more Alex Salmonds into one short missive than he.
charlie says:
is the Yes banner still up on the castle?>/i>
Unfortunately no Charlie, I believe the army was sent out to remove it. š
link to facebook.com
Yeah we can’t convince you to vote for us but vote
For us anyway
Lesley-Anne: Unfortunately no, Charlie
And as the incident did not reach newspapers we can only presume this social media is under constant surveillance.
I find that letter deeply depressing.
Lie after lie after lie – What is wrong with these folk?
But unfortunately some people will believe them
In his final appeal to us David Cameron puts on his most condescending face and informs us all that if we vote Yes it means ‘forever’. I presume he will talk to those aged eight and over later tonight.
Lying toads.
Everyone who votes No will regret it. No matter what the outcome, but more so if No actually win!
What a pathetic bunch. Completely devoid of original ideas. They revert to the negative stance that has resulted in the Scotland we live in today. No vision, No new ideas just the same old sound bite in varied formats based on “it’s bad, it’s terrible but only We can stop it getting even worse.
A reminder – it was a Labour First Minister who was proud to have sent money back to Westminster from his budget.( how could you underspend the Scottish budget?)
That act indicates that the party comes first. I refuse to believe that Scotland did not have a need for those funds.
The feeble fifty. Hide the McCrone Report. Tax evade while people are sanctioned and walk to food banks. Defrauded Ā£Million/Billlions of public money. Lied about illegal wars. Had Thatcher to tea. Westminster child abusers, tax evaders, embezzlers and liars. Above the Law, they make.
Charles Kennedy saying people protesting about BBC wasn’t helping anyone.OK Charles we will just knuckle down and take it on the chin. Aye right this is a revolution Charles and you are not part of it.
Still got that Troggs song running round my head –
Yes is all around, Yes is in the air…
Surprised they didn’t include a voucher for a free bowl of cereal.
I can’t say I’m surprised by Labour’s poverty of ambition. They have fallen so far.
As far as the UK NuLabour Party is concerned its core voting constituency is mere electoral/voting fodder to be prodded at the Party’s behest when necessary and then forgotten as the Party’s hierarchy gets on with the business of shafting its own constituency.
I say this as a nearly 30 year former member of this once proud working class/progressive movement filleted by neoliberal crackpots and professional politico’s who’s idea of radical is red wine with fish.
Not being able to give a reasoned dialogue as to why the Scots should remain but servants of Westminster and the British Union, they have reverted to scare mongering on a massive scale in an effort to force their “elected” loyal electorate to vote for something that is actually against their own self interest.
NuLabour and Scottish NuLabour have essentially turned gutter politics into a fine art form, so here’s hoping as a once loyal party member and foot soldier that the people of Scotland do the right thing and ignore these cretins by voting “yes” for an independent and social democratic modern state. I do not believe for an instant that Mr. Salmon will deliver this vision I’m beholden too, but the vision remains but a dream unless Scotland embraces its independence. Any Labour Party voters or members reading this, please note that you are not voting for the SNP, Scottish independence is above the SNP, it’s your natural calling and will help other marginalised peoples across the UK and further afield attain what is best for them, and that means turning our backs on nearly 40 years of neoliberalism and embracing a new community that cares, rather than exploits.
NuLabour are but Tories dressed in red, they cannot abide us their natural constituency, hence, given this fact why should we listen, never mind vote for these buggers and the Unionists. Vote yes if you desire a better tomorrow, or vote no for the same old, same old. It’s your choice, so I implore you as a Welsh socialist, please vote yes for your children, your grand children and my children.
Without wishing to stray too far into hyperbole, the slogan, the overall message & the constant attacks on the opposition leader makes this look like a leaflet from a far-Eastern military junta.
Labour really don’t have a clue anymore.
Grouse Beater says:
Lesley-Anne: Unfortunately no, Charlie
And as the incident did not reach newspapers we can only presume this social media is under constant surveillance.
WHAT?
Didn’t you get the E-mail Grouse?
I was sure I saw your name on the list. Ach don’t worry you’ll receive it shortly no doubt. š
Just in case folks missed Albanach’s post on the previous thread have a listen to this radio broadcast. Absolutely amazing. Not only does the Wee Blue Book get a mention but also Wings AND the First Minister morning briefing that was misreported by Smackdown Nicky. š
link to nrtalkradio.libsyn.com
David Cameron does Jolly Phonics…..
“Yes is for per-man-ent..
An es-cape from my
ex-cre-ment” !
Yes..yes…yes.
Is there any credible ‘better together’ people left standing?
Look at them all, in all parties, their demeanour,their actions and literature, do they portray a confidence that the NO’s will win the vote?
They have accepted that YES will win! It is obvious they now believe that. Two days left for the unexpected, the dirty tactics brigade will be seeking an advantage, however small.
Make no mistake, the lights will burn brightly tonight in No 10
wher as the 40watt lights in the discredited labour party in Scotland will shrug glow dimly and hope for the best.
We, on the other hand must keep delivering a positive message which will overcome the negative stuff rammed in our faces in the papers and tv right to the end.
I heard earlier on BBC that the vote will not be made clear until Friday between 05:00hrs and 07:00hrs.
I’m off to bed usual time and setting the alarm for about 04:30hrs. That is plan ‘A’
I have a plan ‘B’ it involves some pills and two match sticks and a cold face cloth. š
just seen lady from Channel 4 news say David Cameron ‘pleads’with Scotland to vote no,meanwhile we talk to a confident Alex Salmond. do we think they are all finally waking up to what a pathetic Man Cameron is?.
Even their fraud’s a soul sucking bore. You have to hear the C4 news ligger trying to explain Crash Gordon’s devo max latest con right the noo. Brian Taylor tried to flog it too but he’s got a lot more practice than the C4 cheeseball.
We’ve still had nothing from the unionists, no compelling reasons, no positive case for remaining in the UK. We certainly ain’t going to get it now. The best they can muster is “we’ve fought wars together”, “we built the NHS/welfare state”, all about the past, nothing about the future.
There is so much stuff out there, as an earlier poster said:if you don’t know, find out! Do some digging, talk to people. Whatever. We’re going to be explaining this decision for the rest of our lives. The least we can do for ourselves and future generations is make as informed a decision as possible. Which means voting Yes!!
The union really has got nothing to offer Scotland. I thought I’d write a song explaining that. Enjoy.
soundcloud.com/aye-we-can/the-union-has-got-nothing-to-offer
That’s little more than a disgraceful compilation of lies?
I get angry when I see or hear John Reid preaching from on-high. Check put the content of my post and decide for yourself. Saint or Charlatan?
when Mr Reid was Shadow Defence Secretary, his assault was witnessed by several people. One said: “John came lurching up and said to Dawn, “I want to have sex with you, I want to f*** you, you want it as well.” Ms Primarolo’s friend and neighbouring Bristol Labour MP Jean Corston intervened and, according to a source, told Mr Reid: “You are a disgusting creature. Get away from her,” adding, “That’s it, I’m going to report him.”And there is more. Disgusting man.
link to caltonjock.com
O/T I think we’re in for a love bomb extravaganza. Just had a chap phone me from ‘the no campaign’ clearly not originally from Scotland and scripted to talk about security and the ‘Bank of England leaving us’ – I kid you not! Well he got it with both barrells and some as I pointed out the lack of security in Scotland as a result of “his” governments policies – yada yada yada. He then went on about how it would affect the rest of Britain, I suggested they should have thought about that 30 years ago and what a disgrace the no campaign had been in denegrating Scotland in the manner they had. It turned out he was phoning from England as well, I drew his attention to the fact he doesn’t even have a vote. Sorry for the rant but I’ve been waiting for 2 years for these guys to phone.
SKY News introduces Referendum as follows:
“Will Scots vote to turn their backs on 300 years of shared history?”
… rather than:
“Will Scots vote for greater democracy and refuse more rule from Westminster?”
Lesley-Anne: Didnāt you get the E-mail, Grouse? I was sure I saw your name on the list. Ach donāt worry youāll receive it shortly no doubt.
I’m intrigued. Don’t keep me in suspense longer!
Indiana Jones has just tweeted that he can’t find the positive case for the Union anywhere after almost 3 years looking.
Just reading the above BT crap. I am FURIOUS to say the least.
ANY NO VOTERS OUT THERE – SEE IF THEY CAN SIT DOWN AND STOMACH THIS….
MORE OF THIS IS WHAT THEY ARE VOTING FOR AND SO THEY SHOULD BE MADE TO WATCH IT.
Aye, don’t bother trying to educate yourself about the issues, just blindly vote no and get well and truly shafted, most probably by another Tory government.
What an absolute disgrace the Labour Party has become. Utterly shameful that they treat the people of Scotland in this way.
NOT WINNING THIS IS NOT FEASIBLE.
YOU CAN’T START A MUTINY AND THEN HALF-WAY THROUGH, SAY NO, WE’RE NOT GOING TO GO THROUGH WITH THIS.
SCOTLAND WILL BE HUNG, DRAWN AND QUARTERED BY WESTMINSTER IF THIS VOTE FAILS.
Report about Rory and the cairn/opinion in Gretna on France24 channel.
Your family will be foriegners”We love you” there’ll be borders “We love you” You can’t keep the pound “We love you” Let’s fight nasty people together
Or we’ll have a nasty divorce forever and we’ll never play with you again “We really do love you”
I’m welling up…
Craig Murray’s site is down: Error establishing a database connection.
link to craigmurray.org.uk
Wee point of order – why is Baron Reid of Cardowan being described by the BBC as ‘John Reid MP’?
His ‘if you don’t know, don’t vote’ gaffe is a hoot, mind you. Silly auld fool: I suppose that’s because four years spent warming the benches of the Upper House addles the mind!
The whole labour movement will need a complete overhaul in an independent Scotland.Workers will have to take it back and reshape it for its role of responsibility in creating a whole new relationship between shareholders,management,workers and customers.To the benefit of all involved.Thats the way they do it in prosperous,progressive and fair social democracies.
There was an E-mail circulating, apparently, that stipulates that NO media outlet WILL mention anything about the YES sign on the castle rock and that MI5 and MI6 ARE watching Twitter and Facebook 24/7 for all and any references to said Castle rock YES sign. Anyone making said reference will be receiving in the fullness of time a nice *ahem* friendly visit from a person or persons unknown. š
I thought PM saying turn your backs rest of UK was a bad line
To be fair, Lesley-Anne, it was placed on the front wall of somebody’s house.
I’m guessing she was the one who called the army out to remove a sign placed by a seriously ill dying woman then. š
A more secure border could have its advantages …. Like we could deny entry into Scotland for undesirables. And, let’s face it, there are a hell of a lot of people out there should be kept out on the basis of their recent anti-Scotland subversive activities!
Dr Jim – Spot on Dr, they love us sooooooo much but if we dare leave they will destroy us….we are living with a psychopath
link to facebook.com bank of england says YES
Labour are a complete joke.
They keep banging on that this referendum isn’t just about one politician or one party.. you wouldn’t think it with their obsession with the SNP and in particular with Alex Salmond.
I think they are just jealous of AS as he kicks their ass constantly with ease.
O/T Nearly sick there as Crash Brown just been on that Bitter Together tv add again.. pass the bucket please someone.
Not only are we voting on the democratic future of Scotland, we are voting either for or against Cameron and if he does get the bullet if we win, who’s going to be take his place? Mike Gove, stalking horse for Theresa May on George Osborne but Osborne will probably get kicked out too. Bet Major Bojo’s kicking himself he stand for MP even last year.
link to telegraph.co.uk
The ‘Salmond’ word count is impressive.
link to theguardian.com Graun flexing its muscle. eek
I’m curious Stevie.
IF the referendum is NOT about ONE party then WHY do Labour keep going on NON STOP about the S.N.P.? š
Eat yer cereal, vote No, then just…gie up. Decades of supposed radicalism end in a knackered nihilism.
The zombie corpse of Labour totters towards the hero’s double barreled shotgun..
The Yes campaign is a grass-roots movement.
The No campaign is exactly that, a campaign organised from the top, disorganised starting from bad to seriously inept.
The No campaign is in a constant state of chaotic flux. That alone will probably be the loss of its goal, the control of Scotland.
When I make a document that is for public display or circulation, and to be signed by more than one person, I ask both signatories to use the same pen.
link to id.theguardian.com My Slovene girlfriend’s back in the BT game again. If they say no CU, does England have even the faintest idea what that would mean to them, virtually from the off? No.
Have a go and vote…
link to noscotland.net
Well Nana, that is a resounding yes on the no site š
@K1
YES, good isn’t it.
After reading all I can on the matter. I can see the yes collapse at the first hurdle. Alex Salmond my hero needs to get his head out of his arse. Who in their right mind would want any of the BT mob on their negotiating team? The Yes mob will need eyes in the backs of their heads. BT are proven beyond truth and trust. God help us.
No Better Together Thanks c o n f l i c t e d?
I spotted that Slabour HQ was open and inviting helpers, when returning home from my Q&A in the my local curry house this evening. I wanted to see what was going on, so removed badged and entered the viper’s pit.
The only occupants were three very board looking helpers, early twenties and fiddling with their mobiles. It took a little explaining to establish that I was a DK who wanted info I could trust. I asked for a reason to vote Naw and this is what Slabour told me.
1. We are stronger together.
2. UK pensions are backed by 55 million UK taxpayers, instead of Scotland’s 5 million.
3. Pooling and sharing resources will enable the UK to protect the most vulnerable in society.
4. The Scottish NHS is safe from ongoing privatisation of the English NHS, as Health is a devolved matter.
It was around about this time that I could no longer take being so blatantly lied to, in a plummy home counties accent. I snapped and gently told her that “I smelt shit”. No further discussion was offered as I was immediately asked to leave. Delicate souls these Establishment foot-soldiers. š
Re. my Q&A. All six now lean towards Yes. The boss floored me a little, when he told me 35 of his extended family intend voting Yes. Unfortunately the girl on reception had been left out a little and intended voting Naw because we are “Better Together” and everything seems to be working OK. I few selected questions latter and I left her with her nose stuck in the WBB.
@ Labour
Your mendacity will be remembered for many generations to come.
Alex Salmond has clearly put the frighteners on Project Fear. A NO-hoper who stopped me on the street on Saturday could talk about nothing other than Alex Salmond. “That Alex Salmond tells nothing but lies, that’s all he does.” Asked for an example, all he could say was “Everything Salmond says is a lie.” So what about others in YES? “I have the greatest of respect for the YES campaign, but I’m sorry for them because that Alex Salmond just tells lies”.
He was a proud Scot by the way.
My lovely, standard, “what can you do to stop us?” response from the BBC:
“Thanks for contacting us.
The BBC’s Political Editor Nick Robinson asked Scotland’s First Minister Alex Salmond two questions at his press conference on Thursday 11th September. The first question centred on the tax implications of RBS moving its legal headquarters to London; the second on why voters should trust a politician rather than businessmen.
Nick Robinson’s report showed the second question on trust, with a script line noting that Mr Salmond had not answered that point.
Mr Salmond’s answer on tax was lengthy. Since it was not possible to use it in full in a short news report, a series of clips were included making his central points – the job implications of the re-location of RBS, the accusation that the Treasury broke rules by briefing market sensitive information and his request that the BBC should co-operate with an enquiry. In addition Nick Robinson’s script pointed out that the First Minister said there would be no loss of tax revenue.
The BBC considers that the questions were valid and the overall report balanced and impartial, in line with our editorial guidelines.
Thanks again for contacting us.
Kind Regards
BBC Complaints”
Vote NO – get nothing.
Down here in East Ayrshire, the former mining area of Orange County, legend had it, when you got the keys of your Council house,you also got a big photie of King Billy on his white horse, to hang above the mantlepiece.
The ludges, Orange and Masonic, then and still, by and large run things around here and I know some of the brothers are none-too-happy with one of the patriachs of the Celtic Family telling them to vote No.
After all, Baron Reid (allegedly) is word-perfect on every Irish Rebel song ever written, and isn’t afraid, when he deems it necessary, to play the Oirish card to the “plastic Paddies” on the outer fringes of the Celtic support.
I long for the day political dialogue in West-Central Scotland gets beyond this sort of religious tribalism and we look at the issues in an adult way.
Sadly, the likes of Baron Reid are not capable of this, he is Yesterday’s Man, and, a total hypocrite into the bargain.
Lord Reid of the Falls Road and the Orange Order in bed together for the sake of the Union.
Sic a parcel o’ rogues in a nation.
Channel Four news, every item a patronising gem, thousands more votes for Yes. Keep it coming.
Have we had ‘Knees up Mother Brown’ or ‘Down at the Old Bull and Bush’ in Trafalgar Square yet ?
Grouse Beater says:
15 September, 2014 at 6:42 pm
Charlie: is the Yes banner still up on the castle?
No. Removed within 48 hours.
Who removed it and on what grounds? And why did nobody stop them?
Lesley Ann,
Thanks for the link to the radio broadcast, it was great loved the bit where he said does the BBC know the internet exist’s
When I read that letter from the Labour Party, I thought, at first, our dear friend from the Herald, John MacIntyre OBE had written it – such was the obsession with the First Minister.
But, on second reading, it wasn’t OBE’s work, no mention of Independence being: “A Vanity Project”.
I think my default answer/response to anything from Better Together, No Thanks uKOK, from now till Thursday is simply going to be
“PISH”
The Banks are Moving… “PISH”
Your not using the pound.. “PISH”
Alex Salmond is Bad… “PISH”
Oil is a Burden.. “PISH”
Johann Lamont’s a muppet.. ahh.. I see what you tried to do there..
The answer then, is “Perfectly agree with you.”
See, I am genetically programmed to see pish when presented with it.. (although not to make political decisions)
IF YOU DON’T KNOW DON’T VOTE! It would be irresponsible to vote if you don’t know what you are doing.
Well there we have it another “misbriefing” from Lord John this time, no doubt trying to protect his cloak of ermine and leather seat in the House of Lords. Find it difficult to accept that he spoke to 500,000 undecided voters? Couldn’t make them out in the audience. “If you don’t know – vote No.” Well apparently, according to Johann, it is not in our genes to make such important decisions but perhaps Gordon could transplant an answer in his quest for ermine and leather! They just don’t get it – New/Old Labour – worn out tactics – it just does not work anymore.
Sorry, diving in O/T
Jim Sillars last public meeting ON NOW
tinyurl.com/px9z3ob
Mass singing of “Donald where’s your troosers” now on livestream.
Hmm…try again
link to tinyurl.com
They could have supported the concept of Independence and ‘Yes’ would be strolling to to victory. Instead they have chosen selfishly to rally round the New Labour flag to protect their positions in London, forgetting who they were elected to represent. Hopefully it will never be forgiven or forgotten, especially if, god forbid, we vote for sevitude.
Of course our impartial and fair media will attack the bare aggressive negativity and dishonest claims on display here and the ad hominem attacks on Scotland’s First Minister.
Won’t they?
Or will they headline NAT SCAREMONGERING at the first suggestion by anyone on the Yes side that the above might just be a tad intemperate and undignified?
‘servitude’ ……….bugger!
O/T 4 unsolicited phone calls in the last 20 minutes from somewhere in Sheffield saying they were from Bitter Together and No Campaign.
Asked where they got the number from said from a database supplied by the campaign. One said he had never heard of the Telephone Preference List as he was just a volunteer.
Desperate stuff but tried to keep them on the phone to waste their time.
(from trafalgar square)
I honestly think those who are still undecided are far from thick. I’m sure they’re being very careful about their vote, and are therefore very unlikely to be swayed by this “Vote No just because” nonsense.
Working class people had to strive and fight against the British Establishment to get the right to vote. The Suffragettes fought and some died to gain the right for women to vote. For the Labour Party to advise people not to vote if they are unsure , in the most important vote in Scotland’s history shows the depths to which the Labour Party have sunk. Those who are undecided should seek out more information, there is plenty out there.
Lots of worried NO faces on STV news at 6. NO still smearing the YES campaign and BBC parading supposed “impartial” commentators to peddle more negative scenarios if the Scots have the temerity to vote YES.
who are they going to roll out next
maybe jim from vicar of dibley
vote n,n,n,n,n,n,n no
Brian, I believe the YES sign on the Castle rock was removed by the army. I’ll leave you to draw your own conclusions. š
jacksg says:
Lesley Ann,
Thanks for the link to the radio broadcast, it was great loved the bit where he said does the BBC know the internet existās
I tell you what JACK. If his broadcasts do go national all over the U.S. there are one hell of a lot of Americans who will have their eyes well and truly opened. š
Just caught the end of Channel 4 news interviewing Martin Amis and Irvine Welsh. Amis asked what he would say to Yes voters to vote No, Welsh asked what he would say to conciliate Yes and No after the vote. Balance my foot.
Amis reply: why can’t the Scots be ‘loyal’ like the Northern Irish?
Also, they’re actually saying “a No vote is a vote for change”? Doesn’t that undermine the entire reason you should vote No if you’re undecided?
If they’re admitting that both votes represent a change (which they do, although I’d say the No vote does not represent a change for the better), then why is No magically the ‘safe’ vote? You can’t have it both ways.
The Orange Order are so bereft of brain cells that they might have unwittingly won this for us. My brothers father in law Celtic daft,reads the Daily Fail. Insisted he was no and would not budge despite a year of my brother giving him the facts. He wakes up on Sunday and sees the Orange Neanderthals on the streets of Edinburgh in the paper. In a fit of outrage he says he is now voting yes. Guy at my work voted no his 3 kids and wife yes. His 16 year old daughter told him he had voted with the Orange order and should be ashamed. How many more families are there like this. The Orange order have spent their whole existence doing bad things. They have finally done something for Scotland!lol
In the last couple of days, it really does feel as though YES has upped its momentum, big crowd today in Partick Glasgow as the Independence Fire Engine showed up, in Merkland street, the whole thing had a carnival feel to it.
People were debating some were singing Caledonia, other handing out YES material, I really feel we’re going to win now, I just hope we’re not somehow cheated on the vote count.
Andy just a hunch but I think no might have pipped the postal vote by a percentage or so. I think it missed the big surge to yes. However even if we accept we might have only 45% in the postal vote. It is only about 23% of the total vote. On Thursday anything more than 53% will easily pull that back. However I could be wrong and we actually won the postal vote.
I think someone from No Better Together Thanks has been watching “Duck Quacks Don’t Echo” over the weekend. Dara O’Briain did a piece on people being more likely to follow advice if it rhymed.
How about “If you want success, just vote YES!” š
OT @Tartanarse from the previous thread,
http://dvlaregistrations.direct.gov.uk/buy.html?plate=YE55%20ERS&price=599
Only Ā£600 of your finest pounds sterling for such an awesome numberplate! š
What on Earth does Cameron imagine we Scots are? His great, err! āImpassioned speechā, was downright insulting to all Scots whether they be for YES, NO or if they still don’t know how to vote. This is the person charged with running the United Kingdom Government yet his basic education is abysmal in its sheer downright ignorance of the English Language, the History of Britain and the Geography of Britain. If you cannot even get the very most basic fact correct you should not be charged with running the bipartite United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland.
Let us examine how this downright ignorant and insulting person set about attempting to persuade we Scots to remain as a supposed equally sovereign partner in a bipartite United Kingdom. First he blethers on about Scotland leaving splitting up, āThe Countryā, but what country is this seriously ignorant numptie talking about? Scotland is a country, as are England Wales and Northern Ireland and all these are parts of the, āUnited KINGDOMā which is, of course a kingdom and a kingdom need not be a single country and may indeed be several countries or even just part of a country. Second of all the United Kingdom is a bipartite kingdom as the only two, equally sovereign, signatory kingdoms on the Treaty of Union document will attest.
So Cameron is rather ignorant of what the words country, kingdom and union actually mean. He is also ignorant of the fact that the Great in Great Britain refers to the larger, or greater, island in the British archipelago and that it contains only three countries while the British Isles has eight different countries only four of which are part of the United Kingdom yet Cameron constantly chuntters on about being the PM of Britain and such things as The British Parliament, armed forces, government and so on. He is PM of the United Kingdom only. He seems to have no real idea of the composition of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland nor of its history and correct legal situation. Yet he treats we Scots as if we are as ignorant as himself.
RT on Sundays demo
link to rt.com
Darling says Scots wont be bullied into something they dont want.
Too true we wont,nice pic of convoy parked up and nasty nick say he no LIAR
So what do people make on the bookies odds then?
Nana Smith @ 7:37pm
Thanks for the link.
On a No site and the Yes vote leads at 91.96%.. OMG.. I think I can’t hear Jackie Baillie warming up to sing!! Bloody hell haha. š
In fact I’ll start.. And now, the end is near…
Early on Saturday morning travelling to work I changed buses at Haymarket, west Maitland St to be precise. On bus stop next to mercat pub someone had put a large sticky-backed full colour poster of Alec salmond dressed up as a south american dictator, with the words..surely not president salmond!
Anyone else see this as I put it in bin,this was around 6am.
Don’t know if this was just a one off,but it was of a high standard,know there’s a printer nearby.Anyone seen this poster elsewhere? Talk about desperate.
Seen a few comments on international news sites about Scotland
joining BRICS. That really would be a kick in the teeth to the
wasteminster elite
Aye, Lesley Ann
here’s hoping eh?just great to hear them talk about what is actually happening rather than all the media bullshit.
Gallowglass
I’ll tell u what I make of them.. get ur money on now!!!
They’re still playing to the ‘bookies are never wrong’ tune.
Well they are definately wrong this time. I have been betting on it since beginning of August as I knew the odds were a mile off.
Stand to make a right wee few quid and my local food banks will get some of my winnings š
John Reid, Jim Murphy, Helen Liddel and all the rest of them: all those bastards are descended from the cowardly rats who jumped ship from Ireland as soon as it declared for independence. They came over here for an easy life because they didn’t fancy having to get their hands dirty working for a newly independent country.
They’re not Scots. They’re not Irish. They’re not English.
They like to call themselves ‘British’. It’s a cop-out and makes it easy for them to smarm their way into cushy jobs like Labour provosts, councillors, MPs and Lords where they can hide their Irish roots away from view until it suits them to play the convenient green card of ‘The Ould Country’.
Ireland and its lovely people is well rid of them. With any luck we’ll be rid of them too, and the English (I’m so sorry guys) can deal with them however they like.
No Scotland site has a poll where you can cast your vote. It’s fun!
O/T – Everyone is saying the referendum is too close to call but bookies odds are still 1/4 NO, 3/1 YES. This is weird.
It must be because the size of bets for NO are much higher, and from what we have been told in the media coming from Englandshire.
Does anyone know if any of the bookmakers have indicated what the odds would be if only bets in Scotland were taken into account?
@Greannach – didn’t see your post :0
Line of the week for me. Tommy Sheridan, saying on BBC Sunday Scottish Politics, with A. Neill
“Milliband could not run a bath”, cracked me up!
Go Tommy!
Andy,
i have seen two of them one near Lothianburn end of last week and yesterday near Cameron Toll,the first one was taken down, but i urge anyone who has seen any to remove them as they are very disrespectful to AS.
It makes me laugh when I hear them saying there will be no going back to the u.k. Union to me that is the beauty of it we will never ever again have to be ruled by liars and incompetents to me that is what it is all about O.T. I was in the pub last night and we were talking about that poor man who was executed by i.s.i.s. And one of my friends said that he was educated at Perth but that he was not Scottish i told him that the bbc reported that he was so could some one out there tell me who is right , my friend said it is Cameron and the bbc way of trying to get Scotland to back another war in the Middle East Vote yes
Sorry Stew,
I am pressed for time, so have not read all the comments! to see if this had been mentioned, on B.B.C. News 24, this afternoon when I switched on the presenters were putting 10 questions to their deputy political editor, I think it was the last question which was along the lines of “what would happen to the Scottish people’s passport if there was a yes vote?, the answer he gave was that we would loose it!!, can you find time to look at it ( somewhere about 15-00hrs) and comment on it, actually some of our contributors may have seen it as well.
Lady in Brechin said “there was a grey haired man on TV who spoke my language” – Tommy Sheridan.
les wilson
tommy sheridan was fantastic and that line cracked me up too…still cleaning the tea and egg that i spat out from my laptop, but it made my day
Jim McIntosh
I’m firmly of the understanding that around 85% of the bets in Scotland have been placed on Yes to win. I’ve heard that from a few sources.
I think it’s cos of the Ā£800k bets etc on No that’s keeping the odds for Yes high. I honestly just don’t think they believe we will vote to leave the union.. but we all know the truth.
I’ve been telling everyone to stick a few quid on it and use the winnings to celebrate!!
Independence and rich.. that’s a nice wee bonus!! And all at the bookies and Westminsters expense.. luvvly jubbly!!
Alex Salmond Alex Salmond Alex Salmond . The BT campain thinks if you cut of the head of the HYDRA the body dies,they havent grasped the concept of A Grassroots Campain.There is no overall head,but many, many willing body’s,useing their heads.
I wonder where the money will come from once we turn off the tap…
link to huffingtonpost.co.uk
Blair Paterson
I believe that the poor chap that was killed by ISIS is English but has relatives living in Scotland.
At first they said he was Scottish then they changed it British.
I could be wrong but I’m sure that’s what they said.
All trends are currently indyref related in Scotland. Tommy Sheridan has been trending 24 hours in Scotland (positive). Vote Yes been trending high for a number of days in Glasgow.
‘proud Scots and we want the best for our country’.
Ok, I am sure that is true, most want the best outcome for Scotland.
‘Alex Salmond…is prepared to break up the country’.
Wait…since when did YES or AS want to break up Scotland? Or is the Shetlands finally getting their own vote?
They have lost and they damned well know it.
@ Paula Rose your going through men like there’s no tommorrow,ya Floosy.
PatronisingBTMan
More people whose belief system is informed by Allah have suffered from the IS than anyone else, all my friends who hold to the tenets of Islam despise those despots.
Stevie: I could be wrong but Iām sure thatās what they said.
Aye, they did.
They’re preparing us for another continuation of another war – more profits for armament companies – they need Scots to do their dirty work – again.
The other side are trying really hard to make us all look evil and nasty,give them nothing back,not even deeply hurtfull sarcasm,definately no complicated kwestions aboot currantsy onions and the pownd
I’m just voting yes coz Alik Sammin said, SO THERE ,i think, or mibbes Naw, or… ahm away fur chips
Well what do you know folks, yon wee cry baby that was up in Aberdeen talking to a vetted audience has decided to pause any decision about attacking IS.
While Prime Minister David Cameron pledged yesterday to take āwhatever steps are necessaryā to confront Islamic State after the beheading of a British hostage, decisions on U.K. military action are unlikely before the Scottish independence referendum.
link to bloomberg.com
I’m absolutely appalled by the outright, blatant lies in that letter. I’m so angry right now.
Don’t get angry Suzanne … get even vote YES! š
Airdrie today BT put No Thanks signs on the traffic arrow signs on the Roundabout at Airdrie Sherrif Court.Police notifyed as was Northlanarkshire Council,but signs NOT removed at the same time of complaint.
If anyone still fancies a wee flutter..
Just checked the odds and most bookies are still going 3/1 for a Yes win.
Bet365 are currently 7/1 for Yes to get 55% or higher of the vote. Was 9/1 y’day!!
Ladbrokes are actually offering 12/1 for Yes to get over 60%. I believe that’s possible (so does Tommy Sheridan on Andrew Neil y’day). Well technically he said about 60%.
Ladbrokes are also offering 10/11 (almost double your money) on Yes only getting 48% or over!!
Will these prices last.. I’m not sure. They prices generally went higher last week when the scare stories of the banks and stores were flying about but as they don’t seem to have worked the odds are getting shorter again. I can’t see them going out much more again.. they can’t have many scare stories left surely!!
Paula Rose your going through men like thereās no tommorrow,ya Floosy
wee bit harsh ronnie, I think oor Paula Rose just can’t say No š
link to youtube.com
Anyone interested on how those poor, under paid, under valued, clueless, desperate food bank users … BANKERS, then there is a programme coming on to BBC1 showing these poor over worked underpaid workers in their full glory! š
Goodness. That No Scotland poll is a bit demoralising.
š
Reid the Weasel was caught on camera saying, “If you don’t know, genuinely, don’t vote.” When questioned on it, he said something along the lines of, ‘No, I didn’t say that. I said…’ (Sorry, can’t remember his exact words.) Utter lies. He was caught on TV cameras saying that, yet we get, ‘Naw it wiznae me, honest it wiznae!’ Despicable behaviour.
These blaggards should be run out of Scotland on Friday, our first day of independence.
Really good interview with Lesley Riddoch and Alan Cochrane on Aussie TV. No prizes for guessing who came out on top š
link to abc.net.au
@ stevie boy
sorry, I just cant resist
I don’t know if you can see, The gastric band coming over me. In these last few days, I’ve been afraid, that I might waste away.
Alan Bissett ” what the future will look like if the result is NO”
dec 2013 link to youtube.com
Not sure if anyone saw Mibees Aye, Mibees Naw on BBC1 tonight?
I know, I wasn’t going to watch it but wanted to see their spin on these undecided voters.
Glad I did. Think it back fired on the Beeb!! Of the ones that did come to a decision they all said Aye lol!!
Couple of woman (on the first show I thought would be a definate Naw) said they had researched into it (unlike our BT woman in the kitchen) and thought Yes was for a better future!!
.. was pissing myself laughing. F*cked up there BBC!! š
Suzanne says:
Goodness. That No Scotland poll is a bit demoralising.
NAW! It is only demoralising Suzanne if you are a NO voter and clearly you are a NO voter to NO! š
Davidb
Lol. We will all be singing come Friday mate.. for a good few days!!
What is the expression “there is no such thing as bad publicity”.
This is all about Salmond and SNP.
They really are totally useless
Really is down to positive vision vs no vision.
Please accentuate the positive and no shouting.
You should really visit the No Scotland site – it’s pure comedy gold!
“Have your say ahead of the referendum
Should Scotland leave the United Kingdom?
No 8.05%
Yes 91.95%
Total votes 180,544 votes”
ROFLMAO!
http://noscotland.net
O7T I liked that link to the American reporter. Thanks to the poster who provided it
hope you enjoy this
link to eurofree3.wordpress.com
immense thanks to Wings, friends and supporters for all you have done so far. Only another 2 days to go for breakthough YES!
Alabaman
I think you are referring to James Lansdale, Political Editor or something. Surprise, surprise, he went to Eton at the same time as David Cameron and Boris Johnston!
If I’m wrong it’s because I switched off before he could speak.
The obsession and fixation with Salmond by the Labour Party in Scotland is really quite worrying. You know you could say all they have left is a knuckle dragging form of British nationalism, but of course that would be completely out of order…. š
No much to add team. Out in the pishing rain the night dropping leaflets in affluent Edinburgh – to what effect God only knows. If we lose this thing it will be because of the media terrorising old people: what kind of victory is that to base our future on?
My heart breaks when I read the lies in the press. The troops at Pacific Quay yesterday were spot on – we demand better than this nest of vipers at the BBC.
I saw a wee vision of our new Scotland last night in the Usher Hall – I saw a unity of purpose and a country with a heart and soul and voice. The dickhead’s on twitter likened it to nazi rallies: it felt like the opposite. You could feel the hope and pride and sense of fellowship and community in the air.
I am proud of a all the activists and feel embarrassed that I have not done more.
Let’s enjoy these last few days and keep positive. It is within our grasp.
Love to all
Tam
Albaman @ 8.34 raised the question of passports post-independence.
That same question was raised at our Senior Citizens current affairs discussion group last week. One of our number, a retired polis, was a bit upset at what would happen when he had to update his passport.
He was unaware Scottish passports are now processed in Belfast, but, our group’s resident Yes campaigning lady and I soon put him right.
Passport, driving licence and other state documentation will surely have to be processed in Scotland, post-independence, therefore creating jobs, in Scotland, for Scots.
Another example of independence win-win for Scotland.
If you don’t know, vote no….then shut up and eat yer wheetos.
@stevie boy
aye singing and dancing
might even do a morris dance….and pigs might fkin fly lol
Always remember Tam that when someone has LOST then they will automatically revert to type and start with the nasty abuse against the WINNING side. In my view, the fact that there is so much vile abuse out there against the YES side just proves that they, the NO side, are scared shiteless. THEY know they have lost and are doing ANYTHING to cover up their FEAR! Trouble for them is that WE know they are FEART and we know they have LOST! š
O/T, but the debate yesterday discussed NHS rises in England and NHS reductions in Scotland – this wasn’t addressed in an answer – anybody care to enlighten me?
I will have a deep loss within me when Scotland votes yes.
The loss is a cause that I have had as long as I can remember which will be fulfilled when Scotland votes yes. Scottish independence has formed who I am ( thanks mum and dad) and has been a part of who I am as long suffering friends, teachers and employers can attest. That will be gone on Friday.
I will, instead, turn that pigheadesness into ensuring that an equal Scottish society becomes reality.
I look forward to that sense of loss.
That No Scotland poll will get yanked soon citing irregular activity
Panorama tonight was interesting (as far as the bbc goes), but didn’t talk much positively about the CULTURAL REBIRTH from dismal jimmyism in the 80’S generation onwards
Alan Little concluded a bit negatively in that the glue that holds the united kingdom together can’t be based on fear. – as if independence will come about solely from scaremongering as if it has nothing positive to say itself. Also didn’t mention the role of the british elite and its stranglehold on all matters political.
All in all, a very conservative britishcentric essay.
The Labour Party – Couldnae muster a smell in a damp room
Just voted on the No Scotland site. Must be all those vile cybernate *whistles…*
Dal Riata
8% that can’t be right a no voter must have clicked no in box 14000 times.
Tam Jardine
Chin up mate. U are doing a cracking job. Some places will be harder than others to get our message across but every vote we get counts.
I’m the same, was out in the drizzle from 10am til 5:30pm delivering leaflets around Cumbernauld. Did 767 houses to be exact. Counted as my legs were killing me. I volunteered to do more than usual today as I had missed it y’day as I went to the BBC protest.
We had 22 volunteers turn up this morning for the Cumbernauld and Kilsyth team. Most I’ve personally seen turn up.. proves no-one is taking the foot off the gas.
With everyone doing there bit we are gonna see this through.. and win our freedom!!
The LABOUR PARTY is empty.
The TORIES are empty.
WESTMINSTER is empty.
The Union has a prime minister who cannot speak to the people because he is empty and has nothing to say. His actions express this clearly.
Now the nation is speaking and it has a great deal to say. The Union and its prime minister hear it with great clarity.
scunnered 8.01pm
Thanks for the name call!
I’ll have you know Jim from the Vicar of Dibley is a fine chap.
Just back from a busy day in Perth. More WBBs given out, more undecideds on their way from misery to happiness (proclaimers). Unfortunately two old dears told me they hate Alex Salmond and he is con man- both Daily Express type readers, Mmm.
SLAB have plummeted to new depths. After a YES vote Allan Grogan Labour for Indy has to step in and get Johann and Anas oot. Murphy a spent force, Broon will disappear. Darling off to the corporate world, Blair McD P45 with a crap reference. Wee Dougie off to a safe seat in England.The rest are just just not capable. Where is Kezia? Where is JBallie?
Away to catch up on the News Where We Are.
In the *shudder* unlikely event of a no vote. What future is there for SLAB. Like the BBC they are now toxic. I have a lot of SLAB friends, all of whom have said they are never voting for them again.
Just been at the Tain and Inverness YES stalls. Yes banners throughout the town and the city. In Inverness there was one no campaigner with a placard and one young girl with no balloons. Pitiful.
@ Ewen
That’s my sense of this too. I can finally say “Mission Complete”. It’s kind of like waiting for your day in court too. With similar results too, depending on the verdict.
Albaspark says:
O/T, but the debate yesterday discussed NHS rises in England and NHS reductions in Scotland ā this wasnāt addressed in an answer ā anybody care to enlighten me?
I am no expert, let me say that at the outset Albaspark but I’ll try and explain the NHS thingy as I understand it which may be way off base so be warned. š
The NHS in Scotland is under the control of the Scottish government however the financing of this is governed by the pocket money given by Westminster to the Scottish government as part of the annual Barnett formula. The Barnett formula takes things like the WM spending on NHS in England and issues the SG a set amount of that.
As you are aware the Westminster government is, despite all the false claims to the contrary, privatising the NHS in England and Wales. This means, obviously, that WM pays private companies to run various health trusts. On the one hand this means that WM is putting MORE money into the NHS however, any contracts with private companies running the health trusts are EXCLUDED from the total NHS spend that is used to calculate the Barnett equivalent for the Scottish NHS.
On the one hand WM are right in that MORE is being put into the English and Welsh NHS, as result of paying the private companies. However, the reality of this action means that the Scottish government is also correct because, as a result of privatisation we receive LESS from WM.
Apologies if this has left you even more confused than you were before you started. š
Just received the latest begging letter from labour:
On Friday, we’ll know. And there will be no turning back.
There’s no time left to speculate on the result. Not when I know that with your help, we can deliver the right choice for Scotland and for all the UK.
Donate today so we can tell hundreds of thousands of undecided Labour voters why a No vote is the only vote for our party and our country’s future.
I refuse to look back at Thursday’s referendum and say that we could have done more to reach our supporters. Our campaign is not going to give up just because recent polls have put this race neck and neck.
When Labour created the Scottish Parliament in 1999, we demonstrated our commitment to a better Scotland and a better Britain.
I need supporters like you to join us and show your commitment now ā donate whatever you can to protect our future.
Thanks,
Iain
Iain McNicol
General Secretary
Labour Party
Had to laugh earlier when delivering my leaflets. As I was almost finished a door opened and a woman came out and shouted something at me (honestly no idea what it was) then she ripped my leaflet into tiny bits and threw it up in the air.. all over her own garden!! Think then she just realised what she had done and just looked at me. I have her the big thumbs up and continued on my merry way, chuckling to myself.
On Friday I’m gonna drop a card though her door.. inviting her to a party!! I’m sure she will know who it’s from. š
@no no no yes
i know hes a fine chap and hes given me a lot of laughs..just a bit of humour
O/T Have it on decent authority that at least a couple of the ‘ordinary shipworkers expressing concern about independence’ today were in fact Labour diehards….and I remember one being involved in the Labour group at university. Not a crime, but leading one to believe they were ‘ordinary workers’ is more dishonesty.
I brought the Provisional IRA girl with a gun in from the cold.
Last week a Senior Tory local Councillor was revealed as Maria McGuire, a former IRA activist:
Maria McGuire on killing British soldiers. āI agreed with the shooting of British soldiers and believed that the more who were killed the better. I remember occasions where we heard late at night that a British soldier had been shot and seriously wounded in Belfast or Derry ā and we would hope that by the morning he would be dead.ā
Maria McGuire on killing civilians. āI accepted too the bombing of Belfast, and when civilians were accidentally blown to pieces dismissed this as one of the unfortunate hazards of urban guerrilla war.ā
link to croydonadvertiser.co.uk
link to mailonsunday.co.uk
There is no Scottish Labour Party they are funded from London HQ. Where will the funding come for when their time runs out. The phoenix arises and there are wings over Scotland again.
Vote YES.
cockney lad says:
15 September, 2014 at 6:12 pm
āWeāre not genetically programmed in Scotland to make political decisionsā says Johann Lamont.
This statement came from the leader of the Scottish Labour Party.
It doesn’t insult but it informs.
O.K. folks, I’m not really sure if I should do a heads up here cause well, it’s really, really, REALLY bad news! š
link to twitter.com
I see the BBC reporting No rally in London. Except they missed all the ones in Scotland for Yes.
I’ve got a feeling they’ve got it stitched up the back somehow.
@Lesley-Anne says:
15 September, 2014 at 9:47 pm
…not funny. I’m on the edge stuck offshore.
Off tomorrow š
Lesley-Anne
Is that poll just been released yeah?
O/T – If you haven’t seen it, National Collective have put the Alan Bissett play ‘The Pure, the Dead and the Brilliant’ up on You Tube.
Saw it during the fringe, it’s excellent.
Hmm, I do NOT think this is what dear Eddy Izzard or Dan Snow was expecting tonight. LOL
link to twitter.com
@R-type Grunt
Yup but It is an internal win win.
If it is no, then it is business as usual…fight the fight. If it is yes then it is fight for the Scotland we fought for. My only regret is having to leave Scotland 19 years ago so not being on the ground. Thankyou internet for giving me the chance to help a wee bit.
@Albaspark
Privatisation of the Scottish NHS: TTIP and independence
The NHS in Scotland is now very different from that in the rest of the UK. It is increasingly under threat because of funding cuts from Westminster. The plan for the UK to enter TTIP, without an opt-out clause for NHS Scotland, is symptomatic of the way Scotland has been treated in general, and an even more potent reason for Scottish people to be able to elect governments with full economic and bargaining powers through independence.
I am keeping all fingers and toes crossed but just had a slightly depressing phone call from my friend – 3 Yessers in her house, saying that 3 of her friends, 2 of whom work in the NHS have alreaay voted no and her husbands work – air traffic control at Prestwick – are all Noes.
So there are folk out there who are really misinformed but as my friend said her 3 votes for yes cancel out her friends 3 noes.
How are the loving masses getting on in Trafalgar Square?
Do they feel a harpoon-sized dose of irony cheering Scotland 500 miles away?
To paraphrase:
“I will NOT walk five hundred miles for you, Jock!”
Still lots of no voters. Gonna be close. Be positive.
@Jim Kennedy
Salmond can make that offer quite freely
Because no way in hell would their own lot let them anywhere near a negotiating team. More civil war and backbiting amongst BT
So the FM can appear magnanimous and conciliatory, knowing that the pirhanas in BT will make sure that it never happens
When is the trafalgar thing on or is it over, looked at a live cam
and it looks deserted
Lesley-Anne
Sorry, was that ICM poll u post correct yeah?
Ah its over according to bbc there was 2 million there
@liz
Ah, keep the chin up. Your nerves might be getting a wee bit frayed but my expectation is rising.
For a long time I believed it was close now I believe the Yes vote has a substantial lead, my own eyes and ears tell me that. So, keep the spirits up and help maintain the momentum š
Bill Hume
If you donāt know, vote noā¦, then shut up and eat yer wheetos.
Hope you don’t mind me suggesting a tweak. š
If you donāt know, vote noā¦,then shut up and eat yer Austerity Biscuits.
Anyone know what’s happening with the polls?
Just had a friend text me to say that all the polls people are talking about on Facebook are saying that the No side is dead in the water?
link to theguardian.com A familly guy from south Dublin Ireland says vote no. Can it get any more surreal out there. And then but so, its actually Sir Bob Geldof to you, which may add some pep to bettertogether Bob.
Being knighted by Brenda does seem to make people very loyal to England and England ruling Scotland, so why not make everyone in Scotland a knight or a lady or baroness etc?
Get the Queen up to Hampden park and have mass knighting of every YES vote only and that’s it, my evil and cruel separatist dreams to break up the yewkay shattered.
Also virtually the whole of West End London from Trafalgar Square to Heathrow is owned by Dan Snow’s father in law.
Cancel that.. think she got mixed up!
Everyone is saying they are dead in the water but don’t think it was specifically linked to any polls.
I got a bit excited there!!
Sorry Clootie, enjoy your trip home tomorrow. š
The tweet was put up around 7hrs ago Stevie I’m afraid I don’t know any more than that. All I can say is that the poll results are BIGGER than the actual poll results put out by the Sunday Times last Sunday. I’d suggest that based on that this is a new poll.
Yes is in the air, yes is all around xx
Stevie boy and LA
Thanks for your posts. Don’t get me wrong – I am very confident but at the same time the stakes are so high I canny help being nervous.
The idea of our country falling for this same jam tomorrow crud makes me sick to my stomach.
Funny thing is, I saw that arial display from the Grange today on the cover of the Scotsman and thought to myself – how many of those folk have actually got off their arses and done anything to make a No vote happen?
They don’t deserve to win. They haven’t earned it like the Yes campaign has.
I’ve still got chants ringing in my head after PQ yesterday.
And now a new one:
‘Geldof, Geldof, GTF…Geldof, GTF…’ etc. Quite catchy methinks.
O/T
Last few hours for Friends of Wings Indiegogo thingee and last post on this from me. Thank you guys, you are awesome !
link to indiegogo.com
Lesley-Anne
Thanks for letting me know.
Doubt the bookies are just thinking it’s another flash in the pan.. not much movement from them.
I still think it’s higher than 54% š
Geldof calls Scots “selfish”.
dont know about knighting everybody but i think we should all be pushing for a knighthood for rev stu campbell
ICM poll is correct. First saw it on Sky yesterday. Establishment are playing it down
Lets get this to 100,000
link to you.38degrees.org.uk
No knighthood for Stu – he would turn it down, acceptance would be a betrayal.
Nick Robinson on BBC News tonight speaking about David Cameron, Ed Milliband and Nick Clegg
āWhat I find as Iām close to these leaders in recent days is ā¦ the closer you get to them ā¦ the more you can almost smell the anxiety.ā
Bob says, out loud, to other people too
“Before there was a United States, before there was a United Nations, before there was a united this, that and the other there was a United Kingdom and it was an extraordinary meeting of very different minds of two extremely close cousins. And what a construct this thing is. Because Scotland is a feeling. England is a feeling. Wales is a feeling, Ireland a feeling. But the United Kingdom is one of the greatest ideas for the modern age. Between the native genius of the Scots and the pure pragmatic drive of the English we made a world beater. The pity of this is that we are the closest of cousins ā when one of our blood spills then it all spills. There is such thing as a big glorious no. No is not always a negative.”
“Because Scotland is a feeling.” lol
“the native genius of the Scots,” I dont even know how the tin opener works.
“No is not always a negative.” its just that it is. But once again, who knew our ukok scrounger region populated with fat unhealthy drunks on the brew could have suddenly transformed itself into a beautiful place full of geniuseses?
Give us a fucking break why don’t you.
Oh look what was the number one item on the main news at 10 p.m. tonight folks.
link to twitter.com
Ooops, sorry I forgot that story was NOT mentioned tonight after all, I must have been dreaming.
gillie
I know, the bloody cheek mate eh.
I don’t get how Geldolf and George Galloway and the likes think we are being selfish for wanting to breakaway and rule ourselves.
If they think we are turning our backs on other poor people in rUK or regarding the food banks in rUK then it isn’t the case.
Westminster isn’t going to fix ANY food banks so at least we have a chance to fix our ones and then hopefully that will lead rUK to sort their own house out.
If we waited on Westminster doing something they are only gonna get worse.. Westminster has simply failed everyone and it’s time to get rid!!
@paula rose
yeah he would turn it down but im talking about a knighthood from the scottish people not the brittish empire
Tommy Sherridan is at it again. He is having to do a unscripted speech OUTSIDE Fir Park to people who were unable to get INTO Fir Park to hear him. š
Watching the political debate with a group of work colleagues who were an almost equal mix of yes, no, and don’t know. When Douglas Alexander revealed he worked as a solicitor in Edinburgh the yes group swelled by 2, with the comment didn’t know he was a fxxxng lawyer !!!! this profession has not a lot going for it. Is it time to have a reshuffle.
I’m with you Stevie on the 54%, I too believe the TRUE percentage to be much higher than 54%. Westminster are really looking down BOTH barrels of a loaded shot gun with the people of Scotland ready to pull the trigger! š
@Lesley-Anne
Don’t get too excited š That poll is from last Sunday and was released on Saturday night. Just not overly reported as the result may not have been what the Sunday Telegraph wanted.
Scot Goes Pop probably best place to read about it.
link to scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk
Target audience – link to facebook.com
@Big Jock – I believe they do count the postal vote beforehand, but to leak the results to anyone is a criminal offence. If the NO’s were in lead I do feel the BT politicians would be a bit happier looking than they actually look now. Just a thought.
@Albaman – If they did say our passports were no good now, and remember they say EU on them, we would all be wanting a refund. So I think that one is a red herring. Again just me thinking like.
Go on YouTube and put in “David Cameron seat of pants”.Its a one minute clip.Listen to the reaction of the House of Commons.They think we are a joke.Maybe someone could put a link on here.
I donāt get how Geldolf and George Galloway
Gallow bases his antipathy to independence agreeing the Labour party has long-lost its principles whilst demanding we stay with Westminster.
Underneath having his cake and eating there’s an intense hatred of the SNP driving him, same as any Labour machine politician.
Geldof is ditzy headed. Bet he wishes he could organise a Jock Aid.
The main UK parties have signed a pledge on the front of the daily record stating that devolution would be considered permanent and something along the lines of new powers and spending will mean the NHS isn’t under threat.
Hmm, I’m not sure how postal voters will appreciate this. I wonder what the headlines on Wed & Thur will be :p
A simple misunderstanding. Its a suicide note from El Gordo and his wummin pal
‘If you don’t know, vote NO!’ Gordon & Johann really have gone through the looking glass, haven’t they?
‘”But I don’t want to go among mad people”, Alice remarked. “Oh, you can’t help that,” said the cat.”We’re all mad here. I’m mad. You’re mad.” “How do you know I’m mad?” said Alice. “You must be,” said the cat, “or you wouldn’t have come here”.’
Lesley-Anne
You probably clicked trough ’cause you appear to have a hyperactive digit. š
For those that may not have spotted the Tartan Army from another angle. š
link to twitter.com
A privilege to be alive to witness the end of an era, and it couldn’t be sweeter that Cameron is at the helm when Brittania’s back is finally broken.
Come in Cameron, and Boris, and Farage, and Clegg, and Miliband – your time is up. You can stay on the deck playing ‘Believe It If You Like’ (with your stiff upper lips and underpants full of keech), but very few of our kinfolk, friends and good neighbours in England, Wales or the Six Counties are going to tolerate you for much longer.
We’re blazing a trail, and our friends in ‘The Provinces’ WILL follow. Don’t doubt it chaps – don’t doubt it for a nanosecond.
The Waterboys, ‘Old England’ –
link to youtube.com
Heedtracker: Give us a fucking break [Cameron] why donāt you?
Chuckle …
My god they’re not giving up.
Rhona is sitting in front of a big screen tv on STV with a picture of a ballot box with a no thanks paper being inserted into the box.
No balance.
I know it’s an obvious point but it certainly bears repeating.
According to the Britnats Scotland is a sad broken bankrupt region that is supported by the English for some reason. And will be unable to be independent as we are too poor and will be even poorer when the oil runs out.
Except that when the oil runs out the Scottish region will then require even bigger subsidies from the English taxpayer.
According to the same Britnats the vile Salmond is Anti-English for wanting to remove this parasite and spare the English from a future of subsidising Scotland.
Yes that makes perfect sense. Vote no to be a parasite.
Argghh. Newsnight in the Ferry!
How did I miss that, I could have been handing out the WBB. Miffed.
Genius from Cameron. He makes the pleas but labour carry the can for the dirty work. Of course he pulls in his Bullingdon Bildeberg network but labour will carry all the damage.
@heedtracker – like @Thepnr said my nerves are frayed but –
āthe native genius of the Scots,ā I dont even know how the tin opener works” made me LOL.
I’m getting completely paranoid. Every time my computer freezes when on the Wings site I think ‘that’s it they’ve shut it down’. š
can anyone else see that we are being treated like ungrateful servants.
who instead of “politely”, saying no, are saying yes.
the BT campaign, it’s catch phrases, and wordings are straight out of a dickensian novel.
it is all out of the public school grace and etiquette vocabulary.
Wonder why the BBC gets accused of bias?
Main online story is now the PLEDGE for ‘extensive’ new powers.
Then the other independence page we have had all day:
link to bbc.co.uk
2 speeches, Cameron’s highlighted.
Of the links to other BBC stories.
8 are pro-NO
2 are pro-YES
2 are neutral
Then the UK-wide comment section, where Scottish voices are drowned out.
Cameron and westminster thinks Scots are stupid
link to youtube.com
Is this the same Gordon Brown who said he would prefer at Tory/UKIP coalition after the next election over a Yes result on Thursday? I can only assume that there is a double involved somewhere, because the Gordon Brown I know used to be a LABOUR Chancellor and Prime Minister.
Maybe is a mistake in the translation… link to en.ria.ru
You know, that leaflet with “Alex Salmond…, Alex Salmond…, Alex Salmond….” reminds me of nothing so much as Captain Ahab pacing the deck of the whaling ship Pequod, his sanity long since gone, muttering his obsession to himself over and over again “Moby Dick, Moby Dick….”.
“Geldof is ditzy headed. Bet he wishes he could organise a Jock Aid.”
But Midge Ure, the guy who actually wrote the tune of the Band Aid hit, is a Yes supporting Scot.
I don’t think duetting with John Barrowman on a number penned by Jimmy Krankie would have much chance of repeating ‘his’ earlier success.
Incidentally as I posted yesterday, today I got a thing through the door from Scottish Labour Vote No with a number if you need a lift to the polling station. Labour have always had this and it is a vote winner. We need this in the Yes campaign, one number to give you a lift or help to get to the poll. Maybe they already have it in hand but it is needed. It is a must.
@ James Caithness
Postal votes are not counted beforehand. They are extracted from their outer envelopes, over a period of several days depending on how they arrive at the council offices. The signatures and dates of birth are compared with those on the applications for postal votes; dubious ones are assessed. All those that have been verified are then removed from the inner envelope. They are supposed to be kept face down. They are put in their own ballot box(es), but at the count after the close of polls they are mixed in with votes from the polling stations for the actual counting.
http://www.electionsscotland.info/emb/…/flowchart_-_postal_vote_opening
To all you paranoid pussies – we have representatives from Wings at every count – now behave, organising wingers is harder than herding cats, stop fretting, we are on the ball.
We are looking at getting a new family car next year, but I am not sure if the make we like is any good? Better not risk it and stick with the auld banger.
Well done Paula, thanks for the recruitment. Sorry I could not make it, I was unable to get any holidays as my work colleague booked holidays before me (he is canvassing for Yes and going to the count!)
Tombee says,
Where is Andy Burnham while all this is going on?. Is he an undecided?, Or maybe not genetically programmed to make political decisions. Or has he just been told to shut up and stay out of it in case he slips up and tells the truth about the National Health Service privatisation policy in Waste minster?. If you are in any doubt Andy you could always have a read at the Wee Blue Book.
What a bunch of has beens, no imagination and no credability
@razycat
That’s exactly correct. Too many are fearing the worst from postal vote fraud.
I think there seems to have been an error with the printing on the postal ballots that I’ve seen so far – as the words ‘Alex Salmond’ don’t appear on any of them. Whereas it is clear from that letter that the whole vote is solely about ‘Alex Salmond’!
That whole letter is pathetic.
Managed to persuade a friend who had been No to change her mind for tomorrow ref.
Pledge to celebrate with her on Friday morning after the positive result.
Coincidentally, my wife, son and daughter managed to return home last night from France (flight problem) to vote ..YES.