What’s your point, caller?
Posted on
March 17, 2015 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
For those of you who missed it, me ringing in to the Kaye Adams show this morning.
(In fairness to Kaye Adams, I’d been so startled by the vehemence of her response at the end that I totally failed to register the bit where she invited me to stay on the line and “chip in”. I assumed we were done at that point and hung up.)
Hi Stu, Yeah I wondered what had happened to you, as Private Jones used to say, “They don’t like getting it stuck right up them do they?” Nice to hear you rattling their smug cage.
Auld Rock
It’s was radio, but I’m sure I heard a petted lip! You’ll be getting those misogynist accusations again Stu!!
You’re some man Stu, you should phone in to these shows more often, you’re a great orator and can debunk these clowns in a second. Keep up the good fight ma man. I love this website.
Kaye denied shes BBC
who pays her wage?
just asking
Politics for dummies….
Good on you Rev 🙂
Oh dearie me wee Simon Pia sounded a wee bit p****d with you there Stu. 😀
That’s you telt !!
The Rev Stu could not have been more precise or clearer in his points of fact.
BBC Scotland does not accept criticism. It is above being held to account in the regions. It’s senior executives refused to offer any statistics regarding independence referendum complaints to a committee of the Scottish Government.
Couldn’t help but notice that Simon Pia didn’t refute or contradict your comments Stu when they were put to him.
It will be interesting to see how the BBC moves forward with this for future interviews.
You were very concise in your points Stu. Well done.
well at least you know she is willing to more calls from 😉
oooh, touched a nerve there I think!
They don’t like it up ’em, do they?
Not like Kay Adams to get kranky when it’s pointed out that she’s fairly transparent at taking the company line.
Well done Stu, it sounded like you imparted to much truth for Kaye to handle.
Well done rev. Great to hear Kaye being rattled. I don’t think you will ever get back on the show again.
If I had my way you would take over the show and their ratings would go through the roof.
Keep up the great work.
i notice adams didn’t press for an answer on whether the largest party forms the government either.
the largest party does NOT form the government, it IS a crucial point.
how are “ordinary voters” ever supposed to know about it if journos and broadcasters don’t do their jobs and challenge labour lies and evasion?
Running scared, Running Blind……
Well done Stu. Keep sticking it to them. Perhaps Ms Adams will develop a conscience and go and learn the truth, assuming she isn’t trying to deliberately ignore it…
“How many MPs does Scotland have?, is it 56 is it 57, c’mon anybody in the studio help me”
Dingbat, Kaye Adams, really has her finger on the political pulse of the Scottish nation.
She didn’t even know how many MPs were in Scotland and neither did any of her staff.
And she said at the start of her show today, that she was “confused” by all this coalition stuff.
Well, from an ordinary persons point of view – and my view may be limited in that sense..
I thought that was good, all very well mannered etc, up till Kaye said something about not being the BBC and the BBC not being her. Strange thing to say..
To me, that would imply that the BBC has no influence over what a presenter/reporter may do/say, and conversely, the presenter/reporter has no obligation to follow the guidelines/agenda set out by the BBC?
…or has my brain turned to mush as I’m too ordinary and get easily confused, too easily..
Well done Stu, glad you pulled them up on it. It’s quite clear from that conversation she was a little bit rattled. Guess the truth hurts eh?
Maybe we need to tease out the “so what?” element of this. When Kaye queries whether this debate helps the “ordinary voter” decide where to put their cross on the ballot paper, we need to hammer home the point:
Whenever Labour say “the biggest party forms the government”, it is specifically in order to scare uninformed voters in Scotland into switching their vote from SNP (or other non-Labour) to Labour, for fear of Labour not being the largest party, and hence the Tories forming a government.
That’s the reason – and we need to be explicit about it. They’re trying to scare Scotland into voting for them in order to beat the Tories, when we all understand fine well that we don’t need to vote Labour to keep the Tories out.
Well that’s you well and truly vetted. “Tell the switchboard not to accept any more calls from that Stuart Campbell”! BBC under it’s breath “we’ll have none of that democracy and truth shite here”.
Really well presented arguments Reverend. Pia and Kaye only showing how much of a giant fraud their whole vote MorphySLab or else Scotland stuff really is. And Kaye finds it all such a why bother eh puzzle and says she’s not the BBC now?!
If she’s not BetterTogether BBC, who on earth who is.
That’s UKaye telt!
Great Work Rev!
Clear, concise and truthful!
Yes! Right on. You could not have been clearer.
I don’t listen to the prog anymore. However, I wonder if now that Kay with an e knows the correct position she will let the lie about the biggest party slide past her in the future?
You can only hope, but don’t hold your breath
Poor Debating Skills 101. When losing a debate, immediately change the focus by accusing your opponent of personalising the argument, and then, if allowed, you can make the debate about that.
That’s the way to tell them Stuart, I just wish some of our politicians would take up the same issue when on TV confronted by a red tory leaning interviewer.
Amazes me that the BBC & the Media in general who claim to take politicians to task every day for not performing – and yet when called out themselves for their conduct – act in a hostile defensive manner instantly.
Well done Rev.
The BBC…state propaganda with every word and breath.
I didn’t hear you live on the Adams programme this morning RevStu, but have just listened to your clip on Wings. Well done for challenging both Ms Adams and Simon Pia on their “implied” support of the inaccurate claim that the biggest party gets to form the UK Government, a false claim being repeatedly voiced unchallenged by the likes of Murphy and Dugdale among many other Unionist politicians compliant media outlets.
Please phone in more often and challenge these pro-Union propaganda spreaders and those who, like the wittering Ms Adams, sit silently by and allow them to spread misleading claims and downright lies to the listening public, many of whom are potential voters.
Pia and Adams are complicit in
What happened to Mrs Wilson from Coatbridge?
Any chance of a transcript for us unfortunates in workplaces where no media volume allowed\possible etc
Is anyone any good at shorthand and can transcribe it for us, it would be good to read the transcription even Kaye’s huff
Fascinating that Kaye offered the chance for you Rev. to stay on and chip in. Wonder if they’d (by they I mean BBC, not Kaye personally…) allow for a wee slot for you on a show later in the week seeing as they appeared willing to give you platform to make your point.
Well done Rev. Obviously she is now added to the list (which she was already) with Wark and others as Labour apologists..only small point is the bit at the end – saying the word “You”. It was blatantly obvious that you meant the BBC but it allowed her to use faux outrage and pretend you “were personalising it”. They’ll do anything (including letting Pia on to do actual ad hominem personality attacks unchallenged) but I suppose we must be careful to not even give them the slightest chance i.e. beyond reproach. I know you know this and she’s basically bang out of order.
I loved the way she turned to Simon Pia to get his take on it, and rather than try and prove you wrong, he just went “TORIES, TORIES, SNP BAD”.
Also, in what way is it somehow detrimental to the debate for lies to be exposed? It’s pretty much fundamental to the role the media is supposed to play in a democracy.
Kaye’s “ordinary person” schtick doesn’t wash. She’s a politics graduate from Edinburgh University and spent the formative years of her career as a political journalist. If she can’t understand something so fundamental about UK politics, then perhaps the BBC could find someone who has a clue what they’re talking about? Someone who knows that Scotland has 59 MPs might be a good start…
Stuart
With few exception BBC Scotland Radio is too parochial.
Listen to Ireland’s RTE 1, BBC’s equivalent, and you soon perceive how much more informed Irish presenters are about their world, and the world around them.
Listening to Kaye Adams tells us how she is more intent on controlling the conversation than bringing illumination to it than creating insight. She does not know anything. BBC might as well employ a traffic warden.
You can hear the wheels and cogs of her departmental boss’s memo grinding away. Give the speaker up to 2 minutes to make his or her point, and then ask three questions at the most. Avoid stating any personal opinion. Insight she has none.
You getting the smack down is the same as I got by letter for daring to make a complaint direct to the chair of the BBC Trust.
(See ‘How the BBC Erases Complaints’)
Well done, Rev., and thanks for posting. I think you were very clear, and polite. 🙂
Think they all get nervous when you call a spade, a spade.
How did Simon Pia just happen to be on hand, to shout, Vote Labour???
Well done Stu ! For a moment there Kaye had her nose well and truly put “out of joint”
Wow, that was a morning call with a bit of oomph!!! I may start listening to this program if they had Stu on it every day! 😀
Well done you, at least you got your point out, Simon Pia is so typical of the breed how do they live with themselves.
Simon Pia states that it’s Rev Stu’s ‘interpretation’? Is this a new way of describing UK legislation now? Glad he cleared that one up for us mere mortals.
As for Kaye throwing a strop at the end, you clarified your point about it being the BBC at fault and not her personally, but she did the usual Labour tactic of feigning faux outrage and running with it, with her fingers in her ears shouting ‘bully!’
Sigh.
Also, I absolutely agree with everyone else. You were crystal clear in getting that across, anyone listening in surely can’t now claim ignorance on this issue.
Both Adams and Pia are complicit in Murphy’s lies.
Adams is duty bound to challenge assertions, she is failing those who pay for the BBC.
Clear, concise, calm and surely a breakthrough that you passed whatever screening mechanisms they use?? Now, your next target is a wee seat as a pundit on some of these otherwise excruciating televisual events. Chief debunker of popular myths. Great stuff, and well done
Is it just me or are other folks comments disappearing too?
Am I in moderation Stu?
And then she ran away to a caller in Coatbridge. But I suspect the lie will continue to be aired.
Even though I don’t live in Scotland, and at times like this I’m glad I don’t, I still find this utterly infuriating. I’ve looked on in complete disgust as this appalling episode has unfolded.
It’s been said elsewhere, but it’s worth repeating, that this election campaign’s representation by the media is an even greater assault on truth and democracy that anything that took place during the referendum. They are treating the British public, not just the Scots, with complete contempt. How can they ever recover from this shameful behaviour after the election? How can they seriously expect a single Scot to have even a shred of respect for them? And what self-respecting Scot could ever wish to be in such a spiteful, disjointed and mendacious union, one they were begged and harried and threatened and conned to stay in only to be denied a voice in 6 months thereafter?
Very well and calmly put Rev. The discomfort at having the truth so straightforwardly put to them was palpable, you could almost hear the cogs thinking”how do i get him aff without soundin biased”
Stuart says that people are not challenged on the lie.
Kaye asks Pia about it and he does not answer but diverts.
She does not challenge him.
Instead, she snipes at Stuart.
Stuart says that people are not challenged on the lie. QED
caz-m says:
“How many MPs does Scotland have?, is it 56 is it 57, c’mon anybody in the studio help me”
erm … Kay with an “E” this is the studio here … we are working on getting a figure for you … we’ll be back with you directly once we have figured out who it was that nicked our BBC calculator! 😀
Tomorrows headlines:
Cybernat attacks lone female at BBC!
“I am not the BBC”
Theres the perfect Wings t-Shirt slogan right there!
Well done Stu. By not admitting your point was correct, she was brought right down to size. Hope you’re ready for their backlash. However, I think anything they say now will be queried with scepticism by the ‘ordinary man’.
Kaye says she is “struggling a bit” … “I am not the BBC” … jeez!
If she can’t understand the substance of this straight forward complaint, nor understand the facts, what she doing in that job!?
Wait a minute … silly me … she does carry out her mission as Labour/Union propaganda stooge. I forgot she was never supposed to be an impartial presenter.
Did anyone get the impression someone whispered in Kaye’s ear half way through … well, shouted in her ear … “GET THIS BACK ON SCRIPT!”
BTW Well done Stu!
The proof of her even-handedness will appear when Kaye Adams challenges any Labour apologist still daring to push that lie. (Including those others at the BBC who are not her and whose probity therefore, according to her argument, must be in doubt.)
Thanks for phoning that programme. I can’t stand to listen to any of the BBC Scotland Labour Party infomercials so very glad that others take on that awful responsibility. You came across loud and clear and Kaye did sound very miffed. I didn’t think she was offering to bring you back in later if you stayed online. I heard that as an “it’s all very well for you sitting there phoning in ” put down.
Thanks to all of you who keep track of all these media shills.
Would it be out of the question to say that KayE really doesn’t really know anything about whatever the topic of the day is. She doesn’t need to.
She is really a drone chosen for that purpose with skills in listening to her instructions over the headphones whilst her handlers tell her what to do at the same time as she is talking to the audience and the callers?
Before the show, as GB and Derek Bateman have said, there must be a managerial conference to discuss the topic to be covered and what will be the line. She possibly has no input to that but, in order to keep her “freelance” contract, she does follows her orders.
She seemed to me to genuinely did not know the Rev Stu’s position was in fact the truthful one and the evidence of Gus O’Donnell’s intervention as well as the existence of the protocols used when a hung parliament happens.
One could say that she should ,but her programme is not classified as a political one but as some sort of “entertainment” and part political hybrid, like the Jeremy Kyle one on TV? Controversy is the really important factor, not the truth.
She is a willing cog in the big wheel of political manipulation of Scotland by the BBC, but the real culprits are the ones on the other end of her headphones and the others further up the red monkey tree that is BBC Scotland
Well argued Stuart.
You should have given your “drawing a cock and balls on the ballot paper” answer when Kaye asked who you were going to vote for though. 🙂
It would be great if that programme would consider even a little bit of pro Indy spots, they could choose from a wealth of various people to chat on subjects.
What have they got to lose? They could increase their audience in the same way the National is performing.
C’mon Kaye, show some bravery, don’t live down to our expectations!
Pia’s slurred aside was calculated to insult.
What a boor.
God, how Labour’s Scottish branch detests the SNP and anybody who thinks them good parliamentarians.
Calling that phoned in presentation of why exactly Murphy’s a lying fraud, BBC is a journalistic and democratic failure as “just your spin Stu” was a predictably piddly thin response from them.
I liked the “Your Professor Curtice.” haha! Give them a taste of their own medicine but from UK cabinet governance rules to Prof Curtice, you cant get a more reasoned fact based display of just how bad its got for Morphy and the BBC.
The end is nigh call Kaye and all your fellow UKOK shills. You had a good run though.
Kay with an e is not the BBCe except on paye daye.
It would be great if you could get it up on Billboards that Jim Murphy is a Liar. And challenge him to take action if you are Wrong. Which you are not. Can you put that wee clip on you tube facebook and twitter. Well done as always. And many Thanks.
@ Desimond
You’re on to something there, you know. Wings t-shirt with the slogan, “Wings Over Scotland – Not the BBC”
Fantastically well controlled Stu, articulate and accurate to a tee. No argument to argue.
She seemed a bit smug at the start when asking you about Wings, like as if you were lucky to be getting any air time at all.
But fair play to her, I expected more interjection but she did allow you get to the end of the point without making a mockery of the call-in..
I doubt The Wark would have granted you the privilege.
——————
Believers 45, Collaborators 55.
But the tide is turning and the dream shall never die.
John Curtice is currently explaining Stuart’s point about surviving a vote of confidence on Jeremy Vine show right now and making reference to Stanley Baldwin’s government.
George Orwell will be rolling around when he hears this from wee skanktimonious (borrowed from WGD) in todays guardian UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!
Douglas Alexander, head of Labour’s election strategy, said it was getting harder for politicians to campaign because voters were more exposed to false information on social media sites like Facebook.
To illustrate his point, he recalled a conversation with someone in a supermarket in his constituency. She was “an intelligent woman”, a senior social worker. But she told him that she did not believe the results of the independence referendum, and that she thought there had been a conspiracy. She also thought the oil companies were involved in a global conspiracy to keep oil prices low, he said.
I said, ‘Do you mind if I ask where you get your news?’ And she said, ‘I get if off Facebook every night’.
Now, we are used to a politics where we share facts, but diverge on opinion. We are confronting increasingly, because of the rise of social media, a politics where people’s social media feeds can be an echo chamber for, at best their own opinions and at worst their own prejudices. And that’s a tough challenge for all democratic politicians in every party of the UK, and more broadly.
How do we engage in a very rapidly changing media landscape in which facts are not common, actually people have their own facts?
I always understood the encumbant PM got first dibs at forming a government & that’s why Gordon Brown had the chance at coalition with the liberals first, in 2010, before they were woo’d away by tories with promises of riches and ministerial cars. Labour get away with the lie, as it sounds so plausible, and very easy to understand for those not normally engaged with politics. The biggest party gets to form the government. Of course not as the 2nd and 3rd placed could outvote them. Taking labour’s statement to the next train of thought seems beyond the bbc at the moment.
“Being technically correct does not help the debate”
BBC Scotland staff manual.
“I’m not the BBC”
Was that the sound of a cock crowing, or a hen clucking.
🙂
Notice Pia virtually imploring the public to vote labour. Good old impartial BBC!
Stu Ferigno – The Wingcredible Hulk. Don’t make him angry. You wouldn’t like it when he’s angry. Or is it hungry?
I wonder if Morphy (a wee plasticine man from the 60,s)will come out with the same lies at the debates where I,m sure Nicola will be more than capable to put him straight on the rules of General Elections
@ Doug Daniel great point. How can Kaye, an ordinary person, with a Politics degree and years of experience as a political journalist, understand such a complicated point as that!
I think there will be many people listening who took that on board, Stu. No matter what Kaye says, or what Pia yammered into the microphone. You cited a great deal of backed-up evidence and Pia couldn’t bear that you were speaking truth. Great job.
On the subject of radio Scotland, on last nights drivetime they had a section on a campaign to designate Britain’s national bird. I had a look on the site today to see the options and was somewhat surprised at their intro
“Two amazing things happened in the mid 60?s. The Robin was voted Britain’s national bird and…”
You can guess what the second thing was, a big picture of England winning the world cup. What is the relevance to Britain here, well Britain is England and England is Britain.
I was even more miffed when I couldn’t vote for the capercaillie.
http://www.votenationalbird.com
Well said, Stu.
Very clear, calm and collected. And to the point.
Her patronising attitude is appalling. She might as well say don’t muddy the water by telling voters the truth, they just won’t understand it.
Listened to this with the Mrs. who hates politics she said “that Kaye is acting the daftie”
I must be missing something here, but I don’t think Kaye was as much rattled by Revs points, but showed herself to be badly misinformed.
How can she sit in her studio and not know this stuff? it’s been getting discussed for weeks now and as Rev said, it is the central plank of the Labour parties strategy!
She made a good point about ‘ordinary people’ not knowing what to believe, because of claims and counter claims, so surely her job as a BBC presenter is to make sure she has at least some grasp of the truth.
The question to the BBC is simple: Does the BBC still believe that it is important for them to attempt to TRUTHFULLY INFORM your listeners or viewers?
Simon Pia, lied through his teeth, but did not contradict Rev, and pointedly did not answer Kaye when she asked him to confirm or deny Revs point.
Until the BBC challenge the Labour party, and inform their listeners/viewers of the truth of this matter, something that is not subject to spin or opinion, but is easily checked for the facts,
THE BBC ARE LIARS!
Haha! Nicked your comment Doug Daniel and tweeted it.
“Kaye’s “ordinary person” schtick doesn’t wash – politics graduate from Edinburgh University +was political journalist”
Kaye said ‘I don’t think it helps’ which is a bizarre response to the Rev’s statement but correct response to Simon Pia’s misdirection. It didn’t seem like she meant Simon Pia funnily enough. It seemed like she was agreeing with something Pia said. Devious. #eatyourcereal folks.
Wingers of a certain age may recall another phone-in where there was the oft repeated question,
“Caller, are you accusing me of mendacity?”
If only wee Jimmy Sanderson was still around because I would have enjoyed him saying,
“Caller, I am not Radio Clyde Superscoreboard and Radio Clyde Superscoreboard is not me ! And by the way, were you at the game ?”
Neatly done. 🙂
The BBC’s new tagline:
“The truth doesn’t help.”
Isn’t it in fact the case that historically the largest party has formed or been the core of the government, it’s just that it’s not automatic? So Labour is being truthist (or whatever the term is), i.e. saying something that’s technically correct in the actual words they use, but not in the way they’re spinning it. Like in 2010, the largest party ended up forming the government with the third largest one, but purely because the second and third largest couldn’t (or wouldn’t) work together and Labour completely ruled out any deal that would have involved the SNP.
@ Rev they,ve all watched the Prof Morano lecture at Westminster 2 years ago on distraction internviews, same tactic as Murphy employs.
Maybe Kaye is freelance, like Clarkson,and thats why she got abit offended and claimed not to be the BBC.
Shame you couldn’t have stayed on the line a bit longer Stu,but lets hope someone twigs at the BBC that they’re
not doing their job.
I hope I live long enough for broadcasting to be devolved to Scotland!
I was looking forward, if that is the term, to the morning phone in when I heard the topic and even more so when I heard that Robin McAlpine was taking part (what happened to Robin btw?!). The cherry on top was the good Rev daring to clarify the constitutional situation in the event of a hung parliment. No wonder Kaye’s nose was put out of joint, she didn’t seem to have a clue how many MPs Scotland had so what chance did she have of knowing this. That is no defence though, if you don’t know enough on the subject then either get in someone who does to do the phone-ins, or not take offence when someone points out the facts. Shameful.
A few other things bothered me in the BBC coverage this morning:
1. Kaye getting quite argumentative with the caller suggesting that SNP will get 50+ seats. Kaye was insistent that 30 to 40 was the correct “prediction” (in contradiction to the bulk of the polling data out there).
2. Audio snippets on Labour ruling out a coalition with the SNP contained a line or two from Nicola not in context, about how it was ridiculous that Labour would rule out working with the SNP. Of course, she ruled out even ever entering a formal coalition with them.
Good stuff.
I wonder if Kaye and other BBC presenters will be challenging ‘The Lie’ from now on.
Stewart Labour are mouthing off about the biggest party get to govern the UK, Guess what people that are going to vote Labour will vote labour even if they retain all their seat they won in 2010 but if they lose the election in 2015 they will be finished once and for all, they are playing a deadly game with peoples live and hopes with the lies and fear as they did in the referendum. She the one that voted no on Independence and was praising Gordon Brown on the BBC News 24 about hit speach on home rule.
Well done Rev,you highlighted a point,that needed to be,brought to task.
I can’t count how many times,the biased media have let the largest party always forms a government quote,slip by without so much,as a whimper from them.
Kaye Adam’s was only annoyed,because you pointed out,that she amongst other so called presenters,fail miserably to hold certain Labour statements to account.
I heard this, well said… I later texted to back you up, here’s what I said;
“There are 59 Scottish seats! Stuart Campbell from Wings over Scotland is correct, you are promoting a Labour lie & leaving it unchallenged & you are part of the BBC! Turn off your bias generator please.”
It wasn’t read out as usual.
“Je ne suis pas la BBC”
Well done Stu, I thought you did great. You stayed calm and definitely got the point across, plus fair rattling Kaye’s cage. Wehey
When I’m confronted by people on line who insist on the ‘biggest party’ lie I usually point them to the Guardian ‘exclusive pictures’ of Gordon Brown’s last moments in Downing Street.
The caption with the first photograph is:
A hunched Gordon Brown (back right), Labour ministers and advisers including Alastair Campbell (standing left) wait for Nick Clegg to call with his decision on who will form the next government
Link: https://archive.today/ppWOY
The notion that Kaye doesn’t know how many MPs Scotland has was a blatant act. Just a dismal attempt to come across as ‘one of us’ to her listeners. Classic patronising BBC.
Sorry for O/T here but for those of you following the “£was it a slur wasn’t it a slur” going’s on with David Coburn here’s the latest. 😉
The European Parliament has been asked to investigate the conduct of UKIP MEP David Coburn after he made Islamophobic remarks, comparing SNP MSP Humza Yousaf to convicted terrorist Abu Hamza.
http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2015/mar/european-parliament-asked-investigate-coburn
Pleading ignorance is no defence.
UKOK Kay now knows for sure that “the biggest party” line is a lie.
She has been well and truly made aware that it’s a lie when the Rev referred to the top Civil Servant saying it wasn’t true and when the Rev stated it was written in law/Commons rules etc.
She now cannot let that lie pass on any future show, but will she?
Also, after that “revelation” BBC Scotland should now have a duty to make it CRYSTAL CLEAR to all presenting/interviewing staff that they cannot let liars away with spouting the biggest party deception, but again, will they? Time will tell.
I can see the postits now flying around BBC Scotland:
“Quick, we’ve been rumbled, further emergency training needed on how to further embellish our propaganda, someone contact Jim & Kez with the greatest urgency, my office @ midnight, everyone.”
O/T
I’ve just had an email from LSE about the video from yesterdays event in London.
They say they can’t post the video online because they don’t have permission to do so.
I’ve emailed back to say we can get Nicola’s permission as she’s a very accessible First Minister.
I await their reply
Separatist thug verbally abuses young BBC presenter
Brilliant Rev.
Kay(e)’politics’ graduate, ‘all too confusing’ was playing the BT ‘eat your cereal’ woman.
That plus the rampant misogyny in MSM,- Ed in Nicola’s bra, -courtesy of the rancid daily Mail, is trying to appeal to women who are not interested in politics.
Hopefully it will backfire in spectacular fashion.
Labour lying to people’s faces to try to get their vote. The media knowlingly propagating that lie because it suits their own agenda.
So sad that it’s come to this.
I actually didn’t think Kaye was that bad really. The bit where she said oh I can’t even work it all out was horseshit but STU defo. got a good crack of the whip there.
@Mike
Britain’s national bird has just got to be the cuckoo.
Remember folks, be careful. Kaye Adams is an ordinary Mum, just like Claire Lally. lol.
Stephen,
I just loved the way Kaye sought clarification about Stu and his blog and then asked about its leanings and his own voting intentions. It would have been nice if she’d reciprocated with the BBC’s leanings and her own voting intentions.
Well said Stu, you had them gobsmacked, its the quietest she has ever been. Hope you managed to get others to questions what was being said. You should call up more of these programs.
Bloody well done Stew,
Hope you’ve left the line opened to B.B.C. Scotland, at these appropriate times?, because we need people like you to get across to the public at large what’s going on!.
Simon Pia?, now there is a Labour dinosaur if ever there was one, he is one who would shove his granny off the bus,if he thought it would give a Labour person a seat!.
Kaye plays dumb but it is just a creepy act.
We are disconnected from how Westminster works though or at least you need to be very interested to get clued up, thanks again £3-4bn a year public teamGb broadcaster-
Here in England, lunch chat with fellow Brits, “No chance of Salmond being in government” Me, “There was if Milliband hadn’t said no to coalition with SNP,” Her, “but we wouldn’t stand for it,” Me, “Who’s we?” Other fellow Brit, “Do you need a ferry to get to Scotland?” Me, “Yes, takes an hour, leaves from Newcastle.”
Well done Stuart. We need more well informed people like you to keep BBC and STV on their toes.
Wish we could raise a petition to get rid of the BBC etc in Scotland. I have not watched it or listened to it for quite a while as their bias makes me sick.
Small donation on its way in coming weeks. Thanks for all you d for us.
Sounds familiar Ghostly – Propaganda method 4b from the BBC:
“Audio snippets on Labour ruling out a coalition with the SNP contained a line or two from Nicola not in context“
It’s that plebeian ‘You’ word wot done it.
You’re just not posh enough, Stu. If, instead, you’d said “One must challenge those scoundrels on that, Kaye. One is remiss of one’s duty if one permits a propagandist to disseminate such a blatant falsehood completely failing in every way to present any contest to it.” she’d be pushed to get snippy.
Remember her “I’m thick me” act when she denied Brown ever said home rule was on the table.
What I couldn’t believe was that after you had CLEARLY stated the position Pia came in and blatantly repeated the lie. And Adams is completely wrong about it being difficult to understand. I believe a 10 year old schoolboy would understand after it was explained to him.
What is making it difficult for people to understand is that Labour are blatantly lying by contradicting the established constitutional position and the MSM and BBC are helping to muddy the water by not challenging Labour’s lies.
Your explanations were very clear and concise. Labour should now concede and stop lying and the BBC should start challenging.
Stuart you should have used the Scottish plural of you (yuz) and possibly she might not have taken your remark so personal 😀
Kaye Adams and Kirsty Wark are indeed not the BBC but only because they are allowed to work as self employed contractors for the avoidance of tax.
The rest of us suckers are taxed PAYE whether we like it or not!
Off topic
Getting a good laugh at wee Dougies upset that ‘democratic politicians’ have a hard time with Facebook just becoming an echo chamber for the grief and anger of the nationalists.
This is going so well – their campaign to continually insult the electorates intelligence.
Way to go Dougie! Keep throwing those votes our way!
Sorry KayE when you are on the BBC broadcasting their flagship political show then you are the BBC and as mentioned if you have a degree in politics you must surely understand the basics.
I’m with joemcg’s wife in that KayE is “acting the daftie” which doesn’t really wash.
History reminds us that in 1974/9 people were brought into the chamber on stretchers to vote when there was a very close vote. Nowadays there is no pretence of votes being that democratic (I think they use a tally or “matching” system so in most cases MPs don’t have to turn up except when the whip says so). I haven’t even got o level politics but the magic number is exactly half plus one. If you can achieve that by any combination of parties for a vote, you are the government. Simples. There are 650 MPs so if you can command 326 you are the winner.
Phew thank God for my comprehensive education.
Stu. Just for clarification mail her and the BBC editorial team the evidence so if some of us also call in we can reference that they were informed with date and source.
Al
A related issue tag doesn’t help is the sloppy language. How exactly is ‘the biggest party’ defined? What they mean is the party with the most MPs but that does not mean it is the biggest party in terms of membership or in terms of votes cast for them. It revealingly shows that they take there to be a correlation between the relative numbers of MPs and the political opinions of the citizenry, a handy self-delusion to remove the need for any changes in the minimalist understanding of ‘democracy’ that Westminster represents.
Accurate, articulate, concise, calm, and a very good “radio voice”.
Stuart, we need you to do a regular broadcast, by-passing the BBC. The Rev’s Thought for The Day?
Valerie
If it is an echo chamber we would be speaking to ourselves. Labour no longer have a 100% control on informing the electorate. What he meant to say was that he cannot control the electorate finding out things for themselves and making them look dishonest.
‘I’m not the bbc’. Of course you are Kaye. You are paid in a professional capacity to represent that organisation. When I am addressed as ‘you’ by a customer I know perfectly well they are referring to the organisation I represent – hence I don’t take it personally.
well said the Rev. Kaye paid well enough not to be so sensitive but I think you can get to a level of ‘success’ in life where you expect mostly deference.
Message to the British Bullshit Corporation:
The Scottish branch of your organisation is currently employing unqualified presenters to front political shows.
These presenters are handsomely paid and on a daily basis they continue to destroy the perceived grand reputation of your organisation.
The main culprit on radio, who goes by the name of Kaye Adams but is rather affectionately known amongst the wider population as UKlucker Kay, openly admits to being dumb when it comes to political facts.
How can YOU, as an organisation, claim any form of credibility whilst employing substandard presenters?
These presenters AND producers are doing very serious damage to your organisation and your tv licencing funding.
Cheery-bye!
🙂
@Cagdoesthinking
In practice the magic number is more like 323 as Sinn Fein don’t take their seats.
Actually it would be an interesting tactic if, having taken 45-50 of the 59 Scottish seats the SNP joined Sinn Fein and decided not to take their seats on legitimacy grounds and dared London to enact any laws pertaining to Scotland without them.
Kaye sure didn’t like it being personalised, but it is personal. She is representing what should be an impartial public broadcaster (no matter what her personal employment arrangements are) and as such is there to ask questions on my/ our behalf. If she, or any of the others, aren’t doing this they are either incompetent or bias.
Any lie told to us matters!
Stuart’s feedback was clear and specific…the BBC and it’s presenters need to get used to this type of criticism OR CHANGE!!
Aplogies if this has been mentioned before.
Kaye, with her earpiece, is a mouthpiece for the BBC.
Kaye Adams says that she is not the BBC and the BBC is not her.
This, while she sits for three hours in a BBC studio,
with 100% BBC staff,
and with a BBC earpiece in her ear
through which the ‘call Kaye’ BBC producer
prompts and guides her, step by step, word by word,
through the 3 hours.
Note – when a caller phones Kaye,
it is not a two way conversation – it’s 3 way.
The producer also hears the caller and guides Kaye
through the conversation if necessary.
The caller does not hear the producer
and might think he is just talking with Kaye.
Kaye, with her earpiece, is a mouthpiece for the BBC.
Kaye Adams – a woman who pretends to be “stupid” but gets upset when made to look genuinely stupid.
Isn’t it funny how the BBC run around congratulating themselves on uncovering stories like child abuse when it’s convenient to use those stories to cover up news they don’t want you to know, at the moment they’re going with Cyril Smith (AGAIN)
But lying to an entire Nation is OK
Collusion to subvert democracy is OK
Another cover up story the BBC love to run when a distraction is needed
The death of a celebrity, the bigger the better
Or indeed a Royal Event, that’s always good for a distraction
Well done Stu for managing to get out as much as you did
and let’s hope enough of our folk out there heard it and will spread the truth
The BBC are always trumpeting they stand for truth…SO
What “Have” the BBC got against the truth
Didn’t matter how many times she was told that there are no ‘secret negotiations’, no ‘off the record discussions’, and no no party is ‘doing deals behind closed doors’ – she persisted in showing her complete ignorance of what’s actually going on until the end of the first hour.
I could almost smell BBCScotland’s Tim Reid’s exasperation as he tried to educate her – as did Fraser Nelson.
Both simply gave up and after a few minutes and hung up !
I will not be changing my Vote from SNP end off no matter if RED OR BLUE TORY GET IN.
@
jake says:
17 March, 2015 at 2:36 pm
“I just loved the way Kaye sought clarification about Stu and his blog and then asked about its leanings and his own voting intentions. It would have been nice if she’d reciprocated with the BBC’s leanings and her own voting intentions.”
If you listen you can see her slowing down verbally as she poses the questions to Stu.
That was because she was being told what to say via her headphones by her bosses in the control room.
I posted earlier, but it was held up in publication and has only just now appeared, (01:43 pm) that Kaye is a drone and just does as she is told.
This post will probably see the light of day later this evening
BtP (Gone Tonto)
Rev,Jim Murphy is lying,wow I wonder if he will get back to you and ask you to prove it and is he going to threaten you with slandering his name,I loved it about time Kaye and the rest were shown up for what they are.I don’t think you will be asked on any BBC show in the future.
She’s a snippy wee git.
If you don’t want to be criticized in your job get good, or get out!
And she IS the BBC in the context of that show.
Well done Stu … wonder if the BBC will let you back on again. Good on you for hanging in and getting the point across and especially for quoting the BBC to prove your point.
The only thing in her arsenal was to personalise and cut you out of the debate.
Quiz time:-
Name three other countries in which the population is
actively discouraged, through state propaganda,
from thinking for themselves.
(Answers later tonight – if I remember!
Brian Taylor Political editor, Scotland this morning.
Let’s bear in mind exactly what’s happening here. We are not here pre-negotiating a coalition, or pre-negotiating a coalition out of existence. It is not about that.
Right now, it is about all the parties trying to trip up their opponents (entirely understandably and reasonably from their perspectives).
The SNP put forward terms for a coalition, which is no Trident update, an improvement in public spending and an enhancement of Scottish powers beyond the Smith Commission. These are not negotiating techniques – these are issues they’re putting forward now to embarrass the Labour party because they feel Labour is weak on those.
In return, Labour say SNP proposals would mean ending Barnett and ultimately bringing about a further referendum on independence. They’re not doing that to knock down a coalition, they’re doing that to point out what they feel are potential weak spots in the SNP position.
The Conservatives? They’re looking on and laughing.
Alastair says:
Stu. Just for clarification mail her and the BBC editorial team the evidence so if some of us also call in we can reference that they were informed with date and source.
Al
I think if Stu were to do that there might one almighty explosion Alastair. 😉
I think folks have been on Twitter, Facebook and Text all day sending her little *ahem* “help it” guides as to how to figure out who gets first shottie at being Prime Minister in May. I know I have been tweeting her. 😀
@gerry parker: 17 March, 2015 at 1:58 pm
I do rather think she was laying eggs.
Got to hand it to Kaye, what a pro. Her total and utter personal loathing of you and everything you stand for did not erupt live on air, but remained barely audible under her thin-lipped contemptuous avoidance of your point.
She did, however, completely fail to challenge Simon Pia as he waffled away implying collusion between the SNP and the Tories – a trope also being developed in the Guardian over recent days – when she had an open goal to simply ask him the straight question. So, Stu, I’d suggest you’d have been well within your rights to personalise it because she did EXACTLY what you had pointed up and did not debunk the myth. Of course, any question of collusion between the Labour Party and BBC Scotland is entirely out of the question…
Did the SNP put forward terms for a coalition? I don’t remember that
That was great, the Rev holding the BBCs feet to the fire.
I listened live this morning but listening again you hear much that was missed first time around.
The most striking maybe was Simon Pia’s voice in his “rebuttal” it was positively quavering, you had him on the run. He actually said that both Tory strategists and SNP candidates he had spoken to agreed that ultimately it suits the SNP down the road to have a Tory government in power if they want Independence.
More lies I believe, I’ll bet he was shaking from his toes to his forehead as he spouted such crap.
Great plug for the site though.
Guys at work were browsing Wings at lunch time. A first.
Ye’ve got ’em thinkin!
Bravo.
@ Thepnr
That struck me about Simon Pia’s disgraceful contribution. Shame that it was not pointed out that if the SNP actually want a tory government then ruling out support for one is a funny way of going about it.
Sorry for O/T but just read Ian McWhirter tweeting that he’s off to the bookies to lay a fiver on Scotland being independent by 2018! 😛
I asked if he’d lay a fiver on for me when he’s there but somehow I don’t think that will happen. 😀
Toys out the pram at the end from Lightweight Adams. Can she honestly not remember all that way back to 2010? Seriously?
Stuart Campbell .
You are my fucking hero. A programme designed to inform listeners with Kay(e) being too thick to realise she’s been caught aiding and abetting a lie to the people of Scotland.
The holy trinity of Labour , BBC and the Record. Your days are numbered you nawbags.
Roll on May. Labour are goosed. no one but the usual OO and like will vote for you . Scotland is going places and your not invited.
Scum bag Liars.
Fiona says:
Did the SNP put forward terms for a coalition? I don’t remember that
I don’t believe they have Fiona. I think the closest they have ever got to a coalition is to say they would support Labour on a case by case basis. Which if you think about it is really what most S.N.P. voters would want, I think. 😉
I’m now heading for the “Darkened Room” before all the s***e hits the fan over what I’ve just said. 😀
I haven’t commented on this website for a long time but this made me so angry, so apparently it doesn’t help to point out facts to the electorate! What a ridiculous response. Her tirade at Stu at the end was also pathetic, trying to make out the BBC was doing him a favour by even letting him on.
WOS is not only one of the largest and most influential political blogs in Scotland but in the entire UK and yet the BBC barely mention it, funny that, nothing to so with it being pro-independence of course. Well done Stu, you put your case across very well.
Oh dear, Radio Scotland.
Oh for the days of John Milne, Colin Bell & Colin MacKay – people who knew what they were fucking talking about, and if they were ‘confused’ about anything would ask the right people the right questions until they weren’t.
Kaye Adams – out her depth
Did I hear someone getting totally OWNED there?
I think I did. 🙂
“I am not the BBC and the BBC is not me” lol. This woman is a disgrace. She is no reporter and is a very inept presenter.
Well done Stu, you got here pissed of, you could hear it in he voice for a good while after you went off air lol.
Still bringing a smile to my face.
BTW folk saying when previously complaining about her to the BBC, reponse was nothing to do with us, she’s freelance.
So how come they can discipline J. Clarkston who is also ‘freelance’- historical definition -a medieval mercenary
the penman claims, “we all understand fine well that we don’t need to vote Labour to keep the Tories out.”
Alex Massie wrote in the Spectator, 16 March, “the fewer Labour MPs there are the more probable it is that David Cameron somehow stumbles into a second term. Now the SNP will pretend to be appalled by such an outcome … On the one hand the SNP stress the importance of kicking the Tories out of power; on the other they say that Labour and the Tories are just the same. … Either it doesn’t matter whether Labour or the Conservatives win the election or it does. Half the time the SNP would like you think it makes no difference; the rest of the time they acknowledge it does.”
This tells you all you need to know about BBC Scotland. Inconvenient truths are not welcome. It truly is “a station like no other”, but not in a good way.
I’ve heard Kaye’s patronising’ let’s not confuse our poor little listeners’ schtick before. Talk about dumbing down – she really does assume her audience are idiots. Idiots that don’t think too hard and swallow her phony willingness to enable a fair debate.
In saying that, any intelligent person would quickly tire of Kaye’s dire wee phone in.
But … I think we all feel that this guff should be challenged. So well done Stuart, you were polite, assertive and extremely clear. Your treatment was shoddy, but you did your duty and we all thank you for it.
Perhaps Kaye had an easier time with Mrs Wilson from Cowdenbeath.
Just re listened to clip.
Tory strategists agree that another Tory govt will help to get independence. Says Pia.
In that case, surely in the spirit of Better Together and the Union then the Tories should be urging everyone to vote Labour …….. Stupid, I know but that is what he said.
Kaye said that she is going into a ballot box …….. Best place for her.
macnakamura says @ 1.49pm
Kay with an e is not the BBCe except on paye daye.
Haha,
there’s your Tee Shirt right there! 🙂
Stuart
Well done. She didn’t like your intervention & was all at sea at one point & had to bring in Pia because she didn’t know what to say.
Well done,sir.
gerry parker says @ 1.58
“I’m not the BBC”
Was that the sound of a cock crowing, or a hen clucking.
She has to say it three times Gerry. 🙂
Thats ONE!
@mike,
No bittern either ;-(
Honesty is always high on my ‘I’ll consider giving you my vote’ list so Putting everything else aside for a moment. The fact that labour candidates, all across the country, as well as the party hierarchy are repeating this lie on the door steps and across the uk media is reason enough to not give them your vote?
Let’s stop all this doo doo,its the resources of our nation that these parasites want.
They don’t give a damn obout the people,and ("Tractor" - Ed)s in the media like Kaye adams makes us all look like the horses ASS.
How often have we heard the “I’m confused, along with the rest of the public”, line from her when a probe hits a nerve. She’s got a nerve, she is the BBC, she practically lives in the place. How much are we paying her for this pish one wonders? She’s the kind of wummin you dread ever moving into your close. Well done indeed Stu’.
Well done to the BBC producers for digging up Mrs Wilson by the way. Finding a Tory pensioner in Coatbridge is audience vetting on an almost supernatural level!
The BBC is not a person. So agreed Kaye, you are not the BBC, but whether a staffy or freelance, you are representing the BBC and should uphold its “mission statement” – just love that expression, it always causes me to snigger.
I expect the BBC Mission Statement application is like what I experienced when Quality Assurance came over the horizon in industry. A tome is prepared of company procedures for QA, Lloyds, or whoever, review your QA manual, you include their constructive criticism, they stamp approved, and bill you. Then you have the quality control practises where you as a manager strive to ensure that nothing leaves the factory that is deficient.
That is where the BBC and its representatives are failing, they are not applying quality control. Lies, distortions, bias are allowed to prevail.
Simon Pia, I wonder who his mates are McTiernan, MacDougal,Murphy? Birds of a feather flock together.
I think a number of presenters are freelance for tax avoidance purposes.
Weren’t Paxman,Bruce and a few others named round about the time Jimmy Carr was being hung out to dry?
@Will Podmore, if the people of England want a Labour government they’ll vote for it in May, end of. The fact that they appear not to know what they want is what all this nonsense is about and what’s causing the rising hysteria amongst flag-wavers such as yourself.
For me personally they’re two cheeks of the one imperialist arse. They both want the same-auld, same-auld, the House of Lords, WMD’s, Tuition Fees, Wars and Screwing the Poor, who they’ve shamelessly abandoned. You can safely vote for either, either way you’ll get what you want. Leave us to vote for what we want.
Kall Kaye said that she wasn’t sure if the information from Rev. Stu would help her when “she got into the ballot box” to cast her vote. Question, what is she doing in ballot boxes? Is this a confession about ballot box tampering? I think Stu needs to phone in again and ask Kaye to clarify.
Her “I’m just a daftie like all of yuz that are listening” really gets on my goat though.
Brilliant! You can hear how pissed off Kaye Adams is – well and truly found out. If anyone wasn’t in doubt that the BBC are complicit in Labour’s electioneering, they can’t be any more.
@ Velofello
“That is where the BBC and its representatives are failing, they are not applying quality control. Lies, distortions, bias are allowed to prevail.
Simon Pia, I wonder who his mates are McTiernan, MacDougal,Murphy? Birds of a feather flock together.”
Sorry, I disagree.
They are applying Quality Control.
It is just got nothing to do with journalistic integrity or the truth.
It is about how many lies, smears, innuendos, bias and a million and one technical tricks against the SNP.
That is their standard for QC.
Basically she took offence to being told that she is not doing her job properly, but the fact is she is not doing her job properly, so what is her problem.
Clearly it is true what they say, they don’t like it up em.
Maybe I’m being thick here, but if she’s looking for a party she can trust, how exactly is informing her that the Labour Party are repeatedly lying to her “not helping”?
Well done Stu. It is best that you didn’t stay on line. Making just a single point is going to focus all attention on that point. And that is what you would want.
She is looking for a party which will preserve her job, that is why it is not helping
YESGUY wrote:
“Labour are goosed. no one but the usual OO and like will vote for you.”
Ricky, Ricky, Ricky, not the ones i know, blue Tories or Ukippers through and through.
One massive (as far as they’re concerned) reason they wouldn’t pish on Slabber if they were on fire is, in their words, “that lot are nothing but fenians scrounging off our British state” so you can guess what they think of Dim Jim.
These people tend not to consider policies when committing their “loyalty”, it’s more a “dedication” to “Queen and Empire”.
And certain fuckwits have the brass neck to accuse us of creating division. Any division in Scotland was created hundreds of years ago.
Thankfully progressive parties such as the SNP have made considerable strides forward and succeeded, so far, in pulling many of us together, of all faiths and none, under the one common aim of independence for a modern, forward thinking Scotland.
😉
Taking it personally was simply a way of deflecting from what had been stated. Not easy to deal with those rats Stu, more power to your elbow 🙂
Very well done Stuart. First time I’ve heard someone really take the BBC on and tell it like it is. You made the point so well and in such a balanced and respectful way I really can’t see how she could justify such a response. As for her saying she’s not the BBC and it’s not her I think she should look at her contract! Keep up the excellent work. You are speaking for us all who aren’t able to verbalize our points of view so clearly.
Think Kaye Adams was very tolerant of you ” Rev”, sadly your Christan principles of patience, tolerance and selflessness are conspicuous by their absence.
Alastair says:
“Stu. Just for clarification mail her and the BBC editorial team the evidence so if some of us also call in we can reference that they were informed with date and source.”
Agree 100% with this, send every media outlet links to the sources of information, telling them that it is 100% verifiable facts, and that it is their duty to inform their own readers/listeners/viewers of these facts, should any Labour politician repeat this lie.
I saw the gruesome twosome of Bradfurd and Burd at it again today. Adams has to do all she can to outdo those two, it must get her really hissy at Scot Nat’s!
Next time you call in you might get Louise Whyte and she makes Kaye Adams seem like a rampant NAT 🙂 I think Louise Whyte qualified with an A plus from the Naughtie-Marr, school of neutrality.
Kaye says ‘I am not the BBC’.
You are the BBC or it least it’s your voice on it’s programme.
I’m beginning to think she really is a bit dense.
Who the fuck pays your salary Kaye?
Best question of the call:
‘In what way does it not help [to tell voters the truth]?’
I laughed my ass off. Really, it’s time the First Minister skewered this nonsense at Holyrood.
Brilliant Stu.
You spelled it out. Loud and very clear.
BTW ref ‘Grouse Beater’ above and his letter of complaint to the BBC Trust.
This should be required reading for all Wingers, so here is the link.
https://grousebeater.wordpress.com/2015/03/17/how-the-bbc-erases-complaints/
I missed your bit on KallK today, but was stunned to hear that Elanor Bradford has found a nonce to assist with her NHS bashing as we get closer to the election.
What I would like to know is, is Rodger Livermore the love child of Elanor and Prof. Curtis?
I burst out laughing when she said ” your technically right”. Well Kaye, that means the Labour are wrong, so challenge them !
Deary dear, they really don’t like it. Good stuff Rev.
Well-done Stu.
For getting the point across clearly. Is obviously slab policy to churn out the “biggest-party” line as heard little else but that from them both last night and this morning.
When Kezia Dugdale vocalised it earlier she put on that voice she does when it’s apparent she’s trying to remember a “script”. (heard often in FMQ’s too).
The more slab repeat it then the more emphatically it should be countered and shown to be a blatant lie. Referring back to 2010 election is particularly appropriate way of doing this.
Textbook demo of how to Call Kaye. References available on request.
Great work Rev!
Given that nowadays The QT Panel normally contains one non-politician wouldn’t it be wonderful if somehow they could be persusaded to include Rev Stu in particular on any future edition from Scotland which also included Creepy Jim.
Even if it wasn’t an edition from Scotland The SNP seem to feature in the discussion every week these days and I’m sure Stu would manage to upset the Unionist applecart without breaking sweat.
Hey folks – were starting to get stuck in a rut here and like a mental dog were chasing our own tails.
My guess is labour will be rubbing there hands in glee and laughing there socks off at us getting stuck in this rut. I don’t blame fellow posters like myself on here. We need some sort of leadership by the SNP at this point. Am pretty disappointed if am honest there has been no strong hand on the go from the SNP.
Labour better not return double figures mp’s in May. But it’s starting to look that it’s possible. We need leadership. WHERE IS IT!!!!!
Right thread this time. Oops
She’s full of guff. Trying to act coy about politics. If the BBC waste their money on presenters who ask questions and then don’t like the answer, should they be in the job.
Kay with an E knows fine well Jim Murphy and Dugdale are liars, does that make her one as well?
Speak for yourself Kevin. I do a lot outside this site. I am contacting MSPs and MPs regularly with what I learn from Wings and other pro-Indy websites. I am sure I am not the only one. Educating them and chiding them to do more.
The problem is the mainstream media bias and anti-Scots agenda. Until we can prove that bias exists then the problems will continue. That said, I am urging MSPs and MPs to get their staff to check out the bias and act on it.
@Kevin Evans
If you really have a bee in your bonnet about leadership then you would do better by showing some yourself.
No point in sitting around waiting on someone to take you by the hand, grasp the nettle and show others what to do. Become a leader, don’t sit around waiting for one.
We all have it in us to take a lead, feel free to play your part, no point grumping about what you may see as the inadequacies of others before confronting your own.
@Author_Al
You were baited and caught by a “very concerned” independence supporter.
@Gone Tonto
Hey! I’ve got a mate that looks just like you 🙂
Well done, Stu…more of the same please.
Jim McIntosh says:
“When I’m confronted by people on line who insist on the ‘biggest party’ lie I usually point them to the Guardian ‘exclusive pictures’ of Gordon Brown’s last moments in Downing Street.
The caption with the first photograph is:
A hunched Gordon Brown (back right), Labour ministers and advisers including Alastair Campbell (standing left) wait for Nick Clegg to call with his decision on who will form the next government
Link: https://archive.today/ppWOY
Great images that sum up the situation perfectly.
The third largest party as Kingmakers.
“Brown takes the phone call from Clegg that seals his resignation. The Liberal Democrat leader elected to support a Conservative government.”
I wonder what the strop was like in the post broadcast session..
“I flunked it..” wail..
“But Kaye no one noticed that you hesitated just even slightly, you sounded great, you certainly put him in his place”.
“Anyway I have a bag of fan mail all hand written and underlined to reinforce how great you are”. “All signed Jim or Danny right enough..”
@ Tonto
Read his earlier stuff – wasn’t impressed – just said what I thought. He might indeed be concerned, or a troll, but I can’t be arsed to differentiate. I guess there will be more people coming on here as wind-up merchants – so they can say how vile we are. The thing is, they will say it whether we are nice or nasty.
Being nice, I’ll give Kev the benefit of the doubt.
Sorry, but Kaye Adams is wrong on this one. If she presents a BBC program, then she is the BBC!
To put it another way, if I turn up at someone elses workplace, while wearing my company polo shirt, badge and van, then I am my companies representative. If I misbehave or get something horribly wrong, my defence can’t be ‘It wasn’t me! It was my company!’. My company would have me hauled into a room wanting to know exactly what I had been up to.
So having Kaye Adams spit the dummy and having a slight hissy fit is not going to fool anyone. If she is saying that she is not sure about the finer points of politics, then she should not be discussing it. I certainly wouldn’t walk into a trading floor and start telling the traders what shares to buy or sell (though I probably couldn’t do any worse from what we’ve seen!). However, to be fair, she is not the only one. This has also been allowed to happen in papers such as the Daily Record.
But overall, there have been too many of them at the BBC allowing this to happen; Brian Taylor, Kaye Adams, and even Gary Robertson this morning.
They now have to set the record straight, and especially when dealing with Labour’s little slips, and bring those who fib …to task.
Kevin Evans says:
17 March, 2015 at 6:45 pm
“We need some sort of leadership by the SNP at this point. Am pretty disappointed if am honest there has been no strong hand on the go from the SNP.”
I agree.
The media will continue to let them get away with it.
Press releases will continue to be buried.
This single issue deserves an official SNP leaflet to every doorstep.
We can only do so much individually – so might as well make it an official flyer and do it right. We can all help to deliver it.
There is a reason Labour is punting this single message, robot style.
If an SNP vote is seen as pointless, then no other arguments matter.
The Lie is a big danger because it “has the advantage of sounding right”
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/analysis/314056-analysis-stephen-daisley-on-a-labour-and-snp-deal-after-election/
If it can be nipped in the bud, then it backfires for Labour, making them look even more untrustworthy.
There is a danger the current lead in the polls makes for complacency.
If this message starts to sink in, we could have left it too late, and Labour holds on most of their seats.
It would be a disaster for Scotland if they get a clear majority and can brush any new powers under the carpet.
@ the pnr 7:16.
Nail on the head Alex.
@ Kevin,
Everyone can do something.
A great leader is not measured by the number of followers he has, but by the number of his followers who become leaders themselves.
Since coming to this site, meeting Stu at Calton hill and attending a few events and gatherings, I’ve watched and listened to people becoming more confident and growing in their ability to go out and change things in their own way.
Can’t surpass Stu, but I can damn well try and do my bit locally to get people to question what they are told and try and jolt them out of their complacency and/or feeling of helplessness.
Talk to your friends and workmates, write to your MP, MSP or Councillor. Write to your local newspaper,engage with everyone you can.
Don’t let the lies go unchallenged, find your own voice and use it.
Simon Pia has been advising the Labour Party… is he related to the captain of the Titanic, in any way?
The sun will rise in the east and set in the west.. Pia – “That’s just your spin on it”
Just listened to this Stu – well argued! I don’t think KayE understood or actually cared about what you said. However the listening public will have understood.
Keep up the good work!
tbh the best response towards Labour’s TBPAFTG strategy is simply to ignore. What it is a classic attempt at trolling: The purpose of which is to upset and annoy people. Plus the more you talk about it the more some people will imagine that it’s actually a serious point.
You don’t have to be a politics nerd to know that the claim is bogus. There can be few people who don’t understand that a coalition which can command a majority of seats in the House of Commons will form the government- and if this isn’t the case then there’s little hope for us all anyway.
My advice to everyone is to simply ignore this claim and focus on things that matter.
Bird and Bradford “usual NHS Scotland storyline”
However “Public enquiry” called for ? Because “some patients die ”
Whilst in hospital” and apparently this is the fault of Health boards?
No doubt tragically sometimes Heath professionals “make mistakes”
However , surely not on a scale to warrant a Public Enquiry?
Threpnr
Changing the e-mail address and name “Bugger,” didn’t work and my posts still take anything from 20 mins to 40+ to appear.
BtP
Loved the Labour guy’s “Oh look, a squirrel!”
Kaye Adams, the sound of one neuron clapping, clearly has difficulty understanding the collective “you”.
She clearly had no clue about the LIE itself, nor did she understand it’s importance in swaying votes in the campaign.
Stuart Campbell was dealing with a dufus. That’s hard. Odds are, next time he’ll cross swords with a politically savvy BBC presenter. Much easier to counter mendacity than stupidity.
I only hope that, once Scotland gets independence and BBC Scotland becomes a Scottish broadcasting service dedicated to the Scottish people,people currently employed by BBC Scotland and being so biased such as Garry Robertson, Kaye Adams etc are not re-employed by the new broadcasting service.
Bugger the Panda
Matey, most of the time, I’m not seeing my posts appear until after 10 minutes after posting.
I’ve tried different email address, names, etc. No joy!!
One thing that makes me wonder though. My provider used to be TalkTalk, but it is now SKY. From the moment we started using SKY Broadband last August, the problem or ‘delay’ thing kicked in. However, if I post from my phone which is O2 …then ‘bang’ …it instantly appears on the forum.
To be honest, mate …I just run with it now. 5 minutes, 10 minutes. It doesn’t matter! I just tell myself, that just being able to post, even if it does take 10 minutes for it to appear, is better than nothing being posted at all.
Hope this helps!
Well Done Stu more of the same please.
Not long before WunderKayE came on with her refusal to measure up to ‘The Lie’ Gary Robertson on GMS allowed Kezia to state and state and state the ‘The Biggest Party Forms The Government’. No request for truthful clarity was made.
This was so, so unlike his previous interview attempts at exhuming the truth when he at least tried and was talked over. Gary Robertson I’d guess is not easily talked over, unless he’s on a managerial leash or has the occasional bad day at the microphone.
The two Lie incidents in the one morning: BBC Management must be happy their kids are playng their rules at last.
Stu, love you . I just missed your call this morning. You had the sanctimonious mealy mouthed crow on the rack. Fucking brilliant Stu, but you know what? Dick Murphy will still be out chanting the same mantra tomorrow & i am disapointed that our politicians are remaining silent when they should be ripping these ("Tractor" - Ed)s to their own peopleva new arsehole when ever they peddle their lies. Kaye , just didnt like it though and we all witnessed her imagiary invisable cloak vanish.
Ukaye claims to have a politics degree. Maybe she attended Uni and dossed about sniffing glue with Dim Jim. Maybe she can’t remember how many MPs Scotland has. Maybe she is a daftie???
I’m amazed you were allowed on air Stu. They all know who you are and what you do. By shooting her down as you did you must have made the blacklist. Or maybe they are so arrogant they wrongly thought they could handle you.
I never heard the programme itself only the snippet you posted. I thought she tried to interject and cut you short but you were off on your rant unable to hear her due to being a phone call and not face to face.
I hope she gets a bollocking for allowing you to finish what you were saying without stopping you. SLab must be furious and phoning BBC demanding answers.
Well said, with good evidence and a calm demeanour. I don’t think that Kaye was as outraged as reported, but she was ruffled. Simon Pia’s Labour bias was obvious, and his assertion that ScotLab was deliberately squeezed out from the left and right by SNP and Tories in some form of underhanded coup is laughable.
“I have to go into a ballot box and I have to decide who to vote for” said Kaye at about 4 1/2 minutes in.
Is she very small, trying to subvert democracy from the inside or just a bit flustered by the Rev?
Apologies if anyone else has pointed this out but it made me laugh.
@BtP and JTL
Me too, this has been going on for months with the delay in seeing your posts or others for that matter.
However, as mentioned earlier using an ? after the main title (delete comment-page ect) does seem to work most of the time.
Patrician, a regular poster here believes he has a solution for those that use Chrome though he is still testing it. See Off Topic thread from yesterday.
Like you I am cheesed off so hopefully Patrician can produce the goods.
@Kennedy
It’s not the first time the Rev has been on the Call Kaye show, he made an arse of them last time too and owned them.
I can only assume that both times he was allowed to put his point of view they hoped to ambush him, failure yet again.
Doubt he will ever be on again, after three times he gets to put Kaye on the mantelpiece. Well worth listening to is this.
http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-morning-after-the-day-before/
Just wanted to add my support and appreciation for Stuart’s contribution this morning.
He said clearly and pointedly what has needed to be said for a long time, and Kaye Adams didn’t like it because it was quite rightly criticising her and her colleagues.
She then went on to insult the intelligence of her listeners by repeatedly saying it’s all so confusing, as if that’s some sort of excuse for their poor standards of journalism.
Well done Stuart, keep up the good work. Soaring far above the main stream media.
( I love that B t P makes my day )
( I love that BtP makes my day )
I think KayE is much more suited to doing Loose Women.
How much does it cost to advertise on bill boards. If it’s not ridiculous could we not crowd fund a few strategic billboards with a black and white statement preferably from the cabinet manual.
We don’t need to many, a couple in each city and I suspect then we can rely on the media to report it.
Noticed when she asked about your voting intentions (rather leadingly IMO)
I thought for a moment she was going to follow up with “but you live in Bath and wont be able to vote in the Scottish referendum”.
But of course it’s not a referendum is it?
She so nearly tripped and fell there, pity.
Heard this live but missed the first few minutes so didn’t realize who it was. Made my day though.
Journalists don’t like being challenged. They see themselves as unbiased and informed.
The reality is they wouldn’t have got to where they are if they didn’t conform to the system.
Kaye Adams is reported to have a “property” in Tuscany.
I wonder if it is near Kirsty Wark and Joke McConnell?
BtP
Sadly I think it’s pearls before swine. People are supposed to go on Kaye’s and say they are voting Tory ‘cos blue is their grandson’s favourite colour.
Your input is as out of place as a discourse on dialectical materialism in the Sunday Post letters – hence why Kaye continues to play the every-woman role.
‘The BBC – dumbing it down so you don’t have to think. And now enough from you Gene Cernan – just to keep things fair- over to a man who believes all the moon landings were faked and apparently he can predict the future using his own nose hairs…’
@
Paula Rose says:
17 March, 2015 at 9:49 pm
( I love that BtP makes my day )
What are you after?
BtP (Gone Tonto)
Let’s be very clear here. Kaye Adams is a highly educated and politically savvy woman. For sure she knew exactly what the position is if there’s a hung parliament.She’s just toeing the BBC Scotland line that they’ll help Scottish Labour in any way possible.
Your are getting a bit fixated on this issue.
Your problem here is that, in practice, it IS true. Yes, there are umpteen possibilities but the fact of history is that the largest party (in terms of number of seats) HAS formed the government in the vast majority of Westminster elections. It is NOT a lie it is stating a matter of historical record.
OK UK had the point proved to her right left and centre and still refused to concede to an unequivocal fact?
Good old Labour- Rev put a spin on it?
A spin? Is that what you call a constitutional fact endorsed by the nation’s top civil servant?
For me I would like to condemn Labour rep or broadcaster to sue me for calling them a blatant Liar on this issue.
You are liars and you would not dare sue as you know that you are still running on scare and smear tactics as it is all you have.
@bookie from hell says:17 March, 2015 at 1:06 pm:
“Kaye denied shes BBC
who pays her wage?
just asking.”
Ah! Bookie from hell, now there’s a thing. There is a great deal of ignorance about that whole matter so here’s the truth.
The BBC is an independent, (as its title describes it), Corporation. It is legally independent of the United Kingdom Government.
The TV Licence Fee is not paid directly to the BBC.
It is a United Kingdom Government licence to view any TV broadcast from ant source and any place. The BBC collects the fee on behalf of the United Kingdom Parliament who then make a grant to the BBC for services rendered and I do not mean only public broadcasts. They run many services including radio, TV and other transmission interference.
Into the bargain the BBC also sells things on the open market including programmes. So in short the Government pays a grant to the BBC with money collected partly by the licence fee.
Stu, that was brilliant. PLEASE keep doing what you’re doing.
How much cash would it take to buy/start a newspaper?
The Slabbed lie exposed again on Scotland Tonight. Constitutional expert Prof. Trent setting John McKay straight…Murphy is a liar. Now that’s a fact!
Lets not be polite.
Fuck off Phil.
@galamcennlath says:17 March, 2015 at 1:40 pm:
“Kaye says she is “struggling a bit” … “I am not the BBC” … jeez!
Perhaps Kaye wi wan e’e isn’t the BBC but she sure as hell has a wee earpiece in her lug that connects her to the production team and they have wee earpieces ben their lugs connected to those further up the management tree. They are indeed all connected to each other, a bit like Cybermen with just the one brain between them.
Matter of fact most programmes billed as, “Live”, aren’t live but have a built in delay before being broadcast. This allows them to cut out and edit so called Live Broadcasts. Here’s another little clue – BBC Radio Scotland broadcasts these so called live shows over several different types of broadcast. Medium Wave analogue, FM VHF and Digital among them. Turn on any two of these at the same time and you will hear a delay between the two.
I know, I know, behind the times. I’ve had myself a very busy day and have only just listened to Stu on Kill Kaye.
She was humphing and hawing straight away and didn’t cover heself in glory.
Stu deserves the world self restraint award for that performance as I’d have had to explode in a fit of anti BBC rage.
@
Jen says:
17 March, 2015 at 10:39 pm
“Stu, that was brilliant. PLEASE keep doing what you’re doing.
How much cash would it take to buy/start a newspaper?”
If you want to make a small fortune in the newspaper business you need to start with a big one.
The Mirror Group ( incl D Record) is trying to buy the Express Group. The reason they are doing that is that the days of newspapers are numbered and by buying out their rivals, keeping the titles, political positions, some of the journalists, they can save on back office staff and have a heavier clout in attracting advertising revenue.
Without the advertising revenues many newspapers would have folded a long time ago.
If someone offers you a newspaper for sale, beware. They will be offering them for free soon enough and maybe paying you to take it off their hands.
That is the point of newspapers, as Chomsky said long ago. They deliver you to the advertisers. All else is incidental
Jesus wept. Kaye:” I don’t think telling the people this helps”. Telling the people the truth is not helping Stu do you not know that!
I can’t believe she said :” I am not the BBC”. You present a phone in on BBC Scotland for gods sake woman. Your job is to be bloody informed about basic stuff. If you don’t know ferk all about the constitution then don’t anchor a phone in. I really despair. There are 300 people on here who could do a better job. Its just a shambles our whole media.
You can now go on a live radio show and lie to the public and BBC permit this!
Stuart you rattled Kay. She didn’t like it. Keep going strong.
Phil you are talking out of your arse. Because something has happened a few times in the past. Through design,luck or opportunism. Does not make it a fact that it always happens.
Brown walked away from a coalition with the SNP and Libs because he was an arrogant bigot. He got first dibs despite having less seats than the Tories. The system did not prevent him from forming a government. He let the Tories in because of his personal vanity and anti SNP agenda. The system would have allowed him to form the government.
The only fact is you need majority support to form a government not the majority of seats. If 5 trees fell to the right in a forest in the past. That doesn’t mean the sixth tree couldn’t fall to the left in the future. It depends which way the wind blows it and how strongly. The only fact is that 5 trees previously fell to the right and the 6th could fall either way.
Just listened to the Rev, well done that man. Also watched Scotland Tonight and boy, haven’t Murphy and Dugdale been caught out. Great day for the facts. Labour in Scotland will have to try and find another lie, and we are waiting to expose that..tick tock.
aww. little miss huffy pants
Fantastic, the interviewer could not take it, her whole tone was someone who was bitter because a member of the public proved that the BBC are undermining the will of our nation. When I say a member of the public, I should of said a citizen who represents the public and has a higher standard of journalist credibility than the interviewer, and she knew it, caught red handed deceiving the public who pays her wages. Going to listen to it again and again.
@Phil Robertson says: 17 March, 2015 at 10:32 pm:
“Your are getting a bit fixated on this issue.
Your problem here is that, in practice, it IS true.”
Now either you are incredibly stupid, Phil, or are under the strange impression that we are.
So I’ll assume the former and set you straight. It is the party with a clear working majority, either with or without entering into a coalition, that forms the government post any UK GE.
It is thus not the single party with the largest number of won seats. As this coming election is far too close to call then there is unlikely to be any single party with, “A clear working majority”. It amplify that fact even with the largest number of seats won no party will have a, “clear working majority”.
As you do seem a bit thick, Phil, I’ll explain, just for you, why. If a party doesn’t have a clear majority then simple arithmetic dictates that the others together can call a vote of no confidence and throw them out. No party or coalition of parties can rule without a clear majority.
Is that clear enough for you now?
Heh. Just had the first chance to listen to this.
Full marks Rev.
The self-evident truth ‘confuses’ Kaye Adams, ordinary person that she is.
And oh look, a squirrel. You were hurting her feelings.
Like every other ‘journalist’ at the BBC, she’s a charlatan of the highest order.
Picking up on an earlier post drawing attention to Stuart’s tete’ a tete’ with lady Kaye I was reminded of the real reason behind Obama’s reluctance to overplay his hand in support of David Cameron. Hawaii !!! is threatening to conduct it’s own referendum and Obama could not be seen to provide support to Scotland and the concept of freedom
http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-morning-after-the-day-before/
http://freebeacon.com/national-security/hawaiian-independence-movement-attracts-chinese-interest/
@ Phil Robertson.
FFS, man, away and raffle yer doughnut.
Goodnight all.
Loved it! The defence mechanisms of Pia and Adams kicked in automatically. Pia’s voice drops down a tone or two and Adams hides behind ‘I’m just an ordinary person in Better Together woman in kitchen fashion’
“Your problem here is that, in practice, it IS true. Yes, there are umpteen possibilities but the fact of history is that the largest party (in terms of number of seats) HAS formed the government in the vast majority of Westminster elections. It is NOT a lie it is stating a matter of historical record.”
.
A lie that goes unchallenged is a lie believed. Repeat the facts carefully for as long as it takes to stop them uttering the lie.
“the fact of history is that the largest party (in terms of number of seats) HAS formed the government in the vast majority of Westminster elections.”
Indeed Phil, you are correct. let me say that again: YOU ARE 100% CORRECT.
However, that fact has no bearing of any kind in the rare case where we have had a hung parliament. Now what is the unique characteristic of a “hung parliament”? It is that no party has an overall majority.
So in order to look at the historical record as a predictor of outcome, we must first strip our list of all cases where a party won a majority of seats outright, n’est-ce pas?.
Now when you do that, the correlation between being largest party and forming a government is way less than 1 (perfectly positively correlated).
And we should also remember that correlation is not necessarily evidence of cause and effect (acting on our target variable) – as we see with your original argument. We had excellent correlation but the cause of that was due to an extraneous factor, i.e. that most of the time a party won an outright majority of seats.
So consider that you a comparing apples to moonrocks. We are dealing with the exception rather than the rule.
Which party has the most seats in a hung parliament is of no consequence whatsoever. ALL that matters is which party can command the confidence of the House by way of agreement (in a coalition or confidence-and-supply pact) with another party or parties to form a majority.
2. The counter from Labour empty suits invariably is “Well, if Tories are the largest party Cameron gets to be first to try to form a government.”
So what? Who gets first dibs is immaterial. ALL smaller parties will decided who to support based on their policy agenda and their political self interest. They’ll go for the choice that best serves them, regardless of who asks them first.
But hold on – here’s something you might NOT know . . . Turns out that under the Cabinet rules that govern these procedures, the incumbent PM ALWAYS gets first dibs on forming a new government in a hung parliament.
So it makes no difference if Labour come first or second since either way Cameron will ALWAYS get first shot at forming a coalition or pact with other parties.
You might then ask: What the hell are Labour talking about? The answer of course is that they are trying to inculcate a fallacy in the minds of (particularly) low-information voters, to instil fear that will drive them to return to the Labour fold.
Now if there is anything substantive in that explanation with which you disagree, by all means let me know.
Well set out, Christian Wright. Your explanation is far better than my own attempt. Thanks for that
Andrew Morton says: “Let’s be very clear here. Kaye Adams is a highly educated and politically savvy woman. “
Can’t say I saw any evidence of that in the segment, Andrew. I do not think she was being mendacious, rather that she’s just not the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree.
Well, I suppose we could add to that arrogant, imperious, and wont to preening self regard.
The revolution will not be televised – I guess it’s not gonna be broadcast on the radio either then.
I’ve met Kaye Adams and I and I can confirm she’s not intelligent. She’s a trained actress (done her degree in acting( not politics)) and she’s good at following instructions. That’s why she’s a presenter.
She follows instructions fed to her by BBC.
But to make it personal she’s an outright red Tory pure and simple.
Now when are the SNP gonna go on the offensive. We now are taken up the fight people like my grandfather fought for 75 years ago. Make no mistake about it. We are now in a fight for democracy.
We must win. The pen in mightier than the sword. Vote SNP
Definitely a case of “Teddy bear found ten feet from pram” where the delightful Ms Adams is concerned.
O/T I know.
But the Wee Ginger Dug is going to have a weekly column in the The National.Please buy the paper and enjoy his rants. Tell your mates.
Maybe even crowd fund a big billboard with the news.
ThePNR
See Off Topic thread from yesterday.
Cheers mate. Will do.
You have been blacklisted as a dangerous radical and Kremlin agent
Running around like a blue-ersed flea yesterday, I missed this and am just catching-up.
Jings, crivvens, help ma Boab Rev, you really nipped one nippy sweetie HARD.
I sense, perhaps, Ms Adams’ partner got his tea flung at him last night – the lady was not happy.
Dancer!!!
I may be forced to strongarm my family to buy copies of the National just for the Dug.
She aint too bright – but smart enough to follow orders from her unionist masters in the Beeb !
I’m gonna be a little controversial. I was listening to this show and I was looking forward to your comments. Tbh I was disappointed that you pressed too strongly and a little too personally. We need you to be invited on these shows regularly to dispel lies, but no one likes being told their are not doing their job. We need a voice and that voice wont be heard if it is not tempered with diplomacy.
On the whole though good job.
Still no one else picked up on Kaye saying
“I have to go into the ballot box…”
(at about 4 1/2 minutes into the clip)
I know it is just a slip of the tongue when under pressure but surely most people go into polling booths?
Definitely a cause for concern if she did go into the ballot box.
This sums up BBC complaints procedure. Say hello to lots more protests outside Pacific Quay –
https://grousebeater.wordpress.com/2015/03/17/how-the-bbc-erases-complaints/
Mr Robertson (10.32am) is like Murphy, someone who believes a majority of one seat is a working majority.
He forgets the first calculation made by a leader of any political party: at least two MPs will die of illness or old age, two more fired for corruption, and probably one cross the floor of the House to join the Be Kind to Badgers party.
Then there is the wee problem of all other MPs from all the other parties either voting against your bill, or undermining it by abstaining, and abstaining includes some of your own independent minded MPs.
Over and above all those misfortunes ranks the Vote of No Confidence in Her Majesty’s Government, a vote taken by all the other parties combined. Your party is out on its arse.
Hence, even with the election over and you have a few more seats that other parties, the need to secure a coalition or pact with another party is critical to taking power.
If you are unable to do that one of the smaller parties can wrench power from you by gathering up enough to have a greater tally than your party. A single party can take the chance of power from you to run a minority party because you were unable to convince anybody you had the support of as much as a flea.
@ Grouse Beater, and any other fans of old movie mis-quotes:
“Badgers, we don’ need no steenkin’ badgers! Well, unless of course they & their supporters give us working majority in the House.”
This sums up BBC complaints procedure.
Imagine if Savile was around now, still at work, and I was first person to blow the whistle on him – my complaint and warning would still be rejected!
@tony…
Whenever I listen to Morning Call, or whatever it is called, I hear Kaye or Louise or whoever they are banging on about balance and fairness and getting things into the open. They then shut down discussion, favouring pro Labour, anti Scottish govt sentiment. Gets repetitive and wearing.
So Stu was a welcome break, a fresh voice. Told Kaye the facts pleasantly despite the obvious sarcasm and mocking tone in her first few comments to him.
She played dumb and meant Stu had to be blunter. He was never rude. Using ‘you’ allowed Kaye to take feigned umbrage. She is paid by the BBC, sits in the BBC presenter’s role and is biased as f***.
Stu was remarkable cool and balanced, with facts to back up his assertions. Kaye was not and clearly wanted him to sit at the back of the bus for being naughty, forgetting that’s just where we like it.
I have to go into the ballot box
So do we – and we expect our journalists / TV presenters / Radio Hosts to actually know what they are talking about when they host a political show
or as another poster said – you’d be as well having the show hosted by a passing traffic warden
Christian Wright says
“So in order to look at the historical record as a predictor of outcome, we must first strip our list of all cases where a party won a majority of seats outright, n’est-ce pas?.
Now when you do that, the correlation between being largest party and forming a government is way less than 1 (perfectly positively correlated).”
Well let check the facts. At Westminster the last two hung parliaments resulted in the largest party forming the government. At Holyrood, the same applied in 1999, 2003 and 2007.
You have to go back to the WM election in 1923 to find the exception. In that case there were three parties each with more than 150 seats so it is not a good comparator for what is likely to happen this year.
I don’t challenge the assertions about the end effect being able to pass muster in the Commons not the incumbent being able to have first go at carrying on. Another reason is that they choose the time that they choose to resign. But neither is the central theme of this posting.
However I still maintain that the repeated assertion that saying that the statement the “largest party forms the government” is an outright lie is at odds with historical facts. Indeed its aim is “to inculcate a fallacy in the minds of (particularly) low-information voters”
@Phil Robertson –
Professor Alan Trench 11 minutes in on last nights Scotland Tonight…
http://player.stv.tv/programmes/scotland-tonight/
Eppy says:
18 March, 2015 at 10:01 am
Still no one else picked up on Kaye saying
———-
I refer my honourable friend to 17th March 4-18pm and there are others, I think.
I haven’t listened to BBC Scotland for nearly 3 yrs, and hearing that now doesn’t exactly tempt me put the tranny on. From what I remember K. Adams has form on taking personal insult whenever she doesn’t like hearing what she’s being told. It’s one of her classic get out clauses.
Respect Stuart!!!You said your piece and stayed on air! I can assure you this is a first for anyone who declares as pro-independence on this programme. Folk, calmly expressing clearly, well informed, evidence based, pro independence views are routinely cut short, cut off and have even been shouted at. Can’t express how satisfying I found your exemplary and successful contribution. – And absolutely fascinated by your second first in your call when Kaye Adams, clearly beside herself, was determined to take offense even when you explained the ‘you’ was for the BBC. Now that was revealing!
Nice one!
Robert Peffers says:
“As you do seem a bit thick, Phil, I’ll explain, just for you, why. If a party doesn’t have a clear majority then simple arithmetic dictates that the others together can call a vote of no confidence and throw them out. No party or coalition of parties can rule without a clear majority.”
Just noticed this erudite contribution.
For your information, the Scottish National Party formed a minority government in 2007 (with support from the Greens on certain issues). It had 47 out of 129 seats. It remained in power for the full term of the parliament.
Surprised that, with your superior intelligence, you don’t know/understand the basics of government!
@Phil Robertson –
For your information, the Scottish National Party formed a minority government in 2007 (with support from the Greens on certain issues). It had 47 out of 129 seats. It remained in power for the full term of the parliament
Oh come on Phil well you know that the reconvened Scottish Parliament was designed that no party would have an outright majority. We had Labour FM’s in a coalition with the Libs for the first two parliaments.
In 2007 when the SNP polled more MSP’s than Labour they could still have had a coalition with the Libs to keep the SNP out but the price was a Lib Dem First Minister and ignominy for wee Union Jack.
Wee Union still had to be dragged out of Bute House with his fingernails scraping the walls in his disbelief probably crying ‘Donald said this wouldn’t happen’
Now Phil at any point in that parliament Labour or the Libs could have tabled a no confidence motion in the government and won so why didn’t they Phil
As history has shown the SNP minority government made such a good job of governance that they were rewarded with the landslide win in 2011
KayE repeatedly asked the question “Which party are you going to vote for” so that she could draw out Stuart on the fact he doesn’t live in Scotland. Well done Stuart for not biting.
I think that people are being overly generous when they give her the benefit of the doubt. As has been pointed out she is a politics graduate and former political journalist. So the “Ah’m confused, ah’m jist an ordinary wummin” line, while it may fool the general listener, doesn’t fool the learned one.
Certain same subjects are regularly covered on the show, Scottish politics being one, but I’ll illustrate my point by using the shows coverage of cycling.
Every 4-6 months there will be a discussion about cycling. I can think of three that I have heard over the last two years, possibly there may have been more. In the first one angry motorist from Auchenshuggle comes on moaning about how cyclists “don’t even pay road tax”. Annoyed cyclist then comes on pointing out that “Roads are paid for through general taxation, that cars pay a duty based on their emmissions, and many cars are exempt from this too”. This is then discussed at length.
KayE has established that:
Road maintenance is paid for through general taxation
Cycles and some cars are exempt.
Fast forward 4 months, and cycling is in the news again.
Kaye takes a call from angry motorist from Stoneybridge, moaning about how cyclists “don’t even pay road tax”.
Kaye has learned 4 months previously that the caller is wrong. Instead of correcting the caller, in line with the BBC’s founding principles which are of course to educate, inform and entertain, she allows the wrong information to stand. Should no caller come forth to pass on the information KayE already knows then the listener gains the impression that the angry motorist was right. The listener has been ill informed and badly educated. Perhaps at least they have been entertained.
Fast forward a few months and cycling is back in the news. Repeat to fade.
KayE and any other presenter who allows information they KNOW to be wrong to go unchallenged are in effect complicit in allowing the telling of a lie. It’s as though they told it themselves.
In this case KayE personally has been pulled up for it very publicly. She must know that she is being watched to see if she allows this whopper to slip through again.
It should now though be blatantly obvious to the BBC that this lie has been flogged to death and they should not allow it to be passed off again without challenge. I foresee that it will probably be told again, and very soon. Probably by Jim Murphy or Kezia Dugdale. Probably at peak time, and certainly it will go unchallenged.
Would love to hear Stu in a debate with Murphy. It would be priceless. Maybe K. Adams could boost her ratings and get it on.
Wow. Right after Kaye Adams getting chinned for not challenging Labour, she lets the Labour man completely ignore the question and go on a three minute squirrel hunt.
That last part where she scolded you for “chipping in” right after asking you to speak – that was surreal. As well as dead funny.
Belter Stu, well said, and done.
STV clearly identifies the “untruth”. If there are lies and damn lies, does the context make this a “solemn lie”?
http://news.stv.tv/politics/314056-analysis-stephen-daisley-on-a-labour-and-snp-deal-after-election/
“Labour has strained to fight this narrative. It has claimed that the largest party always forms the government, which isn’t true but has the advantage of sounding right.”
“Think voters don’t understand parliamentary pacts? Don’t be so sure; they’re smarter than the political class might imagine.”
@Phil Robertson You do not get to conflate Holyrood’s proportional system with Westminster FPTP. The analyses is of WESTMINSTER results.
I must say it is a crude deception you tried to perpetrate. Doesn’t speak well of you at all, Phil.
Soooooooooo well done Rev.