The master of disaster
The comedy “obnoxious Tory” stereotype/respected BBC pundit (delete as applicable) Adam Tomkins has a dramatic opinion piece in the Spectator this week, which also commands the magazine’s front cover.
It’s a handy one-stop compilation of some of the most comprehensively-debunked Unionist myths and lies of the past couple of years, livened up for readers with some standard-issue wild-eyed frothing lunacy shrieking about one-party states, “Orwellian” dictatorships, the evil Nats are coming for your children, blah blah etc.
If we were to pull up every absurdly laughable line we’d be here all day, and nobody reads 5000-word articles, so we’re going to restrict ourselves to a single example.
The SNP was elected in 2007 with 32% of the vote against Labour’s 30.7%.
The most recent polls from each of the five major pollsters regularly covering Scotland (YouGov, TNS, Ipsos Mori, Panelbase and Survation) record current SNP support at an average of 53.4%.
In other words, after eight years of “disaster” and “catastrophic” rule the party has increased its support by a colossal 21 points, and has extended its average lead over Labour by even more, from just 1.3 points in 2007 to a crushing 32 points today.
It’s sort of heroic for an obscure unelected commentator to arrogantly tell Scottish voters that they’re a bunch of idiots too stupid to know they’re supporting an awful government on the basis of numbers like those, particularly when that commentator is standing for a party that’s just recorded its lowest vote share in 100 years.
We suspect the SNP will be urging the Spectator to make Professor Tomkins as prominent a figure as possible in its pages in the next seven months.
Mr Tomkins may go and boil his offensive Tory heid. Slowly.
The Professor of Law at Glasgow Uni, Adam Thomkins, is expecting his position and expertise in Law to transfer, in the minds of the Scottish electorate, to politics and economics. Trouble is, he only espouses Conservative politics and Osbornomics. To do that in Scotland is not a project for a professor but for the guy at the bottom of the class.
It is beginning to look like in order to become a unionist flag waver a full frontal lobotomy is mandatory.
The fella is a demented loon.
Mind you this was in the Spectator.
I couldn’t give two figs if he’s a Professor, a Confessor or a Window Dresser . . . he’s an unelected mouthpiece!
For his own sake alone I don’t want him to be elected as a regional MSP here in Glasgow next May. He’s so unhinged and such a bitter British nationalist/imperialist that having to spend his days in Parliament vastly outnumbered by SNP MSPs and people who don’t agree with his “wise” opinions will make him explode. An utter fanny!
The irony of him complaining about Scotland being a one-party state (when there are no ballot papers with ony one name on them) is only trumped by the fact that he has probably had more influence on the future governance of Scotland through his membership of the Smith Commission, and believe you me, I certainly never voted for the Tory apologist.
One thing about Unionism is increasingly standing out, and it’s evidenced in this article – that the Establishment is having recourse to the batshit mental as their line of first resistance. Even ten years ago someone like Tomkins wouldn’t have got near the ‘mainstream’ discourse – now he’s in the front line.
This can only be good news for those in favour of Scottish self-determination.
What is Adam Tompkins a professor of, Stupidity?
The article in the spectator is the most absurd, over the top piece of hysteria I have ever read. Truly, I might frame it and put it up on the wall in my house, as a reminder as to how freaking nuts some unionists have become.
It is hard to have any respect for the spectator when it publishes childish hysteria like that.
How freaking bizarre. Seriously, how very freaking bizarre.
Sadly, that attitude is all too common up here. I have lost count of the people who insist that Scotland is in crisis because of the incompetence of the Scottish government, ignoring any and all figures which show different. This does not matter whether it is law, education, medicine, etc.; they simply say that things have been steadily getting worse, ignoring the fact that for many of these things, we lead rUK.
Sadly, from an academic’s perspective, there were quite a few during the referendum who thought that knowledge in one field transferred to others, particularly economics. Adam’s knowledge on constitutional law is pretty good, but although ‘bottom of the class’ may be a bit hyperbolic, he definitely comes across as someone who needs extra support classes (remedial?) for an understanding of Scottish society, the body politic here, psychology, sociology, and of course, economics (theories and models).
I hope Prof Tompkins does get in on the list. He is going to be a complete disaster for the Tories in Scotland.
A complete zoomer of first order who is going to come to come seriously unstuck once his ramblings are properly exposed.
I wonder how his republican views will go down with the Orange Unionist Glasgow vote that the Tories are trying their hardest to attract?
What were you saying about Talent pools?
Isn’t it fascinating to observe that, when supposedly well educated people nominate themselves for a political job, their ability to use even basic logic while maintaining a firm grip on reality, simultaneously vanishes?
Said it before and will say it again, if you had children attending his University would you want him teaching them anything?
Agree with all of the comments I have read so far.
The really interesting question is if the SNP are going such a bad job how come the polls give then a 30% lead?
What tactics are the SNP using to brainwash voters?
The Spectator article is hilarious. Even the cover had us in stitches. Yes, it’s a just a troll, but it reaches new heights of frothing bonkerism.
It’s a bit odd. It’s as if some of the more Ultra Unionists need to create their own fantasy in order to avoid real issues. A sort of Teletubbie fascist state in which Sturgeon is the dictator and her minions are forced to endure free healthcare and protected human rights.
O/T Enjoyed the Guardian bit re SNP Honeymoon over… ‘faint signs, hinting at problems to come’… oooooh scary.
Beware the faint signs, hinting….
What Tomkins and many Tories seem incapable of understanding is that the voters are not convinced by their policies and CHOOSE to vote for the SNP. If that makes Scotland a one party state, then it’s not the SNP’s fault. Maybe they are doing what people want their government to do. O/T. I see Mundell trying again to promote the claptrap of Scotland having two governments during his answers about GHQ snooping. Technically it has I suppose, but it’s not the way most in Scotland view it. It’s going to be a long and tedious election campaign with this kind of rubbish.
Thank goodness we have the BBC, to provide wall to wall live coverage, with incisive analysis, of the largest political party in Scotland, which has been in Government since 2007, and is holding the largest political party conference seen in Scotland.
If only.
Some of the comments beneath his article are as you would expect centred around
Entitlement,breeding,intelligence etc etc,are all there in Conservatives,whilst those who arose from poorer backgrounds with limited genetic intelligence try to compete.
I suspect Prof Thomkins believes himself better than he actually is.
@ Hoss Mackintosh
I believe Tomkins has changed his mind about the monarchy recently – very convenient.
Of course SNP rule since 2007 has been a disaster. A great big bloody disaster – for him.
What tactics are the SNP using to brainwash voters?
Standing for election with policies that they believe voters have asked for, then once elected, they ten try to implement said policies.
Breathtaking in its audacity… Britnat media, BBC, red/blue tory world watch, learn, do the same, lolz
Sorry rev I posted the link to the SNP conference without removing the http, my bad
link to youtube.com
Oh and once again: Tompkins is batshitcrazyspewingshitetastic.
Like Hoss Mackintosh I hope Tomkins does get elected from the regional list. He will be even worse than the Tories’ current equivalent of Labour’s Jackie Baillie, Alex Johnstone. It will be enjoyable observing him being verbally dissected by Nicola Sturgeon at FMQs, any time he attempts one of his hysterical SNPBad rants.
OT: SNP 2015 conference.
link to youtube.com
Yes we all know that this guy is a littke twerp, but they are pandering to the ignorant South of the border.
Look at what the brainwashing corp are getting away with whenever Scotland has to be mentioned on one of their programmes. Remember in the lead up to the independence referendum they demonised that Alic Sammin, then they tried with Nicola, but she is too popular.
Now they are going for the SNP. Stoking up more animosity toward Scotland, and the less enlightened South of the border soak it all up like sponges, laughing at Scotland and believing we will be the cause of a world war 3. Honestly.
Their point? To undermine the whole idea that we can oppose the disgusting austerity being imposed on us and our neighbours. How bloody dare we!
As my ignorant graun reading, bbc watching friends in Newcastle said last week, we are living in ‘cloud cuckoo land’ to think we can counter the tory agenda. And of course we are all so airy fairy with an unattainable ‘utopia’ idea clouding our irrational minds, which are by default, labour minds, really they are.
Unionists in Scotland love to please their Westminster-centric masters by doing down Scotland. It’s this unionist sycophantic creepiness that so disgusts most people in Scotland.
Ruby @ 11.39
“What tactics are the SNP using to brainwash voters?”
Aye, and this despite constant attack from Unionists and their cohorts throughout the media. No wonder they’re terrified of giving us control of broadcasting,(The media which reaches the parts of the electorate the other media doesn’t reach).
I suggest you send the Spectator a full and frank critique of the Profs article.
I’m sure they will apreciate it!!
The great pity is that it’s now become common place to spout any sort of rubbish whether or not there is any shred of evidence to support it. Once upon a time we would argue over interpretation of evidence. That was one thing. But to open your mouth and spit out something that has no basis in evidence is, for anyone, a great shame. For someone from an academic background, it is disgraceful and calls into question his or her competence to hold an academic position.
Dan Huil says:
15 October, 2015 at 11:55 am
Unionists in Scotland love to please their Westminster-centric masters by doing down Scotland. It’s this unionist sycophantic creepiness that so disgusts most people in Scotland.
Dan, I am convinced that one of the major causes of people rejecting unionisim in Scotland are “unionists”. The hard-core variety. They truly are among the nastiest, most obnoxious of individuals. Long may they spout their guff on air and in print, and continue to recruit more supporters of independence. Even the NO voters are ashamed of them. We owe them so much.
‘We suspect the SNP will be urging the Spectator to make Professor Tomkins as prominent a figure as possible in its pages in the next seven months.’
SNP success down to Unionist propagandistas being bat shite crazy?
I was hoping for something more intriguing like Planet SNP sending out rays and turning everyone into SNP-mad fiends.
You’ll know what I mean if you’ve seen Flesh Gordon.
If you get the chance, check out today’s neo fascist Voice of The North Press and Journal front page, full page photo of drilling rig tossed around in stormy waters, with a silly little cut out of Kez Dugdale sad face at bottom, “worst economic crisis ever” headline. So it’s fair to say neo fascist Voice of the North isn’t happy about something happening at the Brig o Don this week.
I’m a bit confused by the symbolism in the Spectator’s front cover. Can anyone help.
Why the red eyes? Are they suggesting that Nicola Sturgeon is ‘Rosemary’s Baby?’
What about the Alistair Darling eyebrows?
The symbolism in the picture Stu has chosen for this article is easy to read. Jezerna Rosa – No Thanks.
THE MAN WANTS ELECTED : A LICENCE TO LIE
From now until next May, professor Tomkins will write only what Tory voters and Tory Party leaders, want to hear.
The methodology and discipline he has learnt and practised in his academic career will be set aside completely.
From now on, Adam Tomkins will be like a TV weather presenter, whose forecast is a complete distortion of the weather map behind him.
This man is an English Imperialist and is paid by one of our leading Universities to teach our youth. By the nature of his anti-Scottish and distorted colonial mindset, he has no place in a higher seat of learning. Yet there is no call for his removal.
When Prof. John Robertson produced his erudite analysis of BBC bias during the REF campaign, the BBC attempted to suppress his findings and to get him sacked.
My experience of Scottish Universities is that they are dominated by English academics…many excellent, but a minority with Tompkins prejudices. I don’t believe that any politically motivated individual should hold positions of power over students’ future careers. Ask yourselves: if you were one of his students and held your current views…would you be secure in ever expressing them..even in the context of the chosen subject?
This in itself…makes him a questionable holder of his post. His publically expressed views are dishonest and disingenuous and often downright lies. Yet he continues to hold an elevated academic position.
I would like to see a move to get him to step down if he continues in his political ambitions. He won’t be able to contribute 100% to either post should he be successful and get into Holyrood.
ha ha the king of the zoomers its batshit mental britnat wanna be(not a chance in hell)Scottish tory FM loony tunes Tomkins.
Saying that i guess it fits in well with the usual lunacy that comes out the spectator.
Ruby they have brainwashed us all by being competent,doing their jobs and listening to us its truly dastardly and deserves a big SNP BAD lol
Fellow travelers we have to face it we have become click bate. If this had been printed in the Guardian it would have had over a 1000 comments by now and the owners would be rubbing their hands in glee. The Spectator comments have barely gone into double figures and most are off the zoomer scale. It’s a good insight into the “global reach” of their rag.
Adam Tomkins is a professor? The university of East Anglia and the LSE have a lot to answer for on this one!
Why would a professor of law allow the truth to get in the way?
Wow, started reading the link. What planet is this Tomkins person on?
@JayR 11:27am
so, how many of these will we need to clear up the post explosion mess? There’s even a bit for his sharp tongue
link to uk.rs-online.com
The guy’s not exactly an intellectual, and as Stuart points out, “professor” is a title NOT a qualification.
One of the best bits from that demented article:
Imagine that the ruling party controlled 95 per cent of MPs, and policed the political culture through a voluntary army of internet fanatics who seek out and shout down dissent.
‘Internet fanatics’ thats a new one
@Rob James 11:59am
I’m not sure, but, it does seem to have worked on me. I managed to recall a bizarre password that was issued to me after having NOT used it in about six months or more.
Maybe, as a teenager, I watched too many Black Sabbath LP middles rotating .. spinny, whirly, ooohh …
[snaps out of trance ] which probably means that the SNP are a bat-munching cult after all. Woohoo, I’m a cult member (at last).
I love the SNP I love Nicola Sturgeon I love Independence Baaaa Baaaa Not brainwashed Not brainwashed
You’ve gotta laugh, if you favour the SNP you’re a Nutter, if you favour any of the other lot, You’ve looked at their policies and made a sensible choice
Quick word, If I pay a cop to commit a crime I’m in the shit, I’m part of it, I’m as guilty as him
But if you’re a “journalist” apparently that’s OK
@crazycat,
So Prof Tompkins obviously a man of principle then.
An indy supporting, socialist, republican turned in a few short years into a right-wing, Unionist who supports the monarchy.
I wonder what happened to him?
Here is a picture of him from happier times…
link to tinypic.com
here you all go for a nice refute of the Spectator article link to lallandspeatworrier.blogspot.co.uk
Well I read the piece of zoomery by the mad professor. I need a shower now.
Just one comment on the ‘Getting it right for every child’. What Tomkins omits in his hysteria, is that the legislation has been challenged via the courts, and rightly thrown out.
The premise of ‘Getting it right’ is a phrase that has been used for many years in Scotland. It is the aim of ensuring no child falls through the net, in any situation. From struggling with education, to physical abuse etc., every child deserves the right of having someone ultimately responsible in pulling the right services together for that child.
It is not a comment on parents, at least not all parents. The named person will never come into play if a child goes through the system never having an issue.
Scotland is the only country in the world to operate the Children’s Panel system, and has every right to be proud of that. Having worked in the system in Glasgow for a number of years, the reasons for children starting to fail is myriad. In Glasgow, grannies are the lynchpin of many children not being in care. They need support, and are glad to be guided, and get support with various issues.
I despise people that paint the named person as something sinister, when it’s the opposite, and puts a child’s welfare at centre.
well the esteemed prof was giving a performance in his chosen final destination of choice, “The House of Lords” namely the select committee on constitutional matters yesterday , chaired by former Scottish office high heed yin Ian Lang , not sure if he is a lord , he probably is because he was surrounded by lord this and sir that ,they were discussing the ” in their words” the Scottish (problem) namely how to present the Union in a more relevant light, a more caring Union, ha ha never seen so many people scrabbling around trying to defend the indefensible , it was like listening to your postman and the milkman discussing your family finances and asking a passing plumber for his opinion, out of touch dosent come close to this lot
95% of MP’S perhaps in Westminster,but not here in his supposedly one Party State in Scotland. I believe that the Holyrood Parliament he wishes to join himself ,has, is ,and will be ,well represented by other Parties
The Nutty Professor sound like loyalist knuckle draggers that are online on the Hootsmon everyday.
Almost a case of …. with enemies like Tomkins, who needs friends?
Then the reality is, the SNP have huge numbers of ‘friends’ as well as ‘assets’ like Tomkins.
Hopefully the juggernaut will continue being unstoppable. Latest post-smearing YouGov poll is excellent.
There are a limited number of people in Scotland who will vote for a party led by a Bullingdon Boy. By selecting candidates from the lunatic fringe of the party I think the Tories are further reducing the limit of their potential vote.Highly amusing,though.
Is Slovenia near Transylvania? Because Tomkins sucks the blood out of democracy.
Nicola Sturgeon just said this:
“So let me be clear. To propose another referendum in the next parliament without strong evidence that a significant number of those who voted No have changed their minds would be wrong and we won’t do it.
It would not be respecting the decision that people made.
But, over the next few years, as the Tories impose even deeper cuts, press ahead with Trident renewal and fail to honour in full the vow of more powers for our parliament, I think support for independence will continue to rise.
So let me also be clear about this.
If there is strong and consistent evidence that people have changed their minds and that independence has become the choice of a clear majority in this country, then we have no right to rule out a referendum and we won’t do that either.
No one has the right to stand in the way of democracy.
So, those will be the principles that guide us – respect and democracy.”
I take it from it appears to me that she is trying to gently let down the pro-indy side – whilst trying not to lose their support by restating the vague potential in the event of strong evidence of a shift in majority opinion.
It begs the question, of course, what constitutes “strong evidence”. How do you get strong evidence without holding a referendum?
At first pass, I am not sure whether the speech is about letting down Yessers gently – or
OK Tomkins … what do you make of the latest YouGov poll ….
Constituency ballot :
SNP 51% (n/c)
Labour 21% (-1)
Conservatives 19% (+1)
Liberal Democrats 5% (+1)
Regional list ballot :
SNP 45% (n/c)
Labour 20% (n/c)
Conservatives 19% (+1)
Greens 6% (n/c)
Liberal Democrats 5% (+1)
SSP 3% (n/c)
UKIP 3% (n/c)
….?
I see comments are open on the BBC website report of Nicola Sturgeon’s opening speech to conference. The BBC claims that the comments are ‘reactively moderated’. Given the amount of bile and hatred shown toward Nicola Sturgeon in particular & the SNP in general it is quite clear that the BBC do not deem offensive comments to be a reason for moderation.
There also appears to be a huge amount of ignorance about the Scottish Gov’t in most of these comments.
Sadly, very few people read The Spectator in Scotland. Any chance his most recent nonsense piece can get replicated in the Record, Sun, etc? That would be very helpful.
It is really bizarre that at a time when the likes of the Land Reform Bill appears to be getting gradually watered down, we have the bizarre spectacle of unionism in Scotland and the rest of the UK, becoming more and more hysterical about one party state’s, and all the general howling at the moon. You could do a perfectly reasonable critique of the SNP without this demented hysteria. They just cannot help themselves.
@sensibledave,
The tory boy who supports a government who installed Saudi Arabia as chair Of Un Human Rights Committee.
Let me help you Dave. The referendum will come no matter what Nicolas message imparted to you.
You never answered my question notsosensibledave,
Who you voting for as your beloved Tories are so bent these days.
o/t
re Nicola and indy ref2
in the next term, we will Respect the result of indyref1, however, if opinion shows an increase in support for indy, indyref2 will happen
respect and democracy
if support increases, we will have another ref, if it doesn’t, we wont
this is the best solution, it doesn’t commit us to either course of action and allows us to review the situation as it unfolds.
I think support for indy will increase in the next term and this respect and democracy approach enables us to take advantage of this increase and declare indyref2. crucially, it doesn’t commit us to indyref2 if support for indy falls.
re Heedtrackers girl friends rant…..no sense, from a no mark with no hope and no support.
who cares?
It begs the question, of course, what constitutes “strong evidence”. How do you get strong evidence without holding a referendum?
Sensible we can’t keep explaining to you Britnats how democracy works but for n the time, YOU put it in your election manifesto and if people want a referendum, they will vote for you.
Sheesh. You UKOK Britnats really don’t do democracy in your Scotland region do you sensible. And no doubt manifesto policy offers by the SNP are another appalling outrage against UKOK power and glory of teamGB and the 600 Englsih MP’s that control Scotland, for now.
When commenting in the herald always refer to wings
Daisy Walker says:
15 October, 2015 at 11:44 am
O/T Enjoyed the Guardian bit re SNP Honeymoon over…
Ever heard of anyone who had a ‘honeymoon’ that lasted 8 whole years?
That’s how long the SNP have been in government. Maybe the Guardian thought they just suddenly appeared on the scene last May, because it was only then that their myopic editorial team began to notice them.
The Scottish public isn’t infatuated with the SNP, but it’s sick to death with the rest of them. Compared to what else is on offer, voting SNP is just a matter of common sense.
Nobody in his right mind wants his country to be run by nutters.
Can anyone in his right mind believe that Scotland would be in safe hands if its government was taken over by Professor Tomkins and his likes?
Twenty or thirty years ago there used to be plenty of people in public life who were distinctively Scottish, and confidently so, yet at the same time fully and genuinely committed to Britain. Such people are now increasingly hard to find.
When Unionism in Scotland has to sink to the likes of Professor Tomkins to represent it, this is a clear sign of its decline, and approaching demise. It will never revive unless it finds people who feel genuinely Scottish, and who truly identify with Scotland, to represent it.
Personally, I don’t want it to revive, but if there were such people around in public life I would at least have a healthy respect for them. Frankly, I don’t see any. There are still a decreasing number private individuals of that kind, no doubt, but in public life? No one.
So the field has been taken over by people who have no empathy for Scotland’s distinctive past, and no desire to forge any kind of distinctive future for her, even within the Union.
A Union which they purport to love but in fact never understood, and are now hell bent on destroying.
Their agenda is Scotland’s absorption into another country which is the only one they really love, the only one they ever genuinely believed in. After absorption their objective is Scotland’s annihilation – its reduction to total nothingness. It’s a very old agenda indeed. And it pre-dates the Union.
Genuinely Scottish Unionism no longer seems to exist, not in public life at least.
The old Scottish Unionists, who were certainly Scots, and not ashamed to identify themselves as such, are no more. Even if you never agreed with them, there is still something sad about their disappearance. What was once their field has been left to charlatans and rogues, thieves and robbers, haters of Scotland who have no real and deep and abiding love for her.
A field left to be plundered and devastated by superficial opportunists – and transformed into something it never was before.
Enter Professor Tomkins …
Bearing with him his fellow far-away Spectators from that distant long-loved country of his dreams.
IMO The unionist lachies are being controlled and directed by the Establishments security propaganda services.
Over the last few days ALL the establishment propaganda units and personnel have been pushing the line about the SNP bubble has got to burst some time, WHAT HAPPENS THEN TO THE SNP?
The EBC AND ALL THE OTHER MOUTHPIECES OF THE STATE ARE MARCHING TO THE DRUMBEAT OF THE ENGLISH STATE SECURITY SERVICES! where are they going to take us next? They will do ANYTHING to protect the ENGLISH STATE, ANYTHING! Just read your history books about the end of empire.
If the SNP don’t start making serious mistakes that the state can exploit then the state will just have to create some! They have form in that area from all over the world. Aye better the GITHER?
sensibledave says:
“what constitutes strong evidence”
That rather depends on whether you are looking to make a case to the public, or whether you need information to make a political decision.
On the 5th September Cameron was aware from private polling that he was about to become the last PM of the UK. He took the political decision to make false promises of more powers.
In the same way the SNP, from private polling and canvas returns, will know that a majority support Indy. Since Indy is a central objective of the SNP, I would think the next step would be to wait for a trigger to hold IndyRef2. Cameron appears to be on course to provide a whole selection of opportunities.
Even given all the caveats about public polling accuracy, in terms of question style and weighting, I would expect those too to be showing Indy support.
Everything Nicola says fits this developing scenario.
I’m sure Prof Tomkins cunning strategy of telling the majority of Scots that they simply vote for the wrong party will get the result it deserves.
Maybe he will do it in sing-song or poetry, to make it even more eye-catching, as we approach May 2016?
gala mcennalath 1.14
Developing scenario.Thats just where we are.And what role does Mr Tomkins play in this developing scenario? It seems to me the Tories have completely the wrong candidate here.Hes only going to engender greater fear of Tory rule.
@papadox,
I tend to agree with you.
It would be too much of a coincidence as I have heard recently,,for political programmes,blogs,journalists and commentators to utilise the same phrasology on numerous occassions.
It is as if the are receiving weekly updates on an agenda or a phrse or concept to pursue.
i.e. One party state, when the bubble bursts etc.
Scottish taxpayers pay to be insulted.
Maybe he will do it in sing-song or poetry, to make it even more eye-catching, as we approach May 2016?
I think he should give his UKOK propaganda through the medium of interpretive dance, him and Sarah Smith Scotland 2015, union jack leotards, vote No, forever and ever…
Could be a big Britain’s got talent thing too, give it up for Professor Smirky and his UKOK dance troupe who will now do their UKOK thang and a one two three etc
INDYREF2 is a catch 22 situation.
Support for Independence will lie dormant if we sit back and do nothing.
Or, support will grow a lot quicker if a date for the Referendum was announced.
I want a Referendum yesterday, but I also think that we need control of the major councils. That takes us into 2017.
This thing called patience is getting harder and harder to keep under control.
best quote ever
Lady Michelle Mone ?@MichelleMone · Oct 14
Lady Michelle Mone
And? I promise you something…I will never change who I am…Lady or no Lady
Is Tomkins hoping for the lead role in a remake of “The Nutty Professor”?
Please assure me that he isn’t allowed near students, research animals, or sharp instruments at University.
If he only appeared in his Union Jack Boxer shorts singing God Save the Queen, we would still know where he is coming from without all the rhetoric .
Hello Wull,
I was laughing AT the Guardian’s comments, not agreeing with them,
I mean really, they issue a warning and when asked for the evidence, say… ‘there are faint signs… hinting’ It doesn’t make you want to rush out to man the barricades and stock up on emergency food, does it?
Perhaps it was foretold and they read it in the teabags.
Best wishes to all. Beware the faint signs, hinting.
“If there is strong and consistent evidence that people have changed their minds and that independence has become the choice of a clear majority in this country, then we have no right to rule out a referendum and we won’t do that either.”
The First Minister’s statement clearly leaves a number of options open but what it seems to overlook is the power of persuasion. What effort is going to be put into increasing support for Independence other than letting ‘nature take its course’ on the basis of the SNP’s effective government, and the actions of Independence favouring grassroots organisations?
Given the fantastic increase in support during the Indy 1 campaign, and the utter contempt with which citizens of Scotland are viewed by Westminster as evident in Project Fear and current policies, by drawing upon the numerous lies, misleading statements, distorted statistics, etc ( comprehensively analysed and commented on by various bloggers and authors ) another campaign can surely only increase support further. Additionally, knowing where pressure is likely to be applied and which demographic groups are most in need of accurate information and good reasons for supporting Independence, a properly managed and funded campaign supplemented by tens of thousands of volunteers can only see support move in one direction, cutting into Unionist support.
I therefore cannot see why so much emphasis is being placed on increased support in the absence of serious attempts to generate that support. I trust it does not indicate a lack of willpower on the part of the SNP hierarchy to test their beliefs yet again.
Challenged, the campaign to ‘Keep Scotland Servile’ always degrades to a single line, that the people of Scotland are fooled, misled, hoodwinked or gullible to vote for the SNP.
Tomkins – a good name for a cat – feverish attempt to crown himself arch destroyer of the SNP fools no one. Galloway discovered that too.
mealer says:
“what role does Mr Tomkins play in this developing scenario?”
… my comment at 12:47
I think Tomkins is a fabulous Tory candidate, but not for the Toies’ benefit!
Talking of Tories. Today’s YouGov poll puts Lab and Con in a statistical tie. It really would help the Indy cause, in many ways, if the Tories were to overtake SLab and be the opposition, but still 30% behind an SNP SG.
What would the BBC do if their precious SLab were to fall to 3rd party? Hilarious situation!
If he only appeared in his Union Jack Boxer shorts singing God Save the Queen, we would still know where he is coming from without all the rhetoric .
Professor Tomkinski’s pretty stretched as honourable member of Ljubljana West( C ) and BetterTogther branch manager (Slovenia) too. These are full time jobs.
Surprised to see that BBC Scotland website are allowing comments on SNP link to bbc.com but not surprised that all favourable SNP comments are not there and only Bad SNP comments can be seen. Happy memories from last year referendum. Nothing has changed. Just wanted another reminder what a hoot the BBC is.
Any reference to being a “constitutional lawyer” as being somehow authoritative would, depending on the audience, be laughed at in the USA. Obviously the gun lobby are a bit reticent at referring to the right to bear arms as being the 2nd Amendment. Most of the population wouldn’t have a problems with the idea of “pleading the 5th”. The joys of a formal written constitution being that whilst not binding it does become obvious that that is the case.
Meanwhile in the UK we have a Westminster parliament at the moment voting on legislation supposed to force subsequent governments to act in a given manner. Not only wasting time on political gesturing and breaking the unwritten constitutional principle of not binding subsequent governments but unworkable given that the HoL can’t legally oppose budgets and I really can’t see the rozzers invading parliament to arrest the HoC if they dare pass one contravening said legislation.
The slight relevance to independence is that given half a chance this same party would just love to outlaw a second independence referendum.
I just posted “Tories were to overtake SLab and be the opposition”.
What I really meant was SLab fall below Tory levels of support! I certainly wouldn’t want the Tories to INCREASE support.
Heedy 1.10
You wrote “Sensible we can’t keep explaining to you Britnats how democracy works but for n the time, YOU put it in your election manifesto and if people want a referendum, they will vote for you.”
Er, I think you are missing the point Heedy (quelle surprise!) – a call for another Independence referendum isnt going into the Manifesto. I don’t know why.
We are told, when it comes to GEs, “its the economy stupid”. If that is the case, then with employment at record levels unemployment falling over time, wages rising, deficit coming down inflation at zero – then that would suggest the Tories might do well over the next few years and cause other parties, that want to change track, some discomfiture.
If the UK economy continues to improve and oil prices stay low, then, I would imagine, that things would become tougher for the pro indy cause for the time being.
BtW – Did you read/understand anything I wrote on the subject of Unionism?
Perhaps the Tories might better reflect on why they are unpopular rather than gripe about a party that is.
One party state, religious cult, police state, communist land grabbers, blood and soil Nazis…they aren’t short on the insults but it isn’t hard to kick the insults into touch either.
A total balloon.
Dippydave: a call for another Independence referendum isnt going into the Manifesto
Dippy, unable to get a life, is back to disrupt the core of the thread’s discussion. And as usual he can’t get his facts right.
@ Grouse Beater @1.46pm
“Tomkins – a good name for a cat – feverish attempt to crown himself arch destroyer of the SNP fools no one. Galloway discovered that too.”
A neutered one. A cat was has been and really is no more and good only for pissing in the wrong places, completely oblivious to his state of uselessness.
Dippydave: “How do you get strong evidence without holding a referendum?”
We have no chance he will think a question through before posting it and looking ignorant.
Next he will claim there’s no way you can tell if its raining unless you can count umbrellas.
If the guy used to be a socialist,now a tory,then don’t worry,soon he will be a Green or a LibDem then SNP. In an independent Scotland,you will be allowed to change your mind
.
It seems to be a new career route for some,this changing sides from being on the left to being a tory ,then on to the lords for life. Don’t know if they that jump onto the tory bandwagon realise that they will never really be part of the tory in crowd,always I think,they will be viewed by tories as tamed.
During my life time I have travelled nearly 28 billion miles, and on that journey I have learnt many things, the single most important thing being, that under no circumstances do you ever ever engage with or feed trolls.
BtW – Did you read/understand anything I wrote on the subject of Unionism?
Other than that you despise Scotland running it owns affairs sensible, you’re pretty repetitive.
Anyway all your wishful thinking on Scotland’s current/impending economic downturn/collapse, with subsequent Scots begging England for more handouts and naturally that you take back full control again of your Scotland region, does all create more questions than answers sensibldave, if you’re right, as you always are, because your British:D
The Vow is historic fraud sensible and Prof T explains why, it’s all designed to “make Swinney’s life harder”, and Scotland’s too, so SNP get kicked out of Holyrood, rule Britannia, with future Lady FM Kezia Dugdale where she so rightly belongs.
Full Scottish independence from likes of teamGB unionists like Prof T and sensibledave, anyone?
@caz-m
‘support for independence will lie dormant’
Aye and that patience thing is a pain.
It won’t lie dormant IMO. It certainly hasn’t for the past eight years and now that everyone’s attention is focused on both the SG and the constitutional question, its not far from most folks thoughts whenever politics is discussed.
The better the SG handle themselves on a day today basis, the more confidence they invoke and the more folk look to them for answers and leadership. The actions of Westminster government, their policies, media spin and general demeanour toward Scotland and its electorate will also factor in hugely here. They’ve done a bang up job in the past year to date.
The more we discuss the issue and keep lines of communication open, the more the subject becomes normalized in the mindset.
You are bang on though, as and when a date is set, the whole thing will go into overdrive and that is when real progress will be made. When that will be? Well that’s up to folk who voted no at first time of asking.
The former will affect the latter. Polling and canvassing will keep the SG appraised of the drift of public opinion and so far,over the year, the drift is not good for Westminster. It won’t take much to set the ball rolling on round two at this stage.
Patience is a pain, but the prize is worth it.
@grouse beater,
Belter of a comment .Still laughing.
Neil Dorward says@1.48pm
Surprised to see that BBC Scotland website are allowing comments on SNP.
I had a look at those comments ouch! i need a lie down whit a shower
One of them actually said that if we become independent he would be waiting at the Border for the English army to let him in.
Aye they are welcome to you pal FFS.
It’s sad that Tomkins used to write some interesting articles on his blog until he fell under the influence of Better Together when he started to mumble and splutter.
Then he joined the Tories and now he just dribbles.
The Labour Party stands for opportunity. That is the chance to make a lot of money at the taxpayers expense
link to caltonjock.com
Rancid Graun put the UKOK boot in. Its always pretty creepy watching the British media pretend it didn’t have any influence on how Scotland voted last year.
So from union jack draped mountains of
link to wingsoverscotland.com
to
link to theguardian.com
Maybe the whole UKOK creep show’s just very modest.
We are constantly told to respect the NO vote. It is a pity this courtesy is not reciprocal. When will the unionist parties recognize Scotland overwhelmingly rejected their austerity, nuclear weapons,and dirty dealing .
I always have and always will support Scotland’s independence. I am absolutely confident that the position Nicola has made public is the right one.
All of us who support independence have to do everything we can to promote it in Scotland. The SG has the very special role of showing competence and an absolute commitment to the process of democracy. Together we will create an enduring support for independence that cannot be undermined by the kind of frothing madness of Tomkins and other unionists.
We MUST be patient. We must win Holyrood and then the local elections. We must build a Scottish government of national unity and create a situation where independence is indisputably the free will of the Scottish people.
Meantime we have to support the Scottish Government in remorselessly seeking to improve life for all of Scotland’s people – regardless of the current constitutional arrangement.
Just how did that tit get to be a Professor?
I heard that Pro Tomkins believes in equality with animals and when it comes to rats he is spot on
What I loathe most about this parasite is that he is paid for by Scottish taxpayers’ money and owes his position to a university founded in 1450 in an independent Scotland.
It occurs to me that even Tomkin’s own blog rejected his own article because it was mince, so he had to go to the Speccy to get it printed.
The latest Brit Nat Gov Poll isn’t good reading for the Brit Nats. I wonder who the GCHQ/MI5 rats will turn their guns on next as the MT affair doesn’t seem to have made any difference at all.
Another ‘Proud Scot But’ on the make, espousing his BritNat credentials to become accepted into the BritNat Establishment. Let’s face it–they are handing out Ladyships and Lordships out like confetti these days to any moaning BritNat-Scot-But that will talk Scotland and its Government down.
Away and chase yersel, prof. You and your ilk are going the way of the Dodo.
In many ways I hope he does get in. He is a unionist zoomer and internet troll. He’s never had to face the people he maligns. He has never been asked awkward questions, which he then must answer. He’s never had to to try and stare down Nicola Sturgeon in person and let loose the sort of brain farts, he thinks passes for cogent analysis.
Let’s be honest about this. He has not joined a party that is literally dying on its feet, because he believes in effective opposition.
He has deliberately chosen the conservatives because he knows it will make people angry. He wants a chance to troll the SNP in a far public place than twitter, and do it on the public purse. In short he intends to use his very existence as a wedge issue. He will get more than he bargained for and Rona won’t be there to help him.
Senseless Dave, Nicola unlike all those unionist parties has a whole lot of members to appease, I am not there but believe me I know that a lot of members will be working behind the scenes to ensure that a new Referendum is on it’s way sooner than later. It all depends Dearest on how your beloved party in the South behaves. Right now it is not doing much for the Union, it is making a great deal of a chance that it will lose it. Never mind the austerity, given the disgusting attitude to Scotland and the Scots, we in the SNP will soon just have to sit back and watch as people change their minds. Little we can do about your folk who moved up here and seem to think they have the casting vote but slowly inch by inch things are being seen for what they are.
‘Keep Scotland Servile’
lol
love it
I’d say that pledging not to hold a second referendum until there’s a clear indication that it would win is more about respecting those who voted No than the decision. That’s the thing about democracy in the UK there’s nothing to stop people changing their minds. After all that’s why we have elections. If anything it’s those who constantly go on about it who don’t respect the people as much as the actual decision. It’s not like marriage where you have to go to the courts to obtain permission to withdraw.
What is it about Unionism that attracts the bat-shit crazies?
Helena Brown says:
15 October, 2015 at 3:24 pm
Senseless Dave
He’s only parroting what Scotland’s in for, from now until independence-
“If the UK economy continues to improve and oil prices stay low, then, I would imagine, that things would become tougher for the pro indy cause for the time being.”
Sensibledave means the English economy but Smith commission tax devo will damage Scots economically, BBC Scotland, STV etc will talk down, under mine as per and hopefully, with England booming and Scotland crashing, its all over for Scotland as an independent nation state.
And lets face it, the UK media in Scotland are going to make any economic growth under SNP and Swinney look as bad as possible.
Its another UKOK double whammy, although not a very healthy way to keep control of a third of your country. But that’s UKOK unionism.
It doesn’t help much knowing that Scottish taxes, balance of trade and energy resources are, well we all know the rest…
I assume that, if elected he’d have to give up his tenure (or whatever the hell they call it) at Glasgow?
If that IS the case then for the sake of his current & future students vote him in & we can all have a laugh
Helena Brown 3:24 pm
You wrote “It all depends Dearest on how your beloved party in the South behaves. Right now it is not doing much for the Union, it is making a great deal of a chance that it will lose it.”
Two things. 1. As I wrote above, if (as is said others – not me), “its the economy stupid”, then either by accident or design, many of the indices by which the economy is measured are heading in the right direction. That could make people nervous about major change.
2. With respect to “not doing much for Union” what is it that you think that the government should be doing “for the Union”? I guess you mean they should be doing more for Scotland to encourage people to want to stay in the Union? Why?
I like this one:
“Despite having fewer offences to investigate, however, Police Scotland manages to clear up 50,000 fewer crimes each year..”
Well, obviously if there are fewer crimes in the first place, then fewer crimes are going to be cleared up.
Unionists must hate the figures showing that recorded crime in Scotland is at record lows – partly due to the SNP maintaining 1000 extra police officers.
link to news.stv.tv
The sensible thing for the unionist parties to have done would have been to honour their vow – all the vital bits that Scotland provides would have been kept in place and Scotland would have been placated.
Not very sensible to ride roughshod over Scotland’s wishes.
Maybe the Spectator’s sales are at an all time low, so they’ve thought to themselves, I know lets bash the SNP and Jocks, that always sells well down here.
2. With respect to “not doing much for Union” what is it that you think that the government should be doing “for the Union”? I guess you mean they should be doing more for Scotland to encourage people to want to stay in the Union? Why?
Give us devo-max sensibledave. Full control of Scottish oil and gas industry etc.
Thats what the Vow historic fraud was meant to be, not a bear trap for Swinney designed to damage Scotland in to recession and worse. But you know all this anyway.
link to channel4.com
And you britnats can still say you own Scotland sensibledave.
Heedy 3.52
You wrote: “Sensibledave means the English economy but Smith commission tax devo will damage Scots economically,…..”
No Heedy, I meant exactly what I wrote thank you! The UK economy is the sum of its parts.
If people in Scotland start to feel that, economically, the UK is doing well with all the indicators heading in the right direction then, if the saying is indeed true, that may prove a major factor in determining voting intentions in future elections in all areas of the UK – of which Scotland is one.
If oil prices stay low, then that would, at best, be unhelpful to the Independence cause (for which I am ambivalent).
Just for once Heedy, how about you actually share your thoughts with respect to the specific point raised – rather than doing a “cut & paste” of your UKOK, Britnat, etc, etc diatribe? Or are you just not capable of a reasoned debate?
@Craig MachAonghais
The other puzzle for me is why in the Anglo-Saxon world (well, in UK and USA at least) it appears that nationalism goes hand in hand with right wing ideology (not talking about ‘Scottish separatism’ by the way which I guess wouldn’t identify itself as anglo-saxon anyway). It seems a contradiction. If you want small government, maximum individualism, then you want a strong nation, unified, anti immigrant, etc – are they not inconsistent?
Paula Rose 4:10 pm
You wrote “Not very sensible to ride roughshod over Scotland’s wishes.”
If, as you say, Scotland’s wishes have been “riden roughshod over” then there would be a clear majority of Scots that wanted Independence and Nicola Sturgeon would be calling for indyref 2?
Based on her speech today, I assume that Ms Sturgeon does not currently believe that a majority of Scots agree with you.
Independence is a bit like trying to teach someone to swim who’s got a water phobia
You know it’s safe, but they’re having none of it,
The First Minister’s idea of patience while we improve the country so folk will see things can be done better is the right thing but with that comes a problem
When things do improve and Scotland’s looking good, more people from south of the border will be swarming (ref to David Cameron) up to Scotland ready and willing to vote NO in even greater numbers to preserve little England which is the very thing we don’t want
Whatever people think of an Independent Scotland the English don’t want it to happen, which is kinda strange in a way considering how many of them move to live in Spain and other “Independent” countries and that seems to be OK because they’re “foreign places” but not Scotland because (that wouldn’t be right) I’ve tried asking what that means but no success so far
My own relatives in Wolverhampton want Scotland to look after itself (their words) but be in the UK and try as I might I can’t seem to convince them otherwise, they keep going back to the same question (what for? why are we so unhappy?) They really believe our government controls and runs everything and the English help us out with extra money as we’ve got no economy
So, I think as long as the Media punts this shit and controls Britain, Britain will control Scotland unless we somehow create a method of mass communication to distribute the truth because the Scottish media is “openly” against us now and even the pretence of impartiality has gone
The situation is “Them and us” now and I suppose we have to hope our youngsters are smarter than some of their parents
I certainly hope so at least before me and Alex Salmond’s lifetime is up
Dr Jim 4.22
You Wrote “When things do improve and Scotland’s looking good, more people from south of the border will be swarming (ref to David Cameron) up to Scotland ready and willing to vote NO in even greater numbers to preserve little England which is the very thing we don’t want”
… absolute tosh!
You wrote “Whatever people think of an Independent Scotland the English don’t want it to happen”
Even more tosh.
“My own relatives in Wolverhampton want Scotland to look after itself (their words) but be in the UK and try as I might I can’t seem to convince them otherwise …..
… please save us from this sort of partisan anecdotal evidence! Its the same sort of thing as when you listen to an MP telling us what they are hearing “on the doorsteps” – they hear what they want to hear from the people they want to hear it from! Invariably, they have ignored the doorsteps of the 70% of people that they know disagree with them.
You wrote “The situation is “Them and us” now and I suppose we have to hope our youngsters are smarter than some of their parents”
… logically, you appear to be arguing that the majority of parents in Scotland are not very clever?
It is an interesting way of arguing your case – i.e. insulting a huge section of the population.
Does it mean that you are officially a permanent politician when you enter the house of lords?
crisiscult says:
Far beyond that. The Spanish civic war was fought between the conservative rebels who styled themselves Nationalists and the elected left leaning government, the Republicans. And, in many more countries, the nationalists are typically the right wing.
Google seems well clued up! A quick search for nationalism shows the two forms …
– an extreme form of patriotism marked by a feeling of superiority over other countries.
“playing with right-wing nationalism”
– advocacy of political independence for a particular country.
“Scottish nationalism”
… thank you Google for featuring us in the correct sense/meaning!
The other, dark version of nationalism is what right wing regimes inevitably adopt. ‘Anglo Saxon’ nationalism certainly falls into this category. Imperialism, superiority, xenophobia and right wing politics & government at home – very much par for the course.
We just no long want to have anything to do with it.
I gather from some of the posts I’ve read that ‘sensibledave’ lives in England. What I would like to know is what are ‘sensibledave’s’ aims & objectives in posting here on ‘Wings Over Scotland’
Does ‘sensibledave’ what people here in Scotland to lie back & think of England.
Is it his opinion that England are ‘Better Together’
I would also like to know why people bother to respond to ‘sensibledave’ Are you just using ‘sensibledave’ as a kinda stooge.
Please note that I don’t read ‘sensibledave’s’ posts if I were interested in reading the ‘sensibledaves’ posts I would go to The Scotsman.
@Dr Jim
I’ve had a look at this spectator and theres some angry people but theres angry people here to and I’ve had a look at the referance on here. I’ve decided to do this. I’m going to not vote again next Holyrood unless things change and I’ll wait to see how the SNP improve everything here in Scotland with the new powers. With the given powers already you should be able to make our lives better. If by the vote for independance it has got better, then I vote Yes. If not No. Fair enough deal no. BTW how did you know my nickname is Lucy ?
Luigi;
Good point. The orange odour morons who abused Yessers the day after the referendum alienated many no-voters when they showed their true colours. Who’d want to be associated with those cro-magnons? I’m sure this had a positive effect on SNP membership, and would cause many to change their view in a second ballot.
On the good prof’s latest haver; how stupid does he think any Scot without a degree is? The days of gaining public sympathy by associating a political party with a dictatorship are gone. We don’t now rely on ebc for our real news.
I’ve said it several times now; Nicola Sturgeon is a very clever person, but even I could gain ground as leader of the SNP; just stand back and let them spout nonsense like this, and watch the polls soar!
@Lochside
SOME English academics in Scotland resent the fact that they are reduced to being employed in Scotland. When reminded of the pretty excellent worldwide rankings of our universities they mumble and haa.
Fortunately they are in a small minority, but the type is present enough for Tomkins to be an exemplar of it.
Also fortunately hard core Tories are quite rare in our universities which are quite liberal places by and large. Which probably makes Tomkins even more irate.
And remember the Law faculty in Glasgow also includes the excellent Lallands Peat Worrying Andrew Tickell. So don’t criticise it just because it also employs Tomkins.
DrJim@4.22pm
I think you are right, but we don’t need to persuade those unenlightened South of the border of anything. The only thjng they need to know is that Scotland is very very cold and the midges are bad all year round these days, as an old friend used to say to folks in London when he went down, to put them off swarming into our fabulous country. :))
The meedya really do want it to be a sort of stand off or even some kind of war, they will do anythjng to keep their cash cow. I love the English friends n family over the border, if they can please, just stop meddling in our affairs, sort your own out down there for gods sake!
You do own Scotland, ditch that notion England.
Of course any enlightened, pro Indy/Scotland people are welcome anytime. :)) Like me, been here 26 years n never looked back.
oops, should have said, you don’t own Scotland…subliminal messaging must have planted itself in my mind, arghhh!
From the Grauniad:
“The more they talk about it, the better it is for the Scottish Conservatives because there are a lot of voters on the centre-right of Scottish politics who voted SNP in the past but will never vote for them again as long as they keep alive the possibility of another referendum,” he said.
Who are these centre-right, anti-independence voters who voted SNP in the past?
I see the Anglo-Saxophone is currently running with a breaking story about Lockerbie in that two new Lybian suspects are being sought.
SNP conference in full swing. Co-incidence – not.
OT: bbc leads its radio 4 news [5pm] with the Megrahi case. Jings, there must be a conference going on somewhere. Aberdeen maybes?
Apologies if someone has already alerted to this news.
Apparently Moaning Minnie o Gesga has been *ahem* ennobled.
Her *cough* title is Barnoess Mone of Mayfair in the City of Westminster. I jest you not.
Surely she could have picked an easier name for us poor wee plebs to remember … something like Baroness Moaning Minnie of Loadsamoney for example!
Iain More says:
15 October, 2015 at 3:07 pm
The latest Brit Nat Gov Poll isn’t good reading for the Brit Nats. I wonder who the GCHQ/MI5 rats will turn their guns on next as the MT affair doesn’t seem to have made any difference at all.
Ruby replies:
I don’t know about that I reckon the MT affair will have increased the SNP vote.
Jezerna Rosa’s article in The Spectator will add another good few votes to the SNP’s huge tally.
Pictures of Baroness Mone of Mayfair in her ermine robes will be sure to help the SNP vote. It’s weird that she called herself after a Glasgow nightclub. I preferred the Locarno myself but then I suppose Baroness Mone of Locarno wouldn’t have that alliteration that the BritNats like so much.
What happens with the D’Hondt system if there is only one party with any votes and all the rest have zero votes?
Should I check with Spike for an answer?
@woosie says
Come on thats not very constructive FFS. Whats wrong with the Orange Order. Nothing is the answer. You want an SNP Scotland your going to have to compromise. Considering the hatred that the SNP have for anything connected to Ibrox its a wonder any vote for them. And I know thats exactly what you mean. Proddys like me.
Dr Jim 4.22
“So, I think as long as the Media punts this shit and controls Britain, Britain will control Scotland unless we somehow create a method of mass communication to distribute the truth because the Scottish media is “openly” against us now and even the pretence of impartiality has gone”
which kind of leads to the question as to why, for example, the National doesn’t advertise itself (never seen a single public ad for it anywhere) or why the inform-Scotland project (billboards etc) can’t or won’t get itself off the ground.
There’s always a lot of talk about finding ways to get the facts across but very little if any action – so far anyway.
@Ruby
Thats rubbish Ruby. Why would reading the spectator make anyone vote SNP. Reading wings wont make me vote for tories or labour etc. The MT thing will put folk of big stile from voting SNP. Same for the migrants. Naw, I think your wrong there doll.
O/T but related to previous thread.
Electoral Commission have ruled out the Biz for Scotland and SNP links.
No case to answer – that was quick!
And they forgot to tell poor Kevin Hague, who raised the original complaint – oops!
Maybe he should just go back to the Pet Shop…
Surely any student in their right mind who is going to University to study law,would think twice about Glasgow Universities School of Law who employ such a right wing Unionist as Tomkins.
He not only blemishes the name of such a great university,he also tarnishes the other forty odd faculty at the School of Law.
Hello Daisy Walker (at 1.22 p.m.). Thanks for your post at 1.42 pm. I had not seen it until now, because I had to go out immediately after I posted my own. I am just back.
I realised that you were laughing at the Guardian, and not agreeing with them. What I wrote was not meant to be against the Guardian, and against the daft ideas of Prof Tomkins, but not in any way against you. My apologies if I did not make that plain.
I am sure we are 100% on the same side. Have to go out again! All the best, Daisy. Yours, Wull
Ruby / Iain
Actually the thought “Baroness Mone of Mayfair in her ermine robes”, fleetingly brought back memories of a glossy magazine from the 70’s..
I need more medicine Nurse..
Davy says:
15 October, 2015 at 5:14 pm
@Ruby
Thats rubbish Ruby. Why would reading the spectator make anyone vote SNP. Reading wings wont make me vote for tories or labour etc.
Ruby replies:
Why do you read Wings Poppet? Why do you post on Wings?
What is it you are trying to achieve?
How come all you UniTrolls have left The Scotsman?
The Scotsman has been really good to you over the years it’s a shame to desert the sinking ship in her time of need.
Davy@5.06
Woosie never mentioned Ibrox, or “Proddies”, but it is a fact that on Sept. 19th a drunken mob of thugs, many wearing Rangers tops and carrying Union and Ulster flags, and giving Nazi salutes, attacked a totally peaceful rally in George Square. (Plenty of pictures if you want them).
Since you raised the subject, Ibrox is certainly a place where giant Union and Ulster flags are not uncommon, although I am sure that there are many Yes supporters there too. Still, would you want to come out as a Yes supporter among the hardcore thugs?
Incidentally I was a “Proddie” too until I got wise to religion.
No patience for you simplydavynit FUKC right off
@ Davy 5:14 pm. Jings, that must be an awfy big stile!
O/T
Headlines.
Elections watchdog finds no evidence of unlawful joint working between SNP and BFS.
Westminster standards watchdog: Michelle Thomson will not face probe into property dealings.
Poor Jackie Baillie will be mad her smears once again have fallen at the first hurdle will she never learn.
@ Stephen McKenzie. Ah, happy days. Couldn’t see the knees for the bush.
Stephen McKenzie:
Mayfair magazine is still available. Check the top shelf. They are currently running a series called ‘The Best of British’ Union Jacks on the front cover probably loads inside.
Hoss Mackintosh says:
15 October, 2015 at 11:35 am
“I hope Prof Tompkins does get in on the list. He is going to be a complete disaster for the Tories in Scotland.”
—
Yep, you would think they would realize that having an arrogant English academic telling Scots they could never prosper under independence might just backfire.
Especially one who seems to gloat at the idea of Holyrood having spending powers without sufficient economic powers.
The mainstream view in their party is to want Scotland to suffer in relation to England, thinking that the need for future subsidy will hold the union together. You would think there would be some Scottish Tories who wouldn’t put up with it, but apparently not.
manandboy at 11:18am
“The Professor of Law at Glasgow Uni, Adam Thomkins, is expecting his position and expertise in Law to transfer, in the minds of the Scottish electorate, to politics and economics.”
If that is so then Professor Tomkins knows very little indeed about Scots.
@Paula Rose “Not very sensible to ride roughshod over Scotland’s wishes.”
Bearing in mind that the Conservatives totally outmanoeuvered Labour during the Ref, so were strategically clever in that respect, I’m not convinced the Tories want to keep Scotland in the Union.
Just for once Heedy, how about you actually share your thoughts with respect to the specific point raised – rather than doing a “cut & paste” of your UKOK, Britnat, etc, etc diatribe? Or are you just not capable of a reasoned debate?
Well I did sensible, give Scotland devo-max, like madasfcuk, purdah breaking, The Vow shyste said vote NO for, in the very last sweaty palmed, freak out that was signed by Cammers, Milliband and some other Westminster bullshitter.
It cant get any more specific than that sensibledave. Keep it coming though, sensible you’re an old fraud of a UKOK britnat con arteest, but you’re good fun too.
@Lesley Anne
Baroness Mone of Mayfair is it?
Bwahahahahahahaha
Perfect! Just perfect!
Ms Mone has her reward and a very grand mouthful it is. An entire Monopoly board.
My enjoyment of using this site has diminished greatly as I, and too many others have given the lunatic “Sensible”?
Dave more time and effort than his ramblings deserve.
Could we agree that the man is entitled to his opinion, and let him post whatever he likes while he waits for a white jacket with sleeves that fasten around the back.
By all means point out the flaws in his misguided claims, but there is no need to mention the poor soul’s nom di plume.
I’m sure he would be just as happy biting the buttons off his pyjamas if we all left him alone.
What a complete and utter fannybaws. Does anyone else think BBC Labour in Scotland is unreasonably enthusiastic about the Scottish Government and the SNP?
link to culteducation.com
@ Adam Tomkins
Care to explain how a one-party state can operate when broadcast media is controled by another government in a neighbouring nation?
Senseless Dave, Now none of us here want to remain in this Union so really for us you can do your worst, but that other Dave,you know the one with the big shiny plastic face and a taste for pig made one huge fuss about us staying with him.
With regard to economics perhaps you need to go over to the place we first met because Thomas has a very interesting take on Osborneomics.
@Ruby 5.34
I came here looking for hope but only found angry twisted bigots. I even think some may be mentally ill. I think we have enough information on how to vote for the future. UKIP it is then.
@Hoss Mackintosh
The Electoral Commissioner were very quick. From the Herald:
“Under SIRA, if campaigners worked together under an ‘agreed plan’, spending related to this plan would count towards each campaigner’s spending limits. The Commission found no evidence that BFS and the SNP were operating under such a plan.”
and
(BFS spokesman): ““They told us that speaking with, sharing a platform with and getting updates from other Yes groups was, not only within the rules, they expected us to do so and went so far as to say they couldn’t understand how we could run our campaigns without communicating in that way.” “
So much for our Kevin and his alter ego(s).
Some peeps may recall last week there was an ultra high pig pen around parts of Manchester with snipers on the surrounding roofs. You may have been concerned that these *ahem* items have since disappeared. Well worry no longer peeps. They have all turned up in Aberdeen at the SNP conference.
Don’t panic folks none of these items are OUTSIDE the conference hall, they are all INSIDE. Yes that’s right INSIDE the hall.
The pig pen is currently surrounding the stall put up by the BBC and the snipers are currently precariously perched atop step ladders inside the pig pen.
This is the only way that the BBC can have a stall at the SNP conference and survive in one piece … apparently.
link to archive.is
Stephen McKenzie says:
15 October, 2015 at 5:24 pm
Ruby / Iain
Actually the thought “Baroness Mone of Mayfair in her ermine robes”, fleetingly brought back memories of a glossy magazine from the 70’s..
Ruby replies:
When I think about it she has chosen well. Calling herself after The Best of British Big Tits magazine is the perfect choice.
You and Dan Huil should take care especially of your eyesight. I’ve just had to fork out £600 for new glasses and I haven’t ever had a copy of Mayfair tucked under my mattress.
yesindyref2 says:
So much for our Kevin and his alter ego(s).
Ruby replies:
KevAverage is as mad as a box of frogs but he does do a nice range of kilts for dogs on his Pet Planet.
What’s he saying on his blog today?
WRH2 says
“What Tomkins and many Tories seem incapable of understanding is that the voters are not convinced by their policies and CHOOSE to vote for the SNP. If that makes Scotland a one party state, then it’s not the SNP’s fault. Maybe they are doing what people want their government to do”
But…but…but…they’re…doing it…deliberately cant you see?
CANT YOU SEE???
link to youtube.com
Pants for peerages?
Mirror is reporting Hameron has revealed he was sent a gift from Ms Mone a year ago.
Other talented businesspeople must be right pissed watching this charade.
Bookie from hell
“I promise you something…I will never change who I am…Lady or no Lady”
What?
like this you mean?
link to youtube.com
@Dave,
Ukip it is then….UKIP IT WAS…AND WOULD ALWAYS BE for you Dave.
It has its advantages. You will not need to hide your bigotry.
galamcennelath says
“What would the BBC do if their precious SLab were to fall to 3rd party? Hilarious situation!”
Your not…you couldn’t….you wouldn’t… vote Tory on your second vote would you?
naw you wouldn’t…would you?
The reason the EC reached their conclusion quickly is because BfS consulted with the EC during the indy ref about procedure.
Mrs ‘Lady’ Darling is not happy that the EC didnt tell the eejit who raised it first before press release and Mr ‘Lord’ George F thinks the EC are ‘in thrall’ to the SNP.
A good day today.
@Bob Mack
Well come on Bob. What alternative is there ? Torries oot, comunist corbyn oot, lib dums and greens oot. Only leaves the SNP or UKIP. The choice has just become obvious. If Scotland was independent and you lot flooded the country with islamic migrants like germany, we would have no heritage in 50 years. Tartan burkas are not sexy on girls. Besides, I like my Union flag waving sessions. Looking forward to next years Union day in George Sq.
Macart 2.14pm
Excellent reply regarding IndyRef2.
@ Truby 6:91 pm. I’ll wrist it. Eh?! Who said that?
When the media talk about something people actually know about it’s all over. You don’t have to be an expert on oil or finance to know that Nick Robinson made an absolute prat of himself regarding Alex Salmond.
Once people are sensitised to the ongoing dishonesty of the media, whether it concerns the Scottish referendum, Corbyn’s leadership, or Syria, it’s difficult to regain any trust for the media and the establishment.
According to the BBC, violence in Palestine is caused by social media ‘trolls’ … link to palestinecampaign.org
MSM nearly lost their battle over the referendum and did over both GE in Scotland and Corbyn’s leadership, and are panicking. My guess is that, like Scottish Labour, they will keep digging and thus continue to decline.
I have always believed that even No supporters would have taken offense at members of their family, whom they know to be ordinary decent people, being denigrated as they were. Likewise it must rebound on the BBC when it vilifies ordinary people who happen to believe in international justice.
The elections watchdog will not be launching a full investigation into “malicious” claims the SNP illegally colluded with a pro-independence business group before last year’s referendum.
Any reaction from KevAverage re Herald describing his claims about the SNP as being MALICIOUS?
I have a nasty feeling I cut and pasted the wrong link to my comment (which isn’t showing yet). Should be:
link to palestinecampaign.org
“If oil prices stay low, then that would, at best, be unhelpful to the Independence cause (for which I am ambivalent). ”
If you so “ambivalent” why the FUCK do you show so much interest in it then?
why don’t you just toddle off now there’s a good chap
toodle pip.
Born Optimist says
“What effort is going to be put into increasing support for Independence other than letting ‘nature take its course’ on the basis of the SNP’s effective government, and the actions of Independence favouring grassroots organisations?
a properly managed and funded campaign supplemented by tens of thousands of volunteers can only see support move in one direction, cutting into Unionist support.
I therefore cannot see why so much emphasis is being placed on increased support in the absence of serious attempts to generate that support. I trust it does not indicate a lack of willpower on the part of the SNP hierarchy to test their beliefs yet again.!
some sympathy for this point of view, however, the responsibility for grass roots campaigns lies with, well us, the grass roots
I have been calling on this forum for the launch of yes2 and the appointment of a new leader of yes2 to help coordinate and energise the grass roots campaign,
how do we do this? is it for the SNP to select a yes2 leader?
Methinks a certain dumb and vacuous youth
needs his bottle skelped.
“Mirror is reporting Hameron has revealed he was sent a gift from Ms Mone a year ago.””
Good grief, Miss Piggy in an Ultimo. Roll the commercial.
Oh dear, the Electoral commission has dismissed the complaint about BfS and the SNP working together. But from the Herald about this just a few short days ago (Sunday):
“Labour described the allegations as “hugely serious” with Jackie Baillie, the party’s public services spokeswoman, saying: “If it is proven that these groups were established and effectively controlled by the SNP in a bid to get around spending limits it would potentially be a breach of electoral commission rules.”
I believe the correct expression is “egg on face” (some good images if you google “egg on face”).
I wonder how Baillie likes her eggs, fried or boiled? Perhaps “scrambled” is more her thing.
Barbara McKenzie
Thanks for the link.
link to palestinecampaign.org
I wonder how the BBC’s rather partial treatment of events would stand up under the Nuremberg rulings on war crimes?
Why an Israeli state but no Scottish state?
leslie ann @ 6.08 that link has a poll on whether the BBC was biased during the referendum
can you try it and see if it works or anyone else i cant get it to work
Well the SNP rule has been a disaster………………….for the likes of him and the Tories of various hues.
I imagine anyone with a law degree from Glasgow University is a little bit embarrassed by his antics.
Davy says:
“Besides, I like my Union flag waving sessions. Looking forward to next years Union day in George Sq.”
Ah, the mask slips..
What makes a man change his mind so drastically? I don’t believe it’s anything to do with common sense having read the drivel he produces.
Does Tomkins just like being the underdog? It’s easier to criticise when you’re the opposition. Will he change his views the next time he changes his underwear, or is he just some stroppy contrarian teenager trying to rebel against the establishment.
All the stories from the Tory press during the snp conference weekend.
Are you surprised.
I read 5000 word articles. Perhaps we’d be better off if more of us did.
Those eyebrows are off the Richter scale of panic!
If it’s true that Tomkins is top of the Tory list in Glasgow, then we need to get the ball rolling to get an extra Green and Sheridan elected.
There’s a good chance that finishing 5th on that list won’t be enough to win a seat: if Labour, SNP and Greens hoover up 6 list seats, there will only be one left, and whoever finishes top of the also-rans will get it.
Perhaps Tory voters could be reminded that not too long ago, Tomkins was happy enough to address rallies calling for an independent socialist Scottish republic – alongside Sheridan…
Another thing to hope for is that UKIP run on the list, to drag some of the Orange tendency away from the temptation of voting Tory.
What is more pathetic than his lies and deceit, is his self asserted opinion of himself.
He, like so many now, are pathetic feeble creatures who think they are taken seriously. However, they are grotesque decaying observers, so out of touch with the new vibrant electorate.
How can anyone have the audacity to make such ridiculous claims and expect them to make news other than in Spectator or similar unionist rags What a waste to the environment by helping to ruin the forestry industry.