Quoted for truth #4
Joyce McMillan in the Scotsman today, as the Scottish press is finally, after three days, shamed into acknowledging what happened on Tuesday.
“What I see at Westminster now is not an alternative politics that avoids the pitfalls of nationalism, but an instinctive, backward-looking British nationalism that is even worse: a farrago of double standards about Westminster and Holyrood, and of reactionary nonsense about the nature of national identity in the 21st century, combined with a complete vacuum of progressive policy, and an instinctive willingness – on the part of the Labour Party – to side in this debate with what is perhaps the most privileged and reactionary government the UK has seen in a century.
The truth is that the tone of the No camp’s response to the independence debate has – in too many cases – been so reactionary, so negative, and so fundamentally disrespectful of the Scottish Parliament as an institution, that I now find it hard to think of voting with them, no matter what my views on the constitution.
And this, for me, is a new experience in politics – to enter a debate with a strongish view on one side of the argument, and to find myself so repelled by the tone and attitudes of those who should be my allies that I am gradually forced into the other camp.”
We’ll have more on that subject later this morning. Don’t miss it.
Read that this morning, I think the negativity of the NO campaign is bringing a lot of people into the YES camp.
This struck me as no more than a grudging acceptance of the merits of independence; ‘well, Westminster’s worse’. I see no enthusiasm for the myriad of benefits in independence to the Scottish people in this argument.
The positive vision for an independent Scotland, and an addressing of the democratic deficit, is what has driven the movement, not ‘how bad’ Westminster is or is not.
“Damn with faint praise, assent with civil leer, and, without sneering, teach the rest to sneer.”
Alexander Pope
It seemed obvious to me when the latest poll showed no increase in in YES voters, but a decrease in NO voters and a subsequent increase in DON’T KNOWS, that the NO campaign was getting the tone all wrong.
The clear hatred of Holyrood, something that Scottish people, from all sides, seem to like and respect well enough, from a bunch of people who have a great deal to lose personally, from any change in the constitution and the negativity and what most people can see as downright lies, and ridiculously obvious lies at that,are clearly putting people off.
It is getting through to folk that the NO campaign has nothing positive to offer us except WMDs, more embassies than you could shake a stick at, a seat on the UN Security Council, “clout” in the EU (?????) and some vague promises from David Cameron!!!!! (well we all trust him, don’t we?) about changes in the future (but he’s not telling us what…)
Not one single thing that will get better… just more cuts, more Tory injustices that Scots vote against.
You know, sometimes I feel sorry for those charged with selling this crock of shit to the Scots.
@stevie cosmic
A yes vote is a yes vote “grudging” or not.
OT – Talking of NOT shamed into reporting what happened – Glasgow City Council leader Gordon Matheson arrested for performing sex act in public. Did so with someone other than his significant other.
And it is treated with compassion and respect in the Unionist press
heraldscotland.com/…/…
dailyrecord.co.uk/…/…
Pathetic that it is not the lead story in these “newspapers”, but it does get a front page lede to an inside page in the Record at least. The Herald, however, once again confirms its status as McPravda.
Here is the headline as it appears in the Herald:
“Fears for Glasgow council leader’s future over sex act”
Here is the headline had it been an SNP council leader:
“Alex Salmond in crisis as SNP leader arrested for gay sex act in public. ”
Actually, the Record is even worse than the Herald – this is their headline:
“Council chief Gordon Matheson issues public apology after being caught cheating on partner”
No mention of arrest or the sexual offence
“No mention of arrest or the sexual offence”
Perhaps because he doesn’t seem to have been arrested. The Record says:
“Officers found Matheson committing an “indecent act” with his former partner. They spoke to the pair then reported them to the procurator fiscal.”
You know, sometimes I feel sorry for those charged with selling this crock of shit to the Scots.
You must be a real soft touch, Tris
The NO campaign is doing an excellent job of forcing even its natural supporters to look around and think “if this is all the Union has to offer after 300 years surely there must be something better than this”.
That’s why positive words, actions and a clear vision of the opportunities for social justice (despite Joyce pretending that it’s all vague and not enirely be trusted) from the independence campaign will gently impell the swelling ranks of Don’t Knows to vote YES in 2014.
Right, where do I sign to nominate Ian Davidson for an OBE for his services in defence of the Empire?
Ian Davidson for OBE?
You mean an Old Bell End?
That’s the one.
Looks like she was just about choking to admit what little she did. Felt like half the piece was her padding and qualifying statements assuring us the the SNP/independence crowd ain’t all that great and are probably just as bad, etc.
Pravda behaviour continues all around but maybe this grudging admission of fault for the No campaign is one of the first cracks and a sign of something gathering momentum.
“Looks like she was just about choking to admit what little she did. Felt like half the piece was her padding and qualifying statements assuring us the the SNP/independence crowd ain’t all that great and are probably just as bad, etc.”
Maybe. Or, you could see it as setting our her Unionist credentials in order to illustrate just HOW bad they must have been to be pushing her towards the Yes camp.
link to heraldscotland.com
This story was on Herald website but buried and not visible form any of the news segments. I had to find it by searching for Matheson. The Herald has a peculiar love in with wee Gordy and so I had commented that the story was miraculously buried and wondered if that would have happened should he have been in another political party…
An hour later its on home news front page and my comment deleted….
Yes, and as noted in my post the Record seems to have been economical with the truth.
From the Herald:
“Glasgow City Council leader Gordon Matheson was apprehended by officers after they witnessed him carrying out the act in a car on the city’s south side.”
apprehended: Verb
Arrest (someone) for a crime.
Merriam-Webster
Being reported to Fiscal does not always require arrest.
Radio Scotland nearly choked on its shortbread breakfast this morning when forced to read out the Record’s and Herald’s coverage of the Matheson story. It did not, natch, find room for the story in its main news bulletins.
Kenny Campbell says:
18 January, 2013 at 9:22 am
Being reported to Fiscal does not always require arrest.
If he was apprehended as the Herald insists, then he was indeed arrested.
I may be reading the signs wrong, but I get the impression that there are a number of prominent “unionists”, possibly devomax supporters, that have just stuck their heads above the trenches and have started looking for an excuse to vote YES in 2014?
Joyce McMillan won’t be the only one thinking that. She has come a long way in her political thinking to her present position. The anti side are helping. Thank you Darling.
Re Matheson, I expect a lot of jokes about his ‘Glasgow Kiss’
Maybe Matheson was auditioning for an OBE. And entirely unbidden, the phrase ‘ointment before entry’ just popped into my head there. Uuurgh.
MajorBloodnok says:
18 January, 2013 at 9:45 am
the phrase ‘ointment before entry’ just popped into my head there.
Seems to me you’re behind the curve with that one, Major.
@blunttrauma
“Read that this morning, I think the negativity of the NO campaign is bringing a lot of people into the YES camp.”
SSHHHHHH! They’re doin’ jist fine.
My only concern is that the police took good care of the guide dog belonging to Mr Mathieson’s partner-in-not-quite-a-crime.
Joyce McMillan practially worshipped Gordon Brown, I seem to remember from articles from the late 1990s/early 2000s. She believed the Labour party could do no wrong. Well well.
The Joyce McMillan comments in the piece above is exactly how my wife feels about the whole situation. She’s not overly political or attached to any one party but she considers herself to be somewhat conservative. She’s voted for the Tories during the last couple of elections that have popped up but, like me, she votes for a party after pondering the present and the near future rather than the past or because of some sort of tribal instinct.
Since she’s been made aware of WoS, and the workings of the Scottish/British mainstream media, and after listening to the explanations behind the stories and seeing for herself the utter contempt Westminster politicians have for Scotland, she has gone from a definite No to a probable Yes.
I think it’s safe to say she’s not the only one.
If a stone-cold unionist like Joyce McMillan is saying this, Better Together really had better pay attention to how their message is coming across before it is too late for them.
On the other hand, carry on as you are, B.T.
Major, glad you left that one till after breakfast!
Marcia says: The anti side are helping. Thank you Darling.
Indeed, we are well served by the enemies providence has provided us.
Looking at the completely ambiguous headline (“No Answer Came The Stern Reply”), am I being paranoid in thinking that if this had been a story about the pro-independence side’s behaviour, it would have been something like “I Can’t Vote For Independence” or something?
Joyce’s article reads like someone telling the story of a friend they used to be enthralled to, who they felt could do no wrong. But they’ve just witnessed that friend doing something absolutely heinous, and their faith in that friend has been critically shaken. Her eyes have been opened, and from now on she’ll start to see all the faults for what they are.
Joyce is not the first, and she most certainly won’t be the last. This is one of the reasons why the transfer of votes will only go one way, because a lot of “no” voters simply haven’t been forced to see the union for what it is yet.
Morag says: Joyce McMillan practially worshipped Gordon Brown, I seem to remember from articles from the late 1990s/early 2000s. She believed the Labour party could do no wrong. Well well.
I think she can convincingly argue that she did not leave the Labour Party, the Labour Party left her,
“Joyce is not the first, and she most certainly won’t be the last. This is one of the reasons why the transfer of votes will only go one way, because a lot of “no” voters simply haven’t been forced to see the union for what it is yet.”
I think that is a critical point, if you are YES today you won’t ever be switching to NO. The same can’t be said for NO voters today.
The headline over Joyce’s piece….
link to poetrysoup.com
A sad little tale. Congratulations to the Scotsman sub who thought of the connection.
My favourite comment on the Scotsman article:
“Is it unhelpful to point out that National Socialism in post-WW1 Germany was borne out of hope too?”
I just… I don’t even… ah… [heid slams down in desk]
Anent trying to get to the bottom of the NO campaign’s policy. Do you think Gordon Matheson knows anything about it. ?
I think an awful lot of Unionists now wish they had included a second question in the Referendum.
“trying to get to the bottom of the NO campaign’s policy. Do you think Gordon Matheson knows anything about it. ?”
I’m sure he’ll consider the issue, have a poke around, and should he discover a void, conduct a probe into it.
‘When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser’
Socrates.
How true. How very true.
I think Joyce McMilllan is doing a Kevin McKenna. I reckon she could well gradually be coming round to independence in her recent articles.
On Matheson, such a breach of trust and illegal activity would normally lead to any public servant tendering their immediate resignation.
On Joyce, I believe this is the thin end of the wedge. The apparent silence from the YES campaign suggests to me they believe the frantic, negativity of the NO campaign are doing just a grand job. Of course, I expect there will be a tipping point where the YES campaign will swing into full force and many more will be persuaded of the benefits of independence.
I predict, without any research whatsoever and using what is known as gut-feeling, that the NO percentage will gradually and continually fall this year. Those people (to whom Devo-Max is preferable) will at first go into the ‘don’t know’ category and then shift later into the YES camp. The final persuasion will be the publication of the White Paper including the FM’s idea of all-inclusive constitution and the realisation that NO means you get nothing except more misery for years to come. I can see a 20-30% shift to the YES camp bringing out a similar result that led to the YES-YES win of 1997.
Extraordinary article by Margaret Curran on 15 Jan – does she have no sense of irony? It’s okay, I do know the answer to that!
“The debate ahead on the future of Scotland has to be more than an accountancy exercise. The tone and tenor of it has to match the high aspirations that people on all sides have for an event of this significance.
As we have been doing from the outset, we will continue to grasp the nettle and deal with the difficult and challenging issues that Scotland has to face with rigour and honesty. It has to be a debate that meets the ambition of the generations of Labour advocates for devolution. In the words of Donald Dewar, Scotland’s first First Minister:
“Introspection will not solve our problems. Nor will preoccupation with constitutional point-scoring. Responding to the needs of the Scottish people is what matters.”
For those of us who have spent a life time in Scottish politics, this is an important opportunity to settle this question once and for all. When Parliament’s debate concludes this afternoon, we will be one step closer to that end.
Margaret Curran MP, Shadow Secretary of State for Scotland
link to labourlist.org
Those who read Kevin McKenna’s articles in the Guardian/Observer will have noticed his change of tone ever since Lamont’s ‘Something for nothing’ speech and subsequent fallout. Now, having ‘followed’ his warblings for quite a while, from his earlier insulting and unfunny jibes against Scottish independence, the SNP, Salmond, etc. to his latest more mature and questioning stuff about the future of Scotland I’m still wary of this volte-face… but I live in hope that its genuine! We haven’t had the full ‘Damascene conversion’ yet, but you can almost taste it!
As an aside, @Rev Stu: re Kevin McKenna.
I remember some people questioning your decision to move Kevin McKenna from your Zany Comedy Relief section to the Scottish Politics section. Does this now prove that you have the power of prescience?
From Wiki.:
“Prescience – The power to have instinctive foreknowledge of incoming events. A form of precognition, and a sub-power of precognition.
Capability: The user has instinctive knowledge of events before they happen, and often knows an enemy’s every move and intention before said enemy even decides them.”
Well, well. Who knew?!
“I remember some people questioning your decision to move Kevin McKenna from your Zany Comedy Relief section to the Scottish Politics section. Does this now prove that you have the power of prescience?”
More just the power of reading, really. I based the move on what he actually said, not what I guessed he might say. If I was that smart I’d have also predicted Alex Massie slipping the other way…
@The Tree of Liberty: In the early stages of the debate, I wondered why the unionists were so agin Devo-Max, yet insisting Alex Salmond secretly wanted it. I still can’t decide if they were just being stupid, or if wee Eck is a genius. I mean, they were being stupid either way, but if Alex Salmond really put them into that position, he definitely is a genius. He has been very lucky with his enemies!
Wee Eck is a genius. That was a masterstroke.
I remember the day the penny dropped for me, in October 2011. Before that, I couldn’t quite figure out what was going on, with all this stuff about indy-lite and devo-max, and journalists crowing that Salmond was just softening up his supporters to get used to the fact that he wasn’t aiming for independence any more. And nobody in the SNP was denying it. Sillars went on a public strop about it. (Now I wonder if he was privately prompted.) That year’s SNP conference had puzzled little fringe meetings trying to work out what was going on.
Then a junior MSP explained it all clearly on Newsnight, and I nearly fell off the sofa. I was absolutely struck dumb with admiration when I realised the trap that had been set.
I thought once it had been explained at least the unionists would figure it out, even though they were in a cleft stick. But they didn’t. They went on walking right into it. They may only be beginning to figure it out now.
Tried to comment to Joyce McMillan’s piece but bloody hell The Hootsmon site is so slow
Anyhow… embe think the general disillusionment with Scotland Labour will filter down to the Labour Party in England? And mebbe make them realise where they are going wrong as a UK party?
All the best
Charlie