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Wings Over Scotland


What might have and what did

Posted on May 12, 2014 by

It’s been fascinating to watch the media slyly turning Chris and Colin Weir’s quite understandable objection to being defamed by loathsome right-wing newspapers and MSPs into an attack on “cybernats”.

But this morning Alan Cochrane of the Telegraph – who we rarely read even for laughs now, so far gone is his grasp on reality – added a particularly deft twist which we thought worthy of note for those who like to study how the press does its business.

schrodingers

And yes, we entirely meant that double entendre.

“Is this the most vicious political campaign in modern British history? That’s what a visitor from Mars might well have concluded from a brief perusal of the Scottish newspapers in recent days.

Almost at the same time we saw supporters of the No camp – Vote No Borders – complain bitterly about the vicious personal attacks to which they’ve been subjected just for, well, saying what they think.”

Did you spot it, readers? Let’s try it again, this time with emphasis:

“Is this the most vicious political campaign in modern British history? That’s what a visitor from Mars might well have concluded from a brief perusal of the Scottish newspapers in recent days.

First up we had the Weir lottery millionaires calling for decency and an end to abuse – such as they say they’ve had to endure – since they decided to back the Yes campaign with large amounts of hard cash.

Almost at the same time we saw supporters of the No camp – Vote No Borders – complain bitterly about the vicious personal attacks to which they’ve been subjected just for, well, saying what they think.”

The attacks on the Weirs aren’t just something they claim have happened. They’ve been conducted in full public view, reported in countless newspapers. They’ve been perpetrated by a named Conservative MSP, in the open and on the record. They are indisputable empirical fact, and should not be talked of as mere allegations.

The “vicious personal attacks” on Vote No Borders, on the other hand, are somewhat of a more dubious nature. All comments on the group’s website have been deleted and commenting closed. Such examples as were fortuitously saved for posterity showed no evidence of abuse whatsoever.

There may, of course, have been some unpleasant remarks we haven’t seen, but there’s no proof of any. No saved files, no screenshots, no Facebook trail, nothing. We have nothing by which to judge their “viciousness” or otherwise, if they existed at all. Any responsible and professional journalist, therefore, would describe THAT, not the undeniable attacks on the Weirs, as the “claimed” abuse.

It’s hardly the first such case, of course. Every paper and broadcaster still routinely talks of supposed death threats against the comedienne Susan Calman as concrete definite facts, despite the fact that absolutely nobody – not even Calman herself – has ever actually seen them.

But the audacity of Alan Cochrane sowing a seed of entirely fabricated doubt over Alex Johnstone’s repulsive slurs against Chris and Colin Weir, just days after they were made in newspapers the length and breadth of the country, is a newly-plumbed depth even for the increasingly-demented columnist. It looks like we might have to reluctantly go back to keeping an eye on the mad, ranting old idiot after all.

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84 to “What might have and what did”

  1. heedtracker says:

    Old Cockers is great to watch on better together newsnicht though. Last time I saw him they had undone his straight jacket and he was tonguing the tips of his own incisors before he realised he was on telly, hopefully. It was a bit odd as usually BBC producers whip cameras off of unionists when look a bit creepier than usual. I think he was flogging his vote no or else half of a book but it’s nice that they let him out now and again.

  2. Doug Daniel says:

    “Any responsible and professional journalist”

    Aye well, that’s where the problem is.

  3. Howard Kennedy says:

    So to sum up; entirely predictable drivel and childish attempts to manipulate from the Torygraph. Just once I would like them to surprise the nation with an unbiased piece of real journalism, or am I asking too much?

  4. muttley79 says:

    Cockers is really not worth getting bothered about. That also applies to Mrs Cochers, Gardham, and the guy from the Daily Record (name escapes me at the moment). They are essentially establishment journalists. You know what you are going to get from them.

  5. bunter says:

    Journalists are really going to have a mega problem after the referendum if there is a NO, and their papers.

  6. panda paws says:

    Up is down, black is white and we’ve always been at war with Eurasia.

    The Big Lie seems to be the only bit of the Dritte Reich that will last anywhere near 1000 years! Not that I’m suggesting MSM are Nazis, that’s obviously only separatists 🙁

  7. He did something similar when Nicola Sturgeon “claimed to” receive threats. The guy’s an arse.

  8. Mary Bruce says:

    The campaign group “Silenced by Better Together” has some screen shots of comments on the Vote No Borders facebook page which were deleted. None of them look offensive.

    https://www.facebook.com/SilencedbyBetterTogether?fref=ts

  9. a supporter says:

    Never mind. Telegraph circulation in Scotland 18,000 pd to diehard unionists, and probably 25% giveaways. So it, Comical Cochrane and Spinning Jenny Hjul are totally irrelevant to Independence. They are farting into the wind.

  10. handclapping says:

    Torygraph not getting enough clicks. Wind it up, get the wife in, anything to get more clicks

  11. Mark J says:

    I got updated comments by email from vnb and it was hilarious. Every one was from a yesser and all very polite simply questioning the validity of their grass roots claims. As far as I could see they closed comments because non were from their grass roots activists at all.

  12. Helena Brown says:

    One of these days someone is going to go too far and boy I wish I had the Weir’s money, just a loan, because I am itching as I bet so many are at the disgusting behaviour of the press in this horrible UK.
    As for the man in question, cannot abide him or the paper he writes for.

  13. Papadox says:

    Think this lot is either morally/mentally challenged or zero contract workers for secret “intelligence?” Services. Or again they could be both (withdraw intelligence it just don’t sound right)

  14. Chris Darroch says:

    Excellent journalism ! Bravo.

  15. heedtracker says:

    The Weir’s will be a tricky subject for the Daily Telegraph. Is there any teamGB newspaper around that doesn’t worship unearned money, wealth, privilege, nepotism, royals, elitists, harder than what the Telegraph does?

    Mad old Cockers could easily get a job at BBC vote no Scotland but he doesn’t because he’s too much of lackey or not enough, you decide.

  16. JimnArlene says:

    I hope the Weirs get a public apology, though I very much doubt it.

  17. Thepnr says:

    I am happy that the MSM appears to be stepping up a gear in their virulent attacks on the Independence campaign.

    Steeping up a gear results in their articles looking more and more ridiculous, which at the same time allows me to point this out to genuine undecided friends of mine.

    Their pathetic attempt at journalism, with the attendant obvious lies and smears just makes it so much more apparent even to those who so far have not really paid much attention.

    The last 4 weeks of the campaign look like they could be fun. Bring it on.

  18. Big jock says:

    He’s a nasty wee piece of work. Full of venom like most right wing unionists. I try and avoid him as he makes me ashamed that he came from the same country as me.

  19. Evelyn says:

    Vote No Borders comments..I’ll post a few at a time…
    The comments below are from the Vote No Borders website. As I was one of the first people to register and comment, I then received all replies to my email inbox. Unfortunately, I won’t have copies of the first 2 or 3 comments before I registered and I also don’t have copies of my own, but I can assure you that I did not post any hateful comments on that site. Below are the comments which came after mine. I’m struggling to find the “nasty and virulent attacks” and the “outpouring” of “abuse” and “extremist” “venom” that “forced” the group to completely close down the comment facility

    Here goes:

    Vote No Borders.co.uk

    1 May
    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    These are fantastic! Ill-informed unionist views on a subject they clearly know very little about . I hope you have more to upload….comedy gold !

    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    In response to Cliff Allum : Braveheart: The woad to independence. Gibson’s Law, if a Unionist mentions Braveheart in a discussion about Scottish independence, they’ve already lost the argument and you are at liberty to guffaw at such braying nonsense. But for some it’s far more comforting to imagine that Scots are so gullible and easily led that we only want independence because of a Holywood movie that involved lots of people getting stabbed. The same sort of people usually believe that Scots are especially keen on stabbing, so there’s a kind of poetic circularity to it all. But back in the land of the grown-ups, a Unionist who goes on about Braveheart is behaving like a talking donkey, because they saw one in Shrek.

  20. Evelyn says:

    Nick Durie just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    This ‘grassroots campaign’, according to the Herald newspaper, “has been developed by” a “Millionaire” and “financier” called “Malcolm Offord, who has donated more than £100,000 to the Conservatives… Mr Offord’s partner in the project is Fiona Gilmore, founder of Acanchi, a London-based consultancy advising governments on brand management and “country positioning strategy”.” Didn’t take long to show that this is not only the exact *opposite* of grassroots, it is actually about rich Tories working with Tory PR gurus allied to the Tory government in Westminster setting up front organisations to funnel money into manipulating democracy through a web of deceit. Furthermore it seems remarkably similar in strategy to this latest NO campaign deceitful ploy: http://wingsoverscotland.com/picking-up-a-buzz/

    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    where are all the NO camp comments ?

    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    I WOULD LIKE TO CORRECT MY LAST COMMENT. Where are all the SCOTTISH NO camp? as the only comment here is by this guy and he’s in LONDON. https://www.facebook.com/cliff.allum?ref=ts&fref=ts

  21. Evelyn says:

    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    …WHY is this site based in the USA ?

    Jennie Macfie just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Every single person interviewed in the videos is from the Glasgow area. Nobody from Edinburgh, Perth, Stirling, Aberdeen, or Dundee. Nobody from the Borders or Dumfries & Galloway. Nobody from the Highlands, let alone the Islands. Two women to five men. How much did this cost? You were robbed, Mr Offord, you were robbed.

    Floople Poop just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    How can this be a ” Grassroots ” offering, if it formed and subsidised by a BoE executive?

    Cliff Allum just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Sorry folks I didn’t see all these comments until now I’ve been at work. It may come as a surprise but I think you guys have a little too much time on your hands.

  22. Evelyn says:

    Too Poor Too Wee just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Vote No Keep Trident Vote No Keep Bedroom Tax Vote No Keep Benefits Capped Vote No Keep yersel tae yersel

    N. O. Bodie just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    farah, A vote for common sense…. have we thought it through, will we be able to just jump in our car and drive down to see my family in england like we did the last time. Have they really thought it through. What a stupid thing to think, there is nothing to say and no proof that there will suddenly be a border crossing between Scotland and england when we separate. This is 2014 not 1914. There is no borders anywhere else in Western Europe, why should we suddenly stick one up at Hadriens Wall????

    Nick Brannigan just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    I am voting Yes to get rid of Trident, To create a Scottish Government that is accountable! I am really close to my English Friends, I detest the undemocratic Westminster rule, and hope that once Scotland is Democratically Separate, that I can enthuse my Welsh English and Irish friends to bring about the same change that is so desperately needed to fix the mismatch that makes London so prosperous and Lancashire and Dundee so poor! Be critical and question what you hear and read folks, and good luck on September 18th whatever you Vote. (joking, vote yes!)

  23. Evelyn says:

    John jsjamieson1 [at] btinternet [dot] com just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Any grass roots here are deep inside the Conservative and Unionist Party.

    Peter Piper just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Probably unusually for a long-term Independence supporter, I wish you luck with your venture. Not victory of course 🙂

    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    To answer your last comment Mr Allum from London. You can be at your work AND post on this site at the same time.

    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    I’m voting YES for SELF-DETERMINATION!

    Karen Brownlee Lvss just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    I’m Voting Yes to get a government i vote for , I’m voting yes to stop foodbanks, I’m voting Yes to rid Scotland Of Trident..I’m Voting Yes For Scotlands Future Generations , I’m Voting Yes For My Ancestors Who Would Expect Nothing Less From Me .I’m Voting Yes For Renewable Energy, I’m Voting Yes For free Education…I’m Voting Yes For Scotland To Keep The Money We Generate …

  24. Evelyn says:

    Michael Murphy just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    I’ve only watched the first one and the guy thinks london and the SE has too much economic power and that he would have quite liked devo max …. is this some site some kind of weird satirical joke !!!

    Andrew Clarke just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    For anyone planning to vote No in September, you have to be completely certain, beyond any doubt, that you are comfortable with the direction the UK is headed. You have to accept that the wider UK political landscape is being shaped by the far right, and that the mainstream parties (ostensibly the Conservatives, Labour and the Liberal Democrats) are being inexorably pulled ever rightwards in the scramble for votes. You have to be comfortable with the marginalisation and victimisation of the poor, with the dismantling of the Welfare State, the widening of wealth inequality between rich and poor, and the continuing erosion of workers rights. You have to accept that nuclear weapons and aircraft carriers are more important to you than education, healthcare and welfare for the elderly and vulnerable in society. You have to accept that, even if you do care about these things, your vote at Westminster will make no difference to the outcome. If you accept all these things unquestioningly; if you can reconcile your personal politics with what awaits a No vote; if you can consider all of these issues and conclude that a Westminster government can deliver the kind of society you believe in; then by all means vote No. But if you sleepwalk into this referendum, without making any effort to consider the case for Yes; if you squander this incredible opportunity to transform our politics, reclaim democracy, and build a society we can once again be proud of; then I can only hope that, when the full calamity of your decision is revealed to you, you can come to terms with your choice.

  25. Evelyn says:

    Keyser Soze just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    I’ve now watched all of the vids. Heaven help us ! These are hilarious …..def up there with ”wee dugs and sausage rolls” unionist vid.

    John Smellie just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Vote Yes! Save the Borders.

    Cliff Allum just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Ooops sorry again I have failed to respond to so many comments calling my parentage into question. (what happened to positive debate? Oh yes) I guess the problem is that I live in London which puts us in different time zones. I live in 2014 you need to put your watches forward 300 years.

    Stephen Davies just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    I really despair of the desperation of the Yes campaign’s efforts to stamp on any opposition. I am a business owner who will vote no because I believe it offers a better chance to all Scots of economic success and of fulfilling their potential.

  26. Evelyn says:

    British and proud just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Wow i see the usual cybertwat lynch mob are all over the comments like a tramp on a bag of chips as per usual. Why are guessnp followers always so angry and full of hatred? why do you all feel so hard done by and always screaming and shouting like the world owes you a favour? you lot seriously need to rid yourselves of those humongous chips from your shoulders and lose the victim mentality you just love to have and you might just find you will get on a bit better in life 🙂

    William Wallace just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Stephen Can you say a bit more about your vision for a future with scotland still in the uk? I look around and see young people with degrees not able to get jobs. I see Foodbanks and a situation where poor people are being sanctioned at a higher cost level than if they had committed a crime. We appear to be London City dependent and our governments (labour & Tory) have no other recognisable policies than to protect the City. Mr Osborne intends to reduce Scottish budgets by £4bn and labour have indicated they will do the same. The promise of more powers appears to be a sham. My friends are scared when they read the anger and threats against scotland in newspaper columns from supporters of the No campaign throughout the uk. My mother in law is scared because she believes that a No vote would see scotland ripped apart to ensure that the referendum would never happen again. In your view, what can we look forward to?

  27. Evelyn says:

    Craig Elliott just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Ladies and Gentlemen, I would ask you to consider something. You may have been receiving most of your information from the main stream media when considering how you will vote in the referendum. Are you aware not ONE national daily newspaper in Scotland is actually owned by Scotland. This includes newspapers such as the Scotsman and The Herald. From time to time there are some articles from some Journalists who have pro-independence views however these are dwarfed by other articles by ALL newspapers (whose UK HQs are based in England) and who have clearly taken a pro-unionist position. It is therefore no surprise or coincidence most articles are an attempt to scaremonger and mislead readers. Or the fact BBC Scotland has already been found guilty by the BBC Trust for misleading viewers in favour of the Better Together Campaign (yes, they kept that one quiet). The BBC were also monitored in an independent study by the University West of Scotland (Professor John Robertson) who f ound broadcasts significantly favoured the No campaign on a ratio of 2:1. It is for these reasons that so many YES groups have started grassroot campaigns as they know the main stream media is overwhelmingly favouring the No campaign and hence a voice is needed to counter the misleading information which is being given unanswered. How many times have Unionist politicians made speeches, not answered any questions and then left. David Cameron in the London Velodrome, George Orsborne in Edinburgh. How about those supposed public meetings (which were by invite only) from Gordon Brown, Ed Milliband, Danny Alexander, Phil Hammond, Alistair Carmichael. Again no opportunities for people to ask them questions. A speech then off. The No campaign are solely relying on the main stream media to make points as it means they cannot be cross examined or countered. Hence the reason why Better Together refuse to take part in debates all across Scotland. Tonight there is a major debate in Glas gow City Centre however Better Together refused to participate. Attempts had been made over the past few months to get representation from Better Together however every single Glasgow MP supporting the No campaign refused to attend and not one person from Better Together in the whole of the UK agreed to attend. Let’s be honest, there is virtually no grassroots campaign for Better Together as they have the media sown up. Seems simple, get your message across in a media that favour your view with no need to answer questions. If you are reading online articles then try and read those with comments to at least get another side of the story. Alternatively try and seek your information from many of the other sites out there that give differing views. You are being asked to make a judgement so please don’t just hear one side of the argument and from the same sources. Sorry but those who say they need more facts and information are not looking hard enough. The information IS out there. For the first time in 307 years you have total power on Sept 18th with one stroke of a pen to decide the future of your country. Do you not owe it to yourself and others to make sure you have done your best to make an informed decision?

  28. Evelyn says:

    Niels Ferksvard just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    Think I shall depart. Two Cybernats and a his dog. ZZzzzz

    Suzanne Bosworth just commented on The Voices of the People: spread the word:
    For those of you in Scotland, who live and work and bring up your families here, please take the time to look at both sides of the debate. Think about the kind of country you want to live in, and by what ethics and principles you want it to be governed by. How do you want your children to grow up and be educated? How do you want to see our elderly treated and looked after? Do you want Westminster to decide how much money Scotland should be given in return for all the taxes we pay (well over and above what the rUK pays, by the way) or would you prefer that the Scottish Government decides what to spend 100% of our taxes on? This referendum isn’t about Alex Salmond or the SNP, of course. They’re the conduit through which we gain independence and they’re joined on the road by Scottish Greens, Labour, Socialists, LibDems, SNP and even Tories. It’s a huge alliance of cross-party support seeking self-determination and the freedom to make our own decisions. The campaign is massive, far greater than the polls will show. Change doesn’t need to be something to fear. Change and development are positive and mature. Change happens when we compare what we have – poverty, foodbanks, a lack of affordable housing, our NHS being privatised, our postal service privatised, our oil revenues used up by Westminster over the decades with nothing left to show for it – with what we have right now in Scotland and can keep and develop: a free NHS, free prescriptions, free elderly care, an oil fund to build for our future, increased levels of income from new investments and businesses in Scotland, and much more besides. Come and find out what we can do in an independent Scotland, and hand on a better life to your children and grandchildren, and their grandchildren too. It’s understandable that you want assurances. You want to know about pensions, tax, the implications to the rUK of not having a currency union, education, health, defence, the list goes on, especially as the mainstream media won’t cover the Yes issues. The following sites are well-respected political blogs for independence that are recognised by the quality press as being authoritative and well-researched. Read them. Ask questions, put aside your preconceptions about the Yes campaign and find out more about independence and why it’s so important. This is not about seeking a party to run the country – this is about all of us in Scotland seeking to run our own country to our benefit, to rebuild ourselves as a successful, thriving and prosperous nation, and to continue being a good neighbour to the rest of the British Isles as well as being active and thriving in the wider world. Take time to understand both sides of the argument. Come along to a local Yes meeting, where everyone is invited – Yes, No, Perhaps, Don’t Know and anything else besides, and where we encourage speakers from both sides of the debate to answer questions. This debate belongs to all of us, so why wouldn’t we invite anyone who wants to come along. Talk to people. Share your thoughts and concerns. Visit these sites too, and connect with people: BellaCaledonia Wings Over Scotland NewsNet Scotland The very Sovereign Scots plus of course your local Yes Facebook page or Twitter group. Your decision is yours to make. But make it an informed decision

    THE END (Vote no Borders close down comments…)

  29. Lanarkist says:

    Cochers really has lost the plot, or the plot has really lost him! Trying to keep the threads of his multiple lies in order makes for some great entertainment.

    Happened to hear him on BBC Scot at lunch time, tearing a strip off J. Beattie for daring to question the reporting of politics in Scotland.

    Cannot remember the exact wording or what prompted it but it made me laugh.

    Co hers to J.B. You are allowed to comment on rugby but do not comment on politics.

    His righteous indignation was a sight to behold and made him sound as mad as a hatter.

    He really isn’t a class act and the more that his natural moral authority is questioned the more he loses it. His sense of entitlement is the only thing that dwarfs his ego!

  30. Peter Macbeastie says:

    I, to be honest, have never gone near Vote No Borders. It had the look of a unionist love-in and I’m allergic to levels of bullshit so high they’re getting up both nostrils.

    That they claimed to be the product of a grass roots organisation subsequently found to be a London based operation surprised me little; I’ve long since stopped paying attention to the fact that every Better Together ‘local group’ post seems to come from ‘near Glasgow’ which, in Facebook land, is exactly the same as IN Glasgow.

    Glasgow funnily enough, for those who are unaware, is where Better Together have their campaign HQ in plush offices in Blythswood Square. Offices which seem curiously quiet almost all of the time. Had a job interview up there last July, decided to sit and have my lunch in the wee park in the middle of the square what with it being a nice sunny day, me being ginger and there being shady trees in there. Nice clear view of Number 5. Lunchtime, mind. No one to be seen. No one in, no one out, for a full hour between half twelve and half one. Now, either they don’t eat lunch, they’ve got any activists chained to their desks, or there was no one in there.

    Oh, and just in case anyone should wonder how I come to be online so much today…. I use a system at work called Servitor. It’s broken and the relevant support has been summoned since our IT department have run out of ideas. The filing was all finished in an hour this morning. My thumbs are exhausted from all the twiddling. The whole reason for haunting WoS like a vengeful ghost today is to give my other fingers something to do…. wooooooo…. scary ghostie stuff… wooo…. still less scary than Better Together… wooo…..

  31. Pentland Firth says:

    I enjoy reading dear old Cochers. He’s always worth a laugh, and usually much more than one. We shouldn’t get upset by his increasingly deranged ravings or his vicious bile. He’s frightened by the future he sees unfolding before him, and we’re the ones causing that fear! The only folk who take him seriously are Rule Britannia singing, Union flag wavings die hard Unionists, and they’re never going to change their minds. They remind me of those Irish Unionists who never reconciled themselves to the creation of the Irish Free State in 1922. Sad, pathetic people. They are more to be pitied than scorned.

  32. Grendel says:

    Mr Cochrane is a national treasure, and should be locked away for safety.

  33. MochaChoca says:

    You’d think VNB would have welcomed input and questions from YES or undecided voters, afterall otherwise they would just be preaching to the converted.

  34. heedtracker says:

    This Telegraph weekend, a charming UKOK journalist said she actually saw Yes voters and “a pair of scrufs” she called them. The LibDem boss Wullie Rennie told AlicSalmin to “call off his dogs” when Wullie was commenting on the 200 protesters outside the Farage thing in Scotland. So they sure can dish it out, our betters.

    Scruffy dogs say vote YES!

  35. stonefree says:

    comedienne Susan Calman???
    Should that not be alleged comedienne Susan Calman
    Just for clarity

  36. Footsoldier says:

    Maybe the wrong post to comment on this but I cannot help feeling that there is still a place such as billboards to hit No with a few headlines whilst still keeping a positive campaign For example:
    Labour hid oil cash from Scots.

    We need to counter the MSM headelines with a few of our own, we are too soft.

  37. call me dave says:

    First Minister today on ‘Team Scotland’ snippet from Herald

    Commenting on the negotiating team, he said: “The independence team will secure expertise from across the political spectrum and beyond, and from Scotland and beyond, to begin talks with Westminster before the end of this September – marking the point at which the real negotiations will begin.

    “I understand that people on the other side of the political debate cannot accept that at the moment, but hope and expect that they will be fully part of the Team Scotland approach once the votes have been cast. It is also the case that a number of people outside party politics – but with key expertise – have already been approached and the response has been universally positive.

    “More clearly than anything else this demonstrates the wish of those of us on the Yes side to move forward in a consensual way once the people have spoken.”

  38. Ken500 says:

    Cochrane talks himself out of a ‘job’. Readership falling ever further. Hilarious.

  39. Richard Taylor says:

    Since when was this the nastiest political campaign in the UK, ever? Quite apart from terrorist groups ‘working’ for both sides in NI, mining and ex-mining towns still burn Margaret Thatcher in effigy. What about the BNP political campaign? When Conservatives and Labour put up signs saying things like, “New Labour, New Danger (demon eyes)” isn’t that pretty nasty? Or comparing a certain Tory politician to a vampire? Politicians get eggs and flour chucked at them fairly regularly. Isn’t that nasty?

  40. schrodingers cat says:

    ahem

    the act of observation, ie opening the box or indeed me posting a comment, collapses the 11th dimensional probability wave into an actuality, removing any other probabilities

    im sorry to say, cocherane has been a fossil for quite sometime, no doubt about it and i didnt even need to open the box to check

  41. Jim Marshall says:

    This rag Cochrane works for is named after a now defunct means of communication and will soon be defunct also.

  42. Findlay Farquaharson says:

    i dont agree with the sentimental terms such as dear ol cochers, national treasure and such, what i see is a toxic, nasty, opinionated man, livid he is being scrutinised by the online community and very angry his opinion is not being adhered too. he will challenge a yes victory, he will not accept it and will try to stir up tensions between people. in his world it his way or no way. just an opinion.

  43. Luigi says:

    Journalists!!!!!

    Journalists???

    I don’t know what we should call them, but they are certainly not journalists.

  44. bjsalba says:

    The technique described above is the same one as used by Naughtie on a regular basis.

    He is on a par with Cochrane.

  45. Gillie says:

    Q. What is the difference between Cockers and a flying pig?

    A. The letter ‘f’.

  46. Luigi says:

    Old Cockface should stand as a UKIP candidate.

    He certainly talks the talk.

  47. badgerboydarling says:

    hope the old cockroach and the neurotic ms hell have remembered to book the helicopter for the 19th of september then.

  48. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    I am Cybernatacus.

  49. bigGpolmont says:

    I would not have expected anything else from him and his rag

    Many years ago after an old uncle returned after many years from the colonial service I went to visit him I spotted that he was having the telegraph delivered. I and expressed my surprise He told me that was the mainstay for keeping alert in the colonies and the habit was one he could not break .

    But it is the most pathetic jingoistic venom filled waste of paper I told him “I will give you the first three desciptions but never ever the last .” firstly you go through it reading exactly the opposite of their news articles and you will not be far wrong, secondly its been my puzzle book correcting grammar and mispelling has kept me alert for many years and finally even way Back in those days they hired sub standard cowboys as journalists
    the cost of toilet paper is horrendous in Africa and when your miles from anywhere it really comes into its own !

    true then as it is now !
    He also said that as it hired nothing but cowboys it was know in the foriegn and commonwealth office not as the Thudererer as they would have you believe but The daily Ponderosa ( the ranch in the western series for younger readers)

  50. Jim Marshall says:

    I am Cybernatacus.

  51. DaveDee says:

    I wonder if Vote No Borders have reported these vicious attacks to the Police?

    Did people not have to register to post on their forum so surely they have the email addresses of anybody that threatened them.

  52. heedtracker says:

    The mad old fart doesn’t disappoint today either. Gasp as the teamGB far right weep over long dead Labour dude. Cheer at the outrage, we gave them a parliament, now the blighters want to run Scotland, groan at the sheer stoopidness of Labour in Scotland, its all their mediocre fault don’t you know. John Smith must be reappearing all over the shop right now, like a BetterTogether Alex Guinness in Star Wars, episode VI, Alan Cockers, use the force and keep taking your medication, you’re coming across as a far right lunatic.

    “A Labour Party with no vision was confronted by a movement with only one – separation, the very antithesis of John Smith’s dream.”

    http://archive.today/T3UAR

  53. Jim Marshall says:

    Evelyn

    I read through these No Borders posts and there is some excellent writing there for YES. No wonder they shut up shop.

  54. Thepnr says:

    @Jim Marshall

    I read all of them before they were pulled and of course there was NO nastiness or venom. Liars just can’t help themselves.

  55. Harry says:

    Prepare for possible pensions scare propaganda on Reporting Scotland tonight.

  56. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    Next-generation VNB adverts have started to appear:

    http://i.imgur.com/J9myzN5.jpg

    (Cybernat-style)

  57. Greannach says:

    The Nob Orders website still allows people to ask questions, but not the see the questions already asked, like “Can I put empty crisp packets into the recycling bin?”, “Do you think I should buy a Volvo?” or “What is the highest mountain in Venezuela?”.

  58. seanair says:

    And don’t forget Cochers is a big pal of Brian Taylor (EBC). They cover up their meetings by pretending to be Dundee Utd. supporters. Would like to hear their conversations!

  59. Craig P says:

    Richard Taylor says:
    Since when was this the nastiest political campaign in the UK, ever?

    Perhaps Alan Cochrane has had exclusive foresight of Better Together’s plans for the summer.

  60. MIdgehunter says:

    TESTING

    Comments from me seem to be disappearing into thin air.

    (Not that anyone missed them of course ..!) 🙂

  61. heedtracker says:

    Pico Bolívar is the highest mountain in Venezuela, at 4,978 metres. Not a lot of people no that.

  62. dunghurlersunite says:

    Why not invite these so called journalists/editors for a T.V. debate?

    I they feel so strongly about their convictions I’m sure they can put up a good argument. If not then all their BT bias will be on air for all to see.

  63. G. Campbell says:

    The Guardian: Overseas students warn Scottish independence could put off applications – survey

    “A survey of 200 overseas students by the online student magazine ChinaGirlsAbroad found many come to Scottish universities because they want ‘brand UK’, and that would be affected by independence, says editor [b]Yajun Deng[/b]”

    “The effects of independence would be felt almost immediately by universities, and in this, the results of the survey point to very serious issues for the future.”

    Yajun Deng > favourites > other: Better Together
    https://www.facebook.com/yajunadela

  64. G. Campbell says:

    chinagirlsabroad.com

    “The results raise serious questions for universities in Scotland, since a sharp decline in numbers of international students could potentially lead to redundancies and severe cutbacks in areas such as the development of accommodation, as well as academic provision.”

    ChinaGirlsAbroad @CGAbroad
    https://twitter.com/CGAbroad
    followers 4

  65. Greannach says:

    heedtracker –

    Thanks for that snippet, but should I buy a Volvo? If you answer that correctly, then I’ll know you work for the Nob Orders!

  66. OMG . . . Nob Orders have nione of their ‘real people’ splashed across nine pages in today’s Daily Record.

    Nine pages !

    I think Wings, YES and the SNP had better start splashing some of the accumulated cash on big advertising right now.

    Doesn’t most of it need to be spent before the end of the month ?

  67. The Man in the Jar says:

    I am not long back from the supermarket where I noticed the headline in the Scottish Express it gave me a “You couldnae make it up” moment.

    “Independence will hurt the Scotch Whisky industry”

    Honestly!

  68. heedtracker says:

    @ Greannach, buy a Volvo and stick a big YES on the back. Also I am the Nob in nob.orders.co.uk, mahogany perma tan, 60 grand gold rolex, yacht club blazer, massive over estimation of my own brilliance…

  69. rab_the_doubter says:

    Read some of the comments by the noborders ‘real people’. Im surprised theyre not banned from their own site.

  70. badgerboydarling says:

    First it was the Russians now its the Chinese the bitter together mob are getting to do there dirty work. Desperate or what?

  71. Greannach says:

    I don’t want to comment on the photogenic appeal of the Nobs in the Nob Orders adverts, so I won’t say anything.

  72. MIdgehunter says:

    @ Heedtracker

    Pico Bolívar is the highest mountain in Venezuela, at 4,978 metres. Not a lot of people no that.

    And there’s me thinking that Salto Angel was a surfers paradise… 🙂
    (Spent some time working in Caracas..)

  73. G H Graham says:

    Off topic but when is Brian (Toodloo the noo) Taylor expected to spontaneously combust?

  74. Truth says:

    Jumped off the paqe as soon as I read it.

    Aye, you get a nose for bullshit after all these years.

  75. Iain More says:

    So what is Torquemada Crichton’s role in all of this?

  76. ronnie anderson says:

    Prohabition in America could’nt stop the Sales of Scottish

    Whisky so whit chance have Westminster/EU, it will be more

    noticeable in Tax Revenue in a Indy Scot as the export tax

    /vat will be payed in Scotland,& no more Westminster labled

    Scotch Whisky in westminster shoppe.

  77. Seepy says:

    Calgacus McAndrew @5.40pm

    At least Karen isn’t from “the Glasgow area”. I don’t know of anywhere called Pollock in or near Glasgow. Authentic grass-roots or what?

  78. keaton says:

    @ Seepy

    Maybe she’s from the Pollock Halls student digs at Edinburgh Uni.

  79. ianbeag says:

    Wee Duggie being challenged by ‘Brillo’ on Labour’s latest poster claims and growing unease of colleagues for his election campaign strategy – over to Guido Fawkes
    http://order-order.com/2014/05/12/knives-out-for-wee-dougie-as-insiders-prey-for-axe-swing/?utm_source=Guy+Fawkes%27+Blog+List&utm_campaign=9fbf38eefc-happy+hour&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_547885726c-9fbf38eefc-229867597

  80. Tam Jardine says:

    I remember taking a look at the comments on VNB and as the comments were typical ‘vile cybernat abuse’ in other words a mix of powerful political statement, jokes and craziness of varying levels of wit (some of it extremely funny) and some of the forum style conversation from wings, I thought, why not?

    There were a lot of people putting the case for independence forward and I answered the request for feedback and put a few lines together.

    I have a record of about a dozen posts from the emails I received – nothing untoward there. Had there been a shred of abuse it would have been in every newspaper the next day. That means there was none, and that’s what guys like Cochrane can’t handle- the discipline.

    This campaign ain’t going the way they planned and the Yes campaign is much more disciplined, much broader in support and much better informed than they had envisaged. The answer for No is to carry on regardless with one of the largest propaganda assaults I can think of this side of the second world war.

    They are losing this. No one goes from Yes to no. In any yes/no argument (and there are thousands taking place every day) are there any attempts by No to talk the advocate of Yes round? My experience is the entrenched No voter will simply attack, NEVER try and win me round with advantages of the Union.

    This negative, shoring up of votes approach is risky. Everyday the flow is one way only.

    As for Cochrane’s distortion of reality, it’s further evidence that the MSM journalists are entering the realms of a kind of cult group think. He is to be pitied.

  81. X_Sticks says:

    Well gutted Stu. I always try to find the best in people, but I can’t find so much as a scrap of integrity or anything to like in Cochrane. Fundamentally nasty if you don’t share his view.

    @Evelyn

    Really good post Evelyn, but would have been a whole lot easier to read with some paragraph breaks. (Rumour has it that paragraph breaks get you brownie points with Rev Stu and that if you accumulate enough brownie points has sends you a Wings badge, but you never know whether you can believe some of the misinformation that these Wings people disseminate 😉 )

    @G H Graham

    “Toodloo the noo..spontaneously combust?”

    19th September? Could set off the whole of PQ. Ach, I can but dream…

  82. What is it with the no camp and Echo chambers?

  83. pa_broon74 says:

    Just another example of the no campaign in its manifold forms confusing ‘vile abuse’ with being corrected.

    The British State pretends to be this stoic ever present force in the world, yet, at times its various reps & supporters can become the most whining sniveling little poltroons* you’re ever likely to meet.

    * My new favourite word for the week.

  84. Stevie says:

    I am Cybernatacus.

    I followed the Vote NO Borders comments threads i ndetail and never saw any examples at all of unpleasantness from the ScotNats – to be fair, the BritNats haven’t been their usual nasty selves but they do demonstrate an unhealthy degree of arrogance in their comments. Another FB page however does keep a horrid record of cyberbrit bile, insult – their nasty comments and their death threats are saved for public consumption via screenshots.



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