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The Upside Down

Posted on January 25, 2023 by

Sorry readers, been a bit busy with research today. But here’s a news:

Now the Catholic Church loves all The Gays and Stonewall hates them. It’s 2023, and welcome to whatever the Hell this is, everyone.

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0 to “The Upside Down”

  1. Athanasius says:

    One word — Jesuits. Catholics will understand

  2. Karen says:

    Sorry, my brain just exploded!

  3. Dorothy Devine says:

    I feel utterly unwelcome in 2023 I would prefer to go back a decade to 2013 and work harder for independence in the hope the result would change.

  4. Garrion says:

    Stonewall. The new sexual/gender ISIS. Hilarious.

  5. Lorna Campbell says:

    It really is quite surreal in the true sense of the word. The Catholic Church has been moving towards acceptance of gay people for some time now (accepts women okay these days, too), and the Anglicans and Presbyterians positively embrace ‘trans’, with the Anglicans (some of who were infamous for saying that women in surplices should burn) having recently appointed a ‘trans’ identified male as a vicar. It took just ten years to invite in ‘trans’ and two thousand years to accept the women are actually fully human rather than the devilish Eve reborn every generation. The ‘trans’ hate everyone who is not ‘trans’. Just listened to a young ‘trans’ man (woman) who, in partnership with his/her ‘trans’ woman (man) boy/girlfriend, have created a new life. Each has the genitals that accords with their sex, but they are at a loss to understand how they can be having a baby. God help that poor child.

  6. robertkknight says:

    Think that’s nuts? How about this…

    Imagine if every male prisoner informed the SPS that they’ll be transitioning, adopting a female name, and demanding in three months time that they be transferred to a woman’s prison.

    Imagine the shit storm that’d descend on Sturgeon?

    Get the popcorn at the ready.

  7. Wulls says:

    The Catholic Church is comparable with the house of Windsor.
    Both could end foodbanks with a few % of their nett worth.
    The fact they don’t tells you all you need to know about their basic humanity.

  8. SusanAHF says:

    He says it’s not a crime but IS a sin

  9. Confused says:

    The current Pope is a jesuit and not to be trusted. The Pope who just died supposedly in a memoir blamed a “gay mafia” for a lot of the trouble in the church.

    Being too sympathetic to the gays (always short of priests, don’t ask, don’t tell) caused a lot of problems for the church including the paedophile problem – if you were a predatory paedophile, salivating at the thought of 12 year old boys with angelic voices, and you could join the church flying a flag of convenience as an “ordinary decent gay” – why would you not?

    – when these scandals blew up the “forgiveness” thing works against the situation; they pretend to be sorry and get moved to another parish, or somewhere they can do no harm, the real life “Craggy Islands”.

    This “gay mafia” at the vatican is precisely an example of a “pathocracy” that Lobaczweski wrote about.

  10. Bob Mack says:

    Anagram of Stonewall is stolen law. Quite appropriate.

    They have helped steal reason and sanity from those who lead us and make our laws

  11. Morgatron says:

    There is no hell, like an old hell.

  12. Big Jock says:

    We are moving to a position in society where being abnormal is normal. Where being normal is abnormal.

    When the minority take control of the majority, then society collapses. Because its unsustainable.

    Yes we are truly screwed folks. Listen to John Beattie a supposed journalist. Chastising an MSP for having a view shared by the majority and by science. You can change your name from Jock to Joan, but you aren’t a woman, not even with every bit chopped off.

  13. Big Jock says:

    Meanwhile on Wings Watch. Kelly thinks we are all insane. Does he ever stop for one moment and consider that we might be right! You cannot put your fingers in your ears and pretend this madness isn’t happening, but Kelly is doing exactly that.

  14. Mark Boyle says:

    Confused says:
    25 January, 2023 at 10:29 pm

    The current Pope is a jesuit and not to be trusted.

    Ah yes, Jesuits. Up there with Jews, Rosicrucians, the Illuminati, Gerald Kersh’s Secret Masters and the Teletubbies in being responsible for all the ills of the world in some big “cunning plan” according to some …

    Going on the train to work in the mornings, you often hear the kids going up to St Aloysius moaning to one another, “… you think it’s bad getting a double period of Maths first thing? We’ve got Double Monita Secreta AND Advanced Infiltration And Subversion before lunch!”

  15. SusanAHF says:

    All major world religions are misogynistic so I have no interest in them or their opinions of me.

  16. PhilM says:

    I used to look at SGP for his analysis of opinion polls but he seems to have turned into someone whose handbag is permanently two inches below his chin. Quoting some random BTL comment as if it’s somehow representative is pretty poor journalistic ethics. Anyone with a computer keyboard can and often do comment BTL…does that mean we need to self-censor even more in oor Bonnie Scotland because any little bon mot, any parody, any satire might go through the SGP ‘taking things literally’ machine and end up in a WingsWatch exposé.
    Puir auld Scotland…what’s happened tae us?

  17. Athanasius says:

    Just a thought — maybe we’ve all been doing it wrong for the last fifty years; maybe the Church was right all the time; maybe gay sex is wrong and maybe women should have stayed in the home. Anybody ever consider that thought experiment? I’ll get my coat…

  18. PhilM says:

    Pope states teaching of Catholic Church on homosexuality…people are stunned…
    WoS article makes satirical contemporary comparison contrasting 2000-year old institution with late-80s trend-setting gay charity to the latter’s detriment…readers BTL so far generally miss the point…
    What about that Opus Dei lot though…great bunch o’ lads but Dan Brown said and I quote…

  19. Big Jock says:

    Phil. I lay the blame at one woman’s door. Sturgeon was the Trojan Horse for every one of these loonies. It was done by deception and stealth. Yet some don’t even know they have been taken over when it’s right in front of their eyes.

    I just pray Salmond lets rip with everything he has on Sturgeon. I can’t see he would have anything to lose.

  20. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “I used to look at SGP for his analysis of opinion polls but he seems to have turned into someone whose handbag is permanently two inches below his chin.”

    There hasn’t been anything worth analysing about the polls in years. Other than an understandable COVID blip when Sturgeon was on telly every single day, the polls have meandered along at 48% plus or minus 3 (ie the margin of error) since January 2015. That’s why we’re not spending much money on them atm – it’s just pointless.

    Maybe James has just gone out of his mind from there having been absolutely nothing of interest to say to his dwindling band of readers for so long, and this purple-faced ranting street preacher routine is his last attempt at holding their attention, because at least people tend to have an opinion about me. I dunno.

  21. Roger says:

    The difference between man ?? and woman ??, between male and female is real. Everyone knows it, every mammal knows it. Without it, evolution would be an impossibility.

    To say a man becomes a woman if he merely,’feels’ like a woman is one thing, but the GRR doesn’t even require that the individual in question has gender dysphoria and ‘feels’like a woman. If a man decides it would be fun or a laugh or a turn-on to play at being a woman, that’s enough. This is NOT about gender dysphoria anymore. This is about something else.

    So saying a man literally becomes a woman if he says so is one thing, but getting an entire society to accept this and to have laws passed to criminalize anybody who refuses to go along with this unreality (and that’s the case from 2024) and who refuses to refer to a man who is a rapist by his ‘preffered’ pronouns of she/her… well, that really is fkn something else. Who, ten years ago, would have believed it would be possible?

    Why do people go along with this obvious unreality? I fear society is much weaker than I would have ever suspected. But I now understand how totalitarianism comes about. A few buy the official ideology’s bullshit, more simply don’t notice what’s going on, and many more see what’s going on but side with the powers that be out of economic self-interest -dont want to risk damaging their careers, losing their jobs, not getting promotion or funding, etc. So they ‘go along to get along’.

    You could make them swallow just about anything – or at least pretend to go along with it, to smile and nod in the face of unreality, and that’s effectively the same thing.

    The same arguments used in the trans debate can so easily be recycled and used to legitimize paedophilia. Ah! But that’s totally different, I hear you say, that’s where the whole issue of consent comes in. Don’t be so fkn naive – if they can erase the distinction between male and female, how safe do you think the distinction between adult and child is? And shouldn’t we respect the autonomy of young people over their own sexuality? Shouldn’t their right to consent be recognized? Don’t you know that the whole concept of an age of consent is a western, colonialist, patriarchal concept? Don’t you know that ‘inter-genetational’ sex is common in many traditional non-western societies? (So is cannibalism, but they won’t bring that up).

    I could go on, but why bother – you can see how that game could – and I fear WILL – be played.

    Things are bad now but they are going to get worse… and I have no idea what to do about it.

    Maybe I should just ‘be kind ‘ and celebrate the ‘liberation’ from all those old ‘prejudices’ that believed in the existence of the reality of men and women, of adults and children – it certainly would make my life easier…

  22. David W Ferguson says:

    The longer this goes on the more I see bizarre parallels with the Cultural Revolution in China. If I ever rouse myself from my torpor I’ll write a more detailed account of this – maybe WoS would publish it.

    For starters, when I ask Westerners who were the core of the infamous “Red Guard” they almost never get the answer right. Wokers? Nope. Peasants? Nope. The PLA? Nope. CPC members? Nope.

    It was boily-faced wet-behind-the-ears know-it-all student zealots, inspired by extremism and intolerance. They were orchestrated by a cynical cabal of opportunists, led by a nasty little woman who was obsessed with replacing her much-respected predecessor and seizing absolute power…

  23. David W Ferguson says:

    Wokers? Nope. Peasants? Nope. The PLA? Nope. CPC members? Nope…

    A profoundly infuriating typo, given that the core of the Red Guard were precisely the “wokers” of their day…

  24. Roger says:

    ‘how do I look?’
    Well, as you asked…
    You still look the same – like a self obsessed wanker.

    Yes, I could have been kind, but I went with being honest instead cos Jesus said not to tell lies.

  25. Bill Greaves says:

    I have been laying low and keeping my head down but this week I have read more than 1 post about normal people striking back and refusing to accept 330 genders and all the other woke stuff. I have been called sexist, misogynist, homophobe and arsehole so I think I can call myself a normal person. Thanks for accepting me.

  26. Chas says:

    ALL religions can be summed up in three words-Fear, Money and Power.
    Fear for the masses. Money and Power for those at the top.

  27. PacMan says:

    A different angle on this Trans issue.

    In the corporate world, changing gender is being used to get around the female pay gap:

    Stonewall has been accused of “eroding” gender pay gap monitoring among civil servants after fresh diversity training surfaced.

    The LGBT charity marks hundreds of public sector employers on their diversity credentials each year, in return for a league table ranking in the Workplace Equality Index (WEI), the UK’s largest such benchmarking scheme.

    Six government departments, NHS England, six regional NHS bodies and four police forces were among the 400 employers to take part last year, proudly celebrating their ranking in Stonewall’s “top 100 employers” list.

    However, The Telegraph has learned that Stonewall is urging employers to monitor inequalities by self-identified gender rather than sex within their organisations.

    On Saturday, women’s rights campaigners condemned it as “shocking” and “disturbing”.

    The gender pay gap is an official equality measure that shows the difference in average earnings between women and men. Employers with more than 250 staff are legally required to publish their gender pay gap annually.

    I wonder if Stonewall is as aligned to corporate interests than it is to equality due to their reliance of finance from there?

  28. Stuart MacKay says:

    Big Jock

    Kelly, as the Rev says, is probably finding that audience for blog posts on polls that never change is fading fast so he needs a new purpose in life. What better to be the Official Ombudsman to adjudicate everything that is published here. As a result, it’s just possible he’d pick up some of that £9 million provided by the Scottish Government to support media outlets. Worst case, he just gets all the haters as new followers. However that just might be a case of be careful what you ask for.

    As for that announcement from the Pope. If it’s not a crime, then there’s no need to involve the police when sins are uncovered.

  29. JGedd says:

    Confused @ 10.29pm

    You do realise that ‘gay’ is not synonymous with ‘paedophile’ don’t you? Not all paedophiles are gay but paedophiles are mostly heterosexual or often, any warm (young) body will do irrespective of sex? Paedophiles are dangerous to all children, not just males.

  30. akenaton says:

    The problems concerning homosexuality in the Catholic Church have been exposed by the inquiries in the US over “Paedophile Priests”.
    The newspaper headlines at the time were wrong as statistics prove that the crime of Paedophilia is extremely rare and almost exclusively, the crimes being committed by these priests were “sexual abuse of minors” (Pubescent children and youths between the ages of 13 and 18).
    I know a man who decided to join the priesthood and went to a Seminary where he estimated that 40 to 50% of the trainees were homosexual, whether this was innate or learned behaviour he was unable to determine, as he left the Seminary and the Church within one year.
    He reckons that the problem could be fixed almost immediately by only ordaining married heterosexuals preferably with family, but the obstacle is the Catholic Church’s worship of Mammon. It is much cheaper to keep single men as priests, than the greater expense of two adults with children, therefore the scandal continues.

    The legislation for and the promotion of homosexuality as a positive lifestyle is becoming ever more fashionable regardless of the strains which we see being exerted on heterosexual society…..not least by the Scottish Administration.
    We need to put all of the sexual and gender madness back into the cellar where it belongs and concentrate on the promotion of family values, respect for women and their primary role in evolution and most importantly protection of our children who are under the most severe attack from all public bodies including care services, education services, right up to edicts from the disgraced Scottish Devolved Administration.

  31. Ottomanboi says:

    This is no place for moral theology, however, in sum, the Pope has repeated the orthodox Catholic view of homosexual practice as «intrinsically disordered» and consequently a sin. The psychological orientation per se is not, as in the orthodox Catholic view, sin is a manifestation of human frailty requiring understanding and «charity». Shun the sin, not the sinner.
    There is no «ad hominem» approach to the matter, none of us is perfect, but that does not mean «giving in» and parading the frailty as something to be proud of.
    This is a «humanist», in the classic sense, approach which will satisfy neither side, those seeking a definitive judgment. For the Christian believer there can be only one Judge whose Incarnation was recently remembered, by some.
    There is two thousand years of literature on this subject, secular as well as religious, so good luck with that.

  32. Red says:

    Pacman I wonder if Stonewall is as aligned to corporate interests than it is to equality due to their reliance of finance from there?

    If you cast your mind back to the dark ages of 2011/12, American capital was briefly terrified of Occupy Wall Street gaining political traction in the wake of the financial crisis.

    Suddenly, Woke Capital appeared out of nowhere. And hordes of weirdos who were hitherto restricted to the wackier fringes of academia and Tumblr descended on OWS. The protests quickly descended into accusing each other of racism and transphobia, rendering it harmless to the bankers.

    The modern progressive agenda is indistinguishable from BlackRock and Google’s and Davos’ agendas, because modern progressivism (aka “woke”) is a wholly owned subsidiary of Big Money.

  33. SusanAHF says:

    Kinder, kuche, kirche? Eh Akenaton.

  34. akenaton says:

    Sorry Susan, I don’t have the Gaelic.

  35. SusanAHF says:

    It’s German Akenaton, and it means ” children, kitchen, church”, is that what you believe a woman’s life should consist of?

  36. William Habib Steele says:

    The Pope has not said that homosexual sex acts are not sinful. He said homosexuality should not be a crime. I don’t know if he thinks homosexual acts should be a crime. I think that he probably thinks they should not be a crime. I’m not a Roman Catholic, but I well understand that this Pope is trying to be faithful to RC doctrine and also compassionate towards people who have same sex attraction.

    I have the same tension concerning trans people. I don’t believe that Gender is real, but that it’s a social construct. I believe that what is called Gender Dysphoria is a condition of the mind and emotions, and it should be called Sex Dysphoria. I believe that the Gender Recognition Act was a mistake and should be repealed. It’s at the root of all this Gender nonsense. At the same time, I’ve been acquainted with trans people who have spoken about how much they have suffered because of their unease with their sex and I feel empathy towards them. Even so, truth and reality must have priority. To tell a man who wants to be a woman that he is really a woman is a denial of truth and reality.

    The trans ideology is based on the post-modern notion that there is no publicly accessible truth and reality. Each person has his or her own truth and reality. It’s also based on Neo-Marxism, which advocates bullying and violence to get what its advocates want, no matter the cost to others. A critical-realist (Not Critical Theory) philosophy and a belief that there is publicly accessible truth which is corrigible is what we must advocate.

  37. Mac says:

    If a politician is a big proponent of all the woke / progressive / identity politics agenda I consider it a sure-fire sign they are (either low intelligence or much more likely) a betrayer, of the people who voted for them.

    It is a ‘badge’ of someone who is an imposter, corrupt and is working for the US ‘deep state’, the WEF, or whoever the hell it is that has been pushing and funding it all, across nearly all western countries, for a long time now.

    Our politicians (mostly) are now hugely complicit in it, captured by it. The end game seems to be nearing.

    It is a carefully crafted and well thought out way to divert people from the causes they should be fighting for and to instead make them fight amongst themselves.

    The template they are using is the very similar to one the communists used to seize power, only they replaced the class war with the ‘social justice’ war and the angry working class warriors with their social justice warriors.

    Of course none of these SJWs are actually fighting for social justice and neither are they remotely progressive. The polar opposite is true, they are extremely regressive and prejudiced, shockingly so in fact, and yet completely unaware of their monstrous hypocrisy.

    Many of these people are just the useful idiots, indoctrinated all through school (starting at a very young age) and higher education, but the ones behind it all and pulling the strings knew exactly what they are doing.

    Our ‘elites’ in the west are essentially waging a war on ‘us’ (as much as they are on the big country in the east with the furry hats). They clearly do not see themselves as ‘of us’, or even like us as fellow human beings, in fact they evidently despise us and fear us.

    The woke agenda is so poisonous and insidious, it is the equivalent of a societal biological weapon that was released upon us. A very carefully crafted, psychological based weapon to keep people down, fighting left-right but never fighting up-down, and to get their Nicola and Justin stooges into positions of power to do their bidding for them and fuck people over.

    The woke onslaught gradually appeared in all ‘far’ western countries pretty much everywhere at the same time and has been gearing up for decades. It is now very well advanced. All of that has to have come from ‘within’.

    They want us all living in the economic gutter, fighting and clawing each other eyes out over their indoctrinated woke madness forever… and completely unfocused on going after them in any way.

    All these woke leaders go along with every imperialist war going, every time, without fail. Salmond didn’t and Corbyn wouldn’t so they got taken out.

    What is happening in the west is not natural, not organic, it is ‘enemy-action’.

    We know who the target is, us (and especially in Europe). The question is, who is our real enemy here.

  38. stuart mctavish says:


    Spot on

    However enough red flags in the not unrelated Adam Graham story to suspect an unsafe conviction regardless so assuming it happened as reported, and Isla is not Mossad or its nuscot equivalent, he could do worse than crowdfund his appeal and exploit his current opportunity to write a Jeffrey Arrcher style novel outing all the GRR supporting MSPs & MPs that refused to contribute.

    Bigger issue for those not related to Graham/ Bryson though might be the deflection onto SPS for where he serves his sentence/ remand since even the dogs in the street must know that prison service personnel can expect 8 month incarceration for contempt of court in event they disagree with any judge* making their prisoner a woman (anonymous or not)

    *Or whoever made the judge behave that way

  39. McDuff says:

    We are in the Twilight Zone.

  40. Athanasius says:


    The ordination of married men with children is an old chestnut and really not of much relevance. The biggest single group of abusers ARE married men with children, often abusing their own children the worst. The idea that the Church doesn’t ordain married men because of inheritance issues is a nonsense. Do the children of your work colleagues have any claim on your employer’s largesse? No, I’m sorry, but increasingly the real problem cannot be ignored, and it isn’t celibacy. If it were, no child would be safe from ANY man not getting regular sex, and in our ever-more-incel world, that’s an awful lot of men, most of whom have no connection to the Church. You’ve already named the problem in your own post.

  41. Ruby says:

    Well done to all of those who protested outside Bute House.

    These protest would be great if there was a snowballs chance of getting through to Sturgeon.

    It’s going to take an exorcist!

    Even then she’d be projectile vomiting pea soup while screaming in a very strange voice

    ‘transwomen are women’ ‘women have cocks’
    ‘terfs can suck their cocks in hell’

  42. Dorothy Devine says:

    McDuff , it’s not the Twilight Zone , it’s the Dark Ages.

  43. akenaton says:

    “Finally, in general terms and perhaps most importantly, I heard the chief executive of Rape Crisis Scotland say this yesterday – ‘I don’t see how it’s possible to have a rapist within a female prison’. And so let me be very clear, I agree with that statement. Bearing in mind what I’ve just said about the importance of individualised risk assessment, as a general principle and presumption I think that statement is correct.”

    Sturgeon is buckling get her a spade and make her keep digging.

  44. Republicofscotland says:

    Christ I loathe Alister Jack, but this is the right thing to that she did.

    “AN SNP MP wrote a letter to Scottish Secretary Alister Jack asking him to “prevent” Scotland’s gender reform legislation from becoming law on the same day he blocked the bill, it has emerged.

    Dr Lisa Cameron (East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow) personally wrote to the Tory minister urging the UK Government to “intervene” on the bill”

    Meanwhile (I missed FMQs) but I’m under the impression that the Judas Sturgeon will stop the double rapist now posing as a woman from entering Cortonvale women’s prison.

    Probably because of the outcry about it.

  45. akenaton says:

    Athanasious, I don’t necessarily agree with everything my friend says, but he has experience of living in a Seminary and I don’t think his view on the financial factor had anything to do with “inheritance”, simply bread butter and housing costs. I am an Atheist with no particular axe to grind other than the protection of children from predators.
    Additionally, when comparing different sections of the community it is prudent to keep population percentages in mind. I.E. 2% and 95% giving you the benefit of any doubt.

  46. James Che says:

    The trans issue is about assaulting vunerable people in society and making and changing laws so pervert don’t get charged,
    And if they do, then they can be in women’s spaces to continue their holiday abuse.

    Gives a new meaning to bad governance and appalling behaviour of politicians coming out the closet. To admit they like abuse, and are abusers

    As I have been saying for awhile to deaf ears here on wings, this is not a snp policy, it is a global agender policy.
    It is going on in all countries, and in all establishments.
    The gender laws are being trialed in small Scotland first, similar to to the poll tax.
    A social experiment.

    Our devolved government in Scotland is being run by bigger people and players from out with Scotland.

    Now I find it interesting that one monarch’s royal assent within a devolved Scottish government can decide on violent and sexual abuse towards you’re family, friends and neighbours in your community in Scotland,

    But there are those still sleep walking, still dumbed down, unable to see the connection or difference between having our own parliament and having one run by outside actors.

  47. Ruby says:

    William Habib Steele says:

    I believe that the Gender Recognition Act was a mistake and should be repealed. It’s at the root of all this Gender nonsense.

    Very well said. I totally agree.

    The Act involves an obvious dishonesty. For while its title refers to gender, those in receipt of a GRC are allowed to change their recorded sex on their birth certificate – and changing sex is a biological impossibility

    Autogynephilia, the feeling of sexual arousal some men feel as they pretend to be women, is according to some researchers behind many or even most cases of gender dysphoria among those born as men. It is legitimate to ask whether non-consenting women ought to be participants in such sexual fantasies.

    Autogynephilia is defined as a male’s propensity to be sexually aroused by the thought of himself as a female. It is the paraphilia that is theorized to underlie transvestism and some forms of male-to-female (MtF) transsexualism.

    Autogynephilia is what is commonly know as cross dressing.

    If it’s true that gender dysphoria is just Autogynephilia aka ‘cross dressing’ isn’t it completely mad that the UK Gov has a law in place that allows cross dressers to change sex?

    I’m also getting the impression that these ‘cross dressers’ are also masochists.

    Who is attracted to cross dressing masochists who are Beth’s clients for example?
    What % of transwomen are prostitutes like Beth?

    I get the impression it’s quite a high number.

    If cross dressers get sexually aroused by wearing women’s clothes what is the outlet for that sexual arousal?

    Why do they want to be women?

  48. Geoff Anderson says:

    Sturgeon looked really rattled at the start of FMQs. She had obviously been told to backdown and it hurt. How can she make a statement without the SPS review being completed….because she has alway pulled those strings.

    Keep up the pressure because the public ( the voters) are starting to realise just how bad it is under Sturgeon’s TransCult Rule.

  49. Ruby says:

    Nicola Sturgeon says trans rapist will be moved from female prison

    That’s transphobic Nicola! ‘Transwomen are women’

  50. akenaton says:

    Susan, its not really up to me it’s up to women. Do you think they will be happy in Sturgeon’s brave new Scotland, where motherhood is despised and women deprived of the most beautiful and rewarding act in bearing and delivering a child?
    Reminders of the beehive with unthinking programmed female workers, fat bloated male drones used only for reproduction when or if required.(It’s already happening in our public services)
    Our children were the pain of our lives and the joy of our lives and when one gets older they come to the understanding that having a family is the real purpose of life, the joy, the pain and in the end the fulfilment.

  51. SusanAHF says:

    Having a family isn’t the be all or end all of a woman’ life. I’ve never wanted children, so I’ve never had them. Isn’t that a sound position to take, or am i just unnatural and unfulfilled? Maybe you’d be happier living in Afghanistan akenaton, women know their place there.

  52. akenaton says:

    Again it’s up to you Susan, would Sturgeons Oceania really be preferable to Afghanistan?
    I wonder.

  53. Livionian says:

    Whilst there are always exceptions to the rule, religious institutions aren’t where intolerance is preached. This is a textbook example.

  54. SusanAHF says:

    I would prefer neither akenaton, living in a dystopia whether gender ideology or religious ideology driven is not acceptable.

  55. akenaton says:

    OK Susan. Thanks for the exchange.
    Livionian, “Intolerance” is such an accommodating word these days. It means many different things to different people. Some say free speech should not be tolerated.

  56. SusanAHF says:

    Thank you akenaton for such a polite discussion.

  57. Dave Hansell says:

    Stonewall, which once upon a distant time was created to protect the Lesbian and Gay community from bigoted inspired physical attacks, has done a full 180 degree turn in its position of declaring exclusive same sex attraction to be the ultimate crime under woke law.

    Lesbian biological women and Gay biological men are now guilty of Bigotry for their sexual preferences. With Stonewall now aligning itself with the very forces and mindset which once persecuted same sex attracted people whilst the Catholic Church now finds itself in a position more in line with the original raison detre of Stonewall – which has now gone full metal gay bashing in its official stance.

    Apparently it is already next to impossible for genuine Lesbians to access a genuine Lesbian dating site anywhere.

    This former Gay and Lesbian Rights organisation is now little more than a mafia operation for incel’s and the men’s supremacy movement.

    It is little wonder that many in the lesbian and Gay community have upped sticks and formed an alternative organisation more attuned to the original values which Stonewall has abandoned as a result of being infiltrated by the crazy’s from the basement.

  58. Geri says:


    The Catholic church can’t ‘sell’ thier artifacts because they don’t belong to the Pope, they belong to future generations to enjoy. Not like the Royal family at all who acquired thiers by slavery & theft.

    As for Catholic sex scandals. There was a good book out by the investigative journalist who blew the lid on the US abuses & it is strikingly familiar to the trans cult.

    ‘Goodbye, Goodmen’

    Radical liberalism.

    Basically change from within. Almost textbook to what’s happening now..

    Gay men thought a life of celibacy was the answer to thier condition so joined the priesthood – unfortunately, others had the same idea. Seminars, university & dorms turned into a dating agency & along with it the subculture that scene attracts. The radical liberals manoeuvred into positions of power & started thier own vetting system to eject or make extremely uncomfortable those considered too faithful or Christian from the priesthood while the radical liberals advanced up the ranks to either abuse thier positions with children or turn a blind it was happening at all – wheesht for the church!

    Everything was laid bare. Parties, prostitues, minors, orgies, ripping up orders from on high along with the rule book.

    There were many, many failures & in no way excusing any of it but his investigation did go a way to explain the toxic culture that was allowed to get out of control.. Any stern orders from the very top were ignored or basically told to GTF..they ran thier own (what they thought) *improved* version in thier own churches.

    This also happened in the Anglican church but they embraced it by allowing lesbians to be vicars & get married & have kids or be divorced.

    You can’t serve two masters. You can’t say to someone dying & wishing last rites ‘Hang on until I put my kids to bed’ lol!

    In the Catholic church, women are valued & have a role. Jesus surrounded himself with women loyal to him, non more revered than his own mother who is celebrated, BUT he chose 12 men as his disciples to ordain & go forth *through Him* because *through Him* a priest gives *through Christ our Lord* His sacraments.

    Pope’s never hated homosexuality. A case of love the sinner – hate the sin. Same applies to the rest of us, we’re all sinners.

    I know most here won’t be into such tosh but just explaining why there’s no women priests. It’s nothing to do with mysoginy or anti women. Women can be nuns with thier own pecking order.

  59. Geri says:

    Catholic priests being celibate is actually a request not a dogma, btw.

    Nothing to do with inheritance or being cheapskates. More of a man cannot serve two masters. They’re married to the church & serve the faithful. That’s thier chosen vocation.

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