Scottish independence referendum, plus jokes.

Wings Over Scotland


Fair and balanced #2

Posted on March 22, 2013 by

We’re only just now getting round to watching last night’s special edition of Newsnight Scotland. It’s off to a cracking start. Great work there, BBC Scotland graphics team.

newsnichtjack

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  1. 22 03 13 22:41

    In The Best Traditions Of The Slightly Elongated Arms Of The British State | Michael Greenwell

103 to “Fair and balanced #2”

  1. Cath says:

    Bloody hell. That’s very, erm, subtle. Please tell me that isn’t the entire backdrop?

  2. Melissa Murray says:

    My husband and I watched this last night. He pointed it out to me straight away, and he’s not one to notice subtle, umm references.
    But the whole show was a shambles. Gordon Brewer shouting down Nicola Sturgeon. Personally I think he was drunk. Either that or he wants to replace Jeremy Paxman some day.  

  3. Gordon Bain says:

    I’ve suspected Brewer of being drunk in the past too. He’s moronic, that’s for sure.

  4. muttley79 says:

    BBC Jockney are outdoing themselves as time goes on.  A Union Jack backdrop?  No saltire just a union jack…They should just go the old hog now and tell us to vote No! 

  5. Cath says:

    Thing is, that backdrop rather contradicts the other message BT are trying to get out which is “don’t let the Saltire be connected with independence – reclaim it”. Wonder how well that’s going running alongside the “drown everyone in union jacks to keep them patriotic to the UK” campaign?

  6. Geoff Huijer says:

    We are simply not going to get a balanced debate in the media.
    So many people I know just accept what the media says & apparently
    I am sounding like some mental case now when I point out all the
    inaccuracies and lies.
    I really fear the result next year because people are simply
    being taken in by lies and spin. Why would the media change
    and be truthful and balanced? They know that if they do so
    a YES vote will be a ‘shoe-in’.
     

  7. EdinScot says:

    I dont watch EBC these days but tell me this UJ backdrop is for real…Im almost convinced its the EBC Scotlandshire spoof site!  Something tells me surreal times lie ahead in the next 546 days.  Faster your seatbelts folks, the Unionists are going to certainly entertain us….

  8. Morag says:

    It wasn’t 547 days either, it was 546.  Although even UKaye was confused this morning.

  9. Graham Anderson says:

    Brewer is a disgrace. We know it, the BBC knows it, he knows it; but of course the state propaganda machine will just keep churning it out.

  10. Training Day says:

    At Yes Bearsden the other night Gil Paterson MSP was unequivocal in his condemnation of the BBC, likening them to Pravda and calling their behaviour ‘a disgrace’.
    Will there come a point when the leadership of the SNP make the judgement that highlighting and condemning publicly the outrageous bias of the state broadcaster more than offsets any ‘value’ there is in remaining silent and not frightening the horses?

  11. Cath says:

    “Will there come a point when the leadership of the SNP make the judgement that highlighting and condemning publicly the outrageous bias of the state broadcaster more than offsets any ‘value’ there is in remaining silent and not frightening the horses?”
     
    There must be others out there who can do that – the body Craig Murray mentioned for example/ Trouble is, if no one reports they said it, who will ever know?

  12. ianbrotherhood says:

    I wish to god someone inside the Beeb would just come out and tell us how these decisions are made – that graphic didn’t construct itself.
    Whose idea was it?
    Who actually ‘designed’ it?
    Who approved it?
    Who are these people?

  13. muttley79 says:

    @Training Day
     
    Good point.  I think Craig Murray’s point about requesting international media monitors is a very good idea.  I can only think that the Yes campaign believe they can win by concentrating on things well away from the media spotlight.  I am not convinced but they certainly know their stuff.

  14. Cath says:

    Very good questions Ian. One thing is for certain – it came out of our license fee money. As all their biased programmes do.

  15. Albert Herring says:

    The highlight for me was Brewer’s derisive laughter when Blair Jenkins suggested English people might want to move to an independent Scotland. 33’35″

  16. tartanfever says:

    Cath - 
     
    It’s up to us to do it. It’s up to us to campaign and demonstrate against the BBC. The SNP can’t do it because the claim of bias will be laughed at and reported that the SNP are trying to run the media. It would simply backfire.
    One thing you can be sure of, BBC Scotland are laughing their heads off. Three demonstrations in the last year have brought about a total of 500 demonstrators to marches in Glasgow. That is a joke. Now if you complain to the BBC, you don’t even get an acknowledgement with a reference number, they just ignore you and don’t reply.

    At present we pose absolutely no threat to the BBC whatsoever.
     

  17. EdinScot says:

    I think the most damage we can cause good old auntie is to call her out by reporting her behaviour far and wide.  She holds dear her International reputation so we should shout from the rooftops to other news organisations and press outlets Worldwide exactly what the EBC is getting up to with Scottish licence fee money.  They are aiming to fight us by skewing the debate blatantly over our countrys future and breaking their charter time and again.

    This is big news especially with a referendum date now set.  They are out pravda ing pravda ffs and its time we had them neutered.  Our futures are too important to let them away with this blatant propaganda and lies.

  18. muttley79 says:

    The BBC in Scotland were always going to oppose independence.  That they are reverting to Pravada-style tactics is no surprise.  I read one of John Simpson’s books ages ago, and he said the BBC regarded the SNP as “bigots.”  John Birt and Greg Dyke are both on the record as saying that the BBC acts to protect the Union.  They have no interest in what is good for Scotland.  The sooner we get international media monitors in the better.  Last night was just another example of the Pravada-on-the-Clyde mentality of BBC Scottish Labour.  

  19. Tom says:

    Appalling.

  20. ianbrotherhood says:

    Last year, on BellaC, someone contacted Michael Greenwell (I think) offering to get in touch with Stacey Herbert of RT’s Keiser Report. I can’t remember the details, or the thread. 
    RT have done good packages in the past about Independence movements, not just here, but Catalonia, Bavaria etc. 
    Could Rev, Greenwell, BellaC, NNS etc get together and try to interest Herbert/Keiser in doing a show from Edinburgh? – the relevance to his show is obvious.

  21. alasdair says:

    RT is hardly a balanced broadcaster themselves, the bias they show is as disturbing (if not more so) than anything the BBC does.

  22. dmw42 says:

    I have already made a formal complaint to the BBC on their misrespresentation of EU Foreign Ministers. The initial response was ‘we didn’t misinterprit”.
     
    I then sent an emailed complaint to ecu [at] bbc [dot] co [dot] uk and copied the email to office [at] odihr [dot] pl the body that Craig identified.
     
    I have had a response from ECU of BBC that my complaint will be dealt with by the Head of Public Policy of the BBC inScotland.
     
    He / she has been given until Monday and has been advised that I will, nevertheless, be making direct contact with ODHIR.
     
    If we all sent emails to the ODHIR address above maybe, just maybe, action will be taken.
     
    Best wishes to all (oh happy days, oh happy days… sorry, just haven’t been able to stop singing that today)

  23. Craig Evans says:

    Having watched News Night Scotland on the I player, I was just amazed at how rude Brewer was to Nicola Sturgeon. Interupting, snide etc.
    I then made the mistake of watching Reportiung Scotland and that was almost as bad!
    I just wish I could persude my wife to stop paying the TV licence!

  24. balgayboy says:

    @ianbrotherhood says:
    RT does a good job exposing the british establishment and their defence of the city of london’s financial shenanigans, not to sure too many people in Scotland view the channel, if at all they have access to it. You are correct in the suggestion to have a outsiders scrutinise the MSM and our friends at bbc scotland’s anti-indepence broadcasts.  Gordon Brewer is showing signs of hysteria, probably he knows he will need to look for another job down south…good luck and good riddance as far as I’m concerned.

  25. Paul Martin says:

    BBC Scotland are ripping the utter pish with these kind of subliminal stunts and hostile interviewing. They’ll be having a bloody good laugh in the staff canteen at our apparent impotence.
     
    At some point soon – and we can’t wait too much longer – we have to request that monitors are brought in to detect and highlight these abuses as and when they occur. If YesScotland doesn’t want to be seen to doing that, then its down to the SNP. Hardly an issue for the SNP as the BBC can scarcely hold them in any less contempt, so what have they got to lose I ask myself.

  26. Arbroath1320 says:

    Nice to see that the BBC are maintaining their impartiality with their coverage of the independence debate. I just glad they decided not to go with a biased view point!

  27. Seasick Dave says:

    If you check out that No site with the poll on it, you will see that they have the date of the Referendum as 18 October 2014.
    http://noscotland.net/
    Oh, dear.

  28. ianbrotherhood says:

    @balgayboy-
    I suppose the real value in asking outsiders for their take on what’s happening is that they can/should be truly objective in a way that we can’t be, no matter how balanced or fair we think ourselves. We’re far too close to it all. 
    It would be fascinating to hear the opinions of professional broadcasters who know propaganda when they see it – perhaps they might think our criticisms OTT? Who knows – I’m confident that we’re not all delusional and paranoid. The bias is real enough, but none of our fellow citizens would ever know that if their MSM diet is restricted to terrestrial output.

  29. Dcanmore says:

    Bugger the BBC! If I win the £80m Euromillions tonight then there will be a new Scottish TV channel coming! :)

  30. Macart says:

    @Seasick Dave
     
    Sourcing their pet media for the ‘facts’ as usual. They really shouldn’t believe all they read in the papers. ;)

  31. John Lyons says:

    I hope as many people as possible watch this programme for as long as they can stand it. Brewer was a complete shambes. Tried to make light of a very specific example Sturgeon gave on Finance, but then wanted her to take very seriously his example about a very specific point. You can’t have it both ways. And why, after telling her they were runnng out of time and asking her to answer very quickly why did he ramble on for nearly a minute trying to ask a question? Has he been taking lessons from Davidson?
     
    I couldn’t stomach anymore and left the room half way through the panel of four only to rush back as my beloved Susan shouted at Patricia Fergusson. Absolutely gobsmacking that someone can blame the SNP for the Bedroom tax that Labour invented and the Tories are implementing with Glee.
     
    I enjoyed Blair McDougall saying “When we vote for independence…” Even the head of the better Nos doesn’t believe in his own campaign….
     
     

  32. Ray says:

    @Albert Herring
     
    Somebody suggested on Facebook yesterday that if the SNP’s stance – that Scotland will be better off than the rUK – actually happened, “millions” of English people will jump the sinking ship, move to Scotland for a better life and Scotland won’t be able to cope with it and collapse. How patriotic!
     
    I found that point of view…interesting.

  33. Albert Herring says:

    @Ray
    If Scotland’s population had grown at the same rate as that of Denmark since 1900, we’d now have over 10 million people. 
    http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/03/14/5227/

  34. Jiggsbro says:

    Bugger the BBC! If I win the £80m Euromillions tonight then there will be a new Scottish TV channel coming!
     
    Sorry, but buoyed by my success at predicting the referendum date, I shall be winning the Euromillions tonight. Don’t worry, I’ll bung Alex a fiver.

  35. MajorBloodnok says:

    @Seasick Dave
     
    Well, if the Onionists turn up to the referendum a month late, I won’t be greetin’ intae ma porridge.

  36. John Lyons says:

    I also liked Alasdair Darlings scare story that Scotland only has 6 million people and if pensions collapse it’d be better to be in a country of 60 million people. Does he not realise the percentage of that 60 Million who are pensioners would be roughly similar and therefore they would have the same problem making absolutely no difference whatsoever????
     
    If this is the strength of his grasp of basic mathematics I think I can see why the Credit crunch arrived when HE was Chancellor of the Exchequer.

  37. Arbroath1320 says:

    Oops!
     
    I think I’ve had a wee electronic accident! :lol:
    I’ve just sent an E-Mail to RT [dot] producersgroup [at] rttv [dot] ru
     
    I have absolutely no idea how that happened! :lol:
     

  38. JLT says:

    I watched the Scotland Today (is that it?) on STV at 10.30pm last night. I don’t know the female Reporter, but first, she interviewed Nicola Sturgeon. We got the same usual questions; will Scotland be in the EU, what will the Scottish economy look like, how will we fund this, that and everything. Nicola answered by basically saying it will all be in the white paper. The Reporter did point out that the SNP have had 18 months to tell us, blah, blah, blah…
    She then interviewed Alistair Darling. What I will say is that the Reporter got ripped into him too. When she asked ‘what if Scotland votes ‘No’, what will you give the Scots?’. Big Al said there would be some powers passed to Holyrood if it was a ‘No’ vote. When the Reporter asked what powers they would give, Alistair started stammering and shuffled a lot. When she bollocked him by telling him that they also have had 18 months to come up with something, then surely he wasn’t going to wait until after the referendum before he gave answers. At this point, Alistair looked like he was about to face the guillotine. Guilt was written all over his face. He was very flustered and looked like he wanted the ground to open up and take him away from these seriously awkward questions. 
    So there is your answer from the ‘No’ campaign. We will only know what new powers we will get (if any) once the Referendum is over, and whether it is a ‘No’ vote.
    In fact, I’ll predict now and say we will get Hee-Haw…and it would not surprise me, if the mob in London try to dismantle the Scottish Parliament to stop this happening again…

  39. Albert Herring says:

    @John Lyons
    He must have been including the postal votes.

  40. JLT says:

    John Lyons says:
    I also liked Alasdair Darlings scare story that Scotland only has 6 million people..
     
    —————–
     
    I also noticed that! Bloody hell. Get the fences up at the border. Our population just rose 600,000 people in a matter of a year!!!
    Does the useless b****** that is head of the No campaign not know the actual population of Scotland. Last time I heard, it was 5.4 million.
     
     

  41. MajorBloodnok says:

    Must be terrible living in all those countries with fewer than 60M population, pensionless and defenceless.  Terrible.

  42. creag an tuirc says:

    @Arbroath1320
    Good to see you back posting on WOS 

  43. Dal Riata says:

    The way Brewer conducted himself in that interview with Nicola Sturgeon was a disgrace – rude, contemptuous, snide and unprofessional.
     
    Yes, an interviewer must, on occasion, ‘work’ to get their interviewee to be more precise on statements they make, or answer the question asked rather than offer party platitudes, but Brewer’s attitude towards Nicola Sturgeon went way beyond that – constantly on the attack, interrupting every time she tried to answer a question, any answers met with contempt, trying to trip her up on every point made, etc.
     
    It does, of course, follow the BBC diktat that all SNP politicians\Yes Scotland representatives must be given as rough a ride as possible, while LibLabCon\Better Together should be treated with kid gloves.
     
    Gordon Brewer: bufoonery dressed up as professionalism

  44. The Man in the Jar says:

    Channel 4 has a good line in “insider documentaries” It would be good to see them do one on the BBC. Although internal media fighting is not normal in the UK at least. The subject would not broadcast well in England anyway.
    On the subject of the ODIHR how do they respond to private individuals complaining? On Craig Murrays original article he ended with something like “It is time that Alex Salmond contacted the ODIHR. I assume from this that it would have to be someone in authority complaining for the complaint to be taken up. Dmw42 please let us know how you get on. If successful then if all of us do it something might just happen. You have to hope.
    On the subject of newsnicht Nicola should have asked Brewer “Mr Brewer can you tell me just how much you had to drink before you came on set this evening?” Then sit back and watch his head explode!

  45. dmw42 says:

    The Man in the Jar
     
    Rest assured, I’ll keep everyone posted on responses from both BBC and ODHIR
     
    best wishes to all
     
    David

  46. EdinScot says:

    creag an tuirc says:
    @Arbroath1320
    Good to see you back posting on WOS
     
    Seconded.

  47. Dal Riata says:

    @JLT 
    Yes, I was watching that on STV too, and, my, my, didn’t Darling squirm when asked why Scotland should vote ‘No’ and what the positives were of doing so! 
     
    How very typical of Better Together, of course. ‘We’re better together because.. stronger/top table/hitting above our weight/influence/history/ad nauseum.’ ‘After Scotland votes ‘No’..um/er/mm/devo something/er/jam!’ 
     
    And the MSM spins this daily to influence the Scottish people to vote for that…!?!?

  48. The Man in the Jar says:

    @Dal Riata
    Agree. Last night Darling was a complete and utter shambles on Scotland Tonight. Keep it up, keep it up Mr. Darling.

  49. Arbroath1320 says:

    Glad to be back folks.
     
    Just hope my HIGH I mean LOW level of cynicysm reaches the DEPTHS it reached before! :lol:
     
    I’ve missed posting my highly INTELLECTUAL???? comments on WOS but now I’m back and raring to go! :lol:

  50. Jeannie says:

    @Arbroath 1320
     
    Welcome back, Arb. 

  51. Indy_Scot says:

    My theory is that they are no longer trying to hide their bias towards the union and are quite happy to openly taunt the Yes campaign to see how blatant they can become before they get a reaction, which they will then try and use for their own purpose.
     
     

  52. molly says:

    Good point John Lyons ,if pensions collapse, banks go bust etc or we’re attacked trips off Alistair Darlings tongue like its a normal thing to happen.
    So he’s being the ultimate democrat  ,vote to stay with us /UK and we’ll all go down together.
    What kind of logic is that and good lord here’s Gordon Brewer going to ask that very question -sorry got a bit carried aware there 

  53. ianbrotherhood says:

    I’m trying to imagine any scenario in ordinary life where it’s acceptable for anyone to speak to anyone else the way Brewer did to NS last night.
    If anyone in my local (which is, shall we say, an ‘earthy’ establishment) spoke to another regular in that manner, there would be teeth and hair flying within minutes. The man is nothing more than a well-dressed ned and NS should be commended on her supernatural patience.
    Could someone with the technical nous please, please compile a three-minute montage of his worst behaviour (and maybe use The Smiths’ ‘This Charming Man’ as the soundtrack)? – it would be a useful tool in showing just how ‘objective’ the man is.

  54. Indy_Scot says:

    I would be genuinely ill at the thought of paying his wages.

  55. Semus says:

    I have already written to Max Keiser at maxkeiser [at] rttv [dot] ru pointing out that this is an oil rich , energy rich nation with a sizeable economic centre.Also that RT have reported dismally from Edinburgh and London on nationalism. The RT UK staff take a UKIP brief and Russia isnae interested in wee uppity nations who want to secede.
    Also pointing out that 100% of press and media take a London brief and operate as Pravda and Izvestia agin independence and the SG.
    I sent it with the wee banned video of yesterday.
    WE will see uvidíme.
    But ye get used to being ignored 

  56. Arbroath1320 says:

    I’m wondering if this piece is another reason we are better together.
     
    http://forargyll.com/2013/03/south-scotland-msp-raises-the-mystery-of-1980s-west-coast-oil-capped-on-westmister-instructions/
     
    Interesting that it appears maintaining the nuclear dump of WMD’s in Scotland was MORE important than the exploration of Scotland’s oil resources off the West coast of Scotland. Are we looking at a McCrone Report II here by any chance?
    Why does Westminster continue to treat the people of Scotland as Third world inhabitants?
    Do they REALLY think we believe their claims that we we are too wee, too small, too stupid?

  57. MajorBloodnok says:

    Hello Arbroath!

  58. ianbrotherhood says:

    @Semus-
    Good on ye.
    Here’s a thought – why don’t a few of us contact the Keiser team at the same time and cite the McCrone report as worthy of a look when/if he and Stacey come to Edinburgh? Surely that would be right up his street.
    Someone posted great links to succinct McCrone leaflets a couple of weeks ago. They could be attached to pique interest.

  59. muttley79 says:

    Yes, welcome back Arb.

  60. Arbroath1320 says:

    Hello Major and Muttley!
     
    I’m beginning to get the feeling that my absence was not as unnoticed as I thought it was! :lol:

  61. Juteman says:

    I never saw any TV yesterday.
    Was that really the background in the studio?

  62. albaman says:

    Good to see you back Smoky,   Rev, I have my lap-top back, turned out that it 
    needed a brain transplant so it is FiN?e now, anyway a further measly £5 winging
    your way,    o/t anyone out there taking bets on Westminster “awarding” the
    carbon capture to Draxs rather than Peterhead?

  63. muttley79 says:

    @Juteman
     
    I did not see Newsnight (I have stopped watching it and Reporting Murders and Football in Scotland) either.  However, it does appear to be the case that this was the backdrop they used.  The only thing missing is a six foot No sign….Does anyone know if they had Yes Scotland to match the BT banner things? I am thinking not…

  64. Arbroath1320 says:

     
    Juteman says:
     
    I never saw any TV yesterday.

    Was that really the background in the studio?

    I’m afraid so Juteman and here is the proof in all its unionist flag waving glory. Just make sure you have sick bucket ready to hand!
     
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01rhdrk/Newsnight_Scotland_21_03_2013/

  65. Jiggsbro says:

    Does anyone know if they had Yes Scotland to match the BT banner things?
     
    There are three Yes logos on that backdrop. One disappearing off the left, one disappearing off the top and one that would be clearly visible, if only Gordon wasn’t – purely coincidentally – stood in front of it.

  66. Richie says:

    Welcome back Arby!
    Thought you had gone over to the dark side :)
     

  67. Arbroath1320 says:

    WHIT the dark side? NAW I’ll never go over to the dark side, the darkened ROOM yes the darkened SIDE no! :lol:

  68. Juteman says:

    No bias there then! :-)

  69. Albert Herring says:

    Why has Isabel Fraser been disappeared?

  70. Horacesaysyes says:

    @Albert Herring

    Too wee, Too Poor, Too Scottish, obviously! ;)

  71. Aplinal says:

    @Albert
     
    re: where is IF.  She is at least moderately neutral, that’s why.

  72. mato21 says:

    Isobel was on the wireless last weekend

  73. CameronB says:

    I live close to where SLab had their Edinburgh HQ, so used to bump in to Captain D quite regularly. I can testify that he is terrible under pressure, even from a mere mortal pleb such as myself. I would ask him about topical issues and always remembered to include a question about the IRAQ WAR. Now I know that the side of a busy road might not be ideal surroundings for considered conversation, and I would always do my best at maintaining a calm and friendly demeanor, but he doesn’t like it up him. He used to run away from me. Literally run.
     
    Perhaps the Yes strategy is to have head-on broadcast debates which will sink the unionist gunboats, both BT and their MSM sock-puppets, together at the same time? That would be quite spectacular viewing I think, and I’d even buy a TV and pay a license to watch it. There are going to be head-to-heads soon?

  74. R. Louis says:

    The image of Brewer at the start of this article, is pretty shocking.  If you look at it, you can see, ‘bitter together’ written three times around the presenter, but not one complete ‘independence’ word, all of which is overshadowed by the union jack and no saltire.

    The BBC, the propagandist wing of Scottish Labour.

    Cameron B,
    The question needs asked all the time, WHY is Darling so afraid to debate independence with the leader of the YES campaign??

  75. EphemeralDeception says:

    Great “heads up” Arbroath.
     
    I would like to add that the probable reason the UK Gov. chose Defence interests over oil revenue, is because it was not oil that was found. (details are in some of the historical papers on the forargyll web site)
    However hydrocarbons were indeed found but it was GAS not oil.  At the time the UK had sufficient gas, so exploiting more was maybe not a major priority.
    Recently the UK needs more gas, but I hazard a guess that new fields on the west of Scotland are a bit of a nightmare scenario for some.
    I hope chic keeps scraping away the onion layers to get to more concrete detail.
     

  76. CameronB says:

    R Louis says:
    “The question needs asked all the time, WHY is Darling so afraid to debate independence with the leader of the YES campaign??”
     
    It would be game, set and match at that point. The union’s busted flush would be exposed for the sham that it is.
     
    It really is quite amusing to watch Captain D take a red face, as the colour slowly spreads up his neck towards his forehead. Well, actually not that slowly, on occasion, such as when being asked questions about the IRAQ WAR. I suppose it is quite childish of me to be amused by unconscious anatomical responses. But if he doesn’t want to be embarrassed, he stop trying to put lipstick on a pig, to put it politely.
     
    Vote Yes on September 18th

  77. ianbrotherhood says:

    Apologies if it’s already been posted on other threads – worth a look if you’re into all that Facebook malarkey.
     
    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=438674936148433&set=a.130587086957221.22991.127993583883238&type=1

  78. Arbroath1320 says:

    Just a wee thought outside that damned box I keep dragging around.
     
    I wonder what dear old Darling’s excuse would be if Alex Salmond took him up on an offer to a T.V. debate?
    How long would it be before Darling started coming up with all the exc uses under the sun that are not already part of the Better Together excuse manual part I?

  79. Juteman says:

    @Arbroath.
    I actually think that AS has already prepared for a ‘showdown’ debate with AD nearer the time.
    Why strike early?

  80. Arbroath1320 says:

    Fair do’s!
    I’m still not convinced Darling will EVER turn up to face anyone from the YES camp. WE all know he is TERRIFIED of Blair Jenkins so you really have to look at Darling’s shouting for a debate with Alex Salmond as nothing more than a load of hot air. I don’t think it is a stretch of even the most taut mind to see that Alex Salmond will crucify Darling, any where and any time!

  81. Baheid says:

    Juteman says:
     
    Totally agree with you, (and there is no rush at all), I also believe AS will invite Cameron to have a go.
    Both would be out of their depth.

  82. Yesitis says:

    A nice way to pass the time if you have to sit through Reporting Scotland, is to play the ‘Spot the strategically placed Union flag that wasn`t there before’ game.
     
     

  83. Kenny says:

    In the BBC’s charter under the heading ‘Incorporation and Purposes’ I saw this ;

    6.The independence of the BBC

    (1)The BBC shall be independent in all matters concerning the content of its output, the times and manner in which this is supplied, and in the management of its affairs.
    I’m not sure if this means they have to project an unbiased opinion or that they can take their own stance as we are experiencing at the moment.

    Also from their Agreement there is this paragraph under Regulatory Obligations on the UK Public Services ;
     


    44. Accuracy and impartiality

     (1) The BBC must do all it can to ensure that controversial subjects are treated with due
    accuracy and impartiality in all relevant output.
     

    (3) The UK Public Services must not contain any output which expresses the opinion of the BBC or of its Trust or Executive Board on current affairs matters of public policy other than broadcasting or the provision of online services.

    Although it does go on to say that it doesn’t apply to content of proceedings in any of the houses of parliament, which may be their get out clause…

      

  84. Braco says:

    Mr 1320,
    Alex will not debate Darling, as Darling will abuse his role as a supposed non Party political leader of the Better NO Campaign and try to constantly paint the issue as Labour vs SNP, tartan Tory, self interested politicians only interested in themselves, they are all the same and I should know etc, why should anybody bother listening blah, blah, blah.

    This is exactly the same reason that he is running a mile from a debate with (our)Blair as he has no party affiliations and Darling would run out of personal abuse right after the third time he repeats YES Man to the YesNP.

    (our)Blair is actually really very good. He is cordial, non party political, gets the FACTS over and comes across as a thoughtful and considered churchgoer (snigger).

    Salmond is the First Minister of the Scots Government. Cameron is the Prime Minister of the UK Government and has vowed to fight ‘Separation’ with every sinew. As Salmond is the elected First Minister of a Majority Scots Government mandated to argue for the break up of PM Cameron’s UK, I find it amazing that anyone in the UK would accept his abdication of it’s defence.
     
    I can’t help but feel that such a debate would turn a currently little local (Scottish) difficulty into a very public (probably far too public for Cameron) ‘nationwide’ televised UK issue. 
     
    One that might, aside from his own humiliation, raise issues and policies that a large part of rUK electorate may find very interesting and future food for thought. Not something desirable with only six months or so until Cameron’s own General election show down.

    Just a few thoughts on the probabilities of an early agreement on head to head debates. Only when the polling, public or private, start scaring the Better No UK string pullers, will Cameron even start to think about debating with Salmond. If he eventually does agree, I think we can assume our opposition think we are about to win.

  85. the rough bounds says:

    I didn’t watch any of those propaganda programmes on the telly and I will not be doing so in the future. I will be voting Yes as I am a Scot and want the Scots to have control of their own affairs.
    Frankly I don’t give a bugger about all the arguments. This isn’t about pensions and the price of oil or the price of a can of beans. It’s about independence.
    I couldn’t give a toss even if Scotland were to become poorer as I believe in Scotland’s folk. They only need their chance to blossom.
    Who is to say what the world will be like in fifty or a hundred years? All this political posturing by the No campaign is just rank cowardice…nothing more and nothing less.

  86. Linda's back says:

    We need to expose the BBC’s biased graphics etc via letters to the mainstream press as this embarrassses the BBC more than 1000 complaints or 500 demonstrators.
    We should also keep asking why Labour politicians are acting as human shields for the London Tory funded No campaign and why the BBC or STV  does not  make sure Tory politicians represent the NO campaign as often as Labour nominees.

  87. Braco says:

    the rough bounds,

    The question is always ‘but will we be poorer as a country?’

    The answer is, we are already a rich country. Richer or Poorer the real difference to the majority of the population’s everyday lives will come from how that existing wealth is shared out.

    When that ‘national’ sharing is on a fairer and more equitable basis (as opposed to the opposite reality we currently suffer under), then the future, given the effective democratic oversight, should take care of itself.

    I totally agree with you though! (weesmily)

  88. AnneDon says:

    Darling is incapable of debating with anyone. He attended a CND meeting in Edinburgh a few years ago, and I went along. Even I was able to out-argue him – he was saved by the chair. 
    He had been anti-nuclear in the 80s, (or at least spoke at CND meetings when he was a councillor)  but was part of a govt which had no intention of getting rid of Trident, and were even planning its replacement.
    Yet, it didn’t seem to have occurred to him that anyone would argue against him, because he certainly wasn’t prepared. He trotted out a few catchphrases, but once contradicted (which I did!) he was floundering.
    In the referendum campaign, the proper person for him to debate with is Dennis Canavan, IMO.  I think Darling is demanding to debate with Salmond because he knows it won’t happen.
    Salmond would wipe the floor with him, or PoshDave. Or both at the same time!

  89. Arbroath1320 says:

    oh don’t bring Dennis Canavan into the picture you’ve just sent Darling scampering after one of Lamont’s bolt holes! :lol:
     
    OMG! what will happen if he scarpers down the SAME bolt hole that Lamont is already occupying?

  90. muttley79 says:

    For some reason I have a hunch that the debates will either be a 1 on 1 (Salmond versus Cameron or Darling) or 2 on 2.  If it is the latter I would hope it would be Salmond and Jenkins, as Sturgeon has been on all of the debates last year.  Darling would be on for the No side, and another politician would be with him.  I think Cameron wants to avoid getting involved in the debates if he can manage it. 

    I think the Yes campaign view Canavan as a good campaigner (which he is), and he will probably be sent to address public meetings, possibly communicate with trade unionists etc, and to further build up the Labour for Independence group.

  91. douglas clark says:

    I think Cameron would like shot of us. We do nothing whatsoever for his ‘vision’ of a modern fucked up country. We are a fly in the ointment of his perfected notion of a country that does not care, about anyone really.

    It is to our eternal shame that we do care. From their point of view.

    We need to vote ‘Yes’ in order to be the country we can be.

    Sad, innit?

  92. The Man in the Jar says:

    @muttley79
    I don’t agree with you on this one. I don’t think you will ever see AS and AD in the same studio. I think it would devalue AS. His stance regarding AD should be “I’m not wasting my time on that blithering idiot!” I think it would be more likely be our Blair against AD. Will we ever see JL up against anyone? That is one to ponder.
    As for D Cameron he can’t avoid AS forever. He will have to face up to the debate or he is snookered.
    My sympathies go to whatever poor soul has to go up against JL or RD. I sugest that they just smile and nod their head a lot.
    On a brighter note. Think of the comedy value.

  93. ianbrotherhood says:

    @TMITJ-
    ‘Will we ever see JL up against anyone? That is one to ponder.’
    It certainly is…but not to be pondered for long.

  94. The Man in the Jar says:

    Muttley you have got me thinking. (Not a good idea) but I had a horrible thought. What if they had a woman’s perspective special? JL, RD and NS poor NS her ears would be bleeding by the end of it. But then I thought hey! You could add Margo MacDonald. Then I thought please please “bring it on”!

  95. The Man in the Jar says:

    @ianbrotherhood
    Personally I would like to see her up against a wall!
    NO wait no, no, no I didn’t think that no!

  96. molly says:

    Douglas Clark
    ‘his vision of a modern fucked up country’ where the tax payers are to pick up the tab of between £150-200 MILLION pounds in a deal to allow a Premier League football team convert the Olympic stadium into a football stadium. A team full of millionaires !
    Back in the real world today,when I was in town ,I was handed an Easter Pamphlet .On the back cover they were making people aware they run the local food bank.
    Better Together- so some of the people having to go to a food bank to survive can give their taxes to millionaires to convert a stadium they will never be able to afford to visit -you could not make it up !

  97. Dee says:

    Someone mentioned earlier about contacting RT tv. That sounds a great idea and should be followed up… Also how about contacting Al Jezeera tv,  They would not miss a chance to show wrong doing in UK broadcasting. They done a piece on the Falklands referendum and didnt take the UK point of view on that..

  98. ianbrotherhood says:

    @TMITJ-
    Cheers mister. That’s just about guaranteed a feverish night-sweat…think I’ll bed-down in the spare room…blimey, where’s the tramadol…

  99. Adrian B says:

    I think Patrick Harvie should debate against Lamont. A good choice for Lamont as he is not in the SNP, he is also in opposition to the Labour Party as well as the SNP on many things within Parliament. Only question is whether Johann would want to do it? 

  100. HenBroon says:

    Regarding Newsnicht/ Brewer/ Subliminal advertising, I am surprised no one has mentioned his sartorial elegance! Crisp white shirt and red white and blue striped tie. No question it was deliberate blatant propaganda, the interesting question is how much more blatant can it become?
    BBC Scotland is completely out of control. John Boothman is the guy with the levers in his hands and he is one rabid Labour luvvie. He is the long term partner of Susan Deacon ex Labour MSP. Just remember these are the people, McQuarrie and Boothman, who first refused to appear before a Holyrood committee. And by all accounts had to be ordered to do so. McQuarrie then went on to deny any problems at BBC Scotland due to underfunding and redundancies. (Crisis what crisis?) The other guy Malcolm, is as nasty a piece of work as you will find in any boardroom. An accountant, looks like a ferret, who has a laugh that would scare the daylights out of a Carstairs warden. I have seen these people in action. They are ruthless corporate clones who would sell their mothers to keep their jobs, lucrative perks, and pensions. http://bbc.in/WKMfo2
    Some other footage that is worth watching is the performance of Andrew Neil and Brian Taylor in this training day event. http://bit.ly/Za0B1k

  101. The Man in the Jar says:

    @Adrian B
    They would have to find her first. I hear that there is a labyrinth of tunnels leading to small dark rooms in her secret bunker beneath George square.
    It is my theory that the George square re-vamp is really to screen her bunker from nasty cybernats. J

  102. Bruce says:

    Brewer is a Twat.

  103. Adrian B says:

    @ The Man in the Jar
     
    Well that certainly explains the sucking the blood out of the Scottish people talk from her. Vampire lives in underground bunker in the heart of George Square.
     
    Think you might be on to something – do you think BBC Scotlandshire could shed some light on the story?
     
     



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