The public interest
Posted on
September 12, 2013 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
One of the most encouraging aspects of the pro-independence movement is the strength of real grassroots activism compared to its Unionist opponents.
So here are a couple of nice shots of a well-staffed Yes Scotland stand attracting lots of attention from students at the Glenrothes campus of Fife College recently.
And a few feet down the corridor, the “Better Together” one.
Och, someone get the poor lassie a book to read or something.
Perfect illustration of hope vs fear.
Let’s not feel too sorry for them. There are yogis in Himalayan valleys who spend decades trying to attain such perfect solitude.
It is not, you know who….. A world tour beckons.
nicely placed next to the exit.
Not another “lonely UK-OK lady”? 😉
It’s amazing Susan Boyle found time from her busy schedule to man a UKOK table.
This gives me hope. I hang about in circles that tend towards ‘no’ and get frustrated. Seeing the larger picture (be it ‘likes’ on Facebook, busier online activity, more numerous and better attended meetings) makes me think we will pull this off.
@ Doug
Not to burst your bubble but I’m responsible for at least 26,000 of those likes. Monthly….
Is it not the same lonely lady? She does put the miles in.
No sympathy for anyone that sets up a stall to belittle Scotland, their ain folk and insinuate that their all cocks.
Stuck inside Glenrothes with the Union blues again, as Bobby D nearly sang.
U-KOK definitly seem to be fighting a losing battle and if it wasn’t for the media aiding and abetting their peddling of lies it would be plain for everyone to see. How I yearn for the day when we have an impartial and honest press.
Here’s the magnificent Eric Carmen (no stranger to hair-care products bearing the same name) with an apt tear-jerker:
Seems appropriate the blue balloon’s burst…
Why is no one from the Yes stand engaging her in debate? Poor lassie.
She has a copy of Thatcher’s memoirs in her bag, and is wondering if it’s safe to get it out & read it.
(whoops its me – forgot I volunteered for that one, doing well aren’t I?)
castle hills chavie
I’m advised that the blue one is there, it’s just hiding behind the red one.
Sorry to go O/T, but what is going on with this Derek Bateman blog? Is it for real?
http://www.derekbatemandotnet1.wordpress.com
In all seriousness (most unlike me), my son was there manning the Yes stand today. 19 y-o.
Scaredy Cat:
It is satire.
http://derekbatemandotnet1.wordpress.com
Sorry not sure previous link works.
scaredy cat
?
http://wingsoverscotland.com/a-sense-of-priorities/#comment-535818
scaredy cat – I originally thought that the ‘blog’ was either a spoof or ‘Black ops’ poor in either case. It now appears that it may be satire from Derek Bateman himself!
Nice to see G Brown’s and previous principle’s labour hideout being invaded by the YES team.
G Brown is chancellor of the College. (for how much longer?)
I know the college very well and the YES team too.
@Marcia
Thank God. It seemed so far fetched but then seemed to end abruptly.
saying no sometimes is a real turnoff, this seems to be such an occasion, they there suporters now only say it in a whisper, we all know what the whisper game produces. Looks like she feels like a whisper, or needs one.
Ironically, it looks like she is trying to block the exit.
Move over darling, we want oot!
Hahaha. You see. This is what happens when you drink red wine and read WoS backwards. My humble apologies :-/
The UKOK mob are too busy dreaming up scares and smears to sit on stalls answering difficult questions like what is the positive case for the union? I see the Daily Record’s seen fit to have a go at you today. sorry that you’re in the firing line just now. Keep on doing what your doing you’ve clearly got under their skin. Anyway their attacks didn’t have the desired effect as I’ve just subscribed to Wings. YES 2014
Bateman blog – spoof I assume but well crafted.
o/t Sorry Rev but this could be important. Apparently the leader of the Labour Party in Scotland, has been spotted on Glasgow’s southside looking for a Subway, it is reported that she is looking for toast.
OT
Westminster MP’s expenses details released – Jim Murphy leads the SLAB charge to the trough.
Full details here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuKClsmdCNgddEJ4RGx4bllaeWcxT1lGa2x2TXVDanc#gid=0
why do you have to knock something down whilst building the yes camp up. This is reminiscent of playground bullying. Im no moral arbiter, but surely the debate is above what is, if you scratch the surface, something rather distasteful. Be better than this. The content doesn’t need nasty spin. Exemplify tolerance, because we need it. #bethebetterperson
I also attended a Yes campaign meeting in Elderslie village hall on Monday night, its small meetings like that which are happening all over the country and are rarely heard about. We are quietly going about our business, chipping away at the No vote. All of which will culminate in a glorious victory on 18th sept 2014. The Edinburgh rally on 21st sept 2013 is just a taste of the enthusiasm and energy that is oozing from the Yes Campaign.
Aye. Ending up on your Jack Jones. Miserable. It can happen to anyone:
“why do you have to knock something down whilst building the yes camp up. This is reminiscent of playground bullying. Im no moral arbiter, but surely the debate is above what is, if you scratch the surface, something rather distasteful. Be better than this. The content doesn’t need nasty spin. Exemplify tolerance, because we need it.”
Lord forbid anyone have a sense of humour. We must create a po-faced Scotland that would suck the life-force out of anyone.
Why is it “distasteful” to note that one side has greater grassroots support than the other?
BTW, anyone else seen this:
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/video/thinking-aloud-scottish-independence-101219994.html
Nice mix of Magrit’s bollocks, Niall’s cringe and Natalie not exactly covering herself in glory….
In the interest if fairness; were all the photos taken at the same time?
James Kelly MSP
Oh dear.
(apols for knocking someone down)
Think Bateman needs some support here. He stated clearly “I still support independence” and I believe him in this. What he does need though is to find a constructive way in which to focus his independence instincts and energy, rather than continue to inhabit this self-doubting, immediate post-retiral fantasy world of his. The urge to seek attention and to “confess” is to gain acceptance and recognition by the gang he really would like to join. So let’s invite him to the party – I’m sure he could contribute a lot!
Serious questions here: Is there anything that SLAB would feel the need to apologise for in Scotland? Have they actually apologised about anything ever?
Iain
I think James Kelly is as thick as mince but perhaps the SG should convene an inquiry and then hang SPT Chair, Labour Cllr Alastair Watson out to dry for buying £840K worth of unnecessary land. [pdf link page3]
@Iain – Just witnessed Mr. Kelly on Newsnight. Clearly very uncomfortable at trying to defend the conduct of his leader. Stewart Maxwell basically skewered him to the point that I feared for Mr. Kelly’s health. I think the colour he turned is described as puce. Fortunately for Mr. Kelly the debate was short and I am sure he will make a full recovery.
@Karamu
The problem is neither Magrit nor Natalie are any good at “thinking”, let alone “thinking aloud”. I gave up after 10 seconds of Magrit’s diatribe about how we only survived the (Union inflicted) banking crisis by being part of the Union. Oh, and also that oor Magrit was proud of being Scottish and proud of being British, no-one more patriotic than me , blah de blah…
muttley – aye, Lamont apologised on behalf of all of Scotland for the release of Megrahi, remember?
I was boiling with rage that day. The nerve of the woman…
@Doug Daniel
I honestly can’t ever remember Labour in Scotland apologising about anything they have done? Maybe they have never felt the need. The strange thing is they are always criticising Salmond. However, when he has made a mistake over a figure, he has gone to Holyrood and apologised.
“Stewart Maxwell basically skewered him to the point that I feared for Mr. Kelly’s health.”
He was doing well until the end, when he let Kelly off the hook to crowbar in a crappy “Project Fear” soundbite.
mutley79
To be fair, they do seem to have an increasingly common habit of apologising to their dwindling number of supporters for losing elections!
Blocking the bloody fire escape!
Doubtless this constitutes yet another BT ‘event’.
More like an event horizon.
@Rev – Fair point.
Just watched the second installment of “The Fear Factor”… absolutely brilliant :o)
Episode 1:
Episode 2:
…next episode on 19th (next week) :o)
@Alan Gerrish
It was pretty horrendous, wasn’t it?
“why do you have to knock something down whilst building the yes camp up. This is reminiscent of playground bullying. Im no moral arbiter, but surely the debate is above what is, if you scratch the surface, something rather distasteful. Be better than this. The content doesn’t need nasty spin. Exemplify tolerance, because we need it.”
Lord forbid anyone have a sense of humour.
#not what i’m suggesting
We must create a po-faced Scotland that would suck the life-force out of anyone.
#argument lacking in maturity i’ll move on
Why is it “distasteful” to note that one side has greater grassroots support than the other?
#now we are somewhere. It is not ‘“distasteful” to note that one side has greater grassroots support than the other’. On the contrary, that is journalistic commentary. The manner in which you did it is distasteful. It was #sneer and #smear photo op. Look, i’m not here to harangue you. I’m not out to make your life more difficult. But I am someone looking in, and I so want the debate to be removed from juvenile craic that when you scratch the surface of it, really feels quite nasty and unnecessary. I think there is always a reason we are why we are. I’ve made my point, and whilst it may not be agreeable, i hope it is welcome. As i said earlier on twitter, no agenda, ‘just gut feelings of wanting to make things better by being better. Good speaking with you, even if we differ’
no agenda
snigger
Apologies if anyone has posted this already but it’s late and I’m just in from the pub
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/video/uk-numbers-scottish-independence-150409927.html
TWO of the male front-runners to be Labour’s candidate in the by-election to replace convicted wife-beater Bill Walker have ruled themselves out of the contest, as pressure increases for a female candidate to be selected.
Former Dunfermline Athletic manager Jim Leishman told The Scotsman he had decided not to seek the Labour nomination after previously saying he was considering the move.
scotsman.com/…/…
“Look, i’m not here to harangue you. I’m not out to make your life more difficult.”
Stop doing those things, then.
Sorry, I’ve no sympathy for someone who sits at a desk with the symbol ‘you cock’ in front of it, and then doesn’t get any takers…
It’s just plain nasty.
I’d be inclined to walk past …and mouth ‘you asshole’
Re the BT lassie, I guess they needed someone at the door to tell people where YES Scotland were. Looks like she was doing a good job.
Scottishmatters,
One of the things I appreciate about this site is Rev Stu can post an item and by the end of the topic , there can be discussions about classical music,cats,GM crops,every pub in Edinburgh suitable for a get together ,you name it,its discussed.
Your sentiment of “just gut feelings of wanting to make things better by being better ” is very laudible but better than what ?
As an ordinary member of the public eligible to vote in next years Referendum, I don’t force my politics on other people ,yet I have been told I voted in a dictator, the job I do is not good enough and responsible for plunging targets (people), the school my children go to is not providing the education that other countries children receive, the food I eat is tainted by either the environment I live in or by factories I have no control over ,in order to maintain employment I must have weapons of mass destruction living near to me and you ‘think we must exemplify tolerance?’.
Unfortunately as proved by Anas Sarwar in last weeks debate, the current strategy of the Labour party at Holyrood and the constant presence of the Herald and Scotsman journalists lurking more on Twitter than actually writing anything of any validity , you cannot be better for both sides.
Can I ask what kind of reception your appeal got over at Better Together ?
I just hope that on Independence Night, somebody gives her a glass of wine, a big hug, and asks her for a wee dance. She will be forgiven.
“Look, i’m not here to harangue you. I’m not out to make your life more difficult.”
Are you here to bore us then?
Get a life and a wee sense of humour.
Great post Molly. I’d be all for a good quality, polite and fair debate. It isn’t happening, and I can’t see it happening. The NO/Westminster crowd and their tame media have instead spent the past 2 years (at least) denigrating, abusing and insulting those who dare disagree with them. Natz, cybernats, separatists and some pretty sickening abuse towards our elected government as well.
Frankly I think we should be angry at the way we, and our country, is being treated and if those provoking that anger don’t like it, tough shit. I won’t apologise for being angry. I’ll always be polite to opponents to their faces because at the end of the day they’re all human and I wouldn’t treat anyone the way we get treated by our opponents. Plus it’s counter-productive in most possible ways. But that doesn’t change the fact I’m angry and at this stage fail to understand why any remotely decent person living in Scotland would be seen dead around the UKOK campaign.
marcia said
“It is not, you know who….. A world tour beckons.”
Spooky, my thoughts exactly
scottishmatters says @ 11.00pm
are you kidding me? the amount of negativity and mocking from the no’ers is sickening but a little (justifiable) leg pulling from the yessers and someone gets out thier soapbox about how serious the subject is,
Believe me scottishmatters
noone knows just how serious this is MORE than the yes campaign and the onslaught of abuse and diversionary attacks by the no campaign is a very revealing factor in thier campaign so far which has not come up with ONE SINGLE CONCRETE REASON why we are actually better together so resort to petty childish attacks , the only thing they haven’t done (still time) is hair pulling
why dont you
A get a life
B get a sense of humour
C get a significant other
sorry if you have all of the above but your post made me momentarily lose MY sense of humour
rant over.
soor ploom anyone?
Was looking for some coverage in The Herald re yesterdays FMQs and Lamonts attempted smear and found hee haw. Ian Bell used to do a wee piece every Friday, but so far, diddly squat.
Surely someone should ask Jl to repeat her remarks word for word outside of holyrood and let’s see what her reaction will be!
Here’s a story to lift hearts. A 20 year old lass joined our section in April there. Once she got to the section, and she realised that 2 of us were hardcore Nationalists, she began asking me questions about the referendum. Well, after a few rounds of history, politics, moral values and the reasons why Scotland should be independent, she was more knowledgeable in the subject, and she said quietly to me and my workmate that she would vote ‘Yes’ next year.
Well, the other morning, she came in and told me that she had been at a dinner party with 6 of her friends, when the topic of the referendum came up. Her pals were all saying ‘oh, Britain, UK, UK, I’m British, but Scottish, but British, blah, blah, blah, blah’. To their astonishment, my wee pal got stuck in, and hit them with facts. They were rocked that their friend (who like any other 20 year old is more interested in fashion, music, films, celebrity culture and all that nonsense) was battering them with hard core facts that only a politico would know. They were stunned that she knew all this! In the end, they got the computer fired up, and they were googling to prove my pals facts …which to their shock …found that she was right. Stuff they never knew, was being opened up before their eyes.
Apart from one person, five were converted in that one night. I have told her to tell her pals to come to this site if they want more facts, to ask questions, or just to see that there are other folk out there who are thinking just like they are.
This raises the same fact that we have all said on this site. These young folk were ‘No’ers’, but all it took was a few facts, and within an hour, they were turned into ‘Yes’ folk. The problem is that the vast majority of Scotland do not know the facts. It is as simple as that. They just don’t!
However, what gives me hope is that by next summer, when this subject will become a red-hot potato (more like white-hot), that from not knowing or appearing not to care, the people of Scotland will want to know the facts, and once they get them then, oh by God, I can see an upsurge in the Yes vote.
If one wee lassie can convince near enough all her pals in one night by giving them the true facts, then it certainly gives me hope for next year! Salmond was right …this is the phoney war. The real war is next summer.
JL’ s style is that of a playground bully but when confronted she justs runs away. Lamont is a coward.
I do feel for the lass in the 3rd photo. Not only is she alone, but she must feel like someone has put her on a pedestal to be pointed at due to the advertisement that says ‘UKOK’. Talk about adding salt to the wounds.
If I was there, I would have got her a coffee to cheer her up.
Is there any coverage on the rocketing Westminsters expense claim story. I thought I heard something about our own Murphy was top of the class!
O/T Gordon Brown is making a speech warning about pensions in an independent Scotland.
It was Gordon Brown who decided to FULLY tax pension funds in 1997. We now see the results with pensions taxed both as they are invested and then again when they are paid out! Only Gordon Brown could have thought of that and we now see the results with lower payouts for pensioners!
He decided IN 2007 to DOUBLE the income tax rate for low earners from 10% to 20%. We now have a complicated and costly system of benefits introduced by the great control freak to try to compensate for his lack of foresight.
He FAILED to introduce any form of regulation over the ‘wheelers and dealers’ in the City of London, a select few who become very rich on multi-million pound salaries and bonuses. These were gained by taking investment risks with other people’s savings and pension funds and helped bring down some previously solid businesses. What kind of financial ‘prudence’ is that from Gordon Brown?
He FORCED the unwelcome takeover of HBOS by making the financial rescue package (using our money) for Lloyds TSB and HBOS a condition of the deal. We have now lost the independent Bank of Scotland and with job losses to come thanks to Gordon Brown.
He PROMISED an end to ‘boom and bust’. Some promise, or does he now claim: ‘ It was Nothing to do with me, gov.’?
Samond and the land deal headline online Herald. Can`t read it as do not subscribe. Usual smear a day keeps Independence away on the Herald these days!
Gardham has now penned his version of events at FMQs and tries to continue the smear, ever so subtely. Im sure e had to run this article past The Heralds lawyers before publishing as he continues to infer something untoward and links Salmond and McGlynn a few times. He also omits the SPT involvement and states that McGlynn is pro indy when the businessman states he is for fiscal autonomy, which is more like Devo Max.
The wee lassie on the table should have had an epiphany, thought bugger this for a game of soldiers and joined in the party over the way. Surely she must have realised she’s batting for the wrong side.
isnt that jaba in the foto ?
I think Mr Bateman was indicating his exit from the beeb was because he supported independence and the powers that be didn’t like it.
Read “red” for “blue” in the dress sense and I do believe a little birdie appears.
I do hope that when Mr McGlynn returns from Canada that he persues this case with his lawyers the deformation of character, because that is exactly what the leader of the Labour party in Scotland has done. It wasn’t an off the cuff remark, she said it three time on the floor of the Scottish Parliament. Even after a warning from the First Minister that she was out of order, she continued her smear of Mr McGlynn.
JLT – that’s an awesome story, very heartening to hear.
Margo said at the march last year that all it would take is for everyone to convert just ONE person, and we’d easily win the referendum. Sounds like your pal has done her bit, and more besides!
@Cath
Well said Cath – we should be in the faces of BT’s reps asking what the hell they think they’re doing. There are still staggering levels of ignorance and apathy out there, and these reps are feeding that paralysis.
BT’s ‘day of action’ next Wednesday seems a good place to start 😉
Well done the YES people at the college freshers day. I found the Bateman blog very funny, not quite Swift but made me laugh. Can’t wait to see how the defamation of Mr McGlynn turns out and if the MSM will give it much exposure. I can’t believe labour have so little self awareness that they are content for their leader to make smears and lies on TV and look like an embarrassing drunk whille doing it. Who’d a thunk it 🙂
Well, the 9.00 news on Radio Scotland just came and went, and mention of McGlynnGate was there none…ho-hum.
The headline “THe Public Interest” prompts me to wonder why none of the MSM has picked up on the sensational Channel Four programme last night on the UK establishment’s cover up over Liberal MP Cyril Smith’s activities with young boys.
Why did Labour government in 1970s force the Director of Public Prosecutions to drop any charges despite 80 pages of police evidence?
The DPP response at the time was that “It was not in the national interest” i.e, Labour government had a very slim majority and relied on Liberal support.
What did David Steel and Ming Campbell know and why did they nod through his knighthood?
Y’know, I would have my suspicions that these pictures, while not doctored or selectively chosen to show what they do, had I not actually seen this situation with my own eyes (and camera) at many of the highland games and piping competitions I attended over the summer. There wasn’t a single occasion when the crowd around the Yes tables didn’t exceed those around the No table (OK I’ll be generous and call them Better Together even though it chokes me!) by at least ten to one. Never.
I don’t understand how there “seems” to be so many unionist supporters in polling figures while on the ground there are so few. Are they all really too embarrassed to actually show up in person?
@scaredy cat and others
The Derek Bateman blog is indeed by him.
Better Together sitting alone. You couldnt make it up.
Just been reading the Holyrood Magazine Annual Review edition…
Inside they have main players from all Parties as well as the 2 Blairs involved in the Referendum. Not one of the NO Camp give any reason why someone should vote NO, all they do is snipe at Wee Eck and SNP, they just dont understand. Blair MacDougall makes you cringe and the thought that regardless of the result, him and his like will still be hanging around like a bad smell. Oh for a new dawn, a new day and a new NEW Labour!
Are they all really too embarrassed to actually show up in person?
Yes – unionism In Scotland appears to be like smoking – no longer socially acceptable (although many still do it)! There are still a few union flags flying in Scotland, but very few nowadays. 20 years ago, many people would have been embarrassed to stand by the YES table, in case anyone they knew saw them! How things have changed. However,
Beware the closet unionists!
Just read Derek Batemans one and only blog it says. Pure dead brilliant! Was rolling about with laughter by the end. It should be repeated on BBC Scotlandshire!
ScottishMatters
The Better Together campaign have sewn up the media and get an easy ride from the BBC. If people were to believe their propaganda they would think that the world is rushing to the No stand and Yes is nowhere. They claim to have sent millions of leaflets (although I have never seen one) and have 10s of thousands of volunteers. Yet whenever any of us actually get our butts out of the door and attend something it is the Yes stand that is packed with helpers and interest and it is the No stand that is forlorn and empty of both helpers and interest. It is the No rallies that are poorly attended and Yes that pulls in crowds. There was, what, about 350 at the launch of Better Together Glasgow a couple of weeks ago on a Saturday in central Glasgow with all their big guns on the stage. I went to a Yes rally in Irvine on a wet Monday night and there were around 200 there. They had to raid chairs from other rooms to get enough in the hall so everyone could have a seat.
People need to know these things. They need to see that the 1984 style propaganda is just a paper tiger. That people are not flocking to the No tables and not going to their rallies. “No” may be ahead in the polls but not because people are passionate about No, people are reticent to vote Yes because of the uncertainty and negative spin. Conversely those who are active in the Yes campaign and are indicating they will vote Yes are those who think “Yes we can do this, this is the better path”. So not only do I not think it is mean to show the lack of interest in No I think it is essential that we get the message out that there is only one side of this debate that has a positive message that engages people. Interest generates interest and when people go to something, and increasingly over the next year there will events and rallies, they will look and see and say, “Wow that is right, No are thin on the ground and their tables are as popular as the proverbial soiled space suit these chaps (and chapesses) were right”.
It is Yes that has the popular movement on the ground No is just a manufactured media exercise a la New Labour.
Sorry this is so long but I think it is important that it is set out clearly that this is not about being nice or nasty. It is about letting people see the reality on the ground which then shows what is being said in the press by the UKOK people is a confidence trick. If we can do so with a bit humour then it sticks in the mind so much the better. People will remember the joke long after this lengthy exposition is forgotten (in the case of the latter in about 5 minutes).
Everyone must try to attend the rally in Edinburgh on the 21st September. Whatever numbers turnout on 21st, the MSM will downplay it.
It would be nice to think we could hold another rally very soon that would fill every civic square the length and breadth of Scotland. It would of course be risky if it fell flat.
Just read Bateman’s blog.
Astonishingly, there are those (particularly over on NNS) who’ve taken it seriously. One guy is nearly having kittens thinking it’s a mortal blow to the Yes campaign!
Good stuff Derek, an excellent two fingers to your previous employer.
“Is it not the same lonely lady? She does put the miles in.”
If that were a dating agency I’d be wantin ma money back hen
I hope the YES campaign are taking part in all our Uni & colleges during freshers week.
Particularly to point out that a vote No would ensure the introduction of student fees in Scotland, almost doubling a students liabilities and costs at a stroke.
I hope all our student bodies for YES are getting enough support, haven’t seen much activity or contributions from youth wing for some time though which surprises me.
Yes, I enjoyed the Bateman blog and thought it was a wryly humorous take on the likes of Foulkes who were convinced that Derek was a 5th columnist. I’m baffled as to how anyone could read it in any other way than satire. Do they not teach English comprehension in schools any more?
I’m sad that Derek is gone. He ran the Newsweek shows really well and always had a good mix and balance to his shows that somehow (strangely) the BBC seems to struggle to achieve elsewhere.
It’s pointless ridiculing the poor woman, people already know about what we have in the UK which is why they are more interested in the idea of independence and are drawn to the stands and campaigners.
Scottish Matters – just to add that are literally hundreds of serious, informed and educational articles on this site to chose from so I would go and read some (or all) of those before coming back and offering up your advice on how the Rev should run his site or what he should write about.
10,000 BT volunteers
Think about it this way – if people who support the union are too embarrassed to stand by a UKOK table, what is the chances of them volunteering to walk the streets, knock on doors and chat to strangers about why they should vote NO?
It’s a lonely life, being a unionist.
On the plus side for the Unionist lady at least she has a wee Union Jack at her table. A lot of them of them are a tad coy about those things.
“It’s pointless ridiculing the poor woman”
Nobody’s ridiculing the woman. They’re ridiculing BT’s lack of grassroots activist support.
But the question is do they really need these stands, when they have the luxury of the TV, Radio, press and media, Treasury committe statements / State machine etc ?
There are plenty of gullable scots out there and we all know it, christ we’re probably related to half of them.
At some point along the line (maybe sooner than we think), we have to get radical, play an alternative game and hit the Streets to moblize support of young and old.
Lets hope we get the turnout we all deserve on the March & Rally (no backsliding now ! ) – hope someone has a decent idea of proving the numbers to counter the enevetable alternative figure to come from MSM & Police.
I also wonder where the online presence of those that support the Union are. I mean, apart from trolls (paid by msm/Brit establishment?) its really stretching the bounds of credibility that its the YES side that is more internet savvy and no Unionists supporters own a pc. We are constantly told as fact that there is a significant hardcore in support of continued Westminster rule and yet despite this very thing being threatened by a looming Independence referendum for Scotland to run its own affairs thereby ending London rule once and for all, there is no rallies or demos on our streets in favour of the NO campaign unlike the YES campaign who are much more mobilised for their cause.
The more vocal us Independence supporters become online and on streets the more they ratchet up the propaganda which in turn gets more obvious to the ordinary Joe & Johann (lol) and in so doing more support for the YES side. Something is not sitting right with what the msm and British Establishment are trying to bulldoze us with. I have learned through my lifetime that the more propaganda from the Britnats the harder it must be getting for them and the more things must be going in our favour. Its a yardstick i use to measure where we are in this fight. How the msm and Unionist politicians must wish they had the YES support behind them. But they dont, cue their increasing bitterness. Roll on the YES rally a week tomorrow!
Can someone post a link to Bateman’s latest blog as I can’t find it anywhere.
O/T Royal mail to be privitised within weeks.
The tories are ruthless. They don’t hang about once they get the bit between the teeth. If Scotland votes NO, and Cameron wins the next GE, how long before Scottish Water is privitised?
The really irritating thing is the display of the Saltire on the U KOK table.
These people are fighting for the retention of the Union, a political construct, of which the representative flag is the UJ.
If they are so proud to be Scots and British fighting to remain British then let’s have them fight under the appropriate banner which everyone knows to be the Butcher’s Apron Not flying false colours. C’mon Blair McDon’t get the orders out to your troops.
Edit to my comment above;
Something is ”not”sitting right with what the msm and British Establishment are trying to bulldoze us with.
Chalks
The link is on this thread at 10.44 pm.
@chalks
http://derekbatemandotnet1.wordpress.com/
EdinScot
There was some independent look into this a while back and it did find that there was a significant number of Yes supporters active on the internet (the dreaded cybernats) and actually very few UKOK supporters. I know a lot of the regular anti-independence commentators on the Guardian like Bangorstu, Rider, Lownoise, RotherhamMan, Answer and others do not live in Scotland and for the most part are not Scottish. They are Britnats Unionists…mostly are Tories although a couple lean to UKIP now.
I notice that even on the Better Together Facebook page a disproportionate number of posts come from a handful of posters. A couple of Labour councillors, some guy who thinks he is train whose name escapes me and some chap called Rub On Lube (or similar).
“Edit to my comment above;
Something is ”not”sitting right with what the msm and British Establishment are trying to bulldoze us with.”
As I was in there fixing it anyway, I took out all the extra spaces after the full stops for you too 😀
Edinscot there is an old folk song which some may say is childish but is appropriate to what you were saying
Scottish meeja,Scottish meeja
We’re not listening anymore
We’re not listening anymore.
verse2 Blair Mcdougall.
Verse 3 Scottish Labour
verse 4 Anas Sarwar
Erm…..so I’ve read through ALL the comments…isn’t that a bloke at the No table…?
(I’m not making a joke, I am now questioning my eyesight 😐 )
Handandshrimp
some guy who thinks he is train whose name escapes me and some chap called Rub On Lube (or similar). LOL reminds me of the Larry Grayson characters.
Thanks folks, quite the satirist….he could get a job with the express
Boorach / agree.
The lack of union flag regalia on the stalls is somewhat misleading, what is there to hide ?
Perhaps thats the best contribution for those that want to remain British, that a YES supporter could make ?
Provision of Union flags would that be offensive; as they were absent from the only other stall I have seen at a ‘highland games’ (and that was poorly attended also).
Now surely they could not be offended by that … could they ?
One problem; how many yes supporters could bring themselves to handle such material ?
Yes it is a bloke at the table, I didn’t bother clicking on the picture to take a close up look before.
She must be sitting there thinking, who are we trying to kid.
Could be either. Not really clear even from the full-size photo.
Just a thought. There one reason why UKOK tables and tents seem to be bereft of people, maybe because curious-minded people see NO as a representation of the status quo, in other words ‘why bother asking because I know what the UK is all about already’; but independence is something different and the curious with the Don’t Knows do want to find out what it’s all about. The down side to that is the BT/NO campaign are not being challenged on what a NO vote really means for Scotland. I’ve said many times on here before, I think the majority of Scottish people are waiting to be sold on Independence.
Derek Bateman has a second killer post on his blog re Vitoil 🙂
I really didn’t see the windup there with Batemans blog, made a total twat of myself hey oh, never mind, posted an apology. 🙁
John, I think that’s the problem. It’s very subtle satire, and there are a lot of people who are not going to get it and take it at face value. It’s seeded with clues that probably seem to be blazing signals to the writer, but may whoosh straight over the head of someone who isn’t reading it on the right wavelength.
“Could be either. Not really clear even from the full-size photo.”
Indeed. Not conclusive, my impression was a female, and if I’d said “the lassie (I think)” I’m sure that would have been some sort of -phobia…
HandandShrimp, Remember my time on the old hootsman and Herald boards being littered with said posters as much as two years back when i came to the logical conclusion that these posters had many different monikers and were not the run of the mill examples of the general public posting. If it were, i think we wouldnt be having a refererendum next year. It really must be a poisoned chalice to have such spiteful hateful trolls on the NO side. Btw, duly had my bath in dettol as i exited the hootsman back then.
Revstu, sorry about the extra gaps between my text. Its due to my space bar having become detached from its base and its driving me up the wall. Will type bit slower in order to stop it behaving like skippy on speed 😉
molly, im singing along with you but bear in mind im like the cats chorus.
Doug Daniels
Thanks, mate. Sometimes, when we see the Yes campaign taking a kicking after kicking, that a wee story like that sometimes gives everyone hope. When my wee work pal told me what had happened the previous evening, it gave me a moment to reflect and realise that all is not lost.
If one 20 year old young lass can make her pals sit up, then what might it be like next summer. When the facts finally do become common knowledge through word of mouth, then …who knows?
Sticking Better Together next to the Emergency door was a nice touch by the janny!
Oh gawd, not another ‘gender’ debate – can we just agree that someone is sitting, alone and bored-looking, at the UKOK table?
@ibh
With a `stylish` UKOK bag to their right.
From Bateman’s blog I particularly liked these comments:
There is an explosive story waiting to be told of corruption, illegality, conspiracy and manipulation involving both BBC and government in which I was first a key player then a helpless pawn. The cast includes household names both on screen and in power.
:D:
If the site got started before the Unionists cranked up their inevitable campaign of disinformation, it could become a trusted source of objective information ahead of the referendum.
For the next hour I learned how the British state was mobilising to defeat the will of the people; how heads of state were being asked to keep quiet, international organisations chivvied into endorsing a united Britain and editors massaged and threatened into following the official line.
The same thing happened over Lockerbie when the intelligence service briefed editors that Libya was responsible for the bombing not, as previously indicated, Iran. That just happened to coincide with the West taking on Saddam’s Iraq, sworn enemy of Iran. Those guardians of objective news duly complied.
Ouch!
The media was the single most important tool in the struggle and I was at the heart of the most trusted and most widely consumed sector…the BBC. I both developed ideas for programmes and presented them. Was it too much to ask that I skew some items, sound positive about independence, ridicule Unionist claims and just let journalist principles of impartiality slide for a while? To help the cause. For Scotland?
.And so I was caught in a web of deceit in which I hated myself and lost my self respect.
I confess too that it was my idea to get rid of trained newsreaders, ostensibly to save money, but in reality, to make sure that producers who can barely read and presenters with no concept of diction, would present news bulletins, turning them into a lottery of misplaced emphasis and garbled syntax.
All of this delighted Salmond who said the less professional the BBC appeared, the less impact it’s pro-Unionist propaganda would have. “Can you make sure they keep Catriona Renton on air?” he asked. :D: :D:
That I was successful is confirmed by the finding that less than half of Scots trusts BBC Scotland’s coverage. Another potshot! :D:
I was very nearly unmasked by the ever perceptive George Foulkes, whose powers of deduction are honed on the Intelligence Committee. He tried to flush me out by tweeting that I was biased. Tried but failed.
:D:
But the next stage was daunting. I was to recruit a network of sympathisers to infiltrate all output. Such was the low morale among my colleagues caused by a dysfunctional management that in the space of a few weeks I had a list of 12 willing clandestine supporters all subtly changing scripts.
Key among them is one of the best known faces in Scotland, a fixture on national television, who may now follow me into ignominy. Her nightly appearances on Reporting Scotland have undergone nuanced adjustments. From research conducted at the Poynter Institute of Journalism in St Petersburg, Florida, http://www.poynter.org I learned how to promote a subconscious message while broadcasting. If you observe closely you will hear a momentary pause before she says the words “Scottish Government” to give it emphasis and on completion, she will smile faintly to leave an optimistic sense in the mind of the viewer. When she mentions “Labour leader Johann Lamont”, her brow gently furrows and her timbre drops to indicate something sinister. It is by these tiny measures that public perceptions are formed. Jackie Bird or Sally Magnusson?
In the final days before the referendum we had a Wardrobe Plan in which her outfits would turn from sky blue to an ever darkening navy until, on voting day, it was to be Saltire Blue with white piping, mimicking the national flag. A specially prepared locket would be prominent on her throat of a celtic design in which the SNP symbol could be discerned. Such was our attention to detail. But all to no avail.
Next week: How I recruited Dotaman.
Excellent stuff. There will no doubt be a reaction in Pacific Quay!
“From Bateman’s blog I particularly liked these comments:”
With the link having already been posted half-a-dozen times, did we really need huge chunks reproducing so that I’d have to go and fix all the formatting in it?
Apologies.
Gulps nervously , do you think it was the Tunnocks wafers that affected him ?(puts packet back in cupboard quietly ) Fred Mcaulay …..
Oh, it’s cutting. It’s far more explicit than I had imagined he would be, and indeed he seems to be saying that the manipulation is actually quite overt. He’s walking us through what’s actually being done to promote Labour and the union. That stuff about the female news presenter manipulating by tone of voice and facial expression is actually fairly dynamite. (You know how you can tell who’s won the football match by the tone of voice preceding the announcing of the second team’s score….)
Interesting historical note about Lockerbie. Indeed, it looks as if everyone was told to forget about Syria and Iran, and start writing anti-Libya articles, and obviously that did happen. But he seems to be saying that journalists were being actively steered rather than simply briefed.
Pravda-on-the Clyde.
@Morag
How is your book going? Have you finished it?
Does anyone know whether Bateman is talking about Jackie Bird or Sally Magnusson? I am not sure because it could easily be one or the other? The comment about Catriona Renton was very cutting as well.
It is definitely a UKOK person
“Does anyone know whether Bateman is talking about Jackie Bird or Sally Magnusson?”
I think Batemans trying to get us to watch them and see if we can spot the subtle way they promote BT propaganda.
It’s going to make it difficult for them to keep doing the things that he will be continually calling them out on.
The mind boggles !
How is your book going? Have you finished it?
http://www.troubador.co.uk/book_info.asp?bookid=2499
Oooh, they’ve added the cover picture since I last looked at the page!
Just goes to show the more we get out there the easier project fear will be to overcome. People want to hear a vision and some detail which the MSM are doing their best to see doesn`t happen. My brother just texted me from Buchanan Street where NO are out today, when he told the guy he`d be voting Yes the look on his face was priceless he said.
I think Batemans trying to get us to watch them and see if we can spot the subtle way they promote BT propaganda.
I think that is exactly right. Coming from anyone else, I’d probably suggest they stop drinking the Kool-aid, but from Bateman it means something.
@Morag
Congratulations on the book’s imminent release. I see its due to be released in December (25th anniversary of Lockerbie). Hopefully it will create a stir in government and media circles.
Just a thought. There one reason why UKOK tables and tents seem to be bereft of people, maybe because curious-minded people see NO as a representation of the status quo, in other words ‘why bother asking because I know what the UK is all about already’; but independence is something different and the curious with the Don’t Knows do want to find out what it’s all about.
I think there’s a great deal of truth to that. The deserted condition of the U-KOK stands isn’t necessarily a fair reflection of the number of people prepared to vote No. The buzz around the Yes campaign isn’t faked though.
There’s very little subtlety in the way Bird and Magnusson promote BT (Labour) propaganda.
Remember Sally’s ‘what do you say tonight to people who are scared?’ to Salmond in 2007? Or ‘what do we do now, Margaret Curran’ in 2011?
Or Jackie informing us in the 2011 campaign that Ed Milliband was coming to Scotland ‘to continue.. pause for big grin..Labour’s onslaught on the SNP’? We know how that onslaught turned out.
Subtle they ain’t.
Congratulations on the book’s imminent release. I see its due to be released in December (25th anniversary of Lockerbie). Hopefully it will create a stir in government and media circles.
Mmmm. I’ve had to go through a self-publishing deal, because there simply was not time to get in in print before the anniversary through normal publishing channels. That rather limits the amount of exposure it gets, but it would have bombed next year anyway I think.
It will be available to buy before the actual date, and I’m trying to organise a book launch in a central Edinburgh bookshop. There’s also a possiblilty of a tie-in appearance in a Lockerbie documentary currently in production. However, the Crown Office and the Scottish government have already demonstrated their consummate ability to ignore any Lockerbie story they don’t like. The Lord Advocate goes one better and defames people in the pages of the Scotsman. I don’t expect any different treatment. These people really, really don’t want to consider the possibility that they may have got it wrong.
ROFLMAO! 😆
I know we shouldn’t mock the afflicted but….
ROFLMAO 😆
I really am trying to look at this photograph and feel sorry for her but….
ROFLMAO! 😆
It’s the big poster as much as anything. I mean, do they still not realise, or what?
I wondered if it was just a Wings/BBC Scotlandshire thing to read that poster as “you cock”, but apparently not. Last month while I was manning a Yes tent I saw a couple of people with UKOK badges (there was no equivalent BT tent, though I did find a deflated BT balloon lying on the grass). I asked another activist who was with me, who doesn’t camp online all day, whether I was alone in reading that logo as an obscenity. No, she sniggered, it’s not just you – I’ve seen members of the public giggling at it.
@Morag
Have you thought about trying to get a place at the Edinburgh Book Festival to promote your book?
Have you thought about trying to get a place at the Edinburgh Book Festival to promote your book?
That’s next year, though. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof, and all that. Also, the more I look into this book promoting business, the more it transpires that you have to pay thousands for the sort of high-profile spots that we see. Books don’t just appear in W H Smiths or Tesco because someone in these firms trawled through the entire list of books in print and decided what they were going to stock, for example.
I don’t know how much it costs to get a spot at the Book Festival, but I suspect it’s way beyond my means. I know James Robertson read an abridged version of his “Lockerbie” novel as Book at Bedtime on Radio 4, just a week or two after it was published. I don’t know how you get those gigs, but I suspect it ain’t cheap. (Not that my book is a candidate for Book at Bedtime, but you know what I mean.) Even if the BBC aren’t taking money for the publicity, the gig will have been arranged by a publicist who knows how to get the foot in the door. And these people don’t come cheap.
It’s one thing if it is a commercial publisher pushing a book. OK, the author may be lucky to see 50p a copy, but that at least is clear profit because the publisher organises and funds the publicity. Presumably they expect to sell sufficient copies to make it worthwhile. But for a self-publishing deal that sort of money is a bit of a thought – especially as books lacking the imprint of known publishing houses aren’t taken as seriously by definition.
@Morag
Yes, it sounds a very tricky situation. The only other things I could think about would be to see if a newspaper would run an extract from your book, or if you are having a book launch to have somebody like Terry Waite (who I see has written the foreword) or Jim Swire, to help get publicity for the book. There is also a good independent book shop near Edinburgh University, who might be interested in the book.
There has been some talk about seeing if the Herald might run some extracts. Lucy Adams is very on-message with Lockerbie. We’ll see. I am hoping very much that Jim Swire doesn’t even find out about the book until the last possible moment, for various reasons.
If we’re talking about the same bookshop, which we might be, I only found out recently that a personal friend works there in a fairly senior position. We have been talking!
Nearer the time I’ll ask Stu if he might take an article about the book. It’s certainly not unrelated to Scottish politics.
Dammit! Can’t focus on the news now – keep getting distracted by Jackie Bird’s body language, half-smiles, rising and falling cadence, tone, etc. Derek Bateman, you’re for it!
@Morag
If we’re talking about the same bookshop, which we might be, I only found out recently that a personal friend works there in a fairly senior position. We have been talking!
Opposite the Pear Tree pub, just around the corner from the Mosque? I have forgotten its name.
I remember Jackie McPherson from her days in the Scout Bar in Dundee. Went to a party or two, but my memory is very muddled. 🙂
Muttley, we’re probably talking about different shops. Come to think of it, the one I’m talking about is quite big and part of a chain.
@Morag
Word Power is the name of the bookshop I was talking about.
Ah, that’s quite interesting. I’m not quite sure what to do about Word Power. They read my book and said they were interested. I then heard from a third party that they’d been asking around in an interested sort of a way. However, it was absolutely clear they had no ability (or probably even intention) to get it out by the anniversary date, and the whole thing fizzled out. I don’t quite know if we’re on friendly terms or not at the moment. Probably, but it was all left a bit in the air.
Actually, my friend works for Blackwell’s Bookshop. Big enough to do an actual book launch, if it comes off.
@Morag
I know Blackwell’s well. Good luck with the book.
Thanks. This self-publishing malarkey is unfamiliar to me – other books I’ve written have just been handled by the publisher, and they sent me money. If the 25th anniversary had been next year I’d just have hawked it round publishers and I think I’d have found one. This way, I have to arrange things like a book launch and book signings myself. I also feel constrained that booksellers tend to assume that self-published books are crap.
However, there seems to be a reasonable amount of interest here and there, so hopefully I can shift enough to break even. The object of the exercise is really to force the Crown Office to confront the fact that the investigation screwed up big time, and that’s the hard part. I don’t think it can be done without getting a reasonable sale for the book though.
Here’s one for all you folks that follow the recent comments links..
(This article (which is in the public interest) was published by WoS a year ago today.)
Ain’t it funny how there’s ALWAYS public interest at the YES stand, but no stands are typically tumbleweed.. things have not changed much within the year!
..back to the future..